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Speaker 1: Hey, discos, need a little more Disgraceland in your life,

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Speaker 1: just to touch to get you through.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, me too.

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Speaker 1: This is the podcast that comes after the podcast. Welcome

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Speaker 1: to Disgraceland, the after party. Welcome to the Disgraceland bonus episode,

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Speaker 1: a little thing we'd like to call the after party.

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Speaker 1: This is the show after the show, the party after

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Speaker 1: the party, the bridge to get you from one full

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Speaker 1: episode of Disgraceland to the other, the backyard to dig

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Speaker 1: into the dirt. On this bonus episode, we are talking

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Speaker 1: about this week's subject of the disgrace Land full episode,

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Speaker 1: Alfred Hitchcock talking about problematic artists and our tours cancel culture.

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Speaker 1: I hate that term, but hey, the nineteen nineties has

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Speaker 1: peak life. That's another point of discussion, at least if

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Speaker 1: we're talking music in amazing movies releas during that decade,

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Speaker 1: and of course we are diving into your voicemails, text

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Speaker 1: and more, and as always a whole lot of rosie.

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Speaker 1: All right, discoes, let's get into it. In nineteen ninety six,

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Speaker 1: Entertainment Weekly ranked Alfred Hitchcock number one in their list

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Speaker 1: of the greatest directors of all time. It's a fascinating list,

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Speaker 1: really one where Steven Spielberg does not even crack the

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Speaker 1: top ten. Behind Hitchcock. In slots two to ten, we

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Speaker 1: have Orson Wells, john Ford, Howard Hawk's, Martin Scorsese, a

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Speaker 1: Kiri Kurrosawa, Buster Keaton, ingmer Bergmann, Frank Capra, Federico Fellini

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Speaker 1: at number ten, and then at number eleven, mister Steven Spielberg.

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Speaker 1: The reason they have Hitchcock at number one is a

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Speaker 1: surprising one. It has less to do with the innovative

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Speaker 1: style Hitchcock created and popularized, and more to do with

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Speaker 1: his persona as being what they call the quote unquote

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Speaker 1: quintessential brand director. Interesting phrase there, given the time nineteen

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Speaker 1: ninety six, A director who in name and likeness was iconic.

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Speaker 1: I assume that's what they mean by quintessential brand director.

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Speaker 1: A director who, in their estimation was everywhere beyond Hitchcock's

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Speaker 1: incredible films, which were not just creatively genius, but also

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Speaker 1: they were huge commercial successes. Hitchcock, they mentioned, was rewarded

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Speaker 1: for his appeal with a TV show that we know

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Speaker 1: of called Alfred Hitchcock Presents.

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Speaker 2: And I didn't know this.

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Speaker 1: There was an actual magazine as well called the Alfred

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Speaker 1: Hitchcock Mystery Magazine. So Hitchcock was everywhere during his reign,

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Speaker 1: and it seems that because of that sort of like immediate,

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Speaker 1: big commercial, big iconic status that they're granting him number

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Speaker 1: one slot on the list. Another Element Entertainment Weekly credits

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Speaker 1: Hitchcock with for his success. So and I agree with

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Speaker 1: them totally on this point. Is his point of view.

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Speaker 1: Hitchcock was one of the first so called tour directors,

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Speaker 1: a phrase that critics didn't really throw around until the

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Speaker 1: nineteen fifties and the sixties, when Hitchcock was really at

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Speaker 1: peak Hitchcock. Not only is Hitchcock's point of view overt

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Speaker 1: in his filmmaking, of course, but even comparatively to some

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Speaker 1: of the more studio assembly line fair that was being

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Speaker 1: pumped out at the time as far as films were concerned,

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Speaker 1: from comparatively nameless and faceless directors, Hitchcock's point of view

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Speaker 1: was a unique and compelling one, and it's right there

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Speaker 1: on the screen for all of us to see. As

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Speaker 1: we detailed in this week's full episode on Alfred Hitchcock.

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Speaker 1: Hitchcock was the original true crime fan. Okay, he followed

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Speaker 1: the crimes of the day very closely, and they obviously

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Speaker 1: influenced him. The ghoulish nature of these events was formative

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Speaker 1: for him. Heavily influenced his filmmaking. And the thing that

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Speaker 1: I think is super interesting about Hitchcock myself is that everyone,

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Speaker 1: everyone that the viewer came in contact with on screen

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Speaker 1: could be guilty. Now nowhere in his films is this

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Speaker 1: more impactful than in what I think is his best film,

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Speaker 1: Rear Window and Rear Window. Not only does the director

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Speaker 1: make us wonder about the guilt of the seemingly innocent

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Speaker 1: people on the screen, he makes dirty little voyeurs out

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Speaker 1: of all of us as well. Case in point, Miss Torso.

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Speaker 3: So.

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Speaker 1: I say this just to point out how unique the

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Speaker 1: guy's point of view was at the time. We know,

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Speaker 1: if we saw a movie like this now, we wouldn't

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Speaker 1: be shocked. But we've got like fifties plus years of

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Speaker 1: filmmaking to create this context that is no longer shocking.

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Speaker 1: But trust me, back when Rear Window came out, it

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Speaker 1: was a unique story. There's a unique storytelling device the

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Speaker 1: way that they painted this picture out the window of

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Speaker 1: Jimmy Stewart's character on screen. Hitchcock made monsters of ordinary

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Speaker 1: people in off screen. We know Hitchcock's success made a

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Speaker 1: monster out of him personally, as detailed by his treatment

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Speaker 1: of Tippy Hedrin in this week's full episode of Disgrace. Now,

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Speaker 1: none of Hitchcock's behavior toward Hedrin is considered in Entertainment

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Speaker 1: Weekly's ranking of hitches.

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Speaker 2: In the number one slot.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure I should be, as I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that it was well known back in nineteen ninety six

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Speaker 1: at the time of this ranking. Then again, I'm pretty

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Speaker 1: sure that any serious history film buff at the time

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Speaker 1: would have had some understanding of the director's behavior. But

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Speaker 1: I can't say one way or another. The question is

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Speaker 1: where would Entertainment Weekly rank Alfred Hitchcock today? Knowing all

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Speaker 1: that we now know, I think we can safely say

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Speaker 1: that Alfred Hitchcock wouldn't even sniff the top five. And

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Speaker 1: that's because the Entertainment Weekly list is more about perception

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Speaker 1: in vibes than it is talent. It's first and foremost

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Speaker 1: about Hitchcock's legacy is a personality as a quote unquote

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Speaker 1: quintessential brand director, which is understandable. This is Entertainment magazine,

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Speaker 1: not a scholarly study of film. Perception and Vibes are

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Speaker 1: Entertainment Weeklies bread and butter, a damn a fish for

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Speaker 1: liking water. Today's cover, just for reference of Entertainment Weekly,

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Speaker 1: is a not so great photo of Ben Affleck and

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Speaker 1: Jennifer Lopez and the news on their recent divorce filing.

