Speaker 1: Loud and Quiet presents Midnight Chats.
Speaker 2: I want to start this episode of the podcast with
Speaker 2: an apology, but mostly I want to start with some
Speaker 2: thank you. First off, sorry we've been away. It's been
Speaker 2: about six weeks since our last episode of Midnight Chats,
Speaker 2: episode thirty one with Lucy Rose. There was never a
Speaker 2: plan to take a summer break, but unfortunate at the
Speaker 2: end of July, our office in London was burgled and
Speaker 2: all of our equipment was taken, and that included the
Speaker 2: kit we used to make this series and two unpublished
Speaker 2: chats we'd already recorded, one that I'd had with the
Speaker 2: legendary Tom Morello which took place the more after the
Speaker 2: UK general election, and another that Stuart had done with
Speaker 2: Adam from the War on Drugs. Unfortunately, those conversations won't
Speaker 2: get heard now, which is a shame, but hey, maybe
Speaker 2: we'll get those guests back on one day. As I said,
Speaker 2: I also need to say a few thank yous as well.
Speaker 2: We're a small, independent team, so the last month hasn't
Speaker 2: been the easiest. But the people who got in touch
Speaker 2: afterwards to offer temporary working space or help, or sent
Speaker 2: us some whiskey or just ask if we were all right.
Speaker 2: Cheers to you guys, it was much appreciated, and also
Speaker 2: thank you to Zoom who kindly sent us a new
Speaker 2: recorder so that you can hear this now. This feels
Speaker 2: like a good opportunity then as we come back to
Speaker 2: remind you what we're all about and what we do,
Speaker 2: or if you're listening for the first time, to introduce
Speaker 2: you to Midnight Chats. It's a podcast series made by
Speaker 2: us at Loud and Quiet. Some episodes are hosted by me,
Speaker 2: Greg and others by Stuart and we aim to have
Speaker 2: conversations with artists, people of interest that have a late
Speaker 2: night feel, the kind of thing that maybe hopefully goes
Speaker 2: a bit deeper, maybe is a little bit different from
Speaker 2: what you normally hear from those musicians. So after our
Speaker 2: recent unplanned pause, we start again now. A new episode
Speaker 2: will be published every fortnight at midnight on a Thursday,
Speaker 2: and you can listen, subscribe, ray and review us on
Speaker 2: all the major podcast platforms, plus we stick these on
Speaker 2: YouTube and Facebook as well. In exactly one week from now,
Speaker 2: the winner of this year's Mercury Prize will be announced.
Speaker 2: Just less than two years ago, that was Benjamin Clementine
Speaker 2: picking up the award, inviting the eleven other nominees on
Speaker 2: stage that night to pick up the award with him,
Speaker 2: and he was dedicating it to the victims of the
Speaker 2: recent Paris terror attacks. At that time. It was a
Speaker 2: poignant moment, and the night itself wasn't just the breakthrough
Speaker 2: moment for his music, but also the springboard for his
Speaker 2: extraordinary story to start being told more widely. Benjamin grew
Speaker 2: up in Edmonton, North London, left home when he was sixteen,
Speaker 2: spent a couple of years living in Camden before leaving
Speaker 2: London for Paris. He was often sleeping rough there on
Speaker 2: the streets. He was busking, though at the same time
Speaker 2: on the Metro and on the boulevards, and that's where
Speaker 2: he was spotted an experience which eventually led him on
Speaker 2: to record his debut album, at Least for Now, and
Speaker 2: eventually onto winning that distinguished award, which incidentally he's managed
Speaker 2: to break. As he says in this chat, the morning
Speaker 2: after winning the Mercury, he went back to Paris to
Speaker 2: the cheap hostel room where he was staying and thought
Speaker 2: about how surreal the whole thing was. But two years on,
Speaker 2: in the middle of September. Now he will release his
Speaker 2: second album. It's called I Tell Afly, And there's a
Speaker 2: bit in this chat about the album, but not a lot.
Speaker 2: Mostly his conversation about his roots in Edmonton, why it
Speaker 2: was so hard going back there a few years ago
Speaker 2: to try and live there, why the twenty five pounds
Speaker 2: he got given for winning the Mercury Prize is still
Speaker 2: sat in a bank account, and also his impression of
Speaker 2: America and Americans after he spent the majority of last
Speaker 2: year there writing and recording his new album. Just finally,
Speaker 2: I should add that Benjamin speaks in a quite hushed,
Speaker 2: unhurried way, so you may want to turn this up
Speaker 2: a touch to get the full effect of our conversation.
