WEBVTT - Jenna Fischer - Pt. 2 0:00:05.559 --> 0:00:16.520 This is Jenna Fisher, I played Pam Beasley. Hello, folks, 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:21.400 thank you so much for joining me here today. That's right, 0:00:21.840 --> 0:00:26.120 she's back. Uh. This is the office Deep Dive and 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:31.040 I am your host, Brian baum Gartner. Today I am 0:00:31.080 --> 0:00:33.960 so thrilled to be bringing you the second half of 0:00:34.000 --> 0:00:38.640 my conversation with Jenna, and this time we are diving 0:00:39.240 --> 0:00:43.280 right in to the good stuff. That's right, the real 0:00:43.440 --> 0:00:48.239 reason you're all here Jim and Pam, p B and 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:53.920 freaking Jay. Now, over the years, Jenna and John have 0:00:54.080 --> 0:01:00.200 been asked approximately eight billion questions about Jim and Pam's relationship. 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:03.000 So I have to say I almost didn't even want 0:01:03.000 --> 0:01:06.640 to ask them about it, but but I did, and 0:01:06.720 --> 0:01:11.319 I was blown away by how interesting it was to 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:17.039 talk about Jenna in particular, shared so many incredible insights 0:01:17.319 --> 0:01:20.960 into their relationship and and what made it unique on television, 0:01:21.360 --> 0:01:25.319 and why she and John are actually not a couple 0:01:25.440 --> 0:01:29.800 in real life, and trust me, they are not anyway. 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:32.839 That is just the beginning. This conversation was so fascinating, 0:01:33.360 --> 0:01:37.679 as every conversation with Jenna is. I cannot say enough 0:01:37.720 --> 0:01:42.760 good things about her. So go ahead and welcome to 0:01:43.000 --> 0:01:53.120 your ear holes. Miss Jenna Fisher, Bubble and Squeak. I 0:01:53.360 --> 0:01:59.440 love it, Bubble and Squeaker, Bubble and Squeaker cooking at 0:01:59.560 --> 0:02:14.360 every More lived from the I was literally laying in 0:02:14.360 --> 0:02:16.799 bed last night thinking about this, Like if you think 0:02:16.880 --> 0:02:21.720 about the office as like a person or a body 0:02:21.840 --> 0:02:26.240 or something, Pam was the heart and your relationship with 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:29.400 so many different people, well, with everybody, but really those three, 0:02:30.240 --> 0:02:35.600 you know, Jim and Dwight and Michael, obviously the relationship 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:38.760 with Jim. Why do you think that that relationship resonated 0:02:38.800 --> 0:02:43.800 so much with with audiences? Oh, I think it's the 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:48.240 unrequited love. I think we've all been there. We've all 0:02:49.240 --> 0:02:52.680 been in love with someone who either didn't love us 0:02:53.440 --> 0:02:57.280 or couldn't love us, or because of circumstances or distance 0:02:57.440 --> 0:03:00.639 or whatever these things were, we're keeping us from being 0:03:00.680 --> 0:03:06.160 able to fully express our feelings. The longing. And then 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:11.600 I think additionally the clear chemistry between the characters that 0:03:11.760 --> 0:03:14.640 you could see that they were meant to be together 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:20.560 and you just rooted for them absolutely. But I think 0:03:20.600 --> 0:03:26.040 that there was also something about your performance and John's performance. 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:31.919 You showed such heart and vulnerability that I think people 0:03:31.919 --> 0:03:34.800 were really rooting for you, whether they had found what 0:03:34.840 --> 0:03:37.760 they wanted to or not. Well. I think both Pam 0:03:37.800 --> 0:03:42.080 and Jim are very good people. They're polite. It's one 0:03:42.080 --> 0:03:45.560 of the reasons why it takes them so long. And uh, 0:03:45.800 --> 0:03:47.400 I think you always want the good guy to win, 0:03:48.400 --> 0:03:51.320 so I think you did want them to find one 0:03:51.360 --> 0:03:59.200 another and be together. It's hopeful, right. Um, Nothing throughout 0:03:59.200 --> 0:04:03.080 the entire his tree of the show brought production to 0:04:03.120 --> 0:04:07.800 a screeching halt, like a big Jim Pam moment. It's true, 0:04:07.880 --> 0:04:11.280 and I say that with love and also with utter frustration. 