1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 1: Hi, everyone, Sophia Bush here. Welcome to Work in Progress, 2 00:00:05,440 --> 00:00:08,280 Speaker 1: where I talked to people who inspire me about how 3 00:00:08,320 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: they got to where they are and where they think 4 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:25,480 Speaker 1: they're still going. Today's guest is Ogi Abuna. She is 5 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 1: a filmmaker focused on disruptive and inspirational storytelling, and her 6 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:36,000 Speaker 1: incredible documentary, Invisible Portraits is now out on demand. We'll 7 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 1: put a link to it in the episode description and 8 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:43,880 Speaker 1: on Instagram. This film, you guys. It is a powerful, 9 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:49,440 Speaker 1: beautiful celebration of black women and their history and features 10 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 1: interviews from scholars and authors sharing their stories. I was 11 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: lucky enough to get to see it early before we 12 00:00:57,120 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: did our interview, and I just loved talking to Ogie 13 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 1: about the film, how her own experiences shaped it, what 14 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 1: she learned that she didn't know about her own culture, 15 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:12,119 Speaker 1: how she got to this point making her own film, 16 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: and more. Enjoy. Thank you so so much for joining 17 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 1: me today. I'm just I'm honestly like I'm geeking out 18 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:28,039 Speaker 1: a little bit because when I first saw the trailer 19 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:31,320 Speaker 1: for your film, one of our former Work in Progress guests, 20 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:35,480 Speaker 1: Dr Molina Abdela, is in the in the movie, and 21 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:40,759 Speaker 1: all of these beautiful, just bold incredible women who you 22 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 1: collected to tell their stories, and it's all happening now. 23 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 1: It's it's so eerily timely. And I think the reality 24 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 1: is that it's always been timely to tell these stories. 25 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: But something's happened in the in the shift of this 26 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: greater kind of social aware this and and I'm just 27 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 1: I'm so excited to talk to you about your movie 28 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:11,240 Speaker 1: and where the idea came from and how you got here. Yeah, 29 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 1: I mean, my life in the in the sense of 30 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 1: this has been quite unconventional. If if I'm to talk, 31 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:20,160 Speaker 1: if I'm gonna tell you how I got into the industry. UM. 32 00:02:20,200 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: I moved to l A eight years ago, UM through 33 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: a retail job that I ended up quitting because I, 34 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:29,240 Speaker 1: for me understood that my morals and values didn't the 35 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: line with that company. UM. And I was introduced about 36 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: a month later into yoga UM more particularly restorative yoga, 37 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 1: and I fell in love with it, and I was like, 38 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:42,679 Speaker 1: I want to teach this, like this is how MYNA 39 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: help heal the world. UM. And so I went into 40 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: a teacher training for a year and learned UM how 41 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:51,079 Speaker 1: to teach resort of yoga. And so I started teaching 42 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 1: it throughout l A and I started working at this 43 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:58,360 Speaker 1: one particular gym that introduced me to a private client, 44 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:00,920 Speaker 1: and that private client at the time was this guy 45 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:04,079 Speaker 1: named Jet doherty Um. And I didn't know who Jet 46 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 1: was because I only had a first name basis with 47 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 1: my clients at the time. And I would say it's 48 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 1: about like a month and a half and maybe two 49 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 1: months in, you know, Jet looked at me at the 50 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:14,639 Speaker 1: one session and was like, have you ever thought about 51 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 1: working in film and music? And in my head, I 52 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: was like no, Like I don't even know a TV 53 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: like not interested at all, And like the first thing 54 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:23,320 Speaker 1: that goes in my mind is like, oh, this is 55 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 1: that casting couch thing people talked about, Like he must 56 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 1: think I'm like an expiring actress and that he's gonna, like, 57 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:31,080 Speaker 1: you know, like convince me to like do whatever. And 58 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,239 Speaker 1: I was like, I'm not interested, and I know, and 59 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: you know, a few sessions happened after that, and at 60 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 1: every session, you know, Jet would just be like, you know, 61 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 1: like I think you we have the same taste of music, 62 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 1: Like let's that's like exchange music ideas, and you know, 63 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: like I just feel like you will be really good 64 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: in film and music, like there's just something nice seeing 65 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 1: you and so like, after a few sessions and really 66 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 1: getting to know him more, I realized like, oh, he's 67 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 1: not a creep um, that he actually sees something in me, 68 00:03:57,160 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 1: like so like maybe I should explore it. And so 69 00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:01,200 Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, tell me more about who you 70 00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:04,360 Speaker 1: are and what you do. And so he started to 71 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 1: explain to me that you know him and the actor 72 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: Colin Firth formed rain Dog Films six months prior um 73 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: and that he was in l A looking for a 74 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 1: director for a film they were trying to get greenlit. 75 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 1: And I didn't know who Colin Firth was at the 76 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: time because I just I wasn't into film like that. 77 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:21,640 Speaker 1: And so he was like, um, have you seen King's Speech? 78 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 1: And I was like no. He was like watch that, 79 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:28,280 Speaker 1: like that's my producing partner. And so I watched the 80 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 1: film and I saw him again for a session a 81 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 1: week later, and I was like, oh, like, that guy's 82 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 1: a really good actor. Was a great film, and so 83 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 1: he was like, that's my producing partner. And so I think, 84 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:39,320 Speaker 1: I don't know what it is, but there's something that 85 00:04:39,360 --> 00:04:41,440 Speaker 1: I see in you that I think that if you 86 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:43,600 Speaker 1: come and work with us. We can help cultivate that 87 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:46,479 Speaker 1: and we can teach you everything we know, although you know, 88 00:04:46,600 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 1: he was like, I'm gonna be very honest, like I 89 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 1: come from the music industry. He used to be the 90 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:53,600 Speaker 1: CEO of Sony Music in the UK and Colin was 91 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 1: an actor, so producing was both new for both of them, 92 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:00,200 Speaker 1: and so um En was like, you know, will be 93 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 1: learning with us, and so um through like meditation and 94 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 1: you know, consultation with my friends and family. I said 95 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,280 Speaker 1: yes to the call, and I was like, I'll try 96 00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:11,240 Speaker 1: it for three months. If I don't like it, I'll quit. 97 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: And Jet was like all right, absolutely, and so um 98 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 1: I end up moving to London um to work with 99 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,679 Speaker 1: Jet and Colin for rain Dog, and you know, within 100 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:22,919 Speaker 1: the first month there, we got green light for I 101 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: Am This Guy, and I moved to South Africa for 102 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,240 Speaker 1: four months while we filmed that, and then a year 103 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 1: later we got green light for Loving. Moved to Virginia 104 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:33,839 Speaker 1: while we filmed that, and you know, I was with 105 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 1: rain Dog for about three and a half years and 106 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 1: then I parted ways with them and I moved back 107 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: to l A and I went through like this phase 108 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:45,040 Speaker 1: of like deep depressions. I couldn't figure out like had 109 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: I made the right choice? Like why did I? Like 110 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 1: why did not work out? Like like what is what 111 00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: am I doing next? And I didn't know. Um. And 112 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 1: in the midst of that, I received the text from 113 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 1: this woman, um, Christie Campo, UM that I had met 114 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:01,039 Speaker 1: an event like a few months prior, and she was 115 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,119 Speaker 1: just like, you know, I'm at lunch with a friend 116 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: really random and I just met you, but he has 117 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,600 Speaker 1: this idea and I thought about you and would you 118 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: be willing to meet him tomorrow? Um? And I was 119 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:13,719 Speaker 1: like all right, So I meet up with this guy 120 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:15,600 Speaker 1: at the Peninsula and I walk into the meeting and 121 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:18,159 Speaker 1: it's just, you know, middle aged white guy and I 122 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,239 Speaker 1: sit down and I'm like, you know, what's the vision, 123 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 1: Like what's your idea? And he goes you know, I 124 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: was watching this YouTube clip of Isaiah Thomas like being 125 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 1: inducted into the Hall of Fame, and you know, he's 126 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:32,840 Speaker 1: balding crying and he's like honoring his mother and I 127 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:36,800 Speaker 1: want to create something that celebrates black mothers. And I 128 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:40,760 Speaker 1: was like okay, Like but I was like I think, like, 129 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: if you're gonna do something like that, like you got 130 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 1: to create something that celebrate black women because they're black 131 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 1: women first. And he was like, you know, all right, 132 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 1: if you come back with a pitch, if I love 133 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:54,039 Speaker 1: it all fully funded. And I was like wait what, 134 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 1: And I'm like, you do know I've never directed before 135 00:06:56,720 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 1: in my life, so I can produce it, but I'm 136 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:01,840 Speaker 1: not a rector. And he was like, okay, let's make 137 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,039 Speaker 1: the pitch and we'll go from there. And so, oh 138 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,200 Speaker 1: my god. Yeah, So I go and make a pitch 139 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 1: and I pitch him this idea and he's like, all right, 140 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:12,920 Speaker 1: I love it, go make it. And I was like what. 141 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 1: And I remember that like when I left the meeting. 142 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: Immediately I went to Halle Berry's house. It was a 143 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 1: dear friend of mine and I was just talking to 144 00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:21,679 Speaker 1: her and I'm crying in her living in her kitchen. 145 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 1: I'm like, I can't do this, like I've never directed before, 146 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 1: Like I gotta say no, like this is too big 147 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 1: of a subject matter and like I can't. I don't 148 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 1: have the tools to do this, and like you know, 149 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:34,480 Speaker 1: she literally picks me up off the floor and she's 150 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:37,120 Speaker 1: like looking at me and she's like you gotta say yes. 151 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: She was like, what do you mean She's like, about 152 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,000 Speaker 1: to put the full force of my team behind you 153 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:43,160 Speaker 1: to make this, Like you're going to say yes to this? 154 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 1: She was like, so many men, is, particularly white men 155 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 1: in this town, get an opportunity without them knowing how 156 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: to do it, and they say yes to it. So 157 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 1: she was like, you're gonna say yes, like it's okay, 158 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: Like you can do it, afraid. And what strikes me 159 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: is that you'd already And this is always easy, right 160 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 1: from the vantage point of a person who is not 161 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 1: involved in something, like when you're in it and it 162 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 1: means everything to you and you you're trying to figure 163 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:11,560 Speaker 1: out how to make something monumental. You can't see the 164 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:14,480 Speaker 1: forest for the trees, right And from the outside, I'm like, 165 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 1: you were already directing. He gave you an idea and 166 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 1: then you told him what the idea really needed to be, 167 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 1: to be authentic and to be and to really go deeper. 168 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 1: And I'm like, you are already doing it, you know, 169 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: but I'm sure in the moment it I can't imagine 170 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 1: how crazy that must have felt to have a person 171 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:34,679 Speaker 1: just say, oh, that enormous idea that you have, why 172 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 1: don't you make it? Yeah? That was like yeah. It 173 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:43,319 Speaker 1: baffled me for days because I'm like, wait what, because then, 174 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 1: like like you said, like when you're in the thick 175 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 1: of it, you don't see that you're already doing it, 176 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:50,640 Speaker 1: and every doubt and fear is starting to creep up, 177 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:53,960 Speaker 1: right because you're like, I can't fail this, like this 178 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:56,360 Speaker 1: is too much, and you know, like I want to 179 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: do it justice that black got a research and I 180 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: gotta learn, and like every fear that known and unknown 181 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 1: that could possibly come up for me came up in 182 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:05,600 Speaker 1: that moment. And then you know, for someone to be 183 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:07,959 Speaker 1: like yeah, they'll make it awfully funded, You're like wait 184 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:16,439 Speaker 1: what because then for that right, like never happens never. Yeah, wow, Okay, 185 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 1: So I want to get into that stuff, into how 186 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:23,640 Speaker 1: you decide when one of your dear friends looks at 187 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 1: you and says you can do this, like I'll throw 188 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 1: my weight behind you, but I see you. But I 189 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:33,199 Speaker 1: want to rewind first, because I love to go back 190 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:37,640 Speaker 1: with people and and get to know their story and 191 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 1: how it begins. I always, I always find that really 192 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 1: going back helps us make so much more sense of 193 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: the present, at least for me, as I learned about 194 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:51,680 Speaker 1: where people's kind of motivation and leadership and and tenacity 195 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 1: comes from. So before we get into how the film 196 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 1: came to be, although like what a preview that somebody said, 197 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:02,520 Speaker 1: go me get I want to go back and get 198 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:06,080 Speaker 1: to know you and your story. So Um, as we 199 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: talked about for a moment before we started our interview, 200 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 1: your family is Nigeria. Did your parents move here from Nigeria? Yeah, 201 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,200 Speaker 1: so me and my brother our first generation. I am 202 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: on my dad's side too. So I I love hearing 203 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:24,200 Speaker 1: about like when people's families came here and where they 204 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,720 Speaker 1: went and what it sort of felt like to to 205 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:31,200 Speaker 1: you know, shake out, like the pursuit of the American dreams. 