Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and a welcome to ok F Daily
Speaker 1: with Me your Girl. Recording from the Long Island home Bunker, Folks,
Speaker 1: I am having a fucking day, and it's one of
Speaker 1: those days where the night before I spent way too
Speaker 1: many fucking hours on Twitter unpacking the latest Tucker Carlson
Speaker 1: story and what I have been thinking about. As we,
Speaker 1: you know, are getting the drip drip drip of all
Speaker 1: of his fucking texts, probably from Fox News or some
Speaker 1: affiliate of Fox News, there is something much bigger going on.
Speaker 1: There is something much bigger as all of these distractions
Speaker 1: that Fox and the media are putting out. I just
Speaker 1: there is a nagging feeling that I have that it's like,
Speaker 1: look at this shiny thing over here while we continue
Speaker 1: to you know, disrupt and rob and pillage all of
Speaker 1: your civil liberties over there. I want us to be
Speaker 1: able to have the flexibility to walk and chew gum
Speaker 1: at the same time, to both stay alert and yet
Speaker 1: stay emotionally well and intact, which I am struggling with
Speaker 1: this week. I came to Long Island because one I
Speaker 1: wanted to spend time with my family, but I also
Speaker 1: needed to be around just more nature and get a
Speaker 1: change of scenery because I feel like I'm losing my mind,
Speaker 1: and I know that I'm not alone. I know that's
Speaker 1: why many of you come to this show to feel
Speaker 1: like you were in community and not just a crazy
Speaker 1: person that wants to be able to open up their
Speaker 1: front door and just scream. I feel like if we
Speaker 1: were to collectively decide to do that as like a society,
Speaker 1: just every day, at say seven pm, just open up
Speaker 1: your front door and let out a scream for you know,
Speaker 1: one to five minutes and then just go back inside.
Speaker 1: I feel like we would all be better off these
Speaker 1: days because it's how we are all fucking feeling. I
Speaker 1: am going to be having a conversation on this episode,
Speaker 1: a super sized conversation with my friend, doctor Christina Greer,
Speaker 1: who is a political scientist, and you see her on
Speaker 1: MSNBC and in other places talking about, you know, our
Speaker 1: democracy and pretty much how to stay sane, and how
Speaker 1: she continues to teach you know, the next generation of
Speaker 1: analysts and political scientists and you know, potential politicians and
Speaker 1: legislators and all of these things, and how she continues
Speaker 1: to hold on to hope because I gotta tell you,
Speaker 1: I you know, have long nails, and I feel like
Speaker 1: I am hanging on to the side of a cliff
Speaker 1: with my claws, just you know, trying my damnedst Some
Speaker 1: days are better than others, folks, and today is not
Speaker 1: one of those days. I am going to go back
Speaker 1: to what I tell you all, which is to limit
Speaker 1: my time on social media, particularly the cesspool formerly known
Speaker 1: as Twitter. It's just okay, Like, let me just say this.
Speaker 1: Social media this week has been crazy. On one hand,
Speaker 1: if you're on Instagram and you use Instagram as a
Speaker 1: way to you know, follow pretty things, you see this
Speaker 1: whole alternative universe of like the met Gala and all
Speaker 1: of these super wealthy, you know, famous people without a
Speaker 1: care in the world except to where you know are
Speaker 1: and go to fancy parties that we all drool over
Speaker 1: because they get to live inside of a real life fantasy.
Speaker 1: Their life is a real live fantasy of you know,
Speaker 1: cocktail parties and you know caviare and the like. And
Speaker 1: then you go on to Twitter, which is just a
Speaker 1: seft pool but also a microcosm of you know, the
Speaker 1: existential crisis that we're all living in, whether it's the
Speaker 1: economic crisis, the fact that rents are going up everywhere,
Speaker 1: and pretty much there's a housing crisis and nowhere is
Speaker 1: affordable that you know, the Feds are going to raise
Speaker 1: interest rates again, that children are being found to be
Speaker 1: working at fast food restaurants, which was just discovered by
Speaker 1: CNN ten year olds working at a McDonald's until two
Speaker 1: am and not getting paid, because that's fucking normal because
Speaker 1: the Republicans are rolling back child labor laws. And then
Speaker 1: you know, there's Republicans also rolling back the ability for
Speaker 1: women no fault divorces in Red states, so that women
Speaker 1: have to stay trapped inside of marriages that they want
Speaker 1: don't want to be in. And you know, on top
Speaker 1: of that, Carrie babies that they don't want. I feel
Speaker 1: like I want to fucking scream, like I'm losing it, folks,
Speaker 1: And yeah, this is not a great week. So I
Speaker 1: am going to meditate again for like the third time today,
Speaker 1: go out for a walk and take in something beautiful
Speaker 1: that doesn't revolve around capitalism or patriarchy or white supremacy,
Speaker 1: and hopefully tomorrow will be better. But today not fucking great.
Speaker 1: And that's okay. Some days again, are better than others,
Speaker 1: and we just have to recognize that that we're in
Speaker 1: it right now. I don't know what the other side
Speaker 1: looks like, or frankly, if any of us will be
Speaker 1: alive to see it, because some days I feel like
Speaker 1: we're about a couple of months into the hundred year
Speaker 1: War and we won't know it until you know, historians
Speaker 1: documented if they're still alive. Oh m mmm. I just
Speaker 1: it's like, you want society to be better, right, Like
Speaker 1: each generation's responsibility is to try and better the society.