0:04:13.560 --> 0:04:17.559 It Um, Yeah, we really really cared. I mean John 0:04:17.560 --> 0:04:20.880 and I would fight hard for what we believed and 0:04:20.920 --> 0:04:23.080 we were usually on the same page with Jim and Pam. 0:04:23.160 --> 0:04:25.720 We were had like a singular mind when it came 0:04:25.760 --> 0:04:28.279 to Jim and Pam. For the most part, there was 0:04:28.400 --> 0:04:32.440 often one Jim Pam moment per episode, and it was 0:04:32.520 --> 0:04:35.920 either where they're going to connect in some super special 0:04:35.960 --> 0:04:40.480 swoony way, or they're gonna misstep in some way where 0:04:40.480 --> 0:04:42.920 one of them gets their feelings hurt. And there was 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:45.320 this very fine line that we had to walk all 0:04:45.320 --> 0:04:50.240 the time. So, for example, shooting a scene over and 0:04:50.279 --> 0:04:53.520 over and over again where this time they can touch hands, 0:04:53.960 --> 0:04:55.279 but then we have to do one where they don't 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:56.960 touch hands because it might be too much when their 0:04:56.960 --> 0:04:59.640 hand if their hands touch, that might be going to 0:04:59.760 --> 0:05:02.080 fall are Or do we end it with a hug? 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:04.960 Or should he kiss her cheek? Before all of these 0:05:05.000 --> 0:05:08.000 little ways, how much were they allowed to literally touch 0:05:08.080 --> 0:05:11.880 one another, look at each other's eyes, swoon at each other? 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:16.640 I mean we would we would spend hours debating and 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:19.919 shooting alternates of these Jim Pam scenes and ours is 0:05:19.960 --> 0:05:25.000 not an exaggeration. But what's amazing is this wasn't like 0:05:25.120 --> 0:05:29.320 mystical producers in another land talking about it. This was 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:36.440 you and John who are in there in question? No, No, 0:05:36.480 --> 0:05:38.799 not at all. No. I mean, I think it speaks 0:05:38.839 --> 0:05:41.200 to the two of you as artists, but I think 0:05:41.240 --> 0:05:44.640 that there's also the camera as a character. And what 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:49.000 I recall is you and John, specifically with greg Or 0:05:49.120 --> 0:05:52.840 Ken or one of the other directors, you know, sort 0:05:52.839 --> 0:05:55.960 of two major questions, who is seeing this moment? Is 0:05:56.000 --> 0:05:59.520 the camera seeing this moment? And how does that change 0:06:00.120 --> 0:06:03.679 my behavior in this moment? And those were the things 0:06:03.720 --> 0:06:07.360 that I feel like well brought production to a screeching hold. 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:09.599 This was one of the most fun elements of working 0:06:09.600 --> 0:06:13.520 on our show was this camera as a character, because 0:06:13.880 --> 0:06:17.560 this idea that when you know the camera is filming you, 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:21.080 it affects your behavior. It certainly affects Michael's behavior. When 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:24.400 he knows the camera is on him, he performs for 0:06:24.480 --> 0:06:29.080 the camera. He does things like makes giant declarations and 0:06:29.240 --> 0:06:33.839 pledges of money to Oscar's nephews Walkathon in front of 0:06:33.880 --> 0:06:35.960 the camera. But then when he doesn't know that the 0:06:36.000 --> 0:06:38.200 camera is shooting through the blinds, he tries to talk 0:06:38.400 --> 0:06:41.119 his way out of it. So that is so fun 0:06:41.240 --> 0:06:44.520 to play. And similarly with Jim and Pam, how do 0:06:44.640 --> 0:06:46.840 Jim and Pam behave when they know they're being watched 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:49.600 and observed, and then how do they behave with one 0:06:49.600 --> 0:06:52.320 another when they can't see the camera when the camera 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:56.119 is deep in the kitchen shooting through the blinds. I 0:06:56.200 --> 0:07:00.000 absolutely loved those nuances. Those were some of the most 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:02.719 fun things to play with on our show. Yes, well, 0:07:02.760 --> 0:07:06.360 and when I directed, and I'm not just saying well 0:07:06.360 --> 0:07:08.360 what I directed to get in the fact that I directed, 0:07:08.400 --> 0:07:12.280 But there was a moment later on season eight, Kathy 0:07:12.600 --> 0:07:16.400 Lindsay broad like Kathy and Jim goes away to Florida, 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:19.000 and Cathy's clearly trying to get the moves on him. 0:07:19.000 --> 0:07:23.800 It's taking place in Jim's bedroom and we had to shoot. 