Speaker 2: So here it is the return of Midnight Chats. This
Speaker 2: is episode thirty two with Benjamin Clementeine. What is the
Speaker 2: summer looked like for you?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've been finishing the album and also playing from
Speaker 3: festivals across Europe. The last one it's in a few
Speaker 3: days in Portugal, and I can't wait to go and
Speaker 3: perform for them, and then go back and rest a
Speaker 3: little bit before it all starts again in September.
Speaker 2: How do you find that transition between being in the
Speaker 2: writing recording place and then being out on stage, because
Speaker 2: I know for some artists their preferences to be in
Speaker 2: one zone at a time, if you like. So if
Speaker 2: you're trying to finish things, off record things and play
Speaker 2: shows at the same time, it can be a distraction.
Speaker 3: But how do you find it? I see it as
Speaker 3: as you know, a part of what, don't you know?
Speaker 3: What defines me going into the studio and recording it's
Speaker 3: the same as going to the stage and performing. Obviously
Speaker 3: they're both different things. Making the studio album it's different
Speaker 3: from making even a live album. But I think it's
Speaker 3: a bit like being a mu's good. You know of
Speaker 3: our occupations, like you know, a doctor or whatever it is.
Speaker 3: You know, you go to different places every time, and
Speaker 3: you you're going to have to give your best at everything.
Speaker 3: So you know, I wake up every day to do
Speaker 3: what I what I love doing, which is which is
Speaker 3: being an artist.
Speaker 2: When you're off the road, so to speak, where do
Speaker 2: you consider yourself based? Now? Are you living in London?
Speaker 3: Well, I am. I'd say that I pay my taxes
Speaker 3: in London, so I suppose because I'm living here. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I mean, I like coming back to London every time
Speaker 3: I'm not working or I'm not yeah, if I'm not
Speaker 3: writing or and in fact, I don't really like hanging
Speaker 3: around in London. I like to go outside London as
Speaker 3: much more peaceful.
Speaker 2: Where do you take yourself? Do you go to the coast,
Speaker 2: do you get into the countrysideway?
Speaker 3: Do you go well, you know, these days, my girlfriend
Speaker 3: she and she's, she's she's got a nice house and
Speaker 3: there's woken them. Okay, so we we go there, you know,
Speaker 3: as much as possible to to relax and and and
Speaker 3: get out the what's called the tantrums and snelligans of
Speaker 3: of off the city.
Speaker 2: And increasingly polluted out it feels like it.
Speaker 3: Certainly as soon as you leave London you realize how
Speaker 3: how dreadful it is to live in a search metropolis.
Speaker 2: What are the things that you still love about London?
Speaker 2: Night like having you know, growing up here. I don't
Speaker 2: know whether you consider yourself still in London and having
Speaker 2: like moved around to different places, but yeah, one of
Speaker 2: the things you still love about the city, I think
Speaker 2: is that a short list?
Speaker 3: I'm asually you have. I'm glad that I I I know,
Speaker 3: in fact, leaving London made me No London more, No
Speaker 3: London more because living in the city and you haven't
Speaker 3: really traveled around other cities, you don't realize what you
Speaker 3: have or what you don't have. For me, I like
Speaker 3: the openness of London, so if you want to go somewhere,
Speaker 3: you're going to have to really go there, cause it
Speaker 3: takes a long time to go there. I also like
Speaker 3: the obviously the so called it's the word mrticultural aspects
Speaker 3: of the city. Whether it's an advantage, I have no idea,
Speaker 3: but I do appreciate it. That's what I like about London.
Speaker 3: I think I like the southmore, South London more because
Speaker 3: it is very quiet compared to Central and North London.
Speaker 3: That's my experiences, you know, maximum anthorm of London. But
Speaker 3: I think I prefer up Landing more. Overall, I it's
Speaker 3: nice again, it's it's nice to to to see a
Speaker 3: whole bunch of people from looking different everywhere around the
Speaker 3: world coming to the city to somehow uh fulfilled their dreams.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: It's a bit like I'm sounding a bit like America
Speaker 3: now so called the American dream might be a great
Speaker 3: British dream, but you might have to ask her. You
Speaker 3: might have to ask her what's his name? Like your farage.
Speaker 2: If I am right or wrong, You're from Edmonton, so
Speaker 2: north of London. You're already north London. You've already mentioned.
Speaker 2: Do you find yourself back in that neighborhood very often?
Speaker 3: No, be honest with you, it's it's a shuttle.
Speaker 2: And I can agree with you on that because I
Speaker 2: live relatively close to there.
