Speaker 1: Pushkin. If you've sung along to a power ballad in
Speaker 1: the last thirty years, chancers are, you're already intimately familiar
Speaker 1: with Diane Warren's songs. Some of her biggest hits include shares,
Speaker 1: if I Could Turn Back Time, Selene Dion's Because You
Speaker 1: Loved Me, and Aerosmith's I Don't want to miss at You,
Speaker 1: like your mayor stool, like the handicuffs, you go the fool,
Speaker 1: and I'm no wage shit, I'm nowhere. Over the span
Speaker 1: of her thirty five year career, Diane Warren has penned
Speaker 1: hits for hip hop, country, R and B an adult
Speaker 1: contemporary artists. In late August, she finally released her own alley,
Speaker 1: The Caves Sessions Volume one, where she wrote songs for
Speaker 1: artists like Tydalla Sign, Darius Rucker, and John Legends. The
Speaker 1: genre spanning project is modeled after DJ compilation Aalogus and
Speaker 1: brilliantly shows off Warren's incredible range as a writer. On
Speaker 1: today's episode, Rick Rubin talks to Diane Warren about how
Speaker 1: she decided to become a songwriter when she was just
Speaker 1: eleven years old, and how her parents built a shed
Speaker 1: in their backyard where she could work out her early arrangements.
Speaker 1: Warren also talks about her one and only music teacher,
Speaker 1: who told her dad she had no future in music,
Speaker 1: and why she feels she has yet to write her
Speaker 1: best work. This is broken record liner notes for the
Speaker 1: digital Age. I'm justin Richmonds. Here's Rick Rubin and Diane
Speaker 1: Warren and to see you same great to see you.
Speaker 1: It's been it has been I don't know how many years,
Speaker 1: but it feels like it's been a long time, really
Speaker 1: a really long time. I'm trying to think when the
Speaker 1: last time I saw you was. I can't remember. I
Speaker 1: can't remember I did last week. So I remember visiting
Speaker 1: you in Malibu, and I feel like that's like ten
Speaker 1: years ago. Probably. I remember coming your studio. I remember
Speaker 1: being in the studio when you played me a Wheezer's
Speaker 1: version of Unbreak My Heart, which was odd fucking awesome,
Speaker 1: which I loved to this day. I love it. I
Speaker 1: love just people flipping my songs. Yeah, I think that's
Speaker 1: one of my favorites of your songs. I just love
Speaker 1: that song. It's a it's a really special song. Thank you.
Speaker 1: Tell me how that one got written. It started with
Speaker 1: the title Don't Break My heart. It was a weird title.
Speaker 1: I'd never heard it before, you know, and I can't
Speaker 1: remember the magic of that song. No no no non
Speaker 1: this signe me break. I went from B minor to
Speaker 1: D minor. It was like, when I came up with that,
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, fuck, that's fucking that's the part.
Speaker 1: That's the part where it gets you. It hits you immediately.
Speaker 1: It's like it's an emotional change. Yeah. Yeah, it's weird.
Speaker 1: You know, it doesn't make any sense. But you know
Speaker 1: that's because I you know, I didn't really study music,
Speaker 1: so I didn't know, you know, when something's fucked up
Speaker 1: and wrong. So I probably do a lot of fucked
Speaker 1: up wrong things that are cool. When did you start
Speaker 1: writing songs? How old were you? I was eleven, But
Speaker 1: when I was when I was fourteen, I became like
Speaker 1: obsessed where it was all I lived for. I would
Speaker 1: study Billboard. I mean, I was a shitty student. I
Speaker 1: got kicked out of, you know a couple of schools,
Speaker 1: and I fucking hated school. But when I really got
Speaker 1: into writing, you know, I made my dad get me
Speaker 1: a subscription of Billboard. I studied it like that was
Speaker 1: college to me. I studied to see who wrote every
Speaker 1: song and who produced songs, and I didn't really care
Speaker 1: who sang them, you know, as much. I was interested
Speaker 1: in all the behind the scenes stuff going on, but
Speaker 1: I was just obsessed, obsessed with writing. And that was
Speaker 1: on was fourteen. So I'm the same way now. I
Speaker 1: just go, you know, I you know, I say I'm
Speaker 1: in a nicer play to write, but I'm not. I mean,
Speaker 1: my room is disgusting right where I mainly work. You know,
Speaker 1: it's really messy and dirty and stuff. So at the time,
Speaker 1: you know, as a kid, my dad got me a
Speaker 1: shed in the back of the house because my parents
Speaker 1: couldn't stand listening to me playing the same song over
Speaker 1: and over. That's why I do when i'm writing, I'm
Speaker 1: just kind of playing it over and over and getting
Speaker 1: it right. So I would go in that. I'd be
Speaker 1: in that shed in the backyard, you know, this like
Speaker 1: metal kind of shed thing and just writing and if
Speaker 1: it was cold, eye a little heater there. I've just
Speaker 1: been like this and I'm the same way now. I
Speaker 1: just I just I do the same thing. I'm still
Speaker 1: as obsessed. I think hopefully I'm better and I keep learning.
Speaker 1: I think I'm really writing my best songs right now?
Speaker 1: You know that I've ever written from the time you're fourteen,
Speaker 1: Did you know you wanted to be a songwriter and
Speaker 1: that's what you wanted to do with your life or
Speaker 1: did you think you'd have a real job and you
Speaker 1: would write songs too, a real job? What no I
Speaker 1: knew when I was I knew I was eight years old.
Speaker 1: It's what I wanted to do, you know, And there
Speaker 1: was no plan B. Plan B is you know, being
Speaker 1: a bag lady and you know, living on the street
Speaker 1: or somethings. I literally do not know how to do
Speaker 1: anything else. I don't I don't know to do anything else.
Speaker 1: I'm utterly useless at everything except this. Where do you
Speaker 1: think the idea came from to do it? What did
Speaker 1: you see that at least made you want to do this? Well?