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Speaker 1: So Entertainment Weekly today, they're not writing about the directorial

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Speaker 1: prowess Affleck used for the town in relation to the

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Speaker 1: Friends of Eddie Coyle, nor is it a study of

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Speaker 1: the cultural significance of Jenny from the blocks age defying backside. Wait,

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Speaker 1: I'm getting off track. You get my point. It's Entertainment

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Speaker 1: Weekly perception in vibes, Okay, that's kind of what the

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Speaker 1: magazine's all about. And even going back to nineteen ninety

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Speaker 1: six when they make this ranking of directors and they

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Speaker 1: put Hitchcock in the number one spot. We've always cared

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Speaker 1: about perception and vibes as a culture that glorifies entertainers.

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Speaker 1: But somewhere over the last decade, for better or worse,

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Speaker 1: I believe we started caring more about perception and vibes

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Speaker 1: than objectifiable facts. If Entertainment Weekly or any other mainstream

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Speaker 1: entertainment outlet wants to lower Alfred Hitchcock in its estimation

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Speaker 1: of who the greatest directors of all time are, then

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Speaker 1: that is their business, but it does and change the

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Speaker 1: fact that people will forever watch Alfred Hitchcock's movies. His

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Speaker 1: movies are just too damn good. Now, listen, I know this.

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Speaker 1: I know this because you told me so. I asked

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Speaker 1: you guys last week in preparation of this episode, and

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Speaker 1: you called in and texted me and gave me your feedback,

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Speaker 1: just as you did on Instagram and the socials. Alfred Hitchcock,

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Speaker 1: like Woody Allen, made some of the greatest movies of

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Speaker 1: all time in the world. Will forever watch their films again.

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Speaker 1: I know this because you guys told me so, and

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Speaker 1: I would say the same thing for lesser directors as well,

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Speaker 1: for someone like Brett Ratner, who didn't make you know,

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Speaker 1: great films on the same level with Alfred Hitchcock and

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Speaker 1: Woody Allen, but he made Rush Hour, for God's sake.

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Speaker 1: In ten years from now, is anyone going to really

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Speaker 1: think about Brett Ratner's transgressions when they're debating whether or

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Speaker 1: not to pull up Rush Hour on Hulu or Netflix

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Speaker 1: or whatever they're not. They're just gonna be psyched about

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Speaker 1: Chris Tucker and Jackie Chan. You know, Brett Ratner might

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Speaker 1: not get invited to whatever bullshit Hollywood events are going on,

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Speaker 1: but this movie's are gonna remain.

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Speaker 4: Now.

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Speaker 2: Is this good or bad?

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Speaker 1: That's the question. Is watching a Hitchcock movie make me

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Speaker 1: a bad person? Is watching a Brett Ratner movie make

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Speaker 1: me a bad person? When I watched Rush Hour with

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Speaker 1: my six year old a couple weeks ago, and I

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Speaker 1: didn't explain to him the me too movement, does that

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Speaker 1: make me a bad person? I don't think it does.

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Speaker 1: I know I'm a good person. I know it doesn't

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Speaker 1: make me a bad person. But back to the vibes.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 1: Another piece of feedback from you guys, something that I

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Speaker 1: heard express in one way or another over and over again,

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Speaker 1: is that the choice to engage with an artist who's

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Speaker 1: behavior was particularly monstrous is a personal one.

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Speaker 2: And I totally get that.

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Speaker 1: If you somehow came in contact with Brett Ratner back

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Speaker 1: in the nineties, then I'm sure you have a different

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Speaker 1: view on Rush Hour.

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Speaker 2: Than most people do. Okay.

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Speaker 1: I can't tell you how long it took me to

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Speaker 1: listen to Rick James and actually enjoy his music again

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Speaker 1: after researching the Rick James episode of Disgracelane and learning

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Speaker 1: and shocking detail how much he abused women. And I

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Speaker 1: don't think I'll ever listen to Spade Coolie again. I

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Speaker 1: can listen to a dozen other example similar to this.

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Speaker 2: But but, but.

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Speaker 1: There's always a Butt Jane from Rick James comes on

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Speaker 1: now after the shock is worn off. You know, my

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Speaker 1: head was fully in this three years ago, into this

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Speaker 1: Rick James subject three years ago, and I'm turning Mary

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Speaker 1: Jane up. Okay, I'm not thinking about Rick James, the kidnapping,

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Speaker 1: crackpike burning monster at all. Okay, I think of nothing.

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Speaker 1: The music just floods through me. It makes me dance,

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Speaker 1: it makes me smile, it makes me goofy. Okay, It's

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Speaker 1: just the same thing when I'm watching Alfred Hitchcock's Rear Window. Shit,

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Speaker 1: I'm not just entertained by a rear window. I want

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Speaker 1: to live in that apartment complex in that city at

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Speaker 1: that time, in that moment. That's how powerfully compelling that

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Speaker 1: piece of art is that Alfred Hitchcock created.

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Speaker 2: The romance is palpable.

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Speaker 1: Okay, to say nothing of the suspense, which is also

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Speaker 1: just amazing. And my heart broke for Tippy Hedron when

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Speaker 1: we were putting together this Alfred Hitchcock episode for real.

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Speaker 1: But that for whatever reason, whether it's selfish or whether

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Speaker 1: it's superficial, just vibes, whether it makes me a bad

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Speaker 1: person by some people's estimation the art. In most cases

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Speaker 1: for me, especially the better that the art is, the

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Speaker 1: more compelling that it is and genius that it can be,

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Speaker 1: the more easily I can then objectify it and engage

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Speaker 1: with it despite the behavior of the artist.

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Speaker 2: That's just me.

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Speaker 1: If you feel differently, that's fine, But like I said earlier,

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Speaker 1: the majority of you are thinking the way the same

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Speaker 1: way that I am. Now Listen, Okay, I'm not an

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Speaker 1: absolutist like everyone out there. I'm hypocritical in some ways.

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Speaker 1: And here's how it gets really interesting for me is

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Speaker 1: when I think about rationalization as it relates to this topic. Okay,

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Speaker 1: on the one hand, I don't rationalize what Alfred Hitchcock did,

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Speaker 1: not one bit. So I don't do that so that

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Speaker 1: I can feel good about watching his films. Like I said,

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Speaker 1: I can just objectify it. But when it comes to

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Speaker 1: Woody Allen, when it comes to Ryan Adams when it

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Speaker 1: comes to disease, and sorry when it comes to Michael Jackson.

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Speaker 1: I am one rationalizing motherfucker, in part because I've done

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Speaker 1: a considerable amount of research into each of the allegations

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Speaker 1: against all these artists, just like I did with Hitchcock. Okay,

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Speaker 1: and unlike Hitchcock, and unlike Harvey Weinstein, and unlike Bill Cosby.

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Speaker 1: From what I've learned in my estimation, the allegations against

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Speaker 1: the guys I mentioned earlier with he Alan, Ryan Adams

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Speaker 1: as Ease, Michael Jackson, they're less solid, or they're at

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Speaker 1: least more gray. Okay, they're they're less compelling in some cases,

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Speaker 1: way less all right, all right, Perhaps maybe I don't know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I have the stomach for it.

