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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us

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Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app, or listen on

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Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 2: New York becomes the center of the political universe today

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Speaker 2: is Speaker McCarthy speaks at the NYSE and the Republican

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Speaker 2: led House Judiciary Committee holds a field hearing in Lower

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Speaker 2: Manhattan not far away on violent crime in the city.

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Speaker 2: We're going to walk you through both of these, Remembering

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Speaker 2: that Kevin McCarthy last met with President Biden on the

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Speaker 2: debt ceiling and the budget process the first of February.

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Speaker 2: It is now the seventeenth of April, and since then

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Speaker 2: the administration has unveiled its budget proposal, but Republicans have not.

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Speaker 2: And while the Speaker promised one by now earlier in

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Speaker 2: the year, he chose to travel to the Stock Exchange

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Speaker 2: today to make a point.

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Speaker 3: Make no mistake, the longer President Biden waits to be

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Speaker 3: sensible to find an agreement, the more likely it becomes

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Speaker 3: that this administration will bumble into the first default in

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Speaker 3: our nation's history.

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Speaker 2: Bumble into default McCarthy making clear he will not deal

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Speaker 2: with the debt ceiling until they reach a deal on spending.

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Speaker 3: A no strings attached debt limit increase will not pass.

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Speaker 3: But since the President continues to hide, House Republicans will

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Speaker 3: take action.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so here's our plan.

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Speaker 3: In the coming weeks, the House will vote on a

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Speaker 3: bill to lift the debt ceiling into the next year,

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Speaker 3: save taxpayers trillions of dollars, make us less dependent upon China,

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Speaker 3: curve our high inflation, all without touching social Security and.

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Speaker 2: Medicare continuing the mantra of reducing spending to fiscal twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty two levels. While a short distance away in Lower Manhattan,

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Speaker 2: the Judiciary Committee opens the field hearing on violent crime,

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Speaker 2: and the city Chairman Jim Jordan swinging early at Manhattan

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Speaker 2: DA Alvin Bragg, of course, recently indicted Donald Trump.

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Speaker 4: In this country, justice is supposed to be blind, regardless

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Speaker 4: of race, religion, or creed. However, here in Manhattan, the

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Speaker 4: scales of justice are weighed down by politics. Rather than

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Speaker 4: enforcing the law, the DA is using his office to

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Speaker 4: do the bidding of left wing campaign funders. He's taken

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Speaker 4: his soft on crime approach to the real.

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Speaker 2: Criminal Senior Congressman Jerry Nadler. They're a Democrat, of course,

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Speaker 2: ranking member on the committee.

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Speaker 5: You're here today in Lower Manhattan for one reason and

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Speaker 5: one reason only. The chairman is doing the bidding of

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Speaker 5: Donald Trump. Commedia Republicans designed this hearing to intimidate and

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Speaker 5: deter the duly elected district Attorney's Manhattan from doing the

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Speaker 5: work as constituents elected him to do.

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Speaker 2: Things did get a little rambunctious and extended period where

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Speaker 2: the Heckler. We'll get to all of that, but let's

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Speaker 2: get to Bloomberg News congressional reporter Billy House, who's in

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Speaker 2: Manhattan for all of this. Billy, thanks for joining. I

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Speaker 2: know you're super busy. Did this Did the speaker of

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Speaker 2: the chairman coordinate on this one big day in New York?

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Speaker 2: Are they going to a ballgame or something?

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Speaker 6: That's that's a great question. I think if they would

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Speaker 6: have coordinated, they wouldn't have done them simultaneously. So yeah,

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Speaker 6: these were these were happening at the same time and

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Speaker 6: kind of stomping on each other's headlines a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. Is Kevin McCarthy's We'll to kind of

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Speaker 2: pick through these quickly. Before we bring in Mia Mcguinnis

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Speaker 2: is Kevin McCarthy trying to spook the market to generate

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Speaker 2: a reaction that will that will force Joe Biden to

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Speaker 2: the to the table. Why speak at the stock exchange.

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Speaker 6: Well, his view is that he's not trying to spook it,

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Speaker 6: but he's trying to alert let them know, and that

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Speaker 6: they should be concerned that there is not going to

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Speaker 6: be a deal unless Republicans and Joe Biden come to

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Speaker 6: the table together and come up with the deal, and

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Speaker 6: that that's not going to happen unless the President, you know,

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Speaker 6: acquiesces on some of his new spending cut stances.

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Speaker 2: Any word on another meeting or is the refrain from

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Speaker 2: the White House? Billy, show us your plan is that

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Speaker 2: nothing's really changed here?

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Speaker 6: Well, actually, House Republicans have had two briefings on their

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Speaker 6: quote unquote plan and have a closed door briefing tomorrow morning. Members,

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Speaker 6: including Frenchshill of Arkansas, who was here attending the speech,

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Speaker 6: said that it's very possible that a text of the

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Speaker 6: Republican plan could emerge this week or shortly after.

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Speaker 2: The word was though the White House wanted to see

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Speaker 2: something past. Billy, is that how you understand.

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Speaker 6: It, that is, And McCarthy said that whatever it is

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Speaker 6: they come up with, and you've described it a little bit,

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Speaker 6: would be voted on later this month, and we've reported

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Speaker 6: that what it would do was lift of depth ceiling

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Speaker 6: probably till May of twenty twenty four. But also that

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Speaker 6: doesn't happen unless Republicans get the spending cuts that they want.

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Speaker 2: Was that a friendly c it sounded like it for

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Speaker 2: speaker McCarthy. Did they stack the room with supporters or

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Speaker 2: how did that work?

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Speaker 6: It was about two hundred and fifty people financial leaders.

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Speaker 6: I would call it more a polite crowd than a

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Speaker 6: friendly crowd. There was one instance where there was a

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Speaker 6: smattering of applause and I can't even remember what that was,

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Speaker 6: but I wouldn't call he didn't bring the house down,

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Speaker 6: let's put it that way. But they were polite and

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Speaker 6: very quiet afterward.

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Speaker 2: Now you started your day at the Judiciary Committee Field

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Speaker 2: hearing less than polite. We saw at least one Heckler

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Speaker 2: remove from the room in a pretty contentious debate among members.

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Speaker 2: What's this going to lead to? Or is this just

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Speaker 2: show business?

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Speaker 6: It's very showy, and you've got to understand the Republicans

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Speaker 6: are operating on two paths here A. They're really going

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Speaker 6: after da Alvin Bragg Manhattan for indicting or acquiring an

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Speaker 6: indictment of Trump, but rather than just say that, there

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Speaker 6: attacking his credibility as a prosecutor, including some of this

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Speaker 6: criminal justice reforms that they say and some of their

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Speaker 6: witnesses suggest have led to more violent in New York City.

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Speaker 2: Really interesting argument here today. Billy, thanks so much for

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Speaker 2: coming along, Billy House, Bloomberg News congressional reporter on the

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Speaker 2: ground in Lower Manhattan, for all the stories you're reading

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Speaker 2: on the terminal and now hearing on Bloomberg Radio. And

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Speaker 2: it's a great opportunity to spend some time with Maya mcguinnis,

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Speaker 2: the president of the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget.

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Speaker 2: Let's back up to the McCarthy speech, Maya, I'm sure

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Speaker 2: you had a chance to listen to watch to get

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Speaker 2: a sense of what he was rolling out. Did you

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Speaker 2: expect more from Kevin McCarthy in terms of details on

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Speaker 2: his plann or was this an effective way to roll

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Speaker 2: things out at least in terms of the top line

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Speaker 2: initiatives in a Republican budget?

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Speaker 7: Right?

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Speaker 8: I think that this was pretty much what I did expect,

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Speaker 8: and that this was the framing of their whole approach.

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Speaker 8: This was the Republicans are tired of the narrative on

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Speaker 8: the debt ceiling not working in their faith. I think

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Speaker 8: it's played poorly for them so far, and the President

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Speaker 8: has been able to say, we put out our budget

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Speaker 8: where as yours. And this was the Speaker and his

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Speaker 8: party trying to take back kind of the arguments, and

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Speaker 8: he put forth what I thought was a really compelling

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Speaker 8: and reasonable sounding speech right on specifics. But I think

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Speaker 8: if the response is good to the basic frame of

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Speaker 8: the debt is unsustainable and here are all the problems

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Speaker 8: that go along with this, here's our approach to it.

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Speaker 8: We want to save some money, we want to focus

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Speaker 8: on economic growth, and we do not want a default.