Speaker 1: I always loved music, and i've you know, I've always
Speaker 1: just been immersed in it. You know, I have older sisters,
Speaker 1: so I always heard music. My mom and dad had like,
Speaker 1: you know, all the all the great show tunes, you know,
Speaker 1: Man and La Mansha, all those, you know, My fair Lady,
Speaker 1: and then my sisters had all the pop music of
Speaker 1: the day. And when I grew up radio played everything,
Speaker 1: so I just got fed this diet of just great
Speaker 1: music and I but anyways, I remember looking on a
Speaker 1: single on a forty five Kids when They're there used
Speaker 1: to be forty fives back in the old days, and
Speaker 1: it was a forty five of up on the Roof,
Speaker 1: and I saw a goffin King and I loved that song,
Speaker 1: and I thought to myself, and I remember, I still
Speaker 1: remember looking at it and going, I want to be
Speaker 1: in those parentheses. I want to be that. I don't
Speaker 1: want to be the singer, I don't want to do
Speaker 1: any of that, but I want to be in the
Speaker 1: parentheses a kid when I thought that, so, how the
Speaker 1: fuck did I know that? So cool? That's a great
Speaker 1: album title for your next album. In the parentheses would
Speaker 1: be a great name. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's amazing
Speaker 1: that you knew so early and you dedicated yourself to
Speaker 1: it and it worked and it's one of them billion.
Speaker 1: But it's the passion that you put in that makes
Speaker 1: it what it is. It's like you're meant, you were
Speaker 1: clearly meant to do this. It's interesting. Yeah. And then
Speaker 1: there's all these you know things that these pinched me
Speaker 1: moments like like I was the biggest Beatles fan, Like
Speaker 1: my older one of my sisters took me to see
Speaker 1: the Beatles twice, you know, when I was like a
Speaker 1: little kid, like six or seven or something, and I
Speaker 1: just had Paul McCartney and Ringo Star on my song
Speaker 1: Here's to the Nights. In the video, they're singing my
Speaker 1: song and with a bunch of other great artists as well,
Speaker 1: like Lenny Kravitz and Cheryl Crowe and Chris Stapleton, you
Speaker 1: know a lot of other artists on there, but the
Speaker 1: you know, the main part of that song is Paul
Speaker 1: McCartney and Ringo Star. And I'm like, I still like,
Speaker 1: if I think about it, it kind of blows me away.
Speaker 1: Did you take piano lessons as a kid? No, I
Speaker 1: didn't take any. Okay, So I'm gonna tell you the
Speaker 1: one time I took music lessons, my dad brought me
Speaker 1: a little guitar from Tijuana. He took me to a
Speaker 1: guitar teacher in the valley. So the guart teacher wanted
Speaker 1: me to learn scales and I didn't. So the second time,
Speaker 1: I just wanted to make up my own songs. I mean,
Speaker 1: fox learning scales so I came back the next week
Speaker 1: to take my second lesson, and the guy said, mister Warren,
Speaker 1: you shouldn't bring your daughter back. She has no future
Speaker 1: in music. So that was that was, That was my
Speaker 1: music lessons. You know. I taught myself to chords. I
Speaker 1: taught myself. I taught myself to play the piano. Someone
Speaker 1: once told me that the piano is the songwriter's instrument.
Speaker 1: So when I was eighteen, I'm like, okay, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: learn enough to you know, I'm not a good piano player.
Speaker 1: I'm not even a good guitar player, right right. I
Speaker 1: can get around. I know chords. You know. I took
Speaker 1: one theory class in school that you know, beginning theory,
Speaker 1: but I don't I didn't really pay attention to it,
Speaker 1: but maybe some of it seeped in. But again, I'm not.
Speaker 1: I'm not a schooled musician, which is good because if you're,
Speaker 1: if you if you have too much music education, you'll
Speaker 1: go like, well that you can't do that, that's not
Speaker 1: the right, that doesn't you know? Well fuck that. I
Speaker 1: don't even know what's right or wrong. I just go
Speaker 1: by what I feel. What's your rhythm of writing? Do
Speaker 1: you write every day every day. It's funny with t
Speaker 1: shirt you chose to wear fuck off, I'm writing, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's kind of my favorite shirt. I thought it was
Speaker 1: appropriate since I'm since we're talking today that I should
Speaker 1: wear that. My rhythm and my first hit being rhythm
Speaker 1: in the night, So rhythm is a good word. You know.
Speaker 1: I just show up, you know, I go to work
Speaker 1: every day. I go get my coffee and go to
Speaker 1: my office and either starting something new or working on
Speaker 1: what I'm working on. How did the first one happen?
Speaker 1: How did the DeBarge song happen? I was signed to
Speaker 1: a guy named Jack White, who not not the White
Speaker 1: stripes Jack White. I'm a German producer and through Jack,
Speaker 1: I was signed to arist To Publishing and ministered him.
Speaker 1: So someone over there named Linda Blum actually told me
Speaker 1: about that this movie on the Last Dragon, and I
Speaker 1: did the song for it. I've done a lot of
Speaker 1: movie songs. I still That's what I do a lot of.
Speaker 1: So my first big hit was from a movie Berry
Speaker 1: Gordy's The Last Dragon and to Bars did the song
Speaker 1: and its the first time that I had to you know,
Speaker 1: hit words and music you know by me. I wouldn't
Speaker 1: have guessed that you wrote that. I didn't. I didn't
Speaker 1: know that you wrote that song until until recently. Again,
Speaker 1: you write all kinds of songs, yeah, I do, but
Speaker 1: that's not one that I would have imagined you wrote.
Speaker 1: And it really made me happy to see that you
Speaker 1: wrote it. I love I love that you wrote it.
Speaker 1: I probably wrote a bunch of songs you didn't know
Speaker 1: I wrote. You probably didn't know I wrote Blame it
Speaker 1: on the Rain, Yeah I didn't. It's so cool. Yeah,
Speaker 1: let's say you were to sit down now to write
Speaker 1: a song, just start the process for me. I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know how to do that
Speaker 1: in front of somebody, Like I mean, I play some chords,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I might have a drum going on
Speaker 1: a programmed to drum pattern or something, or I might
Speaker 1: start playing something. What's going to come from that? Who knows?
Speaker 1: And when you play, are you listening to what you're
Speaker 1: You're playing and listening, and then based on what you hear,
Speaker 1: you make decisions to change things or do something different,
Speaker 1: or to go somewhere else. I'm not even conscious of it.
Speaker 1: It's it's such a weird, like that's why it's hard
Speaker 1: to like, you know, people are going, well, what's your process?
Speaker 1: I mean, I have no fucking clue, you know, I'm
Speaker 1: just I'm just in the moment. I'm just going with it.
