WEBVTT - Checking In Replay: Sunny Hostin 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:03.040 Welcome to Checking In with Michelle Williams, a production of 0:00:03.080 --> 0:00:20.640 iHeartRadio and The Black Effect. Okay, everybody, h thank y'all 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:23.120 for tuning in to another episode of Checking In. 0:00:23.239 --> 0:00:24.360 I get the privilege. 0:00:24.400 --> 0:00:27.960 I'm truly honored, truly humble to interview one of my 0:00:28.160 --> 0:00:30.760 favorite humans ever on this planet. 0:00:31.400 --> 0:00:34.159 She is a three time Emmy Award winning. 0:00:33.880 --> 0:00:38.360 Co host of ABC's The View, New York Times bestselling author. 0:00:39.159 --> 0:00:41.360 I fell in love with her first of all because 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:45.120 she is an attorney, a legal analyst, as well as 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:46.600 a sought after speaker. 0:00:47.440 --> 0:00:50.640 Y'all already know. Y'all know who it is. Please welcome 0:00:51.320 --> 0:00:52.280 Sonny Houstin. 0:00:52.600 --> 0:00:54.840 Oh, thank you for having me. 0:00:55.080 --> 0:00:55.280 Wow. 0:00:55.680 --> 0:00:58.360 You know, I remember the first time we met. I 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:01.040 mean I had watched you for form, of course, but 0:01:01.080 --> 0:01:03.560 I remember the first time we met. We were you 0:01:03.600 --> 0:01:06.160 were walking out of a Japanese restaurant. I was walking 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:09.080 into a Japanese restaurant and you were like, Sonny Housen 0:01:09.160 --> 0:01:11.120 and I was like, I know, Michelle Williams does not 0:01:11.240 --> 0:01:17.319 know who I am. So it was great and it's 0:01:17.319 --> 0:01:19.080 been great to keep in touch since then. 0:01:19.680 --> 0:01:21.440 Yes, ma'am, it has been great. 0:01:21.880 --> 0:01:25.920 It has just been awesome over the years, because you know, 0:01:26.080 --> 0:01:30.600 I am a bootleg attorney. My college was criminal justice, 0:01:31.000 --> 0:01:36.240 so I would stay tuned and peeled into cases that 0:01:36.440 --> 0:01:41.000 made like mainstream television. And what inspired me so much 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:45.280 was to see women of color bringing it as it 0:01:45.360 --> 0:01:49.200 related to the legal parts of all these cases that 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:54.640 were going on. I mean, killing it sure confident. There 0:01:54.720 --> 0:01:56.600 are times where you had to set people in their place, 0:01:56.680 --> 0:01:57.960 or there are times you had to be. 0:01:57.880 --> 0:02:00.000 Like, no, the person did it. 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:02.880 How do y'all not see it? 0:02:03.040 --> 0:02:04.320 How do they not singing it? 0:02:05.800 --> 0:02:08.839 So I'm just appreciative of you. I'm appreciative you've been 0:02:08.919 --> 0:02:11.200 what ten seasons or more on the View? 0:02:11.880 --> 0:02:12.080 You know. 0:02:12.480 --> 0:02:16.280 I was just reminded of that my someone on the 0:02:16.360 --> 0:02:20.320 View I had said during an interview six years and 0:02:20.360 --> 0:02:23.600 she was like, no, you started guest hosting with us 0:02:23.960 --> 0:02:27.880 in twenty twelve, and I was like what She was like, yep, 0:02:27.960 --> 0:02:31.280 Barbara got you into the rotation in twenty twelve, and 0:02:31.440 --> 0:02:35.920 so I was a guest co host for a lot, 0:02:36.080 --> 0:02:38.639 like half the shows in a year, and then I've 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:41.720 been on the show formally as a full time co 0:02:41.840 --> 0:02:45.800 host since for seven years. It went by really. 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:48.360 Quickly, doesn't it. Go by quickly. 