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Speaker 1: Hey, what up. Welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlie. This is

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Speaker 1: all ball, all right. So what you heard by now,

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Speaker 1: and I don't.

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Speaker 2: Know if we've talked about this in the pod is

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Speaker 2: I'm not gonna do the live radio show. This feed

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Speaker 2: will be my outlet to the world. So we're gonna

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Speaker 2: keep adding things in tigre with things. But in the meantime,

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Speaker 2: what you do need to know is every Thursday, and

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Speaker 2: obviously we're putting this thing out on the was this

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Speaker 2: Christmas Eve? Yeah, we'll put this out on Christmas Eve,

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Speaker 2: which is a Wednesday. Every Thursday, we're gonna have Dan

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Speaker 2: Poneman on the show. Dan Poneman is the owner proprietor

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Speaker 2: of We've. We've is I think the biggest college basketball

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Speaker 2: an IL agency working, or if not, it's the most

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Speaker 2: interesting one. And Dan I have a great relationship. So

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Speaker 2: what it is, what this is a place for is

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Speaker 2: for you to get educated on the reality of the space,

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Speaker 2: the reality of the space, instead of hearing from it

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Speaker 2: from people on TV, none of whom I believe, well

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Speaker 2: maybe with some of the fire football coaches, but there's

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Speaker 2: no basketball coach that I believe that's on TV. That's

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Speaker 2: been fired in this new nil era. Who can tell

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Speaker 2: you how it really works, what really happens, some of

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Speaker 2: the pitfalls of it, some of the challenges of it,

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Speaker 2: some of the good things about it as well. So

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Speaker 2: Dan Ponaman is going to join me every Thursday here

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Speaker 2: on the show. But the Personal Life Update is not

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Speaker 2: going to do the live radio show press pause on it.

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Speaker 2: You know, like perception reality two different things. But you

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Speaker 2: also you have to win sometimes the perception battle to

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Speaker 2: win the reality battle perception from some of b how

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Speaker 2: can you do two jobs? How can you do love radio?

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Speaker 2: It's like it was fine. The parts that come up

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Speaker 2: short are the rest of your life. You know, this

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Speaker 2: is a really random one. I was thinking about this today.

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Speaker 2: I have never taken my dogs. So at Green Bay

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Speaker 2: we have the campus. Part of it used to be

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Speaker 2: an eighteen old golf course. There was a nine old

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Speaker 2: golf course. Then the last nine holes were made into

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Speaker 2: this incredible cross country of course. So I not out

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Speaker 2: of season. I take my dogs there. They run it,

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Speaker 2: They love it. One of my dogs gets in the

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Speaker 2: you know, the ponds and chases the.

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Speaker 1: Ducks and whatever.

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Speaker 2: I don't get to do that in basketball season, you know,

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Speaker 2: just don't get to have lunch with my players unless

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Speaker 2: they have it in my office when I'm working.

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Speaker 1: So I'm gonna take it.

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Speaker 2: Use the benefits of only locking in, only holding out

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Speaker 2: of basketball, and then on off times we'll do podcasts

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Speaker 2: and they'll be really really good and you know, kind

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Speaker 2: of the less is more sort of variety. We'll have

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Speaker 2: more of these podcasts than we've had previously, but less

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Speaker 2: than a five day a week grind. And also, I

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Speaker 2: don't feel like I need to only discuss the Dallas

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Speaker 2: Cowboys and you know, Tom Brady and Lebron James and

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Speaker 2: all the topics that Daily Radio TV feel compelled to

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Speaker 2: do because the numbers tell you got to talk about those.

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Speaker 2: It's not that what I can talk about not popular things,

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Speaker 2: but we can be more exactly what we want to

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Speaker 2: get to. Here's where we are in college basketball. With

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Speaker 2: our season. We played three conference games. We're one and two.

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Speaker 2: I'm really disappointed in our Robert Morris loss. So one

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Speaker 2: and two is a game below where we think we

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Speaker 2: should be. We're six and eight overall, coming out of

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Speaker 2: non conference where we were five and seven, and of

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Speaker 2: that five and seven, Yale was a game that we

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Speaker 2: came from behind, had a chance to win. Minnesota went

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Speaker 2: to overtime very well, could have won that one, and

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Speaker 2: the Campbell game. The last game was really disappointing. Our

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Speaker 2: guys just didn't fight back in the second half. And

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Speaker 2: credit them, they played great, made a ton of shots,

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Speaker 2: played great basketball, pubbled.

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Speaker 1: Us inside, and then kicked it out to open threes.

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Speaker 2: So for me, I'd say we're a game or two

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Speaker 2: behind what my personal expectations are of my team. For

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Speaker 2: people out there, I think think we're ahead or oh

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Speaker 2: my gosh, they're not going to lose every game this

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Speaker 2: year the way it felt like they lost every game.

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Speaker 2: I think everyone can see that we're on a track

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Speaker 2: to being a good basketball team, a good program, and

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Speaker 2: we got to learn to do a couple of little

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Speaker 2: things if we want to win more of these league

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Speaker 2: games and give ourselves a chance when the rise in

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Speaker 2: league tournament starts. As for college basketball, you're seeing a

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Speaker 2: lot of these wild swings and big losses, and I

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Speaker 2: think many of us are in the same boat where

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Speaker 2: we're still trying to figure out our rosters. I mean,

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Speaker 2: I have two players that I want to play more,

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Speaker 2: but I feel like if I'm playing them. Then I'm

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Speaker 2: playing either too many guys or I got to sit

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Speaker 2: somebody who has consistently brought more effort and physicality, which

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Speaker 2: is what we need. So you're still kind of trying

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Speaker 2: to figure out your roster. So you get the personal update,

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Speaker 2: the team update. Our guys are all home for three days.

