Speaker 1: Wonderful good podcast introduction boys the West part of the podcast.
Speaker 1: Maybe that could just be hor retro, Hi Mayre, how
Speaker 1: are you we're doing a podcast?
Speaker 2: I've been feed a the chess world has decided that
Speaker 2: my chess powers are too strong, and I'm now I'm
Speaker 2: now being discriminated against. It's a good time, very excited. Yeah,
Speaker 2: having a great time with my biological advantage at chess.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Well, you know, you've got to reach
Speaker 1: those those chess pieces somehow, and it's old to do
Speaker 1: with your hip angle.
Speaker 2: Trying to my wrists are too powerful. This allows me
Speaker 2: to write down my moves faster than my opponent, thus
Speaker 2: giving me an advantage on the clock. I can also
Speaker 2: reach the clock faster. Incredible stuff happening in the world
Speaker 2: world of chess.
Speaker 1: Not just chess, sadly, but the fact the Turfs have
Speaker 1: got their clause, I guess, into many sports, which is
Speaker 1: what we are talking about today. Specifically, I thought we
Speaker 1: could talk about how the Turfs were in cycling, Yeah,
Speaker 1: because that is the thing they have been trying to
Speaker 1: do for some time. It's a thing I've written about before,
Speaker 1: and hopefully a thing I'll be able to write about again,
Speaker 1: and unless the cycling press just kind of gives itself
Speaker 1: over to the turf, which doesn't seem to have done,
Speaker 1: to be fair, generally, generally dicycling press, I think it's
Speaker 1: fair to say, has lacked an intersexual analysis of anything.
Speaker 1: But they've been better on this than I had expected,
Speaker 1: especially the outlets which are not run by white sis
Speaker 1: heat dudes in Boulder, which, to be fair, is a minority. Yeah, strange,
Speaker 1: that odd? How odd? But yeah, shouting in particular to
Speaker 1: Outside for including a gear guide to the gear the
Speaker 1: cop used at the twenty sixteen RNC, which could perhaps
Speaker 1: be included as the most tone deaf article ever written. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: incredibly comment and then to leave it up in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty to not like cover your tracks.
Speaker 2: You know, this is one of those. This is one
Speaker 2: of those like when the workers take Boulder like no
Speaker 2: biker will go hungry moments.
Speaker 1: Ah Yeah, Boulder, Colorado is a special place for bad things.
Speaker 1: I won't say bad things to happen because they had
Speaker 1: not a format shooting, but like social Yeah, intersexual analysis
Speaker 1: has not made it to Bolder savvy. Great, great shame.
Speaker 1: But when I'm talking about Boulder today, we're starting out
Speaker 1: with a little discussion of cyclo cross. So, cyclo cross.
Speaker 1: Are you familiar with cyclo cross? Mire? No, okay, so
Speaker 1: it's a fundamentally silly sport in which I've competed, of course.
Speaker 1: It's it's when competitors race skinny tired drop bar bikes
Speaker 1: on off road course. Yeah, I would please google preps. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm going to send you one one cyclic cross video.
Speaker 1: It is iconic for people who are who are at home.
Speaker 1: The videos called is joey Okay, we can we can
Speaker 1: have mere reacting live.
Speaker 2: The first picture that I saw when when I googled
Speaker 2: this is two people not riding on the two people
Speaker 2: carrying their bikes.
Speaker 1: Yes, so this is a thing. Right, you get really
Speaker 1: good at cycling, you train your entire life and then
Speaker 1: and then in cyclic costs are parts where you have
Speaker 1: to get off. Unless you're very talented. You can hop
Speaker 1: the barriers. I've tried that with mixed success or you
Speaker 1: can also you can ride the stairs, but you do
Speaker 1: have to be a bit of a boss. So there
Speaker 1: are barriers and challenges which you have to get off.
Speaker 1: It's called field riding in Dutch, which is about right
Speaker 1: writing have you watched the video will include a link
Speaker 1: in the note to everyone else of it. Did you
Speaker 1: watch it with the sound on?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Okay, I'm trying to figure out how to describe
Speaker 2: this effectively. What has happened is this guy Okay, so
Speaker 2: these guy's like going at full speed and then while
Speaker 2: the bike is still moving, he's attempting to get off
Speaker 2: the bike before he gets to this barrier, and he
Speaker 2: like he just goes. He does not get offentime. The
Speaker 2: bike's going too fast and he like he is he's
Speaker 2: like sprawling, but in mid aires he's flying off his
Speaker 2: bike over this barricade thing.
Speaker 1: EDGs. It is incredible. Yeah, all the time people are
Speaker 1: shouting his name. And that's what you're supposed to do.
Speaker 1: You're supposed to dismount and just carry the speed. You
Speaker 1: kind of you can thwing your leg through a thing,
Speaker 1: your leg to outside and then carry a speed and
Speaker 1: jump and then hop back on it. It's a very
Speaker 1: strange sport, right, And a big part of cyclo cross
Speaker 1: is heckling. So the crowd will heckle you, right, they will.
Speaker 1: They'll do all kinds of things like often like crowd
Speaker 1: hand ups are a big thing in cycle across. So
Speaker 1: like I've been handed dollar bills.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what is happening in the sport?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's very funny. And the moment, you're not
Speaker 1: compective if you're just grabbing ship off the spectators. So like,
Speaker 1: like I remember racing in Las Vegas at night. There
Speaker 1: was a race in Las Vegas at night, and I
Speaker 1: ain't gonna win right like then, so I'm just grabbing
Speaker 1: dollar bills and shoving them down my like like people
Speaker 1: will hand you like drinks. I've had beer hand ups,
Speaker 1: donut spake, and one notable occasion a cookie that was
Speaker 1: not just a normal cookie, which you should fucking disclose
Speaker 1: to someone before you get to Yeah, that was a
Speaker 1: bad day. I also had a pretty rough traumatic brain
Speaker 1: injury that day. Oh no, yeah, I'd already sustained brain injury.
Speaker 1: And the cookie. I thought my blood sugar was low,
Speaker 1: so I was like, yeah, I'm going to get that
Speaker 1: cookie and it's going to be great. It was not.
Speaker 1: It wasn't the blood sugar. It it was affected my cognition.
Speaker 1: So cyclo cross is fun and silly, and heckling is
Speaker 1: part of it, but like heckling occurs within a certain
Speaker 1: certain bounds right, Like you're not supposed to be mean,
Speaker 1: it's just supposed to be funny, like everyone's supposed to laugh.
Speaker 1: So I think in twenty twenty one everyone was rather
Speaker 1: it's funny signed as a part of it too, right.
