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Speaker 1: Hey there, everybody. It's Tuesday, November eighteen, and a big

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Speaker 1: headline for Ron Goldman's father, Fred Goldman, thirty one years

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Speaker 1: after the death of his son O J. Simpson's estate

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Speaker 1: finally agrees to pay him and with that everyone, welcome

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Speaker 1: to this episode of Amy and TJ. This is a

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Speaker 1: man who has been for three decades talking about pursuing

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Speaker 1: trying to get some sort of justice for the death

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Speaker 1: of his son, and it seems as though he may

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Speaker 1: get a part partial justice, perhaps is what we might

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Speaker 1: call it?

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Speaker 2: Is that what we call this If he'd have gotten

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Speaker 2: every single dime of that money that initial judgment thirty

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Speaker 2: plus million.

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Speaker 3: Would that it felt like justice?

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Speaker 2: I would argue, No, like you said, some semblance of

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Speaker 2: some little I guess something that you could say you

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Speaker 2: had a win. I mean, the win was in court.

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Speaker 2: Him paying isn't the win, I guess, But I guess

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Speaker 2: that judgment originally was the only thing they had, which

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Speaker 2: was a legal court proceeding that said that O. J.

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Speaker 2: Simpson was responsible for killing Ron Goldman. That was the

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Speaker 2: biggest moment probably for this family.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and you think about it, This is a family

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Speaker 1: that has been dealt a series of somewhat wins and

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Speaker 1: obviously a significant loss when OJ Simpson was found not

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Speaker 1: guilty for the murders of Ron Goldman and Nicole Brown Simpson.

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Speaker 1: But then yes, they get the civil judgment with a

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Speaker 1: huge payout that they never received. Then OJ Simpson finally

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Speaker 1: does go to prison, but not for the crime of murder,

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Speaker 1: but for burglary for sealing back his own stuff. So yes,

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Speaker 1: he goes behind bars, but not for the reasons why

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Speaker 1: the Goldman family would have wanted. And then he dies

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Speaker 1: before any of this actually happens in his lifetime. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's like some wins but a lot of losses. But

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Speaker 1: today or at least this headline has to be some

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Speaker 1: sort of a victory for the family.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it seems weird to talk about it in

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Speaker 2: wins and losses. I know what you're saying, but yes,

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Speaker 2: to your point, it was that moment in court that

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Speaker 2: everybody saw right when he was not guilty was the

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Speaker 2: biggest possible loss. But still, even today we are thirty

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Speaker 2: plus years later, O J. Simpson has never been criminally

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Speaker 2: held responsible for the deaths of his ex wife and

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Speaker 2: Ron Goleman. That is just a fact that will stand

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Speaker 2: for all time for this family. So when they can

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Speaker 2: get something, when they can get a victory in court,

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Speaker 2: when I guess when he went back to prison, when

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Speaker 2: I mean, I don't want to say that anybody celebrated

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Speaker 2: his death, but there was anybody on the planet who

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Speaker 2: I could imagine hurt least in hearing that old J.

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Speaker 3: Simpson was dead. It might have been that family.

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Speaker 1: Agreed, agreed. And so this latest headline is that OJ

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Speaker 1: Simpson's estate has accepted a claim for fifty eight million dollars.

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Speaker 1: Ron Goldman originally had wanted one hundred and seventeen million.

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Speaker 1: That's what he had done, the math he had done

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Speaker 1: with all the interests he said had accrued. OJ Simpson's

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Speaker 1: estate said, yeah, we think your math might be a

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Speaker 1: little off, so we will agree to fifty eight. However,

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Speaker 1: and there is a big however, we don't even have

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Speaker 1: even anywhere close to that amount of money in the

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Speaker 1: estate to give you. I think they're saying they might

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Speaker 1: be able to scrape together anywhere between five hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: and a million dollars.

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Speaker 2: Now I saw this as well. He said scrape together.

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Speaker 2: That might be all they got. And that doesn't mean

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Speaker 2: they're going to get every dime of it. If they

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Speaker 2: document every single dime to OJ Simpson's name that's left over,

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Speaker 2: there's a whole bunch of people in line ahead of

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Speaker 2: the Goldmans who need to get paid first.