0:02:49.160 --> 0:02:51.840 Yeah, and it's like I started guest co hosting, but 0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:54.480 at the time I was working at CNN, so it 0:02:54.639 --> 0:02:57.280 was it was, you know, they wanted me to start 0:02:57.320 --> 0:02:59.880 at the View, but I really couldn't because I have 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:04.080 a contract and CNN at the time was like, no, 0:03:04.160 --> 0:03:07.200 you can't get out of your contract, which in a 0:03:07.200 --> 0:03:09.520 way was a good thing for me because I was 0:03:09.560 --> 0:03:11.600 reporting out in the field. I was doing the things 0:03:11.600 --> 0:03:13.800 that you you were just talking about. You know, I 0:03:13.880 --> 0:03:17.440 was covering the Trayvon Martin trill well, the George Zimmerman trial, 0:03:17.520 --> 0:03:20.880 but the Trayvon's murder, and I was, you know, covering 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:24.600 Casey Anthony who murdered, in my opinion, her, you know, 0:03:24.680 --> 0:03:26.800 her baby, And so I was. I was in the 0:03:26.919 --> 0:03:31.960 thick of a lot of heavy stuff that was really 0:03:32.000 --> 0:03:34.520 important to me. And so in a way it was 0:03:34.600 --> 0:03:38.040 great to be able to do that that heavy lifting 0:03:38.560 --> 0:03:41.240 and give voice to our community and then get on 0:03:41.320 --> 0:03:43.240 the View and have a little bit of fun. So 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:46.160 it was it was a good balance. 0:03:46.680 --> 0:03:51.440 Got it. The foundation of checking in is mental health. 0:03:52.000 --> 0:03:55.200 And just mentioned that, you know, you had to cover 0:03:55.400 --> 0:03:57.040 some heavy cases. 0:03:57.560 --> 0:03:59.200 Yeah, okay, I named. 0:03:58.920 --> 0:04:01.600 All these brilliant things that you do. But some of 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:04.640 the most brilliant things that you are is a wife 0:04:04.840 --> 0:04:10.800 and mother. Yes, someone's daughter, someone's friend. How were you 0:04:10.880 --> 0:04:14.320 able to handle all of these heavy moments as far 0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:16.120 as your mental health is concerned. 0:04:16.720 --> 0:04:21.400 You know, it's interesting. I'm learning how to handle it better. 0:04:22.160 --> 0:04:26.720 I am someone who tended to internalize things. You know, 0:04:26.839 --> 0:04:30.360 I was the calm in the storm. I had a 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:33.360 pretty chaotic upbringing because I grew up in the South 0:04:33.400 --> 0:04:36.480 Bronx projects and I saw a lot of violence and addiction, 0:04:37.440 --> 0:04:40.159 and so I was always the kid with the book 0:04:40.560 --> 0:04:44.360 that was looking for an escape from my surroundings. And 0:04:44.839 --> 0:04:47.680 it kind of grounded me. And my faith grounded me. 0:04:47.880 --> 0:04:51.520 You know. I'm Catholic, went to Catholic schools. I had 0:04:51.520 --> 0:04:55.719 a really good friendship with a nun believe it or not, sister, 0:04:55.760 --> 0:04:58.040 and she passed a couple of years ago, and I 0:04:58.160 --> 0:05:00.159 still to this day have a really good friendship with 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:03.720 two priests, Father Edward Beck and Father Bob, and so 0:05:03.880 --> 0:05:06.480 I was able to turn to them. I didn't turn 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:11.400 to a traditional therapists, but I turned to them for guidance, 0:05:11.520 --> 0:05:13.920 you know, like faith guidance, Like how do I do this? 0:05:14.080 --> 0:05:17.640 Especially when I was covering a lot of the heavy stuff, 0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:24.120 and it's hard, I will say, not only covering those issues, 0:05:24.839 --> 0:05:28.880 but covering them as a public figure, and it's especially 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:31.680 hard on your family. And you don't think about that, 0:05:31.839 --> 0:05:33.760 or at least I didn't think about that when I 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:36.200 first started. I just want to tell people's stories. I 0:05:36.240 --> 0:05:38.160 just want to make sure people knew about Trayvon. I 0:05:38.160 --> 0:05:40.599 wanted to make sure you know that people knew about 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:42.440 George Floyd. I just it was important to me that 0:05:42.440 --> 0:05:45.279 people knew about what was going on community. I prosecuted 0:05:45.440 --> 0:05:49.080 child sex crimes and trafficking. That was the business that 0:05:49.120 --> 0:05:52.520 I was in when I was a prosecutor, and I 0:05:52.560 --> 0:05:57.000 pretty much put myself last all the time. I wanted 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:59.640 to make sure my daughter was okay, my son was okay, 0:06:00.040 --> 0:06:04.200 my husband was okay, and I was doing the work. 