1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:03,239 Speaker 1: Welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff with Margaret Piljoy, 2 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:07,000 Speaker 1: a podcast that's about cool people who did cool stuff. 3 00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:09,360 Speaker 1: Our guest today is Max Collins. Max, how are you doing? 4 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 1: You wanna about yourself at all? What's going on? I'm 5 00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: doing great. Thank you, it's good to be here. I 6 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: was going to say on this day. That is definitely 7 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 1: a different day. I think everything this podcast knows that 8 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:26,960 Speaker 1: we recorded in two takes one good. Yeah. So so 9 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: Max Collins our guests in the nineties, he actually did 10 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 1: an anthropological field study on one hit wonders in the 11 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:35,800 Speaker 1: rock world. That's right. Everything where you're saying right now 12 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:43,920 Speaker 1: is absolutely on, equivocally, verifiably true. Yeah, exactly, Yeah. Yeah. 13 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: So today we're talking about one hit wonder Chumbawamba, and 14 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,200 Speaker 1: if you haven't listened to part one, what is wrong 15 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: with you? Did something go wrong with your life? Why 16 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 1: do you make the choices that you make? So go 17 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: listen to that. Okay. So around the early nineties, life 18 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 1: starts chan changing. For Chambawamba. It stays egalitarian, but it 19 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: goes from this like loose chaotic thing into something more 20 00:01:05,880 --> 00:01:08,839 Speaker 1: like a workers cooperative. They start having tons of meetings 21 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 1: by one account, they spend more times and meetings than 22 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:12,640 Speaker 1: in practice. There's like eight or nine of them at 23 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: this point, and most of them move out of the 24 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: squad but stay in the band and stay activists, and 25 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: they just want to do other things with their lives 26 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 1: and more and more they're alto like having families and 27 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:26,200 Speaker 1: ship right and sometimes maybe obviously some of them having 28 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:28,680 Speaker 1: kids in the squad, but I could imagine not being 29 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:30,839 Speaker 1: like this is where I want to raise my children. 30 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:35,160 Speaker 1: I don't know, whatever. And and one of the cooler 31 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:36,960 Speaker 1: things about them is as they start doing this, they 32 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:39,360 Speaker 1: don't go off the h ones behind the music, like 33 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:43,120 Speaker 1: they keep not exploding. Some of them did drugs, some 34 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 1: of them were sober. They date within the band, they 35 00:01:46,520 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 1: get one of them dumps one of them to go 36 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:52,800 Speaker 1: date the other bandmate, and everyone stays good with each 37 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:56,080 Speaker 1: other more or less, like I don't know. They feel 38 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 1: like they kind of like did hedonism right, at least 39 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: as it's presented in their self mythologizing right parties and 40 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: raves and shows and everything. But there they're not doing 41 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:08,359 Speaker 1: the like trash the hotel room, drop penises, sexually assault fans, 42 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: thing and so, and they're basically at this point trying 43 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 1: to make it as no longer young musicians. They're trying 44 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:19,519 Speaker 1: to be like this is So they sit down and 45 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 1: they have what the funk are we doing? Meeting, like 46 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: a conversation ten years into the band, and they're like, 47 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 1: all right, let's fucking do this thing, like let's double 48 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 1: or nothing, let's um you know. They they quit their 49 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: jobs to do it full time, which means that they 50 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: needed to pay their employees, which was themselves, and also 51 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:38,639 Speaker 1: other people are helping them out, and so commercial considerations 52 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:43,239 Speaker 1: start having to be balanced alongside musical and political considerations 53 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 1: as they make this music and they release Anarchy is 54 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:51,239 Speaker 1: the name of an album and the cover of which 55 00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: features the photo of a child being born, which is 56 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:56,160 Speaker 1: from a book for children about where babies came from. 57 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 1: But this is obviously like their whole point is like 58 00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: you're all going to call this pornographic, aren't you, And 59 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 1: it did. It's called pornographic. Stories refused to sell it. 60 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:06,359 Speaker 1: They keep it in brown bags because you can see 61 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:10,280 Speaker 1: a vagina in it or whatever. It's my favorite of 62 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:13,639 Speaker 1: their albums, um and it's the first time that they 63 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:17,360 Speaker 1: crack the very bottom of the mainstream charts, and it 64 00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 1: has the song if you haven't if you've never listened 65 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:22,960 Speaker 1: to Chumba Womba song besides Tumpa Plumping, or even if 66 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:26,679 Speaker 1: you haven't heard that, go listen to Homophobia by Chumbawemba. 67 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,919 Speaker 1: So they start getting to play larger and larger shows 68 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 1: right there as they start taking this band really seriously. 69 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 1: Ten years in, they tour more of the world, and 70 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 1: the press fucking hates them. They're like, you're washed up, 71 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: bad musicians. You're all too old. You scream about politics, 72 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: but you don't even believe any of it. You're or 73 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: like they're all like you're two woke, you're ruining the 74 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 1: music whatever. And the fans love them. They sell out 75 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: shows left and right. Uh, and the press goes between 76 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: ignoring them and hating them, which is like this is 77 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: just like literally how to see see that's a cult 78 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 1: band as first, and they're not super famous yet, they're 79 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: not tub thumping famous yet, but they're sharing a stage 80 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: of smashing pumpkins in Germany at some big televised event, 81 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 1: and smashing pumpkins is apparently being real assholes about it, 82 00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: at least as related in Boff Whale's book and so they, 83 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:22,359 Speaker 1: like all the other bands have to like hide in 84 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,760 Speaker 1: their dressing rooms with the doors closed and they can't 85 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:27,839 Speaker 1: be in the corridors when Billy Corgan comes through or something. 86 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:32,039 Speaker 1: And this is still prey yeah yeah, so they're like 87 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 1: not seeing as Smashing Pumpkins as peer yet, but they're 88 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 1: big enough to be at this televised event. And so 89 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 1: Dan one of the people in Humble one, but he 90 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: likes being naked, like constantly, He's stripping on stage for 91 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:46,680 Speaker 1: the funk of it. And the band is like, what 92 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 1: are we gonna do to prank these assholes? That's like 93 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 1: what we gotta do. That's our thing, you know, I know, Dan, 94 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 1: take off all your clothes. So Dan gets naked. They 95 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 1: write they were punk and huge letters across his chest. 