1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Have I fucked a doctor? 2 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:08,520 Speaker 2: I have not fucked a doctor. Have I fucked someone 3 00:00:08,520 --> 00:00:09,360 Speaker 2: with a doctorate? 4 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 1: I'm sure you have. 5 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 2: That sounds more like me. 6 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:17,639 Speaker 1: She's Sheen, I'm me, No. 7 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 2: May not my name? Yoo yoh? What is your childhood? 8 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 1: I am a choky? 9 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 2: What's going down before? 10 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:32,000 Speaker 1: Like you? 11 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 2: So round, Hey, Virgins. So this week we are skipping 12 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:49,600 Speaker 2: the chit chat and getting right to the meat and 13 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:52,120 Speaker 2: potatoes of the conversation. We got a lot going on 14 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 2: this week. Lucky for you if you are deprived of 15 00:00:56,760 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 2: some news catch up. We always have our patreon available 16 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 2: to you at patreon dot com slash like a Virgin, 17 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:05,679 Speaker 2: So get into that while you await our return for 18 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:13,119 Speaker 2: chit chat. Today we are talking about doctors and medical things. 19 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:19,119 Speaker 2: A lot of uh deep trans personal conversations happening here. 20 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 2: It's a bit of a fun and different episode for 21 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 2: us because this is like a Virgin, the show where 22 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 2: we give yesterday's pop culture today's takes. 23 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: As always, I'm Fran Toronto, I'm Rose DomU. 24 00:01:30,160 --> 00:01:34,960 Speaker 2: Are you ready to talk about the medical industrial complex? 25 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: Yeah? Cough twice, got it? Okay, you want to play 26 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: doctor Fran? 27 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 2: Actually, maybe you should play the doctor. 28 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: Okay, we're gonna play doctor, but not in I guess 29 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 1: the sexy way, although I never played like sexy doctor. 30 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 2: I'm not promising anything. I can't. I can't not promise sexual. 31 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 1: So it could get heated in here, heated by on 32 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 1: tip tip tip on hard floors. Okay, so let's play doctor. 33 00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:07,280 Speaker 1: I'm going to be the doctor. Okay, Okay, So you're 34 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 1: you're like in the You're in the room, You're in 35 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 1: the examination room, and you've been waiting bear asked for 36 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: like forty five minutes, at least forty minutes, and someone 37 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:18,800 Speaker 1: has already come in and misgendered me. Yes, okay, scoom, 38 00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: that's the door opening. Hi mixed terrada. 39 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 2: But I don't know if that's what my medical forms say. 40 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:29,840 Speaker 2: But I really appreciate the gender affirming way you just 41 00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 2: addressed me. Thank you doctor. 42 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 1: Well, you're wearing a shirt that says everybody knows I'm 43 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 1: a transsexual, so I figured it was a safe assumption 44 00:02:37,160 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 1: to make thank you do. So, Fran, is it fran 45 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 1: to tell me? Tell me what brings you in here today? 46 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 2: So I recently had a gonorrhea and chlamydia scare, and 47 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 2: I feel like you know, because I've slept with these partners, 48 00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 2: I should get tested and maybe also get a shot. 49 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 2: I also need my hormone levels checked. And there's something 50 00:02:57,200 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 2: weird on my foot. If you could also look at. 51 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 1: It, great, So you know, without examining you, I think 52 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 1: I can diagnose you. And the diagnosis I would give 53 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: is that you're a whore. 54 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 2: Doctor, I would say, that's a completely accurate diagnosis. Thank 55 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 2: you so much for your time. 56 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know what, I got the medicine for that. 57 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:17,480 Speaker 1: Oh and what's the medicine this fucking checock? 58 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,560 Speaker 2: I got a fever and the only cure is more chic. 59 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 1: I mean, this is literally the way my appointment at 60 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:33,440 Speaker 1: callan Lord went weeks ago. 61 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:36,440 Speaker 2: Oh you got sucked by your doctor, doctor in a way, 62 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 2: in a way I feel like, honestly, there's something when 63 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 2: you said that, it kind of reminded me of that 64 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:42,840 Speaker 2: scene in. 65 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:48,800 Speaker 1: This fucking cock continue, sorry, reminded. 66 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 2: Me of what was the Rachel Vice show series that 67 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 2: we just watched with. Oh uh, what the fuck is it? 68 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 2: Called Ringers? Which I never finished, which you never finished? 69 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 2: So dead Ringers a show we already discussed. There's a 70 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 2: scene in it an immaculate scene in it where one 71 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 2: of the Rachel vices is talking to this guy and 72 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:11,280 Speaker 2: his wife in a doctor's office, and the wife briefly 73 00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 2: leaves and then she basically in a matter of seconds, 74 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:17,160 Speaker 2: goes him into pulling out his cock so she can 75 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 2: look at it. It's so good. It's one of the 76 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 2: best doctor scenes I've ever seen in my test. Did 77 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 2: you ever watch grays Anatomy? 78 00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 1: Of course I watched. 79 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 2: I have watched zero episodes. What can you tell me? 80 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 1: So it's about surgeon and. 81 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 2: It's about mostly. 82 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 1: It's about Sandra. Well, it's about this girl, Meredith Gray, 83 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 1: who is part of a class of residents who come 84 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:49,320 Speaker 1: to a hospital, and it's about them becoming doctors and 85 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 1: also falling in love and you know, making lots of 86 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 1: bad decisions and it I'm sure it really does not 87 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:02,080 Speaker 1: resemble the medical field in any way in any way, 88 00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:11,720 Speaker 1: but it is very entertaining. I want to hold space 89 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: for our audience as I'm sure that thinking about doctors 90 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,840 Speaker 1: or the medical field in any way, or the pharmacypally 91 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: probably somewhat traumatic. 92 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:28,279 Speaker 2: So you know, this will not really be a triggering episode, 93 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 2: though we're gonna shoo sh about how horrible is. 94 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:40,239 Speaker 1: Honestly, doctors are the wa U do Doctors are people 95 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: who ostensibly exist to help us, and in practice are 96 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: frequently horrible. 97 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, And the thing that we need to know about 98 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:58,560 Speaker 2: them is that generally speaking, they are running a business 99 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 2: and a lot of them aren't interested in your medical 100 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:04,480 Speaker 2: care at all. And I think that honestly, you know, doctors, 101 00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 2: you know, have gotten this societal have achieved this societal 102 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 2: placement where like they're questions so infrequently and they're they're 103 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 2: just like, oh, yeah, whatever you say goes because you 104 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 2: went to a bajillion years of school and could afford that, 105 00:06:17,839 --> 00:06:19,560 Speaker 2: and now you are in this place and probably make 106 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:24,039 Speaker 2: zillions of dollars doing it. But everyone should be skeptical 107 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 2: of their doctors. 108 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 1: Did you ever want to be a doctor? No, thank god, 109 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: No I did. I wanted to be a surgeon, mostly 110 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 1: because of Grey's anatomy. But I but I realized very 111 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:38,120 Speaker 1: quickly that I was not smart enough because you have 112 00:06:38,200 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 1: to wait, very smart and remember so much stuff to 113 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:44,599 Speaker 1: be a doctor, and that there was no way I 114 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: could stand for that long to do surgery. 