1 00:00:01,800 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 1: Alone media. 2 00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 2: Welcome to it, kidap to hear a podcast about ice 3 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:16,920 Speaker 2: training desk squads. I guess I'm your host via Wong. 4 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:19,279 Speaker 2: I guess I don't know if formerly or better is 5 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 2: the correct word, but sometimes also not as the ice 6 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:24,440 Speaker 2: was be destroyed. Girl, So I'm mad about this one 7 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:28,080 Speaker 2: with me? Is someone else's extremely bad about the existence 8 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:30,480 Speaker 2: of ice, which is James Yep, I'm here. 9 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:34,480 Speaker 3: I'm mad as a waste. I guess, just another Monday. Yeah, 10 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:37,640 Speaker 3: this shit sucks, This does suck. Yeah, you know, I 11 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 3: had this realization. 12 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 2: I get this on Twitter a lot, where I realized 13 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 2: that there are people who don't know what ICE is 14 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:47,640 Speaker 2: because they're like, they're not from the US, or they're like, yeah, 15 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:50,880 Speaker 2: so ICE is immigrations and customs enforcements. The shortest description 16 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 2: of what they are is that they are one of 17 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 2: the like four American border gestapos. 18 00:00:55,920 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 3: Yeah. The number of agencies under DHS is fucking baffling. 19 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:04,560 Speaker 3: They're constantly rebranding every time they have a scandal or 20 00:01:04,600 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 3: they kill too many people. That, yeah, ice is kind 21 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 3: of their flagship evil program. 22 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:15,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, and they like they do raids on fucking houses, 23 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:18,760 Speaker 2: they do raised on businesses, They suck. Like if you 24 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 2: vaguely remember, there was a whole bunch of protests in 25 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:23,400 Speaker 2: like twenty eighteen over this stuff, and that was mostly 26 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 2: anti ICE stuff. 27 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, if someone's getting deported, it's ICE for the most 28 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,760 Speaker 3: part doing it. Like Yeah, they also run detention centers 29 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 3: where people go, you know, they work with Jeff Bezos 30 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 3: on deporting people. 31 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 2: Oh my fucking god. Okay, I just remembered a story 32 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 2: I had. I had a flashback to standing in a protest, 33 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:45,959 Speaker 2: a very very large protest in twenty eighteen. This is 34 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 2: one of like the big pro immigrant rallies. And in 35 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:51,920 Speaker 2: this fucking protest, I saw a thing for this group 36 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:55,639 Speaker 2: called Heartland Alliance. Now pro people who probably don't outside 37 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 2: of Chicago probably don't know what this is. The Heartland 38 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 2: Alliance runs like fucking child prisons facilities like for ICE school, 39 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 2: and they were at this protest against ICE. Fucking it 40 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 2: was the worst. That shit was terrible. You know, this 41 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,080 Speaker 2: whole thing is all extremely bad. But what we've been 42 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 2: learning more details about recently is this program called Citizens Academies, 43 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:25,240 Speaker 2: which is run by ICE's Homeland Security Investigations. I didn't 44 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 2: think HSI was under ICE. I thought HSI was a 45 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 2: different branch of DHS. I might be wrong, but they 46 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:34,840 Speaker 2: used to be under ICE as far as I know, 47 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:38,240 Speaker 2: and then they became HSI. Okay, I might be wrong 48 00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:40,679 Speaker 2: about that because the stuff that I was reading was 49 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 2: saying that they are still part of ICE, but they 50 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:45,160 Speaker 2: might not be. It's also possible that it's literally has 51 00:02:45,200 --> 00:02:47,959 Speaker 2: gone back and forward multiple times in the last Yeah, 52 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 2: this is merecrareck. Things fucking suck, But HSI also does, 53 00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 2: like a lot of the times, there's some of the 54 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:55,240 Speaker 2: people who like do like physically the people on the 55 00:02:55,240 --> 00:03:01,240 Speaker 2: ground doing a raid will be HSI, like fucking stormtroopers whatever. Yeah, 56 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 2: they do arrests. 57 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, often they appear in like these joint counter terrorism 58 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 3: task forces, like when they especially when they're doing stuff 59 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:10,799 Speaker 3: with like drugs and that kind of thing. 60 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, the civilian academies are I think really the only 61 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 2: way you can describe them, even though this is not 62 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 2: how it's being described, really is that they're treating random 63 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:26,120 Speaker 2: people to like become desk what. 64 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, It's what's interesting is like the protest that you 65 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 3: talked about seem to have been the sort of reason 66 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:36,320 Speaker 3: that they started this program, right. 67 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:38,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, we need to rewind this a little bit because 68 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 2: they started in the US as a reaction to those protests, 69 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 2: like specifically as like a pr thing. But the original 70 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 2: version of these programs started in Puerto Rico under Obama. 71 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:53,720 Speaker 3: Look, we don't give Obama or anything like enough shit, right, 72 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 3: Like fucking Obama just like in terms of killing people, 73 00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 3: in terms of deporting people, fucked up human being. 74 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, he was the deporter in chief and like, yeah, 75 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 2: part of what's sort of brutal about the mom administration 76 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 2: is like a lot of his support had been from 77 00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:13,120 Speaker 2: like the huge undocumented that could have like peaked in 78 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 2: like two thousand and six, and he comes in on 79 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:17,200 Speaker 2: this and they just fucking deports everyone. 80 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:19,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, as Democrats too every time. 81 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're seeing it again with Biden. Right, It's like 82 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 2: it's the same sort of process. And under under Obama 83 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 2: these these programs start. There's specifically, as you're talking about, 84 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 2: there's specifically supposed to be these like training programs are 85 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 2: supposed to be for community. 