96 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: He strolls out on stage just a smashing bomb gets 97 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 1: it's their big finale, you know. He walks up to 98 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:06,120 Speaker 1: Billy and he salutes the crowd naked, and then he 99 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:08,760 Speaker 1: walks off and the rest of the band is to 100 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: physically rescue him from pouncers and that they fled the 101 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:16,080 Speaker 1: scene as like they're being chased, and the promoters like, 102 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 1: you'll never appear on German television again which probably didn't 103 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: turn out to be true incredible and yeah, I know, 104 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:28,360 Speaker 1: I love it, I love it. Um. Also, they turn 105 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: in an album called tub Thump into their label, which 106 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:33,919 Speaker 1: is a label called One Little Indian, which was not 107 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: a great name for a label, and just to be clear, 108 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 1: the label realized that and in they changed their name 109 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:44,400 Speaker 1: to One Little Independent. Chamba Womba turns in this album 110 00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:47,440 Speaker 1: to them and the labels like, no, this sucks, go 111 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:51,800 Speaker 1: home and write better songs. No good onward. And then 112 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,840 Speaker 1: E m I Germany, a major label, was like, well, 113 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: we'll give you a hundred thousand fake europe money for it, 114 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 1: maybe pound, maybe euros, I don't know, one of the 115 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:04,600 Speaker 1: fake moneys that they have over there. And at first 116 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:06,480 Speaker 1: they laugh it off right there, like no way when 117 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 1: we do that, obviously, and then they kind of sit 118 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:12,839 Speaker 1: on it and they're like, we're so fucking broke, and 119 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,679 Speaker 1: that is enough money that even if the album doesn't 120 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: sell at all, we can still pay everyone involved a 121 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: decent wage, you know. They to be clear, Chumbawemba had 122 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:25,839 Speaker 1: put a song out on an anti em I compilation 123 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:28,480 Speaker 1: about ten years earlier. The compilations called Funck E M 124 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: I at at the time e m I was was 125 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:33,560 Speaker 1: deep in the nuclear arms industry. E m I had 126 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 1: since divested from that, but still it wasn't It clearly 127 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:40,600 Speaker 1: wasn't good optics, and they weren't sure, but they I 128 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: think what happened is that they they were sure it 129 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 1: wasn't good optics to the punk scene. What they were 130 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:47,040 Speaker 1: trying to figure out was whether or not it was 131 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 1: good ethics, and they wanted to make their decision based 132 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:51,680 Speaker 1: on that. So they talk it over as a collective, 133 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: like they do everything. They don't vote about major decisions. 134 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:57,239 Speaker 1: They work for consensus, and they talk it over for weeks. 135 00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:01,039 Speaker 1: They are like, look, the symbolism is bad, but change 136 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:04,159 Speaker 1: for change's sake is sometimes good. They were stagnating, and 137 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: they were like, fuck stagnating, that's what we don't want 138 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: to do. It's more of a chance to reach more people. 139 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: Saying fuck you to a scene that was getting way 140 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 1: too essentially conservative from their point of view, seemed fun 141 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 1: to them. Being able to pay themselves enough to not 142 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 1: worry for a while. Like they're all working class folks, right, 143 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 1: and they're proceeding in middle age without much of a 144 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:26,320 Speaker 1: safety net. Because they all were squatter punks and and 145 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: they're like fans like Fugazi can get away with being 146 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 1: fiercely independent because they're just big enough and sell enough records. Right, 147 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 1: Chamba Womba wasn't selling that kind of those kinds of numbers, 148 00:07:37,320 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 1: and but fear of what people would think was a 149 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 1: big part of it. A few years earlier in Poland, 150 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 1: some American punk had taken it upon himself to like 151 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 1: slash their tour van tires because he was mad about 152 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 1: how much the band was charging for the show. Punks 153 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:58,240 Speaker 1: can be sort of yeah, yeah, And one of one 154 00:07:58,280 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: of the things that they thought about a lot they 155 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 1: you know, the most convincing argument to some of them, 156 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 1: and I actually think maybe the most convincing argument to 157 00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 1: me is they're like, look are independent labels are also 158 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 1: just all about the money. They are also fucking us over. 159 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: They're also greedy, we might as well get paid well. 160 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 1: Alice Nutter puts it in an interview of The Punk 161 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: magazine later, my reasoning for doing it isn't how we're 162 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 1: going to get our message across to more people. It's 163 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 1: nothing to do with that. It's because my experiences with 164 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:30,800 Speaker 1: one little Indian in the music industry have me convinced 165 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:33,520 Speaker 1: that they're all the fucking same. They're small businessmen and 166 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 1: big business men, and they've they have a different agenda 167 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:40,600 Speaker 1: to us. There's no good or bad capitalism. It's kind 168 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:44,960 Speaker 1: of what they hit upon. They do it, and which 169 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:47,440 Speaker 1: brings us to probably the only song by them that 170 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 1: most of the people listening to this podcast have actually heard, 171 00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 1: stub thumping about falling down and standing up and about drinking. 172 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 1: I literally don't know. I didn't actually ask Sophie what 173 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 1: I'm allowed to do in terms of quoting song lyrics. 174 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 1: So that's why I keep tea speaking about it. Very verge. 175 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:03,600 Speaker 1: Sophie says, yes, I can claim that I wrote the 176 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 1: song and that it is legally my property. That is 177 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:09,120 Speaker 1: what Sophie is nodding and saying, yes right now. So 178 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 1: I wrote the song tub Thumping, and when I did, okay, So, 179 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,560 Speaker 1: but I'm gonna quote Boff Walley about this song. Tub 180 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: Thumping from its very outset as an idea, was definitely 181 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 1: populist and based on working class experience. That's working class 182 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:24,680 Speaker 1: not just as a mythic Trotskyist vision, but as a 183 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:28,200 Speaker 1: cultural and historic whole which includes family and sport and 184 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:31,680 Speaker 1: community and war and love and entertainment, not just the 185 00:09:31,679 --> 00:09:35,520 Speaker 1: cliche clenched fist getting up, but the getting knocked down 186 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: as well. Tub Thumping became known to some purely as 187 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 1: a drinking song, which is fair enough because of nothing else. 188 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 1: It didn't belong to an elite group of musicians. It 189 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:49,440 Speaker 1: belonged to people, people at football matches, people singing along 190 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,160 Speaker 1: to the radio as they drove, people at parties, drinking 191 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 1: too much whiskey and tripping over the kitchen chairs, people 192 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,960 Speaker 1: like me. And because it helped beggar the notion that 193 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 1: Chumba Womba were boring zealots from planet anarchy. And that's 194 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,400 Speaker 1: not what I realized when I heard it when I 195 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 1: was in the nineties and like driving around and like, 196 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 1: but but I think it's cool that they don't try 197 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 1: to shoe that interpretation because it is a drinking song, 198 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 1: you know, it's but it works on a couple of 199 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 1: different levels. But um, it is a drinking song insofar 200 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:27,080 Speaker 1: as like, you know you're drinking with your mates, and 201 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:31,880 Speaker 1: that there's community there, and there's solidarity there, and and 202 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 1: there's you know, commiseration for the getting knocked down, you know, 203 00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 1: parts of life there, which is punk as fuck. It 204 00:10:41,800 --> 00:10:44,319 Speaker 1: is punk as fucked, like put your arms around all 205 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 1: your friends and drunkenly sing songs like whatever. The song 206 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 1: you know, like yeah, like yeah, um, it's collective, it's 207 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:57,120 Speaker 1: it's yeah. It's a kind of a spiritual experience, you know, yeah, totally, 208 00:10:57,160 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 1: and it's one that we have like increasingly stripped away 209 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 1: from us up by modern life. And apparently one of 210 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:05,679 Speaker 1: the main inspirations of the song was watching a drunk 211 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:08,600 Speaker 1: irish guy stumbling home from a bar singing Danny Boy 212 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 1: and being told to shut up by a neighbor. So 213 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 1: and the song goes fucking huge. And again, if you 214 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:19,000 Speaker 1: were live in the nineties, you probably remember this. It's 215 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:21,480 Speaker 1: number two in the UK, it's number six in the US, 216 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 1: It's in the charts everywhere in the world. It gets 217 00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:27,079 Speaker 1: ranked on lists of like the twenty most annoying songs 218 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:31,240 Speaker 1: of all time. Yeah, I mean there's a distinction to 219 