Speaker 1: Hey, everybody. Today's episode of the Around the NFL Podcast
Speaker 1: is presented by Rocket Mortgage. Join Rocket Mortgage and saying
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Speaker 1: everyone Knows a hero dot com. Also, the Around the
Speaker 1: NFL Twitter Show is back this week. It's on Tuesday tomorrow.
Speaker 1: It's live, It's all about the Draft and it's gonna
Speaker 1: be a lot of fun breaking down the big event
Speaker 1: coming up on Thursday through Saturday. So check us out
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Speaker 1: pm GMT, so a little bit later than our usual time.
Speaker 1: Make sure you check it out. Let us get to
Speaker 1: the Monday show. Me Around the NFL Podcast have a
Speaker 1: billion dollar idea. Welcome to another edition of the Around
Speaker 1: the NFL Podcast. My name is Dan Kansas. I'm coming
Speaker 1: to you from city filled with heroes and bunkers. Mark Sessler,
Speaker 1: Chris Wesley, What is up? Gentleman? Hey d it's a
Speaker 1: gentleman instead of boys. Finally, classy, sophisticated. Um, how is everybody?
Speaker 1: How was your weekend? I like the weekends. It is
Speaker 1: quite a difference, I mean with the schools and the shows.
Speaker 1: Like it's a relief to get to the weekends. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I find myself drifting away on the weekends. I kind
Speaker 1: of need this daily UM exercise that we do to
Speaker 1: keep us or keep me somewhat sane. UM. I enjoyed
Speaker 1: the weekend quite a bit. I was talking to Erica
Speaker 1: before the show that I've started to look back over
Speaker 1: the past couple of months of like the things that
Speaker 1: UM I had a chance to do that I that
Speaker 1: I didn't do because I thought, well, you know, we'll
Speaker 1: always be able to do this, and it was remind
Speaker 1: I remind I thought about the night that Dan and
Speaker 1: I we almost went to France UM and to Paris
Speaker 1: from UM a late night UK bar, but we thought
Speaker 1: it's too audacious an idea. We'll do what another tense like,
Speaker 1: I wish we had done that. Now I'm just looking
Speaker 1: back saying, like that will that may never happen again?
Speaker 1: And you know, with the way things of working out now,
Speaker 1: with the world turned upside down and then the uncertain
Speaker 1: nature of the NFL season, I'm very worried that we
Speaker 1: won't get to go to London this year. And who knows,
Speaker 1: you know, all of a sudden, now you're talking two
Speaker 1: years down the line, you know where the world is
Speaker 1: filled with unknowns. I guess what is the lesson here? Uh?
Speaker 1: Grab life by ther carpet and and the lesson is
Speaker 1: Dan is now in into other countries, um, other than
Speaker 1: our own, which I like. That's good. It's a it's
Speaker 1: a trope being perpetuated by you guys. But I do
Speaker 1: that stuff with you all the time. So UM. I
Speaker 1: didn't really come that close to going to France either.
Speaker 1: That was more assessler fever dream that maybe I could
Speaker 1: have gotten roped into. Uh And now in retrospect, yes,
Speaker 1: that would have been great because who knows. We got
Speaker 1: a nice show coming up today. Did everybody watch the
Speaker 1: Last Dance? Definitely? I have yet to do that, but
Speaker 1: I feel highly on top of the situation thanks to
Speaker 1: thousand sports writers tweeting about it. I thinks exact same time,
Speaker 1: Mark will never watch it. I will watch it. I
Speaker 1: have I will watch it and catch up and we'll
Speaker 1: watch it. But I haven't yet. Hyes, I thought of
Speaker 1: you while I was watching it, because you spoke very
Speaker 1: eloquently on the on the matter on our Twitter show
Speaker 1: on Friday. And Michael Wilbon is a guy I think
Speaker 1: we all respect. At one point he was one of
Speaker 1: the talking heads and if you don't know the Last Dance,
Speaker 1: it's a ten part ESPN documentary about Michael Jordan's focusing
Speaker 1: on the last season with the Bulls, but really on
Speaker 1: his whole career in life. Um and Will Bon said,
Speaker 1: there's only really three guys in the history of American
Speaker 1: sport that could you know, you could do a documentary
Speaker 1: like this that have this this, this is the layers
Speaker 1: that Jordan had is. It's Babe Ruth, It's Muhammad Ali,
Speaker 1: and it's Michael Jordan's did get me thinking that football is,
Speaker 1: you know, the most popular sport in America. It's been
Speaker 1: around forever now, it's kind of interesting that there's never
Speaker 1: been that type of a guy that went next level
Speaker 1: and became the fascination that those three personalities are. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I thought it was interesting too. Had I had a
Speaker 1: couple of thoughts on that one that it's interesting that
Speaker 1: those three guys all came from different sports, and they
Speaker 1: all came from probably the time when those sports were
Speaker 1: at their peak in popularity. Um, Babe Ruth and twenties
Speaker 1: with baseball, Muhammad Ali and the sixties with boxing, and
Speaker 1: then Michael Jordan in the nineties with basketball. Maybe football
Speaker 1: has yet to reach its peak in popularity and we'll
Speaker 1: have that athlete who lifts the whole game up and
Speaker 1: sort of becomes that icon. That's kind of a scary
Speaker 1: thought that that football has not peaked in popularity. How
Speaker 1: much bigger can it get? Really? Well, the way Greg's talking,
Speaker 1: Patrick Mahomes could be that guy he's gotta I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't know, documentary Greg, I don't know. I don't
Speaker 1: know what you would have to do to transcend this sport.
Speaker 1: And like the world at this point now that the
Speaker 1: NFL is so saturated, Like if Patrick Mahomes, let's say
Speaker 1: one five m v ps, you know, I mean Pat
Speaker 1: Peyton Manning did that and you wouldn't put him at
Speaker 1: that level. I guess what would you have to do
Speaker 1: to be like Michael Jordan? I guess if if, if,
Speaker 1: I don't know, there's something more than just like racking
Speaker 1: up trophies and racking up title it's playing style too.
Speaker 1: And Ricky has put up at the bottom of the
Speaker 1: screen Tom Brady, Are you numb? There's no arguing with
Speaker 1: his success? Are you numb? What do you Wayne Campbell?
Speaker 1: Im Brady has not played with the style that has
Speaker 1: made people people outside of football take note and saying, well,
Speaker 1: he's so exciting. Right, Let's say this about Jordan's. Likeing
Speaker 1: and West were at that same age where we were
Speaker 1: like fourth, fifth, sixth grade, Jordan's was you know, the
Speaker 1: sun was rising on the NBA and I have these
Speaker 1: notebooks filled with just Michael Ordon drawings. And something that
Speaker 1: was different about him than anyone else was the very
Speaker 1: truthful marketing campaign that this man could fly like I
Speaker 1: am a young kid falling in love with sports, and
Speaker 1: you've got the the black and white ad where he's
Speaker 1: taking off from the foul line with the overlay of
Speaker 1: an airline taking off into the skies, and the way
Speaker 1: he was marketed in the in the in the clash
Speaker 1: of Jordan's and Nike. And then he'd go out and
Speaker 1: do things like how many players were dropping sixty one
Speaker 1: points on the reg over and over on teams. He
Speaker 1: was doing stuff that nobody else knew how to do
Speaker 1: or could do. And I mean he captured the imagination
Speaker 1: in a way that no other athlete did growing up
Speaker 1: for me, on the reg sounds ridiculous when I say that.
