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Speaker 1: Hmm, what abusing my Africa's I don't know how to

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Speaker 1: open this episode. Uh, oh boy, I'm Robert Evans. Uh.

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Speaker 1: This is a behind the Bastards podcast where we talk

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Speaker 1: about horrible people, and today we're talking about horrible people

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Speaker 1: who abused Africa. My guest today is Sofia. How are

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Speaker 1: you doing, Sofia? I'm doing great. Thank you so much

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Speaker 1: for having me, Thank you for being on the show.

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Speaker 1: Now we talked last for all that an episode about

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Speaker 1: a little lady named Georgia tan Um. Oh boy. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Some people might say the most sad and fucked up

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Speaker 1: episode of your podcast, or at least that's what a

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Speaker 1: lot of the tweets I got said. Yeah, I would

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Speaker 1: say that is the saddest and most fucked up episode

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Speaker 1: of my podcast. Um. It was fun when people were

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Speaker 1: tweeting and like being like, ha ha, that's a good

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Speaker 1: joke for some things. So sad. And then I got

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Speaker 1: really real when people were tweeting and being like I

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Speaker 1: think my family history involves this. Yeah. I was like,

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Speaker 1: I am not prepared to handle this. I am a

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Speaker 1: stand up comedian. And then we got people making fan

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Speaker 1: art about Ric Flair being stolen as a baby, which

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Speaker 1: I both appreciate and feel weird about because I'm sure

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Speaker 1: that's like the most traumatic chapter from Rick fair Flair's life,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know how to respectfully address what a

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Speaker 1: what a nightmare that is? Yes, and also I did

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Speaker 1: ask for the fan art, so it would be bad

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Speaker 1: of me to condemn the people who have then just

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Speaker 1: executed beautifully on the fucked up thing I came up with.

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Speaker 1: So I feel like, uh, let's keep that in the

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Speaker 1: gray area. No one was more wrong than Georgia Tan. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: no one was well except for maybe our subject for

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Speaker 1: today's episode. Because this this is might be a darker story.

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Speaker 1: It's not a darker story because the scale of Georgia

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Speaker 1: Tan is so awful. But this is, again a story

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Speaker 1: about an affluent young woman who injected herself into the

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Speaker 1: lives of poorer people, thinking she knew better than them

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Speaker 1: what they needed, and a whole lot of babies died. Um,

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Speaker 1: are you are you purposely only inviting me on episodes

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Speaker 1: that involve child murder right now? No? No, that's too long. Honestly,

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Speaker 1: that beat lets me know that the answer is yes.

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Speaker 1: I feel like you're trying to challenge me, challenge accepted Robert,

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Speaker 1: maybe Sophia. It's just that that I see something in

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Speaker 1: you that I I see in me, which is an

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Speaker 1: ability to to to stare into the darker aspects of

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Speaker 1: the human condition and look at that and analyze it

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Speaker 1: and say, I want a picture of Ric Flair acknowledging

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Speaker 1: that he was stolen as a baby. Uh. Um, thank you.

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Speaker 1: That is the nicest thing anyone's ever said to me. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, just being Russian, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that I was. I didn't want to say it's because

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Speaker 1: you're Russian and can handle it, but essentially that's what

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Speaker 1: we're saying. Yes, yes, every episode you're on is like

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Speaker 1: the a Serbian film of Behind the Bastards. He just

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Speaker 1: likes drill into, uh the darkness of reality. Uh I

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Speaker 1: love that about us. Yeah. Well I opened this episode

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Speaker 1: by saying, what's abusing my Africa's which was a terrible introduction,

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Speaker 1: maybe my worst. Um, but we are talking about someone

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Speaker 1: who abused a whole lot of Africans today. Uh, we're

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Speaker 1: talking about Renee Bach. Have you ever heard of Renee Back? No,

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Speaker 1: nobody has. She is not yet, miss I have a

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Speaker 1: feeling she's going to be soon, but we're kind of

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Speaker 1: on the cutting edge of this one. Um. I love

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Speaker 1: being avant garde about murder. She hasn't really gone viral yet,

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Speaker 1: So we're gonna we're gonna talk about that. But first

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about Cony. Do you remember that

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Speaker 1: pr campaign whatever you want to call it, that awareness campaign?

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Speaker 1: I guess of course. Yeah, that was like the one

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Speaker 1: week or so when everyone in America cared about Uganda

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Speaker 1: because of a poorly fact check documentary. People donated a

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Speaker 1: bunch of money and they pasted stickers that said Cony

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Speaker 1: twelve that you can still find on Toyota Corollas to

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Speaker 1: this day. It was it was, it was a whole thing. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And then the creator of the documentary was caught masturbating

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Speaker 1: in public and there was a South Park episode making

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Speaker 1: fun of that, and then we all kind of moved

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Speaker 1: on from con Um. But it was like in the

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Speaker 1: middle of San Diego, wasn't it. He had like a

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Speaker 1: psychotic break. Oh I do remember remember the story? Okay?

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Speaker 1: Was that was a whole thing. Um, so many things

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Speaker 1: have happened since then. Yeah, that was literally like eighty

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Speaker 1: thousand atrocities ago. Yeah, yeah, it feels like it was

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Speaker 1: three years ago. It feels older than World War One.

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Speaker 1: It was really just like seven years back. Yeah, yeah. Now,

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Speaker 1: there was a brief period of time where the documentary's creator, uh,

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Speaker 1: the Invisible Children like company behind it were lauded as

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Speaker 1: like the shiny future of activism and like this is

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Speaker 1: how we were going to change the world in the future.

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Speaker 1: And um it was a heady time when con was

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Speaker 1: was still going viral. And during the heart of this

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Speaker 1: fevered period, African writer Teju Cole posted this in a

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Speaker 1: series of tweets from sex to christoph to Invisible Children

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Speaker 1: to ted. The fastest growth industry in the US is

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Speaker 1: the white savior industrial complex. The white savior supports brutal

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Speaker 1: policies in the morning, found charities in the afternoon, and

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Speaker 1: receives awards in the evening. This world exists simply to

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Speaker 1: satisfy the needs, including importantly, the sentimental needs of white

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Speaker 1: people in OPRAH. The white savior industrial complex is not

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Speaker 1: about justice. It is about having a big emotional experience

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Speaker 1: that validates privilege. Feverish worry over that awful African warlord,

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Speaker 1: but close to the one point five million Iraqis died

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Speaker 1: from an American war of choice. Worry about that. I

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Speaker 1: deeply respect American sentimentality the way one respects a wounded hippo.

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Speaker 1: You must keep an eye on it for you know,

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Speaker 1: it is deadly damn. Yeah, that's quite a line. I

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Speaker 1: really yeah, that's a real good line. I mean I

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Speaker 1: feel called out, you know. Yeah, yeah, I think we're

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Speaker 1: all supposed to. Yeah, thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Now, as

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Speaker 1: you might expect, Teju Cole took some ship for writing that. Um.

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Speaker 1: There are a couple of think pieces that went after

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Speaker 1: him for it, and and I'm not going to quote any

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Speaker 1: of those here, but he was basically attacked for being

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Speaker 1: a spoil sport and for the eternal crime of, you know,

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Speaker 1: bringing race into it. Um. People wondered, like, why should

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Speaker 1: it matter that the people who made this document entery

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Speaker 1: we're white. Joseph Coney is an objectively bad dude, and

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Speaker 1: the truth needed to get out, so like, what's the harm?

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Speaker 1: And of course the harm was that conwelve was was

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Speaker 1: hot garbage. Joseph Coney's Lord's Resistance Army was not active

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Speaker 1: in Uganda when the documentary went viral. It had no

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Speaker 1: positive impact on the ground, and it had several negative

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Speaker 1: impacts as best elucidated by Uganda human rights lawyer with

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Speaker 1: Segue boa Um with se Gear in a two thousand

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Speaker 1: fifteen interview, he said, to be honest, it seems what

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Speaker 1: skeptics predicted has come true that there would indeed be

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Speaker 1: more of a lasting impact on how people, especially in

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Speaker 1: the West, perceived Uganda than on the attainment of justice

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Speaker 1: for victims of the l r A conflict. For the

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Speaker 1: first time in a long time, some other monster was

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Speaker 1: connected to the country than a d I mean, and

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Speaker 1: the questions about a Coney experience pop up in spaces

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Speaker 1: where they at least expected. Imagine you are Uganda at

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Speaker 1: a youth conference somewhere in the West, and the conversation

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Speaker 1: icebreaker is whether you are a former child soldier. Invisible

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Speaker 1: Children may be closing, but I think many of Ugandans

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Speaker 1: will continue to be asked about Coney and whether they

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Speaker 1: are one of his victims. The simplifying of the narrative

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Speaker 1: has just added a new layer of areeo types for

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Speaker 1: Uganda's This will take a while to wear off. You

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Speaker 1: may have seen a campaign on the Guardian website led

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Speaker 1: by the Ugandan government comparing Uganda and Spain as tourist

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Speaker 1: destinations such are necessary because no one wants to visit

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Speaker 1: a place where they may be entangled in a war.

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Speaker 1: They are not interested in. The image of Uganda and

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Speaker 1: Africa as a permanent war zone was no doubt strengthened

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Speaker 1: by the Cony twenty twelve campaign. So Tejukole was was right.

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Speaker 1: Con hurt people living in Uganda by making the country

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Speaker 1: look like a war ravaged heellhole, hurting tourism, the damaging

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Speaker 1: their economy and the livelihood of many. But as far

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Speaker 1: as consequences of white saviorism go, Tonyve is actually kind

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Speaker 1: of the best case scenario, and today we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about one of the worst case scenarios. And this

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Speaker 1: brings us back to renee Bach. It was a long intro.

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Speaker 1: I mean, all I wanted to add to that is

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Speaker 1: the question of, like, well, why is it bad if

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Speaker 1: a white person tells a story about non white people

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Speaker 1: as long as the story is told. I mean, inherently

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Speaker 1: that question doesn't recognize that there is a bias in

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Speaker 1: being white person telling the story of someone who's not white.

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Speaker 1: I think it just denies the idea that people should

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Speaker 1: tell their own story and not have it be co

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Speaker 1: opted by someone who comes in and pretends or thinks

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Speaker 1: they know what's best. But I think people don't often

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Speaker 1: make that jump. They're just like, well, if you're helping

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Speaker 1: and the intention is good, then yeah, the outcome is good,

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Speaker 1: automatically good, and I think you you hit the nail

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Speaker 1: on the head. That's sort of the whole story we're

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Speaker 1: gonna be talking about today, this idea that if the

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Speaker 1: intention is good, then that's mostly what matters when it

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Speaker 1: comes to activism, because this is a story about someone

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Speaker 1: whose intentions I really do think have been good this

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Speaker 1: entire time, and it doesn't matter because spoilers. She she

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Speaker 1: kills like a hundred babies. Um, like a Georgia Tan Junior,

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Speaker 1: like a Georgia Tan Jr. I mean, Georgia Tan. Nobody

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Speaker 1: came close to to GT when it came to racking

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Speaker 1: up that baby count. But this is pretty bad. I mean,

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Speaker 1: she's not putting up the same numbers. But not putting

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Speaker 1: up the same numbers, she's the I wish I knew

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Speaker 1: enough about basketball to make a basketball joke about this,

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Speaker 1: but I just don't could make a joke about this. Alright, alright, alright,

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Speaker 1: let's do it. I mean if she you would say

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Speaker 1: that Georgia Tan's whole life is like a triple double game,

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Speaker 1: you know, where she's putting up numbers in every category

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Speaker 1: like molestation, yes, mass murder. Yes, my dad is a

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Speaker 1: judge that forgave all of my stuff. Yes, you know

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Speaker 1: that's what I think. And then you get it. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think I get it. Um. I mean, I'm just

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Speaker 1: saying and just putting up one stat is not as

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Speaker 1: impressive as putting up stats in all three like rebounds, shots, assist. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is just Renee Bach is just putting up three pointers.

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Speaker 1: Side not great at basketball here, your partners are really hard,

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Speaker 1: yeah so maybe not maybe not all right, well yeah

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Speaker 1: yeah yeah, yeah so Renee Bach is not a well

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Speaker 1: known person at this point. No major Western news source

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Speaker 1: has covered her alleged crimes. I found out about this

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Speaker 1: in the first place from just a series of tweets

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Speaker 1: about Renee Bach from like some local African activists, people

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Speaker 1: who were with a group called No White Saviors. Um.

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Speaker 1: They published an article in September two eighteen about Renee

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Speaker 1: and then I I did a little bit more looking

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Speaker 1: and I found an article by a woman, young woman

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Speaker 1: named Nikki Gagnon uh, and she provided a lot of evidence,

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Speaker 1: and then I found even more evidence, including articles from

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Speaker 1: local Ugandan news sources. So this is a story that's

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Speaker 1: much better known in Uganda than the United States. I

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Speaker 1: have a feeling, based on the nature of the case

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Speaker 1: that it will eventually become big news in the West.

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Speaker 1: But you know, nobody liked The Guardian or wherever has

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Speaker 1: covered it yet. So again we're on the ground floor. Spoiler.

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Speaker 1: I did a little bit of original reporting for this,

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Speaker 1: which is exciting for me. Normally I'm just reading. Normally

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Speaker 1: I just get to read other people's reporting. Um, so

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Speaker 1: zero reporting for this. Well, what you're doing right now

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Speaker 1: is on the on the ground journalism. Uh, sort of

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Speaker 1: thank you for trying to make me feel important. You

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Speaker 1: can you can put on, you can wear get one

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Speaker 1: of those Fedora's that they stick a piece of paper

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Speaker 1: into that says press like in the old days. Yes,

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Speaker 1: get me an old timey. Yeah, please go on. No, no,

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Speaker 1: you're not interrupting. You're doing your job and it's time

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Speaker 1: for me to do mine. So there has been some

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Speaker 1: Western coverage of renee Bach the news in advance. A

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Speaker 1: local Virginia paper wrote an article about her in title

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Speaker 1: was an extraordinary girl who said yes to an extraordinary God.

