Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: Joining us now as we parse through everything that has
Speaker 2: happened in twenty twenty five around the trade story is
Speaker 2: the twentieth US Trade Representative.
Speaker 3: Jamison Greer.
Speaker 2: Representative Greer, I want to start on how busy twenty
Speaker 2: twenty five really was looking ahead to twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2: Do you expect the same kind of pace with respect
Speaker 2: to trade deals with respect to trade announcements.
Speaker 1: Well, during twenty twenty five, President Trump the administration has
Speaker 1: essentially reset the global trading order to move from total
Speaker 1: liberal trade in the United States without any cost to
Speaker 1: a new fair and balanced approach. We we've announced lots
Speaker 1: of trade deals, We've announced lots of tariffs, as you know,
Speaker 1: in the coming year, we expect to finalize a bunch
Speaker 1: of those trade deals as well. You know, I think
Speaker 1: that the tariff plan is in good shape. I think
Speaker 1: we have a lot of the tariffs we want in place.
Speaker 1: You know, if there are countries here and there that
Speaker 1: don't comply with their deals or don't want to finish
Speaker 1: a deal, then maybe we have.
Speaker 4: To have another conversation.
Speaker 1: But I think the economy's booming, inflations, down wages, are up.
Speaker 4: We're in a really great track.
Speaker 2: How much are you potentially at risk should the Supreme
Speaker 2: Court overturn some of the tariffs that have been enacted
Speaker 2: under the AEPA provision. Do you have something in place
Speaker 2: to get those tariffs through other measures or will there
Speaker 2: be a rethink about what will be put on and
Speaker 2: what won't.
Speaker 1: Well, it would be terrible if the Supreme Court overturned
Speaker 1: the case because we have built a new global trading
Speaker 1: order on the back of these tariffs and the tariff
Speaker 1: system and our trading partners have accepted it, and they've
Speaker 1: made deals and they've accepted there's going to be some
Speaker 1: tariff leveled help protect US industry.
Speaker 4: So it would be disaster if this was pulled out.
Speaker 1: All that being said, we will do whatever we need
Speaker 1: to do to make sure that we can maintain the
Speaker 1: tariffs we need and keep the deals in place. Obviously,
Speaker 1: we want the flexibility of the emergency powers that Congress
Speaker 1: has given to the President. It's the most effective way
Speaker 1: to deal with it. So what's made them so effective
Speaker 1: this year in negotiating. But absent that, you know, we'll
Speaker 1: work and we'll find a way to make sure we
Speaker 1: can keep all these games we've made over the past year.
Speaker 2: Representative Greer, there's also a feeling right now that cost
Speaker 2: of living concerns are coming to the fore. And President
Speaker 2: Trump has talked about removing some of tariffs on specific goods,
Speaker 2: particularly having to do with food, is a way of
Speaker 2: alleviating some of the price concerns. How does that factor
Speaker 2: into discussions going forward? Do you think that that will
Speaker 2: be an increasing part of your thought process as you
Speaker 2: go through some of these trade negotiations.
Speaker 1: Well, any good president wants to address affordability, and our
Speaker 1: president is and over the past month we saw you know, dairy,
Speaker 1: you know, fruit and vegetables, all kinds of prices go
Speaker 1: down for basic stables, staples. So that's a great development
Speaker 1: going forward. The President removed some tariffs in connection with
Speaker 1: some deals related to food coming from a broad bananas, coffee, coco,
Speaker 1: the kinds of things we just don't make in the
Speaker 1: n United States is a food powerhouse.
Speaker 4: When we saw.
Speaker 1: Inflation earlier, it's really about causing healthcare driven by Obamacare disaster.
Speaker 1: So I don't think that, you know, food imports are
Speaker 1: really going to be an issue for us. You know,
Speaker 1: the tariff program is really about creating jobs, and the
Speaker 1: presence regulatory approach is really about bringing prices down and
Speaker 1: bringing affordability.
Speaker 3: Ambassador.