Speaker 1: And what we have, we have stuff to get to
Speaker 1: we should move on, although would be fun to do
Speaker 1: an entire Michael Jordan's NFL podcast. That seems weird. But
Speaker 1: when they go to France to do like a charity
Speaker 1: tournament type thing before the start of season, there's a
Speaker 1: headline in a French newspaper that Michael Jordan's is the
Speaker 1: closest thing we have to God, or the closest thing
Speaker 1: to God. He's h I think it was a reference
Speaker 1: to his high flying ability, but also just how incredibly
Speaker 1: popular he was, uh and Brady like to your point,
Speaker 1: Ricky as as hugely influent, influential in terms of like um,
Speaker 1: the popularity connected to the Patriots and what he was
Speaker 1: able to do. He's ever really grabbed the country's attention
Speaker 1: and fascination the way a guy like Jordan's and obviously
Speaker 1: Ali and for the World wasn't before us. But he
Speaker 1: also wasn't one of the top five players at his
Speaker 1: position the first six years he was in the league,
Speaker 1: so it he's he's different. But thinking about your question,
Speaker 1: maybe it's football is too much of a team sport,
Speaker 1: because I know basketball is a team sport, but but basketball, boxing, baseball,
Speaker 1: it's a place individuals. I think can maybe shine in
Speaker 1: a different way. Well, it's also a global thing, Babe,
Speaker 1: Ruth towards Japan in the nineteen twenties before airplanes were popular.
Speaker 1: You know, Michael Jordan's globalized basketball. Muhammad Ali met with
Speaker 1: world leaders while he was a champion boxer, and Muhammad
Speaker 1: Ali changed politics around the world. So Tom Brady doesn't
Speaker 1: have that kind of power plane in americanized sport. Sorry, Erica,
Speaker 1: keep it on mute, all right. A lot to get to, uh.
Speaker 1: Bob McGinn is joining us from the athletic to break
Speaker 1: down all the great draft heat and there's so much
Speaker 1: to get to. He's the best in the business. Uh
Speaker 1: in being plugged into Insiders, So it's great to have
Speaker 1: him on the show. We're looking forward to that conversation.
Speaker 1: But before that, let's do some news I've been telling
Speaker 1: at any cost. Jordan is the most talented player in
Speaker 1: the NBA by five, the show of the nineties, the
Speaker 1: team of the nineties. Whenever they speak, Michael Jordan's she speaks.
Speaker 1: We created an image that people want to live up to.
Speaker 1: I think that's all you can hope for him. And
Speaker 1: before the news, just a reminder tomorrow, Big day as
Speaker 1: we get closer to the draft, Tuesday, we will have
Speaker 1: the annual Mark Sessler Mock Draft. That will be an
Speaker 1: audio show and also we're double dipping. The Twitter Show
Speaker 1: returns usually on Friday. This week, it will be on
Speaker 1: Tuesday tomorrow at two pm Pacific, five pm Eastern. Oh
Speaker 1: and it's late night. It's fun over in the UK
Speaker 1: and Ireland and surrounding territories. What would that be? It
Speaker 1: would be although, you know what, the last time I
Speaker 1: attempted this, I got twelve tweets. You don't know how
Speaker 1: to do that. But then every yeah, we do get
Speaker 1: that tweets, Like, but we just had a time change, mate, right,
Speaker 1: It's like, I'm not London, summertime. Stop it find it
Speaker 1: Twitter Show. All right, let's get to the news. Here
Speaker 1: we go and Mark, we're excited about that mock draft. Um,
Speaker 1: let's start with Leonard four Nette. So you know Leonard Fournette,
Speaker 1: we we talked about it on the Twitter Show on
Speaker 1: Friday that he spoke out, you know, saying Cam Newton
Speaker 1: would be great in Jacksonville. Well, Jacksonville, you know they
Speaker 1: might be okay with Cam Newton coming to the Jaguars,
Speaker 1: but they also may be okay with Leonard Fournette not
Speaker 1: being with Jacksonville rap Sheet reported that the Jaguars had
Speaker 1: trade talks centered around four Net for more than a month,
Speaker 1: and they circled back with teams in the last three days,
Speaker 1: a k a. They're aggressively shopping the former first round pick.
Speaker 1: ESPN's Josina Anderson reports that the Bucks are not expected
Speaker 1: to be a taker. Uh. They were connected to the
Speaker 1: running back for a while, but apparently that is not happening.
Speaker 1: According to Anderson, Grey what kind of market does Leonard
Speaker 1: four Nett have at this stage of the game. Obviously
Speaker 1: has been a disappointment since coming into the league. I
Speaker 1: would guess very little too possibly none. Uh, he's due
Speaker 1: four million dollars this year. Can they get a conditional
Speaker 1: seventh round pick for him? You would, you would think,
Speaker 1: But I think that's about the area we're talking about.
Speaker 1: I almost thought when this is floated out, because they're
Speaker 1: they're so sick of dealing with for Net that they
Speaker 1: almost want to show him. They want to show him
Speaker 1: like what the league thinks of him, that that's all
Speaker 1: they're gonna get for him, is like a seventh round
Speaker 1: conditional pick. The Jaguars used him as a three down back.
Speaker 1: I can't think of another franchise that would use him
Speaker 1: on passing downs. He's just not that good at it
Speaker 1: um it's misuse of an asset to use him on
Speaker 1: passing downs. I think he's limited in his skill set.
Speaker 1: He can get you a thousand yards on first and
Speaker 1: second downs, but he's gonna need a tunnel to run
Speaker 1: through because he's a straight ahead runner without as much
Speaker 1: lateral agility. And with Mike Gara Folo pointing out that
Speaker 1: he's been oversleeping, he's been tardy, he's been moody, and
Speaker 1: he was drafted by Tom cough and who had a
Speaker 1: vision for a run first offense. So there's a lot
Speaker 1: of negatives there. I mean, is there any selling point,
Speaker 1: because I mean, number one, you're not looking at an
Speaker 1: NFL right now where there are a lot of running
Speaker 1: back holes. I mean, the Bucks were one team that
Speaker 1: you could think of them maybe adding stacking up um
Speaker 1: backs with them out of the picture, and they seem
Speaker 1: very zoned in on on drafting and running back. You
Speaker 1: can catch passes out of the backfield and the Tom
Speaker 1: Brady offense, I mean, Leonard Fournette has been um, if anything,
Speaker 1: a consistent headache and I mean involved with some of
Speaker 1: the more problematic scenarios in Jacksonville over the last three seasons.
Speaker 1: So he's he's a former fourth overall pick. Is he
Speaker 1: gonna help you in special teams? No? Is he a
Speaker 1: guy that you could plug in and a depth roll
Speaker 1: as a backup and expect him to be a good
Speaker 1: soldier about it? I don't know. Doesn't seem like that
Speaker 1: maybe is the safest route either. Has he performed at
Speaker 1: a high level when given the opportunities, I mean in
Speaker 1: in spurts, but overall it's not really worked out. He's
Speaker 1: a guy that might struggle to find a job, probably
Speaker 1: will get a job. But he's in the league, right Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think definitely. But you're not gonna give up anything.