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Speaker 1: Bedford native finds home in Uganda. Now that article, as

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Speaker 1: you might have guessed from the fawning title, presents Renee's

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Speaker 1: story as she wants it to be told and as

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Speaker 1: most of her friends back home believe it to be quote.

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Speaker 1: When Bedford native Renee Bach arrived in Uganda in September

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Speaker 1: two seven, she was alone. The eighteen year old had

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Speaker 1: landed in Uganda very late at night, only to find

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Speaker 1: her organized ride from the airport was nowhere to be found.

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Speaker 1: Construction had forced the plane to land on an airstrip,

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Speaker 1: where she went through immigration at a nearby tent. That experienced,

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Speaker 1: coupled with the increase in guns and rustic atmosphere, made

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Speaker 1: bak Bigin to question her choice to volunteer at a

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Speaker 1: local children's organization. I'm like, I'm from little Bedford and

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Speaker 1: I don't know anything about life here, and I got

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Speaker 1: left really late at night at the airport, she said,

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Speaker 1: I'm just sitting in the parking lot and then got

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Speaker 1: taken to a bunch of different places with random people

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Speaker 1: before I made it to the town I was going to.

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Speaker 1: But really quickly after I learned to super love it,

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Speaker 1: super love it. Oh boy. Yeah, see, you get a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a feeling for Renee and kind of

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Speaker 1: her attitude here. Uh, definitely going into it with good intentions.

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Speaker 1: She's a very motivated by her faith, motivated to go

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Speaker 1: and do volunteer work in this country. Uh, and obviously

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Speaker 1: going to Uganda is her first time in a UM.

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Speaker 1: I don't like the term third world nation developing nation.

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Speaker 1: I don't like that either, because like there's a there's

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Speaker 1: no term for countries where your security is not as

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Speaker 1: guaranteed and the infrastructure is not as built up. That

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Speaker 1: isn't in some way offensive, yeah, condescending, but it's it's

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Speaker 1: she's this is her first experience going from fucking suburban

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Speaker 1: Virginia to a place where the roads aren't reliable and

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Speaker 1: uh sometimes ship happens in a tent as opposed to

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Speaker 1: a well lit building, and like like that. This is

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Speaker 1: that experience for her. If you've ever traveled um through

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Speaker 1: parts of the world like that, you know how the

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Speaker 1: first time can be both like really scary and also

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Speaker 1: uh like a really exciting and electrifying experience. So she

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Speaker 1: has that sort of experience with Uganda and she falls

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Speaker 1: in love with it, which is not an uncommon thing

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Speaker 1: to do. So Renee's story is that she realizes how

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Speaker 1: many little kids in Uganda we're sick and malnourished, so

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Speaker 1: she decided to start her own five oh one C

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Speaker 1: three nonprofit. She called it Serving His Children or s HC.

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Speaker 1: She says. The organization initially started as a feeding program

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Speaker 1: that provided food to children, but soon children suffering from

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Speaker 1: malnutrition begin to show up at the center's gate and

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Speaker 1: MASSISI a slum in Ginja box set and so I

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Speaker 1: thought it was so odd because I had never seen

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Speaker 1: malnutrition before. And I was like, what is happening? This

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Speaker 1: is so weird. Quotes are perfect, Yeah, and then I

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Speaker 1: was like, w e t F. And I turned to

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Speaker 1: my friends and I was like, oh mg, yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: exactly what I've said every time I've seen malnourished children

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Speaker 1: somewhere in the world. W t F. What's going on?

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Speaker 1: And also what is that is a really weird question

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Speaker 1: to ask? Yeah, she's again sheltered, sheltered baby, very sheltered um.

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Speaker 1: And she goes to a part of the world where

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Speaker 1: you know, we have no fewer problems in our society,

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Speaker 1: but we're very good at hiding them, especially from upper

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Speaker 1: middle class kids who grow up in a place like Bedford, Virginia. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And this is a place where the problems aren't hidden.

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Speaker 1: And so she sees all of these issues and it's like,

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Speaker 1: I can do something to help um, and that's what

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Speaker 1: she starts doing. So very quickly, it becomes clear to

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Speaker 1: her that just getting people food is not enough for

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Speaker 1: her to do. Uh. And after seeing a bunch of

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Speaker 1: malnourished kids come through, she decides that the Lord is

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Speaker 1: showing her that there is a need for her to

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Speaker 1: provide more medical care for children. In the question, how

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Speaker 1: did she get the money for her to feed the children? Well, uh,

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Speaker 1: mostly donations, Like she starts a charity and then it's

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Speaker 1: like her family back home is connected to a large

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Speaker 1: church and so they solicit donations. Okay, so she's running basically,

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Speaker 1: she's running it on the money of the people back home.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, And she's her family runs ran at

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Speaker 1: this point. I don't think they do anymore, but they

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Speaker 1: ran a like one of the family businesses was like

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Speaker 1: a horse therapy center, like therapy like or she's a

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Speaker 1: horse girl girl, and she comes from horse money, like

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Speaker 1: that's that's that's some serious money. So I'm guessing her

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Speaker 1: church is similarly affluent. So she started mostly horses, mostly horses. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: a lot of Clydesdale's dropping h what's horse money? Probably

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Speaker 1: horse Arabians, Arabians. I feel like, fancy horse. Isn't that

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Speaker 1: a fancy horse? Probably the horses are best in Arabia, Right,

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Speaker 1: That's what I've heard. That's what Lawrence of Arabia taught me.

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Speaker 1: And I've never been steered wrong by that movie before,

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Speaker 1: speaking of colonialism and such. It taught me how to

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Speaker 1: blow up train tracks, which, let me tell you, has

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Speaker 1: come in handy a few times now. Um Renee registers

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Speaker 1: as a rehabilitation center with the Uganda government, and her

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Speaker 1: charity takes off. Within five years, it had an operating

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Speaker 1: budget of seventeen thousand dollars a month and was helping

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Speaker 1: hundreds and hundreds of little kids every year, which sounds great. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you can see why her local Virginia paper wrote a

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Speaker 1: really fawning story about like what she was doing out there,

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Speaker 1: like it sounds like, um like exactly the kind of

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Speaker 1: story if you're one of these missionaries who believes that,

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Speaker 1: like missionary work is crucial for the good of the world.

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Speaker 1: You can see why you'd want to publicize this as

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Speaker 1: much as possible because it sounds like like the success story.

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Speaker 1: So that's the that was four years and years and years,

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Speaker 1: from like two thousand eight up until two thousand eighteen,

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Speaker 1: that was the story. Anyone outside of Uganda would have

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Speaker 1: heard about Rene's charity saving his children. But that version

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Speaker 1: of the story leaves a couple of things out. There

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Speaker 1: was a couple of things out. So I'm going to

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Speaker 1: read about those couple of things for another nine pages

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Speaker 1: or so. I can't wait. Are you really sided? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I think you should rename this podcast white man Reading

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Speaker 1: to Me because I think I think that's pretty accurate.

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Speaker 1: But the podcast, yeah, yeah, I didn't want to really.

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Speaker 1: I mean yeah, but I love You're lucky because I

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Speaker 1: love being man's plained too. I know it's we're all

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Speaker 1: secretly programmed to love it, which is why what I've

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Speaker 1: based my career upon is is our internal uh is

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Speaker 1: the is the authority that my voice conveys despite it

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Speaker 1: being completely unearned by my actual lived experiences. I mean, look,

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Speaker 1: we all know a white man's voice is worth more. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well it's it's it's fucking I don't know. This is

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Speaker 1: a little bit off topic, but not entirely. Um. I

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Speaker 1: have talked a number of times about the magical power

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Speaker 1: of being a tall white man with a stereotypically kind

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Speaker 1: of authoritative voice, because it's great for like walk going

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Speaker 1: into situations where there's like police officers and stuff and

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Speaker 1: just like taking control of the situation if you just

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Speaker 1: talk really authoritatively. Like that's how so many scammers get by,

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Speaker 1: is if you are like, if you look a certain

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Speaker 1: way and sound a certain way in our society, you

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Speaker 1: can just take control of situations, which is why a

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Speaker 1: guy like Beto O'Rourke can decide I'm born to be

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Speaker 1: president totally and people are like, oh my god, he's

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Speaker 1: so charming mm hmm, and it's uh yeah you um. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: it's freezing your white man powers for good. We appreciate it.

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Speaker 1: At least neutrality, I mean, I guess that's the best

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Speaker 1: you can really hope for it. That's that's what I

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Speaker 1: shoot for on this show, to leave a neutral impact

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Speaker 1: on the world. Yeah, I would like to leave no print,

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Speaker 1: just one of those washed away by the sea. Kind

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Speaker 1: of prints. Yeah, I would like my life to be

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Speaker 1: like a boy Scout campfire, um, where very carefully hide

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Speaker 1: all of it races of you having ever been there. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's that's really should be everybody's goal. But it was

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Speaker 1: not renee Box goal. And see we tied it back around.

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Speaker 1: It's beautiful. It's beautiful. Now, after we come back from

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Speaker 1: this ad break, because it's time for an ad break,

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk about why exactly it's bad that

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Speaker 1: Renee Bach didn't decide to lead the boy Scout campfire

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Speaker 1: sort of life. Um. But first, you know what won't

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Speaker 1: leave a horrible mark on the world, Sophia. Know what?

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Speaker 1: The products and services that support this podcast. I love

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Speaker 1: products and services unless we get another coke industry sad,

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Speaker 1: and then I will say that I never said that

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Speaker 1: I love the products. So please buy these products and

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Speaker 1: services unless it's an ad for coke industries, which why

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Speaker 1: do they even advertise on podcasts? Who? Who? Who listens

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Speaker 1: to podcasts and needs an oil refinery like my dad?

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Speaker 1: The monopoly Man products. We're back, Okay, So now I

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Speaker 1: just read to you sort of Renee's story the way

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Speaker 1: she presented it, that it was presented in her local papers. Um.

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Speaker 1: But uh, there's another version of the story, and it

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Speaker 1: came out in I believe October of two eighteen. It

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Speaker 1: was a medium post and it was published under the

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Speaker 1: name of of a group called No White Saviors. But

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Speaker 1: it was written by by a young white woman who

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Speaker 1: had gone to Uganda around the same time Renee was

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Speaker 1: starting out her NGO there. And this young woman was

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Speaker 1: a missionary and went to Uganda with dreams of essentially

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Speaker 1: doing the same thing that Renee did. Um. But after

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Speaker 1: a little time in the country, it became clear to

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Speaker 1: her that something really fucked up was happening in Ginger. Uh.

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Speaker 1: So I'm gonna quote from her medium article. Now, there

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Speaker 1: was a child referred to our center who had previously

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Speaker 1: been at serving his children. He and his grandmother stayed

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Speaker 1: with us for several months while he received much needed

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Speaker 1: medical care. The day after we had received some good

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Speaker 1: news about his heart condition, he died of a sudden

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Speaker 1: heart attack. His three year old body had been through

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Speaker 1: a great deal of stress and it had finally given out.

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Speaker 1: We found out that this little boy had suffered a

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Speaker 1: severe case of malnutrition and was brought to Renee's in

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Speaker 1: Geo and Messisi. They got him fat and healthy and

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Speaker 1: then sent him home without so much as any consideration

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Speaker 1: for the root cause of his malnutrition. There was no

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Speaker 1: follow up, so he fell sick again, so sick that

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Speaker 1: his body was not able to come back from at

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Speaker 1: this time. So yeah, horrible story. UM and the author

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Speaker 1: of that medium article met with Renee and her social

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Speaker 1: worker and told them that she considered them partially responsible

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Speaker 1: for the little boy's death. I explained that had had

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Speaker 1: she training or experienced in child welfare, she'd know how

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Speaker 1: critical it is to follow up on cases like this.

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Speaker 1: I was frustrated at that point, but all I was

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Speaker 1: asking was that Renee and her team do better follow up,

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Speaker 1: moving forward to prevent kids from falling through the cracks

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Speaker 1: and ending upright where they started. It was soon after

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Speaker 1: this that my concern moved to terror, as I learned

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Speaker 1: that the poor follow up procedures were far from the

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Speaker 1: most dangerous thing happening at serving his children. It was

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Speaker 1: reported by multiple parties that Renee was actively practicing medicine

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Speaker 1: on children that came to the center. She had medical staff,

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Speaker 1: but she herself, with no medical training, shows to actively

426
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,440
Speaker 1: treat and respond to serious medical needs of children in crisis.

427
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 1: So we got another fake fucking doctor here. Which is

428
00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:28,359
Speaker 1: a trend on this show is serial killer ship. Yeah. Yeah,

429
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:32,360
Speaker 1: it gets serial killery um to coin a new verb,

430
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:40,040
Speaker 1: I think. So it became obvious but adjective. Yeah, grammar

431
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,320
Speaker 1: is not my strong suit. Okay, you're fired off your

432
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 1: own podcast, Sophie. I was just hoping you'd believe that

433
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,440
Speaker 1: it was a verb based on the confidence in my voice. Yeah.

