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Speaker 1: Oh hey, everybody else, So one zero two, what did

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Speaker 1: you say? The one you're too coming at you from Bosman.

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Speaker 1: Now this is a big one. This pack full of stuff,

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Speaker 1: lots of stuff, lotstuffs. Canna probably be longer than normal.

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Speaker 1: And the two things you're about the here don't relate

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Speaker 1: to each other at all, really, but we're having fun.

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Speaker 1: Nonetheless that we'll starting the show out. We have be

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Speaker 1: Honest pitelist Joe Fernado, Seth Moore's flip clup plusher and

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Speaker 1: the baritone Badass. I just named it that, by the way,

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Speaker 1: new art and of course filled the engineer. So that's

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Speaker 1: one of the two's early panel. We selected the winner

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Speaker 1: of the draw a phil contest, voice face contest. It

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Speaker 1: was tough. We did our best. Hopefully you will share

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Speaker 1: these picks on my Instagram at Beny A B three

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Speaker 1: oh once so you can see them after the fact.

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Speaker 1: We had a lot of fun selecting them, so thank

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Speaker 1: you so much for sending those in. And we had

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Speaker 1: Luke and Lisa to t C listeners at one of

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Speaker 1: the two of them is call in. They got engaged.

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Speaker 1: We heard their engagement story. I gave look a little

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Speaker 1: bit of advice via Instagram and he he performed it

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Speaker 1: to a T did you did you think so, Phil?

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Speaker 1: I think so. I did a great job. Great job,

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Speaker 1: great interview, great stuff. So thank them for joining us.

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Speaker 1: You'll hear that soon. And we had Ryan Holliday from

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Speaker 1: The Daily Stoic uh Stoicism is what he practices as

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Speaker 1: an ancient Roman philosophy centered around Marcus Aurelius and many others.

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Speaker 1: So I'm gonna hear from him. That was a great interview.

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Speaker 1: Like I said, these two things are kind of unrelated,

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Speaker 1: but have fun with it anyway because it's t h C.

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Speaker 1: Before we get to all that one more time, go

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Speaker 1: to first light dot com slash t a h R hunt,

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Speaker 1: sign up to go to New Zealand with me. You're

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Speaker 1: gonna get a weather to be rifle, you're gonna get

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Speaker 1: a bench paid knife, you're gonna get a whole first

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Speaker 1: Light kit. And this is one of the better contests

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Speaker 1: you'll ever hear of. So go and do it. Do

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Speaker 1: it now. If you haven't already done it and eligible,

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Speaker 1: get over to first light dot com and enter enter,

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Speaker 1: Enter Enter. I don't know why you wouldn't unless you're ineligible.

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Speaker 1: So if you're eligible, go over there now episode one

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Speaker 1: zero to enjoy. Hey, everybody, welcome to episode one oh two.

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Speaker 1: I get that right, one oh two. This is a

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Speaker 1: big time operation right now. We're trying to do We're

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Speaker 1: trying to juggle a lot of things, right, Johnnie, Like

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Speaker 1: we got we've got people on the phone. We got

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Speaker 1: how many people in the room? We got six people

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Speaker 1: in the room. This is uh, this is gonna be

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Speaker 1: tough for Phil to put together. Right. No, I'm a pro.

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Speaker 1: You're a pro. All right, Well let's go around the

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Speaker 1: table real quick, just because there's so many people to

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Speaker 1: my left, the baritone badass Speworth, senior hunting editor and

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Speaker 1: media you're nice. Did you ever smoke cigarettes? Spencer? Uh?

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Speaker 1: I could probably count the amount of cigarettes have smoked

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Speaker 1: on two hands total. That's it, so ten like if

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Speaker 1: someone ten didn't do that to your voice? No, you

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Speaker 1: smoke cigar. One thing about Spencer you'll like to know,

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Speaker 1: not only is he a senior editor, he uh is

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Speaker 1: a hot tub guy. He loves every morning he goes

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Speaker 1: in a hot tub, big time hot. He's also a

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Speaker 1: cat guy. That's set all right, Seth, you're here, yep,

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Speaker 1: Seth Morris standing for cal you'll find out. Uh, you

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Speaker 1: just needed to be here to bring that mustache flavor. Yep,

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Speaker 1: thank you. The room needed a mustache. Thank you, I am.

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Speaker 1: And then the eagle is here. Ye Jane put us,

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Janice. Joe Fernado, Joe Fernado community coordinator. No,

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Speaker 1: you're the Jamie Jamie, the Jamie Jamie So Jamie meteor

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Speaker 1: cross expert to yeah and cross fits you know that?

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Speaker 1: And fill the engineer behind the board. What's up? And

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Speaker 1: on the phone, Luke and Lisa are on the phone.

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Speaker 1: Say hi, guys, if you're still there, if Phil didn't

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Speaker 1: mess something up, they're still there. Okay, great, I'd like

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Speaker 1: to hang out because Luke seems like he's got an

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Speaker 1: attitude or he's got something against me. Man, never mind,

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Speaker 1: he sounds great. He loves you. He loves you, okay.

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Speaker 1: So and looked at his Instagram page today so I

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Speaker 1: can figure out some more stuff about him. There, so

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Speaker 1: coming prepared. I like it now. Luke and Lisa are

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Speaker 1: here for a special reason. You guys got engaged? Is

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Speaker 1: that right? Oh? I got that right? Is correct? And

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Speaker 1: when was this? That was back in September back and

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Speaker 1: said all the way back in September, and when is

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Speaker 1: the wedding? Do you have a guy set a day

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Speaker 1: to the wedding? I know that's a big deal. November.

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Speaker 1: Now listen, Luke, that sounds Luke. Luke, what's going on? Man?

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Speaker 1: I think it's a give and take relationship. What are

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Speaker 1: you getting out of it? Yeah? What are you getting?

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Speaker 1: Because that's during the Actually last night we just signed

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Speaker 1: the papers on our new house, so I get moved

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Speaker 1: out of my shanty into a pretty nice house. Congratulations, congratulations. Um, well,

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Speaker 1: one mistake begets another. Uh the houses, houses are tough

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Speaker 1: thing to take care of it and you can't get

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Speaker 1: married or apparently have kids in November or September. October

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Speaker 1: in the hunting space, is all right guys? Anybody else? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Everybody here like recoiled when she said it was a shock, Luke?

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Speaker 1: Why all right? Well, um, Luke, go ahead and give

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Speaker 1: me the full rundown as much as you want to

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Speaker 1: give us of your relationship with Lisa. Lisa. Please make

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Speaker 1: sure he's correct. Correct him if you need to, Um,

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Speaker 1: where you guys met, Like you want to go all

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Speaker 1: the way back to like first date or how he

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Speaker 1: met or was let's go how how you met. Let's

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Speaker 1: go how you met first, and then the speed forward

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Speaker 1: to the proposal. But how you met, Well, we met

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Speaker 1: actually on bumble Uh. We matched And the only reason

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Speaker 1: we actually matched was because I happened to be at

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Speaker 1: my parents house and she happened to be in Lincoln, Nebraska,

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Speaker 1: So we are radius as were small enough that we

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Speaker 1: happened to pop up. And I was so tired of

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Speaker 1: like the dating things or whatever. I think the second

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Speaker 1: thing I did was asked her for her phone number,

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Speaker 1: and she gave it to me, and then a couple

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Speaker 1: of days later, when I got back up on the app,

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Speaker 1: she wasn't there anymore, but I remember that I still

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Speaker 1: had her phone number, so I text her and just

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Speaker 1: kind of started from there. Then love. When did love

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Speaker 1: blossom right away at first sight? Or did it come

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Speaker 1: later on? Um? Actually, I could probably tell you that

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Speaker 1: I knew that you was the one when we were

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Speaker 1: chopping up a huge tree branch in my backyard that

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Speaker 1: had fallen on my roof and knocked my chimney over

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Speaker 1: and total her car basically, And so we were out

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Speaker 1: chopping it up and I missed the tree branch and

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Speaker 1: smoked my shin with an ax, and instead of freaking

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Speaker 1: out or anything, she laughed at me and went inside

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Speaker 1: and got some stuff to patch me up. And I

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Speaker 1: don't know, I figured after that she actually probably handled

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Speaker 1: what I can throw out during the suturing process. Love

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Speaker 1: was born. Yeah, I like it pretty much. Lisa, Where

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Speaker 1: are we at with you? Where? What are you thinking

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Speaker 1: about this whole thing? Was that correct? Are you on

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Speaker 1: board that that was probably a similar timeline. I think

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Speaker 1: it didn't really hit for me that I actually thought

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Speaker 1: he was the one until a few months later I

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Speaker 1: was in Europe and I actually missed him. Was that surprising?

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Speaker 1: Like I missed this guy? Yeah? It was like, Oh,

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Speaker 1: maybe you find out how many years years ago or months?

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Speaker 1: Was this a quick quick to marriage or have you

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Speaker 1: guys been together? Well, um, it'll be two years in

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Speaker 1: April that we've been together dating. Yeah, that's right. Does

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Speaker 1: anybody else here have any questions? Yanni? You have an

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Speaker 1: inquisitive look? Well, yeah, I'm not to rewind the way

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Speaker 1: way back, because here's a good boomer question for you.

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Speaker 1: Maybe you can just really quickly give me a rundown

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Speaker 1: of how bumble works and what that is and what

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Speaker 1: that means. Come on, it's all right. Now you go

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Speaker 1: for classy dating app because the girls have to talk

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Speaker 1: to you first, you can match with them, but it

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Speaker 1: does away with a lot of the creepy guys just

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Speaker 1: blowing up girls direct messages. So basically she gets to

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Speaker 1: pick if she wants to talk to you or not.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of like Tinder but classy. Somebody, if

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Speaker 1: anybody at Bumble is listening, you can use that. It's

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Speaker 1: kind of like Tinder but classy Bumble dot com. They're

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Speaker 1: like an asset, like a word essay about yourself there

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Speaker 1: on your on your profile. Is it just pictures? Like

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Speaker 1: what eld you tell somebody on Bumble when they just

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Speaker 1: match you or find you, you can put a little

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Speaker 1: like summary. You can be as direct or sarcastic as

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Speaker 1: you want to be, and then you just put some

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Speaker 1: pictures um and then you just have to give your location.

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Speaker 1: So that's how you kind of match within a certain radio.

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Speaker 1: Yeah I missed the I missed the dating, the online

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Speaker 1: dating thing I did too. Anyone here done that? Done

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Speaker 1: the app stuff? Oh yeah, I've done it. Flip flap,

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Speaker 1: I did it. I do it again. My best friend

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Speaker 1: got married off a Bumble too. Awesome, man. I mean

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Speaker 1: I just met my wife like ten years ago, and

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Speaker 1: so it wasn't really I mean it was around, but

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Speaker 1: it wasn't a popular way to do it. I it

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Speaker 1: done it, I would be into it. Let's not let's

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Speaker 1: not focus too much on the bone. I made not

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Speaker 1: a sponsor. I made my wife a mixtape on a

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Speaker 1: cassette when we started dating. Okay, there was there was

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Speaker 1: no Internet. I'm stay, I'm sorry. I know that. I

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Speaker 1: can tell you for sure. Blue Sky Allman Brothers, I

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Speaker 1: know that was on there, and yeah, I sent a

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Speaker 1: lot of there's a lot of messaging. I don't know

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Speaker 1: what Allman Brothers really gets the mood going. But you're

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Speaker 1: my blue Sky, You're my sunny Day. Come on, that's

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Speaker 1: that's true. Uh, nobody else here, Phil, You probably didn't.

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Speaker 1: You were before. You're like me. I met my wife

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Speaker 1: nine years ago. So yeah, I didn't do any of

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Speaker 1: it in college. No, no, all right, um, all right,

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Speaker 1: Well let's let's fast forward to the proposal. Now, Luke,

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Speaker 1: you're thinking about how long have you been thinking about this?

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Speaker 1: How did you get the ring? Give us the run

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Speaker 1: up to the proposal. Let's see, I was probably probably

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Speaker 1: the end of that summer, so that would have been

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Speaker 1: like the July or August before I proposed when I

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Speaker 1: was ready. But um, I of course had no money

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Speaker 1: to buy an engagement ring, so I had to wait

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Speaker 1: until I could afford it. And then, UH, what I

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Speaker 1: did was I went down to our jewelry store and uh,

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Speaker 1: I just had her kind of tell me what she liked,

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Speaker 1: and mostly actually I had her tell me what she

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Speaker 1: didn't like. And uh, so then I went and worked

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Speaker 1: with the jeweler and I picked out the wedding band,

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Speaker 1: and then we looked at a whole bunch of diamonds

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Speaker 1: underneath the microscope and everything. And so I got that built.

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Speaker 1: And then I was actually doing my Osha ten training

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Speaker 1: at my new job, and the jeweler called and told

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Speaker 1: me that the ring was done, and he said I

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Speaker 1: could just come pick it up whenever I wanted, And

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Speaker 1: so I went and uh told my supervisor who was

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Speaker 1: doing our Ocean ten training, that I had to go

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Speaker 1: for a personal emergen see and uh drove all the

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Speaker 1: way back home and ring up now, and then I

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Speaker 1: picked the ring up, and then I turned right around

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Speaker 1: and drove up and and basically proposed, do you want

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Speaker 1: the whole proposal story too. Well, you know, at some

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Speaker 1: point in there, I'd like, I didn't remember this until

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Speaker 1: we were reading Phil's first Dr Phil Medicine Woman's segment

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Speaker 1: on the show, and I didn't remember that you had

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Speaker 1: written in with some questions for Philip um, and I

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Speaker 1: didn't remember that i'd i'd even correspond with you about this.

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Speaker 1: But apparently at some point along the way you asked me,

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Speaker 1: can hey, what's up with the proposal? Or what should

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Speaker 1: I do? And then what what the hell iven say?

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Speaker 1: I literally just said, hey, man, I'm thinking about proposing

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Speaker 1: to my girlfriend. What should I do? And you said

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Speaker 1: to keep it simple and make it about her and

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Speaker 1: don't do anything extravagant um, basically just trying to keep

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Speaker 1: all the focus on her. I wish you'd said wear

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Speaker 1: pants because then security would interrupted when I was doing

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Speaker 1: it in the parking lot. Well that I'll take the

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Speaker 1: hit on now, know. So yeah, I think I think

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Speaker 1: I asked you like three, three or four days before

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Speaker 1: I did it, and you weresponding right away, and so

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Speaker 1: I was like, oh, that's that's a good idea, because

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Speaker 1: I'm not really very good at like, I don't know

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Speaker 1: what I was gonna do sing or a song or

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Speaker 1: and I know she hates surprise parties or anything like that,

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Speaker 1: so I figured I would just keep it as simple

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Speaker 1: as possible. And so that's that's pretty much what I did.

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Speaker 1: That's a good way to pressure a girl into saying, yes,

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Speaker 1: we we have surprise engagement party. Yeah. Yeah, So Lisa,

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Speaker 1: you knew it was coming. You were like just waiting

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Speaker 1: for him to to pull it out, like you had

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Speaker 1: an idea, right, I had. I had an idea that

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Speaker 1: it was coming, but we had talked about it. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: I spent some ring ideas, but I thought it was

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Speaker 1: probably more like Christmas time or like the beginning of

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Speaker 1: somewhere in that time frame, so I didn't think it

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Speaker 1: would be that early. Wow, he came. Okay, Now, if

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Speaker 1: Luke had been smarter, he would have weighed because then

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Speaker 1: the wedding might have been pushed off into December. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: A big takeaway from this, guys, guys, guys, is everything.

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Speaker 1: I had my first child in October. That's not great.

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Speaker 1: That's not great. Second one January perfect perfect Alrightly give

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Speaker 1: us the rundown of how how it went down. Just

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Speaker 1: give us all the emotions well, um, after I picked

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Speaker 1: the ring up, I want to say it was probably

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Speaker 1: it was probably like one in the afternoon, and I

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Speaker 1: probably took about three hours to make an hour and

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Speaker 1: a half drive because that ring was the third most

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Speaker 1: expensive thing I've ever bought in my life and bought

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Speaker 1: besides my house in my truck. So I was freaking out.

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Speaker 1: And plus there's all those stories about like people getting

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Speaker 1: in a car accident or something horrible happening to somebody

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Speaker 1: right on their way to get engaged. So I was

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Speaker 1: fairly paranoid about that. You be reading this, they're out there. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was very I was pretty pretty terrified. And uh

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Speaker 1: so I just basically just parked by her car and

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Speaker 1: her work parking lot and then I text her what

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Speaker 1: I got there, and said, hey, what did I think?

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Speaker 1: I said? Up? So I called her and said, hey,

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Speaker 1: why don't you come down to your car or yeah,

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Speaker 1: and so she's like, oh, okay, I think he thought

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Speaker 1: I was gonna take out the dinner or something like that.

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Speaker 1: And then uh she text me that she was on

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Speaker 1: her way and she was taking up like way, way

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Speaker 1: way too long, like abnormally long amount to just walk

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Speaker 1: down one slide of stairs and get out to the

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Speaker 1: parking lot. So I think I probably text her two

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Speaker 1: or three times while she was on her way, and uh,

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Speaker 1: she got to the parking lot and I was waiting

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Speaker 1: outside my truck and she kind of was walking up

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Speaker 1: and smiling, wondering what I was doing. And that's when

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Speaker 1: I reached in my pocket and pulled the ring out.

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Speaker 1: And as I was getting down on one knee of

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Speaker 1: you'll fumble around with a ringbox, she took off, running

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Speaker 1: back towards her car and told me to shut the

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Speaker 1: funk up, and as they do, and then and then

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Speaker 1: after she kind of got over whatever the hell that was,

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Speaker 1: Oh man, Lucy, and then she came and said and

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Speaker 1: said yes, and I gave her the ring and then

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Speaker 1: we had to go and we went to a middle

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Speaker 1: school she teen girls back are volleyball game. So we

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Speaker 1: celebrated right after, right after we got engaged, and that's

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Speaker 1: basically where we told her family. And I was on

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Speaker 1: the phone with my family pretty much right after that,

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Speaker 1: and that's kind of that's kind of the day we

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Speaker 1: got engaged. Pretty much. That's awesome. A Lisa, where do

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Speaker 1: you have the shut the funk up moment? What's what

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Speaker 1: explained that to us. I just like I think I

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Speaker 1: was just so surprised, I mean, really caught off guards.

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Speaker 1: Like I had to take a moment like let it

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Speaker 1: soak in. Oh, oh, he's actually he's actually doing this.

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Speaker 1: He did it. Um, Well, that's awesome. Congratulations from every

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Speaker 1: everybody's congratulates, round of applause. Probably isn't do in order.

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Speaker 1: Well done, well done. You guys are still you're still confident.

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Speaker 1: We're gonna make it to November. We're good, healthy relationship, Lisa,

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Speaker 1: so far, so good. Well, listen, thanks for the story.

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Speaker 1: That's awesome. We'll all we're all gonna we're gonna let

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Speaker 1: you guys go, but we're all gonna tell our own

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Speaker 1: stories of how we I had my wife ran away

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Speaker 1: from me the first time I tried to kiss her, Luke,

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Speaker 1: so don't worry. I mean she and she ran down

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Speaker 1: a pier, like a long, long pier, and I had

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Speaker 1: to watch that whole She had to run like a

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Speaker 1: hundred yards down the spear and I was just at

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Speaker 1: the end of the one. I think the whole time,

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Speaker 1: like what, I hope she didn't trip? Did she run

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Speaker 1: to the end. We have to jump off now, then

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Speaker 1: it goes to land. I was thinking about jumping off,

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Speaker 1: like I thought I had this. Uh. She described it

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Speaker 1: as I was trying to lick her face. I thought

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Speaker 1: I was going in for like it just a nice

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Speaker 1: peck on the cheek. She described it as maybe like

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Speaker 1: coming in making noises. I was a little drunk. It's fine,

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Speaker 1: it's all fine. But she ran away, and so I

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Speaker 1: felt like connection with you, Luke. When you said that

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Speaker 1: that she ran away, I thought, oh, well, that happens

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Speaker 1: to everybody, right Phil. Yeah, I just figured that it's

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Speaker 1: like a true love story. It's a true love story.

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Speaker 1: If she if they put all the movies right when

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Speaker 1: they proposed, the girl always runs away and tells the

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Speaker 1: guy to shut the funk up. So I figured that

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Speaker 1: it would just be perfect. Yeah, you've got mail, that's

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Speaker 1: I think that's what happens been Meg Ryan and Tom Hanks, Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: everything Joe's telling me. You do the recent um listen,

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Speaker 1: Lisa and Luke. I talked to our friends at First Light,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, man, these two kids are getting married.

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Speaker 1: We need to give him something. So Kevin Harland and

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Speaker 1: my good buddy at First Light, said we're gonna give

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Speaker 1: you each a beautiful piece of brand new first light

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Speaker 1: gear to either wear. It would be nice if you

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Speaker 1: word at the while going down the aisle as a

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Speaker 1: nice you know, piece of advertype. Don't have to know pressure.

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Speaker 1: So we're gonna hook up with the after show. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna get you a beautiful piece of new first like gear.

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Speaker 1: We'll let you kind of pick what you want and

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Speaker 1: go from there um as a nice one and get

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Speaker 1: from us here at th HC. So congratulations, Oh well,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much, man, no problem, we will. We

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Speaker 1: appreciate taking the time. We're gonna hang up and then

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Speaker 1: tell lots of crazy stories about our own our own engagements.

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Speaker 1: So thanks guys, all right, thank you, all right. That

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Speaker 1: was beautiful, cute, that great great. Although I've never heard

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Speaker 1: of these uh stories of everybody dying and getting injured

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Speaker 1: on the way over to the guys know everybody knows that.

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Speaker 1: People know. We're just going to propose and you get

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Speaker 1: and you're playing crash after speed. He's so worried about

355
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Speaker 1: a deer jumping in front of him, like, dude, people

356
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Speaker 1: can die at thirty. He's looking for snipers trying to

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Speaker 1: pick him off on the way over ye oncoming traffic. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well I had a very like up. Mine was a romantic.

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Speaker 1: I gathered my wife's entire family. I was already back

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Speaker 1: in Maryland at the time. We were living in Illinois,

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Speaker 1: so I flew back early, made an excuse, flew back early,

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Speaker 1: gathered my wife's entire family, my entire family, and waited

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Speaker 1: for her at the airport she was flying in a

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Speaker 1: couple of days later. Made signs that said will you

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Speaker 1: marry me? That's a lot of pressure, man. Yeah. Well

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Speaker 1: we made all these signs, and everybody in her family

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Speaker 1: was holding a letter, right, and so were as she

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Speaker 1: came down right. Well, here's what happened. Uh, people started

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Speaker 1: to see it was we were waiting on her for

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Speaker 1: a while, like half an hour, holding these signs. People

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Speaker 1: in the airport started to see this, and so a

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Speaker 1: giant crowd of random strangers formed around hundreds of people

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Speaker 1: with their phones out like recording this. I remember she

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Speaker 1: came down an escalator and I got down on one knee,

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Speaker 1: so will you married me? And she immediately said yes.

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Speaker 1: And then I looked to my right and there's a

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Speaker 1: random dude I've never seen before, like walking up to us,

378
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:03,359
Speaker 1: filming in our faces like awesome. So I believe it

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00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:06,040
Speaker 1: made the news the next day. But there was like

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Speaker 1: a bunch of strangers giving us around of applause. And

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Speaker 1: then we got into a limo and we went to

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Speaker 1: a dinner that I planned. So nice. That's good your faces, guys,

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00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:17,240
Speaker 1: that was that's impressive. It was good. It was And

384
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Speaker 1: she said that was the best moment of our relationships.

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Speaker 1: I'd like to downhill ever since, Um says, you're the

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Speaker 1: only one that hasn't done this. Yes, Uh, living in

387
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Speaker 1: Sin huh, living in Sin A beautiful girlfriend, Kelsey. Um,

388
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:34,720
Speaker 1: she'll probably listen to this. Would you ever want to

389
00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:38,320
Speaker 1: say anything to us? Pretty smart? Yeah, maybe proposed now

390
00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:43,840
Speaker 1: not yet, not yet, not yet any reason. Uh, just

391
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Speaker 1: just you know, just making sure it's the right one.

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Speaker 1: That's fine, the right one, that's fine. She'll listen to this.

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Speaker 1: That's fine, Johnny, we gotta hear about yours. I don't

394
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Speaker 1: have one because my wife proposed to me. Should have

395
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Speaker 1: known that. Great, fantastic. I guess I was dragging my

396
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Speaker 1: heels so long, which wasn't that long because we hadn't

397
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Speaker 1: even been together for two years. And uh, we actually

398
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:16,119
Speaker 1: went to Belize and she had a it's just like

399
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:19,360
Speaker 1: a Latvian internet ring based is the easy, easiest way

400
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:23,720
Speaker 1: to describe it. She hadn't made um, I've gotten some

401
00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,439
Speaker 1: ideas from some family and whatnot, but it didn't arrive

402
00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:30,240
Speaker 1: in time, and so she our roommates at the time,

403
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:31,800
Speaker 1: I thought, well, what does ship it down to Belize

404
00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 1: because we're going to be down there for like a

405
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Speaker 1: month or hanging out. Are you wearing this ring right now? No?

406
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:42,720
Speaker 1: I'm not, um, not engagement. I wear my wedding band now. Um.

407
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 1: But so I got stuck in customs in Belize, and

408
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: so she never got it until we were on our

409
00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:52,760
Speaker 1: way out at a Belize city and we had to

410
00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:58,160
Speaker 1: go into this like crazy like Belize city warehouse of

411
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Speaker 1: of Belizian customs and go get this box. And I'm

412
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:03,600
Speaker 1: like and she wouldn't tell me what was going on.

413
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:06,480
Speaker 1: Finally she broke down in tears and was like, there

414
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Speaker 1: was this ring that I made for you and I

415
00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 1: was supposed to da da da da da, And uh,

416
00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:14,359
Speaker 1: of course I said, yes, would you expect it to

417
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:17,320
Speaker 1: come like you know, we've been talking about it when

418
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:19,760
Speaker 1: you knew we were going to get married. But it

419
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:21,840
Speaker 1: was interesting because then I got home and I had

420
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 1: to call her dad and we're like, so hey, usually, yeah,

421
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,919
Speaker 1: I can make this call first, but you're crazy ass daughter,

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Speaker 1: and you know he gave us his blessing. Anyways, it's

423
00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:37,720
Speaker 1: like the bumble version of getting engaged. Yeah, it's like that, Yeah,

424
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 1: bumble traveling to belieze. He's an onion, just peeled back

425
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:47,200
Speaker 1: those layers. Song something to make you cry underneath, Joe,

426
00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 1: what's yours? You're recently? Yeah, two years ago, well almost

427
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,680
Speaker 1: two years ago. I'd be two years in August, I guess,

428
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,639
Speaker 1: but we push it out so many times to avoid

429
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,399
Speaker 1: the whole getting married in November. I was surprised at

430
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 1: Luke let that go down. We changed the date so

431
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:05,959
Speaker 1: many times, and Calvin was always like, can we just

432
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:10,200
Speaker 1: do it like, you know, September to November. I'm like, no, sorry,

433
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 1: off limits. A little afraid that we'll get an email

434
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,040
Speaker 1: from Luke like six months from now, and like I

435
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 1: tried to argue it back to August and it's not

436
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:20,840
Speaker 1: gonna happen. Didn't learn to broke it off, so hopefully

437
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:24,199
Speaker 1: we didn't negatively affect his relationship. But I proposed in

438
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:29,080
Speaker 1: a river in Alaska. Fishing for salmon. So she loves

439
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 1: fly fishing and stuff. So I toted a ring around

440
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:37,400
Speaker 1: Alaska chasing cariboo. I was like, I was like slapping

441
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:39,679
Speaker 1: my backpack every third step to make sure it was

442
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:43,119
Speaker 1: still there. And uh ended up putting the ring in

443
00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:46,760
Speaker 1: a fly box over fly and uh when she was like, oh,

444
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:48,679
Speaker 1: I need a different fly nothing, spiting took it out

445
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:50,520
Speaker 1: and through it in the river. She almost dropped it

446
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 1: in the river. She definitely went through a dangerous Yeah,

447
00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 1: it was very dangerous, dangerous And as soon as she

448
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 1: put it on her finger and I was like, this

449
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:58,479
Speaker 1: is out of my hand. If you lose it, as

450
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:04,080
Speaker 1: on you well done, Spencer. Do you have to have one? Uh? Yeah,

451
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 1: we just like we've never been that traditional and so um.

452
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:09,880
Speaker 1: When we decided we were gonna get married, I had

453
00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: her pick out like the exact ring, like the exact ring,

454
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 1: the exact size, everything, and I gave her a budget.