00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:35,559 Speaker 1: be made there between between like a hit song and 220 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: like a global smash like that song was like, you know, 221 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: number one on alternative rock radio or whatever, but also 222 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:48,720 Speaker 1: pop radio, and also not just in the US, but 223 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:53,559 Speaker 1: like yeah, you know, everywhere. It was just one of those, 224 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 1: you know, hyper ubiquitous, so that you could not escape 225 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:03,040 Speaker 1: no matter where you were, no matter what you're where 226 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 1: your tastes, what genres your tastes went through or whatever. Yeah, 227 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:10,080 Speaker 1: because it's also kind of a genre list song. Like 228 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 1: on its face, you know, it has like I think 229 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 1: electronic drums and just this catchy sing along chorus and 230 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 1: like it's just and it's like, yeah, it's almost like 231 00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 1: like a collective delusion, you know, this thing that just 232 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:31,120 Speaker 1: like absorbed everyone for a moment, you know, and yeah, 233 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 1: I don't know, it's fucking interesting. It's like in a way, 234 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 1: it's like it was it was a troll sort of, 235 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:42,760 Speaker 1: but it also wasn't a cynical one. They were they 236 00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:47,440 Speaker 1: weren't looking down on the people enjoying it for whatever 237 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 1: surface reasons. There was no contempt there um, but it 238 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:56,679 Speaker 1: was this thing that functioned on a couple of different levels. Yeah, 239 00:12:56,720 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 1: it's so fucking like it's just brilliant. It's us So 240 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 1: it's yeah, it's it's a prank, but it's not a prank, 241 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:06,160 Speaker 1: you know. It's this earnest thing they did that got 242 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:11,599 Speaker 1: injected into pop culture and sucking and a lot of 243 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:15,960 Speaker 1: their old fans write them letters calling them sellouts. But 244 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 1: the people who really lad the charge of calling them 245 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: hypocrites were the same music journalists who had always hated 246 00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:23,199 Speaker 1: them because they're like, ah see, we told you their 247 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:25,960 Speaker 1: politics didn't mean anything, which was their way of basically 248 00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:29,120 Speaker 1: excusing themselves for never having had decent politics in the 249 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 1: first which is a really dubious way to sort of yeah, 250 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:39,559 Speaker 1: you know, truffle hunt for what seems like hypocrisy, but 251 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 1: if you scratch the service at all, you realize really isn't. 252 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: It's a collective who wants to take be able to 253 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:50,160 Speaker 1: take care of their own and as we'll find soon 254 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:53,800 Speaker 1: enough in the story, um take care of others as well, 255 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: and do that by siphoning corporate money. And yeah, like 256 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:03,400 Speaker 1: you know, doing Robin hood ship. Really yeah, totally totally 257 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,440 Speaker 1: And and it's funny is to look at like if 258 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 1: I had been I, you know, I was a salty 259 00:14:09,520 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 1: subcultural but not like a punk yet right at the 260 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 1: time of all of this, if I had been like 261 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 1: if it had happened in two thousands three, I probably 262 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:18,679 Speaker 1: would have been one of the people being like, you 263 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:23,320 Speaker 1: fucking sellouts, right, But I'm glad that I don't um, 264 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:25,240 Speaker 1: you know, like twenty one year old me is not 265 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 1: who I look back to about what decisions were best 266 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:30,200 Speaker 1: to make for my life. You know, I'm stuck with 267 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 1: some of the tattoos, but that's okay. Yeah. So they 268 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 1: spent two years, the next two years in this whirlwind 269 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 1: of fame. It doesn't stop them from being themselves. And 270 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:44,000 Speaker 1: first and foremost, they gave away just a fun ton 271 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:47,320 Speaker 1: of money since since all the money gets split equally, 272 00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 1: they didn't like fuss about who did who deserves what 273 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: amount and stuff like that. You know, there were the 274 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 1: people who are the lead singers of the songs whatever, 275 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: but they're like, we're just split in evenly. We'll work 276 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:58,480 Speaker 1: from there. And they peer pressure each other out of 277 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: like running out and buying Jaguars. Boff notes that Dan 278 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,760 Speaker 1: went out and bought a really fancy vacuum cleaner, which 279 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 1: I must be what middle age an artists do. And 280 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 1: they suddenly have a lot of money. You know, vacuum 281 00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:14,000 Speaker 1: cleaners a very nice thing. And they I get the 282 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:16,240 Speaker 1: impression that they hold onto enough money to not have 283 00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: to like worry about being poor. But they donate money 284 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:24,640 Speaker 1: to artists, women's groups, prisoner defense campaigns, kids football teams, 285 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 1: radical media projects, venues, solidarity groups, individual organizers, community groups, magazines, 286 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: direct action groups, and social centers. At one point in 287 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:37,720 Speaker 1: two thousand two, GM wanted a song for a commercial. Yeah, 288 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 1: Jumba Womba said yes, and they take took a hundred 289 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:44,000 Speaker 1: thousand dollars or different accounts give different amounts, but a 290 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:48,440 Speaker 1: large number of money, high money number hundred thousand will 291 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: go with that. And they just turn around and they 292 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 1: give half of it to indie media, which is this 293 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 1: big decentralized you be the media network, and they give 294 00:15:57,520 --> 00:16:00,080 Speaker 1: which is unfortunately kind of probably what prefigured to it 295 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 1: earned the rest of the night where we living now, 296 00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:03,600 Speaker 1: but it was a good idea at the time. And 297 00:16:03,640 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 1: they give the other half to a project called corp 298 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:10,160 Speaker 1: Watch that is specifically fucking um tracking GM and like 299 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 1: exposing their crimes. And so they just turn around and 300 00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:16,520 Speaker 1: give fifty to people who are like specifically attacking GM. Yeah. 301 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 1: And so if the two main arguments that they have 302 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:21,240 Speaker 1: in favor of selling out are reach a wider audience 303 00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: and get fun tons of money, they do both. But 304 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 1: but I actually I think Alice Nutter was right in 305 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:30,280 Speaker 1: some ways, the funk tons of money, which seems less 306 00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: radical goal, is actually in some ways the more radical 307 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:36,360 Speaker 1: thing they did, because the wider audience didn't necessarily like 308 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: get it right. Uh. They talk about anarchism on news shows, 309 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: they mostly get made fun of. They sell their music 310 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: to a ton of places, but they turned down other 311 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: places too. They turned down Nike, who offered them a 312 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: million and a half bucks. Their rules were really simple 313 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,560 Speaker 1: and strict. They wouldn't sell their music to anyone involved 314 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:56,760 Speaker 1: in sweatshop labor or the arms industry. And when I 315 00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 1: first started researching this episode, I thought it was gonna 316 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:01,720 Speaker 1: be mostly about their their high jinks during the fame period, 317 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:05,080 Speaker 1: because it's really good hijinks. But in the end, I 318 00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 1: you know, the reason the first half is more about 319 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 1: the working class punks in the squad breaking laws is 320 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:12,000 Speaker 1: like what I kind of lingered on. But let's start 321 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:16,680 Speaker 1: without the hijinks. One time, the tob Thumping era, Dan 322 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,639 Speaker 1: gets arrested in Italy literally for just walking down the 323 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,359 Speaker 1: street wearing a skirt, and he's held in his cell. 324 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 1: He's a show that night. He gets held in a 325 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:26,679 Speaker 1: cell with no one speaking to him in English, and 326 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:30,119 Speaker 1: finally he scrawls I'm in a pop group called Chumbo 327 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,879 Speaker 1: Womba on a piece of paper and helds it up 328 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:36,159 Speaker 1: to the glass of the cell and they release him 329 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,679 Speaker 1: um and he gets in time to go to the 330 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:42,680 Speaker 1: sound check. Uh. The next day, he appears on Italian 331 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 1: TV in the skirt and says Italy has some problems 332 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:51,320 Speaker 1: with homophobic, macho cop culture. Alice Nutter steps up as 333 00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 1: being the kind of unofficial spokesperson for the band, I 334 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: think mostly because she enjoyed talking the most and had 335 00:17:57,320 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 1: the most to say. She was also maybe the most 336 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 1: firebrand of them. She told the UK Press, nothing can 337 00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 1: change the fact that we like it when cops get killed. 