206 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:34,559 Speaker 1: So when when your family came here? Did they first 207 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 1: go to Houston or were they somewhere before you were 208 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: raised there? No, they first came to Houston. So my 209 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 1: father at the time was already in Houston, and he 210 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:47,199 Speaker 1: had met my mother, um in boarding in secondary school, 211 00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 1: which is like college in Nigeria. His sister was her roommate. UM, 212 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:55,200 Speaker 1: And so he met her that way, UM, and they 213 00:10:55,280 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 1: you know, like they you know, he pursued her and 214 00:10:57,240 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 1: like they dated and they you know, fell in love 215 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:02,319 Speaker 1: and got married. UM. And then he came to Houston 216 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:05,480 Speaker 1: for work, and then her family and his family, UM 217 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:09,120 Speaker 1: wanted to surprise him and send her down to meet him. UM, 218 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:10,559 Speaker 1: but it doesn't in in the faery sales, so it's 219 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 1: not a good story. Yeah, yeah, you know, UM. And 220 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 1: so you know, she surprises him and comes down and 221 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:22,120 Speaker 1: she's at she gets to the airport and she calls 222 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:24,600 Speaker 1: him and like she's stuck there for hours. He's like 223 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 1: not asking the phone, not picking up, and you know, 224 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:29,680 Speaker 1: she doesn't really speak English, so like the people at 225 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 1: the airport are trying to like help her connect to 226 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:34,839 Speaker 1: whoever she's trying to connect to. And when they finally 227 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: connected him hours later, he shows up and he's yelling 228 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 1: at her and he's like literally going off so much 229 00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: so that he gets physically abusive. UM. And you know, 230 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 1: she she stayed married to him for about four years 231 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:52,880 Speaker 1: and during that time, like it was probably one of 232 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 1: the probably the worst four years of her life. Like, 233 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,440 Speaker 1: you know, like he was very physically abusive. He would 234 00:11:57,480 --> 00:12:00,640 Speaker 1: beat her, UM, throw her downstairs, and you know, she 235 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,960 Speaker 1: would write letters to her family to try to be 236 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 1: like Okay, someone helped me, this is what's going on. 237 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:07,840 Speaker 1: And she would put him in the mailbox, and after 238 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:09,520 Speaker 1: a few months she was like, why is my family 239 00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 1: not responding to me? Like, you know, like it hurt 240 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 1: her even more that she felt abandoned by them, and 241 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:16,160 Speaker 1: I guess you just like let it go, like, okay, 242 00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:18,200 Speaker 1: they're not responding, like maybe they don't believe me or 243 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:20,839 Speaker 1: whatever the case may be. Come to find out a 244 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 1: year later, she's like in the house looking for something 245 00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 1: and a box falls from like a closet and he 246 00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:29,040 Speaker 1: had tooken every note that she put in the mailbox 247 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:31,600 Speaker 1: to be mailed to her family and hit it and 248 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:33,920 Speaker 1: so you know, it was just things like that, you know. 249 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:37,400 Speaker 1: And it wasn't until she had me that she realized 250 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:39,400 Speaker 1: that she couldn't do it anymore. But it's not even 251 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 1: as she realized it, Like while she was having me 252 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 1: and I was in the hospitals, I had complications at birth. 253 00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:47,319 Speaker 1: Um he had tooken everything. So when we left the 254 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 1: hospital to go home, all that was there was like 255 00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:52,559 Speaker 1: a spring and the job coins that she had collected, 256 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: like he had took in everything in love, and so 257 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,319 Speaker 1: you know, it was it was difficult for a while, 258 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 1: like we lived like that in that um. But no electricity, 259 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: no nothing until the neighbors found us there like they 260 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: thought we had all moved and then when they was 261 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:09,960 Speaker 1: realized that we were living in such provish in provished 262 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 1: like such a condition. You know, we we lived with 263 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:15,160 Speaker 1: people like you know, people that she had met had 264 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 1: took it, taken us in. You know, she you know, 265 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 1: figured it out, um, but you know it was it 266 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:26,280 Speaker 1: was challenging growing up. Mm hmm. I can't imagine what 267 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 1: that experience must have been like for her to come 268 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:33,800 Speaker 1: to a place where she didn't have anyone and and 269 00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 1: didn't have first even the language to try to find 270 00:13:39,559 --> 00:13:42,720 Speaker 1: some sort of support system when you have no community. 271 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 1: It's it's so incredibly isolating and really a testament to 272 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 1: some of what is highlighted in the film, the the 273 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 1: resilience of black women, and and to your point of 274 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 1: how the movie began in concept at least what mothers 275 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 1: do for their children. Yeah, how how did things begin 276 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: to change for you both in your young life? How 277 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: did you and your mom begin to get back onto 278 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: more stable footing And were you in a position where 279 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:26,200 Speaker 1: you felt like you were really trying Because I know 280 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: this is a struggle for so many families who come 281 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: from places where the adaptation of language is difficult, like 282 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 1: from my grandmother and her family coming here from Italy, 283 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:41,040 Speaker 1: Like my great grandmother didn't speak any English, and I 284 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:44,640 Speaker 1: always grew up hearing stories of how tricky that that was. 285 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 1: And I wonder when did that begin to change? Were 286 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 1: was your mom struggling so much to get back on 287 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:54,760 Speaker 1: top of things and kind of assimilate or was she 288 00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: able to hold onto aspects of Nigerian culture and language 289 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 1: for you was as a family? Um? I think like 290 00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: she she tried, I think as much she can to 291 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 1: try to assimilate, right, but like she you know, you know, 292 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 1: she had to figure out the language. She had to 293 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: figure out how to find a job, and she had 294 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:17,560 Speaker 1: to figure out how to provide for me and my 295 00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 1: brother at a time where like she was also trying 296 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:23,840 Speaker 1: to figure herself out, um, And so you know, it 297 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 1: was difficult. She worked multiple jobs, like you know, and 298 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: I grew up resenting my mom for not being president, um, 299 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: because I didn't understand why she could not be as 300 00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:37,400 Speaker 1: president as other kids mothers. Like why I felt like 301 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: I had to start working, you know, in babysitting and 302 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:41,800 Speaker 1: working jobs at such a very young age. At like 303 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:45,320 Speaker 1: thirteen and fourteen and not being allowed the privilege to 304 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:48,080 Speaker 1: have a childhood per se. Um, So I grew up 305 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 1: very resentful, um towards her. That now like through like 306 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:54,240 Speaker 1: you know, the work of like therapy and things like that. 307 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 1: And just as an adult, I understand it now better. 308 00:15:57,080 --> 00:15:59,640 Speaker 1: I understand why she wasn't present because she had to 309 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 1: work ultiple jobs, you know, and even in the raising 310 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:04,600 Speaker 1: of me and my brother and trying to figure out 311 00:16:04,680 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 1: how does she do that, um, and makings meet. She 312 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 1: then adopted my cousin who became my brother because his family, 313 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 1: his father got deported back to Nigeria, and so like 314 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 1: she took on another child, like barely taking care of 315 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 1: the twoth that she had. And so, you know, as 316 00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 1: an adult now I see it now, I see it differently, 317 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:25,800 Speaker 1: and I and I realized it differently. But in those moments, um, 318 00:16:25,840 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 1: as a kid, it was it was very very difficult 319 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 1: because I wanted her around more and she just she 320 00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 1: wasn't She wasn't there, Um, she couldn't be. Yeah. Yeah, 321 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:39,400 Speaker 1: the the sort of experience that so many single moms 322 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 1: don't get to have. Do you think that looking back, 323 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 1: Like when you talk about the things you're able to 324 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 1: process as an adult, understanding her her perspective from this 325 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:55,280 Speaker 1: vantage point being able to go to therapy and kind 326 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 1: of unpack childhood, which you know, all of my listeners 327 00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:00,760 Speaker 1: are like, oh my god, I Peter talks about her 328 00:17:00,760 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 1: therapist for more time. But I'm telling you, I'm just like, 329 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:07,119 Speaker 1: therapy is where it's at. Like are there things that 330 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:10,439 Speaker 1: you can look at now and and draw a line 331 00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:13,320 Speaker 1: between you know, in your adulthood to your childhood, like 332 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:18,160 Speaker 1: lessons that your mom taught you work ethic or prioritization 333 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,840 Speaker 1: of family, like having adopted your cousin? Do do you 334 00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:26,120 Speaker 1: see those through lines differently now? I definitely see those 335 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:28,480 Speaker 1: three lines differently now, But it's also you know, I'm 336 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:31,040 Speaker 1: still working through it right, Like so like there's also 337 00:17:31,280 --> 00:17:34,359 Speaker 1: this dynamic of culture, right and the way that she 338 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: perceives life versus the way that I perceive it from 339 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,119 Speaker 1: a cultural standpoint. For example, like when I shaved my 340 00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 1: head seven years ago, like she was living and she 341 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:46,879 Speaker 1: didn't speak to me for months because in the Nigerian culture, 342 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:48,560 Speaker 1: like she would always say like a woman's hair is 343 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: her glory, So she couldn't understand why I shaved my head. 344 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:54,480 Speaker 1: Like her first question was that are you on drugs, 345 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 1: like like what do you like? What do you And 346 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:57,879 Speaker 1: I was like what because I because I shaved my 347 00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 1: head like it was it's just different dynamics like that 348 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 1: and like understanding that, UM. And she's very much so 349 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 1: conventional in the sense of like, you know, this is 350 00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:09,119 Speaker 1: how I was raised, to the rules that I follow, 351 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,200 Speaker 1: and this is what you do, and I'm very unconventional. Um. 352 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:15,199 Speaker 1: I questioned everything, you know, like I I don't. I 353 00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 1: don't believe in social constructs like I know the person 354 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: I know they exist, but I'm also I also questioned them. UM. 355 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 1: And so we would get into it a lot because 356 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:26,560 Speaker 1: of that because I don't just do what I'm told, 357 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:30,400 Speaker 1: like I questioned everything, and she couldn't understand that. UM. 358 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 1: Even so much so when I moved to l A 359 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 1: from Houston. You know, we didn't speak for months because 360 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:38,200 Speaker 1: she felt that I was abandoned the family and I 361 00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 1: was like no, like I'm just growing up, like I'm 362 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:44,359 Speaker 1: I'm stepping into adulthood like things like this happened, and 363 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 1: she couldn't wrap her mind around why would I want 364 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 1: to leave? So you know, once again, like you know 365 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 1: therapy has helped to give me this platform and this 366 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,879 Speaker 1: understanding in the language to be able to communicate what 367 00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 1: I've been feeling, because prior to that, like I just 368 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:01,439 Speaker 1: will hold everything in and out with stone wall, you know, 369 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 1: versus now like with therapy, it's it's given me the 370 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:07,800 Speaker 1: tools and resources to be able to communicate um but 371 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:11,000 Speaker 1: also to just hold space for the complexities of a 372 00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:15,760 Speaker 1: mother daughter relationship. Right. Yeah. One of the ways that 373 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: I've come to kind of think about my experiences and 374 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 1: and the way you just talked about it made me go, oh, yeah, 375 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 1: that that feels. The way I've come to feel about 376 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 1: it is years ago I started talking with my therapist 377 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:33,199 Speaker 1: about how therapy gives you a toolkit. And if you 378 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:36,240 Speaker 1: think about like a carpenter's belt, like a lot of 379 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:39,760 Speaker 1: people maybe have a hammer, And the more tools you're 380 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:42,840 Speaker 1: able to put in your tool kit, the more complex 381 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,880 Speaker 1: structures you're able to build. And when I think about 382 00:19:45,880 --> 00:19:48,240 Speaker 1: a complex structure, I think about it as being something 383 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 1: that can hold a lot of space. And it doesn't 384 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:56,080 Speaker 1: mean that your trauma is lessened per se, or that 385 00:19:56,160 --> 00:19:58,960 Speaker 1: it wasn't a big deal, or that whatever struggle each 386 00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,840 Speaker 1: of us has gone through isn't ours to own. It 387 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 1: simply means you can you can hold this more complex 388 00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:09,960 Speaker 1: space and things don't feel quite so triggering. They feel 389 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 1: they just to me, I feel like kind of pieces 390 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 1: of a puzzle, and the puzzle is of my life. 391 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:20,960 Speaker 1: And and for that, I'm I'm so grateful that we 392 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:25,479 Speaker 1: are having conversations in a time where discussions about mental 393 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:30,880 Speaker 1: health are becoming not only more publicly popular, but more 394 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:35,399 Speaker 1: more and more publicly acceptable. Yeah, I mean to I 395 00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:38,679 Speaker 1: what what I think? It's so important for people to 396 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:43,400 Speaker 1: remember that our mental state is our our most powerful currency. 