Speaker 1: I've never been in trouble in my life. I didn't
Speaker 1: even have a parking ticket, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I was brought up like copsure the good guys.
Speaker 2: I didn't know what was going to happen, but I
Speaker 2: do know that everything was stacked against me. Everything like everything.
Speaker 3: This isn't supposed to happen this way. I'm innocent. I
Speaker 3: know I'm innocent. I know I had nothing to do
Speaker 3: with this. How is this possible?
Speaker 4: I grew up trusting systems. I've grew up believing that
Speaker 4: every human being should do the right thing. And that's why,
Speaker 4: even though I knew I was dealing with corp people,
Speaker 4: I wasn't going to break anyone to get me out
Speaker 4: of prison because I wouldn't live with the fact that
Speaker 4: I break my way out of my wife's death.
Speaker 2: I'm not innocent, too proven guilty. I'm guilty until I
Speaker 2: prove my innocence. And that's absolutely what happened to me.
Speaker 1: Our system.
Speaker 5: Since I've been out ten years, it has come a
Speaker 5: little ways, but it's still broken.
Speaker 4: I totally lost trusting humanity after what's happened to it.
Speaker 6: This is wrongful conviction. Welcome back to wrongful Conviction with
Speaker 6: Jason Flamm. Today's episode features two extraordinary people. Steve Fishman,
Speaker 6: the journalist who was the host of Empire on Blood,
Speaker 6: which played a role in the ultimate reversal of the
Speaker 6: conviction of our other guest who was in prison for
Speaker 6: over two decades for a double murder he didn't commit.
Speaker 6: And that's Calvin Bari.
Speaker 7: Calvin Buari was convicted of a double homicide in nineteen
Speaker 7: ninety five, but maintained he was innocent for more than
Speaker 7: two decades. He was released last year after his conviction
Speaker 7: was overturned, but prosecutors threatened to retry the case until
Speaker 7: last week.
Speaker 6: So Steve, welcome to the show.
Speaker 5: Thanks for having me.
Speaker 6: Jason and Calvin Welcome to Wrongful Conviction.
Speaker 1: Thank you. Thanks for having me. Jason.
Speaker 6: Let's get right into the story, because your story has
Speaker 6: more twists and turns than a Hollywood movie. I would say,
Speaker 6: let's go back to the beginning. Calvin, where did you
Speaker 6: grow up?
Speaker 1: I grew up in the Bronx.
Speaker 2: I grew up at nine to twenty two East to
Speaker 2: eleventh Street in the northeast section of the Bronx Wakefield area.
Speaker 6: And what was that like? What was your childhood like,
Speaker 6: did you have brothers, sisters? Were your parents at home?
Speaker 6: Was it a tough neighborhood? What was the situation growing up?
Speaker 2: That's where I was born, But I was moving around.
Speaker 2: Where was that At one time? I was staying in Brooklyn,
Speaker 2: in the Brownsville area. You know, it's very rough, especially
Speaker 2: in the seventies at that time. I was a baby
Speaker 2: when I was in the Bronx, but I came back
Speaker 2: to the Bronx because that's where my grandmother lived, and
Speaker 2: my mother ended up moving back with her mother.
Speaker 1: Your dad wasn't around, No, my dad wasn't around.
Speaker 2: He left me when I was about I think three
Speaker 2: or four years old.
Speaker 6: And what about brothers and sisters.
Speaker 2: I have one brother, one younger brother who's a year
Speaker 2: younger than me. His name is Abdull. That's just a
Speaker 2: brother on my mother's side. I have a whole lot
Speaker 2: of other siblings on my father's side as well that
Speaker 2: I just recently started getting in contact with.
Speaker 6: Got it Okay, So you grew up in well difficult circumstances, right,
Speaker 6: dodge in trouble and ultimately getting into getting into trouble,
Speaker 6: but not the trouble that you were convicted of. Right, No,
Speaker 6: absolutely not, And that's part of the crazy story. So
Speaker 6: you were known as a fixture in the drug trade
Speaker 6: at the time that this went on, right, Yes, And
Speaker 6: you were in the crosshairs of the police as a
Speaker 6: result of the fact that you were a known dealer.
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 6: And can you just give us a quick overview of
Speaker 6: what your life was like when you were in the
Speaker 6: game in the Bronx back then.
Speaker 2: I mean, when I was in the game, I could
Speaker 2: say I was on top of my game, my lifestyle
Speaker 2: was good, I had money, and I was doing well,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: So I don't know what else I could say about that.
Speaker 5: I mean I could have add at a little bit
Speaker 5: of a few details. Cal sometimes likes to talk about him,
Speaker 5: but you know that's not who he is now. So
Speaker 5: I understand a little shyness about it. But cal Is
Speaker 5: he once told me he was living the life. And
Speaker 5: we think of people imitating rap stars now, but rap
Speaker 5: stars back then were imitating people like cal So. He
Speaker 5: had a couple of mink coats, he had a matching
Speaker 5: mink hat. He had two what he called black Man's wishes,
Speaker 5: which b m W. The car that let people know
Speaker 5: that he made it, and I think yeah, that was
Speaker 5: part of the great thrill of it, But in the end,
Speaker 5: that brought a lot of attention into the can all
Speaker 5: the wrong kind of attention.
Speaker 6: I'm not judging one way or the other. I don't
Speaker 6: think anybody can unless they walk a mile in your shoes.
Speaker 6: That being said, how did this crazy situation unfold? You
Speaker 6: were convicted of a murder in nineteen ninety two, So
Speaker 6: on that faithful night of September tenth, nineteen ninety two,
Speaker 6: two brothers, Elijah and Saladin Harris, twenty four and twenty
Speaker 6: five years old, were murdered in cold blood as they
Speaker 6: sat in the car eating their food, and that's what
Speaker 6: started this whole chain of events that led to your
Speaker 6: wrongful conviction. Yes, were you there at the time.
Speaker 2: I wasn't on the scene where the crime happened at
Speaker 2: I was in the middle of the block. It was
Speaker 2: probably what like five hundred or one thousand feet away
Speaker 2: from where the incident actually took place when it had happened.
Speaker 2: But I was always in and around that area at
Speaker 2: all times. That was the block that I was known
Speaker 2: for selling drugs at.
Speaker 5: Just to set the scene. One of the things that's
Speaker 5: kind of incredible Cow was a drug distributor, a very
Speaker 5: good one. I mean, he's got immense entrepreneurial talents, which
Speaker 5: also served him well when he was in prison and
Speaker 5: managing his own case. But the thing that's incredible going
Speaker 5: back to the late eighties early nineties, is that the
Speaker 5: cops target Cow and they say it out loud, it's
Speaker 5: in the newspaper, we want Cow Buari and they go
Speaker 5: so far as to say he's not only a murderer,
Speaker 5: we believe a drug dealer who walks around flaunting his success,
Speaker 5: but he knows black magic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was like the biggest propaganda in the world.
Speaker 2: I think that only happened because they figured out that
Speaker 2: I had an African last name, and instead of me
Speaker 2: knowing this black magic as they proclaimed, they were the
Speaker 2: ones that were really on the witch hunt and they
Speaker 2: just wanted me by all means necessary. And one of
Speaker 2: the things that I learned later is this is the
Speaker 2: way that Alan Caaren when he mentions how you know
Speaker 2: he utilized different tactics and angles, that was actually one
Speaker 2: of his biggest tools. Because what happened was when I
Speaker 2: went to trial, not only did he ambush me with
Speaker 2: surprise witnesses that me or my lawyer didn't know about
Speaker 2: who was coming into wrongly accuse me. He also utilized
Speaker 2: the media, so now jurors were actually getting that article
Speaker 2: delivered in little flyers to their houses while I was
Speaker 2: on trip.
Speaker 6: Wow, you never heard selling before?
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I think there was even like a newsletter,
Speaker 5: a co op newsletter that did this. And you know,
Speaker 5: Alan Karen's the prosecute. He works for the bronx DA,
Speaker 5: He's got a big reputation. He comes in like they're
Speaker 5: throwing their heavy hitter at it because they want Col.
Speaker 5: And you know, Cal has in their minds. I think
Speaker 5: he's you've been accused of another murder and Cal keeps
Speaker 5: eluding them, and this kind of engenders this ferocity on
Speaker 5: their part to let's get Cow.