Speaker 3: It's a shittle. I would like to hopefully, you know,
Speaker 3: I have so many you know, so many dreams, and
Speaker 3: you know, you know, when I'm when I'm done with
Speaker 3: this music, I would want to know I would be
Speaker 3: allowed to say that I can do it. At the
Speaker 3: same time, it's amount of times I'm traveling, so I
Speaker 3: had to you know, even I have time for my
Speaker 3: own lady. You know how much more our village of
Speaker 3: Old City City in the city, I think that it's
Speaker 3: such a I wouldn't say the poor area because there's
Speaker 3: there's two parts of Edmonton. It's angel Edmonton and there's
Speaker 3: Edmonton Green. Edmonton Green is a poor side, and Andrew
Speaker 3: Edmonton is not so poor side. When we lived in
Speaker 3: Age Andrew Edmonton, so there was less crime and but
Speaker 3: you know, we always warned to never walk around Edmonton
Speaker 3: green going back there, you know, nothing has really changed.
Speaker 3: It's so look the look I get when I go
Speaker 3: to Edmonton. Edmonton suggest that I I've grown out of
Speaker 3: it now, I've I tried to live there. I went
Speaker 3: back there to live in Edmonton for a couple of
Speaker 3: months when I was recording my first album and just
Speaker 3: couldn't live there. M I couldn't live there, and I
Speaker 3: was very sad because you know, here I was, you know,
Speaker 3: you know, the man who I'm always foe for, you know,
Speaker 3: uh uh. I stayed true to my word, and I
Speaker 3: I tried to stay true to my words. You know,
Speaker 3: all the people I'm working with, you know, have been
Speaker 3: welcome with them for or four years now, and I'm
Speaker 3: and there's no way I'm not. I'm just gonna stop
Speaker 3: working with them, you know. So going back to Edmonton
Speaker 3: where my where my mother lives there, but I didn't
Speaker 3: want to live there. I wanted to get my own place,
Speaker 3: and it was a a very sad sight, one that
Speaker 3: I don't think I'd ever want to experience ever again.
Speaker 2: What made you sadder? Was it the flood of kind
Speaker 2: of memories of the place, that came back to you
Speaker 2: when you moved back there possibly some negative experiences or
Speaker 2: was it more that the place haven't changed and you
Speaker 2: felt like maybe it would have moved on in that time?
Speaker 3: Was both next feelings, of course, So as trauma. Uh,
Speaker 3: I would walk on the street and whenever I see kids,
Speaker 3: you know, I'll just you know, started thinking about when
Speaker 3: I was a kid, and I wouldn't want to pass
Speaker 3: them because cause I was bullied in school. So I
Speaker 3: wouldn't wanna walk past the badge of kids laughing together
Speaker 3: cause I think they might look at me in and
Speaker 3: uh we'll start laughing at my hair or you know,
Speaker 3: and I'm a corn man. So that, yes, of course.
Speaker 3: But it's also the fact that I, as you rightfully said, uh,
Speaker 3: I hadn't really moved on, you know, it hadn't. It
Speaker 3: was still I was going back. It's the past, you know,
Speaker 3: and I had already you know, gone fr gone through
Speaker 3: a lot and embarrassed. So and if I I mean,
Speaker 3: I can afford to live somewhere, there was you know,
Speaker 3: you know, not not the penthouse, but you know, in
Speaker 3: a in a nice are, in a safer and I
Speaker 3: was called a peaceful place. So yeah, it was, it
Speaker 3: was it was both, it wasn't it wasn't just and
Speaker 3: also in the you know, it's funny it's people. People
Speaker 3: do change, and and you know, talking about the neighborhoods.
Speaker 3: So going back there, they were less English people there,
Speaker 3: you know, and there's more I think, uh, Turkish people,
Speaker 3: and you know, it's uh, it's different. I mean a
Speaker 3: a a and field particularly it's it's is full of
Speaker 3: you know, uh, English, Greek people and fields the borough
Speaker 3: of of Edmonton, and and we were the few black
Speaker 3: people who who lived at that time. And then now it's, uh,
Speaker 3: it's changed, you know. I hope it's for the better
Speaker 3: in the long run because one a lot of uh
Speaker 3: I think one A lot of working class, you know,
Speaker 3: a lot of a uh yeah, a lot of working class.
Speaker 3: And I mean, what's people under working class?
Speaker 2: What's it called?
Speaker 3: I don't even know.
Speaker 2: Crime. Well, I mean I said, technically, I guess you're
Speaker 2: moving inside.
