1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,960
Speaker 1: If you love iPhone, you'll love Apple Card. It's the

2
00:00:03,040 --> 00:00:06,920
Speaker 1: credit card designed for iPhone. It gives you unlimited daily

3
00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:10,000
Speaker 1: cash back that can earn four point four zero percent

4
00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:12,960
Speaker 1: annual percentage yield. When you open a high Yield Savings

5
00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:16,280
Speaker 1: account through Apple Card, apply for Applecard in the wallet

6
00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,520
Speaker 1: app subject to credit approval. Savings is available to Apple

7
00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,800
Speaker 1: Card owners subject to eligibility. Apple Card and Savings by

8
00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:26,120
Speaker 1: Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City Branch Member FDIC

9
00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,280
Speaker 1: terms and more at applecard dot com. When you pop

10
00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:31,240
Speaker 1: a piece of cheese into your mouth, you're probably not

11
00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:34,280
Speaker 1: thinking about the environmental impact. But the people in the

12
00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:37,680
Speaker 1: dairy industry are. That's why they're working hard every day

13
00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:40,760
Speaker 1: to find new ways to reduce waste, conserve natural resources,

14
00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:44,360
Speaker 1: and drive down greenhouse gas emissions. How is US Dairy

15
00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,520
Speaker 1: tackling greenhouse gases? Many farms use anaerobic digesters to turn

16
00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:53,080
Speaker 1: the methane from manure into renewable energy that can power farms, towns,

17
00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:57,200
Speaker 1: and electric cars. Visit us dairy dot COM's Last Sustainability

18
00:00:57,280 --> 00:00:58,000
Speaker 1: to learn more.

19
00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:03,440
Speaker 2: And friends and families walking riding on passing the roads

20
00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:05,800
Speaker 2: every day. Remember they're real people with loved ones who

21
00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:06,280
Speaker 2: need them to.

22
00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:07,040
Speaker 1: Get home safely.

23
00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:11,280
Speaker 2: Protect our cyclists and pedestrians because they're people too, Go safely, California.

24
00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:13,600
Speaker 2: From the California Office of Traffic Safety and Caltrans.

25
00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:17,680
Speaker 3: We're just days away from our twenty twenty four iHeartRadio

26
00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:20,160
Speaker 3: Music Festival, presented by Capital On.

27
00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:23,800
Speaker 4: The biggest headliners in live music will be taking over

28
00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:26,080
Speaker 4: to Mobile Arena, Las Vegas.

29
00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:28,360
Speaker 3: Loss sub special surprises and moments you are not going

30
00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:29,480
Speaker 3: to want to miss.

31
00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:33,920
Speaker 1: Stream only on Hulu iHeartRadio Music Festival and listen on

32
00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,360
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio the most anticipated live music events of the.

33
00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:42,120
Speaker 5: Year this Friday and Saturday, starting at ten thirty pm

34
00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:53,440
Speaker 5: Eastern seven thirty Pacific. Hey, Daniel, have you guys figured

35
00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:56,480
Speaker 5: out how to make quantum mechanics and gravity work together?

36
00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:56,800
Speaker 6: Yet?

37
00:01:56,960 --> 00:01:59,000
Speaker 1: Ooh hit me hard with a nasty question, run off

38
00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:02,400
Speaker 1: the bat. Huh, Well, unfortunately we haven't figured it out yet.

39
00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:04,880
Speaker 5: Well what have you guys been working on and how

40
00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:07,080
Speaker 5: long have you been working on it? For decades?

41
00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:09,640
Speaker 1: More than one hundred years?

42
00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:12,920
Speaker 5: Actually, Well, and I thought I was a little bit

43
00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:16,239
Speaker 5: behind on my deadlines, So you know how long you

44
00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:19,400
Speaker 5: think it's going to take? Another weekend, another thousand years.

45
00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:21,919
Speaker 5: Can I get it in by Monday?

46
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,040
Speaker 1: You know, the only progress we've really made is coming

47
00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:28,239
Speaker 1: up with some long, confusing names for it.

48
00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:31,519
Speaker 5: Like Mississippi or quantum gravity.

49
00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:35,079
Speaker 1: No, that would be much too clear.

50
00:02:35,200 --> 00:02:39,000
Speaker 5: Okay, like gravito, quantum field, hydrodynamically.

51
00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:42,880
Speaker 1: I think you should be a physicist, Katie. You have

52
00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:43,720
Speaker 1: the knack for it.

53
00:02:43,800 --> 00:02:46,080
Speaker 5: I know how to throw a ball and look at

54
00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:48,560
Speaker 5: it go up and come down, so I'm already halfway there.

55
00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:04,320
Speaker 7: Hi.

56
00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:07,160
Speaker 1: I'm Daniel. I'm a particle physicist and a professor at

57
00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:10,640
Speaker 1: UC Irvine, and I desperately want to know the underlying

58
00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:11,919
Speaker 1: rules of the universe.

59
00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:15,280
Speaker 5: I am Katie Golden. I am not a particle physicist.

60
00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:19,320
Speaker 5: I host a podcast about animals. But that doesn't mean

61
00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:23,480
Speaker 5: that I couldn't maybe try to smash quantum mechanics and

62
00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:26,600
Speaker 5: gravity together if you give me a government grant.

63
00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:31,240
Speaker 1: I think everybody who's not a particle physicist should introduce

64
00:03:31,280 --> 00:03:34,680
Speaker 1: themselves that way. Hi, I'm Sally. I'm not a particle physicist.

65
00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:36,000
Speaker 5: I think that makes the most sense.

66
00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:40,400
Speaker 1: In that case, I should start off by listing all

67
00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:42,760
Speaker 1: the things that I'm not. Every time I introduce myself

68
00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,560
Speaker 1: to somebody, I'm not an Olympic gymnast, I'm not a

69
00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:47,000
Speaker 1: Wall Street trader dot dot.

70
00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:49,160
Speaker 5: Com, i am not a hot dog eating champion.

71
00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:55,400
Speaker 1: Yet we can all aspire to stuff. Well. Welcome to

72
00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:58,600
Speaker 1: the podcast Daniel and Jorge Explain the Universe, a production

73
00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:02,560
Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio in which we aspire to be particle physicists.

74
00:04:02,880 --> 00:04:05,680
Speaker 1: We all want to understand the way the universe works.

75
00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:08,080
Speaker 1: We all want to figure it out, to zoom down

76
00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:11,000
Speaker 1: to the tiniest little bits of the universe, the basic

77
00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:14,240
Speaker 1: building blocks and the rules that intertangle them, and zoom

78
00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:16,560
Speaker 1: out from that picture to understand how it all comes

79
00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:19,839
Speaker 1: together to make our amazing hour bonkers are wonderful, our

80
00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:21,400
Speaker 1: delicious universe.

81
00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:26,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, like a nice stew of concepts all mingled up

82
00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:29,520
Speaker 5: in the stars. So yeah, I mean it is interesting

83
00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:32,440
Speaker 5: because I think we've talked a little bit on the

84
00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:34,840
Speaker 5: times that I've been on the show about quantum mechanics.

85
00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:37,920
Speaker 5: We've talked about gravity, We've talked about sort of this

86
00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:43,080
Speaker 5: distinction between the physics involved in the really tiny and

87
00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:46,360
Speaker 5: the really huge, and how it's a bit of a

88
00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:48,320
Speaker 5: puzzle to fit those together.

89
00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, the basic strategy of physics has always been to

90
00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:54,680
Speaker 1: zoom down to the littlest bits of the universe to

91
00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:58,080
Speaker 1: try to understand them, and then hope that we can carefully,

92
00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,240
Speaker 1: one step at a time, zoom out and figure out

93
00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:04,479
Speaker 1: how those things come together to make our world. You know,

94
00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,600
Speaker 1: how electrons and protons come together to make atoms, and

95
00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,880
Speaker 1: atoms come together to make molecules, and molecules come together

96
00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:13,719
Speaker 1: to make proteins, and proteins come together to make steak

97
00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:15,800
Speaker 1: and ice cream and all the delicious things that you eat.

98
00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:19,320
Speaker 1: That's sort of like reductionist approach. We zoom down and

99
00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:22,200
Speaker 1: then one at a time step back up to understand

100
00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:24,960
Speaker 1: our world. Has long been the approach we wanted to

101
00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:27,560
Speaker 1: take to understand the universe, and that's worked for lots

102
00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:29,640
Speaker 1: of stuff, like the way we understand ice cream and

103
00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,359
Speaker 1: blueberries and steak and goats and all that stuff. But

104
00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:34,799
Speaker 1: you're right, Katie, there's one big thing that it hasn't

105
00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:38,240
Speaker 1: been able to explain, maybe the biggest, most important thing

106
00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:42,200
Speaker 1: that shapes our universe, and that's gravity. How everything seems

107
00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:45,240
Speaker 1: to attract itself, or how things flow through space time.

108
00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,280
Speaker 1: We still don't understand how that bubbles up from the

109
00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:49,640
Speaker 1: tiniest little bits of.

110
00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:53,760
Speaker 5: The universe because gravity is sort of, I guess, like

111
00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:56,880
Speaker 5: a big force that we observe. So like you know,

112
00:05:56,920 --> 00:06:00,120
Speaker 5: you feel gravity on a planet. Maybe you and I

113
00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:03,159
Speaker 5: I have our own gravitational pull, but it's much weaker

114
00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:05,160
Speaker 5: than a planet, so we're not going to notice it.

115
00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,520
Speaker 5: But is gravity something you can really measure much when

116
00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:12,320
Speaker 5: you get really small, like say you're looking at particles,

117
00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:15,560
Speaker 5: Like does a particle have its own gravity? Or can

118
00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:19,240
Speaker 5: you even measure gravity of say like a neutron or

119
00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:20,839
Speaker 5: a proton or an electron.

