WEBVTT - The Fyre Festival Fiasco 

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's

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<v Speaker 2>Chuck and Jerry's here with us too. So this is

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<v Speaker 2>a straight ahead episode of Stuff you Should Know, the

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<v Speaker 2>podcast That's right.

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<v Speaker 1>And today we're discussing the Fire Festival, the festival that

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<v Speaker 1>never happened f y r of which there were two

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<v Speaker 1>documentaries made, and I'm pretty positive I saw both of

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<v Speaker 1>them back when they came out.

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<v Speaker 2>Who la la. I only saw one.

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<v Speaker 1>Which one did you see?

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<v Speaker 2>I saw the Netflix one?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think I saw both of them because I

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<v Speaker 1>was like, I don't want to miss anything, right.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, Yeah, I think I got the gist of it

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<v Speaker 2>from the Netflix one. I saw it essentially when it

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<v Speaker 2>came out, so I haven't seen it in a little while,

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<v Speaker 2>but I did an awful lot of reading about this

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<v Speaker 2>and a lot of stuff back.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right. We're going to kind of let it unfold

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<v Speaker 1>as it happened or as it didn't happen rather, which

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<v Speaker 1>means I guess we should start with the organizer of

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<v Speaker 1>this musical festival that was not right.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, mister william Z, Billy McFarland, this guy Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>this guy, that's another way to put it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he was born in New York in ninety one.

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<v Speaker 2>He's a millennial through and through, and he was essentially

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<v Speaker 2>a rich kid. I don't know that he was like

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<v Speaker 2>fabulously wealthy. I don't have that impression, but he was.

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<v Speaker 2>His family is pretty well to do. They were real

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<v Speaker 2>estate developers in New York, which is really kind of

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<v Speaker 2>all you need to know. But he was brought up

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<v Speaker 2>in like a nice suburb in New Jersey and he

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<v Speaker 2>seemed to have had. What you need to know about

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<v Speaker 2>this guy is he is a business minded cat. Yes,

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<v Speaker 2>that's what he wants to do. He wants to create

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<v Speaker 2>successful businesses, start up. She's got the whole dot com

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<v Speaker 2>bug essentially. And apparently so. There's an author, a journalist

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<v Speaker 2>named Gabrielle Bluestone who wrote a book on the Fire

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<v Speaker 2>Festival and she she chronicles Billy McFarlane creating his first

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<v Speaker 2>company in the fifth grade, a web posting company whatever

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<v Speaker 2>that is, not web hosting, no posting. Yeah, so putting

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<v Speaker 2>stuff on the web. That was his business model, I guess.

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<v Speaker 2>And he had He said that he had three full

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<v Speaker 2>time adult employees in India working for his company which

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<v Speaker 2>he was which he founded in the fifth grade.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right. Apparently in that same book, in the name

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<v Speaker 1>of the book, by the way, is Hype Colon inside

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<v Speaker 1>the Fire Festival in the Golden Age of Grift. And

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<v Speaker 1>in that book she also says that he claims at

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<v Speaker 1>least that he sold start and sold three companies while

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<v Speaker 1>still in high school. H although that has been verified,

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<v Speaker 1>but I wouldn't be surprised, because this guy most starting companies,

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<v Speaker 1>it seems like.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So the first verifiable company that he started was

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<v Speaker 2>while he was attending Bucknell University or buck Nail. He

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<v Speaker 2>dropped out in twenty eleven to work more on a

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<v Speaker 2>social media platform. It was an online ad platform that

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<v Speaker 2>actually had some pretty big advertisers. He called it Spling

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<v Speaker 2>sp l i NG And he dropped out, but not

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<v Speaker 2>before he got like a five thousand dollars like essentially

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<v Speaker 2>a little scholarship prize I guess for venture capital, like

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<v Speaker 2>five thousand dollars capital seed from Bucknhell University. He said,

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<v Speaker 2>thank you very much, I'm dropping out, and then he

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<v Speaker 2>started generating investment from investors's divers as the CFO of

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<v Speaker 2>a pharma company to actual like private equity companies.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I mean the guy had a knack for drawing investors,

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<v Speaker 1>that's for sure. I think if I'm doing quick math,

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<v Speaker 1>four hundred and fifty four hundred and seventy five plus

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<v Speaker 1>a little juice from Cornell, like four hundred close to

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<v Speaker 1>five hundred grand he got for this spling startup. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and you know he did that for a little while.

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<v Speaker 1>I guess that was a couple of years, because in

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<v Speaker 1>twenty thirteen he started something new. He abandoned splaying and

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<v Speaker 1>started and this is covered in the documentary the credit

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<v Speaker 1>card company Magnus's m A G N I S e S,

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<v Speaker 1>which was a credit card. He was like, Hey, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>going to start a new credit card. No one's done

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<v Speaker 1>that in a while, and it's gonna be metal, and

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<v Speaker 1>it's going to look cool, and we're gonna kind of,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, take from what the Soho House did, kind

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<v Speaker 1>of literally in that they opened a loft in Soho

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<v Speaker 1>in New York and said, you've got a membership here.

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<v Speaker 1>You can come to these cool parties and you can

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<v Speaker 1>get like the whole the thing was beyond just having

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<v Speaker 1>this sort of fancy credit card that made you stand

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<v Speaker 1>apart from the crowd. In that crowd, you could also

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<v Speaker 1>supposedly get like advanced reservations when they were impossible to

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<v Speaker 1>get or get into the club that was impossible to

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<v Speaker 1>get into if you had this card.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was like the Players with Yourself card.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So here's here's the first flash of what you need

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<v Speaker 2>to know about Billy McFarland. The Magnus's card. It was

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<v Speaker 2>very cool. The whole thing was set up pretty neatly,

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<v Speaker 2>but it was not a credit card. What it did

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<v Speaker 2>was you took your Bank of America or Wells Fargo

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<v Speaker 2>debit card and it copied the information from the magnetic

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<v Speaker 2>strip onto the magnetic strip you for Magnuss. So essentially

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<v Speaker 2>what you had was a cool, metal I believe black

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<v Speaker 2>version of your Wells Fargo debit card. And that's that

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<v Speaker 2>was it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, aside from the membership in the SOHO loft and

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<v Speaker 1>the supposed perks that came along to getting into the

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<v Speaker 1>clubs and things, that's why people got it.

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<v Speaker 2>Here's the problem with that. They weren't able to deliver

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<v Speaker 2>on what those perks were.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, not at all. And this is you know, kind

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<v Speaker 1>of the first in a series of stories about over

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<v Speaker 1>promising and under delivering to say the least.

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<v Speaker 2>For sure. So here's also where it starts to become

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<v Speaker 2>a bit of a Ponzi scheme. Magnus seems to have

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<v Speaker 2>been like his heart was in that one, so he

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<v Speaker 2>was really he was spending a lot more money than

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<v Speaker 2>he was taking in. I think I saw at its

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<v Speaker 2>peak it had seven hundred members and that was it.

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<v Speaker 2>But so he was just just spending way too much

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<v Speaker 2>money to keep that company afloat. So he's like, all right,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to start another company and then I can

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<v Speaker 2>use the revenue from that company to keep Magnuses afloat

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<v Speaker 2>and keep my investors happy. And I'm going to call

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<v Speaker 2>this new company Fire Media FYR.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>And it actually was kind of a clever idea. It

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<v Speaker 2>was a talent booking app for anybody, Like if you

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<v Speaker 2>had the money, you could get in touch with say,

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<v Speaker 2>off the top of my head Wrapper Jaw Rule and say,

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<v Speaker 2>hey man, I'm throwing a really ill party and I

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<v Speaker 2>want you to perform there. How much do you want?

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<v Speaker 2>He would say, this is how much I want, and

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<v Speaker 2>you would pay him and book him, and you didn't

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<v Speaker 2>have to use any promoters or you didn't have to

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<v Speaker 2>know anybody. All you had to do was have this

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<v Speaker 2>Fire app And like, I think it was a good idea,

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<v Speaker 2>but he created that almost exclusively to keep Magnuses propped up.

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<v Speaker 2>Keep that in mind.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I'm going to withhold judgment on whether or

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<v Speaker 1>not I think that was a cool idea. Okay, but

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<v Speaker 1>I'm glad you did.

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<v Speaker 2>Sure I said clever. I don't think I said cool.

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<v Speaker 2>Did I say cool? Oh?

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<v Speaker 1>You said cool more than once?

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Oh it's a cool idea, all right, I'll stand

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<v Speaker 2>behind that.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, great, So you're right he was doing that

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<v Speaker 1>to keep Magnus's afloat. He was using those corporate cards,

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<v Speaker 1>which again were just Reskin debit cards of his own employees,

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<v Speaker 1>of the employees of Fire to fund the Magnus events,

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<v Speaker 1>and they were left to put the bill. There was

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<v Speaker 1>this one guy in the documentary I think his name

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<v Speaker 1>was M. David Lowe, and he says that he was

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<v Speaker 1>left two hundred thousand dollars in debt and he was

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<v Speaker 1>an employee. So that should give you an idea of

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<v Speaker 1>how this guy's going to end up treating concert goers

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<v Speaker 1>that he doesn't even know, which is what would kind

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<v Speaker 1>of you know, happen next. Essentially when he said, all right,

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<v Speaker 1>I need some more cash. Basically, fire media really needs

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<v Speaker 1>to take off in order to save magnuses and so

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<v Speaker 1>a music festival. Those things make tons of money, right guys,

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<v Speaker 1>That's a great way to make dough. So that was

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<v Speaker 1>the next big idea.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So essentially, this fire festival, which is the crux

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<v Speaker 2>of our story, was an idea that was meant to

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<v Speaker 2>promote the fire app, which was created to fund and

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<v Speaker 2>keep afloat the Magnus's fake credit card.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, so here we are in the fall of

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<v Speaker 1>twenty sixteen, and he wants to throw this thing in

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<v Speaker 1>the spring of twenty seventeen. So keep that timeline in mind.

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<v Speaker 1>That's about six months to throw a major music festival

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<v Speaker 1>in the Bahamas. I don't know anything about throwing a

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<v Speaker 1>major music festival, so I'm a novice, but that seems

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<v Speaker 1>like a pretty short time span to me.