86 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 3: Well, okay, so this is and this is one of 87 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 3: these things. 88 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:35,440 Speaker 2: Was like this is what they say that it's for, 89 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 2: and given what they're doing, I don't know how much 90 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:40,720 Speaker 2: I believe them what they're what they say that it's 91 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,040 Speaker 2: for is it's because there's been all of these anti 92 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 2: ICE things, Like, I mean, there's lots of people who 93 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:50,640 Speaker 2: now are like, don't say shit about ice, who like, like, 94 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:54,159 Speaker 2: AOC hasn't fucking said anything about abolishing ICE in like 95 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 2: half a decade, right, and she ran on that. Yeah, 96 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,240 Speaker 2: because of how powerful those social movements were. I mean, 97 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:04,360 Speaker 2: there's like Sean mcguey whatever the fuck guy whose whole 98 00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:06,560 Speaker 2: thing was abolish ice and then he became a Democratic 99 00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 2: staffer and now it never talks about it again, and 100 00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:11,880 Speaker 2: he's like my absolute wordal nemesis, like I will face 101 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 2: at the end of days. Yeah, I will destroy his 102 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 2: fucking traitors ass and yeah, many many, many such cases. 103 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 2: But yeah, Like, and I think probably peak like anti 104 00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 2: ice sentiment was in the Trump era, right when people, Yeah, 105 00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 2: people started to look at immigration as the way that 106 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 2: like people have immigrant communities and diasporas see it, right, 107 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 2: which is this thing that tears families apart, that destroys communities, 108 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 2: that rich children from their parents, and people obviously recognized 109 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 2: it was bad. And then Biden got in and the 110 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,360 Speaker 2: Democrats had to do this like kind of cover your 111 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 2: eyes and turn away thing where they continue to do 112 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:51,839 Speaker 2: the same shit. Kids and cages are good now, Yeah, yeah, 113 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 2: yeah in cages great democratic kids and cage is incredible. 114 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:57,240 Speaker 3: What if no cage is? What do we just leave 115 00:05:57,279 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 3: them out in the fucking mountains and James's friend have 116 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 3: to feed them beans will winter? 117 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, But the thing is, in twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen, 118 00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 2: it's not entirely clear that the Democrats are going to 119 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:11,600 Speaker 2: swing that way. No, And so you get these programs 120 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 2: and what's interesting about them, and so a lot of 121 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 2: this is coming from that. There's a very very good 122 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:20,720 Speaker 2: piece by Barrizio Guerrero indocumented who got a bunch of 123 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:24,360 Speaker 2: Foya documents about this program and what they. 124 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:25,919 Speaker 3: Were actually doing. Yeah. 125 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 2: And one of the things that he discovers about this 126 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 2: is that it's like a lot of rich guys. Like 127 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:34,200 Speaker 2: it's some of them are like really rich. It's also 128 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 2: it's a lot of like bank employees. 129 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:39,159 Speaker 3: Yeah. That was a funny almost, I guess kind of 130 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 3: it got through that little social circle or whatever. 131 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, And like there's this sort of feed in program 132 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 2: that sends people into this. 133 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:50,560 Speaker 3: And I actually I realized I had. 134 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:54,039 Speaker 2: Vaguely known about these but didn't quite understand how bad 135 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,359 Speaker 2: it was because he didn't have a bunch of the 136 00:06:56,360 --> 00:06:58,480 Speaker 2: documents we have now. But this was a big thing 137 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:02,040 Speaker 2: in Chicago in twenty twenty one, where there was proposed 138 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 2: to open one of these things. It's like these like 139 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:07,240 Speaker 2: training centers for these like fucking people. Oh yeah, and 140 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 2: you know, twenty twenty one was still in Chicago. There 141 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 2: was still like like there's some protest stuff going on 142 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 2: because I mean there's you know, like twenty twenty hadn't 143 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 2: quite faded yet. And there was also like our cops 144 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:21,240 Speaker 2: We've talked about this a couple times on the show, 145 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 2: but like shot a fucking fourteen year old, like yeah, 146 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 2: it's fucking murdered him cold blood. And the protests were 147 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 2: bad enough that like even lower Lightfoot was like like 148 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 2: fuck this, like this is this Trump ice stuff. 149 00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 3: We can't let them do it. 150 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 2: This was back with the when like these people like 151 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 2: the Democrats were started pretending that they didn't like all 152 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 2: of these like federal deportation machine things. But the things 153 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 2: that we have now are we have the actual this 154 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 2: is like I think were the public most valuable part 155 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:51,640 Speaker 2: of this whole thing is that we actually have a 156 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:56,320 Speaker 2: bunch of the documents now of what they were showing people. 157 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'd love to see the fucking Foyer fight for 158 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:05,160 Speaker 3: this because I have foyed the Department of Homeland Security 159 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 3: a lot and getting any Like I have a fire 160 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 3: out right now regarding the CBP one and the fact 161 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 3: that it doesn't work on non Apple phones, and they 162 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 3: very clearly know this, right like, if I know it, 163 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 3: they know it, And I would love to know if 164 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 3: that was from the outset that they knew and they 165 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 3: just didn't give a fuck, Like I would like to 166 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 3: see those emails regarding it doesn't work on Samsung. I 167 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 3: think I think they got it from a court order. 