Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
Speaker 2: my name is Noah.
Speaker 3: They call b Ben. We're joined as always with our
Speaker 3: super producer Dylan the Tennessee pal Fagan. Most importantly, you
Speaker 3: are here. That makes this the stuff they don't want
Speaker 3: you to know. This is part two of a continuing
Speaker 3: conversation with friends of the show the legendary John Cameron Mitchell.
Speaker 3: Please please please tune into part one before you travel
Speaker 3: to part two.
Speaker 4: Yeah, God does where we landed? Where we're going to
Speaker 4: start this one off? We covered so many amazing topics
Speaker 4: with John.
Speaker 2: Oh.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And one of the things we're talking about specifically is
Speaker 2: his show Cancelation Island that you can listen to you
Speaker 2: right now if you want to. It's brought to us
Speaker 2: by Topic Studios. You guys, I look them up. They
Speaker 2: also produced a like a television documentary called Risk back
Speaker 2: in twenty seventeen about Julian asonge and this it was
Speaker 2: the Laura poetrous thing that was just so interesting to
Speaker 2: see the inner workings of that dude. It's cool that
Speaker 2: they are also producing this project.
Speaker 4: They also had a hand in a little movie that
Speaker 4: I believe won a couple Oscars this year called A
Speaker 4: Real Pain with Jesse Eisenberg and the Culkin, the Young,
Speaker 4: the Medium, Culkin, the Middle Culkin. Karen, Yeah, he's hot
Speaker 4: right now. But topic's great for sure.
Speaker 3: And armed with that information, fellow conspiracy realist, please join
Speaker 3: us for Part two of our conversation with John Cabern
Speaker 3: Mitchell in.
Speaker 1: Progress as we speak.
Speaker 3: I love this point of interpretation right the story, right
Speaker 3: of a story, a common lived experience. And earlier, earlier, John,
Speaker 3: we talked briefly about, you know, the nature of reality?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 3: Is reality a matter of consensus? In interpretation? We see
Speaker 3: quite a few institutions over the course of human civilization
Speaker 3: arguing this, and it's it's real bag of badgers. You know,
Speaker 3: it's a pickle to think on. And as we know now,
Speaker 3: many many people feel that they have figured out the truth,
Speaker 3: at least for themselves, and many other people are are
Speaker 3: still searching, still navigating the identity. Right, what is the universe?
Speaker 3: What part do we play in this? Tremendous theater. And
Speaker 3: this is this is where we have to ask you.
Speaker 3: We had this list in our notes of questions to
Speaker 3: ask you what's next for John Cameron Mitchell. You you
Speaker 3: teased a little bit about your next project. Could you
Speaker 3: share some insider info for our audience?
Speaker 6: Yes, you know, a cancelation I on the podcast sitcom
Speaker 6: of whatever you want to call it. Satire is out
Speaker 6: now and I'm very proud of it. And we haven't
Speaker 6: actually designed animated characters because we'd love it to be
Speaker 6: an animated series that would be ongoing. So that's something
Speaker 6: that's we're in the process of. I'm doing a reading
Speaker 6: of my new play, my first since head Big in June,
Speaker 6: about Claude Cahun c a h u n if you
Speaker 6: can look up.
Speaker 5: And incredible story and incredible art, credible work.
Speaker 6: Probably recognize some of the photography they did in the twenties,
Speaker 6: but she and her female partner in art and life
Speaker 6: went on to create a two women too, middle aged
Speaker 6: woman art resistance cell. Again, it's the Nazi occupation and
Speaker 6: Claude was half Jewish and she knew what that meant,
Speaker 6: you know, she knew what was going to happen and
Speaker 6: she's like, we're going to fight, but we're her wife.
Speaker 6: Marcel was like, well, we're older women. What are we
Speaker 6: going to do. Well, We're going to use our art.
