1 00:00:01,520 --> 00:00:07,080 Speaker 1: Body Donors with Joseph Scott More. I just got back 2 00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:10,880 Speaker 1: from Great Britain. I spent most of the time that 3 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:13,800 Speaker 1: I was over there in London, and the people over 4 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:19,799 Speaker 1: there are just remarkably friendly. And here's why I know 5 00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: I didn't have to do this, But on three separate 6 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:29,159 Speaker 1: occasions I had total strangers walk up to me and 7 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:32,200 Speaker 1: tell me to take my phone out of my back 8 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 1: pocket and put it inside of my jacket. And the 9 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 1: reason they told me that is that there were a 10 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: lot of pickpockets around and apparently this is a huge 11 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: thing in London, and I just didn't really think about 12 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 1: It's something that you don't think about here in America 13 00:00:48,040 --> 00:00:50,040 Speaker 1: that much, I guess maybe if you live in New York, 14 00:00:50,080 --> 00:00:54,959 Speaker 1: but certainly certainly not in Alabama. And I thought, how 15 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 1: horrible would that be to have your pocket picked and 16 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: then somebody use your credit cards to buy things that 17 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:09,680 Speaker 1: they'd always wanted. Now, let's take that and think a 18 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:11,760 Speaker 1: little bit about the case I'm going to tell you 19 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: about today. Imagine, if you will, your lady who is 20 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:21,600 Speaker 1: estranged from your husband, hadn't been together in a while, 21 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 1: and then he kills you. He takes your credit cards 22 00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 1: and goes out and purchases cleaning supplies with them to 23 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 1: clean up the mess that he created from your homicide. 24 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:47,920 Speaker 1: That's what we're dealing with today in the case of 25 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 1: Crystal Rash. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Bags. 26 00:01:57,080 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: Brother Dave. You ever had your pocket picked? 27 00:01:59,880 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 2: You were talking about that. I thought, what a nice 28 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:06,240 Speaker 2: group of people, because we haven't been you and I, 29 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:09,640 Speaker 2: Joe and I live very near one another geographically speaking, 30 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 2: although both of us are used to being in much 31 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 2: bigger cities, and it's one of the things that when 32 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 2: you were first talking about, I thought, what a kind 33 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,640 Speaker 2: thing to tell you. Except I remember being in the 34 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 2: city and I never put anything in my back pocket 35 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:24,399 Speaker 2: in the city. I always put in my suit coat 36 00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 2: or in my front pocket. Yeah, basic things of life 37 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:28,920 Speaker 2: in a big city. So you're in London. 38 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:31,760 Speaker 1: Yeah. I hope my son doesn't hear this, because every 39 00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: time he goes out somewhere, tell him to put his 40 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 1: wallet in his front pocket, and that's your standard practice. 41 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 1: And he's going to hear this now because now it's 42 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: for the whole world, right, and he's going to chastise 43 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:43,959 Speaker 1: me about it because I've been preaching to him, but 44 00:02:44,120 --> 00:02:47,000 Speaker 1: it's longer we get sorry. 45 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:50,360 Speaker 2: I thought that was an amazing thing that somebody would 46 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 2: take the time to share that with you, whether they're 47 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 2: you know, in that big city all the time or 48 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 2: not recognizing. Hey, do they call us Yanks? 49 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:04,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't hear that term very much, primarily Americans, 50 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:06,919 Speaker 1: and they don't say it with a sneer, contrary with 51 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:10,520 Speaker 1: some people might think everybody is just look, everywhere has 52 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 1: got jerks. Okay, it doesn't matter where you are. You'd 53 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 1: be the smallest town in the south, and you think 54 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 1: you're going to run into totally hospitable people and you'll 55 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 1: run into a jerk. They're everywhere. But on the whole, 56 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: I've I have yet to have a bad experience. I've 57 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 1: been going to London Oil England for ten years, almost 58 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: ten years. People will bend over backwards to help you 59 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: if you're lost, and it's very easy to get lost 60 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:38,360 Speaker 1: in London because it's so massive. But yeah, it was 61 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 1: completely enjoyable. But you know, interestingly enough, Kim and I 62 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:44,320 Speaker 1: while we were over there, we went into one of 63 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 1: the oldest, oldest pubs still operational in London and there 64 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 1: was a sign when we walk when we walked in 65 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: next to a Guinness beer ad, an old Guinness beer ad. 66 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 1: They had a sign adjacent to it and says take 67 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 1: care there are thieves about and wow, that's kind of chilling, 68 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 1: you know. And there was more than one sign like 69 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 1: that in the same specific of course, where this pub, 70 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: where this pub is Dave is actually located in Whitechapel 71 00:04:16,880 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: where Jack the Ripper did perpetrated all of his cases. 72 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:22,599 Speaker 1: So I don't know, maybe there's a. 73 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 2: Maybe that's why maybe they're saying there, I don't know, 74 00:04:27,080 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 2: nefarious behavior. I will tell you the way that you 75 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 2: brought it in there of in this day and age, 76 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:35,279 Speaker 2: when somebody does get a hold of your credit cards, 77 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 2: debit cards, they can trash you pretty quick, you know. 78 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:41,239 Speaker 2: I actually was at I was in a college town 79 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 2: and had to stop and get gas and needed some 80 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:45,320 Speaker 2: cash for where I was going, So I went and 81 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 2: used to tell her at a convenience store, and two 82 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 2: hours later, I get a buzz on my phone from 83 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 2: my bank because there's somebody six hundred miles away trying 84 00:04:57,040 --> 00:05:00,480 Speaker 2: to buy groceries and they're like, there's it's impossib this 85 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 2: doesn't make sense. And I was able to stop the 86 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:05,719 Speaker 2: account shut everything down. I got hacked at that college 87 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 2: town convenience store with my teller machine, so people can 88 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 2: tell you quickly. And I'm glad you brought that up, 89 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:14,960 Speaker 2: because it wasn't a stranger danger that got her and 90 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 2: the money. It was somebody that she had shared a 91 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 2: life with. And police found out that Crystal Rash and 92 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:28,279 Speaker 2: her husband, Zachariah Rosh, they did have separate bank accounts 93 00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:32,039 Speaker 2: and they did not plunder each other's accounts. They were separate, 94 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 2: and they were kept separate that neither one had permission 95 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,480 Speaker 2: from the other, even in their married life, for going 96 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:42,840 Speaker 2: into that account. And when the police are talking with 97 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 2: Zachariah Rosh, that became an important part of this case 98 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:51,279 Speaker 2: because Crystal Rush went missing and they weren't even exactly 99 00:05:51,360 --> 00:05:54,680 Speaker 2: sure when she vanished. How many times have we had 100 00:05:54,680 --> 00:05:57,119 Speaker 2: that on this show, Joe, where we have a story 101 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,280 Speaker 2: about somebody who vanishes and the closest person and to 102 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 2: them doesn't bother to report them missing. Ever, it was 103 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:08,159 Speaker 2: her husband didn't. He's the last person known to be 104 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 2: with her. He does a reporter missing her stepmother does. 105 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:16,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, so we're talking, we're talking literally, I think twelve 106 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:20,200 Speaker 1: days down range from when she was last seen. We 107 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 1: have to back up and say that she was last 108 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:29,440 Speaker 1: seen or known to be alive, back on June the eleventh. 