397 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: Like it is the most powerful currency that we have, 398 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 1: because that is from the space that we create everything. 399 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:51,879 Speaker 1: That is a space where ideology is created. It's the 400 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:54,680 Speaker 1: space where social constructs are created. Right. So, like we're 401 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 1: able to talk right now because someone imagine that to 402 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:00,159 Speaker 1: be true. Right, Like we're able to like be in 403 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:02,600 Speaker 1: these homes and being cars and read books because it's 404 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:05,959 Speaker 1: first started in someone's thought and imagination. And so for me, 405 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:09,640 Speaker 1: it's like what therapy allowed for me was to remind 406 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:12,919 Speaker 1: me the power of my mental state, UM, the power 407 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:16,400 Speaker 1: of imagination, UM, the power of questioning things that were 408 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:20,360 Speaker 1: taught to be true. And you know that for me, 409 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:24,879 Speaker 1: when I got that, it rearranged everything for me. Was 410 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: that a practice that began in your life after moving 411 00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 1: to Los Angeles or before after? For sure it was 412 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: it was it was the introduction of yoga. And for 413 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:37,480 Speaker 1: me when it's it's more than the physical aspect of yoga, 414 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 1: it's it's the mental and spiritual aspect of it. That 415 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: part is what opened the gateway to that that knowing 416 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 1: mm hmm, I love that. And I'm also sitting here 417 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:50,560 Speaker 1: being like, God, I need to go back to you 418 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: because it's such a great practice and and I I've 419 00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:00,880 Speaker 1: had to learn that in sort of my my personal 420 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:05,920 Speaker 1: in the complex structure of my life. So often when 421 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 1: things get busy or or there are places to show 422 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:12,600 Speaker 1: up and and you know, serve or just helped to 423 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 1: to show up as an activist or a person with 424 00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:17,679 Speaker 1: a platform, like the first thing that goes is my 425 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:24,879 Speaker 1: movement and something about Interestingly enough that the intersection of 426 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:28,960 Speaker 1: what appears to be a global awakening that's long overdue 427 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:32,960 Speaker 1: with a global pandemic that is happening for the first 428 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 1: time in a hundred years, is it it's reshaping my 429 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:42,159 Speaker 1: perspective on health in a really interesting way. And I 430 00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 1: just found a book in one of my book stacks 431 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:46,399 Speaker 1: and I started laughing. So I'm like, oh, look, I 432 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:48,399 Speaker 1: bought that book and then I never read it. And 433 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: it's called it's called wealth, but it's spelled w E 434 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 1: L L t H. And I was like, it's all 435 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,000 Speaker 1: about how your health is, like is the real currency? 436 00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:00,199 Speaker 1: And I was like, cool, cool, I feel attacked by 437 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:04,920 Speaker 1: a book I bought myself. Great, but it's so true, right, 438 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 1: Like what yoga taught me is that life is a practice, right, 439 00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:13,399 Speaker 1: and so the question is always what are you practicing right? Um? 440 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:17,120 Speaker 1: And for me that is what shifted my perspective and everything, 441 00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:20,240 Speaker 1: because it became more than just me going to do 442 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,480 Speaker 1: a physical practice at a studio. Um. It was like 443 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 1: what was my practice on and off the mat um. 444 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:30,760 Speaker 1: And so for me, like having that be a mantra 445 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,160 Speaker 1: that carries me throughout the day is what has helped 446 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:36,680 Speaker 1: reshaped a lot for me as well. UM. But also 447 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,520 Speaker 1: to just understanding like what does wellness mean, you know, 448 00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 1: and and tapping into that because once again, like that's 449 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: our true currency, Like it it's not it's not money, 450 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 1: it's not this celebrity stuff. It's none of that, because 451 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 1: you can have all of that and be the most 452 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:54,119 Speaker 1: miserable person. But you know, it's something, it's something powerful 453 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:58,040 Speaker 1: when you understand, um, the importance and the essential of 454 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:03,400 Speaker 1: your well being UM. And how how do you cultivate that? Yeah? 455 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 1: So I'm curious. You know, you decided to come here 456 00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 1: and and yoga became this transformative discovery in your life. 457 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 1: But was that something that motivated the move or or 458 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 1: was it something that came as a byproduct of it? 459 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:25,439 Speaker 1: It came as a by product because I moved to 460 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:28,320 Speaker 1: l A UM through a retail company I was working 461 00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:32,200 Speaker 1: for that I was, yeah that I absolutely I dreaded 462 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 1: this company UM. And so they moved me here and 463 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 1: after I had been with them for four years and 464 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:40,920 Speaker 1: by the time I moved, by the time they moved 465 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:43,280 Speaker 1: me to l a and then I was with them 466 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:44,919 Speaker 1: for six months and then I quit because I was 467 00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,359 Speaker 1: just like I can't do this, Like this company is 468 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 1: so disgusting. And I was like twenty six at the 469 00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 1: time or twenty seven, I think I was young, and like, 470 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:55,159 Speaker 1: I'm in a new state for like six months, I 471 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: don't really know anyone. And then I was introduced to yoga. Um, 472 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:02,400 Speaker 1: and so that's what you know catapulted everything. And so 473 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:06,120 Speaker 1: what happens when when you get introduced to yoga? Did 474 00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:08,879 Speaker 1: someone tell you about a studio or take you to 475 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: a class, Like what's the first moment? Well, one of 476 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 1: my friends was like, come try this yoga class. I mean, 477 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 1: I was like, what is yoga? And she was like 478 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,080 Speaker 1: you like to work out? Right? I'm like yeah, and 479 00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 1: she's like it's like a workout class. And that's how 480 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 1: it was introduced to me. So I go and it 481 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:25,399 Speaker 1: was a vinyasa class and I absolutely hated it. I 482 00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,199 Speaker 1: was like, this is so mechanical. It's dangerous because, like 483 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: you know, like unless you have a really good instructor, 484 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: you can really hurt yourself in the vinyasa class because 485 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: it's so mechanical and like, not every teacher is paying 486 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:39,760 Speaker 1: attention to detail. Not every student is paying attention to detail, 487 00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:41,560 Speaker 1: like they're looking to the person next to them to 488 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 1: figure out how to be opposed. And so I was like, 489 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 1: I don't like this. So then I was like this sucks. 490 00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,479 Speaker 1: Not going again. And then like a month later, another 491 00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 1: friend was like, have you reached restored if yoga? I 492 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,399 Speaker 1: think you'll love. And I was like, I'm done with yoga, 493 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 1: and she was like, no, no no, no, you should really 494 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 1: try it. And after a few back and forts, I 495 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:01,479 Speaker 1: finally said yes and went to a restorative yoga class, 496 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,679 Speaker 1: and I was like, this is heaven, Like this is 497 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:06,800 Speaker 1: what I want to, you know, continue to take like 498 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,199 Speaker 1: this is what you know Like this was It was 499 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:11,960 Speaker 1: inspiring to me. And so then I got a digged 500 00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: it to it and I would go for like five 501 00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:15,879 Speaker 1: days a week for like two months. And then I 502 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: was like, I want to teach this, like I'm gonna 503 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:21,720 Speaker 1: heal Black communities do like restorative yoga, And so I 504 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:25,000 Speaker 1: decided to get certified as a restorative yoga teacher. How 505 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 1: long does getting certified as a yoga teacher take? It 506 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 1: took a year, It takes about it took about nine months, 507 00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: nine or two months mm hmm. Yeah. And and it's 508 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 1: interesting to me to think about all those poses, all 509 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,600 Speaker 1: those heart openers and hip openers and and back bends 510 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:46,000 Speaker 1: and things that really open up the middle of the 511 00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:49,600 Speaker 1: body in ways that we're just not taught to do 512 00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:55,920 Speaker 1: in regular life. The the connection to that emotional opening, 513 00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 1: to that kind of energetic flow of experience. I've I've 514 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: witnessed people cry in yoga class kind of out of nowhere, 515 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 1: And I now knowing what I do about how trauma 516 00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: lives in the body and and the way we experience 517 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,040 Speaker 1: things in our lives that get stuck, you know, in 518 00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:20,439 Speaker 1: our muscles and and in our actual physical structures. I 519 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:24,480 Speaker 1: think about the experience we can have if we learn 520 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:29,119 Speaker 1: to open and move those things through. And and so 521 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 1: I wonder what was there a part in the beginning, 522 00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 1: whether you were consciously aware of it yet or not. 523 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 1: Was there a part of you that felt like, oh, 524 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 1: this is doing something emotional for me? Also, yeah, because 525 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 1: in the sort of class I took the first one, 526 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:47,679 Speaker 1: I cried too, Like the first one I cry, and 527 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:51,640 Speaker 1: it was doing a heart opening um pose and then 528 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: it was led by a hip opener um and I 529 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:57,600 Speaker 1: could not understand it. And I was like, why am 530 00:27:57,600 --> 00:27:59,600 Speaker 1: I crying? Like I was trying everything I could to 531 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,600 Speaker 1: hope at the tears and not break down an ugly 532 00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:04,679 Speaker 1: cry in this class of like tweld people who I 533 00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:06,919 Speaker 1: do not know. And then I was like when I 534 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 1: left the class, I was like, what just happened? Like 535 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:12,520 Speaker 1: I was so curious about like why that was happening 536 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,720 Speaker 1: for me that I just started to do research And 537 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 1: the more I started to read about the yoga practice, 538 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:20,080 Speaker 1: the more I start to read about the parasympathetic and 539 00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,040 Speaker 1: the sympathetic nervousness, and the more I start to read 540 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,240 Speaker 1: about the trauma that we hold in the body, the 541 00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:26,640 Speaker 1: more I started to read about somatic healing and starts 542 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,359 Speaker 1: to click for me, and I was like, oh, like, 543 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:31,359 Speaker 1: not only is this powerful, but I want to be 544 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 1: able to educate, especially communities of color about this because 545 00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 1: of the history of trauma that we've experienced. Um, and 546 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 1: that's what spearheaded me into teaching yoga. That was gonna 547 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,360 Speaker 1: be the next question if that if got led into 548 00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:49,240 Speaker 1: Oh this could heal people, especially to your point, people 549 00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:52,080 Speaker 1: who have existed in communities where they've been oppressed or 550 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 1: experienced community based violence. Can you walk some people through, 551 00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 1: because I'm sure there's some people at home who are like, 552 00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 1: but what is the para sympathetic nervous system? Can can 553 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: you explain a little bit about what you're referring to 554 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:09,720 Speaker 1: as as a teacher and an expert. Yeah, so you know, 555 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 1: part of the nervous system is a parasympathetic nervous system 556 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,160 Speaker 1: and a sympathetic nervous system, which is basically the fight 557 00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:18,920 Speaker 1: or flight are what they call rest and digest and 558 00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 1: so typically most people are constantly in fight or flight. 559 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 1: So that's when you're in this nervous state and the 560 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:26,960 Speaker 1: blood is really rushing to the brain and the muscle 561 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: because it thinks that you're in danger. Right, So like 562 00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:32,200 Speaker 1: you have like adrenaline being pumped into your blood, which 563 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,120 Speaker 1: is why you know most people, especially in black communities, 564 00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:37,520 Speaker 1: fight or flight is with a lot like I said, 565 00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,680 Speaker 1: like a nod of stress. It's it's it's basically encompassing 566 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:43,240 Speaker 1: a very stressful environment um and when you think about 567 00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 1: the traumas that black folks in particular experience, it makes 568 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 1: sense why you know these you know, the diseases of 569 00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:53,520 Speaker 1: like high blood pressure, are diabetes exists because when you're 570 00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 1: in a constant state of fight or flight, the blood 571 00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,560 Speaker 1: is rushing to the brain and the muscle. It's not 572 00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: being able to circulate to the other parts of your 573 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,720 Speaker 1: reproductive system. Your nervous system, because it thinks that you're endangering, 574 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,480 Speaker 1: is trying to get you to a state where you're 575 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:08,880 Speaker 1: able to flee that versus when you're in a state 576 00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:10,800 Speaker 1: of rest and digest the blood is able to flow 577 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:12,640 Speaker 1: to all these different systems, like it can flow to 578 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:16,040 Speaker 1: the reproductive system, it can flow to the digestive system, 579 00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 1: and it's able to give you to this space where 580 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 1: you're able to be in a RESTful space UM, and 581 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,960 Speaker 1: the body is functioning an optimal level UM. Which is 582 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,960 Speaker 1: why typically, you know, when people are having a hard 583 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,920 Speaker 1: time getting pregnant, are having digestive issues, are having really 584 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,480 Speaker 1: any medical condition that certain that deals with the nervous 585 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:40,200 Speaker 1: system UM, a holistic practitioner would always offer a restorative 586 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 1: yoga or meditation because it brings you to this state 587 00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 1: of calmness, and it brings you to this state of 588 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:49,560 Speaker 1: finding inner peace UM. And it's just it's it's powerful. 