434
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 1: You almost sold me on it by just being white

435
00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:57,119
Speaker 1: and authoritative. Yeah. I was like, yeah, that is Wait

436
00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 1: a minute. I do the same thing with pretending I

437
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:05,399
Speaker 1: a driver's license, and it usually works. So it became

438
00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 1: obvious to the author of this medium post, who is anonymous,

439
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,439
Speaker 1: that Renee had apparently trained herself up on YouTube and

440
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:14,440
Speaker 1: started practicing medicine without a license. Local Uganda news sources

441
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:17,400
Speaker 1: spoke to several of her victims. A Ugandan paper called

442
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:22,640
Speaker 1: The Spy interviewed a miss Kakai Rose. She said, my son,

443
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 1: Elijah Benjamin would be two years old today had he

444
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,480
Speaker 1: been alive. I delivered him at Ginger Hospital in twenty

445
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:30,239
Speaker 1: first January. Seen. I feel his life was snatched from

446
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,280
Speaker 1: my arms by the actions of miss renee Bach. I

447
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:35,879
Speaker 1: hope the court can give me justice. Now. That's horrible,

448
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:37,680
Speaker 1: but it's really light on details. It's hard to tell

449
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 1: exactly what happened there. I found another article from another

450
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:43,880
Speaker 1: Uganda news site called The Independent, which explains why detail

451
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 1: is hard to come by in many of these cases.

452
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,360
Speaker 1: They also interviewed numerous women who claimed to have lost

453
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: children to Renee Bach and her charity. None of the

454
00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 1: mothers knows exactly what happened to her child. What they

455
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 1: all say is that their children were not growing normally

456
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 1: and we're possibly malnourished. They all went to rene Bok

457
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:01,679
Speaker 1: for help and the children died um. They spoke to

458
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:05,160
Speaker 1: Beatrice Kayaga, a legal officer at the Women's Pro Bono Initiative,

459
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:08,080
Speaker 1: which provides legal aid to women in Uganda. Uh The

460
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,879
Speaker 1: Women's pro Bono Initiative is currently suing rene Bach on

461
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:13,720
Speaker 1: behalf of dozens and dozens of Uganda mothers. She is

462
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 1: currently being charged in a civil case with contributing to

463
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 1: the deaths of more than a hundred children who were

464
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:22,200
Speaker 1: put into her care. Annett Kikai is one of those women.

465
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:24,679
Speaker 1: She told The Independent, these people did something to my

466
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 1: child and he died. They gave him something. When we

467
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:31,400
Speaker 1: got home. He died. Uh A mets Annette son, Elijah

468
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:33,280
Speaker 1: was not growing normally, so she went to Boxing Geo

469
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: for help, since their whole thing was treating cases of malnourishment.

470
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:37,879
Speaker 1: Annette had heard from a friend that there was a

471
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:40,440
Speaker 1: quote white lady who would help feed her one year

472
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,160
Speaker 1: old so he would grow up fat and strong. She said,

473
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:45,639
Speaker 1: Elijah was playing, he was laughing. My worry was that

474
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:47,560
Speaker 1: he was too small for his age. The white lady,

475
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 1: dressed in a doctor's uniform white lab coat, took my

476
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 1: son and went with him to another room. An hour later,

477
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,760
Speaker 1: back left the room and asked Nette to return to

478
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:56,919
Speaker 1: the facility the next day. When they returned, she and

479
00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 1: her baby were putting a car and taken to a

480
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 1: health center in another town. Elijah was given some milk.

481
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 1: We stayed there for two days and they discharged us.

482
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:06,399
Speaker 1: She was not given any documentation or explanation for what

483
00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 1: was done to her child. They didn't say anything. They

484
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:10,959
Speaker 1: drove me up to Ginger Amber Court and gave me

485
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: basically a pile of cash. When we got home, the

486
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 1: baby became very weak. He died three days later. She sobs.

487
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:19,560
Speaker 1: Those people did something to my child and he died.

488
00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 1: So this is these are kind of the details we

489
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:25,879
Speaker 1: have initially coming out of Uganda about what's happening, and

490
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: it's hard to pin like what's going on clearly to

491
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 1: a cause because these are these are sick kids in

492
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:36,479
Speaker 1: a country that has not great access to a medical

493
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 1: care and hospitals. But the through line is that a

494
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:41,439
Speaker 1: number of women have the same story. They take their

495
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 1: kids to this clinic, a white woman dressed as a doctor,

496
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 1: gives their kids some medication, performs treatments on them. The

497
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 1: kid dies, and then the lady gives the mother a

498
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 1: pile of cash and their kid's body back. Like that's

499
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: the story you hear again and again and again. It's

500
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 1: like what we were saying about being you know, authoritative

501
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 1: and stuff. It's like you put on that white coat

502
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: and you come in there being all like white saviory

503
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 1: and you're like, hey, you know, I know what to

504
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 1: do when you take the son away from the mother.

505
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: Where is like if maybe you weren't wearing that cloak

506
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:20,119
Speaker 1: of like yeah uh protection because of of your whiteness

507
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 1: and your medical coat, then probably you would be like, hey,

508
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,439
Speaker 1: can I stay in the room for whatever happens, you know,

509
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:29,119
Speaker 1: and I see what's going on. Yeah, but you're just

510
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:33,359
Speaker 1: trusting blindly because you're like, well, this person has authority

511
00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:35,760
Speaker 1: and medical training. Well, and if you're in a very

512
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 1: poor part of Uganda, you've had Doctors without Borders and

513
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: similar groups come by. So you've seen a lot of these,

514
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of foreigners, Europeans and Americans

515
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 1: and lab coats and carrying stethoscopes, and they've given you

516
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 1: good medical care and your family good medical care. And

517
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 1: you know that that's like a thing that happens in

518
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 1: your area. And so this lady shows up, she's dressed

519
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: the same way as someone from Doctors without Borders, and

520
00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 1: you just assume she's actually a doctor and perform actual medicine,

521
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 1: which is not the case. I'm going to read another

522
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: story from a mother named Zubeta Gimbo. According to The Independent,

523
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 1: they took her son toil Ali Kifabi from her while

524
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 1: she was heavily pregnant. They only returned him home in

525
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 1: a coffin and gave me an envelope with cash in it.

526
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,120
Speaker 1: They came in a car and left immediately before burial.

527
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 1: I had questions as to what may have killed my child.

528
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 1: I needed help and explanations. None was given to me

529
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 1: by the woman that came home with the body of

530
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:28,760
Speaker 1: my dead child. Now, Ms Gimbo was confused and obviously heartbroken,

531
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 1: but she didn't take action until she heard stories that

532
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,440
Speaker 1: Renee Boch was not actually a doctor. This surprised her

533
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 1: because when her son had been admitted to the medical center,

534
00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:39,560
Speaker 1: she'd seen bought connect tubes to the child's arms and

535
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 1: chest Beatrice Kiaga, Gimbo's lawyer, claimed sources who worked with

536
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:45,840
Speaker 1: Box saw her surf the internet for medical advice and

537
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 1: called doctors back in the United States when she had

538
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:52,680
Speaker 1: questions on the treatment she administered. So again, Renee box

539
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 1: intentions seemed to have been good. She she saw that

540
00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: there was not enough competent medical care here decided that

541
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 1: she could administer it herself. Uh and that like in

542
00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 1: the absence of actual trained doctors, her just skyping a

543
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 1: doctor or looking on YouTube for guides on how to

544
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,440
Speaker 1: solve issues would be enough to handle it. So it's

545
00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 1: both like this, Um, I'm suspicious as fuck though, because

546
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:21,640
Speaker 1: it seems like she was just like trying to find

547
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 1: a cover for like being an angel at death. You know,

548
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 1: I I wonder about that. I the evidence I have

549
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:33,440
Speaker 1: makes me think she was really trying to, um, to

550
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 1: do good. I think it's more which doesn't mitigate at

551
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: all the fact that she got a lot of kids killed. Um.

552
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: What I'm saying is, if you're noticing that you keep

553
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: killing children while you're trying to heal them, if that

554
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 1: was what you were really trying to do, wouldn't you

555
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 1: be like, oh, clearly I'm not doing this. Well I

556
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 1: should probably stop, unless your whole point was to feel

557
00:30:56,080 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 1: like you're caring and whatever, but then actually to be like, well,

558
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 1: you know, probably it's a mercy to murder them, don't

559
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 1: you think, just to have access. Well, we'll see, is

560
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: it we get a little bit through this. I read

561
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 1: through her blog a lot, which has since been scrubbed

562
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,880
Speaker 1: by the Internet, but a blog she used to have

563
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 1: a blog, yeah where it's my god. Yeah, we'll be

564
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:21,920
Speaker 1: talking about it a lot. Um. There were hundreds of

565
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 1: kids she dealt with, and most of them didn't die,

566
00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 1: and most of them, you know, it's the kind of

567
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: thing where, like, you know, how people can convince themselves

568
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 1: that like whatever sort of weird snake oil they take

569
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: heals them, just because most problems you have, if you're

570
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,600
Speaker 1: a healthy person, you will eventually get over. So if

571
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:41,560
Speaker 1: you're like rubbing fucking a Regano oil on yourself, as

572
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,320
Speaker 1: you your body heals naturally, you can convince yourself, oh,

573
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 1: this is Regano oils healing me or whatever, just because

574
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:50,000
Speaker 1: like that's so. She dealt with a lot of kids,

575
00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: some of whom she was able to give actual help

576
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 1: to just because she had access to the money to

577
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 1: give these kids nutritional supplements. Some of them just got

578
00:31:57,160 --> 00:31:59,479
Speaker 1: better on their own, But she has all these stories

579
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 1: about kids is getting better on her blog, some of

580
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: which she attributes to like miracles and stuff, which I'm

581
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 1: guessing like that's I think that's another explanation than that

582
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:13,160
Speaker 1: she's a serial killer. Is just most of the kids

583
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:15,440
Speaker 1: she saw didn't die, so she assumed, well, you know,

584
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 1: I'm giving medical care to these kids. They can't all survive,

585
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 1: but I'm still doing a good thing, um, which gives

586
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 1: her more confidence and more confidence to treat more kids,

587
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 1: which means up she ends up killing more kids too,

588
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,680
Speaker 1: because she's taking on more and more people and getting

589
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 1: further and further out of her actual area of competence,

590
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 1: which is raising money to provide food for kids. Um,

591
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 1: I guess I did not realize what happens. I guess

592
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:44,200
Speaker 1: I did not realize that she, in addition to killing

593
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 1: a large portion of kids, also saved a large larger

594
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 1: portion or maybe they got back better on the I

595
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 1: didn't realized that there was a high higher survival rate

596
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 1: than death rate because I was in my Georgia Tan brain.

597
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:04,640
Speaker 1: I'm like, probably we're not talking a It's impossible to

598
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 1: say what the rate is because I don't know how

599
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: many kids she she actually dealt with. But it also

600
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,200
Speaker 1: is like most of the kids she sees are just

601
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,040
Speaker 1: kids who aren't they're not dying, they're just they don't

602
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 1: have they're malnourished. So if she's able to like cook

603
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:19,280
Speaker 1: these kids up with like nutritional supplements and better food

604
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:21,719
Speaker 1: than that actually does help them, and then you know,

605
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,560
Speaker 1: they go off in it. So she's I think that's

606
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 1: part of and that's that's part of why she gets

607
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 1: I think more and more into providing actual medical care.

608
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 1: Is the more kids who come by with minor problems

609
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,680
Speaker 1: and she's able to help, the more convinced she becomes

610
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 1: that she can do stuff like give them fucking blood transfusions,

611
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: which is where this story ends up. Um. Yeah, So again,

612
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 1: none of this mitigates the fact that she was performing

613
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: unlicensed medical care on children that got them killed. Because

614
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: what she's doing is horribly fucked up. I don't think

615
00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:55,480
Speaker 1: she's a serial killer. I think she's someone who got

616
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 1: way over confident because of her ability to provide moderate

617
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 1: help to some of these kids. Uh, and that leads

618
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:05,239
Speaker 1: her to kill others of them. That's my interpretation. We'll

619
00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:10,440
Speaker 1: see if you agree. As I finished the story. Um anyway, Um,

620
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,400
Speaker 1: there is some evidence that she got addicted over time

621
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:17,000
Speaker 1: to playing doctor on these kids. Uh. Kayaga That legal

622
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 1: representative Renee says that Renee hired social workers to comb

623
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:25,000
Speaker 1: government health facilities for new children she could treat. Um,

624
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,000
Speaker 1: so she eventually starts actually seeking out really sick kids

625
00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: that she can perform medical operations on doors. Right. Murder,

626
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 1: absolutely not right? Uh? And this was apparently common knowledge

627
00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 1: within the Ugandan missionary community. The author of that medium

628
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:47,320
Speaker 1: post wrote, taking children from actual hospitals and medical centers,

629
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:49,080
Speaker 1: Renee and her team would bring children back to the

630
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,880
Speaker 1: center in mess cci. Renee herself would openly talk about

631
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 1: how much she enjoyed hands on medical care. Now, I

632
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,120
Speaker 1: would be remiss in my journalistic duties if I did

633
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:01,880
Speaker 1: not note that Renee His family has responded to the

634
00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 1: allegations made against their daughter. They deny that Renee performed

635
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:09,320
Speaker 1: any inappropriate medical procedures outside of her certifications and CPR

636
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 1: Basic First Aid and emergency Stabilization. They claimed that saving

637
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:17,840
Speaker 1: his children her in GEO eventually did hire doctors and nurses,

638
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,279
Speaker 1: and that any procedures Renee helped and were carried out

639
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 1: under the supervision of these professionals. As evidence, they attach

640
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 1: an image macro. It shows Renee attaching a tube to

641
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,120
Speaker 1: a patient, which is apparently a fuller version of a

642
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 1: picture that was attached to that medium article and uses

643
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,799
Speaker 1: evidence that Renee was performing medical procedures. And the version

644
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,319
Speaker 1: of the picture that the family sends over UH, you

645
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: can see a man standing behind Renee, who they claim

646
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:44,920
Speaker 1: as a licensed doctor overseeing her work. Renee's mom attached

647
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,440
Speaker 1: a quote to the picture, UH in seeking truth you

648
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:49,959
Speaker 1: must find both sides of the story. That's a quote

649
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:55,160
Speaker 1: from Walter cronkite Um. Now, Renee's family, I think, specifically

650
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 1: her mother published an open letter that kind of is

651
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 1: set it rebuting all of these claims made again her

652
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:05,640
Speaker 1: daughter UM, And that's sort of the the overview of

653
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:07,800
Speaker 1: the claims. They say that number one, you know, children

654
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: in this area, there's a high death rate for malnourished children.

