1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I Want Justice. 2 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace premieres March ninth, only on 3 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: Fox Nation. A nineteen year old girl hops in her 4 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:22,560 Speaker 1: car and goes to the gas station that Come and 5 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 1: Go the seven to eleven and that's it. She's just gone. 6 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:33,720 Speaker 1: And the dichotomy of a seemingly normal day just as 7 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:37,519 Speaker 1: blown to hub allenback. What happened and where was the 8 00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 1: last time McKenna milhan was saying alive Crime Stories with 9 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:58,640 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. On December twenty second, Milhan was reported missing 10 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: by her mother. This bring Field Police Department had been 11 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:05,760 Speaker 1: investigating her disappearance since she was reported missing. McKenna Milheim's 12 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 1: mother reported her daughter missing two days after receiving a 13 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:12,520 Speaker 1: text from McKenna that she had been raped. According to 14 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:16,400 Speaker 1: the Missouri State Highway Patrols Endangered Person Advisory for her, 15 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 1: Milhan was last seen on December twentieth. She was seen 16 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:22,399 Speaker 1: getting into a black vehicle at the Come and Go 17 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 1: at National and Norton in Springfield. I'm Nancy Grace, what 18 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: happened to mckinna milhon? Have you ever heard the phrase 19 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: disappeared into thin air? We'll think about it. What if 20 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:39,479 Speaker 1: that was your loved one, they went off to work 21 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 1: that morning, or they went about their business and you 22 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:46,639 Speaker 1: just very simply never saw them again. I'm Nancy Grace. 23 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 1: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us 24 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 1: with me. Jason Wart journalist owner Ozark's Independent dot Com. 25 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 1: We're now medical examiner out of South Carolina. Doctor Michelle Dupree, 26 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 1: author of homicide Investigation field Guide. Doctor Bethany Marshall, psycho analyst, 27 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:07,920 Speaker 1: joining us from Beverly Hills at Doctor Bethany Marshall dot com. 28 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:11,320 Speaker 1: Cloyd Steiger thirty six years, Seattle PD twenty two years, 29 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: homicide author Seattle's Forgotten serial Killer, Gary Jene Grant, Cloyd 30 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:20,840 Speaker 1: Steiger dot com, Defense attorney, former prosecutor out of Atlanta, 31 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:27,000 Speaker 1: Darreld Cohen, and special guest joining us, Rain Marie Davis. 32 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:31,919 Speaker 1: First of all, let's figure out what happened and where 33 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: was the last time McKenna Milhahn was seen alive. We 34 00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:42,960 Speaker 1: understand that she was last seeing getting into a vehicle 35 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:46,600 Speaker 1: at the come and go, okay, I assume that that 36 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:51,520 Speaker 1: is like a seven eleven. Jason Wurt, owner Ozar's Independent 37 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:56,640 Speaker 1: dot Com. Tell me about the last time this beautiful, 38 00:02:56,720 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: young nineteen year old girl was seen alive, sane, alive. 39 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:05,120 Speaker 1: Witnesses said that she was seeing at the location, she 40 00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:08,280 Speaker 1: was talking to people, Everything seemed fine. She climbed into 41 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:11,560 Speaker 1: the vehicle with somebody that they said she appeared to know. 42 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:14,800 Speaker 1: There was nothing that indicated she was scared or she 43 00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:17,799 Speaker 1: was afraid to be there. Climbed into the vehicle, they 44 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:19,440 Speaker 1: pulled out into the night, and that was the last 45 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:22,919 Speaker 1: she was seeing. Okay, what exactly is it coming? Guy? 46 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: It's your typical convenience store gas pumps, you know, like 47 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 1: a seven to eleven. You're pretty accurate in describing it. 48 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: I call everything a seven to eleven, and apparently that's 49 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 1: not correct. Jason, where's You're a journalist. I'm sure you 50 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: have an eye for detail. Okay, let me ask you this, 51 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 1: Jason wret were their surveillance videos. There were surveillance videos 52 00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:46,400 Speaker 1: that did catch her getting into the vehicle, but there 53 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: wasn't anything on the video that was released to the 54 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 1: public that really gave any indication as to who she 55 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: had gone with, and so that was part of the 56 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 1: problem is nobody really seemed to know who she had 57 00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 1: disappeared with at the time. They just knew that she 58 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 1: had gotten into a vehicle, and it appeared that she 59 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:04,600 Speaker 1: was on friendly terms with the person that she got 60 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 1: into the vehicle with. She wasn't forced into it, willingly 61 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 1: got into the vehicle. And we understand something, Jason. She 62 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: got into her own vehicle or someone else's vehicle, someone 63 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 1: else's vehicle. She was the passenger in the vehicle, but 64 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:20,600 Speaker 1: nobody was forcing her to get into it. Do we 65 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:23,159 Speaker 1: have any idea what she bought inside the cove and go? 66 00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:25,159 Speaker 1: I have not been able to find out what she 67 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:27,280 Speaker 1: had bought inside the that would be interesting to me. 68 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 1: I don't know why, but you know, to Daryl Cohen, 69 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 1: former prosecutor or, a former felony prosecutor now defense attorney Atlanta, 70 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 1: Daryl Cohen, it's little details like that. I don't know why. 71 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: I just loved finding out every tiny detail about a 72 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:48,280 Speaker 1: case I prosecuted or a story, as you well know, 73 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:53,279 Speaker 1: because sometimes those details matter. For instance, what if she 74 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 1: bought a map? What if I mean, of course you 75 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:59,160 Speaker 1: can look up ways or Google map, but what if 76 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:05,279 Speaker 1: she bought map? What if she bought gloves and it's 77 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:08,120 Speaker 1: hot outside? I mean, what if she bought beer. I 78 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: don't it matters what you buy. Every detail matters, dear 79 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:16,320 Speaker 1: Old Cohen. When somebody goes missing, explain well, Nancy, the 80 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:19,280 Speaker 1: more you know, the less you don't know, and you 81 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 1: start taking clue by clue, piece by piece and discarding 82 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:27,600 Speaker 1: it or saying, well, you know what, as you point out, Nancy, 83 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 1: maybe she bought gloves. It was ninety five degrees on 84 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 1: that crazy day in December. Why would she do that? 85 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:37,120 Speaker 1: Why would she buy a map when she has Google 86 00:05:37,279 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 1: or she has ways. Maybe she didn't want her cell 87 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 1: phone to be tracked. There's so many little, tiny things 88 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 1: that appear to be nothing that when you put them 89 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:49,960 Speaker 1: all together, they are major, and they give you a 90 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 1: trail that you can follow to see what happened. Dearyl Cohen, 91 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:56,719 Speaker 1: you know you're a tree defense attorney. I'm sorry to 92 00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:59,680 Speaker 1: say because your first statement, the more you know, the 93 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 1: more you don't know, is not exactly what I was 94 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:07,880 Speaker 1: looking for. But you know that, said Bethany Marshall joining 95 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 1: me psychoanalyst out of Beverly Hills. Doctor Bethany, I want 96 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:14,680 Speaker 1: you to get your head out of Rodeo's drive, as 97 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:17,119 Speaker 1: they call it. Get your head into the real world, 98 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 1: doctor Bethany. Of course, no offense to you and your 99 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:24,159 Speaker 1: high price clients. Bethany, I found it very interesting what 100 00:06:24,320 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 1: Jason worked from the Ozarks Independent dot Com said that 101 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: she got into the car of her own volition, that 102 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 1: she didn't seemed forced. What does that tell you, doctor Bethany, 103 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:41,320 Speaker 1: And this is right here is very important. You know, Nancy, 104 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 1: as a psychoanalyst, I am always interested in the behavioral evidence, 105 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 1: not just what she might have been been buying in 106 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:52,279 Speaker 1: the come and go, but what was the nature of 107 00:06:52,320 --> 00:06:56,599 Speaker 1: the relationship between the driver of that vehicle and her? 108 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 1: And the surveillance did not show that she was forced 109 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 1: into the car. So did they have a relationship that 110 00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 1: began in the come and go? For instance, did they 111 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: strike up a conversation? Did they decide to go party? 