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Speaker 2: They'll be back night of twenty six, twenty seven. If

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Speaker 2: we get after we don't play until the first of January.

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Speaker 2: Don't get up to the first of January. As for

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Speaker 2: the nil world, and we'll get to some of this

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Speaker 2: with Dan. You know, now we're in college football season

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Speaker 2: or college football portal season, and you're starting to see

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Speaker 2: guys pop in the portal. And if a player has

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Speaker 2: a great year and they pop in the portal, it's

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Speaker 2: really simple. They're looking to.

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Speaker 1: Capitalize on it.

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Speaker 2: If a coach gets fired, you can pretty much expect

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Speaker 2: ninety to ninety five percent of the players to put

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Speaker 2: themselves in the portal. And in basketball, centers and point

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Speaker 2: guards are the most valuable. In college football, quarterbacks obviously

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Speaker 2: have a huge value. And you got to figure out,

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Speaker 2: all right, if we're gonna go get one, we're gonna

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Speaker 2: get two. Were gonna overspend what happens if that guy

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Speaker 2: gets hurt and you have to find the right quarterback

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Speaker 2: for the right scheme that you're going to run.

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Speaker 1: I think that all of it is all of it

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Speaker 1: is super.

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Speaker 2: Super interesting because you sit there and you have all

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Speaker 2: your analytics, all your data, your connections to people you

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Speaker 2: want to go and get.

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Speaker 1: You don't really know who else is in on a player.

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Speaker 2: You don't really know how much they're being offered, and

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Speaker 2: oftentimes you actually call the other coach, Hey, are you

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Speaker 2: guys in on this guy? You know, you guys want

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Speaker 2: to tell us where you are financially, so we don't

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Speaker 2: get you know, we can be at the same place

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Speaker 2: and they can just choose where they want to go.

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Speaker 2: You know, I don't think there is a perfect science.

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Speaker 2: I mean I look out at our roster. I know

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Speaker 2: where our holes are, and I know where I thought

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Speaker 2: I filled them, you know, with a guy that leaves

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Speaker 2: after a couple of days, or a player that you

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Speaker 2: thought you had and then you got out bid, and

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Speaker 2: then you start kicking yourself where I should have spent

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Speaker 2: a little bit more money and got that guy, or

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Speaker 2: I should have done this, or I should have done that,

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Speaker 2: And you learn as you go.

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Speaker 1: There's no exact science.

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Speaker 2: It is just like recruiting in that just because they

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Speaker 2: look really good, you do investing.

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Speaker 1: You find out the type of kid they are.

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Speaker 2: You like the program, but you put them in a

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Speaker 2: college game and sometimes they look really really different. Sometimes

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Speaker 2: the pressure of it, sometimes the money, sometimes other people

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Speaker 2: make more money affects them. So there is no it's

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Speaker 2: it's not a science even yet, which is you know,

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Speaker 2: ninety seven percent perfect.

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Speaker 1: But you have to have a plan going in.

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Speaker 2: You have to know what you want your roster to

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Speaker 2: look like and do the best job within your budget competing,

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Speaker 2: and then you got to decide am I going to

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Speaker 2: go over budget for a player or two? And if

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Speaker 2: you go over budget for a player or two, one

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Speaker 2: you better get them, and then two you better.

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Speaker 1: Make it work.

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Speaker 2: All right, More to come, but let's uh, let's get

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Speaker 2: to our conversation with Dan Parnaman. Okay, so part one,

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Speaker 2: Week one, here's what I wanted to do DP. Okay,

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Speaker 2: you get to go on one topic. I get to

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Speaker 2: go on one topic.

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Speaker 3: Is that fair?

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Speaker 1: That's fair?

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Speaker 2: Because I think I think we get caught up in

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Speaker 2: all the gullibi gobbly gook. There's like just so many

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Speaker 2: things that people want to know from your perspective, but

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Speaker 2: it gets lost, right And I'm not trying to like

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Speaker 2: stretch to stay out, but let's like, let's let's go deep.

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Speaker 4: Okay, let me let me start.

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Speaker 2: Let me start with mine because I know us, Hey so,

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Speaker 2: and I would appreciate.

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Speaker 3: One of the strengths of you is you give the

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Speaker 3: real stuff, the honest truth.

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Speaker 2: How does the recruitment process take place during the year

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Speaker 2: for agents?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, for you work for is anything for high majors

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Speaker 4: who are coaching players or for agents for us?

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Speaker 2: Let's just start with you because it's you know, it's

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Speaker 2: the first person you've been in this thing since since

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Speaker 2: it's it's beginning and you know it's just you and

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Speaker 2: now you've expanded to it. So how does it How

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Speaker 2: does it work where a kid is not represented? And

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Speaker 2: do you seek them out for representation? Do they seek

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Speaker 2: you out? How does it work?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: So I'll give the I'll give the real So the

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Speaker 4: game has changed a lot since I was the first

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Speaker 4: agent to do this in twenty twenty one, Right, the

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Speaker 4: game has changed a lot. That first year of NIL

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Speaker 4: and the transfer portal, there were guys I'd reach out

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Speaker 4: to and say, you know, hey, I'm an MBA agent,

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Speaker 4: then a college agent. You're averaging fourteen a game at

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Speaker 4: Utah Valley and i'd love to, you know, represent you.