655
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,320
Speaker 1: So yes, some kids in the care of the center died,

656
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,480
Speaker 1: but that's to be expected. They report out all of

657
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:19,280
Speaker 1: them to the authorities. They had doctors on staff. Renee

658
00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:23,440
Speaker 1: never performed any inappropriate medical procedures. These are the claims

659
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:26,319
Speaker 1: made by the family UM and the case has not

660
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:28,319
Speaker 1: made its way through the court system yet, but there

661
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 1: are some reasons to doubt Renee and her family's side

662
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: of the story. One of them is the fact that

663
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 1: she had a blog that she maintained now SOFA can't

664
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:42,440
Speaker 1: wait here about this dear diary, Today I murdered three children.

665
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: It was an okay day. UM. One of the things

666
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 1: that's immediately sketchy about Renee's excite of the case is

667
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 1: that she scrubbed her blog from the Internet after the

668
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 1: lawsuit was five, which makes you think that maybe there

669
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:04,920
Speaker 1: was something incriminating in the blog, like, oh no, I

670
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: should have never been writing about my murders. I shouldn't

671
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:13,879
Speaker 1: have been writing about the crimes I was committing. Yeah. Now,

672
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 1: and this is again part of why I think she's

673
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:19,760
Speaker 1: not intentionally killing these kids is she details her breaking

674
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 1: the law a bunch in this blog and doesn't seem

675
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:24,399
Speaker 1: to notice that what she's writing is fucked up. Well,

676
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:27,879
Speaker 1: she's also not smart, clearly. Yeah, I don't think she's

677
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 1: a genius. Now, I wanna give a thanks first off

678
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:34,480
Speaker 1: to the the young writer Nikki Gagnon, who told me

679
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:36,759
Speaker 1: the name of Renee's blog so that I could find

680
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: it on the way back machine, which is why we

681
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:42,719
Speaker 1: have access to all these blog posts because obviously nothing

682
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: on the Internet has ever gone forever um and there

683
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,520
Speaker 1: will be links to uh to renee box blog on

684
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 1: our website behind the Bastard's dot com if you want

685
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 1: to read any of her posts. Yeah, well, right now,

686
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 1: I'm going to have Sophie show you what the landing

687
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:00,840
Speaker 1: page of Renee's blog look like and the name of

688
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 1: her blog was. But the greatest of these is love,

689
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 1: which I think is a chunk from a Bible quote. Now, Sophia,

690
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:16,319
Speaker 1: how would you describe that? Boy? Yeah, oh boy, that's yeah, yeah,

691
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:20,800
Speaker 1: it's it's some again. It's it's like a perfect encapsulation

692
00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 1: of this vibe, real serious exploitation vibe. Yeah. It's a

693
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 1: very close up picture of a malnourished child on his

694
00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:34,799
Speaker 1: mother's arms, with with with very large eyes looking up

695
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:37,799
Speaker 1: at the camera UM, on a background of what looks

696
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 1: like a burlap sack. I guess she's superimposed the picture

697
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:45,320
Speaker 1: onto not a great graphic designer. UM and her blog

698
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:49,160
Speaker 1: in general is filled with lurid pictures of sick and

699
00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:52,760
Speaker 1: injured Uganda children, dozens and dozens and dozens and dozens

700
00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 1: and dozens of them. UM, you might call it suffering porn.

701
00:38:57,320 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 1: Was just going to it that. Yeah, that that's the

702
00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:04,480
Speaker 1: overwhelming feeling you get from looking through her blog. UM.

703
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 1: Many of the pictures are before and after, showing children

704
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:09,719
Speaker 1: after time in her care. Others just seemed to emphasize

705
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: the suffering and pitiable state of her patients. UM. I

706
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:16,799
Speaker 1: can't over emphasize how many pictures of sick children there

707
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: are in this site. And I I have no evidence

708
00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:23,279
Speaker 1: that there's also pictures of her performing operations on people. UM.

709
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:25,480
Speaker 1: I have no evidence that the people in those pictures

710
00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:29,360
Speaker 1: consented to have their images used um or that the

711
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 1: parents of the kids in those pictures consented to have

712
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:35,560
Speaker 1: their images used. Who knows if those children were murdered

713
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,319
Speaker 1: by her like that is so fucked up. Some of

714
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:41,239
Speaker 1: them may have been, because she does talk about some

715
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 1: kids Diane in her blog um Now. She regularly talks

716
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 1: about performing medical operations on children in this blog, although

717
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 1: she always uses the term we for this, So it's

718
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:56,840
Speaker 1: possible that there's medical professionals with her performing these procedures

719
00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:58,799
Speaker 1: for some of them, but she's very vague about it.

720
00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 1: She almost never as to doctors being present. She occasionally

721
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:05,680
Speaker 1: mentions a nurse being present, but there is no evidence

722
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:07,720
Speaker 1: given in the blog that she's working under their direction

723
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,680
Speaker 1: or guidance. She tells frequent stories of children as being

724
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:14,320
Speaker 1: healed by miracles in her clinic after doctors and cities

725
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:18,640
Speaker 1: gave them prognoses of doom and uh. While I was

726
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:22,200
Speaker 1: browsing through her blog, I found some posts that directly

727
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,640
Speaker 1: contradict the claims that her mother made in that open letter.

728
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: But we're going to get into that after some ads,

729
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:34,120
Speaker 1: because this is a great time for ads by stuff

730
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:40,480
Speaker 1: by stuff by product, unless that product is a charity

731
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:44,840
Speaker 1: that I was actually killing kids. Always do your research.

732
00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:50,160
Speaker 1: Always do your research before donating money to some fucking

733
00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:53,759
Speaker 1: twenty something year old rich kids charity, But don't do

734
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:57,439
Speaker 1: your research before supporting the companies that support their show.

735
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,239
Speaker 1: Is that Is that a good ad pivot? Sophie, No,

736
00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:08,480
Speaker 1: you're not. You're not happy with that one. See. I mean,

737
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:10,480
Speaker 1: like it's hard not having you in person, But the

738
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 1: fact that now I'm singing across from Sophie and we

739
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 1: can just both frown at you, it's at the same

740
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:18,200
Speaker 1: time it's pretty great. It's like looking at him in

741
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 1: a beautiful blonde mirror. I can feel y'all's disapproval, uh,

742
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:29,480
Speaker 1: coursing over the airwaves, traveling through the Internet and beaming

743
00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:31,960
Speaker 1: out of the screen of my laptop. And how could

744
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:35,920
Speaker 1: you want apart from like regular disapproval that you just

745
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:38,720
Speaker 1: would get from living in Portland. You know, they're different.

746
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:42,399
Speaker 1: There's different flavors of disapproval that you get. But but

747
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:45,279
Speaker 1: but Sophie and Sophia, you both have I would say,

748
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:49,000
Speaker 1: a tangier taste of disapproval. And it really fuels my

749
00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:52,320
Speaker 1: heart in the same way that the products and services

750
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 1: you're about to hear ads for fuel this podcast with

751
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:59,400
Speaker 1: their advertising dollars. That's a fucking ad pivot. Are you

752
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:04,120
Speaker 1: proud of mean Sophie. Okay, well, it's as good as

753
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:14,760
Speaker 1: it's getting products. We're back. I'm still proud of myself

754
00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 1: for that ad pivot, just like Renee Bach was proud

755
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 1: of herself for her medical charity. Anyway, so we're talking

756
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:25,399
Speaker 1: about Renee's blog, and I found a post in two

757
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 1: thousand fourteen as I was reading through very old articles

758
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 1: in this Man's Slaughterer's child Slaughterers. I'm not sure what

759
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,880
Speaker 1: the legal term for her crimes is blog that seemed

760
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:39,239
Speaker 1: to contradict directly the claims made by her mother. If

761
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:42,760
Speaker 1: you will remember, she stated like that open letter stated

762
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:47,240
Speaker 1: that uh, Renee did not perform any sort of medical

763
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:51,720
Speaker 1: operation without um like the direct supervision of doctors and nurses.

764
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:55,280
Speaker 1: That the evidence was a picture of a man standing

765
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:59,799
Speaker 1: behind her. It's a man the man there. Are you

766
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 1: hitting me? How could your teaser of an email practice

767
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:06,400
Speaker 1: a man was standing behind her, was standing right behind

768
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 1: her behind in front of every fag doctor is a

769
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 1: murderous woman also pretending to be a doctor. That guy

770
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:18,239
Speaker 1: might have been a real doctor, But the fact of

771
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:20,759
Speaker 1: the matter is there's documentation that she was performing a

772
00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:26,480
Speaker 1: shipload of medical interventions without a doctor present. So I'm

773
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:30,400
Speaker 1: going to read a quote from blog post. The baby's

774
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:32,759
Speaker 1: name is Patricia. She is nine months old. She had

775
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 1: fallen sick three weeks ago. Her mom had taken her

776
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 1: to a health center, but there was no improvement. She

777
00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:39,520
Speaker 1: continued to get worse despite my treatment that was given.

778
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:41,799
Speaker 1: One of their relatives told them about a hospital in

779
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:44,839
Speaker 1: Missisi with a white doctor, so that Sunday morning, they

780
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:47,359
Speaker 1: left their home early in journey to Ginger in hope

781
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 1: of finding someone, anyone who could help their daughter. So

782
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:53,319
Speaker 1: you can see right there. At no point did she say,

783
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:55,799
Speaker 1: of course I wasn't a doctor. Of course I wasn't

784
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 1: running a hospital. She presents this as like kind of

785
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:00,760
Speaker 1: like she's proud that she's become known as the white

786
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:03,400
Speaker 1: doctor in Uganda. She's like, um, I don't know. Have

787
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:08,839
Speaker 1: you heard about the logo angel saving and I are

788
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:14,560
Speaker 1: the same. That's the feeling you get reading this blog. Renee,

789
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 1: of course leapt into action. Well, I was listening. I

790
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 1: was attempting to diagnose the many problems that could potentially

791
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: be at hand diagnosed. Got it malaria positive HB three

792
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:26,880
Speaker 1: point two. Both are a big problem, and together they

793
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:29,440
Speaker 1: create an even bigger, most likely fatal problem for such

794
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:32,840
Speaker 1: a small child. She needed a blood transfusion and fast.

795
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 1: After doing a search for blood around Ginger Town, we

796
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 1: found her type and it was a match. We started

797
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:40,839
Speaker 1: the transfusion, praying with every drip. About thirty minutes into

798
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:44,640
Speaker 1: her transfusion, she started showing signs of having anaphylactic reaction.

799
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:47,279
Speaker 1: Not good, not good at all. Her neck and face

800
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:49,960
Speaker 1: started swelling a lot. I'm talking about a ton of swelling.

801
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:52,359
Speaker 1: Within fifteen minutes, her breathing went from bad to worse,

802
00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:55,279
Speaker 1: her throat was beginning to close. We gave her an antihistamine,

803
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:57,520
Speaker 1: and off to Compoula we went. We arrived at one

804
00:44:57,520 --> 00:44:59,880
Speaker 1: of the best hospitals and come Pola by around eight pm,

805
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,640
Speaker 1: and then sat in the e er for over three

806
00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 1: hours waiting to see a doctor. It was a very

807
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,200
Speaker 1: long night, to say the least, but surprisingly she made

808
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:10,840
Speaker 1: it to see the morning. So Renee is posting in

809
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:14,000
Speaker 1: this about giving a child a blood transfusion and giving

810
00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 1: that kid the wrong blood which causes an allergic reaction

811
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:22,640
Speaker 1: which can very very easily be fatal. Why did she say,

812
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 1: we found her match. That's how dumb she is. She's

813
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,759
Speaker 1: so bad at this blood is red, This blood is red.

814
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:35,200
Speaker 1: She's like, it looks like it's a match. This is

815
00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:38,719
Speaker 1: a human. This is taste the same one human. Go in,

816
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:45,880
Speaker 1: one other human that worked for me. It gets grosser

817
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:49,520
Speaker 1: because Renee's story again, she this is part of why

818
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 1: I don't think she's intentionally killing these kids. She shows

819
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:54,440
Speaker 1: no self awareness at how like a person reading this

820
00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 1: would be like, you just gave a kid the wrong

821
00:45:56,560 --> 00:46:00,200
Speaker 1: kind of blood? What the funk? Lady? Uh in. She

822
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 1: goes on to talk luridly about how in the e

823
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:05,680
Speaker 1: R they found out that she and this little kid

824
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:08,239
Speaker 1: had the same blood type, so she was able to

825
00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:11,319
Speaker 1: donate her own blood to save this child, who she'd

826
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: actually put in danger in the first place by giving

827
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:17,359
Speaker 1: the wrong blood initially, which like, that's so crazy, it's

828
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 1: so fucked up. It's so fucked up. She's definitely an

829
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:26,920
Speaker 1: insane person who needs definitely of others and for people

830
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:29,520
Speaker 1: to be like, oh my god, yes, but if he

831
00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:33,200
Speaker 1: or you gave this kid your own blood, yeah, after

832
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:38,200
Speaker 1: giving the kid the wrong blood. Now, in that open

833
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 1: letter published by her family, Saving, They claimed, Saving his

834
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:43,640
Speaker 1: Children has perfect records of every child they treated and

835
00:46:43,640 --> 00:46:45,600
Speaker 1: every child that died in her care. They say Renee

836
00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:47,719
Speaker 1: is blameless and all of that, But god damn of

837
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:50,160
Speaker 1: Renee's blog does not paint almost the same picture is

838
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:53,160
Speaker 1: painted in that medium post. There is evidence that the

839
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:55,480
Speaker 1: open letter published by her family contains at least a

840
00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:58,239
Speaker 1: few direct lies. For one thing, Renee's family claims that

841
00:46:58,280 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: they first brought a real doctor on to their team

842
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:04,959
Speaker 1: three days a week in two thousand eleven. Perhaps they did,

843
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:09,520
Speaker 1: but again, Renee's own blog posts say otherwise. See and

844
00:47:09,600 --> 00:47:11,360
Speaker 1: this is a little bit of a little bit of reporting.