Speaker 6: And that's something that I talk about a lot. You know,
Speaker 6: when they take this talk about black magic like a
Speaker 6: witch hunter, they decide they're going to get Col. Right.
Speaker 6: That means, now this double murder happens, are like, how convenient,
Speaker 6: we'll pin this on you. But in the meantime, that
Speaker 6: means by definition that they're totally willing to ignore the
Speaker 6: actual killer or killers, who are then going to be
Speaker 6: free to go do it again. But I want to
Speaker 6: go back a little bit because there you are five
Speaker 6: hundred one thousand feet away whatever shots ring out. I mean,
Speaker 6: this was a very violent time, right was there a
Speaker 6: were shootings a frequent thing in the neighborhood.
Speaker 2: I mean in that era, murders were at an all
Speaker 2: time high. New York I think at that time was
Speaker 2: the murder capital. You know, you had two thousand and
Speaker 2: something murders a year. Looking back at that time and
Speaker 2: that age, you know, literally I knew that when I
Speaker 2: was in the lifestyle I was in. Every day that
Speaker 2: I walked out my house, I knew I was putting
Speaker 2: my life on the line. But you know, to me,
Speaker 2: it was a sacrifice because I felt like I had
Speaker 2: to beat a man of my household because my father
Speaker 2: wasn't around and I was the oldest sibling, and my
Speaker 2: mother lost a job and she was struggling.
Speaker 6: So even in a neighborhood where shootings were a regular occurrence,
Speaker 6: this was a double murder of two brothers, and you
Speaker 6: heard the shots, did you go to the scenes, and
Speaker 6: then how did it happen? When did the arrest happen?
Speaker 6: And when did you start to see that this was
Speaker 6: really going to be your undoing.
Speaker 2: After that happened, I had immediately ran to the opposite
Speaker 2: end of the block, and I was with a friend
Speaker 2: of mine's, John Parris, you know may rest in PC's
Speaker 2: not here today. And then when I walked back up
Speaker 2: to the block, we walked to his house because he
Speaker 2: had drugs on him, and we started seeing police come
Speaker 2: to the corner of the block. So we wanted to
Speaker 2: know what was going on because we just heard the
Speaker 2: shots go off. So once he had took what he
Speaker 2: had in the house, we walked up to the block
Speaker 2: and that's when I found out that two guys had
Speaker 2: got murdered.
Speaker 6: Did you know those guys?
Speaker 1: No? I didn't.
Speaker 6: Were you arrested on the spot or no, I wasn't.
Speaker 2: I was arrested six months later. I was arrested because
Speaker 2: Aldrick Griffin, he was one of the leaders of the
Speaker 2: Shower Posse, the Jamaican gang called the Shower Posse, and
Speaker 2: from the records that I had read, he had gotten
Speaker 2: locked up for inoperable or a firearm, a weapon, and
Speaker 2: I think some drugs. He already wanted to get me
Speaker 2: off the block because he was also my competition. Of course,
Speaker 2: the street so that's how I got arrested. He falsely
Speaker 2: accused me for killing the Harvest brothers.
Speaker 5: And remember, I mean this block gets called eventually Corner
Speaker 5: on Blood, right on that corner, and you know, some
Speaker 5: years later, there's like seven eight nine shootings within the
Speaker 5: span of a month, So this becomes a very very
Speaker 5: hot block. Juliani comes in, he wants to clean it up.
Speaker 5: Calf kind of falls into that to that profile in
Speaker 5: a big way. But when they first arrest him, I
Speaker 5: think it's March of ninety three, so that's like six
Speaker 5: months after the actual executions. It's an aspirational arrest. I mean,
Speaker 5: they got one witness who may or may not hold
Speaker 5: up in court, but they want Cal off the street.
Speaker 5: So hey, we're gonna throw him in jail for as
Speaker 5: long as we can, and we're going to try and
Speaker 5: develop a case while we're holding him, and they don't
Speaker 5: have a case. It takes some years, and the thing
Speaker 5: that comes out is that they're actually about to walk
Speaker 5: away from this case. They're completely bluffing. Cal mentions Alan Karen,
Speaker 5: the prosecutor, and really he tells me in the podcast
Speaker 5: he had no case. He says, I was bluffing I
Speaker 5: was going to take this as far as I could
Speaker 5: and then dismiss it. And then there's a twist and
Speaker 5: a turn that intervenes three years later.
Speaker 1: I wanted to touch on that too.
Speaker 2: I literally have to commence Steve because I think that
Speaker 2: he did a more thorough investigation than any prosecutor, than
Speaker 2: any lawyer that I ever had, than any detective that
Speaker 2: was ever on my case. And he talked to every
Speaker 2: single individual that had anything to do with my case.
Speaker 2: And you know, with that bluff that he said that
Speaker 2: was a violation of the sixth Amendment to my speedy
Speaker 2: trial rights. He never had had a case against me.
Speaker 2: They always knew that that guy initially was lying. When
Speaker 2: he got arrested, he immediately went back to Jamaica. He
Speaker 2: wasn't trying to cooperate with them. He just utilized me
Speaker 2: to get out of jail and possibly get back on
Speaker 2: the block to try to take over what I had
Speaker 2: going on out there, you understand. And the sad part
Speaker 2: about it is when you talk about Alan Caaron, you
Speaker 2: talk about one of Robert Johnson's leading hitman, so speak.
Speaker 5: That Johnson's the district attorney in the Bronx for twenty
Speaker 5: five years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And with him, it's sad because I know that
Speaker 2: that man has a lot of individuals possibly in prison
Speaker 2: right now for cases they didn't commit. And with Robert Johnson,
Speaker 2: the reason why I brought him up is because under
Speaker 2: his tenure, the Bronx had the most Brady violation and
Speaker 2: prosbittorial misconduct violations than any other borough. And none of
Speaker 2: them ever has been chastised or punished for none of
Speaker 2: these acts. So when they get away with doing these things,
Speaker 2: they walk around as though they are above the law,
Speaker 2: like with impunity that they have no punity. So it's
Speaker 2: just sad, you know, rather than see justice done, Alan Cameron,
Speaker 2: rather uphold the conviction. And that's who this man is.
Speaker 2: And it's just a lot of other people that I
Speaker 2: know that are in the situation that I am, because
Speaker 2: when this God took a set on you, he was
Speaker 2: gonna go by all means to take you down, period
Speaker 2: and he showed that clearly when he spoke to Steve.
Speaker 1: He has no impunity for that, you know.
Speaker 6: No, it's something that we talk about unwrung for conviction
Speaker 6: a lot, which is that until we are able to
Speaker 6: get rid of prosecutorial immunity, which is almost total but
Speaker 6: probably the only profession that enjoys that type of protection. Right,
Speaker 6: almost any job that you do. If you're a doctor
Speaker 6: and you mess up, you know you're going down. I mean,
Speaker 6: it's like and there's so many exis samples of that,
Speaker 6: but they're able to get away with just insane things.
Speaker 6: I mean, it's the most powerful position in the justice system.
Speaker 6: I think most people think that a judge has an
Speaker 6: ultimate authority, but we know, those of us who are
Speaker 6: in this business, no, definitely that the prosecutor has so
Speaker 6: much power. They can drop charges whenever they want to,
Speaker 6: for whatever reason they want to. They can throw the
Speaker 6: harshest penalties at you. In an attempt to bluff, as
Speaker 6: you said, to get you to cop a plea.
Speaker 5: Col Is offered a plea three years, three years, and
Speaker 5: he turned it down because he's innocent. And you know,
Speaker 5: to your point about the prosecutors, one thing that happens
Speaker 5: is the system gives them, legitimately by law, enormous advantages.
Speaker 5: Now imagine six witnesses come forward and testify against cal
Speaker 5: and they're really drug dealers who have been in the
Speaker 5: scene or people who have committed crimes, and the prosecution
Speaker 5: is allowed to encouraged to hand out deals.
Speaker 6: Sure.
Speaker 5: And so there's actually a guy in prison and they
Speaker 5: go to him and they say how long you want
Speaker 5: to do right or you can testify against Cal. And
Speaker 5: by the way, there's a guy who's very close to Cal.