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Speaker 4: Doesn't mean that you're going to enter the portal or not,

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Speaker 4: but i'd love to have a conversation with you and

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Speaker 4: you know, help you evaluate your options. And the kids

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Speaker 4: are like agent college, what are you talking about? I

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Speaker 4: met you know, I met McNee state. Why what's going on?

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Speaker 4: And I would have to explain to them how this

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Speaker 4: business works. That first year, ninety nine percent of guys

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Speaker 4: I was the first agent they'd ever talked to. Now,

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Speaker 4: if a player on a mid major average is eight

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Speaker 4: points a game, they have twenty agents in their inbox.

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Speaker 4: So now, like my staff, we don't do like cold outreach.

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Speaker 4: Right at that point, you get lost in the shuffle

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Speaker 4: and there's so many pretenders. There's so many like dude

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Speaker 4: you just got out of college who just like made

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Speaker 4: a website and now they're an agent or you know,

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Speaker 4: no offense to them. But like AAAU coaches who have

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Speaker 4: just like started their own you know, agencies or everything

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Speaker 4: in between that are all throwing darts at these guys.

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Speaker 4: We take them a strategy. Right. For us, it's building relationships.

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Speaker 4: You know, our current clients will introduce us to their friends.

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Speaker 4: AU coaches will ask us for help with guys in

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Speaker 4: their programs. And sometimes it's mid major coaches calling us

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Speaker 4: and saying, hey, we have this guy who's so good

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Speaker 4: he's for sure going to leave like he has every

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Speaker 4: agency recruiting them. Will you help him? Right? But rest assured.

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Speaker 4: I mean you know this, I'm sure any mid major,

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Speaker 4: low major player or D two player who's putting up

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Speaker 4: even like okay numbers and they have social media, their

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Speaker 4: inbox is flooded with twenty five agents that you've never heard, right,

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Speaker 4: just like every dude under the sun. And know what's

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Speaker 4: funny is everybody claims it's crazy how many agencies are

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Speaker 4: the best agency in college basketball? Or did the most

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Speaker 4: nil deals are number one in the sport of the

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Speaker 4: leader in the industry.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 4: So for us as an agency that tries to do

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Speaker 4: it the right way, right, like, if we're talking to

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Speaker 4: a guy, we can't till after the season start talking,

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Speaker 4: right if the guys that mercer averaging fifteen to nine,

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Speaker 4: you can't wait till after the season and start recruiting, right,

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Speaker 4: like that dude's going high major, he's potential pro and

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Speaker 4: you have to start that process. The right way to

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Speaker 4: do is to have conversations with their coaching staff and say, hey,

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Speaker 4: this player's for sure gone, right, do you want us

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Speaker 4: to talk to him now? Do you want us to

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Speaker 4: talk to him later? How do you want this process

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Speaker 4: to go? And we have great relationships across the college

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Speaker 4: basketball spectrum, so oftentimes they they'd rather us sign them

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Speaker 4: than some random agent. Right. But then there's sometimes that

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Speaker 4: coaches try to shield their guys from agents, and all

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Speaker 4: it does is play into the hands of bad agents. Right.

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Speaker 4: There was one kid last year that one of our

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Speaker 4: agents called who was trying to recruit, and he called.

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Speaker 4: It was at a CAA school and the kid wanted

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Speaker 4: to go with us, and he calls the head coach says, hey,

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Speaker 4: you know your player is going to be like all conference,

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Speaker 4: he's going to leave. You know, we want a recruiter.

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Speaker 4: He wants to go with us. A coach cursed him out, said,

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Speaker 4: I my guy doesn't need an agent. And the kid

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Speaker 4: ends up staying for like a quarter of the money.

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Speaker 4: It is having a worst year this year, right, Ruin

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Speaker 4: his chance for earning and ruin his future stock. And

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Speaker 4: sometimes these coaches are harming their players by trying to

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Speaker 4: shield them from agents because if they play into bad

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Speaker 4: decision making, or it plays into the agents who are

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Speaker 4: willing to subvert them and recruit the kid anyway. Right,

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Speaker 4: So like for mid major coaches, I encourage them, like,

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Speaker 4: let's be realists. If we have an all conference player,

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Speaker 4: they're gone unless you have like an outsized budget, right,

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Speaker 4: have conversations with their guys, ask them they need to

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Speaker 4: help with help them pick the right agent, rather than

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Speaker 4: acting like it's not happening. Right, But every single player

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Speaker 4: in high majors, you assume those dudes already have agents. Right,

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Speaker 4: You're not going to like start recruiting a starter at

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Speaker 4: Saint John's and he's going to be like agent, never

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Speaker 4: heard of it. Like, these dudes all have agents at

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Speaker 4: the high major level, right, But it's the high school, juco,

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Speaker 4: mid major, low major level where guys blow up and

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Speaker 4: they start getting recruited by agents and every single like

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Speaker 4: people are go to their jobs and their sharks, and

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Speaker 4: like all these TuS are getting blown up. For us,

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Speaker 4: we like to talk to coaches, have relationships with the

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Speaker 4: staffs do things the right way, not be shady about it.

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Speaker 4: But that is not the way most people go about it.

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Speaker 3: So how do you know?