Speaker 1: And and concepts kind of pop up, these crazy concepts
Speaker 1: like I just started something. I'm not gonna play you
Speaker 1: because I don't know how much of it. But I
Speaker 1: was like, the fucking coolest concept, Like you know that
Speaker 1: no one's done this, you know, so it's kind of fun,
Speaker 1: you know, whether it's on break my Heart or whether
Speaker 1: it's you know, something else I'm coming up with. You know,
Speaker 1: it's just kind of finding something that maybe hasn't been
Speaker 1: said that way, or some notes that excite me. And
Speaker 1: I don't know, have you always programmed a beat first
Speaker 1: and then played to the beat or not necessarily? No,
Speaker 1: Sometimes I don't any I'm just sitting at the guitar
Speaker 1: or my keyboards. You know. I love big string sounds,
Speaker 1: you know too, I love that that so, you know,
Speaker 1: yesterday I was trying I was kind of trying to
Speaker 1: the song was working on. I was kind of playing
Speaker 1: in my hand on the drum machine, was and trying
Speaker 1: to play the bass on the on my left hand.
Speaker 1: It was kind of funny and horrible sounding, but the
Speaker 1: song I think would be good, So you know just
Speaker 1: how I however, way I do it? Do you typically
Speaker 1: get the melody before the lyrics and then you fill
Speaker 1: in the lyrics. Yeah, I mean the really good ones
Speaker 1: kind of come together in a weird way, but then
Speaker 1: the rest of the song I have to fill in,
Speaker 1: like like what's you know, the first verse might have
Speaker 1: come easy, and then you know where am I going
Speaker 1: to go in the second verse? And I remember going
Speaker 1: near the bridge until I have every part of the
Speaker 1: song written, because I have no idea what the bridge
Speaker 1: wants to take me, even musically. Would you not know
Speaker 1: the bridge until the rest of this written? Yeah, unless
Speaker 1: I might have had something that that I didn't use
Speaker 1: in the in the verse that like something I did
Speaker 1: a few weeks It was like that where it's this
Speaker 1: part didn't work in the verse, but I was like,
Speaker 1: I made a mental note to myself, there's there's your bridge. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Do you ever start the process with an artist in mind,
Speaker 1: I'm going to write a song for share or do
Speaker 1: you just write a song? I try just to write
Speaker 1: a song, you know, like, um, yeah, I just I
Speaker 1: just try to write a great song. I don't want
Speaker 1: to have any preconceived notions, like if I write it
Speaker 1: for with one person in mind, that's going to only
Speaker 1: be for that one person. And if they don't do
Speaker 1: the song, you know, then what you do? You know, So,
Speaker 1: if you write a great song, you know it can
Speaker 1: go a million different ways and to a lot of
Speaker 1: different people. You know, when I'm writing something, I go, oh,
Speaker 1: that's really great for so and so or so and so.
Speaker 1: But I don't sit down to write a song for somebody.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm the only time I stand to write
Speaker 1: a song for something in particular as a movie. Yeah, Typically,
Speaker 1: if it takes a week to write a song, has
Speaker 1: there ever been a case where a song has come
Speaker 1: really quick or where a song that you've had to
Speaker 1: fight with for a really long time, Has it ever
Speaker 1: happened nothing I've had to fight with for a really
Speaker 1: long time. A couple of them have come quick. I
Speaker 1: could think of two songs that came really quick, you know.
Speaker 1: Two of my favorites too. One is Until It Happens
Speaker 1: to You, done by Lady Gaga. That song just wrote itself.
Speaker 1: The other one is a song that called when I'm
Speaker 1: back on my feeding in it. Michael Bolton did that
Speaker 1: to this day is one of my favorite Both those
Speaker 1: songs are two of my favorite songs. When they come
Speaker 1: quickly like that, when do you start thinking about who
Speaker 1: could record it? During the process? You know, while I'm
Speaker 1: writing it, I think I like different artists I could
Speaker 1: do the song. I'm not above calling people you know,
Speaker 1: you know me? Yes. How often does it happen when
Speaker 1: you finish a song and you think, wow, this is
Speaker 1: really great? It's been happening a lot lately, amazing. Like
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm like wow. Used to be where I
Speaker 1: felt like I'd write one of those songs every now,
Speaker 1: like in a bunch of songs and one of those
Speaker 1: And now I'm feeling like with a lot of what
Speaker 1: I'm doing right now a great feeling. Yeah it is.
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm learning and just getting better. I'm
Speaker 1: just hungry to learn and hungry to write, and you know,
Speaker 1: hungry to succeed. Yeah. How would you describe what makes
Speaker 1: a song great? It's hard to describe it. You feel it, right.
Speaker 1: A great melody, I mean, you have to have a
Speaker 1: great melody, and to me, you have to have a
Speaker 1: great lyric too, and you have to have the marriage
Speaker 1: of the two. What do you think makes a great song.
Speaker 1: I think it's the feeling. I think it's the way
Speaker 1: it makes you feel. I don't think there's any technical
Speaker 1: way to describe it, right, but that is what's making
Speaker 1: you feel something when it's that perfect combination. Yeah, the
Speaker 1: example you gave when you played Unbreak the piece of
Speaker 1: Unbreak my Heart with that change. To me, those moments
Speaker 1: are what makes a song great, like an unexpected change
Speaker 1: that the fact that it's unexpected makes you listen closer,
Speaker 1: you know, like it catches your ear, it makes you
Speaker 1: pay attention. Yeah. But often things that catch your ear
Speaker 1: and make you pay attention or things you don't like
Speaker 1: so for be something. It's like a fine line when
Speaker 1: something can be challenging enough to be interesting and still
Speaker 1: you want to listen to it again instead of never
Speaker 1: hear it again. Yeah, I prefer I prefer the other way.
Speaker 1: I prefer it the good way. We'll be right back
Speaker 1: with more from Diane Warren after a quick break. We're
Speaker 1: back with Rick Rubin and Diane Warren after the DeBarge song.
Speaker 1: What was the next song that somebody recorded of yours?
Speaker 1: I think nothing's going to stop us now, or I
Speaker 1: Get Weak? I can't remember. There's a bunch of them.
Speaker 1: Then nothing's gonna stop us now. It was from Mannequin,
Speaker 1: and that's kind of become a classic. I did that
Speaker 1: with my friend Albert Hammond, and then you know, a
Speaker 1: bunch of other ones. At that time, I'm just trying
Speaker 1: to think a big hit with heart. Who will you
Speaker 1: Run to? Blenda Carlile I Get Weak, which is still
Speaker 1: one of my favorite songs I've ever done. You know,
Speaker 1: the doors started opening, you know, the doors that are
Speaker 1: closed as you know, you know, you know, when it
Speaker 1: became easier, you have a little success, and and all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you know, it's it's the people that
Speaker 1: didn't like that song. Oh I really like that song now,
Speaker 1: you know that shit goes, you know, but it's just
Speaker 1: like it's natural. Describe what the record business was like
Speaker 1: when you entered it versus the record business of today
Speaker 1: and all the changes it's gone through. Just describe your
Speaker 1: experience of seeing it change. Okay, Well, one thing stays constant,
Speaker 1: and that's a great song. So what I do stays
Speaker 1: the same, Right, I still have to write a great song.
