WEBVTT - Crypto Billionaires Reconcile, 'Britcoin' In Works 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:06.120 This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily Bloomberg Ihad podcast, and 0:00:06.160 --> 0:00:09.680 I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael, Managing editor of Crypto for Bloomberg News. 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:23.560 It's Friday, February tenth. Hi everyone. You know what we 0:00:23.600 --> 0:00:25.920 say about everything in crypto is always moving really fast. 0:00:26.079 --> 0:00:29.600 Well after we recorded this episode, the U S Securities 0:00:29.600 --> 0:00:33.200 and Exchange Commission announced that it had reached a settlement 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:37.360 with Kraken, a crypto exchange. As part of that settlement, 0:00:37.440 --> 0:00:41.240 Kraken agreed to do two things. First, pay a thirty 0:00:41.280 --> 0:00:45.040 million dollar settlement to the SEC and to and even 0:00:45.080 --> 0:00:50.440 more importantly, to stop offering their US staking service. That's 0:00:50.479 --> 0:00:52.360 the service that they offered that would allow you to 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:55.600 stake your coins with Kraken or your tokens and earn 0:00:55.720 --> 0:00:58.840 returns on those coins. According to the SEC, this was 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:02.639 a direct violation of US securities law. We'll have much 0:01:02.680 --> 0:01:11.039 more on this in the coming episodes. Enjoy. You've heard 0:01:11.040 --> 0:01:13.800 of say it before, and it's worth repeating. Crypto is 0:01:13.840 --> 0:01:16.280 a twenty four seven asset class and it can feel 0:01:16.319 --> 0:01:18.559 really hard to keep up. So we're back with another 0:01:18.600 --> 0:01:21.880 episode that reviews the biggest stories of the week in crypto. 0:01:22.680 --> 0:01:26.639 Here's one which billionaires have stopped fighting, just as a clue. 0:01:26.920 --> 0:01:29.440 On the one side you have famous twins Tyler and 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:32.640 Cameron Winklevoss and their Gemini exchange and on the other 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:36.320 Barry Silbert's and Genesis. We're also going to talk about 0:01:36.400 --> 0:01:39.840 luxury handbags and how they relate to n f t 0:01:40.000 --> 0:01:43.200 s or non fungible tokens, what the UK is doing 0:01:43.280 --> 0:01:45.959 as it relates to its plans to launch a digital currency, 0:01:46.520 --> 0:01:49.000 and as a bonus, we have a quick aside about 0:01:49.000 --> 0:01:50.840 the U S Super Bowl and how it will be 0:01:50.920 --> 0:01:53.360 different from last year's at least when it comes to 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:55.960 crypto ads. Joining me this week in the New York 0:01:56.000 --> 0:01:58.160 studio to break down the latest developments in the world 0:01:58.160 --> 0:02:08.880 of digital assets is Bloomberg Senior editor Anna Arera. I know, 0:02:09.600 --> 0:02:11.880 so great to have you in the studio and instead 0:02:11.880 --> 0:02:13.840 of me being in London and US recording this episode, 0:02:13.840 --> 0:02:16.000 this time you're in New York. Yes, which is a 0:02:16.000 --> 0:02:20.400 big change of scenery. It's a big change of scenery. Um, 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:24.040 but the scenery might change, but somehow the sec coming 0:02:24.080 --> 0:02:27.200 after crypto companies seems to be the thing that is consistent. 0:02:27.760 --> 0:02:29.600 As we were getting ready to step into the studio 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:33.960 for this episode. Our colleagues in d C, you know, 0:02:33.960 --> 0:02:35.640 Alison verse Brel, who has been on this show a 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:40.839 bunch of times, reported that Kraken is being probed by 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:45.200 you know, the top us financial regulator over whether and 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:48.519 I quote it broke security rules related to certain offerings 0:02:48.560 --> 0:02:52.200 to American clients, which is another way of saying, once again, 0:02:52.440 --> 0:02:57.519 there are questions over whether exchanges like Kraken and others 0:02:57.600 --> 0:03:01.920 are offering unregistered secure these and if they are, the 0:03:02.040 --> 0:03:04.560 SEC is trying to make it clear that no, you 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:06.160 don't get to do that. There are rules, there are 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:09.440 regulations that you need to follow. And from the perspective 