845
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:13,120
Speaker 1: I got to do here because I wanted to make

846
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:15,560
Speaker 1: sure I wasn't slandering this. It would be totally possible,

847
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:17,879
Speaker 1: totally possible that like the ship I saw on Twitter

848
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:20,520
Speaker 1: and whatnot was wrong. Uh, this was just a case

849
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 1: of like, yeah, some kids are gonna die. It's like

850
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:25,319
Speaker 1: it's it's a tough place to perform medical care. I

851
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:27,640
Speaker 1: didn't want to like get sued by the family, So

852
00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:29,640
Speaker 1: I was kind of looking for a smoking gun in

853
00:47:29,719 --> 00:47:32,319
Speaker 1: the blog that showed that there were lies in the

854
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:34,840
Speaker 1: open letter, and I found at least one thing that

855
00:47:34,920 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 1: suggests that because that blood transfusion thing happened, I think

856
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:41,359
Speaker 1: in October of two thousand eleven, uh and the next year,

857
00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:44,240
Speaker 1: in May of two thousand twelve, Renee posted an update

858
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:46,880
Speaker 1: with the title we need your help UH. In the

859
00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:49,640
Speaker 1: post details a story about a woman with a sick

860
00:47:49,719 --> 00:47:52,359
Speaker 1: child coming in the night. Renee claimed she and her

861
00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:54,839
Speaker 1: staff had to drive around to find a doctor who

862
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:57,359
Speaker 1: could see them. After knocking on just about every door

863
00:47:57,400 --> 00:47:59,279
Speaker 1: in the hospital, I found a nurse. She promised to

864
00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:01,399
Speaker 1: call a doctor in disappeared again. I made my way

865
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 1: back to the e r and watched, waited, prayed, and

866
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,000
Speaker 1: for almost the next three hours, the child in my

867
00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:07,479
Speaker 1: arms continue to drift away and the doctor never came.

868
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,520
Speaker 1: This story, sadly, is a familiar one, a scenario that

869
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 1: has played out for many sick children that God sends

870
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:15,080
Speaker 1: into our care. It is a terrifying and heart wrenching

871
00:48:15,120 --> 00:48:17,239
Speaker 1: experience from mothers who have sought refuge and help in

872
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:19,160
Speaker 1: our home, as well as frustrating for me as I

873
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:21,680
Speaker 1: seek medical expertise beyond my own in a world that

874
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:24,040
Speaker 1: is often just not available. This story and others like

875
00:48:24,120 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 1: it would be different if we had a doctor. So

876
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:29,200
Speaker 1: that's May of two thousand twelve when she posts that

877
00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:32,000
Speaker 1: which seems to make it crystal clear that Saving his

878
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:34,759
Speaker 1: Children had no doctor on staff. In May of two

879
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:37,880
Speaker 1: thousand twelve, Renee explicitly spells out in that post that

880
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 1: her staff includes three full time Uganda nurses and medical

881
00:48:40,600 --> 00:48:43,520
Speaker 1: equipment that is not even often available in local hospitals,

882
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:46,399
Speaker 1: but laments not having a doctor on staff. The whole

883
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:48,720
Speaker 1: goal of that post was to raise money fifteen thousand

884
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:51,600
Speaker 1: dollars a year to hire a doctor. Now here's a

885
00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:54,719
Speaker 1: quote from the open letter published by Renee's mom. As

886
00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:56,480
Speaker 1: a board, we have been approached in the past with

887
00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 1: concerns about the amount of medical work being done at

888
00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:01,040
Speaker 1: our center and Renee's personal and involvement. Once in the

889
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:03,319
Speaker 1: fall of two thousand eleven, our response was to hire

890
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:05,480
Speaker 1: a Ugandan doctor three days a week, to work with

891
00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:08,400
Speaker 1: the nurses, to establish treatment plans, and to be available

892
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:11,759
Speaker 1: for emergency consults. Now, that note about concerns in the

893
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:13,880
Speaker 1: fall of two thousand eleven is clearly a reference to

894
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:16,719
Speaker 1: Renee transfusing the wrong blood into a child, but the

895
00:49:16,840 --> 00:49:19,359
Speaker 1: letter of what her family rights in the open letter

896
00:49:19,560 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: makes it sound like saving his children immediately hired a

897
00:49:22,400 --> 00:49:25,359
Speaker 1: doctor in response to that. Renee's blog makes it clear

898
00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:27,760
Speaker 1: that seven months later, and may have two thousand twelve,

899
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,919
Speaker 1: they still had no doctor on staff, and we don't

900
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:32,960
Speaker 1: know how long after that post it took them to

901
00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:38,640
Speaker 1: actually hire one. I just love that. Uh, the number

902
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 1: one thing that you would think from a title like

903
00:49:41,680 --> 00:49:45,600
Speaker 1: saving his children, that you would have is someone who

904
00:49:45,640 --> 00:49:49,239
Speaker 1: could literally save a live a k. A doctor. It's

905
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:52,400
Speaker 1: like she's like, no, let's buy this dialysis machine first.

906
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,920
Speaker 1: It's like, probably not the right order. Maybe get the

907
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:59,319
Speaker 1: doctor first, Maybe invest in the doctor. I don't know,

908
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:01,880
Speaker 1: and I think I did wrongly say I wrote it

909
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:04,319
Speaker 1: out wrong when I announced that when I started reading

910
00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:06,080
Speaker 1: the story about the blood transfusion, I said, I found

911
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:07,799
Speaker 1: a post from two thousand and fourteen. That post was

912
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:10,400
Speaker 1: from two thousand eleven, um, which I made clear later on.

913
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:13,400
Speaker 1: I just want to make it super clear here. So, yeah,

914
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:16,279
Speaker 1: that that seems to be you know that right, I

915
00:50:16,360 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 1: will not inaccuracy. I was allowed to believe that you're

916
00:50:20,239 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 1: a professional. I'm Sophie. Can I go thank you so much? So? Yeah,

917
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 1: that like that seems pretty damning to me. Right, You've

918
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 1: got this letter where they're saying we had concerns in

919
00:50:31,280 --> 00:50:33,359
Speaker 1: two thousand eleven and we hired a doctor, and then

920
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:35,960
Speaker 1: you've got Renee seven months later saying we don't have

921
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:38,880
Speaker 1: a doctor and we need one. Like it seems like

922
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:41,200
Speaker 1: a pretty clear example. Not only is number one her

923
00:50:41,239 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 1: post in two thousand eleven a clear example that she's

924
00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:46,440
Speaker 1: performing blood transfusions, which goes against what they say in

925
00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:48,799
Speaker 1: the open letter, but the other post in May is

926
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:51,319
Speaker 1: a clear evidence that they didn't have a doctor when

927
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:53,839
Speaker 1: her family claims they had already hired a doctor. So like,

928
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:57,560
Speaker 1: I don't know. That doesn't mean everything that they claim

929
00:50:57,600 --> 00:50:59,439
Speaker 1: in the open letter about their clinic as a lie,

930
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:01,359
Speaker 1: but it means at least one thing in that open

931
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:03,600
Speaker 1: letter is a lie, which makes me believe the local

932
00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:07,120
Speaker 1: Ugandan reporting uh and the reporting in that medium post

933
00:51:07,160 --> 00:51:10,839
Speaker 1: even more because everything they say is internally consistent and

934
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:14,400
Speaker 1: is consistent with Renee's own blog, which was written contemporaneously.

935
00:51:15,040 --> 00:51:18,640
Speaker 1: So I don't know, pretty clear she doesn't want the

936
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 1: children to be saved. She wants to be known for

937
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,960
Speaker 1: saving children, which is not the same thing at all,

938
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:28,960
Speaker 1: And to her, I don't think the lives matter at all,

939
00:51:29,040 --> 00:51:31,640
Speaker 1: which is why I still think she's like a creepy

940
00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:36,279
Speaker 1: serial killer. Yeah, it's all well yeah, well, well well

941
00:51:36,440 --> 00:51:38,520
Speaker 1: we'll we'll talk at the end of this about like

942
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:41,400
Speaker 1: where we wind up on exactly what we think her

943
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:44,520
Speaker 1: motivations are, although I don't think her motivations really matter.

944
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:48,040
Speaker 1: What matters is that she's giving kids the wrong blood

945
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:50,680
Speaker 1: and stuff and some of them die. Um, which I

946
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:53,840
Speaker 1: think we're Yeah. So, having read the Renee's blog and

947
00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:56,480
Speaker 1: several well reported articles from local Uganda journalists, I feel

948
00:51:56,520 --> 00:51:59,879
Speaker 1: comfortable saying, uh that I think we've reported on both

949
00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 1: sides of the story now, uh, and it seems like

950
00:52:02,600 --> 00:52:05,000
Speaker 1: something really messed up is going on here. The author

951
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:07,080
Speaker 1: of that media article alleges that several members of the

952
00:52:07,120 --> 00:52:10,800
Speaker 1: Uganda missionary community expressed their concern about saving his children

953
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:13,200
Speaker 1: at varying points. Many of us who have tried to

954
00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:16,400
Speaker 1: hold Renee in SHC accountable have been lambastad, yelled at,

955
00:52:16,440 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 1: and referred to as the enemy by supporters of Renee.

956
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:21,440
Speaker 1: The home church that miss bak attended in Jinja, as

957
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:23,879
Speaker 1: well as a significant portion of the missionary community here,

958
00:52:24,120 --> 00:52:29,160
Speaker 1: supported and defended her. Now, according to Spy Uganda's reporting,

959
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:32,080
Speaker 1: or the spy in Uganda. Bach family members seem to

960
00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:37,160
Speaker 1: make up the majority of the staff running Saving His Children,

961
00:52:37,719 --> 00:52:41,480
Speaker 1: so her mother is the US director of Saving His Children.

962
00:52:41,520 --> 00:52:43,840
Speaker 1: Her twenty two year old sister, Eleen, works with the

963
00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:47,720
Speaker 1: organization's marketing and social media team. So like the actual

964
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:50,520
Speaker 1: staff that runs the organization is all members of the

965
00:52:50,520 --> 00:52:55,400
Speaker 1: Bach family, but the majority of the employees are basically

966
00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:59,080
Speaker 1: part time Ugandan employees. So the actual people doing most

967
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:01,480
Speaker 1: of the work on the ound and providing care are

968
00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:05,360
Speaker 1: usually Ugandan's in Renee in The people running the company

969
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:07,799
Speaker 1: and doing things like publishing open letters that have at

970
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 1: least one major inaccuracy in them are Renae's mom and sister,

971
00:53:11,320 --> 00:53:14,960
Speaker 1: So that's how this charity is run now. Earlier in

972
00:53:14,960 --> 00:53:17,880
Speaker 1: this episode, I mentioned Nikki Gagnon, one of the writers

973
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:19,800
Speaker 1: who covered this story. She's the person who told me

974
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 1: how to find renasal blog posts, and Nicki has done

975
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:24,719
Speaker 1: a lot of digging into this case. Her coverage might

976
00:53:24,719 --> 00:53:27,200
Speaker 1: be the best that I found so far. For one thing,

977
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:30,440
Speaker 1: she delves deeper into Renee's blog than anyone else. Quote

978
00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:33,480
Speaker 1: one harrowing passage from June twelve, two thousand eleven follows

979
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:37,480
Speaker 1: bacause she simultaneously drives a vehicle and administers emergency oxygen

980
00:53:37,600 --> 00:53:40,160
Speaker 1: via a bag valve mask to an infant. She writes,

981
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:42,560
Speaker 1: oxygen was finished and I had been driving and bagging

982
00:53:42,600 --> 00:53:44,839
Speaker 1: Raheem at the same time. It was working, but wasn't

983
00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:47,319
Speaker 1: exactly safe. My sister and two of my best friends

984
00:53:47,360 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 1: in the world came to my rescue exclamation point. Exclamation point,

985
00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 1: exclamation point. They met me along the road with the

986
00:53:52,120 --> 00:53:54,399
Speaker 1: oxygen cord, another set of hands to drive, and some

987
00:53:54,440 --> 00:53:59,919
Speaker 1: emotional support exclamation point. The baby later died. Wow, that's

988
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,520
Speaker 1: too many exclamation points for a post that ends with

989
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:08,279
Speaker 1: a baby death. Yeah, that's paying attention to the important part, like,

990
00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:10,800
Speaker 1: oh my god, I have the best friends in the world.

991
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:15,560
Speaker 1: R I P baby baby? What funk are your priorities?

992
00:54:16,239 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 1: She yeah? Now. Nikki helped me iron out some of

993
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:22,439
Speaker 1: the more confusing details of the case. That medium post

994
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:24,920
Speaker 1: had concluded by noting that Saving his Children shut down

995
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:27,799
Speaker 1: in two thousand fifteen, but other coverage suggested that the

996
00:54:27,840 --> 00:54:31,400
Speaker 1: nonprofit was still operational. It turns out that Saving his

997
00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 1: Children shut down briefly in two thousand fifteen, when criminal

998
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:37,560
Speaker 1: charges were filed against Rene Bach. With the Ginia Police

999
00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:40,480
Speaker 1: and the Ugandan Ministry of Health. Uh, then the organization

1000
00:54:40,560 --> 00:54:43,080
Speaker 1: started back up again and has been running ever since.