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:26.800 The only way to shoot the room was through the windows, 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:30.000 because if the cameras were in the room, we would 0:07:30.000 --> 0:07:34.880 not have gotten the interaction between Kathy and Jim that 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:38.400 we ultimately wanted. But then there was a phone call 0:07:39.360 --> 0:07:42.120 with Pam. You with Pam that happened there and I 0:07:42.160 --> 0:07:45.920 remember sitting in You weren't Invalencia, You were probably home. 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:48.480 Did I not come because I have a very vivid 0:07:48.560 --> 0:07:52.160 memory of being there when Jim was a smug bedbug? 0:07:53.640 --> 0:07:57.560 Was that your episode smug Bedbugs? I have a memory 0:07:57.680 --> 0:08:02.720 of watching Rain and John crack up as John was 0:08:02.800 --> 0:08:05.480 a smug bedbug. I think that you came for the 0:08:05.520 --> 0:08:11.720 phone call. But we had a huge conversation about you 0:08:11.960 --> 0:08:18.200 were involved in what the interaction was between Kathy and Jim, 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:21.320 because John wanted you involved and you wanted to be involved, 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:25.960 and how that interaction, what that meant for your relationship 0:08:26.000 --> 0:08:30.200 with Jim. Anyway, I think it just speaks to everybody 0:08:30.280 --> 0:08:34.160 wanting to get it right. Yeah, we cared on this 0:08:34.200 --> 0:08:38.800 show very deeply. Everybody cared very very much, And I 0:08:38.840 --> 0:08:42.480 think that started with Greg. Greg's heart was in this show, 0:08:42.760 --> 0:08:47.760 and you could tell, and he delighted. He delighted in 0:08:47.800 --> 0:08:51.400 getting it right, and and we would shoot something and 0:08:51.440 --> 0:08:54.280 we would all look over at the monitors at Greg 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:58.880 and see if he was doing his little handclap with 0:08:58.920 --> 0:09:01.559 his little smile, and he puts his eyes up in 0:09:01.600 --> 0:09:05.439 the air, you know, because that's when we knew we 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:07.960 nailed it. And he was such a great barometer for that. 0:09:09.320 --> 0:09:13.480 When did you When did you start realizing or noticing 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:17.520 that Jim and Pam's relationship was becoming so important to 0:09:17.600 --> 0:09:23.920 people outside and was it infringing on your real life? Well, 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:29.480 realizing that my friend John and I couldn't go anywhere 0:09:29.480 --> 0:09:33.760 in public together as friends or else people would lose 0:09:33.760 --> 0:09:36.960 their minds. They didn't know how to deal with that. 0:09:37.000 --> 0:09:40.960 They didn't know how. And even today people don't know 0:09:41.080 --> 0:09:43.280 how John and I are not a couple in real life. 0:09:43.800 --> 0:09:46.640 They don't understand it. And I don't know how to 0:09:46.679 --> 0:09:49.120 explain it because it's a little bit like telling kids 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:51.440 there's no Santa. It's like I don't want to break 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:57.959 anyone's heart. So it's hard. It's it's really hard. You 0:09:58.000 --> 0:09:59.960 should just explain that he's a real pain in the 0:10:00.040 --> 0:10:03.760 as in real life. Why would you not just say that? 0:10:03.840 --> 0:10:05.560 But that's weird. I have to. I feel like I 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:09.280 have to justify why John and I, which are actually 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:12.640 in love, And the bottom line is we were playing characters. 