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Speaker 1: Including the irs. I believe they said the OJ Simpson

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Speaker 1: estate owes around six hundred and forty thousand dollars in

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Speaker 1: taxes to the state of California, and that would have

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Speaker 1: to be the priority. Makes sense.

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Speaker 2: This is what happened, right the headline and I get it.

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Speaker 2: It is a major headline that the Simpson of state.

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Speaker 2: It almost sounds like there is an admission of guilt

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Speaker 2: or we're saying, okay that this is no What this

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Speaker 2: is is what so many people in this country go

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Speaker 2: through every single day having to do with probate court.

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Speaker 2: This is really a civil matter where they're trying to

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Speaker 2: hunt down the estate of someone who has died. They're

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Speaker 2: essentially a creditor at this point, and everybody's coming after

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Speaker 2: this estate because he's died and we want our money,

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Speaker 2: and this is a part of the process. Ropes this

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Speaker 2: almost I know the headlines are where they are. This

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Speaker 2: seems like even a bigger headache, like, oh my god,

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Speaker 2: they got to deal with this now.

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Speaker 1: Now, now we're finally hearing that you are acknowledging that

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Speaker 1: you owe us money, and you're saying you're going to

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Speaker 1: try to pay us what you can. But yeah, we're

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Speaker 1: in line, and we're at the back of the line. Look,

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Speaker 1: Fred Goldman and his family, they I mean, when I

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Speaker 1: was working at the Today Show sometimes I felt like

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Speaker 1: they were on once a month trying to continue putting

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Speaker 1: a spotlight on OJ Simpson almost in a weird way,

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Speaker 1: publicly shaming him for not actually giving the money to

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Speaker 1: them that they are owed that a court mandated he

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Speaker 1: paid them back, and would complain about how he basically

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Speaker 1: found a way to live off of other people, like gifts,

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Speaker 1: things that weren't financially trans like that weren't transactions that

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Speaker 1: he could say, oh, I earned this money, now I

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Speaker 1: owe this to you, So he found ways to get around.

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Speaker 3: They couldn't touch his NFL pension.

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Speaker 1: He could not touch his NFL pension.

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Speaker 2: Du spoke a cigars. They see him playing golf. You

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Speaker 2: owe us thirty plus million, and he is seemingly at

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Speaker 2: least was going about his life. So this moment, for

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Speaker 2: that reason is a significant one headline wise, but in reality,

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Speaker 2: I don't know how much of a difference this now makes.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I do think in tone it was striking to me.

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Speaker 1: And look the initial response from the executor of OJ

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Speaker 1: Simpson's estate the day after his death. I actually read

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Speaker 1: what he said, and it's pretty remarkable given that he

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Speaker 1: said this in April of twenty twenty four, and now

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Speaker 1: we have the headline we have to day. His statement was,

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Speaker 1: it's my hope that the Goldmans get nothing, get zero

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Speaker 1: them specifically, and I will do everything in my capacity

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Speaker 1: as the executor or personal representative to try and ensure

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Speaker 1: they get nothing. That was what he said the day

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Speaker 1: after O. J.

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Speaker 2: Simpson died, and that could still stand. I mean, this

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Speaker 2: does not mean a check book is about to get

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Speaker 2: opened up at all. So to your point, he might

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Speaker 2: not have gone too far from that. And again there

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Speaker 2: was a timeline after his debt was an April.

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Speaker 1: Year, April of twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 3: Okay, he died April last year.

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Speaker 2: This put a whole bunch of things into motion, and

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Speaker 2: that's why we are at this point. It's not like

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Speaker 2: the Goldmans, this is some renewed effort. They have not stopped.

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Speaker 1: They never let go the moment we.

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Speaker 2: Found out about the death of Ron Goldman. This family

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Speaker 2: has had one mission and is to go after oh J. Simpson,

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Speaker 2: and they have not stopped for that. I give them

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Speaker 2: all the credit in the world.