168 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 3: Oh okay, so they went to court to get Yeah yeah, yeah, 169 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:38,280 Speaker 3: every like people, Freedom Information Act is great. It only 170 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:40,120 Speaker 3: works if you have a lawyer who's prepared to sue 171 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 3: over it like that is the especially with DHS. You're 172 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 3: just not like, yeah, I've got stuff, so I found 173 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 3: in twenty twenty. They'll just kick it down, kick can 174 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:51,320 Speaker 3: down the road, like yep, I'm not going to get it, 175 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 3: but yeah, kudos to them for doing it. Yeah, it's 176 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,840 Speaker 3: so hard if you are a First Amendment lawyer, hit 177 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 3: me up. But okay, the ship that's in this one 178 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 3: of these things. The first page of this is maybe 179 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 3: the most deranged chart I have ever seen in anything. 180 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 3: Which is it is It is. 181 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 2: A picture of a naked human body, is the friends 182 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 2: and back of it, right, And they've labeled all of 183 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:20,000 Speaker 2: the parts of the body by and they've been so 184 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:21,440 Speaker 2: we only have a black and white version of this, 185 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 2: but they've they've been they've been labeled by how effective 186 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 2: it is to hit someone there with the baton? 187 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:30,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And they're like green in the in the 188 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:34,319 Speaker 3: actual document, they're green, yellow, and red. I guess, uh. 189 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 3: And then it says like reasoning for the red one, 190 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 3: I'll just read it highest level of resultant trauma injury 191 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 3: tends to range from serious to lung lasting rather than temporary, 192 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:47,160 Speaker 3: and may include unconsciousness, serious body injury, shock, or death. 193 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:51,320 Speaker 3: So I guess like it's saying like, don't hit them 194 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 3: in the in the in the red area. No, that's 195 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 3: the thing. That's the thing. They're not saying that, They're 196 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:58,240 Speaker 3: just saying, these are your options. 197 00:09:58,320 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. Is so part of this is supposed to be 198 00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 2: part of like a force escalation thing. But the point 199 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:04,560 Speaker 2: of this is that it is actually like they're trying 200 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:06,960 Speaker 2: to explain force escalation, and the thing is that like, yeah, 201 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:08,600 Speaker 2: you actually can do this, but you can only do 202 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:10,400 Speaker 2: this if you're in like the highest level of force 203 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 2: escalation or whatever. Okay, and if any of you have 204 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 2: ever been around a cop, you know, but those people 205 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 2: jump to the highest level of force escalation at like, yeah, 206 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 2: a fucking again, we have literally seen an acorn drop 207 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 2: and it can't be able to do this, right, and 208 00:10:24,559 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 2: so and so what they're what they're teaching these people, 209 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:28,840 Speaker 2: and this is like I think, like Jenny widely horrifying. 210 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 3: It's like, yeah, they are. 211 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 2: Teaching these people like the specific technical details of how 212 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:35,679 Speaker 2: you like fucking maim someone with a baton. 213 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, I meant to reading the force escalation this is 214 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:42,080 Speaker 3: and they actually did physical training right, like I think 215 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:44,559 Speaker 3: they did weapons training. I think they did a bunch 216 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 3: of a bunch of simulation kind of exercises. And then 217 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 3: if you if you scroll down, this is like a 218 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:56,120 Speaker 3: PowerPoint for those listening at home. They gave an overview 219 00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:58,880 Speaker 3: of like use of force to include a bunch of 220 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:01,719 Speaker 3: Supreme Court cases. I think that Supreme Court cases is 221 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 3: certainly yeah, Supreme court cases about use of force. None 222 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:08,440 Speaker 3: of these apply to you as a civilian, and you know, 223 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 3: like unless you're a sworn law enforcement officer, I guess 224 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 3: I'm not entirely sure like what the use case for 225 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 3: civilian baton training is aside from like well, I mean 226 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 3: my guess. 227 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:22,199 Speaker 2: And this is the way I've been like sort of 228 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 2: looking at this program is that this is the thing 229 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 2: partially being designed for PR, but it's partially also being 230 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 2: designed to create parabilitaries that if you're in a situation 231 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 2: like twenty twenty but about the border, for example, you 232 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:38,000 Speaker 2: suddenly have all of these people that you could just 233 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:40,720 Speaker 2: fucking call up because like part of what's going on 234 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:43,280 Speaker 2: with this too record you remember, like actually, I guess 235 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:45,719 Speaker 2: it is, funnily enough, like we are we are the 236 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:47,839 Speaker 2: only two of the four hosts who didn't end up 237 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: having to deal with fucking Bortak getting deployed in Portland 238 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 2: in twenty twenty. But Bortak is border patrols like swat teams. Yeah, 239 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 2: basically yeah, there are stated reason is like, oh, so 240 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 2: this is this so you understand what it's like to 241 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 2: like be one of these people, how hot it is 242 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 2: to be a cop and well, like I think the 243 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 2: actual reason again is so that you could you're training 244 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:10,720 Speaker 2: a bunch of people who you can just sort of 245 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 2: call up and be like, we need a bunch of 246 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 2: people to come like fucking obliterate a bunch of like 247 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 2: protesters or whatever, help them do mass deportations. Yeah, which 248 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 2: is another thing because like part of what this is 249 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 2: too is they're teaching them to do like raids on houses, right, 250 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 2: and like how do how do like physically fucking deport people? 