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Speaker 8: All sounding reasonable, and then they will try to get

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Speaker 8: enough support within their conference for the actual specifics, which

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Speaker 8: I think, if everything goes according to plan, we'll start

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Speaker 8: to see over the next few days. So I think

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Speaker 8: that the Speaker probably felt like he achieved what he

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Speaker 8: needed to for the first step, and now they the

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Speaker 8: steps are going to get harder along the way as

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Speaker 8: they go from home.

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Speaker 2: YEA, of course, they will. What do you think of

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Speaker 2: his line as President Biden bumbling into defaults? Not exactly

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Speaker 2: the soothing words for investors.

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Speaker 8: No, not soothing words and not words that I want

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Speaker 8: to hear from leadership. I have to caveat that. I

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Speaker 8: am just really dead tired of politics. I feel like

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Speaker 8: the issues we are dealing with right now, on the debt,

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Speaker 8: feeling on China, on AI, all of these things call

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Speaker 8: for a serious moment for our political leaders to stop

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Speaker 8: looking at Republican versus Democrat and start lisking at country.

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Speaker 2: Thank God from Miam Beginnis is from your lips to

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Speaker 2: God's ears. Here's what he said. By the way, we'll

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Speaker 2: just kind of get into that. Let's talk about the

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Speaker 2: meat for a moment, at least to the extent that

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Speaker 2: we had some on these bones talking about spending levels.

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Speaker 2: At least in his view, our.

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Speaker 3: Legislation accomplishes the same goal by returning the federal government

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Speaker 3: to twenty twenty.

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Speaker 2: Two okay, twenty twenty two levels, this is consistent.

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Speaker 3: And then limit the growth of spending over the next

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Speaker 3: ten years to one percent of annual growth. Now, don't

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Speaker 3: believe any one who tells you these are draconian limits.

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Speaker 3: Think about it, they're the same spending levels we had

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Speaker 3: just four months ago, just last October, last seven.

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Speaker 2: Months, seven months, whatever it is, Maya, that's a pretty

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Speaker 2: compelling line for him, remembering that, of course, you know,

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Speaker 2: we dealt with some pretty major increases in spending during COVID.

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Speaker 2: We've moved beyond the pandemic that I suspect will resonate

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Speaker 2: with some Americans, if not a lot of them.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, he's absolutely not wrong. Spending skyrocketed during COVID, as

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Speaker 8: it should have appropriately so, but we've in many ways

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Speaker 8: been building off of that base. Since we never were

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Speaker 8: good at bringing ratcheting spending up and bringing taxes down,

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Speaker 8: we're not good at the reverse, at kind of undoing

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Speaker 8: some of that when the economy doesn't call for it,

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Speaker 8: and certainly with the inflation or facing the economy doesn't

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Speaker 8: call for this high level of spending and borrowing. So

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Speaker 8: another way to think about it is the numbers that

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Speaker 8: President Obama had proposed when he was in office, are

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Speaker 8: many of them are lower for spending than what would

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Speaker 8: be true under this twenty twenty two levels going up

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Speaker 8: by one percent. So I think we're so stuck in

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Speaker 8: the basic camps of Republicans want less spending, Democrats want

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Speaker 8: more spending. That actually looking at what the needs are

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Speaker 8: and what spending levels will accomplish that would be a

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Speaker 8: refreshing approach. And if you do look at that, it

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Speaker 8: seems that the levels that twenty twenty two could indeed

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Speaker 8: meet most of the needs of what we're thinking about.

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Speaker 7: Now.

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Speaker 8: We don't know what they're looking about on defense and

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Speaker 8: veterans yet though, and if they want to exempt those,

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Speaker 8: the cuts on domestic discretionaire are going to be a

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Speaker 8: lot harder to achieve than if all of the different

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Speaker 8: parts of the discretionary budgets are on the table. The

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Speaker 8: other trick is only one percent growth for ten years.

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Speaker 8: That's more constraints than I think we'll see. You may

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Speaker 8: get that level of moderate growth for a few years,

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Speaker 8: but then we've seen this story over and over again.

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Speaker 8: It won't stick to one percent, So not all of

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Speaker 8: those savings will be realized in the longer term for sure.

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Speaker 2: Reaction from the White House a statement from the White

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Speaker 2: House quote Speaker McCarthy is breaking with the bipartisan norm.

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Speaker 2: He followed on Trump by engaging in dangerous economic hostage

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Speaker 2: taking that threatens hard working Americans, jobs and retirement savings.

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Speaker 2: They quote Donald Trump here from twenty nineteen. I cannot

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Speaker 2: imagine anyone ever thinking of using the death ceiling as

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Speaker 2: a negotiating wedge. Of course, both sides can find all

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Speaker 2: the quotes they want to fit their argument, but would

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Speaker 2: it not have behooved him to show up with a budget.

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Speaker 2: You're going all the way to Wall Street. This is

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Speaker 2: your one swing at the Nysese and we're more than

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Speaker 2: halfway through April maya. So where is it right?

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Speaker 7: Yeah?

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Speaker 8: I mean the fact that we're not going to see

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Speaker 8: a budget from the House Budget Committee. It's right now.

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Speaker 8: The budget is due. Congress's budget is supposed to be due.

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Speaker 8: It was April fifteenth. They didn't do it, no peep.

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Speaker 8: The House Budget Committee is likely going to be late.

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Speaker 8: The Senate Budget Committee is likely going to be not

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Speaker 8: at all. And this is a huge problem. We cannot

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Speaker 8: deal with these issues in this country if we don't

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Speaker 8: start budgeting. We haven't passed a budget on time in

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Speaker 8: twenty years. Out of practice regular order.

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Speaker 2: I thought that was going to be the hallmark of

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Speaker 2: this new Congress.

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Speaker 8: They call for regular order, and then nobody puts a

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Speaker 8: budget for it, and the reason is neither the House

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Speaker 8: or the Senate actually wants to be accountable to the

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Speaker 8: hard choices that are in budgeting. That's the point of budgeting.

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Speaker 8: So that is a huge mistake. I will go back

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Speaker 8: to what you said about when we lifted the debt

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Speaker 8: ceiling under President Trump. That was probably the model of

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Speaker 8: really really reckless ways to lift.

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Speaker 7: The debt ceiling.

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Speaker 8: Because what happened in all three sistans no surprise here,

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Speaker 8: because President Trump was not committed to fiscal responsibility no

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Speaker 8: matter how you slice it. He was somebody who really

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Speaker 8: blew up the borrowing long before the COVID environment hits,

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Speaker 8: and borrowed for pretty much all his policies. But on

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Speaker 8: the debt ceiling, they actually increased the debt ceiling three times,

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Speaker 8: and each time they also did pass other legislations. It's

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Speaker 8: just that instead of generating savings, it grew the debt

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Speaker 8: by even more. So that was kind of the double like,

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Speaker 8: we're gonna lift the debt ceiling and not even have

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Speaker 8: a discussion of the problems. But while we're at it,

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Speaker 8: let's add some more borrowing. So let's hope we don't

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Speaker 8: take from that model. Let's hope we do take from

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Speaker 8: the model that we had in the eighties early nineties

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Speaker 8: where they would accompany debt selling increases with some savings.

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Speaker 8: But let's do it. Gosh, let's just do it in

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Speaker 8: a reasonable timely. Let's get to it, do it right away,

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Speaker 8: and find some of the compromise areas they can both

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Speaker 8: agree on. It's not going to be a huge package

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Speaker 8: of savings, but let's get back into practice of actually

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Speaker 8: having anything at all that reduces the deficit. This is

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Speaker 8: a good moment to look at getting that done. But

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Speaker 8: it needs to be done well, advanced to the debt selling,

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Speaker 8: and there needs to be no drama, no antics, no

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Speaker 8: hostage taking.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad you could join us. I hope the

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Speaker 2: spring's going well. Miami. Aguinnis president of the Committee for

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Speaker 2: a Responsible Federal Budget or Reliable Voice here on Bloomberg.

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Speaker 2: I'm Joll, Matthew and Washington assembling the panel here for

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Speaker 2: a quick spin on this. We'll have plenty of time

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Speaker 2: to talk with Rick Davis and Genie Shanzano. But Rick,

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Speaker 2: your thought, as Republican sees on Lower Manhattan, has this

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Speaker 2: been effective today in terms of optics and politics?