Speaker 1: But it's like, how do you continue to push against
Speaker 1: these forces that are just you know, herculean at this point,
Speaker 1: that are successfully pulling us back to the eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 1: I mean, I can't wait for them to pass, you
Speaker 1: know nationwide, you know, prayer back in schools, which they're
Speaker 1: already doing in the South. Women can't wear pants, can't
Speaker 1: get a divorce, have to carry babies, can't work. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, I want people to understand that there was
Speaker 1: a time when Iran was a democratic country, when they
Speaker 1: were liberties, civil liberties and freedom, and then the Islamic
Speaker 1: you know, regime came in and everything changed. And that's
Speaker 1: what I feel like we are facing right now, and
Speaker 1: more people just need to wake up and be conscious
Speaker 1: to that. Coming up next, my conversation with my friend
Speaker 1: doctor Christina Greer. Folks, whenever I have the opportunity to
Speaker 1: speak with one of my good, good colleagues and friends
Speaker 1: in the space of politics, I am so incredibly honored
Speaker 1: always when doctor Christina Greer, political scientists and associate professor
Speaker 1: at Fordham University, joins us and is the author of
Speaker 1: Black Ethnics and the co host of FAQ NYC and
Speaker 1: host of the Blackest Questions on the Grio Black Pods.
Speaker 1: Let me tell you something. There is not a day
Speaker 1: that has gone by this year thus far where I'm
Speaker 1: not like, oh, our democracy is in shambles, Like oh,
Speaker 1: I think that, Oh, I think we've reached the point
Speaker 1: of no return, Like I don't think that this is repairable.
Speaker 1: And I feel like historians, you know, if those people
Speaker 1: still exist and are not you know, in prison and
Speaker 1: in you know, someplace, we'll look back and be able
Speaker 1: to pinpoint, Christina, these inflection points that marked the end
Speaker 1: of our democracy. Now, you know, every time I've got
Speaker 1: my own right, every time I talk to you, you know,
Speaker 1: as a professor, I'm assuming you have to have some
Speaker 1: sense of hopefulness. Otherwise you wouldn't be trying to educate
Speaker 1: the future political scientists in this field. But when you're
Speaker 1: kind of taking a step back, as you know, we're
Speaker 1: not even six months into twenty twenty three and we're
Speaker 1: seeing this not no longer slow moving insurrection. Right, it
Speaker 1: wasn't just the violence that we saw in January sixth,
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. There has been an onslaught at every angle,
Speaker 1: every level of government and every angle. What what are
Speaker 1: you thinking these days? And how does that how does
Speaker 1: that inform frankly, how you are teaching?
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, you know, I tend to have a
Speaker 2: pragmatic optimism just because I am with young people, and
Speaker 2: so I think we're in really good hands. Especially you know,
Speaker 2: I've said this before. I love this gen Z. Like
Speaker 2: they're just they're on some like I don't take no
Speaker 2: shit type of stuff.
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, they're kind of like us.
Speaker 2: They're more like gen xers, you know, unlike millennials, Like
Speaker 2: they're scrappier, you know, they their future is uncertain. You know,
Speaker 2: we've gone through a lot as gen xers. You know,
Speaker 2: we've gone from like literally like tapes to you know
Speaker 2: the Internet and like we're latchkey kids and parents like
Speaker 2: good luck Bee.
Speaker 1: And nine want to get home. You know, like we
Speaker 1: kind of raised ourselves like pop tarts and stakehems, you know.
Speaker 2: So it's we we're scrappier and gen Z has some
Speaker 2: of that, so that makes me feel good. Yeah, we
Speaker 2: are on the precipice. But if we really, if we're honest,
Speaker 2: we're always on the precipice. Like the reality of this
Speaker 2: country is that we've never been in a good place.
Speaker 1: Never really no, no, like the ay was raven? Was
Speaker 1: I just too young? And yeah I think we were
Speaker 1: and like in my in my own stuff to think that,
Speaker 1: like there were better times than what the fuck we're
Speaker 1: living through right now. Here's the thing.
Speaker 2: The people were always here. They just didn't say it
Speaker 2: out loud, but they still professionally they you know, prevented
Speaker 2: people from getting promotions, they prevented people from moving to neighborhoods.
Speaker 1: Now they're just like negroes. I just don't want you here.
Speaker 2: But before and I should use the Southern accent because
Speaker 2: it's all they these states. But like gonna say, right,
Speaker 2: so it's you know, as Mark Dwaine always tells us,
Speaker 2: he's like, hey, listen, you know these other women learn
Speaker 2: from the Northern women a lot of ways. But you know,
Speaker 2: I think now, as as Donald Trump would always say,
Speaker 2: it's like, you know, we're this silent majority and just
Speaker 2: like say it out loud. And he's given people permission
Speaker 2: to say things out loud. But it's not like he
Speaker 2: taught them. He's just saying stop whispering it amongst your
Speaker 2: quiet circles.
Speaker 1: You can say it like be loud and proud. So
Speaker 1: I don't feel like, yes, are we Does it feel
Speaker 1: like we're on the break? Absolutely, But if.