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Speaker 1: It's pretty remarkable. Yes, it is three decades unrelenting, and

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Speaker 1: I do I do want to point out that same

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Speaker 1: executor because that was quite the statement, he said. A

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Speaker 1: short time later, he did express regret for speaking so forcibly,

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Speaker 1: and so he said, in hindsight in response to that statement,

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Speaker 1: it's my hope they get zero nothing. I think that

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Speaker 1: was pretty harsh, he admitted, and he said, now that

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Speaker 1: I understand my role as the executor and the personal representative,

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Speaker 1: it's time to tone down the rhetoric and really get

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Speaker 1: down to what my role is as a personal represent

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Speaker 1: It's interesting because it felt as though, and look, yes,

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Speaker 1: the Goldmans and Fred Goldman specifically and the sister were

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Speaker 1: very very aggressive in their media campaign against OJ Simpson,

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Speaker 1: trying to get some sort of justice, but there seemed

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Speaker 1: to be a real personal hatred not just from Fred

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Speaker 1: Goldman and family towards OJ Simpson, but reciproably as well

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Speaker 1: OJ Simpson, and certainly hearing that from his executor. Clearly

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Speaker 1: that was the tone in which he said he did

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Speaker 1: not want to give a dime a nickel to Fred

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Speaker 1: never ever. So this there was an emotional feud going

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Speaker 1: on between those two.

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Speaker 2: And look, by his death changed some things, right, it

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Speaker 2: changed They didn't have that target. Necessarily, you don't have

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Speaker 2: a human being to direct your focus. So now it's

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Speaker 2: the estate, and I think, look, these are the executor

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Speaker 2: has a specific job, and it's not to defend a legacy.

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Speaker 2: It's not to offend oj Simpson criminally. It's essentially to

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Speaker 2: handle your personal financial affairs. And this estate has things

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Speaker 2: it has to answer for legally or it's going to

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Speaker 2: be in trouble. His job is to make sure it's

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Speaker 2: handled one of those things. All these creditors came running

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Speaker 2: after his death. One of them was Ron Golman. Do

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Speaker 2: you acknowledge this debt or not? They officially acknowledged yep,

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Speaker 2: we owe money.

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Speaker 3: Is what happened, and.

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Speaker 1: That's a big deal.

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Speaker 3: They have officially acknowledged we legally. Oh, mister Goldman, this

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Speaker 3: money is he gonna get it? Don't know.

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Speaker 2: But this it's funny how something that is that so

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Speaker 2: many Americans are dealing with day in, day out having

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Speaker 2: to do with trying to track down money. You're old

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Speaker 2: in probate court now has ballooned into this headline making

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Speaker 2: thing that is in a lot of ways mundane and routine.

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Speaker 3: In a lot of ways, it.

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Speaker 2: Is historically significant to one of the biggest cases we

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Speaker 2: have maybe ever watched in this cause you.

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Speaker 1: Were just rewatching a fascinating documentary about this case and

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Speaker 1: we still are learning things that we didn't know at

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Speaker 1: the time, even though this trial was on television every

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Speaker 1: single day, from the police chase and the White Bronco

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Speaker 1: to the actual day in and day out with Judge

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Speaker 1: Edo with Marsha Clark and Johnny Cockran. I mean, there

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Speaker 1: was never a trial like this, the attention to focus

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Speaker 1: the details that we all think we know. There's still

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Speaker 1: still information that we're finding out.

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Speaker 2: Courage, everybody watch that documentary with the people. You know

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Speaker 2: which one is it. It's called It's on Netflix now,

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Speaker 2: it's the most It's the latest O. J.

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Speaker 3: Simpson documentary. And I was, you know that we were

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Speaker 3: in Sweden.

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Speaker 2: I was watching it every morning as I was taking

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Speaker 2: a shower and was going to it while.

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Speaker 1: You were playing it and coming and going, wait, what

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Speaker 1: did they just say?

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Speaker 2: And I swear to you in the first forty five minutes,

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Speaker 2: I came to you, I said, oh my god, he

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Speaker 2: absolutely did it.

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Speaker 3: I have no quo, there's nothing to talk about.

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Speaker 2: I came back to you the next episode and I said, Sweetart,

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Speaker 2: I don't know if he did it. It was you

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Speaker 2: heard so many things that it was wild. So I

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Speaker 2: encourage everybody to listen to it. But Robes, one of

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Speaker 2: the most striking parts of that was Ron Goldman's sister,

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Speaker 2: who everybody you know her face, We're so familiar with

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Speaker 2: her at this point, but she said the reason she

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Speaker 2: was doing the documentary is because if I don't, none

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Speaker 2: of you all are going to talk about my brother.