115 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, you, I mean, when you're a doctor, you 116 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 2: have to be on your feet for like twelve, fourteen, 117 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 2: nineteen hours a day, Like it's insane. 118 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: Can't do that. That's why they wear such ugly shoes. 119 00:06:56,880 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 2: That's why they wear such ugly shoes and such ugly 120 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 2: clothes too. I mean, I know people are trying to 121 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:03,440 Speaker 2: like really up the scrubs game. They're like these influencer 122 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:05,839 Speaker 2: scrubs figs or whatever, but like those are not that 123 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 2: cute either. 124 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 1: So I used to wear scrubs as a kid a 125 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: lot because my dad, my dad worked at the hospital, 126 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: and I don't know, because he used to like bring 127 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 1: them home and whenever we spent the weekend at his house, 128 00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 1: like after my parents got divorced, like that's always what 129 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 1: I would wear to sleep was in the hospital. I 130 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:29,440 Speaker 1: do think I've talked about this before, my intense love 131 00:07:29,520 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 1: for hospital food because we used to go visit my 132 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: dad for the hospital at the hospital, and he would 133 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 1: take us to the cafeteria. 134 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 2: Do you still like hospital food? 135 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: I do have this weird appreciation for kind of institutionalized 136 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: food that is made in huge batches, like airplane food, 137 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 1: like airplane food, cafeteria food of any kind, and hospital 138 00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:59,360 Speaker 1: food really gives me that When was the last time 139 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 1: you were in a hospital as a patient that wasn't 140 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: just like an appointment, Like when was the last time 141 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 1: you needed care from the hospital in a sort of 142 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:12,840 Speaker 1: extended way as a patient? I mean, have I already 143 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:17,600 Speaker 1: told you the story about when my long spontaneously collapsed? No? 144 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 2: Apparently No. Okay, let me see if I can tell 145 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 2: the short version. The short version is I was in college. 146 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:27,400 Speaker 2: I was working as an eighteen hour credit student. I 147 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 2: was also a closeted smoker, which was something that I 148 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 2: kept for my boyfriend at the time. And it's just 149 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 2: an extremely stressed out, very skinny person. I was probably 150 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 2: like one hundred and thirty five one hundred and forty 151 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 2: pounds as a consequence of a recently healed eating disorder 152 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:43,480 Speaker 2: back in twenty whatever the fuck? 153 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:45,079 Speaker 1: Okay I rushed music videos. 154 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 2: Sorry, yeah, I'm not skinny. I mean I'm still skinny, 155 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 2: but whatever. Anyways, this is all relevant information because one 156 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:53,560 Speaker 2: day I was in the library of studying for an 157 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 2: Italian test because I took Italian because I had read 158 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 2: epre Love and thought it was a phenomenal piece of. 159 00:08:58,200 --> 00:08:59,959 Speaker 1: Oh my god, I was watching epray Love this morning. 160 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:02,839 Speaker 2: What what for work for? What it was for work? 161 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 2: And I leaned over the back of my chair and 162 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 2: I heard a little pup and I was like, what 163 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 2: was that, James, Well, what was that, James? And then 164 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:16,240 Speaker 2: I leaned back over and I was like, oh, like 165 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 2: my back was cracking. 166 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 1: That was weird. 167 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 2: And then I was experiencing what was probably the worst 168 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:23,440 Speaker 2: possible pain I've ever experienced in my entire life. And 169 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 2: I was like, what the fuck just happened? And then 170 00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 2: in my head, I was like, is this what it 171 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 2: feels like when people throw their back out? Like is 172 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 2: am I experiencing like back problems for the first time? 173 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 2: And anyways, I, you know, was too poor, like I 174 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:40,080 Speaker 2: it was at a time and honestly still is that 175 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:41,280 Speaker 2: time where it's like I'm not going to go to 176 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:43,240 Speaker 2: the doctor's office just to give them fifty dollars to 177 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:45,480 Speaker 2: like tell me that like, I, you know, broke my 178 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:49,559 Speaker 2: back or whatever, or that my back is like hurting. 179 00:09:49,640 --> 00:09:52,200 Speaker 2: It's just like, yeah, I knew that. But I went 180 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 2: two full days wandering around campus being an eighteen hour 181 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 2: credit student. I was a commuter biker. I jogged every 182 00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 2: single day five mile. I did all of that for 183 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:06,000 Speaker 2: two days and an excruciating kind of quote unquote back pain, 184 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 2: which I found out was not a back pain when 185 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:10,839 Speaker 2: I finally did go to urgent care and then they 186 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:12,760 Speaker 2: did an X ray on me and they were like, yeah, 187 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:16,280 Speaker 2: so you had a spontaneous pneumothorax. You literally only have 188 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 2: one lung right now and have had one lung for 189 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,199 Speaker 2: two days. You need to go to the er immediately. 190 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 2: Would you like an ambulance? And they fixed it like 191 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 2: fifteen minutes. It's actually a really simple surgery, and it's 192 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 2: an incredibly common thing that happens to a very small 193 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 2: number of people who are usually stressed and or really 194 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 2: skinny and or smokers. And I was all three at 195 00:10:36,960 --> 00:10:37,240 Speaker 2: the time. 196 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:39,720 Speaker 1: Did you have to be put under anesthesia? 197 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:44,440 Speaker 2: I don't think I did need to, but I was like, 198 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 2: you're doing that. I'm like not going to be awake 199 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 2: for this, like I do. I can't experience that. 200 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,640 Speaker 1: Being put under anesthesia is so cunty. It's so nice, 201 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:57,079 Speaker 1: Like I I got something done in when was it 202 00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: like twenty twenty one? That's I don't know if you 203 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 1: remember this. I had a. 204 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 2: Little and. 205 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 1: I just like that feeling of like being conscious one 206 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 1: moment and then suddenly awake another moment, completely somewhere else 207 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 1: under very different circumstances is such a gag. 208 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, wait, okay. 209 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: That's how I wish I fell asleep every night. Okay, 210 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 1: I want to be put under anesthesia every night. That 211 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 1: would be very bad for your brain. Cares, but who cares. 212 00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 2: Estheticians are probably making bank for not that big of 213 00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:35,120 Speaker 2: a skill set. 214 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 1: Right. 215 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 2: You have to go to so much less school to 216 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:38,760 Speaker 2: be an esthetician, right. 217 00:11:38,679 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 1: Or an estheticianth ansty ziologist. 