109 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 1: She was not reported missing until June twenty third, So 110 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:38,320 Speaker 1: there's this big delay. And as we have talked about 111 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: on body bags beforehand, the longer we moved down that timeline, 112 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 1: the more things get diminished. As a matter of fact, 113 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 1: not only do things get diminished by time and where 114 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: and all those sorts of things that we look at 115 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 1: as these kind of outside factors in cases, but also 116 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:04,279 Speaker 1: get diminished by further and nefarious activity. So if you've 117 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 1: got this huge gap of Tom Dave and you have 118 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:12,040 Speaker 1: a suspect that still has control over, say, for instance, 119 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 1: a human remain, then it's during that period of time 120 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:19,440 Speaker 1: this individual can do just about anything that they want 121 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:23,480 Speaker 1: to do with a victim's body. And in this particular case, 122 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 1: there are some pretty ghastly things that have happened here, 123 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: my friend. 124 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:30,119 Speaker 2: Let me ask you this, Joe, because yeah, you mentioned 125 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:33,559 Speaker 2: June eleventh, that's our starting point. That's the last time 126 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:39,240 Speaker 2: anyone remembers seeing Crystal Rush. And actually the proof is 127 00:07:39,240 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 2: in the pudding. She was Crystal Rosh was seen at 128 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 2: a thrift store with Zachariah Rosh, her husband. Now granted 129 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 2: he is estranged, Okay, she has filed for divorce. They 130 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 2: are not living together as husband and wife. They're in 131 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 2: the process of a divorce that was instigated by Crystal. 132 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 2: But they are seen together on surveillance cameras in the 133 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 2: store shopping together on June eleventh. But what gets this 134 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 2: whole ball rolling is that's the last time. Because as 135 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 2: the days go on and she doesn't have a lot 136 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 2: of contact with people, and finally her stepmother sees her car. 137 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:24,200 Speaker 2: Her stepmother sees Crystal's car and realizes she hasn't talked 138 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 2: to her, not getting return calls or return message. I mean, 139 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 2: these little things start piling up. But when friends started 140 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 2: getting messages from Crystal, the messages didn't ring true. And 141 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:43,400 Speaker 2: so as police get notified on the twenty third by 142 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:47,559 Speaker 2: Crystal's stepmother can't get her. Her car's over here, I 143 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 2: don't know where she is. Would you do a quick 144 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 2: check on this for me? The police are already almost 145 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 2: two weeks behind the eight ball. Yeah, So they start 146 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 2: digging through everything and that's what led them to bringing 147 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:04,840 Speaker 2: in Zachariah Raj. They wanted to know why were you shopping, 148 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 2: why were you buying cleaning supplies? And why are you 149 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:11,600 Speaker 2: using Crystal's bank card? You know, that's that doesn't seem 150 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:14,800 Speaker 2: to be the proper thing for an estranged husband to do. 151 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:19,000 Speaker 1: No, it doesn't. And here here's kind of an interesting 152 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,440 Speaker 1: little tidbit here. If you want to kind of get 153 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 1: an inside peek at all this, Dave, you look back, 154 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 1: you know, retrospectively. I think you know, kind of conducting 155 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:35,600 Speaker 1: this retroactive investigation where they're going back. 156 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:36,240 Speaker 2: Is that normal? 157 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:39,600 Speaker 1: Really? Yeah? Yeah, it is. You have to. You have 158 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 1: to go back as far as you can. Because listen, 159 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,199 Speaker 1: if if you're working a case that you suspect is 160 00:09:45,320 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 1: missing or is a homicide or both, you have to 161 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 1: I think in all of our minds, we began to 162 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 1: think about, well, what is it that connects what previous 163 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:01,920 Speaker 1: events connect the victim and disappearance in their death, And 164 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 1: so you have to go back in that anti mortem 165 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 1: state and try to build that out. And sometimes it's 166 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 1: a daunting task, but you know, it's less daunting when 167 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 1: you have numbers, Dave. And here here's something a little 168 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 1: tidbit for all our friends. When they did a search 169 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:21,560 Speaker 1: of Crystal's financial records. What really kind of stood out 170 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:26,680 Speaker 1: is that on June the third, she had a balance 171 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 1: in her bank account of over nine thousand dollars. You 172 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:34,320 Speaker 1: jump all the way forward to June twenty fourth, that's 173 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 1: down to twenty nine hundred dollars. Now, listen, you know, 174 00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:41,800 Speaker 1: you could say, well, you know, she got paid. You know, 175 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 1: you get paid the first of the month, and you know, 176 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:46,839 Speaker 1: when you've got more going out than you've got coming 177 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:49,360 Speaker 1: in and you're paying bills and whatnot, Yeah, you would 178 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 1: expect there to be a diminishment at funds. But that's 179 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 1: a pretty striking amount. So over that five dollars, Yeah 180 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: and yeah, yeah, precisely, man, So how do you account 181 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 1: for that? And the thing about it is nowadays, if 182 00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: you're using a card which is easily tracked, if you're 183 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 1: talking about a debit card, for instance, and you're going 184 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 1: in and you're swiping this thing for every time. You know, 185 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 1: we talk a lot about cell phones, don't we, Dave, 186 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 1: and we forget what gets caught, It gets left in 187 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 1: the dust. Here is that for a long long time, 188 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: we've been able to track people with their financial records. 189 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:28,240 Speaker 1: You know, you go and you utilize a debit card somewhere. Well, 190 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 1: every time you do a strike on one of those cards, 191 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:34,080 Speaker 1: that literally pinpoints the location where it puts you. You 192 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 1: know that card is going to be in hand. Somebody 193 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:40,679 Speaker 1: has to actually utilize that card in order to make 194 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:42,960 Speaker 1: this happen. Now, I guess you know, you could say 195 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: that you know, well, maybe they were online purchases and 196 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: things like that, but still those things are trackable, and 197 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:54,320 Speaker 1: this is I think, moving forward with this case, I 198 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:58,280 Speaker 1: think this is going to be damning, damning information because 199 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 1: Dave is always been said, and I don't know that 200 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 1: it necessarily rings true, but it does. Sometimes money is 201 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 1: the root of all evil. Well, you know, Dave, I 202 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:29,439 Speaker 1: don't know that you know that that's necessarily a true 203 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: statement that I just made. People have quoted that for 204 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 1: years and years. Money is the root of all evil. 205 00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:36,920 Speaker 2: The love of money. 