1
00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:09,120
Speaker 1: Hi, and welcome back to the Carrel Markwood Show on iHeartRadio.

2
00:00:09,640 --> 00:00:13,680
Speaker 1: My guest today is Natalia Barrocker. Natalia is the producer

3
00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:17,440
Speaker 1: and director of Fifteen Days, a documentary about the pandemic

4
00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:21,360
Speaker 1: school closures, and the co founder of Restore Childhood, a

5
00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:24,440
Speaker 1: nonprofit that was formed during the closures to defeat the

6
00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:26,840
Speaker 1: school mask and vaccine mandates.

7
00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:28,440
Speaker 2: So nice to have you on, Natalia.

8
00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:30,360
Speaker 3: Thanks so much for having me, Carol.

9
00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:34,479
Speaker 1: So on my other podcast, normally, Mary, Katherine Hamm and

10
00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,320
Speaker 1: I have a segment called Still Mad, Bro, and it's

11
00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:40,760
Speaker 1: about things that we are still mad about, and a

12
00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:45,680
Speaker 1: lot of them are pandemic era things. The fact that

13
00:00:45,720 --> 00:00:48,680
Speaker 1: schools haven't bounced back, the fact that you know, they

14
00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:52,360
Speaker 1: admit things in retrospect very very casually, that oh, we

15
00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:55,120
Speaker 1: all knew that masks didn't work outside, like did we

16
00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:57,960
Speaker 1: because you kept kids in masks outside till like twenty

17
00:00:58,000 --> 00:00:58,480
Speaker 1: twenty two.

18
00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:00,639
Speaker 2: Are you still mad?

19
00:01:00,680 --> 00:01:00,840
Speaker 4: Bro?

20
00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:02,680
Speaker 3: Am I still mad?

21
00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:05,480
Speaker 2: Yeah?

22
00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:06,720
Speaker 3: Yeah? I guess so.

23
00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,360
Speaker 4: I mean, I think what they're doing now is far

24
00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:10,280
Speaker 4: more nefarious.

25
00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,800
Speaker 3: It felt like they were just distracting us.

26
00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:17,320
Speaker 4: It was very very obvious masks did nothing, and in fact,

27
00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:19,880
Speaker 4: Randy Weingarten didn't wear masks herself.

28
00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:22,880
Speaker 2: Oh I know, yeah, because she needed to be understood.

29
00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:24,120
Speaker 2: But the kids did me that.

30
00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:28,080
Speaker 4: Do you remember when she was at some teacher convention

31
00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:31,319
Speaker 4: in Puerto Rico just before in the mayoral election New

32
00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,560
Speaker 4: York and she was busted without a mask on, and

33
00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:37,520
Speaker 4: we were like masked, our kids were masked, and she

34
00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:39,720
Speaker 4: just covered up and said, oh, you know, I felt

35
00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:43,280
Speaker 4: uncomfortable having Yeah, I mean, so.

36
00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:47,240
Speaker 3: Am I mad? Sure? But mad is only good for fuel.

37
00:01:47,560 --> 00:01:51,680
Speaker 4: Like I really prefer to be active, and I'm too

38
00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:52,840
Speaker 4: busy to be mad.

39
00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:55,840
Speaker 3: Randy is going around the world.

40
00:01:56,120 --> 00:02:00,080
Speaker 4: Like selling her book and this false narrative, trying to

41
00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:05,320
Speaker 4: to feign compassion for Charlie Kirk or victims of extremist

42
00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:09,720
Speaker 4: political violence, when in fact she is inciting it every.

43
00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:10,640
Speaker 2: Single day at the day.

44
00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:14,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, she calls people who disagree with her fascists. Yet

45
00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:15,840
Speaker 1: that's not inciting it somehow.

46
00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:16,640
Speaker 3: You know.

47
00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:17,320
Speaker 2: One of the.