112 00:07:11,800 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: And then it would be important if they bought alcohol 113 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 1: or tobacco or they being supplies, if there were any 114 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: such thing in the come and go? Did the driver 115 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 1: of this vehicle did they ever get the person's license plate? 116 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 1: Was that linked back to any online communication she had 117 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 1: with that particular individual? Who were McKenna's friends? Who did 118 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 1: she know? Was this person linked to anybody else she knew. 119 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:40,960 Speaker 1: This kind of behavioral evidence can be shown not only 120 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 1: in what she purchased in the come and go, but 121 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 1: how she might have chatted with that person, what her 122 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 1: online presence was, if that online presence linked back to 123 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:52,680 Speaker 1: that person. And also I would want to know from 124 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:56,240 Speaker 1: the parents, you know, how extensive were her friendships in 125 00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: this small town? Did she know? Was she a part 126 00:07:59,080 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: of a community one person might know another. I mean 127 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 1: maybe the person with whom she entered, who's the vehicle 128 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 1: she entered, was a stranger? Well not based on what 129 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 1: Jason we'ret's telling me, the person in the car was 130 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 1: not a stranger. And because she's seeing like normal, got 131 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 1: in the car talking, maybe smiling. But what is bothering 132 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 1: me Claude Steiger, among so many things, is that if 133 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 1: you could tell, as Jason weren't from Ozark's Independent dot 134 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: Com says that she got in willingly, she was fine, 135 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 1: she was smiling or talking. If you can tell all that, 136 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 1: why the hey, can't you tell who was in the car? Well, 137 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 1: I would think you might be able to tell who's 138 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 1: in the car. You may have there are probably other 139 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 1: video of that car before she had the interaction. Maybe 140 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:44,839 Speaker 1: the guy got out of it, Did it was he 141 00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:48,600 Speaker 1: in this store? Yeah? You know, Oh you didn't get 142 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 1: out of the car. Well, then you got the car. 143 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 1: And Springfield, Missouri is not a huge town. Maybe they 144 00:08:53,360 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 1: talked to her close friends and said, do you know 145 00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 1: who drives this car? Again, like doctor Bethany said, you'd 146 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 1: go through her online presence or Facebook or you know, 147 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:05,079 Speaker 1: they didn't have her phone obviously, but all those things. 148 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 1: You can get her phone records to see who she 149 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 1: even calling, who she's been talking to. Well, I'm still 150 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 1: hung up on the fact that even in this day 151 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:17,720 Speaker 1: and age, we can't enhance video because that would be 152 00:09:18,080 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 1: a prosecution's best friend. Who was she with last? That 153 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:28,120 Speaker 1: is so critical in a case like this. All we 154 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:32,000 Speaker 1: know now is that this young nineteen year old teen 155 00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:35,679 Speaker 1: girl and a small town goes to the come and 156 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:39,600 Speaker 1: goes like seven to eleven. She goes in, she comes out, 157 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 1: she gets in her car, she drives off, and she's 158 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 1: never seen alive again. What happened to McKenna milhaun Just 159 00:09:51,360 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 1: nineteen time stories with Nancy Grace. She was always fun 160 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 1: to be around. She was a very very jovial individual. 161 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: She's my red headed Missouri Mule. But this isn't the 162 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: only time McKenna had been in the news. She was 163 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 1: actually the first baby born in this millennium in Springfield 164 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,320 Speaker 1: and was featured in the Springfield Newsleader's Millennium Baby's feature 165 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: on January third, two thousand. She was born in the 166 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:38,320 Speaker 1: January first, two thousand, so she and she was the 167 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: first one, so she was on the prep page of 168 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: the paper and everything. Mike says, McKenna had a great 169 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 1: sense of humor. She's a teenager that was enjoying life 170 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: with her friends. And that's what's that cut short. She 171 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:56,839 Speaker 1: was just a fun loving person that liked people, and 172 00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:01,760 Speaker 1: people liked her. My other son and her could almost 173 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: verbat him quote all of the dialogue around the dinner 174 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 1: table from the movie, and her Nicknami became a shaken weak. Okay, 175 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: that's funny. You're hearing Mike Milhon talking about his granddaughter, 176 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 1: but the context is no laughing matter, because that granddaughter, 177 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:27,680 Speaker 1: McKenna Milhon, goes missing after just an innocent trip to 178 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 1: the convenience store. You know, that's really troubling. Doctor Bethany 179 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 1: Marshall's psychoanalyst joining me out of Beverly Hills at doctor 180 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall dot com. Doctor Bethany I learned after the 181 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:42,720 Speaker 1: murder of my fiance that life is just going along 182 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: as normal right as you think what you think normal is. 183 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:51,679 Speaker 1: That day, I was finishing in an exam, the last 184 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:57,280 Speaker 1: one of the quarter at Mercer University. I finished a 185 00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:04,319 Speaker 1: statistics exam and walked out. The hallway was dark inside 186 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 1: the building, the math building, and I walked out and 187 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 1: I remember thinking, wow, it is so bright and sunny 188 00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 1: and beautiful. Had started walking and walked across campus to 189 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: my job, which was in the library, and I stopped 190 00:12:21,559 --> 00:12:23,800 Speaker 1: half away at the student union. There were no cell 191 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 1: phones and used a pay phone to call the library 192 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,000 Speaker 1: and tell them I had been in the exam, and 193 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: I went like fifteen twenty minutes late, and I was 194 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 1: coming as fast as I could, and they told me 195 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 1: to call Keith's family. And I knew at that moment 196 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:46,280 Speaker 1: that Keith was dead and everything had just been completely normal. 