455
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,080
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, this is the amount of money. And

456
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 1: of course she came within two dollars of that budget.

457
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 1: That's it couldn't be like a few thousand under. It

458
00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:27,440
Speaker 1: was just like two, right. So I got the ring

459
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 1: and then I sat on it for like a few months.

460
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:32,960
Speaker 1: I was also living in Illinois at the time, like

461
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 1: you yep, yep. Came back to South Dakota, which is

462
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 1: where we grew up, came back there for Thanksgiving when

463
00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 1: on pheasant hunt, came back from the pheasant hunt proposed

464
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,359
Speaker 1: um which there was like no drama involved because she

465
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 1: knew it was coming. Hey, here's a ring. Yep, that's

466
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 1: that's kind of how it went. There was the rest

467
00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,679
Speaker 1: of your life. Yeah, the awareness was there. But in

468
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: the time Morie died. Because we saw our families that weekend,

469
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 1: we can tell them. Um, So that's how it went.

470
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 1: That's nice. No hot tubs involved, no damn, and I

471
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 1: wish you were like I put it in the jet

472
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 1: flew out of the service of the water. I was hoping.

473
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,400
Speaker 1: I was hoping. Um, all right, well that's great. Every

474
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,439
Speaker 1: I'm feeling good. Congratulates to Luke and Lisa. Um. I

475
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:22,919
Speaker 1: thought that was a pretty cool thing to try to do.

476
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:24,919
Speaker 1: I was thinking moment might not work, but he had

477
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,879
Speaker 1: some good stories and bumble. I didn't know any of

478
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,120
Speaker 1: that stuff before we called Luke and Lucas, So its

479
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,159
Speaker 1: congratulations to them and thank you. The first lighte for

480
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,560
Speaker 1: helping him out with some with the wedding gift from

481
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:43,560
Speaker 1: us THHD. Now another giveaway, Phil, Phil, Yes, Sir Phil Taylor,

482
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:48,240
Speaker 1: Phil t engineer, filt engineer. We have we're you know here,

483
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:52,360
Speaker 1: the rustling of papers. We have a big, big thing

484
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 1: to decide. We do things to decide. Now an episode

485
00:26:55,840 --> 00:27:01,320
Speaker 1: one hundred, we announced a slew of giveaways, too many giveaways.

486
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 1: It turned out for a lot of reason. Are you

487
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:09,600
Speaker 1: regretting any decisions that I'm not fun, But I will

488
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 1: say that it's done a lot of a lot of

489
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 1: a lot, a lot of work going through all your submissions.

490
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 1: We got a couple of a couple of hundred uh

491
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 1: what we'll call Phil's voice face drawings. These were drawings

492
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 1: that were illustrations that were done of Phil's face and

493
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 1: likeness based only on hearing the sound of his voice.

494
00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:32,880
Speaker 1: And this was a contest to win a YETI tongue

495
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:37,080
Speaker 1: of one ten and in a work sharp can onion sharpener. So, Phil,

496
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:38,880
Speaker 1: how do you feeling in general before we get going

497
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,360
Speaker 1: on this, how are you feeling in general about what

498
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:45,760
Speaker 1: has occurred here? Um? I should be flattered, and I

499
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:48,679
Speaker 1: am flattered, but I'm mostly embarrassed. I walked into the

500
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 1: office after being out of town for several days, and

501
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:56,480
Speaker 1: hanging behind my desk, Uh were dozens of these drawings.

502
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,200
Speaker 1: Yeah you put them there, I did as if to

503
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 1: help me help, Thank you, seth. We used tape, but

504
00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 1: those were even called from a bigger batch. How many

505
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:14,440
Speaker 1: time you get almost three almost three hundred and UM,

506
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 1: I will tell you before we get into this, if

507
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,639
Speaker 1: you photoshop something, it did I didn't included, although there

508
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:22,800
Speaker 1: were some pretty hilarious photoshops, and if it wasn't a

509
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 1: draw if you A lot of people just sent me

510
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: pictures of things that they thought Phil looked like a

511
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:30,639
Speaker 1: lot of Simpsons characters were involved. A lot of people

512
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 1: thought you might look like Kevin from Home alone. Um,

513
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,239
Speaker 1: there's a lot of a lot of difference. I can

514
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: see that. Yeah, me too, me too, Come on, do

515
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: the thing. It looked pretty good. So we we stuck

516
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 1: with just the ones that were illustrated, which they were

517
00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:49,440
Speaker 1: over a hundred of those, and then we called them

518
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:51,480
Speaker 1: down to what we put on the wall or Phil's

519
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 1: wall is about fifty something maybe, so we're in that number.

520
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:59,520
Speaker 1: And then yesterday we called them down six top six. Uh,

521
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 1: and there that many people in this room, so we

522
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: can't all just pick a separate one, but we've printed

523
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 1: them out. As you can hear the sound effect of paper. Everybody,

524
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 1: make your paper sounds. We're taking this ship seriously because

525
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: you're gonna win quite the prize for this one. And

526
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 1: we have three other giveaways and I just don't have

527
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,120
Speaker 1: enough time to read hundreds of poems and listen to

528
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 1: hundreds of turkey calls, and uh so we're gonna get

529
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,080
Speaker 1: to those. We're gonna do one a week for the

530
00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 1: next couple of weeks as we go through, and so

531
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 1: you guys will just have to hang with us and

532
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: stick with us while we announced these winners, because I

533
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:33,479
Speaker 1: want to read them all and look at them all.

534
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 1: There's some I spent the last six days laughing my

535
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 1: ass off while looking at these, while listening to your

536
00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 1: turkey calls and watching the videos. There's one guy who's

537
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 1: in a video in where he had decorated his house

538
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 1: with various artifacts from the show. He had illustrated my

539
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: hamster squeakers and framed it and put it in his bathroom.

540
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:56,840
Speaker 1: That's very good. We've got several rap videos from people, Um,

541
00:29:56,960 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 1: it's fantastic, just well done out They're well done. I'm

542
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:02,240
Speaker 1: very happy with where we're at right now. So I

543
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 1: felt bad calling it down to six. Yeah, we had

544
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: a big I just so I was I'm just so

545
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:12,240
Speaker 1: impressed by people who have more talent than me. Uh,

546
00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:14,240
Speaker 1: And I didn't. I didn't want to give him a

547
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: short trip. I just know that I saw many of

548
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: these drawings and the detail and the just the care

549
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 1: was well, there's no way, very flattering. There's no way

550
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 1: that number five has more artistic talent, and Yanni will

551
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: get to that. I've got number of contention. So here's

552
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:35,000
Speaker 1: what's going down. I've numbered these, I've numbered each one

553
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 1: of the entries one through five, and I put the

554
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:40,080
Speaker 1: name of the person who who sent him in. And

555
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 1: so we're gonna there's no Unfortunately, this is America, there's

556
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:46,920
Speaker 1: no participation trophies. If you didn't win, you didn't win.

557
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 1: We're not giving any second or thirds out here at

558
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: each I'm sending a participation last. It's not first, your last,

559
00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 1: but we do appreciate you doing this. I'm looking at

560
00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: number one and it makes you have every time. So

561
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: we're gonna got around the table. I'm gonna give each

562
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 1: person a number, and I'd like to just to describe

563
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 1: what you see, Seth. When you start with number one,

564
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 1: please and tell us who it's from. Um Ryan S

565
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:15,400
Speaker 1: strip strip Yes, S S t R E p Um.

566
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 1: I will say, going through all these it was alarming

567
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 1: how many had but chins. A lot of people think, Phil,

568
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 1: do you have a bunch of You have a bunch

569
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 1: of dude, you do a little bit, you do a

570
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:30,440
Speaker 1: little bit of. One that's fine. One is one is

571
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,520
Speaker 1: actually the one that I picked out of all the

572
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 1: ones that I saw. One could be kind of maybe

573
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 1: your dad or uncle. Yeah, a little bit. It's a

574
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 1: dad bod um. So please do your best to describe this.

575
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,480
Speaker 1: So this guy is a little bit heavy set, he's

576
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:52,440
Speaker 1: got a butt chin um, pretty puffy cheeks, he's got

577
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 1: a terrible excuse of a mustache. Um. He's staying there

578
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 1: with one hand in his pocket and one hand holding

579
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 1: a coffee mug, which I've seen Phil stand just like this.

580
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 1: But yeah, this is what this is why it gets me. Yeah,

581
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: this is why I chose it because I've seen Phil

582
00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:12,720
Speaker 1: stand exactly like this before. He's got like a polo shirt,

583
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 1: he's got a polo on it's as Star Wars Professional

584
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 1: Star Wars tea. His polo is tucked in yep um,

585
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 1: what looks like a pair of slacks, very a very

586
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,880
Speaker 1: tiny pair of glo this was if this was in color,

587
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:31,400
Speaker 1: they would be khakis. I feel khakis um. Yeah, square glasses.

588
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 1: And he's got like a little like greased up um

589
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 1: like hairstyle in the front, like a little flippy thing.

590
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:39,560
Speaker 1: He looks like that dude from the office who has

591
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:45,959
Speaker 1: the stapler. It's like my stapler. That's what this If

592
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 1: you're trying to picture this, that's what you should be

593
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 1: picturing that guy basically. What so that's what thinks Phil's

594
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 1: voice face, Phil, go ahead and react to that one.

595
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 1: What do you? How's it making? This is one of

596
00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 1: my favorites. Yeah, it's not. It doesn't pay me in

597
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 1: the best. But this guy's got This guy's got a story.

598
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 1: He's got a lot of He's looking into the distance.

599
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:10,640
Speaker 1: His lips are like somehow just like pursed, like inquisitively. Yeah,

600
00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:15,760
Speaker 1: he looks like he manages a bad hot tub store,

601
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 1: or he used car salesman, or maybe he sells paper.

602
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 1: Pe teacher, yeah, pe teacher for sure. He's got a

603
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 1: weirdly long torso big traps Ryan. He got some skills though,

604
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: he's like to get out of the ones I saw.

605
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:35,160
Speaker 1: He's the one that could be a cartoonist. Yes, yes, okay,

606
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,920
Speaker 1: the next one is rich. I'll just go and describe

607
00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: these so you can go quick. This one. It really helps.

608
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 1: We only have one version that's in color. Spencer's got it.

609
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 1: I like the speaks a lot. It's like a it's

610
00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,440
Speaker 1: part illustration, part photoshop Phil. It looks like it's a

611
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: young Phil with his mustache. It looks a lot like Phil.

612
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 1: He's holding a black cherry white clow on one hand

613
00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 1: a lightsaber in the other, and it appears he has

614
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:04,720
Speaker 1: struck down a turkey with the lightsaber. Yeah. Also it's

615
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,240
Speaker 1: it's a lightsaber. I thought it was a empty bottle

616
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:12,080
Speaker 1: of wine. That doesn't say good. That does two very

617
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 1: different things strike down a turkey with both. I like

618
00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 1: this one. It's very like expressionist pastel. It's like a painting.

619
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 1: It's it's I I like I like it a lot.

620
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,439
Speaker 1: Only a lightsaber would produce like the peacock feathers that. Yeah,

621
00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:31,239
Speaker 1: there's it's a purple background. There's like peacock, multi color

622
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:34,680
Speaker 1: peacock feathers. There's a butter one butterfly, and there's a

623
00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: bunch of fall leaves behind a dead turn, which doesn't

624
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:38,520
Speaker 1: make sense because you know that one should be framed

625
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: and go on the wall. Really, I'm also holding a

626
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 1: white claw. The only problem with it is that it's

627
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: not natural line. It's black cherry. But we'll let it slide.

628
00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 1: Who did did we say? Who did this one? May

629
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:53,200
Speaker 1: be rich, that's what it says. Okay, may be rich.

630
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 1: Kevin Ryan did this one? This one is the most

631
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:00,680
Speaker 1: is the most well done artistically. This needs to be framed,

632
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:04,360
Speaker 1: sticker or something. So this is a similar It's a

633
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:08,080
Speaker 1: young Phil looking nervous. He's wearing like an Elmer futt

634
00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:11,319
Speaker 1: orange hat. He's got skimpy mcweeks. That does Phil look

635
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,839
Speaker 1: old to you? Now? No, he looks like a young man, right.

636
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:18,360
Speaker 1: You keep saying there's young young pictures? Well like, okay,

637
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:22,799
Speaker 1: normal Phil actual film. Thanks, thanks you for correcting. He's

638
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 1: wearing like a green scarf or something like an ascot

639
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:30,880
Speaker 1: green ascot. He's got a red flannel shirt on and

640
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:33,919
Speaker 1: then uh orange hunter safety guess with a natural lime

641
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 1: white claw tucked in the pocket. He's holding a shotgun

642
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:41,399
Speaker 1: upside down, sweating nervously, sweating nervously. He's got a pair

643
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,759
Speaker 1: of blue jeans on that are ripped intentionally. And then

644
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:47,520
Speaker 1: he's wearing a pair of ug boots for what reason,

645
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 1: I'm not sure. I just it looks like Phil. If

646
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 1: Phil didn't work immediately and wanted to hunt for the

647
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,239
Speaker 1: first time, this might how he might present himself into

648
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:57,919
Speaker 1: the woods. And where do you wear? No, but I'd

649
00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:00,840
Speaker 1: like to. And it's really well, it's really really well done.

650
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:05,279
Speaker 1: So that's number three. Number four came in ready at

651
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: the last moment. Also should probably be framed from Adam Miller.

652
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:10,839
Speaker 1: This one is gonna be hard. He has a has

653
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:15,360
Speaker 1: an Andy warhol of Ben's green peas and photo. Instead

654
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 1: instead of Campbell's soup, there cans of peas. He's got

655
00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:23,240
Speaker 1: a framed picture of Mango wearing a mango white claw shirt.

656
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 1: Who's Mango? Mango is Phil's dog. He's got some books

657
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 1: on his day standing behind a desk which is behind

658
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: a curt curtain. A lot of these entries included the curtain,

659
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 1: which I loved. In his little cup on his desk

660
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 1: has a pencil and a turkey feather and he has

661
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,200
Speaker 1: two books on his desk, one his Turkey Tack Tactics

662
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 1: and one his weak Stashes for Dummies. So this one

663
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: is the DT. He's got a blonde, creepy looking mustache, glasses,

664
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:50,839
Speaker 1: looking real nerdy. This is really good, really detailed. Number

665
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:54,720
Speaker 1: five is uh how to describe it is? It is perfect.

666
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 1: That's how I would just see Dave Campbell. Um, you

667
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 1: seem like you seem like a nice guy. Uh. You know,

668
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:03,320
Speaker 1: I said that we don't require a lot of effort

669
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 1: with these drawings. I just want to let you know

670
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 1: I did not want to include your entry in the

671
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 1: top It was supposed to be a top five, and

672
00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:14,840
Speaker 1: Ben made it a top six to include Dave Campbell's

673
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 1: drying is perfect. It's made it through said we should

674
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,399
Speaker 1: frame this one perfect, Dave. Dave Campbell, what he's done.

675
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:26,759
Speaker 1: I think he might have done this just like on

676
00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:29,000
Speaker 1: his phone. He's he's It's a line drawing, is what

677
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 1: I would say. It's an impressionist and it's got a

678
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:34,759
Speaker 1: circle head and inside he's scratched some yellow hair, but

679
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:38,399
Speaker 1: you can still see the circle underneath. He's scratched a

680
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:41,960
Speaker 1: blonde mustache with u a rye smiles all just lines

681
00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:46,440
Speaker 1: and Dick knows and then two eyes that are looking.

682
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:48,520
Speaker 1: They seem to follow you wherever you go, like the

683
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:52,920
Speaker 1: mona Lisa uh and the dog He's written on here

684
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:56,400
Speaker 1: Phil plus mango and then mango is just a mango's

685
00:37:56,440 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 1: face um with a beautifully drawn nose and two for eyes.

686
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 1: Some would say it's crude. I think it is impressionistic.

687
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 1: What are the fore at the bottom? That was that

688
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:08,759
Speaker 1: part of the No, that was not part of that's

689
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:10,200
Speaker 1: stake to be on there. It wasn't part of the

690
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,279
Speaker 1: original art. Now do we know how old Dave is

691
00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:18,719
Speaker 1: because if Dave's like five, I'm gonna give a man.

692
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 1: Probably don't have many kindergartners that listen to your people

693
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:23,400
Speaker 1: did have their kids do it, but that none of

694
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 1: them made it. We do like kids, but they didn't

695
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:27,760
Speaker 1: make it, none of them. Are you sure Dave didn't

696
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:30,239
Speaker 1: have his kid do it? No, Dave, I have to

697
00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:32,400
Speaker 1: go back and read his email. But I think Dave,

698
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:35,600
Speaker 1: if my inner child drew Phil, this is what it

699
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:39,040
Speaker 1: would looks like. It is fantastic. It is it is

700
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:43,480
Speaker 1: just beautiful. This one has led to the most laughs

701
00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 1: in the office because it's just perfect. At one point

702
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:49,319
Speaker 1: you described it as something like a like a fingerprint

703
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 1: or something. It's just like there's only one of them.

704
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,200
Speaker 1: There's it's a snowf like you could never you can

705
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 1: never sit down and do this again. It is beautiful.

706
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,279
Speaker 1: It's one of a kind. You could never sit down

707
00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 1: and recreate it. Just the subtleties here, the depth, and

708
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 1: I'm sure people will be able to see these on

709
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:10,760
Speaker 1: your Instagram. Okay, but this one is is the best, alright,

710
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:16,400
Speaker 1: an unbiased opinion, not Patrick Spiker Drew Phil riding a

711
00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 1: deer or elk, some sort of mystical creature that looks

712
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:22,840
Speaker 1: like a deer elk. He is dressed like Iron Man

713
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:27,000
Speaker 1: and he's carrying a lightsaber. He's wearing a pair of headphones.

714
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 1: He looks very weathered. Again, you know, very accurate to

715
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:32,799
Speaker 1: what Phil looks like. But in this he looks look

716
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 1: a little bit like Kevin Costner an open ring. This

717
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 1: is an older Phil. Yeah, he's based seeing some ship

718
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:43,719
Speaker 1: like he's been there. We're onisode of th HC. Yeah, yeah,

719
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:47,359
Speaker 1: you've been you You've missed a lot of turkeys. Your

720
00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 1: family is hungry and you've climbed upon your steed to

721
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 1: go out into the wilderness like an Iron Man suit on.

722
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:57,480
Speaker 1: But this is it's sort of like a play on

723
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:00,880
Speaker 1: Luke on the I don't I can't remember what you

724
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 1: call that animal. It's called the tom Tom Phil? What

725
00:40:04,280 --> 00:40:07,400
Speaker 1: it called? Yeah, it's kind of like a play on

726
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 1: is this one word? Why did you say that? Phil?

727
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:11,200
Speaker 1: Would you say that? I would? I like this like

728
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 1: a poster in The Lord of the Rings ride something

729
00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 1: like this. I don't believe so now, no, that was wrong.

730
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 1: Is a tong tong or to to is tonton? The thing?

731
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:28,600
Speaker 1: He cut it open and crawled him and cut him,

732
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:30,080
Speaker 1: cut it open and put him in there so it

733
00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:32,880
Speaker 1: wouldn't freeze today. Okay, all right, well here we go.

734
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:35,400
Speaker 1: Everybody shuff your papers and anticipation. We're just gonna go

735
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 1: around the table and say who we're going for. Yeah,

736
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:39,879
Speaker 1: we're gonna go around the table. Just remember, I think

737
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 1: he had to keep in mind this was supposed to

738
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 1: be done off of what Phil's voice sounds like, and

739
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:50,400
Speaker 1: that should influence your We gave a lot of details

740
00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 1: as to what I'm torn. I'm torn between two between

741
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:55,360
Speaker 1: two of them. Okay, I don't know. I need to

742
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:56,880
Speaker 1: come to a decision. Rip him in half and you

743
00:40:56,920 --> 00:41:02,359
Speaker 1: can put it half. Seth number one, Ryan Strip number one,

744
00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:05,919
Speaker 1: Ryan Estrip, Bryan Estrip. Ryan has one vote. One vote

745
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:12,880
Speaker 1: for Ryan. Ryan is the uh like the Dilbert character. Okay, Yanni,

746
00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:17,399
Speaker 1: I'm going number two, number two. The abstract number two

747
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:21,280
Speaker 1: is a be Rich, whereas Phil has struck the turkey

748
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 1: down with his lightsaber and the fall and there's some

749
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 1: peacock was also peacock was also hit by a car. Joseph,

750
00:41:31,400 --> 00:41:34,359
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with number three, Kevin Ryan. Number three,

751
00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:38,160
Speaker 1: Kevin Ryan oh Man the accurate illustration of Phil holding

752
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 1: the shotgun upside down with the white claw in his pocket. Philip,

753
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: I'm going Taylor number two a rich. Maybe Rich takes

754
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 1: the lead. Abe riches the lightsabers struck down the wild

755
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:59,000
Speaker 1: bird triumphantly. I'll hold mine to last. Actually accounts for ten,

756
00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 1: So go ahead, Spencer, I'm voting number three Kevin Ryan.

757
00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:11,040
Speaker 1: Ben All right, Well, I will take it upon me

758
00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:16,239
Speaker 1: to break the tie, but I am going to personally

759
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:20,480
Speaker 1: send my own drawing to Dave Campbell, the guy who

760
00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:23,359
Speaker 1: drew number five, And I'm gonna suggest as a thank you,

761
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 1: because I wish he would one. But it's only in

762
00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 1: my heart that you're gonna draw a picture of Phil

763
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:29,759
Speaker 1: and send it back to Him'm gonna draw a picture

764
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:34,440
Speaker 1: of what I think Dave Campbell looks thank you in

765
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:37,839
Speaker 1: the style of that style of this one, because in

766
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:39,279
Speaker 1: my heart it win. So we're looking at number two

767
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 1: and number three. Phil inserts some sort of drum roll

768
00:42:42,680 --> 00:42:47,239
Speaker 1: sound effects. All right, so who picked number two? There

769
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:50,399
Speaker 1: was a Yanni and myself and Phil, and number three

770
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:57,360
Speaker 1: was Spencer and Joe. Both well done. Both uh means

771
00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:02,200
Speaker 1: something to me, It's hard to say. Like Kevin Ryan's,

772
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:05,640
Speaker 1: Kevin Ryan's is better illustration. It's the best illustration that

773
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:10,359
Speaker 1: we that we received, but it's also creative. It makes

774
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:15,000
Speaker 1: me feel, it makes me feel something. I feel for

775
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:18,440
Speaker 1: this character. He's in his ug boots, he clearly his

776
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: feet probably hurt. He's having a second about decisions. I

777
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 1: shouldn't have got these genes at coals, So that makes

778
00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 1: me feel something. But ab Rich number two is a

779
00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 1: triumphant illustration. Phil is hoisting his lightsaber into the air

780
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:38,440
Speaker 1: as if to say I've done it. So this also

781
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: makes me feel something. Um who wants to try to

782
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,560
Speaker 1: convince me of their pick. Johnny even try to convince

783
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 1: me of a B. Rich oh Man. What can I say,

784
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:56,080
Speaker 1: just Mrs Sway, this is for a tundra. Well, the

785
00:43:56,120 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: fact that Phil feels like a B is you know,

786
00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:02,880
Speaker 1: a little closer to his own heart. I think that

787
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: should that should account for something. I just listen. I

788
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:09,359
Speaker 1: love the creative choices in both of them. I think

789
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:12,400
Speaker 1: a B went outside the box. We didn't receive a

790
00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:17,160
Speaker 1: single other entry that was in this that included this

791
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 1: weird past with I'm also I'm wearing a nome packing

792
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:24,640
Speaker 1: out a unicorn shirt in this. I don't think we

793
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:31,359
Speaker 1: mentioned that. So we got some mediator merch crossed over there. Um,

794
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:32,600
Speaker 1: I don't know. I like it. I think it's the

795
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 1: most artistically creative be too right, because that's what that's

796
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:42,560
Speaker 1: your future. If I was walking through, if I was

797
00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:45,840
Speaker 1: walking through, if I was walking through a museum and

798
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:47,879
Speaker 1: I saw that hanging on the wall, I wouldn't think twice.

799
00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 1: I'd be like, hmm, you're right, this is what a

800
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:55,080
Speaker 1: B wrote. He said clearly, my drawing skills can't keep

801
00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:57,800
Speaker 1: up with my imagination. I envisioned Phil with skimpy mickweek

802
00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:00,200
Speaker 1: sash slaying a turkey with a lightsaber and chuck a

803
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:03,080
Speaker 1: white claw. I wanted to add his dog Mango. Maybe

804
00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 1: I'll work on it some more and send in a

805
00:45:05,160 --> 00:45:08,799
Speaker 1: new one. Maybe. Um. So it's this is a collaboration

806
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:10,880
Speaker 1: of my drawing and cropping and pacing skills. I call

807
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 1: this masterpiece. Fill the white claw, Jett. I hope this

808
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,440
Speaker 1: brings you some entertainment and I could win. That's what

809
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 1: a B Rich says. Let's see if I can see

810
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:23,320
Speaker 1: what Kevin Ryan said here. I'll have to search into

811
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:27,479
Speaker 1: the phill. The engineer. Uh, he says, love the show

812
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:31,399
Speaker 1: attaches my submission. So he didn't really didn't really go nuts.

813
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:33,279
Speaker 1: He sent us to Actually this is the first one

814
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:37,800
Speaker 1: he sent us. Um. His email is at Kevin Ryan Creative,

815
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:43,680
Speaker 1: so he's a pro creative. He's a creative. You're gonna

816
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 1: need another drum roll? Okay, secondrum, secondrum I'm gonna go

817
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:58,800
Speaker 1: with them to be rich. He did it? You want you?

818
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:01,920
Speaker 1: You beat over hundreds of people who are everyone who submitted.

819
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:05,920
Speaker 1: It's it's a genuinely flattering thing. Thank you for listening,

820
00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:08,719
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening, Thanks for taking the time in Thanks

821
00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:10,440
Speaker 1: for taking the time. Now we're gonna go to a

822
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:15,160
Speaker 1: completely unrelated interview with my new friend Ryan Holiday of

823
00:46:15,239 --> 00:46:18,799
Speaker 1: the Daily Stoic uh and congratulates dab Rich. You're gonna

824
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 1: get a tone of one ten. You're gonna get a

825
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:24,280
Speaker 1: damn work sharp can onion, sharp Perry. Thanks everyone for

826
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:34,880
Speaker 1: taking part. Now here's Ryan Holiday. Hey Ryan, how's it

827
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,400
Speaker 1: going in It's going well? Thanks for having so. We

828
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:41,719
Speaker 1: were just talking. You're in beautiful Austin, Texas, or just

829
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 1: east of Austin, Texas, right, correct, Yeah, in in what

830
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:48,120
Speaker 1: they call Pime country. Yeah, it's beautiful Pome country. Um,

831
00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 1: we'll have to talk a lot of compare a lot

832
00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:52,720
Speaker 1: of notes about that. But before we get any further,

833
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:55,520
Speaker 1: you were just before we hit record, you were just

834
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:57,800
Speaker 1: talking to me about the virtues of hall cunning or

835
00:46:57,880 --> 00:47:01,919
Speaker 1: versus of hunting. Necessarily before we explain kind of all

836
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:04,040
Speaker 1: the things that you do and your philosophies and all

837
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:07,040
Speaker 1: that stuff. Just talked to a little bit about what

838
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:10,239
Speaker 1: why you go hall unting there and then what it

839
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:12,880
Speaker 1: means to you. Well, I mean, I think the reason

840
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:15,080
Speaker 1: you go hog hunting in Texas is because if if

841
00:47:15,120 --> 00:47:19,239
Speaker 1: you don't do it, uh uh, it's a problem, right,

842
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 1: you know, they're they're basically just sort of giant destructive rats,

843
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:27,600
Speaker 1: and and somebody else already killed all the cougars and

844
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:30,080
Speaker 1: the wolves and so you know, it's a sort of

845
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:33,840
Speaker 1: massively invasive species. So I can see like on the

846
00:47:33,840 --> 00:47:37,480
Speaker 1: back of my property like if if you know, if

847
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 1: if I'm not doing it, every once in a while,

848
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:41,440
Speaker 1: I can just see evidence that they've been there. They

849
00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:44,400
Speaker 1: just sort of you know, root around and just destroy stuff,

850
00:47:44,440 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 1: which is bad for my cows. It's bad for you know,

851
00:47:46,719 --> 00:47:48,879
Speaker 1: it's bad to look at, and so I just try

852
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:50,840
Speaker 1: to try to do it every once we I have

853
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:53,760
Speaker 1: a neighbor near one of my back pastures that raises

854
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:57,600
Speaker 1: sort of heritage hogs. So she's like a magnet for

855
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 1: them because they actually, uh you know, they'll they'll the

856
00:48:01,560 --> 00:48:05,560
Speaker 1: wild hogs will come break into her pins like basically

857
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:08,399
Speaker 1: rape per hogs and then and then it can ruin

858
00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:11,839
Speaker 1: like you know, a whole uh you know, uh sort

859
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:15,000
Speaker 1: of breeding cycle of her animals because the like I guess,

860
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 1: the half breeds aren't worth anything. So I kind of

861
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:19,120
Speaker 1: I kind of do it obviously just for sort of

862
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:23,120
Speaker 1: pure maintenance sort of conservation purposes. But what I just

863
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 1: found is that as as a writer, it's sort of

864
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:33,319
Speaker 1: a sedentary profession, but it's also it's also very mentally intensive.