Speaker 6: And they, for example, they were undermining morale of normal
Speaker 6: German soldiers. Again, their queerness made them understand it wasn't
Speaker 6: a black or white situation. All Germans were not Nazis,
Speaker 6: just as all Americans are not Magat. You know. It's
Speaker 6: like people take advantage of economic situations and even as
Speaker 6: a minority can take over. And Germans were known for
Speaker 6: following orders as Japanese were and Americans aren'ts That's why
Speaker 6: I still have hope that our military will not turn
Speaker 6: on its own people when commanded by their anti military
Speaker 6: commander in brief, and I say this as a military brat,
Speaker 6: like I know what the military is and it's not cops,
Speaker 6: you know what I mean to me? Claude Cahun is
Speaker 6: a hero for our age because she and her partner,
Speaker 6: for example, broke into a German church at night to
Speaker 6: put up a banner that said Jesus is great, but
Speaker 6: Hitler is greater because Jesus died for you, and you're
Speaker 6: going to die for Hitler.
Speaker 4: Love love is the wrong word. Maybe that's what an
Speaker 4: important realization.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I can.
Speaker 6: That is poetry, That is truth that allows the viewer
Speaker 6: of the so called propaganda to think about it, to
Speaker 6: think about their lives, to make a decision about it,
Speaker 6: not be it's not rammed down their throats. Look at
Speaker 6: this situation.
Speaker 4: I mean, just back to your point at the very
Speaker 4: beginning of the show, where you know the idea of
Speaker 4: when off news is fake, all stories are true, and
Speaker 4: how what that means for the power of stories. And
Speaker 4: I think maybe in times of upheaval and division, it's
Speaker 4: things like satire and story telling that can do much
Speaker 4: more work and be more powerful even than revolution, or
Speaker 4: even at the very least be the seeds of that.
Speaker 4: I mean, I keep thinking back to things that I
Speaker 4: read when I was younger, like nineteen eighty four and
Speaker 4: Fair and nine four fifty one, that at the time
Speaker 4: seemed like fiction. But then as you grow older and
Speaker 4: you start to see all of these little touch points
Speaker 4: that you first were made aware of by fiction and
Speaker 4: realize how much connection there is and how that can
Speaker 4: not only I mean, sure it can be a bummer
Speaker 4: because of the realization, but it can also give you
Speaker 4: the tools you need to either change minds or to
Speaker 4: have your mind changed.
Speaker 5: Just I don't know. I think it's very powerful.
Speaker 6: You're right, and you know sadly and fortunately, as facts
Speaker 6: degrade and as let's even say, nightly evening news, which
Speaker 6: used to be kind of accepted as somewhat true by
Speaker 6: everybody has gone, and now we've replaced it with the
Speaker 6: news that we want to read and see. And it's
Speaker 6: been replaced also by po so there, you know, podcasts
Speaker 6: and YouTube. It's like, we do your research right. We
Speaker 6: have a Robert Rfk Junior saying, Wow, if you just
Speaker 6: do your research about measles, then you'll treat it with
Speaker 6: you know, castor oil. And it's just like, dude, you're
Speaker 6: in charge our health. Not to mention our military and
Speaker 6: our economic system, but it's like we are in this
Speaker 6: strange almost medieval time when the number of angels on
Speaker 6: a pin is being debated on podcasts, and podcasts like
Speaker 6: yours are looking at those stories from an outside point
Speaker 6: of view in a bigger context of like where are
Speaker 6: we You know this? All of these stories are entertaining
Speaker 6: in many ways, but when they become gospel and when
Speaker 6: they justify someone going into a pizza joint. Guns, He's like,
Speaker 6: what is going on? It reminds me of medieval times,
Speaker 6: you know. Witches are you know thrown in?
Speaker 4: I mean like the fun theme restaurant or no, okay, n.
Speaker 5: Go get a go, get a pint of ale?
Speaker 2: Yeah, John, really quickly. You you talked at the top
Speaker 2: about how you've had friends who were directly impacted by
Speaker 2: cancelation or through some of the culture happening there. I
Speaker 2: want to talk about your role as Hal Carter in
Speaker 2: the Sandman universe and then watching, you know, on just
Speaker 2: online everything that's happening with Neil Gamon and the Sandman
Speaker 2: universe and all that, and just being a part of
Speaker 2: that universe. What has it been like for you to
Speaker 2: experience that and just what is happening.
Speaker 6: It's very sad, you know, and I'm I'm friends, you know,
Speaker 6: in a kind of cursory but friendly way with Neil
Speaker 6: and his separated partner Amanda Palmer from way back, you know,
Speaker 6: and see them every couple of times a year or whatever.