48
00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:20,880
Speaker 1: Things about her is that now she says that she

49
00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:24,960
Speaker 1: was fighting against school closures, And my question always is

50
00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:27,480
Speaker 1: who was on the other side of that fight, Who

51
00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:32,079
Speaker 1: was she fighting to open schools? Because all I remember

52
00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:35,440
Speaker 1: is her blocking the door. I remember her being the

53
00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:40,280
Speaker 1: major blockade to her, of course altering CDC policy, but

54
00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:44,000
Speaker 1: more than that, she got so many of the marks

55
00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:46,520
Speaker 1: in the mainstream media to go along with her that

56
00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:49,560
Speaker 1: I remember her trying to keep schools closed in Florida

57
00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:53,280
Speaker 1: for twenty twenty two, and you know, she got these

58
00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:57,120
Speaker 1: stories placed about teachers dying. They all died during summer break,

59
00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:00,400
Speaker 1: but she made it seem like they died in schools

60
00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:03,680
Speaker 1: and schools weren't even open yet. So you know, I

61
00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:05,919
Speaker 1: have a lot of bitterness. I am still mad, bro,

62
00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:11,200
Speaker 1: and it does spur me to action. So tell us

63
00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,320
Speaker 1: about your film. What do you hope people get out

64
00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:14,560
Speaker 1: of it?

65
00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,640
Speaker 4: I hope people get critical thinking skills, because I think

66
00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:21,680
Speaker 4: we've lost all critical thinking skills and we're certainly not

67
00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:24,600
Speaker 4: transmitting into our children and they're not going to learn

68
00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:28,959
Speaker 4: it inside those like red brick doors or schoolhouses. Rather,

69
00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,839
Speaker 4: I want people to know that this happened, that there

70
00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:37,960
Speaker 4: were bad guys keeping schools closed. We know who they are.

71
00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:42,000
Speaker 4: We had extortion happening right in front of our eyes.

72
00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:45,200
Speaker 4: The kids don't go back until we get these relief funds.

73
00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:49,160
Speaker 4: Think we have Randy Becky, all of these union heads

74
00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:50,400
Speaker 4: talking about resources.

75
00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:54,320
Speaker 3: What are resources? Their dollar signs And in.

76
00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:58,520
Speaker 4: The middle of the pandemic, Randy Winegarden was demanding a

77
00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:03,920
Speaker 4: trillion dollar and one hundred billion to reopen school doors

78
00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:04,960
Speaker 4: that are ours.

79
00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:07,480
Speaker 3: We are the taxpayers, They're not her schools.

80
00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:10,720
Speaker 4: There are schools, right, So I would like people to

81
00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:14,040
Speaker 4: know what happens. I'd like them to see what propaganda

82
00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,479
Speaker 4: looks like. I would like to make sure that what

83
00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,160
Speaker 4: happened to Jay Badiitaria and people who spoke out and

84
00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,840
Speaker 4: challenged the narrative with evidence based facts never ever get

85
00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,159
Speaker 4: silenced again. And I would like us to be able

86
00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:30,200
Speaker 4: to get our news sources and our information from a

87
00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,400
Speaker 4: multiple multiple varieties, not just one place.

88
00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:36,320
Speaker 3: The New York Times, the Washington Post, the MSM.

89
00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,760
Speaker 4: That can't ever be the single source of news again.

90
00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:43,960
Speaker 1: Right, They've failed on such an epic level during the pandemic.

91
00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:45,120
Speaker 2: I mean the New York Times.

92
00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:47,760
Speaker 1: You know a porva at the New York Times was

93
00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:52,960
Speaker 1: there was their health reporter, and her corrections were legendary.

94
00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:57,320
Speaker 1: There were paragraphs long corrections because she would frequently make

95
00:04:57,880 --> 00:04:58,840
Speaker 1: tons of mistakes.

96
00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:00,640
Speaker 2: Had no business writing this at all.

97
00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:05,000
Speaker 1: Do you feel any kind of optimism over where we

98
00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:07,560
Speaker 1: are now And the fact that say, Jay Bodicharia, who

99
00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:10,719
Speaker 1: was you know, labeled a villain during the COVID years,

100
00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:13,840
Speaker 1: is now head of the NIH. Is that a point

101
00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:14,919
Speaker 1: of optimism for you?

102
00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:16,120
Speaker 3: Oh? Absolutely.