Speaker 1: But in twenty twenty one we saw some shit that
Speaker 1: was distinctly not funny when a group called Save Women's
Speaker 1: Sport posted up at the race and held what were,
Speaker 1: as you can probably guess by the name, transphobic science
Speaker 1: throughout the race. So a lot of people were upset
Speaker 1: by this, and by their own admission, nobody wanted them there.
Speaker 1: One woman told the protesters your shiit feminism isn't welcome here,
Speaker 1: which I think would be a great T shirt. If
Speaker 1: she's listening, please will license your T shirt from you.
Speaker 1: And they were pretty rarely rejected by most of the community,
Speaker 1: which is great, But the bigotry they bought really wasn't
Speaker 1: a surprise to anyone who'd been paying attention to online
Speaker 1: discourse for a while, especially with respect to cycling. The
Speaker 1: harassment of trans cyclists has been escalating for years. For
Speaker 1: at least five or six years now, the governing body
Speaker 1: USA Cycling has known about this and chosen to have done
Speaker 1: nothing to stop it. Right, So this particular focus on
Speaker 1: cycling came about in twenty eighteen when anti transcardras began
Speaker 1: to focus on the sport because of the success of
Speaker 1: a woman named Veronica Ivy. She wasn't called Veronica Ivy
Speaker 1: at the time, and she was using she had a
Speaker 1: different name then, but that's her name now, so I'm
Speaker 1: going to use that name out of respect for her
Speaker 1: choice for that to be her name. She she won
Speaker 1: a world championship in the women's thirty five to forty
Speaker 1: four spring category. Now, like, I have no disrespect at
Speaker 1: all for masters athletes. It's great. I'm glad people are
Speaker 1: out there exercising. This is not the same as an
Speaker 1: Olympic gold medal, right, like the big I would I
Speaker 1: mean people may disagree. The biggest determinant of your ability
Speaker 1: to win a master's track cycling gold medal is the
Speaker 1: amount of free time you have to exercise and the
Speaker 1: amount of money you have to buy fast gear and
Speaker 1: get to the event. Right, wait, what what is like?
Speaker 1: The difference between masters is it's competitions for older people.
Speaker 1: So it's so in cycling you have juniors and there
Speaker 1: are various you know, obviously the eight year olds don't
Speaker 1: compete with eighteen year olds, but up to eighteen is
Speaker 1: juniors espoirs is eighteen to twenty three. We use a
Speaker 1: French name because you know, you want to be all
Speaker 1: what is what is what? Jesus Christ? Yeah, this French
Speaker 1: name under twenty three, right, you can call it if
Speaker 1: you want it to be an angler phile. And then
Speaker 1: from there you go into the elite competition. Elite competition
Speaker 1: is it's actually eighteen and like an eighteen year old
Speaker 1: could compete in an elite competition, so could a fifty
Speaker 1: year old, right, But it's the highest level of competition.
Speaker 1: And then you get protected age categories again once you
Speaker 1: get to thirty five, so thirty five to forty four,
Speaker 1: forty five to fifty four going ten year blocks, right,
Speaker 1: and that's for people who are only of that age.
Speaker 1: Now it's the older you get, the less competitive it gets,
Speaker 1: just because more people will fewer people will be racing. Right,
Speaker 1: But thirty five plus masters sometimes they call it baby masters,
Speaker 1: is not. You don't have a significant decrease in your
Speaker 1: endurance performance at thirty five, so like some of these
Speaker 1: people are still very good, and that's why they call
Speaker 1: it baby masters, I guess. But like track cycling is
Speaker 1: not a big sport to begin with, right, that's going
Speaker 1: around in circles on an indoor velodrome. Master's track cycling,
Speaker 1: it's a smaller sport. And then I know some excellent
Speaker 1: masters track cyclists who just don't care to go to worlds. Right.
Speaker 1: They've been professional cyclists, are very high level amateur cyclists,
Speaker 1: and once you reach your mid forties, some people don't
Speaker 1: care to travel and spend that money and do that competition. Right.
Speaker 1: San Diego has a really great track scene. Some people
Speaker 1: who I know very well have recently won multiple world
Speaker 1: championships on the track, like, we have a very thriving scene,
Speaker 1: but not all of those people even care to go
Speaker 1: to La to race worlds like, let alone travel across
Speaker 1: the world. Right, So it doesn't necessarily truly mean the
Speaker 1: people who win Masters are the best athletes in the
Speaker 1: world for their age group. And certainly I wouldn't say.
Speaker 1: There are lots of things that make this competition unfair.
Speaker 1: One of them is how much track bikes cost, how
Speaker 1: much track time costs, and how much travel costs to
Speaker 1: get to the event. But of course it didn't matter
Speaker 1: to these people, right, What mattered is that a transfoman
Speaker 1: had won, and she became the center of the culture war.
Speaker 1: And this was really at least the first one that
Speaker 1: I was aware of, a sort of instance of someone
Speaker 1: a trans person winning a very a notable event in cycling.
Speaker 1: And maybe trans people have been competing in elite races
Speaker 1: in cycling for forty years, like Wally Cameron was the
Speaker 1: first trans woman to race in a World Cup, and
Speaker 1: Money's been racing for a while, and no one said shit,
Speaker 1: no one cared, right, But around twenty eighteen, the culture
Speaker 1: war around trans people was becoming heightened, and so people
Speaker 1: got mad about her wing the race. And since then
Speaker 1: there's been this steady increase in transphobic sentiment towards by Crass.