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Speaker 9: Well, I think that it tries to harken back to

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Speaker 9: Reagan going to you know, Manhattan and speaking he was

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Speaker 9: hoping to dock Exchange, and I was there, and and

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Speaker 9: the difference is, I think, you know, the willingness to

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Speaker 9: lead right. And look, I mean, we've been waiting for

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Speaker 9: this moment. Finally, you know, Speaker McCarthy has said, I'm

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Speaker 9: going to engage in this discussion. He's still got to

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Speaker 9: get his own caucus in order, and nobody should underestimate

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Speaker 9: the challenges that exist there. But at least we've begun

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Speaker 9: this process of raising the debt ceiling.

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Speaker 2: What's going to light the fire? Genie, the X date

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Speaker 2: finally emerging, you know, that is going to light the fire.

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Speaker 10: But I you know, I get Kevin McCarthy credit for

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Speaker 10: starting this ball rolling, but he has a you know,

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Speaker 10: he's got to push it up hill. Can he get

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Speaker 10: to two eighteen. Let's not forget many members of his

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Speaker 10: caucus have never voted to raise the dead ceiling.

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Speaker 2: With an eye on New York even though it's Boston

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Speaker 2: Marathon day, I'm Joe Matthew in Washington with our panel

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Speaker 2: Genie Schanzano and Rick Davis. The day that Kevin McCarthy

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Speaker 2: marches to the Stock Exchange, telling those who were there

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Speaker 2: to listen as Billy House mentioned about two hundred and

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Speaker 2: fifty people in the room there, not on the trading floor,

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Speaker 2: it's you know, in a room off to the side.

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Speaker 2: It was clearly the New York Stock Exchange based on

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Speaker 2: the architecture, the optics there. For the speaker, as he

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Speaker 2: recalled the meeting with Joe Biden on February first.

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Speaker 3: When I walked with him and sat with him, I said, look,

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Speaker 3: we could negotiate, and there's parameters. Let me be very clear,

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Speaker 3: there's two things I will not do. I will not

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Speaker 3: raise taxes and I will not pass the clean debt.

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Speaker 3: City they just won't pass. So why don't we sit

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Speaker 3: together and find ways to put us on a better path.

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Speaker 3: Why don't we spend less than we spent the year before.

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Speaker 3: If we just go back seven months to twenty twenty two,

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Speaker 3: is that really going to break us?

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Speaker 2: Genie? The White House reaction to this speech was pretty severe,

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Speaker 2: breaking with the bipartisan norm he followed under Trump engaging

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Speaker 2: in dangerous economic hostage, taking threatening hard work working Americans

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Speaker 2: jobs and their retirements, talks about the extreme MAGA wish

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Speaker 2: list that will increase costs for hard working families. But

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Speaker 2: the Speaker put this in terms that most people could understand.

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Speaker 2: Are we really not capable of living under the spending

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Speaker 2: that we had seven months ago?

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Speaker 11: Yeah?

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Speaker 10: I mean the White House wants to call the speaker's bluff.

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Speaker 10: I think we are arguably able to live under that.

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Speaker 10: He is right about that, But the reality is what

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Speaker 10: he has been asking the White House to do is

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Speaker 10: to come to the negotiating table. But he's not going

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Speaker 10: to bring any of his toys along. And so the

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Speaker 10: White House has been calling that bluff for a long time.

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Speaker 10: And this is why we saw Kevin McCarthy go to

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Speaker 10: the New York Stock Exchange today. He's trying to turn

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Speaker 10: the page because this has been a loser for him

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Speaker 10: politically so far. They have been saying one thing and

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Speaker 10: one thing alone, come to the table with your budget.

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Speaker 10: He has a problem. He can't control his caucus, so

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Speaker 10: he can't get there. I'm happy to hear today he

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Speaker 10: thinks he can get there. But what are we hearing

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Speaker 10: He's going to get there by an exchange will raise

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Speaker 10: the debt ceiling until the middle of a presidential election.

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Speaker 10: You're interesting timing in return for all of these, you know,

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Speaker 10: this wish list of Republican ideas. The question is can

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Speaker 10: he get to two eighteen for that bill? And the

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Speaker 10: reality is it's going to be very hard because again,

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Speaker 10: very few people in his own caucus are in the

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Speaker 10: inclined to vote for a clean debt ceiling, as he said,

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Speaker 10: So how is he going to get out of this?

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Speaker 10: This is the reality that Kevin McCarthy is facing, and

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Speaker 10: the White House is calling him on it. And oh,

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Speaker 10: by the way, using everybody from Ronald Raygan to Donald

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Speaker 10: Trump to say, don't play chicken with the debt ceiling.

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Speaker 10: It's not good for the United States.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they quote Trump. You gotta love a White House

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Speaker 2: statement quoting Donald Trump. Rick, I can't imagine anybody ever

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Speaker 2: thinking that using the debt ceiling as a negotiating wedge.

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Speaker 2: More specifically, though the statement from the White House, Rick

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Speaker 2: goes on to say, a speech is not a plan,

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Speaker 2: and that's what we're talking about here, right, I mean,

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Speaker 2: this is an effective line for the White House. If

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Speaker 2: they don't think he can pass a budget, why not

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Speaker 2: just wait him out? Yeah?

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Speaker 9: I think that the White House risks the opportunity of

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Speaker 9: looking like they're disconnected from the process, right. They were

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Speaker 9: originally said they weren't going to even meet with Speaker McCarthy,

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Speaker 9: and the back off of that, they said they're not

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Speaker 9: going to negotiate. But this isn't the first time we've

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Speaker 9: had a debt ceiling that is accompanied with other spending increases,

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Speaker 9: which we just heard from Mia McGinnis, which was consistent

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Speaker 9: throughout the Trump administration. So it's not like there's never

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Speaker 9: been anything but a clean debt ceiling.

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Speaker 2: And so I think they're they're they're they're building a.

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Speaker 9: Flimsy case for not being engaged. I see no downside

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Speaker 9: to continuing the discussion with with Speaker McCarthy from the

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Speaker 9: White House because it's exactly what Genie says, and that

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Speaker 9: the onus is still on him to come back with

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Speaker 9: two hundred and eighteen votes and that's going to be

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Speaker 9: the hardest thing he can get done, regardless of what

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Speaker 9: the policy that he wants to promote is.

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Speaker 2: Maya McGinnis did say it, though, Rick, you know the

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Speaker 2: budgets do where is it? Why not why not craft

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Speaker 2: something knowing it might not pass in that for him

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Speaker 2: to show up at the NYSC of all places, today.

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Speaker 9: Well, my also said that we haven't had a budget

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Speaker 9: on time in twenty years, so this year be any different.

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Speaker 2: Well, he did promise it would be, right, Yeah, he

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Speaker 2: promised it would be.

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Speaker 9: His caucus said, Oh, the whole reason that we're revolting

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Speaker 9: and we're you know, making it so hard for him

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Speaker 9: to be speaker is to force him to agree to

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Speaker 9: you know, regular order so that we can do budgets

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Speaker 9: on time. And now we see that that hasn't worked.

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Speaker 9: So look, I mean the rhetorica is one thing. I

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Speaker 9: think the White House is right show us the plan.

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Speaker 9: He's got a lot of conflicting caucuses within the House Caucus,

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Speaker 9: the House GOP caucus who want different things in this deal.

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Speaker 9: So how far along they are and getting that done,

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Speaker 9: I think we'll start to see that really in earnest

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Speaker 9: tomorrow after the caucus meeting.

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Speaker 2: That's right in the next date will soon arrive, and

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Speaker 2: once we get through tax Day and I don't know,

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Speaker 2: maybe this thing starts to accelerate. But of course, the

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Speaker 2: other story I want to ask you about is the

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Speaker 2: field hearing, which is not that far away, also in

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Speaker 2: Lower Manhattan, not on Wall Street, but nearby where Jim

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Speaker 2: Jordan has brought the Judiciary Committee. Jerry Nadler. Of course,

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Speaker 2: New Yorker lives a little further uptown than where this

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Speaker 2: hearing has taken place, showed up with statistics.

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Speaker 12: Over the last year, crime in Manhattan has dropped nearly

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Speaker 12: every major category, including murders down fourteen percent, shooting's down

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Speaker 12: seventeen percent, Bergleary's down twenty one percent, and robbery's down

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Speaker 12: eight percent.

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Speaker 2: And no one is listening or seems to care. At least,

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Speaker 2: the whole thing went off the rails. At one point

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Speaker 2: when Congressman Schiff was talking, the Hecklers showed up. You

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Speaker 2: know this.

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Speaker 13: It is the GOP leadership in Congress doing what it

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Speaker 13: has done best for the last six years, and that

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Speaker 13: is to act as the criminal defense council for Donald J.