589 00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: Like you you witness people like literally who are like 590 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 1: on medication for years and over time they're no longer 591 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: using it. UM. Women who have been trying to get 592 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:02,440 Speaker 1: pregnant for years, who through a restorative practice or through acupuncture, 593 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: through meditation, all of a sudden is now pregnant with twins. 594 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:09,400 Speaker 1: You know. It's it's a very healing and therapeutic practice 595 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,320 Speaker 1: that's been studied in practiced for years and Eastern culture, um, 596 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 1: but not so much here in the Western culture m hm. 597 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 1: And so through that awakening and that desire to transform, 598 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 1: you know, you mentioned getting to a point where you 599 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:31,600 Speaker 1: have private clientele, so you get certified and then you 600 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:35,160 Speaker 1: are living here as a healer, as a yoga teacher, 601 00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:37,120 Speaker 1: and that's kind of the plan, right until you have 602 00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 1: this conversation with Jed and and so I'm curious and 603 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:46,240 Speaker 1: I love it too when I was looking, when I 604 00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:48,959 Speaker 1: was doing all my nerdy research on your background, and 605 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:50,560 Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, you helped for this 606 00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 1: loving and loving day was last week, like everything just 607 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,880 Speaker 1: it's so weird, the synchronicity of all of this, And 608 00:31:55,960 --> 00:32:00,760 Speaker 1: I makes me feel very emotional and excited. I wonder 609 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 1: what what was that transition? Like, you know, you said 610 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 1: you were going to give it three months, and you 611 00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 1: obviously went on to make a bunch of films with them. 612 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:16,360 Speaker 1: So I wonder when you go from full time teaching 613 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:21,160 Speaker 1: to moving to London to work at this production house, 614 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 1: what what is that experience? Like? Is is there any 615 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:31,400 Speaker 1: kind of like culture shock moving to the UK? How 616 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:35,040 Speaker 1: does it feel going from you know, full time practitioner 617 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:39,320 Speaker 1: work to industry work. Like what what that feels like 618 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: a like a head spinner to me? Oh, it definitely was. 619 00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:45,239 Speaker 1: It was. I mean I think once I was like 620 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 1: young and just like not reckless, was like, let's just 621 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,719 Speaker 1: try it and see what happens. Um. But you know, 622 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:56,360 Speaker 1: it was hard, Like moving to London was difficult. Um. 623 00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: I would be remiss if I didn't say that, Like 624 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,880 Speaker 1: it was one of the most um challenging times of 625 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 1: my life because it is such a huge culture shock. Um. 626 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:10,720 Speaker 1: And you know, the first probably the first six months 627 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:14,080 Speaker 1: that I was there, I experienced depression on on on 628 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:17,680 Speaker 1: a very heavy scale because it was hard. Um. The 629 00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 1: culture is so completely different. The lack of sunshine was 630 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,680 Speaker 1: really hard to deal with. And also to like the 631 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:27,880 Speaker 1: food wasn't great um, and I love to eat, like, 632 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:32,000 Speaker 1: so like that was that was that was very difficult 633 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 1: to deal with, um. But also to like You're going 634 00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 1: across the pond to a country that like I didn't 635 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,280 Speaker 1: know anyone but them, Like I knew no one really 636 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 1: but Jet and then I met Colin and the team 637 00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,200 Speaker 1: as I as I transitioned over there. But it was 638 00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:50,720 Speaker 1: it was difficult and it was hard, and I questioned 639 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: the first year, did I make the right move? Um? 640 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,760 Speaker 1: Because I was having such a hard time adapting to 641 00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:58,840 Speaker 1: the culture of London, Like it's very much a very 642 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:01,800 Speaker 1: repressed culture, and you know, they believe in the Queen 643 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,000 Speaker 1: and all and all those things, and you know, there 644 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,240 Speaker 1: is a hierarchy in the business. There were like it's 645 00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:08,840 Speaker 1: like I'm only a secretary, Like I can't say anything, 646 00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:11,120 Speaker 1: Like I can't and I'm just like what, you have 647 00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:13,000 Speaker 1: a voice too, like what do you think about this? 648 00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,839 Speaker 1: You know? And even in meetings and deveulpment meetings, when 649 00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:19,359 Speaker 1: I would push back on certain ideas, you know, people 650 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,399 Speaker 1: be like, oh, you can't say that, Like why why 651 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,080 Speaker 1: are you pushing back? And I was like because that 652 00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,319 Speaker 1: I didn't make sense. What do you mean? Like you know, 653 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:29,000 Speaker 1: like like because I have a good idea, yeah, And 654 00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:31,279 Speaker 1: I'm like, you guys are having the same discussion at 655 00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:33,080 Speaker 1: the water cooler, but like you should be having it 656 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:35,200 Speaker 1: here in the meeting room. And they're like, oh, that's 657 00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:37,920 Speaker 1: not how it works here. And I was like wait 658 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:40,320 Speaker 1: what Like so like you know this idea that like 659 00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:42,280 Speaker 1: I was seen as like a rebel bucking the system. 660 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,960 Speaker 1: It was just a lot of it was a huge 661 00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: culture shock, you know, but you know there was also 662 00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 1: some beauties in it that I got to travel the world, 663 00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:51,880 Speaker 1: like being in London, I can have on a flight 664 00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,440 Speaker 1: for forty bucks and go to Spain or go to France, 665 00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 1: or you know, I got to experience culture in a 666 00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:00,040 Speaker 1: way that I don't think I would have had I 667 00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 1: stayed in America. UM, teaching yoga, UM, I got to 668 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:07,560 Speaker 1: meet some incredible people and tell amazing story. So you know, 669 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:10,920 Speaker 1: it had his pros and his consum but it was 670 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:17,480 Speaker 1: definitely a mind fuck. So sorry, a mind uh spin. 671 00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:23,480 Speaker 1: So it's fine, yeah, whatever, you transition to living in 672 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:27,919 Speaker 1: that space. And it strikes me you know too. Two 673 00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: of the films that you're credited on is as we 674 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,640 Speaker 1: we mentioned a little earlier, or I Am the Sky 675 00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:37,760 Speaker 1: and Loving, and these are both movies that are talking 676 00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:42,520 Speaker 1: about what's happening in the world. You know. I Am 677 00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:46,440 Speaker 1: the Sky was positing what are the ethics of drone warfare? 678 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:49,880 Speaker 1: You know, positing that question which we need to be asking, 679 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,359 Speaker 1: and and Loving took us back in time to look 680 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,200 Speaker 1: at how it really wasn't that long ago that interracial 681 00:35:56,200 --> 00:36:01,200 Speaker 1: marriage was deemed was was illegal and was only deemed 682 00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:05,480 Speaker 1: to be legal it's like being alive now. Granted I 683 00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:08,880 Speaker 1: don't think racism went anywhere, but it's so crazy to 684 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,160 Speaker 1: think that we do these things over and over again, 685 00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:16,040 Speaker 1: like that in the era of Loving versus the United States, 686 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,320 Speaker 1: two people had to defend their right to be married 687 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:21,160 Speaker 1: because they were in love, and in our lifetime we've 688 00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:24,640 Speaker 1: had to watch LGBTQ community go to court to defend 689 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:26,920 Speaker 1: the same And it's like, what are we doing here? 690 00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:29,960 Speaker 1: And and what it makes me think a lot about 691 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:34,560 Speaker 1: is what you referenced, that everything is a social construct. 692 00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:39,080 Speaker 1: Everything we think of as normal has been created by 693 00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:44,720 Speaker 1: someone and most of what we in the world through, 694 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:48,640 Speaker 1: you know, imagery that affects us unconsciously or subconsciously. Two 695 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:52,400 Speaker 1: stories were told um that we're aware of very consciously. 696 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:55,680 Speaker 1: Most of these structures were created by people in power, 697 00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:59,279 Speaker 1: and most people historically in power have been white men. 698 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:05,719 Speaker 1: So when we are speaking about wanting to dismantle the 699 00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:10,600 Speaker 1: white supremacist patriarchy and create a new system, it's interesting 700 00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:13,239 Speaker 1: too to see how many people get rattled by that. 701 00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 1: And perhaps it's it's the luxury of it's it's my 702 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,440 Speaker 1: privilege of exposure and of having a diverse community and 703 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:25,560 Speaker 1: I could go on and on, but I I think 704 00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:31,799 Speaker 1: about how important it is too undo the lesson, and 705 00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:37,759 Speaker 1: your movie is undoing so much of the lesson. And 706 00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:40,160 Speaker 1: and if I may say, for the listeners, you know, 707 00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:44,840 Speaker 1: we have to think about what history we've been taught 708 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:47,960 Speaker 1: and what history has been left out of the books. 709 00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:51,520 Speaker 1: And just as you know, Ogie, you and I can 710 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:55,879 Speaker 1: identify what it is to be the victims of sexism 711 00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:59,279 Speaker 1: and of patriarchy as women. The way that so many 712 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:02,359 Speaker 1: women who have invented throughout history have been left out 713 00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:07,799 Speaker 1: of the story. The compounding effect for black women is 714 00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:13,640 Speaker 1: exponential and immeasurable. And if I want to fight for 715 00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:16,920 Speaker 1: my right as a woman who was born in a 716 00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:21,280 Speaker 1: body that is white, to be equal to the boys 717 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 1: in the room, I can't do that, or I'm not 718 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:28,319 Speaker 1: doing that authentically or effectively if I'm not acknowledging that 719 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:31,040 Speaker 1: for any of my friends who are women of color, 720 00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:34,239 Speaker 1: and in particular black women, If I don't acknowledge how 721 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:36,040 Speaker 1: much harder it is for you to be in that 722 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:40,200 Speaker 1: same room, then what is my activism? What is what 723 00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:45,120 Speaker 1: is my call out of the patriarchy? And your movie 724 00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:49,520 Speaker 1: it this beautiful movie. Everyone listening at home. I can't 725 00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:52,480 Speaker 1: wait for you to see this is a true re 726 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:56,920 Speaker 1: education of what has been left out of our history. 727 00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:01,600 Speaker 1: And I wonder the circle back when you said I 728 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,320 Speaker 1: can't do this. It's a big it's a big story 729 00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,520 Speaker 1: to try to unpack, and it's so much to try 730 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:12,719 Speaker 1: to expose. How did you begin to get past the 731 00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:18,240 Speaker 1: initial I can't do this um in all honesty, prayer 732 00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:21,319 Speaker 1: and meditation because I had to, like after you know, 733 00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 1: like speaking with Halle and like you know, other friends 734 00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:26,200 Speaker 1: who was like, no, like you gotta do this. I 735 00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,799 Speaker 1: went into deep meditation for a few days because I 736 00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:33,440 Speaker 1: had to really sit with it, and you know, in 737 00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,480 Speaker 1: in that practice, like I was just like, okay, like 738 00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:39,200 Speaker 1: all you can do is try, like you gotta at 739 00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:41,799 Speaker 1: least try to tell the story. And so when I 740 00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:45,240 Speaker 1: got to a space of understanding that, I began my research. 741 00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,360 Speaker 1: So you know, I started The pre production base for 742 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:51,399 Speaker 1: me for research was about seven months, six days a week, 743 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,799 Speaker 1: fourteen hour days. And you know, I would read everything 744 00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:57,720 Speaker 1: that I could about black women. I would read articles 745 00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:00,239 Speaker 1: and books written by black women about black a man. 746 00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:05,320 Speaker 1: I just fully immersed myself into this this learning um 747 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,400 Speaker 1: and it was it was like within the first month 748 00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:09,839 Speaker 1: of that that, you know, it really tried to hit 749 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:13,120 Speaker 1: me like holy sh it, like what we've been taught 750 00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:16,880 Speaker 1: in school is revisionist history because sixt of what I 751 00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:19,480 Speaker 1: learned I had no clue about. And I was thirty 752 00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:21,560 Speaker 1: two when I started making this project, and I'm like, 753 00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 1: how did I not know this? And you know, like, 754 00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:27,480 Speaker 1: I went through a plethora of emotions from like I 755 00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:30,160 Speaker 1: was really angry at myself for the first month, I 756 00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:32,960 Speaker 1: was disappointed in myself. I was angry because I felt 757 00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:35,399 Speaker 1: like I should have known this, especially being a black woman. 