Speaker 5: This all happens. It's a kind of intimate drama. It
Speaker 5: all happens within most of it, within a circle. But
Speaker 5: the second advantage, and this is what really shocked me.
Speaker 5: I think when I looked at the transcript, you know,
Speaker 5: eleven hundred pages thick, Cal had it sent to me.
Speaker 5: This is of a trial in nineteen ninety five. As
Speaker 5: Cal alluded to. The prosecutor goes to the judge and says,
Speaker 5: Calvin Buari black magic. Calvin Bari is so dangerous. We
Speaker 5: need in order of protection. The judge says, all right,
Speaker 5: you know, I mean the judge isn't running this. It's
Speaker 5: the prosecution that's running this. He says, Okay, I don't
Speaker 5: want to be on the front page of the New
Speaker 5: York Post if something happens. And so that means that
Speaker 5: Cal and his attorney cannot know who is going to
Speaker 5: testify against him until the witness walks to the stand. Now,
Speaker 5: I mean imagine that kind of disadvantage and that's legal.
Speaker 5: To your point, Jason, there's a kind of immunity. Whether
Speaker 5: I don't think it's in the law, but it in practice.
Speaker 5: Prosecutors are not held to account for there. Let's give
Speaker 5: it the best, the best interpretation. They're mistakes. Sometimes those
Speaker 5: mistakes are due to overzealousness or refusal to look at
Speaker 5: the facts, and it doesn't have an impact on a career,
Speaker 5: so you know, recidivism, that's what we're talking about, right.
Speaker 6: They are, in fact immune in so many ways. Freedom
Speaker 6: Agenda is a proud sponsor of this episode of Wrongful Conviction.
Speaker 6: Freedom Agenda is led by people directly impacted by incarceration,
Speaker 6: and they're organizing to get Mayor Eric Adams to follow
Speaker 6: the law and shut down Rikers Island. Right now, thousands
Speaker 6: of people are awaiting trial there in life threatening conditions.
Speaker 6: Freedom Agenda is committed to creating a safer and more
Speaker 6: just city by winning investments in long neglected communities, protecting
Speaker 6: the rights of people involved in the criminal legal system,
Speaker 6: and ending the cycle of violence that Rikers perpetuates. To
Speaker 6: learn more about the campaign to close Rikers and to
Speaker 6: sign up for Freedom Agenda's mailing list, go to campaign
Speaker 6: to close Rikers dot org, slash get involved, or follow
Speaker 6: that Freedom Agenda and why on social media. There's a
Speaker 6: couple things that I want to highlight. One is that
Speaker 6: had they really believed that you murdered two people in
Speaker 6: cold blood, there's no possibility they would have offered you
Speaker 6: three years. That's ridiculous, right, That's just I mean that
Speaker 6: you have you really have to suspend a lot of
Speaker 6: layers of disbelief in order to try to give yourself
Speaker 6: around that one. And what you were talking about is
Speaker 6: a legal principle that was developed in England centuries ago,
Speaker 6: which is called trial by ambush, right, which was where
Speaker 6: they would not tell the defense anything that they were
Speaker 6: going to say or do, or who they were going
Speaker 6: to bring in. Their thought was that this way they
Speaker 6: would get to the truth because they would just use
Speaker 6: this surprise tactic. But of course it's just patently unfair.
Speaker 6: And now we have the Brady decision from nineteen sixty
Speaker 6: four in which the Supreme Court said that prosecutors have
Speaker 6: a duty, that obligation to disclose exculpatory evidence to the defense,
Speaker 6: but they left it up to the prosecutors to decide
Speaker 6: what they considered to be exculpatory. So they really they
Speaker 6: had it right, and then they sort of pulled the
Speaker 6: rugout from under their own decision, which left us in
Speaker 6: this situation where we see time and again in New
Speaker 6: York State, it's common that they sometimes they turn it
Speaker 6: over the day of the tr trial too, right, so
Speaker 6: it's like, oh, here's the stuff, and then what are
Speaker 6: you supposed to do? Like, you can't, you can't, you
Speaker 6: can't examine it.
Speaker 2: And investigate, you can't do anything. It's absolutely what you said,
Speaker 2: it's a trial by ambush, I mean, and that's how
Speaker 2: I was ultimately sadbag and convicted because if you're looking
Speaker 2: at the ambush and you're looking at the media that
Speaker 2: was brought up against me, then you have six individuals
Speaker 2: that say they know me, and some of them I
Speaker 2: didn't know, then you got a conviction. I'm not innocent
Speaker 2: to proven guilty. I'm guilty until I prove my innocence.
Speaker 2: And that's absolutely what happened to me. But I also
Speaker 2: think that Alan caaron to to touch more on that
Speaker 2: point that Steve brought up. He was actually promoted after
Speaker 2: all of that. He was Robert Johnson's ada top dog
Speaker 2: in that office, and he allowed him to do whatever
Speaker 2: he wanted to. That's why he has that attitude that
Speaker 2: he has. Would you believe that out of four file folders,
Speaker 2: three of those filfolders went missing and my case complete?
Speaker 2: So you know, this is the new tactic that Alan
Speaker 2: Karon employed. He's not only gonna turn over this sculpatory evidence,
Speaker 2: he gonna make sure that the any esculpatory evidence just disappears.
Speaker 1: Period.
Speaker 2: So what do you do now when you have evidence
Speaker 2: that they have in their possession they possibly always knew
Speaker 2: I didn't commit the crime that you're gonna never be
Speaker 2: able to get your hands on. There's also some type
Speaker 2: of justice reform that needs to be done with that.
Speaker 2: I think that there needs to be an open case
Speaker 2: foul with the defense attorney and the prosecutor. Because there
Speaker 2: are both officers of the court, they share the same
Speaker 2: ethical duty. It shouldn't be a disadvantage where they have
Speaker 2: all the power. And then if you have anything that
Speaker 2: can support your position and you'll never get it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you'll never know about it, and it is crazy.
Speaker 6: But the fact is that, as we all know, in
Speaker 6: a civil trial, everyone has to turn over everything and
Speaker 6: all you're arguing about is money. In this case, they
Speaker 6: were arguing about your life. And that's for some reason
Speaker 6: that's not true with the same level of respect by
Speaker 6: the justice system as money is, which just strikes me
Speaker 6: as Alice in Wonderland, like completely upside down and inside out.
Speaker 6: It doesn't make any damn sense. So back to you,
Speaker 6: did you know after you go through this trial, they
Speaker 6: have these witnesses, every one of which was an incentivized witness, right,
Speaker 6: and you know, had every reason to lie. They didn't
Speaker 6: really care about you. In some cases they wanted you
Speaker 6: convicted because, as Robinson did, he wanted you off the
Speaker 6: street so he could have it to himself. So, I
Speaker 6: mean he had multiple reasons he was getting off and
Speaker 6: he was going into a better business situation, yeah, because
Speaker 6: his main competitor was going to be behind bars. So
Speaker 6: when the jury went out, did you think you had
Speaker 6: a snowballs chance in hell of being vindicated?
Speaker 2: I mean, truthfully, I put my faith in God and
Speaker 2: at that time, and I'm taking myself back to that time,
Speaker 2: I didn't know what was going to happen, but I
Speaker 2: do know that, you know, everything was stacked against me.
Speaker 1: Everything like everything.
Speaker 5: Let me just add to that, because Dwight Robinson he's
Speaker 5: a key, key character. He's a guy who he idolized
Speaker 5: cal He's four years younger. He admires Cal and then
Speaker 5: for whatever internal dynamics, he feels spurned. He's hurt. He's
Speaker 5: also at the same time really ambitious, and that results
Speaker 5: in an attempted murder of cal So. Dwight Robinson emerges
Speaker 5: as the central witness. He organizes the prosecution. The prosecutor
Speaker 5: uses the word to me. He says Dwight Robinson was
Speaker 5: a gift. Dwight is bringing people into the prosecutor's office
Speaker 5: in the back of police cruisers. So he is not
Speaker 5: only an arm of the prosecution, he's like a lieutenant
Speaker 5: of the prosecution. They can't do it without him. He
Speaker 5: has just I think three months prior to tried to
Speaker 5: murder cal in are weeks ply three weeks pride just
Speaker 5: in a hall bullets in an ambush, right, and that
Speaker 5: information is kept from the jury in this sense, it's
Speaker 5: brought up. Dwight denies it on the stand. At the
Speaker 5: same time, according to Dwight, and Dwight spent a lot
Speaker 5: of time talking to me. According to Dwight. It's common
Speaker 5: knowledge among the prosecutions, certainly among the cops or the detectives.