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Speaker 1: Trump.

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Speaker 13: Well, let me tell you this.

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Speaker 2: Let me tell you this.

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Speaker 4: Capitol please, gentlemen will to spend.

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Speaker 2: Just like we're back in Washington now.

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Speaker 4: Capitol police will remove the gentleman from the audio.

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Speaker 2: Let me tell you this seemed to be a little bit.

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Speaker 4: Hard for gentlemen.

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Speaker 2: All right, let me.

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Speaker 13: Tell you this.

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Speaker 2: Can we get a cop over here? Incidentally, if you

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Speaker 2: actually listen to what the heckler is saying is yelling

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Speaker 2: about Ralph Nader, which I'm not sure he was aware

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Speaker 2: of Trump.

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Speaker 4: Gentlemen, which hearing you is att order.

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Speaker 2: This goes on for minutes.

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Speaker 4: Uh, gentleman, Wilson's spend the audience.

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Speaker 2: Has to be good drama, I guess, Genie, but what

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Speaker 2: does this say about New York?

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Speaker 1: Uh?

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Speaker 2: Any hearing a boy that somebody turned off the lights

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Speaker 2: in the middle of it. This wasn't exactly top level production.

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Speaker 10: This has been a circus. And you know, I guess

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Speaker 10: they are not listening to MIYAMC. Guinness and the rest

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Speaker 10: of Americans when they say they're sick of politics, because

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Speaker 10: in their infinite wisdom, the House Judiciary Committee decided to

440
00:21:58,400 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 10: spread it across the country. It's not enough to keep

441
00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:03,639
Speaker 10: it in DC. They're spreading it around and it is

442
00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:06,439
Speaker 10: a circus down there, of course. And you know, the

443
00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:10,239
Speaker 10: reality is, you know, we heard, as you noted, that

444
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:13,080
Speaker 10: the crime statistics in New York City have been going down.

445
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,120
Speaker 10: But what's not been going down have been mass shootings

446
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:19,360
Speaker 10: across this country. And as opposed to having a serious

447
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:23,320
Speaker 10: discussion about those issues and crime across the country, which

448
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,280
Speaker 10: needs to be addressed. They are taking this to New

449
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:29,919
Speaker 10: York City, as the chairman, as the regular ranking member noted,

450
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,879
Speaker 10: because they are trying to address Alvin Brad's indictment of

451
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:36,200
Speaker 10: Donald Trump. They don't like it. A lot of people

452
00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:39,400
Speaker 10: don't like it. But they are mixing apples and oranges here.

453
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,080
Speaker 10: It's not going to serve Republicans well. And Democrats have

454
00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 10: shown up, including Dan Goldman, to address it. So they're

455
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 10: not letting it go, you know, unnoticed, and they're fighting

456
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:49,679
Speaker 10: back and right they should.

457
00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:51,840
Speaker 2: Rick, you know New York as well as anyone who

458
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 2: lives in Washington. You used to keep an office there

459
00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:56,320
Speaker 2: is stone Core Capital brings you there. You work with

460
00:22:56,359 --> 00:23:00,560
Speaker 2: the investment community. I've seen you there myself. Is this

461
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:02,639
Speaker 2: narrative sticking? Was this good politics?

462
00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:03,439
Speaker 6: You know?

463
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 2: I don't think so.

464
00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:07,800
Speaker 9: I mean it kind of opens up the Pandora's box,

465
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 9: especially for Jim Jordan, who you know, represents a district

466
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:15,360
Speaker 9: near Columbus, Ohio. And it was pointed out that Columbus,

467
00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 9: Ohio crime statistics are three times higher than New York.

468
00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 2: I mean that's kind of embarrassing.

469
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:23,520
Speaker 9: I mean, so look, I mean this was a veiled

470
00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:27,560
Speaker 9: attempt at messing with prosecutor brag and what he's doing.

471
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:30,119
Speaker 9: I suspect if there had never been a prosecution of

472
00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 9: Donald Trump, there wouldn't be a hearing in New York

473
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:36,400
Speaker 9: And so, yeah, I think you know, this is a group.

474
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 9: Jim Jordan is certainly one of them who tend to

475
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 9: shoot before they aim. And I think this is a

476
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:45,440
Speaker 9: classic example of Gee, maybe it would have been one

477
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:47,320
Speaker 9: better not to have done it in New York too.

478
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:50,400
Speaker 9: Actually look at the rest of the country's crime statistics.

479
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 9: And then, by the way, you bump into those issues

480
00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:56,360
Speaker 9: that Genie said, which were you know, incredibly high crimes

481
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:01,199
Speaker 9: committed with assault rifles and guns. So you know, if

482
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,119
Speaker 9: he's really interested in lowering crime, which I hope he

483
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:06,480
Speaker 9: would be, in this the reason for holding this hearing,

484
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:09,960
Speaker 9: I suspect there's a different way approaching it.

485
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:13,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, does it speak Genie at all? We don't have

486
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,600
Speaker 2: much time, But does it speak to his relationship with

487
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:17,320
Speaker 2: his caucus, the fact that he had to let Jordan.

488
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:20,119
Speaker 2: I'm assuming Kevin McCarthy did not prefer to have this

489
00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:21,280
Speaker 2: all happen on the same morning.

490
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,760
Speaker 10: Yeah, Kevin McCarthy wanted to be there in New York City.

491
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:27,239
Speaker 10: Have the spotlight to himself. Jim Jordan shows up, and

492
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:29,280
Speaker 10: you know, let's not forget Trump is also calling to

493
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,159
Speaker 10: defund federal law enforcement, so he's got a lot to

494
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:33,119
Speaker 10: push back on.

495
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:37,560
Speaker 2: Wow, it's just it's crazy. The Mayor of New York,

496
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 2: by the way, Eric Adams, weigh in.

497
00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 14: It is really troubling that Americans taxpayers dollars are being

498
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:48,640
Speaker 14: used to come here on his junket to do an

499
00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 14: examination of the safest big city in America instead of

500
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:58,679
Speaker 14: focusing on the real over proliferation of guns that we

501
00:24:58,760 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 14: have witnessed.

502
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:01,520
Speaker 2: Somebody gets at your phone. We'll keep you posted on

503
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 2: this as opinions start to gel over the next couple

504
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:04,960
Speaker 2: of days.

505
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:09,399
Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the

506
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the

507
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,720
Speaker 1: tune in alf, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App.

508
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,719
Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our

509
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:24,240
Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

510
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,920
Speaker 2: But Joe Matthew along with Kaylei Lines in Washington, d C.

511
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:30,600
Speaker 2: I hope you had a great weekend. It's good to

512
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:34,120
Speaker 2: see you like you moved out of Manhattan, you came

513
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 2: back here to Washington, d C. Which at one time

514
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 2: was home for you. Yeah, but I'm just curious before

515
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:40,840
Speaker 2: we get it. We're gonna hear about the field here,

516
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,440
Speaker 2: and we're going to talk about Kevin McCarthy's speech, and

517
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:46,600
Speaker 2: we were talking to Mia McGuinness about the speech last hour.

518
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 2: Really interesting conversation. But in terms of crime, do you

519
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 2: feel safer here than you did there?

520
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,640
Speaker 15: I think it's different because the thing with New York

521
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 15: is there's always.

522
00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:58,400
Speaker 2: People right and this is a bit of a ghost

523
00:25:58,480 --> 00:25:59,120
Speaker 2: town than.

524
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,359
Speaker 15: Walking down the street in DC and not see another

525
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 15: human being. That's never the case in New York. And sure,

526
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 15: maybe I didn't take the subway after nine pm, but

527
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 15: by and large I felt safe there.

528
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:15,080
Speaker 11: Generally speaking, this is.

529
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 2: What Jerry Nadler is, the ranking member on the Judiciary

530
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 2: Committee Jim Jordan, who wanted to hold this field hearing

531
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 2: in Lower Manhattan as the chair. Nadler came packing stats.

532
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:28,439
Speaker 12: Over the last year, crime in Manhattan has dropped nearly

533
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 12: every major category, including murders down fourteen percent, shooting's down

534
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:38,640
Speaker 12: seventeen percent, Bergley's down twenty one percent, and robbery's down

535
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 12: eight percent.

536
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,879
Speaker 2: Okay, seems like the right direction. Then again, Alvin Bragg

537
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:45,359
Speaker 2: said that last week in his response to Jim Jordan,

538
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 2: and nobody seemed to care about that. Either there's really

539
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 2: a perception issue, I guess, is my point.