197 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: I saw him just that morning. Everything was fine. And 198 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:53,280 Speaker 1: here a nineteen year old girl hops in her car 199 00:12:53,360 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 1: and goes to the gas station that come and go 200 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 1: the seven to eleven, and that's it. She's just gone, 201 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 1: and the dichotomy of a seemingly normal day just as 202 00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:11,960 Speaker 1: blown to agbl Alaback. I think that's part of the 203 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: shock when someone goes missing, Nancy. There is a dichotomy 204 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 1: because life is fragile. I mean, I listen to what 205 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 1: the family members are saying. They're talking about her personality, 206 00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 1: her life, her friendships, what she meant to them, and 207 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 1: now she is not around and they don't know where 208 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:36,680 Speaker 1: she is. And that's how danger happens. Nancy. We don't 209 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 1: necessarily see somebody stalking us across the parking lot. We 210 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: don't really know that somebody could be stalking us online, 211 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:49,840 Speaker 1: or maybe an old boyfriend is preoccupied and planning some danger. 212 00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:55,360 Speaker 1: Mostly danger is outside of awareness. That's why it's so 213 00:13:55,559 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 1: important to be aware of our surroundings, to know about 214 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:03,679 Speaker 1: strange for danger, to be careful about our attachment systems, 215 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 1: to not put ourselves in vulnerable situations. I know your fiance, 216 00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:12,000 Speaker 1: Keith did not put himself in a vulnerable situation. I 217 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:14,280 Speaker 1: think if I recall he was going to get food 218 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:16,480 Speaker 1: for a crew, that he was worked right so right, 219 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: he was studying. We met at Valdosta State where he 220 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:24,040 Speaker 1: was on baseball scholarship. He was studying geology and he 221 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 1: had to transfer to complete his degree. And when he transferred, 222 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 1: I transferred to a nearby university. My dad wouldn't let 223 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 1: me go where he was going because he said it 224 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: was too big of a university for a little girl 225 00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 1: from making. He was paying the bill, he and my mom, 226 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:42,000 Speaker 1: so I had to go along with that. I sure 227 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:46,680 Speaker 1: as didn't have enough money to pay tuition. So that's 228 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 1: how the whole thing happened. And he was working on 229 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 1: a construction crew that summer and left to go get 230 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:55,320 Speaker 1: They were out in the middle of nowhere, a very 231 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 1: rural area building I guess, some sort of an industrial complex. 232 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 1: So left at lunch time to go get everyone's soft 233 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 1: drinks to go with their lunch that they brought. He 234 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: was pulling back in and it's been mistated many many times, 235 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:15,479 Speaker 1: but a guy at least this is what the prosecutor 236 00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:18,920 Speaker 1: told me back at the time, that had been fired 237 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: the week before, I believe, was standing there angry. And 238 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: then the week before Keith had been hired. Keith pulls 239 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,160 Speaker 1: in and the company truck and the guy just goes 240 00:15:30,280 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: berserk starts shooting. He had enough sense to steelcase wallet. 241 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: I know that much, but that's you're right, he was. 242 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 1: I hate to say this close it's so cliche. In 243 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:44,400 Speaker 1: the wrong place, at the wrong time, but that is 244 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:48,320 Speaker 1: exactly what happened, so he was within the normal scope 245 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:52,200 Speaker 1: of his daily activity. Go ahead, Beth. I was just 246 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 1: saying that because of that abrupt quality with which we 247 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: can all be victims, we cannot always forestall danger, right, 248 00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 1: We cannot always see what's coming, even though we have to. 249 00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 1: But as much as possible, what I'm saying, as much 250 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:13,080 Speaker 1: as possible, we have to be aware of what's going 251 00:16:13,080 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 1: on around us. And I think the best way to 252 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:20,080 Speaker 1: be aware is to always just check your surroundings. When 253 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: you're leaving your car, or you're entering your car, you're 254 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: in a strange place, you're in a parking lot, if 255 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: you're working for a company like Keith did, if somebody's 256 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 1: been fired or there's some imminent danger, be aware of 257 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:38,240 Speaker 1: the stats on workplace shootings one in four workplace shootings, 258 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 1: or because somebody has recently been fired, or they experienced 259 00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 1: that they're not making as much money as somebody else, 260 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,800 Speaker 1: or there's a power to differential. You can just go 261 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 1: online and read about danger and at least fortify yourself 262 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 1: with knowledge, so at least you have a little bit 263 00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 1: of an advantage in life. Joining me, Jason worked from 264 00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:00,320 Speaker 1: the Ozark's Independent Jason, tell me something. Tell me about 265 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:03,160 Speaker 1: the area right now, because obviously the first person you 266 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:05,160 Speaker 1: look at is whoever is in that vehicle with her. 267 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:07,560 Speaker 1: But what time of the day or night was it? 268 00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 1: And tell me about the area where the seven to 269 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:13,520 Speaker 1: eleven was. Well, the area, I mean, it's a fairly 270 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:16,880 Speaker 1: trafficked area, but it was in the middle of the evening. 271 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,440 Speaker 1: I mean we're talking late at night. She got there, 272 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:25,800 Speaker 1: she was actually dropped off there by a friend. And 273 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:28,679 Speaker 1: what's interesting to me, Nancy, if you look at the 274 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 1: probable cost statements from the Sheriff's office, they described the 275 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:36,159 Speaker 1: person she got into the vehicle with as a friend, 276 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 1: and so the people connected to her there was that 277 00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:43,560 Speaker 1: established relationship. So she knew him ahead of time before 278 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:46,440 Speaker 1: getting into the vehicle with him. And so I think 279 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:49,399 Speaker 1: that's pretty telling that, you know, you talk about somebody 280 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:53,000 Speaker 1: just disappears without a trace. This is somebody that she knew, 281 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,120 Speaker 1: she had established a relationship, but she trusted. She had 282 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,240 Speaker 1: no idea she might be in danger when she got 283 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:01,800 Speaker 1: into that vehicle. Greene County Sheriff Jim Arnott says McKenna 284 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:06,239 Speaker 1: Milhon's body was found outside this house earlier today. He 285 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:09,200 Speaker 1: says deputies don't think the nineteen year old had a 286 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 1: connection with the home. The Springfield Police Department had been 287 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:16,359 Speaker 1: investigating her disappearance since she was reported missing. According to 288 00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: the Missouri State Highway Patrols Endangered Person Advisory for her, 289 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 1: Milhon was last seen on December twentieth. She was seen 290 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:26,199 Speaker 1: getting into a black vehicle at the come and Go 291 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: at National and Norton in Springfield. Shaff Jim Arnott says 292 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:33,199 Speaker 1: right now, authorities don't know what caused her death, but 293 00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 1: says it is being considered suspicious. Right now, we're investigating 294 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:40,960 Speaker 1: it as a homicide, as we do with any suspicious death. 