206 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:40,360 Speaker 1: It is the love of money. But there's also something 207 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 1: else that comes along with us. And I've said many 208 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 1: times that most of us are at more are at 209 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 1: more peril uh at the hands of the person that 210 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 1: we're in bed with, than we are on some stranger 211 00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:59,719 Speaker 1: and sometimes that you know, things come about anger jealousy, possessiveness, 212 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: you know, all those things that come around, and I 213 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:05,360 Speaker 1: would argue, I could argue the point that they those 214 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:09,680 Speaker 1: things rival and their ferocity probably even more than the 215 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:13,000 Speaker 1: love of money that would drive and you know the 216 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: fact that you're stealing from a dead person after the fact, 217 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:19,440 Speaker 1: which is you know, it's really grimmy, isn't it. You 218 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:21,880 Speaker 1: know when you think about it, insult to injury, that 219 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:22,560 Speaker 1: sort of thing. 220 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:25,040 Speaker 2: I was going to ask you about the when police 221 00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:28,679 Speaker 2: are tracking this and they're going to start with, Okay, 222 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 2: we got the phone call on the twenty third, don't 223 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,439 Speaker 2: We don't know where she is. And so as they 224 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:36,240 Speaker 2: start looking back, they're going to try to find the 225 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 2: last time they can identify Crystal Zara Rosh being somewhere. 226 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:43,720 Speaker 2: And so once they can identify it, we know she 227 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:45,719 Speaker 2: was here, do they start going from like Juna love 228 00:13:45,840 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 2: now and saying, okay, where was she on the twelfth, 229 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 2: let's find out? Yeah, And then they hit that part 230 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:53,720 Speaker 2: where now we don't know we know that this is 231 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:57,640 Speaker 2: absolutely last day. Okay, Now they look at in this case, 232 00:13:57,679 --> 00:14:00,720 Speaker 2: you mentioned the bank statements and you and see where 233 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:05,080 Speaker 2: they started and how it ended. Yet we don't have 234 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:09,160 Speaker 2: any proof of life after June eleventh, and a lot 235 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:12,560 Speaker 2: of expendors do they then break down what was he 236 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:16,280 Speaker 2: buying and was he with anyone? Because there's surveillance video 237 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 2: at these places, right. 238 00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:20,080 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, there are. And that's the other thing. There's 239 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 1: three big components here to this case from a forensics perspective. 240 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:26,440 Speaker 1: First off, you've got the financials, which I think is 241 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 1: standing alone. They're damning. And then you know we had 242 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 1: mentioned the text or you did specifically these text messages. 243 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:39,200 Speaker 1: How many cases have we covered over the year's day 244 00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: where we've got somebody that will get their hands on 245 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 1: somebody's mobile device and start to pretend that it's they're acting. 246 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:50,640 Speaker 1: They're acting as the decedent, you know, trying to play 247 00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 1: the game out if you will put people off sin. 248 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:56,240 Speaker 1: So you're going to have digital records as far as 249 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: phone records go. And then on top of that, I 250 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 1: think that what's crucial here are going to be these 251 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 1: CCTV records as well. Boy, you've got individuals that are 252 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 1: coming in and out, and you marry that up with 253 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:11,680 Speaker 1: the financial statements where you're going in to purchase things, 254 00:15:11,720 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 1: and then you've got CCTV of them actually purchasing things. Boys, 255 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: that's a that is a huge amount of evidence to 256 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: present the accused with by the police. 257 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:25,240 Speaker 2: You know, I was thinking about the CCTV cameras because 258 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 2: when you were in London, you know, at Crime Con London. 259 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 2: For those of you don't know, there's a show on 260 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 2: body bags, you know that Joe did with an incredible 261 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 2: it was blood spatter and everything else. It was just 262 00:15:37,880 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 2: really brilliant and Joe Millington, her voice is so soothing, 263 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:47,880 Speaker 2: it's like a grand Yeah. I just wanted to tell her, like, hey, 264 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 2: what do you want me to admit to because I mean, 265 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 2: I'll do it. Just to hear her talk. It was amazing. 266 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, I found myself it's the old Mike Myers thing 267 00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: from Coffee Talk on SNL who said it's like but 268 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 1: uh you know, and so yeah, that's that's the way 269 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:03,760 Speaker 1: Joe's voice is. 270 00:16:04,880 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 2: But I thought about that with London and all the 271 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:08,760 Speaker 2: CCTV cameras there. 272 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: And they are everywhere. 273 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 2: But Europe is a different place than the United States. 274 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 2: You know, everything's closer together and here in the United 275 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:19,040 Speaker 2: States we're spread out a little bit, so we don't 276 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 2: have necessarily cameras on every street corner. But in every 277 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:25,840 Speaker 2: place you're going to use a card pretty much under 278 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 2: surveillance because it's so cheap. Now, so you've got that. 279 00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, you've got card. Well, let's just say you go 280 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:36,160 Speaker 1: to an ATM. Well, there's videography with that, uh and 281 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:38,240 Speaker 1: and then you know, and they're all over banks and 282 00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 1: then some ATM machines actually have uh, you know, CCTV 283 00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:45,480 Speaker 1: contained therein so you can see it. And there's been cases, 284 00:16:45,520 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 1: you know, where you've got a perpetrator using a card, 285 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 1: you got a clear shot of their face and you 286 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 1: know with you were comparing you know how it is 287 00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:58,960 Speaker 1: in London where you've got cameras everywhere, and you look 288 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:02,040 Speaker 1: at the coburger k where they're just they're trying to 289 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 1: scrape together anything that can of the of the white Sedan, 290 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:08,159 Speaker 1: remember that, you know, passing by stores. They did the 291 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:14,239 Speaker 1: twenty mile loop. And in our case with Crystal, you know, 292 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 1: the thing that is going to be so damning with 293 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: this is that you've got multiple points of contact. And 294 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 1: that's one of the things that we look for in forensics. 