540
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 15: Yeah, perhaps, I mean, we have to consider that New

541
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:56,160
Speaker 15: York as a city just has a very high profile,

542
00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 15: especially when that is where you had the indictment of

543
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:01,919
Speaker 15: former President Trump, which kind of brings it back to

544
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,919
Speaker 15: the question of is this really about crime or is

545
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 15: this trying to pick at one city in particular and

546
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:13,200
Speaker 15: certain prosecutors and those that have jurisdiction over it and

547
00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 15: trying to kind of undermine their authority your point of

548
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 15: finger at them for doing things quote unquote wrong.

549
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 2: That's what Natler would tell you. That's of course what

550
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 2: Eric Adams, the mayor, spoke about it this morning as well.

551
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 2: Interesting at the same time, and it's not very far.

552
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:31,920
Speaker 2: How far do you think it is from the field

553
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,399
Speaker 2: hearing to the NYSE You could walk the miles Yeah, well, okay,

554
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,359
Speaker 2: a long walk, but you're in the same part of

555
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:42,360
Speaker 2: the city. For crying out loud as the speaker addresses

556
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:44,879
Speaker 2: the New York Stock Exchange on the debt ceiling. He

557
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 2: did not come packing with a budget. He did describe

558
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 2: the plan, but went out of his way to call

559
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,440
Speaker 2: out Joe Biden and listen to the language that he used.

560
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 3: Make no mistake. The longer President Biden waits to be

561
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:05,639
Speaker 3: sensible define an agreement, the more likely it becomes that

562
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 3: this administration will bumble into the first default in our

563
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 3: nation's history.

564
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 2: Bumble, toul, We don't have an X date yet, But

565
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 2: I don't know how to say that to the stock

566
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:23,560
Speaker 2: market itself and expect a good reaction is really something?

567
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:26,520
Speaker 15: Yeah, Well, I think this is so interesting because clearly

568
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,720
Speaker 15: he is trying to get the markets to pay attention here,

569
00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:32,440
Speaker 15: hence at the stock Exchange, which show I have to admit,

570
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:32,879
Speaker 15: I bumble.

571
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 11: It's less than a mile between the job.

572
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 15: Rebuilding where the hearing is taking place in the New

573
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 15: York Stock Exchange. Clearly, take the girl out of New

574
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 15: York and she loses all sense. It's all sense of direction.

575
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 15: But yeah, talking about the idea of bumbling, does anyone

576
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,680
Speaker 15: want to see any elected official bumbling with something like

577
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 15: the full faith and credit of the United States?

578
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,400
Speaker 2: Well, and if they are, don't tell the stock market

579
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 2: for correct right out.

580
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 15: So the choice of language very interesting.

581
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 2: That's down less than one hundred, yes, and p's down thirteen.

582
00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 2: I don't know. It didn't seem to scare anyone, because

583
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 2: first investors are pretty savvy. They were well aware of

584
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,960
Speaker 2: this debt ceiling issue. At least I thought, did Kevin

585
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,040
Speaker 2: McCarthy light a fire. Let's bring in Mick Malvaney, who

586
00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 2: joins us each week at this time, former director of

587
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 2: the OMB, currently co chair ACTIM Global Consultants, and of

588
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 2: course spent time as Acting White House Chief of Staff.

589
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 2: Mick is is this a good idea? Does this motivate

590
00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 2: Joe Biden to go to the stock market and say, hey, guys,

591
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:27,800
Speaker 2: you need to know about this. It's not good.

592
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 7: That's the idea, right, That's why Kevin's doing it. I

593
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:33,240
Speaker 7: think it's probably the right move. Do I think it's

594
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 7: going to move the needle?

595
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:34,880
Speaker 6: Probably not.

596
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 7: Keep in mind, anytime there's a discussion about a government

597
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 7: shutdown or a debt ceiling or default, whatever, the Republicans

598
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 7: tend to get blamed because they're the ones who want

599
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 7: to talk about spending reduction. So I know why Kevin's

600
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 7: doing it, but I can't imagine it's going to change.

601
00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 7: I don't think Biden's going to turn off you know,

602
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:54,800
Speaker 7: Bloomberg and go, oh my goodness, Kevin's asking me.

603
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:56,480
Speaker 2: To come up right, I got to call him back.

604
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 7: That's exactly that's that's not going to happen. I think Kevin's,

605
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 7: you know, the best he can in the circumstances. But

606
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 7: I think the Biden administration knows they've got the upper

607
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 7: hands on a pr standpoints, so they're not really willing

608
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 7: to chat.

609
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 6: At this point.

610
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 15: Well, and the Biden administration keeps saying, you know, will chat,

611
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 15: We will talk to you. You got to bring us

612
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 15: the plan first. I mean, is it really just a

613
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 15: republican of building a Republican consensus around what that blueprint

614
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:20,040
Speaker 15: should look like.

615
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 7: Keep in mind what they said was we'll talk when

616
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 7: you have a budget, which is a nonsensical thing. YE say, Okay,

617
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 7: you can say, talk to us, what's your plan? What

618
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 7: do you want to talk about? What you give us

619
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 7: the first piece of paper that shows what your offer

620
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 7: sheet is going to be. That's one thing. But the

621
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 7: budget is not that. The budget is something entirely different

622
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:40,080
Speaker 7: that we've gone years here in this town without Congress

623
00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 7: passing a budget. Typically when the Democrats are in charge

624
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 7: of the House, the Senate is never going to pass

625
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 7: a budget this year, So that's a nonsensical thing. I

626
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 7: wish more folks in the press would pick up on that. Yeah,

627
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,239
Speaker 7: it's reasonable to say, you know, what do you want

628
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 7: to talk about? You want to talk about in title

629
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 7: and spending, you want to talk about this, you want

630
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 7: to talk about that. But to say we won't talk

631
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 7: to you until you passed a budget is a non sector.

632
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 2: And again, Kevin McCarthy said there was going to be

633
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 2: regular order in this Congress, right, Mick Mia mcuinnis was

634
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 2: here last hour and she said, you know, he promised

635
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 2: to have one by now. He's late.

636
00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:12,440
Speaker 7: Yeah, I think they're late technically as of today. As

637
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 7: a matter of facts, do April fifteenth. So keep in

638
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 7: mind it's usually late when it exists, and oftentimes it

639
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 7: doesn't even exist. That White House was late and delivering

640
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 7: their budget this year too. It happens all the time,

641
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 7: So regular order. I'd love to see a budget. I'm

642
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 7: the former budget direct right. I think they're probably they're

643
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 7: valuable tools when done properly, So I get all that

644
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 7: about doing regular order. And if you want to criticize

645
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:38,120
Speaker 7: Kevin for missing the deadline in the House, that is

646
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 7: a fair criticism. But the two don't go together. It's

647
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:42,560
Speaker 7: not like, oh, you didn't do a budget, we can't

648
00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 7: talk about the debt ceiling. Two things have nothing to

649
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 7: do with each other.

650
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 15: Just on the budget specifically, and really what McCarthy's message

651
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,240
Speaker 15: was today at the New York Stock Exchangement, Mick was

652
00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 15: this idea that you can't raise the debt limit without

653
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 15: also having spending cuts, that it's irresponsible to do that.

654
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 15: But on the subject of spending cut, it's how politically

655
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 15: difficult did it is it to be a Republican looking

656
00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:06,680
Speaker 15: for areas to cut spending when you have to look

657
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 15: in entitlements in some sense, right you do?

658
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 6: You don't. Eventually, yes you do.

659
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 7: It'd be nice if you could cut anything, But we

660
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,640
Speaker 7: don't do any of that in Washington, d C. And

661
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 7: the Republicans didn't cut anything when they were in charge.

662
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 7: And I know that because I was a budget director

663
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 7: when they were in charge, and they took my budget,

664
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 7: which was I think a Wall Street journal called it

665
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 7: the most fiscally conservative since Reagan, and my own party

666
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 7: through it in the trash. So yeah, they've got a little,

667
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 7: a little credibility issue of their own to work with.

668
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 7: But look, you'd like to think that what Kevin did

669
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 7: today is the right move. I think he's signaling that

670
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 7: he wants to continue to have conversations. It's it's what

671
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 7: needs to happen. I think we're going to get closer

672
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:52,240
Speaker 7: and closer to what I perceived to be a July.

673
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 6: Deadline, not a June.

674
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, July or August is starting to look like here

675
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 2: the statement from the White House reacting to Speaker McCarthy's speech, making.

676
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 7: Ye hate and reruptive, the supporting difference through those things.

677
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 7: Congress is not in in August.