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:13.120 of somebody who covers crypto from like multiple perspectives, multiple countries, 0:03:13.200 --> 0:03:16.000 multiple geographies, do you feel like we're kind of in 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:19.919 a stage where the long awaited enforcement action is seems 0:03:19.960 --> 0:03:23.880 to finally be happening. I guess so. But also, knowing crypto, 0:03:23.919 --> 0:03:26.440 there will always be someone who says, but this, it 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:29.600 doesn't show that this they're still not saying that it's 0:03:29.600 --> 0:03:32.360 a security And if you speak to lawyers, even lawyers 0:03:32.400 --> 0:03:35.240 with crypto clients now, and obviously they have a sort 0:03:35.280 --> 0:03:37.360 of like an invested interest in telling you it's a 0:03:37.400 --> 0:03:40.800 security and you're doing something illegal. But they are saying 0:03:41.320 --> 0:03:43.800 the SEC could not be clearer Garrigan's or could not 0:03:43.840 --> 0:03:46.400 be clear. They are saying and they think that everything 0:03:46.960 --> 0:03:49.520 under the sun that you have said as a cryptocurrency 0:03:49.600 --> 0:03:53.119 is actually most likely a security, and it's most likely unregistered, 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:56.040 which means if you're trading, selling it, doing anything with it, 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:58.680 that that tool will be illegal unless you have a 0:03:58.720 --> 0:04:01.760 broker deer license, you're registered with the SEC. And to 0:04:01.920 --> 0:04:05.760 quotes our colleague on Bloomberg Opinion, Matt Levine, if you 0:04:05.800 --> 0:04:08.920 are Gary Gainstler talking to the crypto industry, it sounds 0:04:09.000 --> 0:04:12.160 like everything is a security. And it's not just Gary Gainstter, 0:04:12.320 --> 0:04:15.320 but his predecessor as well was saying that everything was 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:18.240 a security, and they were. There were speeches and there 0:04:18.279 --> 0:04:22.000 was a case brought against Ripple. So, you know, I 0:04:22.000 --> 0:04:25.000 think it's maybe wishful thinking, or I guess they're hoping 0:04:25.000 --> 0:04:27.359 it gets sorted in courts and they're fighting it, and 0:04:27.400 --> 0:04:30.000 they're hoping that they can claim that cryptos not elenregistered 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:33.600 security so they can keep doing what they're doing. And 0:04:33.640 --> 0:04:35.640 to your point there, there's you know two things about 0:04:35.760 --> 0:04:39.880 this cracking thing that are important. The first is it's 0:04:39.880 --> 0:04:43.239 still just approved. They haven't yet come out and said 0:04:43.880 --> 0:04:45.479 we are going to accuse you of X y Z, 0:04:45.800 --> 0:04:48.640 and we don't know what tokens might be involved here, 0:04:48.680 --> 0:04:51.000 like what are the specific things are that the SEC 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:53.640 is trying to classify securities? But then I think the 0:04:53.640 --> 0:04:55.440 point that you're making about how so much of this 0:04:55.480 --> 0:04:58.120 is going to be played out in courts is really key, right, Like, 0:04:58.200 --> 0:05:04.480 in the absence of specific defineable this is crypto regulation. 0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:06.560 And here's the book you can read to find out 0:05:06.560 --> 0:05:10.000 everything you can about it. It's been judges and lawyers 0:05:10.000 --> 0:05:13.520 who are ending up shaping this policy. And you know, 0:05:13.760 --> 0:05:15.919 we are going to have one of our other colleagues, 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:19.599 Steve Church, who covers bankruptcy here at Bloomberg, on on 0:05:19.640 --> 0:05:22.160 a future episode to talk about how that dynamic is 0:05:22.160 --> 0:05:25.480 playing out. But we had yet another example just this 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:27.880 week because as always a lot of crypto stuff happened 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:30.599 this week, but this time in the world of luxury handbags. 