120
00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:24,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly the puzzle. On a theoretical sense, we

121
00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:26,800
Speaker 1: don't know how to stitch these two things together, and

122
00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:30,120
Speaker 1: we'll talk about that more during this podcast. But even

123
00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:34,000
Speaker 1: more frustrating, in experimental sense, we can't even see what

124
00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:37,359
Speaker 1: the universe does. Basically, the job of physics is to

125
00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:40,240
Speaker 1: explain what is the universe doing, what's happening out there,

126
00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:43,040
Speaker 1: and why does it make sense? And the first step

127
00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:45,279
Speaker 1: there is to see what's happening in the universe. And

128
00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:46,680
Speaker 1: so the first thing you want to do if you

129
00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:50,000
Speaker 1: want to explain the gravity of little particles, the quantum

130
00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:53,880
Speaker 1: mechanical understanding of gravity is to see gravity operating on

131
00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:57,360
Speaker 1: little particles. That's basically what you're asking. And the challenge

132
00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:00,640
Speaker 1: there is that gravity is so dang weak compared to

133
00:07:00,680 --> 00:07:03,920
Speaker 1: the other forces of electromagnetism, even the weak force and

134
00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:07,480
Speaker 1: definitely the strong force, Gravity is like a bajillion zillion

135
00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:11,480
Speaker 1: quintillion times weaker, which is why, for example, like a

136
00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:14,920
Speaker 1: simple fridge magnet can overpower the gravity of the Earth

137
00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,800
Speaker 1: and hold your recipe against your fridge or your pictures

138
00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:20,840
Speaker 1: of your kids and their cousins. It's not hard to

139
00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:24,000
Speaker 1: overcome the gravity of an entire planet with a tiny

140
00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:27,400
Speaker 1: little bit of electromagnetism. And so when you're looking at

141
00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:30,680
Speaker 1: a tiny particle, a proton or a neutron, its gravity

142
00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:34,520
Speaker 1: is basically zero. It's so hard to measure. The smallest

143
00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:37,600
Speaker 1: thing we've ever measured the gravity of is something like

144
00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:40,200
Speaker 1: on the order of a gram, you know, which means

145
00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:43,600
Speaker 1: it has like ten to twenty particles in it. So no,

146
00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:47,400
Speaker 1: we are nowhere close to being able to see gravity

147
00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,480
Speaker 1: operate on particles so that we can then try to

148
00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:51,920
Speaker 1: explain how it all works.

149
00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:56,480
Speaker 5: That seems kind of hard because like science is mostly

150
00:07:56,560 --> 00:08:01,360
Speaker 5: about say either direct observation or so setting up an experiment.

151
00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:05,160
Speaker 5: So if you can't even see it happening or figure

152
00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:07,640
Speaker 5: out how to observe it in particles. How can you

153
00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:11,000
Speaker 5: ever figure out how it works on such a small scale.

154
00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:14,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, great question. Well one is you don't give up.

155
00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:21,360
Speaker 5: Oh I was just gonna go for just give up, never.

156
00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:25,280
Speaker 1: Give up, Never give it. People are doing these incredible experiments.

157
00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:28,840
Speaker 1: It's really an amazing accomplishment to figure out how to

158
00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,480
Speaker 1: test gravity on the smaller and smaller things. And there's

159
00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,079
Speaker 1: this history getting all the way back to like Cavendish

160
00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,280
Speaker 1: torsion experiments of lead balls a weigh a few pounds,

161
00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:40,520
Speaker 1: down to smaller objects and smaller objects, and very recently

162
00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:43,160
Speaker 1: down to stuff like smaller than a raisin, you know,

163
00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:46,160
Speaker 1: a few grains of sand of material. And I really

164
00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,480
Speaker 1: want to underscore that there's a special scientific skill there.

165
00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:54,280
Speaker 1: It's not like mathematics or genius insight into philosophy. It's

166
00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:55,800
Speaker 1: experimental bravura.

167
00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:56,080
Speaker 7: You know.

168
00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:59,400
Speaker 1: It's what Ray might call engineering. It's like figuring out

169
00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,080
Speaker 1: how to make your experimental system so quiet and so

170
00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:05,400
Speaker 1: clean and so pristine that you can force the universe

171
00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,560
Speaker 1: to reveal one of its secrets. It's a really special

172
00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:11,040
Speaker 1: skill in science. And so those folks are working hard

173
00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:13,720
Speaker 1: and drilling down, but yeah, they're like twenty orders of

174
00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:16,560
Speaker 1: magnitude away from figuring it out, so it's going to

175
00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:18,720
Speaker 1: be a while. The other thing is, you could, you know,

176
00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:21,640
Speaker 1: try to visit a black hole. Inside a black hole,

177
00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:24,360
Speaker 1: we think that gravity and quant mechanics are both relevant

178
00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:28,080
Speaker 1: because obviously there's strong gravity, but also things are squished

179
00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:31,880
Speaker 1: really really small at the singularity inside the black hole.

180
00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:35,680
Speaker 1: Of course, that's inside the black hole beyond the event horizon.

181
00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:37,880
Speaker 1: So we still haven't figured out how to probe that.

182
00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:40,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, we've talked about this. It is not in the

183
00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:44,800
Speaker 5: budget to go to a black hole just yet.

184
00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:47,320
Speaker 1: No, so instead you might want to make your own

185
00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:49,840
Speaker 1: black hole and then study the patterns of its hawking

186
00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:52,400
Speaker 1: radiation to try to get some clues as to what

187
00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:55,559
Speaker 1: might be inside of it. But nobody succeeded in making

188
00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,199
Speaker 1: a black hole yet, and if they did, it might

189
00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:59,959
Speaker 1: destroy the Earth, and so there are some questions there.

190
00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,760
Speaker 1: So while the experimental side is super tooper frustrating, we

191
00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,600
Speaker 1: can try to make some progress on the theoretical side thinking

192
00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:13,000
Speaker 1: deeply about the universe, eating special mushrooms and having insights

193
00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:17,440
Speaker 1: about connections and mathematical symmetries between these two ideas, to

194
00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:19,920
Speaker 1: look for links, to look for connections, to look for

195
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:22,880
Speaker 1: ways to fit them together in our minds that might

196
00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,319
Speaker 1: give us some new clues as to how to bridge

197
00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:28,360
Speaker 1: these two fundamental pillars of modern physics.

198
00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:32,800
Speaker 5: Now, do you get university funding for mushroom tripping in

199
00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,320
Speaker 5: the sake of theoretical physics?

200
00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,400
Speaker 1: If you can convince the funding agency that it's essential

201
00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:42,120
Speaker 1: for your research to make progress, then ya, I'll bet you.

202
00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:46,360
Speaker 1: And so today on the podcast, we'll be exploring one

203
00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:49,800
Speaker 1: of those potential directions to bring gravity and quantum mechanics

204
00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:53,400
Speaker 1: together to try to fit these two genius insights about

205
00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:57,440
Speaker 1: the way the universe works into one mega insight. And

206
00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:05,040
Speaker 1: today in the podcast, we're asking the question, what is

207
00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:10,560
Speaker 1: gravito electro magnetism? Boy? Is that a mouthful? I feel

208
00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:12,680
Speaker 1: like this must have been named by some German person. Yeah,

209
00:11:12,679 --> 00:11:13,959
Speaker 1: every time they come up with a name for something,

210
00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:15,720
Speaker 1: they just like stick a bunch of words together into

211
00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:16,680
Speaker 1: one super long word.

212
00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,120
Speaker 5: Instead of coming up with a new word, it's used

213
00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:21,840
Speaker 5: the words you already have, but stick them all together.

214
00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:25,800
Speaker 1: Imagine if you came up with new ice cream flavors

215
00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:29,120
Speaker 1: that way. Cookies and cream all one word.

216
00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:31,000
Speaker 5: Wait, it isn't already?

217
00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:34,800
Speaker 1: No, No, I think that's exactly how they figured it out.

218
00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:38,280
Speaker 5: Like, I think it's interesting that I don't think I've

219
00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:40,800
Speaker 5: ever seen a question before of the audience where people

220
00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,079
Speaker 5: are just like I can't even comprehend the name of this.

221
00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:46,719
Speaker 1: That's right, And so this was maybe a little bit

222
00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:49,640
Speaker 1: unfair to drop this on the listeners, But what the heck?

223
00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:51,960
Speaker 1: I think it's fun to ask the guys questions about

224
00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:54,599
Speaker 1: things you never heard about. So thanks very much to

225
00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:57,760
Speaker 1: everybody who volunteers for this audience participation segment of the

226
00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:01,400
Speaker 1: podcast and is caught awareby by very technical physics questions

227
00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:04,800
Speaker 1: without an opportunity to prepare. We really appreciate you being

228
00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:06,640
Speaker 1: gained for this. If you would like to play for

229
00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:09,480
Speaker 1: future episodes of the podcast, please write to me two

230
00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:14,000
Speaker 1: questions at Danielanjorge dot com. So before you hear these answers,

231
00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:15,840
Speaker 1: think about it for a minute. What do you think

232
00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:21,240
Speaker 1: gravito electromagnetism could be? Here's what some listeners had to say.

233
00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:27,960
Speaker 6: Is it the electrocharge put off by strong gravity?

234
00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:28,840
Speaker 1: Maybe?

235
00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:34,560
Speaker 6: I don't know how you combine gravity and electromagnetism, but

236
00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:38,120
Speaker 6: it sounds like some kind of combo of the two.

237
00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:43,280
Speaker 6: So maybe it's the way in which electromagnetic fields are

238
00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:44,880
Speaker 6: affected by gravity.

239
00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:47,640
Speaker 1: Or vice versa.

240
00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:56,920
Speaker 7: I'm going to guess that gravito electromagnetism is the impact

241
00:12:57,120 --> 00:13:00,840
Speaker 7: that gravity has on the electromagne that A four.

242
00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:05,160
Speaker 5: I wonder what insane clown Posse has to say about

243
00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:09,800
Speaker 5: gravito electromagnetism, and if they know how it works? Does

244
00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:12,120
Speaker 5: that call back too old? Now? Am I old?

245
00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:18,040
Speaker 1: I'm not going to comment on it. I will say

246
00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:20,760
Speaker 1: that I am approaching fifty and so I've embraced being

247
00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:24,040
Speaker 1: fifty by calling myself fifty before I even got there.

248
00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,040
Speaker 1: And my kids think it's weird that I round myself

249
00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:29,079
Speaker 1: up to fifty, but I love it.

250
00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,360
Speaker 5: I do that too, I round up, so I'm not

251
00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:32,920
Speaker 5: so shocked when it happens.

252
00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:36,040
Speaker 1: Exactly That's what I was thinking. And then my daughter

253
00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:38,080
Speaker 1: asked me. She said, well, does that mean when you

254
00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:40,520
Speaker 1: turn fifty one, you're gonna round yourself up to one hundred?

255
00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:41,560
Speaker 5: Why not?

256
00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:44,000
Speaker 1: Yeah? I thought, you know, for the sake of consistency,

257
00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:44,720
Speaker 1: I guess I have to.

258
00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:47,640
Speaker 5: I mean, you know, then you could be the oldest

259
00:13:47,679 --> 00:13:50,520
Speaker 5: person on Earth, even before you start getting a pension.

260
00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:53,800
Speaker 1: That's true. I'm just hoping to get some of those

261
00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:59,120
Speaker 1: compliments like wow, Daniel, you look good for it. All right,

262
00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:02,240
Speaker 1: But back to the time of quantum mechanics and gravity,

263
00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,440
Speaker 1: we see people are struggling to understand what this word means.

264
00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:07,560
Speaker 1: But there is a sense there that it's about some

265
00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:13,200
Speaker 1: relationship between gravity and electromagnetism. Maybe gravity is caused by electromagnetism,

266
00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:16,480
Speaker 1: or maybe you get electric charges from gravity. There's some

267
00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:17,600
Speaker 1: fun ideas in there.