103
00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:18,320
Speaker 4: I mean so many of the parents that we were

104
00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:21,520
Speaker 4: you know, working with at that time, including people like

105
00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:25,120
Speaker 4: Tiffany Justice, are now in Washington and are trying to

106
00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:28,760
Speaker 4: change things. And these are really good people. Jay as

107
00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:32,960
Speaker 4: the head of the NIH, Marty McCary, Tracy Hogue. You know,

108
00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:37,680
Speaker 4: Jay talks about replicability. He believe science should be replicable.

109
00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:42,280
Speaker 4: That is like the paragon, that's the ideal. Yeah, yeah,

110
00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:44,320
Speaker 4: so yes, I think there's a lot of reason to

111
00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:45,360
Speaker 4: be optimistic.

112
00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:47,720
Speaker 3: And also the fact that Elon Musk.

113
00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:50,800
Speaker 4: Bought Twitter, I mean, act whatever, you know, whatever we

114
00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:54,800
Speaker 4: want to call it. The reality is citizen journalism is flourishing,

115
00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:58,280
Speaker 4: very white and the free press. What she did in

116
00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,159
Speaker 4: just a few short years, I mean she talks about

117
00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:04,560
Speaker 4: needing to build something, She's building things. I think there's

118
00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:05,640
Speaker 4: a lot of optimism.

119
00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:10,440
Speaker 1: Does your film stand as a historical record or is

120
00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:11,800
Speaker 1: it a warning to people?

121
00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:12,360
Speaker 4: Is it?

122
00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:13,760
Speaker 2: Did you mean it to be both?

123
00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:19,560
Speaker 4: That's a great question. Most certainly the historical record. I

124
00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:24,359
Speaker 4: was really inspired by Steven Spielberg's Showa project and how

125
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:29,440
Speaker 4: he realized that there was only a certain finite window

126
00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,919
Speaker 4: during which time he could capture those stories, and once.

127
00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:34,440
Speaker 3: They were gone, they were gone.

128
00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:38,240
Speaker 4: And while this is not a holocaust, these children, I mean,

129
00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:42,040
Speaker 4: it's the film is dedicated to a boy who unfortunately

130
00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:45,720
Speaker 4: took his life this past May, whose mother was a

131
00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,000
Speaker 4: plaintiff on my open schools case here in.

132
00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:48,600
Speaker 3: New York City.

133
00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,760
Speaker 4: She was screaming from the rooftops in twenty twenty, twenty

134
00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:54,680
Speaker 4: twenty one. And this is an affluent woman who was

135
00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:58,240
Speaker 4: a psychiatrist at a Brooklyn medical center, who had all

136
00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:01,320
Speaker 4: the resources and tried everything, still was unable to save

137
00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:04,359
Speaker 4: her son. Can you imagine all the stories we don't know?

138
00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:05,200
Speaker 2: Right?

139
00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:08,320
Speaker 1: How do we find out those stories? That's the other thing.

140
00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:11,640
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, when a child horribly, you know,

141
00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,840
Speaker 1: kills himself in twenty twenty five, it's hard to tie

142
00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:17,160
Speaker 1: it back to what happened in those years, but it

143
00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,559
Speaker 1: easily could stem from those years of you know, real

144
00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:25,960
Speaker 1: pain and isolation and the unnecessary things that they did

145
00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:30,080
Speaker 1: to kids at that time. How do you tell that story?

146
00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:34,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, I mean it's suicide is of course the

147
00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:39,040
Speaker 4: worst case scenario, or maybe we could argue that shooting

148
00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:42,680
Speaker 4: other people. Yeah, it's the worst case scenario. And all

149
00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,560
Speaker 4: these shooters are pretty young, right, they were in high school,

150
00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:47,520
Speaker 4: you know, maybe the last year of high.

151
00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:50,720
Speaker 3: School when schools shut down. Right, we had an impact

152
00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:51,200
Speaker 3: on them.

153
00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:55,720
Speaker 4: You isolated these people, You put them into online communities

154
00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:59,960
Speaker 4: where there were predators waiting for them everywhere and no guardrails.