295 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 1: We try to take as much of the data, whether 296 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:30,320 Speaker 1: you know, we're talking about forensic toxicology we're talking about 297 00:17:30,359 --> 00:17:34,840 Speaker 1: DNA or we're talking about electronic are in financial data, 298 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:36,960 Speaker 1: and we're trying to connect the dots and see if 299 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 1: there's any overlay with a lot of these things, you know, 300 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,800 Speaker 1: kind of any kind of connectivity between these and they're 301 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:46,479 Speaker 1: going to have a lot of this, I think. And 302 00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 1: if you want to take it to another level, some 303 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 1: of the items that Zachary Rash was purchasing, we're talking about. 304 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:00,919 Speaker 1: Now hold on to your head. Where's talking about cleaning 305 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 1: supplies and and drum roll sulfuric acid and so get that. 306 00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:10,719 Speaker 2: Is there any ration forgetting cleaning supplies and acid? 307 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:16,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, So when you begin to think about the nature 308 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:26,000 Speaker 1: of sulfuric acid, it's obviously it's it's highly highly caustic, 309 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 1: so it will burn you, it will clean. It's used 310 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 1: to clean surfaces many times. And I'll tell you one 311 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:38,680 Speaker 1: of the one of the utilities that it has actually 312 00:18:38,800 --> 00:18:42,879 Speaker 1: is you can take it, for instance, like if you 313 00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:46,920 Speaker 1: have a car port, right and you've got oil stains 314 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 1: that are on the car port, you can actually take 315 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:54,320 Speaker 1: this stuff and apply it directly directly to that surface 316 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 1: in order to get to get those stains off of 317 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: those surfaces and it will you know, it'll be used. 318 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:06,440 Speaker 1: It has multiple uses, you know in industry, everything from 319 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:11,240 Speaker 1: explosives to making a paint to just tons and tons 320 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 1: of things. But you know, you have to think about, well, 321 00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:18,400 Speaker 1: what would have been his purpose for wanting sulphuric acid? 322 00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:24,359 Speaker 1: Because this is, in fact an industrial They just latch 323 00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:30,399 Speaker 1: on these words industrial cleaning agent. So it's it's so 324 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:33,120 Speaker 1: caustic that you could actually take it, and I think 325 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: that a lot of people believe that you can take 326 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:38,320 Speaker 1: it and you can actually render down a body with it. 327 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 1: Well maybe you can remove stains with it and those 328 00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 1: sorts of things. So it's very very dangerous. 329 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:49,439 Speaker 2: I'm thinking you're getting an industrial cleaner. What did you 330 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 2: eat that has to be cleaned with the uric acid? 331 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 2: That doesn't make any sense at all. Now what we 332 00:19:57,160 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 2: have here is we got some facts. We've got money 333 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 2: being spent by you, mister Rash, which, by the way, 334 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 2: we're charging you now with spending your wife's money without 335 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 2: her permission. That's we don't know where she is, but 336 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:14,439 Speaker 2: we know you spent money that you've already told us 337 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 2: you don't. Because that was during their interview. They brought 338 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 2: him in and said you know, you were spending her 339 00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 2: money in her card and we can't find her. Did 340 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:26,680 Speaker 2: you have permission to use her card while she's gone? 341 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 2: And he's like, no, we don't do that, and you 342 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 2: realize that's against the law, right, and so they charged him. 343 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's and I'm glad you brought that updated. 344 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 1: That's that's a salient point because if you if you have, 345 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:43,800 Speaker 1: if you suspect somebody, and we see this played out 346 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:46,359 Speaker 1: over and over in crimes, and I urge anybody that 347 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:52,479 Speaker 1: follows your crime you look for for these individuals that 348 00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,919 Speaker 1: where the police are looking to charge them with something 349 00:20:57,040 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 1: more specific, probably more horrific, and they will on secondary 350 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: charges to hang on them just so that they can 351 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:06,040 Speaker 1: hold them on this. But you know the fact that 352 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:11,120 Speaker 1: this was a theft of thousands of dollars. First off, 353 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,960 Speaker 1: This just the theft alone puts it into the felonious category. 354 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,760 Speaker 1: So you're talking about a felony that you're being charged 355 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,439 Speaker 1: with in most states. You know, you look at the 356 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: way it has been in the past, if you if 357 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 1: you steal something of value or like an item, or 358 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,639 Speaker 1: if you steal steal moneies, and it's over four hundred 359 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:36,240 Speaker 1: ninety nine dollars point ninety nine cents. That's that's a 360 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:40,160 Speaker 1: felony count. And so every time, every time you go 361 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: and you withdraw, say for instance, something above that above 362 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 1: that level, these would be individual counts that you could 363 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,359 Speaker 1: credit them with and hold them there. And so you 364 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 1: can present us to a magistrate and say, look, you know, 365 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:58,719 Speaker 1: look sir, we've got we've got this individual we're charging. 366 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:03,240 Speaker 1: He's gotten moremultipley felony offenses that were charging him with. 367 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,440 Speaker 1: We didn't make sure he doesn't get out of jail. 368 00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:08,680 Speaker 1: And all the while, in the background, the police are 369 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:13,080 Speaker 1: working the case of Crystal, who to this point is missing. 370 00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 1: You have no idea what's happened to her, but what 371 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:22,159 Speaker 1: you do know is that she's being robbed and the 372 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:26,160 Speaker 1: individual that robbed her has gone out and purchased items 373 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:31,280 Speaker 1: that would be consistent with trying to eradicate any kind 374 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:34,840 Speaker 1: of evidence, either of the body or the spilling of blood. 375 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,880 Speaker 1: And I think that those you know, you couple all 376 00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 1: of that together. They had to hold this guy, Dave. 377 00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 2: You know, I was thinking about other crimes we've covered 378 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 2: where police ended up charging suspects with other crimes trying 379 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:51,679 Speaker 2: to put them on ice a little bit, Yeah, to 380 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:53,359 Speaker 2: get to the bottom of it. And what came to 381 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:57,280 Speaker 2: mind was Haley Cummings, the little girl who went missing 382 00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:59,040 Speaker 2: in the middle of the night when he seventeen year 383 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 2: old babies that are watching her and her dad and 384 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:05,160 Speaker 2: the babysitter of getting married. And anyway, they had them 385 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 2: charged with a couple of different crimes along the way, 386 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,680 Speaker 2: and it was a substantial amount of time. All the while, 387 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:12,600 Speaker 2: I thought the charges seemed to be get pushed a 388 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,880 Speaker 2: little bit to keep them in jail, separated, to get 389 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 2: them to talk about what happened to Haley, you know, 390 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:20,399 Speaker 2: and that never happened. We still don't know what happened 391 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:23,600 Speaker 2: to Haley Cummings. But in this case, we've got a 392 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:27,199 Speaker 2: guy who has, by his own admission, admitted to a 393 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 2: crime of using his wife's money, her card, her account 394 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:34,600 Speaker 2: that he wasn't entitled to because he told them, no, 395 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 2: we don't she's not allowed to use mind, I'm not 396 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:39,679 Speaker 2: supposed to use hers. So there you go. We're going 397 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:41,480 Speaker 2: to lock up for this one. Think about that for 398 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:42,040 Speaker 2: a little while. 