268
00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:21,640
Speaker 5: It does sound like a little scammy. It sounds like

269
00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:25,280
Speaker 5: something where someone's trying to sell something to me, because

270
00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:28,960
Speaker 5: it's just so many technical sounding words all smashed together.

271
00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:33,400
Speaker 5: It's like, yeah, I kind of want to know what

272
00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:35,720
Speaker 5: it is. The only thing I can think of, like

273
00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:38,000
Speaker 5: these listeners is just that it's like kind of trying

274
00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:41,880
Speaker 5: to smoosh the concepts of gravity and electromagnetism together, but

275
00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:46,040
Speaker 5: I kind of want to know more specifically what that

276
00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:47,200
Speaker 5: is and how that works.

277
00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:49,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so delay the groundwork. I think we need

278
00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:51,360
Speaker 1: to spell out a little bit of detail about like

279
00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:55,360
Speaker 1: why this problem is hard. Why is it difficult to

280
00:14:55,560 --> 00:15:00,640
Speaker 1: bring gravity and electromagnetism or gravity, and quantum mechanical theories

281
00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:04,640
Speaker 1: of forces together in general, and so we should probably

282
00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:07,400
Speaker 1: start with those quantum mechanical theories. And you know, we

283
00:15:07,400 --> 00:15:11,480
Speaker 1: talked about electromagnetism because it's one of the fundamental forces

284
00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:13,760
Speaker 1: that we know about in the universe. And all of

285
00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:17,440
Speaker 1: these fundamental forces are quantum mechanical, meaning that we have

286
00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:20,680
Speaker 1: a theory of quantum mechanics that describes particles and how

287
00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:23,440
Speaker 1: they move through space or how they exist and how

288
00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:27,480
Speaker 1: they have probabilities to exist. And those quantum mechanical theories,

289
00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:31,640
Speaker 1: those Shroninger equations and the lagrongins and the Hamiltonians, all

290
00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:36,080
Speaker 1: those mathematical structures are quantum mechanical and they describe the forces.

291
00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,560
Speaker 1: So we have electromagnetism, we have the weak force, and

292
00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:42,480
Speaker 1: we have the strong force. All these things can be

293
00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:44,920
Speaker 1: described using a quantum mechanical theory. It means we know

294
00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:48,480
Speaker 1: how to calculate what happens when one particle pushes or

295
00:15:48,520 --> 00:15:52,520
Speaker 1: pulls on another particle using one of these forces. Like

296
00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,120
Speaker 1: when two electrons are coming near each other, they repel

297
00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:57,680
Speaker 1: each other and they use these forces to do so.

298
00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:01,800
Speaker 1: They use electromagnetism, and think about that quantum mechanically, either

299
00:16:01,880 --> 00:16:06,120
Speaker 1: as one electron has a big electromagnetic field and that's

300
00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:08,720
Speaker 1: pushing on the other electron, or if you prefer the

301
00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:11,640
Speaker 1: particle picture, you can imagine that the two electrons are

302
00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:15,320
Speaker 1: exchanging photons. They're tossing photons back and forth, and that's

303
00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:17,600
Speaker 1: how they're pushing on each other. But either way we

304
00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:20,400
Speaker 1: have a nice quantum mechanical picture from the ground up,

305
00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:24,640
Speaker 1: from the littlest bits of these three fundamental forces, electromagnetism,

306
00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:26,680
Speaker 1: the weak force, and the strong force.

307
00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:31,680
Speaker 5: So is gravity even weaker than the weak force?

308
00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:36,280
Speaker 1: Gravity is like ten to the thirty times weaker than

309
00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:40,240
Speaker 1: the weak force. It's almost unimaginably weak. It's so much

310
00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:42,920
Speaker 1: weaker than the other forces that it's a big puzzle

311
00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,920
Speaker 1: in physics. Like in physics, we look for patterns and clues.

312
00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:49,080
Speaker 1: We expect things that are similar in nature to all

313
00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:52,880
Speaker 1: operate in under similar principles and have similar numbers. So

314
00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:55,200
Speaker 1: if you want to lump gravity in as one of

315
00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:58,120
Speaker 1: the forces, then you've got to answer the question, why

316
00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,640
Speaker 1: is it so much weaker than the other forces? Not

317
00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:03,720
Speaker 1: by a factor of ten, not by a factor of

318
00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:07,119
Speaker 1: one hundred, not by a million, but ten with thirty

319
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:09,400
Speaker 1: zeros behind it. That's a big deal.

320
00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:13,440
Speaker 5: And so like the difference between electromagnetism, the weak force,

321
00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:16,960
Speaker 5: and strong force like is not nearly as big as

322
00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:20,639
Speaker 5: the difference between all those three and gravity.

323
00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. The strong force is like ten times more

324
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:27,440
Speaker 1: powerful than electromagnetism, which is like one hundred times more

325
00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:30,800
Speaker 1: powerful than the weak force, which is like a gajillion

326
00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:33,600
Speaker 1: billion of jillion times more valuation.

327
00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:36,600
Speaker 5: To hang on, that doesn't even sound like a number, Okay,

328
00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:39,520
Speaker 5: but I get it. So gravity is so incredibly weak

329
00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:42,280
Speaker 5: it doesn't even seem like it's in the same category

330
00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:45,879
Speaker 5: as these other things. It's like comparing it like a

331
00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:47,399
Speaker 5: blue whale to an ant.

332
00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly right. Now. Fundamentally, that's not a problem.

333
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:54,520
Speaker 1: Like it's possible that you could have for forces in

334
00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:56,840
Speaker 1: the universe and one of them is just much weaker.

335
00:17:57,160 --> 00:17:59,560
Speaker 1: There are ways that you can do that. It's not

336
00:17:59,560 --> 00:18:02,119
Speaker 1: an insert amountable issue. It's strange and it would make

337
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:05,720
Speaker 1: you ask like why is that and to look for explanations,

338
00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:09,400
Speaker 1: but mathematically it doesn't prevent us from describing it. That's

339
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,199
Speaker 1: not the challenge with gravity. If you sit down and

340
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:15,600
Speaker 1: try to describe gravity using some kinds of maths similar

341
00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:18,440
Speaker 1: to the way we describe electromagnetism and the weak force

342
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,200
Speaker 1: and strong force, to come up with like a quantum

343
00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:24,240
Speaker 1: theory of gravity that describes it as a force. Then

344
00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:26,960
Speaker 1: you start to build in gravitational fields, and you can

345
00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:30,119
Speaker 1: think about the quantized ripples in those fields as particles.

346
00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,360
Speaker 1: In this case, it would be the graviton. So when

347
00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:36,200
Speaker 1: two planets come near each other and pull on each other,

348
00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:40,920
Speaker 1: the quantum picture of gravity would have them exchanging gravitons

349
00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,720
Speaker 1: the way two electrons are like exchange photons. So you

350
00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:47,760
Speaker 1: can start to go down that road mathematically and things

351
00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:50,560
Speaker 1: seem okay. You just like dial the force way way

352
00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:52,919
Speaker 1: down to make it super duper weak, But then you

353
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:56,360
Speaker 1: run into a lot of mathematical problems actually making that

354
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:57,040
Speaker 1: theory work.

355
00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,359
Speaker 5: How do you check your math in a situation like this, like,

356
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:03,160
Speaker 5: what are the kinds of mathematical problems that you run

357
00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:05,600
Speaker 5: into and how do you know that they're problems?

358
00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:08,560
Speaker 1: Yeah? Great question. The way that you know that your

359
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,480
Speaker 1: theory is working or not working is that you try

360
00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:14,919
Speaker 1: to use it and you see if it gives reasonable results. Like,

361
00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:17,080
Speaker 1: if you ask, I want to push these two particles together,

362
00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:20,359
Speaker 1: I want to calculate the probability of various outcomes. I

363
00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:21,959
Speaker 1: want to know the particles are going to bounce off

364
00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:23,520
Speaker 1: each other, or if they're going to scatter off at

365
00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:25,560
Speaker 1: this angle or at that angle. So you try to

366
00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:29,080
Speaker 1: calculate things, you try to make predictions in physics. For

367
00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:32,840
Speaker 1: your predictions to be reasonable, there's some limits. There's some restrictions,

368
00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:36,880
Speaker 1: like your predictions can't have probabilities greater than one. If

369
00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:38,680
Speaker 1: you ask, like is my electron going to go left

370
00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,080
Speaker 1: or right? And your theory says you have one hundred

371
00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:43,159
Speaker 1: and seventy five percent chance of its going left, And

372
00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,800
Speaker 1: you're like, well, that's that seems wrong.

373
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:49,000
Speaker 5: That can't wait right, So when my gym teacher told

374
00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:51,359
Speaker 5: me to give it my one hundred and ten percent, like,

375
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:56,240
Speaker 5: that's not right, that's physically impossible. That's right, one hundred

376
00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:57,240
Speaker 5: and ten percent of my.

377
00:19:57,240 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 1: All your gym teacher is violating the fundamental.

378
00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:02,480
Speaker 5: Rules of physicals call them up right now.

379
00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:04,960
Speaker 1: Or maybe your gym teacher is a quantum gravity theorist,

380
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:08,320
Speaker 1: because that's exactly what happens when we try to make

381
00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:13,040
Speaker 1: a quantum gravity theory. Gravitons are really tricky because they

382
00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:16,920
Speaker 1: don't just transmit gravity. They have energy themselves, which means

383
00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:21,080
Speaker 1: they also couple to gravity. They feel gravity, they emit gravity.

384
00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:25,800
Speaker 1: So like when you emit a photon, photons don't feel electromagnetism,

385
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:28,520
Speaker 1: they don't bounce off of other photons, they don't emit

386
00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:32,960
Speaker 1: other photons. Right, Photons don't feel electric charges because they

387
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,879
Speaker 1: are neutral. They don't have a charge themselves, so they

388
00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:38,439
Speaker 1: will like fly right through an electric field. But a

389
00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:42,720
Speaker 1: graviton has energy, and gravity is felt by everything with energy.

390
00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:46,960
Speaker 1: So gravitons feel gravity, which means they emit more gravitons,

391
00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:49,960
Speaker 1: and those gravitons emit more gravitons, and pretty soon you

392
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,359
Speaker 1: have an infinite number of gravitons, and you start to

393
00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,479
Speaker 1: get nonsense answers out of your theory.

394
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:57,919
Speaker 5: When you say a graviton, right, I'm thinking of a

395
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:04,080
Speaker 5: particle sort of like a photon. But photons we've actually measured, right,

396
00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:07,040
Speaker 5: We've actually been able to sort of get physical evidence

397
00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:10,200
Speaker 5: of their existence, Like, do we have like physical evidence

398
00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:15,840
Speaker 5: of the existence of gravitons as like an existing thing

399
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,600
Speaker 5: other than just knowing that gravity exists?