Speaker 5: And at one point I said to Dwight, I said,
Speaker 5: were you surprised that they let you commit perjury on
Speaker 5: the stand? And he said, nah, nah, I understood the game.
Speaker 5: It's dirty all around. You tell the truth, you're going
Speaker 5: to lose every time. That may be the most chilling
Speaker 5: thing that I heard. You know, that kind of organization,
Speaker 5: that kind of organizing of the prosecution. In fact, that
Speaker 5: kind of by Dwight Robinson, that kind of utilizing of
Speaker 5: the prosecution, becoming this collaborator of the prosecution. And I
Speaker 5: think Calius phrase trying to kill Cow by other means.
Speaker 5: He failed with bullets, So now he teams up in
Speaker 5: the prosecution. And by the way, Dwight admits that he says, yeah,
Speaker 5: I wanted to get Cow off the street and I
Speaker 5: saw this opportunity. So cal has to spend the next
Speaker 5: two decades of his life proving the Dwight Robinson, this
Speaker 5: guy once idolized him, is a liar. And that's I mean,
Speaker 5: that's a drama that shouldn't be imposed on to anybody.
Speaker 5: But it is an amazing drama to follow.
Speaker 6: And let's get to that because that's one of the
Speaker 6: more interesting aspects of this case, I think, is that
Speaker 6: you end up being convicted. You were sentenced to fifty
Speaker 6: years of life, fifty the life, right, so that's pretty
Speaker 6: much game over. But you didn't give up. It would
Speaker 6: have been pretty easy to give up at that point,
Speaker 6: you know, I mean you have now seen the justice
Speaker 6: system at its worst, and you know what they're capable of.
Speaker 6: You know that they're they're hiding stuff, they're bringing.
Speaker 1: On witnesses riding with his sentence to lie.
Speaker 6: And the most nefarious characters they're bringing on to the stand,
Speaker 6: like Robinson, right, who they knew was a bad guy, right,
Speaker 6: but they didn't care. So you know what they're capable of.
Speaker 6: You know how steep of a hill you've got to
Speaker 6: climb now, because it just got one hundred times harder
Speaker 6: because now you're behind bars and you're looking at fifty
Speaker 6: to life. And then things get really interesting all of
Speaker 6: a sudden when you get a letter in the mail, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've received a foot from Dwight Robinson.
Speaker 5: Yeah, eight years after his conviction.
Speaker 6: And where were you serving at this point?
Speaker 2: I was an upstate correctional facility at that.
Speaker 6: Time, maximum security, yes, right.
Speaker 2: And when he wrote me, he started explaining, like I've
Speaker 2: seen them, remorse in them, because you know, one of
Speaker 2: the things that or jumped out with me is the
Speaker 2: fact that he started saying, you know, Cal, I'm on
Speaker 2: the inside looking out now, you know, I know your
Speaker 2: hand and called for this, and you know, I started
Speaker 2: to say some type of remorse, you know, when it
Speaker 2: started from there.
Speaker 6: The wait, he was in prison writing to you.
Speaker 5: Yes, he had been convicted of a different murder under
Speaker 5: very remarkably.
Speaker 1: Similar similar circumstances.
Speaker 5: But so Dwight's doing twenty five to life.
Speaker 6: Right, And let's just point out for a second that
Speaker 6: that murder didn't ever really have to happen. If they
Speaker 6: would have just arrested him when they should have in
Speaker 6: the first place, he wouldn't have been free to go
Speaker 6: kill whoever it was if he killed. But okay, so
Speaker 6: let's just put that on the side for a second. Right,
Speaker 6: So you're here in this maximum security prison. First of all,
Speaker 6: is it as bad as it sounds?
Speaker 2: I mean, yes, I mean, especially at that time in
Speaker 2: that era, it was a whole lot of I mean,
Speaker 2: if you look at right because Alan in Upstate in
Speaker 2: the early nineties, that's when they started to have the
Speaker 2: most cutting, stabbings and all that type of stuff. So,
Speaker 2: I mean, Jill is just not a place for nobody
Speaker 2: to me.
Speaker 5: I always wondered, Cal. You know, you're sentenced to fifty
Speaker 5: years to life for crimes you didn't do. I mean,
Speaker 5: you have to be angry, and I mean it's oh I.
Speaker 2: Was, and I think that I had missdirected anger in
Speaker 2: the beginning, and that's what allowed me to end up
Speaker 2: in the box. But also being afraid, you know what
Speaker 2: I'm saying. I was in an environment that I felt
Speaker 2: like you couldn't show no weakness, and if you did,
Speaker 2: I seen individuals getting raped, stabbed and all type of
Speaker 2: stuff too. So that's what kind of like I had
Speaker 2: misdirected anger. So you know, I was doing what the
Speaker 2: romans to do while and wrong.
Speaker 6: You know, yeah, I mean, you had almost nothing to
Speaker 6: lose if they could throw you in the prison within
Speaker 6: the prison, which is the box, right, but other than that,
Speaker 6: you can try to spend the rest of your life
Speaker 6: in there anyway. So how did you turn that around?
Speaker 6: Because obviously you found a different year, right, had you
Speaker 6: already gone through that shift when this letter arrived in
Speaker 6: the mail, because that's a big moment when that letter
Speaker 6: gets there.
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, I had already went through the shift at
Speaker 2: that point. I'm an introvert, so naturally the box was
Speaker 2: kind of like a good place for me, you know
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. Not only was I alright with myself,
Speaker 2: that I noticed that a lot of other individuals they
Speaker 2: couldn't live with themselves inside of prison. And that's why
Speaker 2: a lot of people do a lot of things.
Speaker 1: That they do.
Speaker 2: They want to stay on the gate, they want to
Speaker 2: get high, they want to get into fights, because you know,
Speaker 2: I do mine as a devil's playground. So that's what
Speaker 2: I kind of grew at when I was in solitary confinement.
Speaker 2: This book by James Allen called as a Man Think.
Speaker 2: If I read that book, it was a simplistic book
Speaker 2: to me. However, it kind of like related to me
Speaker 2: so well because it made me look at the glass
Speaker 2: half full of instead of half.
Speaker 1: Empty, you know, and it.
Speaker 2: Allowed me to even look at and messed up situations
Speaker 2: the good out of it. Even though I have fifty
Speaker 2: years to life, I know a lot of individuals that
Speaker 2: were in the grave and I still felt like I
Speaker 2: was alive, so I'm blessed regardless. And that's the mindset
Speaker 2: that I got into once I read that book, and
Speaker 2: once I started with that positive energy, that's what really
Speaker 2: gave me the sense of fied because at the time,
Speaker 2: I started to beat myself up to the point of saying,
Speaker 2: you know, I was a drug dealer. Maybe I was
Speaker 2: belong in jail, because in the beginning, that's what I
Speaker 2: was telling about myself. You know, I never got locked
Speaker 2: up for selling drugs, so maybe this was a recompense
Speaker 2: for my actions. And once I got into the positive
Speaker 2: mind frame, it made me throw that away and say,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm in here for somebody didn't do.
Speaker 1: If I was here for drugs, it'll be all right.
Speaker 2: I did the crime, I'll do the time, but I'm
Speaker 2: in here for a double homicide I did not commit.
Speaker 2: And I just started getting into the books, legal books,
Speaker 2: started reading up on. I started contacting a lot of attorneys,
Speaker 2: a lot of investigators.
Speaker 1: The Innocent Project was one of the main ones.
Speaker 2: I was in correspondence with Barry Shek, Vanessa Pokin, Nina Morrison,
Speaker 2: and a couple of others in an Innocent Project office
Speaker 2: but at the time, even though they were corresponding with me,
Speaker 2: they were not taking cases that did not have DNA
Speaker 2: evidence at the time, So you know, they were leading
Speaker 2: me to other law firms that were taking pro bono
Speaker 2: cases that dealt with wrongful convictions that did not have
Speaker 2: DNA evidence. At that point. Is like the gears shifted
Speaker 2: for me. And once I started to dig into my case.