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<v Speaker 2>I actually don't really know much about throwing a music

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<v Speaker 2>festival either, but I did see in a few articles

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<v Speaker 2>covering this that experts, essentially people who have thrown them,

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<v Speaker 2>say you want twelve months minimum to do this, or

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<v Speaker 2>maybe they said you need usually on average twelve months

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<v Speaker 2>from the outset, from the time that he decided to

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<v Speaker 2>do this, he gave himself the six months and then,

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<v Speaker 2>as we'll see, he actually gave himself way way less

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<v Speaker 2>than that to actually organize this thing because the Fire

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<v Speaker 2>Festival was built entirely on hype. In the first several

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<v Speaker 2>months of the project were given exclusively to figuring out

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<v Speaker 2>how to hype this project that hadn't even been planned

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<v Speaker 2>or organized yet. This is so fiery.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So he you mentioned jaw Rule, he was involved

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<v Speaker 1>in this as well hip hop artists. Jaw Rule was

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<v Speaker 1>he was sort of the main face of the thing,

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<v Speaker 1>like definitely the biggest name that he got involved, I think,

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<v Speaker 1>unless like you're really in the know as far as

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<v Speaker 1>like models and influencers go. And his co I guess

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<v Speaker 1>his business partner was another guy named Grant Margalin. He

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<v Speaker 1>was a VP of marketing, and right out of the gate,

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<v Speaker 1>he started hiring PR companies because, like you said, he

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<v Speaker 1>wanted to create this hype, so he got legit companies.

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<v Speaker 1>He got an ad agency named Jerry Media PR Firm

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<v Speaker 1>forty two West and a media company called Vaynermedia, and

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<v Speaker 1>in December of twenty sixteen, he was like, I got

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<v Speaker 1>to get something out there that people can actually see.

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<v Speaker 1>So we contract did with Matt m Att Projects to

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<v Speaker 1>film a promo video in the Bahamas where it was

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<v Speaker 1>going to be held. And that's about the only thing

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<v Speaker 1>he ever actually created.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and like they really threw a lot at this.

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<v Speaker 2>They hired a bunch of, like you said, Instagram models,

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<v Speaker 2>Kendall Jenner, Hayley Bieber, Chanelle Lemon, and several others. I

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<v Speaker 2>think there was like six like legit millennial supermodels who

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<v Speaker 2>came out to the Bahamas to shoot this this promotional video,

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<v Speaker 2>and the Matt Projects company like showed up. They they

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<v Speaker 2>did a really good job creating this incredibly slick video.

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<v Speaker 2>But by hiring these Instagram models, they also had a

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<v Speaker 2>built in way of just generating tons of hype when

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<v Speaker 2>that video was done, and actually even before the video

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<v Speaker 2>was done, they're like, Hey, why don't you take some

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<v Speaker 2>of these picks from the shoot and you know, put

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<v Speaker 2>them on post them on your Instagram account just to

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<v Speaker 2>kind of get people hyped up about the hype that

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<v Speaker 2>we're creating for the festival.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you know what you obviously don't see in that

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<v Speaker 1>hype video or the promo video was the reality of that,

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<v Speaker 1>which the documentaries both cover. It was pretty chaotic. There

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<v Speaker 1>was some pretty funny scenes in there where they were

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<v Speaker 1>trying to get these models to get in swim in

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<v Speaker 1>the ocean at night. You know. For the shot, Billy

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<v Speaker 1>referred to the attendees as your average losers, and it

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<v Speaker 1>was just you know, it was kind of a mess,

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<v Speaker 1>but obviously the result was you know, beautiful people frolicking

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<v Speaker 1>in the beautiful Bahamas, right. They promised an immersive experience

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<v Speaker 1>on a private island once owned by Pablo Escobar, which

0:12:39.880 --> 0:12:42.520
<v Speaker 1>would turn out to be a pretty fateful mistake to

0:12:42.600 --> 0:12:46.200
<v Speaker 1>say that. But what they didn't include was stuff like, hey,

0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:49.880
<v Speaker 1>who's actually going to be playing because they hadn't booked

0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:51.160
<v Speaker 1>any musical acts at that point.

0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:54.400
<v Speaker 2>No, so if you look at this very slick video,

0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:57.480
<v Speaker 2>none of all of the music acts are generic gets

0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:01.000
<v Speaker 2>all stock footage of like Ray or something like that,

0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:05.280
<v Speaker 2>really well produced, good looking like stock footage, but not

0:13:05.480 --> 0:13:07.960
<v Speaker 2>real stuff. Right, But so it was all just kind

0:13:07.960 --> 0:13:10.839
<v Speaker 2>of suggested. And to give you another idea of the

0:13:11.240 --> 0:13:13.559
<v Speaker 2>way that they were promoting this, they were saying that

0:13:13.880 --> 0:13:17.760
<v Speaker 2>Fire Festival will be a quest to explore beyond boundaries

0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:20.720
<v Speaker 2>like they used words like that, and the whole thing.

0:13:21.200 --> 0:13:26.719
<v Speaker 2>The whole thing was essentially publicized as a complete luxury

0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:29.280
<v Speaker 2>event top to bottom. It was going to be the

0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:34.320
<v Speaker 2>most amazing, luxury exclusive music festival anyone has ever thrown.

0:13:34.600 --> 0:13:37.120
<v Speaker 2>And that promotional video really kind of looked like it

0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:40.200
<v Speaker 2>so much so that that was what they used for

0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:43.640
<v Speaker 2>marketing from that point forward through the end of the festival.

0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:46.400
<v Speaker 2>That was it. Everything came from that photo shoot and

0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:47.080
<v Speaker 2>video shoot.

0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:51.480
<v Speaker 1>That's because that's all they had, right right, Literally, yeah,

0:13:51.600 --> 0:13:53.480
<v Speaker 1>a good time for a break, I think, yeah for sure.

0:13:53.880 --> 0:13:55.920
<v Speaker 1>All right, so that's a little setup of what's coming

0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:58.240
<v Speaker 1>or not coming your way, and we'll be right back

0:13:58.280 --> 0:14:07.320
<v Speaker 1>after this. Stars the sky. There was so much stu

0:14:22.800 --> 0:14:25.440
<v Speaker 1>all right. So in order to promote this video that

0:14:25.480 --> 0:14:29.160
<v Speaker 1>they had shot, they needed they needed people to see this.

0:14:29.280 --> 0:14:31.440
<v Speaker 1>They needed tons of eyeballs so they could sell tons

0:14:31.440 --> 0:14:34.720
<v Speaker 1>of tickets. So they got together with Jerry Media and

0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:39.240
<v Speaker 1>they convinced all these influencers at the same time on

0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:43.640
<v Speaker 1>December twelfth, twenty sixteen, on their socials to post an

0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:46.680
<v Speaker 1>orange tile, just an orange square. I think they got

0:14:46.680 --> 0:14:49.800
<v Speaker 1>like four hundred plus people, and that would direct people

0:14:49.840 --> 0:14:52.000
<v Speaker 1>to the website and the promo video and everything, and

0:14:52.160 --> 0:14:55.200
<v Speaker 1>a lot of people did this, like athletes, musicians, models,

0:14:55.440 --> 0:14:58.200
<v Speaker 1>and it actually went viral, like it really really worked.

0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:01.560
<v Speaker 1>That was actually a pretty good idea, and people started

0:15:01.560 --> 0:15:04.240
<v Speaker 1>buying tickets, like thousands of people started plunking down money.

0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:06.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think I saw that they were like ninety

0:15:06.360 --> 0:15:10.160
<v Speaker 2>eight percent sold out, like almost immediately. So it really

0:15:10.200 --> 0:15:12.680
<v Speaker 2>was a great idea, paying all those influencers to do that,

0:15:13.240 --> 0:15:16.400
<v Speaker 2>and so great, now we've got the Fire Festival ready

0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:20.000
<v Speaker 2>to go, Like, you got tickets sold, you've got the

0:15:20.040 --> 0:15:23.360
<v Speaker 2>promo materials out there, you have all these influencers generating

0:15:23.400 --> 0:15:26.360
<v Speaker 2>all this buzz. And he got one more boost. He

0:15:26.480 --> 0:15:29.800
<v Speaker 2>paid Kendall Jenner a quarter of a million dollars to

0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:33.480
<v Speaker 2>put one post on Instagram about it. And I didn't

0:15:33.520 --> 0:15:37.240
<v Speaker 2>see the post, but apparently she intimated that the like

0:15:37.320 --> 0:15:40.960
<v Speaker 2>she left it open to people's imagination, the possibility that

0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:43.760
<v Speaker 2>Kanye West would be performing there, because remember he was

0:15:43.800 --> 0:15:46.440
<v Speaker 2>her brother in law at the time. Yeah, and of

0:15:46.480 --> 0:15:48.680
<v Speaker 2>course Kanye West never had anything to do with it,

0:15:48.760 --> 0:15:51.760
<v Speaker 2>But if you were things a certain way, then can

0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:53.880
<v Speaker 2>leave it to people's imagination and let them think what

0:15:53.920 --> 0:15:56.280
<v Speaker 2>they want kind of thing, right, So that was like

0:15:56.600 --> 0:15:59.720
<v Speaker 2>the nail, the final nail. They're like, this is this

0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:02.160
<v Speaker 2>is great, We're going to do this and let's start

0:16:02.360 --> 0:16:03.360
<v Speaker 2>figuring this out.