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:08.160 But I wasn't as concerned about myself. And I would 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:11.719 say within the past five years, especially with the help 0:06:11.760 --> 0:06:15.279 of Joy Behar and Whoopee and my co hosts asking me, 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:19.239 are you okay? And I started kind of taking stock 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:22.520 in that and I was like, some days I'm great, 0:06:22.839 --> 0:06:26.360 but some dames, I'm actually not okay. And it's okay 0:06:26.400 --> 0:06:29.599 to say I'm not okay, it's okay to say I 0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:31.159 think I'm going to have to take a mental health 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:36.520 day off today because I need to know. I live 0:06:36.560 --> 0:06:38.599 on kind of a modified farm, So I'm like, I 0:06:38.640 --> 0:06:40.320 need to go out with my chickens, I need to 0:06:40.400 --> 0:06:42.760 tend to my beehives. I need to be with my 0:06:42.800 --> 0:06:46.440 two hundred and fifty pound New Finland dogs. I need 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:49.599 to just spend some time for me. And that's been 0:06:49.640 --> 0:06:54.320 extremely helpful. But it took me a minute to understand 0:06:54.320 --> 0:06:58.320 what self care meant and how if I am not 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:02.479 good and centered mentally, that I am not good and 0:07:02.600 --> 0:07:06.000 centered for anybody else. And it's helped me on the 0:07:06.040 --> 0:07:09.920 show as well. For sure, it's helped me a lot well. 0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:13.800 I think also people feel like you should have. 0:07:13.800 --> 0:07:17.160 Yourself already emotionally put together before you get out on 0:07:17.240 --> 0:07:21.880 that stage. Everyone, And just so you know, respectfully, I 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:24.720 don't want to just have this whole interview be about 0:07:24.960 --> 0:07:27.080 your first morning job. 0:07:26.960 --> 0:07:27.920 Right on the view. 0:07:28.480 --> 0:07:31.200 But I can imagine, like I because I follow the 0:07:31.280 --> 0:07:33.760 View on social media, I follow you, I follow you 0:07:33.800 --> 0:07:36.000 on social media? Right, people a little cruel to me, 0:07:36.120 --> 0:07:38.600 huh No, that's why they have her on the show 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:43.440 for her expert and being able to handleize things. 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:45.840 But as a human, as a woman. 0:07:45.920 --> 0:07:49.760 We want to know how are people really truly feeling? 0:07:49.880 --> 0:07:52.960 And my hat goes off to you and every every 0:07:53.080 --> 0:07:55.960 woman on that platform who has to take a chance 0:07:56.120 --> 0:08:00.560 in sharing their personal views on stuff, and like, no, 0:08:00.640 --> 0:08:03.520 they mean this, well, this is real. 0:08:03.640 --> 0:08:06.240 This ain't scripted, This is for rescripted. 0:08:06.480 --> 0:08:09.360 It's not scripted. And you know, anybody that knows me, 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:13.320 you know me, anyone that knows me personally. I'm a 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:17.200 very well researched person. I try to be as thoughtful 0:08:17.240 --> 0:08:21.440 as possible, but I back up everything that I say 0:08:21.840 --> 0:08:25.560 with data and statistics and receipts as Joy likes to 0:08:25.600 --> 0:08:30.320 call them. And so it does surprise me when I 0:08:30.480 --> 0:08:35.000 say things like you know, I'm not saying this, but 0:08:35.120 --> 0:08:37.440 Christopher Ray, the head of the FBI, is that the 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:41.840 biggest threat to our country is white supremacy and domestic 0:08:42.000 --> 0:08:46.840 terrorism and