Speaker 2: I'm a very determined and resilient person. Once I put
Speaker 2: my mind in something, I won't stop until I feel like.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get it done.
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna hear no full answer, and I'm gonna
Speaker 2: keep pushing until I can't push no more.
Speaker 5: I met Cal after he found that book, and that's
Speaker 5: a book that came out in like nineteen oh three
Speaker 5: something that is by a British guy. It's not a
Speaker 5: Col's World, but if you read it, what it says
Speaker 5: essentially is you can create your own reality by controlling
Speaker 5: your thoughts. And Cal probably the most disciplined person I've
Speaker 5: ever met in terms of thinking positive, and he had
Speaker 5: enormous setbacks. It is not only does he get that letter,
Speaker 5: but imagine Dwight is in one prison, Cal is in
Speaker 5: another prison. And they are suddenly put together. They suddenly
Speaker 5: come together at which Clinton correction Clinton Correctional Institution, and
Speaker 5: they meet in the yard. So there's this guy who
Speaker 5: has maybe has been put away for something, and then
Speaker 5: there's this other guy who says, you know, I testified
Speaker 5: you and I shouldn't have. And I mean, tell about
Speaker 5: that meeting.
Speaker 2: What made me more comfortable is the fact that I
Speaker 2: received that letter that he confessed to the crime right
Speaker 2: before I actually met him, because I don't think that
Speaker 2: I possibly would have went to the yard to meet
Speaker 2: him when he wanted to meet me. But I have
Speaker 2: received the confession letter, and I seen him in the
Speaker 2: mess hall and he told me to come to the yard,
Speaker 2: and I really wanted to hear what he had to
Speaker 2: say outside of the fact that he was now saying that,
Speaker 2: you know, he committed the crime. And when I talked
Speaker 2: to him, I felt CONTRISTI he started crying, and he
Speaker 2: said the same thing. I'm on the tide looking out.
Speaker 2: I want to do the right thing to get you
Speaker 2: outcause you're in here for something you ain't do. And
Speaker 2: we just started talking and I just wanted to get
Speaker 2: certain answers from him on why he did what he
Speaker 2: did it, and you know that's what we talked about.
Speaker 5: I mean, so if you can imagine Dwight actually confesses
Speaker 5: to a double murder that Cal's convicted for in this
Speaker 5: prison yard, and then what happens is on the basis
Speaker 5: of that, on the strength of that, Cal actually gets
Speaker 5: a four forty hearing. So now he's back in court
Speaker 5: and there's somebody else who's confessed to this crime. I mean,
Speaker 5: Cal has to believe he's going home.
Speaker 2: Except that on Frank Vigiano and Detective John Wall they
Speaker 2: were very ambitious for the DA and they were not
Speaker 2: going to allow that to happen because, like I said,
Speaker 2: there was a witch hunt outpha. Me and Alan Caroon
Speaker 2: was at the driving seat of that vehicle, and they
Speaker 2: worked over time to make sure that Dwight Robinson took
Speaker 2: back that confession, right.
Speaker 6: Which is another crazy aspect of this case, because because
Speaker 6: you probably were thinking, well, okay, that's where this thing's
Speaker 6: winding down. Now you got a written confession, he confess
Speaker 6: to you verbally in writing, and he's coming to court
Speaker 6: to the lawyer, and that should be saying this was
Speaker 6: two thousand and three, right, yes, Yeah, So two thousand
Speaker 6: and three. You've been in for ten years already, maybe eleven,
Speaker 6: and you're going to court. And did you think when
Speaker 6: you went to court for that hearing that you were
Speaker 6: going home? Yes?
Speaker 1: I really did?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 6: It sounded like it to me.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: The next best thing the DNA is a confession, you understand,
Speaker 2: And that's what I thought until he came in and
Speaker 2: you know, he got understand and he started doing what
Speaker 2: he'd do best. He started lying, So so.
Speaker 5: You didn't know until he got on the stand that
Speaker 5: he was going to take back his confession.
Speaker 2: I think we did find out that he did take
Speaker 2: it back. But to me, when I said I seen
Speaker 2: him and how I felt with the meeting when I
Speaker 2: met him, I didn't. I felt like I'll be the
Speaker 2: DA or the detectives were pressuring them like they did.
Speaker 2: But I felt like, still, he'll probably come to court
Speaker 2: and tell the truth, you understand.
Speaker 1: But he didn't.
Speaker 6: It's it's a remarkable plot twist, and then your case
Speaker 6: falls apart, right, I mean, he recants his recantation, right,
Speaker 6: so he's reversed himself again. Now his credibility is really
Speaker 6: out the window, right, because it's hard to tell when
Speaker 6: somebody is lying when they're when, you know, when they
Speaker 6: keep changing their story. I assume that they switched him
Speaker 6: to a different prison at this point. Did you have
Speaker 6: to go back to the same prison together after this?
Speaker 2: No, before we even went to court, he had left
Speaker 2: the facility that we were I think immediately after the
Speaker 2: confession he left. And you know what's so funny about that?
Speaker 2: I don't know, man, but it just seemed like a
Speaker 2: conspiracy too, because that naturally doesn't happen where they put
Speaker 2: individuals that testify against you, with the guy, you know,
Speaker 2: that type of stuff. It just seemed kind of funny
Speaker 2: that they did that, you know, like they really wanted
Speaker 2: me to really bury myself your father. You know, I
Speaker 2: think about that all the time.
Speaker 6: These dirty tricks are just I just don't I really
Speaker 6: don't understand it. As we skip ahead, there were other recantations,
Speaker 6: There were twists and turns. Then twenty fifteen comes. Two
Speaker 6: decades have passed, You've went behind bars, and now things
Speaker 6: finally take a turn for the better. You've had Steve,
Speaker 6: who's here with us now, who's been investigating your case,
Speaker 6: diligently fighting for you. Do you have an innocence project
Speaker 6: helping you? You have pro bono attorneys who have taken
Speaker 6: your case.
Speaker 2: Myron Belldock, the greatest lawyer and the planet Earth that
Speaker 2: ever woke this planet Earth.
Speaker 6: Yeah, his name is gold. So you got Myron. I mean,
Speaker 6: you went from having the odds really stacked against you.
Speaker 6: And it's a credit to you, by the way, because
Speaker 6: it would have been really easy for you to just fold,
Speaker 6: but instead, somehow or other, from inside this darkest place,
Speaker 6: you manage to enlist literally the dream team behind you.
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
Speaker 6: So twenty fifteen comes what happens.
Speaker 2: I had the investigator working on a case and he
Speaker 2: actually was able to get some new leads. And once
Speaker 2: the new leads came out with the two sisters that
Speaker 2: were actually like about ten to fifteen feet away from
Speaker 2: the crime when it happened. They lived right where the
Speaker 2: crime happened at and they actually seen Dwight Doe to crime.
Speaker 6: There's a plot twist, no, I mean, and we've seen
Speaker 6: that again and again too, where the witness is the
Speaker 6: actual killer and there's an incentive to lie right.
Speaker 2: Once once I got that information, I think I was
Speaker 2: in touch with Martin Tankliff at the time. I was
Speaker 2: also in contact with Jabal Collins who was working for
Speaker 2: Joe Rudin. I really wanted Joe ruden as my attorney
Speaker 2: at the time, but I wrote Myron Bell Doc, the
Speaker 2: great Myron Bell Doc, you know, who actually represented Hurricane
Speaker 2: Carter and a whole lot of other people. And when
Speaker 2: I wrote to him, he gave me his number so
Speaker 2: I could call him and talk to him. And from
Speaker 2: the initial start, man, I just loved this guy. He
Speaker 2: treated me like family. He showed that I mattered, and
Speaker 2: I don't think that at that point, I never had
Speaker 2: an older male figure in my life that actually genuinely was,
Speaker 2: you know, acted concerned for me or my well being.
Speaker 2: And he was actually going for surgery at the time,
Speaker 2: and he didn't even know if he was would have
Speaker 2: been able to take the case. And it was so
Speaker 2: funny that, you know, I initially wanted Joe Rudin so bad,
Speaker 2: but you know, Joe Rudin wanted his money. You know,
Speaker 2: he didn't care about nothing, no innocence of any of that.
