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Speaker 1: I started to realize that not being an expert isn't

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Speaker 1: a liability, it's a real gift. If we don't know

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Speaker 1: something about ourselves at this point in our life, it's

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Speaker 1: probably because it's uncomfortable to know. If you can die

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Speaker 1: before you die, then you can really live. There's a

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Speaker 1: wisdom at death's door. I thought I was insane. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I didn't know what to do because there was

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Speaker 1: no internet. I don't know, man, I'm like, I feel

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Speaker 1: like everything is hard. Hey, y'all, my name is Kat.

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Speaker 1: I'm a human first and a licensed therapist second. And

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Speaker 1: right now I'm inviting you into conversations that I hope

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Speaker 1: encourage you to become more curious and less judgmental about yourself, others,

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Speaker 1: and the world around you. Welcome to You Need Therapy. Hi, guys,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to a new Monday episode of You Need Therapy Podcast.

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Speaker 1: This is Kat, I'm the host, and today we're gonna

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Speaker 1: have a nice cozy solo episode. Now, before we get

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Speaker 1: into that, quick reminder that although I am a therapist

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Speaker 1: and this is called You Need Therapy, this podcast does

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Speaker 1: not serve as a replacement or substitute for any actual

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Speaker 1: mental health services. Now today I'm kind of, in a way,

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Speaker 1: going to bring the vibe down in order to bring

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Speaker 1: it back up. But I'm gonna kind of bring the

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Speaker 1: vibe down because we are talking about loneliness, which is

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Speaker 1: something a lot of people really don't like to feel.

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Speaker 1: They don't like to talk about it, they don't like

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Speaker 1: to touch. It's just like blenh But something that has

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Speaker 1: been consistent for a very long time, as long as

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Speaker 1: I can remember as a therapist is when clients come

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Speaker 1: to me, they usually bring a presenting problem, but often

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Speaker 1: what they're really coming to me for is a lack

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Speaker 1: of real connection and a desire for true connection. And

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Speaker 1: they may say, Hey, I want to work on my

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Speaker 1: anger or I want to get rid of my eing disorder.

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Speaker 1: But when we get down to things, we are very

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Speaker 1: much talking about behaviors that really revolve around the avoidance

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Speaker 1: of feeling lonely or the attempts to not be lonely.

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Speaker 1: And I say this because I have known and acknowledged

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Speaker 1: and talked about loneliness being an issue in our culture

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Speaker 1: and how our world works for a while. But at

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Speaker 1: the same time, I'm not I'm necessarily not really doing

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Speaker 1: much about that other than helping the individual people that

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Speaker 1: come to my office. And I read a recent article

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Speaker 1: in psychology today that said, this is quoted loneliness is

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Speaker 1: not a personal problem, but rather a social epidemic interconnected

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Speaker 1: with the history of capitalism and individualism. Which might sound

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Speaker 1: like a lot, it might feel really heavy, but it's

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Speaker 1: also very true. This makes a lot of sense. Loneliness

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Speaker 1: is not a experience that anyone would wish upon themselves,

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Speaker 1: and it's something that many people would do anything you

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Speaker 1: told them to in order to feel the opposite, in

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Speaker 1: order to feel social connection. But this explains why none

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Speaker 1: of the tricks or the individual things that people might

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Speaker 1: gain from individual therapy seem to work when solving this

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Speaker 1: larger scale problem. It's not just them problem. It's a

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Speaker 1: wee problem, and it's going to take we or us

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Speaker 1: to fix it. We can't keep putting the work on

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Speaker 1: the one person. Our culture is creating a lot of

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Speaker 1: social issues that we continue to blame on individuals, and

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Speaker 1: then the individuals come looking for solutions, but they themselves

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Speaker 1: can only do so much. They actually alone can't fix

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Speaker 1: the system. And some of you might be aware of this,

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Speaker 1: some not. Some of you might be aware of this,

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Speaker 1: but last week, the Surgeon General put out an advisory

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Speaker 1: on the loneliness epidemic in our country. And if you're like, wait,

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Speaker 1: what does that mean? They put out an advisory. So

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Speaker 1: a Surgeon General's advisory is a public statement that calls

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Speaker 1: the American people's attention to an urgent public health issue

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Speaker 1: to provide recommendations for how it should be addressed. Advisories

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Speaker 1: are reserved for significant public health challenges that require the

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Speaker 1: nation's immediate awareness and action. Aka. These are reserved for

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Speaker 1: very big deals. And I want to read a little

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Speaker 1: bit of the initial letter that is directly from the

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Speaker 1: Surgeon General. It's pretty long. In the show notes, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to link that Psychology Today article that I referenced

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Speaker 1: above and the Surgeon General advisory so you can look

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Speaker 1: at the whole thing. It's like a thirty page maybe

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Speaker 1: in law I want to say, maybe it's actually like

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Speaker 1: eighty pages, eighty page long document, and in it he

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Speaker 1: has a direct letter. I'm going to read a little

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Speaker 1: bit from that direct letter because there is a lot

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Speaker 1: of things that were super impactful that he said. So

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Speaker 1: I'm taking direct quotes from there, but it's not the

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Speaker 1: whole thing. People began to tell me they felt isolated, invisible,

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Speaker 1: and insignificant, even when they couldn't put their finger on

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Speaker 1: the word lonely. Time and time again, people of all

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Speaker 1: ages and socioeconomic backgrounds, from every corner of the country

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Speaker 1: would tell me, I have to shoulder all of life's

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Speaker 1: burdens by myself, or if I disappeared tomorrow, nobody would

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Speaker 1: ever notice. It was a light bulb moment for me.