295 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,920 Speaker 1: We'll work backwards from there and hopefully have some answers 296 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:48,720 Speaker 1: here shortly and right now, this house is occupied and 297 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:51,360 Speaker 1: we're still conducting an investigation a little early on at 298 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:53,399 Speaker 1: this point. If we feel that we need to extend it, 299 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 1: we'll extend it. But right now we think we have 300 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,159 Speaker 1: the scene contained of just this small area. What started 301 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:02,240 Speaker 1: as a disappearance ends when this nineteen year old girl, 302 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 1: McKenna Milhaun's body is found dead outside the home. This 303 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:11,399 Speaker 1: is after she had been missing for ten days, getting 304 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 1: into a car at a local convenience store, perfectly happy, 305 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:19,440 Speaker 1: everything fine, no sign of distress whatsoever. You're hearing our 306 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 1: friends at KY three Springfield. That was nicki Ougle speaking 307 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 1: What happened? How was the body found? How are people 308 00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:31,159 Speaker 1: inside the home and they don't know what happened? How 309 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 1: did a body end up in their yard? Are they 310 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 1: the ones that reported it? Guys Nancy Grace here we 311 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: are heading straight into breaking crime and justice news. But first, 312 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:54,600 Speaker 1: how can you keep yourself and your children safe? I 313 00:19:54,760 --> 00:20:01,720 Speaker 1: have investigated and prosecuted literally thousands of felony cases. I 314 00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: have covered literally thousands of cases of missing people, adults 315 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 1: and children, unsolved homicides, violent crimes. After all the cases, 316 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:17,760 Speaker 1: after speaking to all the victims, all the police, all 317 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 1: the witnesses, over years, what can we do about it? 318 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:26,320 Speaker 1: I don't want to just sit back and report on it. 319 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,280 Speaker 1: I want to take action, and I know you must 320 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,600 Speaker 1: feel the same way. You don't want to just hear 321 00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:34,199 Speaker 1: about crime. You want to do something about it. And 322 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 1: do something to stop it. And here is the news, 323 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:43,160 Speaker 1: Don't Be a Victim, Fighting back against America's crime Wave, 324 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:49,600 Speaker 1: a brand new book. After interviewing literally hundreds of crime 325 00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: victims and police, we put our knowledge into Don't Be 326 00:20:54,720 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 1: a Victim. This book is for everyone to stay safe 327 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:05,480 Speaker 1: or he wants to keep your loved one safe. Crime 328 00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: Online dot Com. Pre order now and know that portions 329 00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:13,800 Speaker 1: of our proceeds goes to the National Center for Missing 330 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:29,200 Speaker 1: and Exploited Children. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, another young 331 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:33,399 Speaker 1: girl gone missing ends up dead, I mean, Nancy Grace. 332 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 1: This is crime Stories straight out to Jason, we're journalist 333 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:41,199 Speaker 1: Ozark's Independent dot Com. How was she killed? Do we 334 00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:43,720 Speaker 1: know the cause of death yet, Jason? And how did 335 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:46,399 Speaker 1: this family or whoever lived in that home not know 336 00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 1: there was a dead body in the yard? Well, what 337 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,359 Speaker 1: we've been told is there was nobody in the home 338 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,359 Speaker 1: at the time and the cause of death Nancy was 339 00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 1: stab wounds to her neck. The report that came in 340 00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,840 Speaker 1: from the corner is that she was three or four 341 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:04,360 Speaker 1: times in the neck with a sharp object. Stab wounds 342 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:09,400 Speaker 1: to the neck. To doctor Michelle Dupree, renowned medical examiner, 343 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,959 Speaker 1: joining us out of South Carolina, author of Homicide Investigation 344 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,879 Speaker 1: Field Guy, Doctor dupree. When you're not joining us on 345 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:19,119 Speaker 1: crime stories, you gotta get busy. I need another book. 346 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:22,760 Speaker 1: I've already been through Homocide Investigation Field Guy, and now 347 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,439 Speaker 1: I need part two. There's been a lot of changes 348 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 1: in advances since you wrote that. I need you to 349 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:32,640 Speaker 1: update that. I don't trust anybody else, doctor dupre. Let's 350 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 1: talk about a stab wound to the neck. Three stabs 351 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:41,680 Speaker 1: to the neck, because you know when that first stab happened, 352 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 1: there had to be extensive bleeding. I'm not talking about 353 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 1: a trickle of blood. I'm talking about spurting geyser of 354 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 1: blood from a stab in the neck. Yes, Nancy, especially 355 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: if that stab wing hit an artery. Arteries are under 356 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:05,240 Speaker 1: pressure and there would be a significant amount of spurting blood. 357 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:08,360 Speaker 1: If by chance, it did hit a vein, it would 358 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:10,479 Speaker 1: still be a lot of blood, but it wouldn't be 359 00:23:10,520 --> 00:23:14,159 Speaker 1: spurting quite so much. We know that December twenty, about 360 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 1: ten o'clock at night, McKenna was seen getting into a 361 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 1: black vehicle at the seven eleven there on Norton Road, 362 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: North Springville. Perfectly good neighborhood, low crime rate, we know 363 00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:34,960 Speaker 1: also a very unusual, unusual fact, Milhun contacted her mother 364 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:41,159 Speaker 1: by phone to say she had been assaulted, raped, and 365 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:45,399 Speaker 1: was possibly in Blue Eye or a Lampy. The call 366 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 1: disconnected after about four minutes. Now, according to my timeline, 367 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:56,880 Speaker 1: that call to her mom was made the next day, 368 00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:02,520 Speaker 1: December twenty one. To Jason word O Zark's Independent dot com, 369 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:04,440 Speaker 1: what do you know about that phone call? Well, to 370 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 1: think about the phone call is Lampy and Blue Eye 371 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,920 Speaker 1: is about sixty five miles away from Springfield, so they 372 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: were well over an hour hour and a half away 373 00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:17,320 Speaker 1: from Springfield. And that area is very rural. So if 374 00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:19,399 Speaker 1: actually had a cell phone signal all to make a 375 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:21,840 Speaker 1: four and a half minute call is surprising in and 376 00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:25,000 Speaker 1: of itself, So I'm not surprised to call dropped and 377 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 1: they that was information that really wasn't released to the 378 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 1: public until after a restaurma and everything. So we had 379 00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,920 Speaker 1: no idea that had actually taken place. At the point, 380 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:37,400 Speaker 1: we just knew she was missing. We didn't have any 381 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 1: other information. Being well, why don't get that Chloyd Stiger, 382 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 1: you know, thirty six years Seattle PD, twenty two years 383 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 1: homicide detective and author, Why would police sit on that 384 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: if we know she's calling from an area Lampy or 385 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 1: Blue I sixty five miles away. I mean, why not 386 00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: put it out there that that's where she's last seen. 387 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 1: Get the public work. Well, you know, sometimes that's a 388 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: tough call sometimes whether what's to release and what not 389 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:06,359 Speaker 1: to release. You always want to see some things because 390 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 1: I'm sure they were in contact with the police or 391 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:12,400 Speaker 1: sheriff whoever it is, out in that area and centered 392 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:16,160 Speaker 1: their investigation into that neighborhood. But you know, you never know. 393 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:19,280 Speaker 1: Sometimes you put stuff out and then you're moving a 394 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,679 Speaker 1: boy getting like false confessions and stuff from people. If 395 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:26,080 Speaker 1: if you have stuff that only the killer knows and 396 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: then he tells you that and you know he couldn't 397 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 1: got anywhere else. Well, Chloyd Steiger, I normally agree with you, 398 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 1: but under