155
00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:03,960
Speaker 4: Of course it had an impact. How do you find

156
00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:06,840
Speaker 4: the stories? I mean, there are so many different stories.

157
00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:11,560
Speaker 4: I mean, for one thing, the gender critical space. I've

158
00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:15,640
Speaker 4: spent enough time now with young people who have detransitioned

159
00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:21,120
Speaker 4: or desisted, who were lured into this very, very terrible

160
00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:24,680
Speaker 4: world where they go through irreparable damage. I mean, they're

161
00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:28,080
Speaker 4: you know Chloe Cole's breasts cut off, right, you know,

162
00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:31,680
Speaker 4: so many, so many stories, and a lot of those

163
00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:36,079
Speaker 4: kids fell into this during the pandemic when all they

164
00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:38,240
Speaker 4: had was the Internet and a lot of predators who

165
00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:41,360
Speaker 4: said we see you, we know you, we know your

166
00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:42,240
Speaker 4: authentic self.

167
00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:43,920
Speaker 3: Here are rainbows, come join us.

168
00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:48,880
Speaker 1: Right, did you find anything that surprised you during the

169
00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:51,840
Speaker 1: making of this film? I think people think that people

170
00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:52,840
Speaker 1: go into projects.

171
00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:55,240
Speaker 2: When Bethany Mandel and I wrote.

172
00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:58,720
Speaker 1: Still Youth that we already know everything, I was shocked

173
00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:00,599
Speaker 1: by some stuff that we learned in the writing of

174
00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:02,720
Speaker 1: the book. I didn't know, like I knew the teacher's

175
00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:05,360
Speaker 1: colleges were a problem. For example, I didn't know they

176
00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,800
Speaker 1: were using Marxist textbooks like that seemed like a conspiracy

177
00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:12,040
Speaker 1: theory to me. Did you make any discoveries like that

178
00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:14,760
Speaker 1: during the making of this film, Well.

179
00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:16,560
Speaker 4: For one thing, I had no idea that the teachers'

180
00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:18,880
Speaker 4: unions were demanding that much money, or that.

181
00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:20,520
Speaker 3: They got that much money.

182
00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:23,200
Speaker 4: And how triple what their normal operating budget was for

183
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:25,000
Speaker 4: the year. Like, I mean, it's just hard because it's

184
00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:25,720
Speaker 4: a lot of zero's.

185
00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:26,680
Speaker 3: Like I don't know what that meant.

186
00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:28,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I was told there'd be no math.

187
00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:34,040
Speaker 4: But beyond that, I mean when we discovered that in

188
00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:37,800
Speaker 4: March twenty twenty, Randy Winngarten and Jane fondam Jane Fonda

189
00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:39,719
Speaker 4: like what does she have to do with school closings,

190
00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:43,800
Speaker 4: but that they were having meetings with other progressive NGOs

191
00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:47,360
Speaker 4: to try to figure out how to weaponize this crisis

192
00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:51,600
Speaker 4: against you know, the entire world basically to get money

193
00:09:51,679 --> 00:09:55,000
Speaker 4: for their climate, social, racial, gender justice agendas.

194
00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:59,240
Speaker 3: March twenty twenty. I was sanitizing groceries, right right.

195
00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:02,240
Speaker 2: We believed it. I mean, it seems like they didn't.

196
00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:05,760
Speaker 1: It's like they knew this was a giant opportunity for

197
00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:08,920
Speaker 1: leftism to be pushed on all of us, and they

198
00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:10,080
Speaker 1: took that opportunity.

199
00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:14,280
Speaker 4: Randy said that it was her opportunity to change society.

200
00:10:13,840 --> 00:10:17,600
Speaker 4: They wanted to get rid of Trump, they had villainized him,

201
00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:19,079
Speaker 4: but they weren't able to get rid of him.

202
00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:21,400
Speaker 3: So this was a way to get regime change. But

203
00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:22,160
Speaker 3: also they.

204
00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:26,200
Speaker 4: Saw, you know, James Fonda says in the film, she goes,

205
00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:29,000
Speaker 4: we have one crisis and then we have another crisis.