Speaker 3: Gypsies, Yes, gyp just uh gypsies. And you know, yeah,
Speaker 3: I saw I saw them living there. And and you
Speaker 3: know when there's that uh, I've been reading h Tom
Speaker 3: sol who's an economist. He says that uh, you know,
Speaker 3: uh uh poverty. There's not great crime, but I do
Speaker 3: a better to differ because liven't there for that particularly
Speaker 3: a few months I've thought to myself, all I could
Speaker 3: get robbed in an instant, you know, I could. I'm
Speaker 3: sure that the people are peaceful in the daytime, but
Speaker 3: at that time it is not. It's not a safe place.
Speaker 3: That's why there's not a lot of people are it's
Speaker 3: that time. So yeah, I hope they they find what
Speaker 3: they're looking for.
Speaker 2: You mentioned the couple of just talking about that. Then
Speaker 2: you said when when the music thing is done, which
Speaker 2: he infers that you don't imagine that you'll do music forever?
Speaker 3: Is that right?
Speaker 2: Do you think that way?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, of course I won't. I won't well doing music.
Speaker 3: Of course I'll playing music forever. But but I I
Speaker 3: don't see myself doing a lot of albums and you know,
Speaker 3: fifty albums and all that. No, that's not that's not me.
Speaker 2: You would be Paul McCartney still going at seventy.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, after a certain time, what do you
Speaker 3: talk about? I don't I don't see how. I mean,
Speaker 3: you love songs? Can you write what I've written? None?
Speaker 3: That's because I'm keeping all of my love. But I
Speaker 3: just don't. I don't like repeating myself, you know, And
Speaker 3: maybe I would just make I'll go to university, will
Speaker 3: go to conserve it or something. Study here, i'd been
Speaker 3: a composer or what's it called, something called director?
Speaker 2: Yeah, like an orchestra leader.
Speaker 3: Yeah you have forgotten, Yeah, the maestra or whatever it is. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: you know. I want to try and help my community,
Speaker 3: communities that touched me. Touch you know. So there's a
Speaker 3: community in France, that's community in England, Edmonton, community in
Speaker 3: Italy near Tuscany. I asked, that's what makes me go,
Speaker 3: That's what makes me breathe, and that's what makes me
Speaker 3: think that I'm worth it or my life is of
Speaker 3: VISal importance umanity. So so that music is I love music,
Speaker 3: but I don't think it's That's what I'll be doing
Speaker 3: for you know. You know, touring is so an easy thing.
Speaker 3: It's not, and there are many ways to make a living.
Speaker 3: It's just that most of the time, we artists, we
Speaker 3: compare ourselves to each other because of our others are
Speaker 3: greedy than others. So when you're making some money, you
Speaker 3: compare your money to someone who's greedy and then you
Speaker 3: think that you're making none, but there's enough to survive,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 2: So so if you were to go back to somewhere
Speaker 2: like Edmonton, how do you imagine what kind of capacity
Speaker 2: would you imagine that in the sense that you would
Speaker 2: want to be part of like a community youth program
Speaker 2: like about about trying to help like lift people out
Speaker 2: of some of the difficulties that you've just talked about.
Speaker 2: How do you mean you would want to go and
Speaker 2: kind of affect those communities in some way work with
Speaker 2: them perhaps.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, first of all, I am you know,
Speaker 3: we just talk about how I'm going to stop doing music,
Speaker 3: and you know, but you know, you know once once
Speaker 3: I'm mature, and since I'm mature, and I'm starting to
Speaker 3: understand that it's not just for me, you know, it's
Speaker 3: it's I'm here because of other people. And so with music,
Speaker 3: for example, I would I would like to be a
Speaker 3: festival in these places, you know, And I'm not talking
Speaker 3: about playing the most obvious music, No, I would want
Speaker 3: to either pick out guys from that same community and
Speaker 3: also bringing people I love. And that's if they want
Speaker 3: to do of course, but that's that's one of the
Speaker 3: things I want to do. The music of course, bring
Speaker 3: people together, but also you know I tried talking to
Speaker 3: the council a couple of months ago and they just
Speaker 3: poor SARTs on it.
Speaker 2: I mean.
Speaker 3: It is you know. I tried to to get you know,
Speaker 3: to get them pianos, as I had said, with my
Speaker 3: mercury money. But after talking to the council or whatever
Speaker 3: his name, the the guy the mayor was it.
Speaker 2: Council leader.
Speaker 3: Or the MP or whatever it is, Yeah, they just
Speaker 3: put me off, you know. So I just need to
Speaker 3: find a way of just doing it. I still have money.