Speaker 2: We're really honest, which we're never honest about the history
Speaker 2: of this nation right where this nation has always been,
Speaker 2: it's like we're always sort of on the break, you know.
Speaker 1: I mean, then, what what is it then? Because I think,
Speaker 1: because I think that you're right right, I think that
Speaker 1: it is this Pollyanna whitewash, purposefully whitewashed view of America
Speaker 1: that we have been indoctrinated with since we entered the
Speaker 1: K through twelve public education system and beyond. If you
Speaker 1: went into a liberal arts college then maybe and decided
Speaker 1: to take some classes that opened up your eyes and
Speaker 1: began to the re education right of yourself. Then maybe
Speaker 1: you know some other things, but the reality is, you know,
Speaker 1: let's take Tulsa, Oklahoma, the hundredth anniversary of the massacre
Speaker 1: that was just you know, acknowledged by the first President
Speaker 1: Joe Biden, right a couple of years ago, and I
Speaker 1: would tell you probably nine and ten Americans didn't know
Speaker 1: what that was. That this was a shock to them,
Speaker 1: and a shock to then learn that it wasn't the first,
Speaker 1: the second, that they're the fourth, the fifth, that you know,
Speaker 1: we could I could keep counting, I would run out
Speaker 1: of appendages. So when when you say we've always been
Speaker 1: on the brink, then is it Christina that we are
Speaker 1: more conscious now so it feels different or is there
Speaker 1: something also very different about this particular moment, both right.
Speaker 2: And so One, first of all, we're a little bit older,
Speaker 2: so we're putting pieces together in a more complex way. Two,
Speaker 2: we're in a twenty first century version of racist America.
Speaker 2: So like, this isn't the seventeen seventies sixth version, or
Speaker 2: the sixteen nineteen version, or the eighteen sixty five version,
Speaker 2: or the nineteen twenties version, or even the nineteen eighties version.
Speaker 2: So we're in the twenty twenty three episode.
Speaker 1: And it feels different.
Speaker 2: But I think, you know, we also have a few
Speaker 2: other competing factors, So we have a lot of visible
Speaker 2: powerful Black people aren't just like athletes and singers, right,
Speaker 2: So I think there's a collective freak out about white
Speaker 2: people when it comes to equity, right, anytime there's inclusion,
Speaker 2: they see it as a loss by and large, And
Speaker 2: so this idea that like black people and Asian people
Speaker 2: and Ladno people and even Native people here there are
Speaker 2: coming into what has always been told to them. It's
Speaker 2: their space, right, their neighborhoods, their schools, their jobs. So
Speaker 2: that's because that's the foundation of America. So it feels
Speaker 2: as though they are losing everything, like Archie Bunker on
Speaker 2: steroids often, you know, because that's the whole premise of
Speaker 2: all in the fact, it's the friendly racist you know. Yeah,
Speaker 2: But I mean the genius of that show is that
Speaker 2: he's mad.
Speaker 1: Don't forget.
Speaker 2: He's mad that the Jefferson's move into his neighborhood. Right,
Speaker 2: He's apoplectic when they move out for the Upper East
Speaker 2: Side because they made so much money. They're like blagueens, right,
Speaker 2: So it's like that's where we're in this moment, and
Speaker 2: then you add in this other piece. And the other
Speaker 2: piece is not just the four years of forty five
Speaker 2: who said bees racist as you want, it's cool, but also.
Speaker 1: The proliferation of guns. Yes, and also so it's like guns, guns, guns.
Speaker 1: Anybody can get guns.
Speaker 2: You can get them legally, illegally. You can get guns
Speaker 2: that can blow up children.
Speaker 1: In three minutes, as we've seen three minutes, in three seconds,
Speaker 1: three seconds.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you add on top of that and it was
Speaker 2: literally justll in my therapist this today. COVID is going
Speaker 2: to take a while for us to ever fully process
Speaker 2: like that year and a half of like the intense
Speaker 2: we're still in COVID, but like from that March twenty
Speaker 2: twenty to sort of like kind of like the end
Speaker 2: of twenty twenty one when it was really intense or
Speaker 2: maybe even why I.
Speaker 1: Would say again.
Speaker 2: Because that's when omicron popped back up, right, So like
Speaker 2: let's just let's just say two years, right, I'll.
Speaker 1: March to March right, March twenty twenty. March twenty twenty two.
Speaker 2: We had over a million deaths that were just not
Speaker 2: are like we still talk about nine to eleven as
Speaker 2: we should right.
Speaker 1: But we don't talk. But we don't talk. You said
Speaker 1: to process, and I'm like, to process something, I'm in
Speaker 1: therapy too. One would have to acknowledge you have to
Speaker 1: be something and so to be processed. So again with racism,
Speaker 1: we got to acknowledge that it's here. Well most Americans
Speaker 1: are you.
Speaker 2: Guys are just being so histrionic and you're always making
Speaker 2: something out of an ealthy right. So when I, you know,
Speaker 2: talk about what what happens to a sixteen year old
Speaker 2: boy who's being shot in the head, and I start with,
Speaker 2: why are you all leading the story with he was
Speaker 2: an upstanding student and in the band.