865
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 1: And so you know, if I was stamp collecting as

866
00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:39,839
Speaker 1: my hobby, I'd just be thinking about books as I'm

867
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:42,400
Speaker 1: collecting stamps or you know, building model trains, I just

868
00:48:42,440 --> 00:48:46,160
Speaker 1: be thinking about you know, hunting is so sort of active,

869
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:49,520
Speaker 1: and it forces you to be so present because you're

870
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:51,319
Speaker 1: having this sort of one I mean, you're carrying a

871
00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 1: loaded weapon, which is you know, a you know, a

872
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:59,720
Speaker 1: bit sobering, but but you're you're having to be aware

873
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:02,960
Speaker 1: and cognizant of so many things that you know, I

874
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 1: could leave my house because I saw something where I

875
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 1: decided to go, and two or three hours could go

876
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:10,120
Speaker 1: by and I'll realize that I haven't thought about anything

877
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:13,239
Speaker 1: in the three hours. The three hours except you know,

878
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:15,799
Speaker 1: this sort of task at hand. So for me, it's

879
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,440
Speaker 1: it's just it's a great hobby that gets me outside

880
00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:21,560
Speaker 1: and active, but also like sort of forces me to

881
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:26,120
Speaker 1: disengage from my work in a really really important way. Yeah. No,

882
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 1: And in the first time that we were just also

883
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 1: talking about how I came to to read some of

884
00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:34,080
Speaker 1: your stuff. There's a lot of listeners to our show

885
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,160
Speaker 1: that that has sent me an article that you wrote

886
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:41,040
Speaker 1: for Human Parts um Inside, why every liberal millennial should

887
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:43,560
Speaker 1: go hunting for to Day. I like the title as

888
00:49:43,600 --> 00:49:47,600
Speaker 1: as a digital journalist myself, we've we've danced around some

889
00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:50,640
Speaker 1: of the similar titling, but but more of the context

890
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:52,520
Speaker 1: of that. You talk about holkn and you talk about

891
00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:55,239
Speaker 1: what it means, and in there you talk about how

892
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 1: serious it is and how it makes you, how it

893
00:49:58,040 --> 00:50:00,920
Speaker 1: makes you feel. Just talk a little bit about those

894
00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 1: those experiences, because it's it's interesting, you know, it's funny.

895
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:06,200
Speaker 1: So obviously I didn't I didn't pick the headline. They

896
00:50:06,200 --> 00:50:08,919
Speaker 1: sort of picked the headlines for you. Although they don't,

897
00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:11,600
Speaker 1: I don't mind it. But what was interesting about that pieces?

898
00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 1: So I wrote, I decided I want to do a

899
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:18,040
Speaker 1: piece about hunting, and because my book Stillness was coming out,

900
00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:19,400
Speaker 1: and I think there's just when we can talk more

901
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:21,800
Speaker 1: about this with the connection mistians are stillness and hunting,

902
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:24,200
Speaker 1: and then there's obviously literally still hunting like in a

903
00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:28,799
Speaker 1: blind which is what that piece was about. But we

904
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:30,720
Speaker 1: sent that to the New York Times and they passed

905
00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:32,799
Speaker 1: on it. We sent it to the USA Today and

906
00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:35,080
Speaker 1: they passed on it. We sent it to the Atlantic,

907
00:50:35,120 --> 00:50:37,240
Speaker 1: I think, and they passed on it. Pretty much everyone

908
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:41,480
Speaker 1: passed on it, and and my editor at at Portfolio

909
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:44,480
Speaker 1: was not particularly pleased with it either, like it it

910
00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:46,920
Speaker 1: was in a way that sort of peace proved itself,

911
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:51,360
Speaker 1: which is that everyone everyone was really just like hesitant

912
00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:53,839
Speaker 1: to touch it because it's it's either so far from

913
00:50:53,840 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 1: their experience or because you know, the sort of gun

914
00:50:57,120 --> 00:51:01,120
Speaker 1: control debate has become sort of so vicious and tragic

915
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 1: and you know, sort of no win that like nobody

916
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: wanted to go anywhere near it. So it's actually I

917
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:10,239
Speaker 1: felt lucky that it ever ended up seeing the light

918
00:51:10,239 --> 00:51:13,280
Speaker 1: of day. It took like two or three months before

919
00:51:13,680 --> 00:51:15,799
Speaker 1: before we ever found a home for which I which

920
00:51:15,840 --> 00:51:17,839
Speaker 1: I you know, sort of proved my point, but also

921
00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:20,000
Speaker 1: it was a little bit disappointing because I wanted it

922
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:23,479
Speaker 1: to reach as many people as possible. Like my point

923
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,560
Speaker 1: in the piece was that like we live in this

924
00:51:26,640 --> 00:51:30,000
Speaker 1: sort of culture where we're trying to make everything black

925
00:51:30,040 --> 00:51:34,359
Speaker 1: and white, like everything's like amazing, everything's terrible. You know,

926
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:38,200
Speaker 1: everyone's a villain or everyone's a hero, and the reality

927
00:51:38,280 --> 00:51:42,560
Speaker 1: is like most issues are gray and complicated, and I think,

928
00:51:43,040 --> 00:51:45,600
Speaker 1: um and and they're just like it's just life, you know,

929
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 1: it's like messy and uh and confusing, and there's trade

930
00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 1: offs and compromises. And one of the things I was

931
00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:57,320
Speaker 1: trying to get in, you know, across in the peace,

932
00:51:57,680 --> 00:51:59,799
Speaker 1: aside from I think just the sort of some of

933
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,160
Speaker 1: the rapeutic and philosophical benefits of hunting, just the idea

934
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:06,000
Speaker 1: that like everyone has really strong opinions about this thing,

935
00:52:06,200 --> 00:52:09,080
Speaker 1: and not enough people actually have done it to have

936
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:13,600
Speaker 1: to justify said strong opinions. Like I think when you

937
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:17,239
Speaker 1: when you hunt, like you know, there's the rush of it.

938
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,279
Speaker 1: There's that sort of biological adrenaline rush you get that

939
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:22,560
Speaker 1: I think, to me, proves we're like sort of made

940
00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:24,680
Speaker 1: to do this. And then at the same time, when

941
00:52:24,680 --> 00:52:27,319
Speaker 1: you see an animal dying, there's a sadness or a

942
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:31,200
Speaker 1: darkness or you know, a sort of that touches a

943
00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:33,560
Speaker 1: different place in you, and you realize, like, these things

944
00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:35,839
Speaker 1: are really complicated and that it's not as sort of

945
00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 1: clean and easy as as maybe we'd like to reduce

946
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 1: it to from you know, in a in a two

947
00:52:41,520 --> 00:52:45,080
Speaker 1: forty character tweet, and so you know, I think just

948
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:49,800
Speaker 1: what I what I love about hunting is that it's

949
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:54,480
Speaker 1: it's complex, and it's confusing, it's good and bad and

950
00:52:54,480 --> 00:52:58,359
Speaker 1: and you know, we should talk about it like adults. Yeah,

951
00:52:58,480 --> 00:53:00,600
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of I think why a lot

952
00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:02,880
Speaker 1: of people sent it to me. They are fans of yours.

953
00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:04,520
Speaker 1: They kind of know what you talk about. They know

954
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:08,960
Speaker 1: the philosophies that you push, which I've really uh dove

955
00:53:09,000 --> 00:53:11,440
Speaker 1: into over the last couple of days, looking at your

956
00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:13,759
Speaker 1: books and your all your talks and just diving in.

957
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:18,479
Speaker 1: And it's been I'm a I'm a stoic. Now I'll

958
00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:22,040
Speaker 1: be I'll be flat honest because a lot of this stuff, Yeah,

959
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:23,319
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of the stuff we talked about

960
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:26,879
Speaker 1: on this show crosses over with stoicism. And we'll get

961
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:30,759
Speaker 1: into a lot of about exactly what I'm talking about

962
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 1: and what you talk about. But this piece is even

963
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,120
Speaker 1: more interesting to me now that I know that you

964
00:53:36,200 --> 00:53:40,480
Speaker 1: got rejected by a bunch of mainstream media outlets. I

965
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,040
Speaker 1: think I'd like it even more. Uh, what are the

966
00:53:43,120 --> 00:53:45,719
Speaker 1: interesting things about that I sort of talked about in

967
00:53:45,760 --> 00:53:47,839
Speaker 1: the piece. I didn't get to it as much, but

968
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:51,000
Speaker 1: so mostly I write about, you know, the stoic philosopher's

969
00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:55,360
Speaker 1: markets really as being the most famous um and and

970
00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:58,279
Speaker 1: so I think, you know, people who start of seeing

971
00:53:58,280 --> 00:54:00,759
Speaker 1: the movie Gladiator go oh, I know Mark Surrealius is,

972
00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 1: and you go, oh, he was the Emperor of Rome.

973
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:05,759
Speaker 1: What's interesting about Marcus surreally is is that you know,

974
00:54:05,840 --> 00:54:09,840
Speaker 1: he wasn't his father was an emperor UM. He was

975
00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:12,719
Speaker 1: just like a sort of a promising young kid, and

976
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:17,360
Speaker 1: the Emperor Hadrian sort of notices him and decides, uh

977
00:54:17,400 --> 00:54:19,560
Speaker 1: that that, you know, maybe this kid has what it

978
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:22,200
Speaker 1: takes to be emperor because Hadrian doesn't have a son,

979
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:25,400
Speaker 1: so that this it becomes this complicated process where Hadrian

980
00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:29,520
Speaker 1: adopts a much older man who's younger than him, who

981
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:32,240
Speaker 1: in turn adopts Marcus Surrealius, and they sort of groom

982
00:54:32,360 --> 00:54:35,719
Speaker 1: him to become emperor eventually when he's old enough. But

983
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:37,759
Speaker 1: one of the interesting things that I came across in

984
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:40,279
Speaker 1: my reading that that I sort of hadn't really thought

985
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,320
Speaker 1: about much before I started hunting, was just the idea

986
00:54:43,400 --> 00:54:48,239
Speaker 1: that Hadrian and Marcus Surrealius would go hunting together. And

987
00:54:48,280 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 1: Marcus talks about boar hunting a few different times in

988
00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:54,840
Speaker 1: his meditations and in his letters, and and it's like,

989
00:54:54,920 --> 00:54:57,360
Speaker 1: oh man, this idea of like two men going hunting

990
00:54:57,400 --> 00:55:00,640
Speaker 1: together and it's sort of being an opportunity to see

991
00:55:00,640 --> 00:55:03,640
Speaker 1: what they're made of at an opportunity to teach, you know,

992
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:07,960
Speaker 1: lessons and you know, an opportunity to practice courage and

993
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:11,719
Speaker 1: patience and also compassion, you know, sort of all the

994
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:15,000
Speaker 1: things that hunting brings up. It's like, oh man, that

995
00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:18,640
Speaker 1: that this is actually sort of intimately tied with the

996
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:21,680
Speaker 1: philosophy that I write about. I just thought that was

997
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:26,400
Speaker 1: so cool and interesting. Yeah, there's so many crossroads about

998
00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 1: you know, this flade, this type of philosophy or this

999
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:31,759
Speaker 1: branch of philosophy, and then all the things we talked

1000
00:55:31,760 --> 00:55:33,920
Speaker 1: about on this show, and I think all hunters kind

1001
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:36,799
Speaker 1: of understand. But you you describe that as bursts of

1002
00:55:36,880 --> 00:55:39,319
Speaker 1: courage in that piece, and I found that to be

1003
00:55:39,360 --> 00:55:42,600
Speaker 1: That's something I was like, wow, because hunting does I

1004
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:45,560
Speaker 1: think the adjective of like bursts describing it is you're

1005
00:55:45,600 --> 00:55:47,960
Speaker 1: sitting around, you're waiting, you're waiting, you're waiting. All of

1006
00:55:48,000 --> 00:55:52,759
Speaker 1: a sudden you're being made two make a decision that's

1007
00:55:52,760 --> 00:55:54,840
Speaker 1: going to affect the life of another thing, and you

1008
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:57,319
Speaker 1: have to have these bursts, these instances of courage and

1009
00:55:57,360 --> 00:56:01,080
Speaker 1: good decision making that that are signs of good leadership

1010
00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:04,799
Speaker 1: or signs of really being uh, someone that can make

1011
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:09,560
Speaker 1: critical decisions. Yeah, especially you know, back then, even even

1012
00:56:09,600 --> 00:56:14,560
Speaker 1: boar hunting, you know, uh was considerably more dangerous. For

1013
00:56:14,680 --> 00:56:18,719
Speaker 1: first off, these are the boars that are now imported

1014
00:56:18,760 --> 00:56:21,399
Speaker 1: to America. So these are sort of these big either

1015
00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:25,560
Speaker 1: African or European wars um and they would hunt them

1016
00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:29,880
Speaker 1: with nets and spears, sometimes from horseback, sometimes on the ground.

1017
00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:33,319
Speaker 1: So you know, like to to to shoot a hog

1018
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:36,320
Speaker 1: from a hundred yards away with a high powered rifle.

1019
00:56:36,520 --> 00:56:38,799
Speaker 1: You know that maybe there's a slight burster courage there,

1020
00:56:38,800 --> 00:56:40,560
Speaker 1: and you don't want to get charged. I've I've been

1021
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:44,000
Speaker 1: charged by them before, you know. But but to do

1022
00:56:44,080 --> 00:56:46,800
Speaker 1: it on a horseback with a net, you know, and

1023
00:56:46,800 --> 00:56:48,880
Speaker 1: and a spear is just a sort of a whole

1024
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:51,800
Speaker 1: other level of it. And and so for the stoics,

1025
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:56,800
Speaker 1: you know, hunting and wrestling and boxing and sports, these

1026
00:56:56,880 --> 00:56:59,520
Speaker 1: these sort of hobbies were also a sort of training

1027
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:03,759
Speaker 1: grounds for the kinds of virtues that you would need

1028
00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:06,880
Speaker 1: in the you know, in life. And so I just

1029
00:57:06,920 --> 00:57:10,719
Speaker 1: get the sense that you know Hadrian was taking him

1030
00:57:10,719 --> 00:57:13,000
Speaker 1: out to go hunting because it's a fun thing to do,

1031
00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:16,560
Speaker 1: but also because they were trying to you know, you

1032
00:57:16,680 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 1: just wanted to see, like, how does this guy respond

1033
00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:22,640
Speaker 1: under pressure? What? What? What? What can I teach him

1034
00:57:22,680 --> 00:57:26,440
Speaker 1: through this experience that would you know, make him the

1035
00:57:26,520 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 1: kind of man that he needs to be for what's

1036
00:57:29,160 --> 00:57:32,880
Speaker 1: going to be in you know, extremely difficult job. Well,

1037
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:34,720
Speaker 1: when you talk about what you mentioned, there is kind

1038
00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:36,400
Speaker 1: of the we I talked about it all the time,

1039
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:39,360
Speaker 1: the plurality of hunting. Right, you could be having fun

1040
00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:41,840
Speaker 1: going out and do something to spend time with people

1041
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:44,240
Speaker 1: you love or but you can also be challenging yourself

1042
00:57:44,240 --> 00:57:48,040
Speaker 1: and getting better and doing things that requires a certain

1043
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:50,760
Speaker 1: type of skill set and knowledge. So you can do

1044
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:52,800
Speaker 1: both those sames at the same time. So it seems

1045
00:57:52,800 --> 00:57:56,320
Speaker 1: that that goes a lot farther than the modern hunter. Yeah, yeah,

1046
00:57:56,760 --> 00:58:00,400
Speaker 1: of course. And and and you know even what I

1047
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:03,600
Speaker 1: what I like is like even an unsuccessful hunt teaches

1048
00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:07,000
Speaker 1: you something. If it's just managing disappointment, if it's just

1049
00:58:07,120 --> 00:58:11,480
Speaker 1: managing patients, if it's just being able to appreciate. I

1050
00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:13,640
Speaker 1: think Theodore Roosevelt writes about this a little bit in

1051
00:58:13,960 --> 00:58:17,120
Speaker 1: one of his um in one of his hunting books,

1052
00:58:17,120 --> 00:58:21,280
Speaker 1: he's just like, like, the hunt is the experience. Like

1053
00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:24,080
Speaker 1: it's like that all the all the things that hunting provides,

1054
00:58:24,160 --> 00:58:27,080
Speaker 1: that's the reward. And then it's like if you get something,

1055
00:58:27,160 --> 00:58:30,520
Speaker 1: that's that's the extra. But but it's easy to sort

1056
00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:33,600
Speaker 1: of miss that. Yeah, I mean the famous quote from

1057
00:58:33,720 --> 00:58:38,400
Speaker 1: jose Give Sette this talking about hunting is we don't

1058
00:58:38,560 --> 00:58:42,480
Speaker 1: hunt to have killed. We kill in order to have hunted.

1059
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:45,880
Speaker 1: And and that's those it's those philosophies, like it's about

1060
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:48,520
Speaker 1: the experience. And we could spin all of that to

1061
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:51,400
Speaker 1: to what you do and what you've done. And I,

1062
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:53,760
Speaker 1: like I said, I've been reading your books and watching

1063
00:58:53,800 --> 00:58:57,160
Speaker 1: some of your your talks and really diving into to

1064
00:58:57,320 --> 00:58:59,560
Speaker 1: what this philosophy that you've kind of brought to life

1065
00:58:59,600 --> 00:59:02,440
Speaker 1: in a model and sense um and it's incredibly interesting.

1066
00:59:02,960 --> 00:59:06,120
Speaker 1: And you start off, you start off by and one

1067
00:59:06,120 --> 00:59:09,200
Speaker 1: of your talks by talking about what philosophy was and

1068
00:59:09,480 --> 00:59:12,120
Speaker 1: is and could be. Um, you say, philosophy has been

1069
00:59:12,240 --> 00:59:15,200
Speaker 1: the guide to the good life. Yeah, can you talk

1070
00:59:15,240 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 1: a little bit about what how you've come to understand

1071
00:59:17,840 --> 00:59:22,200
Speaker 1: that statement? Well, yeah, like I imagine similar listeners are

1072
00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 1: probably just even hearing like philosophy and hunting and feel

1073
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:28,480
Speaker 1: like that's like a contradiction right there. That's what this

1074
00:59:28,520 --> 00:59:34,760
Speaker 1: shows about. They're good, they're just like the philosophers and

1075
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:38,000
Speaker 1: hunting don't feel like they go together. Because when we

1076
00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 1: think philosopher, we think like turtleneck university professor, you know,

1077
00:59:43,560 --> 00:59:47,520
Speaker 1: sort of like bleeding heart liberal, uh, you know, obsessed

1078
00:59:47,560 --> 00:59:52,240
Speaker 1: with ideas and abstractions and theories. You don't necessarily think

1079
00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 1: like real people in the real world, which for most

1080
00:59:55,680 --> 00:59:59,400
Speaker 1: of you know, ancient history is the opposite of what

1081
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:02,720
Speaker 1: philosophy he is like, you know, Socrates, the most famous

1082
01:00:03,520 --> 01:00:07,000
Speaker 1: probably philosopher of the angel world was it was a soldier,

1083
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:12,200
Speaker 1: you know, never wrote anything down, didn't teach classes. He

1084
01:00:12,280 --> 01:00:15,560
Speaker 1: was a philosopher because of what he walked around and

1085
01:00:15,640 --> 01:00:18,720
Speaker 1: did and because of the questions he asked people and

1086
01:00:18,720 --> 01:00:22,720
Speaker 1: then ultimately like his his the way he faced you

1087
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:25,280
Speaker 1: know death. That that was like sort of what made

1088
01:00:25,360 --> 01:00:28,600
Speaker 1: him the philosopher that endured for all time. Cato, who's

1089
01:00:28,640 --> 01:00:31,800
Speaker 1: another sort of famous Roman again, doesn't write anything down.

1090
01:00:32,040 --> 01:00:36,680
Speaker 1: He's a philosopher because you know, of of the standards

1091
01:00:36,680 --> 01:00:39,040
Speaker 1: that he held themselves to that the things that he did,

1092
01:00:39,080 --> 01:00:41,240
Speaker 1: the way that he lived, and Marcus realized being the

1093
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:44,800
Speaker 1: same thing. So for me, what what philosophy is? The

1094
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:47,280
Speaker 1: philosophy I kind of tried to write about Marcus really

1095
01:00:47,360 --> 01:00:48,880
Speaker 1: is has a good quote he says, you know, no

1096
01:00:49,160 --> 01:00:51,920
Speaker 1: role is so well suited to philosophy than the one

1097
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:54,280
Speaker 1: you happen to be in right now. And I think

1098
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:57,600
Speaker 1: he means whether you're the emperor or a slave or

1099
01:00:57,840 --> 01:01:00,360
Speaker 1: you know, living in a trailer or living in you know,

1100
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:06,280
Speaker 1: a mansion, like philosophy is the guide to being the

1101
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 1: best version of yourself. And and so if we can

1102
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:13,480
Speaker 1: see philosophy then not as a sort of complicated explanation

1103
01:01:13,600 --> 01:01:17,080
Speaker 1: for the universe, but instead, like you know, it's sort

1104
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:20,640
Speaker 1: of tips and tricks for for being a good person,

1105
01:01:20,840 --> 01:01:25,880
Speaker 1: for managing your temper, for finding happiness, for getting over grief,

1106
01:01:25,920 --> 01:01:28,440
Speaker 1: you know, for for all the things that human beings

1107
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:31,720
Speaker 1: have to do. UM, I think it not only becomes

1108
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:36,920
Speaker 1: much more practical, but it becomes much more accessible and

1109
01:01:37,120 --> 01:01:41,720
Speaker 1: applicable to everyday people. Yeah, you have a really great

1110
01:01:42,320 --> 01:01:46,880
Speaker 1: thorough quote in there about this um that talks about Yeah,

1111
01:01:46,920 --> 01:01:49,000
Speaker 1: you know, I'll just read it to be a philosopher

1112
01:01:49,040 --> 01:01:51,040
Speaker 1: is not merely to have subtle thoughts, nor even to

1113
01:01:51,120 --> 01:01:54,160
Speaker 1: have found a school. It is to solve some of

1114
01:01:54,200 --> 01:01:57,040
Speaker 1: the problems of life, not only theoretically but practically. Then

1115
01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:00,480
Speaker 1: I read that, I'm like, yeah, exactly, yeah, And look,

1116
01:02:00,560 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: you can imagine throw in that cabin. I think he

1117
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:05,720
Speaker 1: was a vegetarian, so you know, I don't want to

1118
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:08,160
Speaker 1: like sort of project hunting onto him. But you know,

1119
01:02:08,200 --> 01:02:11,840
Speaker 1: he's out in the woods, you know, experiencing life and

1120
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:14,840
Speaker 1: a sort of honest and raw form. Like to him,

1121
01:02:14,920 --> 01:02:18,240
Speaker 1: this is what philosophy is. It's not you know, it's

1122
01:02:18,360 --> 01:02:20,640
Speaker 1: it's not debating, you know, like right now, like the

1123
01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:23,120
Speaker 1: big sort of philosophical question you'll hear people talk about

1124
01:02:23,200 --> 01:02:24,800
Speaker 1: is they'll go like, how do we know we're not

1125
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:27,840
Speaker 1: living in a computer simulation? Or they'll talk about the

1126
01:02:27,880 --> 01:02:32,320
Speaker 1: trolley problem. You know, there's so these interesting philosophical puzzles.

1127
01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:34,040
Speaker 1: But you're like, what then am I supposed to do

1128
01:02:34,080 --> 01:02:35,680
Speaker 1: with this? Do you know what I mean? Like, this

1129
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:38,600
Speaker 1: doesn't tell me what to do? And I think that's

1130
01:02:38,600 --> 01:02:42,120
Speaker 1: what actually philosophy is, is there to guide us around.

1131
01:02:42,160 --> 01:02:44,439
Speaker 1: It's like what do you do? Yeah, that's a great

1132
01:02:44,520 --> 01:02:47,240
Speaker 1: it's It's a profound point. And we've talked on this

1133
01:02:47,240 --> 01:02:49,880
Speaker 1: show about hunting ethics a lot, and I think that

1134
01:02:50,240 --> 01:02:52,200
Speaker 1: what you just said is the big critique of talking

1135
01:02:52,240 --> 01:02:55,960
Speaker 1: about hunting ethics. It isn't it isn't a rule. It's

1136
01:02:56,000 --> 01:02:58,240
Speaker 1: just a way to act, a way to aspire, a

1137
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:01,040
Speaker 1: way to understand kind of how you move through this

1138
01:03:01,160 --> 01:03:04,760
Speaker 1: thing where you're taking another things life. Um, and so

1139
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:07,560
Speaker 1: the critique is just what you said is hunting ethics

1140
01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:10,960
Speaker 1: is just these ideas that never get anywhere, these questions

1141
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:14,200
Speaker 1: that don't have answers. But um, what struck me about

1142
01:03:14,200 --> 01:03:17,080
Speaker 1: what you say and what stoicism says is that you

1143
01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:20,600
Speaker 1: can be you can use those as as kind of

1144
01:03:20,600 --> 01:03:23,280
Speaker 1: ways to shape how you act and what you aspire

1145
01:03:23,320 --> 01:03:26,080
Speaker 1: to be, which which I think brings a full circle. Yeah,

1146
01:03:26,240 --> 01:03:28,880
Speaker 1: like the sort of four vertues. So instead of there

1147
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:32,240
Speaker 1: being like, you know, ten commandments of Stoicism or like

1148
01:03:32,640 --> 01:03:35,680
Speaker 1: this is allowed, but this isn't allowed. You know that

1149
01:03:35,760 --> 01:03:38,320
Speaker 1: there's no Bible of Stoicism. There's really just like a

1150
01:03:38,360 --> 01:03:41,480
Speaker 1: bunch of people who are sort of talking and then

1151
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,800
Speaker 1: also living by example. But the sort of four virtues

1152
01:03:44,840 --> 01:03:48,840
Speaker 1: of Stoicism, you know, and I think they connect really

1153
01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:52,680
Speaker 1: well with with hunting. The four virtues are courage, uh,

1154
01:03:52,880 --> 01:03:58,520
Speaker 1: moderation or temperance, um, justice, and wisdom. So it's sort

1155
01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:01,680
Speaker 1: of like, you know, it's b avery, it's you know,

1156
01:04:01,880 --> 01:04:05,760
Speaker 1: being sort of ethical and fair and just. It's you know,

1157
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:09,520
Speaker 1: sort of finding balance, not taking more than your share.

1158
01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:12,320
Speaker 1: And then and then finally it's sort of integrating this

1159
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:16,040
Speaker 1: into sort of wisdom and knowledge and education. And like,

1160
01:04:16,640 --> 01:04:18,960
Speaker 1: those sort of four ideas are kind of always an

1161
01:04:18,960 --> 01:04:22,160
Speaker 1: attention or a balance with each other because you know,

1162
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:27,760
Speaker 1: sometimes yes, courage is great, but courage you know, aimed

1163
01:04:27,800 --> 01:04:32,360
Speaker 1: at the wrong goal is is not very wise and

1164
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:35,400
Speaker 1: it's not very admirable right or or sort of courage

1165
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:40,440
Speaker 1: taken to excess, so taken out of moderation suddenly you know,

1166
01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:44,840
Speaker 1: becomes you know, not again not wise and not fair.

1167
01:04:44,880 --> 01:04:48,000
Speaker 1: So it's those sort of four things are what the

1168
01:04:48,080 --> 01:04:52,439
Speaker 1: sort of stoic are trying to think about and balance always, yeah,

1169
01:04:52,440 --> 01:04:55,520
Speaker 1: and in some of my readings about in your book

1170
01:04:55,560 --> 01:04:58,520
Speaker 1: and then just poking around about stoicism, it's, you know,

1171
01:04:58,680 --> 01:05:01,920
Speaker 1: we're social beings and the path to happiness is found

1172
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:05,600
Speaker 1: in these accepting the moments as they come right, the

1173
01:05:06,240 --> 01:05:09,360
Speaker 1: accepting what happens to us, understanding that while there is

1174
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:12,400
Speaker 1: randomness and things, existential things we can't control, or external

1175
01:05:12,400 --> 01:05:14,600
Speaker 1: things we can't control, accept them and move through them.