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Speaker 1: But perhaps maybe I'll do a full episode where I

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Speaker 1: can look at all the actual facts laid out in

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Speaker 1: the cases against each of these artists that I've mentioned,

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Speaker 1: the sort of ones that seemed to be a little

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Speaker 1: bit on the fence. It's too complicated to litigate here,

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Speaker 1: to fully dive into here, and I don't want to.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to derail this bonus episode, but I

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Speaker 1: do want to say that I appreciate you guys as listeners.

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Speaker 1: This is a complicated conversation to have. It's highly nuanced,

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Speaker 1: it's emotional. Some of you are victims of abuse. Most

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Speaker 1: of us know victims of abuse. This is a personal

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Speaker 1: issue too, and I think that the discourse we've been

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Speaker 1: able to have around it, both online and public and

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Speaker 1: privately over voicemail and text has been mostly civil and

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Speaker 1: mature and nuanced in and of itself, and all these

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Speaker 1: things are usually lacking when it comes to this topic,

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Speaker 1: especially as it relates to the online discourse. So I'm

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Speaker 1: proud of you guys as listeners and excited to dive

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Speaker 1: into your voicemails and texts on this topic in just

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Speaker 1: a minute. But first we need to quickly talk about

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Speaker 1: another controversial subject, or I should say, another controversial figure,

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Speaker 1: another controversial artist. Lana del Rey. Okay, it's the next

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Speaker 1: she's the next full episode of Disgraceland. Okay, that's coming

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Speaker 1: up next in your feed here. So when you're listening

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Speaker 1: to Lana del Rey, be thinking about the way she

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Speaker 1: was painted by the press and why she was painted

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Speaker 1: that way, and specifically think about how she was treated.

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Speaker 1: And I want to know from you guys. Which entertainers

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Speaker 1: do you think have been unfairly treated by the media,

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Speaker 1: Which artists do you think it a bum rap from

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Speaker 1: the press, And specifically, I want to know about artists, rockstars, actors, actresses,

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Speaker 1: even athletes that you love, that you think you're getting

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Speaker 1: repeatedly torched unfairly by the press, by the media, by

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Speaker 1: the critics. All right, that's for Lana del Rey. That's

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Speaker 1: for the Lana Delray episode. It's coming up next, and

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Speaker 1: Disgrace Land. I'm going to take a quick break. We'll

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Speaker 1: be back in a flash with your calls and your texts.

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Speaker 1: You guys know the number six one seven, nine oh six,

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Speaker 1: six six three eight to leave me a voicemail or

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Speaker 1: to send me a text, let's hear from the nine

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Speaker 1: toh four.

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Speaker 5: Hey, Jake Gubspari from the nine oh four man, I've

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Speaker 5: been really thinking about your question from last week about

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Speaker 5: the artist and the art and how do you separate

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Speaker 5: the artist from the art, and and you know, this morning,

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Speaker 5: my kids were watching Michael Jackson videos on YouTube and

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Speaker 5: I love Michael Jackson. And I noticed in the comments

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Speaker 5: on Instagram you had mentioned someone had mentioned Michael Jackson

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Speaker 5: or you had mentioned Michael Jackson that kind of being

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Speaker 5: a a template or you know, an example if you were.

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Speaker 5: It's really tough, you know, someone who is beloved from

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Speaker 5: your childhood that you have to separate from, you know,

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Speaker 5: from possibly despicable things they did, or you know, definitely

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Speaker 5: despicable that the videos like Little Cosby. It's tough. But

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Speaker 5: like you said, I mean, perhaps there has to be

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Speaker 5: some kind of dividing lamp between the art and the artist.

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Speaker 5: But then again, when does it become so despicable that

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Speaker 5: you just can't you know, like you're Robert Kelly's or

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Speaker 5: your Sean Combs or are those folks who the world

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Speaker 5: or Michael Jackson's. It's tough. So I too am a

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Speaker 5: fan of any Hall and and some of the things

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Speaker 5: that that that Woody Allen has done. I mean it's

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Speaker 5: just despicable. I mean, it's so you know, it's tough

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Speaker 5: defarate the art from the artist, uh and try to

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Speaker 5: move on from there. I guess, you know, it's kind

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Speaker 5: of personalized. You know, what you can and cannot deal with,

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Speaker 5: or what you can and cannot accept from what you

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Speaker 5: believe from what was alleged. I don't know, it's tough

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Speaker 5: for Jake. I'm kind of working it out us do

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Speaker 5: this voice more apparently anyway, Yeah, just looking forward to

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Speaker 5: the Hitchcock ad episode. I know he was uh it was.

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Speaker 5: It was horrible to his uh uh female stars. Uh

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Speaker 5: you know, but it's not going to keep me from

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Speaker 5: watching the birds.

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Speaker 4: Fuck no.

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Speaker 5: So here's what it is. I love you later.

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Speaker 1: Nine o four. I hear you loud and clear. It

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Speaker 1: is complicated. I appreciate you weighing in here. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for the call. Uh our same subject. This is from

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Speaker 1: Ellie Ordes from the nine o nine on the Hitchcock dilemma.

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Speaker 4: Jay, Ellie Ordes here from the nine oh nine. So,

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Speaker 4: I wanted to William o'clock on my whole dilemma with

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Speaker 4: Alfred Hitchcock if he is absolutely my favorite director ever.

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Speaker 4: I did a whole last report about him when I

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Speaker 4: was in high school and growing up. Now revisiting him

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Speaker 4: then it's kind of odd because I'm still out of

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Speaker 4: stand still with well he was back to women. All

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Speaker 4: that Tippy Harden dilemma was pretty bad, and yeah, like

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Speaker 4: I can't just ignore it being a woman myself. But

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Speaker 4: at the same time, I have to say the art

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Speaker 4: that was put behind a lot of these movies, especially

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Speaker 4: a movie like Rebecca which has been pretty forgotten about,

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Speaker 4: as well as violent for murder, There's been a lot

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Speaker 4: of art put into these movies that you just haven't seen.

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Speaker 4: A lot of people miss that, and I understand, I

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Speaker 4: really do. I'm not going to dismiss the bullshit, but

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Speaker 4: I am saying that where art defines the creator might

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Speaker 4: lie with the audience and how they feel about said creator.

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Speaker 4: In my case at the Hitchcock that when I was

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Speaker 4: a teenager, I pretty much rented a lot of this

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Speaker 4: movies from my local Blockbuster or Hollywood Video or my

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Speaker 4: local library. So I was very in touch with the

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Speaker 4: stories and the styles in which these stories were brought

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Speaker 4: and how and documentary on the man himself and how

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Speaker 4: he actually brought things to light and everything, and that's

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Speaker 4: where I was at with it. Was I was appreciating

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Speaker 4: the art more than I was appreciating the creator as

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Speaker 4: a person, if that make sense anyway. So that's my take,

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Speaker 4: and it's probably a hot one or a film one.