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Speaker 1: Social disconnection was far more common than I had realized.

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Speaker 1: Loneliness is far more than just a bad feeling. It

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Speaker 1: harms both the individual and societal health. It is associated

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Speaker 1: with the greater risk of cardiovascular disease, dementia, stroke, depression, anxiety,

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Speaker 1: and premature death. The mortality impact of being socially disconnected

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Speaker 1: is similar to that caused by smoking up to fifteen

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Speaker 1: cigarettes a day, and even greater than that associated with

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Speaker 1: obesity and physical activity. And the harmful consequences of a

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Speaker 1: society that lacks social connection can be felt in our schools, workplaces,

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Speaker 1: and civic organizations, where performance, productivity, and engagement are diminished.

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Speaker 1: Given the profound consequtce prinstans of loneliness and isolation, we

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Speaker 1: have an opportunity and an obligation to make the same

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Speaker 1: investments in addressing social connection that we have made in

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Speaker 1: addressing tobacco used obesity and the addiction crisis. If we

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Speaker 1: fail to do so, we will pay an ever increasing

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Speaker 1: price in the form of our individual and collective health

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Speaker 1: and well being, and we will continue to splinter and

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Speaker 1: divide until we can no longer stand as a community

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Speaker 1: or a country. Instead of coming together to take on

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Speaker 1: the great challenges before us, we will further retreat to

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Speaker 1: our corners, angry, sick, and alone. So that is heavy,

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Speaker 1: and it's a lot, and it might sound like simple

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Speaker 1: words at the same time, if you're paying attention, it's

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Speaker 1: not simple. He made some really good points that we're

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Speaker 1: going to talk about even further. But the fact that

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Speaker 1: feeling a lack of social connection can have a greater

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Speaker 1: harm and can be a greater risk to your health

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Speaker 1: than smoking fifteen cigarets a day is wild to me,

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Speaker 1: because you know what, I would never do, never, ever, ever,

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Speaker 1: ever smoke fifteen sigrets a day because I know what

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Speaker 1: that could cause, and so I'm not going to do that. However,

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Speaker 1: and I even see that when I see people smoking,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, I can't believe you would smoke that cigarette

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Speaker 1: knowing that that could do. I have those thoughts. At

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Speaker 1: the same time, I see people that are lonely all

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Speaker 1: the time, and I don't look at that the same

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Speaker 1: way I would look at my life and the risks

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Speaker 1: I would be taking if I was smoking cigarettes. Now,

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Speaker 1: I know that smoking cigarettes is a choice, and loneliness

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Speaker 1: isn't always a choice. But I say that because it

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Speaker 1: just is wild that I don't think the same whoe factor,

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Speaker 1: and I think we need to start doing that. And

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Speaker 1: what is crazy to me? I can only speak to

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Speaker 1: my for myself. I assume there's other people that feel

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Speaker 1: this way as well, but I can't know that. But

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Speaker 1: I've known about this for a long time, like I've known,

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Speaker 1: like I said earlier, and the reason I even brought

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Speaker 1: that up, I've known that loneliness has been an issue

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Speaker 1: and it's something I'm constantly working with for a long time.

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Speaker 1: But at the same time, like I'm saying, it doesn't

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Speaker 1: always feel like a big deal. And I stumbled upon

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Speaker 1: this advisory. I think it came out the first I

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Speaker 1: stumbled upon it two weeks after it was out. It's

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Speaker 1: not like I saw this the first day I stumbled

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Speaker 1: upon it accidentally, Thank god I did. But there's probably

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Speaker 1: people that are listening that didn't know it was out.

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Speaker 1: And at this point, it's been out for three weeks,

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Speaker 1: and this is a public a huge public health crisis

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Speaker 1: that he is saying we need to put immediate attention

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Speaker 1: on it now. And again, some of the things that

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Speaker 1: I wrestle with in my head is loneliness can't cause

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Speaker 1: this kind of crisis. I go back to that thinking

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Speaker 1: that has been like endoctrined into us that loneliness is

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Speaker 1: an individual problem, and so if people are lonely, then

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Speaker 1: they're lonely. I put like a period on that sentence.

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Speaker 1: I don't initially think about the side effects of loneliness.

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Speaker 1: If loneliness was a disease, what would the side effects be,

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Speaker 1: I mean, off the top of my head, depression, loss

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Speaker 1: of interest in things, poor work ethic, overindulging, under indulging, apathy, anxiety, piety,

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Speaker 1: poor self esteem, poor sense of self, poor self care,

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Speaker 1: poor hygiene. And if we have masses of people that

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Speaker 1: are all experiencing these side effects, we're going to see

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Speaker 1: issues everywhere. We are going to see declines in all

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Speaker 1: kinds of things. So I say all this, and I

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Speaker 1: even am creating this to be a episode in its

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Speaker 1: own right, because this is a big deal and we

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Speaker 1: have to start treating it like it's a big deal.