758 00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:37,080 Speaker 1: I felt like I should have known more about our 759 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:39,439 Speaker 1: history and the fact that I didn't at the age 760 00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:43,040 Speaker 1: of thirty two, I felt very disappointed with myself and 761 00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,960 Speaker 1: angry at myself um. And then eventually those emotions, you know, 762 00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:52,239 Speaker 1: transpired into anger and rage towards the system um and 763 00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:54,719 Speaker 1: being like oh, you know, now it's just making me 764 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,640 Speaker 1: question like, Okay, well, why why do you think you 765 00:40:57,719 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 1: were not taught this? And then I would question like, oh, 766 00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:03,160 Speaker 1: like who's writing the history books right, like how does 767 00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:05,600 Speaker 1: it serve them to not tell these stories? And then 768 00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:07,920 Speaker 1: I had to go and think like, Okay, now that 769 00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:11,359 Speaker 1: you understand this more clearly. How do you fuel take 770 00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:14,160 Speaker 1: this anger and this rage and this disappointment and allow 771 00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:16,399 Speaker 1: it to read direct you into a way that will 772 00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:18,800 Speaker 1: empower you to tell these stories as best as you could. 773 00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:22,600 Speaker 1: Um And then you know, I had to get back 774 00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:25,359 Speaker 1: into therapy because I had stuff I had. I hadn't 775 00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,239 Speaker 1: been in therapy for a while prior to doing this, 776 00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:31,040 Speaker 1: and then you know, by month three of doing this research, 777 00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:33,480 Speaker 1: I was like, there's just no way I can finish 778 00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,080 Speaker 1: this without being in therapy because you know, like I said, 779 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:37,879 Speaker 1: I was doing it six days a week, fourteen hours 780 00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:39,799 Speaker 1: a day, and like on the day that I didn't work, 781 00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:42,560 Speaker 1: which is typically Sunday, I couldn't got to bed for 782 00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:44,040 Speaker 1: like the first half of the day, Like I would 783 00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:46,800 Speaker 1: be in bed crying because you know, after reading the 784 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,760 Speaker 1: slave narratives and you know, reading like all the history 785 00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:53,399 Speaker 1: from a medical apartheid on black woman's bodies to just 786 00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:55,920 Speaker 1: you know, the labeling, like it was a lot to 787 00:41:56,040 --> 00:41:59,759 Speaker 1: hold and I was realizing that it was destabilizing me 788 00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:02,080 Speaker 1: in a way that if I wanted to really do 789 00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:04,960 Speaker 1: this justice and get through to it, I needed the 790 00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:08,680 Speaker 1: extra health therapy to help me process what I was holding. 791 00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,440 Speaker 1: I can I can't imagine. It's interesting, It's my My 792 00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:14,719 Speaker 1: next question for you was, how do you manage to 793 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:18,960 Speaker 1: hold space for stories that have that carries so much 794 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:25,120 Speaker 1: weight and so much intensity. It It strikes me because 795 00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:29,800 Speaker 1: it feels even looking in from the outside, it feels 796 00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:35,120 Speaker 1: so confronting and so devastating and so heartbreaking to listen 797 00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:39,759 Speaker 1: to these stories, to understand these narratives that were left 798 00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:47,239 Speaker 1: out of pages. It crystallizes why in nineteen sixty two, 799 00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:51,279 Speaker 1: Malcolm X said, the most disrespected person in America is 800 00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:55,120 Speaker 1: the black woman. The most unprotected person in America is 801 00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:58,640 Speaker 1: the black woman. The most neglected person in America is 802 00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:03,880 Speaker 1: the black woman. And it is impossible not to feel 803 00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:11,359 Speaker 1: empathetically the the expansiveness of what that kind of lack 804 00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:15,240 Speaker 1: of protection and what that kind of neglect has done 805 00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:18,239 Speaker 1: to black women. When you sit and you listen to 806 00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,200 Speaker 1: these researchers, and you sit and you listen to the 807 00:43:21,360 --> 00:43:24,480 Speaker 1: activists and these mothers, all of these women who you interviewed, 808 00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:27,880 Speaker 1: and you go through history in such a way that 809 00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:33,600 Speaker 1: you find out that this is not new. I think 810 00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:37,719 Speaker 1: that your film will be illuminating and confronting for a 811 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:41,800 Speaker 1: lot of people who watch it, and and I wonder 812 00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:46,759 Speaker 1: how how in the midst of that weight, and and 813 00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,200 Speaker 1: and the sadness that comes with seeing the writing on 814 00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:54,400 Speaker 1: the wall like that, how do you turn that feeling? 815 00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:58,960 Speaker 1: How do you turn that that quote that is sixty 816 00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,839 Speaker 1: years old about respect? How do you how do you 817 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:05,320 Speaker 1: turn it into a fuel for you as an artist 818 00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:08,759 Speaker 1: and as a storyteller. I think for me it was 819 00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:12,600 Speaker 1: it was really about knowing that UM, at the end 820 00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:14,520 Speaker 1: of the day, me creating this was bigger than me, 821 00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:19,200 Speaker 1: and every day from the first day of production until 822 00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:22,120 Speaker 1: the last day of post when we picturelogued, I would 823 00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:25,160 Speaker 1: go into it with my crew sending intention that we 824 00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:28,040 Speaker 1: just allow ourselves to be vessels for this project, that 825 00:44:28,200 --> 00:44:30,520 Speaker 1: there was no egos and this, that we will remain 826 00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:33,279 Speaker 1: open to the process, that we had to make changes UM, 827 00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:36,040 Speaker 1: and that we truly allowed ourselves to be vessels to 828 00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:40,239 Speaker 1: get these stories across UM because I felt that I 829 00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:44,400 Speaker 1: owed it to my ancestors and two black women in particular, 830 00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:47,759 Speaker 1: to tell this story. You know, like in reading and 831 00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:50,640 Speaker 1: learning what I learned in those months of research, I 832 00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:53,279 Speaker 1: had no choice, you know, I had no choice. I 833 00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:57,719 Speaker 1: had to find a way to take those those heard 834 00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:00,600 Speaker 1: emotions that I was feeling and allowed to feel me 835 00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:04,640 Speaker 1: in a way that would allow me to tell these stories, um, 836 00:45:04,680 --> 00:45:08,520 Speaker 1: in a way that would be understood and accepted um 837 00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:11,359 Speaker 1: first and foremost by black women, and then secondly by 838 00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:16,040 Speaker 1: everybody else. Mm hmm. And and was looking at that 839 00:45:16,200 --> 00:45:22,120 Speaker 1: larger narrative, the untold, often untold experiences of black women 840 00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:28,400 Speaker 1: in America. Did that recalibrate some of your own experiences 841 00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:31,520 Speaker 1: with your own identity? Oh? Yeah, absolutely. I mean I 842 00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:33,320 Speaker 1: tend to say to my friends and they all know 843 00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:35,680 Speaker 1: this is that for me, this experience felt like a 844 00:45:35,719 --> 00:45:39,680 Speaker 1: rebirth for me. UM. It gave me permission to be 845 00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:43,279 Speaker 1: fully who I was. UM. It also taught me a 846 00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:48,399 Speaker 1: lot about not only myself, about the history of black women. UM. 847 00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:51,479 Speaker 1: And you know that, you know, I will forever be 848 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:55,680 Speaker 1: grateful for UM. I definitely am not the same person 849 00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:57,560 Speaker 1: going in that I was going into this project. I 850 00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:01,840 Speaker 1: can tell you that. UM it definitely changed me in 851 00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:07,680 Speaker 1: in countless ways. Something that really struck me again when 852 00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:12,359 Speaker 1: we talk about systems, and when we really acknowledge as 853 00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:17,279 Speaker 1: humans that systems were just created by someone, that we 854 00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:23,040 Speaker 1: have the capacity to envision better systems and and I 855 00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:25,880 Speaker 1: look at it as having a duty to do so, because, 856 00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,200 Speaker 1: as you discussed in the film, our current system was 857 00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:34,200 Speaker 1: quite literally designed to produce these outcomes. It is an 858 00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:36,719 Speaker 1: ugly truth, but an important one that we look at 859 00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:41,280 Speaker 1: that the economic foundation of this country is quite literally 860 00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:45,400 Speaker 1: rooted in and built on the exploitation of black women's 861 00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:50,759 Speaker 1: labor and black women's bodies. And something that struck me 862 00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:56,319 Speaker 1: listening to the poet who does many readings and film 863 00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:59,160 Speaker 1: was that she was talking about the sacrifice of women 864 00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:03,160 Speaker 1: and how so often their sacrifices are not acknowledged because 865 00:47:03,160 --> 00:47:06,279 Speaker 1: it's assumed that as women will sacrifice ourselves for love 866 00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:11,400 Speaker 1: for our men, are partners, are children, and that that 867 00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:15,400 Speaker 1: struck me as so I just was so sad and 868 00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:20,160 Speaker 1: mad because I don't know why, as women we are 869 00:47:20,239 --> 00:47:24,839 Speaker 1: expected to erase ourselves were the good of something out there, 870 00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:30,680 Speaker 1: and the the proximity to that reality I can feel 871 00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:33,080 Speaker 1: as a woman, but also the distance from the reality 872 00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:35,160 Speaker 1: being talked about in the movie because I'm not a 873 00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:39,359 Speaker 1: black woman was not lost on me. Um So, when 874 00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:43,360 Speaker 1: I think about again the intersection at which all of 875 00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:48,000 Speaker 1: the subjects of the movie sit and and how there 876 00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:54,800 Speaker 1: is this incredible infographic which explains how black women feel 877 00:47:54,920 --> 00:48:00,000 Speaker 1: both racism and sexism, how they become essentially the oppressed 878 00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:06,040 Speaker 1: of the oppressed. I'm wondering if as a bit of education, UM, 879 00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:08,640 Speaker 1: a bit of a preview for for the listeners who 880 00:48:08,680 --> 00:48:10,360 Speaker 1: I know are going to go and watch this movie, 881 00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:14,160 Speaker 1: because my listeners are read and they really like homework. UM, 882 00:48:14,239 --> 00:48:17,760 Speaker 1: and this is like, this is like church homework, It's 883 00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:23,319 Speaker 1: like spiritual work. UM. Can you walk us through those boxes? 884 00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:27,400 Speaker 1: Can can you walk us through what that intersectionality means 885 00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:31,799 Speaker 1: in terms of sexism and racism? Yeah? So UM. A 886 00:48:31,840 --> 00:48:35,560 Speaker 1: part of the documentaries, UM, I was researching this incredible, 887 00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:40,600 Speaker 1: incredible scholar and author named Dr Joy de Grew who 888 00:48:40,600 --> 00:48:43,840 Speaker 1: wrote this book called post Traumatic slavee Syndrome, and I 889 00:48:44,080 --> 00:48:48,439 Speaker 1: highly recommend that anyone who has a capacity to read 890 00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,760 Speaker 1: beyond the fifth grade level read this book. Her book 891 00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:57,080 Speaker 1: rearranged me in the most profound way in reading that. UM. 892 00:48:57,120 --> 00:48:59,880 Speaker 1: And when I was interviewing her, we were talking about, 893 00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:02,560 Speaker 1: you know, just the way that black women are positioning 894 00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:05,480 Speaker 1: into society, and we were talking about that in disgusting 895 00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:06,879 Speaker 1: and I was just like, I get it, but like, 896 00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:10,239 Speaker 1: what can we show them? Like I need people to 897 00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,279 Speaker 1: physically to visually get it. And she was like, oh, 898 00:49:13,280 --> 00:49:14,680 Speaker 1: I got you real quick, let me explain to you, 899 00:49:14,840 --> 00:49:16,480 Speaker 1: like we're still rolling. I'm like, yeah, we're still rolling. 900 00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:18,640 Speaker 1: And then she just goes into it. She's like, so 901 00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:20,759 Speaker 1: there's a high acrea system, right. She was like, you know, 902 00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:23,400 Speaker 1: at the top of that system is white men, and 903 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:26,720 Speaker 1: then you have two arrows going down from each side, 904 00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:29,239 Speaker 1: and one arrow goes down to white women, and then 905 00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:32,120 Speaker 1: the other arrow goes down to black men. And then 906 00:49:32,480 --> 00:49:35,840 Speaker 1: from the boxes of white women and black men, you 907 00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:39,080 Speaker 1: have two arrows going down to women of color, and 908 00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:41,840 Speaker 1: from women of color, you have one arrow going down 909 00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:44,360 Speaker 1: and that is black women. And you know, she was 910 00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:47,400 Speaker 1: basically saying that black women are the oppressed of the oppressed, 911 00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:50,240 Speaker 1: like we are seeing as the mules of the world 912 00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:54,439 Speaker 1: through the gazes of sexism and racism. So with black men, 913 00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:59,320 Speaker 1: black men experienced racism from white men, and white women 914 00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:03,120 Speaker 1: experience and sexism from white men, and then black men 915 00:50:03,200 --> 00:50:07,080 Speaker 1: also experienced racism from white women. But when you point 916 00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:09,239 Speaker 1: those boxes all the way down to black women, we 917 00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:12,239 Speaker 1: not only experienced sexism and racism from white women and 918 00:50:12,239 --> 00:50:15,000 Speaker 1: white men, but we also experienced sexism from black men, 919 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:19,160 Speaker 1: and so she basically is given this. I mean, she 920 00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:23,279 Speaker 1: articulated so beautifully, um how you can. And we just 921 00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:25,279 Speaker 1: after her saying that, I was like, I gotta create 922 00:50:25,280 --> 00:50:26,959 Speaker 1: a chart off of this like that, I gotta show 923 00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:29,799 Speaker 1: people visually how this makes sense and how this is 924 00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:33,120 Speaker 1: all set up. Um. And by seeing that chart, I 925 00:50:33,160 --> 00:50:36,040 Speaker 1: think it really hits home for you, like, holy fuck, 926 00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:40,160 Speaker 1: Like black black women really are perceived as the mules 927 00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:43,800 Speaker 1: of this world and the oppressed of the oppress um. 928 00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:47,799 Speaker 1: And so you know, when I created that chart and 929 00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:49,759 Speaker 1: I'm in post and I'm looking at it, I'm like, oh, 930 00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:51,759 Speaker 1: this is going to really hit home. Because even though 931 00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,960 Speaker 1: I had done the interview and making the post um 932 00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:56,960 Speaker 1: and making the graph and working on it in post, like, 933 00:50:57,200 --> 00:50:58,920 Speaker 1: it was moments that I would cry because I'm like, 934 00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:02,520 Speaker 1: it's hitting me even harder by visually seeing it. Mm 935 00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:06,960 Speaker 1: hmmm hm. That was a really intense moment for me. Also, 936 00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:11,080 Speaker 1: there there is something that is so powerful in my 937 00:51:11,160 --> 00:51:17,919 Speaker 1: experience of being able to visualize it complex concept and 938 00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:22,160 Speaker 1: when you look at all of those arrows pointing toward 939 00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:24,600 Speaker 1: one box, you just go, that's a lot to be 940 00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:27,960 Speaker 1: on the other end of and and when you look 941 00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:31,279 Speaker 1: at those sort of societal experiences and then you go 942 00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:34,880 Speaker 1: backwards and you get this education. You know, as you 943 00:51:35,000 --> 00:51:39,480 Speaker 1: mentioned in Enjoy's book, when when she talks about what 944 00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:43,960 Speaker 1: post traumatic slave syndrome means, the multi generational trauma, which 945 00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:46,319 Speaker 1: again we're alive at a time where science has been 946 00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:48,680 Speaker 1: able to prove this. They've been able to look at 947 00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:54,400 Speaker 1: the actual changes in d NA passed down from traumatized 948 00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:58,319 Speaker 1: people to their children. You look at it in Holocaust survivors, 949 00:51:58,360 --> 00:52:02,279 Speaker 1: You look at at these same ings in black families 950 00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:07,120 Speaker 1: with lineage that comes from slavery. This is not to 951 00:52:07,239 --> 00:52:11,600 Speaker 1: be underestimated the toll it takes on a people having 952 00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:15,839 Speaker 1: been enslaved, beaten, experimented on, raped, sold. You know when 953 00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:19,440 Speaker 1: when she she said something that was so obvious, but 954 00:52:19,560 --> 00:52:23,160 Speaker 1: that made me just burst into tears when she got 955 00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:28,000 Speaker 1: into the explanations around how enslaved African women were given 956 00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,800 Speaker 1: no rights to their bodies or to their own children. 