1176
01:05:14,720 --> 01:05:16,880
Speaker 1: And that's what that's a huge part of this, and

1177
01:05:16,880 --> 01:05:21,240
Speaker 1: that's hunting totally. Yeah, so Epictetus it was a slave.

1178
01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:24,280
Speaker 1: So your Marcus really said the empery of Epictitius slaves

1179
01:05:24,280 --> 01:05:27,800
Speaker 1: serve two big figures. But Epictitius goes like, look, the

1180
01:05:27,880 --> 01:05:29,640
Speaker 1: first thing we have to do in life is like

1181
01:05:30,280 --> 01:05:32,760
Speaker 1: what's up to us? What's not up to us? And

1182
01:05:32,800 --> 01:05:34,920
Speaker 1: so the stoke it's it's kind of this idea of like, oh,

1183
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:37,960
Speaker 1: look I don't control a lot of what happens, but

1184
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:41,200
Speaker 1: I do control how I respond. And so the decision

1185
01:05:41,200 --> 01:05:44,840
Speaker 1: to focus on how I respond it's not really being reactive.

1186
01:05:44,880 --> 01:05:47,000
Speaker 1: I think that's too simple, but it's the idea is

1187
01:05:47,080 --> 01:05:48,720
Speaker 1: like I'm not going to spend a lot of time

1188
01:05:48,800 --> 01:05:51,520
Speaker 1: wishing things were otherwise. I'm definitely not gonna waste any

1189
01:05:51,520 --> 01:05:54,720
Speaker 1: time complaining. I'm just going to focus always on what

1190
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:59,360
Speaker 1: I can do, like what's up to me? Um is

1191
01:05:59,360 --> 01:06:01,880
Speaker 1: is again, think just a much better way to go

1192
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:04,320
Speaker 1: through life. And it's a very practical way to go

1193
01:06:04,400 --> 01:06:07,160
Speaker 1: through life. Yeah, and reading a lot of this, there

1194
01:06:07,280 --> 01:06:11,240
Speaker 1: is a direct connection between stoicism and viewing the natural world.

1195
01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:14,480
Speaker 1: And we talked about that a lot here, about how

1196
01:06:14,680 --> 01:06:17,320
Speaker 1: hunting and going outside helps us understand the natural world.

1197
01:06:17,400 --> 01:06:18,720
Speaker 1: We can have a better view of it and a

1198
01:06:18,760 --> 01:06:22,000
Speaker 1: better understanding, we can value it in a real way. Um.

1199
01:06:22,000 --> 01:06:24,120
Speaker 1: And I kept running to running into that as I'm

1200
01:06:24,160 --> 01:06:27,720
Speaker 1: reading your stuff and thinking about the connections here, um,

1201
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:30,480
Speaker 1: talk about how how the natural world kind of connects

1202
01:06:30,520 --> 01:06:34,240
Speaker 1: to stoicism. Wells one one of my favorite quotes from

1203
01:06:34,240 --> 01:06:36,160
Speaker 1: from Seneca, and I think this is sort of a

1204
01:06:36,200 --> 01:06:38,920
Speaker 1: sort of critical part of stoicism. You know, he says,

1205
01:06:39,160 --> 01:06:41,960
Speaker 1: you know, all the world is a temple of the gods,

1206
01:06:42,440 --> 01:06:46,320
Speaker 1: and so it's it's you know, seeing sort of nature

1207
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:51,360
Speaker 1: as this kind of majestic um magical thing that that

1208
01:06:51,520 --> 01:06:55,120
Speaker 1: sort of inherently humbles you. I think is really important. So,

1209
01:06:55,440 --> 01:06:57,120
Speaker 1: you know, I think part of what the Stokes are

1210
01:06:57,160 --> 01:07:01,040
Speaker 1: focusing on it is is sort of not deluding yourself

1211
01:07:01,120 --> 01:07:05,040
Speaker 1: about where you exist inside the universe. You know that

1212
01:07:05,040 --> 01:07:09,560
Speaker 1: that that we are very small things and yet um,

1213
01:07:09,600 --> 01:07:13,000
Speaker 1: we are also part of something larger. At the same time,

1214
01:07:13,080 --> 01:07:15,000
Speaker 1: you know, so Marcus really sucks a lot about sort

1215
01:07:15,000 --> 01:07:17,880
Speaker 1: of looking up at the stars and sort of imagining

1216
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:19,800
Speaker 1: yourself as like, you know, sort of part of this

1217
01:07:20,200 --> 01:07:23,640
Speaker 1: giant cosmos which we are. I think for me, when

1218
01:07:23,680 --> 01:07:25,600
Speaker 1: I when I go outside, whether it's hunting or the

1219
01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:27,200
Speaker 1: you know, the sort of walk I take with my

1220
01:07:27,280 --> 01:07:32,240
Speaker 1: kids every morning, it there's just something sort of reassuring

1221
01:07:32,320 --> 01:07:36,720
Speaker 1: and comforting but also inspiring and humbling all at the

1222
01:07:36,800 --> 01:07:40,200
Speaker 1: same time from you know, watching the sunrise or watching

1223
01:07:40,200 --> 01:07:43,320
Speaker 1: the sunset, or you know, looking at an old growth

1224
01:07:43,360 --> 01:07:45,880
Speaker 1: forest or whatever happens to me. It's it's sort of

1225
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:50,280
Speaker 1: finding that connection to nature as as sort of a

1226
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:55,520
Speaker 1: critical philosophical exercise. Now that's that's that's great. Then you

1227
01:07:55,560 --> 01:07:57,919
Speaker 1: just just mentioned you take a walk with your kids

1228
01:07:57,960 --> 01:07:59,360
Speaker 1: every morning. Can you tell us a little bit about

1229
01:07:59,400 --> 01:08:02,080
Speaker 1: that or what the what's the what's the meaning? So

1230
01:08:02,160 --> 01:08:05,760
Speaker 1: every morning, so like this morning, Um, we woke up

1231
01:08:05,800 --> 01:08:08,240
Speaker 1: around six thirty. You know, my wife wakes me up,

1232
01:08:08,280 --> 01:08:10,360
Speaker 1: She hands me both kids and she basically says like

1233
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:14,440
Speaker 1: get out of here, uh, and she catches up on

1234
01:08:14,440 --> 01:08:17,439
Speaker 1: on sleep. So we we we live. We spend most

1235
01:08:17,439 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 1: of her time out in the country, so we sort

1236
01:08:19,160 --> 01:08:21,160
Speaker 1: of we're on this dirt road and we just go

1237
01:08:21,240 --> 01:08:23,439
Speaker 1: up and down the dirt road. I usually carry one

1238
01:08:23,479 --> 01:08:26,160
Speaker 1: and the sort of baby carrier and then the others

1239
01:08:26,160 --> 01:08:28,680
Speaker 1: in the stroller and we and we we walk. We'll

1240
01:08:28,720 --> 01:08:31,560
Speaker 1: do sometimes, you know, as many as three or four miles.

1241
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:35,080
Speaker 1: I don't take a phone with me. It's it's it's

1242
01:08:35,160 --> 01:08:39,360
Speaker 1: just it's it's just the walk, you know. Um. And

1243
01:08:39,360 --> 01:08:41,720
Speaker 1: and it's it's being outside. You know. This morning we

1244
01:08:42,040 --> 01:08:45,200
Speaker 1: watched the deer, we saw a rabbit. You know, my

1245
01:08:45,400 --> 01:08:49,160
Speaker 1: kids love it. It's fun, exciting, and and we watched

1246
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:50,680
Speaker 1: the sun come up. You know. When we leave the

1247
01:08:50,680 --> 01:08:53,519
Speaker 1: house it's it's sort of still a little bit dark.

1248
01:08:53,640 --> 01:08:55,400
Speaker 1: And by the time we come home and are ready

1249
01:08:55,439 --> 01:08:59,760
Speaker 1: for breakfast, it's, um, you know, it's it's uh, it's

1250
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:03,200
Speaker 1: it bright and and nice out. Although I will say

1251
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:05,320
Speaker 1: you so a couple of couple of weeks ago, I

1252
01:09:05,400 --> 01:09:08,240
Speaker 1: was walking down the one of the dirt road sturt

1253
01:09:08,320 --> 01:09:10,559
Speaker 1: near the back of my property, and I could see

1254
01:09:10,640 --> 01:09:13,000
Speaker 1: on my on my neighbor's property that she had a

1255
01:09:13,920 --> 01:09:16,559
Speaker 1: that there was a big thing of hogs back there.

1256
01:09:16,880 --> 01:09:18,920
Speaker 1: And I actually had my phone on me that morning

1257
01:09:18,920 --> 01:09:21,400
Speaker 1: because I was expecting something, and so I texted her.

1258
01:09:21,400 --> 01:09:23,000
Speaker 1: I was like, hey, like, you have a bunch of

1259
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:25,760
Speaker 1: hogs back here. Um. And she was like please, like,

1260
01:09:26,120 --> 01:09:28,000
Speaker 1: you know, to take care of it if you can.

1261
01:09:28,439 --> 01:09:29,880
Speaker 1: And so I was like, you know, a mile and

1262
01:09:29,920 --> 01:09:32,240
Speaker 1: a half from my house at this point, and obviously

1263
01:09:32,280 --> 01:09:35,360
Speaker 1: do not take a rifle with me on a children.

1264
01:09:35,520 --> 01:09:38,240
Speaker 1: So um, it was like how quickly could I get

1265
01:09:38,280 --> 01:09:39,920
Speaker 1: back to the house, you know? So it takes about

1266
01:09:40,000 --> 01:09:42,160
Speaker 1: ted fifty minutes to get back to the house. Um.

1267
01:09:42,520 --> 01:09:45,360
Speaker 1: Dry Like I basically returned the favor to my wife.

1268
01:09:45,400 --> 01:09:49,799
Speaker 1: I'm like, here, you take them. Uh. I grabbed my my,

1269
01:09:49,800 --> 01:09:52,120
Speaker 1: my dear rifle. I threw it in the you know,

1270
01:09:52,160 --> 01:09:54,559
Speaker 1: the front seat of the car. I drove as close

1271
01:09:54,600 --> 01:09:57,120
Speaker 1: as I could because it's sort of back in this thing. Uh,

1272
01:09:57,160 --> 01:09:59,479
Speaker 1: as close as I could. I start shimmying under a

1273
01:09:59,520 --> 01:10:04,080
Speaker 1: barbed wire fence. Um. This lady's mom who has a

1274
01:10:04,120 --> 01:10:06,320
Speaker 1: house in the property. She she freaks out because she

1275
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:08,320
Speaker 1: sees someone like going through her fence with a rifle.

1276
01:10:08,360 --> 01:10:10,320
Speaker 1: So I have to reassure her that I'm not like

1277
01:10:10,400 --> 01:10:13,439
Speaker 1: about to come and murder her. Um. And then I

1278
01:10:13,800 --> 01:10:17,240
Speaker 1: started tracking tracking these hogs and I probably follow them

1279
01:10:17,240 --> 01:10:19,519
Speaker 1: back like a mile. I had to go under a

1280
01:10:19,520 --> 01:10:23,240
Speaker 1: couple other fences. Uh. And then and then I got

1281
01:10:23,520 --> 01:10:26,000
Speaker 1: a decent size one maybe like two hundred pounds um.

1282
01:10:26,479 --> 01:10:28,680
Speaker 1: And then it was like, uh, you know, because it's

1283
01:10:28,720 --> 01:10:31,080
Speaker 1: a hog in this case and it was too far

1284
01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:33,240
Speaker 1: from my property. I was like, you know, this one's

1285
01:10:33,280 --> 01:10:36,880
Speaker 1: just for the birds. But but you know, it was

1286
01:10:36,960 --> 01:10:39,800
Speaker 1: like it was so weird getting back to my house,

1287
01:10:39,880 --> 01:10:43,000
Speaker 1: being like, was this really like my my morning? Like

1288
01:10:43,120 --> 01:10:45,120
Speaker 1: you know, I grew up in the southern in the

1289
01:10:45,120 --> 01:10:48,720
Speaker 1: suburbs of California, like, did not go hunting as a kid,

1290
01:10:49,240 --> 01:10:51,920
Speaker 1: like did did did not even really imagine that I

1291
01:10:51,920 --> 01:10:54,920
Speaker 1: would ever have kids. So the idea that like, you know,

1292
01:10:55,280 --> 01:11:00,160
Speaker 1: flash forward now and I'm I'm walking my kids and

1293
01:11:00,240 --> 01:11:02,160
Speaker 1: having to take a break from it to go hog

1294
01:11:02,200 --> 01:11:04,080
Speaker 1: hunting in the middle of the country. Like it was

1295
01:11:04,120 --> 01:11:06,040
Speaker 1: sort of one of those moments where you're like, I

1296
01:11:06,040 --> 01:11:09,559
Speaker 1: guess this is my life now, but but you know,

1297
01:11:09,600 --> 01:11:11,559
Speaker 1: it's it's just one of those experiences. And like I

1298
01:11:11,560 --> 01:11:15,120
Speaker 1: was saying, it's like that that was one of the

1299
01:11:15,120 --> 01:11:18,400
Speaker 1: most engaged mornings that I've had in a long time.

1300
01:11:18,479 --> 01:11:21,800
Speaker 1: And and you know, the sort of rush and then

1301
01:11:21,880 --> 01:11:26,200
Speaker 1: also sort of focus and presence that I brought, you know,

1302
01:11:26,320 --> 01:11:28,200
Speaker 1: to my work, and when I sat down to write

1303
01:11:28,240 --> 01:11:31,040
Speaker 1: later that morning, was like, uh, you know, it was

1304
01:11:31,400 --> 01:11:33,720
Speaker 1: a great place to come from. Yeah, it's gonna be

1305
01:11:33,720 --> 01:11:37,000
Speaker 1: able to recognize that right in yourself. Um. I imagine

1306
01:11:37,000 --> 01:11:39,800
Speaker 1: with what you've done and the things you've studied, you're

1307
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:43,640
Speaker 1: able to see kind of what value things bring to

1308
01:11:43,680 --> 01:11:46,120
Speaker 1: your life and to your professional work, into your family life,

1309
01:11:46,280 --> 01:11:49,160
Speaker 1: and then apply it, uh in a really efficient way.

1310
01:11:49,200 --> 01:11:51,080
Speaker 1: It sounds like you do. Yeah, I mean every time

1311
01:11:51,120 --> 01:11:54,320
Speaker 1: every time I hunt. I think if you've probably read

1312
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:57,479
Speaker 1: then in the Art of Archery, you know, I like,

1313
01:11:57,600 --> 01:12:00,599
Speaker 1: I'm thinking it's like, oh, this you when he talks

1314
01:12:00,600 --> 01:12:03,439
Speaker 1: about sort of um, you know, letting, letting the arrow

1315
01:12:03,560 --> 01:12:06,320
Speaker 1: fly sort of from you know, it's it's like it's

1316
01:12:06,360 --> 01:12:10,480
Speaker 1: like like ripe fruit falling from the from the tree. Um.

1317
01:12:10,520 --> 01:12:13,680
Speaker 1: You know. Like so it's you read something that's sort

1318
01:12:13,720 --> 01:12:17,120
Speaker 1: of philosophical, are abstract, but then you get opportunities to

1319
01:12:17,160 --> 01:12:20,320
Speaker 1: apply it and so you know, it's it's I think

1320
01:12:20,600 --> 01:12:22,360
Speaker 1: one of the one of the things I've taken from

1321
01:12:22,439 --> 01:12:24,320
Speaker 1: hunting that's been good for me and the rest of

1322
01:12:24,360 --> 01:12:26,639
Speaker 1: my life is going like, okay, so you get that

1323
01:12:26,680 --> 01:12:28,880
Speaker 1: surge of adrenaline. You know, you get that rush, you

1324
01:12:29,240 --> 01:12:31,880
Speaker 1: see it, you know you're you can you can get it.

1325
01:12:31,920 --> 01:12:35,000
Speaker 1: You're a little nervous or shaking even, and and the

1326
01:12:35,040 --> 01:12:37,439
Speaker 1: idea that like, Okay, this is what my body is doing.

1327
01:12:38,000 --> 01:12:41,080
Speaker 1: But now my mind and my training have to take over,

1328
01:12:41,680 --> 01:12:44,880
Speaker 1: and I have to I have to compensate for this

1329
01:12:44,960 --> 01:12:47,800
Speaker 1: sort of surge, and I have to adjust for I'm

1330
01:12:47,800 --> 01:12:49,719
Speaker 1: not going to be able to do what I need

1331
01:12:49,760 --> 01:12:52,720
Speaker 1: to do here. That, to me, like, that's really one

1332
01:12:52,720 --> 01:12:56,080
Speaker 1: of the sort of core elements of stoicism. They're like, look,

1333
01:12:56,439 --> 01:13:00,040
Speaker 1: no amount of no amount of training takes away the

1334
01:13:00,120 --> 01:13:03,080
Speaker 1: fact that you'll feel cold, or you'll feel tired, or

1335
01:13:03,120 --> 01:13:06,080
Speaker 1: you'll feel scared, or any of the sort of biological

1336
01:13:06,160 --> 01:13:11,080
Speaker 1: or hormonal reactions we have. But your training does put

1337
01:13:11,080 --> 01:13:14,559
Speaker 1: you in a position to not be ruled by those things,

1338
01:13:14,960 --> 01:13:18,000
Speaker 1: you know, to be able to sort of compensate for them,

1339
01:13:18,080 --> 01:13:20,639
Speaker 1: or anticipate for them, or adjust for them. And so

1340
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:23,880
Speaker 1: every time I go hunting, to me, it's just like, yeah,

1341
01:13:23,880 --> 01:13:26,639
Speaker 1: I can, can I can I calm myself down here

1342
01:13:26,640 --> 01:13:30,040
Speaker 1: in the moment? Can I not get excited? Because getting excited,

1343
01:13:30,120 --> 01:13:32,240
Speaker 1: doesn't you know, make this hard thing I'm about to

1344
01:13:32,280 --> 01:13:35,360
Speaker 1: do easier. You know, how can I how can I

1345
01:13:35,360 --> 01:13:38,640
Speaker 1: get into a place where there You know, there's this

1346
01:13:38,680 --> 01:13:40,840
Speaker 1: idea when you hear that word stock that it means

1347
01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:44,280
Speaker 1: like has no emotions. That's actually not what stoicism is

1348
01:13:44,320 --> 01:13:46,880
Speaker 1: about at all. It's it's really, they say, sort of

1349
01:13:46,920 --> 01:13:50,559
Speaker 1: the domestication of our emotions. It's the control of our

1350
01:13:50,600 --> 01:13:56,080
Speaker 1: emotions in situations where we need that control. That's like

1351
01:13:56,240 --> 01:13:58,400
Speaker 1: what we're trying to work towards as a as a

1352
01:13:58,439 --> 01:14:01,960
Speaker 1: hunter or as a philosopher. Yeah, that's great. I mean

1353
01:14:02,640 --> 01:14:05,320
Speaker 1: there's so many connections. Like I said, the hall hunting

1354
01:14:05,360 --> 01:14:09,439
Speaker 1: connection of Marcus Raylius is I think a very timely

1355
01:14:09,479 --> 01:14:12,240
Speaker 1: one and connects all these things together. But we should

1356
01:14:12,240 --> 01:14:15,040
Speaker 1: go back and and talk about how you discovered this

1357
01:14:15,280 --> 01:14:17,920
Speaker 1: and what it should change your life. And I've heard

1358
01:14:17,960 --> 01:14:21,320
Speaker 1: you tell his story you were nineteen years old. One

1359
01:14:21,360 --> 01:14:23,559
Speaker 1: thing that was really interesting to me was that was

1360
01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:25,600
Speaker 1: the idea of a quake book, because I have my

1361
01:14:25,640 --> 01:14:29,080
Speaker 1: own quick book and we've talked about that idea without

1362
01:14:29,520 --> 01:14:32,519
Speaker 1: uh saying that term. So can you give people take

1363
01:14:32,560 --> 01:14:36,240
Speaker 1: everybody back before he knew much about this and how

1364
01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:38,599
Speaker 1: it was introduced to you. You're nineteen years old, Yeah,

1365
01:14:38,600 --> 01:14:42,040
Speaker 1: I was. I was nineteen, and I was I was

1366
01:14:42,080 --> 01:14:44,040
Speaker 1: in college. I was writing for the college newspaper and

1367
01:14:44,040 --> 01:14:47,479
Speaker 1: I got invited to this conference in Los Angeles, and

1368
01:14:47,479 --> 01:14:52,519
Speaker 1: and Dr Drew, the radio host and TV personality, was there.

1369
01:14:52,880 --> 01:14:55,840
Speaker 1: And I remember I love Love Line growing up. I would,

1370
01:14:55,880 --> 01:14:57,720
Speaker 1: you know, listen to it every night from ten to

1371
01:14:57,760 --> 01:15:01,000
Speaker 1: midnight on the West Coast from a middle school on

1372
01:15:01,560 --> 01:15:03,439
Speaker 1: I'm not sure my parents knew that I was listening

1373
01:15:03,439 --> 01:15:07,000
Speaker 1: to it, but I definitely was. And and so I

1374
01:15:07,600 --> 01:15:09,920
Speaker 1: remember that Dr Drew was always kind of like talking

1375
01:15:09,960 --> 01:15:11,639
Speaker 1: about books that he read, and he just he seemed

1376
01:15:11,640 --> 01:15:13,679
Speaker 1: like a really smart person. And so after the event,

1377
01:15:13,720 --> 01:15:16,200
Speaker 1: I just said, hey, you know, I'm just curious, like,

1378
01:15:16,240 --> 01:15:18,639
Speaker 1: what what books are you reading? Are you reading anything interesting?

1379
01:15:18,680 --> 01:15:23,840
Speaker 1: And he recommended Epictetus. He also recommended um Edmund Morris's

1380
01:15:23,880 --> 01:15:27,519
Speaker 1: biography of Theodore Roosevelt, The Rise of Theodore Roosevelt, which

1381
01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:30,000
Speaker 1: is like an incredible book that I also really recommend.

1382
01:15:30,439 --> 01:15:33,360
Speaker 1: But I went back to my hotel, I bought Epictetus,

1383
01:15:33,400 --> 01:15:36,120
Speaker 1: I bought Marcus Aurealis, and I bought this Theodore Roosevelt book,

1384
01:15:36,680 --> 01:15:39,640
Speaker 1: and they that, you know, they came a few you know,

1385
01:15:39,720 --> 01:15:42,800
Speaker 1: weeks later, days later, I forget what it was. And

1386
01:15:42,800 --> 01:15:46,760
Speaker 1: and yeah, this term quake book comes from the economist

1387
01:15:46,760 --> 01:15:49,040
Speaker 1: Tyler Cowen. He says, like, you know, sometimes you read

1388
01:15:49,080 --> 01:15:50,600
Speaker 1: a book and it just sort of shakes you, like

1389
01:15:50,640 --> 01:15:53,280
Speaker 1: an earthquake. It just like, you know, sort of tosses

1390
01:15:53,320 --> 01:15:57,479
Speaker 1: you sideways. And that's what That's what reading Marcus Realist

1391
01:15:57,600 --> 01:15:59,599
Speaker 1: was for me. It was just like, holy sh it,

1392
01:16:00,040 --> 01:16:02,559
Speaker 1: you know, this is not what I thought philosophy was.

1393
01:16:02,680 --> 01:16:04,599
Speaker 1: This is the kind of advice that I always wanted

1394
01:16:04,640 --> 01:16:06,160
Speaker 1: to get from my dad. You know, this is the

1395
01:16:06,200 --> 01:16:08,480
Speaker 1: kind of advice that I wanted to get from anyone,

1396
01:16:08,680 --> 01:16:11,880
Speaker 1: any adult figure in my life. Um but I just

1397
01:16:12,000 --> 01:16:15,960
Speaker 1: never gotten and and so yeah, it totally you know,

1398
01:16:16,320 --> 01:16:17,680
Speaker 1: it was I think a couple of things. It was

1399
01:16:17,720 --> 01:16:21,839
Speaker 1: the decision to ask for recommendation. It was the decision

1400
01:16:21,880 --> 01:16:25,400
Speaker 1: to actually read said book, and which you know a

1401
01:16:25,479 --> 01:16:27,599
Speaker 1: lot of people I get emails all the time, people like, oh,

1402
01:16:27,680 --> 01:16:30,160
Speaker 1: you know, what book do you recommend? You know, probably

1403
01:16:30,160 --> 01:16:32,200
Speaker 1: only ten percent of the time do I ever hear

1404
01:16:32,280 --> 01:16:34,120
Speaker 1: from those people that they you know, they took the

1405
01:16:34,200 --> 01:16:37,120
Speaker 1: time to read the book. Um, but taking the time

1406
01:16:37,120 --> 01:16:38,920
Speaker 1: to read the book and then just sort of right place,

1407
01:16:39,080 --> 01:16:41,920
Speaker 1: right time. It was just everything you know, that I

1408
01:16:41,960 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 1: needed and and I actually I saw Dr Drew in

1409
01:16:44,840 --> 01:16:47,920
Speaker 1: Los Angeles last week. It's been this sort of incredible

1410
01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:50,680
Speaker 1: sort of blessing of my career that I sort of

1411
01:16:50,680 --> 01:16:52,840
Speaker 1: got to become friends after the fact with the person

1412
01:16:52,880 --> 01:16:56,000
Speaker 1: who you know, this chance encounter ended up changing changing

1413
01:16:56,080 --> 01:16:59,759
Speaker 1: my life. But I think everyone can think of books

1414
01:16:59,760 --> 01:17:03,759
Speaker 1: that they've read that they were not the same person

1415
01:17:03,880 --> 01:17:06,040
Speaker 1: when they finished it as they were when they started.

1416
01:17:06,439 --> 01:17:09,040
Speaker 1: I think the problem is those books are really rare,

1417
01:17:09,160 --> 01:17:11,639
Speaker 1: and we don't kind of actively seek them out when

1418
01:17:11,640 --> 01:17:14,040
Speaker 1: we should be. Yeah, we talked about that here. The

1419
01:17:14,040 --> 01:17:16,360
Speaker 1: book for me. That book for me was UM out

1420
01:17:16,360 --> 01:17:19,680
Speaker 1: of Leopold's Sant County Almanac. And there's a lot of

1421
01:17:19,760 --> 01:17:24,200
Speaker 1: us in our office pass that along. UM. It's a

1422
01:17:24,240 --> 01:17:27,080
Speaker 1: it's just a wonderful thing. It's thinking about the natural world,

1423
01:17:27,080 --> 01:17:30,439
Speaker 1: thinking about conservation. Um Our founder Steve Ronella said that

1424
01:17:30,479 --> 01:17:33,120
Speaker 1: to me sitting on top of a ridge looking at

1425
01:17:33,160 --> 01:17:35,639
Speaker 1: blacktail deer and in Alaska, he said, you you find

1426
01:17:35,680 --> 01:17:37,760
Speaker 1: these things, he said, you know, he said something to

1427
01:17:37,760 --> 01:17:40,599
Speaker 1: me like read the entire works of Cormac McCarthy and

1428
01:17:40,600 --> 01:17:43,200
Speaker 1: read the entire works of Auld and you will find

1429
01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:47,479
Speaker 1: something about yourself that you didn't know. Um. And when

1430
01:17:47,520 --> 01:17:49,600
Speaker 1: I was was listening to you tell that story, I

1431
01:17:49,640 --> 01:17:51,320
Speaker 1: was thinking of that moment in my life, like, man,

1432
01:17:51,360 --> 01:17:54,040
Speaker 1: this is if we could if if your work which

1433
01:17:54,080 --> 01:17:56,080
Speaker 1: I think your work does at least did for me

1434
01:17:56,120 --> 01:17:59,000
Speaker 1: a little bit, like it starts to steer your way

1435
01:17:59,040 --> 01:18:01,320
Speaker 1: of thinking in a pose of direction, you know, at

1436
01:18:01,400 --> 01:18:05,080
Speaker 1: least in a critical direction. Um that those could be

1437
01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:07,400
Speaker 1: important moments of life. So that could be a podcast

1438
01:18:07,479 --> 01:18:10,320
Speaker 1: or a book, or your newsletter or what it might be.