678
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 2: Well, right, so therefore might actually be inspired to get

679
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 2: this done before recess bingo.

680
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 7: Most of the difficult decisions in Washington, DC get made

681
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 7: either late July or in late December, because that's the

682
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,720
Speaker 7: eve of the two big vacations. So my guess is

683
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,200
Speaker 7: that even when Janet Yellen six weeks ago, eight weeks

684
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:26,560
Speaker 7: ago said the deadline was in June, it was really

685
00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 7: in July, because that's when all the real difficult bulks

686
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 7: take place.

687
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 2: The reaction from the White House mixed speaker. McCarthy is

688
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 2: breaking with the bipartisan norm he followed under Trump by

689
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 2: engaging in dangerous economic hostage, taking of Freton's hardworking Americans

690
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 2: jobs and retirement. They even go to quote your former boss.

691
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 2: In twenty nineteen, Donald Trump himself said, I can't imagine

692
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 2: anybody ever thinking of using the debt ceiling as a

693
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 2: negotiating wedge. How does Kevin McCarthy reply to this?

694
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:55,840
Speaker 6: That the law is the law.

695
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 7: The law's there for a reason, right, This is we're

696
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,680
Speaker 7: dealing with a law some Congress, previous Congress passed the

697
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:02,800
Speaker 7: law and says, look, we can't raise the debt ceiling

698
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 7: without a vote. If it was just a rubber stamp

699
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 7: every single time and you didn't debate anything, why would

700
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:11,040
Speaker 7: that law be on the books. It's the reason I

701
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:13,320
Speaker 7: think the laws on the books is to give everybody

702
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:15,320
Speaker 7: cause to sit back and say, Okay, we have to

703
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,839
Speaker 7: raise the debt ceiling. Why but why have we gone

704
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 7: even further into debt? And what are we going to

705
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 7: do about it? If it was just one of these

706
00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 7: things that had no conditions attached, ever, then you'd have

707
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:27,840
Speaker 7: no need for the law on the books. Keep in

708
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 7: mind that the Democrats have also used the debt ceilings

709
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:32,319
Speaker 7: as leveraged in the past. They used to do that

710
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 7: to us all the time, as was the Trump administration.

711
00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:37,440
Speaker 7: But that's that's fine, that's Washington, d C. We know

712
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:39,960
Speaker 7: there's going to be some negotiation. We know there's going

713
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:43,600
Speaker 7: to be some compromise, probably not much. Keep mind of

714
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,759
Speaker 7: the Republicans only control the House, not the House and

715
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:47,840
Speaker 7: the Senate the White House, like they did since seventeen

716
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,359
Speaker 7: and when they also didn't fix spending. So I don't

717
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 7: know why my Republican friends, especially the Freemacaucus guys, think

718
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 7: they're going to get these wide ranging changes when they

719
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:00,720
Speaker 7: only hold one lever of power. They'll get something small,

720
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:02,719
Speaker 7: and that would be good, better than nothing. But you know,

721
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 7: I do think there'd be some compromise late in the game.

722
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:07,719
Speaker 15: Well, Nick, to the point you were just making that

723
00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 15: Republicans only control the House, It's also worth noting that

724
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 15: they only control the House by a relatively narrow margin.

725
00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:18,240
Speaker 15: I mean, we're talking just a handful of votes potentially

726
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 15: that could make anything go awry. How hard is it

727
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 15: to get everyone on side?

728
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:24,840
Speaker 7: Really are, and it's even harder in the Senate. Because

729
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 7: I think this is a I'm pretty sure this is

730
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:29,360
Speaker 7: a fifty vote requirement in the Senate. This is not

731
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:31,919
Speaker 7: I don't believe this is much reconciliation. So the debt

732
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 7: ceiling vote will have to be sixty. So you're going

733
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,719
Speaker 7: to have to get some bipartisan buy in in the Senate.

734
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,520
Speaker 7: You have to ask the question, does bipartisan in the

735
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:42,799
Speaker 7: Senate mean debt on arrival with just Republican votes in

736
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:45,719
Speaker 7: the House, And the answer is probably yes. So you know,

737
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,359
Speaker 7: the real question is will cooler heads prevail? Will they

738
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:52,560
Speaker 7: get some reasonable reforms? For example, I understand that some

739
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:54,960
Speaker 7: of the Freedom Caucus we're only asking for one thing,

740
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:58,240
Speaker 7: which is a work requirement for for some federal benefits.

741
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,479
Speaker 7: That seems like a fairly reasonable, fairly small thing things

742
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,400
Speaker 7: that Democrats have given, something Democrats have given in the past.

743
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:07,759
Speaker 7: So that's the type of thing I think I'll be

744
00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 7: hoping to see in this negotiation, as opposed to know,

745
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 7: just a complete breakdown and discussions.

746
00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:17,000
Speaker 2: I want to ask you about the field hearing as well,

747
00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:19,640
Speaker 2: Jim Jordan's hearing, Mick, and I don't know if you

748
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 2: see this as kind of snuffing out the message today

749
00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 2: from Kevin McCarthy. Maybe you see them as being unrelated

750
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,799
Speaker 2: to separate events, But here's Jim Jordan kicking this thing off.

751
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:31,800
Speaker 4: Really, in this country, justice is supposed to be blind,

752
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:36,239
Speaker 4: regardless of race, religion, or creed. However, here in Manhattan

753
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 4: the scales of justice are weighed down by politics. Rather

754
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,080
Speaker 4: than enforcing the law, the DA is using his office

755
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 4: to do the bidding of left wing campaign funders. He's

756
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,640
Speaker 4: taken his soft on crime approach to the real criminals.

757
00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 2: Mick, you might have heard us playing some sound from

758
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:55,279
Speaker 2: Jerry Nadler earlier and all the crime statistics showing that

759
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 2: it's been improving in New York in fact, not the opposite.

760
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:01,440
Speaker 2: Recalling Alvin bragg statement last week's as if you want

761
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 2: to hold of hearing on violence in the city, go

762
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 2: to Ohio, of course, where Jim Jordan is from. What's

763
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 2: your take on this move here? Do you think Kevin

764
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:10,560
Speaker 2: McCarthy wanted it this way?

765
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 7: I think there's plenty of oxygen in the room to

766
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:17,319
Speaker 7: have both those at the same time. Keep in mind

767
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,840
Speaker 7: where Kevin gives his speech counts a little bit against

768
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 7: Wall Street, so it's obviously very symbolic where Jim Jordan

769
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,160
Speaker 7: has this hearing doesn't really make a difference. So while

770
00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:28,239
Speaker 7: it may crowd out headlines in the New York local

771
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:30,839
Speaker 7: papers and so forth, it probably doesn't step on each

772
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:33,719
Speaker 7: other to step on each other's toes, especially since the

773
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:37,239
Speaker 7: messages are so different, right ones on crime and law

774
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,399
Speaker 7: enforcements on the debt ceiling. So I don't worry about that.

775
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:41,960
Speaker 7: I'm worried a little bit about you know, why we're

776
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 7: having a federal hearing on state crime. I'm sure there's

777
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:48,600
Speaker 7: some nexus that I'm missing, but I'm not really sure why,

778
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,600
Speaker 7: you know, why that hearing is taking place when it's

779
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:55,040
Speaker 7: a local issue. Now that being said, you know, I

780
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:57,520
Speaker 7: hear what Jerry said, Nadlos said about the crime, and

781
00:37:57,640 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 7: that's great. I no, I have no data otherwise, I

782
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:01,240
Speaker 7: don't live in New I just don't know a single

783
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 7: person from New York saying, you know what, things are

784
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 7: great here. This is fabulous, there's no crime at all,

785
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:06,759
Speaker 7: this is great. Let's go on a subway tonight.

786
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 2: She left the city to come down here.

787
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:11,839
Speaker 6: That's anecdotal.

788
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:12,839
Speaker 7: I know that's not bad.

789
00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:15,799
Speaker 15: I granted some of the first advice I got when

790
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:17,799
Speaker 15: I moved to New York was to never walk home

791
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,880
Speaker 15: from the office after dark. So, you know, a city's

792
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:23,160
Speaker 15: a city at the end of the day, and we

793
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:25,399
Speaker 15: have to consider that. But but we have to talk

794
00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:28,280
Speaker 15: mag and you alluded to this about this city in particular.

795
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:30,759
Speaker 15: You just said that it didn't really matter where this

796
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,520
Speaker 15: hearing was held. But this was intentional. It was a

797
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:37,399
Speaker 15: field hearing. They didn't hold it on Capitol Hill. They

798
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:41,359
Speaker 15: literally went to New York to make a point, right,

799
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:43,360
Speaker 15: I guess.