957 00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:33,799 Speaker 1: And she looked at the camera and said, do you 958 00:52:33,840 --> 00:52:37,719 Speaker 1: really think that? And she was, she said they she 959 00:52:37,840 --> 00:52:41,640 Speaker 1: was referencing white men's slave owners, landowners. You really think 960 00:52:41,680 --> 00:52:44,719 Speaker 1: they waited till the girls were eighteen and I just 961 00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:52,720 Speaker 1: started sobbing this this idea that young girls were in 962 00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:57,200 Speaker 1: in that era, that this was almost like a what's 963 00:52:57,200 --> 00:53:00,560 Speaker 1: the word I'm looking for? This was an older practice 964 00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:04,719 Speaker 1: of sex trafficking, that that mothers had to watch their 965 00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:09,920 Speaker 1: daughters go through this and couldn't say anything. That that 966 00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:16,000 Speaker 1: that this line of taking access to women's bodies, which again, 967 00:53:16,120 --> 00:53:20,279 Speaker 1: all of us, all women, should be enraged hearing that, 968 00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:26,080 Speaker 1: and understand that if our experiences, however proximal or specific 969 00:53:26,120 --> 00:53:31,279 Speaker 1: they may be, to sexual trauma, enrage us for ourselves, 970 00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:35,000 Speaker 1: for our friends, for our sisters. They have to they 971 00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:37,480 Speaker 1: have to be things we look at in our lineage. 972 00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:42,440 Speaker 1: Also that that there was you know that that the 973 00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:47,640 Speaker 1: father of modern gynecology created all of this horrific research 974 00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:53,040 Speaker 1: which really was experimenting on black women because slave owners 975 00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:55,640 Speaker 1: were bringing black women in and saying like fix her, 976 00:53:56,400 --> 00:53:59,080 Speaker 1: fix her body, like she's been raped so many times 977 00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:02,719 Speaker 1: that she doesn't work anymore, Fix her so we can 978 00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:04,839 Speaker 1: rape person more. I mean, this is and and I 979 00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:08,719 Speaker 1: know that this is probably really a lot to hear 980 00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:12,040 Speaker 1: for people who are listening to this conversation, and if 981 00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,680 Speaker 1: it is triggering to you, I apologize. And also I 982 00:54:14,719 --> 00:54:17,840 Speaker 1: want to just say, like it should go without stating, 983 00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:20,279 Speaker 1: but take care of yourself and whatever way you need to. 984 00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:23,600 Speaker 1: But my request would be, even if this is a 985 00:54:23,640 --> 00:54:26,280 Speaker 1: conversation that's tough to listen to, that that the movie 986 00:54:26,320 --> 00:54:29,320 Speaker 1: is one that you sit with people you trust or 987 00:54:29,360 --> 00:54:32,680 Speaker 1: feel safe around and watch because we have to know 988 00:54:32,840 --> 00:54:36,640 Speaker 1: our history. We have to know this stuff so that 989 00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:39,600 Speaker 1: we can understand how we got to where we are. 990 00:54:40,960 --> 00:54:45,600 Speaker 1: We any woman who who values being able to have 991 00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:49,439 Speaker 1: a cervical cancer screening, get a perhaps mirror, make sure 992 00:54:49,719 --> 00:54:53,360 Speaker 1: you know you're not developing breast cancer. We we have 993 00:54:53,440 --> 00:54:56,759 Speaker 1: Henrietta Lacks to thank for that. Yes, you know, we 994 00:54:56,800 --> 00:55:03,320 Speaker 1: wouldn't have cancer treatments without a black woman contributing to science. 995 00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:05,920 Speaker 1: And what angers me is that she wasn't even asked 996 00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:09,040 Speaker 1: to contribute, She wasn't given the rights, her family didn't 997 00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:11,560 Speaker 1: get to profit share in the fact that even today, 998 00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:15,280 Speaker 1: the sole cultures that mean we have cancer treatments belonged 999 00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:19,800 Speaker 1: to her. You know, the the taking and profiting off 1000 00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:24,200 Speaker 1: of black women has been happening for so long and 1001 00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:28,040 Speaker 1: if we don't educate ourselves about this to your point, 1002 00:55:28,160 --> 00:55:32,240 Speaker 1: making these discoveries at thirty two, if we don't learn 1003 00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:36,680 Speaker 1: about the reality of this stuff, we won't see its roots. 1004 00:55:36,840 --> 00:55:39,319 Speaker 1: We won't see those rotten roots in so many of 1005 00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:43,400 Speaker 1: our systems. And if we as women want to envision 1006 00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:47,440 Speaker 1: a better system than a white hood, normative patriarchy, we 1007 00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:50,239 Speaker 1: have to pull all the rotten roots out and cultivate 1008 00:55:50,280 --> 00:55:53,359 Speaker 1: the ones that are good, the ones that have been 1009 00:55:53,440 --> 00:55:56,799 Speaker 1: created in different systems we have to create. We have 1010 00:55:56,840 --> 00:56:02,239 Speaker 1: to cultivate something new altogether. Here, I wonder as we 1011 00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:06,640 Speaker 1: look at that landscape, and I know that's a a 1012 00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:09,239 Speaker 1: bit of a highlight reel of some of the things 1013 00:56:09,239 --> 00:56:12,719 Speaker 1: people will learn much more about in the movie. When 1014 00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:17,120 Speaker 1: we think about the natural reaction which I imagine so 1015 00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:19,600 Speaker 1: many people have, which is to say, how could that happen? 1016 00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:23,640 Speaker 1: How could no one do anything? How how could we 1017 00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:28,880 Speaker 1: have not known this? It seems to me that some 1018 00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:35,840 Speaker 1: of this comes from stereotyping. And you discuss in the 1019 00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:39,480 Speaker 1: movie as well that stereotypes are controlling images, that they 1020 00:56:39,480 --> 00:56:44,319 Speaker 1: are made to keep people in boxes, and that in particular, 1021 00:56:44,360 --> 00:56:47,319 Speaker 1: the stereotypes that have been placed onto black women have 1022 00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:52,080 Speaker 1: been incredibly des humanizing. Um and you reference three of 1023 00:56:52,120 --> 00:56:56,279 Speaker 1: those stereotypes in particular, would you educate the audience on 1024 00:56:56,280 --> 00:57:00,320 Speaker 1: on what they are. Yeah. So in the field them 1025 00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:03,480 Speaker 1: we talk about you know, Dr Patricia Hill Collins coined 1026 00:57:03,480 --> 00:57:07,319 Speaker 1: the term controlling images regarding stereotypes, and so we talk 1027 00:57:07,400 --> 00:57:09,319 Speaker 1: about a few of them, which is, you know, this 1028 00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:12,480 Speaker 1: whole idea of the mammy figure, which ironically woke up 1029 00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:15,160 Speaker 1: this morning to Quaker Oats saying that they realized a 1030 00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:18,640 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty years later that Jemima's racist and so 1031 00:57:18,760 --> 00:57:20,640 Speaker 1: you know, it's just kind of like and then that 1032 00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:23,480 Speaker 1: removing that, But it's like that to me is an 1033 00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:26,240 Speaker 1: impressive that you're you're now figuring out a hundred and 1034 00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:29,080 Speaker 1: fifty years later that you're selling the product that has 1035 00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:32,200 Speaker 1: a racist image. I think what most people are looking 1036 00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:34,320 Speaker 1: for is for them to come out and say, you 1037 00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:36,480 Speaker 1: know what, we realize that this is a racist image, 1038 00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:38,520 Speaker 1: and we want to donate millions of dollars to the 1039 00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:41,800 Speaker 1: likenesses of these women, these black women that we've used 1040 00:57:41,840 --> 00:57:44,600 Speaker 1: to sell and market this product. Now that's a conversation 1041 00:57:44,640 --> 00:57:46,200 Speaker 1: I want to have Until they are able to do that, 1042 00:57:46,280 --> 00:57:48,840 Speaker 1: it's like okay, like you realize it, and then what 1043 00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:51,680 Speaker 1: like what are you gonna do next? Um, So you know, 1044 00:57:51,680 --> 00:57:54,400 Speaker 1: we talked about this whole image of like Jemima UM 1045 00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:56,240 Speaker 1: and how that's been placed on the black woman to 1046 00:57:56,320 --> 00:57:58,600 Speaker 1: keep her small and to keep her in the box. Um. 1047 00:57:58,600 --> 00:58:01,160 Speaker 1: We talk about this notion of the jazzebel and the 1048 00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:04,960 Speaker 1: sapphire of sexualizing black women and how that plays into 1049 00:58:05,000 --> 00:58:08,240 Speaker 1: like rape culture of black women. UM. We talk about, 1050 00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:10,920 Speaker 1: you know, the labeling of black women as a welfare 1051 00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:14,400 Speaker 1: queen and as being seen as lazy. You know, we 1052 00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:18,120 Speaker 1: we we literally we explore all these labels because for me, 1053 00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:20,520 Speaker 1: when when you see the film, it's it's broken into 1054 00:58:20,560 --> 00:58:24,080 Speaker 1: three sections hurt, resilient, and beautiful. And with the hurt 1055 00:58:24,160 --> 00:58:26,800 Speaker 1: aspect of the documentary, I wanted to explore how black 1056 00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:29,440 Speaker 1: women have been hurt in the three dimensional sense, UM, 1057 00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:31,600 Speaker 1: how we've been physically hurt that talks about the rape 1058 00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:35,040 Speaker 1: culture and the medical apartheid on black women's bodies. But 1059 00:58:35,080 --> 00:58:37,480 Speaker 1: then also I want to talk about the mental aspect 1060 00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:39,760 Speaker 1: of the hurt, which is the labeling and how when 1061 00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:43,360 Speaker 1: you've created these, um, these stereotypes that perpetuate through culture, 1062 00:58:43,720 --> 00:58:46,960 Speaker 1: through music, through films, how that affects Black women and 1063 00:58:47,000 --> 00:58:50,120 Speaker 1: how black women are then perceived through those images. And 1064 00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:52,680 Speaker 1: then you know, I wanted to wrap that section up 1065 00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:55,600 Speaker 1: by talking about the emotional aspect of the hurt. So, 1066 00:58:55,680 --> 00:58:58,320 Speaker 1: once you've been physically and mentally hurt in this regards, 1067 00:58:58,360 --> 00:59:00,400 Speaker 1: how do you see yourself as a back women and 1068 00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:02,240 Speaker 1: how does that affect you in seeing yourself? But not 1069 00:59:02,320 --> 00:59:05,880 Speaker 1: only that, how do you then relate to other black 1070 00:59:05,880 --> 00:59:08,600 Speaker 1: women in society as a whole? And so in that 1071 00:59:08,720 --> 00:59:12,160 Speaker 1: section of the documentary, that's you know, mainly what that's about. 1072 00:59:12,320 --> 00:59:15,880 Speaker 1: And so the stereotyping to me was a no brainer, 1073 00:59:15,960 --> 00:59:18,040 Speaker 1: especially when we're talking about the mental aspects of heart 1074 00:59:18,120 --> 00:59:21,240 Speaker 1: because you know, once again it's it all goes back 1075 00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:23,320 Speaker 1: to the power of our mental state, right, like, how 1076 00:59:23,360 --> 00:59:26,360 Speaker 1: are we being conditioned? How are we you know, being 1077 00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:29,640 Speaker 1: conditioned with these social constructs? Like that's what it all, boys, 1078 00:59:29,680 --> 00:59:31,320 Speaker 1: I mean, that's what all of this boils down to. 1079 00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:35,200 Speaker 1: And I was so fascinated. I've looked at a lot 1080 00:59:35,240 --> 00:59:39,720 Speaker 1: of the data around social programming and and welfare systems 1081 00:59:39,800 --> 00:59:43,520 Speaker 1: and community investment and how it's actually so much less 1082 00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:46,640 Speaker 1: expensive as a nation to invest in communities, to invest 1083 00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:49,280 Speaker 1: in addiction treatment, to invest in schools, to invest in 1084 00:59:49,320 --> 00:59:52,520 Speaker 1: after school programs than to do what we're doing so, 1085 00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:56,760 Speaker 1: I've always rolled my eyes it and people who want 1086 00:59:56,760 --> 00:59:59,520 Speaker 1: to say that those are wastes of money or to 1087 00:59:59,640 --> 01:00:04,520 Speaker 1: expect SI And I realized that in understanding, we're looking 1088 01:00:04,520 --> 01:00:06,440 Speaker 1: at a lot of data. I've never looked at the 1089 01:00:06,520 --> 01:00:09,720 Speaker 1: root of this myth of the you know, quote unquote 1090 01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:14,280 Speaker 1: welfare queen, Like I didn't know that it comes from 1091 01:00:15,000 --> 01:00:18,960 Speaker 1: an era where black women were not allowed to access 1092 01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:22,720 Speaker 1: social security, which, by the way, everybody else could, and 1093 01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:28,480 Speaker 1: women started demanding their equal treatment under government funding, and 1094 01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:33,040 Speaker 1: then suddenly they were perpetuated as leaching off of a system. 1095 01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:35,440 Speaker 1: And I'm like, well, that doesn't make any sense though, 1096 01:00:35,480 --> 01:00:38,120 Speaker 1: because there's plenty of white people who are unwelfare. And also, like, 1097 01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:40,760 Speaker 1: what does anyone think their mortgage a percentage of your 1098 01:00:40,760 --> 01:00:44,640 Speaker 1: mortgage right off? Like that's also socialism, and nobody's mad 1099 01:00:44,640 --> 01:00:47,320 Speaker 1: about that. Like our roads are paid for by quote 1100 01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:49,720 Speaker 1: unquote socialism, and our schools are paid for by quote 1101 01:00:49,760 --> 01:00:53,600 Speaker 1: unquote socialism. Like there's a social contract to being a 1102 01:00:53,720 --> 01:00:57,920 Speaker 1: member of any country, and it's meant to be equally accessible. 1103 01:00:58,520 --> 01:01:00,840 Speaker 1: And it made me think out what we're seeing a 1104 01:01:00,840 --> 01:01:04,480 Speaker 1: lot of now modern political party, the demonization of so 1105 01:01:04,560 --> 01:01:07,480 Speaker 1: many brown people this idea of like the quote unquote 1106 01:01:07,480 --> 01:01:10,840 Speaker 1: illegal immigrant who's like mooching off the American system. And 1107 01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:12,880 Speaker 1: I'm like, does is anyone going to talk about the 1108 01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:16,840 Speaker 1: fact that undocumented people put billions of dollars into the U. S. 1109 01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:20,439 Speaker 1: Economy every year and and are paying taxes, and are 1110 01:01:20,840 --> 01:01:24,480 Speaker 1: are are paying into services they're actually not allowed to 1111 01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:29,160 Speaker 1: benefit from. Yeah, And and I was like, Wow, they've 1112 01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:31,400 Speaker 1: really just been at it for so long, like the 1113 01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:34,840 Speaker 1: powers that be have been at the demonization of the 1114 01:01:34,880 --> 01:01:38,000 Speaker 1: people who they want to oppress the most were so 1115 01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:42,240 Speaker 1: long and they're still using the same playbook and just 1116 01:01:42,320 --> 01:01:44,840 Speaker 1: applying it to different groups over and over and over 1117 01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:49,280 Speaker 1: and over again. Yeah. That was really that was really 1118 01:01:49,400 --> 01:01:53,720 Speaker 1: so just jarring to me. Yeah, it's you know, it's 1119 01:01:53,800 --> 01:01:57,080 Speaker 1: it when you it went again to right, it's it 1120 01:01:57,160 --> 01:01:59,920 Speaker 1: really is about doing the research. Right, Like most people 1121 01:02:00,320 --> 01:02:03,720 Speaker 1: live distracted lives, right, and so they're not questioning what 1122 01:02:03,800 --> 01:02:05,920 Speaker 1: they're being taught, like you know, like they're just accepting 1123 01:02:05,960 --> 01:02:08,160 Speaker 1: it to be truth. But when you actually do the 1124 01:02:08,280 --> 01:02:12,280 Speaker 1: independent investigation and you actually do the research, like you 1125 01:02:12,360 --> 01:02:15,120 Speaker 1: really realize like how much of a mind funk this 1126 01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:18,919 Speaker 1: really is. And it also once again it was for me, 1127 01:02:19,120 --> 01:02:22,240 Speaker 1: it continues to remind me the power of the mind, 1128 01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:25,720 Speaker 1: Like if you can control someone's mind, it's a rap, 1129 01:02:26,320 --> 01:02:28,840 Speaker 1: you know, like it really really is. And so it's 1130 01:02:29,160 --> 01:02:33,200 Speaker 1: it's really understanding, um, which is why I'm like the 1131 01:02:33,240 --> 01:02:35,560 Speaker 1: fact that we don't teach about mental health and schools 1132 01:02:35,640 --> 01:02:37,840 Speaker 1: and the power of the minding schools. I think it's 1133 01:02:37,880 --> 01:02:40,280 Speaker 1: very intentional, Like you don't want people to understand that 1134 01:02:40,360 --> 01:02:42,400 Speaker 1: full power because if they did, you will have what 1135 01:02:42,440 --> 01:02:44,360 Speaker 1: we're having right now, which is an uprising. So for me, 1136 01:02:44,400 --> 01:02:46,960 Speaker 1: this pandemic set a stage for us, whether it was 1137 01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:50,240 Speaker 1: conscious or unconsciously, because we were shut in, Like you 1138 01:02:50,320 --> 01:02:52,280 Speaker 1: had no choice but to really do the work and 1139 01:02:52,320 --> 01:02:54,720 Speaker 1: self reflect. You had no choice but to get quiet. 