400
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:22,159
Speaker 1: We do not have any evidence of gravitons. We have

401
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:25,280
Speaker 1: a very successful theory of gravity. It's Einstein's theory of

402
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:29,399
Speaker 1: general relativity that describes how space and time bend around

403
00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:32,480
Speaker 1: masses and that affects how things move, and that's very

404
00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,480
Speaker 1: very precise, but that describes gravity as not a force.

405
00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:38,159
Speaker 1: It's like a bending in space and time. We're going

406
00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:40,400
Speaker 1: to switch over and try to think about gravity as

407
00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:43,760
Speaker 1: a force instead of bending in space and time. Then

408
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 1: you need these gravitons, and nobody's ever seen them. The

409
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,119
Speaker 1: reason they're so hard to see is precisely because gravity

410
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:53,560
Speaker 1: is so weak. Like electromagnetism is a pretty strong force.

411
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,480
Speaker 1: Electrons are radiating photons all the time. It's not a

412
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,479
Speaker 1: rare thing to happen in the universe, but gravitons are

413
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 1: more rare because gravity is so weak, and they're much

414
00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:05,840
Speaker 1: harder to see because gravity is so weak, so the

415
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 1: impact of like one graviton would be very very hard

416
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,520
Speaker 1: to detect. So we don't know that gravitons are real,

417
00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:15,280
Speaker 1: but they are a necessary part of a theory of

418
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:18,399
Speaker 1: quantum gravity that tries to make gravity look like a

419
00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:22,040
Speaker 1: force and fit it into this quantum mechanical framework so far,

420
00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 1: and nobody's even been able to make the math works

421
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:26,960
Speaker 1: to have like a consistent theory that we could even

422
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:28,720
Speaker 1: go out and test in experiments.

423
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:32,359
Speaker 5: So we can't make the math work. We can't even

424
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:36,720
Speaker 5: find any evidence that gravitons exist. Things are looking pretty good,

425
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,720
Speaker 5: pretty good so far. Maybe we should take a quick break.

426
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,879
Speaker 5: I will look around see if I've got any gravitons

427
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 5: just kind of lying around, you never know, And then

428
00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 5: when we get back, maybe we can take another crack

429
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:53,720
Speaker 5: at this and see if there's any anything that actually

430
00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:57,280
Speaker 5: where the math. You carry the ones and it all

431
00:22:57,320 --> 00:23:00,440
Speaker 5: works out.

432
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 1: With big wireless providers, what you see is never what

433
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,600
Speaker 1: you get. Somewhere between the store and your first month's bill.

434
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:11,359
Speaker 1: The price your thoughts you were paying magically skyrockets. With Mintmobile,

435
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 1: You'll never have to worry about gotcha's ever again. When

436
00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 1: mint Mobile says fifteen dollars a month for a three

437
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 1: month plan, they really mean it. I've used Mintmobile and

438
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:22,520
Speaker 1: the call quality is always so crisp and so clear

439
00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 1: I can recommend it to you, So say bye bye

440
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:28,119
Speaker 1: to your overpriced wireless plans, jaw dropping monthly bills and

441
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,280
Speaker 1: unexpected overages. You can use your own phone with any

442
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,960
Speaker 1: Mint Mobile plan and bring your phone number along with

443
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:37,040
Speaker 1: your existing contacts. So ditch your overpriced wireless with Mint

444
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,960
Speaker 1: Mobiles deal and get three months a premium wireless service

445
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,199
Speaker 1: for fifteen bucks a month. To get this new customer

446
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,399
Speaker 1: offer and your new three month premium wireless plan for

447
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:46,639
Speaker 1: just fifteen bucks a month, go to mintmobile dot com

448
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:49,960
Speaker 1: slash universe. That's mintmobile dot com slash universe. Cut your

449
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 1: wireless bill to fifteen bucks a month. At mintmobile dot

450
00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:55,640
Speaker 1: com slash universe. Forty five dollars upfront payment required equivalent

451
00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,040
Speaker 1: to fifteen dollars per month new customers on first three

452
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:01,120
Speaker 1: month plan only. Speeds slower about forty gigabytes On unlimited plan.

453
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,480
Speaker 1: Additional taxi, s fees, and restrictions apply. Seement Mobile for details.

454
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:07,680
Speaker 8: AI might be the most important new computer technology ever.

455
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:11,119
Speaker 8: It's storming every industry and literally billions of dollars are

456
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:15,399
Speaker 8: being invested, so buckle up. The problem is that AI

457
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 8: needs a lot of speed and processing power, So how

458
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 8: do you compete without cost spiraling out of control. It's

459
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:23,840
Speaker 8: time to upgrade to the next generation of the cloud,

460
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:29,360
Speaker 8: Oracle Cloud Infrastructure or OCI. OCI is a single platform

461
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:34,240
Speaker 8: for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs. OCI

462
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 8: has four to eight times the bandwidth of other clouds,

463
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:40,720
Speaker 8: offers one consistent price instead of variable regional pricing, and

464
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,880
Speaker 8: of course, nobody does data better than Oracle, So now

465
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:46,119
Speaker 8: you can train your AI models at twice the speed

466
00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 8: and less than half the cost of other clouds. If

467
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 8: you want to do more and spend less, like Uber

468
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 8: eight by eight and Data Bricks Mosaic, take a free

469
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 8: test drive of OCI at Oracle dot com slash Strategic.

470
00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:03,200
Speaker 8: That's Oracle dot com slash rate Oracle dot com slash Strategic.

471
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,359
Speaker 1: If you love iPhone, you'll love Apple Card. It's the

472
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:10,320
Speaker 1: credit card designed for iPhone. It gives you unlimited daily

473
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,400
Speaker 1: cash back that can earn four point four zero percent

474
00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:16,359
Speaker 1: annual percentage yield. When you open a high Yield savings

475
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:19,960
Speaker 1: account through Apple Card, apply for Applecard in the wallet app,

476
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,200
Speaker 1: subject to credit approval. Savings is available to Apple Card

477
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:26,560
Speaker 1: owners subject to eligibility. Apple Card and Savings by Goldman

478
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 1: Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City Branch Member FDIC terms

479
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,760
Speaker 1: and more at applecard dot com. When you pop a

480
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:34,880
Speaker 1: piece of cheese, into your mouth or enjoy a rich

481
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:38,159
Speaker 1: spoonful of Greek yogurt. You're probably not thinking about the

482
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:41,800
Speaker 1: environmental impact of each and every bite, but the people

483
00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 1: in the dairy industry are. US Dairy has set themselves

484
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:49,160
Speaker 1: some ambitious sustainability goals, including being greenhouse gas neutral by

485
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 1: twenty fifty. That's why they're working hard every day to

486
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,639
Speaker 1: find new ways to reduce waste, conserve natural resources, and

487
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,400
Speaker 1: drive down greenhouse gas emissions. Take water, for example, most

488
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,280
Speaker 1: dairy farms reuse water up up to four times the

489
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: same water cools the milk, cleans equipment, washes the barn,

490
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:08,320
Speaker 1: and irrigates the crops. How is US Dairy tackling greenhouse gases.

491
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:11,399
Speaker 1: Many farms use anaerobic digestors that turn the methane from

492
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 1: maneure into renewable energy that can power farms, towns, and

493
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,080
Speaker 1: electric cars. So the next time you grab a slice

494
00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: of pizza or lick an ice cream cone, know that

495
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:21,720
Speaker 1: dairy farmers and processors around the country are using the

496
00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:25,560
Speaker 1: latest practices and innovations to provide the nutrient dense dairy

497
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,600
Speaker 1: products we love with less of an impact. Visit usdairy

498
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:30,880
Speaker 1: dot com slash sustainability to learn more.

499
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 5: All right, So bad news. Daniel couldn't find any gravitons

500
00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:46,800
Speaker 5: on a single one. I'm also out of milk, so

501
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 5: things aren't looking so good here. Do you have any

502
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 5: good news for me? In our effort to smoosh together

503
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 5: quantum mechanics and general relativity.

504
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 1: I didn't figure it out in the last couple of minutes,

505
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 1: but you know, a lot of clever people have been

506
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,640
Speaker 1: thinking about this and trying to find some connections between

507
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:11,600
Speaker 1: gravity and electromagnetism, or between electromagnetism gravity sort of going

508
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 1: both directions, like trying to make gravity look more like

509
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 1: electromagnetism and the theoretical side, or giving up on that

510
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 1: and trying to make electromagnetism look more like gravity. So

511
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:24,399
Speaker 1: we don't have any experimental results to guide us, but

512
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:26,800
Speaker 1: we can still think deeply about the structure of these

513
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,880
Speaker 1: theories and try to make some theoretical progress in our minds.

514
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 1: Magic mushrooms or no.

515
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,800
Speaker 5: All right, so we're in the mindscape. What are we

516
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:40,359
Speaker 5: doing in order to solve the hurdle of the math

517
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,719
Speaker 5: not mathing in this idea because it sounds like we

518
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:45,679
Speaker 5: were sort of trying to think of planets as like

519
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:51,680
Speaker 5: scaled up particles and gravity as like a force between them,

520
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:56,080
Speaker 5: as if they're giant particles. And that didn't really work, Like,

521
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 5: is there another approach that you could use, or is

522
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,760
Speaker 5: there a way to like fine tune that approach such

523
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 5: that it actually does work.

524
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, So the short answer is there isn't a great approach,

525
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:08,919
Speaker 1: but that doesn't mean we can't make progress. And I

526
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,679
Speaker 1: think people should understand that. In theoretical physics, it's not

527
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:13,119
Speaker 1: like you sit down one day and you just come

528
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:13,920
Speaker 1: up with the whole.

529
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:15,359
Speaker 5: Theory movies lied to me.

530
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:19,560
Speaker 1: You're entering like a mathematical jungle. You're not sure if

531
00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 1: there is a path through, and it takes exploration. Exploration

532
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,600
Speaker 1: is not just something we do in experimental physics or

533
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:29,119
Speaker 1: in experimental biology. We're like walking through a literal jungle

534
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,439
Speaker 1: looking for new kinds of frogs. In theoretical physics, you

535
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:34,639
Speaker 1: can also explore. You can just like try stuff and

536
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 1: say well, I'm gonna go in this direction and see

537
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 1: if it works out, kind of like when you're trying

538
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: a proof in tenth grade geometry and you're like, well,

539
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 1: I'm not sure this is gonna get me where I

540
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 1: need to go, but I'm gonna play around with these angles.

541
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:48,440
Speaker 1: And so in theoretical physics, people are trying something that

542
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 1: has a long tradition dating all the way back to

543
00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:55,280
Speaker 1: like Maxwell. James Clerk. Maxwell in the eighteen hundreds was

544
00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:58,959
Speaker 1: looking at theories of electricity and theories of magnetism, and

545
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 1: he tried something cool. He said, well, let me write

546
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: down the equations for electricity and write down the equations

547
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 1: for magnetism and try to smooth them together and make

548
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 1: them look as much like each other as possible. And

549
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:12,880
Speaker 1: when he did that, he realized, oh, my gosh, these

550
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 1: basically have the same equations. And not only that, but

551
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:18,760
Speaker 1: you can click the equations together because sometimes electric field

552
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: cause magnetic field and vice versa to make one bigger picture.