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Speaker 2: How do you know which how many guys work underneath you?

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Speaker 4: Now, my team, we have seventeen full time employees.

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Speaker 2: Seventeen, So how do you make sure you don't double up?

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Speaker 1: Oh?

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Speaker 4: We have communication, communication, communication, collaboration. It's the same thing

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Speaker 4: as a college staff, right, Like you don't want two

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Speaker 4: of your assistants offering the same kid and not knowing

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Speaker 4: they're recruiting the same kid. Like, teams function best when

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Speaker 4: everyone communicates and collaborates. Right. We have people on my

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Speaker 4: staff who specialize in international, people who specialize in high schools,

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Speaker 4: people specialize in jucoe, people who specialize in West coast,

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Speaker 4: East coast, And we all meet and we all talk,

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Speaker 4: we all communicate, We have group chats, we have team meetings. Like,

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Speaker 4: as a leader, I'm not flying around the country good people, Right,

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Speaker 4: That's not my job anymore. My job is to be

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Speaker 4: in the office and understand everything that's happening with our

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Speaker 4: entire staff and all of our clients. Right, it does

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Speaker 4: not fare to our current clients. And if I'm flying

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Speaker 4: to South Carolina to tell some seventeen year old old

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Speaker 4: one to sign. I'm not doing that. That's not what

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Speaker 4: we do anymore. Right. I had to do that when

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Speaker 4: I was getting started, But now my job is to

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Speaker 4: know everything's going on with my staff and our clients,

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Speaker 4: to watch games, to be aware of what's happening with

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Speaker 4: the guys we currently have. Like my priority is our

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Speaker 4: current guys, not acquiring new talent, right, but also have

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Speaker 4: to checking with all our agents and all our staff

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Speaker 4: every day and make sure I know everything that's going

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Speaker 4: on and make sure that they're communicating with each other.

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Speaker 4: And I think we do a really good job of it.

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Speaker 4: I've been at organizations before where the death of them

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Speaker 4: was lack of communication on staffs and staff's trying to

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Speaker 4: assistant coaches trying to compete with each other. We're trying

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Speaker 4: to one up each other, undermine each other. So I've

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Speaker 4: made it my priority at this company that will never

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Speaker 4: be the company that we doesn't have communication, collaboration and synergy.

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Speaker 4: And I think it serves our clients better because they

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Speaker 4: don't just have one agent. They have seventeen people on

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Speaker 4: their team and they all want them to succeed.

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Speaker 2: The score Act, the Scorrect What are your biggest issues

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Speaker 2: with the Score Act?

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Speaker 4: My biggest issue with the Score Act is that the

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Speaker 4: NCAA paid nine million dollars to push it through, because

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Speaker 4: nine million dollars on lobbying dollars to try to get

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Speaker 4: it through, but showed their desperation and how much they

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Speaker 4: wanted it to happen for their own benefit. My problems

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Speaker 4: with the Score Act are it is it is presented

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Speaker 4: under the guise of saving college sports or helping athletes

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Speaker 4: and helping kids, when it is completely one sided in

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Speaker 4: just helping the NCAA athletic directors and school presidents. How

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Speaker 4: sell Okay, so let me break it down. Within the

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Speaker 4: Score Act, which fell apart, is not going to happen anyway.

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Speaker 1: Okay.

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Speaker 4: Within the Score Act, they are making a variety of

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Speaker 4: is that they're trying to athlete, it's the best interest

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Speaker 4: of the athlete, but in reality it's exploitative and it's

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Speaker 4: bad for the athletes. Right. They're trying to cap what

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Speaker 4: schools can spend on revenue sharing. Not only what schools

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Speaker 4: can spend, but they're trying to prevent boosters who want

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Speaker 4: to give money to players who want to help build

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Speaker 4: their programs. They're trying to stop them, making that illegal,

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Speaker 4: making that against the rules right for those boosters to

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Speaker 4: spend money. So again, if I sell my company for

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Speaker 4: a billion dollars and the one thing I love more

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Speaker 4: than anything is Michigan basketball, and I can buy all

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Speaker 4: the Roles Royces and all the vacation homes I want,

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Speaker 4: but the thing that makes me happy is Michigan basketball

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Speaker 4: winning games. And I want to spend ten million dollars

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Speaker 4: a year on Michigan basketball to help them build a

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Speaker 4: great team to bring me and my family joy. They're

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Speaker 4: trying to make that illegal, even with the state laws

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Speaker 4: say you can do it, Federal law say you can

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Speaker 4: do it, but they're trying to make it against the rules.

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Speaker 4: Who does that benefit doesn't benefit the athlete, doesn't matter

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Speaker 4: if its benefit the fans, doesn't matterfit the coaching staff.

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Speaker 4: But benefits is the administrators who want that ten million

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Speaker 4: dollars donation to go facilities instead of in players poets. Right.