1001
00:54:43,160 --> 00:54:45,440
Speaker 1: So they shut it down briefly because they were criminal

1002
00:54:45,520 --> 00:54:48,080
Speaker 1: charges against them, and then started it back up as

1003
00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:53,399
Speaker 1: soon as they felt like the smoke had cleared. Um Nikki, Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1004
00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:57,319
Speaker 1: so that does make it seem like it's a compulsive

1005
00:54:57,400 --> 00:55:01,719
Speaker 1: need for her to this place. Of course, it's like, uh,

1006
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:06,120
Speaker 1: you know those munchaus On syndrome moms that like need

1007
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:09,560
Speaker 1: the attention that they get from like their kids being

1008
00:55:09,640 --> 00:55:12,640
Speaker 1: fake sick. Yeah, I think that's very much what's going

1009
00:55:12,680 --> 00:55:16,960
Speaker 1: on here now. Nikki interviewed Olivia A. Lasso, a social

1010
00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:19,320
Speaker 1: worker and a member of the group No White Saviors.

1011
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,840
Speaker 1: Olivia Alasso is actually from Ginger. She's a Uganda and

1012
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,200
Speaker 1: Olivia says that she interviewed a number of families who

1013
00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:27,959
Speaker 1: claimed their children were harmed by Renee Bach. She shared

1014
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:30,279
Speaker 1: the story of a family from Bozica, a rural town

1015
00:55:30,360 --> 00:55:32,759
Speaker 1: several hours away from Gina, whose baby passed away after

1016
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:36,200
Speaker 1: intervention from Bach back in August. Alasso said that means

1017
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:38,920
Speaker 1: Renee is still practicing medicine. She went on to explain

1018
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:41,480
Speaker 1: that Box supervised the child's care at clinic and ultimately

1019
00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:44,359
Speaker 1: released the infant after several days. According to the child's mother,

1020
00:55:44,400 --> 00:55:46,680
Speaker 1: who was interviewed by a Lasso, the baby died after

1021
00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:51,000
Speaker 1: developing breathing complications despite being evaluated by Boch from malnutrition

1022
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:55,080
Speaker 1: at the Kigandalo Health Center in Mayugi. So yeah, she's

1023
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:58,880
Speaker 1: at least as all recently, like two thousand eighteen, is

1024
00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:03,400
Speaker 1: still performing medical interventions, not with a doctor present. Um

1025
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:07,960
Speaker 1: you know, yeah cool medical with like air quotes with

1026
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:11,560
Speaker 1: air quotes medical. And that she wears a stethoscope. Yeah,

1027
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 1: she put on a white robe. So I will say this,

1028
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:18,600
Speaker 1: by the standards of the nineteen twenties, she is a doctor.

1029
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:23,640
Speaker 1: That is a very high standard. Again, those standards are

1030
00:56:23,800 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 1: has a white coat and stethoscope. Amazing people are you

1031
00:56:27,719 --> 00:56:31,920
Speaker 1: could afford your own stethoscope? Welcome? Wow, you must be

1032
00:56:32,080 --> 00:56:36,640
Speaker 1: a doctor. Oh I would have been a doctor in

1033
00:56:36,680 --> 00:56:39,520
Speaker 1: the twenties, but I would just have sold people morphine,

1034
00:56:40,320 --> 00:56:42,759
Speaker 1: mainly so I could afford to buy morphine myself. In

1035
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:47,040
Speaker 1: the twenties, they still like jerked off women, right, Yeah

1036
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:51,759
Speaker 1: they sure did. Yeah, okay, cool, just making sure that's

1037
00:56:51,800 --> 00:56:54,040
Speaker 1: kind of your best case scenario with a twenties doctor,

1038
00:56:54,080 --> 00:56:56,600
Speaker 1: because if they're jerking you off, they're not pouring mercury

1039
00:56:56,640 --> 00:56:59,160
Speaker 1: into you. I don't know, I feel like you probably

1040
00:56:59,160 --> 00:57:01,879
Speaker 1: do both. Yeah, you probably. And also you're assuming they're

1041
00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:05,680
Speaker 1: good at jerking you off. Yeah that could really be.

1042
00:57:07,200 --> 00:57:12,120
Speaker 1: You know, they're bad. Fingering is really is real bad.

1043
00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:15,440
Speaker 1: One county doctor who was just the best at it,

1044
00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:19,240
Speaker 1: Like it was like the most popular guy all the women.

1045
00:57:19,640 --> 00:57:23,080
Speaker 1: He's been married five times. All the women go to him.

1046
00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 1: They're like, um, yeah, okay. They're like there's another doctor

1047
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:28,680
Speaker 1: on staff. They're like, yeah, we don't really want to him,

1048
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:32,240
Speaker 1: but your dull oaky farmers sitting around being like, boy,

1049
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:37,520
Speaker 1: Dr Johnson's real popular. My wife keeps biking him cakes

1050
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:40,960
Speaker 1: all the time. How awful you think a woman gots

1051
00:57:41,000 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 1: to go to the woman doctor. She sees him about once,

1052
00:57:44,920 --> 00:57:49,479
Speaker 1: I don't know, twice every day, Like, oh that's too

1053
00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:53,440
Speaker 1: many times. All the women folk are outside of the

1054
00:57:53,480 --> 00:57:57,040
Speaker 1: doctor's office. Again, feel like this happens a lot, and

1055
00:57:57,040 --> 00:58:01,320
Speaker 1: it's like they finally like figure out his his skills.

1056
00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:04,760
Speaker 1: They're like the fingers on his right hands seemed to

1057
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:08,280
Speaker 1: be the nails seemed to be trimmed real nice. You

1058
00:58:08,360 --> 00:58:10,400
Speaker 1: think it's got anything to do with that, And the

1059
00:58:10,400 --> 00:58:13,320
Speaker 1: women are like, yes, it totally does. Please trim your

1060
00:58:13,320 --> 00:58:21,080
Speaker 1: fucking fingure. Well, you know, I've done my job. I

1061
00:58:21,160 --> 00:58:27,240
Speaker 1: made this. Yeah, and in a way, isn't everything. You know,

1062
00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:31,440
Speaker 1: this story is about child murder. Um, just let me

1063
00:58:31,480 --> 00:58:33,960
Speaker 1: get a little fingering in, Robert, a little bit, a

1064
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:35,880
Speaker 1: little bit, a little bit, a couple of things to

1065
00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:39,720
Speaker 1: give me a little pinky action. Yeah, we've had held

1066
00:58:39,800 --> 00:58:44,920
Speaker 1: up her pinky in a very authoritative way. That is

1067
00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:47,480
Speaker 1: the job of a producer. I would trust you to

1068
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:51,720
Speaker 1: finger me. Sophie. You're welcome, Robert. I don't know. We

1069
00:58:51,720 --> 00:58:55,360
Speaker 1: don't know each other all enough, honestly, And I'm like

1070
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:58,400
Speaker 1: a thousand miles away, which is that's the number one

1071
00:58:58,440 --> 00:59:02,400
Speaker 1: thing that in my finger nails are horrible? Um, corros,

1072
00:59:02,400 --> 00:59:05,320
Speaker 1: why did you tell your listeners that your female listeners

1073
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 1: literally just unsubscribed from the podcast. I'm all about cinema verity,

1074
00:59:11,000 --> 00:59:13,320
Speaker 1: which is a term I invented to describe how I

1075
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:16,680
Speaker 1: do my podcast. We talked about in the Hubbard episode.

1076
00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:20,919
Speaker 1: Now I want to get back to au it is known.

1077
00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:23,600
Speaker 1: I want to get back to NICKI Gagnan's article because

1078
00:59:23,600 --> 00:59:26,840
Speaker 1: she also interviewed a Ugandan former employee of saving his children.

1079
00:59:26,880 --> 00:59:29,080
Speaker 1: This is like a local person who actually worked at

1080
00:59:29,120 --> 00:59:33,800
Speaker 1: Renee Box clinic. This guy's recollections are rather damning for us.

1081
00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:36,160
Speaker 1: We saw many mistakes, but whenever you happen to tell her,

1082
00:59:36,160 --> 00:59:38,000
Speaker 1: she was not accepting. And you know, it is such

1083
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:40,200
Speaker 1: a problem. The worker detailed a case where he watched

1084
00:59:40,200 --> 00:59:42,640
Speaker 1: Bo give a child of blood transfusion under a tree

1085
00:59:42,720 --> 00:59:45,720
Speaker 1: and claims he saw that sort of behavior numerous times. Now,

1086
00:59:45,720 --> 00:59:50,280
Speaker 1: I'm not a medical professional, but I have enough medical

1087
00:59:50,320 --> 00:59:56,320
Speaker 1: training to say blood transfusions are not generally performed under trees. Whatever.

1088
00:59:56,760 --> 01:00:00,000
Speaker 1: That sounds like the perfect ambience. Are you a little

1089
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:03,480
Speaker 1: bit jealous? I could find like a nice eucalyptus, just

1090
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:07,120
Speaker 1: lay down underneath it, get a needle in my arm.

1091
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:10,600
Speaker 1: It sounds romantic. It does sound wants to lay with

1092
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:15,080
Speaker 1: me in a meadow and get medical treatment administered by

1093
01:00:15,120 --> 01:00:21,920
Speaker 1: a non professional. You know, she used to behave as

1094
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:24,240
Speaker 1: if she's a professional, Yet she was not second to

1095
01:00:24,280 --> 01:00:26,000
Speaker 1: all that. All the volunteers that used to come at

1096
01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:28,040
Speaker 1: the center, they used to handle medical issues. And I

1097
01:00:28,080 --> 01:00:31,400
Speaker 1: remember one day confronting the doctors, the African doctors. Why

1098
01:00:31,480 --> 01:00:34,760
Speaker 1: these whites, they are playing on our children, our children's lives.

1099
01:00:34,960 --> 01:00:36,840
Speaker 1: You know what the doctor told me. He told me,

1100
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:39,120
Speaker 1: even me, I've been seeing that. But you know, a

1101
01:00:39,200 --> 01:00:43,240
Speaker 1: boss is a boss. There's nothing I can do. Whoa.

1102
01:00:43,600 --> 01:00:46,080
Speaker 1: This is a guy speaking, who's being quoted. English is

1103
01:00:46,080 --> 01:00:48,760
Speaker 1: not his first language, obviously, and so I don't know

1104
01:00:49,040 --> 01:00:52,320
Speaker 1: exactly how he meant the term they are playing on

1105
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:55,760
Speaker 1: our children, but I know what he means because my

1106
01:00:55,800 --> 01:00:59,560
Speaker 1: second language. I think he's like, uh, they're playing with

1107
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:02,959
Speaker 1: their lives, lives, like they're using them as like experiments.

1108
01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:07,400
Speaker 1: It's not serious to them exactly, we don't have value. That.

1109
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:10,120
Speaker 1: That's how I interpreted it too. I think, yeah, he's

1110
01:01:10,200 --> 01:01:12,960
Speaker 1: he's saying that Renee is playing with Uganda children as

1111
01:01:13,000 --> 01:01:15,840
Speaker 1: if they're her toys, like playing doctor, playing pretend with

1112
01:01:15,920 --> 01:01:20,080
Speaker 1: human lives. Um. And I want to show you a

1113
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:24,200
Speaker 1: picture Renee Bach took of herself and posted on social media. Now,

1114
01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:26,320
Speaker 1: this is her as she wants to be seen. And

1115
01:01:26,360 --> 01:01:29,880
Speaker 1: I think it's very kidding me. Yeah, described that fucking

1116
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:33,360
Speaker 1: picture Sophia. I mean it's it's like a combo of

1117
01:01:33,400 --> 01:01:36,680
Speaker 1: that photo of Milannia when she decorated the White House

1118
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:39,240
Speaker 1: for Christmas, and it just looked like it was like

1119
01:01:39,320 --> 01:01:43,400
Speaker 1: haunted by all the families that have been like fucked

1120
01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:46,280
Speaker 1: up by the administration. It was just very gray and

1121
01:01:46,320 --> 01:01:48,280
Speaker 1: white and dull, and she was kind of in the

1122
01:01:48,320 --> 01:01:51,120
Speaker 1: middle as the queen. This has that combined with like

1123
01:01:51,200 --> 01:01:57,760
Speaker 1: a real um uh, what's the show with the bonnets

1124
01:01:57,800 --> 01:02:01,960
Speaker 1: and the red Oh, handmaid's tale, thank you, it's got

1125
01:02:01,960 --> 01:02:06,240
Speaker 1: a real handmade handmail is made stale vibe also, and

1126
01:02:06,320 --> 01:02:09,280
Speaker 1: it's like she's clearly she's like, I am Mother Teresa.

1127
01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:13,080
Speaker 1: There's white glow around me. I am, I am the bitch.

1128
01:02:13,560 --> 01:02:16,120
Speaker 1: She's standing in the center of a room with a

1129
01:02:16,120 --> 01:02:19,280
Speaker 1: couple of empty cradles in it, and her hands are

1130
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:22,040
Speaker 1: down at her side, with her palms facing forward and

1131
01:02:22,080 --> 01:02:25,400
Speaker 1: her head bowed down and like a gesture of religious contrition.