that the black community is under attack. And 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:51.920 then I get someone like Megan Kelly who gets on 0:08:51.960 --> 0:08:55.520 her podcast that's watched by hundreds of thousands of people, 0:08:55.720 --> 0:08:59.120 I think, and puts pictures of my home on her 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:05.280 podcast and starts talking about my children and really puts 0:09:05.320 --> 0:09:10.679 me in danger for what I'm saying. Factually, you know, 0:09:11.040 --> 0:09:14.760 I am not saying that I haven't made it. I'm 0:09:14.800 --> 0:09:19.120 not saying that my kid doesn't go to Harvard. I'm 0:09:19.160 --> 0:09:21.960 not saying that my children aren't in private schools. But 0:09:21.960 --> 0:09:24.920 but I'm the exception and not the rule. Why should 0:09:24.960 --> 0:09:28.559 I be the anomaly? And until my community is the 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:33.480 rule and my success is my community's success and not 0:09:33.920 --> 0:09:37.040 the exception, then I'm going to keep on speaking up 0:09:37.040 --> 0:09:41.319 and speaking out. And it is hurtful when people come on, 0:09:41.520 --> 0:09:44.760 you know, go on social media and think they can 0:09:44.880 --> 0:09:48.840 call me a race bader or a racist or and 0:09:48.880 --> 0:09:52.520 that those are the nice things. 0:09:52.760 --> 0:09:54.720 What does everything have to be about race? 0:09:54.800 --> 0:09:59.320 Like? How m does everything go? I'm giving you the 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:04.760 statistic like, unfortunately, in this country, the cruel legacy of 0:10:05.160 --> 0:10:10.960 slavery and racism has bled into everything, every institution that 0:10:11.000 --> 0:10:14.320 we have, And when I talk about it based in fact, 0:10:15.440 --> 0:10:20.560 I get attacked. And I now, though, if I'm being honest, 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:24.120 I have a social media team. I do not read 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:27.760 the comments. Woopy Goldberg told me to do that for 0:10:27.880 --> 0:10:31.240 my health. She said, if you read the comments, you 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:35.119 may start filtering yourself, and they're painful and they're hurtful 0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:38.520 because I happen to be much more of an introverted 0:10:38.559 --> 0:10:41.079 person than people think I am. So I was taking 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:46.200 things seriously and Joy Behart was like, don't. 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:46.560 Worry about it. 0:10:46.559 --> 0:10:48.560 You open up your mouth. Fifty percent of the country 0:10:48.559 --> 0:10:50.800 hates you, fifty percent of the country loves you. It 0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:52.720 doesn't matter as long as your family and your friends 0:10:52.760 --> 0:10:55.800 love you. And so through the years, through the past 0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:59.079 ten years, I wouldn't say that I've gotten a thicker skin, 0:11:00.080 --> 0:11:03.640 but I understand human nature more, and I understand that 0:11:03.640 --> 0:11:09.000 these people are people that are probably very unhappy. Some 0:11:09.080 --> 0:11:13.760 of them don't have the education in these topics that 0:11:13.800 --> 0:11:19.320 they need. Some people are watching things like Fox News 0:11:19.360 --> 0:11:23.960 on a loop and they're fearful of their neighbors. They're 0:11:23.960 --> 0:11:26.960 going out and shooting their neighbors instead of talking to 0:11:27.120 --> 0:11:29.200 their neighbors and asking for a cup of sugar and 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:31.800 some milk. You know. And I say that because I 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:34.120 live in a great community. My neighbors will come over 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:36.720 and ask me for things. My neighbors will say, you 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.000 know your dog has been born, and you know it's 0:11:39.360 --> 0:11:42.400 nine o'clock at night, can you put the dog in 0:11:42.920 --> 