Speaker 1: It's really the sort of leading voice in this has
Speaker 1: been former probke Grace at Inger Thompson. She's been joined
Speaker 1: by a few amateur women in various fields voicing their
Speaker 1: feelings about the participation of trans women. And Thompson has
Speaker 1: made a lot of statements, some of which I'll, you know,
Speaker 1: choose not to share with you. You can google them
Speaker 1: if you want, but most of them will be like
Speaker 1: she misgenderous people all the time, right, that that's what
Speaker 1: you can find her on Twitter, misgendering people. And I
Speaker 1: think that that is kind of the giveaway that this
Speaker 1: isn't necessarily about sport, right. And I think that it's
Speaker 1: really important that people, regardless of where you stand on sport,
Speaker 1: understand that this is a wedge and it's a wage
Speaker 1: that's designed to push trans people out and away from
Speaker 1: femininity in a way, from inclusion.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think one of the reasons why it's important
Speaker 2: is that it's a way of focusing the discourse like
Speaker 2: on trans people, on like really really weird interpretations of
Speaker 2: physical characteristics. Yeah, and this is something that you can
Speaker 2: use to sort of like, you know, this, this is
Speaker 2: the wedge that you can use to sort of like
Speaker 2: tear this sort of issue open. It's been really really
Speaker 2: effective at this, and it's also been like, you know,
Speaker 2: it's something that's sort of like vaguely plausible, plausibly deniable,
Speaker 2: and it also plays on a really kind of effective
Speaker 2: branding strategy that these people had, which is that, like,
Speaker 2: you know, if people remember what feminism was like in
Speaker 2: like the twenty tens, it was almost entirely about you know,
Speaker 2: not just in the twenty tens, like you even sort
Speaker 2: of previous to this, right, Like the notion that like
Speaker 2: women are weaker than men was something that was like
Speaker 2: like broadly considered to be sexist, Like that was not
Speaker 2: a feminist thing that was like like women are weaker
Speaker 2: than men. And then you know, you get you're when
Speaker 2: you're getting into people complaining about like like trans women,
Speaker 2: like being on Jeopardy or like this shit that's happening
Speaker 2: in chests that we're going to talk about later, it's
Speaker 2: like okay, Like if you go back in time to
Speaker 2: before sort of trans arrangement syndrome set in, like and
Speaker 2: you told someone that in the future, this person is
Speaker 2: going to be arguing that like like like trans women
Speaker 2: have a biological advantage in Jeopardy because men are smarter
Speaker 2: than women. They'd be like, what the fuck are you
Speaker 2: talking about? Like this person is like a neo Nazi.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's oh that women are only defined by their
Speaker 1: ability to bear children, right, and and then that is
Speaker 1: your sole characteristic and value as a woman, Like yeah,
Speaker 1: and like like this.
Speaker 2: Is and this is something that you know if you
Speaker 2: go back to like Simon before God I hate French
Speaker 2: it's really a true it's a truly terrible language.
Speaker 1: That's the official stance of this podcast, Anti French Action.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but like you know, I mean, you know,
Speaker 2: like you actually read the Second Sex, and like in
Speaker 2: the Second Sex is talking about you know, literally like
Speaker 2: her famous line it's like women, like no one is
Speaker 2: born a woman like women is made right because it's
Speaker 2: it's it's it's it's it's a social process, not a
Speaker 2: biological one. And then you know, and and but because
Speaker 2: there was like a kind of cultural victory for feminist
Speaker 2: where it suddenly became really really difficult to be a
Speaker 2: mainstream person and like call yourself, like call yourself an
Speaker 2: anti feminist, Like all of these people who believe all
Speaker 2: of the same shit that like phylish Lafley did, like
Speaker 2: have to relabel themselves feminists. And you know, and sports
Speaker 2: is the sports the thing they picked to do that
Speaker 2: because sports is the like it's the area they can
Speaker 2: pick where they can, like with some plausible deniability, start
Speaker 2: doing all of this like oh, women are inherently weaker
Speaker 2: than men and have to be protected from men like
Speaker 2: shit again.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and it's yes, it's very much like un
Speaker 1: recontstractive stuff that we would have seen if not feminist
Speaker 1: twenty years ago. Now sadly it's being advanced by people
Speaker 1: laying claimed to feminism. I guess yeah. So in the
Speaker 1: most recent Phyclocross Nationals, trans athlete Austin Cillips finished third
Speaker 1: at the event, local John Browann gun club members had
Speaker 1: attended to step in and protect transathletes what's governing body
Speaker 1: wouldn't And it was actually a really I mean, what
Speaker 1: you saw was a lot of discourse online about Austin
Speaker 1: quote unquote blocking uh and SIS woman athlete, and then
Speaker 1: you saw like a lot of people sort of saying
Speaker 1: that and like SIS women had been I guess, like
Speaker 1: you know that Austin's inherent biological advantage I'm using heavy
Speaker 1: scare quotes here had allowed her to come third. She
Speaker 1: got beaten by two SIS girls, right, Like this is.
Speaker 2: Always the thing like that. There was one of these
Speaker 2: in skateboarding where like this turf skateboarder was like yelling
Speaker 2: about how she'd been beaten by a trans woman and
Speaker 2: you look at the results. She lost to an eight
Speaker 2: year old. She was outplaced by an eight year old,
Speaker 2: like shot the fuck up bullshit, like.
Speaker 1: And a lot of the discuss about like Austin quote
Speaker 1: unquote blocking someone like I don't know, but to me,
Speaker 1: it very clearly seemed to come from people who hadn't
Speaker 1: watched many other bicycle competitions, right, Like that's what we do.
Speaker 1: You push on each other, you lean on each other.
Speaker 1: Like if you didn't do that, people would follow over
Speaker 1: a whole lot more. It's a race, you're trying to
Speaker 1: get to the finish line first. But she didn't do
Speaker 1: anything that anyone else wouldn't have done. And at the
Speaker 1: time Turfs kind of tried to make this a big
Speaker 1: deal but were unsuccessful. And it was not really until
Speaker 1: Austin won a race in New Mexico, a big race
Speaker 1: tour of the Healer, that it became again, Like it
Speaker 1: wasn't twenty eighteen a very big deal? Right? So one
Speaker 1: of the key leaders, as I said, is Inga Thompson.
Speaker 1: Inga's a very accomplished cyclist, There's no doubt about that, right.
Speaker 1: She's a Bicycle Hall of Fame inductee, five time national champion,
Speaker 1: three time Olympic team member, a Tour de France firm,
Speaker 1: and a podium finisher, a three time silver medallist at
Speaker 1: the U Show World Championships, but I think she's arguably
Speaker 1: more famous now for her anti trans bigotry, and she's
Speaker 1: appeared she tried to encourage cyclist to take a knee
Speaker 1: in protest at the ucis transgender inclusion Yeah, which like.
Speaker 2: Fox News finally finds something that they're for.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they've finally. She was actually removed from her role
Speaker 1: on the board of a France based American protein for
Speaker 1: her statements there. I thought that their statement is kind
Speaker 1: of interesting. They said, if shared in the absence of politics,
Speaker 1: her knowledge and experience would benefit many in advanced cycling
Speaker 1: for everyone. However, she has decided to dedicate her time
Speaker 1: to excluding people that otherwise currently eligible to compete and
Speaker 1: UCI events. She is also tempted to use our team
Speaker 1: as a platform for political activity, which like is a
Speaker 1: very neutral stance, but it's also it's also like it's fine, right, like, like,
Speaker 1: our cycling team isn't here to hate trans people. If
Speaker 1: you're going to use it for hating trans people, please
Speaker 1: go somewhere else like it. It doesn't you don't have
Speaker 1: to like take a hugely radical stance to be like that,
Speaker 1: this isn't a hate platform for hate speech. Like like
Speaker 1: go away, and that they added to be clear, Miss
Speaker 1: miss Thompson is entitled to her opinion's an advocacy, but
Speaker 1: her methods and personal attacks are inconsistent with ciniska's mission
Speaker 1: to advanced opportunities for women. These methods, well documented on
Speaker 1: Miss Thompson's social media presence, include dehumanization of transgender people,
Speaker 1: spreading misinformation, demagoguery, and personal attacks on anyone who opposes
Speaker 1: her views spellow alert that includes me. She doesn't like
Speaker 1: me it all, I don't don't be mean to trans people,
Speaker 1: don't missgender my friends. So I did think it was
Speaker 1: very funny that like this team isn't like the like
Speaker 1: I don't knowe that like the woke team for woke people.