Speaker 1: The negative difference to me is it's so data driven. Now.
Speaker 1: To me, the data that matters is if it makes
Speaker 1: the hair on your arms stand up and it makes
Speaker 1: you your heart feel something and you just go, fuck,
Speaker 1: what is that right? As opposed to your TikTok numbers
Speaker 1: and all the all the algorithms. Algorithm of the night.
Speaker 1: I'll rewrite it, the algorithm of the night. I was
Speaker 1: talking to an artist and he's really good and he
Speaker 1: just put his album out and I gave him a song.
Speaker 1: So it's like last year and one of his managers
Speaker 1: works for a major come any you know, he's on
Speaker 1: an independent label, and I go, why doesn't your manager
Speaker 1: sign you? And he goes, my TikTok numbers aren't high enough.
Speaker 1: I'm like, fuck, like you know, and you think you
Speaker 1: think that like the greatest artists, you know, with the Beatles,
Speaker 1: you know, if their TikTok numbers weren't high Wood Prince
Speaker 1: get signed today? Would to me some of these some
Speaker 1: of that I find I find sad because it's really
Speaker 1: all about, like we were talking about what a song
Speaker 1: makes you feel, not about your numbers, because you know what,
Speaker 1: some records and artists might take longer. But I don't
Speaker 1: know if a label will stay with you for that
Speaker 1: to happen. And to me, that's sad, don't you think,
Speaker 1: don't you think? Absolutely? And some of the biggest artists
Speaker 1: in the world didn't break to their you know, to
Speaker 1: their third album. Yeah. And in today's the world, if
Speaker 1: you know, if now it's a first single, yeah, you
Speaker 1: don't even get to your second forget your second album.
Speaker 1: You don't get to your second single. Yeah. It takes
Speaker 1: time to develop. It's sad. That's sad, and I feel
Speaker 1: bad for artists, and then they kind of have to
Speaker 1: do all the work even before a label is you know, interested.
Speaker 1: But for me, it's it's the same thing. I have
Speaker 1: to write a song somebody wants to sing. So that
Speaker 1: hasn't changed at all. What's the feeling when you hear
Speaker 1: a great singer sing your song for the first time?
Speaker 1: What's how? Does it? Nothing better? I mean nothing better?
Speaker 1: You know. I'm sitting here writing a song and I'm
Speaker 1: singing it and I sound like shit, you know, And
Speaker 1: then look, I have one song. I'm gonna give you
Speaker 1: an example, and I got to hear two great singers
Speaker 1: on it. I wrote a song called I Was Here
Speaker 1: that Beyonce sang really one of my favorite songs, and
Speaker 1: then last year Dame Shirley Bassi recorded it. It was like, fuck,
Speaker 1: it's like so cool, you know, the original James Bond.
Speaker 1: Dame Shirley Bassi just did my song. Both song amazingly,
Speaker 1: you know, but so different, Like Beyonce is singing it
Speaker 1: fucking amazing, but you know she's talking about you know,
Speaker 1: I was here, I lived, I Love. She's almost looking
Speaker 1: ahead and then Shirley Bassis behind in a way like
Speaker 1: everything she's done. And it's so it's such a different
Speaker 1: reading of the song and both are just genius. I
Speaker 1: think it's an incredible thing when the song's context changes
Speaker 1: based on the person singing it. Oh yeah. Well. Another
Speaker 1: another example was when I did how Do I Live?
Speaker 1: And it was out with Leon Rhymes and Trisha Earwood
Speaker 1: and Leon Rhymes was fourteen and then Shushia Earwood was older,
Speaker 1: and so it meant something different like you're fourteen years old,
Speaker 1: how do I Live without you? And both versions were great.
Speaker 1: One was you know, kind of innocent and one was
Speaker 1: lived in you know, and they both were fantastic. I
Speaker 1: love to see my songs get other lives. And get reinterpreted,
Speaker 1: you know, and I really love I love to go
Speaker 1: on on YouTube and listen to all the covers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and there's some fucking cool ones I heard. I did
Speaker 1: the song stand up for something that common and Andrew
Speaker 1: Day sings would common. It's kind of become like this
Speaker 1: protest anthem, you know, since it was written for this movie.
Speaker 1: Marshall and I went online just to see if there
Speaker 1: was any cool covers and it's like these little kids,
Speaker 1: girl is probably eight years old, you know, singing from
Speaker 1: her heart and singing the shit out of it, and
Speaker 1: a little kid rapper doing Commons rap, and that just
Speaker 1: made me so happy, like that that song got through
Speaker 1: it right. It's like the coolest thing in the world.
Speaker 1: Have the way that people have reinterpreted your songs. Like you,
Speaker 1: you write the song, you give a demo to the artist,
Speaker 1: or you given demo to the producer, and then they
Speaker 1: make the record. How often is it very aligned with
Speaker 1: the demo and how often does it really stray from
Speaker 1: the demo as far as the production goes. Usually it's
Speaker 1: it's pretty close or someone flips it, which I love.
Speaker 1: You know. Here's the thing, it's my song, but it's
Speaker 1: it's your record, so I know that, and that's cool
Speaker 1: with me because I mean, you know, you want people
Speaker 1: to respect the song, and you know, I work really
Speaker 1: hard on them, but sometimes it'll someone will flip something.
Speaker 1: I remember I had a song called I Could Not
Speaker 1: ask for More that Edwin McCain did, and I remember
Speaker 1: matts letta who's a great producer, produced it. I heard it,
Speaker 1: I'm like, this fucking sucks it like you sped it
Speaker 1: up like fifteen you know, beats. You know, it's this
Speaker 1: ballad and I just I hate it when I first
Speaker 1: heard it, And then the more I heard it, I
Speaker 1: was like, this is fucking brilliant. What he did. He
Speaker 1: like he flipped my song and made it better, you know.