Speaker 3: It's twenty quid, twenty k, twenty five k. Sorry, And
Speaker 3: I said, I'm you know as as I said too
Speaker 3: that I am out of my words. And you always
Speaker 3: dreaming about that, you know, I dreamt about it for years.
Speaker 3: But they want to get involved, these guys before their
Speaker 3: own earned benefits. You know. He said something like, and
Speaker 3: let's do it so that this mail or this count,
Speaker 3: this this man will wor will be you will set
Speaker 3: a legacy or something or today I don't care about
Speaker 3: you know what you what you want to set for yourself.
Speaker 3: What I want to do is to help, is to
Speaker 3: give to the place where I am from. And you know,
Speaker 3: so he put me off a little bit, but it
Speaker 3: would still go on, just having the time until but
Speaker 3: I would just rather just because they've got to grant
Speaker 3: me permission to put piano and library because the plan
Speaker 3: the libraries is a public library, you see. So these
Speaker 3: things are now hard when you're not on the same
Speaker 3: side with with the powers of of of the of
Speaker 3: of of the community. But you know, I'll find a
Speaker 3: way and and then let's start. That would be the
Speaker 3: starting point, you know, that giving pianos, putting pianos in
Speaker 3: in schools and in in libraries or set it off
Speaker 3: and eventually you know, of course I wanted to tackle
Speaker 3: things like not tackle, but bringing to the light things,
Speaker 3: especially the arts, because the arts is poor. It's really poor.
Speaker 3: It's very poor compared to French arts and culture. Personally,
Speaker 3: I think it's poor. There's no appreciation for contemporary art.
Speaker 3: There's no appreciation for young people expressing themselves in a
Speaker 3: different way. People get laughed at, you know, the people
Speaker 3: get laughed at for doing things differently, expressing themselves differently
Speaker 3: in England, and it's terrible and I don't personally investment
Speaker 3: giving put into arts. It's mostly put into arts of
Speaker 3: Casto's and you know, and it's it's a waste of
Speaker 3: money because that that that painting is fifty million pounds,
Speaker 3: so it's making his money anyway. You know. That's what
Speaker 3: I'm really upset about concerning the arts and in as
Speaker 3: kandom that I don't ignited Kingdom because I haven't haven't
Speaker 3: been everywhere in me you know, it's it's it's put
Speaker 3: me off London a little bit. You know, who cares
Speaker 3: about uh uh a garden bridge, you know, or who cares?
Speaker 3: I mean, there's there's going back into the community. I'm
Speaker 3: yet to see any you know, any kid coming out
Speaker 3: of the block or whatever painting uh a Renaisance painting
Speaker 3: or you know, or even a contemporary but you know,
Speaker 3: as you know, it doesn't as contemporary as a as
Speaker 3: Michelle John Michelle Bascat's paintings. You know, it's terrible, it's
Speaker 3: too terrible. And then and then for me personally, I
Speaker 3: don't really care about education and education and you know,
Speaker 3: books and eventually you grow up and you learn, of
Speaker 3: course still to have a education, but you know, and
Speaker 3: when you learn, you start reading books. You start reading.
Speaker 3: Now what's called books that you like and you start
Speaker 3: discovering books you know, and and so and so forth.
Speaker 3: But there are you know, is an expression that we
Speaker 3: all have, Yeah, and we express it through you know,
Speaker 3: different mediums, and and it's yeah, sorry, it sounds like
Speaker 3: I'm complaining. I think.
Speaker 2: I think. I think it's interesting because I've just come
Speaker 2: back from France and I think that.
Speaker 3: You're right.
Speaker 2: You can walk around a small village and there'll be
Speaker 2: an encouragement around putting on small art exhibitions or just
Speaker 2: the infrastructure of the ways of sort of doing those things.
Speaker 2: And it's not necessarily about education in the UK because
Speaker 2: the school curriculum when it came to music when I
Speaker 2: remember it wasn't the kind of thing that would encourage
Speaker 2: somebody to go into music. But perhaps it's just what
Speaker 2: I think what you're talking about, or my kind of
Speaker 2: understanding what you're talking about, is the ability to build
Speaker 2: for people to explore that kind of kind of creative
Speaker 2: inquisitiveness at an early age, to be able to if
Speaker 2: that piano is in the library, in that public space,
Speaker 2: in that classroom, in that corridor, or whatever it is,
Speaker 2: to just try and see if that's something.
Speaker 3: Because I I had to have the privilege and I
Speaker 3: like you to have the privilege that I you know,
Speaker 3: I had a piano in my house.
Speaker 2: You know, this is this is.