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Speaker 1: The question that I have is do we have space

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Speaker 1: and do we have the attention span or the patience

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Speaker 1: to acknowledge that? And I ask that question because social

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Speaker 1: issues can be very overwhelming because of the consistency that

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Speaker 1: it takes to address them. And what I mean by

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Speaker 1: that is nothing is going to change about this without

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Speaker 1: really small changes that seemingly seem insignificant until they become

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Speaker 1: ripple effects. There isn't one solution, there's not one medication,

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Speaker 1: there's not one rule or one thing that we can

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Speaker 1: all do to change this. It's a bunch of smaller

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Speaker 1: things that will then combined over time, shift this crisis.

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Speaker 1: And that idea can feel really defeating for people, so

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Speaker 1: it becomes easier to live in denial than to do

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Speaker 1: the work to not have something we need to deny.

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Speaker 1: But this makes you think of Mike Foster and what

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Speaker 1: he said last week. This makes you think of Mike

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Speaker 1: Foster and what he said last week and what he

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Speaker 1: shared with this and said, at some point, you just

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Speaker 1: get sick and tired of agreeing with your pain. And

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Speaker 1: I'm mixing that with my favorite market Meat quote where

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Speaker 1: she says, never doubt that a small group of committed

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Speaker 1: citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing

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Speaker 1: that ever has. And so with those two thoughts, I'm

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Speaker 1: considering all of you people listening my small group of

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Speaker 1: committed citizens, and I'm personally sick of agreeing with the

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Speaker 1: loneliness epidemic. This doesn't have to be the world that

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Speaker 1: we continue to live in. We do have agency and

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Speaker 1: we have choice, and sometimes we forget that. So obviously

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Speaker 1: I'm going to talk about today ways that we can

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Speaker 1: shift this. But before we get there, I want to

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Speaker 1: share some more of the information that was in the

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Speaker 1: advisory that felt really important to me. And again I

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Speaker 1: am going to put this in the note. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you can google it, but I'll put it in there

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Speaker 1: so you can just click on it and you can

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Speaker 1: read the thing in its entirety. It's really long, like

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Speaker 1: I said, so you might have to read it in

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Speaker 1: bits and pieces. It's pretty heavy and deep. But I

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Speaker 1: want to start with how they define loneliness. So in

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Speaker 1: this advisory, they define loneliness as a subjective internal state.

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Speaker 1: It's the distressing experience that results from perceived isolation or

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Speaker 1: an unmet need of an individual's preferred and actual experience.

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Speaker 1: And I like that they define this because then they

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Speaker 1: separate it from social isolation. So loneliness would not be

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Speaker 1: the same as social isolation, which is defined as objectively

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Speaker 1: having few social relationships, social roles, groups, memberships, and infrequent

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Speaker 1: social interaction. So loneliness is than in the subjective internal state,

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Speaker 1: and then social isolation is more that objectively defined not

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Speaker 1: having those things. So in the letter that I in

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Speaker 1: the quotes that I read earlier, they kind of touched

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Speaker 1: on this, but they say that loneliness and social isolation

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Speaker 1: increase their risk for premature death by twenty six percent

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Speaker 1: and twenty nine percent, respectively. Poor and sufficient social connection

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Speaker 1: is associated with the increased risk of disease, including twenty

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Speaker 1: nine percent increased risk of heart disease and a thirty

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Speaker 1: two percent increase risk of stroke, which is wild, and

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Speaker 1: it's associated with the increased risk of anxiety, depression, and dementia,

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Speaker 1: and may cause increased susceptibility to viruses and respiratory illnesses,

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Speaker 1: which has been coming up a lot lately of how

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Speaker 1: our mental health is then affecting our immune system. And

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Speaker 1: what is still crazy is people might think, yeah, ye, yeah,

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Speaker 1: those wild statistics, but I don't struggle with that, so

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Speaker 1: I'm not really affected by this epidemic. But there's no

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Speaker 1: way even if you don't struggle with loneliness, which we

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Speaker 1: all at times feel lonely, but there's no way that

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Speaker 1: this doesn't affect you. Because I want to reduce some

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Speaker 1: more information. Social isolation among older adults alone accounts for

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Speaker 1: an estimated six point seven billion in excess medicare spending annually,

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Speaker 1: and beyond direct healthcare spending, loneliness and isolation are associated

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Speaker 1: with lower academic achievement and worse performance at work. In

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Speaker 1: the US, stress related absenteeism attributed to loneliness cost employers

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Speaker 1: and estimated one hundred and fifty four billion dollars annually.

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Speaker 1: That is a huge number, one hundred and fifty four

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Speaker 1: billion dollars. So that means in the US, people missing

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Speaker 1: work due to loneliness and the symptoms of that cost

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Speaker 1: employers one hundred and fifty four billion dollars. So there

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Speaker 1: is so much money that is being cost and being

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Speaker 1: used because we have this epidemic and we're not using

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Speaker 1: that to solve this problem. This is a cost of

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Speaker 1: it from what I understand. I could be reading that wrong,

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Speaker 1: but that's what I get from it, and that is

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Speaker 1: a huge number. And for people who are like, again,

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Speaker 1: this doesn't affect me, it is because let's say you

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Speaker 1: have a job and work somewhere. I'm sure some of

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Speaker 1: these people aren't showing up for work. Maybe you're not

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Speaker 1: paying the cost directly, but are you picking up their work?