Speaker 1: I'm like, that shouldn't matter. I don't put it was
Speaker 1: a drug dealer on the street. He's a child. He
Speaker 1: shouldn't get shot in the head. And people are like, well,
Speaker 1: you know what, he's in the wrong neighborhood. If he
Speaker 1: didn't want to get shot, he shouldn't have been a
Speaker 1: white neighboro That's the immediate response I get, right, Or
Speaker 1: if I'm talking about children at the border and I'm like,
Speaker 1: how can this country separate to this? You know, during
Speaker 1: the forty five's administration, separating children who are so young,
Speaker 1: they don't know their names, they don't know their parents' names.
Speaker 1: They will never they won't right in and this remind
Speaker 1: people they were using sharpies to write on baby's arms.
Speaker 2: Just I see my child one day. Who knows, right,
Speaker 2: we'll hopefully use DNA evidence to like reunite. And we
Speaker 2: don't know about the sex trafficking or the labor like
Speaker 2: all these things that these poor children are going to
Speaker 2: endure and are enduring probably right now, right, And then
Speaker 2: people message me, if they don't want to lose their kids,
Speaker 2: they shouldn't have come here. So and it's like, right,
Speaker 2: but your ancestors came here, didn't speak a look at English.
Speaker 2: They came here on boats too, you know. So like
Speaker 2: this lack of seeing other people as human has always existed,
Speaker 2: and it's like it's wild for us. But I think
Speaker 2: what also feels very different, And this is why I
Speaker 2: love Mark Twain and I'm on the board of the
Speaker 2: Mark Twain House, is because Mark Twain has always talked
Speaker 2: about white women. He's always put them up there, just
Speaker 2: like I think a lot of people are shocked, like
Speaker 2: what women are upholding picturearchy, racism? Can you imagine? And
Speaker 2: I think for a lot of people they're learning it
Speaker 2: for the first time, and a lot of white women
Speaker 2: are like, yo, what's out with my people? Like I'm
Speaker 2: not like that, but like there are a lot of
Speaker 2: white women who were doing things that are like the
Speaker 2: antithesis of like what would ever help move women along?
Speaker 1: Or like people like me whenever it may be, But
Speaker 1: it's like, right, but we don't respect history in this country.
Speaker 2: We I mean, we've seen time and time again. It's
Speaker 2: not just Ron Desantists who's sort of trying to make sure.
Speaker 1: We're a historic. We've been a historic.
Speaker 2: This is why we didn't learn about Tulsa in school, right,
Speaker 2: This is why we didn't learn about Black Wall Street
Speaker 2: in school.
Speaker 1: This is why the four black people that you know,
Speaker 1: most Americans know are Martin Luther King, Frederick Douglass, to
Speaker 1: journ the truth, Harriet Tubman. That's it.
Speaker 2: Nobody talked about Mary mclabathoo. Right, and so like part
Speaker 2: of my podcast, you know, people, these questions are hard.
Speaker 2: It's like because we should know them, because black history
Speaker 2: is American history, and if we don't know it, then
Speaker 2: we're lying to ourselves. So like we have to ask ourselves,
Speaker 2: why is it that the selective history, like all the
Speaker 2: Native Americans who were snatch from reservations or first of
Speaker 2: all put on reservations and then snatch from reservations and
Speaker 2: sent to these schools, similarly to what we're doing with
Speaker 2: kids on the border, you know, like basically imprisoning them
Speaker 2: and like indoctrinating them and making them speak English and
Speaker 2: lose their native language. They've never seen their parents. Rampant
Speaker 2: sexual abuse and mental and physical and emotional abuse. We've
Speaker 2: been doing that, Like we didn't learn about that in
Speaker 2: school either. So this idea that we take things out
Speaker 2: of the educational system, is it new? This idea that
Speaker 2: white women have pold patriarchy, racism, is it new? This
Speaker 2: idea that white people don't want people of color in
Speaker 2: their homes, neighborhoods, schools, you know, all the things we.
Speaker 1: Talked about this Danielle Upper west Side two years ago.
Speaker 2: A few years ago, w into BLOSSI was trying to
Speaker 2: make folks combine the two public schools K through five,
Speaker 2: the one that was fancy and the one that served
Speaker 2: the kids in the Project Black Latino primarily these white mothers.
Speaker 2: You would think we're Mississippi nineteen sixty two, the way,
Speaker 2: it was like, you can't these kids in my school.
Speaker 1: First of all, it's a public school, easy killer. Second
Speaker 1: of all, do you really think that a five year
Speaker 1: old is going to become quote unquote dumber just from
Speaker 1: having a black kid in their class? Yes, they do,
Speaker 1: because they have had because they have been spending their
Speaker 1: entire you know, life savings and what have you on
Speaker 1: the nannies and on the tutors and on this that
Speaker 1: and the other things. So the idea of black and
Speaker 1: Latino children in your child's classroom means that the classroom
Speaker 1: room must be inferior. That's what. That's what, that's what
Speaker 1: that taught. That's exactly what, and that's what you fundamentally believe.
Speaker 2: Because if you look at Jose and he speaks English
Speaker 2: and Spanish, it's a negative. But your kid with the
Speaker 2: private nanny teaching them Spanish, all of a sudden, it's
Speaker 2: like it's a leg u.