Speaker 1: You're gonna give stuff up for him. He's in the
Speaker 1: journeyman portion potentially. In other um Jags news, Marquise Lee
Speaker 1: another former high draft pick two thousand fourteen high second rounder.
Speaker 1: He has done with the team? Uh that uh? Jaguars
Speaker 1: released the wide receiver he missed all of with an
Speaker 1: a c L injury. Played just six games last season,
Speaker 1: so he had kind of been off off the grid
Speaker 1: a little bit. Uh, and now the Jags cut ties
Speaker 1: with markis Lee West. Does he make sense to you
Speaker 1: at twenty eight years old as a flyer for a
Speaker 1: team or is he just another guy? I think he's
Speaker 1: just another guy at this point. You don't want to
Speaker 1: write off his career because, like he said, he's only
Speaker 1: twenty eight years old. It's been a lot of leg injuries,
Speaker 1: and sometimes it takes guys a couple of years before
Speaker 1: they can return to some semblance of what they were.
Speaker 1: I I think he's a guy you signed sort of
Speaker 1: like a Jason Vare who the forty nine signed to
Speaker 1: play cornerback, where leg injuries make him a complete and
Speaker 1: utter wild card and it's a question of whether he'll
Speaker 1: even make your team or not. They paid some bad
Speaker 1: moves in Jacksonville. I just got to point out that
Speaker 1: this might be one of the worst contracts anyone's side,
Speaker 1: and it was partly bad luck injuries. They gave him
Speaker 1: like million dollars guaranteed he had three catches combined in
Speaker 1: the last two years. I mean, they've had a disastrous
Speaker 1: couple of years as a front office that they've skated
Speaker 1: by on Alright. In other news, New York Giants. They
Speaker 1: are picking number four. Overall, all the mocks seemed to
Speaker 1: have them grabbing one of the uh tackles and plugging
Speaker 1: him in as a guy in front of Daniel Jones.
Speaker 1: But Yahoo's sports is Charles Robinson or excuse me, NFL
Speaker 1: networksn RAPP report reports of the Giants quote have spent
Speaker 1: a lot of time researching Oregon quarterback Justin Herbert, a
Speaker 1: process that's included FaceTime conversations with coach Joe Judge West
Speaker 1: your shake in your head? Uh, do you put any
Speaker 1: stock in the idea that the Giants could be interested
Speaker 1: in taking a quarterback? Or is this your classic draft
Speaker 1: smoke and the day's leading up to the big event?
Speaker 1: Zero point zero stock And it's laughable. And what is
Speaker 1: Getleman doing? He's never made a trade before, and then
Speaker 1: he announces this is the year he's interested in a trade,
Speaker 1: and then all of the NFL insiders come out hours
Speaker 1: later saying, oh, yeah, by the way, we're thinking about
Speaker 1: a quarterback at number four. If you want one, you'll
Speaker 1: have to trade with us. I mean, come on, it's
Speaker 1: a little bit yeah, it's a little see through desperately
Speaker 1: wants someone to trade in that spot, and I mentioned, yeah,
Speaker 1: who sports is. Charles Robinson reported that yes, the Giants
Speaker 1: have uh, you know, connected with Justin Herbert and they're
Speaker 1: looking into him. He is completely certain New York will
Speaker 1: not be selecting him. And he called it the flirtation
Speaker 1: a quote Patriots culture move, uh, Joe Judge who has
Speaker 1: New England ties. Uh. A situation where they're kind of
Speaker 1: doing evaluation of the prospect for down the road and
Speaker 1: just to have it in the bank so not to
Speaker 1: do not put any stock into the idea that the
Speaker 1: Giants can go the route of the Cardinals a couple
Speaker 1: of years ago or a year ago. I should say,
Speaker 1: Mark's Gina talk, but he's on mute. I was debating,
Speaker 1: just letting him, wow, that was that that would have
Speaker 1: been problematic um or better for all of you. But
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think they're the only team that
Speaker 1: does that kind of thing during the draft process. I
Speaker 1: don't who's actually who is buying on any level that
Speaker 1: they get a quarterback. I think nobody. But there is
Speaker 1: some credence if you, if anyone wants to trade up
Speaker 1: for any of these um pastors. And it seems more
Speaker 1: and more unlikely. Maybe you want to get up to
Speaker 1: that spot, um, just to get ahead of everything fallen
Speaker 1: behind it. But I mean the Giants could have not
Speaker 1: telecast this with any less panache. I mean, ultimately the
Speaker 1: news uh nugget, it served its purpose to let you
Speaker 1: guys tea off on Dave Gentleman for no reason. So
Speaker 1: we're all good. I think there was a reason. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's fine, you guys are maybe not bumble um. And
Speaker 1: oh and by the way, we will be talking again
Speaker 1: with Bob mcgainn in a little bit and we will
Speaker 1: certainly touch on all the UM quarterback situations around the draft.
Speaker 1: The New England Patriots, they tagged Joe Tuney there uh
Speaker 1: all pro guard and Mike Reese of ESPN believes that
Speaker 1: the Pats could be open to trading the UM interior
Speaker 1: alignment during the draft. So Tuney greg he signed the
Speaker 1: tender three days after receiving it, uh And people were
Speaker 1: surprised when that happened in the first place, because the
Speaker 1: widely held thought was that he was going to hit
Speaker 1: the open market. And then Tom Brady News kind of
Speaker 1: blew everything off the page Patriots related, but that was
Speaker 1: still a bit of a surprise. Would you be surprised
Speaker 1: if they moved the guard? Now, I won't be because
Speaker 1: Mike Reese reported at him putting it out there of
Speaker 1: all people, tells me that's what they're looking to do,
Speaker 1: and it does. It does make sense. It helps explain
Speaker 1: the tag. I mean, he's a really good player that
Speaker 1: you know, as a Patriots fan, you'd love them to
Speaker 1: just resign, but they have negative cat. They have the
Speaker 1: least cap space of any team in the league if
Speaker 1: they wanted to do anything else. They also are short
Speaker 1: on a second round draft pick because they gave away
Speaker 1: Mohammed Sanu and it it would in retrospect kind of
Speaker 1: explain why they why they did this tag, Why I
Speaker 1: let him go for free? If you can maybe get
Speaker 1: a second or third in this year's draft where they
Speaker 1: feel like they might need players like right now, they
Speaker 1: don't want to wait for a compensitory pick. You know, Greg,
Speaker 1: I read your general manager rankings, good piece, but you
Speaker 1: have Bill Belichick number one, um, And what I would
Speaker 1: ask is like, because you explained in it that that
Speaker 1: was a career wide you know, look at Bill Belichick
Speaker 1: to some degree, but the Bill Belichick of the last
Speaker 1: year or so the team is in weird, weird cap situation.
Speaker 1: Um they I think they really they left tom Brady
Speaker 1: totally hanging from a talent perspective last year on offense.
Speaker 1: I mean, what how what grade would you give him
Speaker 1: over the last three hundred and sixty five days B minus.