Speaker 2: He wanted his money. But the funny thing was Myron
Speaker 2: had told me that if I take the case, if
Speaker 2: you could get somebody to assist me, then I feel
Speaker 2: better because I'm getting ready to go through the surgery.
Speaker 2: So I contacted Joel at that time, and once I
Speaker 2: once he found out that Myron Belldock was on the case,
Speaker 2: he was willing to jump on board now. So that
Speaker 2: was kind of ironic. That's the first time that he
Speaker 2: ever stayed on the phone with me for an hour,
Speaker 2: you know. And actually Myron started to get better, he
Speaker 2: started to heal better. And once I told him that,
Speaker 2: you know, Joe Ruden would be willing to co counsel
Speaker 2: with him, he said, don't worry about we don't need
Speaker 2: him no more. I'll be alright. I got I got it,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. And you know, that's how
Speaker 2: Myron was. And I had right after the surgery, and
Speaker 2: it was very touching for me. I had called him
Speaker 2: in the office. I don't know as it was like
Speaker 2: eight pm and I thought he was being home recuperating.
Speaker 1: Heling up.
Speaker 2: Myron was still in the office working, and here it
Speaker 2: is this man he's almost eighty years old. And you know,
Speaker 2: that meant a lot to me because I never had
Speaker 2: attorney to that point that I felt like was given
Speaker 2: my case. They're old, you understand here it is. I
Speaker 2: had the best of the best when it came to
Speaker 2: the attorney and I'm calling him now and he's on
Speaker 2: my case. You understand that he should have been home recuperating.
Speaker 2: I just never met a guy like that, you know,
Speaker 2: amazing guy.
Speaker 5: You know. I spent a little time with Myron. Cal
Speaker 5: actually never met Myron. Didn't have that good fortune. But Myron,
Speaker 5: I don't think he's too much to say. He came
Speaker 5: off his deathbed to really represent Cal. He had prostate cancer,
Speaker 5: he had heart problems. When I met him, he had
Speaker 5: a tumor behind his eye, so his left eye actually bulged.
Speaker 5: He'd look at you, but that left eye kind of
Speaker 5: veered off to the left at a forty five degree angle.
Speaker 5: It was very disorienting. He's eighty five years old, and
Speaker 5: he says, this could be my last crusade. And I
Speaker 5: say to Myron, you're you know, you're either a fool
Speaker 5: or a hero. And his response is, I think this
Speaker 5: case is going to make me live five years longer.
Speaker 5: So myrone is that's where he gets his adrenaline from.
Speaker 5: And of course the tragedy is that it doesn't make
Speaker 5: Myron live five years longer. And Cal gets that. I
Speaker 5: guess you hear a rumor in prison, and then you
Speaker 5: call me and I have to confirm it for Cal.
Speaker 5: And you know, Cal is a extremely strong, mentally disciplined,
Speaker 5: emotionally disciplined person. And by the way, physically he can
Speaker 5: do one hundred push ups without stopping, so you know,
Speaker 5: he's been in prison twenty years. He knows his way
Speaker 5: around physical challenges, emotional challenges. And I confirmed that Myron's dead,
Speaker 5: and you know, for Cal, and I mean, imagine, this
Speaker 5: is the guy, his savior, his savior now has has died,
Speaker 5: has passed.
Speaker 2: And that was like the most crushing blow ever that
Speaker 2: I ever felt, because I literally felt comfortable with my
Speaker 2: life in iron hands. You know, I want you to understand,
Speaker 2: I literally felt like that. I never felt like that
Speaker 2: with nobody, you understand. So when I lost him, it's
Speaker 2: like I didn't know where to go after that, Like
Speaker 2: I finally got the person that was the best of
Speaker 2: the best that I loved him outside of him being
Speaker 2: my lawyer, you understand, I loved him as a person,
Speaker 2: and when I lost him, I just didn't know how
Speaker 2: to take that, you know, because it was like I
Speaker 2: just came just so far and to be able to
Speaker 2: get the guy to believe in me. You know, it
Speaker 2: was just I just I couldn't help it. I just
Speaker 2: broke down.
Speaker 1: And I was in the yard and that that really
Speaker 1: broke me down.
Speaker 5: And you broke down on the phone with me. You
Speaker 5: called me back, and actually I never heard that kind
Speaker 5: of emotion. I mean you could. You couldn't speak exterially.
Speaker 2: A person is not going to be able to read
Speaker 2: emotions and my feelings because in jail, I felt like
Speaker 2: I couldn't show no weakness.
Speaker 1: That's how it was in prison.
Speaker 2: If you showed like the people in prison, there's a
Speaker 2: lot of predators in there, and if they sense any
Speaker 2: type of fear, that's when they're coming for you. That's
Speaker 2: just how it is. It's no other way. It's a
Speaker 2: savage life in prison. I love this guy, Myron Belldock
Speaker 2: so much that I couldn't help but to break down,
Speaker 2: you understand. And I was in the yard with hundreds
Speaker 2: of men, you understand, And that would be the last
Speaker 2: place that I would want to break down, because here
Speaker 2: I am with all of the wolves and stuff like that,
Speaker 2: and I'm in the middle of that and I'm breaking down.
Speaker 1: So I was overcome by emotions when I lost.
Speaker 5: My man, and actually I remember you you shouted over
Speaker 5: your shoulder. I just had a loss in the family,
Speaker 5: had a loss in the family, so that nobody you're exactly.
Speaker 2: Also, Myron is the one that gave me the tenacity
Speaker 2: and the fortitude in order to push on. When I
Speaker 2: took you to the incident when Myron was working on
Speaker 2: my case at eight PM, and I started to read
Speaker 2: up on everything about Myron. You know, Myron was a
Speaker 2: guy that just didn't give up period, you know. And
Speaker 2: I put his pictures up and like a mural of
Speaker 2: Myron and the cell that I was in, and his
Speaker 2: spirit just came to me, like, you gotta keep pushing,
Speaker 2: don't give up, be a fighter. And Myron actually fought
Speaker 2: for my life while he was fighting for his own,
Speaker 2: So I wasn't gonna get in a situation okay, now
Speaker 2: I lost my top guy and just lay down. And
Speaker 2: just because that's something that I felt that he would
Speaker 2: never do, so he kind of like put the tenacity
Speaker 2: in me to just continue to fight.
Speaker 6: Cal Can you just take us through how you were
Speaker 6: able to get your conviction reversed.
Speaker 2: When I went to the supply my second four forty,
Speaker 2: and they entertained that evidence that substantiated that Dwight Robinson
Speaker 2: actually committed a crime with the Clark sisters.
Speaker 5: Just to expand briefly, it's a dramatic moment. And cal
Speaker 5: had always said, you know, there were a lot of
Speaker 5: people there that night, the night of the shooting, and
Speaker 5: the scene had never been canvased. Well, you know, the
Speaker 5: cops did go door to door and they knock on
Speaker 5: the door of the Clark sisters, kimber Leah and Nikiah Clark,
Speaker 5: and they don't want to get involved. These are the
Speaker 5: two eyewitnesses to the crime, to the murder. But the
Speaker 5: older sister says, no, we heard shots, that's it, and
Speaker 5: that's what's in the police report. And why Well, years
Speaker 5: later I asked them. They didn't want it was a
Speaker 5: block full of drugs and murder. They're not going to
Speaker 5: come forward. Two decades later, through a series of circumstances,
Speaker 5: they resurface. They're in North Carolina and now they find
Speaker 5: out that cow was convicted. They didn't know that they
Speaker 5: had moved away like a year or so after the murders.
Speaker 5: They find out and their kind of heartbroken, and frankly,
Speaker 5: the younger one, who is the one on the street
Speaker 5: twenty feet away. She feels guilty. She feels guilty that
Speaker 5: she hasn't come forward and that this man, Calvin Buari
Speaker 5: is in prison for something she knows he didn't do.
Speaker 5: So there's this dramatic moment when they walk into court,
Speaker 5: and particularly the younger one walks into court and I
Speaker 5: remember the assistant prosecutor tried to pick her apart and
Speaker 5: rattle her. Okay, it's the DA's job, and she is fiery.