218 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:47,119 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what it is. That's what they're called. I 219 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 2: am Okay. Have you ever had a doctor that you 220 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 2: liked slash? Is it our doctor from La Doctor V? 221 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 1: Doctor V? I loved doctor V and I do miss him, 222 00:11:56,840 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 1: although so I recently restarted care at Colin Lore because 223 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:03,800 Speaker 1: since I moved back here, I have been saying over 224 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:05,760 Speaker 1: and over that I wanted to find a doctor at 225 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:07,599 Speaker 1: a private practice. I really didn't want to go to 226 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:11,160 Speaker 1: a queer health center. And then I realized my estrogym 227 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 1: was running out, and I was like, fuck, I guess 228 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 1: I just have to go back to coun lord, because 229 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 1: it's just the easiest thing, even though it is not 230 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 1: easy in literally any way. But I'm going to the 231 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 1: Brooklyn one, so that makes things like marginally better. But yeah, 232 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:29,920 Speaker 1: I really missed doctor V, our gay ass doctor from. 233 00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 2: LA, the gayest doctor, such a competent, like runs his 234 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,600 Speaker 2: practice like a machine, a well oiled machine. 235 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:40,160 Speaker 1: I miss And he's hot. He is hot. 236 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, he was hot. 237 00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 1: I got recommended him from and it was like, this 238 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:47,520 Speaker 1: is a gay doctor that all the girls go all 239 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 1: the girls go to. 240 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:50,800 Speaker 2: Yeah kind of yeah, and I he So I worked 241 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 2: with doctor V for a bit and then there was 242 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 2: someone else in his practice, and doctor Jake Collins, who 243 00:12:55,360 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 2: then became my primary care physician and also put me 244 00:12:57,800 --> 00:12:59,920 Speaker 2: on estradeal honestly, which is kind of a big deal. 245 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:04,080 Speaker 2: And my whole experience of that was so seamless and 246 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:08,240 Speaker 2: easy and unquestioned. I loved it, and I love doctor Collins, 247 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 2: and honestly, so this is in COVID era and so 248 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:13,680 Speaker 2: everybody was still in masks one hundred percent of the time, 249 00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:16,560 Speaker 2: so I didn't really know what doctor Collins looked like. 250 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 2: But one day I was scrolling through Instagram, and turns 251 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 2: out he's like a hot doctor influencer and he has 252 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:26,800 Speaker 2: a kick in bod and the most gorgeous face I've 253 00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:28,559 Speaker 2: ever looked at in my entire life, one that I've 254 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 2: never seen because it's always been under a mask. And 255 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 2: I was like, what the fuck this man just had 256 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: his like rubber gloved fingers in my whole, like checking 257 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:39,840 Speaker 2: for prostate cancer or whatever. Yeah, but I would love 258 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 2: to fuck a doctor. I would love to marry a doctor. 259 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 2: I would love to marry it. 260 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: Because they would not be home a lot. 261 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 2: Yeah exactly. 262 00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 1: Oh, and they would get me, you know, they would 263 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 1: prescribe me whatever I want to wait, you know, those 264 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:53,080 Speaker 1: pills forever. 265 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 2: You know what really fulfills this fantasy for me of 266 00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 2: being married to a doctor is the kids are all right, 267 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 2: starring on at Benning and Julian More because Annette Benning 268 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,880 Speaker 2: is famously kind of the tied up, stuck up like 269 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 2: work bitch doctor mom, and like her like over commitment 270 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 2: to work is like part of what is like wedging 271 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 2: her relationship to Anette Benning that in the fact that 272 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 2: she's like fucking the gardener. But I just remember bearing 273 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 2: witness to their relationship and how loving and supportive it was, 274 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:24,479 Speaker 2: and I was like, yeah, you know, in a gay relationship, 275 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:27,240 Speaker 2: a lot of times there's an Annette and there's a 276 00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 2: Julianne Moore, and I'm always the Annette. But I would love. 277 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:33,480 Speaker 1: Oh and I'm the julian of this relationship. I'm definitely 278 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 1: the Julianne. I would I'm on the redhead. 279 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:38,200 Speaker 2: I would disagree because you're very get shit done. But yeah, 280 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 2: I guess, like on paper because your redhead, you like 281 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 2: legally do have to be Julianne Moore. However, I would 282 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 2: say I wish I was the Julianne Moore. And I 283 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 2: feel like I would like to have a relationship where 284 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 2: I'm the Julianne Moore and the one that's just kind 285 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:52,000 Speaker 2: of like, I don't really know what I'm doing for 286 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 2: my career. I'll start like four businesses. Can I buy 287 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 2: a truck? 288 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 1: Mommy? 289 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 2: Like that's what I want to be, but I'm not. 290 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:01,960 Speaker 2: Then maybe one day, maybe one day, I'll be taken 291 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 2: care of by a daddy. 292 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: Doctor. You know what doctors always make me think of 293 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 1: is my is Highlights magazine? Do you remember Highlight? You 294 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: remember it was like the magazine for parents and it 295 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 1: was always in the pediatricians office. 296 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, with that geo kids, Yeah, I mean a Nickelodeon magazine. 297 00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 1: Did you grow up hating going to the doctor. 298 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm pretty sure my parents didn't have We didn't 299 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:28,880 Speaker 2: have fights about it, which was great, Like I knew 300 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:31,560 Speaker 2: I had to go, but I hated. Yeah, I hated doctors. 301 00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 2: The only doctors I enjoyed going to were eye doctors. 302 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,880 Speaker 2: I think the I think weird. I think taking eye 303 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 2: exams is really fun. 304 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:41,720 Speaker 1: Do you are you squeamish about giving blood? 305 00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 2: No, I'm not. I'm a little bit of a baby sometimes, 306 00:15:45,880 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 2: but like I just look at my phone now and 307 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:49,160 Speaker 2: I'm fine because I feel like I have to get 308 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:50,960 Speaker 2: blood work done all the time because I'm gay. 309 00:15:51,120 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 1: What about you, I like actively enjoy giving blood. 310 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,880 Speaker 2: You're like peah, I mean, oh, that's all you're gonna take. 311 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,200 Speaker 1: Well, I do have some more. Something that's happened in 312 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:06,800 Speaker 1: the past couple of years is I apparently my veins 313 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:09,600 Speaker 1: are really hard to find, either because I have like 314 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:12,440 Speaker 1: I don't know, like thick skin, or they're like really 315 00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 1: recessed or something. So it usually takes the nurse a 316 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,440 Speaker 1: really long time to find my veins and toms. Sometimes 317 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 1: they will have to insert the needle in many times 318 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: before they find you love in. I love it a 319 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 1: little bit. I mean I really don't have a problem 320 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 1: with like doing doing my shots. You know, when I 321 00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 1: inject estrogen, I I just like am not squeamish about 322 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:41,120 Speaker 1: blood all Like I never flinch when a needle gets 323 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: put in me. The other day, I was getting tattooed, 324 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: and like my friend who was doing my tattoos, like 325 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:48,560 Speaker 1: kept asking are you okay? Are you okay? And I 326 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 1: was like, yeah, I'm fine. I mean up until like 327 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,000 Speaker 1: the fourth I haven't even seen your new tattoo yet. 328 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:54,600 Speaker 1: I have five new tattoos. 