0:10:13.240 --> 0:10:16.040 But I know that if people think of us as 0:10:16.120 --> 0:10:19.400 John and Jenna, then it's destroying some of the magic 0:10:19.440 --> 0:10:23.480 of Jim and Pam. But I'm not Pam in real 0:10:23.559 --> 0:10:26.760 life and he's not Jim in real life, and in 0:10:26.800 --> 0:10:31.319 real life we're mismatched. He is perfectly matched with Emily 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:34.440 and I'm perfectly matched with Lee. And you know us 0:10:34.480 --> 0:10:39.719 all both, And in fact, I feel like if anyone 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:43.520 wants to marry anyone, they want to marry Emily or Lee, 0:10:44.160 --> 0:10:47.680 they don't want to actually marry me or John. Is 0:10:47.679 --> 0:10:50.440 that a good description of why John and I are 0:10:50.480 --> 0:10:53.319 not imagined real life because you know us both. Yes, 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:56.920 I think that that's a great description. I also think, yeah, 0:10:56.960 --> 0:11:01.920 you both were playing characters, and I think that you um, 0:11:01.960 --> 0:11:05.200 and you've expressed today how different you are from Pam 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:08.440 and John is different from Jim. People perceive you to 0:11:08.480 --> 0:11:11.240 be that even you know, if someone has a couple 0:11:11.280 --> 0:11:13.599 of minute interaction with me, they're they're not going to 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:17.160 mistake me for Kevin. And I think that's so true 0:11:17.200 --> 0:11:21.720 of like Angela as well. Angela is like a bubbly cheerleader. 0:11:22.520 --> 0:11:25.120 She's your best friend in two minutes. She's so not 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:28.240 the bitchy Angela Martin that she plays on the show 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:32.200 most of the time. Oh come on, but but I 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:34.360 do see how John and I the Lion is a 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:37.240 little more blurred, Like you can have an interaction with 0:11:37.320 --> 0:11:39.679 John and I and think maybe that we really are 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:45.160 just like Pam or just like Yim. Yes, yeah, um, okay. 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:48.240 Do you have a favorite moment or moments between the 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:50.360 two of you that you've got to play together? Yes. 0:11:50.840 --> 0:11:54.000 One of my first favorite moments is when we are 0:11:54.080 --> 0:11:58.319 up on the roof eating the grilled cheese sandwiches and 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:02.600 you and Rain are doing at the fireworks out in 0:12:02.679 --> 0:12:07.840 the lawn. And that was super special because we had 0:12:07.920 --> 0:12:10.839 this skeleton crew. Everyone had gone home for the day 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:13.160 and up until this point we had mostly only ever 0:12:13.240 --> 0:12:15.920 been shooting in a big group in the office with 0:12:16.000 --> 0:12:19.400 lots of people, and here it was just me and 0:12:19.520 --> 0:12:22.640 John on some lawn chairs. It was a summer evening, 0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:28.520 like a warm breeze, candlelight. Greg is up on the roof, 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:32.760 just a couple of crew members were up on the roof, 0:12:32.880 --> 0:12:36.560 and it was like so peaceful up there, the five 0:12:36.640 --> 0:12:40.360 of us and then watching you and Rain, who I 0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:45.320 believe we had no way of communicating with, yeah, just 0:12:45.400 --> 0:12:50.040 setting off fireworks. It just all felt really real and lovely. 