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Speaker 4: It benefits school presidents who want to put that towards

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Speaker 4: staffing and their endowment instead of athletes pockets. And it

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Speaker 4: benefits of the NCAAA and the conference commissioners because Ultimately,

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Speaker 4: these athletic programs are going to be private businesses. We

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Speaker 4: just saw it with you Taget and half a billion

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Speaker 4: dollar investment. We saw with Kentucky moving their athletic department

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Speaker 4: into an LLC. These athletic programs are going to be

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Speaker 4: taking private equity money, private investments, and ultimately, franchises are

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Speaker 4: worth more when you pay the labor less. So they're saying, oh,

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Speaker 4: we have to save the sport, pay the players less

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Speaker 4: because this spending is untenable. Meanwhile, that's on one hand,

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Speaker 4: the other hand, they're taking half billion dollar private equity

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Speaker 4: investments at a certain valuation, and that valuation is much

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Speaker 4: better if you don't have to pay the labor what

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Speaker 4: they're worth. So my primary issue with the Score Act

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Speaker 4: is it's sneaky, it's slimy, and it's gross. They're using

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Speaker 4: this whole like, oh, save college sports, like you know,

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Speaker 4: please eating a heart thing. In reality, they're trying to

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Speaker 4: pay labor less so that their franchises are worth more

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Speaker 4: when they take private equity money, and ultimately these are

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Speaker 4: all going to be private, properly health franchises. Additionally, there

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Speaker 4: are so many other tiny little things like they're trying

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Speaker 4: to get an antitrust exemption. So essentially players can never

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Speaker 4: sue to become employees. Right, MBA, you have a union

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Speaker 4: their employees. NFL, you have a union their employees, and

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Speaker 4: you have a union, they're employees. Well they're not only

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Speaker 4: trying to make it so the athletes can't be employees,

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Speaker 4: they're making it illegal. They want to make it a

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Speaker 4: legal for the athletes to ever shoe to become employees. Well,

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Speaker 4: you can't collectly collectively bargain if you don't have a union.

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Speaker 4: If you can have a union if you don't have employees.

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Speaker 4: So they're just trying to do everything they can. They're

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Speaker 4: paying congress members to everything they can to keep athletes

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Speaker 4: in their place for as long as possible. And it's

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Speaker 4: our job to inform people about this and blow it up.

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Speaker 4: And thank god for the Congressional Black Caucus who recognize

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Speaker 4: what was happening and blew this thing up so the

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Speaker 4: score app will never never make it to the Senate floor.

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Speaker 2: What would your proposal be if I put DP in charge?

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Speaker 3: What would you do? Because I know I know you're

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Speaker 3: thinking free market.

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Speaker 4: I think ultimately football and basketball have to be set

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Speaker 4: with in other sports. No, they can't all be treated

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Speaker 4: the same way. Football and basketball players are getting paid

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Speaker 4: hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not millions from these

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Speaker 4: schools and revenue staring dollars. In what world are they

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Speaker 4: not employees? Like you can you can fudget however you

401
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Speaker 4: want and call them this, call them that these are employees.

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Speaker 4: We have guys making seven figures from Power five schools

403
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Speaker 4: getting paid from the schools, and what world are they

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Speaker 4: not employees? They should be the issue.

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Speaker 2: The issue with them being employees is the threats and

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Speaker 2: the tax exempt status.

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Speaker 3: It's a portion of it.

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Speaker 2: Also state schools, when you employee somebody, there's litany of

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Speaker 2: background checks and you know, like at my school, we

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Speaker 2: unless you do an emergency hire, you have to have

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Speaker 2: a committee for every person who's hired.

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Speaker 3: It's so backlock.

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Speaker 2: Can you imagine if you're doing that for entire basketball

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Speaker 2: and on football team.

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Speaker 4: But I'm not saying it's going to be easy, and

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Speaker 4: it might take years to like smooth out the system.

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Speaker 4: But the alternative is what we currently have, which is

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Speaker 4: either an exploit otative a processive system, or complete free

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Speaker 4: market which is chaotic.

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Speaker 1: You still think this is an exploitative system.

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Speaker 4: I think if you if you impose an artificial revenue

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Speaker 4: share cap and say, uh, this is all you can

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Speaker 4: spend on players, and you can spend whatever you want

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Speaker 4: on coaches, whatever you want on facilities, whatever you want

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Speaker 4: on marketing, but you can only play with players this much.

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Speaker 4: And that's the only team that's capped. Yes, it's exploitative.

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Speaker 2: If you're saying I will tell I will tell you

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Speaker 2: that for professional sports franchises, and granted it's collectively bargained,

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Speaker 2: but when they talk about football and basketball revenue, that's

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Speaker 2: not the actual true revenues, right. That's that's one of

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Speaker 2: the the arguments that athletes make and there and their

432
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Speaker 2: unions make all the time, is like, hey, you know,

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Speaker 2: all these professional sports teams claim their losing money. They're like,

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Speaker 2: they're not losing money, not losing money at all, not

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Speaker 2: just gaining them on the franchise. But what they do

436
00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:11,679
Speaker 2: is they clarified as basketball revenue. At basketball revenue, I

437
00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:13,679
Speaker 2: would say that there's more schools than you think of

438
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:18,479
Speaker 2: that aren't making money. Then you imagine I don't think

439
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,000
Speaker 2: attendance is down. Again, there's clearly money there at the

440
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:26,239
Speaker 2: highest level. I think the fear is that you end

441
00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,120
Speaker 2: up with seventy five or so schools and everybody else

442
00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:32,000
Speaker 2: has to drop to D two because they can't compete.

443
00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:34,800
Speaker 1: And you know, then you have to do things like.

444
00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:37,920
Speaker 2: Our level where you're playing three to seven guarantee games.