1132
01:02:25,840 --> 01:02:32,600
Speaker 1: There is also there's a she's backlit by a light

1133
01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 1: shining through a window, which makes her look almost like

1134
01:02:35,280 --> 01:02:37,760
Speaker 1: she's got like a halo, like she's a saint. And

1135
01:02:37,800 --> 01:02:40,520
Speaker 1: then the walls of the room she's in our plastered

1136
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:44,120
Speaker 1: in pictures of sick African children, hundreds and hundreds of

1137
01:02:44,120 --> 01:02:47,400
Speaker 1: pictures of little shirtless babies, like the ones that she

1138
01:02:47,480 --> 01:02:49,800
Speaker 1: puts on her blog post all around her like it

1139
01:02:50,040 --> 01:02:54,280
Speaker 1: is this mother Teresa bitch right here, Yeah, mother Teresa

1140
01:02:54,320 --> 01:02:57,920
Speaker 1: bitch is the fucking like. You couldn't have a more

1141
01:02:57,960 --> 01:03:01,080
Speaker 1: white saviory picture if you if you try it, Like

1142
01:03:01,120 --> 01:03:03,720
Speaker 1: if you were if you were making a movie, a

1143
01:03:03,720 --> 01:03:06,720
Speaker 1: horror movie about a white savior character and you put

1144
01:03:06,760 --> 01:03:09,680
Speaker 1: this picture in it, everyone watching it would be like, well,

1145
01:03:09,720 --> 01:03:12,960
Speaker 1: this is for the top, come on on the nose

1146
01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:18,160
Speaker 1: on a little much, but this is fucking how Rene

1147
01:03:18,160 --> 01:03:21,360
Speaker 1: Bach sees herself, or at least wants to be seen.

1148
01:03:21,400 --> 01:03:26,480
Speaker 1: I don't know, man, Yeah, yeah, I want to read

1149
01:03:26,520 --> 01:03:28,680
Speaker 1: a little bit more from that local Virginia news article

1150
01:03:28,720 --> 01:03:30,760
Speaker 1: I found on box that I opened this article with

1151
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:34,480
Speaker 1: or this episode with it. Interviewed Richard Heart, her former pastor,

1152
01:03:34,600 --> 01:03:37,320
Speaker 1: and he talked a lot about Renee's humility, claiming she

1153
01:03:37,400 --> 01:03:41,840
Speaker 1: doesn't promote herself and praising her teachability. A teenage girl

1154
01:03:41,840 --> 01:03:44,240
Speaker 1: out of rural Virginia going and making such a huge

1155
01:03:44,320 --> 01:03:46,760
Speaker 1: difference in Uganda and then just to stay with it

1156
01:03:46,800 --> 01:03:49,000
Speaker 1: for all these years has been a real testament to

1157
01:03:49,040 --> 01:03:53,720
Speaker 1: her heart and her character and the humility that she has. Yes,

1158
01:03:53,720 --> 01:03:59,120
Speaker 1: when I think of humble, I think untrained blood transfusions. Yeah. Also,

1159
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:02,120
Speaker 1: I feel like it's always kind of a red flag

1160
01:04:02,160 --> 01:04:05,120
Speaker 1: to me when like the first time a white person

1161
01:04:05,160 --> 01:04:07,760
Speaker 1: tries to help anybody, they're like, I'm gonna go to

1162
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 1: another country and figure it's like you should just be

1163
01:04:12,080 --> 01:04:16,000
Speaker 1: exposed to the poverty and malnutrition and ship in America

1164
01:04:16,600 --> 01:04:19,200
Speaker 1: and then you know, maybe try to see how you

1165
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:21,840
Speaker 1: can help that community. It'll be less of a shock

1166
01:04:22,120 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 1: for your system. Maybe you won't co opt other people's

1167
01:04:25,520 --> 01:04:29,600
Speaker 1: fucking like lives like that, and you can maybe make

1168
01:04:29,720 --> 01:04:33,000
Speaker 1: a little bit of progress. I don't know why. Immediately,

1169
01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:35,560
Speaker 1: I feel like it's got to be such a superiority complex,

1170
01:04:35,600 --> 01:04:38,760
Speaker 1: like we are better than black people, were better than Africa.

1171
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:41,280
Speaker 1: We need to get our hands on it, we need

1172
01:04:41,320 --> 01:04:43,919
Speaker 1: to help because we know best. And it's like even

1173
01:04:44,080 --> 01:04:46,720
Speaker 1: funked up attitude it is. And it's like, even though

1174
01:04:46,760 --> 01:04:51,760
Speaker 1: I don't have any expertise in this, because like my

1175
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:53,960
Speaker 1: my attitude towards this country, and it goes back to

1176
01:04:54,000 --> 01:04:58,000
Speaker 1: like the cony thing building this idea that Uganda is

1177
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:00,720
Speaker 1: just irredeemably fucked up because things are so fucked up

1178
01:05:00,760 --> 01:05:02,520
Speaker 1: and This is also you see it in the open

1179
01:05:02,600 --> 01:05:04,520
Speaker 1: letter her mom wrote where they talk about how often

1180
01:05:04,600 --> 01:05:07,760
Speaker 1: kids die in Uganda because it's so bad here. It's

1181
01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:11,720
Speaker 1: okay that I'm completely untrained wandering into this situation because

1182
01:05:11,720 --> 01:05:14,160
Speaker 1: the situation is so fucked up that anything I do

1183
01:05:14,280 --> 01:05:16,880
Speaker 1: is fine. Like if she had, like you said, if

1184
01:05:16,920 --> 01:05:19,720
Speaker 1: she'd started by like volunteering at local homeless shelters and

1185
01:05:19,760 --> 01:05:22,520
Speaker 1: like running a shelter trying to get Maunderish people, and

1186
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:25,680
Speaker 1: if she built a really effective program in her local

1187
01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:28,560
Speaker 1: hometown and helped a few hundred people and then Gonda,

1188
01:05:28,640 --> 01:05:30,400
Speaker 1: Uganda and been like I'm gonna try to do this here,

1189
01:05:30,400 --> 01:05:33,280
Speaker 1: I'd be like, Okay, well she's got some expertise. It's

1190
01:05:33,320 --> 01:05:35,400
Speaker 1: the same thing as like, it's not white saviorism. If

1191
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:37,880
Speaker 1: you're a white doctor and you travel to Uganda to

1192
01:05:38,080 --> 01:05:40,280
Speaker 1: offer free medical care, it's not not being a white

1193
01:05:40,320 --> 01:05:42,640
Speaker 1: savior to be part of Doctors without Borders or whatever

1194
01:05:42,920 --> 01:05:45,640
Speaker 1: you were. You spend a lot of time to gain

1195
01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:48,160
Speaker 1: a real skill that is in short supply in an area,

1196
01:05:48,360 --> 01:05:51,400
Speaker 1: and then you travel there to give part of yourself.

1197
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:55,680
Speaker 1: That's totally fine. Um, the white saviorism is this person

1198
01:05:55,920 --> 01:05:59,640
Speaker 1: with no skills with a high school degree rolling into

1199
01:05:59,640 --> 01:06:01,320
Speaker 1: this place as and being like, yeah, I can do

1200
01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:03,760
Speaker 1: complex medical ship. What does it matter if I funk up?

1201
01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:07,400
Speaker 1: Everyone's already fucked here because it's Uganda, Like, that's your attitude.

1202
01:06:07,680 --> 01:06:11,959
Speaker 1: That's like, that's what's so offensive, um, And it's it's

1203
01:06:12,000 --> 01:06:17,800
Speaker 1: just so dangerous to not be aware of your own

1204
01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:21,560
Speaker 1: bias to the point where it never occurs to you

1205
01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:27,200
Speaker 1: to not start there. Here's it does occur to her.

1206
01:06:27,360 --> 01:06:30,320
Speaker 1: I'm about to read that part. So in her interview

1207
01:06:30,360 --> 01:06:33,320
Speaker 1: for that article in Virginia, Baca dressed directly the idea

1208
01:06:33,360 --> 01:06:37,120
Speaker 1: of white savior complex. She claims her desire to avoid

1209
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:40,640
Speaker 1: that is why she hired mostly local Ugandan's. It's a

1210
01:06:40,680 --> 01:06:43,040
Speaker 1: real thing. There are people that go there and probably

1211
01:06:43,040 --> 01:06:45,600
Speaker 1: do what they do for themselves, and the self gratification

1212
01:06:45,680 --> 01:06:47,880
Speaker 1: from helping people that are less than or who were

1213
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:51,240
Speaker 1: super poor or assisting orphans. I think all too often

1214
01:06:51,280 --> 01:06:54,120
Speaker 1: we as Americans, we think, oh, well, they're just incapable,

1215
01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:56,320
Speaker 1: so we better go and help these people. I think

1216
01:06:56,360 --> 01:06:57,880
Speaker 1: that's the mindset of a lot of people. And I

1217
01:06:57,880 --> 01:06:59,760
Speaker 1: would probably say that I even had a little bit

1218
01:06:59,760 --> 01:07:02,360
Speaker 1: of that mindset when I first went of like, oh, well,

1219
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:05,040
Speaker 1: maybe they just can't do it, she said, but they can.

1220
01:07:05,240 --> 01:07:08,120
Speaker 1: And I definitely learned that very quickly that I'm definitely

1221
01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:12,640
Speaker 1: not needed here. Then leave, bitch. Yeah, I agree with

1222
01:07:12,680 --> 01:07:16,000
Speaker 1: you on that you're not fucking necessary, and you're making

1223
01:07:16,040 --> 01:07:19,800
Speaker 1: the situation arguably a lot worse if you found out

1224
01:07:19,880 --> 01:07:23,840
Speaker 1: there's no need for you fucking leave. I just don't understand.

1225
01:07:23,920 --> 01:07:26,480
Speaker 1: I mean, I do understand she's a crazy person, but

1226
01:07:27,040 --> 01:07:30,160
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, and oh, speaking of Jesus Christ, it's even

1227
01:07:30,200 --> 01:07:33,280
Speaker 1: more fucked up to tie this into religion too. Yeah, right,

1228
01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:37,560
Speaker 1: like that somehow is like your holy and like special

1229
01:07:37,720 --> 01:07:41,160
Speaker 1: and doing God's work when you're literally killing children and

1230
01:07:41,160 --> 01:07:45,000
Speaker 1: it's giving you this whole like, oh, you know, my

1231
01:07:45,080 --> 01:07:48,040
Speaker 1: mission is not only like good by earthly standards, it's

1232
01:07:48,080 --> 01:07:53,160
Speaker 1: also good by godly standards. And it's like you're the

1233
01:07:53,240 --> 01:07:56,760
Speaker 1: furthest thing away from that. And there's so many stories

1234
01:07:56,800 --> 01:07:58,640
Speaker 1: in her blog of like this kid will get sick

1235
01:07:58,640 --> 01:08:00,480
Speaker 1: and the doctors just say there's no thing that can

1236
01:08:00,480 --> 01:08:03,320
Speaker 1: be done, and then the kid will get better, and

1237
01:08:03,360 --> 01:08:05,640
Speaker 1: she'll say, it's like this miracle that we we healed

1238
01:08:05,640 --> 01:08:08,600
Speaker 1: this child, even though like they said it was impossible.

1239
01:08:08,640 --> 01:08:10,680
Speaker 1: This is like clearly God healing him, and the kid

1240
01:08:10,680 --> 01:08:13,000
Speaker 1: goes away, and it's like, well, but okay, there's a

1241
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:15,560
Speaker 1: ton of fatal illnesses where it's very common for people

1242
01:08:15,560 --> 01:08:17,720
Speaker 1: to get better or seem better for a couple of

1243
01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:20,759
Speaker 1: weeks at a time, because that's just how illness works,

1244
01:08:21,080 --> 01:08:22,960
Speaker 1: and to have a few good days before they take

1245
01:08:23,000 --> 01:08:25,160
Speaker 1: a turn. And we don't know the whole stories of

1246
01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:27,280
Speaker 1: these kids because I don't have a whole lot of

1247
01:08:27,280 --> 01:08:30,080
Speaker 1: faith in fucking Renee box ability to keep records on

1248
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,240
Speaker 1: these children or let us know how often they don't survive,

1249
01:08:33,439 --> 01:08:38,120
Speaker 1: you know, or properly diagnose them ever with no medical training.

1250
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:41,599
Speaker 1: And that's the that's the thing that that mediam article

1251
01:08:41,720 --> 01:08:43,720
Speaker 1: presents is like it starts with the story of a

1252
01:08:43,760 --> 01:08:47,439
Speaker 1: kid who goes to Rene Box very malnourished. Renee's clinic

1253
01:08:47,600 --> 01:08:50,519
Speaker 1: gets the kid nourished again and then just sends him off,

1254
01:08:50,720 --> 01:08:52,439
Speaker 1: not thinking about the fact that like, well, no, this

1255
01:08:52,520 --> 01:08:55,720
Speaker 1: kid has a diagnosed heart condition. It can be dangerous

1256
01:08:55,760 --> 01:08:59,080
Speaker 1: when you're malnourished to feed someone a bunch and get

1257
01:08:59,120 --> 01:09:01,320
Speaker 1: them a bunch of weight and then send them back

1258
01:09:01,360 --> 01:09:03,600
Speaker 1: out into the world. Because like number one, that's a

1259
01:09:03,640 --> 01:09:06,080
Speaker 1: huge strain on their system. There's a reason that doctors

1260
01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:10,479
Speaker 1: are very careful with how they have a ren like

1261
01:09:10,479 --> 01:09:14,000
Speaker 1: like that's part of the problem, is like when we

1262
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:16,960
Speaker 1: get these stories about her saving kids, these stories that

1263
01:09:17,000 --> 01:09:20,600
Speaker 1: I suspect convinced her that she was good at this, uh,

1264
01:09:20,640 --> 01:09:22,840
Speaker 1: like she doesn't know if she's actually saving any of

1265
01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:25,960
Speaker 1: the kids she's claimed she's saved because she's not doing

1266
01:09:26,080 --> 01:09:30,360
Speaker 1: long term follow follow up at all exactly, and like, yeah,

1267
01:09:30,439 --> 01:09:33,519
Speaker 1: it's it's fucked up, and nothing about I have a

1268
01:09:33,560 --> 01:09:36,640
Speaker 1: really like morbid note on that, Like, yes, that's a

1269
01:09:36,680 --> 01:09:42,720
Speaker 1: common thing with if you're treating someone who is hugely malnourished,

1270
01:09:42,720 --> 01:09:46,200
Speaker 1: that you can't let them eat their fill. It's too much.