0:11:44.439 and I'm not going to pull out a gun and 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:47.920 shoot my neighbor because my dog has woken up their baby. 0:11:48.400 --> 0:11:51.960 So I have learned now that you know, part of 0:11:52.000 --> 0:11:54.400 human nature can be very dark, but doesn't mean that 0:11:54.559 --> 0:11:56.400 I have to be a part of that. I can 0:11:56.440 --> 0:12:00.680 give voice, I can spread love, and I I can 0:12:01.040 --> 0:12:02.640 be unaffected by that. 0:12:03.120 --> 0:12:06.280 Yeah, I really can press in. We can end this 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:11.640 right now. That's how graceful you are talking about this. 0:12:12.000 --> 0:12:15.599 And I'm hoping that by the end of this podcast 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:17.400 you have empowered. 0:12:16.800 --> 0:12:20.360 People to continue to speak up. 0:12:20.800 --> 0:12:24.720 Like you said, people will love you and people will 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:28.240 hate you, but focus on the ones that love you. 0:12:28.520 --> 0:12:31.440 But yes, the social media team, I'm sure will have 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:33.079 to keep an eye out for people that you might 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:34.720 even have to report to the authorities. 0:12:35.040 --> 0:12:38.680 So they do, and I have had to do that. 0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:42.560 Yes, people take it, they take their little Twitter fingers 0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:43.840 a tinge too far. 0:12:44.280 --> 0:12:46.840 They take it too far. And you know it was Michelle. 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:50.760 I was telling my a friend of mine who hadn't 0:12:50.800 --> 0:12:53.960 been to my home for about a year. I won't 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:59.400 even give him the breath, but he also decided to 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:03.120 kind of put my address out there to his viewers 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:07.880 and within maybe an hour, I had people at my 0:13:07.920 --> 0:13:11.880 front door, you know, with signs. I mean they people 0:13:11.920 --> 0:13:13.440 have a lot of time on their hands. I mean 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:15.200 I feel like they should be working and being with 0:13:15.240 --> 0:13:19.559 their families. But they had signs, and I never had gates. 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:22.680 I live on a very big property with my dogs 0:13:22.720 --> 0:13:25.040 and my chickens and my beehives. 0:13:25.280 --> 0:13:27.600 We don't get to that because I'm like, we'll get 0:13:27.640 --> 0:13:29.840 to that. I have all of that, and I never 0:13:29.920 --> 0:13:30.559 had gates. 0:13:30.720 --> 0:13:33.200 And I know all of my neighbors, and my children 0:13:33.240 --> 0:13:37.080 grew up playing basketball with their neighbors and we have 0:13:37.160 --> 0:13:39.200 a fire pit and they would sit around the fire pit. 0:13:39.559 --> 0:13:43.840 But you know, long story short, Disney had to pay 0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:48.240 for me to have security. I have gates around my property. 0:13:48.280 --> 0:13:51.679 Now I have cameras all around my property. All because 0:13:51.800 --> 0:13:58.840 one hateful person decided that they didn't like what my 0:13:59.000 --> 0:14:03.320 opinion was and he had a lot of power. He 0:14:03.360 --> 0:14:07.840 doesn't have it anymore. But you know, it's a terrible 0:14:08.040 --> 0:14:13.719 thing when people are so irresponsible, and they're irresponsible on 0:14:14.320 --> 0:14:17.319 social media as well. Social media has a lot of good. 0:14:17.760 --> 0:14:20.440 You know, you and I sometimes will connect and DM 0:14:20.520 --> 0:14:23.600 and how you doing and this and that, and that's wonderful. 