251 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:32,800 Speaker 3: So this is yeah, like like Trump era ICE, which 252 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 3: were where there were open discussions of how many people 253 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 3: can we deport, how much will it cost, how easy 254 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 3: will it be? 255 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, And like right now, like Trump is like his 256 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:44,080 Speaker 2: big one of his big things is mass deportations. But 257 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:45,959 Speaker 2: I think people don't realize that the only reason that 258 00:12:45,960 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 2: this stuff didn't happen under Trump was that pushback to 259 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:52,079 Speaker 2: it was so enormous. Yeah, that like like there are 260 00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 2: democrats now who are screaming about the border, who in 261 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 2: like twenty eighteen were like sanctuary cities, ICE can't do 262 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 2: raids here, and sometimes which were sometimes that wasn't Yeah, 263 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 2: but like there was real systemic pushback to this, and 264 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:10,200 Speaker 2: I think like we're heading to a place where there 265 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 2: isn't a kind of reaction to this anymore, where this 266 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:17,679 Speaker 2: can get really really scary really quickly. And these are 267 00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:20,080 Speaker 2: the kinds of programs that you would need in order 268 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:22,720 Speaker 2: to just do actual master importations. Is that like yeah, 269 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 2: like Ice doesn't have enough people, Like they have a 270 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 2: lot of people, but they don't have enough people to 271 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 2: deport like several million people. 272 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:29,719 Speaker 3: You need people like this. 273 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:32,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, And the scale of this program is kind of small, 274 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:35,040 Speaker 2: but this is something that can be scaled up right, Yeah. 275 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:38,320 Speaker 3: To try and extremely large numbers of people, like fairly quickly. Yeah, 276 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:40,559 Speaker 3: you know what, it reminds me of Maya products and 277 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 3: services and support this podcast does. Yeah, all right, I 278 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 3: hope you enjoyed this. Products and seven suits way back. 279 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 3: We let's go do like the other thing they were 280 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 3: fucking doing. Oh yeah, it's more Jesus wept. So I 281 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:03,280 Speaker 3: want to quote from the article, yeah. Quote. 282 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 2: Documents also contain presentations on how to shoot a gun, 283 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 2: point at targets, and stand in position to fire. The 284 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 2: shooting practices include military style of rifles likewise, A training 285 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 2: in Atlanta organized drills to shoot at human like manikers 286 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:19,840 Speaker 2: and fires M four assault rifles employed exclusively with the military. 287 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:20,760 Speaker 3: The training. 288 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 2: Also included isis guidelines for use of force encompassing deadly force. 289 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 2: One presentation suggests yelling drop the gun as potential cover 290 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 2: when employing lethal force against someone. So they're telling it 291 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 2: and this is definitely supposed to be thinking like, oh, 292 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:38,760 Speaker 2: if you're in playing clothes, like you fucking yell police 293 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:41,760 Speaker 2: and yell drop your gun, and then you shoot them, 294 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:43,760 Speaker 2: and this is how you get away with it. So 295 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 2: like they are straight up teaching people how to murder people, 296 00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 2: like how to get away with murder. 297 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 3: That's what's happening here. Yeah, wild Yeah, Like the government's 298 00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:57,640 Speaker 3: offered firearms trading for civilians, Like that's kind of what 299 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 3: the NRA wasn't a government initiative. But yeah, this is 300 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 3: not that. This is not like, No, I would broadly 301 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 3: be in favor of the government funding free gun safety 302 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:09,920 Speaker 3: classes for people, because I've seen some shit with you know, 303 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 3: like that would be one of the useful things. But 304 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:12,600 Speaker 3: this is not that. 305 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:15,640 Speaker 2: No, And like and like the reason those specific classes 306 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:18,120 Speaker 2: like don't look like that anymore is because and I've 307 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 2: talked about this in some of the episodes on them, okay, assassination. 308 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:23,360 Speaker 2: It's like, well, yeah, when the government taught a bunch 309 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:24,960 Speaker 2: of people how to use rifles, those people use those 310 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 2: rifles to like fight the cops in the streets. Yeah right, yeah, 311 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 2: and now they're all this insane shit. That's like teaching 312 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 2: people how to get away with murder of their cop. Like, 313 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 2: I want to read a power point slide from that 314 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 2: from that thing, because it's it's the most deranged thing 315 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 2: I've ever seen. 316 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 3: Have you read the Graham versus Connor one, because it's 317 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 3: one of the more powerful uses of passive voice I've 318 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 3: ever seen. Oh no, I haven't seen that yet. Let 319 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 3: me read that while you look for yours. This one 320 00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 3: is just incredible instance of cops speak. Graham comma diabetic. 321 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 3: Comma asks friend to drive him to convenience store for 322 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 3: juice good like cops sent is here, ran in and 323 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 3: out of store. Comma also observed the suspicious activity. What 324 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:09,280 Speaker 3: suspicious activity, dear listener, I don't know. We're left to imagine. 325 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 3: Investigative stopped made and Graham was handcuffed by whom doesn't 326 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:19,000 Speaker 3: say weird. Graham receives multiple injuries during the encounter with police. 327 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,400 Speaker 3: Like someone gave him the fucking injuries? Was it the cop? 328 00:16:24,280 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 2: It's just an incredible use of passive voice here throughout. Yeah, 329 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 2: there's this great tweet that was like the US has 330 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 2: a passive voice, in an active voice, and a special 331 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 2: exonerative voice. 332 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:36,400 Speaker 3: It's only used for. 333 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:41,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, Israel gets the exiterative voice. 