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Speaker 1: Are you picking up their slack? Is your job at

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Speaker 1: being affected by those people not going to work? Are

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Speaker 1: their budget cuts because of these things? Are things more

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Speaker 1: expensive because of the fact that all of this money

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Speaker 1: is being spent on this. I mean, I'm not a

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Speaker 1: business accounting numbers person. I'm saying all this because there's

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Speaker 1: no way it's not affecting you. You just might not

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Speaker 1: know it. Now. What is also very interesting to me

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Speaker 1: is even the people who are lonely let alone, the

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Speaker 1: people that are like, I'm not lonely and this doesn't

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Speaker 1: bother me, not a big deal. Even the people that

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Speaker 1: are lonely often don't register it as a big deal, like, oh,

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Speaker 1: I'm lonely, but I'm fine. I mean I can hear

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Speaker 1: that from people in my life and even things that

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Speaker 1: I've said like, yeah, I'm lonely, but whatever in a

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Speaker 1: big deal. I have a lot of friends, but it's

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Speaker 1: not a big deal. It is what it is. But

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Speaker 1: what we know from the research is it is a

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Speaker 1: big deal. In the feelings that you are having from

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Speaker 1: a lack of connection are affecting you in ways that

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Speaker 1: you might not be paying attention to. And twenty percent

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Speaker 1: was reported that twenty percent of individuals who often always

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Speaker 1: feel lonely or isolated actually recognize it as a problem.

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Speaker 1: So that means eighty percent are the I mean, whatever,

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Speaker 1: not a big deal, and I think this has something

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Speaker 1: to do with it. One thing we have talked about

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Speaker 1: on several episodes here is how social media has and

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Speaker 1: is affecting our social interactions, including general connection, friendships, and

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Speaker 1: romantic relationships. So apparently Americans spend an average of six

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Speaker 1: hours per day on digital media, so that's all kinds

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Speaker 1: of digital media. One in three US adults eighteen over

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Speaker 1: report that they are online almost constantly, and the percentage

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Speaker 1: of teens thirteen to seventeen who say they are online

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Speaker 1: almost constantly has doubled since twenty fifteen. Also, the percentage

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Speaker 1: of you as adults eighteen and over who reported using

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Speaker 1: social media, so this is social media, not just digital media,

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Speaker 1: increased from five percent in two thousand and five to

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Speaker 1: roughly eighty percent in twenty nineteen. And I assume that

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Speaker 1: number has grown because it is twenty twenty three. Now.

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Speaker 1: Now several examples of harm from technology. These might not

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Speaker 1: surprise you, but it gets rid of in person engagement

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Speaker 1: and displaces that. It monopolizes our attention when we're with people.

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Speaker 1: It reduces the quality of our interactions because of that,

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Speaker 1: and it diminishes our self esteem. And that is something

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Speaker 1: that again we hear all the time. But are we

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Speaker 1: registering how big of a deal this is and are

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Speaker 1: we really caring enough to do something about it? And

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Speaker 1: if we look at how cyberbulene is affecting us, oh

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Speaker 1: my gosh, Like I cannot imagine what life would have

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Speaker 1: been like for me as an adolescent and a teen

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Speaker 1: if social media was a thing when I was growing up.

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Speaker 1: Targets of online harassment report feeling increased levels of loneliness, isolation,

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Speaker 1: and relationship problems, as well as lower self esteem and

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Speaker 1: trust in others. And what is interesting with this, because

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Speaker 1: that probably doesn't surprise anybody. What's interesting is even the

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Speaker 1: perpetrators of Cyberbowleyne experience weakened emotional bonds with social contacts

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Speaker 1: and deficits and perceived belongingness. So both of these people

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Speaker 1: are suffering. It's not helping anybody. So what do we do.

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Speaker 1: We're getting closer to that, and what's hard about specifically

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Speaker 1: social media, and I'm going to focus on social media

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Speaker 1: for probably the rest of this episode, and the advisory

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Speaker 1: goes into all different kinds of places where loneliness is

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Speaker 1: being suffocated and where we can shift that. But what's

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Speaker 1: hard about social media and digital media is, in general,

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Speaker 1: they've brought us a lot of benefits, but we don't

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Speaker 1: get and we have not been given user manuals that

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Speaker 1: came with directions on how to use these things or

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Speaker 1: warnings of the side effects. We kind of just were

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Speaker 1: given these things and they've grown and we've been like

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Speaker 1: learning as we go along, but our ability to adjust

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Speaker 1: to the side effects and to the consequences isn't catching up.

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Speaker 1: We're not learning about that, and we're kind of just

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Speaker 1: ignoring those because the benefits have seemed so great, and

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Speaker 1: the awesomeness and funness of that is, in my opinion,

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Speaker 1: starting to get a little bit less awesome and fun

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Speaker 1: because we're realizing that it's costing us so much peace

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Speaker 1: and joy and real happiness. With social media, bullying is easier. Again,

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Speaker 1: we fail to develop those social skills. We're distracted, we're preoccupied.