0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and by figuring out, it was February. And remember

0:16:07.640 --> 0:16:09.760
<v Speaker 1>they were trying to do this thing in the spring, right,

0:16:10.080 --> 0:16:12.000
<v Speaker 1>which I don't know if that means. I don't know

0:16:12.040 --> 0:16:13.760
<v Speaker 1>when spring is in the Bahamas. I don't know if

0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:18.080
<v Speaker 1>they consider May spring. But let's generously say they even

0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:22.440
<v Speaker 1>consider May spring. Okay, it's late February. And that that's

0:16:22.480 --> 0:16:26.040
<v Speaker 1>when they started planning the actual logistics of this festival, like,

0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:29.440
<v Speaker 1>how are we actually going to do this? They didn't

0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:34.600
<v Speaker 1>have accommodations at all. They promised luxury accommodations. These were

0:16:34.640 --> 0:16:38.000
<v Speaker 1>going to range from glamping tents to private villas. None

0:16:38.000 --> 0:16:40.640
<v Speaker 1>of these things existed yet because they didn't even have

0:16:40.720 --> 0:16:45.640
<v Speaker 1>a site secured because they had mentioned it was Pablo

0:16:45.800 --> 0:16:49.080
<v Speaker 1>Escobar's Island at one point, this was Norman's k and

0:16:49.160 --> 0:16:50.960
<v Speaker 1>the owner of that island was like, I don't like

0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:54.640
<v Speaker 1>you mentioning Pablo Escobar in association with my island, so

0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:56.600
<v Speaker 1>you can't have it here. So they didn't even have

0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:57.720
<v Speaker 1>a place in February.

0:16:57.840 --> 0:17:00.280
<v Speaker 2>Now they shot themselves in the foot and just not

0:17:00.360 --> 0:17:05.600
<v Speaker 2>putting on Pablo Escobar's private island or formerly belonging to

0:17:05.600 --> 0:17:08.720
<v Speaker 2>pabl Escobar. However, they said it, if they just had

0:17:08.760 --> 0:17:11.760
<v Speaker 2>not done that, this might be a completely different story.

0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:14.879
<v Speaker 2>Maybe at least it would have been a little bit

0:17:14.880 --> 0:17:17.160
<v Speaker 2>of a different story. It actually could have been worse, frankly,

0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:19.760
<v Speaker 2>now that I think about it. But they finally found

0:17:19.800 --> 0:17:22.240
<v Speaker 2>a spot. There was another thing too, like if the

0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:26.320
<v Speaker 2>web archive has some of the pages of the original

0:17:26.359 --> 0:17:29.280
<v Speaker 2>fire festival site, and if you go on like the

0:17:29.320 --> 0:17:32.520
<v Speaker 2>packages thing, they're like up to a quarter of a

0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:36.560
<v Speaker 2>million dollar packages for like three nights on yachts and stuff,

0:17:36.600 --> 0:17:41.560
<v Speaker 2>and they even named the yachts. They had no bargains, deals,

0:17:41.920 --> 0:17:45.600
<v Speaker 2>talks whatsoever with the owners of any of those yachts,

0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:48.600
<v Speaker 2>and these guys were selling quarter of a million dollar

0:17:48.720 --> 0:17:52.440
<v Speaker 2>packages involving these yachts that they had no access to,

0:17:52.760 --> 0:17:55.399
<v Speaker 2>right so they were really scrambling for all this, And

0:17:55.440 --> 0:17:56.840
<v Speaker 2>one of the first things they had to do was

0:17:56.880 --> 0:17:59.800
<v Speaker 2>find a replacement for Norman's k and they finally found

0:17:59.800 --> 0:18:04.000
<v Speaker 2>one on the charming area known as Roker Point on

0:18:04.119 --> 0:18:06.120
<v Speaker 2>Great Exzema Island, in the Bahamas.

0:18:06.760 --> 0:18:08.639
<v Speaker 1>That's right, it's not a private island at all, So

0:18:08.960 --> 0:18:12.760
<v Speaker 1>out of the gate, they've already under delivered. Sure, it

0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:17.119
<v Speaker 1>was an undeveloped plot of land. Apparently it was pretty rocky.

0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:20.320
<v Speaker 1>It has been described as a gravel pit. And if

0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:23.600
<v Speaker 1>you see the documentaries in the actual footage, you know,

0:18:23.680 --> 0:18:26.400
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't look like anything that's capable of hosting even

0:18:26.400 --> 0:18:28.879
<v Speaker 1>if you knew what you were doing, hosting a concert

0:18:28.880 --> 0:18:31.520
<v Speaker 1>event like this. And they had forty five days to

0:18:31.560 --> 0:18:34.240
<v Speaker 1>do it, to build this like, you know, village essentially,

0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:37.240
<v Speaker 1>they're you know, they're trying to replicate like the Coachella's

0:18:37.280 --> 0:18:38.840
<v Speaker 1>and all these things that literally kind of go out

0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:41.399
<v Speaker 1>in the middle of nowhere and build or like Burning

0:18:41.400 --> 0:18:43.919
<v Speaker 1>Man and build a village. And they had forty five

0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:47.400
<v Speaker 1>days to do this. So he hired hundreds of locals

0:18:48.520 --> 0:18:52.120
<v Speaker 1>to put up you know, ikea furniture essentially and try

0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:54.080
<v Speaker 1>and get these things going, get these tents built, these

0:18:54.080 --> 0:18:58.960
<v Speaker 1>glamping tents. And I think what one of McFarland's big

0:18:59.080 --> 0:19:02.680
<v Speaker 1>errors that well, he started way too late first of all. Sure,

0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:05.440
<v Speaker 1>and who knows if he ever even you know, planned

0:19:05.480 --> 0:19:07.120
<v Speaker 1>on getting this thing off the ground to begin with,

0:19:07.200 --> 0:19:11.159
<v Speaker 1>but he didn't realize there's something called island time. And

0:19:11.160 --> 0:19:13.399
<v Speaker 1>if you've ever been to the Caribbean or it's probably

0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:16.159
<v Speaker 1>like this at islands all over the world or just

0:19:16.200 --> 0:19:19.040
<v Speaker 1>beach towns in general. Sure, things just move slower. Like

0:19:19.520 --> 0:19:23.160
<v Speaker 1>you can't go into a restaurant on a Caribbean island

0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:26.200
<v Speaker 1>and like start complaining that the service is slow. And

0:19:26.280 --> 0:19:28.960
<v Speaker 1>that's from like restaurants all the way to everything. Everything

0:19:29.040 --> 0:19:31.160
<v Speaker 1>just moves a little slower and at its own pace.

0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:34.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you're meant to kind of downshift a couple of

0:19:35.480 --> 0:19:39.440
<v Speaker 2>gears as well, the kind of mellow apple supposed to point. Yeah,

0:19:39.560 --> 0:19:42.639
<v Speaker 2>don't bring the agro like city stuff there.

0:19:43.359 --> 0:19:44.240
<v Speaker 1>Not to island time.

0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:47.480
<v Speaker 2>No, So yeah, I think what you're saying, in a

0:19:47.560 --> 0:19:50.240
<v Speaker 2>very roundabout way is that the things that needed to

0:19:50.280 --> 0:19:53.280
<v Speaker 2>get done for the festival did not get done. Just

0:19:53.320 --> 0:19:55.600
<v Speaker 2>as a little aside that'll come up later. There's a

0:19:55.600 --> 0:19:58.880
<v Speaker 2>woman named Mary Ann Roll who owns a local catering

0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:02.640
<v Speaker 2>company that the fire festival hired to feed those workers,

0:20:03.080 --> 0:20:05.480
<v Speaker 2>and she made as many as one thousand meals a

0:20:05.600 --> 0:20:09.320
<v Speaker 2>day during these I think forty five days while these

0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:13.320
<v Speaker 2>workers were working from day one up through I think

0:20:13.400 --> 0:20:15.840
<v Speaker 2>up to like the day before the fire festival. So

0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:17.680
<v Speaker 2>just put that in your hat and smoke it later.

0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:22.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, for sure. So they are having big cash flow

0:20:22.240 --> 0:20:24.960
<v Speaker 1>issues despite the fact that all these people had paid

0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:27.760
<v Speaker 1>all kinds of money for these tickets already, and so

0:20:28.080 --> 0:20:31.520
<v Speaker 1>he starts what he calls the Fire Tour, these little

0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:35.360
<v Speaker 1>pop up concerts or supposed to be pop up concerts

0:20:35.359 --> 0:20:38.240
<v Speaker 1>to promote the festival, right, but most of those don't

0:20:38.240 --> 0:20:39.879
<v Speaker 1>even go off. These are supposed to be in cities

0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:45.359
<v Speaker 1>all over the world. Most of those canceled, So you know,

0:20:45.680 --> 0:20:50.040
<v Speaker 1>he's left without a source of income basically leading up

0:20:50.080 --> 0:20:51.160
<v Speaker 1>to the festival.

0:20:50.760 --> 0:20:53.200
<v Speaker 2>Which is crazy because they were selling tons and tons

0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:56.680
<v Speaker 2>of tickets. But he had raised so much money from

0:20:56.680 --> 0:20:59.640
<v Speaker 2>investors for this, and they were burning through so much

0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:02.560
<v Speaker 2>money that he was like it was gone before it

0:21:02.640 --> 0:21:05.639
<v Speaker 2>went to him, or like it was gone as soon

0:21:05.680 --> 0:21:09.000
<v Speaker 2>as it came in. From what I can tell, he

0:21:09.200 --> 0:21:11.040
<v Speaker 2>came up with another idea. He's like, Okay, we need

0:21:11.040 --> 0:21:13.080
<v Speaker 2>a new instant form of cash flow. How about this.

0:21:13.520 --> 0:21:16.200
<v Speaker 2>We'll say that you have to use an RFID bracelet

0:21:16.240 --> 0:21:18.560
<v Speaker 2>to spend money there, and you have to preload money

0:21:18.600 --> 0:21:20.840
<v Speaker 2>on it, and you better do it now. So if

0:21:20.880 --> 0:21:23.000
<v Speaker 2>you want to be able to buy anything, say like

0:21:23.080 --> 0:21:26.359
<v Speaker 2>booze or whatever on the island, you have to have

0:21:26.400 --> 0:21:28.800
<v Speaker 2>this little bracelet kind of like Disney World or something, right,

0:21:29.840 --> 0:21:32.880
<v Speaker 2>And they suggested you put at least three hundred dollars

0:21:32.920 --> 0:21:35.760
<v Speaker 2>for each day that you're going to be at the festival,

0:21:36.200 --> 0:21:38.880
<v Speaker 2>and in the hopes that people would just start loading

0:21:39.480 --> 0:21:43.280
<v Speaker 2>their wristbands up. And I think it worked to some degree,

0:21:43.320 --> 0:21:45.800
<v Speaker 2>but there was no amount of cash coming in at

0:21:45.800 --> 0:21:49.480
<v Speaker 2>this point to cover what the investors had put in,

0:21:49.760 --> 0:21:54.240
<v Speaker 2>and apparently even to cover the anything that the festival

0:21:54.240 --> 0:21:56.600
<v Speaker 2>had delivered, except for there is a place in the

0:21:56.640 --> 0:21:59.320
<v Speaker 2>Bahamas that we will try to get you to and

0:21:59.359 --> 0:22:01.520
<v Speaker 2>when you show up, that place will be there.