Speaker 1: I think the drafts though over the last five four
Speaker 1: years have been bad. Um, I'm not gonna like kill
Speaker 1: them that they in terms of the talent that they had,
Speaker 1: like a number one type type of defense and a
Speaker 1: team that could you know, win eleven and twelve games
Speaker 1: in Tom Brady's age forty two season, like setting up
Speaker 1: last season. This a new trade though, Um, if it's
Speaker 1: not just him being hurt and he was hurt like
Speaker 1: right after he got there, that that he looked like
Speaker 1: a disaster there, that that was a fiasco. And to
Speaker 1: your point, Mark, Joe Tony is about the last good
Speaker 1: guy they drafted. I mean, they do not have like
Speaker 1: big draft hits in the last four to five years,
Speaker 1: and it's been fairly spotty in terms of the draft.
Speaker 1: They've done a lot of things working around the margins,
Speaker 1: little pickups here there that are contributors and that that's
Speaker 1: like what they do, but it hasn't been great. He's
Speaker 1: number one. Oh yeah, the one for the past at
Speaker 1: least how I've done that, that's the third year I've
Speaker 1: done it. I said, like, they're getting graded on the
Speaker 1: total like, um, the whole body of work, body of
Speaker 1: work in their current job, and so it's hard to
Speaker 1: it's hard to move him off. That's about who who
Speaker 1: would I put first? I also didn't know who to
Speaker 1: put there, like Bret Brett Beach was second with Andy Reid,
Speaker 1: and I heard from a couple of people that were like,
Speaker 1: it's really Andy Reid, It's not Brett Beach, which was
Speaker 1: interesting to me. Um, but he gets the credit from
Speaker 1: Mahomes even though Dorsey was there at the time. And
Speaker 1: then Howary Roseman is for Kevin Colber is three. Uh,
Speaker 1: John Lynch and Schneider were there up there at five
Speaker 1: and six. Chris Ballard. Chris Ballard I think is eight.
Speaker 1: He's he's up there pretty high. Little John Robinson in
Speaker 1: the top ten. I thought, he's done, nice, nice job,
Speaker 1: tight Titans from and yes, check it out. But the
Speaker 1: fact you would who are you putting above them? That's fair,
Speaker 1: that's fair. But I think the idea of saying good
Speaker 1: by to Tom Brady and then the right now the
Speaker 1: organization is set up with Jared Stidham and Brian Hoyer,
Speaker 1: is a huge whole left by the man in charge.
Speaker 1: But then again, I we'll see, we'll see. I guess
Speaker 1: why your editor has you writing this before the draft? Oh?
Speaker 1: Should we win in that direction? Shots fight at the editor. Well,
Speaker 1: I think because you could either do you can do
Speaker 1: it right before after the season. I guess it would.
Speaker 1: It would be another time. But you've gotten like a
Speaker 1: feel of their last draft class. We've gotten a feel
Speaker 1: of the you know, the free agency. Okay, I see
Speaker 1: that side of it as well. All right, well, you
Speaker 1: know what, obviously it is a juicy topic with a
Speaker 1: lot of layers. Yeah, people, people don't like that patriot.
Speaker 1: I guess I'd wait and see about their quarterback position
Speaker 1: before I kill it, like whether Stidham's any good or
Speaker 1: whether they get a first you know, whether they do
Speaker 1: something and get someone new. Then how about does Beach
Speaker 1: slash Andy Reid at number one? And and maybe check
Speaker 1: to the format to include these guys that are the
Speaker 1: oars of their organization. I think there's there's something to
Speaker 1: be said there. Although their drafts have been a little
Speaker 1: weird the last few years. M okay, moving on this
Speaker 1: is for Oh. By the way, the Patriots made their
Speaker 1: color Rush jersey their primary jerseys effective today, Greg, So
Speaker 1: congratulations on that. That's a popular move. UM. In other news,
Speaker 1: back to the Jaguars. You know what, I don't know
Speaker 1: what's going on with this organization. Yannak and Gokway is
Speaker 1: one of the best UH defensive players defensive lineman UH
Speaker 1: in the a f C, and he wants out. He's
Speaker 1: frustrated that the Jags have yet to trade him, and
Speaker 1: all that bubbled over on Monday, UH when he went
Speaker 1: on social media and challenged the Jaguars to get a
Speaker 1: deal done, get him out of Jacksonville and in one
Speaker 1: of the things that you would have never happened, and
Speaker 1: there'd be no way for it to happen UH ten
Speaker 1: twenty years ago. It led to a back and forth,
Speaker 1: public back and forth with one of the team builders.
Speaker 1: So I will play the role of Yannick and Gockway
Speaker 1: and Mark, will you play the role of Tony Khan.
Speaker 1: Yes to friend of the show. He's he's spoken with
Speaker 1: us before at the owners meetings. He is the UM
Speaker 1: what is his role exactly? He's owner of football and
Speaker 1: in charge of football analytics at the Jaguars, according to
Speaker 1: his Twitter profile. Okay, shodkn is his father. I think
Speaker 1: he's e v P. Now, yeah I was. I said
Speaker 1: I thought, and I was just going off the Twitter profile,
Speaker 1: but that sounds right west. Here we go, Yannick hashtag
Speaker 1: free youn no answer at Tony Khan, stop hiding? Mo?
Speaker 1: All right now? This from Tony. Connie responds. He says,
Speaker 1: I'm not in hiding, sir, I'm in isolation getting ready
Speaker 1: for the draft. I've been pretty active on social media
Speaker 1: in isolation. But you wouldn't know that since you on
Speaker 1: followed me in parentheses again where the you? It runs
Speaker 1: by holding his face and all his friends are going
Speaker 1: crazy behind him. Okay, since you're feeling my today. What
Speaker 1: Since you're feeling my today, let's both let the world
Speaker 1: in on the truth. We've been had a discussion that
Speaker 1: the charges game was my last game. You try to
Speaker 1: back to all the situation without answering any of my
Speaker 1: camps calls. Shaking my head. You spoiled bra holding up
Speaker 1: people for no reason. Clown emoji. It's a new regime here. Sir,
Speaker 1: I think I thank you from the bottom of my
Speaker 1: heart for all of the contributions you made here that said,
Speaker 1: tweeting insults at me won't get you traded any faster.
Speaker 1: Only good trade compensation will do that. Please redirect your
Speaker 1: efforts into a more productive outlet. And you think it
Speaker 1: would be over at some point, but it keeps going.
Speaker 1: Just trade me, I don't need the speech, and then
Speaker 1: a emoji of a finish line like a checker your flag,
Speaker 1: and then con you know, hits him up again, show
Speaker 1: me the compensation. I'm sure you're lead driving up the
Speaker 1: price today btw. By the way, ouch, and that's and
Speaker 1: that's kind of where things end. So this is grizzly.
Speaker 1: I don't think this is really the method that any
Speaker 1: team executive should be um going down. But also you know,
Speaker 1: I was a big George Steinbrunner fan, and if Steinbrenner
Speaker 1: had Twitter, he would have been doing stuff like this
Speaker 1: all the time. So I guess I can't get on
Speaker 1: the high horse. Wes. What are your thoughts on it? Well,
Speaker 1: it's not very smart on Yannick and got wise part.
Speaker 1: It's letting emotion do the work of reason. If you're
Speaker 1: trying to do a trade. Don't sabotage your own value
Speaker 1: in such a public way, just lighting fire to your
Speaker 1: trade value and putting the Jaguars in a very poor spot.
Speaker 1: I think it's just it's just not smart as far
Speaker 1: as a means to an end. I don't think you
Speaker 1: had hurt his value too much. I think there's gonna
Speaker 1: be a lot of interest and team teams, and it didn't.