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:34.240 Now I'm not necessarily a luxury handbag person. I feel 0:05:34.279 --> 0:05:37.480 like you have better bags than me. But what happened 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:40.320 with mez in this case crypto saying you have better 0:05:40.360 --> 0:05:44.240 bags than mefferent True, I have zero crypto bags, you 0:05:44.240 --> 0:05:46.919 have zero purpose A bit clear we have we're not 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:50.720 holder of crypto crypto bags. Um so Yeah, So basically 0:05:50.800 --> 0:05:54.720 there was someone who was minting and fts taking advantage 0:05:54.760 --> 0:05:57.440 of the yes the meta broken, Yes exactly, and the 0:05:57.520 --> 0:05:59.600 judge says, no, no, you can't, you can't do that. 0:06:00.200 --> 0:06:03.200 The luxury French designer is suing the maker of the 0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:06.799 non fungible tokens of a trademark rights this court case, 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:09.720 it's all to do with the fact that these nonfushiable 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:14.480 tokens get sold of digital birkens but without is say so, 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:17.919 and as it relates to irmas, they had a really 0:06:18.000 --> 0:06:20.840 significant victory, and the creators of the n f T 0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:24.080 s were arguing like, no, you know, this is homage. 0:06:24.320 --> 0:06:28.920 This is clearly not the same thing as these others, 0:06:29.080 --> 0:06:32.680 and it's certainly going to have an effect on other 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:35.520 similar n f T projects that are sort of playing 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:39.760 with existing very large intellectual property. Yeah, and I guess 0:06:39.760 --> 0:06:41.880 what's interesting here is that a lot of the use 0:06:41.960 --> 0:06:43.960 cases for n f T s have been are like 0:06:44.200 --> 0:06:47.520 potential use cases, pseudo use cases have been in luxury 0:06:47.640 --> 0:06:50.560 so they were like, I guess playing with their own 0:06:50.560 --> 0:06:53.280 crowd because there was the luxury people knew and if 0:06:53.279 --> 0:06:55.080 they've been briefed about n f T s and so 0:06:55.160 --> 0:06:57.520 you can't, like, I think there's a whole point there. 0:06:57.560 --> 0:07:00.120 There there are brands that are trying to connect n 0:07:00.120 --> 0:07:02.680 f T s to your bag, your luxury bag, and 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:06.000 so in this case, you would have been like getting 0:07:06.040 --> 0:07:08.080 in an f T for a luxury bag that didn't exist. 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:10.400 And they were clearly banking on on the on the 0:07:10.440 --> 0:07:12.560 Burkin brand. So it seems like a bit of a 0:07:12.640 --> 0:07:17.160 no brainer. There's something in law, or if you've ever 0:07:17.200 --> 0:07:19.960 been in trial or on trial or you know subpoena 0:07:20.160 --> 0:07:24.160 called the discovery process, which is essentially when you are 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:29.040 compelled to turn over everything everything like all relevant materials, 0:07:29.080 --> 0:07:33.880 and in a digital age, all relevant materials increasingly includes 0:07:34.320 --> 0:07:40.960 text messages. And the discovery in this lawsuit revealed some 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:45.200 just incredible text messages. I'm going to read it just 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:48.320 two of them here. Ours attorneys pointed to dozens of 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:51.280 pages of text messages that they said show the creators 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:55.160 of the meta Burkins wanting to quote create the same 0:07:55.200 --> 0:07:59.600 exclusivity and demand for the famous handbag. According to the 0:07:59.640 --> 0:08:02.680 text messages. The creator of the Messa Broakens, used the 0:08:02.680 --> 0:08:06.640 words pump and chill and sought financial backers that he 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:11.120 called whales. Another quote is, we're sitting on a gold mine. 0:08:12.400 --> 0:08:13.760 I don't have a lot of I'm not a lawyer. 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:15.280 I have a lot of legal advice, but I think 0:08:15.320 --> 0:08:19.000 you know, just don't send text messages people like especially 0:08:19.040 --> 0:08:21.680 if you're gonna get sued by luxury brands that have 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:25.040 the ability and the resources to hire lawyers. One thing 0:08:25.040 --> 0:08:27.840 we should notice about this is the the settlements in 0:08:27.880 --> 0:08:29.240 the case wasn't a lot of money. It was like 0:08:29.280 --> 0:08:31.440 it was less than two hundred thousand dollars like three 0:08:31.440 --> 0:08:33.880 in her broken back. I don't even know how much. 0:08:33.920 --> 0:08:36.480 Broken back costs a lot of time, but if you know, 0:08:36.480 --> 0:08:39.080 police school for the emails, crypto, Bloomer dot net. But 0:08:39.480 --> 0:08:41.960 you know, it's just the important thing here, as we're 0:08:41.960 --> 0:08:46.000 seeing with other cases, is like the legal precedent. We're 0:08:46.000 --> 0:08:48.559 gonna stay on the topic of money. This case digital money. 