445
00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:42,960
Speaker 4: Here, So two things on that note. You're right that

446
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:46,800
Speaker 4: there are salary caps and other professional sports, and yes

447
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:55,240
Speaker 4: they're collectively barking. But here's the here's the incongruency here. NBA,

448
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,600
Speaker 4: the average coach makes seven million dollars and the roster's

449
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,359
Speaker 4: one hundred and fifty billion or so, And the average

450
00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:03,560
Speaker 4: coach makes seven million, the rosters three hundred million. Power

451
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,120
Speaker 4: for the head coach makes seven million in the roster,

452
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 4: they want to make it four million for basketball or

453
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:14,200
Speaker 4: ten million for football. So in pro sports league.

454
00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:15,359
Speaker 3: They don't all make seven million.

455
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 4: Now, Dan, hey, even if it's three million to ten million, Okay,

456
00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:20,600
Speaker 4: that's a three to one even in the best case

457
00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,240
Speaker 4: here three to one NBA, NFL, it's a one to

458
00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:26,680
Speaker 4: twenty or one to thirty ratio between coach and roster.

459
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:30,960
Speaker 4: And like at Ohio State or Alabama, the coaching pool

460
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,760
Speaker 4: is making more than the player pool. No, yes, I've

461
00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 4: done the math. I've added up the math at Alabama,

462
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:40,240
Speaker 4: you add the football coaching staff and the basketball coaching

463
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,160
Speaker 4: staff salary, it is collectively more than twenty point five

464
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,119
Speaker 4: million dollars that they are allowed to spend across football

465
00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 4: and basketball. So you have ninety athletes making collectively less

466
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:50,480
Speaker 4: than twenty coaches.

467
00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:53,880
Speaker 3: But Obama's spending in the thirty million dollar range for football.

468
00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:56,760
Speaker 4: Right they were, which I think is fair. But in

469
00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,000
Speaker 4: a new world where they're trying to cap it's revshare

470
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,240
Speaker 4: cap whe's twenty point five million, they're trying to say a.

471
00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:03,280
Speaker 2: Huge you can still they still have nil on top

472
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:05,160
Speaker 2: of that all those those level schools have.

473
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:07,040
Speaker 4: But nil on top of that has to go through

474
00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:08,679
Speaker 4: the College Sports Commission And.

475
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,040
Speaker 3: How many how many of those things money along? How

476
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,120
Speaker 3: many of these things have gotten dinged A lot.

477
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:15,199
Speaker 4: We've had a number of them that have gotten that

478
00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:17,920
Speaker 4: have gotten blocked, like even at small five thousand dollars

479
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 4: levels that have gotten blocked. So and then that essentially

480
00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,679
Speaker 4: encourages money laundering. Instead of saying, hey, this uh, this

481
00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 4: booster is going to pay you for this appearance and

482
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:29,239
Speaker 4: that's the fair rate, they're saying, no, you have to

483
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 4: work it through other companies or public companies and find

484
00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:34,520
Speaker 4: ways to like it's like the money is getting from

485
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:35,919
Speaker 4: point A to point B and they're just making you

486
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,080
Speaker 4: go through all these hoops that are fake, and you

487
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:43,159
Speaker 4: know whatever, it's ridiculous and that system will never last.

488
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:45,880
Speaker 4: But my point is that you can spend twenty they're

489
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:47,440
Speaker 4: trying to say you can spend twenty point five million

490
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:49,520
Speaker 4: for the entire football basketball roster. But if you want

491
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:51,760
Speaker 4: to spend fifty million for the coaches, you can do that.

492
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 4: That's where it's not fair.

493
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,120
Speaker 1: Okay, So well you can do that.

494
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:57,720
Speaker 2: You can do that in in the NFL and the

495
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:00,320
Speaker 2: NBA as well. There is no cap on which is

496
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 2: salaries there either, Right.

497
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 4: But the cap on the player salaries is reasonable. It's

498
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 4: one hundred and thirty to three hundred million.

499
00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:09,919
Speaker 2: It's based upon a percent it's based upon a percentage

500
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:12,240
Speaker 2: of the revenue of the league.

501
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:16,240
Speaker 4: Right. And if what we saw this past summer in

502
00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:20,120
Speaker 4: the basketball portal was a free market starting to materialize,

503
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:23,120
Speaker 4: that would have shown us where a real reasonable cap

504
00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 4: would have been. We saw Power five schools spending between

505
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,600
Speaker 4: five million and fifteen million on the portal, right, and

506
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:31,399
Speaker 4: some of those schools might be looking and saying, you

507
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:33,280
Speaker 4: know what, we should start paying our coach one to

508
00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:34,720
Speaker 4: two million so we could have a little more in

509
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 4: the player pool. That's what's happening.

510
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 3: I agree, right, I agree.

511
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 4: But now when they say your cap here, okay, well

512
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,880
Speaker 4: we have to spend more somehow, so let's spend more

513
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 4: on the coaching. So it's it's feeding money to coaches

514
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,760
Speaker 4: and athletic directors and school presidents and facilities by limiting

515
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:50,000
Speaker 4: how much you have to spend on the labor on

516
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:52,200
Speaker 4: the players. If you let the market do its thing

517
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 4: and cap it at a place that's like a reasonable

518
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:58,160
Speaker 4: cap and not this like artificially low thing, then it's

519
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 4: going to be fine and where it will said.

520
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 2: I'm going to tell you though, if the if the

521
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 2: basketball cap is four or five million dollars or a

522
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:07,400
Speaker 2: little bit more in the Big East Strikers, they don't

523
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:12,160
Speaker 2: have football like that. That's realistically, you're not making five

524
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:13,960
Speaker 2: million dollars in your college basketball.