Speaker 1: You know, it didn't hurt Jalen Ramsey and differently like
Speaker 1: teams understand he wants to get out. Um. I was
Speaker 1: more taken by the little sentence. And I've seen a
Speaker 1: little bit of this in Jacksonville. It's a new regime, please,
Speaker 1: I mean the same people who hired Tom Coughlin are
Speaker 1: running the place. The same general manager you're there is
Speaker 1: running the place. The same coach has been there since since, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, Blake Bordles was on the team. Let's let's
Speaker 1: quit with I killed Coffins about as much as anyone else,
Speaker 1: but let's quit on like it's every it's everything is
Speaker 1: Tom Coffin's fault. Come on, I can't call it a
Speaker 1: new regime if it's not a new regime. I just
Speaker 1: can't if the coach is there in the GMS there,
Speaker 1: it's not a new regime. I can't think of a
Speaker 1: team with more unhappy players that it just it just
Speaker 1: seems to be a stockpile of discord and they one
Speaker 1: of the weirder off seasons around. Also, I enjoyed it
Speaker 1: in Gotway's accent really cranking up as it as it
Speaker 1: went along. What accent would you say that is? I
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know. It's kind of like a
Speaker 1: it's kind of like maybe the significant other of like
Speaker 1: like the Lakeisha's mom impression. Maybe I don't like a
Speaker 1: Caribbean overtone, like a street heavy. I don't know. That's
Speaker 1: that's interesting. I guess everybody hears it in their own way.
Speaker 1: That's what's happening in the news, all right. As we promised,
Speaker 1: this is somebody that we're so thrilled to talk to
Speaker 1: because in a lot of ways, you could refer to
Speaker 1: him as the dean of American Draft insiders. That's how
Speaker 1: I see him. He's Bob McGinn. This is his thirty
Speaker 1: sixth year working on his NFL Draft series. You could
Speaker 1: read him right now at the Athletic, previously at the
Speaker 1: Green Day Press Gazette, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. He had
Speaker 1: his own website for a little bit. Now he's at
Speaker 1: the Athletic Bob, welcome to the Around the NFL podcast.
Speaker 1: We're so excited to get educated by the dean. Let's
Speaker 1: tell that guy thanks for having me. Uh, you know this.
Speaker 1: We're all big fans because it's there's no way to
Speaker 1: prepare for the jarre aft from our standpoint without reading
Speaker 1: your work. And this year especially, I'm like taking note
Speaker 1: of some of these quotes that you get, Bob. They're
Speaker 1: so juicy, they're so salacious. Do you think you've been
Speaker 1: around the game long enough and you obviously are highly
Speaker 1: respected in this realm, both as a football writer in
Speaker 1: general and a columnist and in this particular realm that
Speaker 1: these scouts and these gms and these personnel guys want
Speaker 1: to impress you like they want to give you the quote,
Speaker 1: and they feel proud to give you one that shows
Speaker 1: up in your copy. I don't know if it's that,
Speaker 1: but I mean, these are long conversations with most guys,
Speaker 1: a lot of people, you know, they go out of
Speaker 1: their out of their way to spend a lot of
Speaker 1: time with me and so there's all kinds of you know,
Speaker 1: garbage in the middle of these conversations. But in these
Speaker 1: capsules I write, um the stuff. I have a lot
Speaker 1: of material to choose from, and and it's I usually
Speaker 1: try to get the quotes with some punch, you know,
Speaker 1: and you and you do it every time. It makes
Speaker 1: it such a fun read. So we're gonna kind spend
Speaker 1: through some of the position groups and like and like
Speaker 1: Bob said, he he breaks it down by position group.
Speaker 1: And again, if you don't have a subscription, I think
Speaker 1: the Athletic is it for free right now? I think
Speaker 1: it might be. So make sure you're reading this. And
Speaker 1: if that doesn't hook you, I don't know what will.
Speaker 1: But let's start with the quarterbacks. And it's fascinating and
Speaker 1: all the people that you spoke to when you spoke
Speaker 1: to uh, you know, many many, many plugged in people
Speaker 1: in the industry. Joe Burrow is by far the best
Speaker 1: prospect out there, and everyone expects him to go to
Speaker 1: Cincinnati at one. Two is the guy that that jumps
Speaker 1: out to everybody is the big wild card. And after
Speaker 1: reading your piece on this, Bob, it is an absolute
Speaker 1: mystery to me. Um, you spoke to um personnel guys
Speaker 1: uh ten on the high end of scale of the
Speaker 1: scale in terms of concern level one to ten uh
Speaker 1: and the average of the panel was seven point six.
Speaker 1: And here's one of those juicy quotes I tell I'm
Speaker 1: talking about. There is concerned, serious concern about the Dura bill.
Speaker 1: He's at a high placed personnel man for an NFC team.
Speaker 1: The ankle, the hip, the size, you name it. It's
Speaker 1: hard because you can't get your hands on him. Uh.
Speaker 1: This this does feel like one of the biggest wild
Speaker 1: cards in recent memory at the quarterback position. Bob, I
Speaker 1: agree totally. I mean, you know, not that long ago.
Speaker 1: I mean still, I guess the narrative out there is
Speaker 1: that he you know, he might be third in Detroit
Speaker 1: or do somebody come in come into that spot. I
Speaker 1: just don't know. I don't I didn't sense that at
Speaker 1: all in these conversations. Um, you know he's got and
Speaker 1: his NFL pass or rating for his career would come
Speaker 1: compute to one thirty eight point one. And you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just remarkable. Is there's never seen any
Speaker 1: that kind of efficiency unless Burrow this year NFL passer
Speaker 1: eating one three point seven. But um, you know, he
Speaker 1: played with fantastic receivers and you know, on and on
Speaker 1: and on. But in terms of the durability, he takes
Speaker 1: all these shots, he doesn't protect himself. I covered bread
Speaker 1: fire for his entire career, and he would be recoiling
Speaker 1: after he would throw it. I mean, he took a
Speaker 1: lot of shots, but he just was never injured. He
Speaker 1: knew how to take a hit. Aaron Rodgers is the
Speaker 1: same way. I mean, he adopted a sliding posture after
Speaker 1: about his third or fourth year, and you know, he's
Speaker 1: escaped injury, but two has not done that. He's getting
Speaker 1: drilled and people estimate his forty between four eight five
Speaker 1: and four nine. He's six ft even. He's strongly built.
Speaker 1: But boy, there's red flags all over on this durability
Speaker 1: you had. You had three teams had off the board entirely. Yeah. Yeah, Now,
Speaker 1: you know, it's easy for them to say, because you
Speaker 1: know two of them had, you know, a quarterback that
Speaker 1: they're not going to be dealing with. That's easy to say.
Speaker 1: But still, yeah, I do wonder with him because I
Speaker 1: think it's gotten lost. You know, he had surgeries on
Speaker 1: both of his ankles, and he's a guy who's you
Speaker 1: don't even hear any concerns about his height, which I
Speaker 1: think shows how much quarterbacks change. I mean, he's he's
Speaker 1: six foot tall. He's maybe not as athletics as some
Speaker 1: of the highly drafted quarterbacks. How much how much of
Speaker 1: this with him potentially slipping do you think is about
Speaker 1: his game and his game style and that, like, he's
Speaker 1: not a guy with a big arm who's not necessarily
Speaker 1: you know, above average athletically, and he has these injuries.