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Speaker 4: I'm up to these people, not me. I'm just staying

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Speaker 4: from how I feel about it all. And yeah, so

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Speaker 4: that's my take on that guy. As far as Quentin Tarantino,

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Speaker 4: life's taste heart with that one. He's great, he's fine,

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Speaker 4: but the overhighth and the pretentious attitudes people have with

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Speaker 4: him kind of make me feel like, oh, this guy's

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Speaker 4: kind of a boner kill actually. Anyway, So yeah, thanks

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Speaker 4: for the show man and for listening to this whole email.

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Speaker 2: Thanks bye, Thanks for the call, Ellie. I agree with

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Speaker 2: your larger point.

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Speaker 1: Hitchcock as an artist was one of a kind, and

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Speaker 1: I hear you on the subjectivity of how we engage

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Speaker 1: with the artists.

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Speaker 2: I've never seen Rebecca.

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Speaker 1: I'm drawing a total blank on this film. It has

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Speaker 1: I have no recall at all. I need to see it.

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Speaker 1: Also love the shout out to Blockbuster. But I really

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Speaker 1: love the Hollywood video reference. Speaking of video stories, I

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Speaker 1: can't go there with you on Tarantino, I'm right or

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Speaker 1: die with that dude as a filmmaker. Speaking of which

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Speaker 1: recently heard from Roger Avery, well, not recently, about six

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Speaker 1: months ago. Roger, of course, wrote part of pulp Fiction

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Speaker 1: with Quentin Tarantino and directed Rules of Attraction. Some of

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Speaker 1: you who follow us on Instagram know about the Roger

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Speaker 1: Avery homage, the tribute that we paid to him in

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Speaker 1: relation to our Brian Jones episode. If you don't know

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Speaker 1: what I'm talking about and you love the movie Rules

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Speaker 1: of Attraction and you heard our Brian Jones episode from

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Speaker 1: our archive, I highly encourage you to head over to

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Speaker 1: at this grace lampod on Instagram. Just just go into

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Speaker 1: the reels section there and look about two or three

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Speaker 1: reels back or actually know it's on the grid and

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Speaker 1: you can see you can see how we paid homage

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Speaker 1: to Rules of Attraction by using the wildlife of Brian Jones. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's do some more voicemails. Here is Katie from the

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Speaker 1: eight oh two.

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Speaker 3: Hey, this is Katie calling from the ato two. You

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Speaker 3: asked for some calls about movies that we still watched.

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Speaker 3: His actors whoever, who we know, did terrible things, but

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Speaker 3: we can't go without them. And the first person who

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Speaker 3: comes to mind for me is a singer and an actor,

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Speaker 3: and that's being Crosbie. Ever since I was a kid,

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Speaker 3: I've been obsessed with Christmas carols. I've loved them. I

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Speaker 3: direct an a cappella group that we started out as

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Speaker 3: a Christmas Caroline group, and White Christmas is always one

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Speaker 3: of my favorite Carols and one of my favorite movies,

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Speaker 3: and Being Crosby and David Bowie's Little Drummer Boy will

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Speaker 3: always be one of my favorite recorded Christmas songs. But

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Speaker 3: Being Crosby was a terrible guy. He was a wife

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Speaker 3: and child abuser, and he did a lot of other

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Speaker 3: shady stuff, and it's tainted it for me a little bit.

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Speaker 3: It's a bit harder to watch his movies and listen

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Speaker 3: to some of his music. But there's no other voice

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Speaker 3: in the world like is, and there probably never will be,

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Speaker 3: so I can't give him up.

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Speaker 1: Thanks.

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Speaker 3: Probably do you love the show, Katie.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for the call.

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Speaker 1: I think what you're hitting on is something that I

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Speaker 1: touched on in the earlier block, and that's the emotional

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Speaker 1: connection to the artists and what they make. It's hard

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Speaker 1: to put down, it's hard to walk away from. I

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Speaker 1: understand the complexity, and I appreciate you weighing in here

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Speaker 1: as well.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for the call. Thank you for the thoughts, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Let's got six one seven nine oh six, Like Katie,

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Speaker 1: like Ellie, like nine oh four to get out of

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Speaker 1: six one seven nine oh six, sixty six three eight

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Speaker 1: voicemail and text, Let's do a couple of texts here

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Speaker 1: we pull up deal text machine. All right, from the

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Speaker 1: five oh weight, says Jake regarding separating the art from

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Speaker 1: the artist.

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Speaker 2: I find it incredibly easy.

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Speaker 1: First of all, we can't really know the truth much

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Speaker 1: of the time, so we might be judging someone based

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Speaker 1: on inaccurate information. Second, it's often a mistake to look

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Speaker 1: at someone from the past with the moral lens of today,

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Speaker 1: So right off the bat, it's frat Finally, it's selective.

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Speaker 1: Some people still get nothing but adoration. Others are never

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Speaker 1: given another shot. So at the end of the day,

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to worry about what Jimmy Page, McJagger

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Speaker 1: or anyone else may have done in the nineteen seventies.

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Speaker 1: It seems silly and arbitrary. Love the show five oheight.

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Speaker 2: I hear you. I agree with you for.

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Speaker 1: The most part. I agree with you, definitely agree with you.

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Speaker 1: In relation to to I don't know. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with Jimmy Page. I'm always going to

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Speaker 1: listen to led Zeppelin. But I don't want to get

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Speaker 1: I don't want to miss I don't want to miss

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Speaker 1: the mark here, right, there's there's a difference between appreciating

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Speaker 1: led Zeppelin and being to just sit back and go

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Speaker 1: what Jimmy Page some of that behavior, specifically with Lori Maddox,

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Speaker 1: which is what I think you're referring to is uh

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Speaker 1: is it's out of fucking control, and you know.

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Speaker 2: I think.

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Speaker 1: But at the same time, I think that's a little

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Speaker 1: bit different from from listening to the Alfred Hitchcock episode

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Speaker 1: in which we we truly detail the physical abuse in

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Speaker 1: toll like we try to make that uncomfortable for you guys,

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Speaker 1: because I wanted to prompt this question, you know, can

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Speaker 1: you still watch the birds?

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Speaker 2: And uh, we can.

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Speaker 1: But it's it's, you know, we're comparing different I don't

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Speaker 1: want to say apples to oranges, but we're can hearing

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Speaker 1: you know, red apples to Macintosh's. I think if that

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Speaker 1: makes any sense, all right, let's check out this one

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Speaker 1: from the eight one six, where I said, hey, nobody

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Speaker 1: is perfect. I find it very interesting that those who

430
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:12,800
Speaker 1: hold power tend to have moral personal transgressions, almost as

431
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:14,800
Speaker 1: if they use it to hold power over others. I

432
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 1: consider it to be an evil character flaw. Bill Cosby

433
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 1: is a good example of this. The public thought he

434
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:22,639
Speaker 1: was this amazing father figure and he was raping women.

435
00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,800
Speaker 1: Those who enabled him are just as guilty. It definitely

436
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 1: tarnished his reputation in the syndication of his shows. Cosby's

437
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 1: a really interesting one for me because, I mean, the

438
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:36,880
Speaker 1: allegations are super fricking harsh, and they're tough to refute,

439
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 1: they're tough not to believe, and his personality, his on

440
00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,120
Speaker 1: screen personality just is so the opposite of what he's

441
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 1: accused of. The like the Texter alludes to there. And

442
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 1: you know, I haven't seen the Cosby Show in a while.