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:53.360 So that moment is one of my favorite moments. And 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:55.280 what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna edit out you're 0:12:55.280 --> 0:12:58.080 talking about Greg and the other two crew members up there, 0:12:58.120 --> 0:13:01.600 because then you're describing city there with John. That's why 0:13:01.679 --> 0:13:06.160 people think it's a warm summer breeze and we were 0:13:06.200 --> 0:13:09.680 sitting in lawn chairs on the roof. But some of 0:13:09.720 --> 0:13:12.240 it like it's true. It's like, you know, Matt Son 0:13:12.400 --> 0:13:14.240 is up on the roof and Greg is there, and 0:13:14.240 --> 0:13:16.360 we're all just none of us can believe we're on 0:13:16.440 --> 0:13:19.480 the roof. And we had to take this. They had 0:13:19.480 --> 0:13:23.880 this old rickety rusted ladder that was on the side 0:13:23.880 --> 0:13:26.040 of the roof that everybody else climbed up, but since 0:13:26.120 --> 0:13:28.280 John and I were cast members, we weren't allowed, so 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:31.160 they like fork lifted us up there on this wearing 0:13:31.200 --> 0:13:35.720 a weird harness. It was very funny. Um, were you 0:13:35.760 --> 0:13:39.520 worried when Pam and Jim got married that was gonna 0:13:39.640 --> 0:13:44.440 screw things up? I wasn't because we had been together 0:13:44.520 --> 0:13:46.760 now for a couple of seasons. So I think the 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:50.760 question was can they get together and be a stable 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:57.480 couple and will we still care? And and I remember 0:13:57.520 --> 0:13:59.679 having a conversation with Greg where Greg was like, well, 0:13:59.720 --> 0:14:02.400 you know what's going to lose people is if we 0:14:02.559 --> 0:14:07.880 just keep manufacturing these affairs and these you know, weird 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:11.480 ways that we keep them apart. That's exhausting and it's 0:14:11.520 --> 0:14:15.560 not realistic. And so what we're going to need to 0:14:15.600 --> 0:14:19.400 do is bring them together and then give them obstacles 0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:23.240 to overcome as a couple. So, rather than obstacles that 0:14:23.440 --> 0:14:26.080 keep them from being a couple, give them obstacles to 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:29.840 break through as a couple, like Pam wanting to go 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:33.360 to art school or Jim wanting to start his own business, 0:14:33.720 --> 0:14:37.120 or having their first kid or whatever these things were 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:40.800 that they were going to have to weather the storm together, 0:14:40.920 --> 0:14:43.120 that that would be more interesting and more realistic, and 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:46.720 people loved it. I think that's so smart, so smart 0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:48.960 because but he said, you know what's not going to 0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:52.320 be satisfying is if they get together at the end 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:56.600 of season nine after multiple affairs, and like everyone's gonna 0:14:56.600 --> 0:15:02.240 be like, Yay, I guess you know. Congrats. I hope 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:07.200 you enjoy your marriage with all your horrible baggage. Look 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:10.840 totally right. That's not a happy ending. I've never heard 0:15:10.880 --> 0:15:34.040 that is so smart. Yeah, okay, so I talked again 0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:38.000 about sort of that emotional core. Dwight. Talk to me 0:15:38.040 --> 0:15:40.120 a little bit about the relationship between the two of 0:15:40.240 --> 0:15:43.080 you and how that changed and evolved. I mean, you 0:15:43.200 --> 0:15:50.360 were with Jim adversaries and made you crazy forever, and 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:53.160 then ultimately by the end, he says that you're his 0:15:53.240 --> 0:15:59.480 best friend. Dwight, doesw does you know? I think it's 0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:03.840 that first episode the Injury, when Pam has that line, 0:16:04.160 --> 0:16:08.520 Dwight is kind of my friend. But I think there's 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:11.000 other things. You know, Jim and Pam spends so much 0:16:11.040 --> 0:16:15.040 time teasing Dwight, and I think even