1439
01:18:10,760 --> 01:18:12,960
Speaker 1: But it's a it's a pretty beautiful thing to be

1440
01:18:13,040 --> 01:18:15,360
Speaker 1: able to recognize that and then go forward and try

1441
01:18:15,400 --> 01:18:18,559
Speaker 1: to get that for people. Yeah, and I mean ever

1442
01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:21,280
Speaker 1: since that, I think one of the reasons people don't

1443
01:18:21,280 --> 01:18:24,200
Speaker 1: read enough is like I think they haven't that they

1444
01:18:24,240 --> 01:18:27,080
Speaker 1: don't quite understand the r O I. So like, you know, teachers,

1445
01:18:27,360 --> 01:18:28,960
Speaker 1: you know, they're like, you should read because that's what

1446
01:18:29,040 --> 01:18:31,840
Speaker 1: smart people do. What they what they do, what they

1447
01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:34,519
Speaker 1: should be saying is like you know, they should be

1448
01:18:34,560 --> 01:18:37,400
Speaker 1: thinking individually, like what's a book that will really impact

1449
01:18:37,479 --> 01:18:40,040
Speaker 1: this person? So then they walk away, you know, sort

1450
01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:43,360
Speaker 1: of haven't been shown rather than told, you know, the

1451
01:18:43,439 --> 01:18:46,200
Speaker 1: sort of power of a book or a page or

1452
01:18:46,200 --> 01:18:48,400
Speaker 1: a sentence. I mean, I remember when I was reading

1453
01:18:48,479 --> 01:18:52,800
Speaker 1: Steve's book American Buffalo, Like I probably think like once

1454
01:18:52,840 --> 01:18:55,880
Speaker 1: a month about a passage in that book. You know.

1455
01:18:55,960 --> 01:18:59,240
Speaker 1: He's he's like walking through wherever, wherever he is, and

1456
01:18:59,240 --> 01:19:03,080
Speaker 1: he comes across some like old buffalo skull or some

1457
01:19:03,200 --> 01:19:06,040
Speaker 1: animal skull, and he picks it up and he sort

1458
01:19:06,040 --> 01:19:08,760
Speaker 1: of holds it and he just starts He's like, how

1459
01:19:08,760 --> 01:19:10,240
Speaker 1: old is this? You know, I think it was like

1460
01:19:10,280 --> 01:19:11,760
Speaker 1: fossilized or something. It's like, you know, this is like

1461
01:19:11,800 --> 01:19:14,120
Speaker 1: a thousand years old or something. And and he's like,

1462
01:19:14,200 --> 01:19:16,960
Speaker 1: you know, who is the person that shot this? You know,

1463
01:19:16,960 --> 01:19:19,360
Speaker 1: who is the person that held this? And he's like

1464
01:19:19,640 --> 01:19:22,000
Speaker 1: what was going through that person's mind? You know, He's

1465
01:19:22,040 --> 01:19:23,679
Speaker 1: like I think he says, like what were their thoughts

1466
01:19:23,720 --> 01:19:26,439
Speaker 1: about God? You know, and just the idea that this

1467
01:19:26,560 --> 01:19:29,200
Speaker 1: is a very stoic concept that like human beings are

1468
01:19:29,280 --> 01:19:32,280
Speaker 1: human beings and have been more or less the same

1469
01:19:32,280 --> 01:19:35,679
Speaker 1: way for all of history, and that we are connected

1470
01:19:35,720 --> 01:19:37,960
Speaker 1: with those people that were the descendants of those people.

1471
01:19:38,240 --> 01:19:41,639
Speaker 1: To me, it's like a deeply philosophical and life changing

1472
01:19:41,760 --> 01:19:45,120
Speaker 1: insight that you know when when I heard for the

1473
01:19:45,160 --> 01:19:47,320
Speaker 1: first time, it's sort of it. It s took me

1474
01:19:47,360 --> 01:19:50,080
Speaker 1: a little bit or it changed what I what I thought,

1475
01:19:50,160 --> 01:19:53,240
Speaker 1: and then it's it's about not just I think. This

1476
01:19:53,360 --> 01:19:55,160
Speaker 1: is something people do wrong with reading, is they'll read

1477
01:19:55,160 --> 01:19:56,960
Speaker 1: a book one time and oh, yeah, it was pretty good.

1478
01:19:57,240 --> 01:20:00,360
Speaker 1: But it's actually the process of reading and re eating

1479
01:20:00,400 --> 01:20:03,639
Speaker 1: and dipping in and out and applying and coming back

1480
01:20:03,680 --> 01:20:06,280
Speaker 1: to it and you know, over and over again, that's

1481
01:20:06,320 --> 01:20:09,599
Speaker 1: what produces the change. Like you probably read sand County

1482
01:20:09,640 --> 01:20:12,000
Speaker 1: Almanact like a bunch of times, right, Oh yeah, Yeah.

1483
01:20:12,000 --> 01:20:13,920
Speaker 1: There's a couple of books I read every year and

1484
01:20:13,920 --> 01:20:16,680
Speaker 1: and um, I find different things in them every year.

1485
01:20:16,920 --> 01:20:19,280
Speaker 1: And it's there's so many moments in each one of

1486
01:20:19,280 --> 01:20:22,240
Speaker 1: these there these words that are used construct these ideas.

1487
01:20:22,240 --> 01:20:25,040
Speaker 1: There's so many moments if you break them down, their endless. Yeah.

1488
01:20:25,080 --> 01:20:26,880
Speaker 1: And then and and that's something where because really talks

1489
01:20:26,880 --> 01:20:30,280
Speaker 1: about in meditations. He goes and he's quoting Heracleitus, who's

1490
01:20:30,320 --> 01:20:33,439
Speaker 1: this sort of mystic pillet. But you know it's no

1491
01:20:33,520 --> 01:20:36,559
Speaker 1: man steps in the same river twice. You know, the

1492
01:20:36,600 --> 01:20:39,280
Speaker 1: idea that like the river is changing and you are changing.

1493
01:20:39,320 --> 01:20:41,639
Speaker 1: And I think that's one of the beautiful things about

1494
01:20:41,680 --> 01:20:44,360
Speaker 1: books is like, you know, I've I've read epict I

1495
01:20:44,400 --> 01:20:48,920
Speaker 1: was just this morning working on a passage from Epictetus

1496
01:20:48,960 --> 01:20:51,559
Speaker 1: that you know, I I had someone send to me.

1497
01:20:51,600 --> 01:20:53,800
Speaker 1: I was like, hey, doesn't Epictetus say something about some

1498
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:55,920
Speaker 1: you know whatever, And you know, some one of my

1499
01:20:55,960 --> 01:20:57,559
Speaker 1: teams sent it to me and I started digging in

1500
01:20:57,600 --> 01:21:00,920
Speaker 1: on it. It's like I read this past shortly after

1501
01:21:00,960 --> 01:21:03,759
Speaker 1: the conversation that you and I are talking about. Um,

1502
01:21:03,800 --> 01:21:08,720
Speaker 1: you know, so like almost fifteen years ago now and um,

1503
01:21:08,800 --> 01:21:11,519
Speaker 1: and yet here I am still getting something new and

1504
01:21:11,560 --> 01:21:14,719
Speaker 1: different out of a passage I've probably seen twenty times

1505
01:21:14,720 --> 01:21:18,439
Speaker 1: since then because I'm different and what I'm thinking about

1506
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:21,439
Speaker 1: this morning or what I need this morning is different.

1507
01:21:22,080 --> 01:21:24,840
Speaker 1: And and so yeah, I think rereading things every year,

1508
01:21:25,439 --> 01:21:28,479
Speaker 1: or you know, randomly flipping through things, I think it's

1509
01:21:28,520 --> 01:21:30,519
Speaker 1: really important to me. That's It's also when I'm a

1510
01:21:30,520 --> 01:21:32,960
Speaker 1: big sort of believer in a physical library, and and

1511
01:21:33,160 --> 01:21:35,080
Speaker 1: I just moved offices, so all my books are kind

1512
01:21:35,080 --> 01:21:37,519
Speaker 1: of laid out and just like you know, the touching

1513
01:21:37,600 --> 01:21:40,559
Speaker 1: and then being able to go through to random pages

1514
01:21:40,640 --> 01:21:43,439
Speaker 1: or pages that you you folded down is like a

1515
01:21:43,520 --> 01:21:48,800
Speaker 1: really important way of interacting and re interacting with the

1516
01:21:48,880 --> 01:21:51,880
Speaker 1: material and you never know what you'll get out of that. Yeah,

1517
01:21:51,920 --> 01:21:54,599
Speaker 1: it's funny you talk about Steve's book American Buffalo, because

1518
01:21:54,760 --> 01:21:57,679
Speaker 1: I had read it multiple times and then I hadn't

1519
01:21:57,680 --> 01:21:59,080
Speaker 1: read it in some years. I mean, I worked with

1520
01:21:59,080 --> 01:22:02,160
Speaker 1: the guy, we talked, we see each other all the time.

1521
01:22:02,520 --> 01:22:06,400
Speaker 1: But um, he recently went back and and did the

1522
01:22:06,880 --> 01:22:10,120
Speaker 1: audiobook and it too because he loves it to be

1523
01:22:10,160 --> 01:22:12,519
Speaker 1: his voice. I went back and listened to that and

1524
01:22:12,600 --> 01:22:16,280
Speaker 1: he starts talking about civil asation, civilization as a mechanism

1525
01:22:16,360 --> 01:22:18,720
Speaker 1: for us to avoid some of the ugly aspects of

1526
01:22:18,760 --> 01:22:21,200
Speaker 1: life in that book, and that was a moment like, Man,

1527
01:22:21,280 --> 01:22:23,519
Speaker 1: I haven't when I remember the first couple of times

1528
01:22:23,520 --> 01:22:25,479
Speaker 1: it is, I didn't pick up on this. This wasn't

1529
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:27,920
Speaker 1: something that was messaged to me through that. But for

1530
01:22:27,960 --> 01:22:30,320
Speaker 1: some reason listening to the audio book, maybe I was

1531
01:22:30,400 --> 01:22:32,960
Speaker 1: president in that moment where I wasn't at at other times,

1532
01:22:33,520 --> 01:22:36,080
Speaker 1: but it it struck me. So it's I think for

1533
01:22:36,120 --> 01:22:38,559
Speaker 1: all you guys out there that are reading, we talk

1534
01:22:38,600 --> 01:22:40,639
Speaker 1: about a lot of books here. We got a book

1535
01:22:40,640 --> 01:22:44,280
Speaker 1: club that we're starting right now. That's the thing that

1536
01:22:44,439 --> 01:22:46,240
Speaker 1: this idea of a quake book, when I ran into

1537
01:22:46,280 --> 01:22:49,280
Speaker 1: it in one of your talks, Um, I wrote that

1538
01:22:49,320 --> 01:22:51,960
Speaker 1: down in huge I just took a sharpie and wrote

1539
01:22:51,960 --> 01:22:54,479
Speaker 1: that down on a piece of paper and huge capital letters.

1540
01:22:54,560 --> 01:22:57,400
Speaker 1: That I that's that's a great idea and something that

1541
01:22:57,400 --> 01:23:00,880
Speaker 1: you can really grab onto. Yeah, and I think I

1542
01:23:00,880 --> 01:23:02,599
Speaker 1: think that's one of the things that Stokes talked about.

1543
01:23:02,640 --> 01:23:05,160
Speaker 1: They're like, you know, you should linger. He says, you

1544
01:23:05,160 --> 01:23:09,280
Speaker 1: should linger on a small number of master thinkers. So

1545
01:23:09,320 --> 01:23:11,200
Speaker 1: that's the other thing that is people and I love

1546
01:23:11,280 --> 01:23:13,639
Speaker 1: reading and I read a lot, but people read probably

1547
01:23:13,680 --> 01:23:17,799
Speaker 1: too many books as opposed to reading the right books

1548
01:23:18,000 --> 01:23:21,040
Speaker 1: the right number of times. And so yeah, really picking

1549
01:23:21,080 --> 01:23:25,800
Speaker 1: like some sort of life defining philosophy, defining sort of

1550
01:23:25,880 --> 01:23:29,880
Speaker 1: text for you and becoming kind of intimately acquainted with them,

1551
01:23:29,920 --> 01:23:33,080
Speaker 1: I think is is that to me is sort of

1552
01:23:33,360 --> 01:23:36,040
Speaker 1: a better path to wisdom than just like trying to

1553
01:23:36,200 --> 01:23:39,640
Speaker 1: ingest as much trivia as possible. Yeah. I think what

1554
01:23:39,760 --> 01:23:41,960
Speaker 1: you're what you've done in your life, and you know,

1555
01:23:42,080 --> 01:23:44,120
Speaker 1: after I didn't know it was Dr Drew, which I

1556
01:23:44,160 --> 01:23:48,759
Speaker 1: think that's funny of hilarious. I did not. I wouldn't

1557
01:23:48,800 --> 01:23:51,600
Speaker 1: expected that. I watched Love Line when I was was

1558
01:23:51,680 --> 01:23:53,960
Speaker 1: around that age, man, and I would never expected that

1559
01:23:54,000 --> 01:23:55,800
Speaker 1: to be the guy that you met that kind of

1560
01:23:55,880 --> 01:23:58,440
Speaker 1: change things for you. But that's that's an interesting anecdote

1561
01:23:59,120 --> 01:24:03,360
Speaker 1: that when you turn then you drop out of college, um,

1562
01:24:03,439 --> 01:24:05,439
Speaker 1: and you can kind of start on this journey to

1563
01:24:05,479 --> 01:24:08,280
Speaker 1: where you are. Now, what are those what's that moment

1564
01:24:08,320 --> 01:24:10,960
Speaker 1: when you drop out? You you were an apprentice for

1565
01:24:11,000 --> 01:24:14,160
Speaker 1: a guy named Robert Green, So there's there's this moment

1566
01:24:14,200 --> 01:24:17,040
Speaker 1: where you kind of take a different path, Like describe

1567
01:24:17,040 --> 01:24:20,160
Speaker 1: how that that started and then what it became. Yeah,

1568
01:24:20,240 --> 01:24:22,639
Speaker 1: the the question for me. I basically had a job

1569
01:24:23,280 --> 01:24:25,519
Speaker 1: at a at a talent agency in Hollywood that I

1570
01:24:25,560 --> 01:24:28,880
Speaker 1: got over the summer between my sophomore and juniors of college.

1571
01:24:28,920 --> 01:24:31,360
Speaker 1: And then also I met Robert Crean, who's I think

1572
01:24:31,400 --> 01:24:33,280
Speaker 1: one of the best living writers of our time. You

1573
01:24:33,360 --> 01:24:36,920
Speaker 1: wrote The forty Laws of Power. Um. I had this job,

1574
01:24:37,000 --> 01:24:39,200
Speaker 1: you know, working with both of them, and it struck

1575
01:24:39,240 --> 01:24:41,559
Speaker 1: me that it was sort of like, if this is

1576
01:24:41,600 --> 01:24:44,439
Speaker 1: what I had when I graduated from college, I would

1577
01:24:44,479 --> 01:24:48,519
Speaker 1: definitely consider college as huge success. And so you know,

1578
01:24:49,439 --> 01:24:52,240
Speaker 1: the question for me was am I going to quit

1579
01:24:52,360 --> 01:24:55,080
Speaker 1: both these things to go back to school, which is

1580
01:24:55,120 --> 01:24:57,720
Speaker 1: what the choice I was faced with, or am I

1581
01:24:57,760 --> 01:25:01,880
Speaker 1: going to quit school and go do these things? And

1582
01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:03,800
Speaker 1: so for me, it was kind of a choice of like, hey,

1583
01:25:04,080 --> 01:25:06,240
Speaker 1: am I going to study it or am I gonna do?

1584
01:25:06,520 --> 01:25:08,360
Speaker 1: You know, and where am I going to learn more?

1585
01:25:08,400 --> 01:25:10,800
Speaker 1: Like in the real world having experiences, or am I

1586
01:25:10,800 --> 01:25:14,400
Speaker 1: gonna learn more in a classroom from people who who

1587
01:25:14,439 --> 01:25:17,160
Speaker 1: they even the teachers haven't had some of these experiences

1588
01:25:17,160 --> 01:25:20,000
Speaker 1: that I was being offered. So you know, it was terrifying.

1589
01:25:20,160 --> 01:25:22,200
Speaker 1: You know, my parents were not pleased, and you know,

1590
01:25:22,360 --> 01:25:25,799
Speaker 1: it definitely strained our relationship for quite some time. But

1591
01:25:25,800 --> 01:25:28,960
Speaker 1: but I can trace most of the success I've had

1592
01:25:29,000 --> 01:25:31,120
Speaker 1: in my life back to the you know, the decision

1593
01:25:31,120 --> 01:25:33,760
Speaker 1: to take that risk. And so earlier we were talking

1594
01:25:33,760 --> 01:25:36,800
Speaker 1: about sort of bursts of courage, you know, like I

1595
01:25:36,920 --> 01:25:40,880
Speaker 1: made the leap and then like immediately regretted it. It

1596
01:25:41,120 --> 01:25:43,640
Speaker 1: looked like, you know, a bunch of stuff happened, it

1597
01:25:43,680 --> 01:25:45,080
Speaker 1: did not go well. It was sort of that thing

1598
01:25:45,080 --> 01:25:47,479
Speaker 1: and arrested development where it's like, you know, I think

1599
01:25:47,479 --> 01:25:50,280
Speaker 1: I've made a huge mistake. Um, you know, I was

1600
01:25:50,280 --> 01:25:52,519
Speaker 1: pretty convinced, like my life was over and it wasn't

1601
01:25:52,520 --> 01:25:54,519
Speaker 1: gonna work out, and you know, I was an idiot,

1602
01:25:54,560 --> 01:25:56,320
Speaker 1: and you know, why did I quit this good thing

1603
01:25:56,360 --> 01:25:59,200
Speaker 1: I had? But then over over time, you know, it

1604
01:25:59,280 --> 01:26:01,920
Speaker 1: turned out to be be the right thing. And so yeah,

1605
01:26:01,960 --> 01:26:04,479
Speaker 1: we need, you know, we need the courage to to

1606
01:26:04,520 --> 01:26:07,320
Speaker 1: sometimes jump off, you know, jump off the cliff a

1607
01:26:07,360 --> 01:26:11,480
Speaker 1: little bit, and be willing to to try different things. Um.

1608
01:26:11,520 --> 01:26:14,120
Speaker 1: I think, you know, at twenty years old, the idea

1609
01:26:14,200 --> 01:26:16,680
Speaker 1: that like you could go back to school and that

1610
01:26:16,840 --> 01:26:18,920
Speaker 1: you know, losing a year was not a big deal.

1611
01:26:19,479 --> 01:26:22,920
Speaker 1: You know, I didn't. I didn't have the experience to

1612
01:26:23,000 --> 01:26:26,120
Speaker 1: really understand that. In retrospect, it feels a little bit silly,

1613
01:26:26,200 --> 01:26:29,200
Speaker 1: but yeah, definitely one of the one of the better

1614
01:26:29,240 --> 01:26:33,800
Speaker 1: decisions I've made. Yeah that as a father of two

1615
01:26:33,840 --> 01:26:36,880
Speaker 1: young boys myself, I think about that like that. Dude,

1616
01:26:37,080 --> 01:26:39,519
Speaker 1: there is no pre you can't be preordained. You don't

1617
01:26:39,560 --> 01:26:41,519
Speaker 1: have to do this than this, than this, than this.

1618
01:26:41,680 --> 01:26:44,080
Speaker 1: You can you can choose your own path. And I

1619
01:26:44,120 --> 01:26:46,760
Speaker 1: think before you even were understanding that you could. You

1620
01:26:46,760 --> 01:26:49,679
Speaker 1: I mean, you've written ten books, You've i think taught

1621
01:26:49,680 --> 01:26:51,280
Speaker 1: a lot of people about how to deal with life.

1622
01:26:52,240 --> 01:26:54,320
Speaker 1: Before you did all that, you were you kind of

1623
01:26:54,439 --> 01:26:56,479
Speaker 1: chose your own path and I had a bunch of

1624
01:26:56,520 --> 01:26:59,160
Speaker 1: obstacles that you had to kick through? Is there, you

1625
01:26:59,160 --> 01:27:02,400
Speaker 1: know before you wrote the obstacle is the way is

1626
01:27:02,400 --> 01:27:04,840
Speaker 1: Is there a moment that you think of that you

1627
01:27:04,920 --> 01:27:09,200
Speaker 1: overcame that was important? You know? No, not really. I

1628
01:27:09,280 --> 01:27:12,080
Speaker 1: mean I feel very blessed not to have, you know,

1629
01:27:12,120 --> 01:27:13,840
Speaker 1: one of those like, hey, you know, for me, the

1630
01:27:13,880 --> 01:27:16,799
Speaker 1: obstacle was cancer. For you know, for me, the obstacle

1631
01:27:16,960 --> 01:27:19,960
Speaker 1: was you know, being born to a you know, a

1632
01:27:20,000 --> 01:27:23,800
Speaker 1: single mother in poverty as a minority like that. That's

1633
01:27:23,880 --> 01:27:26,840
Speaker 1: not the obstacles that I've faced in my life that,

1634
01:27:26,920 --> 01:27:30,080
Speaker 1: you know, very very blessed to be able to say that.

1635
01:27:30,479 --> 01:27:32,840
Speaker 1: I think what what I wanted to talk about as

1636
01:27:32,880 --> 01:27:35,000
Speaker 1: far as obstacles, and I think this is this is

1637
01:27:35,040 --> 01:27:39,280
Speaker 1: the stoic sort of take on it is that you know,

1638
01:27:39,520 --> 01:27:42,960
Speaker 1: every day ship goes wrong, right like that, Murphy's law

1639
01:27:43,000 --> 01:27:45,920
Speaker 1: is very real. However, we want things to be whatever

1640
01:27:45,960 --> 01:27:48,640
Speaker 1: it would be better. However better it would be, you know,

1641
01:27:48,800 --> 01:27:52,160
Speaker 1: whatever the logical, easiest, simplest way for things to be.

1642
01:27:52,680 --> 01:27:56,320
Speaker 1: That's not really how things shake out in fact, you know,

1643
01:27:56,439 --> 01:28:00,799
Speaker 1: life is an unending series of problems that have to solve.

1644
01:28:01,200 --> 01:28:04,240
Speaker 1: And so when Marcus there really says, you know, says,

1645
01:28:04,240 --> 01:28:06,880
Speaker 1: the impediment to action advances action. What stands in the

1646
01:28:06,880 --> 01:28:09,200
Speaker 1: way becomes a way. That's sort of the quote that

1647
01:28:09,200 --> 01:28:12,599
Speaker 1: I've built the obstacles the way around. And actually it's funny,

1648
01:28:12,640 --> 01:28:15,960
Speaker 1: there's a Zend quote also the obstacles the path. But

1649
01:28:15,960 --> 01:28:19,599
Speaker 1: but it's it's it's this idea that the Stokes are saying, like, look,

1650
01:28:20,439 --> 01:28:23,000
Speaker 1: situations are not going to be the way you want

1651
01:28:23,040 --> 01:28:25,160
Speaker 1: them to be or how you plan them to be,

1652
01:28:25,680 --> 01:28:30,280
Speaker 1: but they still each time that happens, are presenting you

1653
01:28:30,320 --> 01:28:36,400
Speaker 1: with an opportunity to practice excellence. The word arete means

1654
01:28:36,439 --> 01:28:38,559
Speaker 1: excellence is sort of a moral excellence, but also just

1655
01:28:38,680 --> 01:28:43,280
Speaker 1: excellence period. How can you practice excellence? That's that's what

1656
01:28:43,439 --> 01:28:45,240
Speaker 1: I try to do. So, whether it's you know, something

1657
01:28:45,240 --> 01:28:47,360
Speaker 1: that goes wrong in my business, whether it's you know,

1658
01:28:47,400 --> 01:28:50,679
Speaker 1: my computer eating my manuscript, whether it's getting stuck in traffic,

1659
01:28:50,760 --> 01:28:54,120
Speaker 1: or whether it's you know, a toddler that doesn't sleep, Like,

1660
01:28:54,320 --> 01:28:58,520
Speaker 1: how do you respond to you know, just the difficulties

1661
01:28:58,560 --> 01:29:01,439
Speaker 1: of life. To me, that's what the book is about,

1662
01:29:02,560 --> 01:29:05,719
Speaker 1: and there's there's disciplines in Stoke. As you talk about

1663
01:29:05,720 --> 01:29:08,600
Speaker 1: the stoicism, you talk about this a lot um, and

1664
01:29:08,640 --> 01:29:11,040
Speaker 1: I think it's would be helpful people to hear you.

1665
01:29:11,120 --> 01:29:12,760
Speaker 1: I know you've probably done this a million signs. But

1666
01:29:12,880 --> 01:29:15,559
Speaker 1: here you go through these three disciplines a kind of

1667
01:29:15,600 --> 01:29:18,479
Speaker 1: what they mean in a tangible form as you move

1668
01:29:18,560 --> 01:29:20,200
Speaker 1: through life, and how you use them and how others

1669
01:29:20,240 --> 01:29:23,240
Speaker 1: might use them. Um. You know, look, nothing nothing pleases

1670
01:29:23,280 --> 01:29:25,160
Speaker 1: me more than to talk about this stuff. It's because

1671
01:29:25,240 --> 01:29:27,400
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm paying it forward and then also

1672
01:29:27,439 --> 01:29:30,680
Speaker 1: like it's just endlessly fascinating. So I'll give sort of

1673
01:29:30,720 --> 01:29:34,559
Speaker 1: one quote that sort of sums up stoicism. Marcus really says,

1674
01:29:34,600 --> 01:29:38,760
Speaker 1: objective judgment now, at this very moment, that's all you need. Um,

1675
01:29:38,800 --> 01:29:42,479
Speaker 1: he says, unselfish action now, at this very moment, that's

1676
01:29:42,479 --> 01:29:45,360
Speaker 1: all you need. And then he's his willing acceptance, now,

1677
01:29:45,400 --> 01:29:48,679
Speaker 1: at this very moment of all external events, that's all

1678
01:29:48,720 --> 01:29:52,240
Speaker 1: you need. And so those are the three disciplines of Stoicism.

1679
01:29:52,240 --> 01:29:55,320
Speaker 1: The discipline of perception. So that's the decision for how

1680
01:29:55,320 --> 01:29:58,160
Speaker 1: you're gonna look at things. That's you know, deciding to

1681
01:29:58,160 --> 01:30:02,200
Speaker 1: see things as objective rather than positive or negative. And

1682
01:30:02,240 --> 01:30:06,080
Speaker 1: then unselfish action. So that's where courage comes through. That's

1683
01:30:06,080 --> 01:30:10,840
Speaker 1: where creativity comes through. That's where sort of determination and

1684
01:30:10,840 --> 01:30:14,280
Speaker 1: and and uh, you know sort of the act. You

1685
01:30:14,280 --> 01:30:16,480
Speaker 1: have to you have to do things. You know, Stoicism

1686
01:30:16,600 --> 01:30:18,920
Speaker 1: is not the secret. You know, you can't just wish

1687
01:30:18,920 --> 01:30:21,400
Speaker 1: things into reality. You gotta make You gotta make choices.

1688
01:30:21,439 --> 01:30:23,920
Speaker 1: You've gotta the rubber's gotta meet the road. And then

1689
01:30:23,920 --> 01:30:26,599
Speaker 1: the final discipline stoicism is the discipline of the will.

1690
01:30:26,680 --> 01:30:28,800
Speaker 1: And that's that's how we deal with those things that

1691
01:30:28,880 --> 01:30:31,280
Speaker 1: kind of like break our hearts that you know, kick

1692
01:30:31,320 --> 01:30:34,360
Speaker 1: our ass that that are just you know, like the

1693
01:30:34,439 --> 01:30:37,120
Speaker 1: real the real tough ship in life. And and so

1694
01:30:37,160 --> 01:30:39,000
Speaker 1: the stoke is kind of trying to cultivate what they

1695
01:30:39,080 --> 01:30:42,280
Speaker 1: call an inner citadel, kind of like a fortress that

1696
01:30:42,439 --> 01:30:45,760
Speaker 1: can't be penetrated by external events. So it's you know,

1697
01:30:45,800 --> 01:30:48,360
Speaker 1: you wake up and you found you find that you

1698
01:30:48,439 --> 01:30:51,559
Speaker 1: made a million dollars, doesn't change you. You know, you

1699
01:30:51,680 --> 01:30:54,160
Speaker 1: find out you woke up and you know all your

1700
01:30:54,160 --> 01:30:58,080
Speaker 1: money has been stolen. Same thing, Like I'm a uh,

1701
01:30:58,240 --> 01:31:01,240
Speaker 1: external things don't change me. I got shipped to do.