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:28.840 You've had the Arab spring and women in Iran. Girls 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:29.720 in Iran. 0:14:29.520 --> 0:14:30.440 Have reached out to me. 0:14:30.600 --> 0:14:33.960 Believe it or not, I've had women in Afghanistan that 0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:36.480 are in hiding reach out to me. They're such good 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:39.840 that can happen. But there is a lot of garbage 0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:43.040 out there and people are taking advantage of it, and 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:45.240 I refuse to be a part of that. So now 0:14:45.280 --> 0:14:48.520 my team does screen a lot and they'll say, listen, 0:14:48.520 --> 0:14:51.960 you've got an Afghan judge. This's reached out to you, 0:14:52.240 --> 0:14:54.480 which you like that message, And I'm like, yeah, send 0:14:54.520 --> 0:14:57.200 that message along because that's someone that I will make 0:14:57.280 --> 0:15:01.440 sure knows that I care. That's where I am now 0:15:01.880 --> 0:15:04.000 in my life, and I'm hoping that social media will 0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:08.080 get better. I'm hoping people will get better, I hope. 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.960 So they're saying that things get worse before they get better. 0:15:12.080 --> 0:15:14.360 So I hope that we are in the turnaround of 0:15:14.400 --> 0:15:15.280 the worst. 0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:19.080 Me too, I really, really, really really do. 0:15:23.080 --> 0:15:26.000 Oh gosh, thank you for sharing all that you've shared 0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:27.080 up to this point. 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:28.720 I want to congratulate you. 0:15:28.720 --> 0:15:31.280 You just had a brand new book called Summer on 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:32.120 Sack Harbor. 0:15:33.600 --> 0:15:37.120 Some of your first book called Summer on the Bluffs. Y'all. 0:15:37.160 --> 0:15:41.680 Let me tell you how busy Miss Sunny is. I'm exaggerating, 0:15:41.760 --> 0:15:43.480 probably lying a little bit, but it's been about two 0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:47.480 years I've been trying to get her on be because 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:51.720 she sent me her very first book, Summer on the Bluffs. 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:54.120 What attracted me to the book in the first place 0:15:54.600 --> 0:15:57.280 was the cover and my favorite, one of my favorite 0:15:57.320 --> 0:16:02.200 colors being that bright pink color. Where some are on 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:05.480 the Bluffs is written, and so I just was just 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:08.160 so excited at one of my favorite people sent me 0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:09.440 her book. 0:16:09.560 --> 0:16:12.240 I just want to know, how have you found time 0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:16.080 to find all these books? What is I write? 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.520 And it's hard because you know, my son's in college now, 0:16:20.960 --> 0:16:23.440 but he was home when I was writing that book. 0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:25.800 He took a gap year. He was home. I wrote 0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:28.920 the book during the pandemic and my daughter was home, 0:16:28.960 --> 0:16:31.600 and my husband's home. Both of my parents were home. 0:16:32.120 --> 0:16:34.880 And what I decided to do was just it was 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:36.600 so important to me to get this book out that 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:38.960 I put myself on the schedule. I was like, I'm 0:16:38.960 --> 0:16:42.440 going to write from eleven pm when everybody finally goes 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.760 to sleep, everybody except my daughter. Pull onma, she's a 0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:47.440 night ourl like I am, and I'm going to write 0:16:47.720 --> 0:16:50.680 definitely into one. But because I got to I get 0:16:50.760 --> 0:16:53.760 up around six. Yeah, I get up early, and if 0:16:53.800 --> 0:16:56.240 I'm doing Good Morning America, then I'm really getting up early. 