these exigent circumstances, that would be more interested 399 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:38,359 Speaker 1: in finding the girl alive. A nineteen year old girl, 400 00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 1: for Pete's sake, that's just a few years older than 401 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: my twins that are twelve. And here is a girl 402 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 1: and there's something so heartbreaking to me, Doctor Bethany Marshall 403 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 1: that she gets raped and she calls her mommy. She 404 00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: calls her mother to tell her what's happened, and then 405 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:59,639 Speaker 1: the phone call gets cut off abruptly. Nancy, it is 406 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,240 Speaker 1: so heartbreaking that was her first call. You know, a 407 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 1: lot of women who are assaulted becomes so ashamed and 408 00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: so frightened that they tell no one. But McKenna had 409 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:17,240 Speaker 1: the type of trusting, dependent relationship with her mother that 410 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,960 Speaker 1: that was her first call. I cannot imagine the mother 411 00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 1: receiving a call like this, the call being broken off, 412 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,560 Speaker 1: and then the police not wanting to put out like 413 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,000 Speaker 1: an all point bulletin to find out where she is. 414 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:33,800 Speaker 1: I mean the heartbreak and the not knowing, and you 415 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,680 Speaker 1: know we talk about the body being found in the ditch. 416 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,760 Speaker 1: When the mother received that call, she did not know 417 00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 1: that her daughter was going to be murdered. She just 418 00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:45,760 Speaker 1: was desperate to find her daughter and terrified that her 419 00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:47,919 Speaker 1: daughter has been raped. Well, maybe I'm not understanding the 420 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:52,880 Speaker 1: timeline correctly, but to you, Jason wert Ozar's independent explain 421 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:57,399 Speaker 1: to me, she calls her mom to say she's been raped, 422 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:03,680 Speaker 1: but then everything just drops, isn't it like two days 423 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,080 Speaker 1: later before police put out the alert. Well, her mother 424 00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 1: actually didn't go to the police until the next day, 425 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: so there was a little bit of time delay between 426 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 1: that call Andrew actually going and filing the report with 427 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,239 Speaker 1: the police. As soon as the police did get that 428 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,399 Speaker 1: report that that happened, they immediately send something out to 429 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 1: the local media with the information of where she had 430 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,160 Speaker 1: been taken as she was last seeing it to come 431 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:29,879 Speaker 1: and go. They did not glue the information about Lampy 432 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:33,240 Speaker 1: and what we received at Ozark's independent, but they made 433 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:35,399 Speaker 1: it very clear of who they were looking for, the 434 00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:38,600 Speaker 1: vehicle she was in, and so they released pretty much 435 00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 1: the information they usually released when someone goes missing. Two. 436 00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:47,959 Speaker 1: Daryl Cohen, former prosecutor now defense attorney, joining us out 437 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: of the Atlanta jurisdiction. Daryl, you know, I've worked with 438 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,640 Speaker 1: Mark Klass for so many years. You know, its daughter 439 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:59,880 Speaker 1: Pauli went missing and was actually kidnapped from her own home. 440 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:04,320 Speaker 1: She was having a sleepover. He is, you know, the 441 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,400 Speaker 1: the ultimate, the gold standard and what to do if 442 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,919 Speaker 1: someone goes missing. But in my mind, this should have 443 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:14,640 Speaker 1: been her photo on TV, on radio, on billboards, on 444 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,520 Speaker 1: if you can't get a billboard, the flyers, and I'm 445 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,560 Speaker 1: getting the sense that none of that happened in this case, Nancy, 446 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:22,840 Speaker 1: the more I hear, the more questions I were. You 447 00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 1: quit saying that for Pete's sake. More information, more, the 448 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:28,040 Speaker 1: more you know, you the more you don't know. The 449 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,639 Speaker 1: more I know, the more questions I have. You know 450 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: I'm not a job. Don't try to buddy the water. 451 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: I may have gone semi dark side, but not completely. 452 00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 1: I'm concerned. We have a four minute phone call. I 453 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 1: was raped. Mom does not report it immediately to the police. 454 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 1: What does that tell me? It tells me that McKenna 455 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:52,600 Speaker 1: was with somebody that her mom knew, and her mom 456 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,160 Speaker 1: may have been upset that she was raped according to 457 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,960 Speaker 1: her daughter, but didn't report it, which means mom is familiar. 458 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 1: Year was a person that McKenna was with. That is 459 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 1: likely in my view, why she did not report it 460 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,680 Speaker 1: to the police until she didn't hear back. I got 461 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 1: to find out who was in that car. You're absolutely right. 462 00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 1: But before we go into forensics and the stab wounds 463 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 1: and how many stab wounds, let me tell you something. 464 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:25,280 Speaker 1: Kenna Milhan was born January one, two thousand, Springfield, and 465 00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: she was a millennial baby for Springfield, the first baby 466 00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:34,040 Speaker 1: born in two thousand at one eight eight m She 467 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:38,800 Speaker 1: graduated from Reid's Spring High School. She went to Ozark 468 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: Technical College. She was studying to be a nurse. She 469 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 1: wanted to become a pediatrician, a baby doctor. According to 470 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,320 Speaker 1: her family, she had the most beautiful smile that could 471 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 1: light up your soul. Mom says she tried to see 472 00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: the best in everyone and never met a stranger. She 473 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 1: had a huge heart. She loved animals, loved her brothers. 474 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:11,680 Speaker 1: It hurts me to read this young girl's obituary as 475 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:16,560 Speaker 1: we try to hash out forensic evidence and video surveillance 476 00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:23,160 Speaker 1: and wound patterns and timelines. This little girl, mckennah Milhoan 477 00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:42,760 Speaker 1: was kidnapped and murdered. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace looking 478 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:46,520 Speaker 1: into the past of Lonnie Williams, who also goes by Leon. 479 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 1: He was charged today with first degree murder in the 480 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,080 Speaker 1: death of McKenna milhan. So a first degree murder is 481 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 1: committed when someone knowingly kills another person after deliberation. As 482 00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 1: we looked at the elements of the offense facts as 483 00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: we know him from the investigation currently, the facts of 484 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 1: this kats met those standards. McKenna Milhan's mother reported her 485 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,840 Speaker 1: daughter missing on December twenty second, two days after receiving 486 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:15,040 Speaker 1: a text from McKenna that she had been raped been 487 00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:19,000 Speaker 1: on Monday, eight days later, her body was found outside 488 00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:24,040 Speaker 1: a home along Highway H north of Springfield. The investigation 489 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,080 Speaker 1: led detectives to Lonnie Williams, who they say admitted to 490 00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 1: being with Milhan in December, but claimed the two had 491 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,560 Speaker 1: consensual sex before he dropped her off. You are hearing 492 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:40,800 Speaker 1: our friends at KY three Springfield. That's Christine Morton. This 493 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:46,200 Speaker 1: reminds me so much of the cheerleader in Alabama that 494 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:52,240 Speaker 1: was burned alive, and then the claim by the perp 495 00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:57,240 Speaker 1: who killed another woman in New