0:22:02.400 --> 0:22:03.320
<v Speaker 1>And it will be lit.

0:22:04.200 --> 0:22:04.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:22:04.560 --> 0:22:09.359
<v Speaker 1>Ill, all right, So the festival is very close to

0:22:09.600 --> 0:22:13.919
<v Speaker 1>you know, the data is impending and people start noticing,

0:22:13.960 --> 0:22:17.359
<v Speaker 1>tickets holders start noticing like, you know what, I haven't

0:22:17.400 --> 0:22:21.920
<v Speaker 1>seen anything on Instagram, like you know, usually when there's

0:22:21.920 --> 0:22:24.080
<v Speaker 1>something like that, it's like, hey, look at how great

0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:26.680
<v Speaker 1>this place is coming along, Look how awesome it looks.

0:22:27.040 --> 0:22:29.320
<v Speaker 1>It's still just that one video that they had shot,

0:22:29.359 --> 0:22:32.160
<v Speaker 1>you know, back in I guess early part of the year.

0:22:33.040 --> 0:22:35.680
<v Speaker 1>They can't get worse still, they can't get information about

0:22:35.720 --> 0:22:39.439
<v Speaker 1>their flights and their accommodations, like what tint am I

0:22:39.480 --> 0:22:41.560
<v Speaker 1>actually going to be in, or what villa am I

0:22:41.600 --> 0:22:43.040
<v Speaker 1>actually going to be in? I want to pick up

0:22:43.040 --> 0:22:44.320
<v Speaker 1>my room before I get there.

0:22:44.240 --> 0:22:47.960
<v Speaker 2>Right right, So people start questioning this. There's a guy

0:22:48.119 --> 0:22:51.479
<v Speaker 2>on Twitter named Calvin Wells who set up fire fraud

0:22:52.000 --> 0:22:54.639
<v Speaker 2>and just basically tracked all these like shady things that

0:22:54.680 --> 0:22:59.240
<v Speaker 2>were going on or like questions people have. People started

0:23:00.320 --> 0:23:04.080
<v Speaker 2>leaving comments on posts about, you know, hyping the fire festival,

0:23:04.160 --> 0:23:07.240
<v Speaker 2>questioning the whole thing, and just basically saying this doesn't

0:23:07.280 --> 0:23:10.720
<v Speaker 2>sound legit at all. Those things got deleted by Jerry Media,

0:23:10.720 --> 0:23:14.560
<v Speaker 2>who is running social media for the for the fire festival.

0:23:14.560 --> 0:23:19.640
<v Speaker 2>And then starting finally the day before the festival, the

0:23:19.840 --> 0:23:24.080
<v Speaker 2>fire media people essentially reached out to their VIPs and

0:23:24.119 --> 0:23:27.399
<v Speaker 2>said just skip the first weekend. Come the second weekend,

0:23:27.680 --> 0:23:29.600
<v Speaker 2>because there was one weekend at the end of April

0:23:29.600 --> 0:23:31.320
<v Speaker 2>and there was the next weekend at the beginning of

0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:33.919
<v Speaker 2>May that was a fire festival, two weekends. They're like,

0:23:34.000 --> 0:23:35.399
<v Speaker 2>just come to the second one. The first one's going

0:23:35.440 --> 0:23:37.720
<v Speaker 2>to be a little we're figuring out the kinks, so

0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:40.520
<v Speaker 2>don't come to the first one. Their employees too, were

0:23:40.560 --> 0:23:43.840
<v Speaker 2>told like, don't come. But the employees were like, we

0:23:43.960 --> 0:23:47.040
<v Speaker 2>already are in Miami waiting to be shuttled down to

0:23:47.080 --> 0:23:47.840
<v Speaker 2>the Bahamas.

0:23:49.040 --> 0:23:52.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. If you're telling the staff not to come, but

0:23:52.200 --> 0:23:55.040
<v Speaker 1>you've allowed the ticket holders to come, yes, then you're

0:23:55.080 --> 0:23:58.400
<v Speaker 1>doing things in the wrong order. And that's just my opinion. Again,

0:23:58.400 --> 0:23:59.800
<v Speaker 1>I've never thrown up music festival.

0:24:00.040 --> 0:24:02.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and that's a really good point, Chuck. They didn't

0:24:02.440 --> 0:24:04.359
<v Speaker 2>tell the ticket holders not to come.

0:24:05.240 --> 0:24:09.240
<v Speaker 1>No, they didn't. The night before the festival, their biggest act,

0:24:09.760 --> 0:24:12.200
<v Speaker 1>or I guess their biggest rock act, at least blink

0:24:12.240 --> 0:24:15.879
<v Speaker 1>of one eighty two pulls out of the festival. Somebody

0:24:16.600 --> 0:24:18.800
<v Speaker 1>smartly in their camp was like, you don't want to

0:24:18.800 --> 0:24:21.760
<v Speaker 1>be you're already unfortunately associated with this, but you don't

0:24:21.760 --> 0:24:23.320
<v Speaker 1>want to be any any more of a part of

0:24:23.320 --> 0:24:24.120
<v Speaker 1>this than you already are.

0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:26.920
<v Speaker 2>No, and there. Their their statement was classy too. They

0:24:26.960 --> 0:24:29.040
<v Speaker 2>just said they're not sure that they would have all

0:24:29.119 --> 0:24:31.639
<v Speaker 2>the resources they needed to put on a quality show

0:24:31.680 --> 0:24:33.320
<v Speaker 2>for their fans, so.

0:24:33.280 --> 0:24:35.879
<v Speaker 1>They pull out and it starts to rain really heavy.

0:24:35.920 --> 0:24:38.040
<v Speaker 1>It's sort of one of those moments in the documentary

0:24:38.080 --> 0:24:43.240
<v Speaker 1>where insult to injury starts happening, and employees are still,

0:24:43.280 --> 0:24:46.480
<v Speaker 1>I mean, bless their hearts, they're still trying to set

0:24:46.480 --> 0:24:48.879
<v Speaker 1>this stuff up. I felt so bad for the people

0:24:48.920 --> 0:24:53.040
<v Speaker 1>that worked for this, uh for Fire Media, because they're

0:24:53.119 --> 0:24:56.719
<v Speaker 1>they're trying to set up these tents still. They're unpacking loading,

0:24:56.800 --> 0:25:00.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, shipping containers or unpacking mattresses, all this Freddy

0:25:01.119 --> 0:25:03.600
<v Speaker 1>furniture that they had bought at the last minute, and

0:25:03.760 --> 0:25:06.639
<v Speaker 1>work eventually halted because it was just you know, it

0:25:06.680 --> 0:25:09.320
<v Speaker 1>was a rainstorm. It was too bad. So there were

0:25:09.440 --> 0:25:12.760
<v Speaker 1>soggy mattresses left out on the ground everywhere, and it

0:25:12.800 --> 0:25:17.159
<v Speaker 1>was you know, it looked like it looked like a

0:25:17.240 --> 0:25:19.520
<v Speaker 1>hurricane had come through and wiped out what was once

0:25:19.640 --> 0:25:20.480
<v Speaker 1>a promising thing.

0:25:20.960 --> 0:25:25.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, So like imagine like a whole work site

0:25:25.040 --> 0:25:27.600
<v Speaker 2>of people getting ready for the festival the night before

0:25:27.640 --> 0:25:29.720
<v Speaker 2>and they were really behind and everybody's working hard, and

0:25:29.760 --> 0:25:32.359
<v Speaker 2>then a whole mon soon comes and everybody runs for

0:25:32.440 --> 0:25:35.680
<v Speaker 2>cover and then never comes back. That's what the Fire

0:25:35.760 --> 0:25:40.680
<v Speaker 2>Festival looked like when the first guests started to show up.

0:25:42.720 --> 0:25:45.200
<v Speaker 1>Maybe a second break. I feel like we're right at the.

0:25:45.080 --> 0:25:46.680
<v Speaker 2>Precipice I think so too, man.

0:25:47.119 --> 0:25:49.239
<v Speaker 1>I can't wait to hear Blink. Well, they already pulled out.

0:25:49.280 --> 0:25:51.800
<v Speaker 1>I can't wait to hear the other musical acts. So

0:25:51.840 --> 0:25:54.639
<v Speaker 1>we'll be right back after this. Just like the number

0:25:54.680 --> 0:25:59.960
<v Speaker 1>of stars the sky, there was so much stuff.

0:26:17.160 --> 0:26:20.840
<v Speaker 2>Okay, chuck. So it's festival day. It's April twenty eighth.

0:26:20.920 --> 0:26:23.919
<v Speaker 2>And on the morning of April twenty eighth, some of

0:26:23.920 --> 0:26:28.439
<v Speaker 2>the people started showing up. There was supposedly private jet service,

0:26:28.480 --> 0:26:31.600
<v Speaker 2>but actually it was just a small airline that was

0:26:31.720 --> 0:26:35.439
<v Speaker 2>shuttling people from Miami's airport down to the Bahamas. And

0:26:35.520 --> 0:26:38.000
<v Speaker 2>the first group showed up the morning of April twenty eighth,

0:26:38.240 --> 0:26:41.680
<v Speaker 2>and the festival organizers were like, we have to figure

0:26:41.680 --> 0:26:44.560
<v Speaker 2>out what to do with these people. That's not ready yet.

0:26:44.880 --> 0:26:47.080
<v Speaker 2>So they got them on a shuttle like a bus.

0:26:47.440 --> 0:26:50.679
<v Speaker 2>They drove them to a local bar and said the

0:26:50.720 --> 0:26:52.760
<v Speaker 2>bar's open, everybody help yourself.