Speaker 1: You know. So like even how we fray up being
Speaker 1: bilingual or bicoastal, whatever it may be, or having you know,
Speaker 1: parents who are immigrants. I mean, first of all, like
Speaker 1: Donald Trump, four of your five kids are children of
Speaker 1: an immigrant, Like you're so anti immigrant.
Speaker 2: Two of your three wives are immigrants. Immigrants, immigrants, not
Speaker 2: just like a little bit, right. So I say all
Speaker 2: that to say we're in dark times. Yeah, but I'm like,
Speaker 2: I know who.
Speaker 1: This country is. She's the same as she always is.
Speaker 1: So it's like, I'm not freaking out because she doesn't
Speaker 1: really surprise me that much. And my grandmother used to
Speaker 1: always say, the only time you should be surprised is
Speaker 1: when you're surprised. You know what it is for me
Speaker 1: these days is that I am not surprised. I am
Speaker 1: exhausted by grief. Yeah, right, it is not It is
Speaker 1: not the surprise because this country has been stealing black
Speaker 1: and brown children from their mother's wounds, from their homes,
Speaker 1: from you know, since the beginning of time. Right, i
Speaker 1: am exhausted by the fact that there is no corner
Speaker 1: of this country that is safe for black people. I'm
Speaker 1: exhausted that there was just the NRA, Right, the NRA,
Speaker 1: following two back to back mass shootings, host their fucking convention,
Speaker 1: and there were pictures going around the internet of young
Speaker 1: white boys holding up guns yeah to cameras, right, And
Speaker 1: I'm thinking to myself, and yet a black boy in
Speaker 1: this country can't get lost. Right, a black boy in
Speaker 1: this country can't play on a playground with a fake gun,
Speaker 1: but a white boy can hold up a real one.
Speaker 1: Ain't gonna be and that be considered cute and okay,
Speaker 1: So I just it is not this. I'm not surprised.
Speaker 1: I'm just exhausted by grief. And I don't really know
Speaker 1: even understanding but a smidge of the history that I
Speaker 1: should know. I don't know what to do with the
Speaker 1: persistent grief.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, listen, when whoever figures that out will
Speaker 3: get the Nobel Peace Prize, because I literally I mean
Speaker 3: that was the topic of today's therapy session, which.
Speaker 1: Was I'm numb.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when I say I'm exhausted because I can't, I
Speaker 2: can't allow myself to fully understand it.
Speaker 1: Right, I think that I was like, I think the
Speaker 1: people who were crazy on the subway, who were like.
Speaker 2: I don't want to used to work crazy, the people
Speaker 2: who are on the subway like talking to themselves and
Speaker 2: like clearly not on this planet with us. Fully, I'm like,
Speaker 2: I think that they're brain are like processing all that
Speaker 2: is happening, or at least more of what is happening
Speaker 2: than we are. Because if my brain allowed me to process,
Speaker 2: first of all.
Speaker 1: The past. Forget about how were you even here?
Speaker 2: My brain camp process, How we have sharks on the
Speaker 2: East coast, it should be in Africa, right, plankton and
Speaker 2: seaweed and fish, like there were so many people that
Speaker 2: were thrown overboard. It's like we have a whole literally
Speaker 2: marine ecosystem that has changed because of the transnational both
Speaker 2: we also, you know, like thinking about white people used
Speaker 2: to use black children as bait when they would you
Speaker 2: know out here, don't like all these things. George Washington
Speaker 2: ripping the teeth out of his enslaved Africans, you know,
Speaker 2: wearing them as the teeth.
Speaker 1: But we're taught it's wooden teeth, like just lies, lies, lies, lies, right,
Speaker 1: the incessant rape, people liking this shit in their enslaved Africans' mouths.
Speaker 2: Like just horrid, horrid stuff like brain camp process. But
Speaker 2: then I bring it to the twenty first century, and
Speaker 2: it's like after Sandy Hook is, you know, when you
Speaker 2: start off talking about like what are these inflection points
Speaker 2: where it's like we lose you know, we've lost democracy.
Speaker 2: Sandy Hook is on that list, right, because the middle
Speaker 2: class white children, And I said and I mean, this
Speaker 2: isn't you.
Speaker 1: Know, profound? Everyone said it, who cares about these issues?
Speaker 1: But we all said, if they let this slide white children, yep,
Speaker 1: beautiful little middle class white children. If they're gonna let
Speaker 1: these babies get murdered in school and do nothing about it,
Speaker 1: we're done.
Speaker 2: Were done where none of us are safe, and white
Speaker 2: people will soon find out that they're not safe either.
Speaker 1: Right. But I was like, but blood people, damn sure,
Speaker 1: it's it.
Speaker 2: And then what happened Obama hired crisis actors. That's when
Speaker 2: also it was like, oh, we've just jumped the shark.
Speaker 2: We I mean, this is where's the bonds in his
Speaker 2: leather jacket? We have fully jumped the shark right now.
Speaker 2: So there's that.
Speaker 1: I think O. J.