0:08:48.720 --> 0:08:52.199 And it's the UK which has, as we've talked about 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:55.560 a lot on the show, attempted to really position itself 0:08:55.640 --> 0:08:59.959 as a digital innovator and to capitalize on the reputation 0:09:00.160 --> 0:09:03.800 for being a jurisdiction that has attracted that kind of 0:09:04.160 --> 0:09:07.920 entrepreneurial talents, people who are interested in financial technology. They 0:09:07.960 --> 0:09:11.839 seem to be moving forward with getting ready to launch, 0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:13.560 which I know is like regularly to speak for like 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:16.319 maybe we will, We're thinking about it. Here's some white papers. 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:18.920 But they seem to at least be coming up with 0:09:18.960 --> 0:09:22.440 a plan for what folks are starting to call get 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:26.440 this brit coin. Yeah, it sounds like endorsed by the 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:30.480 Spice Girls, but it is in fact not. Um, we 0:09:30.520 --> 0:09:33.200 don't think so, but they when when you talk about 0:09:33.240 --> 0:09:35.319 central bank digital currency, as you said, it involves a 0:09:35.400 --> 0:09:37.480 lot of white papers and research, and it's hard to 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:40.160 understand when is it happening. It's very hard to say. 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:42.920 They have said that if they do do something, it 0:09:42.920 --> 0:09:46.120 will be in the second half of this decade decade, 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:49.000 So imagine that being the timeframe from like for like 0:09:49.040 --> 0:09:52.000 a consumer brand thing. We're doing this in like this decade. 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:54.439 So one of the big sticking points with central bank 0:09:54.480 --> 0:09:57.120 digital currencies is will it be like cash, Like would 0:09:57.120 --> 0:10:00.280 it like replace commercial bank money? Will like to be 0:10:00.400 --> 0:10:02.160 cut out, and so there's a lot of lobbying behind 0:10:02.200 --> 0:10:04.200 the scenes to make sure banks don't disappear, and I 0:10:04.200 --> 0:10:06.920 think they've sort of switch concerns and said, you know, 0:10:07.040 --> 0:10:10.319 it'll be beside cash and it won't hurt banks, and 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:12.920 it will be a great opportunity. One thing with like 0:10:13.120 --> 0:10:17.000 CBDCs is that people they're trying to be a little 0:10:17.040 --> 0:10:19.760 bit of everything so that they don't upset anyone. And 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:22.520 so the question is will anyone want them? Especially if 0:10:22.559 --> 0:10:26.680 you're like developing now something that we want we're going 0:10:26.720 --> 0:10:30.080 to use like in five or six years maybe, So 0:10:30.200 --> 0:10:32.360 it's quite interesting. So so if it's not going to 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:35.760 replace cash, then what is it gonna what's it for? 0:10:35.880 --> 0:10:39.200 Can I just not use you know, like whatever we 0:10:39.240 --> 0:10:41.720 have now and in the UK and like sort of 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:45.280 the US digital payments work really well, they're really fast, 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:48.880 they're cheap, and you're just like that's in Europe in general, right, 0:10:49.280 --> 0:10:51.679 So like the idea of like why would we need 0:10:51.720 --> 0:10:55.760 a CBDC that's like a consumers like, it's just that's 0:10:55.760 --> 0:10:58.600 something that still needs to be I think answered well. 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:02.280 I think playing into the confusion is when most folks 0:11:02.320 --> 0:11:06.560 think about digital cash, they think maybe in like the 0:11:06.679 --> 0:11:12.440 US context of zell or Venmo or PayPal or you know, like, 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:15.319 what are some of the e banks in the UK 0:11:15.480 --> 0:11:18.559 that allow you to do mobile based instantaneous payments, and 0:11:18.679 --> 0:11:20.920 it's like basically all of them, the banks like your 0:11:20.960 --> 0:11:24.520 literal bank, Yeah, exactly, just do it. And whereas here 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:26.160 in the US, if my landlady is like you need 0:11:26.200 --> 0:11:29.520 to pay your rent by a transfer, I'm like, yeah, 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:32.199 my landlard here wanted to check when they want. He 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:34.320 wanted to check three years ago, so not so long. 