1702
01:31:01,640 --> 01:31:03,439
Speaker 1: I'm going to focus on the you know, the task

1703
01:31:03,520 --> 01:31:07,719
Speaker 1: at hand. So so that idea of objective judgment, unselfish action,

1704
01:31:08,160 --> 01:31:11,920
Speaker 1: and then sort of acceptance or love of the things

1705
01:31:11,920 --> 01:31:16,000
Speaker 1: that happens. That's that's Those are the three disciplines of

1706
01:31:16,160 --> 01:31:19,040
Speaker 1: the philosophy and that and then each the way the opstocles,

1707
01:31:19,080 --> 01:31:22,040
Speaker 1: the way is spread out is along the lines of

1708
01:31:22,120 --> 01:31:26,840
Speaker 1: those three disciplines. Yeah. I read something around the third one,

1709
01:31:26,840 --> 01:31:30,320
Speaker 1: will and it talked about like an individual's ethical, moral,

1710
01:31:30,560 --> 01:31:33,800
Speaker 1: you know, well being, how you feel. Yeah, and it

1711
01:31:33,840 --> 01:31:37,080
Speaker 1: said vertue consists in a will that is in agreement

1712
01:31:37,120 --> 01:31:38,720
Speaker 1: with nature. And we go back to what we're talking

1713
01:31:38,720 --> 01:31:41,960
Speaker 1: about earlier, how nature is kind of continue comes up

1714
01:31:42,160 --> 01:31:44,600
Speaker 1: in this work. Can you kind of walk through that

1715
01:31:44,680 --> 01:31:47,599
Speaker 1: where that virtue lives. Yeah, So that idea of agreement

1716
01:31:47,640 --> 01:31:49,840
Speaker 1: with nature is it's kind of it's it is, it's

1717
01:31:49,880 --> 01:31:54,599
Speaker 1: weirdly kind of accepting that powerlessness over you know what happens.

1718
01:31:54,640 --> 01:31:57,120
Speaker 1: So for the Stoics that they had this idea, they said,

1719
01:31:57,160 --> 01:32:00,760
Speaker 1: like man is a dog tied to a car, you

1720
01:32:00,760 --> 01:32:05,439
Speaker 1: know that, like like we're small, we're powerless, we're being

1721
01:32:06,000 --> 01:32:09,000
Speaker 1: like the cart is going in the direction that it's

1722
01:32:09,080 --> 01:32:12,640
Speaker 1: going in and but we have a choice like is

1723
01:32:12,640 --> 01:32:15,760
Speaker 1: the dog gonna lay down and be dragged you know,

1724
01:32:15,960 --> 01:32:19,479
Speaker 1: is the dog gonna is the dog gonna wine, you know,

1725
01:32:19,600 --> 01:32:22,520
Speaker 1: or is the dog gonna sort of cheerfully trot alongside?

1726
01:32:23,040 --> 01:32:25,880
Speaker 1: Right that that that so, so when we talk about

1727
01:32:25,920 --> 01:32:28,479
Speaker 1: agreement with nature, what we mean is like what will

1728
01:32:28,520 --> 01:32:32,680
Speaker 1: be will be. But then we decide what our response

1729
01:32:32,800 --> 01:32:34,920
Speaker 1: to that is, what sort of disposition we're going to

1730
01:32:35,120 --> 01:32:38,600
Speaker 1: bring to that, and and and so one of I

1731
01:32:38,600 --> 01:32:40,880
Speaker 1: think one of the most powerful stoe concepts actually keep

1732
01:32:40,880 --> 01:32:43,240
Speaker 1: a coin in my pocket that that has this Latin

1733
01:32:43,280 --> 01:32:46,639
Speaker 1: phrase on it more fatty, which means like a love

1734
01:32:46,800 --> 01:32:50,280
Speaker 1: of fate. So for the Stoics, the idea was like

1735
01:32:50,479 --> 01:32:53,360
Speaker 1: you just embrace what life throws at you. You go

1736
01:32:53,520 --> 01:32:56,920
Speaker 1: like like you know, you're hunting and it starts to rain.

1737
01:32:57,040 --> 01:32:59,439
Speaker 1: You don't go, oh man, don't want it to rain.

1738
01:32:59,479 --> 01:33:02,280
Speaker 1: This the word it's just not supposed to rain. You go, yes,

1739
01:33:02,720 --> 01:33:06,439
Speaker 1: like it's raining, awesome, right, Like you're you just you

1740
01:33:06,560 --> 01:33:09,760
Speaker 1: just embrace it. Um you know, like the Marine Corps

1741
01:33:09,800 --> 01:33:13,880
Speaker 1: thing sort of embrace the suck um uh you know,

1742
01:33:14,160 --> 01:33:16,920
Speaker 1: you're you're just like look complaining doesn't make it better.

1743
01:33:16,960 --> 01:33:19,440
Speaker 1: So I'm going to embrace it. That that's the reality

1744
01:33:19,560 --> 01:33:22,559
Speaker 1: of what we do. Then, So the image for Marcus

1745
01:33:22,640 --> 01:33:25,760
Speaker 1: Realisty goes like anything you throw in front of the

1746
01:33:25,840 --> 01:33:28,160
Speaker 1: fire becomes fuel for the fire. And he says, like,

1747
01:33:28,240 --> 01:33:31,920
Speaker 1: you know, fire turns everything into flame and brightness. That

1748
01:33:32,000 --> 01:33:33,880
Speaker 1: when we when we talk about sort of living in

1749
01:33:33,880 --> 01:33:37,120
Speaker 1: accordance with nature, we talk about will, that's what we're saying.

1750
01:33:37,160 --> 01:33:40,240
Speaker 1: We're saying that like, this is this is the hand.

1751
01:33:40,240 --> 01:33:43,040
Speaker 1: I'm dell, I'm not gonna waste time wishing for a

1752
01:33:43,080 --> 01:33:46,080
Speaker 1: different hand. I'm gonna play this hand as best I

1753
01:33:46,200 --> 01:33:49,800
Speaker 1: possibly can. Yeah, And and and in in the obstacles the

1754
01:33:49,800 --> 01:33:52,040
Speaker 1: way you you have a bunch of examples which I

1755
01:33:52,080 --> 01:33:55,920
Speaker 1: think are important over time to to see how successful

1756
01:33:55,920 --> 01:34:00,559
Speaker 1: people have applied this. Um you know, Rockefeller, Steve Jobs,

1757
01:34:00,960 --> 01:34:03,200
Speaker 1: continue going on and on. Is there one of those

1758
01:34:03,240 --> 01:34:05,840
Speaker 1: that you think the most about or one you want

1759
01:34:05,840 --> 01:34:08,120
Speaker 1: to kind of just tell people about here, Yeah, I

1760
01:34:08,120 --> 01:34:10,000
Speaker 1: mean my favorite story in the book. It's probably the

1761
01:34:10,000 --> 01:34:12,160
Speaker 1: most popular one, and I was just reading about it again,

1762
01:34:12,439 --> 01:34:14,200
Speaker 1: you know, to go to a point about like sort

1763
01:34:14,200 --> 01:34:17,000
Speaker 1: of different you respond to different things different ways. I

1764
01:34:17,040 --> 01:34:19,080
Speaker 1: tell this story towards the end in the world chapter

1765
01:34:19,160 --> 01:34:21,840
Speaker 1: about Thomas Edison, and you know he's he's kind of

1766
01:34:21,880 --> 01:34:25,160
Speaker 1: America's most famous inventor at this time. And and his

1767
01:34:25,280 --> 01:34:28,240
Speaker 1: factory catches on fire, and and you know, Edison walks

1768
01:34:28,280 --> 01:34:29,960
Speaker 1: to the factory and you find his son is like

1769
01:34:30,080 --> 01:34:35,240
Speaker 1: standing their shell shop, and Edison grabs him and he goes, um,

1770
01:34:35,560 --> 01:34:37,840
Speaker 1: go get your mother and all her friends. They'll they'll

1771
01:34:37,880 --> 01:34:40,280
Speaker 1: never see a fire like this again. By far, my

1772
01:34:40,320 --> 01:34:43,400
Speaker 1: favorite part of the bookcase that moment you're like, yes,

1773
01:34:43,800 --> 01:34:45,760
Speaker 1: and I was. I was just reading about it, like

1774
01:34:46,280 --> 01:34:48,599
Speaker 1: apparently he would you know the poem if the Richard

1775
01:34:48,680 --> 01:34:52,799
Speaker 1: Kipling poem? Um? He uh, do you know that poems?

1776
01:34:52,800 --> 01:34:55,840
Speaker 1: By chance? I've not read that one though. Oh dude, dude,

1777
01:34:56,000 --> 01:35:01,200
Speaker 1: you write it down there. It's like it's it's even

1778
01:35:01,200 --> 01:35:04,080
Speaker 1: if for everyone listening, even if you hate poetry, um,

1779
01:35:04,120 --> 01:35:05,719
Speaker 1: even if you never read a poem in your life

1780
01:35:05,720 --> 01:35:08,960
Speaker 1: like this, this poem is like, first off, it's amazing.

1781
01:35:09,040 --> 01:35:10,599
Speaker 1: It's also like you can just read it to your

1782
01:35:10,680 --> 01:35:13,599
Speaker 1: kids as like a story. It's it's so it's got

1783
01:35:13,640 --> 01:35:16,960
Speaker 1: so much life lesson in it. But anyways, Edison is

1784
01:35:17,000 --> 01:35:21,720
Speaker 1: like reciting this poem to himself. You know, someone goes like, um,

1785
01:35:21,760 --> 01:35:24,080
Speaker 1: you know, Edison, you're ruined, and he says, yeah, we

1786
01:35:24,120 --> 01:35:26,120
Speaker 1: sure lost a lot of money tonight, didn't we. He's

1787
01:35:26,120 --> 01:35:28,760
Speaker 1: like laughing about it, um. And then he writes a

1788
01:35:28,880 --> 01:35:32,759
Speaker 1: statement to reporters because Edison's death so he has trouble

1789
01:35:32,800 --> 01:35:36,200
Speaker 1: talking um and he says, uh, you know, like, look,

1790
01:35:36,479 --> 01:35:39,160
Speaker 1: I've been through things like this before. He's like it.

1791
01:35:39,439 --> 01:35:42,759
Speaker 1: At the very least, it prevents a man from getting bored,

1792
01:35:43,280 --> 01:35:45,479
Speaker 1: and kind of the third act of Edison's life is

1793
01:35:45,520 --> 01:35:48,759
Speaker 1: like rebuilding from this. You know, he he doesn't complain,

1794
01:35:48,880 --> 01:35:51,759
Speaker 1: he doesn't cry, he doesn't blame, you know, he doesn't

1795
01:35:51,880 --> 01:35:55,400
Speaker 1: beat himself up for you know, only partially ensuring the buildings,

1796
01:35:55,640 --> 01:35:59,320
Speaker 1: because none of that makes it any better, right, All

1797
01:35:59,520 --> 01:36:02,559
Speaker 1: all you can really do is focus on what he's

1798
01:36:02,640 --> 01:36:07,000
Speaker 1: going to do in response to what's happened. And I

1799
01:36:07,040 --> 01:36:10,120
Speaker 1: think he does, you know, as as good as you can. Again,

1800
01:36:10,160 --> 01:36:14,719
Speaker 1: I was just reading like apparently Tesla, uh shortly after,

1801
01:36:14,840 --> 01:36:17,559
Speaker 1: had gone through a similar thing, and you know there's

1802
01:36:17,600 --> 01:36:20,040
Speaker 1: this scene of like Tesla sort of walking through the

1803
01:36:20,160 --> 01:36:24,040
Speaker 1: ruins of his of his factory, just just like weeping.

1804
01:36:24,360 --> 01:36:26,960
Speaker 1: And you know, I think the contrast of those two responses,

1805
01:36:27,000 --> 01:36:29,120
Speaker 1: it's like who do you want to be and which

1806
01:36:29,160 --> 01:36:31,960
Speaker 1: one is going to go on to accomplish more things.

1807
01:36:32,000 --> 01:36:36,519
Speaker 1: It's like the one who you know who can't be destroyed. Yeah,

1808
01:36:36,640 --> 01:36:41,519
Speaker 1: that's I think like you think. I I've had I

1809
01:36:41,520 --> 01:36:44,080
Speaker 1: don't want to say a privilege existence, but there's been

1810
01:36:44,120 --> 01:36:47,599
Speaker 1: times where to have the experiences you're talking about, I've

1811
01:36:47,600 --> 01:36:49,960
Speaker 1: had to kind of manufacture it, and the way that

1812
01:36:50,080 --> 01:36:53,680
Speaker 1: manufacturers through hunting, um, you know, I've climbed some of

1813
01:36:53,680 --> 01:36:56,920
Speaker 1: the tallest mountains in Nepal, in New Zealand. These are

1814
01:36:56,960 --> 01:37:01,120
Speaker 1: things that I'm not of physically strong person. I was

1815
01:37:01,160 --> 01:37:02,920
Speaker 1: never really great at sports. But it's like, man, if

1816
01:37:02,960 --> 01:37:04,720
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do this, I got to commit to it,

1817
01:37:04,920 --> 01:37:06,600
Speaker 1: and every time looks like I can't, I'm going to

1818
01:37:06,720 --> 01:37:09,160
Speaker 1: just keep going. And I've been I would say I've

1819
01:37:09,160 --> 01:37:13,120
Speaker 1: had to manufacture those moments because I haven't had divorced parents,

1820
01:37:13,400 --> 01:37:15,880
Speaker 1: or I haven't had I haven't got fired from any

1821
01:37:15,960 --> 01:37:18,680
Speaker 1: jobs or you know, found myself on the street or

1822
01:37:18,720 --> 01:37:21,120
Speaker 1: addicted to drugs. I mean, none of that has happened

1823
01:37:21,160 --> 01:37:22,800
Speaker 1: to me, right, And so honey has been a great

1824
01:37:22,840 --> 01:37:25,000
Speaker 1: way to manufacture. That is that something that you think of,

1825
01:37:25,040 --> 01:37:29,719
Speaker 1: like ways to manufacture um these challenges and and totally,

1826
01:37:29,760 --> 01:37:32,479
Speaker 1: totally and and so the Stoics they talked about they

1827
01:37:32,479 --> 01:37:36,120
Speaker 1: call it hard winters training. You know, like what training

1828
01:37:36,120 --> 01:37:38,439
Speaker 1: are you undergoing? So for the Stoics, it was like,

1829
01:37:38,840 --> 01:37:41,960
Speaker 1: you know, they would practice poverty, or they'd sleep on

1830
01:37:42,000 --> 01:37:46,160
Speaker 1: a hard mattress or you know, they they they practice

1831
01:37:46,240 --> 01:37:51,280
Speaker 1: fast and they were trying to toughen themselves up because

1832
01:37:51,320 --> 01:37:54,519
Speaker 1: they wanted to be prepared for what life could could

1833
01:37:54,520 --> 01:37:57,840
Speaker 1: throw at you. I think, look, no one should like ideally,

1834
01:37:57,920 --> 01:38:00,000
Speaker 1: no one should ever have to go through those things

1835
01:38:00,000 --> 01:38:01,559
Speaker 1: as we mentioned, No one should have to be born

1836
01:38:01,600 --> 01:38:05,160
Speaker 1: to single parents, no one should be born to um,

1837
01:38:05,200 --> 01:38:07,720
Speaker 1: you know, poverty, no one should be born to disabilities,

1838
01:38:07,760 --> 01:38:10,320
Speaker 1: and everyone should be treated equal. It'd be wonderful if

1839
01:38:10,360 --> 01:38:12,639
Speaker 1: if life was all sunshine and kittens, but it's not.

1840
01:38:13,240 --> 01:38:16,439
Speaker 1: And so how can we and nor should we have

1841
01:38:16,520 --> 01:38:19,880
Speaker 1: to seek out darkness? But how can we actively toughen

1842
01:38:19,960 --> 01:38:22,640
Speaker 1: ourselves up for the reality of what life has in

1843
01:38:22,720 --> 01:38:24,840
Speaker 1: store for us? And yeah, I think hunting is a

1844
01:38:24,840 --> 01:38:27,360
Speaker 1: way to do that, to go back to markets to realize. Also,

1845
01:38:27,439 --> 01:38:29,360
Speaker 1: what I love about the Stokes is just how much

1846
01:38:29,400 --> 01:38:33,000
Speaker 1: they talk about sports. You know that the Stoics practice

1847
01:38:33,360 --> 01:38:36,600
Speaker 1: uh pancreation, which is sort of an early predecessor of

1848
01:38:36,960 --> 01:38:39,719
Speaker 1: what we now called knicks martial arts, but the idea

1849
01:38:39,760 --> 01:38:42,920
Speaker 1: of sort of wrestling and boxing. You know, there there

1850
01:38:43,000 --> 01:38:45,479
Speaker 1: was a Stoic who was a long distance runner. Like

1851
01:38:45,680 --> 01:38:48,000
Speaker 1: for me, every day I run or swim, and it's

1852
01:38:48,120 --> 01:38:53,000
Speaker 1: it's that that challenging and pushing past my my resistance,

1853
01:38:53,080 --> 01:38:56,160
Speaker 1: pushing past when my mind wants me to stop. Not

1854
01:38:56,240 --> 01:38:58,559
Speaker 1: only is I think it's obviously you know, good to

1855
01:38:58,600 --> 01:39:00,519
Speaker 1: be in shape and to burn cow the reason to

1856
01:39:00,560 --> 01:39:03,800
Speaker 1: get outside, but it's also just practicing this idea of

1857
01:39:03,840 --> 01:39:06,840
Speaker 1: like hey, when my mind or when my body wants

1858
01:39:06,880 --> 01:39:10,320
Speaker 1: to quit, I have the power in my mind to

1859
01:39:10,439 --> 01:39:13,719
Speaker 1: go like no, We're gonna keep going. Because you're gonna

1860
01:39:13,760 --> 01:39:15,559
Speaker 1: need that in life. You need that when you're writing

1861
01:39:15,560 --> 01:39:17,479
Speaker 1: a book. You need it, when you're starting a company.

1862
01:39:17,520 --> 01:39:19,639
Speaker 1: You need it when you you know you have an

1863
01:39:19,720 --> 01:39:22,080
Speaker 1: infant who won't sleep. You know you need it when

1864
01:39:22,080 --> 01:39:24,519
Speaker 1: you when you lose one of your parents or somebody

1865
01:39:24,560 --> 01:39:27,360
Speaker 1: you love, like like life's gonna kick your ass. You

1866
01:39:27,520 --> 01:39:31,840
Speaker 1: gotta have cultivated the ability to go like I'm gonna

1867
01:39:31,960 --> 01:39:35,679
Speaker 1: keep going, I don't quit. Yeah. We had a couple

1868
01:39:35,680 --> 01:39:38,639
Speaker 1: of episodes ago we had a philosopher at a Cornell

1869
01:39:38,720 --> 01:39:40,840
Speaker 1: by the name of James Tantillo when he and a

1870
01:39:40,840 --> 01:39:43,360
Speaker 1: lot of things that you're saying connect I didn't know

1871
01:39:43,439 --> 01:39:45,360
Speaker 1: this before I started reading your stuff, but it connects.

1872
01:39:45,400 --> 01:39:48,400
Speaker 1: We started talking about hunting as an art, as a

1873
01:39:48,479 --> 01:39:51,679
Speaker 1: serious art um and some of the joyce Carol Oates

1874
01:39:52,040 --> 01:39:55,559
Speaker 1: speaks of. He was explain to me how she speaks

1875
01:39:55,560 --> 01:39:59,160
Speaker 1: of the awareness of life's the tragic ambiguity of life

1876
01:39:59,800 --> 01:40:03,800
Speaker 1: the serious art provides. Boxing was for example, but honey

1877
01:40:03,840 --> 01:40:06,599
Speaker 1: was an example that he made the connection as well.

1878
01:40:06,640 --> 01:40:10,080
Speaker 1: So we talked about that there's tragic knowledge within hunting.

1879
01:40:10,200 --> 01:40:12,400
Speaker 1: There's all these things that you can get if you're

1880
01:40:12,439 --> 01:40:15,400
Speaker 1: looking for them. They're all thrown into this moral ethical

1881
01:40:15,479 --> 01:40:18,519
Speaker 1: mix um that are there for you if you want them.

1882
01:40:18,520 --> 01:40:20,000
Speaker 1: You don't have to take part. You can go out,

1883
01:40:20,080 --> 01:40:21,960
Speaker 1: have a good time with your family, kill an animal,

1884
01:40:22,040 --> 01:40:25,240
Speaker 1: eat it, think about this, don't reflect on it at all,

1885
01:40:25,280 --> 01:40:27,479
Speaker 1: but if you want to, it's there for you. Um.

1886
01:40:27,520 --> 01:40:32,519
Speaker 1: And that's something that Stoicism and Stokisms using the term

1887
01:40:32,560 --> 01:40:35,200
Speaker 1: you ammonia a lot as I was reading it. And

1888
01:40:35,200 --> 01:40:38,200
Speaker 1: that's something that James Tantillo we talked about about four

1889
01:40:38,240 --> 01:40:41,120
Speaker 1: episodes ago. So it's crazy how these philosophies kind of

1890
01:40:41,160 --> 01:40:45,200
Speaker 1: connect around these actions. Yeah, and and look at like

1891
01:40:46,320 --> 01:40:48,960
Speaker 1: these philosophers were real people in the real world that

1892
01:40:49,040 --> 01:40:51,880
Speaker 1: had to eat things that you know, we're served in

1893
01:40:51,920 --> 01:40:56,840
Speaker 1: the army, you know, that had you know, positions of influence.

1894
01:40:56,880 --> 01:40:59,960
Speaker 1: They had students, you know, they gave speeches, they did

1895
01:41:00,000 --> 01:41:04,120
Speaker 1: It's like, what what I love so much about Stoicism

1896
01:41:04,200 --> 01:41:06,400
Speaker 1: is is is how much it gets the sort of

1897
01:41:06,520 --> 01:41:08,960
Speaker 1: core of his human experience. And my book still in

1898
01:41:09,000 --> 01:41:11,439
Speaker 1: this is the key I I opened with this story.

1899
01:41:11,479 --> 01:41:14,080
Speaker 1: It's based on one of Seneca's letters where he's kind

1900
01:41:14,080 --> 01:41:18,439
Speaker 1: of like sitting trying to, you know, righte do his job,

1901
01:41:19,200 --> 01:41:23,120
Speaker 1: and you know he's like his his apartments like above

1902
01:41:23,160 --> 01:41:26,439
Speaker 1: a gym, and you can hear like, you know, vendors shouting,

1903
01:41:26,640 --> 01:41:28,719
Speaker 1: you know, their wears on the street, and there's somebody

1904
01:41:28,760 --> 01:41:32,360
Speaker 1: getting arrested downstairs, and there's weights that are being dropped,

1905
01:41:32,400 --> 01:41:35,519
Speaker 1: and you know he's got you know, relationship drama and

1906
01:41:35,600 --> 01:41:38,439
Speaker 1: work drama, and he's just like he's like, I can't

1907
01:41:38,520 --> 01:41:40,880
Speaker 1: focus it's but he's like, but I need to focus

1908
01:41:40,920 --> 01:41:43,479
Speaker 1: and I need to tune all this out, and you go,

1909
01:41:43,600 --> 01:41:46,960
Speaker 1: oh man, for two thousand years at least, you know,

1910
01:41:47,080 --> 01:41:51,680
Speaker 1: human beings have been trying to focus amidst chaos and

1911
01:41:51,720 --> 01:41:56,280
Speaker 1: you know, dysfunction and that like you know, life is

1912
01:41:56,360 --> 01:42:01,160
Speaker 1: life right, and and that we're all like the experience

1913
01:42:01,680 --> 01:42:05,439
Speaker 1: that you had hunting is the same experiences that you know,

1914
01:42:05,560 --> 01:42:08,400
Speaker 1: Theodore Roosevelt had a had a hundred years ago, that

1915
01:42:08,479 --> 01:42:11,559
Speaker 1: you know, French kings had five hundred years ago, that

1916
01:42:11,640 --> 01:42:15,639
Speaker 1: the Stoics had two thousand years ago. Like that that

1917
01:42:15,640 --> 01:42:21,160
Speaker 1: that the world has not changed that much, and that

1918
01:42:21,360 --> 01:42:24,720
Speaker 1: when we can connect to that sort of deeper human experience,

1919
01:42:25,160 --> 01:42:29,479
Speaker 1: we can I think sometimes access wisdom that maybe you know,

1920
01:42:29,520 --> 01:42:33,080
Speaker 1: our our popular culture like isn't isn't teaching the way

1921
01:42:33,120 --> 01:42:37,040
Speaker 1: that it should. Yeah, And there's a lot of when

1922
01:42:37,040 --> 01:42:40,120
Speaker 1: you think about using this every day. Even even Mark

1923
01:42:40,160 --> 01:42:43,439
Speaker 1: Curelius would talk about what he would do in the morning,

1924
01:42:43,479 --> 01:42:46,840
Speaker 1: like what he would say to himself in the morning, Um, yeah,

1925
01:42:46,960 --> 01:42:49,320
Speaker 1: do you have like those things? Like yeah, he said

1926
01:42:49,560 --> 01:42:52,320
Speaker 1: that he would meet violent men and charitable men and

1927
01:42:52,360 --> 01:42:54,840
Speaker 1: like how he would deal with that. Yeah, yeah, And

1928
01:42:54,880 --> 01:42:56,800
Speaker 1: I think he was doing that in a journal, right,

1929
01:42:56,800 --> 01:42:59,320
Speaker 1: because that's what Meditations is, it's his journal. So I

1930
01:42:59,360 --> 01:43:02,080
Speaker 1: think I'm a big believer in routine. I'm a big

1931
01:43:02,120 --> 01:43:05,080
Speaker 1: believer in process. I think if you do routine enough,

1932
01:43:05,120 --> 01:43:08,040
Speaker 1: it becomes almost ritual. So like for me, it's it's

1933
01:43:08,080 --> 01:43:10,920
Speaker 1: waking up early. I sit down with the journal for

1934
01:43:10,960 --> 01:43:13,120
Speaker 1: a few minutes. I just I get I dump all

1935
01:43:13,160 --> 01:43:15,760
Speaker 1: the thoughts in my brain out onto the page. I

1936
01:43:15,800 --> 01:43:18,280
Speaker 1: take my kids for a walk. I don't use the

1937
01:43:18,320 --> 01:43:21,559
Speaker 1: phone right away, you know, we have breakfast as a family,

1938
01:43:22,520 --> 01:43:24,680
Speaker 1: and then and then I go, I go, you know,

1939
01:43:24,680 --> 01:43:27,080
Speaker 1: I take them to school, drop them off, and then

1940
01:43:27,080 --> 01:43:29,360
Speaker 1: I go right into the work. You know, it's the

1941
01:43:29,479 --> 01:43:32,840
Speaker 1: ritual and the process is really important. You do the

1942
01:43:32,880 --> 01:43:34,680
Speaker 1: same thing over and over and over again kind of

1943
01:43:34,760 --> 01:43:38,160
Speaker 1: lulls you into the right head space. So I think

1944
01:43:38,200 --> 01:43:43,680
Speaker 1: that's that's really important. UM. I think journaling especially, um

1945
01:43:43,720 --> 01:43:46,439
Speaker 1: you know a lot of the really great insights we

1946
01:43:46,520 --> 01:43:50,320
Speaker 1: have about hunting comes from people's diaries and from their journals,

1947
01:43:50,360 --> 01:43:53,360
Speaker 1: and so you know, keep that down for your kids,

1948
01:43:53,439 --> 01:43:55,760
Speaker 1: keep that down for history, keep but but also just

1949
01:43:55,800 --> 01:44:00,280
Speaker 1: the process of writing it down is helpful. It's to you,

1950
01:44:01,000 --> 01:44:04,240
Speaker 1: and so um, yeah, I think I think having that

1951
01:44:04,720 --> 01:44:07,679
Speaker 1: having having that ritual was really great. But but Marcus

1952
01:44:07,760 --> 01:44:11,439
Speaker 1: really specifically when he would go, when he would rise

1953
01:44:11,520 --> 01:44:14,240
Speaker 1: to meet the day, he would say something like, look, look,

1954
01:44:14,479 --> 01:44:17,240
Speaker 1: I'm gonna eat assholes today, I'm gonna meet jerks today,

1955
01:44:17,280 --> 01:44:20,360
Speaker 1: I'm gonna meet incompetent people today, you know, all that

1956
01:44:20,680 --> 01:44:24,080
Speaker 1: kind of trying to anticipate in advance all the things

1957
01:44:24,120 --> 01:44:26,519
Speaker 1: that he was likely to see. And then he goes, Okay,

1958
01:44:26,520 --> 01:44:28,599
Speaker 1: but why are people like this. It's not because they're

1959
01:44:28,600 --> 01:44:31,679
Speaker 1: bad people. It's because they're tired, it's because they haven't

1960
01:44:31,680 --> 01:44:34,200
Speaker 1: had the training that I've had. It's because they're you know,

1961
01:44:34,280 --> 01:44:37,320
Speaker 1: all these different things. And he's like, I can't hate

1962
01:44:37,360 --> 01:44:40,360
Speaker 1: them for this. I can't let them implicate me in

1963
01:44:40,400 --> 01:44:43,439
Speaker 1: their ugliness. He says, I just have to be ready,

1964
01:44:43,720 --> 01:44:45,720
Speaker 1: and I have to be tolerant, and I gotta go

1965
01:44:45,760 --> 01:44:48,840
Speaker 1: do what I gotta do. Yeah, that's that's the great

1966
01:44:48,840 --> 01:44:51,760
Speaker 1: thing that I've been learning from what you say, and

1967
01:44:51,800 --> 01:44:54,080
Speaker 1: really for me too. We've talked to a lot of

1968
01:44:54,120 --> 01:44:56,680
Speaker 1: intellectuals on the show, a lot of people that I

1969
01:44:56,680 --> 01:44:59,439
Speaker 1: think James Tantella being one of them, we've already mentioned him.