553
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: So we had this great insight, which is where we

554
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 1: got the theory of electromagnetism. So now people are trying

555
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: to do something similar. They're saying, let's look at the

556
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: equations for electromagnetism and the equations for gravity and see

557
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: if we can find relationships. Are they like a mirror

558
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 1: image of each other? Can we somehow find patterns there

559
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 1: and then use that to guide us through this intellectual

560
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:47,120
Speaker 1: jungle to a theory that combines gravity and electromagnetism into

561
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:48,120
Speaker 1: one big theory.

562
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 5: So for someone just theoretically who does not have a

563
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 5: grasp of what theoretical math would look like, and when

564
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 5: you say equations, like what that is?

565
00:29:58,960 --> 00:29:59,040
Speaker 1: Like?

566
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 5: So are we talking about like you have five equations

567
00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:05,719
Speaker 5: that you have to memorize to understand gravity? Like are

568
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 5: there hundreds of equations? And when you're trying to like

569
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:14,239
Speaker 5: smash together equations, you know, is it sort of like

570
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 5: a brilliant mind where you just see floating numbers kind

571
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 5: of going together and doing things like what in terms

572
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 5: that someone like me who math is trying to calculate

573
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 5: a tip? How does that work?

574
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great question. And we could start off

575
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 1: pretty simply. You know, people are probably familiar with Newton's

576
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 1: law of gravity. That just says that the force between

577
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 1: two objects is proportional to the two masses divided by

578
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,640
Speaker 1: the distance between them squared, and then you multiply that

579
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: whole thing by a constant, big G Newton's constant. So

580
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 1: Newton's equation for the force between two objects is like

581
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 1: g mm over R squared. All right, So that's Newton's

582
00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 1: theory of gravity. Then we can look over at electromagnetism.

583
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,880
Speaker 1: We can say the equation for the force between two

584
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:05,720
Speaker 1: particles that have charge, Like remember our question was like,

585
00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: what happens when two electrons come near each other? Can

586
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:08,720
Speaker 1: we calculate that?

587
00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:09,440
Speaker 7: Well?

588
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:13,400
Speaker 1: Kulam's law tells us that the force between two particles

589
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 1: goes like the charge of the two particles divided by

590
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:20,640
Speaker 1: the distance squared between them, all multiplied by a constant

591
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 1: in this case K. So you look at these two equations,

592
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:26,719
Speaker 1: you notice instantly, like HM, these have kind of similar structures.

593
00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 1: On the top of the equation is the charge of

594
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 1: the two objects. Where gravity the charge would be the mass,

595
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 1: and for electromagnetism the charge is obviously the electric charge.

596
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,959
Speaker 1: And both of them get weaker as the distance grows

597
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 1: by the same power you get twice as far apart.

598
00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 1: Gravity and electromagnetism both get four times weaker. You go

599
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 1: ten times further away. The force of gravity and electromagnetism

600
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 1: both go down by a power of one hundred. So

601
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: they have very similar structures there already. That's encouraging, But.

602
00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:00,760
Speaker 5: If it was just as simple as fin sort of

603
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,680
Speaker 5: some of these equations that seem to look kind of

604
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:06,720
Speaker 5: similar and match them together. Like, it seems like we

605
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 5: would have already figured this out. So what is the

606
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 5: scale of the complexity, Like, why haven't we been able

607
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 5: to find just like a bunch of these equations that

608
00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 5: kind of look similar and seem to have the same

609
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:20,960
Speaker 5: general structure and have them work together.

610
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, one issue, of course, is that we know

611
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 1: that Newton's theory of gravity is not the right theory. Whoops.

612
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,040
Speaker 1: When Newton was a very clever man and he has

613
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 1: a very nice theory which mostly works but not.

614
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:35,360
Speaker 5: Quite irresponsible with apples too.

615
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,920
Speaker 1: Einstein's theory of gravity is not just a reimagining. It's

616
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 1: not just saying, look, the story is wrong. It's not

617
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 1: a force between objects, it's a bending of space and time.

618
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 1: It also gives different predictions, like, for example, Newton says

619
00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:53,520
Speaker 1: that the force just depends on the mass. It doesn't

620
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:57,000
Speaker 1: depend on whether the object is spinning or not. So

621
00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 1: according to Newton, if you're in orbit around the Earth,

622
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:02,320
Speaker 1: whether the Earth is spinning or if it stopped spinning

623
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 1: or spinning the other way makes no difference for gravity.

624
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 1: Einstein says, Nope, that's not true. If the Earth is spinning,

625
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 1: that has more energy. And since gravity is linked to

626
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,680
Speaker 1: energy of all kinds, not just mass, that changes the

627
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 1: gravitational force on the object in a complicated way. So

628
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 1: Einstein's equations are much more complicated than Newton's. He doesn't

629
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 1: just have like one simple force equation. He's got a

630
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: really complicated tensor equation, or a tensor it's just like

631
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: a matrix. It's like an array in computer programming, you know,

632
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: a way to keep track of a bunch of numbers

633
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 1: all at once. So he has more complicated equations. And

634
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 1: so you can't just say, look, Newton's law and culums

635
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 1: are similar. You got to dig deep into Einstein's rules

636
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:43,880
Speaker 1: for gravity.

637
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 5: So how do we know Einstein is right and Newton

638
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,440
Speaker 5: is wrong. It can't just be that Einstein's got cooler

639
00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 5: hair or more complex equations.

640
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 1: Well, Einstein and Newton make different predictions, and famously Einstein's

641
00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: predictions were right. Einstein predicted stuff about how light bends

642
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:04,240
Speaker 1: around the Sun during an eclipse, and he predicted stuff

643
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 1: about how mercury orbits the Sun and the angle of

644
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 1: the eclipse of mercury. How that twists as mercury is

645
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:13,800
Speaker 1: orbiting the Sun. All these little differences between Newton and

646
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 1: Einstein add up and a few special cases, so we

647
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,799
Speaker 1: know that Einstein's theory was right. So then people took

648
00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: this on. They're like, okay, well can I take Einstein's

649
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:26,360
Speaker 1: equations and try to make them look like electromagnetism. Like

650
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,520
Speaker 1: we were able to take Newton's law and make it

651
00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:32,239
Speaker 1: look like Kulum's law. Can we take Einstein's gravity and

652
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: make it look like electromagnetism? And people have actually succeeded

653
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 1: in doing this. There are these gravito electromagnetic equations when

654
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,120
Speaker 1: if you write them down, you get equations that look

655
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: very similar to Maxwell's equations for electromagnetism. Maxwell has four equations,

656
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 1: and I won't get into the math with you. You know,

657
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:55,000
Speaker 1: there's like a divergence and a curl for electricity and magnetism,

658
00:34:55,719 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 1: and Indie gravito electromagnetic equations are also four equations, and

659
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 1: they have a very similar structure to Maxwell's equations. You

660
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:06,399
Speaker 1: should look them up and write them side by side.

661
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,719
Speaker 1: They look very very similar. It's eerie, it's spooky. It's

662
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 1: like the universe is saying, oh, look, you found the pattern.

663
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 1: It's the same over here in the gravity world and

664
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:16,560
Speaker 1: in the electromagnetic world.

665
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:20,560
Speaker 5: This does feel like a conspiracy theorist sort of aligning

666
00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:23,759
Speaker 5: charts and with a corkboard and yarn and trying to

667
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:27,799
Speaker 5: make these connections. But yeah, I mean, I'm looking at this,

668
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,839
Speaker 5: and you know, I don't know a look of complex math,

669
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:34,439
Speaker 5: but it Yes, they look very similar. But if we've

670
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,600
Speaker 5: found this, right, it doesn't mean that we've figured out

671
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 5: how they interlock. Like we found some similarities, some equations

672
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 5: that seem to match, but the bigger picture has not

673
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 5: yet become clear.

674
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right, And I hear you setting me up

675
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:50,680
Speaker 1: to deliver the bad news of why they're going to work.

676
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 1: But first there's a little bit more good, okay, which

677
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:55,720
Speaker 1: I think is a fun insight into how this works.

678
00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: The thing about Einstein's equations for gravity, as we were

679
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:01,399
Speaker 1: saying before or is that it gives you more than

680
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 1: just like a straightforce between two objects. Spinning objects can

681
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:09,360
Speaker 1: create like torque and drag in space time itself, which

682
00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:11,879
Speaker 1: gives all sorts of weird forces, like if you are

683
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 1: orbiting the Earth and the Earth is spinning, then there's

684
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 1: some frame dragging effects there. Check out our whole episode

685
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:20,840
Speaker 1: about that if you want more details. But effectively, it

686
00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 1: gives like a twist on things that are orbiting the Earth.

687
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:27,120
Speaker 1: So according to Einstein's gravity, it's not just a force

688
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:30,040
Speaker 1: between two objects. There are more subtle effects there. And

689
00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: the really cool thing is that in the gravito electromagnetic equations,

690
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: the ones where you take Einstein's gravity and try to

691
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:41,440
Speaker 1: convert them to look like electromagnetism, you can see this emerge.

692
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,640
Speaker 1: And in those equations you have what they call a

693
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 1: gravito electric field, which is sort of like the straight

694
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: up Newtonian version, plus this gravito magnetic field. So basically,

695
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,640
Speaker 1: to explain all of Einstein's gravity, you break it up

696
00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: into two pieces, this analogy to the electric field and

697
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:02,799
Speaker 1: this analogy to the magnetic field. And it goes even

698
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 1: deeper than that, because it's not just notation. It's not

699
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,479
Speaker 1: just like, hey, let's write this down in a cute

700
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:09,759
Speaker 1: way that looks sort of similar. There really is a

701
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:14,200
Speaker 1: conceptual connection there because an electromagnetism, the way you get

702
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: magnetic fields is you take electric fields and you wiggle

703
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 1: them like currents of electrons give you magnetic fields. So

704
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:24,720
Speaker 1: it's like velocity dependent, right. Well, the cool thing about

705
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:28,880
Speaker 1: the gravity magnetic field, this other component of these equations

706
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 1: you have to add on to be able to describe

707
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:35,480
Speaker 1: Einstein's gravity. Where the equations that look like electromagnetism is

708
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:39,680
Speaker 1: that they create velocity dependent acceleration in just the same way.

709
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 1: For example, those spinning masses. When the Earth is spinning,

710
00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 1: that's an acceleration because any sort of rotation is an acceleration,

711
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 1: and that gives an acceleration. On satellites, it gives a twist,

712
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,480
Speaker 1: it gives a pull. So when you force gravity into

713
00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 1: this structure that looks like electromagnetism, you learn some things

714
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:01,239
Speaker 1: about gravity. It's like to sit in your mind in

715
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 1: a way that actually gives you a little bit of insight.