Speaker 6: And adapted Neil's story with Philippa Gosslet how to talk
Speaker 6: to girls at parties, which is punks versus aliens check
Speaker 6: it out. Yeah, and I've done recorded with Amanda. And
Speaker 6: the thing is I don't know all the facts, and
Speaker 6: the thing is I want to believe the best about
Speaker 6: my friends. And I also refuse to adjudicate the situation
Speaker 6: that I know nothing about. That, of course, is what
Speaker 6: cancelation is is saying I am judge and jury. This
Speaker 6: has been said, therefore that you know I will amplify
Speaker 6: the destruction of their career without knowing anything from behind
Speaker 6: my screen. And it comes from a lack of potency
Speaker 6: in your own life. It comes from fear, It comes
Speaker 6: from being afraid of being canceled yourself, right, because if
Speaker 6: you accused, then you can't be accused, or at least
Speaker 6: that's that's the reasoning. And I hate it. I've had
Speaker 6: all kinds of friends under the knife, under the microscope,
Speaker 6: under the cancelation boom, and whether the facts are there
Speaker 6: or not, it didn't happen to me. If something happens
Speaker 6: to you, you deal with it. If you have don't
Speaker 6: have the facts and it happened to someone else, let
Speaker 6: the system figure that out. I refuse to be one
Speaker 6: of the mob in terms of justice.
Speaker 2: It's just.
Speaker 6: It's not right. It's a waste of energy, it can
Speaker 6: destroy lives, you know, and who voted you in as executioner.
Speaker 6: You know, it's like, come on, it's like, we have
Speaker 6: a rule of law. Granted, there are when a cancelation
Speaker 6: came up because as the legal system didn't work. But again,
Speaker 6: unless it's happened to me, I refuse to take on
Speaker 6: the robes of Supreme Court justice. It's arrogant and it's
Speaker 6: ultimately ends up creating camps and silos. And one of
Speaker 6: the reasons Trump was elected is because we all separated
Speaker 6: ourselves into so called identities and so called righteous affinity
Speaker 6: groups to the point that we couldn't collaborate with another
Speaker 6: one that we have goals in common with. You know,
Speaker 6: when people say Kamala and Trump are the same thing, Really, guys,
Speaker 6: tell that to the transferson who's just lost their healthcare.
Speaker 6: Tell that to the professor who's just been thrown out,
Speaker 6: the student has been arrested, Tell them that to their face.
Speaker 4: Hey, let's take a quick pause here, you're a word
Speaker 4: from our sponsor, and then jump right back into talking
Speaker 4: with John Cameron Mitchell.
Speaker 5: Okay, we're back.
Speaker 3: I want to point out for the audience drawn your
Speaker 3: use of the term affinity groups, which may sound like
Speaker 3: innocuous language, but please do uh, as RFK Juger would say,
Speaker 3: please do your own research, dig up that, dig up
Speaker 3: that phrase.
Speaker 6: There's und four chan if that still exists, We're all
Speaker 6: everything's four chun now.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, yeah, we're living the dream underground. Well really quickly,
Speaker 5: just the last thing for me, something we touched on before.
Speaker 4: It really is something that both sides on this very
Speaker 4: divided time, in this very divided time, are guilty of
Speaker 4: in terms of weaponizing, uh, this sort of thing. There
Speaker 4: are folks on the left that are just as guilty
Speaker 4: of perhaps believing the worst reading, not reading past the headline,
Speaker 4: and then maybe from a place of good intention, jumping
Speaker 4: on that social justice bandwagon and just kind of asking
Speaker 4: questions later.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: And then on the other side, you have potential.
Speaker 4: Miss let's say, uh, spreading of misinformation, whether or not
Speaker 4: again that is believed to be true, that you're what you're.
Speaker 5: Doing, what you're spreading.
Speaker 4: There is a certain lack of fact checking oneself on
Speaker 4: that side as well, So there is kind of, I
Speaker 4: don't know, to your point, the idea of trying to
Speaker 4: find that balance in the middle of those things and
Speaker 4: realize that we have more in common with the other
Speaker 4: side than we may realize.