go too far. 0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:18.320 A few times in my rewatching of the show, I 0:16:18.360 --> 0:16:20.880 think there's a few times when we're like, actually a 0:16:20.920 --> 0:16:23.400 little cruel to him that makes me cringe and I 0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:26.320 feel like, oh, that wasn't our best moment, but I 0:16:26.360 --> 0:16:30.440 appreciate because we allow our characters too. We don't all 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:36.200 every day have perfect moments, right. But it's so hard 0:16:36.240 --> 0:16:38.360 for me to think about Pam's relationship with Dwight without 0:16:38.400 --> 0:16:43.280 thinking about my relationship to Rain. Rain is a deeply 0:16:44.240 --> 0:16:48.960 soulful person. He's also like a curmudgeon ly old man. 0:16:49.280 --> 0:16:54.600 He's really cranky sometimes, and on set he would be hilarious. 0:16:55.160 --> 0:16:57.720 Do you remember the time do you remember the time 0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:01.120 he declared, Oh my god, it was so funny. We 0:17:01.160 --> 0:17:02.880 were getting ready to shoot and he said, hold on, wait, 0:17:03.000 --> 0:17:05.040 just hold on, everybody, hold on for a second. I 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:09.840 have an announcement. Everyone on Monday's you do not need 0:17:09.920 --> 0:17:13.960 to ask me how my weekend was anymore? All right, 0:17:14.680 --> 0:17:17.679 every single person asked me how my weekend was. Just 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:20.720 assume it was fine. We were like, where is this 0:17:20.880 --> 0:17:25.040 coming from? Right? And I talked to him about this, 0:17:25.080 --> 0:17:27.040 and he goes, Jenna, that is not true. I said 0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:29.800 that on a Tuesday. I said, only asked me how 0:17:29.880 --> 0:17:32.600 my weekend was on Mondays. No more of this bleeding 0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:36.879 into Tuesday Mondays. And he went crazy because you and 0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:40.879 I know what he was talking about. Because it's five 0:17:40.920 --> 0:17:43.639 o'clock in the morning, and every single person that you 0:17:43.720 --> 0:17:46.200 passed is like, hello, good morning. How was your weekend? 0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:48.960 And he what he was saying was like, you don't 0:17:48.960 --> 0:17:51.080 have to talk to me. We just saw each other 0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:56.200 on Friday night. We're good, We're good. Yes, it's so true. 0:17:56.680 --> 0:17:58.680 So he would be like that guy on this set. 0:17:58.720 --> 0:18:02.000 It was like so funny. But then at the same time, 0:18:03.119 --> 0:18:06.920 in moments of deep crisis, I have phoned him. I 0:18:07.320 --> 0:18:09.199 had a job offer that was going to take me 0:18:09.240 --> 0:18:11.800 out of town and would uproot my family for a 0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:14.600 period of time that I really wrestled with the decision. 0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:18.600 I called him and he counseled me. He is he 0:18:18.720 --> 0:18:23.000 has that in him, a type of counselor, and I 0:18:23.200 --> 0:18:28.320 value him so deeply in my life. But then like 0:18:29.080 --> 0:18:31.439 like he'll call me up and he'll be like, do 0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:33.480 you want to go to lunch? And I'm like, yeah, 0:18:33.520 --> 0:18:35.359 I mean because you sound like you want to go 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:38.200 so bad, Like is it a chore or do you 0:18:38.240 --> 0:18:39.440 want to go? Just like no, I want to lunch 0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:40.960 with you, Like all right, let's go to lunch. And 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:43.760 then you go to lunch and I was just sort 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:47.120 of like, are you liking our lunch. Are we having 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.800 a good lunch? How are you tell me about you? 0:18:49.840 --> 0:18:55.520 And all this so funny, but then like if I 0:18:55.600 --> 0:18:57.840 were to do you know what I mean? So it's 0:18:57.840 --> 