206
00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:31,679
Speaker 4: The one crisis is COVID, which they didn't seem to

207
00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:33,720
Speaker 4: think was that big of a crisis. But the other

208
00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,720
Speaker 4: crisis was the racial, social justice, whatever, free Palestine agenda.

209
00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:40,800
Speaker 4: Because they're all the same thing. And that's what Martin

210
00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:43,079
Speaker 4: Goury talks about all of this in our film. Martin

211
00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:46,600
Speaker 4: Goury is an experienced CIA media analyst. He's written a

212
00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:49,680
Speaker 4: book that talks about the coming of Trump and the

213
00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:52,120
Speaker 4: eroding of faith in MSM and.

214
00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:53,559
Speaker 3: He talks about the fact that this is all the

215
00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:54,920
Speaker 3: same thing, it's all propaganda.

216
00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:58,600
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, yeah, it really opened the door to that

217
00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:03,800
Speaker 1: omni cause in such a way that it became obvious

218
00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:05,640
Speaker 1: to a lot of us that I think didn't maybe

219
00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:09,400
Speaker 1: didn't see it before. But those twenty twenty years where

220
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,600
Speaker 1: everything is heading in one direction, where you're not allowed

221
00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:17,920
Speaker 1: to say certain things and leftism is being pushed so

222
00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:21,319
Speaker 1: hard on the people, did you ever think that we

223
00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:23,320
Speaker 1: would climb out of it and you'd be able to

224
00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,680
Speaker 1: make a film like this, Like I wouldn't have said

225
00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:26,920
Speaker 1: yes five years ago.

226
00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:28,240
Speaker 3: You wouldn't have said yes.

227
00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:29,559
Speaker 2: I wouldn't have.

228
00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:33,080
Speaker 1: Thought that you'd be not you specifically, but that we

229
00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:36,240
Speaker 1: wouldn't as a society have moved past it kind of

230
00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:39,240
Speaker 1: so quickly where you'd be able to make a film

231
00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:42,240
Speaker 1: like this talking about what happened and not have like

232
00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:45,080
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure your life they target you in

233
00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:47,040
Speaker 1: a lot of ways, but you know, to be able

234
00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:48,600
Speaker 1: to be out there and say the truth.

235
00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:52,480
Speaker 4: I mean, we just released it less than a week ago,

236
00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:53,600
Speaker 4: so who knows.

237
00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,480
Speaker 1: They still can Yeah.

238
00:11:57,040 --> 00:12:02,160
Speaker 4: Hopefully not, But yeah, I mean I was going to

239
00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:07,119
Speaker 4: do it regardless. I met so many parents, doctors, advocates

240
00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:08,240
Speaker 4: all around the country.

241
00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:12,520
Speaker 3: So my resources were human resources, not financial resources.

242
00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:16,040
Speaker 4: There was no dark money, unlike some other organizations that

243
00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:19,480
Speaker 4: won't name them. But we just went on the road.

244
00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:23,320
Speaker 4: It was Stephanie Edmonds and I. We didn't have any money.

245
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:25,600
Speaker 4: We had like a very shoe string budget, and we

246
00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:29,320
Speaker 4: just went and started interviewing people because we knew that

247
00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,160
Speaker 4: if we didn't get these stories on we would never

248
00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:34,240
Speaker 4: get them. And did we think we'd finish it?

249
00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:35,280
Speaker 3: I thought so.

250
00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:37,120
Speaker 4: I didn't think it would be as good as it is.

251
00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,960
Speaker 4: But thank god Eli Steele joined us, Hawk Jackson joined us.

252
00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:42,800
Speaker 3: We had people who had conviction.

253
00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:45,520
Speaker 4: They didn't have money, they didn't have the resources that

254
00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:48,880
Speaker 4: the Teachers' Union has, but they had the resources of conviction,

255
00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:50,040
Speaker 4: which are invaluable.

256
00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:54,160
Speaker 1: How do you get people who maybe are not politically

257
00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:57,080
Speaker 1: aligned with this to watch this film and to see

258
00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:58,000
Speaker 1: what really happened.