Speaker 1: They're just trying to get along with helping women cycle
Speaker 1: and they can't do that if they're one of their
Speaker 1: board members is so consumed by hate that no no
Speaker 1: one wants to have anything to do with it. So
Speaker 1: in the wake of this protest, the twenty twenty one
Speaker 1: Save Women's Sport protest fliletted they're unofficial with USA Cycling,
Speaker 1: published an open letter calling for the resignation of the
Speaker 1: organization's CEO and the safe sport coordinator Kelsey Rickson, who's
Speaker 1: responsible for preventing hate speech and bullying. They gather one
Speaker 1: hundred and five signatures from racists and other cyclists in
Speaker 1: support of their demands, and a day after they sent
Speaker 1: the letter, De Martini announced he was stepping down. So
Speaker 1: he has a bit of a failure of just like
Speaker 1: there's a statement he made an interview where he said
Speaker 1: it would be different if our athletes were going to
Speaker 1: be affected. When he was talking about bands for trans
Speaker 1: athletes in interscholastic sports, he said, we don't believe they
Speaker 1: will be which look in technical and in technical sense
Speaker 1: because cyclists could be for clubs, not schools. They might
Speaker 1: not have done. But if you think that a ban
Speaker 1: on trans kids playing at school isn't going to affect
Speaker 1: participation in trans athletes in all sports everywhere, either completely
Speaker 1: myopic or bearing your bigotry. He claimed he was quoted
Speaker 1: out of context, but it was part of a pretty
Speaker 1: big block quote. I don't see how that could be
Speaker 1: taken out of context. They did say at that time
Speaker 1: that they're against any legislation limits trans inclusion. It's worth
Speaker 1: pointing out that cycling has a body as to all
Speaker 1: Olympic sports. It should prevent hate speech, bigotry, and bullying, right,
Speaker 1: And that's called Safe Sport set up in twenty seventeen,
Speaker 1: and that was following what happened at USA Gymnastics, right,
Speaker 1: which was widespread sexual abuse of athletes. People I'm sure
Speaker 1: will remember that Safe Sport, I feel fairly confident in
Speaker 1: saying has completely failed in preventing abuse, preventing harassment, preventing bullying.
Speaker 1: What it has done is is perhaps given a legal
Speaker 1: shield to governing bodies, so has prevented them getting sued.
Speaker 1: But it's done nothing to prevent this kind of bullying,
Speaker 1: which is why athletes and the community have had to
Speaker 1: taken upon themselves to do that. Right, Like, if there's
Speaker 1: one thing you should expect a governing money to do
Speaker 1: to make sure everyone feels safe at races. But people
Speaker 1: were legitimately worried about racing in areas where they knew
Speaker 1: there were a lot of not just turfs, but like
Speaker 1: groups like the Proud Boys right, who have kind of
Speaker 1: hung their hat on transphobia. I know people who didn't
Speaker 1: go to races in areas where they were worried about that.
Speaker 1: I know people who, like you know it went out
Speaker 1: of went to an effort every day to drive a
Speaker 1: different way back to their hotel at races because they're
Speaker 1: worried about like people genuinely felt unsafe doing something that
Speaker 1: no one should feel unsafe doing, which is playing. So
Speaker 1: as I said, you know who won't make you feel unsafe?
Speaker 2: I I'm going to say the products and services, and
Speaker 2: then I'm gonna.
Speaker 1: They will wrap you up in a cocoon like blanket
Speaker 1: of gold and coin and meal kits. How can do
Speaker 1: you not feel so safe when you're surrounded by Reagan coins?
Speaker 2: No one fact checked.
Speaker 1: This is a fact check free zone. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: The following and preceding thirty seconds have not been fact checked. Right,
Speaker 1: Please enjoy these adverts, and we are back and we're
Speaker 1: still talking about turfs. So says Women's Sports, which is
Speaker 1: this organization that put on the protests, presents itself as
Speaker 1: an organic reaction to the participation of trans women, who
Speaker 1: it repeatedly misgenders in women's categories. Claimed that several races
Speaker 1: in the cycle across national championships privately contacted the organization
Speaker 1: to express concerns, but only one, Evie Edwards, competed under
Speaker 1: the SWF Team banner. SWS at the time was not
Speaker 1: a nonprofit, so it was relatively hard to find out
Speaker 1: what exactly their financial ties to various other transphobic and
Speaker 1: right wing groups were. It's registered in Minnesota as a business,
Speaker 1: but it appears to be assault. At the time, again,
Speaker 1: it was a sole prop run by someone called best Steltzer.
Speaker 1: The both Ev Edwards and SWS used the race to
Speaker 1: aggressively fundraise for their campaign. Steltzer, for instance, at the time,
Speaker 1: was making three hundred and eighty five bucks per month
Speaker 1: on Patreon by quote creating awareness of males invading female spaces.
Speaker 1: Page has been taken down since then. She turfed too
Speaker 1: close to the Sun. She also received donations on her
Speaker 1: venmo page, which is very funny because I don't think
Speaker 1: she realized her venmo page was public. Checked it out
Speaker 1: in the judge. Yeah, that there is no there There
Speaker 1: was no distinction made between advocacy spending and personal spending
Speaker 1: on that account, I will say, And she was taking
Speaker 1: advocacy donations and you know, making emoji purchases it on
Speaker 1: a venmo at the time. I think maybe since has
Speaker 1: made it private, but this.
Speaker 2: Is something that like if you ever want to just
Speaker 2: like I don't know if someone just like appears in
Speaker 2: the news and they suck, like, go try to find
Speaker 2: them on venmo because people just don't realize that stuff.
Speaker 2: And oh yeah, you know, people like people recently caught
Speaker 2: like I think we talked about Clarence Thom.
Speaker 1: I think it was.
Speaker 2: Clarence Thomas people amazing paying his staffers on venmo, Like
Speaker 2: you can find a bunch of very funny stuff because
Speaker 2: people people are bad at doing crime.