0:19:01.280 like very much like the Pammed White where Pam will 0:19:01.359 --> 0:19:04.280 like be like, oh, I love Dwight. I'm gonna go 0:19:04.320 --> 0:19:06.720 say something nice to him, and then he'll just be like, Pam, 0:19:07.200 --> 0:19:13.359 something about knives, something about snakes or bears, and she's like, yeah, okay, right, okay, 0:19:13.400 --> 0:19:17.840 But so I guess, um, I feel deeply loved by Rain, 0:19:18.160 --> 0:19:20.480 and I think Pam fell deeply loved by Dwight as well, 0:19:20.520 --> 0:19:22.800 Like they had a real bond, they really cared for 0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:28.160 one another eventually eventually yeah. Um. Well, and it's similar 0:19:28.200 --> 0:19:32.359 to your relationship with Michael, right, I mean from where 0:19:32.440 --> 0:19:38.000 that relationship started and him fake firing you to him 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:42.199 leaving and you you having sort of that final moment 0:19:43.200 --> 0:19:48.320 with him, Um, what did he say to you? Well, 0:19:48.320 --> 0:19:51.960 it wasn't so much what he said to me. Um. 0:19:52.119 --> 0:19:56.199 Paul Fie directed that episode Goodbye Michael, and Uh we 0:19:56.240 --> 0:19:58.879 were at the airport and Paul Fiq said, Jenna, I 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:03.280 want you to just run up and just say goodbye. 0:20:03.280 --> 0:20:07.640 To Steve. Your friend, Steve, this is your last scene 0:20:07.680 --> 0:20:10.240 with him, so say goodbye. We're not going to use 0:20:10.280 --> 0:20:12.879 the sound. We're just going to have a spy shot 0:20:12.920 --> 0:20:16.280 on you. So I thought, okay. So I ran up 0:20:16.280 --> 0:20:18.880 to Steve and I just told him all the ways 0:20:18.880 --> 0:20:20.879 I was going to miss him and how grateful I 0:20:20.960 --> 0:20:24.080 was for his friendship and the privilege of working with him. 0:20:24.119 --> 0:20:27.919 And I'm sobbing, and he's sobbing, and we're hugging and 0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:29.359 and I didn't want to let him go, and I 0:20:29.400 --> 0:20:32.800 didn't want the scene to end. And then finally paulfy 0:20:33.160 --> 0:20:36.119 you know, says cut and he was like, Jenna, that 0:20:36.200 --> 0:20:38.960 was that was brilliant. Can you do it again? But 0:20:39.080 --> 0:20:42.359 just a little faster because it had been like five minutes. 0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:46.959 He was like, we just need to tighten it up 0:20:47.000 --> 0:20:53.720 a little because they wanted him to actually work ahead 0:20:55.040 --> 0:20:58.120 and they had one camera. There was only one shot 0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:03.240 that they couldn't edit. Is so great. I was like, 0:21:03.280 --> 0:21:06.680 just tighten it up a little, but sweetie, great job. 0:21:07.000 --> 0:21:11.480 I guess he could tell. I was like sobbing. Yeah. 0:21:11.600 --> 0:21:16.080 In thinking back, honestly, when he Steve leaving to me 0:21:17.320 --> 0:21:22.040 was almost more emotional than the show ending. Well, the 0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:24.600 thing is is that it wasn't just the character of 0:21:24.640 --> 0:21:28.240 Michael that we were losing. We were losing the captain 0:21:28.280 --> 0:21:31.520 of our ship, Steve Carrell. And I don't think that 0:21:32.600 --> 0:21:36.159 I can say enough how important him as our leader was, 0:21:37.080 --> 0:21:40.359 because just the kind of man he is, his work, ethic, 0:21:41.600 --> 0:21:48.679 his kindness, his generosity, there was no ego, and to 0:21:48.760 --> 0:21:54.080 be led with that, along with Greg's heart, it was 0:21:54.280 --> 0:21:57.720 very frightening to me that we were losing him. He 0:21:57.840 --> 0:22:00.520 was our compass that pointed us north and us all 0:22:00.560 --> 0:22:04.399 in line, and I really worried what's it gonna be 0:22:04.520 --> 0:22:08.040 like on set without him. We just all agreed he 0:22:08.119 --> 0:22:11.320 was the most important person on set, and we always 0:22:11.359 --> 0:22:13.399 wanted the day to be easy for him. He had 0:22:13.440 --> 0:22:15.840 the most lines, he had the most work, he had 0:22:15.880 --> 0:22:19.160 to drive the show, and we all just collectively were 0:22:19.200 --> 0:22:23.320 there to support him. And he was so generous. I 0:22:23.320 --> 