259
00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:00,600
Speaker 3: Well, that's a challenge right.

260
00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:05,400
Speaker 4: First, you need coverage and trusted media sources, whatever those

261
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:09,880
Speaker 4: are at the moment. But the reality is, I'm a Democrat,

262
00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:13,240
Speaker 4: I was, I'm a registered Democrat. I'm an issue oriented voter.

263
00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:16,679
Speaker 4: I don't vote blindly for any party. I still expect

264
00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:18,800
Speaker 4: to vote for a Democrat at some point in the future.

265
00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:21,800
Speaker 3: I have hope for my party, but.

266
00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:24,160
Speaker 2: In this place, this place.

267
00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:26,400
Speaker 4: But but you know, I just saw a clip of

268
00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:31,360
Speaker 4: President Clinton talking about immigrants and illegal migration and from

269
00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,480
Speaker 4: like nineteen night from the State of the Union in

270
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:34,840
Speaker 4: the nineties.

271
00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:37,679
Speaker 3: I mean, so that was the Democratic Party that I

272
00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:38,320
Speaker 3: was part of.

273
00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:40,880
Speaker 4: Maybe I would have issues with it now, but I

274
00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:44,040
Speaker 4: agree with most of the things President Clinton had said.

275
00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:44,760
Speaker 3: And I voted for him.

276
00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:48,840
Speaker 4: But I think that given the fact that we interviewed

277
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,720
Speaker 4: people across party lines. I mean, Carol Vidal is a

278
00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:54,480
Speaker 4: psychiatrist at Johns Hopkins.

279
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:55,720
Speaker 3: She's very progressive.

280
00:13:56,000 --> 00:14:00,640
Speaker 4: Monica Gandhi is an AIDS researcher at UCSF progressive.

281
00:14:00,679 --> 00:14:02,320
Speaker 3: We don't agree on all the issues.

282
00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:07,320
Speaker 4: Morgan Polakov at the USC Education School, super progressive, and

283
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:12,480
Speaker 4: Anya Kamenetz, who was writing for NPR an education policy

284
00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:15,360
Speaker 4: at that time, also super progressive. They all said the

285
00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:17,800
Speaker 4: same thing. There's not much different between what they said

286
00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:21,120
Speaker 4: and Scott Ellis said, so, I don't know. I mean,

287
00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:24,960
Speaker 4: we prevent a balanced story. If the parents want to

288
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:25,960
Speaker 4: listen to us, they can.

289
00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:27,920
Speaker 3: It's there, right.

290
00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:30,480
Speaker 1: I'm not sure, all of those said it at the time,

291
00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:33,880
Speaker 1: but I'll give it a pass in the in this interview.

292
00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:36,520
Speaker 3: They were better than others, you know.

293
00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:39,280
Speaker 4: I mean, I think they all advocated for open schools.

294
00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:41,840
Speaker 4: Maybe some of the other issues were a little bit

295
00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:44,840
Speaker 4: more fraud and we don't addrest. The other thing is

296
00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,680
Speaker 4: you asked how to get parents to watch it. The

297
00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:52,080
Speaker 4: film is just about opening schools. It's not about masks,

298
00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:55,240
Speaker 4: it's not about vaccine mandates. We knew that those would

299
00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:58,400
Speaker 4: be really like third rail issues that may divide people.

300
00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:00,960
Speaker 4: You know where I stand on all of those things.

301
00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:04,320
Speaker 4: But the film really is just about opening schools. And

302
00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,080
Speaker 4: even the New York Times now agrees that it was

303
00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:07,240
Speaker 4: a bad idea to close them.

304
00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:11,360
Speaker 1: Right a little late again, but yes, they finally have

305
00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:13,640
Speaker 1: gotten around to that. We're going to take a quick

306
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:16,120
Speaker 1: break and be right back on the Carol Marcowitch Show.

307
00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:21,960
Speaker 1: What are you most proud of in your life?