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Speaker 2: It'll all be about OJ and Nicole. To hear her

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Speaker 2: say that, now combined with this story, lets you know

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Speaker 2: this is a family who would not let it go.

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Speaker 2: And more power to them. And if this is another

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Speaker 2: moment where they can say we got a victory, knock

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Speaker 2: yourself out. I don't think they ever gave a damn

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Speaker 2: about the money.

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Speaker 1: Oh I don't think they'll probably end up donating it

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Speaker 1: to charity. What would you do with that money? Don't

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Speaker 1: blood money.

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Speaker 3: What do you want?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what do you want? Donated to the domestic violence

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Speaker 2: something or the other. They would probably do. So it's

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Speaker 2: not about that at all. It is just an acknowledgement

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Speaker 2: that this man has been held responsible and he never

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Speaker 2: paid for it, right, paid with jail time?

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Speaker 3: Nope?

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Speaker 1: Nope?

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Speaker 2: So how can he pay for it? He'd have to

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Speaker 2: literally pay with money. This is the only option now

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Speaker 2: if they get some money. This is the first time

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Speaker 2: that wow, he's paid for his crime.

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Speaker 3: Wow.

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Speaker 1: And so we've heard from the executor of the Oja

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Speaker 1: estate that they are and have been over since he died,

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Speaker 1: trying to auction off many of his items, some of

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Speaker 1: the memorabilia, to try and raise funds to pay off

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Speaker 1: the irs and eventually perhaps to pay off the gold Men's.

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Speaker 2: Would you keep one if you had an opportunity, if

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Speaker 2: somebody said the OJ heisman, would you keep any part

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Speaker 2: of OJ Simpson sports memorabilia?

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Speaker 1: I personally would not, would.

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Speaker 3: You seems weird? It seems weird if.

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Speaker 1: You have gobsmacks of mine and you're having a house

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Speaker 1: party and you want to say, hey, look what I got.

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Speaker 1: We've all met those people. They have a treasure trove

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Speaker 1: in their palatial house somewhere, and they want to show

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Speaker 1: you the room they have with pictures of them with

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Speaker 1: famous people and memorabilia from people who did far greater

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Speaker 1: things than they did, to say, look what I got,

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Speaker 1: Look what I bought, Look what I paid for.

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Speaker 2: Then they take you down to the basement and then

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Speaker 2: a room off to the side of the back of

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Speaker 2: the basement. You go into that and then they punch

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Speaker 2: in a code and then the wall opens up and

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Speaker 2: you go, holy shit, you got that?

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Speaker 1: Or the time when they ask you to leave the

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Speaker 1: room while they open the safe just in case you

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Speaker 1: might see you.

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Speaker 3: Remember that, Yes, these people, so you know those.

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Speaker 1: People, We aren't those people.

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Speaker 2: What we're saying, what anybody this memorability we're talking about

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Speaker 2: he's trying to sell?

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Speaker 3: Who would you do?

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Speaker 1: There is someone who wanted to buy a piece of

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Speaker 1: the memorabilia for very personal reasons and was turned down,

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Speaker 1: and she talked about it in one of the latest

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Speaker 1: episodes of Keeping Up with the kr Dash and continuing

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Speaker 1: our conversation about one of the biggest most recent headlines

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Speaker 1: regarding OJ Simpson since his death, Truly, his estate has

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Speaker 1: finally agreed to pay Ron Goldman's family some of the

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Speaker 1: money they owe from that civil judgment that was from

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Speaker 1: back in what nineteen ninety seven, nineteen ninety six, ninety seven,

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Speaker 1: so thirty one years since Ron Goldman's death, the Goldman

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Speaker 1: family is finally getting word from the OJ state that yes,

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Speaker 1: we acknowledge we owe you money somewhere around fifty eight

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Speaker 1: million dollars. They're probably at best, if ever, going to

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Speaker 1: get around five hundred thousand to a million according to

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Speaker 1: the executor of the will. But that's about as good

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Speaker 1: as it gets.

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Speaker 3: Right, do I have it right?

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Speaker 2: That's all he's worse, right, That's all they're saying he's worth,

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Speaker 2: is that if they gave him every dime, the most

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Speaker 2: they get is a million dollars.