1970
01:44:59,479 --> 01:45:02,000
Speaker 1: But but then a little a big turn for me

1971
01:45:02,120 --> 01:45:05,880
Speaker 1: was talking to people who could also not that every

1972
01:45:05,920 --> 01:45:09,639
Speaker 1: intellectual professor whatever can't, but people like yourself who also

1973
01:45:09,720 --> 01:45:12,679
Speaker 1: can say, here's the philosophical idea. We've already talked about

1974
01:45:12,680 --> 01:45:14,720
Speaker 1: this a little bit, but here it is in practice.

1975
01:45:15,000 --> 01:45:18,000
Speaker 1: Here it isn't permanence like here, it is in your life. Um.

1976
01:45:18,000 --> 01:45:20,000
Speaker 1: And we've been trying to pursue that here on the show.

1977
01:45:20,120 --> 01:45:23,280
Speaker 1: People that have that not only are environmentalists or hunters

1978
01:45:23,400 --> 01:45:27,240
Speaker 1: or critical thinkers, but have done things in their life,

1979
01:45:27,240 --> 01:45:30,760
Speaker 1: extraordinary things to kind of push these ideas forward and

1980
01:45:30,800 --> 01:45:34,519
Speaker 1: test these ideas really on themselves. UM. And it sounds

1981
01:45:34,560 --> 01:45:37,519
Speaker 1: like your daily life you've done that. You've you've said,

1982
01:45:37,600 --> 01:45:39,680
Speaker 1: this is this is my process, this is how I

1983
01:45:39,720 --> 01:45:42,040
Speaker 1: think about things, and this is how I allow that

1984
01:45:42,080 --> 01:45:44,800
Speaker 1: to make me better. I find that to be you know,

1985
01:45:44,800 --> 01:45:46,880
Speaker 1: when talking about philosophy and ethics and all those things.

1986
01:45:47,040 --> 01:45:49,920
Speaker 1: When we get down to it and it seems like

1987
01:45:50,000 --> 01:45:53,640
Speaker 1: you've done that, there's specific things you can do to

1988
01:45:53,720 --> 01:45:58,120
Speaker 1: be better. Um. I think that's right. It's beautiful. Have

1989
01:45:58,200 --> 01:46:00,719
Speaker 1: you have you read a general matter his new book,

1990
01:46:00,760 --> 01:46:03,280
Speaker 1: The Call Sign chaos. No, but I had somebody put

1991
01:46:03,280 --> 01:46:05,080
Speaker 1: that on my desk actually a couple of days ago.

1992
01:46:05,680 --> 01:46:07,840
Speaker 1: You would like it. But you know, this goes to

1993
01:46:07,880 --> 01:46:10,000
Speaker 1: this point we're talking about with reading. He has something

1994
01:46:10,040 --> 01:46:13,160
Speaker 1: in there. He goes like, look, human beings have been

1995
01:46:13,200 --> 01:46:16,360
Speaker 1: fighting on this planet, you know, and writing about it

1996
01:46:16,680 --> 01:46:19,559
Speaker 1: for five thousand years. You know that. That's like sort

1997
01:46:19,600 --> 01:46:21,200
Speaker 1: of the oldest book that we have is about five

1998
01:46:21,200 --> 01:46:26,439
Speaker 1: thousand years old. And he's like, he's like, it's inexcusable

1999
01:46:26,520 --> 01:46:30,160
Speaker 1: for a military commander to be learning by trial and

2000
01:46:30,280 --> 01:46:34,240
Speaker 1: error when those lessons have already been learned by other

2001
01:46:34,280 --> 01:46:37,720
Speaker 1: people and put in the helpful form of a book. Right,

2002
01:46:37,720 --> 01:46:40,320
Speaker 1: He's like, he's like, you can't be filling body bags

2003
01:46:41,360 --> 01:46:44,160
Speaker 1: when you could have just opened a book and and

2004
01:46:44,200 --> 01:46:46,200
Speaker 1: that that's sort of what I think about it is like, look,

2005
01:46:46,320 --> 01:46:48,840
Speaker 1: you know, really smart people, people way smarter than me,

2006
01:46:48,920 --> 01:46:52,760
Speaker 1: way smarter than you, have written things, and we got it.

2007
01:46:52,800 --> 01:46:56,160
Speaker 1: We we should start where they left off, you know

2008
01:46:56,280 --> 01:46:58,679
Speaker 1: that that's what we should be. That to me, that's

2009
01:46:58,720 --> 01:47:02,800
Speaker 1: what philosophy is about. It's about the accumulation of wisdom

2010
01:47:02,880 --> 01:47:06,760
Speaker 1: over thousands of years. You know, people who did the

2011
01:47:06,760 --> 01:47:09,360
Speaker 1: wrong the right thing, people who did the wrong thing.

2012
01:47:09,760 --> 01:47:12,240
Speaker 1: You know, what do they learn? What strategies did it

2013
01:47:12,320 --> 01:47:14,320
Speaker 1: come up with? And how can we start to apply

2014
01:47:14,400 --> 01:47:16,360
Speaker 1: those in our own lives and then go have our

2015
01:47:16,400 --> 01:47:19,880
Speaker 1: own experiences that we add on top of that. And

2016
01:47:19,960 --> 01:47:23,280
Speaker 1: so yeah, again, I don't think philosophy is this sort

2017
01:47:23,320 --> 01:47:27,320
Speaker 1: of theoretical thing. No, it's like it's what what have

2018
01:47:27,439 --> 01:47:30,360
Speaker 1: people learned? You know what, what have they done? And

2019
01:47:30,360 --> 01:47:33,600
Speaker 1: and do I agree or disagree? And doesn't work in

2020
01:47:33,600 --> 01:47:36,719
Speaker 1: practice in my own life? Yeah, I think I couldn't.

2021
01:47:36,840 --> 01:47:41,240
Speaker 1: We really couldn't have this conversation or at least ended

2022
01:47:41,400 --> 01:47:44,160
Speaker 1: on anything other than like some of the ills of

2023
01:47:44,160 --> 01:47:46,400
Speaker 1: the world right now, some of the more trite I

2024
01:47:46,439 --> 01:47:48,559
Speaker 1: find there to be a lot of trite examples of

2025
01:47:48,600 --> 01:47:50,160
Speaker 1: things that are going on in the world, like social

2026
01:47:50,200 --> 01:47:54,360
Speaker 1: media is making us um want instant gratification and want

2027
01:47:54,360 --> 01:47:58,000
Speaker 1: to give our opinion before we acquire knowledge, and all

2028
01:47:58,040 --> 01:48:01,080
Speaker 1: these other things I think we've become They've become kind

2029
01:48:01,120 --> 01:48:04,719
Speaker 1: of normal to trot out as what's wrong with modern

2030
01:48:04,760 --> 01:48:09,160
Speaker 1: society kids these days? And I'm becoming like an old

2031
01:48:09,160 --> 01:48:11,840
Speaker 1: I'm the thirty four, but I I'm becoming an old

2032
01:48:11,880 --> 01:48:14,720
Speaker 1: man on the porch already, which is scary to me,

2033
01:48:15,080 --> 01:48:19,439
Speaker 1: man um, But I was watching randomly. I was watching

2034
01:48:19,520 --> 01:48:21,679
Speaker 1: teen Jeopardy with my son, and they had a pop

2035
01:48:21,720 --> 01:48:24,040
Speaker 1: culture thing and I got all of them wrong, and

2036
01:48:24,080 --> 01:48:26,759
Speaker 1: I was needed like mad at Alex Trebeck for bringing

2037
01:48:26,760 --> 01:48:29,200
Speaker 1: it up sharing me that was an old guy. But anyway,

2038
01:48:29,200 --> 01:48:32,320
Speaker 1: back back to kind of the the more trite and

2039
01:48:32,479 --> 01:48:37,320
Speaker 1: common criticisms of culture, how do you see those things?

2040
01:48:37,360 --> 01:48:39,519
Speaker 1: You know, social media I think probably being the main one,

2041
01:48:40,040 --> 01:48:43,200
Speaker 1: and people's need for instant gratification to microwave society. It

2042
01:48:43,240 --> 01:48:46,759
Speaker 1: only keeps getting worse. Um, how do you see those things?

2043
01:48:47,120 --> 01:48:48,720
Speaker 1: How do you interact with them? And then how do

2044
01:48:48,760 --> 01:48:52,839
Speaker 1: you apply stoicism to them? Well, so I actually opened

2045
01:48:53,400 --> 01:48:56,160
Speaker 1: uh still this is the key with a quote from

2046
01:48:56,160 --> 01:48:59,880
Speaker 1: from Blaze Pascal. He said, you know, all of humanities

2047
01:49:00,040 --> 01:49:02,800
Speaker 1: problems stem from our inability to sit quietly in a

2048
01:49:02,880 --> 01:49:07,679
Speaker 1: room alone, which is true. It's also five d years old,

2049
01:49:07,920 --> 01:49:11,360
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like like like we've always

2050
01:49:11,360 --> 01:49:14,880
Speaker 1: had Trump, Like social media is not really doing anything new.

2051
01:49:15,320 --> 01:49:19,479
Speaker 1: I think it's just exacerbating tendencies we already had. So

2052
01:49:19,960 --> 01:49:21,760
Speaker 1: you know, I think I think we can turn to

2053
01:49:21,840 --> 01:49:25,000
Speaker 1: ancient wisdom for some solutions to these modern problems. One

2054
01:49:25,120 --> 01:49:27,920
Speaker 1: one of my favorite ones from Epictetus that I think

2055
01:49:27,960 --> 01:49:32,160
Speaker 1: about is, you know, he goes like, um, if you

2056
01:49:32,160 --> 01:49:35,519
Speaker 1: want to improve as a person, you gotta be content

2057
01:49:35,720 --> 01:49:40,040
Speaker 1: to be seen as like ignorant or foolish on certain matters.

2058
01:49:40,360 --> 01:49:43,679
Speaker 1: So it's like, I don't know anything about this corona

2059
01:49:43,760 --> 01:49:45,719
Speaker 1: or canna. I don't even know how to pronounce it whatever,

2060
01:49:45,760 --> 01:49:48,920
Speaker 1: this thing everyone's freaking out about in Asia, like it's

2061
01:49:48,920 --> 01:49:52,080
Speaker 1: gonna it's not like me knowing me following it in

2062
01:49:52,200 --> 01:49:55,000
Speaker 1: real time, it's certainly not going to affect it, and

2063
01:49:55,080 --> 01:49:57,400
Speaker 1: it's only going to take me away from what I

2064
01:49:57,479 --> 01:50:00,479
Speaker 1: should be focused on. Do you know what I mean? Um, Like,

2065
01:50:01,200 --> 01:50:03,680
Speaker 1: if you know who you're going to vote for, what

2066
01:50:03,720 --> 01:50:06,560
Speaker 1: the fund are you watching the debates for? Right? Like?

2067
01:50:06,560 --> 01:50:10,639
Speaker 1: Like uh, you know, um, Like, but watch a movie.

2068
01:50:10,680 --> 01:50:13,479
Speaker 1: At least a movie is entertaining U. And so so

2069
01:50:13,520 --> 01:50:16,120
Speaker 1: I think we've sort of internalized this idea that we

2070
01:50:16,160 --> 01:50:19,320
Speaker 1: have to keep up with everything, and that that like

2071
01:50:19,880 --> 01:50:22,800
Speaker 1: we'll be laughed at if we're if we're not like

2072
01:50:23,320 --> 01:50:26,559
Speaker 1: hyper informed on all the trends and you know, sort

2073
01:50:26,600 --> 01:50:29,040
Speaker 1: of memes of the day. And it's true, you might

2074
01:50:29,080 --> 01:50:32,080
Speaker 1: get laughed at. But I think what the stoic wants

2075
01:50:32,120 --> 01:50:35,360
Speaker 1: to cultivate is the ability to be okay with that

2076
01:50:35,800 --> 01:50:38,479
Speaker 1: because we have more important things that we're thinking about,

2077
01:50:38,479 --> 01:50:41,840
Speaker 1: whether that's our family or our work or you know

2078
01:50:41,960 --> 01:50:44,439
Speaker 1: some you know, like some work we're doing on ourselves

2079
01:50:44,479 --> 01:50:47,599
Speaker 1: or whatever it is. I think the ability to be like, no, man,

2080
01:50:47,840 --> 01:50:51,559
Speaker 1: I'm I'm opting out of that is I think really important. Yeah.

2081
01:50:51,560 --> 01:50:53,000
Speaker 1: And I think the other one to talk about, because

2082
01:50:53,000 --> 01:50:57,920
Speaker 1: it's it's laid there in everything stoicism is about. It

2083
01:50:58,000 --> 01:51:01,840
Speaker 1: really to me is the them culture and and blaming

2084
01:51:02,400 --> 01:51:05,240
Speaker 1: all these institutions for your problems and not being able

2085
01:51:05,240 --> 01:51:07,400
Speaker 1: to really affect the own the solution to your own

2086
01:51:07,439 --> 01:51:11,480
Speaker 1: problems because you're blaming you know, these big cultural institutions

2087
01:51:11,880 --> 01:51:14,880
Speaker 1: and the things. I would bring an example, we I

2088
01:51:14,920 --> 01:51:18,200
Speaker 1: talked a little bit about UM race and hunting and

2089
01:51:18,240 --> 01:51:23,519
Speaker 1: how race is UM determined, what the how prejudices really determined,

2090
01:51:23,520 --> 01:51:26,880
Speaker 1: like what the demographics of outdoorsmen and women are. We

2091
01:51:26,960 --> 01:51:30,640
Speaker 1: had this conversation and in a part of the conversation,

2092
01:51:30,880 --> 01:51:34,400
Speaker 1: those UM African American folks who felt like they weren't

2093
01:51:34,439 --> 01:51:37,720
Speaker 1: welcome in the outdoors were kind of moving through it like, well,

2094
01:51:37,720 --> 01:51:39,639
Speaker 1: I can't go in public lands because there's white people

2095
01:51:39,640 --> 01:51:43,880
Speaker 1: with guns there. And and at the time I kind

2096
01:51:43,920 --> 01:51:48,280
Speaker 1: of brushed aside and agreed with it, and I understand,

2097
01:51:48,320 --> 01:51:50,320
Speaker 1: I'm trying to understand where you're coming from rather than

2098
01:51:50,360 --> 01:51:53,639
Speaker 1: trying to be a critical of your words. But over

2099
01:51:53,680 --> 01:51:55,840
Speaker 1: time I just thought, isn't that really just affecting the

2100
01:51:55,840 --> 01:51:58,439
Speaker 1: thing you don't want by moving through the world and

2101
01:51:58,479 --> 01:52:04,160
Speaker 1: applying some you know, idea that's really decades old to

2102
01:52:04,439 --> 01:52:07,479
Speaker 1: every place you go public lands there's white people of guns,

2103
01:52:07,600 --> 01:52:09,920
Speaker 1: so there might be racism there. Um, it doesn't that

2104
01:52:10,000 --> 01:52:13,880
Speaker 1: It isn't that affecting racism in your own mind? So um,

2105
01:52:14,160 --> 01:52:17,519
Speaker 1: and allowing you like starting out as a victim when

2106
01:52:17,520 --> 01:52:21,320
Speaker 1: really there's no reality or history behind in the modern

2107
01:52:21,400 --> 01:52:24,320
Speaker 1: sense in the last two decades of white people on

2108
01:52:24,680 --> 01:52:28,760
Speaker 1: public lands with guns threatening African Americans, it's just it's

2109
01:52:28,800 --> 01:52:32,040
Speaker 1: not really there. So I think that all ties into this.

2110
01:52:32,040 --> 01:52:34,519
Speaker 1: But it goes back to of going through the world

2111
01:52:34,640 --> 01:52:37,439
Speaker 1: thinking of yourself as a victim because of the history

2112
01:52:37,439 --> 01:52:39,960
Speaker 1: of this country, where the history of our species well,

2113
01:52:39,960 --> 01:52:44,639
Speaker 1: and look like physically fearing for your safety in a

2114
01:52:44,720 --> 01:52:48,280
Speaker 1: real way, like I'm much more sympathetic to that than

2115
01:52:48,320 --> 01:52:51,679
Speaker 1: this idea of like you know, words or violence or

2116
01:52:51,720 --> 01:52:55,479
Speaker 1: you know, like, uh, you know, it's like trigger warnings.

2117
01:52:55,640 --> 01:52:57,559
Speaker 1: You know. One of the things that Stones talk about

2118
01:52:57,640 --> 01:52:59,880
Speaker 1: is is it's like, look, it takes two to tang

2119
01:53:00,000 --> 01:53:03,720
Speaker 1: go as far as getting getting offended goes, right, Like,

2120
01:53:04,200 --> 01:53:07,240
Speaker 1: words are objective, and then we impute meaning on them,

2121
01:53:07,280 --> 01:53:10,280
Speaker 1: we decide to take them as an offense, right, just

2122
01:53:10,360 --> 01:53:13,599
Speaker 1: like like I choose to see you as a good person,

2123
01:53:13,640 --> 01:53:16,240
Speaker 1: so I'm not offended by what you said, or you know,

2124
01:53:16,280 --> 01:53:18,960
Speaker 1: like I go around with the persecution complex, so I

2125
01:53:19,080 --> 01:53:21,519
Speaker 1: choose to see what you're saying as like, you know,

2126
01:53:21,640 --> 01:53:25,360
Speaker 1: deeply pointed and aggressive towards me. I think we we've

2127
01:53:25,520 --> 01:53:27,960
Speaker 1: we've come to this place where it's like everything is

2128
01:53:28,000 --> 01:53:31,840
Speaker 1: so good and so like bountiful, that we've come to

2129
01:53:31,960 --> 01:53:34,519
Speaker 1: decide that like what we really want to do is

2130
01:53:34,600 --> 01:53:38,800
Speaker 1: like escalate the power of words to almost an absurd level.

2131
01:53:39,360 --> 01:53:42,800
Speaker 1: And and yeah, just like just going around being outraged

2132
01:53:42,840 --> 01:53:45,040
Speaker 1: and offended and hurt all the time, it's just not

2133
01:53:45,200 --> 01:53:47,840
Speaker 1: a good way to live, nor does it nor does

2134
01:53:47,840 --> 01:53:51,519
Speaker 1: it bring anyone together or accomplish really anything. And so

2135
01:53:51,880 --> 01:53:54,479
Speaker 1: I think the stoic wants to sort of cultivate it,

2136
01:53:54,640 --> 01:53:58,280
Speaker 1: like this idea of apatheia, which which basically means like

2137
01:53:58,360 --> 01:54:02,320
Speaker 1: you're not jerked around by external things. So like if

2138
01:54:02,360 --> 01:54:04,400
Speaker 1: someone calls you a piece of ship, you shrug it off.

2139
01:54:04,439 --> 01:54:06,920
Speaker 1: If someone calls you, you know, the best hunter in

2140
01:54:06,960 --> 01:54:09,360
Speaker 1: the world, or the best podcaster in the world, or

2141
01:54:09,400 --> 01:54:12,200
Speaker 1: the best author in the world, you're like, thanks, but like,

2142
01:54:12,360 --> 01:54:14,719
Speaker 1: you know, you don't know me. This doesn't mean anything

2143
01:54:14,760 --> 01:54:17,160
Speaker 1: to me, right Um. One of my favorite lines from

2144
01:54:17,240 --> 01:54:20,040
Speaker 1: kest is because like he's like, accept it without arrogance,

2145
01:54:20,240 --> 01:54:23,040
Speaker 1: let it go within difference, Like you just keep an

2146
01:54:23,040 --> 01:54:26,599
Speaker 1: even keel whatever they're saying about you, you know, whether

2147
01:54:26,680 --> 01:54:29,240
Speaker 1: your show is really popular or the numbers dip. Like,

2148
01:54:29,640 --> 01:54:31,799
Speaker 1: you just gotta focus on the work. You gotta focus

2149
01:54:31,800 --> 01:54:34,480
Speaker 1: on you, and you can't get jerked around by all

2150
01:54:34,520 --> 01:54:37,320
Speaker 1: this stuff happening around you. Yeah, and that and that

2151
01:54:37,440 --> 01:54:40,280
Speaker 1: in your book you talk about there's all these examples

2152
01:54:40,280 --> 01:54:42,840
Speaker 1: of people that have done that, that have met these things.

2153
01:54:42,880 --> 01:54:45,640
Speaker 1: And you can certainly meet criticism and let it affect

2154
01:54:45,640 --> 01:54:48,160
Speaker 1: the way you produce your art or your work or

2155
01:54:48,280 --> 01:54:50,920
Speaker 1: your podcast or your book. You can change what you

2156
01:54:51,000 --> 01:54:54,000
Speaker 1: think based on what people that don't know you criticize

2157
01:54:54,040 --> 01:54:56,280
Speaker 1: you about, or you can just be you and move

2158
01:54:56,560 --> 01:54:58,520
Speaker 1: move through it. Then that will help you smash through

2159
01:54:58,520 --> 01:55:00,560
Speaker 1: some of the challenges you have rather than kind of

2160
01:55:00,560 --> 01:55:03,440
Speaker 1: reeling back every time someone comes at you. Yeah, I

2161
01:55:03,440 --> 01:55:05,600
Speaker 1: remember I told that in my book. I had this

2162
01:55:05,640 --> 01:55:09,480
Speaker 1: story about Amelia Earhart and Amelia Earhart gets offered her

2163
01:55:09,560 --> 01:55:13,680
Speaker 1: first female transatlantic flight is like an incredibly offensive offer.

2164
01:55:13,720 --> 01:55:16,080
Speaker 1: They were like, hey, like, look, there's gonna be two

2165
01:55:16,120 --> 01:55:18,840
Speaker 1: male pilots, like the pilot and the co pilot. You're

2166
01:55:18,880 --> 01:55:21,480
Speaker 1: gonna be the navigator, Like you don't have any say

2167
01:55:21,520 --> 01:55:24,200
Speaker 1: on anything, you know, blah blah blah blah blah. And

2168
01:55:24,240 --> 01:55:26,560
Speaker 1: it's like she said yes. She was like fuck yeah,

2169
01:55:26,600 --> 01:55:29,520
Speaker 1: I'm gonna make that happen. And then she used that

2170
01:55:30,200 --> 01:55:35,839
Speaker 1: platform to to do her female transatlantic solo trans atlantic flight. Now,

2171
01:55:35,960 --> 01:55:38,000
Speaker 1: I remember I told this story had a startup in

2172
01:55:38,040 --> 01:55:40,320
Speaker 1: Silicon Valley and like this woman went on this like

2173
01:55:40,400 --> 01:55:42,880
Speaker 1: whole tweet storm about it about how I was saying, like,

2174
01:55:43,240 --> 01:55:46,280
Speaker 1: you know, Ryan came here and he only had one

2175
01:55:46,360 --> 01:55:49,240
Speaker 1: female example in his talk, and he was saying that

2176
01:55:49,280 --> 01:55:51,800
Speaker 1: women should just be happy with whatever is offered to them,

2177
01:55:51,880 --> 01:55:54,960
Speaker 1: and it's like, come on, Like, first off, we're obviously

2178
01:55:55,000 --> 01:55:57,520
Speaker 1: on the same team here, like I'm holding up this

2179
01:55:57,600 --> 01:56:01,200
Speaker 1: awesome woman as a hero of mine, Like clearly I'm

2180
01:56:01,240 --> 01:56:05,800
Speaker 1: not some like sort of you know, regressive like uh

2181
01:56:05,800 --> 01:56:09,640
Speaker 1: like woman hater. And and second like you're totally missing

2182
01:56:09,680 --> 01:56:11,560
Speaker 1: the point of the story. The story is that she

2183
01:56:11,720 --> 01:56:15,560
Speaker 1: took a shitty opportunity and through sheer force of will,

2184
01:56:16,080 --> 01:56:20,200
Speaker 1: forced it into forced the world into accepting something they

2185
01:56:20,200 --> 01:56:23,680
Speaker 1: were not comfortable with accepting. And and through her determination

2186
01:56:23,800 --> 01:56:28,000
Speaker 1: and her stoicism and her commitment, you know, managed to

2187
01:56:28,280 --> 01:56:32,160
Speaker 1: improve the planet. And here you're saying you're actually agreeing

2188
01:56:32,280 --> 01:56:37,160
Speaker 1: with the like the sexiest of her time, which is like, uh,

2189
01:56:37,240 --> 01:56:39,560
Speaker 1: you know, she should have just sat around and waited

2190
01:56:39,600 --> 01:56:41,840
Speaker 1: for the perfect opportunity, you know what I mean. Like

2191
01:56:42,320 --> 01:56:45,640
Speaker 1: you're like, if she had listened to you, the world

2192
01:56:45,720 --> 01:56:48,360
Speaker 1: would be a worse place. And so there's I don't

2193
01:56:48,360 --> 01:56:51,600
Speaker 1: know it, people like I gotta remember, like people like

2194
01:56:51,680 --> 01:56:55,680
Speaker 1: this have always existed. People have always been shortsighted, easily offended,

2195
01:56:56,080 --> 01:57:00,880
Speaker 1: you know, small minded whatever. But like it is, it

2196
01:57:01,040 --> 01:57:05,360
Speaker 1: is strange how loud those voices are today. And I unfortunately,

2197
01:57:05,400 --> 01:57:08,280
Speaker 1: I think social media amplifies them. Yeah, and those that

2198
01:57:08,400 --> 01:57:12,800
Speaker 1: that amplication becomes a weird version of cultural censorship, and

2199
01:57:12,840 --> 01:57:15,320
Speaker 1: it's it's laid bare and like outrage culture. But also

2200
01:57:15,920 --> 01:57:19,000
Speaker 1: people who need to make money and are scared to

2201
01:57:19,040 --> 01:57:22,760
Speaker 1: say something controversial because that controversy gets picked up by

2202
01:57:22,800 --> 01:57:25,560
Speaker 1: these these type of folks and tried it out. There

2203
01:57:25,600 --> 01:57:28,240
Speaker 1: is a way to cancel you, or to diminish you,

2204
01:57:28,560 --> 01:57:32,240
Speaker 1: or to push you away from the thing that allows

2205
01:57:32,240 --> 01:57:35,080
Speaker 1: your family to have a good life. I've experienced that.

2206
01:57:35,120 --> 01:57:38,960
Speaker 1: I mean, people they know that they're praying upon your

2207
01:57:39,040 --> 01:57:42,040
Speaker 1: need to have a life and your voice connected to

2208
01:57:42,160 --> 01:57:45,200
Speaker 1: your to your income, and so they use that to

2209
01:57:45,280 --> 01:57:47,960
Speaker 1: kind of silence you or scare you out of some topics.

2210
01:57:47,960 --> 01:57:52,320
Speaker 1: And you mentioned early on the piece you wrote about liberals,

2211
01:57:52,520 --> 01:57:55,280
Speaker 1: liberal millnitges should go hunting was getting pushed back because

2212
01:57:55,360 --> 01:57:58,520
Speaker 1: it included things like a R fifteens and that just

2213
01:57:59,000 --> 01:58:03,520
Speaker 1: talking about that is controversial enough. We're just discussing it is.