329 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 2: Okay, we'll see them after I fall asleep during tattoo appointments, 330 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:00,520 Speaker 2: especially now that I get stick in pokes from my 331 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 2: friend Elliott. Those are like jet they feel nice, they 332 00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:04,480 Speaker 2: feel like good. 333 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 1: The first four were fine, and then once we. 334 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 3: Got to my leg that started to become a little 335 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:47,320 Speaker 3: bit of an issue. 336 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:37,000 Speaker 1: Obviously. Like when you're trans you know, doctor, and I think, 337 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:40,560 Speaker 1: just like being queer in general, like doctors become a 338 00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:44,480 Speaker 1: much bigger part of your life. Because before I started 339 00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:48,639 Speaker 1: medically transitioning, I saw a doctor you know, on a 340 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 1: like a good decade, you know, once every couple of years, 341 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:54,920 Speaker 1: you know when I was a kid, obviously I saw 342 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:57,680 Speaker 1: I saw a doctor like once a year for a physical. 343 00:17:57,840 --> 00:18:00,640 Speaker 1: But you know, being trans like you have to be 344 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,399 Speaker 1: much more aware of what's going on in your body. 345 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:07,160 Speaker 1: And then also if you factor being on prep into it, 346 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 1: then you have to see a doctor every three months 347 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:15,199 Speaker 1: to get your blood work done. I I don't know, 348 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:22,080 Speaker 1: Like I think I now feel a lot less intimidated 349 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 1: by medical stuff than before I started transitioning. Like there 350 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: were definitely in my sort of like lawless twenties from 351 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 1: college to when I started transitioning. Like in my later twenties, 352 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 1: I like I didn't go to the doctor for years. 353 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:40,520 Speaker 1: I like had no idea what was going on in 354 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:42,240 Speaker 1: my body. But I was also young enough that it 355 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:44,760 Speaker 1: didn't really matter, Like I was always bouncing back from this. 356 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:47,400 Speaker 1: That's kind of tea, Like we really should get regularly 357 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 1: checked up, especially when it comes to like screenings and 358 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: cancer stuff, but for the most part in your early twenties, 359 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:54,720 Speaker 1: like you do not need to be This is like 360 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 1: such terrible advice, but it's true. You may so much 361 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 1: to just visit the doctor because you're supposed to as 362 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,720 Speaker 1: especially when it comes to like dentists and I doctors 363 00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:04,359 Speaker 1: and all this shit, and then you end up throwing 364 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 1: away so much money on copays in medicine you don't 365 00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:08,919 Speaker 1: actually need or like things that you never asked for 366 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:12,320 Speaker 1: and you don't need it, like you're gonna be fine 367 00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:14,159 Speaker 1: through your twenties, like go to the hour when you 368 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:16,640 Speaker 1: need to. But now in my mid thirties, I'm medicated, 369 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:18,399 Speaker 1: boots boots down. 370 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:20,680 Speaker 2: And let me tell you, just buy within an inch 371 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:22,960 Speaker 2: of my life medicated because health insurance. 372 00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 1: Don't even get me started. I'm still on my California 373 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:31,159 Speaker 1: health insurance have not changed. 374 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 2: So you're paying like six hundred dollars a month. 375 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:36,199 Speaker 1: No, no, no, I'm paying like nothing. Oh. I'm on the 376 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:39,639 Speaker 1: health insurance that I got when I left my last 377 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:43,719 Speaker 1: job and went on unemployment. Oh, I pay like nothing. 378 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:46,880 Speaker 1: And you were still covered by doctor V No no, no, 379 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:48,400 Speaker 1: I stopped going to doctor V. 380 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 2: Oh but what but didn't Oh so you didn't have 381 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 2: your insurance? 382 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:53,800 Speaker 1: No no no oh I see No I didn't do like 383 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 1: the I didn't switch my health insurance. I went on 384 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 1: like the very basic like Medicaid insurance I see, or medicare, 385 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 1: which one is for old people, Medicare or Medicaid. 386 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 2: I think Medicare is for old people. Okay, so Medicaid 387 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:12,200 Speaker 2: but oh no, no, no, a Medicare is for us. Medicaid 388 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:12,520 Speaker 2: is for. 389 00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:16,399 Speaker 1: Old Well, it hasn't been a problem yet. I mean 390 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 1: I haven't been to the doctor a lot this year. 391 00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:23,159 Speaker 1: I only went for the first time outside of like 392 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:25,359 Speaker 1: going to urgent care when I had strapped throat. I 393 00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 1: just went to Calen Lord for the first time to 394 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: start care there again, and like they didn't even have 395 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 1: my current email or phone number, like it is it's 396 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:42,560 Speaker 1: been a while. And I the day that I went 397 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:46,680 Speaker 1: to calen Lord, I saw two people I knew, and 398 00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 1: then afterwards I tweeted something about Callen Lord and someone 399 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:55,880 Speaker 1: I mutuals with messaged me and was like I sent 400 00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 1: this to my friend at calen Lord and they were like, oh, 401 00:20:57,920 --> 00:20:59,200 Speaker 1: Rose Damu was just here. 402 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 2: So it's like everyone knows. It's so bad. 403 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,960 Speaker 1: It's so annoying, and like that sounds very annoying to say, like, 404 00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:09,119 Speaker 1: but it is like the place where there's high the 405 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:14,000 Speaker 1: highest likelihood that someone will recognize one of us, because 406 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:15,480 Speaker 1: like it is very It's like when I went to 407 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,880 Speaker 1: see Caroline, Polo Jack and Ethyl Kane, Like I knew 408 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 1: that was a place where people were going to come 409 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:21,680 Speaker 1: up to me and like know who I was because 410 00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:23,440 Speaker 1: they listened to this podcast or like follow me on 411 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:28,120 Speaker 1: Twitter or whatever. And the Venn diagram between people who 412 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:30,400 Speaker 1: go to a Caroline Polcheck Ethyl Kane show and people 413 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:34,200 Speaker 1: who go to Callen Lord is basically a circle. And 414 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 1: that is honestly like the last place where I want 415 00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:43,840 Speaker 1: to have an awareness that people have an awareness of me, 416 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:47,879 Speaker 1: you know, And like that's very like not a relatable problem, 417 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 1: So I don't want to give it any more airtime. 418 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:53,240 Speaker 1: But it is weird too, because like when you are 419 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 1: doing medical stuff, especially as a trans person, you are 420 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:01,480 Speaker 1: making yourself extremely vulnerable. And that's not when I want 421 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:05,919 Speaker 1: to be worried about like someone being like like oh 422 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:07,439 Speaker 1: my god, I love oh my god, I love your Twitter. 423 00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like, don't I mean to have the sense 424 00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:13,200 Speaker 2: to like not walk out to or acknowledge people at 425 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 2: the doctor when they're at the doctors. I hope people 426 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 2: at least know that, But like, no, I experienced the 427 00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:20,840 Speaker 2: same thing. I love Calm Lord. I stand like a 428 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 2: lot of the fundraising or organizing that they do, but 429 00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:27,440 Speaker 2: for my needs I go to APACHA, which is a 430 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 2: comparable like medical initiative for trans people, and I get 431 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 2: recognized there. I've seen people I know there. But I 432 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:39,200 Speaker 2: will say, from my experience, because everybody I'm talking to 433 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 2: or potentially being recognized by are like queer trans, it 434 00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 2: is a little easier to be there because I'm like, Okay, 435 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:49,280 Speaker 2: we're all here for probably the same or similar reason. 