308
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:29,040
Speaker 4: Probably I was thinking about this, my past and the future,

309
00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:32,040
Speaker 4: my parents, what they did. I don't think I ever

310
00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:35,400
Speaker 4: really fully appreciated, you know what my parents, what your

311
00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:39,120
Speaker 4: parents did by coming to this country into a completely

312
00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:43,320
Speaker 4: unknown place where you don't speak English, you have no money,

313
00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:46,520
Speaker 4: you have no stability. You're just taking a big leap,

314
00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:50,280
Speaker 4: and it's because you have a vision for something for

315
00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:53,000
Speaker 4: the future, for your child, so for your children, for

316
00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:56,320
Speaker 4: next generations. I'm so proud of them. And I was

317
00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:59,080
Speaker 4: not an easy kid growing up. I was super rebellious.

318
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:01,560
Speaker 4: I was a self hating Russian whatever it was like.

319
00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:03,920
Speaker 4: I didn't want anything to do with the community. I

320
00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:05,760
Speaker 4: didn't want anything to do with them. I wanted to

321
00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:09,760
Speaker 4: just be an American. And now all I think about

322
00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:11,840
Speaker 4: is how grateful I wish I could have.

323
00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:13,320
Speaker 3: Been then and I am now.

324
00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:16,600
Speaker 4: Hopefully they're still alive so I can end healthy and

325
00:16:16,640 --> 00:16:20,160
Speaker 4: I could thank them personally by making this film, and

326
00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:22,400
Speaker 4: then from my family, from my husband.

327
00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:23,040
Speaker 3: Who's supported me.

328
00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:27,160
Speaker 4: He's also an immigrant, came from the UK about twenty

329
00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,720
Speaker 4: years ago, so he understands how precious democracy is. He

330
00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:33,880
Speaker 4: sees his country falling in the background. It's heartbreaking that

331
00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:38,320
Speaker 4: we're watching the Ukses succumb to this insanity. But my

332
00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:40,680
Speaker 4: husband and my children, because they're the future.

333
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:45,160
Speaker 1: I love that give us a five year out prediction

334
00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:47,920
Speaker 1: can be about the country, the world, whatever you want.

335
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:51,160
Speaker 3: That's a tough one. I don't know.

336
00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:53,760
Speaker 4: Five years ago, I saw a lot of darkness and

337
00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:56,480
Speaker 4: living in mom Donnie's New York.

338
00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:58,760
Speaker 3: It's hard to make a prediction.

339
00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,160
Speaker 2: I are you stay if he wins.

340
00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:06,240
Speaker 3: I'll try to stay. I'd like to.

341
00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:10,360
Speaker 4: I predict that it will be a year of sheer hell,

342
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:13,640
Speaker 4: and then we'll have a least Staphonic as the governor

343
00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,480
Speaker 4: to rescue in New York State, and we're going to

344
00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:20,240
Speaker 4: have a renaissance because after the worst of times, we

345
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:21,560
Speaker 4: have to rebuild.

346
00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:24,919
Speaker 1: Oh, that sounds like a really good prediction. Actually, if

347
00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:27,760
Speaker 1: Alice Stephonic could pull out the governor's race, I think

348
00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:31,399
Speaker 1: New York has a real chance. I you know, I

349
00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:33,640
Speaker 1: we're recording this and it's funny because I record these

350
00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:34,600
Speaker 1: several weeks in advance.

351
00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:36,800
Speaker 2: My audience knows it's a lag time.

352
00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,720
Speaker 1: But we're recording this after Eric Adams dropped out of

353
00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,480
Speaker 1: the race, and it hasn't really moved the needle yet.

354
00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:45,640
Speaker 2: Maybe it will a little bit.

355
00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:50,040
Speaker 1: But it's very tough to root for Andrew Cuomo to

356
00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,520
Speaker 1: win the mayoralty. But that's kind of what we need

357
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,640
Speaker 1: right now, you know, I say on TV, like root

358
00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:58,040
Speaker 1: for the guy that bungled COVID.

359
00:17:58,080 --> 00:17:59,320
Speaker 2: It's important.

360
00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:04,480
Speaker 1: But he's sort of the best option. Is that weird

361
00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:07,240
Speaker 1: to you? Like he is the villain in a lot

362
00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:08,520
Speaker 1: of our COVID stories.