Speaker 2: Simpson's an inflection point like that, do you realize if
Speaker 2: you talk to it, if you listen to like white
Speaker 2: people talk on podcast, TV shows, like scripted TV shows, whatever,
Speaker 2: in conversation, the number of times that OJ Simpson is
Speaker 2: brought up is fascinating to me. Folks are still feeling it,
Speaker 2: like that is the first time where they're like this
Speaker 2: negro got off Scott free, like the way they're accustomed
Speaker 2: to getting off Scott free. But we we that was
Speaker 2: the first time it was like class trumped money, and
Speaker 2: and it was a white woman and she was blonde,
Speaker 2: Like just a whole bunch of stuff. If you start
Speaker 2: paying attention, you'll realize the number of shows where it's
Speaker 2: like oj Simpsons still comes up like this thing happened
Speaker 2: last year. Obama's another inflection point. It's like educated black man,
Speaker 2: his black family, like all these highly successful, smart black
Speaker 2: people that he hired, where all of a sudden, it's like, wait,
Speaker 2: that one black kid in the class that nobody talked to.
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, it's a gaggle of us, Like you
Speaker 2: put us.
Speaker 1: All together, right, It's like so then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: it's like they started realizing it's like, well that one
Speaker 1: black give you'm your class, one black kid from his class,
Speaker 1: and that one black from our class. He's like, right
Speaker 1: now we're a whole cohort and low key we know
Speaker 1: each other.
Speaker 2: So like, you also can't get away with some of
Speaker 2: your bad behavior because we do know each other, and
Speaker 2: now we no longer suffer in silence. We actually talk
Speaker 2: to each other about your bad behavior. So and we're
Speaker 2: your boss. So that's a whole other thing because most
Speaker 2: most white people have never First of all, they don't
Speaker 2: have white friends or black friends, but they don't have
Speaker 2: black bosses. Like this is why I think it's so
Speaker 2: important to have black teachers. You know, a friend of mine,
Speaker 2: Misha Mosley, doctor Misha Mosley, started the Black Teacher Project
Speaker 2: because it's like most black people have never most white
Speaker 2: people have never had a black person in a position
Speaker 2: of power over them, black boss, black teacher, black principal.
Speaker 2: And you see the constraints and the struggles that black
Speaker 2: teachers go through with their administrators and you know, sort
Speaker 2: of their colleagues who don't respect them in the same ways.
Speaker 2: You know, I see it as a black professor, the
Speaker 2: charals and tribulations of not just getting the PhD, but
Speaker 2: also getting tenure.
Speaker 1: You know, like all these things. It's like, it's still America.
Speaker 2: So just because we're in one profession, it's not like
Speaker 2: racism doesn't exist in the profession, but it is. You know,
Speaker 2: journalists talk about it, doctor's talk about it, nurses talking
Speaker 2: about it, everybody.
Speaker 1: It's just I guess also where I find myself is
Speaker 1: that in the listing of accomplishments and achievements right of
Speaker 1: black people. Despite every purposeful, racist, systemic obstacle that is
Speaker 1: placed in our way, there's more than one cohort of successful, intelligent,
Speaker 1: all you know black folks, right, and this challenges the
Speaker 1: white worldview. And so here we find ourselves. Now, what
Speaker 1: are we fit? Twelve years removed from Obama's first term,
Speaker 1: and we find ourselves experiencing white lash to the ninth degree,
Speaker 1: right that. I don't think I knew that there would be.
Speaker 1: I didn't think that the backlash. I didn't think that
Speaker 1: the white lash that is occurring would take us back
Speaker 1: to the eighteen hundreds, right, Like I didn't think it
Speaker 1: would go back there, right, Yeah, But if we'd look,
Speaker 1: I mean, who came after David Dinkins a series of
Speaker 1: life mass Rudi Giuliani right, specifically right everything like what
Speaker 1: happened to Rundiguland was like nothing. He was always this way.
Speaker 1: He's the one who led the riot on City Hall
Speaker 1: property with a whole bunch of drunken belize and fire
Speaker 1: employees of New York City threatening to hang David Dinkins
Speaker 1: when he was mayor, calling him a shoeshine boy and
Speaker 1: the N word while he's in City Hall, and had
Speaker 1: they broken through the barriers, lord knows what they would
Speaker 1: have done, throwing cans and bottles at city Hall led
Speaker 1: by Rudy Giuliani with a bullhorn. So like history doesn't
Speaker 1: how to wait, how do we remember him America's mayor?
Speaker 1: Until of course, fast forward to Donald Trump with the
Speaker 1: die dripping down it and everyone's like, what happened to him?
Speaker 1: It's like, nothing happened to him. He's the same guy.
Speaker 1: You guys just decided to choose five minutes in time
Speaker 1: with this, with this racist ignoramus and here we are,
Speaker 1: right And so it's like America has all these data points.
Speaker 1: It's just people don't like to connect the docks.
Speaker 2: And I do this before, you know, when it comes
Speaker 2: to like white allies, we're always just like what can
Speaker 2: I do? And you remember when you were growing up
Speaker 2: and you have you know, companies coming over Thanksgiving, Christmas
Speaker 2: or whatever. It's time to get the house together, right,
Speaker 2: like all hands on deck, you know, moms in the kitchen,
Speaker 2: we got things popping, and it's like people are coming, like,
Speaker 2: we got to get this house together. And I swear
Speaker 2: to you if my mom heard me ask the question,
Speaker 2: what do you should to do?