334 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:45,840 Speaker 3: It rails in the greater cop nation. Yeah yeah. 335 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 2: And like also, one of the things that I don't 336 00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 2: think people understand on the Streme Court is like, if 337 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:53,080 Speaker 2: you think that like Supreme Court rulings about abortions are bad, 338 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 2: like then they are right. But like, if you think 339 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 2: those things are bad, look up the Supreme Court cases 340 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 2: about police use of force. You will get you will 341 00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:04,359 Speaker 2: get nine O decisions with like all of like fucking 342 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:07,680 Speaker 2: like like fucking Thurgood Marshall will be signing on to 343 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 2: like a nine O thing where he says that cops 344 00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 2: have the right to just like shoot you in the 345 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:12,760 Speaker 2: back of the head because they couldn't shoot you in 346 00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 2: the back of the head like that the police couldn't function. 347 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:19,400 Speaker 2: It's it's fucking dranged, like the kind of shit they have. Okay, 348 00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:21,520 Speaker 2: I want to read I want to read the slide 349 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:23,040 Speaker 2: because it's it's amazing. 350 00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:24,320 Speaker 3: It's just a giant letters. 351 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:27,920 Speaker 2: It says survival, and then there's like bullet points, and 352 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:31,560 Speaker 2: the bullet points are never give up, never concede defeat. 353 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,400 Speaker 2: I will not die this way. I must go home 354 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 2: to my family. How you trade is how you will fight. 355 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 3: Just imagining that the you know, the person who I 356 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 3: go to at the bank when I need to take 357 00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 3: out large amounts of cash to go on one of 358 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 3: my work trips, learning that I will not die this way. 359 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 2: Okay, So that that that's basically what I have about 360 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 2: this program, other than the bleak note that on on 361 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:00,159 Speaker 2: a pr level, of these people one right, they they 362 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:02,640 Speaker 2: didn't win because of anything they did. They won because 363 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 2: the Democrats decided that they fucking hated immigrants, and because 364 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 2: views of integration are largely driven by by party politics, 365 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:14,200 Speaker 2: are driven by what your party tells you about immigrants, Like, yeah, 366 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:16,880 Speaker 2: all the support that had been built in the late 367 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 2: twenty tens has evaporated. 368 00:18:18,560 --> 00:18:21,520 Speaker 3: And yeah, even like I did a thing for my 369 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:25,040 Speaker 3: Patreon yesterday then made me think of this, Like I 370 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 3: was trying to just do a sort of listing of 371 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:30,760 Speaker 3: Joe Biden's immigration policies, right, from twenty twenty one to present, 372 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,919 Speaker 3: and like twenty twenty one, twenty twenty two, I was 373 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 3: selling stories to NBC, to slate to the nation right 374 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 3: about Haitian migration, about Title forty two, about remain in Mexico, 375 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 3: about especial immigrant visas for Afghans, And after twenty twenty 376 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 3: two you don't even get a response to your email. 377 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:51,879 Speaker 3: You know, the same shit keeps having with twenty twenty 378 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 3: three is the end of Title forty two, right, So 379 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,119 Speaker 3: when we see the beginning of out door detention, arguably 380 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:59,680 Speaker 3: the most heinous shit that the Biden administration has done, 381 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 3: it's that's some pretty heanish shit. I mean, genocide is worse, evidently, 382 00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 3: but on the on the border, this is the worst. Yeah, 383 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 3: some of its worst domestic policy. And you just can't 384 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 3: tell stories. Literally every time I post about this on Twitter, 385 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 3: people will be like, what the fuck? Why didn't I 386 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,120 Speaker 3: read about this? Because an editor made a choice that 387 00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:21,520 Speaker 3: they didn't matter, that the people out there in the 388 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:23,199 Speaker 3: cold and the wind at the rain didn't matter, and 389 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:26,639 Speaker 3: that they don't have rights because aoc or Joe Biden 390 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:28,679 Speaker 3: Orkamala Harris decided that that was how it was going 391 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 3: to be and apparently every corporate media outlet just kind 392 00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 3: of stepped in line and went, yeah, fucking we don't 393 00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 3: care anymore. Yeah, it's pretty bad. 394 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, they've achieved their stated aim and they're not moving 395 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 2: on to their unstated aim, which is mass deportations. 396 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 3: All right, we're back. 397 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 2: Everything I know about the program that you were about 398 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 2: to talk about comes from you, and that is oh boy, 399 00:19:59,119 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 2: it's not good. 400 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:04,120 Speaker 3: All right, So I'm going to read you a small 401 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,760 Speaker 3: story here, and then we're going to talk about whether 402 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:08,720 Speaker 3: or not it's a good idea for the Border Patrol 403 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 3: to have programs for children. Okay, and then I gave 404 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 3: a content warning for sexual assault of children. I'm just 405 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:18,840 Speaker 3: in kiitch. You don't want to listen to this. In 406 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 3: August of this year, Aaron Mitchell, a former CBP agent, 407 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:25,439 Speaker 3: was found guilty of a federal civil rights violation and 408 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 3: also kidnapping. On April the twenty fifth, twenty twenty two, 409 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 3: in Douglas, Arizona, Mitchell found a fifteen year old girl 410 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:34,199 Speaker 3: waiting for school to begin. And for this next part, 411 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:35,879 Speaker 3: I'm just going to read directly from the Department of 412 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:39,920 Speaker 3: Justice presser. He introduced himself as a law enforcement officer 413 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:43,200 Speaker 3: and asked for her papers. Next, after flashing his police 414 00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:46,120 Speaker 3: badge and credentials, Mitchell ordered the child into his car 415 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 3: and explained that he was taking her to the police station. Instead, 416 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,480 Speaker 3: Mitchell drove the car miles away from her school, pulled over, 417 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:56,240 Speaker 3: and restrained her hands and feet with two pairs of handcuffs. 