525
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,880
Speaker 4: Let me explain why that's like called a red herring,

526
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 4: like that's not a fair argument. Here's why. In pro

527
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 4: sports they're self contained businesses. The business is the is

528
00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:29,320
Speaker 4: the franchise, right, So the Chicago Bulls have P and

529
00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 4: L and that's the whole business. Right for Wisconsin Green Bay.

530
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,800
Speaker 4: The Atlantic Department is an extension, is a marketing vehicle

531
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:40,560
Speaker 4: for the university itself, which is a much more profitable enterprise. Right.

532
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:42,640
Speaker 4: And you're a public university, so that's one thing. There's

533
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,240
Speaker 4: also private universities which are another which are more profitable.

534
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:50,360
Speaker 4: But ultimately, when Florida Atlantic made it to the final four,

535
00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 4: it wasn't about the ticket sales. It was about the

536
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 4: ten percent increase in applications they got in the next

537
00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:58,479
Speaker 4: year because all of a sudden they're a much more

538
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:01,119
Speaker 4: popular school. Why why does everyone know what Duke is

539
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 4: because they're basketball team? Right? Why do people go to Alabama?

540
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:07,159
Speaker 4: They want SEC football? So the actual business is the

541
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 4: school and the Atlantic Department is in marketing vehicle. So

542
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 4: my point is you could spend a million dollars on

543
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,879
Speaker 4: a TV ad for University of Alabama. But if you

544
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 4: want to spend that on marketing via athletes who are

545
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:23,919
Speaker 4: walking living billboards or their social media accounts promoting the university,

546
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 4: that's where it's illegal. That's where you draw the line.

547
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 4: You're spending twenty million on these football players and basketball players.

548
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:34,720
Speaker 4: You are getting exponentially more. You know, twenty million is

549
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 4: like you know, forty primetime TV commercials. You're getting hours

550
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 4: and hours of primetime million multimillion viewers every single week

551
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,639
Speaker 4: on their football and basketball games. They're not being paid adequately.

552
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,720
Speaker 4: So basketball and football revenue is not the only metric.

553
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,600
Speaker 4: It's how much revenue are you are you value you're

554
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,399
Speaker 4: bringing to the school via marketing. That's and that's what

555
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:57,119
Speaker 4: you can't truly measure. But that's why you have to

556
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:58,959
Speaker 4: let the market be free and let the schools decide

557
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,360
Speaker 4: what it's worth to them.

558
00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:06,360
Speaker 3: Where are you on two year deals? I love them?

559
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 4: And another point I made I made this on Twitter

560
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,920
Speaker 4: the other day. This hard cap they're trying to impose

561
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 4: YEP is going to make it really hard to do

562
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,200
Speaker 4: multi year deals because people are going to want to

563
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 4: clear cap space for the next year. In the NBA,

564
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:24,959
Speaker 4: you have bird rights and earlier bird rights, which essentially

565
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 4: means you can go over the cap to retain your

566
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,360
Speaker 4: current roster. We're going to see a world where everyone

567
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,439
Speaker 4: everyone's capped at three four million and power five and

568
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 4: you sign a multi year deal and then you have

569
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:36,360
Speaker 4: another guy that you want to sign, but you're like, oh,

570
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,640
Speaker 4: we're already capped out. So now you have a really

571
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,719
Speaker 4: talented freshion that you have to tell the walk that

572
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 4: wants to stay there. Because in the current world, without

573
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:45,959
Speaker 4: a repsure cap, you can just go to a booster

574
00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 4: and say, hey, I need an extra half a million

575
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 4: to retain this really good player. He wants to stay here, Great,

576
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 4: we keep them. Now we're forcing a world where teams

577
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,200
Speaker 4: to be clearing their roster to clear cap space for

578
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,240
Speaker 4: a big free agency Yere and other schools that can't

579
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 4: retain their current talent talent because they're apped out legally.

580
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,239
Speaker 4: So like, multi year deals are great, but we're going

581
00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:05,440
Speaker 4: to start seeing less of them and people are afraid

582
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,040
Speaker 4: of not having cap space in the future.

583
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 2: What about the buyout to do when you negotiate a

584
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 2: multi year deal for one of your players, does that

585
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 2: have a buyout?

586
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,560
Speaker 4: This year we had way more buyots than we've ever had.

587
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 4: This year. I had a number of schools that agree

588
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 4: to do the buyout, and buyouts work if all parties

589
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:23,440
Speaker 4: are on board, Like I said this on your show before,

590
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 4: Like if you agree to a number with a kid

591
00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 4: or a multi year deal, or even a one year

592
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 4: deal whatever, and they get the papers after you've already agreed,

593
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:33,320
Speaker 4: and they and they read defined print and there's a

594
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:36,399
Speaker 4: buyout that's fucked up. But if you know, I have

595
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 4: a kid right now is on a two year, one

596
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:41,479
Speaker 4: point six million dollar deal, okay, and we agreed on

597
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 4: certain buyout terms for both sides. Hey, if you guys

598
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 4: want to terminate it and not on the next year,

599
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 4: this week, you have to pay him. Hey, if he

600
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 4: wants to leave for free agency next year and turn

601
00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 4: down the second year one hundred thousand dollars option, this

602
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 4: is what he pays you. Right, we all agree to

603
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:56,840
Speaker 4: all parties new the terms, we agreed to it. Everyone's

604
00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 4: happy with it. And you know, he's performing really well

605
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:01,320
Speaker 4: and he's probably working more them that next year. He's

606
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 4: gonna have to pay it to give himself out, and

607
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 4: we're cool with that. We wanted the security of having

608
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 4: that second year, and now they gave us that security,

609
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:11,719
Speaker 4: and now they're going to reap reward of it by

610
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 4: doing a fair deal. And I think again, I said

611
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 4: it before, we were in a world and we're still

612
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 4: someone in the world with where the coaches and gms

613
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 4: are coaches. They're not people who have run professional teams before.