Speaker 5: She's got this nickname Evelina because when she gets challenged
Speaker 5: and pushed, there's this kind of fierce character that lives
Speaker 5: inside of her that comes out on the stand.
Speaker 1: Thank God for that.
Speaker 5: And there's this moment because we have the whole courtroom
Speaker 5: micd and we have a mic right up near the
Speaker 5: witness stand and you can't hear it in the courtroom,
Speaker 5: but we picked up where the the it'sistant district attorney
Speaker 5: is really prodding her and under her breath, eviliness says.
Speaker 5: And then she returns fire, and you know she doesn't
Speaker 5: give right and she says, you know, I saw who
Speaker 5: did it and it wasn't Calvin Bullar.
Speaker 6: There you go.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I wanted to expand on that too, and
Speaker 2: you know that was so grateful for me too, because
Speaker 2: I always knew that after my first initial four forty
Speaker 2: when the witnesses that actually came back who lied that
Speaker 2: were criminals. You know, I knew what type of games
Speaker 2: that these prosecutors play with the detectives. And I was
Speaker 2: always adamant on Steve listen, I want these witnesses this
Speaker 2: time to have attorneys like I was not going to
Speaker 2: allow what happened to me previously happened to me again.
Speaker 2: But it was it was overwhelming that the personality and
Speaker 2: the spirit of this witness because that is the very
Speaker 2: type of witness that I needed to stand up against
Speaker 2: these type tactics. You understand, And I just want to
Speaker 2: say too, man, when you when you believe in something,
Speaker 2: stand for it. If you feel something was wrong, stand
Speaker 2: for it. And I'm happy that she stood. She stood up,
Speaker 2: and she stood firm.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and the cops did go to her. She was unfortunately,
Speaker 5: she was in a shelter for abused women. The cops
Speaker 5: showed up, and that caused a lot of problems in
Speaker 5: her in her life. But you know, cow was also
Speaker 5: fortunate he got another attorney warrior, a guy named Oscar Mitchellan,
Speaker 5: who really in that courtroom, I think helped her tell
Speaker 5: her story and beat back the assistant DA when she
Speaker 5: tried to replay the nineteen nineties and said, cow's a
Speaker 5: bad dude. He was a drug dealer who strolled around
Speaker 5: and meant coats. But you know it was true. That's
Speaker 5: not what he was on trial for. He wasn't on
Speaker 5: trial for being a wealthy drug dealer. And it was
Speaker 5: Michellan who pointed it out. And Nikki who gets on
Speaker 5: the stand and fires back, who is the real killer?
Speaker 5: Who is the person who did the grind for rich
Speaker 5: Cal's servant?
Speaker 2: Time right, the tactics will utilized on the key and
Speaker 2: KIMBERLEA Clark. She was in the shelter at the time,
Speaker 2: and when you're in the shelter, you need some place
Speaker 2: to stay. They went there and made it seem as
Speaker 2: though she was being looked into for a double homicide.
Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying. And these are the tactics
Speaker 2: that these guys employ to make you know, life hell
Speaker 2: for a person that just want to fail the truth,
Speaker 2: you understand. And she got kicked out of the shelter.
Speaker 2: She got into an abusive relationship after I But like
Speaker 2: I said, I was so proud they had a personality
Speaker 2: that she stood up because normally with you know, average people,
Speaker 2: they're not gonna want to be bothered period. They're gonna
Speaker 2: care more about their personal situation than wanting to help
Speaker 2: somebody else that you know, Okay, I want to help them,
Speaker 2: but I don't want to go through the headaches that
Speaker 2: I'm going through with my personal life. Let me leave
Speaker 2: that alone. That's what the person doing. And I'm so
Speaker 2: proud that this woman stood up.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, what's the question you hear today, what's
Speaker 5: the upside for me? There's no upside for her, But
Speaker 5: oh John, she stood up.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 6: We end up two thousand and seventeen in Bronx State
Speaker 6: Supreme Court. Yes, and that's the day you had been
Speaker 6: waiting for since the early nineties. Absolutely, and tell me
Speaker 6: about that. Can you take us back.
Speaker 2: To that day when the judge vacated the conviction. I
Speaker 2: had my room picture in front of me. I had
Speaker 2: an actual Innocent magazine that came out on time. And
Speaker 2: before that, the White Robinson was supposed to come in.
Speaker 2: They couldn't produce the White Robinson. And then when I
Speaker 2: went back to court, I just kept my eyes as
Speaker 2: in myself fixated on in God we trust, and like
Speaker 2: I said, I'm a firm believer in God, so that
Speaker 2: is my number one attorney, and I believe that the
Speaker 2: right thing was going to be done.
Speaker 1: And actually that's what happened and that moment.
Speaker 6: So it was Judge Eugene Oliver Jor And we're talking
Speaker 6: about State Supreme Court. This is a big deal, right,
Speaker 6: I mean, And how did that feel? After decades of
Speaker 6: fighting and trying to get people to listen, to have
Speaker 6: a man in that position vacates your conviction.
Speaker 2: It didn't really hit me at first. I think when
Speaker 2: I went back to the bullpen, then it really really
Speaker 2: like really just started to sink in, like.
Speaker 1: I made it, you know, I made it. I'm going on, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm going home.
Speaker 2: And I got hit with another hurdle was I had
Speaker 2: to go back to the facility that I was in
Speaker 2: and stayed for the weekend. And those two days were
Speaker 2: the longest two days than the twenty two years that
Speaker 2: I did in prison, because I didn't sleep and it
Speaker 2: was just elate and I really felt kind of nervous
Speaker 2: because you know, you get a lot of hateration in prison,
Speaker 2: and I was kind of surprised that the people actually
Speaker 2: were more happy than upset here. So then I got
Speaker 2: the day where I came home, which was May eighth,
Speaker 2: which is tomorrow. That's my second birthday, my rebirthday, and
Speaker 2: it was sur real. I'm still looking at it. And
Speaker 2: the nice day that we had a couple of days ago.
Speaker 2: I stayed out till I think four in the morning,
Speaker 2: just enjoying the breeze. And when I first came home,
Speaker 2: my goal wasn't just to come home. My goal was
Speaker 2: to come home and also build a legitimate entrepreneurial life
Speaker 2: for myself. So I had goals out of side of
Speaker 2: just coming home, you understand. So even to this day,
Speaker 2: I'm still enjoying the little things and it's just still
Speaker 2: hit me because I ain't give myself a chance to breathe,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 6: No, And let's talk about that because three hundred and
Speaker 6: sixty four days as recording this podcast, as we're sitting
Speaker 6: here now, you haven't even been out a year, and
Speaker 6: what you've got going on is going to make a
Speaker 6: lot of people feel like, Wow, this is crazy. I mean,
Speaker 6: you've got multiple businesses that you started, right.
Speaker 2: Yes, I have a van company that goes to prisons.
Speaker 2: It's number one van company by the way. You know
Speaker 2: in New York State where I had started a new
Speaker 2: concept that I felt like when I was in prison,
Speaker 2: a lot of my family members came to visit me,
Speaker 2: and a lot of the van service they had the
Speaker 2: old Yankee vans, and they wasn't clean, and they were decrepit,
Speaker 2: and you know, regardless of what their family members wanted
Speaker 2: to see their loved ones that weren't concerrated. So they
Speaker 2: dealt with it. And I felt like our family members
Speaker 2: deserved the same quality service that a regular civilian to
Speaker 2: get out in the street. So I started the concept
Speaker 2: of the uber like prison visit services called riders. Van
Speaker 2: service is spelled ry d E r Z van service
Speaker 2: and my numbers eight four five two O four five
Speaker 2: nine three zero.
Speaker 6: And you service. How many prisons in New York State?
Speaker 2: I service the downstate area. Right now, I'm serving ten facilities.