418 00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 3: The victim testified that after being handcuffs to defend it 419 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:02,199 Speaker 3: and told her to do everything he said because he 420 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 3: didn't want to have to hurt her. I'm not going 421 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:08,000 Speaker 3: to describe an nextpy in detail. He repeatedly sexually assaulted 422 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 3: this young women fucking christ in his apartment, then returned 423 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 3: her to the middle school where he had abducted her, 424 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,879 Speaker 3: and reminded her not to tell anyone. Fortunately, she immediately 425 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:23,359 Speaker 3: reported the abduction to her friends, family members, and multiple 426 00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:26,960 Speaker 3: law enforcement agencies. During an interview with the police, a 427 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 3: defendant exclaim exclaimed that the victim had better hope I 428 00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:33,160 Speaker 3: don't get out of here, which is an insane thing 429 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:36,360 Speaker 3: to say when you're being interviewed by the police. Yeah. 430 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:40,199 Speaker 3: He also googled several times for how long does it 431 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:43,880 Speaker 3: take to smug someone? And he googled a lot about 432 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,159 Speaker 3: sexual assault, how to stop someone from screaming. It's some 433 00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 3: of the darkest shit fuck you're ever going to read. Yeah, 434 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 3: oh my god. This is one of the relatively few 435 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,199 Speaker 3: instances of a Border Patrol agent actually being convicted of 436 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:00,560 Speaker 3: sexual assault. Sexual assault is a massive fucking problem in 437 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:02,879 Speaker 3: the Border Patrol, and the fact that it's such a 438 00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:05,840 Speaker 3: big problem and people get away with it is why 439 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:08,879 Speaker 3: we get shit that is horrific, Like the incident that 440 00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 3: I've just related to you right in twenty nineteen. I 441 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:14,199 Speaker 3: don't know if you remember this, but there was a 442 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:17,560 Speaker 3: pro publicer thing about this Facebook group which had nine 443 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:21,000 Speaker 3: five hundred agents in it. The Facebook group they proted 444 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 3: videos of migrant desks, their children, and rape fantasies, as 445 00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:28,719 Speaker 3: well as doctored images, including ghost images of AFC. At 446 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,720 Speaker 3: the time, Karla provosd, the Border Patrol chief, condemned the 447 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 3: group as inappropriate. Shortly thereafter, the insect reveal that she 448 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 3: had been a member of it for years. Yep, just classics, 449 00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:43,959 Speaker 3: dove right. Border Patrol has consistently failed to hold its 450 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:46,439 Speaker 3: offices to account for rape. Like if you want to 451 00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,520 Speaker 3: read more about this, Jen Bud, She's been on the 452 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,479 Speaker 3: show before is the person to go to about this. 453 00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,440 Speaker 3: I'm also going to include in the show notes links 454 00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 3: to a story about a Border Patrol agent who was 455 00:22:57,240 --> 00:22:59,919 Speaker 3: sexually assaulted at the academy, which I know is as 456 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:01,920 Speaker 3: a thing that is not unique to her. This is 457 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 3: this is a problem. Border Patrol is ninety five percent 458 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:08,439 Speaker 3: male at this point. They call the women the fierce 459 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:13,439 Speaker 3: five percent. But it's like it's probably the most like 460 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 3: gender biased of the federal agencies. Like Border Patrol agents 461 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:20,080 Speaker 3: by and large, like do not do well around women. 462 00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:23,119 Speaker 3: This is something I've observed, this is something other volunteers 463 00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:27,400 Speaker 3: have observed, Like it's such a like masculine agency, I guess, 464 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 3: and they just don't encounter women in a professional capacity 465 00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:32,960 Speaker 3: very often. So I think with this in mind, I 466 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,560 Speaker 3: want to talk about the Border Patrol Explorers, Right. It's 467 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,480 Speaker 3: a youth program that teaches kids the skills of a 468 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:43,920 Speaker 3: patrol agent from as young as forty fucking crust. Yeah, 469 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 3: what's really weird. There's been very little coverage. The two 470 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:50,720 Speaker 3: places I would send people these will be in the notes, 471 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 3: would be Morley Music Write a really good piece in 472 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,920 Speaker 3: the Nation, and Todd Miller's book Border Patrol Nation, which 473 00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,399 Speaker 3: is a book that everyone should read. I think really 474 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 3: like detail is the beginning of how border patrol became 475 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:04,560 Speaker 3: what it is today. Those are really two of the 476 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:07,399 Speaker 3: very few places you'd read about it. The training that 477 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 3: they do is insane. They'll learn firearms drills, they learn 478 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 3: to do checkpoints, they learned to make arrests. I'm going 479 00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 3: to read from an interview from Monie Music's piece, Fabian 480 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:23,479 Speaker 3: explained why his posts would practice shooting sometimes, and then 481 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:27,640 Speaker 3: this is like parentheses. Undocumented migrants are not compliant when 482 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 3: we find them. He said, they paid all this money 483 00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,439 Speaker 3: to get here to start another life. They're just not 484 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,000 Speaker 3: going to give up when they see us. Some would 485 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 3: fight back, some would be compliant. Maybe they tried to 486 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,359 Speaker 3: kill you or threaten you. Sometimes they pick up an 487 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:42,879 Speaker 3: element a rock lying around anything, and that could be 488 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 3: used to kill you. This is not the stuff that 489 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:47,640 Speaker 3: fourteen year olds should be reckoning with, right. 