Speaker 1: Now, yeah, I cannot tell you how many people, uh
Speaker 1: literally had things on their venmo like travel to DC
Speaker 1: and like like on January sixth, right like ven boing
Speaker 1: each other for like revolution tacos after they divated the
Speaker 1: Capitol smart stuff and no, no, please keep doing that
Speaker 1: if you're planning transphobia or coups. So much of this
Speaker 1: awareness that save women's sports awareness, Like I think if
Speaker 1: you're ever donating to someone who's promoting quote unquote awareness
Speaker 1: of anything, there should be a large red flag. It's
Speaker 1: an extremely nebulous concept that very ready does anything to
Speaker 1: help anyone. But much of this awareness seems to be
Speaker 1: tied to pre standard right wing anti trans talking points
Speaker 1: and not the many dozens, maybe hundreds of instances were
Speaker 1: trans and sists women happily compete alongside each other, have
Speaker 1: a nice time, do exercise, go home, and don't engage
Speaker 1: in any bigotry. In the past, just WS has worked
Speaker 1: with far right organizations like the Heritage Foundation and the
Speaker 1: Family Research Council to prepare a guide to quote help
Speaker 1: parents understand the transgender issue. Again, if you're framing the
Speaker 1: existence of other people as an issue, you're not that
Speaker 1: far from flaming it as a question, are you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm impressed to the self awareness avoided the transgender question,
Speaker 1: but only by you know, using the thesaurus to reframe
Speaker 1: it as an issue. I guess the guide refers to
Speaker 1: the transgender trend quote unquote and repeatedly calls trans women men.
Speaker 1: They of course also you know Steltzer In particular, it
Speaker 1: appears anti abortion rallies, anti marriage equality rallies, things like that. Right,
Speaker 1: this is part of a wider space of painting bigotry.
Speaker 1: It's not just about support. Cyclists have taken it upon
Speaker 1: themselves to protect trans riders. So access of solidarity, of
Speaker 1: range for blocking SWS protesters and national championships announces refusing
Speaker 1: to allegedly refusing to mention races on the team.
Speaker 2: That's pretty funny.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is pretty funny. Also, this mo money Cameron
Speaker 1: has this organization called Ride, which is let trans kids ride,
Speaker 1: and money Mate sees wristband which like a trans flag,
Speaker 1: the Transpride flag, and like one of my friends won
Speaker 1: the biggest race in the US. It's cis guy with
Speaker 1: his Transpride ristband on, which, you know, a little thing.
Speaker 1: But also like it's it's nice to see people show up, Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's nice to see and like it's rare that you'll
Speaker 1: go to a race when people won't be you won't
Speaker 1: see a few people wearing that like in pro men,
Speaker 1: pro women, you know, both, like it's there are overwhelmingly
Speaker 1: people don't give a fuck. They're just happy if you're
Speaker 1: enjoying riding bikes. It's not like it's a big sport.
Speaker 1: You know. The real threat cycling is all of us
Speaker 1: getting killed by people in Tesla's playing pong like it's
Speaker 1: not it's not trans women. But unfortunately this solidarity hasn't
Speaker 1: extended to the governing body, so two years after this
Speaker 1: initial protest right, the UCI effectively banned all trans women
Speaker 1: from participating in elite level cycling. This happened just a
Speaker 1: few weeks before the World Championships. Like, I have friends
Speaker 1: who had to cancel their flights. Yeah, it was the
Speaker 1: most bungled, fucked up pseudo science kind of half fast,
Speaker 1: Like it was just a mess. The whole thing was
Speaker 1: a fucking mess. They had an extraordinary meeting in August,
Speaker 1: just a few weeks for the World Championships, and like
Speaker 1: people previously had to have a to have a submit
Speaker 1: blood numbers to show a testosterone level to compete, right,
Speaker 1: which is a thing lots of governing bodies have been
Speaker 1: doing for a while now. They had certified people like
Speaker 1: weeks before this, they'd be like, yeah, you're good to
Speaker 1: go for another year, and then that psyche, No you're not.
Speaker 1: You can't compete ever again. And like this is people's jobs, right,
Speaker 1: this is their livelihood, it's how they pay rents. It's
Speaker 1: also like being an elite cyclist is hard. It is
Speaker 1: most of your life, right, Like you're you've got to
Speaker 1: sleep or you got to eat, right, You've got to
Speaker 1: train all the fucking time. You can't go out. You're
Speaker 1: going to be resting when you're not training to take
Speaker 1: all that away from someone with a click of the
Speaker 1: fingers and bringing no consultation for them. It's incredibly cruel
Speaker 1: and the U see, I'll just read their statement because
Speaker 1: I think there's a couple of things in it we
Speaker 1: should pick apart. Obviously, you can't take woying for it
Speaker 1: being inherently transphobic. From now on, female transgender athletes who
Speaker 1: have transitioned after quote male puberty will be prohibited from
Speaker 1: participating women's events on the UCI International Calendar in all
Speaker 1: categories in the various disciplines. Notably, they also said it's
Speaker 1: also impossible to rule out the possibility that biomechanical factors
Speaker 1: such as the shape and arrangement of the bones in
Speaker 1: their limbs, may constitute a lasting advantage for female transgender athletes.
Speaker 1: And yeah, it's yeah, there's a lot going on there, right,
Speaker 1: Like they use female where where most people would use women.
Speaker 1: The barrier they set is to rule out any possibility
Speaker 1: of an advantage, right, which is a very high barrier.
Speaker 1: That's like a kind of guilty and to prove it
Speaker 1: innocent situation, right, Like I'd also like the arrangement of
Speaker 1: the bones in my limbs changed significantly when I was
Speaker 1: racing bikes because I broke them all the fucking time.
Speaker 1: Such such a strange category to choose. Also, the requirement
Speaker 1: that you transition before puberty. That's not the same as
Speaker 1: taking puberty blockers, right, They're requiring that they're taking homemones
Speaker 1: before puberty, like like eleven or twelve, yeah, which.
Speaker 2: Which is just also now illegal in an enormous number
Speaker 2: of states, like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and even most from what I understand, most gender
Speaker 1: affirming care takes the approach of taking puberty blockers rather
Speaker 1: than yeah.