Speaker 2: I'm going to downstate sing sing Shewonga, Sullivan, Walkkill, wood Burn,
Speaker 2: green Haven, what else the majorities of the facilities that
Speaker 2: are close to New York At the present time, I'm
Speaker 2: moving out further. We're supposed to be getting a bigger
Speaker 2: bus to go to Elmira, Comstock all burned and the
Speaker 2: further facilities up. I'm in the process of doing that
Speaker 2: as I speak, and things are picking up. Doing it
Speaker 2: with the van service for the prisons to show you
Speaker 2: know how important implementing family ties are, because they have
Speaker 2: done statistics that shows that individuals when they're incarcerated and
Speaker 2: they loved ones check for them, they have a lower
Speaker 2: rate of reciticism when they come home. And I also
Speaker 2: plan to have a van go to the female facility
Speaker 2: and beacon. I think that is for free, and I
Speaker 2: want to be able to give back to the female
Speaker 2: facilities because I feel like they don't get as much
Speaker 2: visits as the males do and they have kids and
Speaker 2: stuff like that, so things are probably much harder, and
Speaker 2: I want to be able to put it in rotation.
Speaker 2: Where is that I could go through the whole facility
Speaker 2: female facility and give each one of them female females
Speaker 2: a visit. But I want to find a social worker
Speaker 2: that's intermediary just in case they need somebody to put
Speaker 2: their kids to be able to go see their loved ones,
Speaker 2: because I know that may be a barrier as well
Speaker 2: because of the age of the child and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: But that's another way that I plan to give back.
Speaker 6: So you got the service, which is it's great there
Speaker 6: you are doing good while you're doing good and really
Speaker 6: making life better for those people who are able to
Speaker 6: now visit their loved ones. I wouldn't be able to otherwise,
Speaker 6: and we know what a difference that makes to people
Speaker 6: on the inside.
Speaker 2: I think that one of the main reasons that I
Speaker 2: wanted to do that business is because I've never wanted
Speaker 2: to allow myself to forget about where I came from,
Speaker 2: and by not forgetting that will constantly keep me away
Speaker 2: from doing anything that will put me back in that place.
Speaker 2: So I want to constantly be reminded of that, and
Speaker 2: that's that's how I do it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, well, I think your future looks really bright. I mean,
Speaker 6: you are obviously a very smart and capable and entrepreneurial guy,
Speaker 6: and you're reapplying your skills and the way that you
Speaker 6: are is extremely admirable, and I know you're going to
Speaker 6: be a big success, and I mean I'm looking forward
Speaker 6: to watching you. I know we were speaking earlier, we
Speaker 6: were talking about some innocent people that you left behind,
Speaker 6: and I want to try to bring attention to those cases.
Speaker 6: And it's entirely possible that by highlighting these innocent people
Speaker 6: that you left behind, that you care so much about,
Speaker 6: we may be able to affect some change in their cases.
Speaker 6: So do you want to just talk about that briefly.
Speaker 2: I'll start off with some of the brothers that I
Speaker 2: know about case that I've just left in green Haven,
Speaker 2: that we were actually working on our cases together. That's
Speaker 2: why I'm so much familiar with their facts. You got
Speaker 2: a guy named Nelson Cruz that's currently in green Haven
Speaker 2: who was actually innocent. They did a New York Times
Speaker 2: article on him. He was actually caught up in the
Speaker 2: Lewis scar Seller situation and he just recently got denied
Speaker 2: on his full forty and I believe in him innocence.
Speaker 2: There's another guy named Paul Clark that actually has almost
Speaker 2: forty years in that was arrested by the mafia cops.
Speaker 2: So Paul Clark is one. He's currently at green Haven facility.
Speaker 2: And you know, you have another young brother that I
Speaker 2: met named Kyrie Fry who's also at green Haven, and
Speaker 2: Anthony Reid, but just recently me and Meek Mills was
Speaker 2: in correspondence with each other, and he just sent me
Speaker 2: the information of a person that he was inconcrated within
Speaker 2: Chester at the time.
Speaker 1: This brother has.
Speaker 2: In twenty six years in prison and the only reason
Speaker 2: that he's currently there.
Speaker 1: His name is Eric Riddick. You can look up Eric Ridick.
Speaker 2: He's in Pennsylvania and Chester, PA and penitentiary. And this
Speaker 2: brother is actually innocent, and the only reason he's still
Speaker 2: in concerrated is because a procedural situation whereas that you
Speaker 2: have to have evidence in at a certain time, and
Speaker 2: if you we don't have actual innocent evidence. By the way,
Speaker 2: you know, he has evidence that proves his innocent, and
Speaker 2: he has expert evidence that proves his innocence. It's just
Speaker 2: appalling that he's still in prison after twenty six years.
Speaker 2: And this brother needs to be free.
Speaker 6: So we will post the names of all those individuals
Speaker 6: that Cal just highlighted on the website. Get involved and
Speaker 6: maybe we can together help some of these people get justice.
Speaker 6: So we have a tradition here on wrongful conviction, which
Speaker 6: is that at the end of the show, I like
Speaker 6: to turn the microphone over to you, I do what
Speaker 6: I don't do very well, which is that I stopped
Speaker 6: talking and just let you share any final thoughts that
Speaker 6: you have, and Steve, I'm going to start with you
Speaker 6: so that we can have Cal be our cleanup hit
Speaker 6: or here. So Steve Fishman, any final thoughts?
Speaker 5: Well, first off, thanks for having me. It's an incredibly
Speaker 5: important issue and I spent a lot of time on it,
Speaker 5: actually sometimes bit against my will, but you know, Cal,
Speaker 5: being relentless whatever, I could never say no, even if
Speaker 5: I wasn't always saying yes. But Empire on Blood was
Speaker 5: really a work of passion and it tells Cal's story.
Speaker 5: And I think what you get from it that you
Speaker 5: don't often get is you you get the thinking and
Speaker 5: the thoughts and the feelings of the prosecutor of Dwight Robinson,
Speaker 5: who not convicted but stands accused by eyewitness of having
Speaker 5: done this murder, of the detective who talked Twight Robinson
Speaker 5: out of his confession. So you really end up with
Speaker 5: a sense of the criminal justice system. And I guess
Speaker 5: the last thing I'd say is, you know, yeah, I
Speaker 5: kind of took a journey with Cal, and sometimes I'm
Speaker 5: given some credit for having pushed his case forward, but
Speaker 5: you know, really all credit to Cal. I just think
Speaker 5: the kind of discipline and persistence in the face of
Speaker 5: enormous disappointment that would have not only disheartened people, but
Speaker 5: I think broken most people. I couldn't have persisted. I mean,
Speaker 5: that kind of instinct and ability is very very rare,
Speaker 5: whether you're talking to people on the outside or people
Speaker 5: on the inside. So, you know, all credit to cal
Speaker 5: for realizing is the beginning of his future.
Speaker 6: And now over to you, Calvin Vari, what do you
Speaker 6: got for us?
Speaker 2: I mean, I want to thank Steve for saying that,
Speaker 2: because that means a lot to me because he didn't
Speaker 2: have to get involved with my case, but because of
Speaker 2: my diligence, and I think that, you know, he just
Speaker 2: still he wanted to do the right thing. And it's
Speaker 2: good that we have people like that, whether you're a
Speaker 2: stranger or a friend or not. It's just that I
Speaker 2: feel like people are waking up and they want the
Speaker 2: right things to be done. I think that my last
Speaker 2: words is going to be like what Meek Mill said,
Speaker 2: it's all about justice reform, so these type of things
Speaker 2: don't happen to other individuals. I hope that I'm my
Speaker 2: example to the people that these things do occur and
Speaker 2: we just have to do something so they won't reoccur again.
Speaker 1: That's basically what I have to say.
Speaker 6: Well, now I just want to thank the audience for
Speaker 6: tuning in and listening. This has been an amazing journey.
Speaker 6: And thanks again to Steve Fishman and Calaboari for being
Speaker 6: a part of the show.
Speaker 1: Thank you Jason, Thank you Jason.
Speaker 6: Don't forget to give us a fantastic review. Wherever you
Speaker 6: get your podcasts, it really helps. And I'm a proud
Speaker 6: donor to the Innocence Project and I really hope you'll
Speaker 6: join me in supporting this very important cause and helping
Speaker 6: to prevent future wrongful convictions. Go to inisonsproject dot org
Speaker 6: to learn how to donate and get involved. I'd like
Speaker 6: to thank our production team, Connor Hall and Kevin Wartis.
Speaker 6: The music in the show is by three time OSCAR
Speaker 6: nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us on
Speaker 6: Instagram at Wrongful Conviction and on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast.
Speaker 6: Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flam is a production of Lava
Speaker 6: for Good Podcasts and association with Signal Company Number one