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Speaker 1: We compare ourselves on such a deep level, and much

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Speaker 1: deeper level than we did before, with people like everyday

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Speaker 1: people around us and people that aren't even people. And

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Speaker 1: comparison has always been a thing that's that's caused strife

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Speaker 1: and self esteem issues. But I know growing up I

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Speaker 1: was comparing myself to like magazine pictures and movie stars

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Speaker 1: on TV. I wasn't comparing myself at every second of

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Speaker 1: the day to every single human in my life. I'm

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Speaker 1: having trouble really articulating this because it's so simple, but

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Speaker 1: it's also complex. The people in my life that I

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Speaker 1: was comparing myself to, I got more of an either

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Speaker 1: real view of what their life was like or I

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Speaker 1: didn't know, and so I wasn't comparing. But now with

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Speaker 1: social media, I'm getting a lot of times a fake

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Speaker 1: view of what life is like a fake view of

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Speaker 1: what people look like because of all the filters and

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Speaker 1: all of that, And I just have too much information

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Speaker 1: about people's lives that I otherwise wouldn't have known about,

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Speaker 1: wouldn't have cared about, and I wouldn't have that to

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Speaker 1: compare it to mine. I would just be comparing myself

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Speaker 1: to these people that I didn't think were just like me,

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Speaker 1: like celebrities and movie stars and stuff like that. And

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Speaker 1: I love a blogger. Bloggers are great. I love getting

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Speaker 1: recommendations for things I could use in my home, and

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Speaker 1: I love the decoration tips and the outfit insfough, But

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Speaker 1: I also now am realizing that I spend hours looking

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Speaker 1: at these things and these people, and then I sit

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Speaker 1: and I wonder, I don't look like that in that

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Speaker 1: outfit that I bought on Amazon, and dang it, I

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Speaker 1: can't afford that outfit that that person put together. Or

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Speaker 1: why can't I just come up with that outfit on

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Speaker 1: my own? Or why couldn't I think of that decor

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Speaker 1: idea on my own? Or I mean same with hair ideas,

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Speaker 1: like my hair can't look like that, and when I

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Speaker 1: do it, it doesn't look like that, And dang it,

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Speaker 1: they make that look so easy, and oh the same

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Speaker 1: with like cooking and just like not housewife things because

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Speaker 1: I'm not a housewife, but like just homemaker things of

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Speaker 1: I love the ideas and the inspiration and the tips

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Speaker 1: and the recipes. But then I'm also comparing myself of like,

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Speaker 1: why can't I do that? And why is it so

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Speaker 1: hard for me to do that? And this is making

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Speaker 1: me think of a specific influencer who I followed back

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Speaker 1: in the beginning of influencer life. I wouldn't have even

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Speaker 1: known to her an influencer, and she did all She

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Speaker 1: was always put together, she always made it to the gym,

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Speaker 1: her house was always clean, it was beautiful, everything was beautiful.

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Speaker 1: Like her style was awesome. I mean, on top of that,

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Speaker 1: every day this is what really got me. Every day

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Speaker 1: she managed to cook these meals for her family and

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Speaker 1: they looked easy but also complex at the same time,

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Speaker 1: And I just was like, how is she doing all

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Speaker 1: of that stuff? Meanwhile I can manage barely to cook

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Speaker 1: myself a frozen dinner alone, just for me, just for

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Speaker 1: one that takes ten minutes. So I eventually clicked the

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Speaker 1: unfollowed button and I haven't looked back since. But I

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Speaker 1: also know that I'm following and seeing that stuff from

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Speaker 1: other people. And the reason I unfollowed that person is

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Speaker 1: because I was like, this isn't helping me. The tips

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Speaker 1: are no longer helping me. They now are making me

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Speaker 1: question what is wrong with me, when really there's nothing

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Speaker 1: wrong with me. That is a business that she is running.

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Speaker 1: Her business is to be an influencer and to show

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Speaker 1: us these things and to do these things. My business

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Speaker 1: is to be there, and so I spend my forty

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Speaker 1: hours a week or more or less depend on the

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Speaker 1: week doing that. She spends it cooking meals for her

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Speaker 1: family and putting together outfits. And I think in my head, oh,

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Speaker 1: she's doing that in her spare time, because those are

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Speaker 1: things people do in their spare time. But it's not.

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Speaker 1: And I feel like I'm just like going off on something.

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Speaker 1: And I hope it doesn't sound like I'm preaching. I'm

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Speaker 1: just very passionate about this. And so what I'm getting

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Speaker 1: out here is that we create these narratives that it's

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Speaker 1: just me that can't do these things and it's just

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Speaker 1: me that can't live my life like that, when the

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Speaker 1: reality is it's not. But because we spend so much

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Speaker 1: time online looking at others, we forget to look at

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Speaker 1: what's in front of us. And on the other hand,

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Speaker 1: the things that are in front of us are a

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Speaker 1: bunch of people that are also trying to emulate those

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Speaker 1: lives that we see online. And so I start to

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Speaker 1: think that people in front of me probably don't want

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Speaker 1: to look at me because I can't keep up with

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Speaker 1: what they're trying to do. And I also can't keep

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Speaker 1: up with what people online are trying to do. And

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Speaker 1: so this thing that is created and was I mean

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Speaker 1: social media. It's supposed to be a social thing that

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Speaker 1: we use to socialize. The thing that's created bring us

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Speaker 1: together is pulling us further and further and further apart.

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Speaker 1: And I want to read an excerpt from that article

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Speaker 1: that I referenced in the very beginning of this episode.

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Speaker 1: And I want to read an excerpt from that article

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Speaker 1: that I referenced in the very beginning of this episode.

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Speaker 1: And it's a little lengthy, so stay with me, And

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Speaker 1: again I'm going to link it because I think reading

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Speaker 1: this on your own, if it strikes a chord, might

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Speaker 1: be helpful. But I'm reading just part of it. And

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Speaker 1: this is what they say contemporary society has evolved in

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Speaker 1: a way that actively seeks to suppress humanity's inclination for connection.