800
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,120
Speaker 7: And I'm sure there's you know, I think nad levde

801
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,240
Speaker 7: an opening statement about how this is all being driven

802
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:50,000
Speaker 7: by Trump, I get the impression that's not the case.

803
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:51,840
Speaker 7: I think it's driven by the fact that there's a

804
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:54,120
Speaker 7: great deal of attention by doing field here, and she

805
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 7: do field hearings a lot of times in order to

806
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:57,719
Speaker 7: get media covers. It's a smart thing to do.

807
00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,239
Speaker 2: I did it an you want to poke Alvin Bragg

808
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:01,239
Speaker 2: a little bits.

809
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:02,520
Speaker 7: That's what I think it was. Right. The whole the

810
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:04,759
Speaker 7: eyes of the political world's been focused on Manhattan for

811
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:06,520
Speaker 7: the last couple of weeks because of the indictment of

812
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 7: the former president, And does it hurt to sort of

813
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:11,880
Speaker 7: go there a little bit of theatrical. Yeah, but my

814
00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:14,040
Speaker 7: guess his republics don't have a monopoly on that.

815
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 2: Boy, I'll tell you what. Thanks for the time, No,

816
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,080
Speaker 2: I just it is so you know, it's just another day.

817
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 2: I mean, every time you turn around, it's just the

818
00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:28,319
Speaker 2: news flow has been absolutely wild. Nick, thank you for

819
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 2: talking to us. He joins us each week at this time.

820
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:35,040
Speaker 2: Director Mulvaney, former budget director, currently co chair at Actum

821
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 2: Global Consultant. I'm Joe Matthew with Kaylee Lines. They could

822
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 2: have probably done it in DC.

823
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:44,400
Speaker 11: I mean, still what to cover save some money on

824
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:45,160
Speaker 11: the Amtrak ticket.

825
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:47,640
Speaker 2: You and I could have gone there actually in person.

826
00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:48,560
Speaker 11: My old stomping ground.

827
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 2: That's right.

828
00:39:50,120 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us

829
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:56,840
Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, the

830
00:39:56,880 --> 00:40:00,440
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business App. We'll listening demand

831
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,040
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts.

832
00:40:02,760 --> 00:40:05,680
Speaker 2: It had to happen eventually, here we are. The ad

833
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:09,080
Speaker 2: wars have begun between Donald Trump and Ron De Santis,

834
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,960
Speaker 2: of course, the governor of Florida, who hasn't even announced

835
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 2: a campaign for the White House. I'm Joe Matthew along

836
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,680
Speaker 2: with Kaylee Lines in Washington. Have you seen these ads? Yeah,

837
00:40:17,719 --> 00:40:20,400
Speaker 2: I mean the pudding fingers thing we talked about in

838
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:22,200
Speaker 2: the office last week. I thought, geez, and I'm not

839
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:25,279
Speaker 2: gonna play that on the air. Well we are now

840
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:30,520
Speaker 2: because there's a response ad. But this came from Donald

841
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:35,279
Speaker 2: Trump's main pack. This is maga pack, right, and it's

842
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:39,920
Speaker 2: called putting fingers. Recalling the story that Ron de Santis,

843
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 2: at one point without silverware eight a thing of pudding

844
00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 2: with three fingers. Yeah, he told Pierce Morgan he didn't

845
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:47,680
Speaker 2: remember that.

846
00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 15: I have like a visceral reaction to just the phrase

847
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:52,960
Speaker 15: pudding fingers.

848
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,799
Speaker 2: As well you should. There's science behind this stuff, and

849
00:40:55,800 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 2: if you watch it, well it's just gross. Right.

850
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:01,560
Speaker 16: Ron de Santis loves sticking his fingers where they don't belong.

851
00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 2: And we're not just talking about pudding. Desantas has his

852
00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:11,800
Speaker 2: dirty faces of stock. White guy who's casting slurping.

853
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:14,720
Speaker 16: While it's a Social Security is putting all over his hands,

854
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 16: raising our retirement. Tell Ron DeSantis to keep his putting

855
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:23,960
Speaker 16: fingers off our money. Oh and get this man a spoon.

856
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:28,360
Speaker 2: Then you see all the empty footing containers, it looks

857
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 2: like something that shouldn't be on TV.

858
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 11: But you know what it gets us talking?

859
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:35,920
Speaker 2: Oh absolutely. I had ten people forward this to me,

860
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 2: even got Mike Dorning's attention. This is this is part

861
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:41,840
Speaker 2: of you. You get paid to write about this stuff.

862
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 17: I had to watch these ads.

863
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:45,160
Speaker 10: Now.

864
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 17: It's pretty pretty incredible and a very savvy move by

865
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 17: Trump because it's doing two things. It's one, it's focusing

866
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:58,920
Speaker 17: on Desanders's past stands to cut Social Security and Medicare benefits. Remember,

867
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:02,800
Speaker 17: most republok And voters are over fifty, so they're either

868
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:07,080
Speaker 17: benefiting from those senior entitlements or that's in their near future.

869
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:10,720
Speaker 17: And number two, it's just drilling into people withs minds

870
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 17: these gross images of DeSantis, just like he was when

871
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:17,359
Speaker 17: he was calling him Ron de sanctimonious after the you know,

872
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:18,360
Speaker 17: I'm god.

873
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 2: This calls more meatball Ron. Yeah, I was counting.

874
00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 17: But he's doing it before Ron really gets out there

875
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:28,480
Speaker 17: to define himself. So Trump is defining him and creating

876
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:33,200
Speaker 17: all these visceral, you know, reactions to him which aren't positive.

877
00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:36,080
Speaker 11: What does it say though? That exactly to your point.

878
00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:38,839
Speaker 15: He's starting to run these ads before we even get

879
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 15: a declared candidacy of Rot.

880
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 17: That's Smart. I mean, that's essentially what the Obama campaign

881
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:49,240
Speaker 17: re election campaign was doing in twenty twelve with Romney trying.

882
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:52,960
Speaker 17: They figured he would probably be the Republican candidate, so

883
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:57,120
Speaker 17: they worked very early to kind of portray him as

884
00:42:57,120 --> 00:43:00,879
Speaker 17: this rich, out of touch white guy, and publicans in

885
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:05,280
Speaker 17: that vein same thing. Trump knows who his strongest opponent

886
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:07,040
Speaker 17: is and he's going after him.

887
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:11,319
Speaker 2: So the response from Never Back Down is the pro

888
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:16,280
Speaker 2: DeSantis pack calling him a gun grabber, saying he cut

889
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,239
Speaker 2: and run like a coward. This is going to be

890
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:20,880
Speaker 2: a street fight. Listen to this ed.

891
00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:24,479
Speaker 18: Donald Trump speed attacked by a Democrat prosecutor in New York.

892
00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:27,800
Speaker 18: So why is he spending millions attacking the Republican governor

893
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:31,360
Speaker 18: of Florida. Trump's stealing pages from the Biden Pelosi playbook,

894
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:33,879
Speaker 18: repeating lijahing social secure.

895
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:37,239
Speaker 2: Really ugly pictures of Trump tone side by side with

896
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:40,360
Speaker 2: full color pictures of Ronantis smiling.

897
00:43:41,719 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 3: At some point they will be we will take a look.

898
00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:47,440
Speaker 2: At the entitlements again. As you pointed out here, Mike

899
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,320
Speaker 2: Smart reply, I think.

900
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 17: It's like a you know, average reply. It's more traditional.

901
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,759
Speaker 17: It's not creating this viscillal reaction, But it's kind of

902
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:02,360
Speaker 17: checking boxes that you want to check. Remind people of

903
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:05,680
Speaker 17: Trump's weakest point, which is, hey, there's all these prosecutors

904
00:44:05,719 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 17: going after him. There's probably something there. If they're that

905
00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 17: many prosecutors going after him, he's going to be weak

906
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:14,759
Speaker 17: general election candidate. And you know he can only do

907
00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:18,080
Speaker 17: so much with this social security point, so he's saying, Hey,

908
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:21,680
Speaker 17: that's a Biden Pelosi trick, and I'm not going to

909
00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:25,480
Speaker 17: cut social Security. The smarter thing and probably more urgent thing,

910
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:29,000
Speaker 17: is what's coming next that we know those positive ads

911
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 17: they're rolling out because they can see Trump is damaging them,

912
00:44:33,120 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 17: so they can't wait for him to run. They've got

913
00:44:35,239 --> 00:44:38,600
Speaker 17: to start putting those Here's Ron DeSantis, Here's who he is.