490 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. This is also like I know people have done 491 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,680 Speaker 2: the like connect the border to Palestine things so much 492 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,240 Speaker 2: that it's like hackneyed, but like that is straight up 493 00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 2: that could be lifted from a press release, like from 494 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:04,919 Speaker 2: the idea yeah yeah about why they shot someone yeah, 495 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:06,720 Speaker 2: and it's like, yeah, I mean, you shouldn't be teaching 496 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:10,040 Speaker 2: anyone this, You especially shouldn't be teaching fourteen year olds. Yeah, 497 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,400 Speaker 2: that someone might throw a rock at them, and that's 498 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,160 Speaker 2: a reasonable way people had a gun and shoot them. Yeah. 499 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,040 Speaker 3: Like if you back that into your mind at fourteen, 500 00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:19,160 Speaker 3: I would argue that makes you very unsuitable to carry 501 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:22,160 Speaker 3: a gun in public. Later in life. Kids start out 502 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:26,080 Speaker 3: by doing this kind of boot camp style academy and 503 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 3: then they pretty much begin doing stuff like drill PT 504 00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:34,199 Speaker 3: they practice, conducting vehicle stops and tracking Border Patrol. On 505 00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 3: their website, they claim to have more than seven hundred Explorers, 506 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 3: but over twenty eight posts around the country. It's very 507 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 3: hard to find anything about them. Like, it's not something 508 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:44,919 Speaker 3: that they talk about a great deal. You have to 509 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:47,320 Speaker 3: sort of apply. I looked at how one would apply. 510 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:49,920 Speaker 3: It's one in Santa Sedra, Right. You sort of fill 511 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 3: out this form and you get some kind of clearance 512 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 3: and then I'm guessing they're checking that people are eligible 513 00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 3: to be like hied by Border Patrol. Right, But if 514 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 3: there is data on how many of these kids go 515 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 3: on to be hired by BP, I haven't found it, 516 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 3: but I did find one. I think this is again 517 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:09,359 Speaker 3: from Morley Music's piece when extremely amusing incident the Douglas 518 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,840 Speaker 3: Arizona chapters. The Explorers teamed up with a local high 519 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 3: school drama club and they had the kids playing migrants. Yeah, 520 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 3: Jesus Christ, many of these people will themselves be like 521 00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 3: first generation or like a. 522 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:31,880 Speaker 2: Wild Anyway, the country cannot be allowed to continue. 523 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 3: Imagine, like, what are we doing at school today? The 524 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,480 Speaker 3: theater kids are going to get arrested by the border 525 00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:43,800 Speaker 3: patrol kids. Jesus Christ. Some of the theater kids got 526 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 3: really into character. One of them cried. I guess several 527 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 3: of them managed to avoid arrest and give the young 528 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 3: agents the slip, and then they got told by the 529 00:26:56,160 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 3: agents overseeing the exercise that they've done it wrong because 530 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:03,959 Speaker 3: they'd outsmarted the junior gobs. 531 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,720 Speaker 2: There's a story I can't remember what fucking town it 532 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 2: was in like the fifties that the Army was running 533 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 2: these like infiltration drills where they would like have a 534 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 2: town and they talk to people to town. They'd be like, Okay, 535 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,320 Speaker 2: we're gonna like unleash like a communist diversive agent into 536 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:20,280 Speaker 2: the town, and then you're gonna help the army capture them, 537 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 2: and it said, what happens, everyone has hit the agent 538 00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 2: because I just had a great time like stuff. 539 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:31,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, that is the American spirit. It's it's the people 540 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,439 Speaker 3: of dug this Arizona. We salute you. One of the 541 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 3: things I found really interesting in in the morning music 542 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,960 Speaker 3: piece was this idea of like defensive asylum only being 543 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,000 Speaker 3: for criminals. So it seems like the students learned this 544 00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:47,160 Speaker 3: very binary immigration law. Where defensive asylum, which is when 545 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 3: you claim asylum as a defense against being deported, Yeah, 546 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 3: it's only for people who are criminals versus affirmative asylum. 547 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:56,080 Speaker 3: It's for the people who like really need it or whatever. 548 00:27:56,400 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 3: We fast forward making an affirmative asylum claims extremely difficult 549 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:05,399 Speaker 3: right now. Yeah, you know, I spoke to one hundred 550 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 3: people who wanted to come to this country in the Darien. 551 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,679 Speaker 3: Every single one of those people told me that they 552 00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:14,040 Speaker 3: wanted to use CBP one, that they wanted to do 553 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 3: it the correct way, that they wanted to wait their 554 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 3: turn and do an interview. But like every single one 555 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 3: of those people is now reckoning with the fact that 556 00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 3: if they can make CVP wan work on their phone, 557 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:26,959 Speaker 3: they will wake eight or nine months in Mexico. That 558 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:28,919 Speaker 3: is not a safe place if you're a woman on 559 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,440 Speaker 3: your own, God forbid, if you're a trans woman or 560 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,960 Speaker 3: a gay person like aside from like within certain communities, 561 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 3: it's not a safe place. I think Mexico is the 562 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 3: second highest rate of killings of trans people anywhere in 563 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,920 Speaker 3: the world. Yeah, I think Brazil is maybe more. Yeah, 564 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 3: bort I think is the highest. I don't know if 565 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 3: that's like raw numbers because Brazil is a bigger country, 566 00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 3: or if it's like stags the population. 567 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:53,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, my memory is that it's the rate, But I'm 568 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,440 Speaker 2: not harm so sure either way that people who are. 569 00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 3: Coming to be safe or not to be in a 570 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 3: place where they're in danger, that is what they face, 571 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 3: right And so undoubtedly some of those people who wanted 572 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:09,440 Speaker 3: to come the right way will cross between ports of entry, 573 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,160 Speaker 3: they will surrender themselves to border patrol, and if they 574 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 3: get a chance to file for asylum at all, because 575 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,680 Speaker 3: it's it's a shout test now, But there are numerous 576 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 3: incidents that I've seen described in court cases of people 577 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 3: doing what sounds to me like asserting an asylum claim 578 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 3: and not having a chance to then make their case. 579 00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 3: If they do at all, it'll be defensive asylum, right. 