Speaker 2: Well this is this is sort of like I mean,
Speaker 2: this is sort of the disaster that's been happening in
Speaker 2: the last like four or five years on this, which
Speaker 2: is that like like taking puberty blockers was the compromise position. Yes,
Speaker 2: Like that was the position that was taken because people
Speaker 2: thought it was too dangerous to like let kids do HRT,
Speaker 2: which it's not like it's completely fine. In fact, it's
Speaker 2: actually like you know, you're you're going to go through
Speaker 2: puberty anyways, right, You're like like if if you are
Speaker 2: in a human body, you were doing uncontrolled puberty, and
Speaker 2: that is less safe than doing a controlled really which
Speaker 2: is what you know, doing like doing it urty when
Speaker 2: you're a child, is yeah, but yeah, the young vice
Speaker 2: position was like, oh well we're not we're gonna do
Speaker 2: those will do puberty blockers, and then like everyone went
Speaker 2: insane about puberty blockers. And now like even the compromise
Speaker 2: position has been sort of like you know, I mean
Speaker 2: like we're away that, and it's like okay, like you know,
Speaker 2: but then and then like and then you know, like
Speaker 2: now and then having done this right, and it's like, oh, well,
Speaker 2: now you can set up all of these rules that
Speaker 2: are like require you to have done a thing you've
Speaker 2: now made illegal. It's like this is.
Speaker 1: Great, Yeah, exactly right. You now have a rule that
Speaker 1: basically bans almost anyone from participation, like you have to
Speaker 1: begin transitioning at eleven. It's also very nebulous, like male puberty,
Speaker 1: like like what does that mean? What what point are
Speaker 1: you defining you have been through male puberty? Like are
Speaker 1: we going to after able to submit that fucking test
Speaker 1: of stone numbers from when they were eight?
Speaker 3: Like yeah, like what like it's it's just man, it's
Speaker 3: what it is, right, it's you can't ever transition satisfactorily enough.
Speaker 2: Yeah, or like, for example, I don't know, so, like,
Speaker 2: let's say you you are onlike let's say you don't
Speaker 2: start hormones until you're like twenty four, but but you
Speaker 2: rearrange the bones in your body, it just allows you
Speaker 2: you now have feminine bone arrange.
Speaker 1: Bit does this now allows you to cycle gender affirming
Speaker 1: orthopedic surgery? Yeah? And like also this, and I want
Speaker 1: to get into this a little bit because it completely
Speaker 1: obfuscates or ignores I guess what we know to be
Speaker 1: true that there is not a binary puberty process, because
Speaker 1: there is not. Humans don't exist in a binary sex,
Speaker 1: nor do they exist in binary genders. Right, So, I
Speaker 1: think probably the best example of this would be Marie
Speaker 1: Jose Martinez Patigno. If people aren't familiar with her, obviously
Speaker 1: Google is right there for you. But she was dismissed
Speaker 1: from a Spanish Olympic team in nineteen eighty six for
Speaker 1: failing the gender test. She's publicly shamed for being like
Speaker 1: a secret male. She loses her fiancee, she loses her funding,
Speaker 1: she loses almost everything. She fought and won a successful
Speaker 1: court battle, illustrating the fallacy of this binary gender approach.
Speaker 1: But she's not a trans woman, to be clear, she's
Speaker 1: an intersexu woman who has androgen insensitivity syndrome, but she
Speaker 1: was able to They were using chromosome typing, right, Like
Speaker 1: like you'll often this is a thing that you'll still
Speaker 1: see turf trotting out right, something that was outdated in
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty six, that like xx or x y, that
Speaker 1: is that's not a binary that fits the entirety of
Speaker 1: the human species.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's like a lot of people for a lot
Speaker 2: of other different.
Speaker 1: Kinds of yeah, mosaicism. Like it's again like I get it,
Speaker 1: you didn't you're not a biologist. That's fine, It's okay
Speaker 1: to shut the fuck up if you don't understand something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's one of those things that's sucks because it's
Speaker 2: like like I wish these people had decided to like
Speaker 2: try to build airplanes based off of like pre Deutnean
Speaker 2: or something work, because it's like like there's no consequence
Speaker 2: for them for not understanding biology. But it's like I
Speaker 2: don't know, like like if if you, if you, if
Speaker 2: you're trying to argue that like general relativity doesn't exist,
Speaker 2: like your you're like your satellite is gonna fall on you.
Speaker 2: But this this is the one thing where you can
Speaker 2: just like you can say ship that it's not even
Speaker 2: like like people people make a joke it's like high
Speaker 2: school biology. It's like it's not it's just like elementary
Speaker 2: school biology. And it's not right, like like YouTube biology,
Speaker 2: isn't it That's what it is?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yes, exactly, yeah, but unfortunately the consequences of
Speaker 1: people who are not them, Yeah, and that's hugely unfortunate. Right,
Speaker 1: Like even we see like Cassa Semenia when a court
Speaker 1: case this month or last month, like allowing her to
Speaker 1: compete again, like we found time and again that this
Speaker 1: notion of a binary sex is as nonsense to call
Speaker 1: as emotion of a binary gender, and yet we continue
Speaker 1: to try and force people into these different competitions. I
Speaker 1: just want to read a statement that Austin made and
Speaker 1: like it's very hard not to see this as them,
Speaker 1: specifically seeing Austin winning a big stage race in New
Speaker 1: Mexico and going like, right, we can't fucking have that,
Speaker 1: Like as soon as trans women win stuff, Right, it's
Speaker 1: fine if they come and then don't win, but as
Speaker 1: soon as they win stuff, And again, if she had
Speaker 1: this inherent massive biological advantage, she would have won everything
Speaker 1: which hasn't happened. She said, I'm devastated by the UCI
Speaker 1: decision to renege on the policy and framework it previously
Speaker 1: set out for inclusion. My journey in professional racing has
Speaker 1: allowed me to see the world, build lifelong friendships, and
Speaker 1: most importantly, give my absolute or something I find deeply fulfilling.
Speaker 1: No one should be denied the opportunity to chase that
Speaker 1: same joy that I and others have found through racing,
Speaker 1: which I think is great, and I think it's important
Speaker 1: to lift up her voice in this and other transathlete voices.
Speaker 1: In theory, there is what's called open category, which is
Speaker 1: the men's category. The problem is that there are no
Speaker 1: open races and that this category, like, if you line
Speaker 1: up as a trans woman in the fucking open category,
Speaker 1: you're being very clearly othered, right, yeah, you're being like
Speaker 1: you're Some of them also will have women's licenses, like
Speaker 1: it's not clear what men's category they can race in.