716
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:05,960
Speaker 1: And that's a good sign. Like when you're bushwhacking your

717
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:09,320
Speaker 1: way through the theoretical jungle trying to make connections between things.

718
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: You don't want to have to force things into categories.

719
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:14,319
Speaker 1: When they sort of naturally fall into those categories and

720
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: reveal something deep about the nature of that force or

721
00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:20,040
Speaker 1: the nature of the phenomenon, it's a sign that you

722
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 1: might be on the right track. So that's the good

723
00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:27,160
Speaker 1: news that there really is something satisfying about making gravity

724
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:30,400
Speaker 1: look like the equations of electromagnetism. It's not just like

725
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:32,800
Speaker 1: hacking it up into bits and shoving it in boxes.

726
00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:36,359
Speaker 5: It's not just using the same colored gelpins to write

727
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 5: the equation exactly. That sounds very promising, right, That sounds

728
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,200
Speaker 5: like a very like promising path. And the fact that

729
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:50,080
Speaker 5: there's this wiggle connection where wiggling or velocity movement for

730
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:55,279
Speaker 5: gravity like creates this field is very interesting. I just

731
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 5: I feel a butt is common.

732
00:38:57,160 --> 00:38:59,919
Speaker 1: There is a big butt, a man, I knew exactly right.

733
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 5: I like big butts, and I cannot lie.

734
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:08,719
Speaker 1: Now that's a reference. I hope everybody injury. Hopefully the

735
00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:11,759
Speaker 1: other brothers can't deny. Well, the thing that the other

736
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 1: brothers can deny is that this works in difficult situations.

737
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,319
Speaker 1: Like we said that you could take Einstein's rules and

738
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 1: you can express them in mathematical equations that look like electromagnetism.

739
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:26,239
Speaker 1: But there was a butt there I left off. And

740
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:29,319
Speaker 1: the butt is this only works if gravity is kind

741
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:32,759
Speaker 1: of weak, like when the curvature of space time is

742
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 1: not very strong, when you're like far from any intense mass,

743
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 1: when you're far away from a black hole, for example,

744
00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:41,720
Speaker 1: or even from the Sun. Then this works pretty well.

745
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 1: But when the curvature of space time gets more intense,

746
00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 1: this breaks down. Like the equations are just too complicated,

747
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,479
Speaker 1: too intense, we have no way to fit them into

748
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:54,359
Speaker 1: these boxes to make them look like electromagnetism. In order

749
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:56,880
Speaker 1: to do that, to take the complicated tensor equations of

750
00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 1: general relativity and to make them look like electromagnetism, you

751
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: have to make a bunch of assumptions, and one of

752
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:06,120
Speaker 1: those assumptions is gravity is pretty weak. So basically what's

753
00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 1: happened here is you've avoided the hard problem. You know,

754
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,000
Speaker 1: the hard problem of making quantum gravity work was figuring

755
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 1: out what happens when gravitons amid other gravitons amid other gravitons.

756
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 1: Basically when gravity gets very very strong but it can

757
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 1: no longer be neglected. And that's exactly the situation that

758
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:27,000
Speaker 1: gravito electromagnetism doesn't know how to answer. So it's some

759
00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:29,239
Speaker 1: progress in the sense of like hm, you've found some

760
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,880
Speaker 1: cool connections between these theories, but only in the easy parts,

761
00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: not in the hard parts at all. When you get

762
00:40:35,239 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: to the hard part of gravity being very strong, and

763
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:41,040
Speaker 1: every graviton is emitting ten other gravitons. Then this breaks

764
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:43,839
Speaker 1: down and it doesn't help us at all. So it's

765
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 1: like an interesting island of understanding, but it doesn't make

766
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 1: any progress on the really hard part of the problem

767
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,719
Speaker 1: describing gravity as a quantum theory when gravity is very,

768
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 1: very strong.

769
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:58,480
Speaker 5: But could it be revealing something about gravity still, like

770
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:03,720
Speaker 5: maybe that there is a significant difference between a strong

771
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 5: or large amount of gravity, like the gravity of the

772
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 5: Sun versus the Earth. If there is some kind of

773
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:13,480
Speaker 5: fundamental difference between like weak levels of gravity and strong

774
00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:17,279
Speaker 5: levels of gravity, that seems like that could itself be

775
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:21,200
Speaker 5: an interesting kind of finding, even if it still doesn't

776
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 5: solve the bigger question of how to merge those concepts.

777
00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:27,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, And that was the point I was trying

778
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: to make earlier, that even intermediate progress is progress. You

779
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 1: don't have to know if this is going to fundamentally

780
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 1: solve the question of quantum mechanical gravity for it to

781
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,200
Speaker 1: be cool that you figured something out, that you've made

782
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:41,840
Speaker 1: some headway, you found some island of understanding, whether it

783
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 1: actually connects to the mainland and reveals all the deep

784
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:46,560
Speaker 1: secrets we don't know yet, But that doesn't mean it's

785
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:49,399
Speaker 1: not worth doing and not worth exploring. Right, we've made

786
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 1: it to this stage where we've been able to accomplish

787
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 1: this connection between electromagnetism and gravity. It might be that

788
00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:59,480
Speaker 1: hunting around and digging around, poking in various directions. Lets

789
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 1: us build from this, right that we can go from

790
00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 1: here to figure out how to describe strong gravity. Nobody

791
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,080
Speaker 1: knows how to do that yet, but this is like

792
00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:09,880
Speaker 1: another avenue of attack. This gives us another way to

793
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:12,359
Speaker 1: think about it. At least it might be a total

794
00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:14,840
Speaker 1: dead end, or it might be the wave of the future.

795
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 1: We haven't figured that out yet. It's like on the

796
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:18,520
Speaker 1: forefront of knowledge.

797
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:21,640
Speaker 5: I mean, let's go with not being a dead end.

798
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 5: We'll take a quick break and try to keep up

799
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:30,759
Speaker 5: the optimism that this is actually going towards finding a

800
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:35,200
Speaker 5: fundamental answer that'll change everyone's lives. And we're probably not

801
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 5: going to figure it out in the ad break, but

802
00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 5: you know, I'll think about it.

803
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:44,719
Speaker 1: When you pop a piece of cheese into your mouth

804
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: or enjoy a rich spoonful of Greek yogurt, you're probably

805
00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 1: not thinking about the environmental impact of each and every bite,

806
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:54,720
Speaker 1: but the people in the dairy industry are US Dairy

807
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 1: has set themselves some ambitious sustainability goals, including being greenhouse

808
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 1: gas neutral by twenty to fifty. That's why they're working

809
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,000
Speaker 1: hard every day to find new ways to reduce waste,

810
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:08,319
Speaker 1: conserve natural resources, and drive down greenhouse gas emissions. Take water,

811
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:11,439
Speaker 1: for example, most dairy farms reuse water up to four

812
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:14,959
Speaker 1: times the same water cools the milk, cleans equipment, washes

813
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:17,800
Speaker 1: the barn, and irrigates the crops. How is US Dairy

814
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 1: tackling greenhouse gases. Many farms use anaerobic digestors that turn

815
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 1: the methane from maneuver into renewable energy that can power farms, towns,

816
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 1: and electric cars. So the next time you grab a

817
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 1: slice of pizza or lick an ice cream cone, know

818
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,439
Speaker 1: that dairy farmers and processors around the country are using

819
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 1: the latest practices and innovations to provide the nutrient dense

820
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,799
Speaker 1: dairy products we love with less of an impact. Visit

821
00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:41,680
Speaker 1: US dairy dot com slash sustainability to learn more.

822
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:46,240
Speaker 2: There are children, friends, and families walking, riding on passing

823
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:48,640
Speaker 2: the roads every day. Remember they're real people with loved

824
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 2: ones who need them to.

825
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 1: Get home safely.

826
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 2: Protect our cyclists and pedestrians because they're people too. Go

827
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:57,359
Speaker 2: Safely California from the California Office of Traffic Safety and Caltrans.

828
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:01,640
Speaker 3: Want the secret to your skin yet, I've been getting

829
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:03,880
Speaker 3: a ton of compliments on my skin lately. In the

830
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:07,799
Speaker 3: secret Biosance, this award winning skincare brand, known for its

831
00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:10,480
Speaker 3: science backed formulas, has been a game changer for me.

832
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 3: The best my skin has ever looked is right after

833
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:16,280
Speaker 3: I started using these two holy grails, the biosons Omega

834
00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:20,279
Speaker 3: Repair Moisturizing Cream and Marine Algai Cream. These are just

835
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:24,400
Speaker 3: my personal faves. They're clinically proven products that deliver real results.

836
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:27,240
Speaker 3: Clinical trials have shown that one hundred percent of Omega

837
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 3: Repair Moisturizing Cream users saw an increase in skin hydration

838
00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 3: after five minutes. And if you're concerned about fine lines

839
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 3: like me, the Marine Algai Cream users sawn ninety seven

840
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:40,240
Speaker 3: percent improvement in the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles

841
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 3: after one use. Are you ready for your best skin ever?

842
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:45,960
Speaker 3: Head Tobiosons dot com and discover your next skincare obsession.

843
00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 3: And by the way, use code POD that's Pod at

844
00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 3: checkout to score an exclusive surprise gift with any order

845
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:54,280
Speaker 3: that's codepod at checkout.

846
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,480
Speaker 9: Have you made the switch to Nix? Millions of women

847
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:05,080
Speaker 9: have made the switch to the revolutionary period underwear from Nix.

848
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:10,239
Speaker 9: That's Knix. Period panties from Nix are like no other,

849
00:45:10,520 --> 00:45:14,200
Speaker 9: making them the number one leakproof underwear brand in North America.

850
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:18,799
Speaker 9: Their comfy, stylish, and absorbent perfect for period protection from

851
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:22,600
Speaker 9: your lightest to your heaviest days. They look, feel and

852
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:27,440
Speaker 9: machine washed just like regular underwear, but feature incognito protection

853
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:30,600
Speaker 9: that has you covered. You can shop sizes from extra

854
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:34,320
Speaker 9: small to four XL, choose from all kinds of colors, prints,

855
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:37,920
Speaker 9: and different styles from bikinis to boy shorts, thongs to

856
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:41,960
Speaker 9: high rise. You've got to try Nicks. See why millions

857
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:46,440
Speaker 9: are ditching disposable, wasteful period products and have switched to Nix.

858
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:50,359
Speaker 9: Go to Knix dot com and get fifteen percent off

859
00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:54,200
Speaker 9: with promo code try fifteen. That's Nix dot com. Promo

860
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 9: code Try fifteen for fifteen percent off life changing period underwear.

861
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:09,319
Speaker 9: That's Knax dot com.