Speaker 1: And then it became a hit by two artists. It
Speaker 1: became a hit with Edwin McCain and then Sarah Evans
Speaker 1: had like a number one country record with it too,
Speaker 1: with that arrangement. So you know, I'm all four people
Speaker 1: flipping my songs. You know. I just wrote something recently
Speaker 1: that kind of was just doing this afrobeat kind of thing,
Speaker 1: and then one of my producers played for me, and
Speaker 1: it's I had to listen to it a couple of times,
Speaker 1: you know, but it's fucking great. He kind of flipped
Speaker 1: it and flipped it on its head a bit. But
Speaker 1: after someone's it takes me listening a few times to
Speaker 1: hear past what's in my head, because what's what's in
Speaker 1: someone else's head might be better. Would you say most
Speaker 1: of your songs are love songs? You know, a lot
Speaker 1: of them are, But then you know, but then my
Speaker 1: songs about other things too. You know, I was here,
Speaker 1: it's an a love song. Stand up for something's not
Speaker 1: a love song until it happens you is not a
Speaker 1: love song, you know. I've I've trying to think on
Speaker 1: my album, there's a lot of love songs. But then
Speaker 1: then there's times like this, the Darius Rocker song. In
Speaker 1: times like this, we could all use an angel. How
Speaker 1: did this new album come about? Because in the past
Speaker 1: we've talked about a different kind of album that I
Speaker 1: thought you were going to make. Well, you never know,
Speaker 1: you never know about that one, okay, because that's what
Speaker 1: I thought. When I heard you you have an album
Speaker 1: coming out. I assumed it was that, and it's and
Speaker 1: it turned into this and tell me that, tell me
Speaker 1: how it happened. Yeah, it's it's it's me being DJ Diane.
Speaker 1: You know what is is. You know, I saw a
Speaker 1: lot of these DJ producers, the Mark Ronson's of the
Speaker 1: World or you know, Calvin Harraz, David Getta. You know,
Speaker 1: they all curate records of different artists. I thought, and
Speaker 1: I have this song that John Legend did, so it
Speaker 1: kind of happened the same time. I just don't call
Speaker 1: it where Is Your Heart? I think it's the best
Speaker 1: thing he's ever done. He probably doesn't because he didn't
Speaker 1: write it. It's one of my best songs and performances
Speaker 1: that I've ever heard on any song online. And he
Speaker 1: kept saying he was going to use the song, and
Speaker 1: I kept giving it to other artists and having to
Speaker 1: pull it because he wanted it, and then he didn't
Speaker 1: want it. In my mind, I was like, I'm determined
Speaker 1: to get this song heard right and then I know
Speaker 1: no one can sing it like him, but whatever. I
Speaker 1: don't know if he's ever gonna put on his record.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, I'm thinking that this idea
Speaker 1: is percolating in my mind. Like you know, I do
Speaker 1: so many different I'm in all genres of music. Most
Speaker 1: songwriters are in one genre, whether it's hip hop, country
Speaker 1: or Latin or rock. And I've always been in all genres.
Speaker 1: I've always worked with every artist there is, you know,
Speaker 1: the classical, crossover artists, everything. And it got me thinking,
Speaker 1: you know, why can't I do that? Why can't I
Speaker 1: curate a record and let me just do all kinds
Speaker 1: of songs. Let me just let me do songs like
Speaker 1: Sweet with Pentatonics and John Batiste and Domino with LP
Speaker 1: and and give Selene Dion a really totally different song,
Speaker 1: you know, super Superwoman, and then give a hip hop
Speaker 1: country song to ty Dolla sign And then why can't
Speaker 1: I put gez In Santana on a song She's fired?
Speaker 1: You know, so it's it's all over the place, or
Speaker 1: Louise Fonzie or there's so much variety on this album.
Speaker 1: And usually, like when the DJ producers do something like that,
Speaker 1: they're getting tons of writers. And by the way, every
Speaker 1: song now, as you know, has like ten writers on it.
Speaker 1: Well mine has one or more, you know. Or I'm
Speaker 1: like I'm going like, what do you guys? So what
Speaker 1: do you guys do? You got the coffee, the high
Speaker 1: hat pattern and the bridge? What the fuck got you
Speaker 1: a writing credit on that. But you know, I didn't
Speaker 1: write the Spanish lyrics on this, so I do have
Speaker 1: people that did that. Um, and I didn't write clearly,
Speaker 1: I didn't write g Easy's rap, so that's that's all
Speaker 1: that's his. But you know these songs are all written
Speaker 1: solely by me. And you hear a song like sweet
Speaker 1: and You and you go, how did that same person
Speaker 1: write Where's Your Heart by John Legend and how to Like?
Speaker 1: But that was what I went in, you know, wanting
Speaker 1: to do. I kind of wanted to go, like, just
Speaker 1: show what I do. And I have so many songs
Speaker 1: I have. I already have like part of Volume two
Speaker 1: because I kept changing it, because I kept writing new songs.
Speaker 1: My favorite song on the record to Sea Side tell
Speaker 1: Me about Oh thank You? You know, I just you know, um,
Speaker 1: obvious season. It's not the sun drinking amtobn Zogan of
Speaker 1: the sun Sunlight. It was just a happy song, you know.
Speaker 1: I just, um, I can't, I don't know. I don't
Speaker 1: know what happen. I just kind of was. I had
Speaker 1: this drum beat I just had on my on my
Speaker 1: drum machine. I started playing chords to it, and the
Speaker 1: song that's the chorus just came to me, you know,
Speaker 1: and it's just such a happy, uplifting song. And it
Speaker 1: was like right before the pandemic, you know, but it
Speaker 1: just kind of makes you happy, right like you could
Speaker 1: close your eyes and just be trans you know. The
Speaker 1: best songs to me are the ones that transport you,
Speaker 1: you know, and they and and that song you can
Speaker 1: close your eyes and if you can't get to the
Speaker 1: sea side, you know, that song kind of brings the
Speaker 1: sea side to you. When you're writing that chorus, do
Speaker 1: you have a picture in mind? Yeah, I was. I
Speaker 1: love the beach. I love the tropics, you know, so
Speaker 1: I love that I kind of took me there and
Speaker 1: it just it just made me feel It made me
Speaker 1: feel really good, you know. And and I love the
Speaker 1: melody in it and the verses kind of you know,
Speaker 1: you can live your life stuck in a traffic light.