1140 01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:57,240 Speaker 1: You had no choice but to question how is our 1141 01:02:57,240 --> 01:02:59,520 Speaker 1: government not prepared for this? Like why are so many 1142 01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:02,920 Speaker 1: people so frame? And it laid the foundation for this 1143 01:03:03,040 --> 01:03:05,240 Speaker 1: uprising that happened, you know, and now people are like, 1144 01:03:05,360 --> 01:03:07,840 Speaker 1: I'm fed the funk up, Like and no, I see 1145 01:03:07,960 --> 01:03:10,400 Speaker 1: right through this ship now, like the bill has been lifted. 1146 01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:13,160 Speaker 1: And so as much as you know this pandemic has 1147 01:03:13,200 --> 01:03:15,680 Speaker 1: been unfortunate for so many, it's also a blessing in 1148 01:03:15,720 --> 01:03:19,560 Speaker 1: disguise m And I love that because it it makes 1149 01:03:19,560 --> 01:03:22,600 Speaker 1: me think of what Dr Patricia Hill Collins says in 1150 01:03:22,640 --> 01:03:26,160 Speaker 1: your movie that publicly it's such a good quote. I 1151 01:03:26,200 --> 01:03:28,040 Speaker 1: was like, God, if I was Oprah Winfrey on my show, 1152 01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:29,480 Speaker 1: I'd be like tweet it, like and do you know 1153 01:03:29,520 --> 01:03:31,960 Speaker 1: if anybody has a great quote, that's my favorite thing, 1154 01:03:32,040 --> 01:03:34,000 Speaker 1: she says, And like, one day I just want Oprah 1155 01:03:34,040 --> 01:03:37,280 Speaker 1: to hear me say something and be like tweet it. Um. 1156 01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:42,560 Speaker 1: But but when when Dr hill Collins says publicly articulating 1157 01:03:42,680 --> 01:03:48,200 Speaker 1: rage typically constitutes less a revelation about oppression than a 1158 01:03:48,320 --> 01:03:53,120 Speaker 1: discovery of voice, I'm going to say it again because 1159 01:03:53,120 --> 01:03:54,640 Speaker 1: I know somebody at home is like, wait, wait, wait, 1160 01:03:54,680 --> 01:03:59,520 Speaker 1: that was brilliant. Obviously she is brilliant. Publicly articulating rage 1161 01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:04,720 Speaker 1: tiply constitutes less a revelation about oppression than a discovery 1162 01:04:04,800 --> 01:04:09,720 Speaker 1: of voice. So many people, to your point, in this 1163 01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:14,360 Speaker 1: time at home, have had so much about oppression revealed 1164 01:04:14,400 --> 01:04:19,520 Speaker 1: to them that they are discovering their voices. And it 1165 01:04:19,680 --> 01:04:22,920 Speaker 1: is such a beautiful thing to watch. And and as 1166 01:04:22,960 --> 01:04:25,920 Speaker 1: you talk about, you know these sections of of your 1167 01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:31,360 Speaker 1: movie hurt and resiliency and and beauty, there there is 1168 01:04:31,400 --> 01:04:36,000 Speaker 1: a beauty I think in the reclamation of to your point, 1169 01:04:36,080 --> 01:04:41,400 Speaker 1: your power, your mind, your your mental state. Yeah, I 1170 01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:44,160 Speaker 1: mean I think it's true. Like and you know, making 1171 01:04:44,200 --> 01:04:47,280 Speaker 1: this documentary hit a home for me, Like I I mean, 1172 01:04:47,280 --> 01:04:49,560 Speaker 1: I was dream about the mental health from the rooftop, 1173 01:04:49,600 --> 01:04:51,080 Speaker 1: from this day and to the day I die, because 1174 01:04:51,120 --> 01:04:54,680 Speaker 1: I really understand the importance of it and the power 1175 01:04:54,800 --> 01:04:59,160 Speaker 1: of it um and I just want people to awaken 1176 01:04:59,200 --> 01:05:02,040 Speaker 1: to that, you know, Like, like what we're doing now, 1177 01:05:02,160 --> 01:05:04,880 Speaker 1: like all the change that is happening now is because 1178 01:05:04,920 --> 01:05:08,200 Speaker 1: people are rediscovering their voice and they're understanding that they 1179 01:05:08,240 --> 01:05:10,360 Speaker 1: have a say and what they have to say matters, 1180 01:05:10,720 --> 01:05:12,760 Speaker 1: you know, and it's it's like it's it's a beautiful 1181 01:05:12,760 --> 01:05:15,120 Speaker 1: thing to see, Like it's a beautiful thing to see 1182 01:05:15,440 --> 01:05:18,000 Speaker 1: cities buckling on there at their knees right now and 1183 01:05:18,040 --> 01:05:19,760 Speaker 1: be like, Okay, we'll change it. We'll change it, will 1184 01:05:19,840 --> 01:05:22,680 Speaker 1: change it, you know, because initially, like we forgot that 1185 01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:24,840 Speaker 1: we held the power. We forgot that we are the 1186 01:05:24,880 --> 01:05:27,040 Speaker 1: reason why they are employed, you know, through the but 1187 01:05:27,280 --> 01:05:31,080 Speaker 1: like you know, so it's our exactly, and we will 1188 01:05:31,120 --> 01:05:33,320 Speaker 1: replace you if you don't listen to us, you know. 1189 01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:37,240 Speaker 1: So it's a it's a beautiful thing to be alive 1190 01:05:37,440 --> 01:05:40,000 Speaker 1: at this moment, you know, like it's it's it's remarkable 1191 01:05:40,920 --> 01:05:45,240 Speaker 1: when when you think about where beauty comes from. And 1192 01:05:46,040 --> 01:05:48,680 Speaker 1: I don't want to skip over resiliency actually because because 1193 01:05:48,680 --> 01:05:52,360 Speaker 1: we are talking about resilience has such a pillar of 1194 01:05:52,360 --> 01:05:57,200 Speaker 1: your film, and and the resilience, the resiliency of black 1195 01:05:57,240 --> 01:06:02,919 Speaker 1: women is beautiful, and you touch on why it can 1196 01:06:03,080 --> 01:06:10,280 Speaker 1: risk fet fettization and and be dangerous also because then 1197 01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:12,760 Speaker 1: there can be this idea of what, we're so resilient 1198 01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:17,200 Speaker 1: that you know, we don't need much from you. How 1199 01:06:18,160 --> 01:06:21,400 Speaker 1: how do you figure out how to balance that? What 1200 01:06:21,440 --> 01:06:25,000 Speaker 1: would you want viewers to be thoughtful about in terms 1201 01:06:25,040 --> 01:06:28,680 Speaker 1: of the way they view the resiliency of black women. 1202 01:06:30,120 --> 01:06:32,120 Speaker 1: You know, that's a complex question because, like you said, 1203 01:06:32,160 --> 01:06:36,200 Speaker 1: like resiliency, it's it's used as a double edged sword 1204 01:06:36,520 --> 01:06:38,840 Speaker 1: for black women, right, Like it's that notion of like, 1205 01:06:39,360 --> 01:06:42,120 Speaker 1: you're so resilient, you'll get through this. But there's also 1206 01:06:42,280 --> 01:06:44,360 Speaker 1: that notion, as you said, where it's like you're so 1207 01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:46,120 Speaker 1: resilient that we don't have to worry about how we 1208 01:06:46,160 --> 01:06:50,160 Speaker 1: treat you, you know, And so it's this idea of 1209 01:06:50,160 --> 01:06:52,680 Speaker 1: of seeing women through Black women through the gaze of 1210 01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:56,760 Speaker 1: being superhuman, and it's like we're not, you know, like 1211 01:06:57,360 --> 01:06:59,640 Speaker 1: for most of the for most of us, we have 1212 01:06:59,720 --> 01:07:02,040 Speaker 1: no choice. So it's not it's not even about like 1213 01:07:02,120 --> 01:07:04,600 Speaker 1: we want to be resilient, to be strong, like you 1214 01:07:04,680 --> 01:07:07,240 Speaker 1: have no choice. And an example of that is when 1215 01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:10,240 Speaker 1: you in the film you know Helen Helen Jones, you know, 1216 01:07:10,360 --> 01:07:13,920 Speaker 1: like who lost her son, John Horton, who you know, 1217 01:07:14,040 --> 01:07:16,520 Speaker 1: her son was an Ac County Jelan was murdered um 1218 01:07:16,560 --> 01:07:20,080 Speaker 1: by l a County um Sheriff's department, um in prison 1219 01:07:20,120 --> 01:07:22,800 Speaker 1: and they try to stage it as a suicide, you know, 1220 01:07:23,040 --> 01:07:26,960 Speaker 1: and you know the resiliency of her and just the 1221 01:07:27,040 --> 01:07:29,200 Speaker 1: strength of who she is, like she had no choice, 1222 01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:32,920 Speaker 1: you know, she lost her son and she had no choice, 1223 01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,400 Speaker 1: Like she couldn't buckle down and just give in to 1224 01:07:35,480 --> 01:07:37,120 Speaker 1: what they told her to be true when she knew 1225 01:07:37,160 --> 01:07:39,240 Speaker 1: what they were saying was a lie. She had no 1226 01:07:39,400 --> 01:07:41,760 Speaker 1: choice but to fight that they would be held accountable 1227 01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:44,400 Speaker 1: because she wasn't gonna seek justice. Justice will be John 1228 01:07:44,480 --> 01:07:47,880 Speaker 1: still being alive, right, So she had to fight for accountability. 1229 01:07:47,880 --> 01:07:50,840 Speaker 1: And ten years later she's still fighting for that accountability. 1230 01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:53,520 Speaker 1: And not only she still fighting for that accountability. She 1231 01:07:53,640 --> 01:07:57,120 Speaker 1: now shows up to families who have lost their sons 1232 01:07:57,200 --> 01:08:00,000 Speaker 1: and daughters to police brutality to help them navigate how 1233 01:08:00,040 --> 01:08:01,760 Speaker 1: their first day is going to go, to help them 1234 01:08:01,840 --> 01:08:03,800 Speaker 1: navigat how that first month and year is going to go. 1235 01:08:03,880 --> 01:08:05,640 Speaker 1: And I had to ask it, like, how do you 1236 01:08:05,720 --> 01:08:08,400 Speaker 1: do that? You not feel like you're reliving John's death 1237 01:08:08,520 --> 01:08:10,800 Speaker 1: every time you meet a new family and go through that, 1238 01:08:11,200 --> 01:08:12,600 Speaker 1: And you know, she was like, of course I do, 1239 01:08:13,160 --> 01:08:15,120 Speaker 1: and it's hard, But I also know what it felt 1240 01:08:15,120 --> 01:08:17,799 Speaker 1: like ten years ago when Black Lives Matter did not exist. 1241 01:08:18,040 --> 01:08:19,920 Speaker 1: I also know what it felt like in that moment 1242 01:08:19,920 --> 01:08:22,320 Speaker 1: when I found out not having anyone walk me through 1243 01:08:22,320 --> 01:08:25,599 Speaker 1: those moments. And I wouldn't wish that on any anybody else. 1244 01:08:26,000 --> 01:08:27,960 Speaker 1: And so it's not a it's not a matter of 1245 01:08:28,200 --> 01:08:30,560 Speaker 1: choice when it comes to the resiliency and strength of 1246 01:08:30,560 --> 01:08:33,200 Speaker 1: black women. Most of the times, it's a you have 1247 01:08:33,200 --> 01:08:36,800 Speaker 1: no option, right, And it does strike me that again, 1248 01:08:36,800 --> 01:08:41,320 Speaker 1: it's a reclamation, you know, for her to say, no 1249 01:08:41,360 --> 01:08:45,320 Speaker 1: matter what, when I see a black man murdered by 1250 01:08:45,320 --> 01:08:48,120 Speaker 1: the police on TV, that's going to re traumatize me. 1251 01:08:48,360 --> 01:08:52,479 Speaker 1: I can either sit and fall apart in that pain 1252 01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:55,040 Speaker 1: or use it, use it as a fuel to do 1253 01:08:55,160 --> 01:08:59,920 Speaker 1: something about it. You know, my my friend Glenn and Doyle, 1254 01:09:00,040 --> 01:09:02,800 Speaker 1: who does a lot of you know work calling white 1255 01:09:02,840 --> 01:09:05,960 Speaker 1: women into this space, always says like, what is your 1256 01:09:06,040 --> 01:09:09,519 Speaker 1: sacred rage? And I think about that for mothers, I 1257 01:09:09,560 --> 01:09:13,200 Speaker 1: think about that, for victims of assault. I think about 1258 01:09:13,240 --> 01:09:16,559 Speaker 1: that like it is a sacred rage to know that 1259 01:09:16,600 --> 01:09:19,960 Speaker 1: there will be no justice, but that you can perhaps 1260 01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:23,920 Speaker 1: help to create justice for another out of the thing 1261 01:09:23,960 --> 01:09:27,960 Speaker 1: that should have never happened to you. And I would 1262 01:09:28,000 --> 01:09:30,720 Speaker 1: be remiss as we speak about her case to not 1263 01:09:31,240 --> 01:09:33,880 Speaker 1: remind any listeners who are tuned in right now who 1264 01:09:33,960 --> 01:09:36,960 Speaker 1: live in l A or l A County that what 1265 01:09:37,960 --> 01:09:41,000 Speaker 1: the l A County d A's race has been called 1266 01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:45,520 Speaker 1: the second most important race, second only to the presidency. 1267 01:09:45,800 --> 01:09:48,360 Speaker 1: Jackie Lacey is up for reelection. She has been a 1268 01:09:48,479 --> 01:09:51,840 Speaker 1: terrible DA to this city. Not a single police officer 1269 01:09:51,920 --> 01:09:54,799 Speaker 1: has been prosecuted for the murders of six and eighteen 1270 01:09:54,840 --> 01:09:58,920 Speaker 1: black people in l A since she took office. These 1271 01:09:58,960 --> 01:10:01,000 Speaker 1: are the kinds of cases where talking about people being 1272 01:10:01,080 --> 01:10:04,160 Speaker 1: murdered in police custody with evidence that they were murdered. 1273 01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:08,799 Speaker 1: This is a a tragedy and an insult to justice. 1274 01:10:08,920 --> 01:10:11,840 Speaker 1: And so please, if you live in Los Angeles, look 1275 01:10:12,240 --> 01:10:16,519 Speaker 1: into the d a's race. Make sure you know who 1276 01:10:16,560 --> 01:10:18,840 Speaker 1: you're voting for. Make sure you know what we are 1277 01:10:18,920 --> 01:10:21,680 Speaker 1: up against. You know, when when the people at b 1278 01:10:21,920 --> 01:10:23,840 Speaker 1: L M l A Are saying Jackie Lacy has got 1279 01:10:23,840 --> 01:10:27,000 Speaker 1: to go, they mean it, and and it's our job 1280 01:10:27,040 --> 01:10:29,280 Speaker 1: to be on board and make sure that she does. 1281 01:10:29,439 --> 01:10:32,120 Speaker 1: Because if we don't have somebody in that position who 1282 01:10:32,120 --> 01:10:36,000 Speaker 1: holds people accountable, not only does it not create change here, 1283 01:10:36,120 --> 01:10:39,040 Speaker 1: but the d AS race here is set to set 1284 01:10:39,040 --> 01:10:43,280 Speaker 1: the stage for DAS races and practices across America. We 1285 01:10:43,360 --> 01:10:45,120 Speaker 1: have to lead on this, and the only way we 1286 01:10:45,200 --> 01:10:48,519 Speaker 1: lead on this is if, as og you just said, like, 1287 01:10:48,680 --> 01:10:51,439 Speaker 1: we remind these people that they work for us, and 1288 01:10:51,479 --> 01:10:54,880 Speaker 1: we will replace them if they do not demand justice 1289 01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:57,480 Speaker 1: on behalf of the people. It's it's our job to 1290 01:10:57,479 --> 01:11:00,479 Speaker 1: to replace this person with a new d A. I agree, 1291 01:11:00,520 --> 01:11:03,080 Speaker 1: and you know I think once again too, like you know, 1292 01:11:03,200 --> 01:11:04,960 Speaker 1: like our call. You know, the call of action is 1293 01:11:04,960 --> 01:11:07,280 Speaker 1: to replace Jackue Lacey. But do the research, you know, 1294 01:11:07,400 --> 01:11:10,960 Speaker 1: follow b LM b L M l A, UM, follow 1295 01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:13,760 Speaker 1: Dr Lenov Duel, who's leading a charge on that you know, 1296 01:11:14,160 --> 01:11:17,080 Speaker 1: show up to the protests that happens every Wednesday. Helen 1297 01:11:17,160 --> 01:11:19,720 Speaker 1: Jones and a lot of the mothers of these of 1298 01:11:19,800 --> 01:11:23,200 Speaker 1: these plain kids show up to Jack You Lacey's office 1299 01:11:23,360 --> 01:11:28,120 Speaker 1: every Wednesday for years now, every Wednesday, demanding justice, demanding 1300 01:11:28,200 --> 01:11:31,599 Speaker 1: she held these cops responsible. UM so join that, join 1301 01:11:31,640 --> 01:11:34,639 Speaker 1: the organization of that joined the protests and that um 1302 01:11:34,680 --> 01:11:37,680 Speaker 1: but also to vote Jack You Lacey out, like she 1303 01:11:37,760 --> 01:11:41,080 Speaker 1: has to go, like there is no other option. Yes, 1304 01:11:41,160 --> 01:11:44,479 Speaker 1: And this this is one of the things I love 1305 01:11:44,520 --> 01:11:45,920 Speaker 1: that you touch on in the movie, as well as 1306 01:11:45,920 --> 01:11:49,040 Speaker 1: the possibility for everyday activism. And this is one of 1307 01:11:49,040 --> 01:11:52,439 Speaker 1: those possibilities. This is a place where you can put 1308 01:11:52,479 --> 01:11:56,519 Speaker 1: activism into your every day and and we have to 1309 01:11:56,680 --> 01:12:03,600 Speaker 1: center families. It's it's such an incredibly important place to start. Yeah, 1310 01:12:03,680 --> 01:12:05,880 Speaker 1: And it's you know, it's it's it's also an easy 1311 01:12:06,000 --> 01:12:07,840 Speaker 1: like if you can't, if you can't, because I also 1312 01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:10,719 Speaker 1: get to like, you know, activism looks different for everyone. 1313 01:12:10,920 --> 01:12:13,160 Speaker 1: You know, like your form isn't you know, to be 1314 01:12:13,240 --> 01:12:16,160 Speaker 1: there in person and protests and march with these families, 1315 01:12:16,200 --> 01:12:18,840 Speaker 1: like share share the information on social media, you know, 1316 01:12:18,920 --> 01:12:21,080 Speaker 1: talk to people in your community about it. Get your 1317 01:12:21,120 --> 01:12:23,040 Speaker 1: friends that live in l A County, the sign up, 1318 01:12:23,040 --> 01:12:25,280 Speaker 1: a rest of the vote. There's so many different ways 1319 01:12:25,280 --> 01:12:27,759 Speaker 1: that you can contribute to the conversation, into the movement, 1320 01:12:28,080 --> 01:12:29,680 Speaker 1: you know. But at the end of the day, I 1321 01:12:29,720 --> 01:12:32,680 Speaker 1: think the north star is that Jackie Lacy has to 1322 01:12:32,680 --> 01:12:36,639 Speaker 1: go yes. And we need to remember that we truly 1323 01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:40,479 Speaker 1: as a constituency or in this together, and we have 1324 01:12:40,600 --> 01:12:43,920 Speaker 1: to show up for each other, agree like this idea 1325 01:12:44,040 --> 01:12:47,200 Speaker 1: that that person over there their issue, where their fight 1326 01:12:47,360 --> 01:12:49,120 Speaker 1: is not my fight. It's like this is all of 1327 01:12:49,160 --> 01:12:53,160 Speaker 1: our fight. Yes, these are our communities, these are our people, 1328 01:12:53,320 --> 01:12:56,000 Speaker 1: these are our neighbors, these are our taxpayer dollars at 1329 01:12:56,000 --> 01:12:59,360 Speaker 1: work that are either supporting people are torturing people, Like 1330 01:12:59,640 --> 01:13:04,559 Speaker 1: it is our issue and and that it's it's in 1331 01:13:04,680 --> 01:13:08,640 Speaker 1: that that I that I do find that spark, that 1332 01:13:08,800 --> 01:13:13,040 Speaker 1: kind of that beauty of inspiration, like of possibility of 1333 01:13:13,160 --> 01:13:15,479 Speaker 1: the places that we can go if we go together. 1334 01:13:16,479 --> 01:13:19,839 Speaker 1: When when you move from the sort of beauty of 1335 01:13:20,000 --> 01:13:25,480 Speaker 1: activist possibility into actual the actual highlighting of the beauty 1336 01:13:25,720 --> 01:13:29,599 Speaker 1: like beauty industry, beauty of black women in the movie, 1337 01:13:30,720 --> 01:13:35,280 Speaker 1: does that also feel like a reclamation of space? Um? Yeah, 1338 01:13:35,360 --> 01:13:37,160 Speaker 1: because you know, for me, it was about creating a 1339 01:13:37,200 --> 01:13:40,160 Speaker 1: space where black women were celebrated in all of their glory, 1340 01:13:40,720 --> 01:13:42,880 Speaker 1: right it was it was it was creating a space 1341 01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:47,280 Speaker 1: where you know, the physical attributes which have been deemed 1342 01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:50,960 Speaker 1: for so long to be so unattractive, was then was 1343 01:13:51,040 --> 01:13:53,760 Speaker 1: now given a space to be celebrated like and I 1344 01:13:53,760 --> 01:13:56,000 Speaker 1: mean it, it recently has been celebrated because people pay 1345 01:13:56,040 --> 01:13:58,280 Speaker 1: to get those things done. But I wanted to create 1346 01:13:58,320 --> 01:14:00,920 Speaker 1: space for you know, black women and um to be 1347 01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:05,240 Speaker 1: celebrated for those attributes. And so, you know, filming that 1348 01:14:05,320 --> 01:14:07,400 Speaker 1: was actually too one of the most powerful moments because 1349 01:14:07,400 --> 01:14:10,200 Speaker 1: so many of those women after filming just broke down 1350 01:14:10,280 --> 01:14:11,960 Speaker 1: crying when we had cut because they were just like, 1351 01:14:12,439 --> 01:14:15,240 Speaker 1: I've never been able to say to myself that, you know, 1352 01:14:15,400 --> 01:14:17,800 Speaker 1: my full lips are beautiful. I've never had anyone to 1353 01:14:17,840 --> 01:14:20,760 Speaker 1: repeat back to me that my kinky hair was beautiful. 