862
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:14,399
Speaker 5: So we are back. We have not yet solved how

863
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:22,080
Speaker 5: to weave together electromagnetism and general relativity. Or gravity, but

864
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:26,000
Speaker 5: there has been some interesting progress that has been made

865
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:32,360
Speaker 5: that is perhaps instructive and perhaps interesting. So we had

866
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:37,600
Speaker 5: that issue that these these equations when gravity is weak,

867
00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:39,960
Speaker 5: they seem to kind of align, like you have the

868
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 5: equations associated with general relativity and then Maxwell's equations that

869
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:48,720
Speaker 5: looked similar. Then when gravity got strong, like the sun

870
00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:52,360
Speaker 5: or a black hole, that kind of broke down. It

871
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:56,000
Speaker 5: no longer worked in that way. So is there another

872
00:46:56,239 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 5: sort of angle of attack that is being exploed.

873
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:02,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, people are trying so many different things at once,

874
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 1: and you know, this is the way we make progress.

875
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:06,279
Speaker 1: You push your way through the jungle. Maybe you make

876
00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:07,880
Speaker 1: it all the way through, maybe you run into somebody

877
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 1: else coming from the other direction, right, and you can

878
00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 1: join you in two efforts. And so that's what's happening

879
00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:16,239
Speaker 1: is a bunch of people are working on trying to

880
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:21,240
Speaker 1: make gravity look like electromagnetism. So that's the gravito electromagnetic

881
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:24,000
Speaker 1: approach that we just talked about. But some people are

882
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:26,879
Speaker 1: working in the other direction. They're saying, let's not make

883
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:32,839
Speaker 1: gravity look like electromagnetism. Let's make electromagnetism look like gravity. Right,

884
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:36,799
Speaker 1: Einstein's big idea was, let's not think of gravity as

885
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:39,319
Speaker 1: a force, let's think of it as the curvature of

886
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 1: space time. And so people are wondering, like, can we

887
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:45,520
Speaker 1: extend that idea? Can we also do that for electromagnetism.

888
00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:49,279
Speaker 1: Remember that the way Einstein did this is he said, look,

889
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:52,440
Speaker 1: it feels like there's a force between you and the Earth.

890
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:56,080
Speaker 1: Newton's description of gravity as a force is compelling because

891
00:47:56,280 --> 00:47:58,440
Speaker 1: when you throw a ball in the air, it falls

892
00:47:58,440 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 1: to the Earth and it looks like it's getting hold on. Right,

893
00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:03,960
Speaker 1: we have this experience of gravity as a force. But

894
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 1: he said that it's not actually a force. That's something

895
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:09,000
Speaker 1: of an illusion. What's happening when you toss a ball

896
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:13,319
Speaker 1: is that you're releasing it into freefall. Space itself is

897
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:16,320
Speaker 1: curved in the vicinity of mass, so there's a natural

898
00:48:16,360 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 1: path for objects to follow in curved space time. So

899
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:23,160
Speaker 1: the ball naturally falls towards the center of the Earth.

900
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:27,000
Speaker 1: So Newton's picture is there's a force pulling on the ball,

901
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:29,080
Speaker 1: and then it hits the Earth and it stops it

902
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 1: because the Earth is balancing that force of gravity. Einstein's

903
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:35,840
Speaker 1: picture is different. Einstein says, when the ball is in

904
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,799
Speaker 1: the air. It's in freefall. There is no force on

905
00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:41,560
Speaker 1: the ball at all. It's just following the motion of

906
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,439
Speaker 1: space and time, and then the Earth stops it because

907
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 1: the Earth itself is providing a force. It's accelerating against

908
00:48:47,520 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 1: that natural motion of space time.

909
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:52,759
Speaker 5: Yeah, and I think you've told me this is actually measurable, right,

910
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:57,880
Speaker 5: that there is acceleration acting. When you are, say, standing

911
00:48:58,040 --> 00:48:59,439
Speaker 5: on the floor.

912
00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:01,840
Speaker 1: Exactly, jump off a building instead of the ball, and

913
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:04,440
Speaker 1: you take a scale with you, and as you're falling

914
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 1: through the air, hurtling towards the Earth, you stand on

915
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:08,960
Speaker 1: the scale. What are you going to measure nothing? You're

916
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:11,200
Speaker 1: going to measure nothing. Yeah, right, you have no weight,

917
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:14,600
Speaker 1: and that's because you're in free fall. There's no acceleration there.

918
00:49:14,640 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: You're not measuring anything. If you're standing on the surface

919
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:19,120
Speaker 1: of the Earth and you stand on the scale, then

920
00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:21,879
Speaker 1: you measure your weight. That's where there's a force, right.

921
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:24,600
Speaker 1: So there really is no force on you when you

922
00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:27,440
Speaker 1: are in freefall. There's a force on you when you're

923
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:29,879
Speaker 1: standing on the surface of the earth. That's the Earth

924
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:33,600
Speaker 1: pushing up against that natural emotion. So the explanation is

925
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:35,840
Speaker 1: that there is no force there. There's just a curvature

926
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,160
Speaker 1: of space and time, and we couldn't see that curvature,

927
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:40,560
Speaker 1: and that's why it looks to us like there is

928
00:49:40,600 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 1: a force.

929
00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 5: Having this as the theory about gravity, like, how do

930
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 5: you then fit the quantum forces into this framework? Right,

931
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:52,879
Speaker 5: because like that seems fundamentally different. Those are forces, they're

932
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:55,919
Speaker 5: pulling or pushing against each other. How does that fit

933
00:49:56,000 --> 00:49:59,239
Speaker 5: into this kind of idea of gravity being like the

934
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:04,120
Speaker 5: shape of existence, which sounds it's hard for me to

935
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:06,319
Speaker 5: kind of think about that, right, like the shape of

936
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:10,240
Speaker 5: the universe, the shape of the fabric of the universe,

937
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:12,560
Speaker 5: and then we're just kind of falling along it. And

938
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:16,319
Speaker 5: then you have these particles. Have we observed anything in

939
00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:20,000
Speaker 5: particles that could sort of fit within that framework?

940
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:22,960
Speaker 1: So we haven't observed anything yet, but there are some

941
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:27,320
Speaker 1: theoretical ideas. The idea is to say, well, maybe electromagnetism

942
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:30,080
Speaker 1: also isn't the force. Maybe it just looks like a

943
00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:33,920
Speaker 1: force and it's actually the result of a second kind

944
00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:37,240
Speaker 1: of curvature. So we have like first kind of curvature

945
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 1: is Einstein's curvature of space time that gives us the

946
00:50:40,239 --> 00:50:43,719
Speaker 1: apparent force of gravity. Space can also be curved in

947
00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 1: another way, and that curvature gives us the appearance of

948
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:51,280
Speaker 1: the force of electromagnetism. And in order to have curature

949
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:55,840
Speaker 1: in another way, you need more dimensions of space and time.

950
00:50:56,480 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 1: The idea is like Einstein space is three plus one dimensions.

951
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 1: Start with one dimension, which is a line. You draw

952
00:51:02,560 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 1: a second dimension which is perpendicular to that. Now you

953
00:51:05,200 --> 00:51:07,600
Speaker 1: have like a plane. You can add a third dimension

954
00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:10,520
Speaker 1: which is perpendicular to both of the first two, and

955
00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:13,520
Speaker 1: that gives you like three D space right where each

956
00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:16,680
Speaker 1: of those three lines are perpendicular to each other. And

957
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:19,200
Speaker 1: that's it. There's no more room to add another line

958
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:21,680
Speaker 1: perpendicular to all three right.

959
00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:23,600
Speaker 5: Because space, Yeah, it doesn't work.

960
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:27,320
Speaker 1: It's sort of crazy in mind bending. And I remember

961
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:29,120
Speaker 1: as like an eight year old trying to imagine that

962
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:32,120
Speaker 1: fourth dimension but not being able to do it. But

963
00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:34,840
Speaker 1: we do think of time as sort of a fourth dimension.

964
00:51:35,040 --> 00:51:38,520
Speaker 1: How those three change. So Einstein space is four dimensional,

965
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:41,480
Speaker 1: but we can extend it by adding another dimension of

966
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:45,680
Speaker 1: space and having that curvature be in that additional dimension,

967
00:51:45,719 --> 00:51:48,640
Speaker 1: that fifth dimension. And you might ask, well, I can't

968
00:51:48,640 --> 00:51:51,160
Speaker 1: see that dimension. I can't imagine where that dimension would be.

969
00:51:51,200 --> 00:51:53,920
Speaker 1: How does that even work. Yeah, and this fifth dimension

970
00:51:54,040 --> 00:51:56,080
Speaker 1: is sort of similar to the way we think about time,

971
00:51:56,600 --> 00:51:59,000
Speaker 1: or like time we think about as the fourth dimension.

972
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 1: Imagine three dimensional space and then imagine that changing through time. Right,

973
00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:06,520
Speaker 1: save your full three dimensional space, but now you have

974
00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:10,280
Speaker 1: like another axis along which that three dimensional space is changing.

975
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: So to imagine another dimension of space itself, imagine three

976
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:17,759
Speaker 1: dimensional space and then imagine a bunch of copies of it.

977
00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:20,680
Speaker 1: And this new dimension is not like the original three.

978
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:23,560
Speaker 1: Instead of going on forever, it's like a little loop.

979
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:26,600
Speaker 1: It's more like in polar coordinates, how you have an

980
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 1: angle and the angle can't go from zero to infinity,

981
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:31,520
Speaker 1: just goes from zero to three hundred and sixty degrees

982
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:34,400
Speaker 1: and then it goes back to zero again. Right, Imagine

983
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:36,960
Speaker 1: a new dimension of space that's sort of similar. It

984
00:52:37,000 --> 00:52:40,000
Speaker 1: has a maximum length. It's a circle instead of an

985
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,080
Speaker 1: infinite line. Take three D space and sort of move

986
00:52:43,120 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 1: it around this circle. That's how we imagine the universe

987
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:49,720
Speaker 1: with four spatial dimensions. The first three that are normal,

988
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 1: and then this weird rolled up dimension.

989
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:56,319
Speaker 5: Is it like when your Windows computer crashes and you're

990
00:52:56,480 --> 00:52:59,279
Speaker 5: dragging like your cursor or a window around and then

991
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:01,879
Speaker 5: there's a bunch of little copies of that. They all

992
00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 5: get stacked up and messed up. Is that what we're

993
00:53:05,120 --> 00:53:06,160
Speaker 5: talking about here.

994
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:10,800
Speaker 1: Exactly, Or like when you win solitaire and the cards

995
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:13,400
Speaker 1: all stack on top of each other. It's difficult to

996
00:53:13,440 --> 00:53:16,080
Speaker 1: imagine because we're used to three D space and we

997
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:19,400
Speaker 1: think in three dimensions, and so squeezing that fourth dimension

998
00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 1: into your brain is really a challenge. But mathematically it

999
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:26,160
Speaker 1: allows something very cool that allows you to have another

1000
00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:30,439
Speaker 1: kind of curvature. A curvature in this new dimension might

1001
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:33,240
Speaker 1: be able to explain what we see as the force

1002
00:53:33,280 --> 00:53:36,840
Speaker 1: of electromagnetism. So in this case, not just the curvature,

1003
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:40,200
Speaker 1: but the whole dimension would be basically invisible to us.