Speaker 1: So as someone who doesn't follow the college game, and
Speaker 1: I and I know, the numbers are outrageous, and he's
Speaker 1: known as a great leader and everything, and that's why
Speaker 1: he will get drafted high. But that's not the profile
Speaker 1: of many guys that we've heard getting drafted early. Injury prone,
Speaker 1: you know, shorter and not necessarily like a difference maker athletically. No,
Speaker 1: it isn't he um uh, fantastic release right and um.
Speaker 1: But again, he had all these clear window throws, people
Speaker 1: wide opening things like that, and he would droll a
Speaker 1: ball in there. You know, we all saw it and
Speaker 1: it was it was like a shooting gallery. Um. But again,
Speaker 1: his pick came when there was pressure. Scouts don't feel
Speaker 1: he really handled the pressure real well. Um, he's short.
Speaker 1: I mean it's hard to see over that certainly. Ah,
Speaker 1: he's with a great system and great players all around him,
Speaker 1: tremendous offensive line. Um, I just don't see it. I mean,
Speaker 1: in talking to all these people, it just doesn't ring.
Speaker 1: You know, he doesn't ring like a top ten or
Speaker 1: twelve guys guide even despite the durability issues. It just doesn't.
Speaker 1: I mean, when I started this about a month ago
Speaker 1: or five weeks ago, I was expecting more. But boy,
Speaker 1: in the inflection of these voices, it's not there. One
Speaker 1: thing uh that I love about your capsules is uh,
Speaker 1: you know, in the time of reading then it doesn't
Speaker 1: take long. Uh. The top half, I fall totally in love,
Speaker 1: um with quarterback acts based on the positive, glowing comments
Speaker 1: from scouts. But then in the back half, I'm suddenly
Speaker 1: terrified of the player. And I just wonder when you're
Speaker 1: when you're doing these together and you've been doing it
Speaker 1: for so long, you've got a guy like Joe Burrow
Speaker 1: and and and across the board, and you know, the
Speaker 1: comments were exceedingly positive and kind of stuff we've never
Speaker 1: seen before. Um about a player's ability to process. Uh,
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of that with some of the
Speaker 1: other guys too, But do you have a pretty fair
Speaker 1: level of suspicion about any type of quarterback at this
Speaker 1: point having done it so long. I look at a
Speaker 1: guy like Justin Herbert, who people are talking about someone
Speaker 1: maybe trading up for. But there's the personality stuff. Every
Speaker 1: one of these guys seem to have something um that
Speaker 1: would be in the area of red flag. Are you
Speaker 1: do you look at like Joe Burrow, for instance, is
Speaker 1: someone that is truly different than prospects that have come
Speaker 1: down the pike previously. Let me just mention this, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of people accuse me of being
Speaker 1: negative in my writing on the draft, but guys, if
Speaker 1: you were inside those draft rooms, it's a lot more
Speaker 1: brutal than the way I write it. I mean, this
Speaker 1: is their livelihood, the future of these franchises, and they
Speaker 1: are they're not worried about being politically correct. In these
Speaker 1: draft rooms. They are ripping, they are praising, they are
Speaker 1: going back and forth, debating, arguing with each other. It
Speaker 1: gets intense, and so you know you're right the way
Speaker 1: give you the good early and then but then there's
Speaker 1: strength and then there's weaknesses. I'm just trying to be
Speaker 1: realistic and honest and take people inside where these people,
Speaker 1: you know, real people, the decision makers in the area,
Speaker 1: skeletson whoever are talking. So back to Burrow. Um, I
Speaker 1: don't see many negatives from anybody on Burrow. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: it's sort of a one year wonder. But I mean
Speaker 1: this was such a one year wonder. And he wasn't
Speaker 1: that bad as a junior either. UM. I talked to
Speaker 1: a lot of people trying to compare them. Okay, is
Speaker 1: he on the wreck on the level of oh, some
Speaker 1: people bring up Andy Dalton. Some people, Um, I said, well,
Speaker 1: is he as good as Stafford or Carson Wentz? They
Speaker 1: kind of paused, some say yeah, some say no. But
Speaker 1: then another guy, one of the last people I talked to,
Speaker 1: he said, oh, and way above that stuff, way above
Speaker 1: Stafford and Ryan. He said, he's in there with Peyton,
Speaker 1: Manning and Rogers, anybody you want to name boy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So there is just um they love this guy as
Speaker 1: a as a as a kid. We handle himself and
Speaker 1: he throws it well enough, and he's got good size,
Speaker 1: thirty high test score. Small hands though, small hands though,
Speaker 1: come on, the biggest hands in recent memory was Mark
Speaker 1: Sanchez for the record. So let's count down, think ten
Speaker 1: and a half. Wow. Okay, Bob. One of the things
Speaker 1: we get from from your articles is how much the
Speaker 1: NFL changes from year to year, and we see quotes
Speaker 1: about stationary players can't get drafted anymore. Um nose tackles.
Speaker 1: There's a guy one of your quarterbacks, Jalen Hurts, who
Speaker 1: from reading it, I sort of get a Taysom Hill
Speaker 1: since the team see him as a football player and
Speaker 1: a guy you in your building, but not necessarily as
Speaker 1: a starting quarterback. Is that sort of a do you
Speaker 1: see him as a guy who's going to have a
Speaker 1: tastom he'll like role? Yeah, that's interesting comparison. Hadn't thought
Speaker 1: of that. That makes some sense though. Um I would
Speaker 1: agree with that that he's kind of a backup maybe
Speaker 1: gadget guy, special teams whatever. But he threw it so
Speaker 1: well at the combine, you know, without pads on his
Speaker 1: shoulders and against air and everything. But he looked like
Speaker 1: a real passer that day. Uh he'll yeah, maybe he
Speaker 1: you know, I mean he hurt as a terrific runner,
Speaker 1: and you know, you love the kid and the transfer
Speaker 1: and the way handled all that. I like him, um
Speaker 1: seems like about a third rounder and maybe he can
Speaker 1: have a good career doing a lot of things. Bob,
Speaker 1: you met, You mentioned Joe Burrow. You think, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of checks all the boxes. Maybe you know, not
Speaker 1: the biggest arm in the world, but he makes so
Speaker 1: many plays, you know, off structure that you know, I
Speaker 1: can imagine every team is going to be confident. And
Speaker 1: but then you look at the rest of the LSU
Speaker 1: team and I do under like a talk into the
Speaker 1: scouts how much they are trying to account for how
Speaker 1: ridiculously dominant that offense was. That it almost felt like
Speaker 1: Joe Brady was there running of pro offense and they
Speaker 1: were going up against a lower level of you know,
Speaker 1: college coaches that guys and and I'm specifically talking about
Speaker 1: Justin Jefferson, like and maybe they're they're running back to
Speaker 1: Edward Shailaire that he's so open all the time and
Speaker 1: the productions just off the charts. But when you watch
Speaker 1: Jefferson and some of the other LSU players, is there
Speaker 1: like a concern that it's just the scheme like creating
Speaker 1: these numbers and Jefferson especially compared to all those other
Speaker 1: receivers out there, you know, isn't maybe as special or
Speaker 1: unique just as an individual talent. To a degree there is.