Speaker 1: But more importantly, I think, as Chris Mosia pointed out,
Speaker 1: people will be familiar as Chris as the first trans
Speaker 1: athlete tend Olympic trials in the US. The open category
Speaker 1: contradicts both international Olympic Committee guidelines on Fairness and Inclusion
Speaker 1: and extensive research at states trans women do not have
Speaker 1: an inherent advantage in sport. Chris is a good follow
Speaker 1: on Twitter, it's the Chris Mosia, but it contradicts even
Speaker 1: like the IOC. Again, not like on the bastions of wokeness,
Speaker 1: people who sent the Olympics for the Nazis have a
Speaker 1: better policy see them this. And yet cycling has chosen
Speaker 1: to go above and beyond, And in large part I
Speaker 1: can't not see that as because of the attention paid
Speaker 1: to this by people who do not give a fuck
Speaker 1: about cycling. Yeah, because they found a wedge, and because
Speaker 1: our community has generally been inclusive, Like even after this
Speaker 1: at the World Championships there were people with trans flags
Speaker 1: the course, you know, like World Championship or which trans
Speaker 1: women could not compete, advocating for inclusion right it was
Speaker 1: in Glasgow. And as a rule, the sport I think
Speaker 1: has been accepting. Like I've never cycled, not known there
Speaker 1: being trans people in cycling, and I've cycled a lot,
Speaker 1: but this has allowed trans people to thrive. And when
Speaker 1: trans people started describing these fucking bigots decided to make
Speaker 1: this a wedge issue and that's why it's happening here,
Speaker 1: but it's also fucking happening in chess. So do you
Speaker 1: want to do you want to talk about chess?
Speaker 4: Man?
Speaker 5: This is this is insane, Okay. The weird part about
Speaker 5: the chess one is like I I don't know, I had.
Speaker 5: This is not something that anyone in chess was like
Speaker 5: talking about.
Speaker 2: Like chess has like a lot of incredibly weird and
Speaker 2: bizarre political stuff going on, but like they're I had,
Speaker 2: I don't know, Maybe I just missed it, or maybe
Speaker 2: it was just like a part of the chess discourse
Speaker 2: I wasn't following, But like I I don't know, really
Speaker 2: truly weirdly just seemingly out of nowhere. I don't know
Speaker 2: what is going on with this seemingly out of nowhere
Speaker 2: fee Day, which is like the International Chess Federation released
Speaker 2: this statement, released this like policy that says that like
Speaker 2: it has a lot of weird stuff. It effectively sets
Speaker 2: up fee Day as like what I can only describe
Speaker 2: as a gender counsel, where like, if you want to
Speaker 2: like change your gender, you have to like submit it
Speaker 2: to fee Day, and then fe DA gets to decide
Speaker 2: what gender you are so great, great things happening here.
Speaker 2: And then also for some reason, Okay, so chess has
Speaker 2: had this thing for a while where chess has like
Speaker 2: there are like women's sections for stuff, and there's a
Speaker 2: lot of some weird stuff going on here. So like
Speaker 2: there's the regular title like grand Master, there's also like
Speaker 2: a women's grandmaster thing which has different qualification, is slightly different,
Speaker 2: and this was this was set up basically because like
Speaker 2: the guys who play chess are insane, Like I've talked
Speaker 2: about this some of the Bobby Fisher episodes right, like
Speaker 2: they're like most of the most famous chess players in
Speaker 2: history are like utterly deranged Neo Nazis or like like
Speaker 2: people who are even weirder than Neo Nazis, like like
Speaker 2: like unreconstructed like nineteen seventeen Zon artists, like people like that,
Speaker 2: like just people with with like truly truly deeply weird
Speaker 2: political ideologies that are like unbelievably right wing, and you know,
Speaker 2: and like part of part of what like happens here
Speaker 2: is that like just chess in general is like unfathomably sexist,
Speaker 2: Like it's it's really really bad, and you know, like
Speaker 2: their solution to this effectively was like to create this
Speaker 2: like kind of parallel like women's infrastructure, which kind of
Speaker 2: works and kind of hasn't in a lot of ways.
Speaker 2: And you know, like part of what's going on is
Speaker 2: just like, okay, so a lot of girls, like young
Speaker 2: girls play chess, but there's this bottleneck that happens around
Speaker 2: when you're like thirteen or fourteen, while this is twelve
Speaker 2: to thirteen, So there's fourteen where like the number of
Speaker 2: girls playing chess just like collapses, right, And the reason
Speaker 2: that happens is because boys are fucking dog.
Speaker 1: Shit Like this is this is this is like literally.
Speaker 2: What's happening, right, is like you have a bunch of sexist,
Speaker 2: like really sexist boys. And then the product of this
Speaker 2: is that because there's so many fewer like women who
Speaker 2: played chess and there are men you play chess, like,
Speaker 2: there's just like, for example, like there's way less like
Speaker 2: women who are like really high rated chess players. And
Speaker 2: that's because there's just like like the barrier of institutional
Speaker 2: sexism to like become a woman who's really good at
Speaker 2: chess is so high. And then yeah, okay, so so
Speaker 2: this this is the sort of background, So like there
Speaker 2: are these separate like women's like tournaments and stuff like that,
Speaker 2: and so fee DA, which is the Chess Federation, released
Speaker 2: this thing where Okay, so they say a few things.
Speaker 2: One is that, okay, the the the big one is
Speaker 2: that if you, like, if you are a trans woman,
Speaker 2: you cannot play in official fee Day events or women
Speaker 2: until fee Day does something. And it's not entirely clear
Speaker 2: what that is.
Speaker 1: So is it like a testosterone level you have to submit?
Speaker 2: Wait, literally, I'm just gonna read this sentence because it's
Speaker 2: it's utterly unclear what is going on here. In the
Speaker 2: event that the gender was changed from male to female,
Speaker 2: the player has no right to participate in official fee
Speaker 2: Day events or women until free Day's decision is made.
Speaker 2: Such decision should be based on further analysis and should
Speaker 2: and shall be taken by the fee Day Council at
Speaker 2: the earliest possible time, but no longer than within a
Speaker 2: two year period. So it's you can be out for
Speaker 2: two years. Well yeah, wait, wait, why what the fuck?
Speaker 4: Like?
Speaker 2: What what?
Speaker 1: What?
Speaker 2: What?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 2: What what are they possibly like analyzing here?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: Like I I it is it?
Speaker 2: Like like what what what? What? What it? What is
Speaker 2: supposed to be the thing that differentiates like the genders
Speaker 2: that like lets you that makes you not be able
Speaker 2: to compete in the women's category. Like is it like
Speaker 2: like is it like if you played you aggressively or
Speaker 2: some ship like what what?
Speaker 1: Yeah, well it's baffling. Yeah, that is a bizarre decision
Speaker 1: like and yeah, like you said, it's just completely it's
Speaker 1: not even that they're not it's not an Olympic sport, right,
Speaker 1: it's not like they have to conform to any IOC guidelines.