Orleans, another young woman 496 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:02,200 Speaker 1: claimed consensual set Now, how does that always get into it? 497 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 1: Why is it always that the victim is somehow blamed 498 00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 1: that they had sex that is not what happened. Because 499 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:13,360 Speaker 1: this little girl calls her mom and says, mom, I've 500 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:17,479 Speaker 1: been raped, says after she's been last seated at this 501 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:21,520 Speaker 1: convenience store, the call is cut off abruptly. I don't 502 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:23,920 Speaker 1: think they lost a signal. I think the call was 503 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:29,920 Speaker 1: cut off. Now we hear this guy claiming they had 504 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:35,480 Speaker 1: consensual sex. Really, we also know that this guy, Lonnie 505 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:40,960 Speaker 1: William's girlfriend, Olivia Vega, is charged with the burning burning 506 00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 1: clothing Lonnie William's clothes after the crime. Why would he 507 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 1: burn his clothes if he didn't do anything wrong? How 508 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 1: did this young girl, completely innocent, end up stabbed three 509 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,320 Speaker 1: times in the neck after a visit to the seven 510 00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 1: eleven Joy to me right now is a very special 511 00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:07,040 Speaker 1: guest who alerted me via Facebook to this crime, Rain 512 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 1: Marie Davis. She actually dated Lonnie Williams and has a 513 00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 1: five month old son with the suspect Lonnie Williams. Right first, 514 00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: tell me what led you to contact me on Facebook. 515 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,680 Speaker 1: I've always, you know, wanted to speak out and be 516 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 1: a voice for young girls who are have been sexually 517 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:38,440 Speaker 1: abused in things like that, you know, and knowing this 518 00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 1: person that I thought I knew, you know, it just 519 00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,920 Speaker 1: gave me hopes that I could at least, you know, 520 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:49,920 Speaker 1: speak out on that you don't really know a person fully, 521 00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:52,560 Speaker 1: whether you think you know that person or not, and 522 00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:56,240 Speaker 1: meeting people on the Internet and things of that nature. 523 00:33:56,360 --> 00:34:01,480 Speaker 1: It's just not so good because this is the outcome 524 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 1: of things like that. You know. Tell me what you 525 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,319 Speaker 1: know about this case, Rain, I kind of have learned 526 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:13,640 Speaker 1: a lot of details about Lonnie from this case. You know, 527 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:19,240 Speaker 1: I talked to him after he was charged with the murder. 528 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,719 Speaker 1: I didn't know that he was. You know, at first 529 00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,880 Speaker 1: he was in jail on a probation violation. I was like, okay, 530 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:28,920 Speaker 1: you know whatever. So we were talking, and you know, 531 00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:34,240 Speaker 1: whenever they had linked him to this murder, he called 532 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:36,160 Speaker 1: me on the phone that day and was like, I'm 533 00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,360 Speaker 1: being charged with murder. And I was like, what do 534 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,560 Speaker 1: you mean. You know, wrong place, wrong time, type of 535 00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:45,279 Speaker 1: situation or what. And he was like, no, I was 536 00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:49,839 Speaker 1: drugged by somebody, you know, things like that and whit 537 00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 1: whit white, white white. So he says he Lonnie Williams 538 00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:58,560 Speaker 1: was drugged. He's claiming he was drugged. But he told 539 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:01,360 Speaker 1: me two different stories in the same sentence. One was 540 00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,440 Speaker 1: someone slipped something in his drink. In the next one 541 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:08,120 Speaker 1: was someone shot drugs into his arm. But you wouldn't 542 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 1: remember that, you know what I'm saying. Actually, what he 543 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 1: first told police is that he picked her up and 544 00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:19,880 Speaker 1: that they drove around for a while, and that he 545 00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:22,879 Speaker 1: stopped to have sex with this young girl in an 546 00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 1: alleyway before dropping her off at Atlantic in Maine at 547 00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:33,200 Speaker 1: one a m and that was his last contact with her. 548 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:38,319 Speaker 1: That's what he first told police. And you know, to 549 00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:41,279 Speaker 1: Cloyd Steiger thirty six years Seattle PD, twenty two years, 550 00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 1: homicide author Seattle's Forgotten serial killer, Gary Jane Grant at 551 00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:51,040 Speaker 1: Kloyd Steiger dot com, Cloyd, I have prosecuted. And you know, 552 00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:53,400 Speaker 1: Gerald Cohen, for all I know, you were a defense 553 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:56,080 Speaker 1: lawyer on some of these where you get a witness 554 00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:00,120 Speaker 1: and they are in the car, let's just say, and 555 00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:04,480 Speaker 1: they're doing a robbery, and then their testimony goes and 556 00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:08,600 Speaker 1: then I looked out the window and bam. Why is 557 00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,480 Speaker 1: it that they always look the other way just at 558 00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:14,920 Speaker 1: the time of the homicide? And in this case, Lonnie 559 00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:17,960 Speaker 1: Williams thirty two years old out with a nineteen year 560 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:22,640 Speaker 1: old girl says, uh, the night she's killed. Oh, I 561 00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:25,680 Speaker 1: pulled over and had consensual sex with her in an 562 00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:29,000 Speaker 1: alley in a car, and then I dropped her off. 563 00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:34,120 Speaker 1: What a coinkie dank. Then she's killed. Yeah, you know 564 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:38,959 Speaker 1: these guys, Yeah, well, these guys they know that, he said. 565 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:41,479 Speaker 1: They're thinking they're going to find my DNA on her 566 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:43,600 Speaker 1: and I have to think of a reason why it's there. 567 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,040 Speaker 1: And so he comes up with this ridiculous story. But 568 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:50,160 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, having someone tell a ridiculous story 569 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 1: that could be easily disproved, such as the statements he 570 00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:59,080 Speaker 1: made to miss ring Marie there that that is as 571 00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:01,680 Speaker 1: good as confession. When it's so ridiculous, you know, you 572 00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:03,680 Speaker 1: just say, here you go with that one. Now you're 573 00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:06,359 Speaker 1: you're locked into a story. You can't change it later. 574 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,200 Speaker 1: This is what you gotta go with. And I'm sure 575 00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:13,239 Speaker 1: that people like mister Cohens hate it when their clients 576 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:16,799 Speaker 1: wrap themselves up like that. Again, give themselves no ouse. 577 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 1: But that's what he was thinking. How am I going 578 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,640 Speaker 1: to explain that being there when they find the body 579 00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:22,680 Speaker 1: if they find the body, and they certainly would because 580 00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:24,759 Speaker 1: he didn't do a rather job of covering up. It 581 00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: sounds like, so this guy gives multiple statements, multiple statements. 