Speaker 1: But then guys, when I start talking about Chase and
Speaker 1: Jefferson and that Marshall guy and the running back, then
Speaker 1: they say, yeah, but Bob, look at that offensive line.
Speaker 1: He said, yeah, the center's okay, but you know, and
Speaker 1: the left tackle was an athlete who got suspended, he said.
Speaker 1: The other three guys, there wasn't all that much there,
Speaker 1: he said, That's why he had to scramble and move.
Speaker 1: He said, you know, he looked like Brady kind of
Speaker 1: negotiating the pocket, climbing up. So I you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: supporting cast was I mean great on the at the
Speaker 1: skill positions, but not real great upfront in the wide
Speaker 1: receiver group. Bob, there's a quote you have near the
Speaker 1: top of your capsule. This is maybe the deepest wide
Speaker 1: receiver group, said a longtime a f C personnel man.
Speaker 1: H But as far as like a Julio as in
Speaker 1: Julio Jones or Calvin Johnson, absolutely not. I've seen it
Speaker 1: in some places. And just so you know, Bob, I'm
Speaker 1: sure he plugged in on on me and my career
Speaker 1: in this podcast. I'm a big Jets fan, and so
Speaker 1: with with the Jets sitting at eleven, um Ceedee Lamb
Speaker 1: is a guy that our our friend, some people's friend,
Speaker 1: Daniel Jeremiah has going to them. But when you keep
Speaker 1: in the mind of quote like that and the idea
Speaker 1: that this is such a deep wide receiver class, do
Speaker 1: you buy into the theory out there that it would
Speaker 1: be a mistake to be taking a wide receiver in
Speaker 1: that ten to twelve to thirteen range when you could
Speaker 1: get another need, a higher end player perhaps, and then
Speaker 1: get still a quality wide receiver later in the draft
Speaker 1: in the second or third round. Because we're talking serious
Speaker 1: depth this year. Yes, I do, I do. You know, um,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of balance, and you can you're gonna
Speaker 1: get them from at eight nineties something like that. They're
Speaker 1: gonna be really good players. But still, guys, don't you
Speaker 1: think somebody from this these top ten or eleven people
Speaker 1: are going to be very close to Julio Jones or
Speaker 1: Calvin Johnson. I just kind of do. Somebody's going to
Speaker 1: emerge here, and I don't know who it is, but
Speaker 1: there's enough talent on this board to think there's gonna
Speaker 1: be one real shining light. And all these teams are
Speaker 1: thinking that too. So if they pass and they go
Speaker 1: take tackles, who are you know, okay serviceable and all that.
Speaker 1: But if they passed the guy they totally believe in,
Speaker 1: we know the game is, it's scoring now and it's
Speaker 1: perimeter based game. Past that guy, you might regret it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean that you could see why if you're a
Speaker 1: guy like John Gruden or something that the some of
Speaker 1: these white outs are just too tantalizing to move on.
Speaker 1: But there are UM in that cluster of the Jets
Speaker 1: and Browns and other clubs with real legitimate UM offensive
Speaker 1: line tackle needs. And I can't remember a draft where
Speaker 1: there were so many UM top ten first, you know,
Speaker 1: fifteen pick projections of tackles that are just clustered together.
Speaker 1: And coming out of this project, did you view one
Speaker 1: of the tackles as clearly better than the others or
Speaker 1: did anyone particularly scare you? Because for me, for us
Speaker 1: jumping in, it just seem like a big stack of
Speaker 1: guys and like, who's what's the differentiator here? Man? They
Speaker 1: were those top four. In my I've never had such
Speaker 1: a close pole on the top four we're just almost
Speaker 1: on top of each other. Seventy one and seventy one point. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean Ezra Cleveland has a chance to
Speaker 1: get in the first round. He's really a good pass blocker.
Speaker 1: He's been compared by once got to David Bachtiar and
Speaker 1: Brian Blaga, the team I covered for years. So um
Speaker 1: and Austin Jackson. I mean, he donates his bone marrow
Speaker 1: to his sister, and you know he pays the price
Speaker 1: his final year at USC. But he's a lot better
Speaker 1: than he showed. Um, we know about the other ones, uh,
Speaker 1: I mean there are other guys. I can't say who's
Speaker 1: going to come out of it. I certainly like Robert
Speaker 1: Hunt a lot too from Louisiana, whether it's a guard
Speaker 1: or a tackle. Um, it's a good group. But beyond
Speaker 1: your draft series, we read your Packers game recaps as well,
Speaker 1: and they're very good. I think out of all the
Speaker 1: guys I've read over the years, you come the closest
Speaker 1: to a style. It's like dr Z Paul Paul's Immerman.
Speaker 1: Is that something that you did on purpose? Was he
Speaker 1: a role model or is that just a coincidence? I mean,
Speaker 1: I that's how I basically how I learned to write.
Speaker 1: I've been a subscriber to Sports Holds Story since I
Speaker 1: was about eight, and I've read, you know, every issue.
Speaker 1: I saved those issues for forty years. When I eventually moved,
Speaker 1: I had to get rid of them all. But and
Speaker 1: that's where I mean. The writing was so beautiful and
Speaker 1: the editing was phenomenal. That, um, that's where I think
Speaker 1: all of us learned to write. Really. UM. I certainly
Speaker 1: admired Paul. I knew him a little bit, not a lot. Um.
Speaker 1: I'll mention another guy who influenced me to Jerry Green
Speaker 1: of the Detroit News. He would write for Street and
Speaker 1: Smith's every year, the NFC Central Preview and and I
Speaker 1: was grew up in Michigan's Upper Peninsula. And I've told
Speaker 1: Jerry this. He had an entirely different style that was
Speaker 1: way way early for his time. And he was a
Speaker 1: lot like Paul's Immerman um. And he was analytic when
Speaker 1: nobody else was. And so I love Jerry's covered every
Speaker 1: Super Bowl, and he influenced me quite a bit. Yeah,
Speaker 1: for our listeners, who haven't you know heard me, you know,
Speaker 1: honk about dr Z In the last couple of years,
Speaker 1: it's been that long. Like The Thinking Man's Guy at
Speaker 1: to Football to me, is still the best book on football,
Speaker 1: at least if you're like a young writer. You're getting
Speaker 1: into the business on how to think about football even
Speaker 1: if you don't write. And and it's a it's hard
Speaker 1: to imagine, uh, this the type of book coming out,
Speaker 1: and Mark is showing the video to me of a
Speaker 1: nice looking first addition, it's hard to imagine someone getting
Speaker 1: the access that he had, but just even the way
Speaker 1: to think about the game, there's nothing better. While we're
Speaker 1: on the topic though, of these game recap spot. Before
Speaker 1: we let you go, I got to ask you about
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers because, um, you're you're tough on him. Sometimes
Speaker 1: I feel I don't know what your relationship. How is
Speaker 1: your relationship with Aaron Rodgers right now? Good starting point? Well,
Speaker 1: I haven't seen him in a couple of years, so
Speaker 1: I'm not sure. Um, I'm I'm just curious, um, where
Speaker 1: you see him right now? Because it's obviously when you
Speaker 1: get a reputation like you know, if someone like Rogers
Speaker 1: and you have the high end play, you mostly just
Speaker 1: hear all positive positivity, especially from a national level. But
Speaker 1: there's a certain school of thinking, and you've been writing
Speaker 1: about it certainly that he has not been the same
Speaker 1: player the last three or four years. I guess I
Speaker 1: just be curious before you go, uh like, where you
Speaker 1: see he is now um compared to where he was
Speaker 1: earlier in his career. You know, some people think he
Speaker 1: slipped physically. I don't one bit. He's a you know,
Speaker 1: workout maniac in the off season. He takes care of
Speaker 1: tremendous care of his body. I do not think he
Speaker 1: slipped physically. I think his arm is fine. I don't
Speaker 1: see any problems with any of that. But you just
Speaker 1: gotta do it, you know. And um, I mean, he's
Speaker 1: got a good enough supporting cast. He's got one one
Speaker 1: fantastic receiver, and you know he said he's got a
Speaker 1: great running back. I mean, yeah, the other white oults
Speaker 1: and tight ends weren't very good due year, but the
Speaker 1: old line was real solid. So, you know, supporting cast
Speaker 1: come and go, and he has to make people better.
