1 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:07,960 Speaker 1: Have you ever looked up at the night sky and 2 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:10,400 Speaker 1: wondered if there's life in other parts of the universe? 3 00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: You mean our aliens? Real? Yeah, I mean some of 4 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:16,240 Speaker 1: these questions are so deep that no matter what the 5 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 1: answer is, it's going to blow your mind. So like, 6 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,320 Speaker 1: if there is life out there, that would be totally 7 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:25,479 Speaker 1: mind blowing. And if we're the only living beings in 8 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:45,560 Speaker 1: the entire universe, oh my gosh, also mind blowing. Him. 9 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 1: And I'm Daniel, and I'm a cartoonists former roboticist, and 10 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: I'm a particle physicist, which means I know things about 11 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:56,279 Speaker 1: particles and space and the universe, and I make up 12 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: things about aliens. Welcome to our podcast, Daniel and Horror 13 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:03,680 Speaker 1: Explain the Universe today. On the program, we're asking the 14 00:01:03,800 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 1: question are we alone in the universe? Is there anyone 15 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: else out there that thinks and feels and loves and 16 00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:20,200 Speaker 1: slips on bananas? Or is it just us in the 17 00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:24,400 Speaker 1: universe thinking and feeling? Are we the only ones intelligent 18 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:29,400 Speaker 1: or somewhat intelligent in this entire universe at least? Do 19 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 1: you think humans are intelligent? Or hey, I mean that 20 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:35,479 Speaker 1: says something about you right there. Well, it's a little bar. 21 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 1: Sometimes I wonder if aliens have come to Earth and 22 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:42,000 Speaker 1: just sort of dismissed us as not intelligent life and 23 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:44,320 Speaker 1: moved on. Yeah, They're like, oh my god, we don't 24 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 1: want to associate with these people, these dumb rocks. So 25 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: we were wondering about this question, and as usual, we 26 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: went out and we asked people on the street. We said, 27 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 1: do you think we're alone in the universe or is 28 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: there other intelligent life out there? What do you think 29 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: are we the only ones in the universe. Here's what 30 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 1: they had to say. I definitely think there's other intelligence 31 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 1: out there. Why is that? Well, first of all, I 32 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:08,720 Speaker 1: think it's kind of arrogant to think that we're the 33 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: only ones here because it's a pretty big place. I 34 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 1: think it's possible that there's other intelligent life just because 35 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:18,440 Speaker 1: of how spacious the universe is. I think there's another 36 00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 1: intelligent life somewhere out there. Yeah, I think because I 37 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 1: think the universe is so big, and I don't I 38 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:27,680 Speaker 1: just don't think it's possible that human as the only 39 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:31,959 Speaker 1: intelligence forever life. Yeah, alright, So I think most people 40 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:35,239 Speaker 1: seem to be pretty optimistic about it, right, You think 41 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 1: that's optimistic? I was surprised that everybody believes in aliens, 42 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 1: Like almost every single person thinks there is other intelligent 43 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:44,959 Speaker 1: life out there, right, I was really shocked. I thought 44 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,520 Speaker 1: there's gonna be a lot more skepticism, really a lot 45 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 1: more like human centric people like we're special. Yeah. Well, 46 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: you know, America is a fairly religious nation, and the 47 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:57,800 Speaker 1: narrative of the mainstream Christianity is that humans were made 48 00:02:57,800 --> 00:02:59,839 Speaker 1: in the image of God, and there's not a whole 49 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:03,240 Speaker 1: lot a place in that narrative for other intelligent races. Well, 50 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: I guess there's nothing on the In the Bible, it 51 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:08,520 Speaker 1: says that there aren't aliens. Right, Oh, that's true, I suppose, 52 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:11,320 Speaker 1: But are they human like or you know, other weird 53 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: stuff or yeah, I suppose. Yeah. Anyway, it would be 54 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:17,160 Speaker 1: a fascinating moment and a reckoning for Christianity and most 55 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:20,079 Speaker 1: religions the day that we discover other intelligent life. You 56 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:24,480 Speaker 1: and I should write that Extra Testament, the Newest Testament 57 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 1: by Jorhand Daniel, the Extra Terrestrial Testament, the Terrestament. But 58 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: I was surprised by how subtle people's arguments were. You know, 59 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: they were like, um, it's a big universe, so it 60 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 1: would be surprising if we were the only ones. Like, 61 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 1: that's a very kind of subtle argument, right, what's subtle 62 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:47,120 Speaker 1: about it? I mean they're just saying it's huge, and 63 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: so it's probably not empty, right, there's a lot of 64 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 1: interesting nuances. They're like, yeah, it's big, but we don't 65 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: know how rare life is, and so we have no 66 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 1: idea if being big means that there's a lot of life, 67 00:03:57,600 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: we could still be the only ones. You know. What 68 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:01,960 Speaker 1: I'm really interested in is your comment. You said you 69 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 1: thought they were optimistic, So you think, um, having aliens 70 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 1: out there is good news. Well, I don't know if 71 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:10,320 Speaker 1: it's good news, but it's it's kind of like, um, 72 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 1: it sort of feels like the sadder option is that 73 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: we were the only ones in the entire universe, right, 74 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 1: Like there's something comforting emotionally about the fact that we're 75 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: not the only ones out there, right, Like, you wouldn't 76 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:24,480 Speaker 1: want to be the only person in live in the universe. 