338 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 1: E m I is like, oh my god, please apologize. 339 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:16,159 Speaker 1: What the fuck? Oh my god. She didn't apologize and 340 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: said she clarified her statement. If you're working class, they 341 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,439 Speaker 1: won't protect you. When you hear about them, it's in 342 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:25,640 Speaker 1: the context of them abusing people, you know, miscarriages of justice. 343 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 1: We don't have a party when cops die, you know, 344 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 1: we don't. But before we hear about more of Alice 345 00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:37,919 Speaker 1: Nutter's anti capitalist hijinks, boy, we have some capitalist hijinks 346 00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 1: for you, in the form of products and services. Okay, 347 00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:54,960 Speaker 1: and we are back in January. Alice Nutter, she goes 348 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:59,360 Speaker 1: on the talk show Politically Incorrect, and she says, basically, yeah, 349 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:01,200 Speaker 1: if you can't afford our music, just go to the 350 00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:04,639 Speaker 1: nearest big, evil, giant chain store like Virgin and steal it. 351 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:10,080 Speaker 1: Um and Virgin I didn't like this Chambawamba at the 352 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: time as Universal's number one selling band, and here's the 353 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:15,199 Speaker 1: band saying, just steal it. Who fucking cares as long 354 00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:19,439 Speaker 1: as you steal from a large corporation. Virgin threatens to 355 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:22,119 Speaker 1: remove the album from their stores. And it depends on 356 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:24,919 Speaker 1: what account you read. They either stopped carrying it entirely 357 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:27,880 Speaker 1: or hit it behind the counter. I don't know. And 358 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:32,600 Speaker 1: this only makes sales go up, which doesn't fucking surprise me, right, 359 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 1: Like I could have told them that, Like, yeah, more 360 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 1: will get stolen. But if people steal the CDs, people 361 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:39,480 Speaker 1: are gonna listen to it and talk about it, and 362 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 1: more people are going to go out and sucking buy it. Right. 363 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:44,120 Speaker 1: And and if you're taking it off the shelves were 364 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: hiding it, you're literally manufacturing scarcity for the thing, and 365 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,160 Speaker 1: by making it more valuable. Yeah, yeah, so everyone wants 366 00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:55,040 Speaker 1: to go out and find it and get it. Yeah. 367 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 1: So anyway, their their contact at Universal called the band 368 00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:01,119 Speaker 1: and was like, well, you all just laugh at me 369 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,360 Speaker 1: if I tell you that Universal wants to ask you 370 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:06,160 Speaker 1: to apologize for saying all that, Like they're rep knows 371 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,119 Speaker 1: it's a like fool's errand that he's been tasked to 372 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: call them and ask them to apologize. He's like, you're 373 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:13,639 Speaker 1: not going to do this, are you, And they're like 374 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:19,879 Speaker 1: ha ha ha Nope. And later Alice Nutters, in a 375 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: recollection says, why should I apologize? I wasn't sorry, which 376 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:26,879 Speaker 1: is exactly how you should or shouldn't apologize when you 377 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:32,000 Speaker 1: make decisions about apologies. So, and on The David Letterman Show, 378 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 1: they changed the lyrics of tub thumping to include from 379 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:38,840 Speaker 1: free mu Mia bou Jamal and Mama bou Jamal for 380 00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:41,439 Speaker 1: anyone who's not aware. As a a black political prisoner 381 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 1: who was probably framed up on the murder of a 382 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 1: cop in Philly and at the very least definitely had 383 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:48,720 Speaker 1: an unfair trial, he spent a couple of decades on 384 00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:50,760 Speaker 1: death row, which was reduced to life without pearl in 385 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:53,800 Speaker 1: two thousand one. So Chumbawamba goes on Letterman and sings 386 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: free Muma Bou Jamal and it was prerecorded, so Letterman 387 00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 1: let it happen. In the end, basically they sat down 388 00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:03,359 Speaker 1: like the Letterman Show. People were like, funk, are we 389 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:06,080 Speaker 1: gonna let this fu happen? And finally the network is 390 00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:10,280 Speaker 1: like all right, fuck it. They run it and they 391 00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 1: talked about anarchism with Barbara Walters. They basically leave a 392 00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:16,399 Speaker 1: trail of chaos that the record labels are running around 393 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,679 Speaker 1: trying to clean up for them. But instead of trash 394 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:22,879 Speaker 1: hotel rooms, it was just weird ship, you know. And 395 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 1: the peak of all this was brit Awards, which I 396 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,439 Speaker 1: think are the Grammys for people stuck on entirely tiny 397 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,320 Speaker 1: island without sunshine. My theory is that they actually named 398 00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,440 Speaker 1: the country after the award show. Uh it was called 399 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 1: britt Land, but then with the accents on like Britain, 400 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 1: and so that's what stuck. Sounds true to me. Yeah, 401 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:48,119 Speaker 1: So I wonder how long I'm gonna get away with 402 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 1: this bit um so Jumba Womba. They get invited to awards, 403 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 1: they're even up for an award themselves Best Single, and 404 00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,919 Speaker 1: they're they're going to perform. At first, they weren't going 405 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,520 Speaker 1: to perform, but the director he knows their fucking number 406 00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:05,840 Speaker 1: and he's like, all right, you don't want to perform, 407 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:08,680 Speaker 1: We'll let you have a video behind you. And they're like, yeah, okay, 408 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:12,400 Speaker 1: we're in. We can show propaganda. We are in. And 409 00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:15,959 Speaker 1: the day of the director of the wards he goes 410 00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:19,800 Speaker 1: up to chumble One personally with a plea and he's like, hey, 411 00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 1: could you, um, could you not physically attack any of 412 00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:28,560 Speaker 1: the other artists And that's his big request to them. Chumbawamba. 413 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:32,720 Speaker 1: It's like, alright, fine, whatever, we won't attack any of 414 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 1: the other artists physically, And they even technically stuck with that. 415 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:40,920 Speaker 1: They're not super stoked about it though, and everyone else 416 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:42,920 Speaker 1: is pissing them off with all being off pop Star 417 00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 1: and ship and I have a feeling that every like 418 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,959 Speaker 1: bands that's played at this level kind of like vaguely 419 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: enjoys talking about bands. But you know they they point 420 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:54,480 Speaker 1: out in this in the book that like half a 421 00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 1: Fleetwood Mac refuses to use their dressing room because of 422 00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:00,800 Speaker 1: inadequate carpeting. Um, and I don't know it about Fleetwood Mac. 423 00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 1: And I'm taking Boff Whaley's word for it, maybe inadequate carpeting, 424 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:05,240 Speaker 1: was like maybe like the whole thing was like this, 425 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:09,720 Speaker 1: like sewage swamp. I don't fucking know, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, 426 00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,679 Speaker 1: but it's easier to imagine, like, ah, those damn rock stars, 427 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:16,000 Speaker 1: said the one rock star to anyway, whatever, it's more 428 00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:20,479 Speaker 1: fun to imagine too, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Uh. So they 429 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 1: go up and play and they're all wearing sweatshirts that 430 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,520 Speaker 1: says things like sold out or whatever, and they put 431 00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 1: on a film behind them and it's full of people 432 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,879 Speaker 1: rioting and protesting, and there's act up banners and there's 433 00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,919 Speaker 1: the stage is streaming with red and black banners, and 434 00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:36,959 Speaker 1: it's like, it's exactly what I would do if I 435 00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:39,639 Speaker 1: was up for one of these supports. And it's not 436 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:42,440 Speaker 1: even not necessarily in an original way, but just it's 437 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:44,919 Speaker 1: it's like you kind of have to if you're if 438 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 1: you're that band, you know. And at the time, dockers 439 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 1: in Liverpool had been on strike and it was one 440 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,280 Speaker 1: of the longest labor disputes in British history, and the 441 00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:58,640 Speaker 1: doctors had mostly lost They've been forced into a settlement 442 00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: package and they all lost their job and the Labor 443 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: Party was currently branding itself as New Labor, and they 444 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,400 Speaker 1: were culpable for a lot of that. So Chumba womb 445 00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,639 Speaker 1: but changed the course of tub thumping to include New Labor. 