0:26:53.520 --> 0:26:55.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's a school bus too, Just keep that in mind,

0:26:55.920 --> 0:26:57.760
<v Speaker 1>not that it matters. A bus is a bus, but

0:26:58.000 --> 0:27:01.679
<v Speaker 1>they're nicer buss buses than others. True, especially in the Caribbean.

0:27:01.880 --> 0:27:04.640
<v Speaker 1>And this was a school bus. Okay, maybe a bluebird,

0:27:04.680 --> 0:27:05.919
<v Speaker 1>who knows those are pretty nice.

0:27:06.280 --> 0:27:09.240
<v Speaker 2>The bluebirds are, Yeah, they're top quality, so.

0:27:10.480 --> 0:27:14.800
<v Speaker 1>They send them there. They tried in Vain, I guess

0:27:14.840 --> 0:27:19.280
<v Speaker 1>to initially at least actually assigned tents to people because

0:27:19.280 --> 0:27:21.320
<v Speaker 1>it wasn't like there wasn't one tint set up. They

0:27:21.320 --> 0:27:24.119
<v Speaker 1>had gotten a little bit done, but there were hundreds

0:27:24.160 --> 0:27:26.159
<v Speaker 1>of people there kind of wondering what to do and

0:27:26.200 --> 0:27:29.080
<v Speaker 1>where to go, and so much so that Billy who

0:27:29.200 --> 0:27:31.480
<v Speaker 1>was there, Billy mcfarney actually got up on a table

0:27:31.960 --> 0:27:34.840
<v Speaker 1>and said, just go find a tint, pick up your

0:27:34.840 --> 0:27:37.520
<v Speaker 1>own tint and take it to a place and set

0:27:37.520 --> 0:27:40.560
<v Speaker 1>it up. And some of those people were game enough

0:27:40.560 --> 0:27:42.240
<v Speaker 1>to like, well it's not going off well, but at

0:27:42.320 --> 0:27:44.760
<v Speaker 1>least we can get a tent and find a good spot,

0:27:45.080 --> 0:27:47.159
<v Speaker 1>and so they tried starting to do that.

0:27:47.400 --> 0:27:50.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I don't remember from the documentary, but apparently there

0:27:50.520 --> 0:27:53.639
<v Speaker 2>was like that just opened the floodgates for people making

0:27:53.640 --> 0:27:56.120
<v Speaker 2>a mad rush to grab a tent before somebody else

0:27:56.160 --> 0:27:58.960
<v Speaker 2>grabbed it. For sure, and the tents, by the way,

0:27:59.000 --> 0:28:01.439
<v Speaker 2>we should say, so remember you mentioned glamping, like not

0:28:01.560 --> 0:28:05.240
<v Speaker 2>everybody was buying the quarter of a million dollar yacht

0:28:05.280 --> 0:28:09.600
<v Speaker 2>package that you could get tickets for, you know, several

0:28:09.680 --> 0:28:12.320
<v Speaker 2>hundred dollars and that's what these tents were. But they

0:28:12.359 --> 0:28:15.480
<v Speaker 2>were supposed to still be like really nice tents. I

0:28:15.520 --> 0:28:19.240
<v Speaker 2>saw that they were leftover FEMA tents from Hurricane Matthew,

0:28:19.920 --> 0:28:22.080
<v Speaker 2>and that that's what had been set up for these people,

0:28:22.240 --> 0:28:24.680
<v Speaker 2>and not even set up in most cases, like you said,

0:28:24.760 --> 0:28:26.800
<v Speaker 2>they kind of had to finish setting these things up

0:28:26.840 --> 0:28:30.760
<v Speaker 2>themselves and drag the wet mattresses into their tent. So

0:28:30.880 --> 0:28:33.879
<v Speaker 2>this is how the fire festival is starting at this point.

0:28:34.600 --> 0:28:36.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, they didn't have their luggage, so they started inquiring

0:28:36.920 --> 0:28:41.440
<v Speaker 1>about that, and so they started, you know, just dumping

0:28:41.440 --> 0:28:45.080
<v Speaker 1>their suitcases out onto the beach from the shipping containers

0:28:45.840 --> 0:28:50.520
<v Speaker 1>and just other supplies, and basically it turned into complete chaos.

0:28:50.680 --> 0:28:52.840
<v Speaker 1>They just started dumping supplies on the ground and saying

0:28:52.840 --> 0:28:56.000
<v Speaker 1>because people were revolting and saying take care of yourself,

0:28:56.120 --> 0:28:58.200
<v Speaker 1>like there's the stuff, have at it.

0:28:58.200 --> 0:29:02.560
<v Speaker 2>It's frequently compared to like rich millennial Lord of the Flies.

0:29:03.400 --> 0:29:03.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:29:04.000 --> 0:29:07.520
<v Speaker 2>So one other thing that they were that the festival

0:29:07.600 --> 0:29:11.479
<v Speaker 2>organizers were doing was they were getting everybody super drunk.

0:29:12.080 --> 0:29:15.400
<v Speaker 2>There was one thing and great supply and for free,

0:29:15.440 --> 0:29:17.920
<v Speaker 2>and that was booze. They had like shot girls walking

0:29:17.920 --> 0:29:22.000
<v Speaker 2>around getting getting everybody super wasted on tequila, Like everyone

0:29:22.120 --> 0:29:24.000
<v Speaker 2>was starting to get really really drunk, and they were

0:29:24.000 --> 0:29:26.960
<v Speaker 2>doing that to kind of keep everybody distracted from just

0:29:27.000 --> 0:29:28.600
<v Speaker 2>how horrible this thing was.

0:29:29.600 --> 0:29:31.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but that's also not a great idea to add

0:29:31.760 --> 0:29:33.320
<v Speaker 1>alcohol to a bolatical situation.

0:29:33.480 --> 0:29:37.160
<v Speaker 2>Exactly, No, it's not. It was a very irresponsible thing

0:29:37.200 --> 0:29:40.040
<v Speaker 2>to do, and it just shows all of the incredibly

0:29:40.120 --> 0:29:44.160
<v Speaker 2>short term thinking that went into every stage of this,

0:29:44.360 --> 0:29:46.920
<v Speaker 2>including the actual festival itself.

0:29:47.560 --> 0:29:50.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, for sure. So maybe the worst spout about all

0:29:50.640 --> 0:29:53.680
<v Speaker 1>this is they couldn't A lot of people were like,

0:29:53.960 --> 0:29:56.240
<v Speaker 1>this is a disaster. I want to get out of here.

0:29:56.600 --> 0:29:58.280
<v Speaker 1>They couldn't just get out of there because it was

0:29:58.320 --> 0:30:01.440
<v Speaker 1>the same weekend as something called the National Family Regatta.

0:30:01.800 --> 0:30:04.960
<v Speaker 1>It's a really big event, and you know, most of

0:30:05.000 --> 0:30:06.800
<v Speaker 1>the hotels were booked up, most of the flights were

0:30:06.800 --> 0:30:11.680
<v Speaker 1>booked up, so people were basically stranded down there. I

0:30:11.680 --> 0:30:15.840
<v Speaker 1>think eventually they were even like locked in the airport overnight,

0:30:15.920 --> 0:30:18.200
<v Speaker 1>like when everything was closed. It wasn't like one of

0:30:18.240 --> 0:30:20.920
<v Speaker 1>those airports it still has stuff open overnight, right.

0:30:21.200 --> 0:30:23.480
<v Speaker 2>They were locked in with a chain and a padlock

0:30:23.760 --> 0:30:26.400
<v Speaker 2>and there was no ac They weren't left with any

0:30:26.600 --> 0:30:30.840
<v Speaker 2>water or food. And remember everybody by this time who's

0:30:30.880 --> 0:30:33.680
<v Speaker 2>made it to the airport has been drinking all day,

0:30:34.160 --> 0:30:36.720
<v Speaker 2>so now they're starting to sober up, and they're hungover,

0:30:36.920 --> 0:30:39.960
<v Speaker 2>locked into this hot airport without any food or water.

0:30:40.360 --> 0:30:43.240
<v Speaker 2>So it's a really bad jam by this point. Even

0:30:43.280 --> 0:30:46.760
<v Speaker 2>before that, when they started, when it became clear like

0:30:46.800 --> 0:30:49.640
<v Speaker 2>wait a minute, there's a lot of stuff wrong here. Remember,

0:30:49.680 --> 0:30:52.200
<v Speaker 2>these kids are like all on Instagram and Twitter and

0:30:52.280 --> 0:30:57.240
<v Speaker 2>all sorts of social media, and they immediately started alerting

0:30:57.280 --> 0:31:00.440
<v Speaker 2>the world Fire Festival is a total fraud. And one

0:31:00.440 --> 0:31:04.240
<v Speaker 2>of the most iconic photos that came out of this

0:31:04.720 --> 0:31:09.800
<v Speaker 2>is a styrofoam to go container opened up with a

0:31:09.840 --> 0:31:13.120
<v Speaker 2>slice of bread, a piece of cheese, a skew on

0:31:13.240 --> 0:31:15.800
<v Speaker 2>that slice of bread, another slice of bread, a skew

0:31:15.880 --> 0:31:18.520
<v Speaker 2>on the piece of cheese, a pile of lettuce, a tomato,

0:31:18.800 --> 0:31:22.920
<v Speaker 2>and some sort of oily condiment covering the lettuce and tomato.

0:31:23.160 --> 0:31:27.640
<v Speaker 2>And they said, this is the star catered food that

0:31:27.680 --> 0:31:29.480
<v Speaker 2>we were supposed to get. This is the food that

0:31:29.480 --> 0:31:31.440
<v Speaker 2>they're giving us at fire Festival.