399 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:46,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, And the motivation behind this is to make sure 400 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,200 Speaker 1: that you're keeping them off the streets because Okay, let's 401 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:51,400 Speaker 1: just say we've already got this gap of tom where 402 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:55,200 Speaker 1: Crystal's been missing, right right, I mean we viral on admission. 403 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:58,600 Speaker 1: We talked about this in the first segment of our program, 404 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,719 Speaker 1: where she has been and load these many days, and 405 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 1: Lord only knows what has become of her remains at 406 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 1: this point in time. Well, let's just say you get 407 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 1: this individual incarcerated, you don't hold them, or you decide 408 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 1: not to affect an arrest on him early on, where 409 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,800 Speaker 1: you're just giving him more time because if he knows 410 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 1: where she's at, he can continue to do whatever it 411 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:29,080 Speaker 1: is that he's doing with cleaning supplies. And so you know, 412 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:32,880 Speaker 1: the more time you have where he's out walking the streets, 413 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,879 Speaker 1: the colder and colder this case becomes. And that's always 414 00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:42,080 Speaker 1: a problem. But you know what, I think the police 415 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:47,679 Speaker 1: happened upon something that would make even the strongest among 416 00:24:47,800 --> 00:25:05,680 Speaker 1: us shudder in horror. Well, Dave, I want to throw 417 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 1: a list out to you, brother and kind of get 418 00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: your reaction to this. All right, So you're a cop, right, 419 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:16,240 Speaker 1: you're a detective, and you get your hands on a 420 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:20,040 Speaker 1: suspect's phone and you begin to break this thing down 421 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:22,440 Speaker 1: to check out what kind of searches they've been doing 422 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 1: on the phone. It just bear with me now and 423 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 1: listen to this list that I'm going to give to you. 424 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 1: You've got on here May twenty eighth, you've got searches 425 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:41,480 Speaker 1: relative to gunshot onounes to the chest versus the head. 426 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,840 Speaker 1: All right, If that's not chilling enough, you get to 427 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:50,880 Speaker 1: June eleventh, and you've got a Google search for well 428 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 1: a nine millimeter kill an animal if shot to the head, 429 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 1: and then on June the twelfth, search for carpet cleaner. 430 00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: He jumped to the twenty third. Hey, here's a question 431 00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 1: that's been posed in a search engine. Can police get 432 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:14,359 Speaker 1: search warrants on Sunday? And Wisconsin? Kind of od? On 433 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 1: the twenty fourth of June, search queries included sulfuric acid, 434 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:26,480 Speaker 1: including is sulphuric acid flammable? And let's finish it off 435 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:32,960 Speaker 1: with this one June twenty fifth, the subject who you 436 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:37,520 Speaker 1: now have the possession of his phone, Dave, Wisconsin, missing 437 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 1: person alert that was searched out. So you take that 438 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 1: in its totality. If you're an investigator, do you start 439 00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:48,280 Speaker 1: having that little bell go off in your brain? You 440 00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 1: know that look we might be onto something here, you know, 441 00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you proofs into pudding man. 442 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,639 Speaker 2: When he looked up on June twenty third, we know 443 00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:03,280 Speaker 2: that that was the day that Crystal raw stepmother called 444 00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,480 Speaker 2: police and asked them to do a welfare check because 445 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 2: she hadn't seen her, and she had seen Crystal's car, 446 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 2: but no sign of Crystal. So June twenty third police 447 00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:18,879 Speaker 2: do a welfare check, and it's on that date that 448 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,000 Speaker 2: he searches. Can police get search warrants on a Sunday 449 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 2: in Wisconsin? Well, June twenty third is a Sunday, So 450 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:29,840 Speaker 2: the very day stepmom reports Crystal missing is the same 451 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:34,040 Speaker 2: day her husband as strange though he may be actually searches. 452 00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:36,439 Speaker 2: Can they get it? Do I have basically, hey, do 453 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 2: I have time to clean up anything else before they 454 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,480 Speaker 2: show up? By the way, I think police can get 455 00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 2: a search warrant whenever a judge will sign. 456 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:49,919 Speaker 1: It any day, and there's always a magistrate standing boss 457 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:54,239 Speaker 1: expressly for this purpose. And generally folks might know this, 458 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:57,679 Speaker 1: Folks might not know this. There will be what the 459 00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:00,000 Speaker 1: way this happens? When you go to get a search warrant, 460 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:06,840 Speaker 1: there's generally a junior assistant disc attorney that's on call. 461 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 1: So the way this works is you under their direction. 462 00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:15,520 Speaker 1: Because warrants have to be very specific, you can't just 463 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:18,080 Speaker 1: can you tell us, explain that a little bit, Joe. 464 00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:18,920 Speaker 1: A lot of people don't know it. 465 00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 2: Until I started actually covering a lot of crime, I 466 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,600 Speaker 2: didn't realize what they I thought they could just say, 467 00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 2: I think Joe Scott Morgan has X y Z in 468 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:29,760 Speaker 2: his house and this is why I think it, and 469 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,440 Speaker 2: the judge goes, okay, and that's not it at all. 470 00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:36,040 Speaker 2: They actually have to do some very specific crafting of 471 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:38,600 Speaker 2: the case. The search warrant alone will tell you what 472 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 2: police already know. 473 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, what they already know. It's a big revealed. The 474 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 1: old adage, you know, a wide net catches a lot 475 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,959 Speaker 1: of fish, does not apply to a warrant. You have 476 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,480 Speaker 1: to be very specific as to what you want, so 477 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 1: you can't just say, uh, and that's where our own 478 00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: constitutional protections. You want it, I want to trust me, 479 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: you want it. You don't want somebody to say, Okay, 480 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:06,240 Speaker 1: I'm writing up a search warrant for Dave max home 481 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 1: and we're showing up with this piece of paper. Let 482 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:11,800 Speaker 1: us in. We're going to search your entire house. Like 483 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: you know, they can't go in pulling the walls apart 484 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,000 Speaker 1: and digging into what they refer to as hidden spaces 485 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 1: if they're not specifically enumerated in that search warrant. You 486 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:22,520 Speaker 1: have to say where you're going to look and what 487 00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:27,479 Speaker 1: you're looking for. So he has an awareness at least 488 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,959 Speaker 1: that they're on to him, I think at least. And 489 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:34,800 Speaker 1: so if you've back to what I was saying, if 490 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 1: you've got like a junior district attorney that's on call, 491 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,600 