0:16:56.600 --> 0:17:00.440 But I just make an appointment with myself, you know, 0:17:00.560 --> 0:17:04.280 to carve that time out. I put my fireplace on. 0:17:04.359 --> 0:17:06.840 When I'm writing in the winter or the damp spring, 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:09.480 I get myself a nice cup of tea or a 0:17:09.480 --> 0:17:12.600 glass of red wine, and I just start writing, you know, 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:15.960 And I write kind of traditionally. I write pen to paper, 0:17:17.640 --> 0:17:19.919 which my editor writes pen to paper too, so it 0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:22.760 works for us. And then I send it to where 0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:26.679 I'm collaborating with. I have these great ladies that I 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:29.640 send written stuff to which I'm sure they're like, they 0:17:29.680 --> 0:17:31.560 hate it, and then they'll type it up for me 0:17:31.800 --> 0:17:36.000 and give me suggestions. And that's generally my process. Sometimes 0:17:36.000 --> 0:17:38.800 my process has included I write a couple chapters and 0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:41.760 I invite my family into the living room. I'm like, Okay, 0:17:41.880 --> 0:17:44.320 I want y'all to read this. Have I missed it? 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:47.399 Do you have questions? And that's been very helpful. So 0:17:47.960 --> 0:17:49.520 somewhere on the Bluffs, I did that a lot I 0:17:49.520 --> 0:17:52.280 didn't do it as much with Summer on Sad because 0:17:52.320 --> 0:17:54.280 I was a little more used to writing by then. 0:17:54.800 --> 0:17:58.800 But it's a I make priorities, like my kids are 0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:01.280 my priority. They're both athletes, and so I have to 0:18:01.359 --> 0:18:04.160 go to a lot of track meets and football games 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:09.320 and swim meets. But when they're fed and in their rooms, 0:18:09.720 --> 0:18:12.639 they should be doing their homework or a sleep, then 0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:16.600 it's me time. And my joy is writing. You know, 0:18:16.640 --> 0:18:19.280 I've always written. I was a journalism major. 0:18:19.400 --> 0:18:22.399 So did you ever think that, Okay, I'm going to 0:18:22.480 --> 0:18:25.600 author these books. 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:28.560 I wanted to. I was a journaler when I was 0:18:28.600 --> 0:18:32.680 probably twelve or thirteen. When I had my kids, there 0:18:32.680 --> 0:18:37.080 weren't a lot of books centering black children. There are 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:40.520 so many more now twenty years later, but with mine, 0:18:40.520 --> 0:18:42.920 there weren't. I make them up, you know. And my 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:46.560 daughter was like, please write Princess Paloma's Adventures. And I'd write, 0:18:46.720 --> 0:18:49.919 you know, Princess Looma's Adventures. And so I knew I 0:18:49.960 --> 0:18:52.880 had stories. I knew I had stories in me. And 0:18:53.640 --> 0:18:57.480 the impetus for these books was I was traveling, and 0:18:57.880 --> 0:19:00.440 I keep on trying to remember what I was traveled for. 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:06.199 It was it could have been Ferguson. I was on 0:19:06.240 --> 0:19:11.400 the ground in Ferguson during the unrest. Ben Crump invited 0:19:11.440 --> 0:19:14.520 me to come and just see what's going on. And 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:19.560 I wanted something light to read, because when you start 0:19:19.640 --> 0:19:22.040 to read case files and you start to read about 0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:25.360 black trauma, it's like the last and I'm a preparer, 0:19:25.400 --> 0:19:27.440 so I will have been prepared by the time I 0:19:27.480 --> 0:19:29.960 got on the airplane. I want to read something else. 0:19:30.280 --> 0:19:32.200 I don't want to see a movie, a sad movie 0:19:32.280 --> 0:19:34.480 or anything like that. I want to be on the beach. 