446 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: Sold out the doctors, just like they'll sell out the 447 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:15,480 Speaker 1: rest of us, and they even brought some doctors with 448 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: them to the ceremony with the plan that if they win, 449 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:19,800 Speaker 1: the doctors would go up and accept on their behalf 450 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 1: and give a speech about what was going on. But 451 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:25,879 Speaker 1: Chumba Woman didn't win, so they didn't get to do 452 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 1: the doctors accepting. But after they get off stage, they're like, oh, shoot, 453 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: that's that's John Prescott and he's the Deputy Prime Minister, 454 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:39,639 Speaker 1: which is the roughly the equivalent of vice president, and 455 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:42,119 Speaker 1: he's he's from the working class. He used to be 456 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:45,000 Speaker 1: a member of the same union as the doctors, but 457 00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:48,119 Speaker 1: he basically sold them out. He was blocking tuition bills, 458 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:51,040 Speaker 1: he was sucking over the unemployed. He was just doing 459 00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:53,679 Speaker 1: all kinds of ship right. So they're sitting around and 460 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:55,920 Speaker 1: they're like, what the funk are we gonna do. There's 461 00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:58,640 Speaker 1: the Vice president of Britain, which definitely as a vice president, 462 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 1: and they they look at the bend that had been 463 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: full of all the ice for the Champagne and all 464 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:07,239 Speaker 1: of that, and they're like, Dan, Alice, you got this, 465 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,240 Speaker 1: And Dan and Alice were like, yes, we do indeed 466 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 1: have it. So they go up to Prescott. Dan jumps 467 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,640 Speaker 1: on the table, says this is for the Liverpool Dockers 468 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,920 Speaker 1: and dumps a bucket of ice water on John Prescott's head. 469 00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:23,240 Speaker 1: Not to be outdone, Nutter is right there behind him 470 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 1: with I think an extra bucket of water and also 471 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:30,199 Speaker 1: just soaks him with that as well. And this is 472 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,200 Speaker 1: like on okay. So so Dan gets arrested and Prescott 473 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 1: has to be a good sport about it because he's 474 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,480 Speaker 1: like trying to look cool with the kids he's here 475 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:39,119 Speaker 1: at the brit Awards or whatever. It's really hard to 476 00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:41,679 Speaker 1: imagine the US politician being this cool about especially a 477 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: vice president. I'm like, I'm struggling to imagine the punk 478 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 1: band that can dump ice water on the vice president 479 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,720 Speaker 1: of the United States and survive. You know, yeah, yeah, 480 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,480 Speaker 1: I mean we saw the way, was it Juliani? Who 481 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 1: there was that video of a guy who kind of 482 00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:01,679 Speaker 1: like lightly like gaveh uh hat on the back and 483 00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 1: then talk some ship and he acted like it was 484 00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:11,679 Speaker 1: a soul and yeah, yeah, yeah, But however they managed 485 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:14,359 Speaker 1: to dump ice water on the fucking deputy prime minister's 486 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 1: head and and the Deputy Prime Minister of Prescott is like, 487 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 1: all right, I'm not pressing charges. And so they get 488 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:24,880 Speaker 1: let go, and the tabloids eat the whole thing up, 489 00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: and of course the usual snotty critics get mad. And 490 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:31,840 Speaker 1: oh and then Ginger Spice from the Spice Girls goes 491 00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:33,880 Speaker 1: up to Prescott to make sure he's okay. They made 492 00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: sure to include that part in the in their biography 493 00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 1: or that's really funny, And Alice Nutter later, I think 494 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 1: it's talking about the entire like arc of Chumba Womba 495 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,159 Speaker 1: and it's like it was all worth it just to 496 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 1: be able to get at John Prescott, to just to 497 00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:53,800 Speaker 1: get at these people who think they're untouchable. And that's 498 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: the thing that's kind of interesting to me about like 499 00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 1: like people used to pie politicians more often, it feels like, 500 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,080 Speaker 1: and it seems is like the point of that is 501 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:06,320 Speaker 1: just to say, like, hey, remember you're a person. Yeah 502 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 1: you know, like this could have been worse, is what 503 00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:11,440 Speaker 1: you're saying when you dump ice water on someone's head. 504 00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:14,640 Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, you're a person who's supposed to be 505 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:20,439 Speaker 1: accountable to us. Yeah, and you clearly aren't, and you 506 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:25,720 Speaker 1: enjoy this sort of like protected celebrity status, you know, Yeah, 507 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:30,879 Speaker 1: totally and so okay. So they spent about two years 508 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,199 Speaker 1: on the road doing the celebrity thing, and then they 509 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,360 Speaker 1: take a break and they resume other parts of their 510 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,040 Speaker 1: lives figuring out their next move. And then they put 511 00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:40,520 Speaker 1: out a second album with E m I. UM, which 512 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 1: is a bit confusing because in their mythologizing UM, I've 513 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:46,560 Speaker 1: read some of their accounts that are like E M 514 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:48,640 Speaker 1: I wanted to put out another album, but we said no. 515 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 1: But I think they did put out another album with 516 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 1: E M I. Either way, either either em I dumps 517 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:58,600 Speaker 1: them or they dump E M I and or yeah 518 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:02,720 Speaker 1: E M I cud have done something where if they 519 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 1: were under contract for another record or something but didn't 520 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: want to deliver it, where they either I mean, we 521 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,360 Speaker 1: had our record label do that with us, where they 522 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,399 Speaker 1: put out I don't know if it was like live 523 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:19,439 Speaker 1: stuff for you know, how interesting because you owed them 524 00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:22,160 Speaker 1: an album but they didn't like the wing to tune in. Yeah, yeah, 525 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 1: that that that kind of thing for us. I don't 526 00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:27,600 Speaker 1: remember exactly what the circumstances were, but I could see 527 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,520 Speaker 1: it being something like that where they basically manufactured some 528 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:35,199 Speaker 1: kind of release out of B sides or whatever. You know, 529 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 1: are you still technically owned? I think you're not still 530 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 1: with a major labels? That correct, that's correct. Yeah, we 531 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 1: got dropped from our c A and like two thousand 532 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 1: three and we put records out now with with an 533 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:54,360 Speaker 1: indie label called Velocity, okay, which always seems like kind 534 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:56,680 Speaker 1: of a cool like after this, and I'll get to 535 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:58,200 Speaker 1: it in a moment, like Chamber one by kind of 536 00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: like goes from major label back to indie. They go 537 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:03,600 Speaker 1: from indie to major to indie, right, and they're like 