582 00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:33,440 Speaker 1: But take a listen to our friends at KO l 583 00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:37,000 Speaker 1: R ten. This is Jesse Edman. Thirty two year old 584 00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:41,160 Speaker 1: Lonnie Williams is charged with first degree murder and armed 585 00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:45,759 Speaker 1: criminal action. He's accused of stabbing Milhan multiple times and 586 00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:49,440 Speaker 1: his girlfriend, twenty three year old Olivia Vega. She is 587 00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 1: charged with evidence tampering after allegedly burning William's bloody clothes 588 00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:57,319 Speaker 1: and hiding the knife used to kill Milhan. Now we 589 00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,680 Speaker 1: know that on December twenty second, Milhan was ported missing 590 00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:04,480 Speaker 1: by her mother, and on Monday, December thirtieth, her body 591 00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:07,600 Speaker 1: was found north of Springfield after a tip was received 592 00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:11,239 Speaker 1: by police. Now, initially, Williams told deputies that he had 593 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,960 Speaker 1: no involvement in her death after picking her up from 594 00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:17,200 Speaker 1: Come and Go on North Kansas Expressway in Norton Road, 595 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:22,759 Speaker 1: but investigators interviewed Williams again and he confessed to killing McKenna. Now, 596 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,479 Speaker 1: Williams is accused of stabbing mil Han to death after 597 00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: picking her up at the gas station on December nineteenth, 598 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,840 Speaker 1: and according to the probable cause statement, Williams confessed to 599 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:34,239 Speaker 1: driving around with mil Han, then stabbing her in the 600 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,279 Speaker 1: neck inside the vehicle, and then stabbing her three or 601 00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:40,399 Speaker 1: four more times outside of the vehicle. Wow, okay, there's 602 00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:43,960 Speaker 1: another version of what happened to doctor Michel du Pre 603 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,479 Speaker 1: South Carolina Medical Exam and her author, Homicide Investigation Field 604 00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:50,359 Speaker 1: Guide Dargor Dpre. You know why he came up with 605 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:53,520 Speaker 1: that consensual sex story in an alley. Part of that's 606 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: probably true. They probably were in an alley when he 607 00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,640 Speaker 1: killed her, because he knew he raped her, and he 608 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,799 Speaker 1: knew that there's DNA evidence that there's gonna be sperm. 609 00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 1: How long can sperm reveal DNA evidence inside a body? 610 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,320 Speaker 1: I know, I think I know after about seventy six hours. 611 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:14,040 Speaker 1: First the head of the sperm breaks off, then the 612 00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:17,719 Speaker 1: tail breaks off. Then you've got just the body part. 613 00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:21,400 Speaker 1: Let's just pretend the torso of the sperm and zoa 614 00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:25,080 Speaker 1: still there, but you can still get DNA from And 615 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:29,480 Speaker 1: how long will sperm last inside a body, regardless of 616 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,839 Speaker 1: the elements around the body? Nancy, You're absolutely right. It's 617 00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:36,080 Speaker 1: approximately seventy two hours, and that was a wonderful rendition 618 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:37,719 Speaker 1: of what happened. But I think I want to hear 619 00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:39,959 Speaker 1: it from you. You're the MD. I'm just a JD. 620 00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:42,280 Speaker 1: You tell it. So it is about seventy two hours 621 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:46,279 Speaker 1: that we can actually get viable DNA from sperm that 622 00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,160 Speaker 1: is found inside a body. How do you do it? 623 00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:53,040 Speaker 1: How do you get the DNA from sperm? And what's 624 00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:55,520 Speaker 1: the difference in semen and sperm. I've always wanted to 625 00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:58,719 Speaker 1: know that, but didn't know who to ask. Is a 626 00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:02,440 Speaker 1: lot of sperm together. UM sperm is the usually the 627 00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:08,200 Speaker 1: individual um sperm that actually Jackie wanted to know, and 628 00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:10,640 Speaker 1: so as she put me up to asking, Okay, now, 629 00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:13,440 Speaker 1: so how do you extract DNA from the um. We 630 00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:16,960 Speaker 1: do UM A DNA tests. We can do UM many 631 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,000 Speaker 1: different ways. Typically we will do swabs um of the 632 00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,440 Speaker 1: vaginal area or whoever we think the sperm might be 633 00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:25,440 Speaker 1: UM and then we actually run that through UM for 634 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:27,840 Speaker 1: DNA UM and see if we can get a match 635 00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:32,680 Speaker 1: to someone in coodus or not. So to rain Marie Davis, 636 00:40:32,719 --> 00:40:37,520 Speaker 1: who actually has a son with the alleged part. Lonnie Williams, 637 00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:42,200 Speaker 1: what can you tell me about this guy Lonnie Williams? Um? Well, 638 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:45,120 Speaker 1: you know, from what I knew of him, he had 639 00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:49,200 Speaker 1: some behaviors that were, you know, kind of sketchy, you know, 640 00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:52,880 Speaker 1: make you wonder. I mean, he never was violent towards me. 641 00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: We always, you know, we got along real good. Everything 642 00:40:56,760 --> 00:41:00,160 Speaker 1: was good between them. He didn't seem like that kind 643 00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:04,600 Speaker 1: of person to me anyways, you know what I mean. 644 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:07,680 Speaker 1: And but no I don't, I don't tell me what 645 00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:10,520 Speaker 1: you mean by that, Like, he never showed no aggression 646 00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:14,160 Speaker 1: towards me. It was never, you know, he was real 647 00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:16,799 Speaker 1: hands on with I have two little girls too. He 648 00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:19,560 Speaker 1: was around my kids, you know, he was real good 649 00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:24,200 Speaker 1: with my kids. He seemed to be a decent person 650 00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:27,839 Speaker 1: from what I thought, I knew all. What was he doing? 651 00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:30,480 Speaker 1: I mean, even by his account having sex with a 652 00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:33,680 Speaker 1: nineteen year old girl in a car in an alleyway, Well, 653 00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,399 Speaker 1: you have the baby. How'd that happened? I mean, that's 654 00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:39,000 Speaker 1: a big red fly to me. But that's just me. Yeah, 655 00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:43,759 Speaker 1: I honestly have no idea about any of that. You know, 656 00:41:44,080 --> 00:41:48,719 Speaker 1: he hasn't really been there much for my child, and 657 00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,680 Speaker 1: I'm only finding out that he's got like three other 658 00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:54,680 Speaker 1: kids that were born a month apart from mine, like 659 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:59,080 Speaker 1: a kid born in August, mind September, one in October. 660 00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:03,600 Speaker 1: All of these things that are coming out about him 661 00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:07,319 Speaker 1: aren't just pointing him to being a woman I easier 662 00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:11,200 Speaker 1: type of guy who uses women to his ability, you 663 00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:14,680 Speaker 1: know what. I know. That's got to hurt so badly 664 00:42:15,440 --> 00:42:18,879 Speaker 1: to go through having a child, which is hard enough. Oh, 665 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:22,919 Speaker 1: now you're supporting the baby five months old, a little boy, 666 00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,640 Speaker 1: all by yourself, and you find out not only is 667 00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:30,720 Speaker 1: he charged with murder, but he's had all these other children. 668 00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:32,719 Speaker 1: These are the ones you know of. You know, I 669 00:42:32,760 --> 00:42:35,319 Speaker 1: got to go to a shrink. Doctor Bethany Marshall at 670 00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:38,360 Speaker 1: doctor Bethany Marshall dot com. This is making my head hurt. 671 00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:43,960 Speaker 1: Let me ask you something. Not only did rain Marie Davis, 672 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:48,480 Speaker 1: who contacted us via Facebook about this case, get taken 673 00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:51,640 Speaker 1: in by this guy? She knows of three other women 674 00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:55,560 Speaker 1: did that did? But what about this other girl girlfriend? 