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Speaker 1: Much of our worth is assessed at face value, as

432
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:54,720
Speaker 1: evident on our engagement with dating apps, social media, and

433
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:58,800
Speaker 1: professional networks. Often we enter these online marketplaces with the

434
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,840
Speaker 1: intent to connect an gage, but the majority of our

435
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:06,359
Speaker 1: interactions revolve around our apparent commodification. Falling in sync with

436
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 1: the capitalist society, we employ a series of clever marketing schemes.

437
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 1: We have become fluent in the language of capitalism based

438
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:16,920
Speaker 1: on how we market ourselves to one another. The constant

439
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,840
Speaker 1: buying and selling of our personhood fuels our loneliness on

440
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,959
Speaker 1: a number of levels. Rather than looking inwardly to assess

441
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,919
Speaker 1: our value, we rely heavily on the opinions of others

442
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,960
Speaker 1: to determine our self worth. So much of who we

443
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 1: are now amounts to what we can offer on the

444
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,440
Speaker 1: surface instead of what lies on the inside. This is

445
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 1: evident based on our desire to satisfy our narcissistic tendencies

446
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 1: through convenience and self gratification. We largely operate on a

447
00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:46,480
Speaker 1: superficial level, which can make it difficult for us to

448
00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 1: confront and articulate our feelings. Attraction is largely built on

449
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 1: what is visibly appealing, as opposed to the type of

450
00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:57,360
Speaker 1: person we are, how we conduct ourselves, what we stand for,

451
00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,760
Speaker 1: and how we treat others. We are checking boxes in

452
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: our pursuit of companionship instead of actively working to understand

453
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,040
Speaker 1: ourselves and what that may reveal about the people whom

454
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,199
Speaker 1: we ultimately attract. With so much of our lives reduced

455
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:13,480
Speaker 1: to a screen, we have become lazying and foreign to

456
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 1: the idea of uncovering what lies beneath the surface. We

457
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: are resistant to the acknowledging of our feelings and emotions

458
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:24,560
Speaker 1: because we are consistently supplementing reality with artificial sensation. We

459
00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:30,440
Speaker 1: are inundated with virtual reality, representations and artificial intelligence, which

460
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 1: have desensitized us to what comes naturally. Our social networks

461
00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,439
Speaker 1: may be expanding, but our ability to foster social intimacy

462
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: is virtually non existent. The highly addictive, in all consuming

463
00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 1: nature of our technology conditions us to believe that we

464
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 1: are connected when we are not. On the surface, we

465
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 1: seek a quick fix and pleasure, but deep down there

466
00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:56,840
Speaker 1: is a desire to satisfy a hunger for meaning and understanding.

467
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:01,439
Speaker 1: This paradox convinces us that surface level pursuits will result

468
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:06,400
Speaker 1: in some type of deeper satisfaction. We are communicating without interacting,

469
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,199
Speaker 1: which is why we are purely alone in everything. And

470
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:13,680
Speaker 1: that was an excerpt from an article from Psychology Today

471
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:18,159
Speaker 1: called Social Causes of Loneliness Understanding Loneliness from a Social Perspective.

472
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:22,159
Speaker 1: It came out in January twenty twenty three. And I

473
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 1: don't know how to say this author's name, and I'm

474
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,000
Speaker 1: so sorry. I'm going to try to say the last name,

475
00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:29,879
Speaker 1: Ben Damnon. I hope I got that close to right.

476
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,440
Speaker 1: And I will link that entire article so you guys

477
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: can read it for yourselves in the show notes. Reading

478
00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:37,959
Speaker 1: this article, what I immediately thought, what I couldn't help

479
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,960
Speaker 1: but think about, was how it feels like there's a

480
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:47,119
Speaker 1: constant stream of stories about young social media stars and

481
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 1: TikTok stars specifically, who are dying by suicide. It feels

482
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 1: like that keeps happening. I don't know if that's just

483
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,439
Speaker 1: in my awareness of it, or if it really is

484
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 1: as big of an issue. I think one person dying

485
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 1: by suicide is enough to be an issue, but it

486
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: seems like this is happening a lot with these what

487
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 1: seem like huge stars who have all these followers. It

488
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 1: feels constant sometimes that this keeps happening, and it's wild

489
00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 1: because these are people who look like they have millions

490
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 1: and bajillions of friends, right because there is this illusion

491
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:23,879
Speaker 1: of connection on social media that we are all buying

492
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:28,239
Speaker 1: into that is keeping us more disconnected than ever. So

493
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 1: now this finally brings us to where do we go

494
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:33,159
Speaker 1: from here? What do we do now? The Surgeon General

495
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 1: gives a very detailed idea of ways to help combat

496
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,159
Speaker 1: these issues in a plan, and they look way more deeper.