Speaker 5: Have you had any specific directives from the President though,
Speaker 5: as you carry out your negotiations to make sure any
Speaker 5: tariffs you put on from here are anyones that you
Speaker 5: negotiate specifically are not having an impact on affordability.
Speaker 1: So you know, the kind of the way you put
Speaker 1: it there a specific direction, I would say no. Whenever
Speaker 1: we're imposing tariffs are doing deals. The purpose of the
Speaker 1: trade program is to reshore American manufacturing and protect American
Speaker 1: food security. It's really about jobs and increasing wages, which
Speaker 1: we've seen over the past few months. When it comes
Speaker 1: to prices, the President is undertaking a lot of other actions,
Speaker 1: you know, energy policy, tax policy, regulatory gas prices are down, etc.
Speaker 1: So we don't see the trade policy really as driving prices.
Speaker 1: We see it as driving jobs.
Speaker 3: Ambassador.
Speaker 5: I'd love to go back where Lisa started, and that
Speaker 5: is it looks more likely that we indeed have something
Speaker 5: of a TikTok deal where US buyers will take the
Speaker 5: American portion. You after some of the negotiations in Madrid,
Speaker 5: we're talking about how this deal, how this company was
Speaker 5: part and parcel of a variety of matters when it
Speaker 5: comes to negotiation, negotiating with your Chinese counterparts. So have
Speaker 5: you had more discussions about this deal with TikTok. Does
Speaker 5: it seem likely that China will let it happen.
Speaker 1: So there are two layers to the TikTok deal. One
Speaker 1: is the private sector layer, where the private parties are
Speaker 1: concluding a deal, and then there's a layer of government approvals.
Speaker 4: Between the United States and China.
Speaker 1: And so my conversations with the Chinese government over the
Speaker 1: past few months, as you mentioned, have covered a variety
Speaker 1: of issues.
Speaker 4: One of them has been TikTok.
Speaker 1: Back at our discussions in Madrid, we came to an
Speaker 1: essential agreement that if the private parties came to agreement,
Speaker 1: that the Chinese.
Speaker 4: Would approve it. So we expect approval by.
Speaker 1: The government of China in alignment with that agreement we
Speaker 1: reached earlier this year.
Speaker 2: We're hearing about not only this deal with respect to
Speaker 2: TikTok and some investors in the US, but also a
Speaker 2: review process to sell two hundred chips into China. And
Speaker 2: I'm just wondering, stepping back, if all of these are
Speaker 2: pieces of a bigger deal that will come to fruition
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty six between the US and China.
Speaker 1: I would say with the H two hundred export control issues,
Speaker 1: those really are standalone. That was not a negotiated outcome
Speaker 1: in the United States. With respect to export controls, those
Speaker 1: are not something that are really subject to negotiation. Those
Speaker 1: are national security and commercial decisions made by the federal government.
Speaker 1: So that's kind of standing on its own. With respect
Speaker 1: to the rest of the China deal. Right now, we're
Speaker 1: trying to make sure that rare earths continue flowing from China.
Speaker 1: You know, they bought over five million metric tons of
Speaker 1: soybeans at this point, and we're trying to keep trade
Speaker 1: flowing between the two countries in the way that makes sense.
Speaker 2: Do you expect a bigger deal other than just sort
Speaker 2: of steady reset kind of idea that you've talked about
Speaker 2: with respect to the US and China. Do you expect
Speaker 2: something more comprehensive to be outlined next year.
Speaker 1: It's a little hard to say at this point. Goal
Speaker 1: one is stability. For me, and everyone's heard me say
Speaker 1: this before. We need trade with China to be much
Speaker 1: more balanced. Our trade deficit with China has decreased by
Speaker 1: twenty five percent this year alone under President Trump's.
Speaker 4: Policy, so that's going the right direction.