436 00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 2: So I don't feel a type of way about it. 437 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,480 Speaker 2: But yeah, I think it's not much to ask for 438 00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:57,960 Speaker 2: privacy in your place of medical care. You know what 439 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,920 Speaker 2: I mean. That shouldn't be It shouldn't be a thing. 440 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: I know. It feels like doctor patient confidentiality. I extend 441 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:08,200 Speaker 1: to like being at any kind of medical center. 442 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:11,639 Speaker 2: I'm also realizing, actually that what you've named is actually 443 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,280 Speaker 2: such a problem that I do. I do wear sunglasses 444 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 2: when I go into the doctor's office because I'm like, 445 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 2: I I wear hat, I wear sunglasses. I was like, 446 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:19,680 Speaker 2: I don't want I don't want anybody talking. 447 00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:21,760 Speaker 1: He was like, going to Colin Lord a couple of 448 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,639 Speaker 1: weeks ago. I made sure that I like looked okay, 449 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 1: because I was like, I know, I'm going to at 450 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 1: the very least run into people that I know. 451 00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:32,879 Speaker 2: And when we went to the doctor, when we went 452 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 2: to doctor V, honey, we were stunting. I love. I 453 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:40,080 Speaker 2: looked so good for doctor V. I was like, I 454 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:42,359 Speaker 2: was like, this is a nice little medical facility, and 455 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 2: these are some nice young men touching me. 456 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:49,920 Speaker 1: I miss doctor V so much and the way he said. 457 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:54,400 Speaker 3: But but boot. 458 00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 1: There was a period when I was in college when 459 00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:00,280 Speaker 1: I used to watch a lot of surgery videos. What. 460 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, but this was after you already decided you're not 461 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:04,400 Speaker 2: going to be a surgeon anymore. 462 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:08,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, but like like in my in my like early 463 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:10,639 Speaker 1: to mid twenties, I used to watch surgery videos on 464 00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 1: YouTube a lot for fun. Yeah. Ah, yeah, like the 465 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 1: that's kind of gory, like open heart surgery. 466 00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:20,080 Speaker 2: So you're not squeamish about that. 467 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 1: I actually have become a lot more squeamish in my 468 00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:28,720 Speaker 1: old age. Yeah, I see, I can't do It's not 469 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,880 Speaker 1: the gore that bothers me. It's sort of like weird 470 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 1: body stuff that bothers me, like weird holes and things 471 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 1: like that. 472 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:41,119 Speaker 2: I have a question, Yeah, are there weird holes? H 473 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 2: Are there any sort of medical appointments or plans you 474 00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 2: are making for yourself in any sort of future that 475 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 2: you have to then go to a doctor for. 476 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 1: Are you asking me if I want to get gender. 477 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:01,919 Speaker 2: You and I have talked about FFS before, and at 478 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:03,879 Speaker 2: a certain point you really wanted it, and now you 479 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:05,640 Speaker 2: kind of don't. I don't know if that's on the you. 480 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 1: No, I do want it, and I'm kind of in 481 00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 1: a moment of like looking at my life and figuring 482 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:15,000 Speaker 1: out what I want now, being like a year out 483 00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 1: from having left a corporate job and like being a 484 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: full time creative and something I want that you and 485 00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:23,480 Speaker 1: I have talked about is like I do think I 486 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: want to have a job again, And a big part 487 00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 1: of that is that I do kind of kick myself 488 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 1: for not taking advantage of having really good healthcare when 489 00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:35,280 Speaker 1: I had a corporate job and just getting a lot 490 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:40,159 Speaker 1: of gender affirming surgery. So that is part of the 491 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:42,439 Speaker 1: appeal to me of having a job again, is just 492 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: like being able to get a lot of really cunty 493 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:48,280 Speaker 1: plastic surgery, and like, that is something I want and 494 00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:51,240 Speaker 1: I have gone so back and forth on it because 495 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 1: I am one of the few trans women I know 496 00:25:56,359 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 1: who's had no gender affirming surgery, and I would wow, 497 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 1: would you say few, you would say few. I think 498 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:14,000 Speaker 1: most trans women I know well have had stuff done 499 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:15,800 Speaker 1: and like, you know, I don't think we need to 500 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,399 Speaker 1: talk about like our friends and I've not done, but 501 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 1: you know, like it is a passage now expect it is, 502 00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:27,199 Speaker 1: it is expected, and like especially too, I don't know, 503 00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:31,239 Speaker 1: but kinds of dolls, yeah, certain kinds of dolls, and like, 504 00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: I have gone back and forth so much over you know, 505 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 1: the past seven years about whether it's something I want 506 00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:44,080 Speaker 1: or not, and I've I've swung really far on the 507 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:48,359 Speaker 1: pendulum both ways at different times, and I I guess 508 00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:52,400 Speaker 1: I am at a point now where I it is 509 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: something that I want. I'm not sure what, I'm not 510 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:59,639 Speaker 1: sure when I'm not sure how severe. But yeah, I 511 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:01,439 Speaker 1: mean there's is part of me that just wants to 512 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:06,200 Speaker 1: like fully redo your face transform in some way. 513 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 2: I mean, who doesn't. It's such a it's such a 514 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 2: wish fulfillment thing, like very like the Swan very Disney 515 00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 2: princess Asque, like the posts end or fundraisers and or 516 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:23,639 Speaker 2: parties that we witness to in Brooklyn for the dolls 517 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 2: and their ffs creates this kind of reveal that I 518 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:31,199 Speaker 2: think is really amazing and beautiful to behold. But then 519 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:34,919 Speaker 2: it also creates this kind of standard of something that 520 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 2: you want to be a part of, because who because 521 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:41,359 Speaker 2: I know, I you know, look says people. Gender firming 522 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:46,919 Speaker 2: care is not about beauty, but also it is, and 523 00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:49,159 Speaker 2: we all want to be beautiful, and and when we 524 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,400 Speaker 2: get when we come out of surgery, we are pushing 525 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,639 Speaker 2: a button and dropping thousands of dollars or our insurance 526 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,320 Speaker 2: companies are dropping thousands of dollars to make us more beautiful. 527 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:02,280 Speaker 2: And that is more often than not for our literal 528 00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 2: safety and or daily psychological survival. But also like, not 529 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,840 Speaker 2: everyone needs it, not everyone should have to feel pressured 530 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:12,120 Speaker 2: to get it, but you. 531 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,560 Speaker 1: Know, it is. I do really like that. I know 532 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:18,920 Speaker 1: so many people who have had really like the whole 533 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 1: spectrum of gender affirming care, and so I have people 534 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,920 Speaker 1: that I can ask about their experiences. Like last year, 535 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,000 Speaker 1: I was considering having an orchaectomy and talk to people 536 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 1: that I knew who had had one, and ultimately decided 537 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 1: that it was not for me at that moment. Maybe ever, 538 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 1: I don't know, And right now, like something that's been 539 00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:40,600 Speaker 1: on my mind a lot is like vocal cord surgery 540 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:42,680 Speaker 1: because my voice is the thing that I'm probably the 541 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,600 Speaker 1: most dysporic about, although recently a lot of people have 542 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 1: been telling me that they love my voice and that 543 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 1: they find it very soothing. And when we were on 544 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,600 Speaker 1: Fire Island, that was the thing that made people recognize 545 00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 1: me the most. Like it happened multiple times on the boardwalk. 