0:31:32.120 --> 0:31:36.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you know, by this point they had already officially

0:31:36.120 --> 0:31:40.640
<v Speaker 1>postponed the festival. They came out and said it's due

0:31:40.680 --> 0:31:44.200
<v Speaker 1>to circumstances out of their control. They had, which the

0:31:44.280 --> 0:31:46.200
<v Speaker 1>only thing of which that happened that was out of

0:31:46.200 --> 0:31:49.080
<v Speaker 1>their control was the rain, I suppose. But they officially

0:31:49.160 --> 0:31:52.520
<v Speaker 1>did postpone it, but word had gotten around via social

0:31:52.560 --> 0:31:55.920
<v Speaker 1>media and at least I think a lot of people,

0:31:56.200 --> 0:31:58.280
<v Speaker 1>you know, canceled their plans and didn't actually make it

0:31:58.320 --> 0:32:02.240
<v Speaker 1>down there. Yeah, but you know, people started poking around

0:32:02.840 --> 0:32:06.520
<v Speaker 1>about Billy McFarland and what really happened. The media got

0:32:06.560 --> 0:32:09.120
<v Speaker 1>involved and they were like, hey, this is more than

0:32:09.200 --> 0:32:12.760
<v Speaker 1>just an idea that, you know, good idea that didn't

0:32:12.760 --> 0:32:15.440
<v Speaker 1>work out, Like we think, actual crimes have been committed.

0:32:16.080 --> 0:32:19.440
<v Speaker 1>So over the course of a couple of years they

0:32:19.600 --> 0:32:23.400
<v Speaker 1>realized that he had committed actual financial crimes and that's

0:32:23.440 --> 0:32:26.560
<v Speaker 1>what he ends up going to prison for. Billy McFarlane

0:32:26.600 --> 0:32:27.600
<v Speaker 1>served prison time for this.

0:32:28.000 --> 0:32:30.920
<v Speaker 2>He did so the ticket holders, and I said before

0:32:30.960 --> 0:32:36.400
<v Speaker 2>that they were generally portrayed as rich millennials who like

0:32:36.440 --> 0:32:39.000
<v Speaker 2>to go to music festivals. There were definitely plenty of

0:32:39.000 --> 0:32:42.200
<v Speaker 2>those there. This is like meant to be an instagrammable event,

0:32:42.640 --> 0:32:44.520
<v Speaker 2>but there are also plenty of people who like just

0:32:45.120 --> 0:32:47.800
<v Speaker 2>weren't rich, and they went because actually, in some cases

0:32:47.800 --> 0:32:50.120
<v Speaker 2>it was a good deal. For like eight or nine

0:32:50.200 --> 0:32:53.920
<v Speaker 2>hundred dollars, you could get eight friends together and cover

0:32:55.520 --> 0:33:00.600
<v Speaker 2>air travel, food, accommodations, and three days of music at

0:33:00.600 --> 0:33:03.280
<v Speaker 2>a music festival. It's actually not a bad deal. So

0:33:03.320 --> 0:33:06.200
<v Speaker 2>some people like really spent like money that they needed

0:33:06.520 --> 0:33:10.520
<v Speaker 2>on this and they got screwed. Over all the vendors,

0:33:10.600 --> 0:33:14.840
<v Speaker 2>the people who who worked all those people went unpaid.

0:33:15.200 --> 0:33:17.320
<v Speaker 2>But it was the investors who were the ones who

0:33:18.040 --> 0:33:21.160
<v Speaker 2>the court ordered people to pay or court ordered McFarland

0:33:21.240 --> 0:33:21.760
<v Speaker 2>to pay back.

0:33:22.560 --> 0:33:24.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and you know, I know at the time, it

0:33:24.800 --> 0:33:28.160
<v Speaker 1>was it was it seemed funny to make fun of

0:33:28.560 --> 0:33:31.040
<v Speaker 1>this and the people that you know, these like you

0:33:31.320 --> 0:33:33.840
<v Speaker 1>would you say they were rich millennials, but like they

0:33:34.080 --> 0:33:36.440
<v Speaker 1>spent money and they deserved to have a thing go

0:33:36.560 --> 0:33:38.800
<v Speaker 1>off like they wanted to, and that's the way they

0:33:38.840 --> 0:33:41.320
<v Speaker 1>wanted to spend their time. It's not my deal. But like,

0:33:41.360 --> 0:33:44.000
<v Speaker 1>I don't think it's funny that anybody gets scammed out

0:33:44.040 --> 0:33:44.680
<v Speaker 1>of money, you know.

0:33:45.040 --> 0:33:47.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, No, there was a tremendous amount of shod and

0:33:47.800 --> 0:33:52.000
<v Speaker 2>frauday by people who are not rich millennials or on

0:33:52.040 --> 0:33:55.680
<v Speaker 2>Instagram or just hate that whole Instagram life kind of thing.

0:33:56.880 --> 0:33:58.800
<v Speaker 2>There was a there were a lot of memes that

0:33:58.880 --> 0:34:02.800
<v Speaker 2>came out of it that basically portrayed this as like

0:34:02.800 --> 0:34:05.720
<v Speaker 2>it immediately descended into anarchy and they started eating each

0:34:05.760 --> 0:34:09.760
<v Speaker 2>other and yeah, again kind of Lord of the Flies esque.

0:34:10.280 --> 0:34:13.879
<v Speaker 2>But again it was just the investors who were meant

0:34:13.880 --> 0:34:15.960
<v Speaker 2>to be paid back. I think says quite a bit

0:34:16.000 --> 0:34:18.680
<v Speaker 2>about a lot of stuff. He actually was taken down

0:34:18.719 --> 0:34:23.359
<v Speaker 2>on securities in Exchange Commission SEC charges, so he had

0:34:23.360 --> 0:34:26.720
<v Speaker 2>a federal beef against him, and essentially what the court

0:34:26.800 --> 0:34:30.680
<v Speaker 2>concluded is that he built eighty investors out of twenty

0:34:30.719 --> 0:34:36.480
<v Speaker 2>four million dollars just for the fire festival. I saw

0:34:36.520 --> 0:34:41.680
<v Speaker 2>that he was on the hook for another ten twelve

0:34:41.760 --> 0:34:48.280
<v Speaker 2>million dollars for the other stuff, including the Magnesis scams. Essentially,

0:34:49.239 --> 0:34:52.640
<v Speaker 2>so if this guy is basically like, you have the

0:34:52.680 --> 0:34:55.200
<v Speaker 2>rest of your life to pay this back, and that's

0:34:55.239 --> 0:34:57.160
<v Speaker 2>what you're going to have to do. And on top

0:34:57.200 --> 0:34:59.759
<v Speaker 2>of it, he was sentenced to six years in federal

0:34:59.800 --> 0:35:01.560
<v Speaker 2>pri Yeah.

0:35:01.600 --> 0:35:05.040
<v Speaker 1>So you know, he did this by allegedly lying about

0:35:05.080 --> 0:35:09.720
<v Speaker 1>almost everything financially related to this whole thing, and including himself.

0:35:10.600 --> 0:35:13.320
<v Speaker 1>He said he had two million dollars in Facebook chairs. Personally,

0:35:14.080 --> 0:35:16.600
<v Speaker 1>he had about one thousand dollars worth. He said the

0:35:16.640 --> 0:35:19.239
<v Speaker 1>fire media app was taking in millions of dollars a month.

0:35:20.440 --> 0:35:22.840
<v Speaker 1>Over the whole lifetime of the fire Media app, that

0:35:22.920 --> 0:35:26.480
<v Speaker 1>made about sixty thousand dollars. So in addition to him

0:35:26.480 --> 0:35:30.000
<v Speaker 1>being on the hook, like you know, with the law

0:35:31.040 --> 0:35:35.520
<v Speaker 1>and like the sec, he's on the hook with personal lawsuits.

0:35:35.600 --> 0:35:38.239
<v Speaker 1>So a lot of people there was a class action

0:35:38.360 --> 0:35:41.280
<v Speaker 1>lawsuits for one hundred million dollars. Like everyone got together

0:35:41.320 --> 0:35:44.399
<v Speaker 1>of course and sued them ticket holders, and then they

0:35:44.440 --> 0:35:47.279
<v Speaker 1>were like, hey, we should suit these ad agencies too,

0:35:47.320 --> 0:35:50.799
<v Speaker 1>because they're collaborating with these people. They're putting out like

0:35:50.920 --> 0:35:55.160
<v Speaker 1>literal false information and in some cases they're deleting negative

0:35:55.200 --> 0:35:58.279
<v Speaker 1>comments about the truth of this thing. So a lot

0:35:58.280 --> 0:36:01.839
<v Speaker 1>of these lawsuits got dismissed. Others did go through and

0:36:01.840 --> 0:36:05.760
<v Speaker 1>were successful. I think the class action the ticket holders

0:36:05.800 --> 0:36:08.600
<v Speaker 1>were reimbursed. Who knows if they ever got it, but

0:36:08.800 --> 0:36:11.919
<v Speaker 1>at least they were awarded seven thousand dollars each, which

0:36:11.960 --> 0:36:12.919
<v Speaker 1>is you know, pretty good.

0:36:13.360 --> 0:36:15.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they did not get it, and they probably never

0:36:15.400 --> 0:36:19.279
<v Speaker 2>will get it because as part of the federal sentencing guidelines,

0:36:19.680 --> 0:36:22.320
<v Speaker 2>the investors are to get every penny of their twenty

0:36:22.320 --> 0:36:25.319
<v Speaker 2>four million dollars back first before anybody else starts to

0:36:25.320 --> 0:36:30.360
<v Speaker 2>get paid, vendors, ticket holders, anybody else. So one question

0:36:30.400 --> 0:36:34.840
<v Speaker 2>that I saw that was not asked almost anywhere. I

0:36:34.880 --> 0:36:36.680
<v Speaker 2>think I found one article that asked it because I

0:36:36.719 --> 0:36:39.400
<v Speaker 2>was looking to find out what happened? Where did all

0:36:39.440 --> 0:36:42.439
<v Speaker 2>the money go? He certainly did not spend twenty four

0:36:42.480 --> 0:36:45.800
<v Speaker 2>million dollars on the fire festival, not by a long shot.

0:36:46.360 --> 0:36:49.040
<v Speaker 2>And in the documentary they basically portray it as like, well,

0:36:49.080 --> 0:36:52.040
<v Speaker 2>he was just living it up, and he was, for sure,

0:36:52.719 --> 0:36:56.480
<v Speaker 2>I still would guess not twenty four million dollars in

0:36:56.600 --> 0:36:58.960
<v Speaker 2>six months living it up. So I can't help but

0:36:59.000 --> 0:37:01.800
<v Speaker 2>wonder if he's got money stashed somewhere or if he

0:37:01.920 --> 0:37:04.759
<v Speaker 2>really did just blow through twenty four million dollars in

0:37:04.800 --> 0:37:09.680
<v Speaker 2>six months creating this fire festival that was totally fraudulent.