Speaker 1: Point?
Speaker 2: She was like, look around, look around, like I will
Speaker 2: not sit here and go through an itemized list when
Speaker 2: we have two hours.
Speaker 1: Before everyone gets here.
Speaker 2: It's like, you know, vacuming needs to be done and
Speaker 2: trash cans and beds made. The house needs to look
Speaker 2: a certain way. You know what the house needs to
Speaker 2: look like, So.
Speaker 1: Get to it. Stop acting like you don't know what
Speaker 1: it means to entertain and have the house prepared right.
Speaker 2: Set this table, smait this floor, like, get yourself together,
Speaker 2: get your buying right.
Speaker 1: So it's like that's why I feel about white people
Speaker 1: were like excuse me, chrissy, Like what should I be doing? Girl?
Speaker 1: If we're in the Year of Our Lord twenty twenty
Speaker 1: three and you were looking around at this disheveled house
Speaker 1: and you were asking be what you what needs to
Speaker 1: be picked up and taking upstairs? Like stop passing all
Speaker 1: the things old you know the bottom of the stairs
Speaker 1: that need to be taken upstairs. Stop passing it by,
Speaker 1: pick it up, pick it up and do the work.
Speaker 1: You know. It's like, we know that your grandpa and
Speaker 1: your uncle are going and.
Speaker 2: Your aunt right because we keep saying uncles and your aunt,
Speaker 2: they're not gonna listen to doctor CHRISI.
Speaker 1: Degreer, right, So it's like, do the work. Have those
Speaker 1: hard conversations, but people don't want to have them. So
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, it's like, well what should
Speaker 1: I do.
Speaker 2: It's like, well, you don't feel like working, so I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't know what to say, Like you want me
Speaker 2: to tell you to do something that's real soft and
Speaker 2: easy so you don't have to do the work, And
Speaker 2: then you could just be like, hey, I did something.
Speaker 1: It's like, okay, go knit a pink hat. Then that's
Speaker 1: what I tell you. Shit, that's you know, Christine. That
Speaker 1: the last question that I'll ask you just for this conversation,
Speaker 1: because God, I love our conversation so much. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm still I know, I'm sorry. That's all the things
Speaker 1: would need to be crown the valve. You're like, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go knit, okay, okay, how do you? And you?
Speaker 1: You mentioned therapy and I mentioned therapy, and I talk
Speaker 1: about it a lot on woke Off. I talk a
Speaker 1: lot about mental health and care, and I have tweeted
Speaker 1: out that I'm at a stage of this week where
Speaker 1: you know, I'm at the stage pretty much at the
Speaker 1: end of every week of this of this year thus far,
Speaker 1: where I'm like, I just want to call out black
Speaker 1: like I am tired. My heart is heavy, my spirit
Speaker 1: is heavy, my body hurts, and so how is it? That?
Speaker 1: Is it that not processing sometimes that allows you to
Speaker 1: move forward? What are you doing to not run out
Speaker 1: of your home? Yes and scream in primal rage or
Speaker 1: just like throw the computer against the wall, just like
Speaker 1: be like you know what, just fuck it, just fuck it.
Speaker 1: I'm done. Well, I recognize that this is not a sprint.
Speaker 1: This this is a marathon. Our life is a marathon
Speaker 1: as black people, and so rest is resistance.
Speaker 2: I do go on vacations, this work will be okay, okay,
Speaker 2: Like I go to an undisclosed location for two weeks
Speaker 2: the second the semester ends, once the grades are in,
Speaker 2: go to graduation, put on my little fainting down and
Speaker 2: then about two weeks in the Caribbean, drinking beer for breakfast.
Speaker 1: Walking around in my swimsuit all day, sitting there looking
Speaker 1: at bird drama and iguanadrama. That's what I do. And
Speaker 1: then throughout like I have to go someplace hot.
Speaker 2: You see, I'm like dan in right, now right, it's
Speaker 2: like I have to have sunshine and I can't fully
Speaker 2: check out because it is during the semester. But like
Speaker 2: I'll go away for a few days and yeah, I
Speaker 2: still have to check in with email and things like that,
Speaker 2: and you know, I teach my classes, but like I
Speaker 2: have to leave this country.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's no way. I feel closter.
Speaker 2: But that's that was the hardest thing for me to movement,
Speaker 2: being stuck in this country. That was the longest I'd
Speaker 2: been in the United States as an adult. Just like
Speaker 2: without leaving, I have to leave this country like literally minimum,
Speaker 2: like every three to six months.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that'd mean easy to start that plan and just
Speaker 1: to like.
Speaker 2: Just to be away from her because she can be
Speaker 2: a lot, she can be lovely. I mean, there's a
Speaker 2: lot of beauty in this country, in a lot of nature.
Speaker 2: And if you I can't leave the country. Like I
Speaker 2: was in New Mexico for a meeting, I felt like
Speaker 2: I was in a different country. Like so just going
Speaker 2: to different parts of the United States where it feels
Speaker 2: foreign to me because I don't know much about New
Speaker 2: Mexico and I don't mean listen, that's the only majority people
Speaker 2: of color state that we've got the state Charter, Spanish
Speaker 2: is equal to English.