580 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:34,120 Speaker 3: And these are the people who are like textbook asylum places, 581 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 3: you know, like I am a trans person in a 582 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,520 Speaker 3: place where that might well be punishable by death, de 583 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,760 Speaker 3: facto of du jure right. I am a political dissident 584 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:45,040 Speaker 3: in a country where my political views would be a 585 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 3: reason to kill me. I am a woman from Iran 586 00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 3: who doesn't wear hijab, nicab whatever, you know, Like these 587 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 3: are like why asylum exists. There are lots of people 588 00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 3: who deserve a help who are not covered by these 589 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:01,840 Speaker 3: little buckets. We put people in to for asylum, but 590 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 3: even people who are who falls slap in the middle 591 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,680 Speaker 3: of what your average Midwestern liberal dad would be like, Yeah, 592 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,600 Speaker 3: that's an asylum case. We should help that person. Yeah, 593 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 3: they have to come in. They fare the defense of asylum, 594 00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 3: and that's what we're teaching. I guess these border patrol 595 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 3: kids that these are the quite unquite bad guys, and 596 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 3: they're not. And yeah, they they're doing this sort of 597 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 3: twenty eight posts. It's just one. I read a terrible 598 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 3: account of a young woman who was sexually abused by 599 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 3: a cop in a police Explorer program. Like these Explorer 600 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:38,880 Speaker 3: programs go all across law enforcement. They are administered by 601 00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:42,959 Speaker 3: the Boy Scouts of America. They have a serious problem 602 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 3: with abuse of young people as serious problem, and it 603 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,120 Speaker 3: seems like it's not getting I mean, it does get 604 00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 3: some coverage, like this, this piece about the agent in 605 00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,320 Speaker 3: Douglas got some coverage, right, the piece about this this cop. 606 00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:56,840 Speaker 3: But like, I mean, look at this country. We still 607 00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:59,240 Speaker 3: have the Catholic Church. Just because people abuse kids doesn't 608 00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:02,040 Speaker 3: mean they get shut down. But like, yeah, I don't, 609 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:04,160 Speaker 3: don't don't send your kids. I guess you're listening to this. 610 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 3: You're quite unlikely to send your kids to be junior cops. 611 00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:10,840 Speaker 3: But like, I get young people living in small towns 612 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 3: on the border who don't have many economic opportunities. I 613 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,600 Speaker 3: know those towns. I spend a lot of time in 614 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 3: those towns. And I get that the guys who joined 615 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,160 Speaker 3: Border Patrol, they have big trucks, they have nice houses, right, 616 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:27,120 Speaker 3: that it's one of the few areas of economic opportunity. 617 00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 3: I get that none of that is worth having your 618 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,200 Speaker 3: kid abused. And like I'm not saying that, of course 619 00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,640 Speaker 3: all of these programs resulting child abuse, they don't. But 620 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:37,560 Speaker 3: like law Enforcement Explorer programs absolutely have a problem with 621 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:38,280 Speaker 3: child abuse. 622 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,760 Speaker 2: And yeah, yeah, there was a whole thing in like 623 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:45,400 Speaker 2: the last couple of years about this happening in tension 624 00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 2: facilities in Chicago or intention facilities, things that were supposed 625 00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 2: to be like now figurant housing, and that got reported. Yeah, weirdly. Weirdly, 626 00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:55,680 Speaker 2: the Chicago proces has actually been pretty good on immigration stuff. 627 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 2: But it's literally solely because they hate Brandon Johnson, and 628 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,880 Speaker 2: Brandon Johnson's the one running it. Because of this, we've 629 00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:07,560 Speaker 2: actually gotten a bunch of good good reporting that accident. Yeah, yeah, 630 00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 2: in many such cases. But yeah, like the culture of 631 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:12,200 Speaker 2: border patrol is not one that you want to. 632 00:32:12,160 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 3: Be introducing your child too. Yeah, absolutely not. You know, 633 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,080 Speaker 3: I would really encourage people to read Todd's book Border 634 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 3: Patrol Nation, like he talks about this use of They 635 00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:23,840 Speaker 3: invented a new slur, which you know, is cool. Good 636 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 3: for them for expanding the English language. I guess they 637 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 3: call people tonks. Oh yeah, yeah, some noise that makes 638 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,000 Speaker 3: when you hit someone on the head with your torch 639 00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:37,240 Speaker 3: your flashlight. Yeah yeah, just really great stuff. Some of 640 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 3: the worst people who've ever lived. Yeah, don't don't volunteer 641 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:42,200 Speaker 3: to be a cop. Don't do it for money either, 642 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 3: Like that's what I got for you. Yeah, yeah, I 643 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:49,440 Speaker 3: think that's all we've got for today. Yeah. Shit fucking sucks. 644 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 3: I don't know. 645 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:54,080 Speaker 2: We gave you, We gave you some less depressing episodes, 646 00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 2: but yeah, now we're back ruin your week. Actually, I 647 00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:59,680 Speaker 2: could promise. I could promise tomorrow's episode is going to 648 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,320 Speaker 2: be a lot writer for this one. Yeah, come back 649 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:04,959 Speaker 2: tomorrow to be less horribly depressed. 650 00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, I got nothing good for you coming up for 651 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:09,640 Speaker 3: the near future. To be honest, I'm rite. I think 652 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 3: about the Darien Gap and having to take little walks outside. Yeah, yeah, 653 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:14,800 Speaker 3: get for a walk. 654 00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 1: It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 655 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,000 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 656 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:26,640 Speaker 1: coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 657 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:30,320 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can 658 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,680 Speaker 1: now find sources for It Could Happen here listed directly 659 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,000 Speaker 1: in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.