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Speaker 1: Read it seemed to be. That's what it seems to

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Speaker 1: be the case. And they are in the process of

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Speaker 1: auctioning off what was in this estate. In OJ's estate

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Speaker 1: and among the prized possessions was a Bible. And it

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Speaker 1: wasn't just any bible. It was a Bible gifted to

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Speaker 1: OJ Simpson by his attorney, Robert Kardashian Senior, and of

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Speaker 1: course the father, the late father of Kim Kardashian the

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Speaker 1: Kardashian clan, so they sold the Bible. But before when

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Speaker 1: Kim Kardashian heard, Hey, they're selling the Bible my father

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Speaker 1: gave to OJ, she says she wanted to buy it

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Speaker 1: for her sister for a birthday present, because they wanted

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Speaker 1: to bring the Bible back into their family, and she

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Speaker 1: says the OJ estate rejected her offer period. She offered

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Speaker 1: to buy the book, she says, for fifteen thousand dollars,

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Speaker 1: and says she was willing to negotiate. She was turned out.

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Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure she could have gone higher than the

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Speaker 3: fifteen She.

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Speaker 1: Said she was willing to go up to thirty thousand,

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Speaker 1: but was never even given the opportunity to negotiate. And

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Speaker 1: that's what upset her. She said, I guess I had

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Speaker 1: a little too much faith in humanity, okay.

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Speaker 2: And she's the only one we got an answer for.

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Speaker 2: We haven't got an official reason from the estate.

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Speaker 1: For well, I've had an official reason from the state,

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Speaker 1: the executor said, in response to Kim's complaint, which again

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Speaker 1: she just last week said this all on keeping up

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Speaker 1: with the Kardashians. So here's the deal. The Bible ended up

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Speaker 1: being sold in auction for eighty thousand dollars plus. Again,

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Speaker 1: pretty sure Kim Kardashian could afford that, but she offered

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Speaker 1: fifteen to thirty, said that she was willing to negotiate.

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Speaker 1: She also was upset that that somehow got leaked online

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Speaker 1: that she didn't want that to be out there. So

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Speaker 1: somehow someone put it out there that she made an offer,

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Speaker 1: and maybe they were trying to embarrasser because it was

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Speaker 1: so low compared to what it actually ended, showing that

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Speaker 1: for I.

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Speaker 2: Don't like all that's petty, But point being, does that

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Speaker 2: not make sense? If they understood it, they could get

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Speaker 2: more than the fifteen? Why not wait for auction?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 1: Correct? So that's basically what the executor said. He said,

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Speaker 1: why would I spend fifteen thousand dollars of estate money?

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Speaker 1: Why would I spend fifteen thousand dollars in attorney's fees

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Speaker 1: to sell it to Kim for fifteen thousand dollars. I

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Speaker 1: don't know that attorney's fees are that much money to

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Speaker 1: negotiate a sale, but that's what he said. And he said,

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Speaker 1: that's a zero sum game and it's a bad business model.

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Speaker 3: I don't understand that part with the I don't understand

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Speaker 3: that part.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what he was saying that it would

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Speaker 1: cost him fifteen thousand dollars to sell it to her

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Speaker 1: for fifteen thousand dollars. That makes no sense to me.

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Speaker 1: I don't know how these sorts of things go and

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Speaker 1: what the fees are attached to it. But that doesn't

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Speaker 1: seem to make a lot of sense. But he said

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Speaker 1: basically he would end up with nothing if he sold

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Speaker 1: it to her for fifteen so he didn't even entertain

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Speaker 1: the offer.

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Speaker 2: Wait, there's no explanation for how that goes down with

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Speaker 2: the No, I haven't known a sale. If there's a

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Speaker 2: you know sometimes broker's fees when it comes to auctions.

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Speaker 2: Is that a party it was going through there?

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Speaker 3: Maybe?

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Speaker 2: Okay, I don't understand it because usually when I sell something,

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Speaker 2: I say do you want this? They say yes, I

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Speaker 2: want this much. They say I'll give you this much,

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Speaker 2: and then we're done. It usually can be wrapped up

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Speaker 2: in a tax exchange.

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Speaker 1: Yes, so this is where it is. But it was

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Speaker 1: interesting Kim actually talked about especially why this Bible was

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Speaker 1: important to them. Her father actually wrote an inscription in

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Speaker 1: the Bible to oj that it said this is after

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Speaker 1: the verdict. God has a definite plan for your life.