Speaker 1: I mean it was. So it's not like going to
Speaker 1: Miami where it's like, oh, everyone speak Spanish except for.
Speaker 2: Me, but it's like no, no, no. In the State
Speaker 2: Charter we speak Spanish. So like one of my meetings
Speaker 2: I had the little translator a year on because it's
Speaker 2: like we don't speak English here. Yeah, it's America, it's
Speaker 2: New Mexico. So I have to get out of New
Speaker 2: York City. New York City is wonderful, but like she
Speaker 2: can be a lot. So I take breaks and I
Speaker 2: take rest.
Speaker 1: And you know, like I do. You know, I'm a
Speaker 1: big theater person, so like I have to go see
Speaker 1: like make believe worlds. Mmm, like theaters make believe. So
Speaker 1: I'm not a movies person. Couldn't tell you last time
Speaker 1: I went to the movie theater around COVID time. But
Speaker 1: like that's just not my that's not the thing that
Speaker 1: is my escape. I know a lot of people love
Speaker 1: movies as an escape, Like they go to the movie theater,
Speaker 1: they get their popcorn, like they save up and it's
Speaker 1: like it's an experience. I've never really enjoyed it like that.
Speaker 1: I love going to the theater. So that for me
Speaker 1: is like that's a few hours of just feeling feeling good.
Speaker 1: I also get massages and facials on a regular basis. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because no matter how much I get a massage, They're like,
Speaker 1: what are you holding from our body? And I'm like
Speaker 1: I know, They're like your a little old body, and
Speaker 1: it's like and I'm riddled with fyboids, like I know
Speaker 1: that stress, Like you know, it's all the scientists. We
Speaker 1: don't know why. Look, black women have ninety percent of
Speaker 1: all the viboards, you don't you know how I like,
Speaker 1: we could tell you we don't have you know, I
Speaker 1: don't have a medical degree, but I could tower it out.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I do try and take care of myself,
Speaker 2: you know, Like I mean when I say take care
Speaker 2: of myself, like treat myself to things that like realistically,
Speaker 2: if we were a different kind of country, these things
Speaker 2: would be paid for. You know, we would be like
Speaker 2: right right right, bath houses where you can go and
Speaker 2: steam and soak and you know, But because we don't,
Speaker 2: then I build that into the budget. So like I
Speaker 2: don't have you know, designer handbags because it's like, well
Speaker 2: that means I can't go to the spot so, you know,
Speaker 2: because I'm not a corporate lawyer. So it's like one
Speaker 2: or the other, and I'm choosing spot time. I don't
Speaker 2: begrudge people who you know, have Gucci sandals and all
Speaker 2: this other stuff. It's like I can't afford both. And yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm thoroughly disinterested in proud of bags if that means
Speaker 2: I can't.
Speaker 1: Not if I can't vacation inside of it exactly because
Speaker 1: I need sunshine. So like right now, I'm like researching.
Speaker 1: I gotta finish this book project that has been hanging
Speaker 1: over my head like a man both two years. I
Speaker 1: just haven't like looked at it, and.
Speaker 2: I was like, I need to leave clodly writing here
Speaker 2: isn't helping. So like I'm looking at random cities in
Speaker 2: Europe to like go sit down and like barely speak.
Speaker 1: The language so I won't be chippy chatman with people.
Speaker 2: Like go there and get work done period, someplace gorgeous
Speaker 2: and like find that beauty.
Speaker 1: I think that that is the most important lesson, is
Speaker 1: to find the beauty and a consistent reminder for myself
Speaker 1: and everybody listening that rest is resistance. It is especially
Speaker 1: for black women, particularly for black women that rest is resistance.
Speaker 1: And so with sleep, yeah, which I don't get much
Speaker 1: of these days. Oh I'm I'm like, I go to
Speaker 1: sleep now. I have this bad habit now waking up
Speaker 1: at three o'clock in the morning and like checking Twitter
Speaker 1: and Instagram. So I got to get out of that.
Speaker 2: But like I have like not like a bedtime, but
Speaker 2: like you know, go to sleep. It's out for sleep,
Speaker 2: like the gems are on teeth or brush face is washed.
Speaker 1: IM mind that, but that's me, is that the I
Speaker 1: go through these phases where I'm really really good, but
Speaker 1: my mind won't stop these days. So I need to
Speaker 1: figure out ways to stop it. But I will say
Speaker 1: I have a whole sleep, yeah, I will say. Friends
Speaker 1: listening to remember to engage with as much horror as
Speaker 1: we're seeing on a regular basis that to balance that
Speaker 1: with as much beauty as possible. Doctor Christina Greer, my friend,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for making the time for joining. OK, appreciate, appreciate, appreciate,
Speaker 1: appreciate our conversations.
Speaker 2: I absolutely love being here and hopefully not like a
Speaker 2: you know, clueless ray of sunshine. I'm just trying to balance.
Speaker 1: No, it's balanced. What this country is and what we
Speaker 1: can do. We can only do what we can do. Amen,
Speaker 1: and I sent you my sleep bridgement. You're the best.
Speaker 1: That is it for me today, Dear friends on wok
Speaker 1: f as always, Power to the people and to all
Speaker 1: the people. Power, get woke and stay woke as fuck.