Speaker 1: they will be on call. The police can go to 492 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,520 Speaker 1: that individual and say, here, take your fantasy law degree, 493 00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 1: look at this warrant that we've written up, and make 494 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:50,080 Speaker 1: sure that it passes muster. Because once they take it 495 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 1: from them, they're going to take it to the judge, 496 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 1: last magistrate. They're going to look at it and they 497 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:56,840 Speaker 1: will go over it and they'll say this needs to 498 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:01,000 Speaker 1: be corrected, this needs to be need you to expand 499 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:02,880 Speaker 1: on this, whatever the case might be, and you have 500 00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:04,360 Speaker 1: to go back, you might have to do a rewrite 501 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:09,760 Speaker 1: on it. It's like it's almost like English class, only 502 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:14,200 Speaker 1: there's a lot more at stake here. Okay, So you know, 503 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:16,000 Speaker 1: once you get that warrant. You go in there and 504 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:18,920 Speaker 1: you begin to search. But here's something that's really chilling, Dave, 505 00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:23,880 Speaker 1: when you begin to match these dates up. Remember what 506 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 1: we said, the last time Crystal was known to be 507 00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:35,600 Speaker 1: alive was back on jun the eleventh. Well that search, 508 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,800 Speaker 1: the search for Junior eleventh, that's enumerated here. Now, if 509 00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 1: this doesn't send a chill up and down your spine, 510 00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 1: will a nine millimeter kill an animal if shot in 511 00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 1: the head? Okay, that was searched the same date that 512 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,760 Speaker 1: she was last known to be alive, you'd jump ahead 513 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 1: to the twelfth, and this even gives it more of 514 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 1: a chill. He's looking for carpet clean at that point 515 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,680 Speaker 1: in Tom. So, if we're you know, if we're kind 516 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,120 Speaker 1: of broadly looking at this thing trying to determine, well, 517 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 1: what the heck has happened here, you know, it would 518 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 1: lead us to believe at least that she was shot, 519 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 1: and then she was shot on a carpeted surface. Now 520 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,880 Speaker 1: you think about, well, what links are you going to 521 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: have to go to to clean this mess up? Because 522 00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,240 Speaker 1: you know, we we have the luxury as forensics people. 523 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:28,880 Speaker 1: We go into an environment that's kind of frozen in 524 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:32,400 Speaker 1: tom for us. Once we've gotten everybody out of let's 525 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,200 Speaker 1: say it's a standing structure like a home. Once we've 526 00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: gotten that person out of that environment, we lock this 527 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:41,760 Speaker 1: thing down and it's frozen. They're not going to get 528 00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:45,760 Speaker 1: back access to it. And dude, we're you know, whereas 529 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:47,880 Speaker 1: you have somebody that flies into a fit of rage 530 00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,000 Speaker 1: to pull out a gun, in this case, it doesn't 531 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:51,880 Speaker 1: it sound like flying into a fit of rage. It 532 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,680 Speaker 1: sounds a bit planned to me. But in any case, 533 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,280 Speaker 1: you shoot them. Well, you know, when you shoot somebody 534 00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,720 Speaker 1: like this, if you're one of these people that does this, 535 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,360 Speaker 1: you don't count on the volume of blood you're going 536 00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: to have. You don't count on the mess that you're 537 00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:09,479 Speaker 1: going to have. So suddenly, this individual, if he is 538 00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:13,240 Speaker 1: the person that did this, he's looking at a body. 539 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:17,560 Speaker 1: They're at his feet and he's got this gigantic mess 540 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:20,040 Speaker 1: that he's got to clean up and to boot. It's 541 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 1: on a carpeted surface, which makes it even more difficult. 542 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 2: When looking at the dates. June eleventh, there at the 543 00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:31,520 Speaker 2: goodwill store together, seen on video together, and then after 544 00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:33,800 Speaker 2: that she's not seen again, but he is seen spending 545 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:35,880 Speaker 2: her money. That's what landed him in jail. By the way, 546 00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 2: he was in jail a week after she is reported missing. 547 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 2: She's reported missing on June twenty third, or well, that's 548 00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 2: when they actually started looking for her, and a week 549 00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 2: later her husband. They've already zeroed in on him. We've 550 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:52,600 Speaker 2: always said they always look at the closest person to 551 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,640 Speaker 2: the individual, and they lock him up on the financial 552 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 2: crimes using the card he wasn't entitled to and then 553 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:01,960 Speaker 2: buying these cleaning supplies, if acid and whatnot. So it's 554 00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:06,800 Speaker 2: months later you know they're investigating. And it's interesting because 555 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:09,800 Speaker 2: once they had him in the clink, they were able. 556 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:11,880 Speaker 2: They went ahead and got a search one for the 557 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:16,360 Speaker 2: house June twenty sixth, and there were two different trips 558 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 2: out to the property Joe, separated by a couple of days. 559 00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 2: The first day they get on the property, they find 560 00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:26,000 Speaker 2: a number of cars. One in particular catches their attention. 561 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:30,560 Speaker 2: It's a twenty twenty three Mitsubishi that I'm a little 562 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 2: confused on some of the titling here, but it was 563 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:38,680 Speaker 2: known to be Crystal's car, and it was parked on 564 00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:41,840 Speaker 2: the property in such a way that if you were 565 00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 2: driving by the property, you wouldn't see it. 566 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:46,040 Speaker 1: It's obscured from the road. 567 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's kind of a hint to police. Look at 568 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:54,400 Speaker 2: this car. Yeah, the floor in the middle of the 569 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,360 Speaker 2: parking lot is not going to be their main attention. 570 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 1: Well, let me tell you how seriously they took it. 571 00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 1: They loaded this car up and flatbeded it, and so 572 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: they've gone back. They've taken this car to the Wisconsin 573 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:11,160 Speaker 1: State Police Lab where they have a forensics garage. And 574 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,920 Speaker 1: so when we can take a car into a garage 575 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 1: like this, we have everything at our disposal, everything from 576 00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:22,520 Speaker 1: alternative light sources which you're talking about, like infrared, these 577 00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:24,800 Speaker 1: sorts of things where we've got these different spectrums of 578 00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:29,680 Speaker 1: light where we can analyze things, because you know, just 579 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,080 Speaker 1: a regular household lighting situation is not the most ideal environment. 580 00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:38,360 Speaker 1: Certainly flashlights aren't to pick up on little nuances. You 581 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,440 Speaker 1: use the light source that you have and certain things 582 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,600 Speaker 1: will rise to the top. You might even have to 583 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,560 Speaker 1: wear special glasses to look through in order to facilitate 584 00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:52,000 Speaker 1: this analysis. If you're using if you're using certain types 585 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:55,880 Speaker 1: of light sources that we utilize in crime seene investments. 