538 00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:06,200 Speaker 1: all right, like and it's kind of interesting to me 539 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 1: to see that as a well, you just do what's 540 00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 1: best in the situation, rather than like, oh no, you're 541 00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:15,640 Speaker 1: a failure because the major label dropped you, or oh no, 542 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:19,840 Speaker 1: you're a sellout because you know you went to a 543 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:23,200 Speaker 1: major label at all. I don't know, yeah, yeah, I 544 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:30,320 Speaker 1: mean sort of like judging or making the metric of 545 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 1: like what is worthwhile about making rock by what type 546 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:43,040 Speaker 1: of record label you're on or whatever ain't really where 547 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:46,800 Speaker 1: it's at. I can also see how you know, perception 548 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:51,080 Speaker 1: is created by like by that kind of story, Like, 549 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 1: you know, it did feel embarrassing to get dropped from 550 00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,720 Speaker 1: a major label for all of those reasons, but then 551 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 1: you sort of realize, like why why why do you 552 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:09,800 Speaker 1: feel that way? Right, and that you know this The 553 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: reasons for it are are pretty dubious once you examine 554 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:16,000 Speaker 1: them a little bit, like what what are you what 555 00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:20,760 Speaker 1: are you making stuff for anyway? Is it too you know, 556 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 1: appeas you know, the bean counters or whatever because you 557 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,160 Speaker 1: like like to like to make rock because it makes 558 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:32,880 Speaker 1: you feel free or whatever. Yeah, and like connecting to people, 559 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: like you connect with people in different ways depending on 560 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,000 Speaker 1: what means by which you access them. And it doesn't 561 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 1: make it better or worse, Like, no, that's interesting, Yeah 562 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 1: it must have been. You have not been in that position, 563 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 1: but it must have been like, oh, we've we've hit 564 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,360 Speaker 1: our crest and now we are coming down from it, 565 00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:53,480 Speaker 1: as compared to like, well now you got this like 566 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 1: boost of um attention and now you're able to do 567 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: things with that, you know. Yeah, total, it's all in 568 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,400 Speaker 1: how you sort of frame your your perspective toward it. 569 00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 1: Like I mean, in our case, we did need to 570 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 1: like break up for a host of reasons, um, and 571 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:14,880 Speaker 1: we did for a few years, and only recently, in 572 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 1: the last couple of years have we started doing this 573 00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 1: new iteration of the band that, like I said, is 574 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:25,960 Speaker 1: sort of in practice a side project. But we just 575 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 1: still call it Eve six um. But yeah, you know, 576 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:37,200 Speaker 1: we're doing it for for the right reasons. And I 577 00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:41,440 Speaker 1: think a band like Trumbawamba was always doing it for 578 00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: the right reasons, you know. Yeah, And you know who 579 00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 1: else is doing it for the right reasons. It's it's 580 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: a it's the advertisers. We're actually sponsored by this new um, 581 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:57,480 Speaker 1: this new act on our ci com EVE seven one 582 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 1: new band. It's very original. Okay, this isn't interesting. I 583 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 1: hadn't I hadn't heard of this, hadn't heard of this group. 584 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:07,040 Speaker 1: But um, my first reaction is, I don't know if 585 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,000 Speaker 1: this town is big enough for the two of us. Well, 586 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:12,560 Speaker 1: they've got this hit, and you know that's the first 587 00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: advertisers gonna be this hit. It's called what kind of 588 00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:18,080 Speaker 1: prepositions are they're working with? You put a blender in 589 00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:23,600 Speaker 1: my heart, I believe is that? Okay? Um, it's funny 590 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,280 Speaker 1: because five Seconds of Summer apparently just released a song 591 00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 1: called Blender or like Emotional Blender or something like that. 592 00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:32,920 Speaker 1: I haven't listened to it yet, but yeah, town's only 593 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:35,960 Speaker 1: big enough for one blender song. That's that's right. Yeah, 594 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,320 Speaker 1: I'm stay away from our kitchen appliants. That is the 595 00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: official motto of cool Zone Media. Is that is that correct? 596 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:45,920 Speaker 1: Sophie is nodding. Um, Sometimes I just say so if 597 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 1: he's not in when Sophie's actually holding up a sign 598 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: that says stop doing this, You're going to get us 599 00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 1: in trouble. But so if he's yeah, yeah, totally. And 600 00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:57,480 Speaker 1: here's some other products and services including Eve six I 601 00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:05,600 Speaker 1: mean sorry, seven, eight and nine. M h. And we 602 00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: are back, okay. So, and we were talking about the 603 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 1: the at this point, you know, Chumba Womba is in there. 604 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: They they're they've taken a break from the celebrity thing. 605 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,360 Speaker 1: Then they then they come back at making music and 606 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,760 Speaker 1: they keep at it for another fifteen years. Tump Pumping 607 00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:23,960 Speaker 1: is right in the middle of the career of Chumba 608 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 1: Womba as a band. They start their own label. They 609 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:28,680 Speaker 1: work with a bunch of different indies, and they put 610 00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:32,080 Speaker 1: out a ton of music, and they continue to accidentally 611 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:35,280 Speaker 1: show up at the craziest riots in history. Wow, what 612 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,560 Speaker 1: a weird coincidence. And I actually this part actually caught 613 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:40,440 Speaker 1: me by surprise because I had kind of assumed that, 614 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 1: like they're in their forties, I think at this point, 615 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,280 Speaker 1: and like they're doing all right, and they're still just like, well, 616 00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:49,280 Speaker 1: there's this riot. I mean, actually it's an accident. There's 617 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 1: just accidentally in all these things. Um. And I really 618 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,080 Speaker 1: I really appreciate about the their bad timing where they 619 00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:58,160 Speaker 1: keep showing these things and so, and they also fund 620 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:02,320 Speaker 1: a bunch of direct actions, which I think there's still um, 621 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 1: I don't want to conjecture too hard about the things 622 00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:07,840 Speaker 1: that they fund. And a bunch of them leave the 623 00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:09,919 Speaker 1: band in two thousand four, and I spent a while 624 00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:11,799 Speaker 1: trying to be like, what did they leave the band about? Right? 625 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:14,319 Speaker 1: But then I realized that none of them were trying 626 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 1: to talk about it. There was a little bit of 627 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,799 Speaker 1: like personal and political differences, and they leave it at that, right, 628 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:23,520 Speaker 1: And and that's cool. It's cool that I don't know 629 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,239 Speaker 1: because they're just like their whole thing seems to be 630 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:30,560 Speaker 1: like how do we come close to this environment that 631 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:34,160 Speaker 1: could have made us douchebag rock stars without and so 632 00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:37,080 Speaker 1: they're just like they just worked through it, at least 633 00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 1: somewhat privately, right, Yeah, it sounds like they have loyalty 634 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:46,600 Speaker 1: to one another and like, yeah, actual friendship. Yeah yeah, 635 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:49,560 Speaker 1: it's almost like they you know, repaired a house together 636 00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:51,279 Speaker 1: for ten years before they went on any of this 637 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:54,200 Speaker 1: crazy you know, and um and even the people who 638 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:56,239 Speaker 1: left in two thousand four came back for their two 639 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,400 Speaker 1: thousand twelve Fucket were Done Tour. I don't think that 640 00:34:58,440 --> 00:34:59,960 Speaker 1: was the actual name of it, but it might as well. 641 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 1: And their funcket were Done tour because they basically were like, 642 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:03,520 Speaker 1: fuck it, we're done, and then they had a tour. 643 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:07,319 Speaker 1: Um and they still contribute to each other's art to 644 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,280 Speaker 1: this day. They like a bunch of a make movies 645 00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:13,000 Speaker 1: and theater and music and you know, Boff writes books 646 00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:17,840 Speaker 1: about running, Alice writes for tv UH. Bruce is working 647 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:23,640 Speaker 1: on a documentary about Chumbawemba that's currently on the the 648 00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:25,840 Speaker 1: the circuit where you're not allowed to watch it unless 649 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:32,680 Speaker 1: you have a that's it. When they broke up, they 650 00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:35,239 Speaker 1: put out a statement, I'm a quote from it, because 651 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:37,560 Speaker 1: I think they they do a good, pretty good job 652 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:39,920 Speaker 1: of something up what they were doing. Jumbo Wombo was 653 00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,080 Speaker 1: our vehicle for pointing at the Naked Emperor's we're telling 654 00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 1: our version of the truth. It gave us more than 655 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,520 Speaker 1: the joy and love of playing live, writing songs, and 656 00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:51,040 Speaker 1: singing together. It gave us a chance to be part 657 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:54,680 Speaker 1: of a broad coalition of activists and Hector's optimists and questioners. 