614
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 4: But now as we see more and more professionals coming

615
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 4: from pro sports coming into these college programs, we're going

616
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,200
Speaker 4: to start seeing more creative deal structures because there have

617
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 4: been times in the past I'm trying to explain how

618
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:35,960
Speaker 4: these creative deal structures work and they just like I

619
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,959
Speaker 4: get dead eyes right, people don't even know how a

620
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 4: complihenment what I'm talking about. But the ones you can

621
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 4: get into the weeds and understand how complex deal structures

622
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 4: can actually benefit athletes and their program. They're winning and

623
00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 4: they're doing really well, and they're creating much more sustainable

624
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:54,800
Speaker 4: businesses for the university. But again, a lot of what

625
00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 4: the NCAA is trying to do with the CSC and

626
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 4: the Score Act puts a lot of that ability for

627
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:03,080
Speaker 4: a organic ecosystem to blossom. It puts a lot of

628
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 4: that at risk.

629
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 3: Awesome. So that's this is the first one.

630
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 2: Okay, so score Act and I did kind of double

631
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 2: up on it because I want to know where you

632
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:14,280
Speaker 2: were on biots, But it was kind of to tee

633
00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:16,800
Speaker 2: you up on biots because I know you had talked

634
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:20,600
Speaker 2: about those multi year deals. So every Thursday. Okay, we're

635
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 2: going to record one of these and pop it.

636
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 3: Up in the pod.

637
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 2: And if you have any questions for Dan or for

638
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 2: myself as to what it's really like inside the world

639
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 2: of college athletics, especially college basketball, there's no better resource

640
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 2: than Dan Parliament.

641
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:34,720
Speaker 3: The just there just isn't.

642
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 2: And I can help you a little bit because obviously

643
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 2: I'm in it. We're at a lower level than the

644
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 2: high majors, but there's still the same level movement, the

645
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:45,920
Speaker 2: same kind of discussions. It's just a different decimal point

646
00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:48,240
Speaker 2: in a different or lack of a comma that that

647
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 2: may occur at the at the other level the level.

648
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 2: Happy hanukkah, this is this is awesome and uh we'll

649
00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:56,920
Speaker 2: talk again soon.

650
00:30:57,560 --> 00:30:57,920
Speaker 4: Thank you.

651
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 1: That's it for this edition of All Ball.

652
00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 2: If you're listening to this, you're driving around, it's Christmas Eve,

653
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:09,200
Speaker 2: maybe Christmas Day, you're getting ready for the new year.

654
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 2: And I want to relay this message to so many

655
00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 2: of you who have messaged me on ig, messaged me

656
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 2: on Twitter, message me on TikTok wherever you get this,

657
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,520
Speaker 2: or message me when we're doing the radio show. I've

658
00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,960
Speaker 2: done national radio for twenty three years it's awesome. It's

659
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:30,400
Speaker 2: a dream. I grew up dreaming of doing three things,

660
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 2: you know, playing basketball on TV, playing professionally playing in college,

661
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:39,320
Speaker 2: coaching basketball in college, and broadcasting.

662
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:42,360
Speaker 1: And now I'm doing all three.

663
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 2: So being in your speakers, I mean, I'll give you

664
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 2: an example of one of my closest friends in.

665
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 1: Like most famous friends is Darius Rucker.

666
00:31:55,920 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 2: And I met Darius Rucker at his concert and I

667
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 2: set it up with the promoter.

668
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 1: It was at the mohegan Son. We went back to.

669
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,520
Speaker 2: His dressing room and he's like, dog, he knew my kids' names,

670
00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:10,240
Speaker 2: he knew everything about me, And I'm like, how does

671
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:14,680
Speaker 2: this guy, this guy research me? Oh, Darius, his kids

672
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 2: were school age. My show's on the afternoon. He listened

673
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,239
Speaker 2: to me picking up his kids at school every day

674
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,120
Speaker 2: when I was on ESPN Radio. We were friends, we

675
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 2: just hadn't met yet. So and you know, now twenty

676
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 2: years later, I'm really close friends with Darius. I've gone

677
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,800
Speaker 2: everywhere with him and played at his golf tournament, hung

678
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:36,480
Speaker 2: out with him.

679
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: It's a wonderful human being.

680
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 2: But that friendship was really built in a relationship built

681
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 2: with radio, and I think it's been built with many

682
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:44,200
Speaker 2: of you.

683
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 1: So I'm not going anywhere.

684
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 2: I'm just trying to be more intelligent about things, make smarter,

685
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 2: sounder decisions, be more precise and concise with my time.

686
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 2: I hope you and your family have a very, very

687
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 2: merry Christmas and a happy New Year. Hope you tell

688
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 2: your friends to download this podcast so that we can

689
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 2: keep bumping them out and keeping giving a good sports

690
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 2: chatter in the meantime.

691
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 1: Merry Christmas. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is all Ball