Speaker 1: You know. It's just kind of cool. But you know,
Speaker 1: would I'll be seaside sitting in the sand, drinking a
Speaker 1: my tie. I just wish it said, sipping a my tie,
Speaker 1: sitting on the sand, sip in a my tie. In hindsight,
Speaker 1: but drinking a my tie is colt that happened often
Speaker 1: where you'll hear a song or think about a song
Speaker 1: and think about, oh, I could have done it this
Speaker 1: way or a different either a different line. Well not
Speaker 1: usually that one. Drinking my tie is fine too, but
Speaker 1: sometimes I hear it I thought I kind of thought
Speaker 1: that I wrote it that way, and I hear I go, oh, no,
Speaker 1: I didn't, you know. But it's a fun song and
Speaker 1: and and having the Spanish in it. I love that
Speaker 1: as well. Are there any of the songs that you
Speaker 1: that you're surprised were successful in my life? Yeah? Like
Speaker 1: like you thought the song would any particular undry think, oh,
Speaker 1: that one's a good one. But it you know, I
Speaker 1: don't know that it wins these awards, but it does.
Speaker 1: Like have you had that experience where one just like
Speaker 1: outperforms your expectation. I'm more like the opposite. Whenever anything works,
Speaker 1: I'm shocked, to be honest with you, Like, there's so
Speaker 1: many it's so like, there's so many things that could
Speaker 1: go wrong, as you know, like you probably made great records,
Speaker 1: your best records. You go, what the fuck happened? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And I've done that. No, I mean I remember I
Speaker 1: did a song with the Cult called Painted on My
Speaker 1: heart that like that should have been as big as
Speaker 1: I don't want to miss a thing to me. You know,
Speaker 1: the Cult did it and was for this movie Gone
Speaker 1: in sixty seconds. But I have a bunch of those
Speaker 1: you know that that didn't work, and you go, why
Speaker 1: didn't that work? So when they work, it's like you
Speaker 1: just go, that's fucking awesome. How how did that happen?
Speaker 1: You know it is. It's one of the things that's
Speaker 1: interesting about the process is there are so many things
Speaker 1: that have to go right, yeah that aren't and you
Speaker 1: can break through. Yeah, even even honestly writing it isn't
Speaker 1: totally in our control because the ideas don't always come,
Speaker 1: you know, like the best the best ideas don't always come. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but when they do, when they do, and you could
Speaker 1: have the best our control. Yeah, it's just like you know,
Speaker 1: who knows what's going to happen. Just I just I
Speaker 1: want to keep creating great songs. And by the way,
Speaker 1: know my best songs aren't even heard yet. That have
Speaker 1: so many great songs, Yeah, I'm always writing them. So
Speaker 1: it's always great when you know when they happen or
Speaker 1: or even if they're not the biggest hit, you know,
Speaker 1: like maybe Here's to the Night Nights, the song did
Speaker 1: with Ringo Garney on there that wasn't technically a hit,
Speaker 1: but I think it's a perennial song that'll be around forever.
Speaker 1: And I think that there's nothing cooler that's cooler than
Speaker 1: having a number one record. To me, we're going to
Speaker 1: take a quick break and then we'll be back with
Speaker 1: more from Diane Warren. Here's the rest of Rick Rubins
Speaker 1: conversation with Diane Warren. Have you had any songs that
Speaker 1: when they came out didn't perform well but then found
Speaker 1: a second life in a different way and turned into
Speaker 1: a hit. Oh yeah, I do one of them. Well,
Speaker 1: it's kind of funny. I did a song called Don't
Speaker 1: turn Around, and it was after Tina Turner's first album,
Speaker 1: her big comeback out them with What's Love Got to
Speaker 1: Do with It? And she was in her second album
Speaker 1: and I did a song called Don't turn Around and
Speaker 1: Bryan Adams produced it, and it was fucking awesome. It
Speaker 1: just sounded like a hit, and I remember her manager going, well,
Speaker 1: you know it's not going to be on her album.
Speaker 1: It's like so bummed out. I just remember, like I
Speaker 1: stole to this day, remember how bombed out I was.
Speaker 1: And but they put it on a song on the
Speaker 1: B side of Typical Male of a song of Tina's.
Speaker 1: Somehow luther Ingram, who did if Loving You is wrong,
Speaker 1: I don't want to be right, somehow he heard the
Speaker 1: song recorded it, and you know, it went to like,
Speaker 1: you know, number eighty on the R and B chart,
Speaker 1: you know, and then the song has a crazy life.
Speaker 1: Then somehow this group called Aswa, a reggae group out
Speaker 1: of the UK, heard luther Ingram's version and they did
Speaker 1: a reggae version and it became a number one record
Speaker 1: all over Europe and in England. And then along the way,
Speaker 1: all these other people recorded, like Bonnie Tyler and Neil
Speaker 1: Diamond and all these like people started ring the song.
Speaker 1: And then I'm Clive Davis heard the reggae version and
Speaker 1: gave it to Asa Bass and it did become a hit.
Speaker 1: And here's the irony, here's the total irony, and that
Speaker 1: I haven't seen the Tina Turner musical yet, but in
Speaker 1: the Tina Turner musical, one of the big show stopping
Speaker 1: moments is Tina singing that song. So it kind of
Speaker 1: came full circle. So yeah, like songs can have a
Speaker 1: million other lives. I don't give up on a song
Speaker 1: because it wasn't a hit for somebody. Yeah, it's it's
Speaker 1: fascinating how they can take on life for their own.
Speaker 1: It's amazing to watch, and it's like a living thing,
Speaker 1: right it is, and it is all out of our control,
Speaker 1: and you never know why they come around. It's almost
Speaker 1: like the way that it works is how it's meant
Speaker 1: to be. You know. It's sometimes because it had the
Speaker 1: first version of it been a hit, maybe all those
Speaker 1: covers wouldn't happen. Yeah, exactly. I mean I had Neil
Speaker 1: Diamond cover a song of mine that was cool, you know,
Speaker 1: and then it became a hit, and then it went
Speaker 1: full circle back to Tina Turner's musical. So to me,
Speaker 1: a great song is timeless and genre less. At what
Speaker 1: point is it the most fun of all the stuff
Speaker 1: you do? Is it most fun to start a new one? Okay?
Speaker 1: It's both. The funnest thing that I love is coming
Speaker 1: up with something great. Some moms, I'll have a hit
Speaker 1: of a joint and I'm working on something and I
Speaker 1: think it's really great. Like God, I hope when I
Speaker 1: come back and I'm not high, it still sounds good. No,
Speaker 1: But but it's that feeling of coming up with something
Speaker 1: that is my favorite thing. How often when you come back,
Speaker 1: is it different than you thought it was? I know,
Speaker 1: I usually know that day it's that thing. It's that
Speaker 1: what's what it makes you feel? But just a cool
Speaker 1: like just saying something in a different way that just
Speaker 1: gets you so excited, or this melody or the combination,
Speaker 1: or that you come up with something that there's only
Speaker 1: so many notes and stuff, but yet you can find
Speaker 1: a million ways to make them work. And I love.