0:37:11.160 --> 0:37:13.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I'm not going to speculate. I don't want to

0:37:13.040 --> 0:37:13.520
<v Speaker 1>get sued.

0:37:14.360 --> 0:37:18.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Yeah, I'm not speculating. I'm questioning. I really do

0:37:18.080 --> 0:37:18.920
<v Speaker 2>wonder what happened.

0:37:19.719 --> 0:37:22.279
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, who knows, But that's a lot of dough, that's

0:37:22.320 --> 0:37:25.399
<v Speaker 1>for sure. After he was arrested while he was out

0:37:25.400 --> 0:37:29.720
<v Speaker 1>on bail, he started another company called NYC vip Access.

0:37:30.719 --> 0:37:32.279
<v Speaker 1>He was like, I can't be the face of this

0:37:32.280 --> 0:37:34.799
<v Speaker 1>thing because everyone knows what I look like in my

0:37:34.920 --> 0:37:37.120
<v Speaker 1>name by this point, right, So we hired a guy

0:37:37.200 --> 0:37:39.680
<v Speaker 1>named Frank Tribble to kind of be the face of

0:37:39.719 --> 0:37:44.440
<v Speaker 1>the company, and he used the Fire Festival mailing list.

0:37:44.920 --> 0:37:46.920
<v Speaker 1>You know, a mailing list can be a very valuable thing.

0:37:47.000 --> 0:37:50.000
<v Speaker 1>Sometimes companies are bought just because they have an extensive

0:37:50.040 --> 0:37:52.719
<v Speaker 1>mailing list, and they'll just shutter the company and use

0:37:52.760 --> 0:37:56.240
<v Speaker 1>that contact point. But he actually used the Fire Festival

0:37:56.320 --> 0:38:00.680
<v Speaker 1>mailing list, offering tickets to things that don't even celtickets

0:38:00.680 --> 0:38:03.080
<v Speaker 1>a lot of times, like the met gala in New

0:38:03.120 --> 0:38:06.880
<v Speaker 1>York City Fashion Week. And I think that Fire Festival

0:38:06.920 --> 0:38:10.960
<v Speaker 1>mailing list may have been as undoing there because that

0:38:11.120 --> 0:38:13.359
<v Speaker 1>was added to his list of criminal charges as well.

0:38:13.400 --> 0:38:14.840
<v Speaker 1>That VIP access scam.

0:38:14.920 --> 0:38:18.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah it was again. It was another scam. And this

0:38:18.440 --> 0:38:21.160
<v Speaker 2>guy who he hired to front at Frank Tribble, he

0:38:21.200 --> 0:38:24.160
<v Speaker 2>still lists himself as the CEO of New York NYC

0:38:24.360 --> 0:38:29.080
<v Speaker 2>vip Access on Instagram, I believe, and he also offers

0:38:29.120 --> 0:38:33.200
<v Speaker 2>discounted AirPods in the bio of his Instagram account.

0:38:32.840 --> 0:38:34.680
<v Speaker 1>Nice get a good deal in some AirPods.

0:38:34.760 --> 0:38:39.800
<v Speaker 2>So Billy McFarlane, I think he served four of his

0:38:39.960 --> 0:38:42.920
<v Speaker 2>six years. He was definitely let out early. He was

0:38:42.960 --> 0:38:45.759
<v Speaker 2>also transferred to a low security prison in Ohio.

0:38:46.320 --> 0:38:50.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he tried to get out of prison when COVID happened.

0:38:51.680 --> 0:38:54.640
<v Speaker 1>Is what they call it, like a medical benevolence release

0:38:54.719 --> 0:38:57.120
<v Speaker 1>or whatever, because he said he had asthma and that

0:38:57.200 --> 0:38:59.759
<v Speaker 1>COVID would probably kill him, and so they moved him

0:38:59.800 --> 0:39:03.520
<v Speaker 1>into solitary during that time. Did not let him out then,

0:39:03.680 --> 0:39:06.319
<v Speaker 1>And he did get COVID oh really while he was

0:39:06.320 --> 0:39:07.640
<v Speaker 1>in prison, but he didn't die.

0:39:07.800 --> 0:39:11.960
<v Speaker 2>He did some other solitary stints for breaking the rules,

0:39:12.000 --> 0:39:15.239
<v Speaker 2>like he smuggled the recording device into the prison and

0:39:15.280 --> 0:39:18.400
<v Speaker 2>then used it to launch a podcast. I guess, assuming

0:39:18.440 --> 0:39:20.759
<v Speaker 2>that they the warden didn't listen to podcasts.

0:39:22.040 --> 0:39:22.799
<v Speaker 1>Low Hanging Fruit.

0:39:23.160 --> 0:39:25.719
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and he was released early. I don't know how

0:39:25.760 --> 0:39:28.080
<v Speaker 2>many years early. He was sentenced to six years, and

0:39:28.120 --> 0:39:30.720
<v Speaker 2>I think it did four, maybe five, But he definitely

0:39:30.719 --> 0:39:33.920
<v Speaker 2>got out early. And the first thing he did when

0:39:34.080 --> 0:39:36.920
<v Speaker 2>he got out, almost the first thing was he announced

0:39:36.960 --> 0:39:39.080
<v Speaker 2>that there would be a fire festival two.

0:39:41.080 --> 0:39:45.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Fire I has not happened, but he did finally

0:39:46.960 --> 0:39:51.680
<v Speaker 1>host and organize, and I guess successfully pull off a

0:39:51.760 --> 0:39:56.399
<v Speaker 1>music festival last year on Utilla Bay. He loves these

0:39:56.520 --> 0:40:00.919
<v Speaker 1>shortened sort of misspelled things. I guess he chose Phoenix, Yeah,

0:40:00.960 --> 0:40:04.480
<v Speaker 1>pH NX. I assuming because the phoenix rose from the ashes,

0:40:04.520 --> 0:40:07.480
<v Speaker 1>oh yeah, much like Billy McFarland did. But that one

0:40:07.480 --> 0:40:09.319
<v Speaker 1>actually went down. I went and looked at it, and

0:40:09.360 --> 0:40:13.000
<v Speaker 1>I hadn't heard of a single performer. But that doesn't

0:40:13.000 --> 0:40:17.360
<v Speaker 1>mean that they were not noteworthy. It's just there's tons

0:40:17.360 --> 0:40:19.440
<v Speaker 1>of music out there now that I don't know about,

0:40:19.480 --> 0:40:21.080
<v Speaker 1>so they may all be great. Well.

0:40:21.200 --> 0:40:23.160
<v Speaker 2>So the one that I saw that I recognize the

0:40:23.200 --> 0:40:25.600
<v Speaker 2>name of it was French Montana, and he's a pretty

0:40:25.600 --> 0:40:28.120
<v Speaker 2>big name. He was a big big fish land and

0:40:28.200 --> 0:40:31.200
<v Speaker 2>he did show up and he did perform. But I

0:40:31.280 --> 0:40:33.760
<v Speaker 2>was checking it out too. There was a live stream

0:40:33.800 --> 0:40:36.200
<v Speaker 2>that you could pay for ninety nine to watch this

0:40:36.360 --> 0:40:41.120
<v Speaker 2>music festival, and so it's all very highly documented and

0:40:41.160 --> 0:40:44.520
<v Speaker 2>you can see there's like handfuls of people who are

0:40:44.560 --> 0:40:48.600
<v Speaker 2>attending this music festival. Like when French Montana is like,

0:40:48.960 --> 0:40:52.640
<v Speaker 2>you know, somebody say yeah, like he gets nothing in response,

0:40:52.719 --> 0:40:55.239
<v Speaker 2>and like it was just yes, it was not good.

0:40:55.520 --> 0:40:59.360
<v Speaker 2>They were apparently letting in locals. This is in Honduras,

0:40:59.520 --> 0:41:02.600
<v Speaker 2>letting in locals for free and encouraging to come for free,

0:41:02.640 --> 0:41:05.279
<v Speaker 2>just to kind of fill out the crowd a little bit.

0:41:05.360 --> 0:41:08.640
<v Speaker 2>So but like you said, he did successfully hold the

0:41:08.760 --> 0:41:13.080
<v Speaker 2>music festival, but I saw that he's out of the

0:41:13.120 --> 0:41:16.520
<v Speaker 2>fire Festival game because he sold the brand.

0:41:16.760 --> 0:41:20.000
<v Speaker 1>Did you see anything on that, Well, I saw that

0:41:20.040 --> 0:41:22.359
<v Speaker 1>he sold the brand. He sold it on eBay chuck

0:41:22.400 --> 0:41:23.879
<v Speaker 1>for like a couple of hundred grand or something.

0:41:23.960 --> 0:41:26.319
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like I think two hundred and forty grand. He

0:41:26.400 --> 0:41:29.640
<v Speaker 2>sold it on eBay, and he sold it to lime Wire,

0:41:30.120 --> 0:41:35.080
<v Speaker 2>I think, one of the original music download disruptor apps.

0:41:35.520 --> 0:41:39.080
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, so yeah, LimeWire owns the fire Brand now.

0:41:39.120 --> 0:41:41.760
<v Speaker 2>And if you want a Firebrand mug or a Firebrand hoodie,

0:41:42.000 --> 0:41:46.400
<v Speaker 2>you can go look up fire Festival and LimeWire and

0:41:46.520 --> 0:41:47.839
<v Speaker 2>their site will come right up.

0:41:48.640 --> 0:41:52.200
<v Speaker 1>I am quite sure that to where a fire Festival

0:41:52.200 --> 0:41:54.759
<v Speaker 1>hoodie at this point, this many years later would be

0:41:54.840 --> 0:41:57.520
<v Speaker 1>a very ironic sort of fun thing to do.

0:41:57.680 --> 0:42:00.759
<v Speaker 2>Definitely. I think that's kind of what Lime going for.

0:42:02.280 --> 0:42:05.760
<v Speaker 1>It's they acquired the Mad Magazine of music festivals.