Speaker 2: Yeah is the chess cartel right, Like they can do
Speaker 2: whatever they want, you know, I mean, like I know,
Speaker 2: expecting Fede to do stuff that isn't insane is like,
Speaker 2: look like this is the organization that after uh that
Speaker 2: after Bobbie Fisher went on the radio in the Philippines
Speaker 2: and said that he hopes that the government like rounds
Speaker 2: up all Jewish people and kills them like they let
Speaker 2: him back into feed A after that, So like, you know,
Speaker 2: a great organization run by amazing people here. Yeah, but
Speaker 2: this is I don't know, it's it's incredibly deeply weird.
Speaker 2: Like the thing I keep thinking about is, I don't know,
Speaker 2: this is kind of a weird, kind of silly story
Speaker 2: in someways, but like so, like the first trans person
Speaker 2: that I was like aware of it was a trans
Speaker 2: StarCraft two player named Scarlett, and she's great. She's awesome,
Speaker 2: Scarlet rules she actually she she she's She's one of
Speaker 2: three non Korean players ever to win a tournament in Korea, which,
Speaker 2: like I don't know how to express how difficult it
Speaker 2: is to win a StarCraft tournament in Korea. Like it
Speaker 2: would be like if a football team from like Siberia
Speaker 2: showed up to the US was somehow allowed to play
Speaker 2: in the NFL and then like won the super Bowl.
Speaker 2: Like that, That's about the level of difficulty it is
Speaker 2: to win a StarCraft tournament in Korea. Yeah yeah, Jamaica
Speaker 2: bove say team moment, Yeah yeah, but like like yeah,
Speaker 2: so like you know, it's it's one of those sort
Speaker 2: of like really wild things. But like one of the
Speaker 2: things I remember about that was like she was always,
Speaker 2: as best I could tell, like always allowed. Like StarCraft
Speaker 2: also had a women's division because you know, very very
Speaker 2: similar like probably even more intense sort of sex ye
Speaker 2: going yeah, yeah, being pretty toxic, you know, and like
Speaker 2: like yeah, like it was actually you know over the
Speaker 2: arc of like the like the like over a decade
Speaker 2: she's been playing, like you know, like I've seen the
Speaker 2: scene get less transphobic, but like, as much as I
Speaker 2: could tell, there was never like a thing in the
Speaker 2: women's tournaments. They're always just like yeah, sure, hey, look
Speaker 2: a girl wants to play StarCraft like this rips and
Speaker 2: yeah yeah, yeah, well more of us like yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: like you know, and she's also like and she's like
Speaker 2: again really really good at the game. But like, you know,
Speaker 2: but like it like this is the thing that like
Speaker 2: historically hasn't I don't know, like like Jenny Wiley like
Speaker 2: in in games like this that are like not, well, okay,
Speaker 2: StarCraft is enormously more athletic than chess, but like yeah,
Speaker 2: like you know, like this has been a thing where
Speaker 2: people like there's if you're in one of these like
Speaker 2: incredibly sexist environments, there's like a real, like really obvious
Speaker 2: like both trans women and women like we're all in
Speaker 2: this together thing because you get to look at like
Speaker 2: the fucking ravening hordes of like absolutely deranged psychos in
Speaker 2: like the Twitch chat and be like, oh god, they
Speaker 2: hate both of us. Yeah yeah, which is also like
Speaker 2: I think the other thing about this is like it's
Speaker 2: unclear like who at feet day like decided this, Like
Speaker 2: this doc just like appeared, and so there's like a
Speaker 2: non zero chance this decision is being made by men,
Speaker 2: Like pretty high that this is just like a decision
Speaker 2: made by a bunch of men, because fuck them, and
Speaker 2: they've just decided that, like you know, after just like
Speaker 2: literally are giving a shit about women's dress for like
Speaker 2: the entirety of its existence. They've finally decided to do something,
Speaker 2: and they do something is make me not be able
Speaker 2: to play women's tournaments.
Speaker 1: Like right, yeah, you didn't take action when Bobby Fisher
Speaker 1: went full Nazi, but you decided to.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like, okay, this is great, great, great things
Speaker 2: are happening. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, talking of Nazis, there was a it was I
Speaker 1: think actually a a again a nonbine or okay, an
Speaker 1: intersex woman who competed for the Nazis in nineteen thirty
Speaker 1: six at the Olympics. Yeah, with I'm not entirely sure
Speaker 1: of her, like like external external sex presentation, I guess,
Speaker 1: but later definitely served as a man in the German
Speaker 1: Armed Forces. But that could have been a forced social transition.
Speaker 1: But yeah, there's a long history of us trying to
Speaker 1: work out gender ship through sport, and I guess I
Speaker 1: just want to finish by like, if you don't give
Speaker 1: a shit about sport, you have to understand this is
Speaker 1: still important because like, sport's always about like who's on
Speaker 1: our team and who's not right. That's why we didn't
Speaker 1: let black people play baseball in the fucking country. It's
Speaker 1: why they took like Olympic medals away from indigenous people
Speaker 1: for violating stupid amateurism rules because they were designed to
Speaker 1: only let people have a certain class pay. It's why
Speaker 1: Colin Kathmack doesn't have a job, right, Yeah, that's why
Speaker 1: people didn't want to go to the Nazi Olympics and
Speaker 1: went to one in Barcelona, and it was bigger. Like
Speaker 1: sports not just about being the best to exercise. It's
Speaker 1: it's a social tool to include or exclude people. And
Speaker 1: if you care about including people, then I think you
Speaker 1: have to care about sport right now, because that is
Speaker 1: a wedge that transfers are using to exclude people. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that's that's what I have for you. I don't know,
Speaker 1: if you have money, you can give it to Molly.
Speaker 1: Molly Cameron you can. You can find her online. She
Speaker 1: will help more trans kids ride or yeah, yeah, go
Speaker 1: go ride it back. It's fun.
Speaker 2: And uh if if if if if you are one
Speaker 2: of the seven people in the world who still thinks
Speaker 2: that Colin Kaepernick doesn't have a job because he's not
Speaker 2: good enough of football, come fight, Come find me in
Speaker 2: the Bears parking lot. I will force you to watch
Speaker 2: an entire season of the Chicago Bears, Like, like, watch
Speaker 2: every quarterback we've ever fucking had in my lifetime, and
Speaker 2: then I will beat you. You will you will you
Speaker 2: will you will you you will be you will be
Speaker 2: in a catatonic state after that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just found proven right. Money's website is ridegroup
Speaker 1: dot People want to check that out. Oh oh yeah,
Speaker 1: find find Colin Kaepernick on the internet watch videos.
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