Speaker 5: I think it's a big dose. Yeah.
Speaker 3: The court of public opinion has a thousand judges.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and the sincere people on all sides, of course,
Speaker 6: are being taken advantage of by the chaos agents that
Speaker 6: we call our leaders, you know there. You know, Putin
Speaker 6: himself is very clear that he's trying to sow disunion
Speaker 6: with his cyber you know work as well as China,
Speaker 6: and now Trump joins them as one of their brethren.
Speaker 6: You know, if I was conspiracy theory minded, I you know,
Speaker 6: to me, I'm like a nine to eleven inside job
Speaker 6: organized by.
Speaker 7: The government, right, I think it's going to be that
Speaker 7: well organized. But it's like if I did believe in
Speaker 7: those things. You know, Trump, she and Putin have set
Speaker 7: up a system where they wanted to. If I wanted
Speaker 7: to take over, I would invent conspiracy theories to confuse everyone.
Speaker 7: I would destroy the possibility of fact being accepted. I
Speaker 7: would do all of the things. I would create the
Speaker 7: internet to distract us. When a young person can't get
Speaker 7: to the end of something he's reading or watching, how
Speaker 7: are they going to notice?
Speaker 6: You know? A fascist takeover, you know, attention span itself
Speaker 6: because alien conspiracy theory, you know, to de Troy that,
Speaker 6: but I don't, I don't do that. I see these
Speaker 6: things happening because of capitalism. To be honest, A lot
Speaker 6: of even racism and the queer phobia and sexism are
Speaker 6: just rampant capitalism. Here's an example, like, of course you're
Speaker 6: going to keep casting the same white, straight male actors
Speaker 6: as stars of the movies because they already were stars,
Speaker 6: and that means money. If all those people were people
Speaker 6: of color, that were trans who are already huge stars,
Speaker 6: they would have no compunction putting them in every film.
Speaker 6: You know, it's about money more than let's say, animus.
Speaker 6: You rich people of the world you know, might be homophobic,
Speaker 6: sexist and stuff, but more importantly, their power power is
Speaker 6: more important than any of that stuff. And money fuels power.
Speaker 6: So you know, I'm not just a simplistic Marxist, but
Speaker 6: I also know that that money corrupts, and when you know,
Speaker 6: we're in a situation in some ways, I almost trust
Speaker 6: a capitalist more than a self deluded messiah. They're more predictable,
Speaker 6: that's true, Like Trump is not predictable. Yeah, I think
Speaker 6: he's drunk his own kool aid. He's high in his
Speaker 6: own supply, and that assassination attempt has made him into
Speaker 6: some weird self Martsiah. Yeah, save the world. You can't
Speaker 6: break a law when you're saving the world, he says,
Speaker 6: right right, uves that now.
Speaker 5: The Greater Good back off from a third term though.
Speaker 6: Things, and then he comes back to them, doesn't He.
Speaker 3: Also true, it's always you know, it's always like a
Speaker 3: I'll say it. This is an apolitical point just in
Speaker 3: terms of mechanics of conversation and rhetoric. It's always a
Speaker 3: speech like four thirty pm on a Friday energy, you know, like, hey,
Speaker 3: what do you guys think about I don't know, man
Speaker 3: like Greenland, you know, spitballin. Uh, this, this conversation is
Speaker 3: going in so many directions, John, and we could not
Speaker 3: be more grateful for your time. Uh, the guys now
Speaker 3: we're talking off air in preparation for this, and one
Speaker 3: thing that that we want to make space for with
Speaker 3: you today is the following. It's no secret that this
Speaker 3: is a frightening time in the so called American experiment,
Speaker 3: and right now we have a great many non binary
Speaker 3: transace l G T B Q audience members with us today,
Speaker 3: and so we wanted to ask you on their behalf,
Speaker 3: what message do we wish to convey to everybody listening?
Speaker 3: What what is the you know, uh oto love it
Speaker 3: or not is about empowerment, right, So what is uh what?
Speaker 3: What would be your message beyond cancelation island, beyond all
Speaker 3: of your amazing work, What would be your message to
Speaker 3: the audience.