586 00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 2: Is kind of the stuff we see on TV. 587 00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:58,960 Speaker 1: Then yeah. You see it and they make it and 588 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,080 Speaker 1: it's very dramatic, you know, Yeah, And I got to 589 00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:02,880 Speaker 1: tell you it's very boring and it's tedious. 590 00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:04,759 Speaker 2: When you're going to til you see something explode on 591 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:05,200 Speaker 2: the screen. 592 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,279 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, at that moment time, it's almost you know, 593 00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:11,400 Speaker 1: it's almost a Eureka moment, but part of you is 594 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:13,440 Speaker 1: kind of expecting to see it, and so when you 595 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:16,280 Speaker 1: find it, you try to remain as political and detached 596 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:18,359 Speaker 1: as you can because you have to document this very, 597 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:21,879 Speaker 1: very thoroughly while you have that car. And also, here's 598 00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:23,680 Speaker 1: the other thing. If you get that car in there 599 00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 1: and you've got evidence that some type of trauma has 600 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:30,120 Speaker 1: taken place in there on any level, you have to 601 00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,279 Speaker 1: make the decision, Well, am I going to cut this 602 00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 1: piece of carpet out? Am I going to take the 603 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:37,560 Speaker 1: headliner out? Am I going to take the entire seat? Dave. 604 00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:41,120 Speaker 1: I've been in courtrooms where it seems like, piece by 605 00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:43,440 Speaker 1: piece they brought an entire car into a courtroom. Of 606 00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:45,840 Speaker 1: course I'm going over the top of that, but every 607 00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:49,319 Speaker 1: internal element of the car, in the cab of the 608 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 1: car has been brought in, steering wheels, gear levers, dashboards, seats, headliners, carpeting, everything, 609 00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:02,439 Speaker 1: and so after it's been tested, you know, you try 610 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:05,080 Speaker 1: to determine first off, what is it. If you're looking 611 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,719 Speaker 1: for blood, you don't know that that's blood when you 612 00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,279 Speaker 1: see it. Okay, if it's blood, is it human blood 613 00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:13,920 Speaker 1: or animal blood? If it's human blood, then what type 614 00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:16,359 Speaker 1: of blood is it? As far as blood typing? And 615 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 1: then DNA wise, you go back and you try to 616 00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:24,000 Speaker 1: determine if this blood belongs to the individual. It might 617 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,960 Speaker 1: be missing, and so you but you want that car 618 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,120 Speaker 1: in an environment where you can really go through it 619 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:32,799 Speaker 1: with a fine tooth comb. But you know, they had 620 00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:35,000 Speaker 1: something else, didn't they Dave. They didn't just have the 621 00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:38,960 Speaker 1: car that they were looking at. They found elements out. 622 00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,600 Speaker 2: They found burn residue. They found burn residue in the yard. 623 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,960 Speaker 2: And this is what got my attention, Joe, because of 624 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:49,080 Speaker 2: a couple of cases that we've done. I knew right away. 625 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:53,040 Speaker 2: You know, in a number of places around this great nation, 626 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:55,680 Speaker 2: we have burn piles in our yards and fields and 627 00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:56,200 Speaker 2: things like that. 628 00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:57,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, but a. 629 00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:03,439 Speaker 2: Burn pile is different than a burned area. You can 630 00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:06,319 Speaker 2: tell it my house where the burn pile is right 631 00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:10,920 Speaker 2: at this particular house, they called it burn residue. Yeah, 632 00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:14,160 Speaker 2: they could tell there had been a fire here. That 633 00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:17,560 Speaker 2: to me meant not a burn pit, burn pile, but 634 00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,600 Speaker 2: a fire took place in this spot, not a regular 635 00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:21,240 Speaker 2: burn place. 636 00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:21,799 Speaker 1: Yeah. 637 00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 2: I don't know if that's true or not. It just 638 00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:24,160 Speaker 2: struck me like that. 639 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:27,960 Speaker 1: It's the wording is odd in this particular case. It 640 00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: sounds almost like it was randomized. But here's the thing 641 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,839 Speaker 1: about it, Dave, is that when they begin to kind 642 00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:37,600 Speaker 1: of sift through this area, they do begin to turn up. 643 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:42,560 Speaker 1: Now they've reached a point now in this investigation where 644 00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:47,200 Speaker 1: they have had to reach out to a forensic anthropologist. 645 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:53,720 Speaker 1: So anytime anytime you do that at a scene, first off, 646 00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:57,360 Speaker 1: you're either recovering something that you don't know what you 647 00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,680 Speaker 1: are recovering okay as a cop, and generally what will happen. 648 00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:04,000 Speaker 1: You'll see something odd on the ground and it's one 649 00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:05,880 Speaker 1: of those moments. It's one of those moments, and I've 650 00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:08,200 Speaker 1: been part of them several times over my career. It's 651 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:10,680 Speaker 1: one of those moments where you say freeze, red light, 652 00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,880 Speaker 1: and everybody freezes, and you say, I don't know what 653 00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:16,799 Speaker 1: this is. And generally you'll call one of your other 654 00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:18,839 Speaker 1: colleagues over there to look at it, and somebody will 655 00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:22,520 Speaker 1: look at you and say, I don't know what that is, 656 00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:25,719 Speaker 1: but dog on, that looks like bone. It could be 657 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,520 Speaker 1: charred bone. We need to call the people at the university, 658 00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:32,040 Speaker 1: and generally, you know, forensic anthropologists. I think a lot 659 00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,360 Speaker 1: of people think that these people have some kind of 660 00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:37,200 Speaker 1: standalone office that are out there. You know, Hi, you 661 00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,640 Speaker 1: know forensic anthropologists here. It's not the way it works. 662 00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:43,000 Speaker 1: There's not enough yet, there's not as well there. 663 00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:46,279 Speaker 2: I'm not Joe, you're I'm not kidding. I thought that 664 00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:49,800 Speaker 2: the police knowe. Hey, we got here's the guy closest. 665 00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,239 Speaker 2: It's a Sunday call Bill. He's up there in Jacksonville. 666 00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 2: He can be there in fifteen minutes. 667 00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:57,320 Speaker 1: It's not like these guys are not They're all. Most 668 00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,920 Speaker 1: of them that you come across work at a university. 669 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,359 Speaker 1: So they're teaching. They're teaching, they're doing research. That's where 670 00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,520 Speaker 1: you're going to find most of them. Every now and 671 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:09,200 Speaker 1: then you might find an independent person that's out there 672 00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:11,000 Speaker 1: that have kind of gone out on their own. But 673 00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:16,840 Speaker 1: there's not enough work to, you know, for forensic anthropologists 674 00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:18,680 Speaker 1: to be able to do these things. Lots of times 675 00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:21,200 Speaker 1: you'll find them in museums. As a matter of fact, 676 00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:24,480 Speaker 1: two of the finest in the history of the US 677 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:30,160 Speaker 1: forensic anthropologists worked at Smithsonian and so, and that's been 678 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:32,760 Speaker 1: portrayed in movies and that sort of thing over the years. 