443
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 1: I'm not sure it's still in syndication, but if I

444
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,119
Speaker 1: were flipping through and I saw it, I would definitely pause.

445
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:58,159
Speaker 2: I would definitely watch it.

446
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,879
Speaker 1: In all I would be thinking about would be the allegations,

447
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:05,080
Speaker 1: in the dichotomy between the on screen personality and the allegation.

448
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:07,800
Speaker 1: So that's a really interesting one on the issue of

449
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 1: abusive power. This is kind of off topic, but it's

450
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:12,320
Speaker 1: so heavily in my head right now.

451
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:12,920
Speaker 2: I got to mention it.

452
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:16,520
Speaker 1: I just finished watching that TV show Dope Sick. It's

453
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:18,640
Speaker 1: a couple of years old now. It's about the abuses

454
00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:23,360
Speaker 1: of big pharma, specifically Purdue Pharma, in the Sackler family

455
00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 1: and it is truly horrific and an incredible look at

456
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 1: that theme at the abuse of power. So if you

457
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,960
Speaker 1: have not seen Dope Sick, I highly recommend it. It's

458
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:39,200
Speaker 1: just fantastic television making as well.

459
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:41,480
Speaker 2: Okay, let's see what else we got here. This one.

460
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 2: This text comes from the five to four to one.

461
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 1: Jake, Tom from the five four to one here, very

462
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,639
Speaker 1: excited for a Replacements episode. I'm guessing you read Trouble Boys.

463
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 1: Highly recommended. I saw the Replacements in nineteen eighty four,

464
00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:54,680
Speaker 1: eighty six, and eighty seven in small clubs in music

465
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,840
Speaker 1: halls because want to say, the band ranged from maintenance

466
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:00,920
Speaker 1: level drunk tompletely shit faced.

467
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:02,280
Speaker 2: So the music ranged from.

468
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 1: Sheer brilliance to sloppy covers, but it was always loads

469
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 1: of fun and memorable. It seemed like when they could

470
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:09,960
Speaker 1: be the best band in the world when they wanted to.

471
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 1: The recent release of Tim Has the eighty six show

472
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,200
Speaker 1: I was at also highly recommend. Love the show Rock

473
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:18,760
Speaker 1: a rolla awesome text five to four to one. I

474
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:24,159
Speaker 1: appreciate it, Tom, I'm jealous. I'm a little I'm a

475
00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:27,679
Speaker 1: little loss for words that you saw the Replacements in

476
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,480
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four, nineteen eighty six, and nineteen eighty seven

477
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 1: in small clubs and in music halls. That's incredible, man,

478
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,119
Speaker 1: I of course was not a Replacements fan by that

479
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:40,159
Speaker 1: point in my youth. That you guys want to you know,

480
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,160
Speaker 1: the Replacements episode that Tom is talking about is an

481
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 1: all access episode that's coming out in the Patreon and

482
00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:50,160
Speaker 1: the Apple Podcasts subscriber subscription feeds only for our All

483
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 1: Access members.

484
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:52,960
Speaker 2: That'll be available this week.

485
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 1: If you guys want to sign up, super easy to do,

486
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,200
Speaker 1: just go to our website discracelamepod dot com slash membership.

487
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 1: You can get it there e five bucks a month.

488
00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:02,640
Speaker 1: You can also join for free and you can test

489
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 1: it out for a while see if you like it. Okay,

490
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 1: So six one seven nine oh six six six three eight,

491
00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:08,320
Speaker 1: you want to send us a text, you want to

492
00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:09,919
Speaker 1: leave us a voicemail, You can also hit us up

493
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 1: at Disgrace lam Pod on Instagram, on x on Facebook.

494
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 2: And I want to read I want to read this.

495
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:19,199
Speaker 2: It's almost like a.

496
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 1: Little blog post that this listener left in the comments,

497
00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:25,640
Speaker 1: and I just want to shout them out because it's

498
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 1: pretty incredible. So, you know, you know, I do these

499
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:32,119
Speaker 1: little reels on Instagram. I do these little like sixty

500
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: to ninety second synopsis of different what I call sort

501
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,600
Speaker 1: of holy shit moments from the episodes. The one we

502
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:42,520
Speaker 1: did on Hitchcock is it's more of a summary of

503
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 1: the entire sort of tippy Header and abuse situation.

504
00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 2: And a user on there jumped in the comments.

505
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 1: The user's name is zen kitten Art says, hey, it's

506
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 1: been a while since I researched this, and I'm working

507
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 1: off memory here. But to clarify for the people asking

508
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 1: in the comments about Marnie being made after the Birds,

509
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:01,400
Speaker 1: Hitchcock didn't fire tippy Head in the sense that you think.

510
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:03,720
Speaker 1: My guess is for the sake of keeping the real

511
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 1: short here, she means me, he used that word fired

512
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:10,919
Speaker 1: because it basically amounts to the same thing. Gonna hit

513
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,160
Speaker 1: reply and put the deats there so this doesn't get

514
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 1: too long. So zen Kittenner went off and she did

515
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:17,679
Speaker 1: a little research on the subject. She comes back and

516
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 1: she goes, Okay, Hitchcock owned Marnie. Like seriously, it gets

517
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:25,080
Speaker 1: way worse and creepier than just this bird scene. I

518
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 1: actually won't watch the Birds because the extent of Hitchcock's abuse.

519
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,040
Speaker 1: Fuck that guy. He found her and he made her.

520
00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:33,399
Speaker 1: He used Hollywood to then owner. He put her in

521
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 1: a penhouse where he could watch her from his own apartment.

522
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,040
Speaker 1: He bought all her clothes, she means tippy head, her

523
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 1: air dressed, her, had her hairstyle, controlled where she went

524
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 1: and with who who she was allowed to date.

525
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 2: He controlled how much and what she ate. It's sick, okay.

526
00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:53,960
Speaker 1: Then she comes back about a couple minutes later with

527
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 1: another comment, I just love how worked up zen Kittener

528
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 1: is getting here by all the research she continues to do.

529
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 1: She comes back and rights her contract was how Hitchcock

530
00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:03,280
Speaker 1: controlled her and was able to abuse her for so long.

531
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 1: After the birds he broke her, she wasn't worth another

532
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,840
Speaker 1: contract form. This is way worse than getting fired because

533
00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 1: the contract controlled everything in her life. She lost everything,

534
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:15,080
Speaker 1: her home literally, the clothes off her back, everything and yes,

535
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:18,159
Speaker 1: next comment, after he took everything, he made sure she

536
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:20,679
Speaker 1: was iced from Hollywood, so she had no way to

537
00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:23,959
Speaker 1: keep working and replace what he took. Hitchcock made her,

538
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 1: mentally broke her and then threw her away like trash.

539
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 2: The more I.

540
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: Researched this man, this is another comment. The more disgusting

541
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 1: he became. He didn't do this just to her as

542
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 1: a one time thing. Is mentally terrorized his film crew,

543
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 1: even his financial support as he got bigger and bigger.