1354 01:14:21,080 --> 01:14:23,840 Speaker 1: And you know, they would break down crying, and then 1355 01:14:23,840 --> 01:14:26,040 Speaker 1: like I would break down crying. And you know, in 1356 01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:28,040 Speaker 1: the process of it, which is in the in the 1357 01:14:28,040 --> 01:14:30,599 Speaker 1: film you'll see, is that I had them look themselves 1358 01:14:30,640 --> 01:14:33,360 Speaker 1: in the mirror and and talk to themselves, you know, 1359 01:14:33,400 --> 01:14:36,639 Speaker 1: because I think that's a very very powerful practice, and 1360 01:14:37,640 --> 01:14:39,920 Speaker 1: every single one without fail. We had to we we 1361 01:14:39,960 --> 01:14:42,599 Speaker 1: had to shoot it like multiple times because not only 1362 01:14:42,640 --> 01:14:45,040 Speaker 1: had they not done that before most people don't do that, 1363 01:14:45,280 --> 01:14:47,559 Speaker 1: but they were like, this is hard, you know, because 1364 01:14:47,600 --> 01:14:49,960 Speaker 1: I don't think that I'm that beautiful? Are I don't 1365 01:14:49,960 --> 01:14:52,400 Speaker 1: think that like my lips are beautiful. I don't think 1366 01:14:52,439 --> 01:14:54,920 Speaker 1: that my nose is small enough. Like it was all 1367 01:14:54,920 --> 01:14:56,920 Speaker 1: these different things that they kept saying they didn't think 1368 01:14:56,920 --> 01:14:59,280 Speaker 1: to be true, and I had to create a space 1369 01:14:59,320 --> 01:15:01,559 Speaker 1: to empower gonna be like, okay, but what is beautiful 1370 01:15:01,560 --> 01:15:04,040 Speaker 1: about you? You know, like what would you tell your 1371 01:15:04,080 --> 01:15:07,400 Speaker 1: fourteen year old self now? And it was healing and 1372 01:15:07,439 --> 01:15:09,760 Speaker 1: therapeutic for not only them, but for me as well, 1373 01:15:10,360 --> 01:15:13,400 Speaker 1: you know, because it made you realize like how deeply 1374 01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:17,559 Speaker 1: ingrained these stereotypes have been for us, you know, like 1375 01:15:17,600 --> 01:15:20,200 Speaker 1: even when you think that like you're surpassive and you're like, 1376 01:15:20,280 --> 01:15:22,320 Speaker 1: I don't I don't agree with that, Like you can 1377 01:15:22,360 --> 01:15:24,160 Speaker 1: call me all go digger, Well for a queen, I'm over. 1378 01:15:24,200 --> 01:15:25,960 Speaker 1: I know who I am. But when it comes to 1379 01:15:26,040 --> 01:15:30,880 Speaker 1: really confronting yourself, how that could be very challenging mm hmm. 1380 01:15:31,600 --> 01:15:36,679 Speaker 1: And and in a world where everywhere we look, women 1381 01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:38,840 Speaker 1: are told there are not enough of this or too 1382 01:15:38,960 --> 01:15:41,320 Speaker 1: much of that, or not tall enough or not then enough, 1383 01:15:41,439 --> 01:15:46,120 Speaker 1: or not strong enough or not it's it's relentless, and 1384 01:15:46,360 --> 01:15:50,679 Speaker 1: it's relentless for women through the lens of a beauty 1385 01:15:50,680 --> 01:15:54,599 Speaker 1: industry that has historically only elevated ideals of European beauty. 1386 01:15:55,920 --> 01:15:59,120 Speaker 1: So again, I think about I think about the chart, 1387 01:15:59,200 --> 01:16:01,600 Speaker 1: I think about the ultiple arrows that point at the 1388 01:16:01,640 --> 01:16:06,439 Speaker 1: experience of black women every day. I wonder because we 1389 01:16:06,479 --> 01:16:09,920 Speaker 1: are at this interesting point, as you mentioned, where the 1390 01:16:10,000 --> 01:16:13,120 Speaker 1: veil has come off, where so many people are really 1391 01:16:13,120 --> 01:16:18,200 Speaker 1: looking at the reality of this stuff clearly, and and 1392 01:16:18,400 --> 01:16:25,000 Speaker 1: so many white people are realizing what the experiences look 1393 01:16:25,120 --> 01:16:27,840 Speaker 1: like for black people in America. And I think so 1394 01:16:27,880 --> 01:16:33,200 Speaker 1: many white women are I hope and I pray really 1395 01:16:33,479 --> 01:16:37,599 Speaker 1: considering what the experiences of being black women in America 1396 01:16:37,640 --> 01:16:41,600 Speaker 1: are for our neighbors, like what is your what what 1397 01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:45,679 Speaker 1: makes you hopeful? And what what's your hope for people 1398 01:16:45,720 --> 01:16:49,720 Speaker 1: who watch this film, you know, what are what are 1399 01:16:49,760 --> 01:16:54,240 Speaker 1: you hoping? Is? Is the aha moment as they experienced 1400 01:16:54,280 --> 01:16:58,160 Speaker 1: this with you? Um well, what makes me hopeful is 1401 01:16:58,840 --> 01:17:01,760 Speaker 1: this space that we're in collectively at the moment. I 1402 01:17:01,800 --> 01:17:05,280 Speaker 1: think that because of you know, like I said, the pandemic, 1403 01:17:05,320 --> 01:17:08,360 Speaker 1: that has set the stage for deep reflection and self awareness. 1404 01:17:08,720 --> 01:17:11,880 Speaker 1: What makes me hopeful is that people are now more 1405 01:17:12,000 --> 01:17:15,080 Speaker 1: open to the re education. People are now more open 1406 01:17:15,160 --> 01:17:19,439 Speaker 1: and receptive to reimagining what's possible. So those aspects make 1407 01:17:19,520 --> 01:17:22,639 Speaker 1: me hopeful. What I hope that people, you know, take 1408 01:17:22,680 --> 01:17:24,880 Speaker 1: away from the film of the ah Ha Moment is 1409 01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:27,599 Speaker 1: a little bit too fold. Um. The first is that 1410 01:17:28,160 --> 01:17:31,599 Speaker 1: I hope that people truly walk away from this film 1411 01:17:31,720 --> 01:17:35,640 Speaker 1: understanding deeply the contributions Black women have made to this society, 1412 01:17:35,920 --> 01:17:39,640 Speaker 1: and that people start to hold space and reverence for 1413 01:17:39,720 --> 01:17:42,760 Speaker 1: black women, um and their contributions. And then the other 1414 01:17:42,800 --> 01:17:45,120 Speaker 1: thing is that, you know, I hope that it serves 1415 01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:48,320 Speaker 1: as hope, that it serves as a re education two people. 1416 01:17:48,720 --> 01:17:52,479 Speaker 1: And in that regard, for me, there is no one 1417 01:17:52,560 --> 01:17:54,439 Speaker 1: answer on what the call to action is because I 1418 01:17:54,479 --> 01:17:59,040 Speaker 1: think it takes someone doing that independent investigation themselves and 1419 01:17:59,120 --> 01:18:01,320 Speaker 1: doing the work because what I need as a black 1420 01:18:01,360 --> 01:18:03,360 Speaker 1: woman may would be completely different than what the next 1421 01:18:03,360 --> 01:18:06,160 Speaker 1: black woman needs. But I think that if you walk 1422 01:18:06,200 --> 01:18:08,400 Speaker 1: away from this film with a deeper understanding of black 1423 01:18:08,400 --> 01:18:12,320 Speaker 1: woman's history and a deeper understand of how once privilege 1424 01:18:12,360 --> 01:18:14,240 Speaker 1: may play a role in that that you will do 1425 01:18:14,280 --> 01:18:16,800 Speaker 1: the self work to figure out like how you can 1426 01:18:16,800 --> 01:18:19,120 Speaker 1: show up better, and in doing that, I think the 1427 01:18:19,160 --> 01:18:21,599 Speaker 1: answers will come. I don't think there's just one collective 1428 01:18:21,600 --> 01:18:24,840 Speaker 1: answer on what that looks like. I think it'll look 1429 01:18:24,920 --> 01:18:28,160 Speaker 1: like many different things from many different people. Um. But 1430 01:18:28,200 --> 01:18:31,040 Speaker 1: I think the first step is people doing the work 1431 01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:35,040 Speaker 1: mm hmm. Something that a friend of mine told me 1432 01:18:35,120 --> 01:18:36,880 Speaker 1: that she did this week, which I loved, and I 1433 01:18:36,920 --> 01:18:38,799 Speaker 1: was like, Oh, I'm gonna put it on the podcast. 1434 01:18:39,520 --> 01:18:42,479 Speaker 1: She said that because so much of what has been 1435 01:18:42,520 --> 01:18:45,479 Speaker 1: shared in this time, so many people are sharing these 1436 01:18:45,479 --> 01:18:50,360 Speaker 1: incredible Google docs of anti racism resources, resources and and 1437 01:18:50,800 --> 01:18:54,400 Speaker 1: reading lists and things, she took one of the she 1438 01:18:54,600 --> 01:18:56,479 Speaker 1: sort of compiled a list from a bunch of the 1439 01:18:56,520 --> 01:18:58,960 Speaker 1: reading lists she looked at, and she took it and 1440 01:19:00,000 --> 01:19:03,280 Speaker 1: all the head of the school she attended for junior 1441 01:19:03,360 --> 01:19:05,600 Speaker 1: high in high school and said, I know none of 1442 01:19:05,600 --> 01:19:07,120 Speaker 1: these books were on the reading list when I went 1443 01:19:07,160 --> 01:19:08,880 Speaker 1: to school there, but how many of them are now? 1444 01:19:09,320 --> 01:19:11,320 Speaker 1: And how many days do I have to call you 1445 01:19:11,360 --> 01:19:14,240 Speaker 1: in a row until you start changing your curriculum? And 1446 01:19:14,320 --> 01:19:16,240 Speaker 1: I was just like there it is, you know. And 1447 01:19:16,280 --> 01:19:18,760 Speaker 1: I thought about that, and I thought, how many of 1448 01:19:18,840 --> 01:19:24,080 Speaker 1: us have the opportunity, even in you know, whatever our 1449 01:19:24,120 --> 01:19:26,599 Speaker 1: little sphere of influence might be, to call the school 1450 01:19:26,600 --> 01:19:28,800 Speaker 1: that we attended and say, hey, I want to know 1451 01:19:28,840 --> 01:19:32,400 Speaker 1: what's on your reading curriculum. And prime example of what 1452 01:19:32,439 --> 01:19:34,479 Speaker 1: I mean, like there's no one called to action. But 1453 01:19:34,520 --> 01:19:37,920 Speaker 1: because she's been exposed to this new re education and 1454 01:19:38,000 --> 01:19:40,400 Speaker 1: she did the work of self reflecting, like Okay, what 1455 01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:42,840 Speaker 1: does showing up look like for me, she came up 1456 01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:44,840 Speaker 1: with the idea to go and do that, right, So 1457 01:19:44,840 --> 01:19:47,000 Speaker 1: that's what I'm saying, Like it takes people doing the 1458 01:19:47,040 --> 01:19:49,400 Speaker 1: work and then those answers will show what was it 1459 01:19:49,400 --> 01:19:51,840 Speaker 1: looks different for everybody, Like I would never even about 1460 01:19:51,880 --> 01:19:54,240 Speaker 1: to do that, Like that's incredible, you know, and I 1461 01:19:54,320 --> 01:19:56,640 Speaker 1: love it. And and to your point also about if 1462 01:19:56,680 --> 01:19:58,400 Speaker 1: you're an l A resident, you can come to these 1463 01:19:58,400 --> 01:20:01,559 Speaker 1: protests on Wednesday mornings. People might not have known that 1464 01:20:01,600 --> 01:20:04,719 Speaker 1: there are so many things to do, but I think 1465 01:20:04,760 --> 01:20:09,840 Speaker 1: that this kind of place is where you start, you know, 1466 01:20:09,920 --> 01:20:13,360 Speaker 1: you come to this film, you begin your re education 1467 01:20:14,040 --> 01:20:16,760 Speaker 1: you and then you have this sort of illumination of 1468 01:20:16,800 --> 01:20:19,240 Speaker 1: your experience and the way that you wish it might 1469 01:20:19,240 --> 01:20:21,439 Speaker 1: have been different, the way you see how it could 1470 01:20:21,439 --> 01:20:25,120 Speaker 1: have been more equitable, The way you see how, even 1471 01:20:25,120 --> 01:20:28,920 Speaker 1: if it was unconscious, the way we've been doing things 1472 01:20:29,000 --> 01:20:33,800 Speaker 1: has been upholding this system. And why wouldn't we look 1473 01:20:33,880 --> 01:20:37,680 Speaker 1: to change it? Yeah? Because the system, the system that 1474 01:20:37,720 --> 01:20:40,000 Speaker 1: has been so harmful to women who look like you. 1475 01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:43,439 Speaker 1: The great lie is that it has anything for women 1476 01:20:43,479 --> 01:20:46,599 Speaker 1: who look like me. It doesn't have anything for us. 1477 01:20:47,360 --> 01:20:52,280 Speaker 1: A a white supremacist society and exclusively patriarchal society. It 1478 01:20:52,320 --> 01:20:55,479 Speaker 1: doesn't have anything for any of us. It's toxic to everyone. 1479 01:20:56,400 --> 01:20:59,760 Speaker 1: And and my hope is that this removal of a 1480 01:21:00,000 --> 01:21:05,519 Speaker 1: will will will really illuminate other other opportunities, other ways forward, 1481 01:21:05,600 --> 01:21:08,439 Speaker 1: and new opportunities for for a vision of who we 1482 01:21:08,520 --> 01:21:12,680 Speaker 1: can all be going forward. I hope so too. I 1483 01:21:12,760 --> 01:21:15,240 Speaker 1: have one last question for you. It's my favorite thing 1484 01:21:15,280 --> 01:21:20,160 Speaker 1: to ask everybody who comes on the show. The podcast 1485 01:21:20,240 --> 01:21:23,720 Speaker 1: is called work in progress, and I'm curious when you 1486 01:21:23,720 --> 01:21:25,880 Speaker 1: hear the phrase, is there something that comes to mind, 1487 01:21:25,920 --> 01:21:29,880 Speaker 1: if it's personal or professional, or any in any vertical 1488 01:21:29,920 --> 01:21:31,960 Speaker 1: of life, really that that feels like a big work 1489 01:21:32,000 --> 01:21:35,160 Speaker 1: in progress for you right now? Um, I think for me, 1490 01:21:35,640 --> 01:21:38,639 Speaker 1: the work in progress is the healing. Right. I think 1491 01:21:38,680 --> 01:21:41,880 Speaker 1: for me that healing will, for be, will forever be 1492 01:21:41,920 --> 01:21:44,400 Speaker 1: a lifelong journey for me, and I think for most 1493 01:21:44,439 --> 01:21:49,280 Speaker 1: black folks in particular, UM, but for me UM more specifically, 1494 01:21:49,400 --> 01:21:52,120 Speaker 1: I think the work in progress is the healing, because 1495 01:21:52,160 --> 01:21:55,519 Speaker 1: you know, we're, as much as we are reimagining what's 1496 01:21:55,560 --> 01:21:59,360 Speaker 1: possible and working towards a new society, we all sort 1497 01:21:59,360 --> 01:22:01,040 Speaker 1: of still living in the current one that we have, 1498 01:22:01,800 --> 01:22:03,840 Speaker 1: and so we go through these phases where like you're 1499 01:22:03,880 --> 01:22:06,960 Speaker 1: healing and then a week later there's another quelling that's 1500 01:22:06,960 --> 01:22:09,519 Speaker 1: been recorded, and then like you're re traumatized again, right, 1501 01:22:09,560 --> 01:22:11,760 Speaker 1: and then you're like okay, like let me heal through 1502 01:22:11,760 --> 01:22:13,559 Speaker 1: this and figure out like how can I, you know, 1503 01:22:14,080 --> 01:22:16,639 Speaker 1: wrap my mind mentally and emotion around the idea that 1504 01:22:16,720 --> 01:22:19,200 Speaker 1: I'm hunted because of the color of my skin. And 1505 01:22:19,200 --> 01:22:21,679 Speaker 1: then another killing happens. And so for me, I think 1506 01:22:21,760 --> 01:22:25,400 Speaker 1: the work in progress is the healing because not only 1507 01:22:25,439 --> 01:22:28,960 Speaker 1: does it it guide me personally, it guides me professionally 1508 01:22:29,000 --> 01:22:32,320 Speaker 1: as well. UM. It aligns me with what my purposes 1509 01:22:32,720 --> 01:22:35,280 Speaker 1: and the different ways that I can create and the 1510 01:22:35,320 --> 01:22:37,160 Speaker 1: different mediums of what I can create and what that 1511 01:22:37,200 --> 01:22:40,479 Speaker 1: looks like. Um So for me, yeah, it's the it's 1512 01:22:40,479 --> 01:22:46,000 Speaker 1: the healing journey m hm. And is there as we 1513 01:22:46,080 --> 01:22:48,920 Speaker 1: think about calls to action, as we as we think 1514 01:22:48,960 --> 01:22:52,040 Speaker 1: about how we show up for each other in that 1515 01:22:52,280 --> 01:22:55,000 Speaker 1: healing journey and your experience you know, in the world 1516 01:22:55,120 --> 01:22:58,360 Speaker 1: right now, is there any specific kind of support that 1517 01:22:58,479 --> 01:23:02,599 Speaker 1: you need, whether that's from me as a new friend 1518 01:23:03,080 --> 01:23:06,519 Speaker 1: granted through a phone screen, or or from or from 1519 01:23:06,520 --> 01:23:09,880 Speaker 1: our listeners for today's conversation, you know, how how can 1520 01:23:09,920 --> 01:23:14,719 Speaker 1: we best support you? Um? I think the best support 1521 01:23:14,840 --> 01:23:18,200 Speaker 1: that I could cultivate at this moment is a support 1522 01:23:18,240 --> 01:23:21,679 Speaker 1: around the film because even in making this film, it's 1523 01:23:21,680 --> 01:23:24,519 Speaker 1: been unconventional from the very beginning of it even up 1524 01:23:24,520 --> 01:23:26,960 Speaker 1: into the distribution, Like you know, I submitted to festivals 1525 01:23:26,960 --> 01:23:29,280 Speaker 1: and to a few studios and they all were like, 1526 01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:31,960 Speaker 1: this film is phenomenal, what we don't know how to 1527 01:23:32,000 --> 01:23:33,880 Speaker 1: market it or but it doesn't it doesn't work for 1528 01:23:33,960 --> 01:23:36,479 Speaker 1: us late And so I had to take all those 1529 01:23:36,520 --> 01:23:39,040 Speaker 1: rejections and use it as a as a tool as 1530 01:23:39,080 --> 01:23:41,800 Speaker 1: redirection for me to the point where I was like, Okay, well, 1531 01:23:42,080 --> 01:23:44,240 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna teach you why these stories are important. 1532 01:23:44,439 --> 01:23:47,000 Speaker 1: I'm gonna teach you why you should support black filmmakers 1533 01:23:47,000 --> 01:23:50,120 Speaker 1: and black creatives, and so I decided to self distribute, 1534 01:23:50,280 --> 01:23:52,559 Speaker 1: you know. And so for me, like in this moment, 1535 01:23:52,600 --> 01:23:56,000 Speaker 1: as afraid as I am taking this huge leap of faith, 1536 01:23:56,280 --> 01:23:58,400 Speaker 1: the biggest support for me is just spreading the word 1537 01:23:58,439 --> 01:24:00,960 Speaker 1: about the film and having people watch the film, and 1538 01:24:00,960 --> 01:24:04,000 Speaker 1: having people talk about the film and create a grassroot 1539 01:24:04,040 --> 01:24:07,600 Speaker 1: movement around it and hopes that you know, we it 1540 01:24:07,640 --> 01:24:10,920 Speaker 1: plays into the re education of society as a whole um, 1541 01:24:10,960 --> 01:24:12,840 Speaker 1: not just in the fay that we show up, but 1542 01:24:12,880 --> 01:24:15,519 Speaker 1: also in the industry and why it's important to not 1543 01:24:15,560 --> 01:24:18,320 Speaker 1: just support black women but women in general. So for 1544 01:24:18,360 --> 01:24:21,680 Speaker 1: me right now, that is the biggest ask that I 1545 01:24:21,680 --> 01:24:24,599 Speaker 1: could ask if anyone um is to help me cultivate 1546 01:24:24,640 --> 01:24:28,439 Speaker 1: support around the film. Mm hmm, we can do that. 1547 01:24:29,240 --> 01:24:32,640 Speaker 1: Thank you, Yeah, thank you so much. Thank you for 1548 01:24:32,720 --> 01:24:35,920 Speaker 1: taking the time, and and thank you for being willing to, 1549 01:24:37,400 --> 01:24:40,160 Speaker 1: you know, have a conversation that I imagine that in 1550 01:24:40,200 --> 01:24:44,519 Speaker 1: the midst of healing bumps on a lot of wounds. Yeah, 1551 01:24:44,880 --> 01:24:48,679 Speaker 1: but I think is so enlightening for so many people 1552 01:24:48,720 --> 01:24:51,400 Speaker 1: who are sitting at home and and getting to hear 1553 01:24:51,439 --> 01:24:55,960 Speaker 1: you speak, and who probably have so many of the 1554 01:24:56,040 --> 01:24:58,840 Speaker 1: questions you know that that I was able to ask 1555 01:24:58,920 --> 01:25:01,320 Speaker 1: on on you know, my behalf and on the behalf 1556 01:25:01,320 --> 01:25:04,600 Speaker 1: of so many listeners. I realized the privilege of a 1557 01:25:04,600 --> 01:25:07,200 Speaker 1: platform like this where I can ask questions and interview 1558 01:25:07,240 --> 01:25:09,680 Speaker 1: people who so many people don't have the luxury to 1559 01:25:09,800 --> 01:25:13,880 Speaker 1: encounter or ask questions of. And and I know that 1560 01:25:13,920 --> 01:25:16,160 Speaker 1: it's also not always easy to sit and have to 1561 01:25:16,200 --> 01:25:18,479 Speaker 1: answer them over and over and over again when you're 1562 01:25:18,960 --> 01:25:25,439 Speaker 1: promoting something, especially something is as deeply putting to the 1563 01:25:25,479 --> 01:25:29,479 Speaker 1: insides of yourself and the world. Is this so? And 1564 01:25:29,640 --> 01:25:33,320 Speaker 1: just I'm very grateful likewise, and you know, like whenever 1565 01:25:33,600 --> 01:25:35,760 Speaker 1: I think it's food any creative and you know, I 1566 01:25:35,760 --> 01:25:38,360 Speaker 1: think we all are creative, right, but I think you know, 1567 01:25:38,479 --> 01:25:43,639 Speaker 1: when you create something, when you create something that pour 1568 01:25:43,760 --> 01:25:46,160 Speaker 1: your heart and soul into you know, like you guys 1569 01:25:46,240 --> 01:25:50,000 Speaker 1: want people to receive in the way that you intended for, 1570 01:25:50,360 --> 01:25:53,960 Speaker 1: you know, like my life into this, you know. And 1571 01:25:54,000 --> 01:25:58,439 Speaker 1: so I'm I'm deeply grateful for people who see it 1572 01:25:58,479 --> 01:26:01,200 Speaker 1: and receive it in the way is that they do. Um, 1573 01:26:01,240 --> 01:26:03,680 Speaker 1: So thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. 1574 01:26:04,680 --> 01:26:09,000 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. And I I just somewhat crossing 1575 01:26:09,040 --> 01:26:13,200 Speaker 1: my fingers that this well, I know this is going 1576 01:26:13,400 --> 01:26:19,760 Speaker 1: this movie is going to be immeasurably important. And then 1577 01:26:19,800 --> 01:26:22,800 Speaker 1: I'm also crossing my fingers that this pandemic that has 1578 01:26:22,880 --> 01:26:28,479 Speaker 1: us in this wild time is safely over for people soon, 1579 01:26:28,560 --> 01:26:31,280 Speaker 1: and I can come and take a you over class 1580 01:26:31,320 --> 01:26:32,920 Speaker 1: with you and also take you out for a drink, 1581 01:26:32,960 --> 01:26:37,880 Speaker 1: because I would like to properly toast your your work 1582 01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:42,720 Speaker 1: and your soul and what what you've shared. H m hmm, 1583 01:26:43,600 --> 01:26:51,360 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. This show is executive produced by me, 1584 01:26:51,640 --> 01:26:56,519 Speaker 1: Sophia Bush, and sim Sarna. Our supervising producer is Alison Bresnick. 1585 01:26:56,880 --> 01:27:00,439 Speaker 1: Our associate producer is Caate Linley. This episode is edited 1586 01:27:00,479 --> 01:27:03,639 Speaker 1: by Matt Sasaki and our music was written by Jack 1587 01:27:03,680 --> 01:27:06,400 Speaker 1: Garrett and produced by Mark Foster. This show is brought 1588 01:27:06,479 --> 01:27:07,879 Speaker 1: to you by The Brilliant Anatomy