Speaker 3: A lot of kids don't don't don't have that. They
Speaker 3: don't the music and listen to I don't know. You know,
Speaker 3: if you if you don't play piano, piano or an instrument,
Speaker 3: you don't listen to how the instrument is played, so
Speaker 3: you never you never look for you know, you never
Speaker 3: search for. You know, it's a bit you know, couteeling.
Speaker 3: You can never fall in love and never be a woman.
Speaker 3: You never know how it is to be a woman
Speaker 3: or how it is to be love or whatever. So
Speaker 3: so you know, because they don't have that instrument, when
Speaker 3: they listen to music, they just listen to any any
Speaker 3: you know. It's you know, they have no clue. You've
Speaker 3: got to give. You have to give a child an option.
Speaker 3: You have to, you know, tell them, let them know
Speaker 3: what they things that are there, so that they'll do
Speaker 3: things that are not at least, but it's you know,
Speaker 3: again going back to if I hadn't left to to France,
Speaker 3: I wouldn't have known that what's called exposure is vital
Speaker 3: and and if you're going to expose things that are
Speaker 3: nonsense to kids, at least exposed things that I was meaningful.
Speaker 3: Said that it's a bad That's all I'm saying.
Speaker 2: You mentioned that you the night that you won the
Speaker 2: Mercury Prize. I was there in the room. You said
Speaker 2: that you're going to use the money for that purpose,
Speaker 2: and you haven't actually had the opportunity to do that,
Speaker 2: and it's still set in a bank account somewhere. Apart
Speaker 2: from that that we just discussed, what are your reflections
Speaker 2: on that night? Do you think about it often?
Speaker 3: I've actually broken my Mercury Prize. I've broken it fell
Speaker 3: so then the top has come off. Yeah, the ball
Speaker 3: it's it's but it makes it quite special because it
Speaker 3: looks like different from all the other Mercury Prizes, So
Speaker 3: it's a special thing.
Speaker 2: Did it full off the mental piece? It did?
Speaker 3: Because we're moving. It was a great night. There's one
Speaker 3: that I live at. Let you know, I never thought
Speaker 3: it possible, but I thought that even if I win,
Speaker 3: it won't be just for me. I made my mind
Speaker 3: that whatever happened that day, it will be for the
Speaker 3: purpose of music and people coming together and celebrating their expressions.
Speaker 3: So I was very, very moved through through through the
Speaker 3: whole thing, the whole program, because it goes all the
Speaker 3: way to even the person that made the America prior
Speaker 3: to the year the award, you know, and imagine the
Speaker 3: time they took and it's a it's all arts and
Speaker 3: you know, and obviously Lauren Verne, beautiful lada in Laverne
Speaker 3: and all the but but by the way, I started
Speaker 3: having clues. One, I've realized that Lauren wasn't talking about
Speaker 3: me too much. She mentioned my name talking about everybody else.
Speaker 3: Is that all right? Okay, well, maybe she'll talked about
Speaker 3: talk about me on the bigger occasion. And then and
Speaker 3: then she asked me to play one of my songs.
Speaker 3: When I went on stage and I played, she didn't
Speaker 3: say anything about it. When is sat down, maybe I'm
Speaker 3: just there, what's good?
Speaker 2: Looking back, you can see the signal.
Speaker 3: And also I was sitting right at the very edge
Speaker 3: of the seat, which at the back of the chat
Speaker 3: all the judges, including you, as I suppose, yes, that's right, yes,
Speaker 3: that yeah, and the camera was right in front of me.
Speaker 3: So so you know, I didn't recognize all of this
Speaker 3: until I so I came back. I went back home
Speaker 3: after some months, then thought about it again and then
Speaker 3: none of but you know, I was, you know, I
Speaker 3: was blown away, but I was only you know, drafting.
Speaker 3: You know, I was a good happy for what had happened.
Speaker 3: But I only thought about it, you know, after some
Speaker 3: few months about that, those littleal clues. I haven't said that. However,
Speaker 3: it was a very emotional night a week before that
Speaker 3: I was the Parst terrorist attack. I was, I was,
Speaker 3: I was torn.
Speaker 2: And and.
Speaker 3: I needed some sort of hope. I needed some some
Speaker 3: some sort of I I you know, of course I
Speaker 3: am stronger, but music needed my music, you know, I
Speaker 3: think it just needed that sort of I feel that
Speaker 3: it was meant to be, and so when when when
Speaker 3: I want it. I just felt that it was appropriate
Speaker 3: that I brought everyone on the stage too, to somehow
Speaker 3: stand in front of death and go, well we won,
Speaker 3: you know, or trauma or or fear, and say that
Speaker 3: you know, whatever happens, now know that we always win.