497
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:43,200
Speaker 1: They look at other things other than social media. Social

498
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:46,119
Speaker 1: media is something that I think is specifically dear to

499
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:49,360
Speaker 1: my heart because I'm on it a lot. I understand that,

500
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 1: and I have even felt the shifts and friendships and

501
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 1: connection and conversations and dating from all of that. So

502
00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: I highly suggest you guys go and look at that full,

503
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,359
Speaker 1: entire document. Document. But this really brings us back to

504
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 1: what I said in the beginning. We individually have to

505
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 1: decide to stop a green with this pain so we

506
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 1: can eventually band together and then our small groups can

507
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 1: become a bigger group in a bigger group, and a

508
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:17,560
Speaker 1: larger group and a massive group. And so it starts

509
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:19,639
Speaker 1: with us individually, but then we have to connect to

510
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 1: other people with that decision to stop a green, with

511
00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 1: this pain of loneliness in our communities. So we have

512
00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 1: to start to make small changes. I mean, when it

513
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,640
Speaker 1: comes to social media, it's nothing that you probably haven't

514
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:32,880
Speaker 1: thought about, but it's just stuff that seems like, ah,

515
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: is that really going to matter. I mean, we can

516
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 1: put our phones away, we can put our phones in

517
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 1: our pockets at dinner. Small changes. Just do it once

518
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,920
Speaker 1: a day. I know, I personally am becoming so addicted

519
00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 1: to playing certain games and being on social media on

520
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:50,080
Speaker 1: my phone that I'm even doing it while I'm watching TV.

521
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: So I'm taking in one source of media and I'm

522
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,320
Speaker 1: also supplementing that with another source of media because just

523
00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: one is not enough. When like what happened, when like

524
00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:01,080
Speaker 1: we don't have any of this, I'm double occupied with

525
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 1: technology and I completely miss out on being invested in

526
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 1: something that I'm doing with somebody because oftentimes I'm with

527
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 1: somebody when I'm doing that. I can be with my

528
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 1: partner or Patrick watching a TV show together, and at

529
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:17,960
Speaker 1: the same time, on mon social media, trying to keep

530
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,600
Speaker 1: up with the Jones is there. It's just wild. So

531
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: a small change put the phone away. Put the phone

532
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 1: away when I get home if I'm with somebody, so

533
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 1: I can connect with that person. In the advisory, it

534
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:34,680
Speaker 1: states that a culture of connection rests on core values

535
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: of kindness, respect, service, and commitment to one another. Everyone

536
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,960
Speaker 1: contributes to the collective culture of social connection by regularly

537
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:45,360
Speaker 1: practicing these values. And I wanted to read that and

538
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: specifically say it because this is something that seems very simple.

539
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: And I also feel like it kind of might sound

540
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:53,280
Speaker 1: cheesy or just like a lot of words that don't

541
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: really mean anything, or maybe aren't that helpful and just

542
00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: take up space. But I feel like it's necessary for

543
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 1: them to write and for me to share this because

544
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,880
Speaker 1: it is just that simple. It's almost like it's so

545
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,520
Speaker 1: simple that it's hard, right a culture of connection. If

546
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 1: we could embrace these core values kindness, respect, service, and

547
00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 1: commitment to one another, we could change the entire social

548
00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 1: climate that we're in right now. It's that simple. But

549
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: it's so simple that it's difficult now. To create a

550
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:25,080
Speaker 1: culture of connection, we have to operate from these values,

551
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,440
Speaker 1: and that really means I'm operating from a place where

552
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:31,280
Speaker 1: I respect myself and I also respect the people around

553
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 1: me enough to make these small, seemingly insignificant changes. So

554
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 1: if I think about, oh, me putting my phone away,

555
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 1: this is about respecting myself. This is about respecting my friends,

556
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 1: This is about respecting the people that would benefit from

557
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,959
Speaker 1: It's a way of respecting and being kind to myself

558
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:51,720
Speaker 1: and others that makes it feel a little different. Just

559
00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 1: like I talk about with body image and my clients,

560
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 1: is think about these things that you're doing, getting the

561
00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 1: right amount of sleep, washing your face at the end

562
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 1: of the day, going for a walk. It's a way

563
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 1: to be kind to yourself. It's a way to respect

564
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 1: yourself versus a chore that I have to do now.

565
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,760
Speaker 1: Because behaviors are both learned and then they can be

566
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 1: reinforced by groups that we're in. Right, we gain, and

567
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:17,200
Speaker 1: we develop, and we shift and we change based on

568
00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 1: the people around us. We can be teachers to our

569
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:25,200
Speaker 1: community and our friends. And if that happens, our communities

570
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 1: and those things that we have taught then end up

571
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:30,520
Speaker 1: becoming teachers to us because they get reinforced because of

572
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 1: that ripple effect and it's kind of cool because then

573
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 1: the things that we teach continue to teach us. And

574
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 1: this speaks to my conversation with Luke Durham that I

575
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 1: had a couple of weeks ago on leadership, and we

576
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:42,040
Speaker 1: mentioned and we talked about how we're all going to

577
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 1: be leaders in our lives at some point, even if

578
00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:46,440
Speaker 1: we don't recognize ourselves as like, oh, I'm a leader.

579
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: I like to be a leader. We're all going to

580
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 1: lead in some form or fashion, whether we realize it

581
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 1: or not, somebody or something in our lives. And if

582
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:57,959
Speaker 1: we lead those observing us with characteristics that bring us

583
00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 1: closer together versus push just further apart or avoid connection,

584
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,640
Speaker 1: people are going to pick up on that. But somebody

585
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 1: has to start, even when it feels overwhelming, and even

586
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 1: when it feels pointless, even when it feels like it's

587
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 1: not going to matter. If we keep doing it, it's

588
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:15,680
Speaker 1: going to matter, and that I think that's what is

589
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 1: I think sometimes the biggest issue with all of this

590
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 1: is the one time doesn't really matter, But we have

591
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,240
Speaker 1: to have the one time to create the more times

592
00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 1: that create the thing that matters. So create opportunities to

593
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,280
Speaker 1: connect big and small in your neighborhood, at work with

594
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 1: your family, at the grocery store, talk to that overly

595
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:36,840
Speaker 1: friendly trader Joe's cashier instead of staring at your phone.