546 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:00,400 Speaker 1: Someone would hear me talking and then turn and around 547 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 1: and be like, oh my god, I love your podcast. 548 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:03,040 Speaker 1: So that's funny. 549 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:06,800 Speaker 2: That's a high compliment, but also kind of even further 550 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:09,760 Speaker 2: encouraging reason to do it so that you've become even 551 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:11,480 Speaker 2: more uncor And. 552 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: There's someone there's someone who I follow on TikTok right 553 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: now who is about to start or who is about 554 00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 1: to get vocal court surgery. So I'm just very I'm 555 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 1: very interested in and she is someone who creates a 556 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 1: lot of content about their transition, so I'm very interested 557 00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:30,600 Speaker 1: to see what that process is like for her, And 558 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 1: you know, maybe at some point in the future do 559 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: that for myself. But you know, like that's not necessarily 560 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 1: something I'm ever going to be super public about, and 561 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 1: I don't think I like necessarily owe it to talk 562 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 1: to anyone about it. And I also like fully feel 563 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:52,040 Speaker 1: like I have the right to to do it all 564 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: or to absolutely change my mind and do none of it. 565 00:29:55,480 --> 00:30:02,440 Speaker 1: And you know, because like it's not like unfortunately, like 566 00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:05,360 Speaker 1: as we're talking about doctors, like gender firming care specifically 567 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:13,320 Speaker 1: is not just about you and your gender and like, uh, 568 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:15,560 Speaker 1: the way you like appear in the world. It also 569 00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:23,560 Speaker 1: is about navigating and extremely like transphobic and like bureaucratic industry, 570 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 1: and like going to doing any kind of medical care 571 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 1: is extremely daunting, and especially stuff that's like very tied 572 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,000 Speaker 1: to your gender is just a nightmare. And I also 573 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 1: just hate bureaucracy and like filling out forms that is 574 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:46,280 Speaker 1: probably the thing that the has the most prohibited me 575 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 1: from getting from getting any gender firming care is like 576 00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:55,840 Speaker 1: scheduling appointments, having to deal with insurance companies like that. 577 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 1: If honestly, if like when I was like a corporate batty, 578 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 1: if I could have paid someone to like you could have, 579 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: I probably could have, and I should have paid me. 580 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 1: And that is something that I kicked myself for. It's 581 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 1: like I should have like hired like a like a 582 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:11,960 Speaker 1: transition assistant. 583 00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:16,000 Speaker 2: Actually that has to be a thing. It probably already is. 584 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, someone out there if someone out there, if you're 585 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: looking for like a new a new industry, like a 586 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: cottage industry to start, you should be like a like 587 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:27,720 Speaker 1: transition doula doula. 588 00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, so maybe like you and also not like you. 589 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:53,240 Speaker 2: So I honestly feel very comfortable on the podcast talking 590 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,320 Speaker 2: about a lot of things that I otherwise wouldn't in 591 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 2: mixed company or on social media. So like, I honestly 592 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,760 Speaker 2: feel great talking about like surgery stuff here. And also, like, 593 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,600 Speaker 2: you know, if when I do ever get I mean, 594 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 2: when I do eventually get like gender affirming care of 595 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 2: any kind, I will absolutely talk to anyone about it 596 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 2: if they're also seeking care, because that exchange of information 597 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,719 Speaker 2: is just so crucial, not just referrals whether you had 598 00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 2: a good experience, what you did, what didn't go well, 599 00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 2: things like that, things that you wish you had done. 600 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:31,320 Speaker 2: I've already had n FFS consultation at a doctor that 601 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 2: two of my girlfriends went to. I'm not doing it 602 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:39,520 Speaker 2: through my insurance. I'll do electrolysis through my insurance. I 603 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:41,920 Speaker 2: would do a few other things through my insurance, but 604 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,040 Speaker 2: I'm not doing my FFS through my insurance because I 605 00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:47,760 Speaker 2: was like, I'd much rather wait until I am wealthy 606 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 2: enough to pay for it because I want the best 607 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,320 Speaker 2: that I can get, and that doesn't that's not to 608 00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,120 Speaker 2: say that there are, there isn't the best that you 609 00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,800 Speaker 2: can get under your insurance, but to do it through 610 00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:02,960 Speaker 2: and insurance is a longer process with a longer waiting 611 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:05,920 Speaker 2: list and a slimmer and a slimmer group of people 612 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:08,960 Speaker 2: to choose from, depending on what stay you're in and 613 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,920 Speaker 2: like what like like what part of the country you're in, 614 00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:14,760 Speaker 2: and that's something where it's just like I would pay 615 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,360 Speaker 2: to not have to deal with that, And I'm also 616 00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:20,760 Speaker 2: just not on a corporate insurance anymore, so I might 617 00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:22,240 Speaker 2: as well pay out a pocket right, if. 618 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:24,520 Speaker 1: There's anyone out there who's listening to this podcast who 619 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 1: wants to give us free surgery, No, but that's let 620 00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 1: us know, wait, this is so relevant. So I actually 621 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:34,440 Speaker 1: would never do spawn con surgery like and that is 622 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,520 Speaker 1: I'm saying knowing full well that that is a free 623 00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:42,080 Speaker 1: like thirty forty fifty thousand dollars like a worth of work. 624 00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:45,080 Speaker 1: Like I would never because I don't want people to 625 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,960 Speaker 1: like look at my face and be like, yeah, that 626 00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:50,280 Speaker 1: was the face brought to you In part by doctor 627 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:55,080 Speaker 1: Lee LSPC. Sorry I name dropped Caitlin Jenner and Dylan 628 00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:58,080 Speaker 1: mulvaney's FFS surgeon, but like I but like I just 629 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 1: don't want that, like no offense, Like I have no 630 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:02,560 Speaker 1: compst with Dylan mlvany. I think that everybody needs to 631 00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 1: do what they need to do, and her bag is influencing. 632 00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:06,720 Speaker 1: There's nothing wrong with that. But it's just like that's 633 00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:08,560 Speaker 1: not my bag, that's not the bad, that's not what 634 00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:09,040 Speaker 1: I want. 635 00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:10,799 Speaker 2: To be associate. That's not how I want people to 636 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,160 Speaker 2: see me. And I don't want a little tag on 637 00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 2: my face everywhere I go. You know what, That sounds 638 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:21,319 Speaker 2: really anti capitalist, but it's actually just vain, Like I'm 639 00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:23,520 Speaker 2: just vain, and I don't want people to think that 640 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,440 Speaker 2: I brought it. So like when I do get FFS 641 00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,359 Speaker 2: and any other gender firming care in that pool, I'm 642 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:33,000 Speaker 2: not talking about it on social media like I'm disappearing. 