Speaker 1: That's my favorite thing, is to come up with something
Speaker 1: and finishing it is great, but coming up with something
Speaker 1: is better, you know. And then I put up a
Speaker 1: lot of time into these songs, I really do. I'll
Speaker 1: sit and I'll work all day long. Two lines, the
Speaker 1: last two lines of the bridge, like fuck. Everything else
Speaker 1: is easy, but those two lines have taken me all
Speaker 1: day or maybe till the next day, you know. But
Speaker 1: then you know, I'll listen to a song I might
Speaker 1: have written, you know, a few months ago or a
Speaker 1: year ago. Whatever. If I have a meeting with an
Speaker 1: artist and I'll listen, I'll go I'm so glad. I
Speaker 1: stayed with that song, and I didn't. Because I'm listening
Speaker 1: like with fresh ears, I'm like, yeah, I'm glad I
Speaker 1: did that. I'm glad I took those two days or
Speaker 1: whatever it took to get that right, because it stands up.
Speaker 1: Do you ever leave a song unfinished or never? You
Speaker 1: always finish? And I finished everything I'm writing at the time,
Speaker 1: but I have some starts that I should get to
Speaker 1: and start might just be like a cool chord change
Speaker 1: or like the beginning of something. How how small would
Speaker 1: an idea be that's worth worth coming back to. It's
Speaker 1: usually a chorus, it's usually a hook. I move on
Speaker 1: to something else and I go, come, what about that?
Speaker 1: I should go back to that, and I will I will.
Speaker 1: I have some really good songs that I'll finished, but
Speaker 1: I'm always coming u the new ones. It's like my album.
Speaker 1: I kept like, you know, I kept coming up with
Speaker 1: new songs. I'm like, well, I want to do this one.
Speaker 1: You know. My album was done, and my dentist his
Speaker 1: friends with someone in Pentatonics. My album is done and
Speaker 1: he goes, you need to, you know, meet the Pentatonics people,
Speaker 1: and go, oh, I'd just written this song called sweet
Speaker 1: it's kind of like it's all my albums called kind
Speaker 1: of motowny and so I met them and my album
Speaker 1: is really done. I'm like, I want them to do sweet.
Speaker 1: And then I ran into John Battiste at the Oscars
Speaker 1: earlier this year where I lost for my twelfth time,
Speaker 1: and it's okay, I'm in the game and I fucking
Speaker 1: love it. Yea, and John Battiste won, you know, for
Speaker 1: on his first nomination for Soul and when I when
Speaker 1: I met him, I was like, oh, what if I
Speaker 1: put together John and and Pentatonics, I could be so
Speaker 1: totally cool because John's whole vibe is this positivity. He's
Speaker 1: like so upbeat. I wrote the song that's when I
Speaker 1: was nominated for this year. It's called c Yeah. Laura
Speaker 1: Puzzini sang it. Can you play a little bit of
Speaker 1: the of the song, the one I wrote for the movie? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: but can you just play a little now so we
Speaker 1: can hear it? M I want you to know know
Speaker 1: that you see because I see who you sorry, and
Speaker 1: I see too who you I can't see it, who
Speaker 1: can from me? I want you to know that you
Speaker 1: see when you think then no one understands you. Oh, oh, well,
Speaker 1: it's a beautiful song. I can't see it. It sounds
Speaker 1: so good. Yeah, listen to it. It's called well in Italian,
Speaker 1: it's called eoc scene and Laura Pazzini sings it, so's
Speaker 1: it's beautiful in Italian. You've had a couple of other
Speaker 1: songs that have been translated into Italian. How does that
Speaker 1: experience work? I love it. I love when my songs
Speaker 1: are in different languages and everything sounds better in Italian
Speaker 1: and Spanish. Yeah, it just does. They're both such beautiful,
Speaker 1: romantic languages. That's why I really on my album I wanted.
Speaker 1: I definitely wanted Spanish. When you write a song for
Speaker 1: a movie, do they tell you the story? Do they
Speaker 1: give you the script? Like? How much do you like
Speaker 1: to know before writing a song for a movie. Oh?
Speaker 1: I like to know everything. Ideally I could see a
Speaker 1: rough film, like like this year, I did a song.
Speaker 1: I did but a few songs, but I did. One
Speaker 1: of the ones I'm really excited about is a song
Speaker 1: called Somehow You Do that Reba McEntire sings, and it's
Speaker 1: from a movie called Four Good Days Glenn Close and
Speaker 1: Mulakunas about a drug addic daughter and her and her mom,
Speaker 1: and it's a really powerful movie. But I saw I
Speaker 1: saw a rough of that, and I wanted to write
Speaker 1: a song, a really hopeful song, you know, at the
Speaker 1: end of that movie. And I got Reba can Tied
Speaker 1: to sing my song, which is really cool too. She's
Speaker 1: so great, which she puts into it, and that song
Speaker 1: in that movie it means one thing, but outside of
Speaker 1: the movie, because it's about like going through tough times,
Speaker 1: you know, and if you look at the comments on
Speaker 1: the video, it's a lot about depression, a lot of
Speaker 1: hardships the people that you're going through. So I try
Speaker 1: to keep the song open as well to fit the movie.
Speaker 1: That's that's the most important thing. But it has to
Speaker 1: live outside of the movie as well, and then people
Speaker 1: could become whatever anybody wants it to be. But back
Speaker 1: to your question, Ideally, if if I watch a movie
Speaker 1: or read a script, but I have to see, I
Speaker 1: have to feel what that is, and then it's a
Speaker 1: subconscious thing, and it's if I'm doing an end song,
Speaker 1: like I did something I'm so excited about. I'm not
Speaker 1: going to talk rauts for next year that I read
Speaker 1: the script and it just was so powerful and It
Speaker 1: took me a couple of days to figure out what
Speaker 1: I wanted to say there, because it was had to
Speaker 1: speak for the character and it's an actual person, so
Speaker 1: it had to really be powerful and shok me a
Speaker 1: couple days. But when I got it and I sat
Speaker 1: at the keyboard and I started crying, I knew that
Speaker 1: it was wow, that I knew it was right, Yeah, beautiful.
Speaker 1: Do you ever hear something that you wrote a long
Speaker 1: time ago and have a new understanding of what it
Speaker 1: means later? Not really. I don't go back and listen
Speaker 1: to my old songs, but if I did, I probably would.