Speaker 1: I can first see a situation in the first half
Speaker 1: of next year where we come to some kind of
Speaker 1: agreement with China on exactly what we should be trading
Speaker 1: with each other and even in what volumes. It's a
Speaker 1: little bit of managed trade, but it's the kind of
Speaker 1: thing that can be healthy and stable. You know, Given
Speaker 1: the way that Chinese government runs its economy, it just
Speaker 1: doesn't mesh very well with the way we want to
Speaker 1: run our economy. That just means we have to manage
Speaker 1: it a little bit more. And I think there's a
Speaker 1: possibility of that. I'm not sure i'd call it comprehensive,
Speaker 1: call it confidence building, Ambassador.
Speaker 5: I think a lot of the confusion from many people
Speaker 5: comes around national security. One of the points that you
Speaker 5: mentioned just a moment ago, especially things with H two
Speaker 5: hundred chips giving chips to China has seen an issue
Speaker 5: of national security. Even giving F thirty fives to Saudi Arabia,
Speaker 5: what does that mean for national security? Because critics would
Speaker 5: say that it means that national security is up for sale.
Speaker 3: What would you say to those critics.
Speaker 1: So with respect to the F thirty five, that's not
Speaker 1: my I used to be in the Air Force, but
Speaker 1: it's not it's not my wheelhouse. I'm h two hundreds
Speaker 1: and export controls generally, export controls have always been fluid,
Speaker 1: They've never been static. The very nature of export controls
Speaker 1: is that the US government is constantly reviewing the state
Speaker 1: of technology and assessing what technologies can be sold and
Speaker 1: which ones can't, and balancing national security and assessing whether
Speaker 1: or not there's foreign availability. Everyone knows that the Chinese
Speaker 1: are quickly also trying to develop their own AI chips,
Speaker 1: semiconductor tool to make those chips, etc.
Speaker 4: It's a race. All of those Age two hundred approvals
Speaker 4: still have.
Speaker 1: To go through the Commerce Department to make sure that
Speaker 1: any licenses that are granted really respect US national security
Speaker 1: and make sure that it's not violated, and there can
Speaker 1: be conditions on licenses, etc. To make sure they go
Speaker 1: to end users and end uses that don't jeopardize US
Speaker 1: national security.
Speaker 5: Is it fair to say that, Ambassador that even if
Speaker 5: this does go through the kind of cases where this
Speaker 5: is allowed, where it's approved, will still be quite limited
Speaker 5: in scope.
Speaker 1: So it's hard to say at this point that these
Speaker 1: types of license applications are typically a case by case and.
Speaker 4: Reviewed, so we'll see.
Speaker 1: The way it's set up right now is if the
Speaker 1: chips are going to go to China, they come back
Speaker 1: to the US for a security inspection to make sure
Speaker 1: that they are indeed the types of chips that are
Speaker 1: being allowed to be sent to the Chinese. We know
Speaker 1: there are a lot of Chinese companies that want them.
Speaker 1: We know the Chinese government's pretty interested in having their
Speaker 1: own domestic champions build them. So the Chinese themselves right
Speaker 1: now are having a conversation about the types of chips
Speaker 1: that they want from the United States. We think that
Speaker 1: they want the Age two Hunters. They've shown an interest
Speaker 1: in that, so we'll see between their process and ours,
Speaker 1: we'll see where it goes.
Speaker 2: It seems like the tech wars have been behind a
Speaker 2: lot of the negotiations over the past twelve months, in
Speaker 2: particular not only with China but.
Speaker 3: Also the European Union.
Speaker 2: I'm just wondering where some of those discussions are with
Speaker 2: respect to some of the restrictions and regulatory investigations Europe
Speaker 2: has been making toward US tech companies.
Speaker 3: Where are some of those discussions.
Speaker 1: So I just had a conversation yesterday with my counterpart
Speaker 1: in the European Trade in the European Commission yesterday to
Speaker 1: reinforce some of the strong concerns we're hearing from US stakeholders.
Speaker 1: US tech companies are the most competitive in the world,
Speaker 1: and Europe frankly doesn't have those types of competitors. If
Speaker 1: you talk to the Europeans, they'll say, that's why we
Speaker 1: have to regulate and have these protectionist measures against US
Speaker 1: tech companies. Unfortunately, we see in the way that they've
Speaker 1: developed those measures they're discriminatory. They only capture companies above
Speaker 1: a certain threshold of revenue globally or certain business models,
Speaker 1: and magically it only happens to capture US companies. They'll
Speaker 1: say that they're Chinese companies too, but we only see
Speaker 1: actions against American companies.