658 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,520 Speaker 1: But eventually the rest of our lives got in the way, 659 00:35:57,600 --> 00:35:59,719 Speaker 1: and we couldn't commit the time and enthusiasm that the 660 00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:03,279 Speaker 1: band demanded, couldn't keep up with whatever responsibilities came with 661 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:06,400 Speaker 1: a band like this. If there were ever a chumble 662 00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:10,280 Speaker 1: One manifesto, it would read in the inconsistent, contradictory language 663 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:14,759 Speaker 1: of the dataists, parts strident belligerents, and part foolishness. This 664 00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:17,080 Speaker 1: ending is no different. It comes almost as much of 665 00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:19,160 Speaker 1: a surprise to us as it may do to you. 666 00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:23,680 Speaker 1: Always more clown than politician, the band trips over its 667 00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 1: outsize feet and performs its final tumble. There have been 668 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:32,880 Speaker 1: squabbles and arguments along the way, a deal of griping, frustration, moaning, exasperation, 669 00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:36,399 Speaker 1: but always alongside a huge amount of good will and generosity, 670 00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:39,920 Speaker 1: good humor and love. What a riot it's been, frankly, 671 00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:42,080 Speaker 1: and now it's time to clear up the mess and 672 00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:45,719 Speaker 1: move on. And U and Dan, I'm gonna read one 673 00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:48,439 Speaker 1: more quote about from one of them about this Dan 674 00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:51,920 Speaker 1: an interview with band Camp this year. I guess I 675 00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:53,560 Speaker 1: can just say this year, if I'm just talking about 676 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,759 Speaker 1: the year I'm in, I'm very proud of what we 677 00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,640 Speaker 1: did the whole way through. We tried to push the envelope, 678 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,520 Speaker 1: were and always successful, but we always tried. And that's 679 00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:06,640 Speaker 1: probably a defining characteristic of Chumbawamba. Whatever era or genre 680 00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,919 Speaker 1: we tried, it always had a working class basis, which 681 00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:11,640 Speaker 1: is a whole other story. When we signed with the 682 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 1: major labels in the mainstream, it didn't destroy us. You 683 00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:18,279 Speaker 1: could accuse us of selling out, but we weren't bought up, 684 00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:20,680 Speaker 1: and I think that's a testament to the way we 685 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:23,960 Speaker 1: had each other's backs. The mainstream usually swallows people and 686 00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:27,080 Speaker 1: spits them out. I mean it did spit us out, 687 00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:31,560 Speaker 1: but we took it as a compliment. Really there you go. Yeah, 688 00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:33,000 Speaker 1: it's like what you were saying about, like, it's just 689 00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:39,080 Speaker 1: how you fucking look at it. You know, yep, there 690 00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:43,040 Speaker 1: there like pros or you know, I don't know if 691 00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:47,040 Speaker 1: that last quote quotation was what you know, said to 692 00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,000 Speaker 1: a reporter or something like that, but it's it's so 693 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:54,200 Speaker 1: beautiful and it's like better than their lyrics there their 694 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:59,880 Speaker 1: own sort of like um yeah, assessment of their story 695 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:06,120 Speaker 1: is is really deep and just like so on point 696 00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:13,719 Speaker 1: and and includes all of the admittedly seemingly contradictory things 697 00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:17,120 Speaker 1: that that made made up Shamba Womba, this thing that 698 00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:22,960 Speaker 1: was you know, on one level, just like uh vessel 699 00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 1: for entertainment and diversion, and on another you know, straight 700 00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:34,000 Speaker 1: up you know, activism. Yeah, And it's interesting cause I 701 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:35,480 Speaker 1: was thinking about this as I was writing this out. 702 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:37,160 Speaker 1: I was like, you know, I'm not really talking about 703 00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:40,239 Speaker 1: their music, right, and like their songs, and I'm not 704 00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 1: talking about like the their instrumentation and like and all 705 00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:45,400 Speaker 1: that stuff really matters, and it clearly mattered to them 706 00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:47,000 Speaker 1: because the whole time they're always like, oh yeah, we 707 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:49,360 Speaker 1: don't want to play our instruments. They are like musically 708 00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 1: really talented to the point where it's like sort of 709 00:38:51,719 --> 00:38:54,080 Speaker 1: almost annoying. Like their acapella album. I'm like, you all 710 00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,600 Speaker 1: these amazing like multiple harmonies and like all this crazy shit, 711 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:01,759 Speaker 1: you know, and it's it's about all of these things 712 00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:04,680 Speaker 1: at once. It is one of the things that the 713 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: music is an aspect of this thing that UM as 714 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:16,040 Speaker 1: a whole is like yeah, activist performance art. Yeah, it's 715 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:22,319 Speaker 1: really inspiring, you know. I mean, they they they did 716 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:27,160 Speaker 1: buck the system, as as he put like, maybe they 717 00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:30,720 Speaker 1: sold out, but they didn't. What's the language he used, 718 00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:36,120 Speaker 1: It spits them out right, But but but they weren't 719 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:39,840 Speaker 1: bought up. Yeah. Yeah, it's really cool. Yeah, yeah that 720 00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,600 Speaker 1: it is really Like this is funny because it's like, 721 00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:43,839 Speaker 1: I know, you're in a band, and I'm in a band, 722 00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:45,120 Speaker 1: and I like, doesn't it make you want to start 723 00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:46,680 Speaker 1: a band or like makes you want to be in 724 00:39:46,719 --> 00:39:50,359 Speaker 1: a band? You know, Like, yeah, I'm writing right now. Um, 725 00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:53,439 Speaker 1: I've been in a bunch of bands that have done 726 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:55,840 Speaker 1: various things, and right now, I like signed to my 727 00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:59,279 Speaker 1: first indie label with my metal band, and we have 728 00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:02,359 Speaker 1: an album Do Soon, right and it's our second full 729 00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:04,880 Speaker 1: length of the band. And I'm like, oh, I should 730 00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:07,160 Speaker 1: really care about that, you know, in a way where 731 00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:08,919 Speaker 1: I'm like I care about it. And I've been working 732 00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:11,560 Speaker 1: with this band for years, but I'm like, I don't 733 00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:17,120 Speaker 1: know it. No, it's inspiring, yeah, it uh, you know, 734 00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:21,960 Speaker 1: trains your your eyes back on like what's important? Yeah, 735 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:29,440 Speaker 1: fun joyful about about a project and you know, exposes 736 00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 1: all the things that aren't, all the metrics that are 737 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:34,880 Speaker 1: seemingly important and the matter and all of that ship 738 00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:41,480 Speaker 1: which don't ultimately, Yeah, and the way in which they 739 00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:43,359 Speaker 1: matter is the vehicle with which to do it. Like 740 00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:47,600 Speaker 1: the thing that you know, getting the money to make 741 00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:50,239 Speaker 1: the music allows them to make the music. That is 742 00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:53,239 Speaker 1: the the part of that that matters, you know. It's 743 00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:57,000 Speaker 1: just the ability to continue to allow to continue to happen, Right, 744 00:40:57,080 --> 00:41:02,480 Speaker 1: That's the end. It's not it's not you know, to 745 00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:06,760 Speaker 1: make yourself obscenely wealthy or you know, fame or whatever 746 00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:10,879 Speaker 1: whatever else. It's like how that in