643 00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:35,680 Speaker 2: All my friends will know I'm disappearing, and you will 644 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:38,840 Speaker 2: see me back beautiful as a butterfly. It's such a 645 00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,400 Speaker 2: weird thing to talk about, honestly just because of the 646 00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 2: beauty aspect, but also just like how weirdly we conflated 647 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:49,520 Speaker 2: the medicalization of transnis with transnis itself, which is like 648 00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:54,120 Speaker 2: a conversation we don't have the time to have. But 649 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,520 Speaker 2: I am endlessly grateful for all the girls that have 650 00:34:57,640 --> 00:34:59,960 Speaker 2: already done it and have been so willing to die 651 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:04,319 Speaker 2: document fully on their stories and or close friends, like 652 00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:08,600 Speaker 2: the fluid draining, the stitches that they have, the weirdness 653 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:10,879 Speaker 2: of how it sets in, like how much they can 654 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:16,759 Speaker 2: talk or move their mouth like crazy. Detailed experiences of 655 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:21,920 Speaker 2: medical transition now exists online on YouTube, on Instagram because 656 00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:26,120 Speaker 2: of this information exchange and also because of everyone's hunger 657 00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 2: to be a little famous. 658 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:31,480 Speaker 1: There was this girl on Twitter recently who shared this 659 00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:36,480 Speaker 1: text she had sent her dad who when this one 660 00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 1: time her dad misgendered her and she sent him a 661 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:44,239 Speaker 1: text of her post op pussy and was like, it's 662 00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:45,720 Speaker 1: she who by. 663 00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 2: Word, that's how you do it? 664 00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:50,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that is so cunned. 665 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:54,120 Speaker 2: Literally keep them serving cun am I right? 666 00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:54,359 Speaker 1: Wait? 667 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 2: What does she say, Luanne, Oh, I hope you keep 668 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:00,839 Speaker 2: on serving cunts? I actually voice is kind of giving 669 00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:03,240 Speaker 2: her any are I hope you keep on serving conta? 670 00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 2: That was not. 671 00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,800 Speaker 1: Should we should we do one last doctor? Role? Play 672 00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:10,839 Speaker 1: before we sign off. 673 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:15,239 Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, okay, you're the doctor this time. Hi, I'm 674 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 2: doctor Luhanne. How are you doing today, young lady. 675 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: I'm great. So I'm here because I really want to 676 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:31,759 Speaker 1: get Lady Gaga born this way cheekbones and I know 677 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:35,359 Speaker 1: that you're like pre eminent in this field. Oh yes, we. 678 00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:39,719 Speaker 2: Have that procedure on our kind of offerings pamphlet here. 679 00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:42,120 Speaker 1: So what are the cheekbones made out of? 680 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,000 Speaker 2: Well, okay, I'll have to ask. Hang on, let me 681 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,600 Speaker 2: bring her out. We have Val from Glow up here, 682 00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:53,080 Speaker 2: who is going to be actually, oh my god, vow 683 00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:54,840 Speaker 2: dang Dong. 684 00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 1: My name is Val. 685 00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:02,799 Speaker 2: I think you'll say is smashing and you don't need 686 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:05,560 Speaker 2: a damn thing. Don't get f FS raise dom you. 687 00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:07,280 Speaker 2: That's kind of Australian. 688 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:12,280 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, but Val, it is my right to choose 689 00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:17,439 Speaker 1: surgery for myself. So get that scalpel out and put 690 00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:19,320 Speaker 1: your whole pussy into these cheekbones. 691 00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:24,520 Speaker 2: Dang Dong, you are so right, You are so right, 692 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:29,040 Speaker 2: a rose. What can I let me just get the 693 00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,160 Speaker 2: scalpel right now. 694 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:34,200 Speaker 1: That's a chain, so that's not a scalp. 695 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:39,640 Speaker 2: No, No, this is right, This is a right can 696 00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:49,279 Speaker 2: you insert like chain saw noises. Stick around for a 697 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:54,359 Speaker 2: little preview of this week's Patreon episode, absolutely free to you. 698 00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:57,719 Speaker 2: If you want to listen to the entire episode, you 699 00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,960 Speaker 2: can mosey over to our Patreon at Patreon dot com 700 00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:02,120 Speaker 2: slash Like a Virgin. 701 00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:05,319 Speaker 1: Currently we're doing recaps of and Just Like That and 702 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:10,759 Speaker 1: lots of other fun exclusive content for our paywall princesses. 703 00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:13,320 Speaker 1: You can also buy our merch at like a Virgin 704 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:17,160 Speaker 1: four twenty sixty nine dot com. Follow us on Instagram 705 00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:19,319 Speaker 1: at Like a Virgin four twenty sixty nine. You can 706 00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:22,480 Speaker 1: also follow me anywhere you walk at Rosdamue. 707 00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 2: You can find me at Friends, squish Goo, anywhere you like. 708 00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 1: Like a Virgin is an iHeartRadio production. Our producer is 709 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:31,560 Speaker 1: Phoebe Unter, with support from Lindsay Hoffman and Nikki Detour 710 00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:36,000 Speaker 1: until next week. I guess so it's never really over 711 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:40,200 Speaker 1: just because it SERVI doesn't miniaturally literally, and maybe you'll 712 00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:50,800 Speaker 1: becoming again. Talk to me about polysecure, girl. 713 00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:52,759 Speaker 2: I'm not finished enough with poly secure to give you 714 00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:55,319 Speaker 2: a full overview, but I will definitely tell you that 715 00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 2: I know your attachment style and mine now. 716 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:02,439 Speaker 1: And I feel that's what's what's mine. 717 00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:04,960 Speaker 2: Well, they're not like rigid labels, so I don't want 718 00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 2: to like kind of like foreclose that onto you. And 719 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:09,840 Speaker 2: I'm also nonprofessional, so I won't. I won't really, I 720 00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,319 Speaker 2: won't really describe more on the podcast, but. 721 00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:15,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. I want to hear it. No, you 722 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: said it. Now you have to diagnose me. 723 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,239 Speaker 2: Okay, So for the virgins, everybody has like kind of 724 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:23,480 Speaker 2: combination attachment styles a lot of the time. So this 725 00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:27,080 Speaker 2: is only one of your attachment styles, but I know 726 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,600 Speaker 2: that one of them is this. 727 00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:35,799 Speaker 1: What did you like underline it in the book and 728 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:36,360 Speaker 1: said this is. 729 00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 2: Rose No, No, I didn't. Oh, it's called dismissive attachment. 730 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:43,799 Speaker 1: Explain more. 731 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:49,520 Speaker 2: Well, it's just like when because of of how you 732 00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:53,000 Speaker 2: are cultured and who you are, that you're you're used 733 00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:55,840 Speaker 2: to keeping people at an arm's length, which is true 734 00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,920 Speaker 2: when once again, like these are not like damning labels 735 00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:00,839 Speaker 2: that like prove who people are are they are they 736 00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:05,120 Speaker 2: are crutches that you know, we default to if we're 737 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:07,640 Speaker 2: not plugged into like what it means to actually connect 738 00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:09,160 Speaker 2: with the person, which you are fully capable of. 739 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,160 Speaker 1: Obviously, I don't want. 740 00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:13,719 Speaker 2: To unless you don't want to but like, I mean, 741 00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:16,520 Speaker 2: it's this. I mean my attachment style is like anxious 742 00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:19,960 Speaker 2: or like or avoidant, like or combo of those. 