2214
01:58:03,680 --> 01:58:07,680
Speaker 1: So it's included so much vitriol and viciousness that people

2215
01:58:07,720 --> 01:58:10,320
Speaker 1: just don't want to punch it anymore. That censorship. No,

2216
01:58:10,440 --> 01:58:12,400
Speaker 1: I mean, it was crazy. So I remember a couple

2217
01:58:12,440 --> 01:58:14,880
Speaker 1: I got a couple of interesting reactions. So I got

2218
01:58:14,960 --> 01:58:17,120
Speaker 1: you know, I got a bunch of people like I'm unsubscribing,

2219
01:58:17,200 --> 01:58:19,240
Speaker 1: I hate you, how could you do this? Like you

2220
01:58:19,240 --> 01:58:22,560
Speaker 1: know whatever, And and then I got some emails from

2221
01:58:22,560 --> 01:58:25,200
Speaker 1: people that are like, I didn't like this piece, and

2222
01:58:25,200 --> 01:58:28,920
Speaker 1: they're like, I disagree with you. They're like, but they're

2223
01:58:28,960 --> 01:58:31,640
Speaker 1: like I respect that you sent it instead of just

2224
01:58:31,760 --> 01:58:36,840
Speaker 1: writing about some much more politically correct topic. Like they

2225
01:58:36,840 --> 01:58:39,880
Speaker 1: were like they they noted they saw or at least

2226
01:58:39,960 --> 01:58:43,080
Speaker 1: acknowledged that it was not a safe thing for me

2227
01:58:43,160 --> 01:58:45,320
Speaker 1: to write about. And they were just like, you know,

2228
01:58:45,360 --> 01:58:48,240
Speaker 1: like respect and like I actually really appreciated that. And

2229
01:58:48,280 --> 01:58:50,440
Speaker 1: I think I think culturally, we're going to have to

2230
01:58:50,480 --> 01:58:52,720
Speaker 1: come to a place like right It's like right now

2231
01:58:52,760 --> 01:58:57,360
Speaker 1: we have either everyone is like deliberately afraid to offend anyone,

2232
01:58:57,920 --> 01:59:00,240
Speaker 1: and then we have these other awful people on the

2233
01:59:00,280 --> 01:59:03,440
Speaker 1: extreme end of the spectrum who think that hurting people's

2234
01:59:03,480 --> 01:59:08,120
Speaker 1: feelings and being offensive is like valuable for its own sake,

2235
01:59:08,480 --> 01:59:10,240
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like we have this like

2236
01:59:10,480 --> 01:59:12,240
Speaker 1: this is more on the right, but there's it's kind

2237
01:59:12,240 --> 01:59:14,720
Speaker 1: of like political culture of like like I want to

2238
01:59:14,720 --> 01:59:17,640
Speaker 1: make libs cry or you know, like I want to.

2239
01:59:17,680 --> 01:59:20,480
Speaker 1: I want to, like I want to like humiliate these

2240
01:59:20,680 --> 01:59:24,520
Speaker 1: you know, liberal idiots or whatever, like like like Trump

2241
01:59:24,560 --> 01:59:26,600
Speaker 1: does this on Twitter and not a political statement, but

2242
01:59:26,640 --> 01:59:30,080
Speaker 1: like Trump says nasty ship for no reason on Twitter,

2243
01:59:30,120 --> 01:59:33,240
Speaker 1: which to me is beneath the president of the United States.

2244
01:59:33,280 --> 01:59:36,280
Speaker 1: Like so, so in what we we don't need either

2245
01:59:36,320 --> 01:59:38,040
Speaker 1: of that on either side. I think what we need

2246
01:59:38,120 --> 01:59:41,400
Speaker 1: is just like people being thoughtful, saying what they think,

2247
01:59:41,800 --> 01:59:45,240
Speaker 1: you know, being being firm and what they believe, but

2248
01:59:45,400 --> 01:59:48,560
Speaker 1: also not trying to hurt people's feelings for the sake

2249
01:59:48,600 --> 01:59:52,040
Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, yeah, that I like you and I

2250
01:59:52,080 --> 01:59:55,600
Speaker 1: could have a really nice conversation about their fifteens and

2251
01:59:55,720 --> 01:59:57,720
Speaker 1: hunting and what they mean and why we should have

2252
01:59:57,760 --> 01:59:59,000
Speaker 1: them or not have and we can have a great

2253
01:59:59,000 --> 02:00:01,440
Speaker 1: conversation about that, and there will be a lot of

2254
02:00:01,440 --> 02:00:03,480
Speaker 1: people that would listen to it and have already that

2255
02:00:03,560 --> 02:00:05,840
Speaker 1: would just be looking to agree with one of us.

2256
02:00:05,960 --> 02:00:08,760
Speaker 1: They've I've already made up of mind, and for that reason,

2257
02:00:08,880 --> 02:00:12,520
Speaker 1: and for that reason, I'm like, listen, absolutism is the enemy.

2258
02:00:12,840 --> 02:00:15,080
Speaker 1: Like if you're listening to something and you've made up

2259
02:00:15,120 --> 02:00:18,240
Speaker 1: your mind, if you say I think about something this way, well,

2260
02:00:18,240 --> 02:00:20,840
Speaker 1: you're just going to move through the world looking for

2261
02:00:20,840 --> 02:00:24,520
Speaker 1: for challenging people that don't agree with you and looking

2262
02:00:24,520 --> 02:00:26,760
Speaker 1: to create an echo chamber with those who do. And

2263
02:00:26,760 --> 02:00:33,320
Speaker 1: and absolutism, especially moral absolutism, leads to some weird lines

2264
02:00:33,360 --> 02:00:35,640
Speaker 1: of thinking and a lot of what you've just described.

2265
02:00:35,800 --> 02:00:38,320
Speaker 1: People are just pissed before they even hear the idea.

2266
02:00:38,920 --> 02:00:42,360
Speaker 1: Even at the mention of Trump or air fifteens or

2267
02:00:42,360 --> 02:00:45,640
Speaker 1: any of these things. People can't even hear the words

2268
02:00:45,680 --> 02:00:48,840
Speaker 1: that are said after those terms without trying to apply

2269
02:00:48,920 --> 02:00:51,440
Speaker 1: what they already think. And that's you've never learned that

2270
02:00:51,480 --> 02:00:53,280
Speaker 1: way or grow that way or get better that way.

2271
02:00:53,400 --> 02:00:55,600
Speaker 1: So now I just I just wrote that down and

2272
02:00:55,720 --> 02:00:58,880
Speaker 1: just wrote absolutism is the enemy. That's I like that. No,

2273
02:00:59,000 --> 02:01:01,160
Speaker 1: it's funny. It's funny for me too, because like I've

2274
02:01:01,600 --> 02:01:04,200
Speaker 1: I've written about like, I don't like how easily offended

2275
02:01:04,240 --> 02:01:07,720
Speaker 1: people are. I don't like censorship, I don't like which,

2276
02:01:07,880 --> 02:01:09,600
Speaker 1: you know, I don't like this sort of snow flaky

2277
02:01:09,680 --> 02:01:12,120
Speaker 1: stuff on college campuses. I think this is bad. I

2278
02:01:12,120 --> 02:01:14,600
Speaker 1: think this is you know, unwise, blah blah. So I'll

2279
02:01:14,600 --> 02:01:17,000
Speaker 1: write about that and then everyone so I'll say something

2280
02:01:17,000 --> 02:01:19,080
Speaker 1: because I'm not a Trump fan, So I'll just say, like,

2281
02:01:19,120 --> 02:01:21,080
Speaker 1: you know, like I don't like, you know, I think

2282
02:01:21,080 --> 02:01:23,240
Speaker 1: this has beneath the office of the president. Or I'll

2283
02:01:23,480 --> 02:01:26,960
Speaker 1: point out an example about how Trump's ego right about

2284
02:01:26,960 --> 02:01:28,880
Speaker 1: ego a lot, I'll right about how Trump's ego has

2285
02:01:28,920 --> 02:01:31,280
Speaker 1: caused problems for them. And if people go like, how

2286
02:01:31,400 --> 02:01:34,240
Speaker 1: dare you say this about the president, like I'm unsubscribing,

2287
02:01:34,440 --> 02:01:36,160
Speaker 1: and I'll be like, you know, you sound like a

2288
02:01:36,160 --> 02:01:40,400
Speaker 1: snowflake to write like you sound like you can't hear

2289
02:01:40,480 --> 02:01:45,120
Speaker 1: anything that you don't like that doesn't confirm exactly what

2290
02:01:45,200 --> 02:01:46,840
Speaker 1: you believe, or you freak out and you want to

2291
02:01:46,840 --> 02:01:50,880
Speaker 1: censor that person. It's like, No, the the ideal is

2292
02:01:50,920 --> 02:01:54,320
Speaker 1: that free expression is important and that people should say

2293
02:01:54,360 --> 02:01:57,200
Speaker 1: what they think, and that we should engage with ideas,

2294
02:01:57,280 --> 02:02:02,240
Speaker 1: not attack people personally. And and yet people think people

2295
02:02:02,280 --> 02:02:04,920
Speaker 1: only want to apply that to the other side. They

2296
02:02:04,960 --> 02:02:07,200
Speaker 1: don't want to apply it to themselves, and they definitely

2297
02:02:07,200 --> 02:02:09,640
Speaker 1: don't want to have to tolerate ideas that they don't like.

2298
02:02:09,880 --> 02:02:13,920
Speaker 1: And to me, that's like, but that's that's just totally

2299
02:02:13,960 --> 02:02:16,000
Speaker 1: missing the point in my opinion, for sure. I mean,

2300
02:02:16,000 --> 02:02:18,560
Speaker 1: I've I've personally been beating over the head with the

2301
02:02:18,560 --> 02:02:20,640
Speaker 1: Second Amendment that I don't believe in it enough. And

2302
02:02:20,640 --> 02:02:23,280
Speaker 1: then I've been beating over the head that um, I'm

2303
02:02:23,360 --> 02:02:26,720
Speaker 1: too I care too much about the environment, and so

2304
02:02:27,360 --> 02:02:30,200
Speaker 1: I've been I've been beating over the head on both sides.

2305
02:02:30,240 --> 02:02:31,920
Speaker 1: I take pride in the fact that I've been attacked

2306
02:02:31,920 --> 02:02:35,480
Speaker 1: by liberals and conservatives within I think the hunting community.

2307
02:02:35,520 --> 02:02:38,360
Speaker 1: I take pride in that because I want to challenge

2308
02:02:38,400 --> 02:02:41,400
Speaker 1: both of the idea, their ideas that their thing is right.

2309
02:02:41,520 --> 02:02:44,200
Speaker 1: Because if it's if it's simple and right, that it's

2310
02:02:44,280 --> 02:02:47,400
Speaker 1: probably misleading. There's more to it. Like you said, and

2311
02:02:47,440 --> 02:02:48,880
Speaker 1: a lot of other guests on the show, I've said

2312
02:02:48,920 --> 02:02:51,720
Speaker 1: in the past, it's the gray stuff where we all

2313
02:02:52,120 --> 02:02:55,240
Speaker 1: almost every issue is gray. And so I think when

2314
02:02:55,280 --> 02:02:57,640
Speaker 1: I love when you get attacked by both sides for

2315
02:02:57,720 --> 02:03:00,440
Speaker 1: the same comment. To me, that means like it right?

2316
02:03:00,760 --> 02:03:03,520
Speaker 1: What I mean like that means you're you're you've actually

2317
02:03:03,560 --> 02:03:06,520
Speaker 1: thought about it instead of just like picking aside like

2318
02:03:06,560 --> 02:03:08,880
Speaker 1: a sports team or something. And also, yeah, bring it,

2319
02:03:09,040 --> 02:03:11,320
Speaker 1: you know, let's let's go. You're not gonna censor me

2320
02:03:11,400 --> 02:03:14,480
Speaker 1: because you don't like this. Um, that's I think that

2321
02:03:15,280 --> 02:03:18,200
Speaker 1: you see that a lot in Marcus arelis like bring it, man,

2322
02:03:18,320 --> 02:03:20,000
Speaker 1: you're gonna be an asshole to me, I'm not gonna

2323
02:03:20,040 --> 02:03:23,360
Speaker 1: let you change. I'm gonna accept you that assholes are

2324
02:03:23,360 --> 02:03:26,560
Speaker 1: part of this world and push right through that. Um

2325
02:03:26,600 --> 02:03:28,520
Speaker 1: and know that there's gonna be people that are envious

2326
02:03:28,600 --> 02:03:30,520
Speaker 1: of this that I have egos and agenda, but I'm

2327
02:03:30,520 --> 02:03:33,240
Speaker 1: gonna do my thing. Um. And I think if you

2328
02:03:33,280 --> 02:03:37,080
Speaker 1: can apply that to almost anything, especially people like yourself

2329
02:03:37,080 --> 02:03:41,600
Speaker 1: that have been a tremendously powerful public voice, this is

2330
02:03:41,640 --> 02:03:43,760
Speaker 1: this is something to just continue to march on with.

2331
02:03:43,840 --> 02:03:45,760
Speaker 1: And I think everybody with the social media channel has

2332
02:03:45,800 --> 02:03:50,360
Speaker 1: this a similar opportunity to affect other people. Well, no,

2333
02:03:50,480 --> 02:03:52,440
Speaker 1: and look, I think if you're gonna say what you

2334
02:03:52,520 --> 02:03:55,000
Speaker 1: think and you're gonna be an independent thinker, but this

2335
02:03:55,080 --> 02:03:58,560
Speaker 1: is this, this is what the power of podcasts. It

2336
02:03:58,600 --> 02:04:01,240
Speaker 1: happens to be an email us and you know, owning

2337
02:04:01,280 --> 02:04:03,720
Speaker 1: your audience is like yeah, like when I went to

2338
02:04:03,760 --> 02:04:05,400
Speaker 1: the New York Times to get them to run a piece,

2339
02:04:05,480 --> 02:04:08,440
Speaker 1: like they got to say yes or no, but they

2340
02:04:08,480 --> 02:04:11,680
Speaker 1: I knew it was always gonna I was always going

2341
02:04:11,760 --> 02:04:13,680
Speaker 1: to be able to send into my email list. Because

2342
02:04:13,760 --> 02:04:15,560
Speaker 1: that's mine, you know what I mean. So I think

2343
02:04:15,760 --> 02:04:19,000
Speaker 1: what that's like the power of figuring out these technologies

2344
02:04:19,280 --> 02:04:23,160
Speaker 1: is like owning your audience and controlling your destiny. I'm

2345
02:04:23,200 --> 02:04:25,480
Speaker 1: a big believer in that. I don't want to be

2346
02:04:25,640 --> 02:04:29,160
Speaker 1: depend I don't like what other people even have the

2347
02:04:29,200 --> 02:04:33,160
Speaker 1: ability to influence, like my career or you know, my

2348
02:04:33,280 --> 02:04:36,480
Speaker 1: finances or whatever. I want to be as independent as possible.

2349
02:04:36,520 --> 02:04:39,760
Speaker 1: I think that's really important. Yeah. And I think as you,

2350
02:04:39,760 --> 02:04:42,240
Speaker 1: you know, those out there, start to read Ryan's work

2351
02:04:42,280 --> 02:04:45,000
Speaker 1: and you start to kind of dive into what being

2352
02:04:45,000 --> 02:04:48,280
Speaker 1: a stoic is and this idea of stoicism, you'll find

2353
02:04:48,280 --> 02:04:50,240
Speaker 1: that that that this is a this is a very

2354
02:04:50,280 --> 02:04:52,480
Speaker 1: independent line of thinking. I mean, you didn't come up

2355
02:04:52,520 --> 02:04:56,960
Speaker 1: with it, but applied to this definitely not applied to

2356
02:04:57,000 --> 02:05:01,160
Speaker 1: this modern times and applied to how polar polarized we are,

2357
02:05:01,720 --> 02:05:06,280
Speaker 1: this thing works, um, and it is independent of any ideology.

2358
02:05:06,280 --> 02:05:08,600
Speaker 1: I mean, it just is. It's it is what it is.

2359
02:05:08,800 --> 02:05:12,640
Speaker 1: It is. It's something that was hundreds of years old,

2360
02:05:12,800 --> 02:05:16,000
Speaker 1: and it's not informed by anything we think now, which

2361
02:05:16,200 --> 02:05:19,840
Speaker 1: I think, and it's worked for all different kinds of people. Again,

2362
02:05:19,880 --> 02:05:23,000
Speaker 1: you've got Epictetus as a slave. You've got Marcus Surrealis,

2363
02:05:23,040 --> 02:05:25,320
Speaker 1: You've got there's an emperor, You've got you know, James

2364
02:05:25,360 --> 02:05:28,720
Speaker 1: Stockdale in a pow camp in in Vietnam. You know,

2365
02:05:28,760 --> 02:05:32,360
Speaker 1: like these are real people in the real world testing

2366
02:05:32,400 --> 02:05:36,040
Speaker 1: these ideas in the laboratory, so to speak. Do you

2367
02:05:36,120 --> 02:05:37,560
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like, it's easy to write a

2368
02:05:37,600 --> 02:05:40,680
Speaker 1: book and be like, hey, here's like, here's my you know,

2369
02:05:40,760 --> 02:05:42,600
Speaker 1: some some stuff I just pulled out of my ass.

2370
02:05:42,920 --> 02:05:45,640
Speaker 1: Like what matters is like, have real people tried this

2371
02:05:45,720 --> 02:05:47,879
Speaker 1: in the real world. And that's why I'm pretty confident

2372
02:05:47,880 --> 02:05:50,120
Speaker 1: in what I write about, because it's like, I didn't

2373
02:05:50,120 --> 02:05:53,920
Speaker 1: make this up. I'm just illustrating through stories what has

2374
02:05:53,960 --> 02:05:58,200
Speaker 1: been I think definitively proven through the lives of some

2375
02:05:58,240 --> 02:06:01,160
Speaker 1: of these incredible people. Yeah, and you'll see, you know,

2376
02:06:01,200 --> 02:06:04,240
Speaker 1: those two connected back to hunting one more time. I mean,

2377
02:06:04,280 --> 02:06:08,040
Speaker 1: you see people that increasingly make hunting harder for themselves,

2378
02:06:08,160 --> 02:06:09,480
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of a lot of folks are

2379
02:06:09,480 --> 02:06:10,960
Speaker 1: why are you doing that? Why are you shooting a

2380
02:06:11,040 --> 02:06:13,240
Speaker 1: traditional bow when you could be shooting a compound bow,

2381
02:06:13,240 --> 02:06:15,400
Speaker 1: when you could be shooting a crossbow or shooting a rifle,

2382
02:06:16,080 --> 02:06:18,120
Speaker 1: And um, why are you hiking up that hill when

2383
02:06:18,120 --> 02:06:20,080
Speaker 1: you could go around in this drainage, and why are

2384
02:06:20,120 --> 02:06:24,760
Speaker 1: you supposed Yeah, it's just not supposed to be. And

2385
02:06:24,800 --> 02:06:27,320
Speaker 1: once I got into it years ago, I just wanted

2386
02:06:27,360 --> 02:06:30,320
Speaker 1: to continue to find harder things and harder and harder

2387
02:06:30,320 --> 02:06:33,760
Speaker 1: and harder, and then having those ultimately Moving to Montana

2388
02:06:33,800 --> 02:06:36,720
Speaker 1: for me was the proximity to that difficulty, right, Like

2389
02:06:36,800 --> 02:06:38,280
Speaker 1: I could go out my back door and climb a

2390
02:06:38,320 --> 02:06:40,120
Speaker 1: mountain if I wanted to. I didn't have to get

2391
02:06:40,160 --> 02:06:42,160
Speaker 1: him a plane and fly. And then I can get

2392
02:06:42,200 --> 02:06:43,840
Speaker 1: my kids out. Like you take your kids for a walk,

2393
02:06:43,880 --> 02:06:46,200
Speaker 1: I could take them up. We can run up to

2394
02:06:46,240 --> 02:06:49,080
Speaker 1: a peak every morning, or visit Yellowstone and go go

2395
02:06:49,320 --> 02:06:52,320
Speaker 1: sea bowls and grizzly bears. So um, all this traces

2396
02:06:52,360 --> 02:06:55,000
Speaker 1: back as I was kind of going through this and

2397
02:06:55,240 --> 02:06:58,200
Speaker 1: thinking about it, and you know, reading your work, I

2398
02:06:58,240 --> 02:07:01,960
Speaker 1: haven't got the stillness is the key yet, but I will. Um,

2399
02:07:02,000 --> 02:07:05,240
Speaker 1: there's so many just interwoven ideas and philosophies that I

2400
02:07:05,240 --> 02:07:09,440
Speaker 1: think are great. So um, whether you're hunting or you're bowling,

2401
02:07:09,520 --> 02:07:12,360
Speaker 1: or you're boxing, it doesn't really matter, as you well know. Um,

2402
02:07:12,360 --> 02:07:14,880
Speaker 1: it's just a way to be Now. People are people

2403
02:07:14,920 --> 02:07:16,800
Speaker 1: in life is life. That's how I think about it.

2404
02:07:17,000 --> 02:07:19,520
Speaker 1: I like it. I like it. Man. Well, I'm coming

2405
02:07:19,560 --> 02:07:23,000
Speaker 1: down to Texas and a couple not too well turkeys, man,

2406
02:07:23,240 --> 02:07:25,000
Speaker 1: And so if you want to, if you want to

2407
02:07:25,000 --> 02:07:26,720
Speaker 1: get out and try to hunt a turkey, I promise

2408
02:07:26,760 --> 02:07:29,400
Speaker 1: they're delicious and fun to hunt. I would love that.

2409
02:07:29,720 --> 02:07:31,960
Speaker 1: Mark told me he was gonna take me. So let's

2410
02:07:32,040 --> 02:07:34,360
Speaker 1: let's figure it out. We should. Yeah, I'll be there

2411
02:07:34,400 --> 02:07:38,920
Speaker 1: and roughly a month and a half, so I'll Hi'll

2412
02:07:38,920 --> 02:07:42,720
Speaker 1: figure it out. Let's do it, dude. Absolutely. Um, and well,

2413
02:07:42,760 --> 02:07:44,080
Speaker 1: it's a great thing for your kids. I know how

2414
02:07:44,120 --> 02:07:46,400
Speaker 1: your kids are, but getting the mountain having them at

2415
02:07:46,440 --> 02:07:48,840
Speaker 1: least watch a turkey come walking in and goblets brings out.

2416
02:07:50,680 --> 02:07:53,880
Speaker 1: So be checking the trees for turkeys on your place. Okay,

2417
02:07:55,080 --> 02:07:58,960
Speaker 1: that'd be awesome. Well, thanks so much Ryan for for

2418
02:07:59,040 --> 02:08:02,560
Speaker 1: joining us and for letting us in on stoicism. Um,

2419
02:08:02,600 --> 02:08:04,360
Speaker 1: tell everybody where they can kind of take in. I

2420
02:08:04,360 --> 02:08:06,160
Speaker 1: know your newsletters, like the main thing you do today.

2421
02:08:06,200 --> 02:08:09,120
Speaker 1: Tell people where they can find that. Yeah, so I'm

2422
02:08:09,200 --> 02:08:12,480
Speaker 1: Ryan Holiday dot Net at Ryan Holiday everywhere. If you're

2423
02:08:12,520 --> 02:08:16,400
Speaker 1: really interested in stoicism, I do a Stoics themed email

2424
02:08:16,440 --> 02:08:19,120
Speaker 1: every morning. Like two and fifty thousand people all over

2425
02:08:19,160 --> 02:08:21,640
Speaker 1: the world get it every day. Um, you can get

2426
02:08:21,640 --> 02:08:24,320
Speaker 1: that at Daily stoic dot com. Also, we do a

2427
02:08:24,400 --> 02:08:27,400
Speaker 1: quote every day on Instagram. There's a podcast version of

2428
02:08:27,440 --> 02:08:29,000
Speaker 1: it which you can listen to. It's all called the

2429
02:08:29,040 --> 02:08:31,800
Speaker 1: Daily Stoke. My favorite thing that I'm doing now is

2430
02:08:31,840 --> 02:08:34,440
Speaker 1: I do an email every day inspired by ancient philosophy

2431
02:08:34,480 --> 02:08:37,560
Speaker 1: for for parents called Daily Dad, which is Daily Dad

2432
02:08:37,600 --> 02:08:40,200
Speaker 1: dot com. That's also a podcast as well. It's like,

2433
02:08:40,280 --> 02:08:43,800
Speaker 1: you know, like a two minute saying every day. So yeah,

2434
02:08:43,880 --> 02:08:46,320
Speaker 1: people might like that. Yeah, brand new dad. I had

2435
02:08:46,520 --> 02:08:48,800
Speaker 1: a little boy number two just three weeks ago, so

2436
02:08:48,840 --> 02:08:52,000
Speaker 1: I can do it. Thanks man. Well, I got senior

2437
02:08:52,040 --> 02:08:54,960
Speaker 1: old and in an eight month old, so we're we're

2438
02:08:54,960 --> 02:08:56,840
Speaker 1: gonna ship. I got a three and a half year

2439
02:08:56,880 --> 02:08:59,240
Speaker 1: old and a three week old, so we're go. We're

2440
02:08:59,240 --> 02:09:05,440
Speaker 1: swimming in the same ship. Literally. Listen. Congrats on you

2441
02:09:05,480 --> 02:09:08,080
Speaker 1: know what you've done and what you've built. Like I said,

2442
02:09:08,160 --> 02:09:11,200
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know that it's affected a lot of people. Personally,

2443
02:09:11,200 --> 02:09:14,160
Speaker 1: I find it to be. Um, I'm gonna I'm into

2444
02:09:14,160 --> 02:09:17,480
Speaker 1: the Daily Dad already just hearing about it. Um, and

2445
02:09:17,520 --> 02:09:21,240
Speaker 1: so keep doing it, Um, and thanks for joining us.

2446
02:09:21,680 --> 02:09:34,840
Speaker 1: Thanks all right, Ran, that's it. That's all one oh

2447
02:09:34,840 --> 02:09:37,880
Speaker 1: two in the books. Phil is reeling. Look at him.

2448
02:09:37,920 --> 02:09:40,800
Speaker 1: I can't believe it. It was tense, the voting was

2449
02:09:41,680 --> 02:09:43,880
Speaker 1: it was unbelievable. It was unbelievable. But yes, thank you

2450
02:09:43,920 --> 02:09:45,920
Speaker 1: to Ryan Holiday. I'm gonna go try to hunt turkeys

2451
02:09:45,920 --> 02:09:48,720
Speaker 1: and Ryan Holiday um down to Texas soon and get

2452
02:09:48,800 --> 02:09:51,320
Speaker 1: him on the stick on turkeys and then I learn

2453
02:09:51,320 --> 02:09:54,160
Speaker 1: more about stoicism, because I thought that was one of

2454
02:09:54,200 --> 02:09:56,360
Speaker 1: the more enlightening conversations I've I've had a long time.

2455
02:09:56,440 --> 02:09:58,920
Speaker 1: Plus Um, he seems like a guy I want to

2456
02:09:58,960 --> 02:10:02,880
Speaker 1: follow direct so point just a good dude communicating something

2457
02:10:02,920 --> 02:10:05,520
Speaker 1: that's helped him a lot. So I appreciate him. Hopefully

2458
02:10:05,560 --> 02:10:09,080
Speaker 1: I'm back. I'm making part of our list o characters.

2459
02:10:09,360 --> 02:10:12,840
Speaker 1: And congratulations A. B. Rich Man. We're gonna frame this

2460
02:10:13,400 --> 02:10:17,040
Speaker 1: beautiful illustration and put it in the studios for everyone

2461
02:10:17,040 --> 02:10:19,880
Speaker 1: to see at all times, and we'll always know what

2462
02:10:19,920 --> 02:10:24,240
Speaker 1: Phil look like and and A be Rich's mind. So congratulations,

2463
02:10:24,320 --> 02:10:26,920
Speaker 1: tons of one ten work sharp can onion field sharpter.

2464
02:10:27,320 --> 02:10:32,000
Speaker 1: Next time we're gonna do the same thing with your turkey. Calls.

2465
02:10:32,120 --> 02:10:36,040
Speaker 1: We're gonna get to your videos and audio clips that

2466
02:10:36,120 --> 02:10:38,560
Speaker 1: you sent for Turkey calls to win a Meat Eater

2467
02:10:38,640 --> 02:10:41,960
Speaker 1: signed cookbook, tc hat and tc Adie Tumbler. So that's

2468
02:10:42,040 --> 02:10:45,720
Speaker 1: next time, Episode one or three The Hunting Collective Bye Bye.

2469
02:10:47,760 --> 02:10:50,080
Speaker 1: The Hunting Collective with Ben O'Brien is a part of

2470
02:10:50,080 --> 02:10:52,960
Speaker 1: the Meat Eater podcast network. It is produced by Kringe

2471
02:10:53,000 --> 02:10:55,640
Speaker 1: Schneider and engineered by Phil Taylor. You can find it

2472
02:10:55,680 --> 02:10:59,600
Speaker 1: on iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify, the meat eater dot Com, or anywhere.

2473
02:10:59,640 --> 02:11:02,680
Speaker 1: Podcast us are downloadable. Wherever you listen, leave a five

2474
02:11:02,680 --> 02:11:12,640
Speaker 1: star review and subscribe. H