Speaker 6: It's the same message I've been giving. I've been on
Speaker 6: a college speaking tour talking about film theater, but of
Speaker 6: course we're now talking about the situation we're in, and
Speaker 6: young people don't have the tools anymore. You know, you
Speaker 6: can't cancel a dictator, So to me, I want to
Speaker 6: remind them that the good people are still here and
Speaker 6: those who are not will be. It's going to become
Speaker 6: very clear this situation, this fascist you know.
Speaker 5: Takeover.
Speaker 6: You know, it's happening in slow motion and fast motion
Speaker 6: at the same time. Will tell us what we're made
Speaker 6: of and not everyone is a giant rebel and a
Speaker 6: leader of resistance. But we also will find out who
Speaker 6: the opportunists are very quickly, and they will shift quickly
Speaker 6: from social justice warriors to maga warriors. You'll smell, you smell,
Speaker 6: you'll see it happening. But I'm reminding them that the
Speaker 6: good people are still here. And as I said earlier,
Speaker 6: the outsiders are the ones who get us out of
Speaker 6: hot water. The outsiders are the ones who grew up
Speaker 6: knowing there was something different about themselves, and therefore there
Speaker 6: was complexity to the world. There was surface, and then
Speaker 6: there was truth underneath. And again, like I said, the
Speaker 6: people who are in charge are literal. It's the outsiders.
Speaker 6: It's the misfits who save us. And earlier I talked
Speaker 6: about the people who come saved from the ruling class,
Speaker 6: people who are handed life on a platter. Those people
Speaker 6: are very literal, and it doesn't mean they're bad people.
Speaker 6: It just means they haven't come up against complexity, and
Speaker 6: so things are what they look like. When you grow
Speaker 6: up different and you are judged by how you look
Speaker 6: or you have a secret, you understand there's a surface
Speaker 6: and that there's layers of reality underneath it. You understand
Speaker 6: nuance from five years on. You know, you understand complexity.
Speaker 6: You understand that things aren't what they are, and things
Speaker 6: are not black and white. It's easier to say they are,
Speaker 6: but we know in our heart if we're evolved minded
Speaker 6: people are different from the mainstream that complexity rules. Some
Speaker 6: would say chaos reigns. I prefer complexity rules because when
Speaker 6: this hits the fan, you know, when your parents get Alzheimer's,
Speaker 6: when you when the economic system shifts, who steps up?
Speaker 6: Who's got the still skills to deal with conflict and complexity?
Speaker 6: It tends to be the outsiders. They have the skills
Speaker 6: and if their outsiderness has not destroyed them, because they
Speaker 6: are misfits, and misfits kill themselves. Misfits do more drugs.
Speaker 6: You know, Misfits have a lot of hurdles they have
Speaker 6: to get over. But when they do it over them
Speaker 6: they are evolved. They have powers. As Frank Zappa said,
Speaker 6: there is no progress without deviation. M and the one
Speaker 6: the deviates, which I would include much of your audience
Speaker 6: here are the ones who are going to get us
Speaker 6: out of it because we know there are other ways
Speaker 6: of being. We're scientists of life. We experiment, we have hypotheses.
Speaker 6: That's what this whole you know, interesting podcast is about
Speaker 6: is hypotheses, and whether they have proof or not, they
Speaker 6: tell us something about ourselves. And to me, we have
Speaker 6: to go back to punk. Identity politics and cancelation culture
Speaker 6: has failed us. They had good intentions, it brought up
Speaker 6: good ideas, but it failed us because it separated us
Speaker 6: and it helped, you know, get Trump in there. People
Speaker 6: got tired of it, and people on the edge, you know,
Speaker 6: said well, I'll give him a chance again. It was dumb,
Speaker 6: but I understand it. We've the holier than thou kind
Speaker 6: of thing that comes out of identity politics, stay in
Speaker 6: your lane stuff has alienated a lot of natural buddies,
Speaker 6: and I hate that.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 6: I grew up in the military, which was highly diverse.
Speaker 6: It was a socialist state for rednecks. Everybody was from
Speaker 6: somewhere else. You could be an immigrant, you do service,
Speaker 6: you become a citizen. It was America at its best
Speaker 6: in many ways, even though it was very macho and
Speaker 6: that was not good for women or queer people at
Speaker 6: that time. But now it is. And Trump's about to
Speaker 6: knock remove trans people from their units. What are their
Speaker 6: unit mates going to think when you're under fire, that
Speaker 6: trans colleague is way more important than what I called it.