0:42:05.840 --> 0:42:10.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, for sure if you. I don't know about

0:42:10.120 --> 0:42:11.920
<v Speaker 2>that now that I think about. No, I'm not gonna.

0:42:11.960 --> 0:42:12.439
<v Speaker 2>I'm not gonna.

0:42:12.440 --> 0:42:13.800
<v Speaker 1>You don't want to sell you mad magazine?

0:42:13.840 --> 0:42:18.560
<v Speaker 2>No, Yeah, yeah, they they do offer. Those hoodies are

0:42:18.560 --> 0:42:20.400
<v Speaker 2>two hundred and forty thousand dollars apiece.

0:42:20.920 --> 0:42:21.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh that's a good price.

0:42:23.040 --> 0:42:24.279
<v Speaker 2>Uh, you got anything else?

0:42:25.160 --> 0:42:28.640
<v Speaker 1>I got nothing else. I highly recommend at least watching

0:42:28.640 --> 0:42:30.960
<v Speaker 1>one of the documentaries. They're both about the same, I

0:42:31.000 --> 0:42:33.080
<v Speaker 1>would say, although we should say that both of those

0:42:33.120 --> 0:42:37.399
<v Speaker 1>documentaries came under scrutiny, yeah, because they both I think

0:42:37.480 --> 0:42:40.120
<v Speaker 1>one of them paid Billy McFarland for an interview which

0:42:40.360 --> 0:42:43.400
<v Speaker 1>everyone thought was pretty untoard and give that guy any money.

0:42:44.239 --> 0:42:47.239
<v Speaker 1>And the other one that was partnered by one of

0:42:47.239 --> 0:42:50.760
<v Speaker 1>the PR companies who had scrubbed social media of negative

0:42:50.800 --> 0:42:53.480
<v Speaker 1>comments and they had partner and they don't cover that

0:42:53.520 --> 0:42:55.919
<v Speaker 1>in the documentary, and they were partnered in that documentary.

0:42:56.000 --> 0:42:58.040
<v Speaker 1>So that one was also untoured.

0:42:58.200 --> 0:43:02.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and the net Netflix documentary didn't have Billy McFarlane.

0:43:02.360 --> 0:43:03.960
<v Speaker 2>They approached him to be in it and he's like,

0:43:04.000 --> 0:43:05.399
<v Speaker 2>you have to pay me, and they're like, no, it's

0:43:05.480 --> 0:43:09.400
<v Speaker 2>not ethical, but Hulu is like sure, yeah, so okay,

0:43:09.440 --> 0:43:11.640
<v Speaker 2>So that's it. That's all we have to say about

0:43:11.680 --> 0:43:15.040
<v Speaker 2>Fire Festival and Billy McFarland, and I think then it's

0:43:15.080 --> 0:43:16.560
<v Speaker 2>time for a listener mail. Chuck.

0:43:19.200 --> 0:43:21.960
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to promise this is the last mcguffin email,

0:43:22.920 --> 0:43:25.480
<v Speaker 1>just because I like to torture you. But I think

0:43:25.520 --> 0:43:28.800
<v Speaker 1>this one had the best definition that it finally clicks

0:43:28.800 --> 0:43:29.480
<v Speaker 1>in for everybody.

0:43:29.560 --> 0:43:30.080
<v Speaker 2>We'll see.

0:43:30.920 --> 0:43:32.759
<v Speaker 1>The idea that made it click for me, guys, was

0:43:32.800 --> 0:43:35.279
<v Speaker 1>that an item is a mcguffin if that item can

0:43:35.320 --> 0:43:39.200
<v Speaker 1>be substituted with almost anything else without making any changes

0:43:39.239 --> 0:43:42.280
<v Speaker 1>to the plot of the film. That's a pretty good definition.

0:43:42.520 --> 0:43:45.880
<v Speaker 1>That mysterious briefcase could be a flash drive with important documents,

0:43:45.920 --> 0:43:48.480
<v Speaker 1>or a diamond necklace belonging to the royal family, or

0:43:48.520 --> 0:43:51.360
<v Speaker 1>any number of vaguely valuable things. The point of the

0:43:51.360 --> 0:43:54.120
<v Speaker 1>film is the action that unfolds around that central item.

0:43:54.440 --> 0:43:57.040
<v Speaker 1>If the plot is centered around something, it isn't about

0:43:57.040 --> 0:43:59.959
<v Speaker 1>that thing, it is a mcguffin. And this way both

0:44:00.080 --> 0:44:02.960
<v Speaker 1>definitions actually fit. The existence or the state of the

0:44:02.960 --> 0:44:05.080
<v Speaker 1>object is what moves the whole plot, but the object

0:44:05.120 --> 0:44:10.080
<v Speaker 1>itself doesn't actually matter. I just thought i'd throw in

0:44:10.120 --> 0:44:12.960
<v Speaker 1>my two cents because before I took this film class

0:44:13.239 --> 0:44:15.440
<v Speaker 1>that taught me this. I felt the same about mcguffin's

0:44:15.440 --> 0:44:18.279
<v Speaker 1>as Josh seems to. Thanks for a great show, guys,

0:44:18.320 --> 0:44:20.520
<v Speaker 1>been listening for over ten years, learn so much and

0:44:20.520 --> 0:44:23.480
<v Speaker 1>I have had so many great conversations inspired by stuff

0:44:23.480 --> 0:44:25.720
<v Speaker 1>you should know. And that is from Anna hell Camp.

0:44:25.800 --> 0:44:29.080
<v Speaker 2>Thanks Anna, thank you very much. I saw that definition

0:44:29.600 --> 0:44:34.920
<v Speaker 2>essentially something like that here there still don't understand, really no,

0:44:35.080 --> 0:44:38.360
<v Speaker 2>it doesn't. Okay, Well then what isn't a mcguffin? What

0:44:38.560 --> 0:44:39.520
<v Speaker 2>is not a mcguffin?

0:44:39.640 --> 0:44:43.840
<v Speaker 1>I have to know, I don't even know what that means.

0:44:44.840 --> 0:44:47.160
<v Speaker 1>What isn't a mcguffin then, is something that if you

0:44:47.160 --> 0:44:48.960
<v Speaker 1>could change it would actually change the plot.

0:44:49.040 --> 0:44:52.080
<v Speaker 2>What give me an example? What give me a real

0:44:52.280 --> 0:44:55.920
<v Speaker 2>life movie example of what's not a mcguffin that I

0:44:56.000 --> 0:44:58.799
<v Speaker 2>will be able to understand the difference between mcguffins and

0:44:58.880 --> 0:45:01.520
<v Speaker 2>things that aren't mcguffin. I demand it.

0:45:01.600 --> 0:45:03.480
<v Speaker 1>All right, Well I'll have to go do some research

0:45:03.480 --> 0:45:05.280
<v Speaker 1>on that then, all right, so we will do another

0:45:05.360 --> 0:45:08.080
<v Speaker 1>mcguffin email somewhere or maybe you know, like the murder

0:45:08.120 --> 0:45:11.960
<v Speaker 1>weapon that's not a mcguffin, because that actually matters to

0:45:12.040 --> 0:45:14.319
<v Speaker 1>the plot. A murder weapon couldn't be just some other thing,

0:45:15.400 --> 0:45:19.000
<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean? Yes, but how does this

0:45:19.600 --> 0:45:22.000
<v Speaker 1>we're searching We're searching for the gun that killed them

0:45:22.160 --> 0:45:24.080
<v Speaker 1>the whole movie. They're searching for the gun that killed

0:45:24.080 --> 0:45:27.200
<v Speaker 1>the person, because that is the central piece that would

0:45:27.200 --> 0:45:30.040
<v Speaker 1>actually land the person in prison. Okay, and you can't

0:45:30.080 --> 0:45:31.359
<v Speaker 1>substitute that for a can of coke.

0:45:31.560 --> 0:45:34.680
<v Speaker 2>But okay, then how does the where again does that

0:45:34.800 --> 0:45:39.040
<v Speaker 2>Maltese falcon fit in there? No one is doing anything

0:45:39.600 --> 0:45:39.880
<v Speaker 2>if the.

0:45:39.920 --> 0:45:42.080
<v Speaker 1>Maltese Maltese falcon, so I can't comment.

0:45:42.280 --> 0:45:44.480
<v Speaker 2>But you can replace the Maltese falcon with a giant

0:45:44.560 --> 0:45:47.360
<v Speaker 2>ruby or a flash drive, which would have been weird

0:45:47.480 --> 0:45:48.080
<v Speaker 2>in that era.

0:45:48.200 --> 0:45:51.200
<v Speaker 1>But I think that's why everyone calls it a mcguffin.

0:45:51.960 --> 0:45:54.839
<v Speaker 2>Right, but it's not the maguf Okay, all right, Maybe

0:45:54.880 --> 0:45:56.440
<v Speaker 2>it is starting to dawn on me a little bit.

0:45:56.440 --> 0:45:58.880
<v Speaker 1>Thanks to who that's Romana?

0:45:58.920 --> 0:46:01.880
<v Speaker 2>All right, thanks Sanna. I do want to hear a

0:46:01.960 --> 0:46:05.000
<v Speaker 2>specific example from a movie of what is not a mcguffin.

0:46:05.440 --> 0:46:07.360
<v Speaker 1>Okay, all right, I'm going to find a movie where

0:46:07.440 --> 0:46:09.440
<v Speaker 1>there's someone's searching for a murder weapon, because that's a

0:46:09.480 --> 0:46:10.000
<v Speaker 1>great example.

0:46:10.040 --> 0:46:13.160
<v Speaker 2>I think in the meantime, if you want to be

0:46:13.239 --> 0:46:15.759
<v Speaker 2>like Anna and send us an email where you try

0:46:15.760 --> 0:46:18.640
<v Speaker 2>to crack through my thick skull, I'm up down for

0:46:18.640 --> 0:46:20.719
<v Speaker 2>that kind of thing. You can send it off to

0:46:20.880 --> 0:46:26.680
<v Speaker 2>stuff podcast at iHeartRadio dot com.

0:46:26.840 --> 0:46:29.719
<v Speaker 1>Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For

0:46:29.800 --> 0:46:34.000
<v Speaker 1>more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

0:46:34.120 --> 0:46:35.960
<v Speaker 1>or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.