544
00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 2: She goes on and on. I'm not going to continue

545
00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:39,760
Speaker 2: to go, but.

546
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:45,680
Speaker 1: Check out a disgracelam pod the comment section specifically, get

547
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 1: in there, okay, get in there, I get dirty with us.

548
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 1: Someone mentioned, and I think that someone was me Pulp

549
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 1: Fiction earlier about how it was released in nineteen ninety four.

550
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,440
Speaker 1: And here's something I've been doing recently. Okay, it's because

551
00:28:57,480 --> 00:28:59,280
Speaker 1: I'm getting older. I'm not gonna lie. And my kids

552
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:01,320
Speaker 1: are younger, of course, so I'm trying to explain things

553
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 1: to them and contextualize them, particularly music and film. So

554
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 1: this is, you know, I'm obsessed with this stuff, as

555
00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 1: you know, and I feel myself drawing back more into

556
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:14,200
Speaker 1: the past, try and really remember things as they were

557
00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 1: as I'm trying to explain them to my kids.

558
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 2: Okay, So PAULP.

559
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:18,720
Speaker 1: Fiction, if you were to go to the movie theater

560
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 1: in October of nineteen ninety four, all right, here are

561
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: some of the other movies besides PAULP. Fiction that you

562
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 1: would see that month in the theaters, you'd see Forrest Gump,

563
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:32,960
Speaker 1: The Shawshank, Redemption, Clear and Present, danger, Edwood Clerks, The Mask,

564
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 1: which we just watched the other night. If you got kids,

565
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:38,479
Speaker 1: highly recommend it, Jurassic Park, and a handful of others.

566
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 1: A bunch more actually that you would recognize that I'm

567
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:43,120
Speaker 1: leaving off this list because I could go on and

568
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,000
Speaker 1: on and on. Just trust me, you'd have fond memories

569
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 1: of these films and films I'm not mentioning as well.

570
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 1: All right, So if you were to go to the

571
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 1: movie theater in July of twenty twenty four, this year,

572
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:54,160
Speaker 1: last month of this year, here are some of the

573
00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 1: movies you would see, by comparison to the movies that

574
00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 1: you would see in the theater in nineteen ninety four.

575
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 1: You'd see Despicable Me four, you'd see Deadpool and Wolverine, Twisters.

576
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: I saw Twisters in the theater. You'd see Inside Out two.

577
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 2: You'd see The.

578
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:11,560
Speaker 1: Bike Riders, Bad Boys Ride or Die a Quiet Place

579
00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 1: Day one. Okay, do you notice a drop off in

580
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:16,680
Speaker 1: quality entertainment or is it just me?

581
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:17,360
Speaker 2: All right?

582
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 1: I don't care if I sound like the old guy

583
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 1: here but you cannot compare any of those movies that

584
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: I just listed from July twenty twenty four to the

585
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:28,239
Speaker 1: movies available in October of nineteen ninety four. Similarly, if

586
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:30,000
Speaker 1: you were to go to Tower Records in October of

587
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,000
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety four, here are the albums released that year

588
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:35,520
Speaker 1: that would be available for you to purchase. Weezer's the

589
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 1: Blue album nine Inch Nails is a downward spire, with

590
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: the notorious BIG's Ready to Die, Green Day, Douchie Oasis,

591
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 1: definitely maybe Pearl Jam Vitology. This list I mentioned barely

592
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:51,000
Speaker 1: scratches the frickin' surface of amazing records released in nineteen

593
00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 1: ninety four up to and including October. It's not an

594
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: entirely fair comparison because we are only in the month

595
00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:58,840
Speaker 1: of August right now here in twenty twenty four. But

596
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 1: here's a list of the so called best albums released

597
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 1: this year. Brat by Charlie XCX, Cowboy Carter by Beyonce,

598
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: hit Me Hard and Soft by Billie Eilish, The Tortured

599
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 1: Poets Department by Taylor Swift, The Great American Bar Scene

600
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 1: by Zach Bryan, Great Title Dark Times by Vince Staples, Okay,

601
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:23,200
Speaker 1: do I even need to comment on the comparison between

602
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:27,360
Speaker 1: the albums released in twenty twenty four and in nineteen

603
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 1: ninety four. All right, I don't. But here's my point.

604
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 1: We're the nineties peak life. Okay, I'm serious. I don't

605
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 1: care that this makes me sound old. But you know what,

606
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,320
Speaker 1: I don't fucking feel old, man, not at all. Gen

607
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 1: X is fucking feeling half my age with the confidence

608
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 1: of a thousand burning suns, knowing in my angry latch

609
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 1: key kid bones that the music in movies that we

610
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:52,600
Speaker 1: put out and consumed in the nineties were far superior

611
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: to the movies and music that we are putting out now.

612
00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:58,040
Speaker 2: Not that I like this, I don't. I don't like it.

613
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 2: I hate it. I root for the now. Wow.

614
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 1: I don't like focusing on the past, but certain things

615
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,960
Speaker 1: are undeniable, like the nineties being peak life. Okay, call

616
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 1: me and tell me I'm wrong. Six one seven nine

617
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 1: oh six six six three eight. Give me an era

618
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 1: you'd rather go back and live in to consume music

619
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 1: and movies other than the nineteen nineties.

620
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 2: If you weren't alive, then, if you weren't alive.

621
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: In the nineties, I want to hear from you, especially

622
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 1: knowing what you know about music, now, knowing what you

623
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 1: know about movies, now, knowing what you know.

624
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:27,560
Speaker 2: About history, and you know a lot. I know you're smart.

625
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 1: You're listening to the C block of a freaking bonus

626
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: episode about the dark side of entertainment, so I know

627
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 1: you're here for a reason. And I want to know,

628
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: if you're a twenty or thirty something, what are your

629
00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 1: thoughts on the nineteen nineties and is there another era

630
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:41,560
Speaker 1: you'd rather exist in to consume culture?

631
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 2: And if so, what is it?

632
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 1: Six one seven nine oh six six six three eight

633
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 1: to send me a voicemail or text old heads like myself,

634
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 1: jen x, I want to hear from you too.

635
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 2: Stick around, guys.

636
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:52,720
Speaker 1: We'll be back in a flash and announce the winners

637
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:54,920
Speaker 1: of our free merch this week, and I will read

638
00:32:54,920 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 1: you some reviews. All right, we are back. Disgrace slampod

639
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:13,640
Speaker 1: at gmail dot com. You guys, want to send me

640
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 1: an email, that's where you get in touch with me.

641
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: This one comes from Matt Headley, subject the Hillsborough disaster.

642
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:22,080
Speaker 2: Message.

643
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 1: Hi, I just wanted to say a huge thank you

644
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 1: for your episode and the subject above as a Liverpool fan.