679 00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:34,440 Speaker 2: You have to go to those types of people to 680 00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:35,880 Speaker 2: get them to go out into the They're going to 681 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:38,399 Speaker 2: go up in this guy's you backyard and sift through 682 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:39,480 Speaker 2: his dirt pile or dirt. 683 00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:42,760 Speaker 1: Let me say something. Forensic anthropologists live for this stuff. 684 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,680 Speaker 1: This is what they do. Trust me, it is they wait. 685 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:49,280 Speaker 1: You know, it's kind of like the firefighter. They're reactive. 686 00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:51,719 Speaker 1: They're sitting there and they're waiting for the alarm to 687 00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:55,600 Speaker 1: go off. But you know, here's the thing you were 688 00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:57,879 Speaker 1: talking about. We're going to call Bill, they're on call 689 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:01,600 Speaker 1: or whatever. You do not and I mean, you do 690 00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,960 Speaker 1: not want to be in this position and say who 691 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:08,160 Speaker 1: can we call. So most of the time with police departments, 692 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:13,040 Speaker 1: they will already have a relationship with these individuals, with 693 00:40:13,160 --> 00:40:16,880 Speaker 1: forensic anthropologists who are going to study bones or skeletal remains. 694 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:19,400 Speaker 1: And then you're going to have a relationship with a 695 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:23,719 Speaker 1: forensic odentologist who is a forensic dentist. And this is 696 00:40:23,760 --> 00:40:26,319 Speaker 1: not somebody where you can just go into the well. 697 00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:28,280 Speaker 1: I was about to say, go into the yellow pages 698 00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:31,279 Speaker 1: that don't exist anymore. But Google search these people and 699 00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:34,080 Speaker 1: they're just around the block. You have to have these relationships, 700 00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:39,160 Speaker 1: and even with forensic odentologists, which people might find. I 701 00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:43,320 Speaker 1: don't know, some people might find this kind of off putting, 702 00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:48,080 Speaker 1: if you will. I've worked with forensic odentologists. The forensic 703 00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 1: dentist that worked two in particular that were mentors of 704 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,840 Speaker 1: mine that worked at LSU Dental School School of Dentistry, 705 00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:00,640 Speaker 1: that were dental professors, but being an odentist was not 706 00:41:00,719 --> 00:41:03,400 Speaker 1: their full time gig. But you know, I worked with 707 00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:06,239 Speaker 1: a guy in Atlanta that was our odentologist with the 708 00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:10,080 Speaker 1: Medical Examiner in Atlanta. Well, he's a he's a private dentist. 709 00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:13,439 Speaker 1: He's digging people's mouths, cleaning their teeth and filling, doing 710 00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:16,120 Speaker 1: fillings and extractions and all that stuff. Oh and by 711 00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:20,719 Speaker 1: the bye, he's also doing forensic odentology where he would 712 00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:23,600 Speaker 1: go out and examine decomposing human remains and look at 713 00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:26,120 Speaker 1: the teeth and remove the jaws and do all these 714 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:29,239 Speaker 1: sorts of things that those guys do. So they this 715 00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:32,719 Speaker 1: case actually involves two of these individuals because they found 716 00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:38,320 Speaker 1: they found what turned out to be bone chips in 717 00:41:38,360 --> 00:41:41,440 Speaker 1: the area adjacent to where what was that phraseology? You 718 00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:45,480 Speaker 1: burn site, A burn site, a burned site where you're 719 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,839 Speaker 1: going to have these what I like to refer to 720 00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:51,600 Speaker 1: it as you're going to have these kind of deposits 721 00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:55,040 Speaker 1: of carbon and it'll be black most of the time, 722 00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:58,680 Speaker 1: and you'll see this this kind of scorched area. I 723 00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:02,200 Speaker 1: think my question is was this area dugout at all? 724 00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:05,279 Speaker 1: And if it was dug out, how deep did it go? I, miss, 725 00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:06,840 Speaker 1: I actually gave you the wrong phrase. 726 00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:13,560 Speaker 2: Investigators saw burn residue on June twenty sixth Okay, right, 727 00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:16,120 Speaker 2: it was June thirtieth. That's when they came out there 728 00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:20,440 Speaker 2: with a medical examiner and other investigators. They revisit the 729 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:23,960 Speaker 2: burn residue and they refer to it now as the 730 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:25,520 Speaker 2: burn site burn site. 731 00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:27,440 Speaker 1: And so what they're going to have if they have 732 00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:31,600 Speaker 1: burn residue, it's pretty clear you're probably going to have 733 00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:34,800 Speaker 1: what appears to be at least maybe charred wood, charred leaves. 734 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:38,640 Speaker 1: There'll be evidence on the ground on the surface area 735 00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:43,000 Speaker 1: where something hot has count contacted that area to the 736 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:45,799 Speaker 1: point where maybe you have grass that was underlying the 737 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:50,799 Speaker 1: area that is now scorched. All right, But if you're 738 00:42:50,840 --> 00:42:56,000 Speaker 1: talking about particulated bone, which sounds like what we're dealing with, 739 00:42:56,160 --> 00:43:00,880 Speaker 1: like bone chips, Dave, it would take and I know 740 00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:03,759 Speaker 1: I've mentioned this before, but just hear me out. It 741 00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:06,200 Speaker 1: would take so much time, and time is what we're 742 00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:08,840 Speaker 1: dealing with here. It would take so much time to 743 00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,799 Speaker 1: render down a human remain to the point where you 744 00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:15,400 Speaker 1: could particulate it where you only have bone chips left. 745 00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:21,880 Speaker 1: I remind our friends that you know, with a crematorium, 746 00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:26,040 Speaker 1: which is an enclosed oven that has an ongoing natural 747 00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:30,680 Speaker 1: gas supply, in order to render down an average human body, 748 00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:35,160 Speaker 1: we're talking fourteen hundred to eighteen hundred degrees fahrenheit, and 749 00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:40,759 Speaker 1: that's sustained. That sustained. It's the difference between and this 750 00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:43,640 Speaker 1: is so grotesque, but it is truly the difference between 751 00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:48,360 Speaker 1: cooking cooking in an oven as opposed to holding something 752 00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:52,760 Speaker 1: over an open fire and cooking it. So you would 753 00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:54,600 Speaker 1: and what that means is that this would have been 754 00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:57,799 Speaker 1: a labor intensive event. If they're trying to render down 755 00:43:57,800 --> 00:43:59,839 Speaker 1: the body in that spot. And most of the time, 756 00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:04,120 Speaker 1: once you've rendered down a body, many people will go 757 00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:06,719 Speaker 1: to the next length, which will mean that they're going 758 00:44:06,760 --> 00:44:09,440 Speaker 1: to try to particulate the body. They're going to try 759 00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:12,640 Speaker 1: to break it down and diminish it as greatly as 760 00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,000 Speaker 1: it can. But I think they've the one saving grace here. 761 00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:19,880 Speaker 1: Going back to our friends in forensic identology, they recovered 762 00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:20,919 Speaker 1: a tooth, didn't they. 763 00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:24,000 Speaker 2: Find a tooth? One tooth is all they're saying they found. 764 00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:25,400 Speaker 2: But they found a tooth. 765 00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:28,160 Speaker 1: And based on that one tooth, they were able to 766 00:44:28,760 --> 00:44:34,600 Speaker 1: affect an identification of positive identification of crystal. 767 00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:37,080 Speaker 2: And that's where we sit today. 768 00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,600 Speaker 1: They've got a tremendous amount of physical evidence in this case. 769 00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:43,680 Speaker 1: I think that the tale is left to be told 770 00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:48,440 Speaker 1: as to whether or not Zachariah Roush is going to 771 00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:57,240 Speaker 1: be found guilty or not guilty. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan 772 00:44:57,360 --> 00:44:59,880 Speaker 1: and this is body backs