675 00:42:55,760 --> 00:43:00,839 Speaker 1: And quotes Olivia Vega just twenty three charge with tampering 676 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:04,680 Speaker 1: with evidence. I mean, probably was a normal person then 677 00:43:04,719 --> 00:43:07,000 Speaker 1: get sucked in by this guy. I'm looking at him. 678 00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:09,960 Speaker 1: He's not all that. He's not all that at all. 679 00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:11,920 Speaker 1: He ain't that in a bag of chips. I can 680 00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:15,000 Speaker 1: tell you that much. He's you know, okay looking. But 681 00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:20,160 Speaker 1: I mean, why how can't a man be a Svengali 682 00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,879 Speaker 1: or woman? But I always see cases with men and 683 00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,440 Speaker 1: get women to do all sorts of things they wouldn't 684 00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:28,839 Speaker 1: normally do. Nancy, I did the same thing you did. 685 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:31,160 Speaker 1: I looked at his bug shot and I kept thinking, 686 00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:33,960 Speaker 1: who is this man? He's only thirty two years old. 687 00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:37,600 Speaker 1: These women are being taken in by him. He is 688 00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:40,120 Speaker 1: not all that, He's just oh you know who he 689 00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:43,160 Speaker 1: looks like he looks a little bit like Jesse Smolette. Yes, 690 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:46,120 Speaker 1: a little bit, a little bit, except I think probably 691 00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:49,440 Speaker 1: a little bit more handsome, because Smilette is handsome to 692 00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:52,279 Speaker 1: some people. Now that I know he's pulled a big scam, 693 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,840 Speaker 1: I don't find him handsome at all, but I understand 694 00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:57,480 Speaker 1: what other people seen him. I felt the same way 695 00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:00,120 Speaker 1: about Scott Peterson. Everybody said, oh he's so handsome. I 696 00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:04,799 Speaker 1: never thought he'd looked good ever anyway, But back back 697 00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:06,560 Speaker 1: to this guy. Let me get off Scott Peterson and 698 00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:09,520 Speaker 1: Jesse Smollett and who have nothing to do with this. Hey, 699 00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:12,080 Speaker 1: for those of you listening, this is what happens at 700 00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:15,799 Speaker 1: the lunch table when you're in the DA's office. We 701 00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:20,600 Speaker 1: talk about all the weird, sometimes up two, sometimes unconnect 702 00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:24,800 Speaker 1: disconnected facts about a case. What the point is doctor Bethany. 703 00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:27,200 Speaker 1: I mean, he's okay, but he's not all that. How 704 00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,879 Speaker 1: is he getting all these women under his spell? Then 705 00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,160 Speaker 1: he's got one nineteen year old girl dead after he 706 00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:37,480 Speaker 1: raped her, And now this perfectly attractive young girl, Olivia Vega, 707 00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:42,200 Speaker 1: is implicated in murder Nancy. You know Robert Hare, he's 708 00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:46,480 Speaker 1: a leading researcher in sociopathy. He has a twenty point checklist, 709 00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:50,160 Speaker 1: the Hair twenty point Psychopathy Checklist. You can google it 710 00:44:50,239 --> 00:44:52,680 Speaker 1: us on the internet. It's used in forensic settings. It's 711 00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:56,920 Speaker 1: twenty characteristics of a sociopath. If anyone else there is 712 00:44:57,080 --> 00:45:00,040 Speaker 1: curious about, I'm doing it right now. I want to 713 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:05,400 Speaker 1: make sure my husband David is twenty characteristics of a sociopath. 714 00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:08,239 Speaker 1: Hold on, okay, keep going okay. So one of the 715 00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:14,440 Speaker 1: characteristics is promiscuity. They often have multiple relationships. Why do 716 00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:18,000 Speaker 1: they have a picture of Daryl Cohen here? Okay, go ahead, 717 00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:24,560 Speaker 1: twenty characterists, Jess kidding, go ahead, lying, twenty characterists. Manipulative 718 00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:28,680 Speaker 1: psychopathy is what he how he has it? Twenty point 719 00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:33,120 Speaker 1: checklist psychopathy. So the lying looking at it right now, 720 00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:38,000 Speaker 1: you're absolutely right. The Hair Psychopathy checklist. Twenty most common 721 00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:41,000 Speaker 1: traits of a psychopath. You need to make sure. Okay, 722 00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:44,120 Speaker 1: so what about this guy do you think fits in 723 00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,400 Speaker 1: with these traits? And just a point for the listeners, 724 00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:50,239 Speaker 1: make sure you go to his original list because there's 725 00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:52,680 Speaker 1: many people who have made over the list and written 726 00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:56,320 Speaker 1: articles about it. Go to his list. It is based 727 00:45:56,320 --> 00:46:00,600 Speaker 1: on robust research, but it describes this purpose to a tea. 728 00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:05,120 Speaker 1: First of all, they always they never follow the conditions 729 00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:07,520 Speaker 1: of parole. So remember he was brought in on a 730 00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:12,239 Speaker 1: probation violation drug and alcohol abuse. To remember, he says 731 00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:15,080 Speaker 1: he was drugged, and there are all the stories about drugs, 732 00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:20,120 Speaker 1: Lyon conning, manipulativeness of promises. Why in order to get 733 00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:24,560 Speaker 1: your own way, never say you're sorry. Charming and persuasive, 734 00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:28,160 Speaker 1: that's one that may touch on why women fall for him. 735 00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:31,040 Speaker 1: And the two characteristics that always stand out to me 736 00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:35,480 Speaker 1: one is or three poor behavioral controls. So that's why 737 00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:39,200 Speaker 1: they could rape and kill that they have a thin 738 00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:44,799 Speaker 1: veneer of affability, but when somebody disagrees with them, that 739 00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:49,520 Speaker 1: veneer snaps and it covers up a cold, calculated interior. 740 00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:53,320 Speaker 1: That's how we got all these women. He's probably charming 741 00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:57,640 Speaker 1: and social and promises them everything, but the minute they disagreed, 742 00:46:57,680 --> 00:47:00,680 Speaker 1: he snaps. And I think that one of the other ones, 743 00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:05,200 Speaker 1: Nancy is parasitic lifestyle. They're parasites. They leech off other people. 744 00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:08,520 Speaker 1: He has all these babies, but as Rain says, he 745 00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:11,200 Speaker 1: doesn't even come to the city's own son. I doubt 746 00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:14,440 Speaker 1: he's paying child support. I doubt he's paying child support 747 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,200 Speaker 1: for all these other children he's fathered. So that's the 748 00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:21,040 Speaker 1: parasitic lifestyle. So and also Hair talked about the mask 749 00:47:21,120 --> 00:47:24,120 Speaker 1: of sanity, that these guys know that they're different from 750 00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,960 Speaker 1: other people in society, so they put on what he 751 00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:30,360 Speaker 1: calls the mask of sanity, meaning they pretend to be 752 00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,719 Speaker 1: normal even though they're not. And that's why Rain got 753 00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:36,520 Speaker 1: taken in. He acts normal even though he's not normal. 754 00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:42,640 Speaker 1: To Jason, weren't Ozark's independent dot com? Jason, where does 755 00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:47,799 Speaker 1: the case stand now? And what about this so called girlfriend, 756 00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:52,719 Speaker 1: Olivia Vega well Ray now and everything? Spending trials are 757 00:47:52,719 --> 00:47:54,959 Speaker 1: going to be going to court in March. They're still 758 00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:56,719 Speaker 1: trying to determine whether they're going to go for the 759 00:47:56,760 --> 00:47:59,600 Speaker 1: death penalty in this case or not. And you know, 760 00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:03,399 Speaker 1: nance the interesting thing about this is you'll talk about 761 00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:06,480 Speaker 1: the fact that he's spitting all these tales. The thing 762 00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:08,719 Speaker 1: that jumps out most of all in his statements to 763 00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:11,680 Speaker 1: police is he claims he was going north on State 764 00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:14,239 Speaker 1: Highway H and that he pulled off the road to 765 00:48:14,320 --> 00:48:17,320 Speaker 1: relieve himself. Nancy, they were less than a mile away 766 00:48:17,360 --> 00:48:19,760 Speaker 1: from a come and go, So if that was a concern, 767 00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:21,600 Speaker 1: he would have stopped at the come and go that 768 00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:23,480 Speaker 1: he would not have pulled off the road where he did, 769 00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:26,360 Speaker 1: and where he pulled off was a very public location. 770 00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:30,320 Speaker 1: So it's a situation where he's very clearly lying in 771 00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:33,440 Speaker 1: his statement, and so I would not be surprised if 772 00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:36,000 Speaker 1: they go for the death penalty. Well, I mean, with 773 00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:39,760 Speaker 1: the criminal history and stabbing a young girl three times 774 00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:43,640 Speaker 1: in the neck after raping her, you know what, if 775 00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:45,720 Speaker 1: we're gonna have the death penalty, and I'm not getting 776 00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:48,960 Speaker 1: into a death penalty argument, but if we are going 777 00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:53,759 Speaker 1: to have it, this guy, Lonnie Leon Williams is the 778 00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:57,719 Speaker 1: perfect candidate and number one, I'd get Olivia Vega to 779 00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:03,840 Speaker 1: turn state sevenants and make that case to Rain Marie Davis. 780 00:49:04,680 --> 00:49:09,360 Speaker 1: Thank you Rain for speaking out. We wait as justice unfolds. 781 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:12,560 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace crime story signing off, Goodbye friend,