Speaker 4: So it's a problem. It's discriminatory in fact.
Speaker 1: You'll hear the European say, well, it's fair, but it's
Speaker 1: discriminatory in fact and in intent.
Speaker 4: So I want to talk to these folks. I want
Speaker 4: to negotiate over it.
Speaker 1: They've been somewhat resistant to that, but again I had
Speaker 1: a great conversation yesterday with the European Trade Commissioner, and
Speaker 1: I think we just have to be able to talk
Speaker 1: about why they're doing this, why they're purporting to regulate
Speaker 1: American companies and their global business models.
Speaker 3: Ambassador.
Speaker 2: Coming into twenty twenty five, a lot of people were
Speaker 2: wondering who are allies and who our adversaries would be
Speaker 2: on trade, and we were talking about who traditionally have
Speaker 2: been US allies and who haven't. Have you been surprised
Speaker 2: and who's been most difficult to deal with in twenty
Speaker 2: twenty It has surprised a lot of people in the
Speaker 2: markets to see the likes of Europe be a more
Speaker 2: contentious discussion than other regions, even sometimes China.
Speaker 1: That's because they haven't been trade negotiators. I have not
Speaker 1: been surprised at where it's been more challenging. Take India,
Speaker 1: for example, who's an important partner and a strategic partner
Speaker 1: in a lot of ways. We started negotiating with them
Speaker 1: early in the year and we're still negotiating.
Speaker 4: With them to trying to find a good landing zone.
Speaker 1: During that time, we have other trade partners who have
Speaker 1: come in, started proceeded with and concluded trade negotiations with US, etc.
Speaker 1: The reality is somebody like Europe and frankly you know
Speaker 1: some jurisdictions that want to emulate them. They know they
Speaker 1: might have relatively low tariffs compared to the rest of
Speaker 1: the world, but they have non tariff barriers, regulations that
Speaker 1: exclude American agriculture, which is a major exports, and regulations
Speaker 1: that exclude are industrial exports. And so you get into it.
Speaker 1: And this is why we have giant and balances. It's
Speaker 1: not because Europe is really competitive, we know they're not.
Speaker 1: It's because they have a lot of these rules that
Speaker 1: prevent US goods and services from going into the continent.
Speaker 2: Ambassador Greer just to finish up on Mexico.
Speaker 3: Which has been negotiating.
Speaker 2: From what we understand, they just recently gave final approval
Speaker 2: to put tariffs on certain Chinese imports, and a lot
Speaker 2: of people are expecting there to be some sort of
Speaker 2: reprieve with respect to aluminum and steel tariffs on Mexico.
Speaker 3: Is there any discussion about that going on right now?
Speaker 1: So, first of all, any country in the world who
Speaker 1: exports steel and aluminum to the United States wants to
Speaker 1: have a modification to that regime. Because the United States
Speaker 1: for many years has been the consumer of last resort,
Speaker 1: and this is why the President put steel loomed tariffs
Speaker 1: on in the first administration. The Biden administration kept them,
Speaker 1: and the President has tightened them further in his second administration.
Speaker 1: Of course, the Mexicans are asking for this. We have
Speaker 1: found the Mexicans to be quite constructive in some of
Speaker 1: our recent discussions and looking to change some of their
Speaker 1: laws and regulations related to long.
Speaker 4: Standing US concerns.
Speaker 1: So have the Mexicans asked about this, Yes, you know,
Speaker 1: I won't give any further detail beyond that, but it's
Speaker 1: certainly something that they would like to see.
Speaker 4: It's not surprising.
Speaker 2: Ambassador Greer, thank you so much for being with us
Speaker 2: this morning, and have a wonderful rust of the year.
Speaker 2: Ambassador Jamison Greer speaking with us