0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:37.920 I want Stella to get her groove back. I want 0:19:37.960 --> 0:19:40.280 to do something like that. And I went into the 0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:43.560 book store at the airport and I didn't see any 0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:47.040 black people on the cover. If I'm being honest, because 0:19:47.040 --> 0:19:49.639 that's to tell you know. You start looking through the 0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:51.760 books and you're like, is there any black or brown 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:54.040 people on the cover? And if I find one, and 0:19:54.080 --> 0:19:57.119 then I start flipping through it, I didn't see anything, 0:19:57.880 --> 0:20:00.680 and I was like, how is this possible? A big 0:20:00.680 --> 0:20:04.040 old bookshop with the most popular books and all these 0:20:04.040 --> 0:20:07.840 black people traveling, there's no black books. And I at 0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:12.879 that moment just started thinking, well, maybe I'll write a 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:15.640 beach read, but not just any beach read. A beach 0:20:15.680 --> 0:20:19.760 read centering black and brown people and our relationships and 0:20:20.040 --> 0:20:25.760 our motherhood and sisterhood and our men and love and 0:20:25.800 --> 0:20:29.840 infidelity and sex and just everything that we go through 0:20:29.960 --> 0:20:33.800 in life. And I put it together in a proposal. 0:20:33.840 --> 0:20:35.399 I sent it to my agent and he was like, 0:20:36.359 --> 0:20:38.879 you know, you got some here, right, And I said really, 0:20:39.800 --> 0:20:41.600 I was like, you think so because I want to 0:20:41.600 --> 0:20:43.879 read it. Tony Morrison said, if there's a book you 0:20:43.920 --> 0:20:45.879 want to read and you can't find it, then you 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:49.440 write it. So do you think someone would buy this? 0:20:50.320 --> 0:20:53.160 And sure enough we had a book deal, a three 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:54.440 book deal. I thought it was just going to be 0:20:54.520 --> 0:20:58.440 one book within a week. It was about a week. 0:20:58.640 --> 0:21:02.480 HarperCollins came back said, this is not a one off. 0:21:02.520 --> 0:21:05.440 This is a trilogy set in these three different places, 0:21:06.040 --> 0:21:08.960 places where black people were allowed to own black beach 0:21:09.000 --> 0:21:12.359 front you know, communities, and unfortunately, in the United States 0:21:12.400 --> 0:21:15.400 at a certain time, there's only three, not including Bruce's 0:21:15.440 --> 0:21:20.399 Beach of course, and not including Chicken Beach in Atlantic City. 0:21:20.840 --> 0:21:25.320 And I just I just started writing. I just started 0:21:25.320 --> 0:21:28.640 writing because I've summer on Sag Harbor for twenty years. 0:21:29.000 --> 0:21:29.520 We're there. 0:21:29.600 --> 0:21:32.480 My friend Erica has a house in Highland Beach. Her family, 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:35.760 you know, has had generational wealth for a long time. 0:21:36.080 --> 0:21:36.920 I go visit her. 0:21:36.960 --> 0:21:37.400 We're there. 0:21:37.640 --> 0:21:40.560 This is real, Like, it's real. I've seen you post 0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:42.840 about it, you know what I mean. And those of 0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:45.720 y'all that are listening. I love when the conversations flow 0:21:45.800 --> 0:21:48.840 to where like I had this question about lack of 0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:52.240 diversity for Beach reads, and here we are talking about 0:21:52.720 --> 0:21:56.640 how and what made you write Summer on the Bluffs 0:21:56.640 --> 0:21:58.199 and Summer on Sack Harbor. 0:21:58.840 --> 0:22:03.280 Now, I'm like, what an amazing opportunity in the book. 0:22:03.440 --> 0:22:07.840 You know that you have incorporated so many important messages 0:22:08.320 --> 0:22:11.800 with Guard University and even you spotlight the deep history 0:22:11.840 --> 0:22:14.800 of like we said, black communities that have frequented. 0:22:14.480 --> 0:22:16.920 Beach towns like Harbor. 0:22:17.480 --> 0:22:20.560