1004
00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:42,960
Speaker 1: This is an ancient idea in physics. It goes all

1005
00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:46,040
Speaker 1: the way back to nineteen nineteen. The guy Theodor Cluza

1006
00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:48,640
Speaker 1: came up with this just after Einstein came up with

1007
00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:51,760
Speaker 1: this idea of relativity, and then a few years later

1008
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:54,560
Speaker 1: a guy named Oscar Klein turned it into a quantum

1009
00:53:54,600 --> 00:53:57,719
Speaker 1: theory in nineteen twenty six and try to calculate the

1010
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:00,920
Speaker 1: size of this new fifth dimension and figured out how

1011
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,879
Speaker 1: to be like twenty times the plank length, which means

1012
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:06,880
Speaker 1: it's like super duper tiny. It's like ten to the

1013
00:54:06,920 --> 00:54:10,720
Speaker 1: minus thirty five meters long. So this seemed really exciting.

1014
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:13,400
Speaker 5: I have so many questions just about that, like what

1015
00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:17,279
Speaker 5: do you mean calculating the size of a dimension? Right?

1016
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 1: Like, remember that this new dimension is not infinite, like right,

1017
00:54:21,840 --> 00:54:23,279
Speaker 1: we think that you can go as far as you

1018
00:54:23,320 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 1: want in X or and y, r and z, but

1019
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:28,440
Speaker 1: this new dimension is a loop, which means it has

1020
00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 1: a length. Now there's a maximum distance in this dimension.

1021
00:54:32,239 --> 00:54:34,839
Speaker 1: It's unlike the other ones in a really weird way.

1022
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:37,279
Speaker 1: And that means that you can calculate like, well, how

1023
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:39,520
Speaker 1: big could it be? What is the radius of curvature?

1024
00:54:39,600 --> 00:54:43,359
Speaker 1: What is the length around this dimension? So it's very

1025
00:54:43,400 --> 00:54:47,319
Speaker 1: different in a really counterintuitive way. And then Einstein got

1026
00:54:47,360 --> 00:54:48,680
Speaker 1: to work on it. He was like, all right, this

1027
00:54:48,719 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 1: is exciting.

1028
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:51,319
Speaker 5: Oh good. I trust him more than I trust me

1029
00:54:51,360 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 5: to think about it.

1030
00:54:53,560 --> 00:54:55,680
Speaker 1: He thought, maybe this is exciting, Maybe I can make

1031
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 1: this work. Maybe I can explain all of electromagnetism using

1032
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:02,800
Speaker 1: curvature in this fifth dimension. And yeah, he died before

1033
00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:05,200
Speaker 1: he found and people have been working on it for

1034
00:55:05,239 --> 00:55:07,640
Speaker 1: a long time and nobody's been able to crack it.

1035
00:55:08,239 --> 00:55:10,719
Speaker 1: There are some versions of this theory which sort of work,

1036
00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:12,880
Speaker 1: but they all predict that we would have seen a

1037
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:16,000
Speaker 1: bunch of new particles. They predict that electrons would like

1038
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:19,480
Speaker 1: vibrate in this other dimension, and they would vibrate in

1039
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:22,319
Speaker 1: different ways, so you would see like different versions of

1040
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:25,080
Speaker 1: the electron the way like a string can vibrate, but

1041
00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:27,719
Speaker 1: it can vibrate like one mode or two modes, or

1042
00:55:27,760 --> 00:55:31,200
Speaker 1: three modes or four modes. Electrons could vibrate in this

1043
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:33,640
Speaker 1: other dimension in various ways, and you would see like

1044
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:37,240
Speaker 1: heavier and heavier versions of the electron, where the heavy

1045
00:55:37,239 --> 00:55:40,560
Speaker 1: ones are like vibrating in this new dimension with more energy,

1046
00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:43,680
Speaker 1: which gives them effectively more mass. But we haven't seen

1047
00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 1: any heavy electrons, or any heavy muons, or any heavy

1048
00:55:46,600 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 1: versions of these other particles at all. People thought for

1049
00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:51,920
Speaker 1: a while, oh, maybe the muon is a heavy version

1050
00:55:51,960 --> 00:55:54,600
Speaker 1: of the electron, and that's actually like, you know, something

1051
00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:57,440
Speaker 1: vibrating in this new dimension. But that doesn't quite work

1052
00:55:57,480 --> 00:55:59,680
Speaker 1: out because the electron and the muon feel the weak

1053
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:03,200
Speaker 1: force a little bit differently. So the bottom line is

1054
00:56:03,360 --> 00:56:07,600
Speaker 1: it's an exciting direction theoretically to try to make electromagnetism

1055
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:11,560
Speaker 1: work in this clusive cline theory, but it's made predictions

1056
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:14,400
Speaker 1: that haven't been born out in the data, and so

1057
00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:15,719
Speaker 1: it's not so promising.

1058
00:56:16,239 --> 00:56:19,640
Speaker 5: Well, we need to make a time machine, go back

1059
00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:23,040
Speaker 5: in time and then ask Einstein, first of all, how

1060
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:25,880
Speaker 5: to make a time machine so that in the future

1061
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:27,839
Speaker 5: we can go back in time and talk to them

1062
00:56:29,080 --> 00:56:31,839
Speaker 5: and then present them with all of this information. Or

1063
00:56:32,440 --> 00:56:36,279
Speaker 5: maybe uh, there will be a new kind of Einstein,

1064
00:56:37,040 --> 00:56:41,120
Speaker 5: or collectively, instead of one super genius, just a bunch

1065
00:56:41,160 --> 00:56:46,560
Speaker 5: of very smart people working together figuring this out exactly.

1066
00:56:46,640 --> 00:56:49,640
Speaker 1: But it's promising. It's exciting that people are trying to

1067
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:52,239
Speaker 1: push their way through the theoretical jungle. You know, until

1068
00:56:52,239 --> 00:56:53,960
Speaker 1: we figure out how to make a black hole here

1069
00:56:54,040 --> 00:56:56,680
Speaker 1: on Earth, or we've come up with some clever quantum

1070
00:56:56,760 --> 00:57:00,600
Speaker 1: gravity experiment that lets us see particles feeling gravity and

1071
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:04,880
Speaker 1: understand whether they're like bending space time probabilistically, or whether

1072
00:57:04,920 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 1: gravity collapses their wave functions, or what's going on, we

1073
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:12,000
Speaker 1: can only make progress theoretically. That means trying to find

1074
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:16,840
Speaker 1: mathematical relationships between these theories, either making electromagnetism look more

1075
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:21,400
Speaker 1: like gravity or make gravity look more like electromagnetism. So far,

1076
00:57:21,560 --> 00:57:23,880
Speaker 1: both paths have been sort of stuck in the jungle.

1077
00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:26,640
Speaker 1: But maybe one day people will find a connection between

1078
00:57:26,680 --> 00:57:28,640
Speaker 1: them and will all be illuminated.

1079
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:32,000
Speaker 5: That is beautiful, But you do also keep breezing past

1080
00:57:32,040 --> 00:57:35,120
Speaker 5: this plan to make a black hole on Earth. That

1081
00:57:35,400 --> 00:57:36,640
Speaker 5: sounds dangerous to me.

1082
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:40,160
Speaker 1: It is very dangerous, but also potentially we could learn

1083
00:57:40,200 --> 00:57:42,400
Speaker 1: a lot about the universe, so you know, may be

1084
00:57:42,560 --> 00:57:43,360
Speaker 1: worth the risk.

1085
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:47,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, ultimate knowledge right before oblivion. Sign me up.

1086
00:57:50,360 --> 00:57:53,200
Speaker 1: Sounds good. We'll stay tuned for more hints about potential

1087
00:57:53,280 --> 00:57:56,680
Speaker 1: ultimate knowledge about the universe, just before you get sucked

1088
00:57:56,680 --> 00:57:59,680
Speaker 1: into oblivion. Thanks so very much Katie for joining me

1089
00:57:59,720 --> 00:58:02,960
Speaker 1: on this journey of theoretical understanding, and thanks to everybody

1090
00:58:03,000 --> 00:58:10,960
Speaker 1: for tuning in. Tune in next time for more science

1091
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:13,760
Speaker 1: and curiosity. Come find us on social media where we

1092
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:18,000
Speaker 1: answer questions and post videos. We're on Twitter, Discord, Instant,

1093
00:58:18,080 --> 00:58:21,800
Speaker 1: and now TikTok. Thanks for listening, and remember that Daniel

1094
00:58:21,840 --> 00:58:25,280
Speaker 1: and Jorge Explain the Universe is a production of iHeartRadio.

1095
00:58:25,560 --> 00:58:30,720
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1096
00:58:30,840 --> 00:58:38,280
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. When you

1097
00:58:38,320 --> 00:58:40,360
Speaker 1: pop a piece of cheese into your mouth, you're probably

1098
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:43,480
Speaker 1: not thinking about the environmental impact. But the people in

1099
00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:46,640
Speaker 1: the dairy industry are. That's why they're working hard every

1100
00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:50,040
Speaker 1: day to find new ways to reduce waste, conserve natural resources,

1101
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:54,080
Speaker 1: and drive down greenhouse gas emissions. House US dairy tackling

1102
00:58:54,120 --> 00:58:57,880
Speaker 1: greenhouse gases. Many farms use anaerobic digestors to turn the

1103
00:58:57,920 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 1: methane from maneure into renewable energy that can power farms, towns,

1104
00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:06,480
Speaker 1: and electric cars. Visit you asdairy dot COM's last sustainability

1105
00:59:06,520 --> 00:59:07,280
Speaker 1: to learn more.

1106
00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:10,439
Speaker 4: Vitamin Water is from New York. We needed a drink

1107
00:59:10,440 --> 00:59:12,400
Speaker 4: that can keep up with the music scene in the city.

1108
00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:15,000
Speaker 4: We got to see our favorite DJ perform in Brooklyn

1109
00:59:15,360 --> 00:59:19,280
Speaker 4: at three am, or seeing karaoke in the village also

1110
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:22,800
Speaker 4: at three am. Drink Vitamin Water is from New York.

1111
00:59:23,960 --> 00:59:27,360
Speaker 2: There are children, friends, and families walking, riding on paths

1112
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:29,880
Speaker 2: and roads every day. Remember they're real people with loved

1113
00:59:29,920 --> 00:59:32,120
Speaker 2: ones who need them to get home safely. Protect our

1114
00:59:32,120 --> 00:59:35,640
Speaker 2: cyclists and pedestrians because they're people too, Go safely. California

1115
00:59:35,680 --> 00:59:38,000
Speaker 2: from the California Office of Traffic Safety and Caltrans