Speaker 3: So it was it was a very very What's called
Speaker 3: a business is the time I never forget It's not
Speaker 3: it's the Americay Prize is smaller than the occasion, you know,
Speaker 3: because you can never bring it back. The prize is here,
Speaker 3: you know, but that moment made by the program and
Speaker 3: then that you know, the occasion, it's it's a bigger award.
Speaker 3: It's much of a bigger award for me. Me the
Speaker 3: award was standing on the stage with those people, those
Speaker 3: artists that can out television or you know, thinking you know,
Speaker 3: you can't we see a lot of people. Apparently there's
Speaker 3: a lot of people watching. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a really meaningful moment because I don't
Speaker 2: think that's been done in Mercury history before with an artist.
Speaker 2: He's one has basically invited the other nominees to eleven
Speaker 2: other nominees I think, up onto the stage to effectively
Speaker 2: kind of received the prize along with you, to celebrate
Speaker 2: that moment. And you're right, in the context of what
Speaker 2: happened the week before in Paris, it did feel like
Speaker 2: very emotional occasion. Clearly what happened in Paris was still
Speaker 2: a very painful thing. Still is when was the first
Speaker 2: time after winning the award that you returned to Paris
Speaker 2: and kind of felt the atmosphe in the city and
Speaker 2: what was that like? I mean, I should probably explain
Speaker 2: as well that Obviously you were born in London, but
Speaker 2: you spent three years or so in Paris more than that,
Speaker 2: and then you spent time in New York recently. But
Speaker 2: Paris is still a city that I assume means a
Speaker 2: great deal to you. So, yeah, that experience of going
Speaker 2: back to Paris after winning the prize to kind of
Speaker 2: witness how that city was in the aftermath, how was
Speaker 2: that experience?
Speaker 3: Well, funny you just asked that question if you knew
Speaker 3: what I was about to say next, And that was
Speaker 3: that before winning the Mercurys. The week before that, I
Speaker 3: was in Paris. I was living in the brothel, but
Speaker 3: a very very it's basically it was. It was not brothel,
Speaker 3: but it was. It was a hostel. I chose to live.
Speaker 3: It's a hostel. And you know, every night it was
Speaker 3: you know, someone screaming or you know, yeah, having sex.
Speaker 3: And the room was about the little work bigger than
Speaker 3: this room you were in.
Speaker 2: I should say that, Yeah, it's what kind of six
Speaker 2: meets by six meters something like that. And and.
Speaker 3: I was I was, you know, at my computer, and
Speaker 3: I was composing my keyboard, my little keyboard. I came here,
Speaker 3: came out to England for the occasion, I didn't think
Speaker 3: I win. Of course I wanted. The next day, I
Speaker 3: went back to the room. The room that's a little
Speaker 3: worm was called what's it called a wardrobe like wall?
Speaker 3: You know those small things you can put like glass
Speaker 3: or whatever, and now like a sideboard type thing. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: on the wall. I took them, I took the prize
Speaker 3: and I just put it right there. I led them bed,
Speaker 3: looked out through the window and I just thought to myself,
Speaker 3: this is life. You know, this is life. You know,
Speaker 3: you can't force it, you know, it just happens, you know,
Speaker 3: and of course unfortunate. But these these are the things
Speaker 3: that they make me not only appreciate life, but also
Speaker 3: I think they make me more humble. After winning the
Speaker 3: Mercury Prizes, went back to Paris and they laid down,
Speaker 3: and I just appreciated, appreciated life anymore. And at that
Speaker 3: time I still didn't have I didn't have a house
Speaker 3: that time. You know, it's wondering, you know I And
Speaker 3: you know, personally, I like I like doing that, you know,
Speaker 3: I like staying in cheap pastels. And so you get
Speaker 3: to meet those people, and you get to meet foreigners,
Speaker 3: and you get to meet, you know, different people you
Speaker 3: know who are also coming to stroll. And that's what
Speaker 3: that's what life means to me, you know, meeting people
Speaker 3: and even if you don't talk to them, you see them,
Speaker 3: you know, and you observe them. That's talking to them too.
Speaker 3: That's that's the way. There's a way of expression I
Speaker 3: think of an expression.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you spent time over the years, obviously London,
Speaker 2: Paris that we just talked about. Twenty sixteen, you went
Speaker 2: to New York and had some time there. How how
Speaker 2: long were you in New York.