0:22:27.720 mean I remember, I remember directors would come in who 0:22:27.720 --> 0:22:31.600 were new and they wouldn't be able to find Steve, 0:22:32.240 --> 0:22:35.280 but he'd just be sitting on the couch. By reception, 0:22:35.320 --> 0:22:37.520 We'll be like, oh, he's right there. Because he was 0:22:37.640 --> 0:22:41.160 so he wasn't like and I'm here, kind of guy. 0:22:41.320 --> 0:22:44.800 You know, he was just and I and I say 0:22:44.840 --> 0:22:47.320 this because after working on the Office, I've worked on 0:22:47.440 --> 0:22:50.399 many projects where this is not the case, and I 0:22:50.600 --> 0:22:55.240 see how that infects a group of people when there 0:22:55.320 --> 0:22:58.720 is someone who is leading the ship, who is insecure 0:22:59.000 --> 0:23:02.359 and needs a constant an ego boost, And it makes 0:23:02.400 --> 0:23:04.680 me even more grateful for how Steve was and how 0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:08.400 he is still. I also remember Will Ferrell coming in 0:23:09.080 --> 0:23:12.720 and guesting with us, and then I've done movies with 0:23:12.760 --> 0:23:16.240 Will Ferrell and he's the same way. And I always thought, wow, 0:23:16.280 --> 0:23:19.199 they really have a competition for like greatest person to 0:23:19.240 --> 0:23:23.320 work for work with Steve and Will just like nicest 0:23:23.400 --> 0:23:28.040 man in Hollywood. But um so, my biggest fear was 0:23:28.359 --> 0:23:32.119 even just what is the onset vibe going to be 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:36.199 like without Steve? Not to mention what stories are we 0:23:36.240 --> 0:23:40.119 going to tell? Who are we without this leader? And 0:23:40.280 --> 0:23:42.240 I'll say it here and this is the only time 0:23:42.280 --> 0:23:46.280 I've ever really publicly said this, but it's always disappointed 0:23:46.320 --> 0:23:52.560 me that we didn't trust in our core office group 0:23:52.760 --> 0:23:56.840 enough to continue the show without bringing in what I 0:23:56.880 --> 0:24:00.520 think we thought we needed, which were these big guest 0:24:00.800 --> 0:24:06.280 actors to fill steve shoes. And I always felt like 0:24:07.359 --> 0:24:14.640 fear drove some decisions two that I does that make sense? 0:24:14.760 --> 0:24:19.240 It does make sense. Yeah, I always wondered just what 0:24:19.359 --> 0:24:23.040 would that season have been like, like what we then 0:24:23.160 --> 0:24:25.800 got with season nine, where we said, no, we're enough, 0:24:26.560 --> 0:24:29.760 the bench is deep enough, the talent is there. We 0:24:29.800 --> 0:24:33.679 can keep the ship afloat with what we have. Right. 0:24:33.960 --> 0:24:36.760 I don't know how you feel about that season eight. No, 0:24:37.320 --> 0:24:39.600 I hear what you're saying. I think that there was 0:24:39.760 --> 0:24:43.600 fear and what would happen if we didn't have someone 0:24:43.680 --> 0:24:48.840 else helming? Because being the boss changes the character. Yeah, 0:24:49.160 --> 0:24:53.560 so Dwight as the boss is not Dwight, that's right. 0:24:53.680 --> 0:24:56.280 Dwight is the character who wants to be the boss, 0:24:56.320 --> 0:24:58.840 who's always angling to be the boss, but who had 0:24:58.960 --> 0:25:02.200 does not actually have the authority. So if you make 0:25:02.280 --> 0:25:04.800 him the boss, then who is that guy? So it 0:25:04.840 --> 0:25:07.359 does make sense that they felt like they're needed to 0:25:07.440 --> 0:25:11.800 be and that was the question who should be the boss? 0:25:12.560 --> 0:25:15.199 This was the conversation you should be the boss? I 0:25:15.200 --> 0:25:17.400 mean I remember being up in the writer's room and 0:25:17.800 --> 0:25:19.840 people ask me who I thought should be the boss, 0:25:19.840 --> 0:25:21.879 and I was like, guys, I don't know, I don't know. 0:25:23.119 --> 0:25:26.560 They were still trying to get like anybody's opinion, Like, 0:25:26.640 --> 0:25:28.960 does anyone have a perspective on this? Well? And I 0:25:29.000 --> 0:25:32.119 think as a character it was Jim. I mean I 0:25:32.119 --> 0:25:35.600 think Jim was the most I mean he was lazy, 0:25:35.800 --> 0:25:39.200 he was the most well suited technical level should be 0:25:39.200 --> 0:25:42.600 promoted to that job. Correct, Yes, in terms of his 0:25:42.920 --> 0:25:46.919 interaction with people, his ability to lead and sort of 0:25:46.960 --> 0:25:51.920