743 00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:25,560 Speaker 1: I would say, I would say, we're anxious, You're not really, 744 00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 1: I don't actually see you as an avoid. 745 00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 2: No, I'm I'm someone who well, it depends on the 746 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,719 Speaker 2: circumstance and the relationship, because I am someone who can 747 00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 2: shut people out of my brain and existence if I 748 00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:42,239 Speaker 2: want to, Like, I can be very out of sight, 749 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:44,399 Speaker 2: out of mind, or like I can just choose to 750 00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,600 Speaker 2: not care about certain things in ways that I find avoidant. 751 00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:49,600 Speaker 2: But I'm also just not a professional. And I haven't 752 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,080 Speaker 2: finished the book, so I think, like in a follow 753 00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:55,200 Speaker 2: up book, Corner, I'm definitely going to talk more about 754 00:40:55,239 --> 00:40:57,719 Speaker 2: poly Secure. Maybe we'll talk about Paul's politics the form 755 00:40:57,719 --> 00:40:59,719 Speaker 2: of Immortal Girl. Although I do say that every year 756 00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:01,440 Speaker 2: I've read months I say I'm going to read the 757 00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:02,120 Speaker 2: book that you're doing. 758 00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:05,279 Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't really see I think this was us 759 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:06,120 Speaker 1: talking about it. 760 00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:10,680 Speaker 2: Yeah. That all that is to say, poll Secure is 761 00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:13,960 Speaker 2: something that I'm reading just because it's like relevant to 762 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:20,520 Speaker 2: my life now, and I think that polyamorous relationships are fascinating. 763 00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:23,000 Speaker 2: I have no I don't have a ton of like 764 00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:26,320 Speaker 2: knowledge about them. And I think that regardless of whether 765 00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:30,600 Speaker 2: you are Polly or not, and I'm not, you can 766 00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:37,439 Speaker 2: learn a lot from poly forms of attachment and poly 767 00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:41,319 Speaker 2: structures of relationships because they're so much more liberated. I 768 00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:44,080 Speaker 2: think that's really cool. I also don't know if I've 769 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:46,400 Speaker 2: ever seen a successful one happen. 770 00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:51,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I am trying to think of one. I, you know, 771 00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:57,040 Speaker 1: was giving a friend relationship advice recently, and I won't 772 00:41:57,080 --> 00:42:00,200 Speaker 1: go into too much detail, and I don't I'm not 773 00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:04,600 Speaker 1: really qualified to give relationship advice, but I did end 774 00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:09,759 Speaker 1: up saying that this thing that that I feel, which 775 00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:14,040 Speaker 1: is that I think, as you know, evolved queer people 776 00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:19,400 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty three, we are sort of expected to 777 00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:25,880 Speaker 1: be okay with polyamory or to have it as the 778 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:30,759 Speaker 1: default in our relationships. And I wanted to, you know, 779 00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:36,360 Speaker 1: what I told this friend was, it's okay if you're not, 780 00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:40,560 Speaker 1: It's okay if you don't want, If it's okay to 781 00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:43,480 Speaker 1: not want to have an open relationship, Like it's there 782 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:46,360 Speaker 1: is a reason why, Like I yes, I know, society 783 00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:49,399 Speaker 1: is like fucked up and we live in like this 784 00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,319 Speaker 1: horrible sycteropatriarchy, but like there is a reason why most 785 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:57,040 Speaker 1: people are in monogamous relationships and like it it's Oh, 786 00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,759 Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's right, but I'm saying, like, it's 787 00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:03,920 Speaker 1: okay to want that because we've been conditioned to want it. 788 00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:08,399 Speaker 1: And you shouldn't force yourself to be in a polymagel. 789 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:11,680 Speaker 1: You shouldn't force yourself to be polyamorous because you think 790 00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:16,479 Speaker 1: it's like the quote unquote right thing to do, as 791 00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,799 Speaker 1: especially as a queer person, if you're forcing yourself to 792 00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:22,480 Speaker 1: be poly for any reason, like you're already kind of 793 00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:26,560 Speaker 1: setting yourself up for failure. I'll agree with a lot 794 00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:29,360 Speaker 1: of what you said. You know, I think that monogamy 795 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:32,319 Speaker 1: should be challenged, and like if I could push a 796 00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:40,040 Speaker 1: button and like relational fluidity where the default instead of monogamy, 797 00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:43,239 Speaker 1: Like I think that society would change, right, Like monogamy 798 00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:49,160 Speaker 1: is a product of a very specific kind of colonialism 799 00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:53,240 Speaker 1: and just like how the operate, how the world operates 800 00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,160 Speaker 1: in defaults because of like a kind of structure of 801 00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:58,480 Speaker 1: marriage and partnership that we've created. And I think that 802 00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:02,759 Speaker 1: polyamory is has been around for eons, yes, but is 803 00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:06,680 Speaker 1: a very new tool to a lot of people who 804 00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:07,680 Speaker 1: don't know how to use it. 805 00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:10,160 Speaker 2: And I think that a lot of the reason that 806 00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:14,280 Speaker 2: I find that poly relationships aren't working out is because 807 00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:18,280 Speaker 2: one there's a person in the relationship who is acquiescing. 808 00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:22,200 Speaker 2: They're coming into this poly relationship because they want to 809 00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:25,279 Speaker 2: keep someone or because they don't want to seem like 810 00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:30,360 Speaker 2: old fashioned and lo and behold, they're actually not Polly two. 811 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:35,799 Speaker 2: I feel like people can be sometimes extremely entitled or 812 00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:40,120 Speaker 2: selfish about the number of partners they want to take on, 813 00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:45,320 Speaker 2: probably as a product of previous trauma or attachment styles 814 00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:48,879 Speaker 2: that led them to feel like they couldn't actually have 815 00:44:49,080 --> 00:44:51,840 Speaker 2: one person they could be alone with. And then I 816 00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:56,040 Speaker 2: also think that at the end of the day, we 817 00:44:56,239 --> 00:45:00,279 Speaker 2: just the people that are in poly structures are not 818 00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:05,040 Speaker 2: read up on how polyamory works. Yeah, and they should be. 819 00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:07,759 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think it's very I think it's 820 00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:11,239 Speaker 1: very admirable that you want to sort of do your 821 00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:20,240 Speaker 1: research before you know, potentially entering any kind of polyamorous scenario. Yeah. 822 00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:22,520 Speaker 2: I mean, I don't think I'm gonna do that, but 823 00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:25,479 Speaker 2: I feel like I a lot of my friends are poly, 824 00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:28,160 Speaker 2: and I feel like I myself when I like when 825 00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:30,759 Speaker 2: I have a partner, I've never had an open relationship 826 00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:34,640 Speaker 2: before even so I want to learn how to do that, 827 00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:37,319 Speaker 2: and polyamory teaches you how to do that, how to 828 00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:40,120 Speaker 2: be happy for your partner, how to experience compersion, how 829 00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:43,840 Speaker 2: to mitigate and have a conversation with jealousy or ego. 830 00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:45,920 Speaker 2: You know, those are things that I want to learn, 831 00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:48,520 Speaker 2: even if I'm not Polly and so yeah, that's that's 832 00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:49,160 Speaker 2: what I'm learning. 833 00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:52,759 Speaker 1: I don't even know how to be in a monogamous relationship. Yeah, 834 00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:55,960 Speaker 1: so like that's, yeah, that's kind of where i'm at. 835 00:45:56,040 --> 00:46:00,480 Speaker 1: I'm not ready for the you know, the next I'm 836 00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:03,920 Speaker 1: not ready for the two o two class of relationships. 837 00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:09,399 Speaker 1: Kind to say, actually, I'm just gonna stay where i'm at. 838 00:46:10,040 --> 00:46:10,320 Speaker 1: Love