645
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 1: I cannot tell you how many times over the years

646
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 1: I have heard the name of our fans being smeared

647
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 1: because of that Kelvin Mackenzie and the Sun newspaper printing

648
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 1: their lies. The reporters actually turned up at the funerals

649
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 1: the match going fans that never returned home. Also fantastic

650
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 1: that you mentioned David Dutfield for his part played in

651
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,080
Speaker 1: the tragic day and also, more importantly the lies he

652
00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 1: told afterwards to cover his own arse. I love the

653
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 1: podcast and I've listened for years now. I particularly like

654
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 1: how you've evolved to cover stories like Meril Monroe as

655
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 1: well as the Hillsborough disaster. Anyway, keep up the good work,

656
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 1: and one last time, thank you for honestly reporting something

657
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 1: that is very close to all of our Liverpudians. Hearts

658
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 1: red and blue, Liver live. I can never say it correctly. Guys,

659
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:12,280
Speaker 1: forgive me Liver Liver Puttians, Liver Pudians. I'm I'm Liverpool people.

660
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 2: Listen.

661
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,400
Speaker 1: Matt means a lot that you wrote to us. I

662
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 1: appreciate it. This event was, uh was horrific and we

663
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 1: really really tried hard to represent the truth of what

664
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 1: happened accurately in this episode, and it makes me happy

665
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: that it resonated with you. So I really appreciate the email.

666
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,520
Speaker 1: If you guys are like, what the fuck is the

667
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,600
Speaker 1: Hillsborough disaster and what is Matt talking about, you are

668
00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:43,240
Speaker 1: few and far between because the Hillsborough disaster this episode.

669
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:45,879
Speaker 1: We launched this a couple of days ago, we put

670
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,759
Speaker 1: it into the feed. It's a sports subject, okay, It's

671
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 1: not about an actor. It's not about an not about

672
00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 1: an actress, not about an artist, not about a musician, okay,

673
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:55,840
Speaker 1: but it is about a disaster where a lot of

674
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,800
Speaker 1: people uh met their end and it's just fucking horrific.

675
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 1: And for some reason, the numbers on the listenership for

676
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,799
Speaker 1: this episode went through the roof and we did no

677
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:11,279
Speaker 1: promotion around it at all, like literally nothing, and it

678
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:15,600
Speaker 1: outperformed episodes that we normally drop in that slot and

679
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:19,600
Speaker 1: we have no reason why. So if you're like Matt

680
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:24,919
Speaker 1: and you heard this episode and you appreciated it, tell

681
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,480
Speaker 1: me why. I want to understand. You get Matt's point

682
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:29,239
Speaker 1: of view here, but you know, it sounds like Matt

683
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: is from over that side of the pond. Obviously, the

684
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 1: most of the listenership was here in the States. I

685
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 1: want to know why this resonated with you, guys. I

686
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 1: want to know what we're doing right so we can

687
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: keep doing it and giving it to you. And for

688
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 1: those of you who have not heard the episode, here's

689
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 1: the description. On April fifteenth, nineteen eighty nine, ninety five men,

690
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 1: women and children were crushed to death during a soccer

691
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 1: match between Liverpool and Nottingham Forest. Two additional victims would

692
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:55,360
Speaker 1: later die their injuries. The Hillsborough disaster ruined lives and communities.

693
00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 1: But Hillsborough wasn't just a disaster. It was a fight

694
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 1: for justice. It was a war between these lablishment and

695
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 1: the people, and a cover up on the largest scale,

696
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 1: one that exploited hooligan culture in order to assassinate the

697
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,279
Speaker 1: character of thousands. And once the dust settled on the

698
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:12,960
Speaker 1: very public, very contentious collision of fandom and greedy capitalism,

699
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 1: soccer and for that matter, all sports, would never be

700
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 1: the same again. That's the Hillsborough Disaster. It's currently available

701
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 1: at the top of your feed or near the top

702
00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 1: of your feed. Go check that out, all right, appreciate

703
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,839
Speaker 1: the emails, guys. Disgrace lampod at gmail dot com. Hit

704
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:32,879
Speaker 1: me up on any subject you want. I love all

705
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:34,960
Speaker 1: the engagement. I love that you guys are supporting the show.

706
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:37,279
Speaker 1: You can support the show. It's very easy. I get

707
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 1: asked all the time, how can I support you? What

708
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:42,200
Speaker 1: can I do? Here's how. Go to Apple Podcasts, go

709
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:42,960
Speaker 1: to Spotify.

710
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 2: Leave a review. All right, that's it. Leave a good review.

711
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:49,400
Speaker 1: Okay, it really It sounds stupid, It sounds like a

712
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 1: very tiny thing, but isn't actually a big thing. It

713
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: really helps with discovery. It helps propel those algorithms and

714
00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:59,560
Speaker 1: deliver disgraceland, give it visibility to the most people possible

715
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 1: in those apps. So the reviews really matter. Hit that

716
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:05,799
Speaker 1: five star, make sure you have your auto downloads turned on.

717
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:08,080
Speaker 2: Leave a review, and what we've been.

718
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:10,160
Speaker 1: Doing here as a little thank you for you guys

719
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 1: for the support. I pick out a review every week

720
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:16,720
Speaker 1: from one of you guys, and I read it here

721
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 1: so you can hear your lovely names, and then we

722
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:22,680
Speaker 1: reward you. We reward you with some free merchandise. So

723
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 1: I want to read this one here from Ian Senior.

724
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 1: This was written last Thursday. Says hey found the podcast

725
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:31,000
Speaker 1: by searching guns n' roses is on Apple Podcasts. By

726
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:34,319
Speaker 1: the way, the two part episode on GNR is fantastic

727
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:35,879
Speaker 1: and convinced me to subscribe.

728
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:37,960
Speaker 2: Ian Senior, I hope you're listening. I hope you hear this.

729
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 1: Get in touch Disgrace Lampod at gmail dot com or

730
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:43,560
Speaker 1: hit us up at Disgrace Lampod on any of the apps,

731
00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 1: and we will get you a free T shirt, free pin,

732
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 1: free hat, free poster, whatever the hell we have lying around.

733
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:52,720
Speaker 1: Big merchant news coming soon, by the way, guys, big okay. Also,

734
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,759
Speaker 1: let's see here on Spotify. Michael m Nutt writes, Hey,

735
00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:59,680
Speaker 1: I'm a fairly new listener. Love the content. This episode

736
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 1: is shocking. He's talking about the Alfred Hitchcock episode. I

737
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 1: did not know this about Alfred.

738
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:04,880
Speaker 2: Thank you.

739
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:07,640
Speaker 1: Also, I did send in an email slash comment on

740
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 1: your website about some possible episodes. Once again, thank you

741
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:12,960
Speaker 1: for all the content. Michael, you got it. Get in

742
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 1: touch man, Disgrace mpod at gmail dot com. We'll get

743
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:17,879
Speaker 1: you some merch All right, guys, lead some reviews for us.

744
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:22,920
Speaker 1: Really appreciate it over on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Okay,

745
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:25,280
Speaker 1: this episode is nearing its end, but the after party

746
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 1: continues for all of our all access members, which you

747
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:30,759
Speaker 1: can become an all access member fairly easily, Like I

748
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 1: said earlier, just go to Disgrace lampod dot com slash membership.