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:36.720 So you know, we're a very different stages as development 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:40.040 as the point that you're making. But those apps are 0:11:40.559 --> 0:11:44.400 not actually digital cash, because what they're doing is they're 0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:48.000 allowing you to move around, you know, bits and bytes 0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:51.640 that represent your claims to the banks that you have 0:11:51.679 --> 0:11:54.800 accounts in. But digital cash, in the form of a 0:11:54.840 --> 0:11:58.079 central bank digital currency would actually be like a claim 0:11:58.080 --> 0:12:00.000 on the central bank. Right, it would be the equivalent 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:04.280 into holding a dollar note or a pound sterling or 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:07.760 one Japanese yen, which is a really different paradigm entirely. Yes, 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:09.640 so it would he actually be a claim you have 0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:11.600 with the central bank. Movie, it would be the equivalent 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:17.559 of cash. But then the problem is with cash, it's 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:21.120 like totally like anonymous, right, So do you actually want 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:24.880 to create a digital form of payment that is totally anonymous? Essentially, 0:12:24.920 --> 0:12:28.360 it's central banks launching a great, big consumer like a 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:32.240 big fintech consumer product, which is like very interesting intellectually, 0:12:32.679 --> 0:12:35.320 and they're doing it in that horizon that's like very far, 0:12:35.360 --> 0:12:37.440 very far away. And the last big consumer party launch 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:40.040 was cash, which worked pretty well but hundreds of you. 0:12:40.400 --> 0:12:43.000 But like they haven't done any great product development since, 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:46.200 Like who's the product manager at the ECB? Hard to 0:12:46.240 --> 0:12:49.600 improve on coins and notes? You know, it's it's it's challenging, 0:12:49.720 --> 0:12:51.839 but I actually think we should find out who the 0:12:51.840 --> 0:12:53.560 product manager is the ECB. We'll follow up on that, 0:12:53.600 --> 0:12:54.960 and if you were the product manager of the ECB 0:12:55.000 --> 0:12:56.560 and you listen to those podcast, we'd love to have 0:12:56.600 --> 0:12:59.280 you on the show Cryptoe. When we've done that, we'll 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:01.120 be right back with more of the week's top crypto 0:13:01.200 --> 0:13:13.560 stories with Bloomberg Senior editor an a Arera Anna. How 0:13:13.640 --> 0:13:16.319 much do you care about the NFL? Not very much. 0:13:16.360 --> 0:13:17.920 I used to watch the Super Bowl but like the 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:20.240 ads and then I bade like confused. Okay, So that's 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:22.760 like you and the vast majority of people, especially people 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:26.280 who are not in the US. And last year, basically 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:28.640 for my job, I had to watch the Super Bowl 0:13:28.720 --> 0:13:31.400 for the ads because as we call it, as various 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:33.439 people called it, it was the super Bowl of Crypto. 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:37.040 You know, you had pick a celebrity and they were 0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:41.440 telling you how great bitcoin was. And now fast forward 0:13:41.600 --> 0:13:44.920 it's a year later. I don't think there are going 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:48.360 to be many celebrities at this Super Bowl shilling crypto. 