914
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:41,120
Speaker 17: He's not just a guy who he's putting with three Trumps.

915
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:43,880
Speaker 15: So not letting the former president set the narrative, but

916
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,240
Speaker 15: having the campaign or what will eventually be a campaign

917
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:48,240
Speaker 15: set the narrative themselves.

918
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:50,600
Speaker 17: Yeah, No, Trump has like really forced them into this.

919
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 17: They've got to get out there and stop letting Trump

920
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:57,640
Speaker 17: be the person who defines DeSantis for the country.

921
00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:01,040
Speaker 2: Now, DeSantis's group here never been down, is actually making

922
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 2: a real ad buy right, this is on airwaves, it's

923
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,840
Speaker 2: playing on TV shows. Is the Trump ad or is

924
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:10,360
Speaker 2: that just an online video that we're all sharing and

925
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:11,160
Speaker 2: emailing each other.

926
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 17: My impression is that most of what they're going to

927
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:17,359
Speaker 17: be rolling out is the positive ad on who run

928
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:20,040
Speaker 17: DeSantis is, which is a kind of a here are

929
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:25,400
Speaker 17: my values, and that this ad, the rebuttal to Trump,

930
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:27,200
Speaker 17: is a smaller buy. But I don't know if.

931
00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:29,680
Speaker 2: You're televised or is that not even mattering?

932
00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:34,440
Speaker 17: The one that the one attacking Trump was televised on

933
00:45:34,520 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 17: Fox News Sunday yesterday, and that's an important venue because

934
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:42,920
Speaker 17: that's a program that a lot of Republican leaning people

935
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 17: who are interested in politics watch well.

936
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 15: On the port on the part of this being maybe

937
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:52,200
Speaker 15: targeted in a partisan manner, it strikes me that as

938
00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 15: Joe was just saying, calling Trump a gun grabber, and

939
00:45:55,440 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 15: that this is running in and around a series of

940
00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:00,719
Speaker 15: mass shootings we have seen in the US, you have

941
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,319
Speaker 15: to question the tone. But if it's targeted toward the

942
00:46:03,360 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 15: base and for primary voters trying to decide what Republican

943
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:10,440
Speaker 15: to vote for versus the general electorate, maybe you have

944
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:12,880
Speaker 15: a little bit more room for those kind of harder

945
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:14,400
Speaker 15: line stances at this point.

946
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 6: Yeah.

947
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 17: Absolutely. And the gun grabber one, unlike the one on

948
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:20,200
Speaker 17: Social Security, was online only, so you could gear it

949
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:23,279
Speaker 17: more towards those NRA people. The thing is that even

950
00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:25,719
Speaker 17: though most of the country's kind of recoiling at the

951
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:29,480
Speaker 17: moment because of these mass shootings, the people at the

952
00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:32,760
Speaker 17: NRA convention, the people who are thinking about guns because

953
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:36,360
Speaker 17: of the NRA convention, are more sympathetic to gun rights.

954
00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:41,719
Speaker 17: And this is really hardcore Republican primary voters that that

955
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:44,480
Speaker 17: matter most. I mean, Desantists can't be a general election

956
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:46,600
Speaker 17: candidate if he doesn't win the primary.

957
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:48,960
Speaker 2: Right now, here's the gun ad.

958
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:52,319
Speaker 18: By the way, Trump promised NRA members he'd have their

959
00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:55,600
Speaker 18: back when Second Amendment rights came under attach.

960
00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 2: You see in rocolate here and still with liberal.

961
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:00,200
Speaker 10: Democrats side you guys, half of you as I'm so

962
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 10: afraid of the NRA.

963
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:02,799
Speaker 2: We have to fight them every once in a while.

964
00:47:02,800 --> 00:47:03,240
Speaker 11: That's okay.

965
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 3: Some of you people are petrified of the NRA.

966
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:09,200
Speaker 2: You can't be petrified. They have great power over you people.

967
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:12,040
Speaker 2: Trump agreed with Nancy Pelosia says on the screen. There.

968
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:14,400
Speaker 2: This is a minute twenty two seconds though that's always

969
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:16,080
Speaker 2: the tip off that this is not a TV app.

970
00:47:16,160 --> 00:47:18,839
Speaker 17: Yeah, that would cost you a lot more, buddy.

971
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:21,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, as opposed to the thirty second putting ad.

972
00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:23,560
Speaker 17: There you go, and they've kind of got Diane findes

973
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:28,919
Speaker 17: Dine like cackling and rubbing her hands together as Trump

974
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:31,720
Speaker 17: is speaking and one of them. So it's like using

975
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:33,800
Speaker 17: these Republican villains.

976
00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 15: I'm wondering as we're talking about how much it costs

977
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:40,760
Speaker 15: to buy airtime and what you're spending on these ads

978
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,839
Speaker 15: this early in the race, why start to shell out

979
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:44,960
Speaker 15: those dollars now?

980
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:48,280
Speaker 17: I mean, that is kind of a tough financial decision

981
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:52,680
Speaker 17: that campaigns have to make. But you've seen the gap

982
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:57,400
Speaker 17: between DeSantis and Trump really grow over the last few months.

983
00:47:57,440 --> 00:48:01,560
Speaker 17: It's gone from DeSantis was about thirty teen points behind

984
00:48:01,840 --> 00:48:05,879
Speaker 17: Trump in among Republican voters to now about twenty eight

985
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 17: points behind. Part of that is Trump has effectively been

986
00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:14,399
Speaker 17: knocking down DeSantis. Desanta's has made some errors, but it's

987
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:18,719
Speaker 17: also partly just temper because Trump is grabbing all the

988
00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:21,120
Speaker 17: attention because of these prosecutions.

989
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 2: Looking at a couple of polls here just out since Friday,

990
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:30,239
Speaker 2: University of Georgia, Trump fifty one, DeSantis thirty. In Kentucky

991
00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:34,839
Speaker 2: Fox fifty six, and Emerson Trumps sixty two DeSantis twenty three.

992
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:37,359
Speaker 2: I could keep rattling these off as I read from

993
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:40,080
Speaker 2: Real Clear Politics and the poll of polls, to your

994
00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 2: point is a massive spread. Are we assuming potentially incorrectly

995
00:48:45,960 --> 00:48:48,040
Speaker 2: that Ron de Santis is going to run?

996
00:48:48,600 --> 00:48:51,040
Speaker 17: I think we're assuming correctly that Ron DeSantis is going

997
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:54,960
Speaker 17: to run it. This is this is probably his best shot.

998
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 17: This is his time if he's going to take it,

999
00:48:56,800 --> 00:48:57,600
Speaker 17: so he should take it.

1000
00:48:57,640 --> 00:48:59,279
Speaker 2: There's no wait in four years for him now.

1001
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:03,000
Speaker 17: I think this is his moment. But the question is

1002
00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:07,319
Speaker 17: whether he's like a Fred Thompson where he seems like

1003
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:10,839
Speaker 17: he's going to be very strong, but then he has

1004
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:11,920
Speaker 17: a glass jaw or.

1005
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 11: Another governor from Florida.

1006
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:18,440
Speaker 17: Yes, exclamation, but he might do better because there are

1007
00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:21,759
Speaker 17: some reasons why Trump's strength is really a short term

1008
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:26,120
Speaker 17: phenomena with long term risks. You know, if these prosecutions

1009
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 17: keep going on and unpleasant things get on earthed by

1010
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:33,640
Speaker 17: the time the primaries roll around, Republican voters might be thinking, oh,

1011
00:49:33,680 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 17: he's a risky candidate. Who else can I go for?

1012
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:41,279
Speaker 17: So what's going on now isn't necessarily what's going to

1013
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:43,480
Speaker 17: go on in the long term, but the risk of

1014
00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:46,319
Speaker 17: it defining dessand As is a big risk for him.

1015
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:48,759
Speaker 2: Isn't that something? Boy? I'll tell you what if Rondes

1016
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:51,960
Speaker 2: Santas heard you compare him to Fred Thompson, just might

1017
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:55,040
Speaker 2: announce tomorrow. Mike Dorton, Hey, great work. Great to see you.

1018
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 11: We have great to see you.

1019
00:49:56,120 --> 00:49:58,440
Speaker 2: Love to spend a time with Bloomberg Politics report of

1020
00:49:58,480 --> 00:49:59,759
Speaker 2: Mike Horning