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Speaker 1: You are his child, and he will use you again.

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Speaker 1: And she just thought that it was really special. But

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Speaker 1: her father wrote that and they wanted it back in

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Speaker 1: their family. I don't know if there was a consideration

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Speaker 1: that should have been given. I think it would have

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Speaker 1: been the right thing to do to negotiate with her

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Speaker 1: and say, hey, this is probably going to go for X,

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Speaker 1: Y and Z. Can you match that? Obviously she could

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Speaker 1: have if she wanted it, But she claims he never

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Speaker 1: even negotiated with her.

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Speaker 2: And again I don't know how much more of that,

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Speaker 2: how much I don't know anything personal. If there is

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Speaker 2: anything untoward, anything behind the scenes or personal related to that,

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Speaker 2: or it was just a business decision, I don't know.

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Speaker 2: And again, that was Oj Simpsons. This was OJ's Bible,

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Speaker 2: It was in his possession. This is his thing. It's

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Speaker 2: not her da. She has no right or entitlement to it.

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Speaker 2: Now from a human standpoint, there's nobody in his family

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Speaker 2: who has a use for it.

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Speaker 3: Now do they who.

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Speaker 2: Would want or maybe they would I assume everything in

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Speaker 2: his estate they would get first DIBs on.

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Speaker 3: Is that fair to say?

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Speaker 1: I would think unless they know that they owe enough

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Speaker 1: people enough money that they can't justify handing out memorabilia

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Speaker 1: for emotional reasons or emotional attachments. They actually need to

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Speaker 1: find the highest bidder or the highest price that would

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Speaker 1: be paid, and she would in order to meet the

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Speaker 1: obligations that are clearly there.

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Speaker 3: I hear that. Or maybe she's rugal.

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Speaker 2: Maybe Kim Kardashian, you don't get that rich by throwing

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Speaker 2: away money. We see a lot of stuff she does,

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Speaker 2: and oh wow, she's spending money on that, But she's, hey,

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Speaker 2: fifteen as high as I'm going to go.

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Speaker 3: I respect that.

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Speaker 1: I would think one of her dresses in her closet

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Speaker 1: is more than that. But that's just a guess.

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Speaker 3: But I appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: This just leans more into my new public discovery that

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Speaker 2: I have a parasocial relationship with Kim kardaction.

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Speaker 1: That's for another podcast, but I would like to get

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Speaker 1: into that a little bit more deeply. That would be

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Speaker 1: of great interest to me. But look, this was a

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Speaker 1: fascinating story. It's a it's a case that has captivated

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Speaker 1: this country for three decades and this is the latest

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Speaker 1: development and certainly for the Goldman family, and it's interesting.

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Speaker 1: We didn't hear anything about the Browns that they have

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Speaker 1: not They're not a part of this. I think they have.

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Speaker 1: We haven't heard from them trying to get their share

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Speaker 1: of the money. I haven't heard one case of that. Actually,

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Speaker 1: oh oh they didn't.

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Speaker 2: This was all this was the Goldman. This was the

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Speaker 2: Goldman family that went this route against him. So now

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Speaker 2: they're not. You know, I haven't heard a whole lot

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Speaker 2: about the Simpson, the gold Brown Simpsons family years. But

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Speaker 2: this is just to think thirty years later, this is

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Speaker 2: still making headlines for even the most minute things like

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Speaker 2: something like this, which is literally a legal technical process

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Speaker 2: that they're going through, but it's a very big deal

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Speaker 2: because of what we're talking about. This is the OJ

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Speaker 2: Simpson case, and anything will make a headline. And the

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Speaker 2: headline here is that the old J.

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Speaker 3: Simpson is.

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Speaker 2: Acknowledging that he owes a debt to the family of

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Speaker 2: Ron Goldman.

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Speaker 3: Period.

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Speaker 1: They're looking for a crumb of justice period at this

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Speaker 1: point after all these years, and we will continue to

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Speaker 1: follow this because this is not, as you pointed out,

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Speaker 1: over yet. We have to wait and see if the

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Speaker 1: money is there and if that money will actually be

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Speaker 1: handed over. But in the meantime, we thank you for

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Speaker 1: listening to us. Everyone. I'm Amy Roeboch alongside TJ. Holmes.

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Speaker 1: We'll talk to you soon.