0:13:48.440 --> 0:13:52.720 It's a very different kind of environment. One of the 0:13:52.760 --> 0:13:55.400 things that we've talked about is the fact that crypto 0:13:55.480 --> 0:14:00.400 companies tried to use marketing and advertising to get their 0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:03.160 products in front of, you know, the average consumer. A 0:14:03.240 --> 0:14:06.520 big story this morning, Staples Center getting a name change. Yeah, 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:09.120 it is soon going to be known as Crypto dot 0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:13.760 Com Arena. Crypto dot Com paying some seven hundred million 0:14:13.840 --> 0:14:16.720 over twenty years for the deal and what is believed 0:14:16.720 --> 0:14:20.760 to be the richest naming rights deal. That's why FTX 0:14:20.880 --> 0:14:25.120 had the naming rights to the Miami Heat Arena. In 0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:30.920 the absence of these big event driven things, is there 0:14:30.960 --> 0:14:33.320 still scope for crypto companies to be trying to do 0:14:33.400 --> 0:14:36.280 this kind of marketing and advertising like with the down market, 0:14:36.840 --> 0:14:40.040 with regulatory scrutiny, like what's the vibe right now? So 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:42.120 they don't have any money, which doesn't help if you're 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:44.920 trying to buy a Super Bowl ad. Um. So that 0:14:44.920 --> 0:14:47.840 that's probably like a big issue at the beginning. I'm 0:14:47.880 --> 0:14:50.840 also hearing that some are actually thinking about the potential 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:54.680 reputational damage now that you might have from having like 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.680 a crypto advertisement. You know, like if you had an 0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:00.760 FTX AD. Now is not looking great for you know, 0:15:01.000 --> 0:15:03.680 what's been known as the mt X arena in downtown 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:07.520 Miami is no more. A judge just terminated the naming 0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:12.080 rights agreement with Miami. Dad Kelly after the crypto companies. Yeah, 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:15.040 well he's retired now, he's already easy retiring and he's 0:15:15.080 --> 0:15:17.200 re re re retired and he's going to be some 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:20.800 kind of sports commentated. Yeah, he's doing fine, I think, right, 0:15:20.840 --> 0:15:23.080 like definitely better than the people that lost their money 0:15:23.120 --> 0:15:26.360 and fd X all of it. Um so. So yeah, 0:15:26.480 --> 0:15:29.320 so they have less money to spend on ads. Um, 0:15:29.360 --> 0:15:31.760 there's more scrutiny. And then also we've had cases in 0:15:31.760 --> 0:15:35.640 which the teams themselves have like upped their due diligence 0:15:35.680 --> 0:15:37.520 because they were left with no money. So if you 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:39.720 sign a sponsor and you put it on your team's 0:15:39.960 --> 0:15:42.640 shirts jersey and then they disappear. Then that's a big, 0:15:42.720 --> 0:15:46.000 big problem. So it's another interesting thing that we're looking 0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:51.600 at is seeing like how sports sponsorships evolved. Now as 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:57.080 you correctly identified crypto companies across the board generally have 0:15:57.200 --> 0:15:59.640 less money than this time last year. There's always going 0:15:59.720 --> 0:16:03.000 to be options, but given market conditions, things have been 0:16:03.000 --> 0:16:05.760 pretty tough, and there are you know, a couple of 0:16:06.160 --> 0:16:11.440 well three billionaires actually that we've been covering quite a lot, who, 0:16:11.520 --> 0:16:14.400 to be clear, are still billionaires, so they personally still 0:16:14.400 --> 0:16:17.400 have a lot of money. Two of them are Cameron 0:16:17.400 --> 0:16:20.160 and Tyler Winklevoss, the you know, co founders of the 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:23.480 Gemini crypto exchange, and they have been involved in a 0:16:23.680 --> 0:16:28.360 relatively long running by crypto standards public dispute with Barry 0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:32.960 Silbert of DCG Digital Currency Group, and Digital Currency Group 0:16:33.040 --> 0:16:35.960 owns an entity called Genesis, and Genesis is one of 0:16:36.000 --> 0:16:39.240 the folks that had to file for bankruptcy in recent weeks, 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:41.680 so they've been fighting and one of the things that 0:16:41.720 --> 0:16:44.320 happened this week at least if you are a creditor 