Speaker 6: Commander in brief with making fun of casualties of war,
Speaker 6: calling them a users who the hell does he think
Speaker 6: he is? Chicken hawk making fun of our military at
Speaker 6: its best really did help us out and helps continues
Speaker 6: to help people out through a kind of social program
Speaker 6: of the military, you know, of getting people on their feet.
Speaker 3: Right, providing, providing, you know, even at its most imperfect,
Speaker 3: providing a socioeconomic avenue. Yes, right in a very yeah
Speaker 3: meritocracy in the face of oligarchy and capitalism wherein all
Speaker 3: things are commodial and.
Speaker 6: Other cultures have co opted their military by giving them,
Speaker 6: say the oil business in Iran or you know. But
Speaker 6: so the military will never not support the people who
Speaker 6: feed them, right. But I was just in Korea during
Speaker 6: that constitutional crisis when the military, when the president tried
Speaker 6: to stage a coup and when push came to shove.
Speaker 6: A coup only really takes place when the military is
Speaker 6: willing to turn its guns on his own people, and
Speaker 6: in that case they did not, and when democracy was saved.
Speaker 6: And I really believe that this chicken hawk who's demanding
Speaker 6: a military birthday procession will fail when a push comes
Speaker 6: to shove and he tries, which I think he will,
Speaker 6: to turn the military against his own citizens. He will
Speaker 6: start with illeal immigrants in his view, and it will shift.
Speaker 6: But once it gets to that point, he cannot remake
Speaker 6: the military fast enough for them to reject him. He
Speaker 6: can change the generals but and put a muppet in
Speaker 6: charge of the Defense Department, but he cannot change the
Speaker 6: fact that your unit mate, in your military unit is
Speaker 6: way more important than this walking baby. So that's a
Speaker 6: long way of saying, there is hope in the world.
Speaker 6: There is goodness in the world. We have to think
Speaker 6: about punk, which is about making things outside the system,
Speaker 6: outside capitalism, outside all the approved systems, to make things work,
Speaker 6: whether it's a demonstration or a film, or a food
Speaker 6: bank or a neighborhood garden. New Orleans is a perfect
Speaker 6: example of that. Hurricanes always coming. You better know your neighbors.
Speaker 4: I really, I really thought that was an incredible point
Speaker 4: that you made at the talk you did at Emory
Speaker 4: that I was lucky enough to go to. I knew
Speaker 4: about your military background, but that whole comment and that
Speaker 4: that that train of thought about how this is not
Speaker 4: something that folks within the military are a fan of
Speaker 4: the idea of othering folks within the military, and that
Speaker 4: the general sort of slow rolled a lot of those
Speaker 4: policies It's not something I'd considered, and maybe it's come
Speaker 4: up and on the on the show before, but when
Speaker 4: you said it really put it starkly, because I guess
Speaker 4: in my mind, having not grown up around those type
Speaker 4: of folks, and I know, Ben you did, I often
Speaker 4: maybe unfairly characterize folks from that world as being bigoted,
Speaker 4: perhaps or having the potential for that. But that is
Speaker 4: very much not the case. And it slapped me kind
Speaker 4: of into reality. And I appreciate it that true much.
Speaker 6: The military at its best is some of the best
Speaker 6: of America. Yes, there's a macho thing that suffuses it.
Speaker 6: They can get very much in the way of you know,
Speaker 6: the complexity we know exists, but that is fated, you know,
Speaker 6: it into you know, the military integrated in the late forties,
Speaker 6: you know, not without tension. Gays in the military came in,
Speaker 6: you know, in the two thousands, was not a big issue.
Speaker 6: Trans people came in what eight or ten years ago,
Speaker 6: not a problem, not a problem. And of course now
Speaker 6: this person in charges trying to make it a problem
Speaker 6: and make queer people into the secret lizard people among us.
Speaker 3: And there we have it. We've brought it back, John,
Speaker 3: We have gone again, at the risk of sounded redundant, right,
Speaker 3: we have gone in so many deep directions. This feels
Speaker 3: like the beginning of a much more in depth discourse.