596
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,160
Speaker 1: And I'm speaking to myself when I'm saying this, instead

597
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:40,920
Speaker 1: of stare at my phone while I'm being checked out,

598
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 1: like engage in the conversation that they're opening us up

599
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,960
Speaker 1: to say yes to opportunities that people open up even

600
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: when it's scary, because remember, scary doesn't always mean danger.

601
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 1: Sometimes it just means that something's important. And I'm not

602
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,480
Speaker 1: saying in this say yes idea that we can't have

603
00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 1: our alone time and we can't say no to things.

604
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 1: I fully believe in protect your space and energy and

605
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 1: not over committing. I'm just saying, maybe we need to

606
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 1: start using some of that energy that we spend isolating,

607
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:12,480
Speaker 1: not reconnecting with ourselves, isolating being open to connection. And

608
00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 1: if you have ideas or things that you have incorporated

609
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 1: in your homes or your communities, please let me know.

610
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 1: I would love to create a list of ideas to

611
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 1: post in show notes and share with you guys, because

612
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 1: this is a community that can foster connection. But I

613
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:29,960
Speaker 1: don't want us to connect just alone. I want that

614
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 1: you share something with me, then I can share it

615
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 1: back with the community, and then you listening to this

616
00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 1: episode becomes this that Riple effect where like I'm teaching you,

617
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:39,800
Speaker 1: but then you're teaching me, and then I get to

618
00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: teach a lot of people, and then through that teaching,

619
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 1: you get to be taught as well. More, if that

620
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 1: makes sense, speaks to that effect that I was saying

621
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 1: earlier is if we bring things to people, they are

622
00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 1: going to catch on to it, and then they're going

623
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 1: to do it, and then that's in turn going to

624
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 1: share more knowledge with us, which feels very chaotic in

625
00:33:57,560 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 1: my brain. So I hope that I said that in

626
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 1: a way that made sense to you guys. So again,

627
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:03,000
Speaker 1: if you have any ideas or things or small things

628
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 1: that you've incorporated or loved in your communities, families, friendships,

629
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,319
Speaker 1: work environments, let me know. I would love to hear them,

630
00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 1: and we can continue this conversation of how we can

631
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 1: connect versus isolate, and how we can acknowledge that some

632
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:21,759
Speaker 1: of the connection that we're doing is actually creating more disconnection,

633
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 1: so we can take little turns that can get us

634
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 1: back to that connection that we really all at the

635
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 1: core of us need and crave. So I've linked again.

636
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:31,920
Speaker 1: I feel like I've said this twenty times the article

637
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:34,960
Speaker 1: from the Surgeon General and also the article that I

638
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 1: read from Psychology today in the show notes. Please look

639
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:40,920
Speaker 1: at those, save them, use them, share them. And my

640
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 1: challenge to you guys today, whatever day you're listening to

641
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:47,520
Speaker 1: this is to have one meaningful conversation in person with

642
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:52,440
Speaker 1: somebody today. And there is no one size definition of meaningful.

643
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:55,800
Speaker 1: It could be a conversation about vandor Pump Rules drama

644
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:57,840
Speaker 1: because that stuff is wild to me right now and I

645
00:34:57,840 --> 00:34:59,800
Speaker 1: don't even to watch that show, but I'm eating it

646
00:34:59,880 --> 00:35:02,840
Speaker 1: up up. Or it could be a conversation about your

647
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 1: deeper sensecurities and something really vulnerable in that way with somebody.

648
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Speaker 1: But one meaningful conversation, just one. It can be two minutes,

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Speaker 1: it can be two hours, and see how that might

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Speaker 1: shift what you're feeling or what the people that you

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Speaker 1: have those conversations are feeling. As always, you can reach

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Speaker 1: me Katherine at Unique Therapy podcast dot com to share

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Speaker 1: any thoughts, feelings, questions, feedback. You can send in those

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Speaker 1: questions for couch talks that I do on Wednesday episodes

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Speaker 1: where I answer questions that you guys send to me.

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Speaker 1: If you haven't yet, I would love if you would

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Speaker 1: rate and review the podcast wherever you are listening to this,

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00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:37,319
Speaker 1: I know you can review it on Spotify and Apple Podcasts.

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Speaker 1: And if you would like to follow me, not in

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Speaker 1: a way to avoid connecting with real people. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I am a real person, but people in the real world,

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Speaker 1: in the flesh and today, I am not going to

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Speaker 1: share my social media handles with you in the vein

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Speaker 1: of Hey, I'd rather you go call a friend than

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Speaker 1: follow me on social media today. And if you are

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Speaker 1: my friend and you have my phone number, then you

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Speaker 1: can call me and I can be your meaningful conversation

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Speaker 1: because I'm always up for those. I hope you guys

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Speaker 1: are having the day you need to have and I

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Speaker 1: will be back with you guys on Wednesday for couch

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Speaker 1: Talks