Speaker 3: For I was in New York about a year a bit,
Speaker 3: but I was going backwards and forts I was traveling
Speaker 3: mostly around America. It's just because I was touring. I
Speaker 3: was touring in Europe. Got tired of Europe touring my
Speaker 3: album which obviously it came out to you ven fifteen,
Speaker 3: but I had performed it for almost three years before,
Speaker 3: you know, so I was living there, going around, you know.
Speaker 3: Eventually I in London in New York that was the
Speaker 3: last show. So it's sad to stay there.
Speaker 2: And right, what were your impressions when you arrived in
Speaker 2: New York and what were your impressions when you left
Speaker 2: New York feel different.
Speaker 3: Well, it's certainly shorter too to leave New York to London,
Speaker 3: and it is to going to New York shorter. So
Speaker 3: that's a good thing. Because I hate flights. Not a
Speaker 3: good flyer, well I am these days, I'm pretending not to,
Speaker 3: but I I hated Yeah, but but okay, for me,
Speaker 3: New York is like Paris, but contemporary one where things
Speaker 3: are built to the most grigormous or what's a good
Speaker 3: uh form, just for the sake of impression. I lived
Speaker 3: at a place called Lafayette House, which is off Bowery
Speaker 3: and Greenwich Villages. There's like what seven minutes from Granich Village,
Speaker 3: so it's and you know, the place I lived was
Speaker 3: also you know, the person who luckily again fortunately fortunately
Speaker 3: I met some really nice people who happened to be artists.
Speaker 3: One of them was the girlfriend of Jean Michael Basquat,
Speaker 3: and her brother owned a place I was living. So
Speaker 3: you know, it wasn't I still wasn't. Really I've heard
Speaker 3: to say it, but it wasn't like I'd gone to Mars,
Speaker 3: you know, because every day I was talk about arts
Speaker 3: and and I saw my friend Julian as well, who
Speaker 3: was a great artist for me. He lives he lives
Speaker 3: in Greenwich Village. But the people, I would say, the
Speaker 3: American people, if if you're talking about America, obviously people
Speaker 3: say that depends on where you go. I beg to differ.
Speaker 3: I think the Americans are the same for me. They've
Speaker 3: talked differently of course different places, but I think they've
Speaker 3: got the same heart. They're really nice people, and I
Speaker 3: think they get offended when they are told they're not
Speaker 3: nice people. I suppose, like everybody I personally, I didn't
Speaker 3: see any fault. I didn't didn't encounter any problems of anyone, nothing,
Speaker 3: Nothing happened that made me think that Americans are what
Speaker 3: we protect them, you know, to be in Europe. In Europe,
Speaker 3: we think because I ignorant and half of them don't
Speaker 3: even have passport, which is might be true because America
Speaker 3: is a beautiful place. Some people wouldn't want to go
Speaker 3: anywhere else. But for me, you know, of course, no
Speaker 3: one should tolerate, tolerate, you know, anyone killing somebody or
Speaker 3: and that's that's a different issue, you know, that's that's
Speaker 3: I'm I'm just talking from my story and my experiences.
Speaker 3: I find them really very funny, very peaceful human beings.
Speaker 3: I'd say, who love they love nature, They really love nature.
Speaker 3: I totally appreciate my time. There was one that was
Speaker 3: very sad one, but it also made me learn a lot.
Speaker 3: And I got that. I got my visa. I've been
Speaker 3: telling the other people about this visa. It's an one visa,
Speaker 3: but it's the reason why you're in America. And so
Speaker 3: you're in America because you've got an ability. That's the
Speaker 3: reason why in America in America because they like, they
Speaker 3: love you. You're there because you've got an ability, and
Speaker 3: that you're going to make them some money. And then
Speaker 3: afterwards you're going to was off. You're gonna go back
Speaker 3: to your your poor, your poor home somewhere around the world,
Speaker 3: and and not not not to have a return. And
Speaker 3: if you're going to return, you might also proved that
Speaker 3: you're going to make them a lot of money. You're
Speaker 3: gonna get them some You're gonna show them your ability.
Speaker 3: So it's aordin alien of extraordinarability of gisther. And that's
Speaker 3: that's what I received. And it made me laugh and angry, sad,
Speaker 3: and I thought that I'll just take the positives you
Speaker 3: know and just write something. That's what really triggered the
Speaker 3: whole thing, really triggered the second album. So going to
Speaker 3: America I certainly felt like an alien, put in a
Speaker 3: good way. You know, no one recognize me, or they
Speaker 3: only recognize me because of my hair, but it was
Speaker 3: it was a nice experience.
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