Speaker 3: We want to for today's purposes. We want to thank
Speaker 3: you again so much, not just for joining us today,
Speaker 3: but more importantly for bringing Cancelation Island into the world
Speaker 3: and for exploring you know, incredibly terrifying, disturbing, and at
Speaker 3: the same time inspiring concepts with us today.
Speaker 6: This was delightful. It was so much fun. I feel
Speaker 6: like we've saved the world and had.
Speaker 5: Done check that box off.
Speaker 4: All right, that's well, you know that being said, maybe
Speaker 4: you'll come back sometimes, John, I think just this is
Speaker 4: a breath of fresh air. Anyways, And on the show,
Speaker 4: we often struggle to make sure that we're representing you know,
Speaker 4: everybody and and there it does sometimes feel like we
Speaker 4: have to tiptoe a little bit sometimes as not to offend.
Speaker 4: And I just felt like this was such a measured
Speaker 4: conversation about some very real things that maybe are not
Speaker 4: always easy. And I think, you know, I really appreciate
Speaker 4: you contributing to that and discourse on stuff they don't
Speaker 4: want you to know.
Speaker 6: Of course, I'm sorry I'm so late.
Speaker 2: Finally, John, John, thank you so much for casting Josh
Speaker 2: Pisce as Carl because he was he was the voice
Speaker 2: of Raphael for me, he was.
Speaker 4: I recognized him from somewhere I went to an event,
Speaker 4: yes and yeah, yeah, mutant Ninja, you know the one.
Speaker 2: Yes, So I when I recognized his voice, I know
Speaker 2: this person? Who is this person? And then I looked
Speaker 2: it up and realized and he was a secret turtle, right,
Speaker 2: not really secret, he was just a turtle.
Speaker 5: Talk about full circle. But they're the good ones.
Speaker 4: They are hidden, but they're here to protect the city
Speaker 4: from the Foot Clan.
Speaker 3: And Cancelation Island is available now on your favorite podcast
Speaker 3: platform of choice. We're going to join John in the
Speaker 3: near future and with this go forth do everything John said, honestly,
Speaker 3: I think you nailed it.
Speaker 6: Oh, I love it.
Speaker 3: And there you have it, folks, We've had technically a
Speaker 3: week long deep dive conversation with none other than John
Speaker 3: Cameron Mitchell, the creator of Cancelation Island. Out today wherever
Speaker 3: you find your favorite shows, and speaking of your favorite shows,
Speaker 3: we hope you will also join us. You can find
Speaker 3: us online, you can call us on phone. You can
Speaker 3: always reach us at our good old fashioned email address.
Speaker 4: Yes, find us online at the handle Conspiracy Stuff where
Speaker 4: we exist on Facebook with our Facebook group here is
Speaker 4: where it gets crazy, on x FKA, Twitter and on
Speaker 4: YouTube with video content for your bruising enjoyment. On Instagram
Speaker 4: and TikTok. However, we're Conspiracy Stuff Show, and there's more.
Speaker 2: We have a phone number. It is one eight three
Speaker 2: three std WYTK. When you call in, tell us about
Speaker 2: your favorite therapies that might be included in this show,
Speaker 2: like Harass the Harasser, Bad Touch football and anti racism
Speaker 2: spin Class. Sorry, I just really get a kick out
Speaker 2: of the.
Speaker 5: Fun show. What a great show. Do listen to Cancelation Island.
Speaker 5: That was very grateful to be able to be an
Speaker 5: EP on that project.
Speaker 4: And Man John and his co creator are just such
Speaker 4: talented folks.
Speaker 2: When you call in, give yourself a cool nickname and
Speaker 2: let us know if we can use your name and
Speaker 2: message on the air. If you've got more to say
Speaker 2: they could fit in a three minute voicemail, why not
Speaker 2: instead send us a good old fashioned email.
Speaker 3: We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence
Speaker 3: we receive. Be well aware, yet unafraid. Sometimes the Void
Speaker 3: writes back, joined us here in the dark conspiracy at
Speaker 3: iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2: Stuff they Don't want you to Know is a production
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.