their case, how 747 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:17,040 Speaker 1: that served their their project totally, and both as individuals 748 00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:20,000 Speaker 1: and as activists and as artists like the music that 749 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,040 Speaker 1: they make, how how it matters for its own sake 750 00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:25,000 Speaker 1: and like m hm and so they actually they released 751 00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:28,719 Speaker 1: one album after they broke up, because the very last 752 00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:31,920 Speaker 1: release came in the year after they broke up, and 753 00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:35,560 Speaker 1: because in two thousand five, they recorded an EP called 754 00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:40,680 Speaker 1: in Memoria Margaret Thatcher, and they were like, this would 755 00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:46,160 Speaker 1: be released when Margaret Thatcher dies, and so in Margaret 756 00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:48,640 Speaker 1: Thatcher did that did the world that that favor? And 757 00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:51,680 Speaker 1: went ahead and died and the EP came out along 758 00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:54,480 Speaker 1: with a statement, our deepest sympathies go out to the 759 00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,480 Speaker 1: families of all Margaret Thatcher's victims. And it's a very 760 00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:03,000 Speaker 1: happy little album. Amazing and so okay, so this is 761 00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:04,920 Speaker 1: and so thanks for coming along for my episode that 762 00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,560 Speaker 1: I totally didn't write in order to get myself off 763 00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:10,560 Speaker 1: the hook for taking corporate money, giant faceless corporation around 764 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:12,960 Speaker 1: a podcast but radical history. Now you all know my 765 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:18,080 Speaker 1: secret is that we're telling you about. But I I look, 766 00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:21,799 Speaker 1: I think the analogy works. Yeah, you know, yeah, I 767 00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:25,800 Speaker 1: think I think they might, you know, tip their their bowlers, 768 00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:32,359 Speaker 1: I hope. So if you're listening Jumba Womba, yeah all right, 769 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,040 Speaker 1: well well uh yeah, what what can people you say? 770 00:42:36,080 --> 00:42:37,960 Speaker 1: You're in a band? What what is that band? What 771 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:40,840 Speaker 1: do you? You're the band that ripped off Eve seven? 772 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:46,760 Speaker 1: I think right, yeah, look, um, there's there's a bunch 773 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:52,200 Speaker 1: of you know, vicious like um rumors going out going 774 00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:57,080 Speaker 1: around that have no footpold in the truth. Um, Eve 775 00:42:57,200 --> 00:43:02,239 Speaker 1: six came before Eve seven, and Eve seven has been like, 776 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:07,480 Speaker 1: you know, biting our vibe, you know, agreed to egregiously 777 00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:10,799 Speaker 1: and and and you know, anyone who's got their ear 778 00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:14,279 Speaker 1: to the ground, Margaret has heard of Eve six, this 779 00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:20,240 Speaker 1: quiet band that yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, okay, and it 780 00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:22,840 Speaker 1: it does chronologically six does come before you? Could you 781 00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:26,400 Speaker 1: could use that six comes before seven? Yeah, yeah, yeah, 782 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:32,239 Speaker 1: I actually here it's afraid of seven because nine that 783 00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:35,720 Speaker 1: that that's right, see and that's that too, is true. 784 00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:44,400 Speaker 1: So that was despicable. If the lizarders could only see 785 00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:48,960 Speaker 1: how happy she was while making that terrible joke, that 786 00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:53,520 Speaker 1: they would be, they would be truly dismayed. Yeah, truly 787 00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:56,320 Speaker 1: the worst. I lost all of my my goth points 788 00:43:56,320 --> 00:44:01,280 Speaker 1: went out the river river. Yeah, my out the window 789 00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:06,239 Speaker 1: and down the river. Okay. Well um yeah, so so 790 00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:08,200 Speaker 1: what what do you have going on? You play shows 791 00:44:08,280 --> 00:44:10,239 Speaker 1: or like, how can people check out? Maybe have a 792 00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:12,319 Speaker 1: new album out coming out? Maybe it's even out by 793 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,279 Speaker 1: the time people listen, because this will come out about 794 00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:17,640 Speaker 1: a month after we record it. Yeah it might be. 795 00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:20,120 Speaker 1: I have no idea when our album comes out. I 796 00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:22,800 Speaker 1: don't know, it comes out in like a few weeks. 797 00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:27,360 Speaker 1: I think I should know this, but it's called hyper relativisation. 798 00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:31,319 Speaker 1: If you follow us on Twitter at EVE six, you'll 799 00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:34,279 Speaker 1: you'll hear about all of that stuff. That's the only 800 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,440 Speaker 1: thing you talked about on Twitter. As I recall, Yeah, 801 00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:39,960 Speaker 1: that's that's That's all I talked about on on Twitter. 802 00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:44,200 Speaker 1: Is just just you know, we just do band promo 803 00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:48,040 Speaker 1: on there. It's a very typical nineties band account where 804 00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:54,440 Speaker 1: we just like post photos of ourselves with with wallet chains, um, 805 00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:57,399 Speaker 1: you know, doing the devil horns and saying come out 806 00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:02,080 Speaker 1: to our show, the rib Fest and you know, and Tulsa. 807 00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:04,799 Speaker 1: That's that's what That's the kind of content that you're 808 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:07,520 Speaker 1: going to find that our on our Twitter. Okay, cool? 809 00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:12,839 Speaker 1: Do you still have the pants um which the ones 810 00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:14,600 Speaker 1: that you cut slits in the side to make wider 811 00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:21,319 Speaker 1: say shoes? No, I I wish people changed, I know, 812 00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:26,719 Speaker 1: I know, Um yeah, those were so cool. Like when 813 00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:29,400 Speaker 1: I see pictures of us from from back in the day, 814 00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:33,000 Speaker 1: it's just really funny because none of us have feet. Yeah. 815 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:35,600 Speaker 1: I used to. I used to chain when my when 816 00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:37,439 Speaker 1: my pants would ripped on the side I would chain 817 00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:44,200 Speaker 1: the whole between the two sides of it, make chain man. Yeah, 818 00:45:44,239 --> 00:45:47,520 Speaker 1: that's pretty tough. Yeah, yeah, that's what people saw. They 819 00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:49,359 Speaker 1: saw me coming and we're like, well, that girl is tough. 820 00:45:49,920 --> 00:45:52,719 Speaker 1: That That was absolutely the vibe I managed to communicate 821 00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:55,279 Speaker 1: when I was a goth girl didn't know she was 822 00:45:55,280 --> 00:46:01,720 Speaker 1: a girl in the nineties. Yeah, okay, Well, um, Sophie, 823 00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:04,640 Speaker 1: do you have anything you'd like to plug just at 824 00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:08,000 Speaker 1: cool Zone Media on Twitter and Instagram for all things Margaret. 825 00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:10,200 Speaker 1: And you have a book coming out, correct, I do, 826 00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:13,240 Speaker 1: but I should pitch my band. I have a band 827 00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:17,880 Speaker 1: called Feminale School, where a feminist, atmospheric black metal band. Uh. 828 00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:21,840 Speaker 1: And we have a bunch of different releases, mostly on 829 00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:25,320 Speaker 1: band camp or through various labels. And then also eventually 830 00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:28,680 Speaker 1: we'll have a full length again we already have one, uh, 831 00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:30,640 Speaker 1: but it's not up for pre order right now, unlike 832 00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:32,920 Speaker 1: my book We Won't Be Here Tomorrow, in which I 833 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:35,160 Speaker 1: name every short story things that sound like they would 834 00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:38,359 Speaker 1: be black metal album titles like The Devil Lives Here 835 00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:43,680 Speaker 1: and Into the Gray and you know, very dramatic things, 836 00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:48,080 Speaker 1: very dramatic person um. And that is okay. So my 837 00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:49,600 Speaker 1: book is available for pre order, you can get an 838 00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:52,160 Speaker 1: a k press and if you get it you get 839 00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:56,319 Speaker 1: a little postcard of art. That is nice part we 840 00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:59,920 Speaker 1: love that. And and we'll be back what next week Monday, 841 00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:05,719 Speaker 1: I believe so cool every Monday and Wednesday. Great, I'll 842 00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:09,160 Speaker 1: see you there, all right, Thank you both so much 843 00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:11,080 Speaker 1: for having me on. This has been really fun. Thank 844 00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:15,600 Speaker 1: you cool people who did. Cool Stuff is a production 845 00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:18,880 Speaker 1: of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts and cool Zone Media, 846 00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:21,879 Speaker 1: visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check 847 00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:24,680 Speaker 1: us out on the i Heeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, 848 00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:26,520 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.