363
00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:12,720
Speaker 2: Is it odd? I assume you're rooting for him.

364
00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:15,600
Speaker 3: I was rooting for Adams.

365
00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:17,760
Speaker 2: I thought, yeah, no, same listen.

366
00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:20,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, but now that he's out, I don't know.

367
00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:25,879
Speaker 4: I know, like my Jewish friends and most of my

368
00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:29,760
Speaker 4: you know, conservative and common sense friends in New York

369
00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:32,479
Speaker 4: really want Pomo over Mom Donnie.

370
00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:35,480
Speaker 3: But I wonder if it's an illusion of choice.

371
00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:37,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I hear that, I really do.

372
00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:39,919
Speaker 1: I think Nanni's not going to be able to do

373
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:41,800
Speaker 1: a lot of the things that he wants to do.

374
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:44,840
Speaker 1: Of course, worry that when he isn't able to do

375
00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:46,800
Speaker 1: the things that he wants to do, it'll be a

376
00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,960
Speaker 1: moment of stirring up jew hatred because you'll have no

377
00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:54,040
Speaker 1: nothing else kind of to get the people going. But yeah,

378
00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:58,160
Speaker 1: you're right, I don't know that Cuomo is wildly different

379
00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:02,080
Speaker 1: and is such a better option. But you know, I

380
00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:05,000
Speaker 1: root for New York from afar, and I hope that

381
00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:08,280
Speaker 1: New York pulls itself together. But your your prediction the

382
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:10,280
Speaker 1: least to phonic that wouldn't be bad at all.

383
00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:13,320
Speaker 3: That's actually that's what I tell everyone. I'm like, it's okay,

384
00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:14,440
Speaker 3: it's going to be a year of hell.

385
00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:18,359
Speaker 4: Write your apartment out, come back, We'll have a last

386
00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:20,280
Speaker 4: staphonic and she's going to clean things up.

387
00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:22,080
Speaker 2: I hope so well.

388
00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:25,639
Speaker 1: I've loved this conversation. I can't wait to see the movie.

389
00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:29,879
Speaker 1: Fifteen Days end us here with your best tip for

390
00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:32,920
Speaker 1: my listeners on how they can improve their lives.

391
00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:37,639
Speaker 4: Stop listening to the experts. Listen to their grandma. She

392
00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:38,840
Speaker 4: had all the answers.

393
00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:45,240
Speaker 2: They know nothing, Bobishka knew all. Really, the experts absolutely.

394
00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:47,639
Speaker 1: Need to be taken with a large grain of salt,

395
00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:49,399
Speaker 1: especially after the last few years.

396
00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:51,120
Speaker 2: I really like that.

397
00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:54,160
Speaker 1: I haven't I haven't gotten that tip yet. Where don't

398
00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:56,520
Speaker 1: listen to the experts? Is that the kind of the

399
00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:57,800
Speaker 1: theme in the film as well.

400
00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:02,640
Speaker 4: It's not exactly theme, but I think that it's it's

401
00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:07,359
Speaker 4: the subtext, right, like looking to the CDC or these

402
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:09,720
Speaker 4: government bodies that are supposed to be looking out for you.

403
00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:10,679
Speaker 3: Well, sometimes it.

404
00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,160
Speaker 4: Works, but ultimately you have to have agency. It does

405
00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:17,439
Speaker 4: mean a lot of responsibility, it does mean research, it

406
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:20,040
Speaker 4: does mean that you're going to fail at times, but

407
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,800
Speaker 4: you have to take charge. And that is no more

408
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:26,520
Speaker 4: true than when we look at our children. They only

409
00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:29,480
Speaker 4: have us if we don't advocate for them, if we

410
00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:32,600
Speaker 4: don't choose their paths when they need us, then you know,

411
00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:34,760
Speaker 4: then we leave them floundering.

412
00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:36,520
Speaker 2: She is the Italian We're recover.

413
00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:40,880
Speaker 1: Check out her film fifteen Days fifteen daysfilm dot com.

414
00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:42,640
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Natalia for coming

415
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:43,640
Speaker 3: On having me