Speaker 1: He can take them to the Super Bowl any year.
Speaker 1: He hasn't been there in about a decade. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's time, really, And he's certainly one of the ten
Speaker 1: best qbs in the league without you know, any doubt,
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of good qbs in this league,
Speaker 1: and he had his team in the NFC title game
Speaker 1: last year. He just has to do it. Let me
Speaker 1: connect some dots there, Bob. So you say physically he's
Speaker 1: the same exact guy his supporting cast. It's a little
Speaker 1: bit overstated, um that he's in some type of disadvantage
Speaker 1: position because he does have some big time players. Is
Speaker 1: it Is it coaching that's kept his his production more
Speaker 1: pedestrian recent years? Is it the mental side of things?
Speaker 1: Is that off the field? Is there anything else that
Speaker 1: you can add on kind of your feeling on where
Speaker 1: Rogers has been the last couple of years compared to
Speaker 1: that peak in the beginning of last decade, And so
Speaker 1: it certainly hasn't been coaching. I mean, Mike McCarthy, if
Speaker 1: he told me this once, he told told it to
Speaker 1: me twenty times. His goal was to make the quarterback
Speaker 1: look great. That was his entire goal as a coach,
Speaker 1: number one objective, and he built everything around Rodgers and
Speaker 1: Floor has done the same thing. The system is made
Speaker 1: order for Aaron Rodgers, and he is a good player,
Speaker 1: and he just has to get back to a great level. Um. Uh.
Speaker 1: He knows his mind and his ability to process everything
Speaker 1: is you know, beyond incredible. Really um. He can throw accurately,
Speaker 1: he can still scramble at age thirty six. Um. But
Speaker 1: for some reason he just hasn't really done it here,
Speaker 1: played really well, a little bit little stretches, but for
Speaker 1: the last five or six years it's not been consistently elite. Alright,
Speaker 1: good answer, Thank you so much for your your time, Bob.
Speaker 1: And again, the dean of a Erican Draft Insiders, that's
Speaker 1: what I call him, Bob McGinn, and you could read
Speaker 1: him at the Athletic. The Athletic is a subscription service,
Speaker 1: but not right now during this COVID nineteen madness. And
Speaker 1: speaking of that, Bob, I hope all is well with
Speaker 1: you and your family and you stay well, and we
Speaker 1: hope to hear from you again soon. We'll be reading
Speaker 1: you in the meantime. Thanks very much, guys, take care. Thanks.
Speaker 1: Oh that was great, Bob McGinn, nice guy. Ye uh
Speaker 1: he go. He to me falls into the category of
Speaker 1: you know, and this is a this is a narrowing group,
Speaker 1: gentleman scribe. He just seemed like um an incredibly uh
Speaker 1: warm uh gentle individual who is sitting on way more
Speaker 1: football information um than most men in America. Ahead, I
Speaker 1: was gonna say, he wrote a great book too, is
Speaker 1: like a super Bowl book, um, where he talked to
Speaker 1: players played in each Super Bowl. I recommend that he
Speaker 1: He kind of speaks quietly, but you know, carry's a
Speaker 1: big stick you underneath all of that, Like he's gonna
Speaker 1: let you know what he thinks. And we got some
Speaker 1: interviews with him. He's an opinionated guy, like, way more
Speaker 1: opinionated than he showed before. He was very nice and
Speaker 1: genial though, And we got this question all the time
Speaker 1: on Twitter and d m s and things of that nature.
Speaker 1: How do I get into the business, How do I
Speaker 1: um get involved? What do I have to do to
Speaker 1: put myself in position to be find success? Well, doing
Speaker 1: things like reading Bob mcgins columns, finding the people that
Speaker 1: are the best at what they do in terms of
Speaker 1: how they followed the sport, and just reading guys like him.
Speaker 1: There's there's a tip for you. So check it out.
Speaker 1: All right, big week, Like we said, Monday show in
Speaker 1: the books, Tomorrow Tuesday, the Twitter Show Live and also
Speaker 1: the Mark Sessler mock Draft. Mark you ready for that?
Speaker 1: I am. You know, this thing is changing by the minute.
Speaker 1: I don't know how else to describe it. On the
Speaker 1: fact that I thought I would spend just a little
Speaker 1: bit of time on it. It is an all consuming
Speaker 1: um project that a long way to go. Get ready,
Speaker 1: fluid fluid Uh, that's coming up Tuesday Wednesday. We're gonna
Speaker 1: do some sandwich props connected to the draft also, and
Speaker 1: it's been two years uh in the making. Spice Rack
Speaker 1: returns with his predictions on the guys who will hit
Speaker 1: in a big way, kind of five guys that Spicy
Speaker 1: believes in. Okay, we've had Jonathan Williams in the past,
Speaker 1: good luck we've had We've had, you know some Spicy
Speaker 1: has had some issues in the past. In the segment,
Speaker 1: sometimes he's he's shined and then sometimes he's cratered. So
Speaker 1: it's that's one of the things that are exciting about
Speaker 1: this spice Rack in Parts Unknown like the Ultimate Warrior,
Speaker 1: sharing his draft hot takes. Remember the year he just
Speaker 1: wouldn't give us. He came on and then he decided, no,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna give you by Sleepers A volatile individual.
Speaker 1: I still don't know it was because he was unprepared
Speaker 1: or he was making some type of statement like or
Speaker 1: it was like a punk rock type move. I'll never know,
Speaker 1: you say he could He's gonna give us five names.
Speaker 1: It could be eight names, and it could be one
Speaker 1: or none. You'll get what you get about so spicy.
Speaker 1: Coming back to the Around the NFL podcast on Wednesday, Thursday,
Speaker 1: the Draft, of course, we will be recording immediately upon
Speaker 1: the completion of the first round with a show going
Speaker 1: up that night, and then we'll have another show. That
Speaker 1: show will stand for Friday, and then we'll have another
Speaker 1: show wrapping up the whole draft that we will record
Speaker 1: on Saturday night and get up as soon as possible.
Speaker 1: So that's our draft. We're coming up. It's time. Dan
Speaker 1: Hanson signing off for Quiet Storm, the Mailman, the Old Boss,
Speaker 1: Rick Hollywood, Thank you, Bob mc again of the Athletics
Speaker 1: until Tuesday. S