1271
01:09:46,280 --> 01:09:48,679
Speaker 1: It's they can't go from having no food to all

1272
01:09:48,680 --> 01:09:51,280
Speaker 1: the food. My grandpa, who was in World War Two,

1273
01:09:51,680 --> 01:09:54,160
Speaker 1: said that when they were like outside one of the

1274
01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:58,559
Speaker 1: death camps, a couple of like uh prisoners that had

1275
01:09:58,640 --> 01:10:03,639
Speaker 1: run away from the concent concentration camps or whatever, we're

1276
01:10:03,720 --> 01:10:06,920
Speaker 1: so starving and malnourished, and like they gave them food,

1277
01:10:07,000 --> 01:10:09,360
Speaker 1: and my grandpa was like it was really hard and

1278
01:10:09,439 --> 01:10:13,360
Speaker 1: heartbreaking to not let them eat a lot because they

1279
01:10:13,360 --> 01:10:16,639
Speaker 1: would still beg you for food and they like needed

1280
01:10:16,680 --> 01:10:18,680
Speaker 1: and want it and you just have to be like, no,

1281
01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:20,800
Speaker 1: you can only have a little bit at a time.

1282
01:10:21,160 --> 01:10:25,000
Speaker 1: And it's like even somebody like that knows that who

1283
01:10:25,080 --> 01:10:27,280
Speaker 1: was just you know, you know it from experience, you

1284
01:10:27,280 --> 01:10:31,559
Speaker 1: don't know it from medical training, but just the fact

1285
01:10:31,600 --> 01:10:34,880
Speaker 1: that you can be more informed as a soldier about

1286
01:10:34,960 --> 01:10:41,599
Speaker 1: this than even a woman that's pretending to be a doctor. Yeah,

1287
01:10:41,720 --> 01:10:44,640
Speaker 1: it's super fucked up. Uh. You know. I have a

1288
01:10:44,640 --> 01:10:48,400
Speaker 1: little bit of a White Savior story myself. Although when

1289
01:10:48,400 --> 01:10:52,040
Speaker 1: I was um twenty two or something like that, my

1290
01:10:52,040 --> 01:10:55,960
Speaker 1: my girlfriend at the time and I went to Guatemala

1291
01:10:56,040 --> 01:10:58,439
Speaker 1: with a Catholic church in this charity called I think

1292
01:10:58,439 --> 01:11:00,960
Speaker 1: the name was Kids Saving Kids, And I was not Catholic.

1293
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:04,479
Speaker 1: I was an atheist at that point. I didn't have

1294
01:11:05,040 --> 01:11:06,800
Speaker 1: much of an interest in the church at all, but like,

1295
01:11:06,840 --> 01:11:08,960
Speaker 1: I wanted to go to Guatemala because I want to

1296
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:12,599
Speaker 1: see Guatemala, and the the idea behind what we were

1297
01:11:12,640 --> 01:11:14,760
Speaker 1: doing on paper is that we were going there to

1298
01:11:14,760 --> 01:11:17,320
Speaker 1: help build a clinic. So I was like, Okay, well,

1299
01:11:17,439 --> 01:11:19,519
Speaker 1: I'll get to see Guatemala and we'll build a clinic

1300
01:11:19,560 --> 01:11:22,320
Speaker 1: and that'll be great. And there was a chunk of

1301
01:11:22,360 --> 01:11:23,920
Speaker 1: the charity that was useful because a guy who was

1302
01:11:23,960 --> 01:11:26,680
Speaker 1: an actual doctor came along and he like provided he

1303
01:11:26,720 --> 01:11:30,320
Speaker 1: was up every day like talking to women and doing

1304
01:11:30,320 --> 01:11:32,400
Speaker 1: like women's health issues and stuff, and that was that

1305
01:11:32,439 --> 01:11:34,920
Speaker 1: was great. But the rest of us, it turned out

1306
01:11:34,960 --> 01:11:37,439
Speaker 1: that building a clinic was we didn't. We didn't build

1307
01:11:37,439 --> 01:11:39,360
Speaker 1: a clinic. We went out into the middle of this

1308
01:11:39,439 --> 01:11:43,520
Speaker 1: impoverished village in like about two hours outside of Antigua,

1309
01:11:44,000 --> 01:11:46,360
Speaker 1: and we built a barbed wire fence around a trash

1310
01:11:46,400 --> 01:11:49,280
Speaker 1: field um And the main purpose of us building it

1311
01:11:49,320 --> 01:11:51,080
Speaker 1: was so that we could do a big photo op

1312
01:11:51,120 --> 01:11:54,120
Speaker 1: with the mayor and the lady who ran the charity,

1313
01:11:54,280 --> 01:11:57,200
Speaker 1: who was very proud of herself and spent every day

1314
01:11:57,200 --> 01:12:00,240
Speaker 1: sitting at the hotel clearly on vacation, and that the

1315
01:12:00,320 --> 01:12:01,920
Speaker 1: end of it, got to do big photo op with

1316
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:04,120
Speaker 1: all these kids that she gave shoes and like the

1317
01:12:04,160 --> 01:12:06,280
Speaker 1: mayor of this village while we like stood around this

1318
01:12:06,800 --> 01:12:09,200
Speaker 1: like trash fence that we built. And it was this

1319
01:12:09,240 --> 01:12:12,840
Speaker 1: realization for me of like, oh, the only thing that

1320
01:12:12,880 --> 01:12:14,880
Speaker 1: we needed to do was send the doctor. And the

1321
01:12:14,960 --> 01:12:17,880
Speaker 1: doctor complained that like he didn't actually have much in

1322
01:12:17,880 --> 01:12:20,200
Speaker 1: the way of medicine to hand out to these people.

1323
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:23,000
Speaker 1: And if instead of the rest of us coming, we

1324
01:12:23,200 --> 01:12:27,000
Speaker 1: just sent the doctor with the value of our money, yeah,

1325
01:12:27,160 --> 01:12:30,400
Speaker 1: on antibiotics for all of these women who because the

1326
01:12:30,439 --> 01:12:32,120
Speaker 1: water was bad, Like all of these women had u

1327
01:12:32,120 --> 01:12:33,720
Speaker 1: t e s in this village, Like that was the thing.

1328
01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:36,760
Speaker 1: He was like, I've never seen this, but like there's

1329
01:12:36,800 --> 01:12:38,639
Speaker 1: not much I can do because I don't have any

1330
01:12:38,680 --> 01:12:42,640
Speaker 1: medication for them. If the twenty thirty kids that like

1331
01:12:42,720 --> 01:12:44,879
Speaker 1: flew out there and got put up in a hotel

1332
01:12:44,920 --> 01:12:47,080
Speaker 1: for a week and whatever, if we just put that

1333
01:12:47,120 --> 01:12:50,960
Speaker 1: money into antibiotics, real good would have been done. But

1334
01:12:51,040 --> 01:12:53,559
Speaker 1: instead there's a barbed wire fence around a trash field

1335
01:12:53,680 --> 01:12:58,479
Speaker 1: in a rural village in Guatemala. So yeah, it's it's

1336
01:12:58,600 --> 01:13:04,800
Speaker 1: it's really dumb. Uh. So if you want to help

1337
01:13:04,840 --> 01:13:07,640
Speaker 1: places like this, maybe give some money to doctors in

1338
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:13,679
Speaker 1: that borders or something, actual medical professionals. Yeah, like that's

1339
01:13:13,800 --> 01:13:18,000
Speaker 1: that charity navigator, do a little bit of research figure

1340
01:13:18,040 --> 01:13:23,519
Speaker 1: out yeah, real bad charities. Yeah, yeah, it turns out

1341
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:29,519
Speaker 1: that everything's terrible. I mean, as a breast cancer survivor,

1342
01:13:29,600 --> 01:13:32,920
Speaker 1: I'm super sensitive about people giving money to like Season

1343
01:13:33,000 --> 01:13:38,440
Speaker 1: J comen or like really shitty um breast cancer organizations

1344
01:13:38,479 --> 01:13:41,519
Speaker 1: that just really spent the money on like publicity and

1345
01:13:41,600 --> 01:13:50,160
Speaker 1: overhead and never actually on women. Yeah, it's crazy how

1346
01:13:50,200 --> 01:13:53,559
Speaker 1: often stuff like that goes down, and how when you

1347
01:13:53,600 --> 01:13:57,000
Speaker 1: actually go to places where people need help, the folks

1348
01:13:57,080 --> 01:14:02,439
Speaker 1: doing actual useful work get very little money. Uh, like

1349
01:14:03,160 --> 01:14:06,679
Speaker 1: are operating on a shoestring budget, whereas like the groups

1350
01:14:06,720 --> 01:14:09,360
Speaker 1: that get the most money get the most money because

1351
01:14:09,360 --> 01:14:12,280
Speaker 1: they're able to do big, high profile PR events which

1352
01:14:12,320 --> 01:14:15,800
Speaker 1: cost a lot of money. And yeah, it's it's fucked

1353
01:14:15,880 --> 01:14:20,800
Speaker 1: up doctors of that borders is pretty sweet though, Yeah,

1354
01:14:20,840 --> 01:14:26,280
Speaker 1: can give them your money, don't Yeah? Yeah? All right? Well, uh, Sophia,

1355
01:14:26,400 --> 01:14:28,400
Speaker 1: you wanna you want to plug your plug doubles at

1356
01:14:28,400 --> 01:14:31,040
Speaker 1: the end of this very happy episode about child murder. Yeah,

1357
01:14:31,080 --> 01:14:33,760
Speaker 1: I mean I feel people want more, you know what

1358
01:14:33,800 --> 01:14:35,720
Speaker 1: I mean? How could they not want more of me?

1359
01:14:35,800 --> 01:14:41,240
Speaker 1: After this? You can find me, uh, I host a podcast,

1360
01:14:41,520 --> 01:14:45,000
Speaker 1: co host a podcast called Private Parts Unknown. Um it's

1361
01:14:45,000 --> 01:14:48,080
Speaker 1: about love and sexuality around the world, and you can

1362
01:14:48,120 --> 01:14:51,920
Speaker 1: find me at the Sophia t h E. S O

1363
01:14:52,080 --> 01:14:56,679
Speaker 1: f I y A on Twitter and Instagram twin Instagram,

1364
01:14:56,720 --> 01:15:00,679
Speaker 1: Sofia Private parts unknown. Check her out, can also check

1365
01:15:00,720 --> 01:15:03,839
Speaker 1: me out. I'm Robert Evans and I'm on this podcast.

1366
01:15:03,920 --> 01:15:06,040
Speaker 1: You actually you already have checked me out and there's

1367
01:15:06,160 --> 01:15:09,960
Speaker 1: nothing more. You can do, nothing at all, So uh

1368
01:15:10,680 --> 01:15:16,120
Speaker 1: go home. You're knowing that you have checked me out.

1369
01:15:16,520 --> 01:15:19,800
Speaker 1: Check out, Sophia. I don't. I think that's everything? Is

1370
01:15:19,840 --> 01:15:25,200
Speaker 1: that everything, Sophie is? She shaking her head angry. She's

1371
01:15:25,320 --> 01:15:27,439
Speaker 1: very over me. That's because I didn't plug any of

1372
01:15:27,479 --> 01:15:30,200
Speaker 1: the plugable So I was just trying to exasperate Sophie

1373
01:15:30,200 --> 01:15:33,240
Speaker 1: because it's what I live for it and I think

1374
01:15:33,280 --> 01:15:34,800
Speaker 1: she got it. I think she got that message. You

1375
01:15:34,840 --> 01:15:36,560
Speaker 1: can find us on behind the Bastards dot com. You

1376
01:15:36,600 --> 01:15:38,760
Speaker 1: can find me at I right okay. On Twitter. You

1377
01:15:38,800 --> 01:15:41,559
Speaker 1: can find this podcast on Twitter and Instagram at bastards pot.

1378
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:44,439
Speaker 1: You can find us on tea Public, where you can

1379
01:15:44,520 --> 01:15:46,960
Speaker 1: buy a shirt that does not help a good cause,

1380
01:15:47,640 --> 01:15:52,240
Speaker 1: but will go to pay for my coffee and narcotics.

1381
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:55,280
Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards at te public dot com, where you

1382
01:15:55,320 --> 01:16:00,320
Speaker 1: can donate to medicine, sinse Frontiers or something like that. Um,

1383
01:16:00,360 --> 01:16:04,240
Speaker 1: that's the end of the podcast. I'm sorry, Sophie, please

1384
01:16:04,240 --> 01:16:09,120
Speaker 1: forgive that. Where's my apology. Wait, wait, what would I

1385
01:16:09,120 --> 01:16:12,040
Speaker 1: do about Viea Sophia does dad Baby's over and over?

1386
01:16:12,200 --> 01:16:14,960
Speaker 1: You staffed the humor for me. We're gonna talk about

1387
01:16:15,080 --> 01:16:17,680
Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about YouTube in the next episode, and

1388
01:16:17,680 --> 01:16:20,120
Speaker 1: I feel like this is a trap. Yeah it is.

1389
01:16:20,360 --> 01:16:23,880
Speaker 1: It's it's always a trap with behind the bastards. That's

1390
01:16:23,920 --> 01:16:32,840
Speaker 1: the episode.