Speaker 1: I'm so forward motion and how I am like I
Speaker 1: don't usually look back, like my rear view mirror is
Speaker 1: just cracked. But you're still. Your songs are so in
Speaker 1: the culture that you come up. Your songs come up.
Speaker 1: If you live life, we get to hear your songs
Speaker 1: in life, you know, without the same for me, like
Speaker 1: I don't, I don't. I don't listen back to my music,
Speaker 1: but it's not unusual for me for me to be
Speaker 1: somewhere and hear one of my old songs. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: how amazing is it that you the work you did,
Speaker 1: You've done, but you're thinking of different things now, right,
Speaker 1: you've already moved past that. But when you stop and
Speaker 1: think about it, it is mind blowing the effect what
Speaker 1: you do or what I do has on people. It's
Speaker 1: it's it's it's just like when when we grew up,
Speaker 1: think about how that was for us. Well, that's what
Speaker 1: you're doing or what I'm doing could be for them,
Speaker 1: and it's still it has the same effect on us.
Speaker 1: I mean, I know when I hear a song. Sometimes
Speaker 1: I'll hear a song and I don't remember if I
Speaker 1: hear something I like, I can't tell whether I worked
Speaker 1: on it or not. Yeah, because they fall into the
Speaker 1: same category of something that I've listened to so much. Right,
Speaker 1: either I was in the room or I wasn't right right,
Speaker 1: but the same I've heard it, you know, ten thousand times,
Speaker 1: so I may have been there, you know. I to
Speaker 1: think about have to try to picture the room and
Speaker 1: see if I was there. Sometimes it really feels familiar.
Speaker 1: It's like, wow, where did we record this? Like oh wait,
Speaker 1: I had nothing to do with this one. You could
Speaker 1: be somewhere and you hear something you go like it
Speaker 1: happens to me, Like I was getting coffee BC before
Speaker 1: COVID and I heard something. I go, what is that? Oh,
Speaker 1: that happened to me recently too, And it was just
Speaker 1: the most random thing. And they were my songs that
Speaker 1: happened to me at a restaurant like last month, my friend. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And it was so weird because I was about to
Speaker 1: send one of the songs. I forgot that someone even
Speaker 1: did it, and I was about to send it to
Speaker 1: another artist, you know, like I'm glad I didn't because
Speaker 1: they would have wanted They probably it was in the
Speaker 1: same genre, muse, they probably wouldn't wanted to do it.
Speaker 1: Another song comes on right after, and it was this
Speaker 1: obscure song I did on in sync. I was like, wait,
Speaker 1: that sounds familiar. Oh shit, that's my song. And I
Speaker 1: was wondering if if someone in the restaurant knew that
Speaker 1: I was there or something, because it was kind of
Speaker 1: obscure songs. Yeah, but I forgot that that was mine.
Speaker 1: And then I just she zam it, Yeah, it's happened
Speaker 1: to me too. She zam songs like oh wow, yeah,
Speaker 1: completely forget. It's just has to do in both of
Speaker 1: our cases. With the volume even we make, we work
Speaker 1: on a lot of music and it comes in and
Speaker 1: it goes out. Yeah, exactly, and it's on in the
Speaker 1: next and not there doesn't mean a lot to us,
Speaker 1: because it does, you know, my songs yet to me.
Speaker 1: But I'm like, I'm I'm what I'm excited about was
Speaker 1: the next song and what I'm working on now? And yeah,
Speaker 1: anything else from just from your love of music that
Speaker 1: you want to talk about, I don't think I kind
Speaker 1: of covered I just I just love doing this. I
Speaker 1: love writing songs. I feel like I've almost like never
Speaker 1: had a hit, you know, So it's all it's all
Speaker 1: it's that hunger and that that love of it that
Speaker 1: means everything. Yeah, it's no different. It's nice when their
Speaker 1: hits at the same time when we but we when
Speaker 1: we get to make them. The minute that it's done,
Speaker 1: it's a great feeling of like, wow, we got to
Speaker 1: make this beautiful thing. Yeah, it's the coolest feeling in
Speaker 1: the world. You just want the world to hear them,
Speaker 1: absolutely cool. Well, I hope that there's a way for
Speaker 1: the world to hear all of the songs that you
Speaker 1: have that are that you've never put out and that
Speaker 1: have not yet come out, and that'd be a fun
Speaker 1: thing to think about is how to make that happen
Speaker 1: because they all they all need to be hear. Yeah,
Speaker 1: yeah for sure on this album. You know, there's so
Speaker 1: many good songs on this album too that I hope
Speaker 1: that we get singles rights to the John Legend song
Speaker 1: because that's just such a great song. Yeah. I like
Speaker 1: the Domino song too. I think, Yeah, is that a
Speaker 1: cool song that's like the that's so unlike. That's one
Speaker 1: that's like people are like you wrote that. It's so different.
Speaker 1: It's like a spaghetti western weird song. And and I
Speaker 1: love LP's voice on it, and it's just it's so weird.
Speaker 1: But I think that's like a big song on there.
Speaker 1: That's a lot of people's favorite song. It's really catchy.
Speaker 1: It's just super catchy. And I like the fact that
Speaker 1: it's not like other songs, you know, it's a particular thing.
Speaker 1: It's it's really good. Thank you. Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: I have things that people don't even know that I have,
Speaker 1: you know too, and that's that's one of them. I'm
Speaker 1: glad it got a chance to get heard, and I
Speaker 1: hope it's a big hen that's true. We see you soon. Okay,
Speaker 1: great to see you. I hope to see you in
Speaker 1: person soon. Same thanks to Diane Warren for sharing her
Speaker 1: songwriting process with great. You can check out a playlist
Speaker 1: of our favorite Diane Warren Penn songs plus her new
Speaker 1: album at broken Record podcast dot com. Be sure to
Speaker 1: subscribe to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash
Speaker 1: Broken Record Podcast. We can find all of our new episodes.
Speaker 1: You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record. Broken
Speaker 1: Record is produced with helpful Leah Rose, Jason Gambrel, Martin Gonzalez,
Speaker 1: Eric Sandler, and Jennifer Sanchez, with engineering help from Nick Chafee.
Speaker 1: Our executive producer is Mila Bell. Broken Record is a
Speaker 1: production of Pushkin Industries. If you love this show and
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Speaker 1: podcast to have our the music spect Kenny Beats, I'm
Speaker 1: justin Richmond,