0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:46.200 to either of these companies is they seem to have 0:16:46.640 --> 0:16:49.640 come to some sort of agreement. Yes, they have come 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:53.160 to a settlement. The big sticking point was that Gemini 0:16:53.600 --> 0:16:57.400 was getting money from their own clients who deposited money 0:16:57.400 --> 0:16:59.360 with Gemini, and then the money was going to Genesis 0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:02.360 within lend them out to someone else. Genesis lent to 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:06.040 people it shouldn't have lent to, or like three exactly 0:17:06.119 --> 0:17:07.840 and lost the money. And so if you were a 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:11.440 user of Gemini, normal people, you will have lost your money. 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:15.120 And so that was the issue. Gemini wanted the money back. 0:17:15.200 --> 0:17:17.040 So they've now come to an agreement. So like there 0:17:17.119 --> 0:17:19.080 was a lot of squabbling on Twitter, and it seems 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:21.639 that that has been resolved. Of course, you know, again 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:23.959 it's yet another instance in which a crypto company has 0:17:24.119 --> 0:17:26.119 has gone bankrupt, and as we know, in bankruptcy, a 0:17:26.160 --> 0:17:27.879 lot of people end up not seeing their money, or 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:30.119 if they do, they see it many years after and 0:17:30.160 --> 0:17:32.720 they don't see all of it. So at least it's 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:36.399 been semi resolved and like there's less fighting. So just 0:17:36.440 --> 0:17:39.879 as a closing note, as we look forward into the 0:17:39.920 --> 0:17:43.480 next few weeks and months, I think a buzzy word 0:17:43.600 --> 0:17:47.440 everywhere is artificial intelligence and I'm just going to kind 0:17:47.440 --> 0:17:51.280 of throw out a question, which is channel chat GPT 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:55.240 like war game outs. What you think a likely headline 0:17:55.280 --> 0:17:57.080 is that we're going to have to talk about on 0:17:57.119 --> 0:17:59.920 the show that has to do with AI and crypto. 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:03.200 Someone's gonna do like an AI code or is gonna 0:18:03.600 --> 0:18:07.640 throw AI into their exchange and say that the actually 0:18:07.760 --> 0:18:12.879 matching engine is optimized for liquidity by using artificial intelligence, 0:18:12.880 --> 0:18:15.359 So you're like sending an order and it's getting matched 0:18:15.400 --> 0:18:18.160 in the most perfect way or waiting for the order 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:20.879 to find a match because it's using r I AI. 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:25.640 And then when we asked, but what liquidity, who's actually 0:18:25.640 --> 0:18:27.840 wanting to buy stuff? We will never get an answer, 0:18:28.040 --> 0:18:32.880 but they will raise a hundred million dollars gazillion? Got it? Perfect? Yeah, Well, 0:18:33.040 --> 0:18:34.520 thank you as always, and have a safe flight back. 0:18:34.600 --> 0:18:38.320 Thank you. That was Bloomberg Senior editor Anna Arera. You 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:40.560 can find more of Anna's reporting on the Bloomberg Terminal, 0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:44.000 on Bloomberg dot com and in our twice weekly Bloomberg 0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:54.000 Crypto news letter. This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily podcast 0:18:54.040 --> 0:18:57.119 from Bloomberg and I Heart Radio. For more shows from 0:18:57.160 --> 0:19:00.600 I Heart Radio, visit the i Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 0:19:00.760 --> 0:19:04.679 or wherever you get your podcasts. Send us your comments, questions, 0:19:04.760 --> 0:19:07.840 or suggestions for the show to Crypto at Bloomberg dot net. 0:19:11.040 --> 0:19:14.760 The supervising producer of Bloomberg Crypto is Vicky Vergelina. Our 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:18.600 senior producer is Janet Babin. Our producers are Mohammed Farouk 0:19:18.680 --> 0:19:22.040 and Sharon Barriro. Our associate producers are Ty Butler and 0:19:22.119 --> 0:19:26.400 Moses on Them. Desta wonder At is our engineer. Original 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:31.199 music by Leo Sidrn. I'm Stacy, Marie Ishmael. Have a 0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:31.800 great weekend.