749
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,360
Speaker 1: You can sign up there. You're gonna get a extended

750
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 1: version of this here after party, you're gonna get add

751
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:40,960
Speaker 1: for you listening, and you're going to get an exclusive

752
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 1: full episode every month. Like I said, this month's is

753
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:51,600
Speaker 1: on the replacements. Here's a sneak peek. Paul Westerberg counted

754
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:55,239
Speaker 1: off and the band thrashed into the opening chord right away.

755
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 2: Something was off. They sounded like a semi.

756
00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:00,920
Speaker 1: Truck grinding its gears for a few b before finally

757
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:01,840
Speaker 1: everyone stopped.

758
00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:03,560
Speaker 2: For a second.

759
00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:06,760
Speaker 1: The room was dead silent except for the buzzing coming

760
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:10,560
Speaker 1: from the amplifiers. Paul stared out into the sea of

761
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:14,239
Speaker 1: angry and confused faces and yelled into the microphone, this

762
00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 1: is our last fucking performance ever, ever, ever. Then he

763
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 1: cackled with laughter, and the band kicked into a ramshackle

764
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 1: cover of the Elvis Presley's Do the Clam. After a

765
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,680
Speaker 1: few minutes, they stumbled to a stop. Paul stared at

766
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 1: the floor and tuned his guitar for or felt like

767
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,359
Speaker 1: an hour before switching gears again and trying to make

768
00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:37,279
Speaker 1: it through Led Zeppelin's Misty Mountain Hawk. It was January

769
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,759
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five and the Replacements were on stage at

770
00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:44,360
Speaker 1: CBGB in New York City, playing an unannounced performance that

771
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,080
Speaker 1: was supposed to be their East Coast major label showcase.

772
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 1: The hype around the Replacements was growing fast in the industry,

773
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:54,360
Speaker 1: especially after The Village Voice were in a cover story

774
00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:58,319
Speaker 1: they called them the most exciting band in America. At

775
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,600
Speaker 1: the band's West Coast showcase, Bob and Chris found a

776
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:04,440
Speaker 1: way to undercut that height by letting off a pocket

777
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:07,320
Speaker 1: full of stink bombs just as the band hit the stage,

778
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 1: and that cleared the room pretty quickly. Tonight, they didn't

779
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:14,440
Speaker 1: have literal stink bombs, but they found another way to

780
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 1: clear the room.

781
00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:17,960
Speaker 2: They kicked off the set with You're.

782
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:20,480
Speaker 1: A Mean One, Mister Grinch, and things.

783
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:21,680
Speaker 2: Even got weirder from there.

784
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 1: Paul started maybe fifty songs that night, but the band.

785
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:27,360
Speaker 2: Made it through less than five.

786
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:30,440
Speaker 1: They tried their hand at Dolly Parton and then the

787
00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 1: theme from the Andy Griffith Show. What they didn't play

788
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 1: were songs by the Replacements. As the crowd streamed out

789
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 1: of the club, Paul started playing.

790
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 2: A U two song.

791
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:43,840
Speaker 1: These label stiffs couldn't take a joke.

792
00:40:43,719 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 2: Then fuck it all right, welcome back.

793
00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:07,960
Speaker 1: I'm about to get out of here, but before I do,

794
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,440
Speaker 1: before next week's Lana del Rey episode, there will be

795
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 1: a rewind from our archive popping up in your feeds. Guys,

796
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,120
Speaker 1: we have so many episodes in our archive. We mentioned

797
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:16,759
Speaker 1: Guns and Roses earlier in the episode, and we have

798
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,360
Speaker 1: a two part episode on GNR. Those are episodes number

799
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:22,520
Speaker 1: forty nine, released on March tenth, twenty twenty, and episode

800
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: number fifty released on March seventeenth, twenty twenty. Those are

801
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:27,759
Speaker 1: in the archive. If you have not heard them, check

802
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 1: them out. If you like Guns and Roses, you're gonna

803
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 1: love these episodes. Okay, we also mentioned Beyonce here in

804
00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,720
Speaker 1: this episode. We haven't done an episode on on Beyonce,

805
00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 1: but we have done an episode on Becky with the

806
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:42,279
Speaker 1: Good Hairs alleged illicit lover jay Z, that too. That

807
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:45,400
Speaker 1: jay Z episode is also from March twenty twenty, and

808
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 1: jay Z is episode fifty one in the disgrace Land archive. Okay,

809
00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 1: with Lana Delray coming up next week as our next

810
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,440
Speaker 1: full episode of Disgraceland, and the theme of that episode

811
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:56,800
Speaker 1: being about strong women. I would be remiss if I

812
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 1: did not mention the Jennifer Hudson episode of disgrace Land,

813
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:03,440
Speaker 1: episode number one ten, released on September twentieth, twenty twenty two.

814
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:04,359
Speaker 2: All right, that.

815
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:07,479
Speaker 1: Brings us nearly tune end, my friends. Let's recap, shall

816
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:09,640
Speaker 1: we number one right now in your feed? A brand

817
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 1: new episode on Alfred Hitchcock. Number two coming tomorrow, a

818
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:15,240
Speaker 1: special rewind episode from our archive, and we are talking

819
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:17,719
Speaker 1: Lona del Rey next week. And because we are, I

820
00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 1: want to know from you guys, which artists you think

821
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:21,040
Speaker 1: have been unfairly treated by the press.

822
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 2: Hit me up six one.

823
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: Seven, nine oh six six sixty three eight and let

824
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 1: me know. Call me on the telephone or send me

825
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:26,120
Speaker 1: a text.

826
00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 2: Hit me up.

827
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: That's gracelamd pod on the socials. Number three, merch winners,

828
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 1: get in touch. You know who you are.

829
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 2: Number four.

830
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:34,840
Speaker 1: Remember, no one cares about great storytelling more than you

831
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 1: doing well.

832
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 2: That's a disgrace.

833
00:42:36,719 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 1: All right, to prove to you guys, Yes, the nineties

834
00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:41,760
Speaker 1: were peak life. Here's me reading to you the Billboard

835
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:44,400
Speaker 1: Charts in the week of October fourteenth, nineteen ninety four.

836
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:48,560
Speaker 2: The week Pulp fiction was released. It's this list, this list,

837
00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:52,560
Speaker 2: This list might actually hurt my argument, but away we go.

838
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 2: Number one, I'll Make.

839
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:58,360
Speaker 1: Love to You Boys to Men, last week one, peak

840
00:42:58,360 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 1: position one week on Chart ten. All I Want to

841
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:08,320
Speaker 1: Do Sheryl Crow last week to peak position two weeks

842
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:13,480
Speaker 1: on Chart eleven. Endless Love Luther Vandres and Mariah Carey

843
00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:17,839
Speaker 1: last week three at Your peak position two weeks on

844
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:18,879
Speaker 1: Chart six.

845
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 2: Even number four.

846
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:25,839
Speaker 1: When can I See fur Baby Face? Last week peak

847
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:30,839
Speaker 1: position twelve, four weeks on Charty A. Number five, I'll

848
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:38,759
Speaker 1: Never Lie Churt last week position five, six positions on.

849
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:39,280
Speaker 3: Position.

850
00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:52,520
Speaker 1: Quit talking and start mixing.