77 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 1: I don't know. It depends how friendly they are, you know, 78 00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 1: if there's their ferocious life out their way and to 79 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:31,719 Speaker 1: kill us, I'm not sure i'd be too comforted knowing 80 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: that they're they're not very far away, and they could 81 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:35,960 Speaker 1: come over here and squish us in a moment. Oh, 82 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:39,920 Speaker 1: I see, you're you're pessimistic about the optimistic scenario where 83 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 1: we're not the only ones. Yeah, the fact that we're 84 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: not the only ones. Um, if we were, if we 85 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 1: discover that there is intelligent, other intelligent life out there, 86 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 1: I agree, it means something really fascinating and deep about 87 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:54,040 Speaker 1: life and intelligence and consciousness. But I'm not sure it 88 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 1: would be good news for humans, you know. And what 89 00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:59,239 Speaker 1: you said a moment ago is fascinating as well, because 90 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 1: you say it would be comforting to think that there's 91 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 1: other intelligent life out there. On the contrary, if we 92 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 1: are the only intelligent life in the entire vast cosmos, 93 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:11,360 Speaker 1: that means we're quite special. You know. In the history 94 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:14,000 Speaker 1: of science, mostly the role of science has been to 95 00:05:14,279 --> 00:05:17,479 Speaker 1: put humanity in its place. You know. Oh, you the 96 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:19,280 Speaker 1: Earth is not the center of the Solar system. Oh, 97 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: the Earth is not the center of the galaxy. Oh, 98 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:23,720 Speaker 1: this galaxy is one of zillions. So it turns out 99 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:25,800 Speaker 1: we're tiny little things living on a tiny speck in 100 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,800 Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere. Wouldn't it be amazing if science 101 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 1: then put humanity right back in the center of importance 102 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:34,799 Speaker 1: and said we are special. We are the only intelligent 103 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 1: life in the universe. We are basically the universe's brain. 104 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 1: That would be a fascinating new role for science in 105 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:44,159 Speaker 1: sort of the communal mindset. I guess I don't have 106 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: the same ego as a physicist, maybe, right. Cartoonists are 107 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:53,919 Speaker 1: famously self depricating, right, it doesn't take any ego to 108 00:05:54,160 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 1: put your art online for millions to admire. But yeah, 109 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a big universe, and so it would 110 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:07,840 Speaker 1: be weird if we were the only ones. And so 111 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: that's that's a big question, right, Like why haven't we 112 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,599 Speaker 1: by now we've been listening to these guys and looking 113 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:16,279 Speaker 1: out there by now, why haven't we heard from, or 114 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:21,600 Speaker 1: been contacted by, or seen evidence of other intelligent life forms? Right, 115 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 1: It's a famous question, and people call it the Fermi 116 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 1: paradox from for Enrico Fermi, who first posited it. He said, 117 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 1: the universe is huge, and it's old, and that's another 118 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 1: important factor. The universe is old, and that means that 119 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:37,720 Speaker 1: even though it's pretty big, it doesn't take that long 120 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: to get across it, like take our galaxy. Right, it's 121 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 1: pretty big, but you could traverse it in you know, 122 00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: a couple of million years if you had pretty good technology. Right, So, 123 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,360 Speaker 1: so by now we should have seen some passing cruise 124 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,560 Speaker 1: ship or ailing cruise ship or some sort of probe 125 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:55,800 Speaker 1: or something by now. Yeah, Like, if I wanted to 126 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:58,039 Speaker 1: explore the galaxy, how would I do it? I would 127 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 1: send out a probe which would then self replicate. It 128 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 1: would like land on an asteroid and mind the materials 129 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 1: to build two copies of itself, which would then land 130 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:08,719 Speaker 1: on an asteroid, which would then land on asteroids. So 131 00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: you get this exponential growth in these probes, and it 132 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:14,280 Speaker 1: only takes you know, a few hundred thousand years to 133 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 1: visit every single thing in the galaxy if you use 134 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: that technique. So then the question is, why haven't we 135 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 1: been visited? If the galaxy is billions of years old 136 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: and not that hard to get across in a fraction 137 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 1: of the galaxy's lifetime, where is everybody? Right? So that's 138 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 1: firm me his famous question, right, right, And it's kind 139 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:33,360 Speaker 1: of related to this idea you mentioned earlier, which is 140 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 1: that it sort of depends on the probability of things, 141 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: like the probability that we would be contacted by life 142 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 1: is equal to the probability that life can form and 143 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 1: that it can do other things. Right, That's right, And 144 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:48,920 Speaker 1: you have to sort of break the problem into pieces. 145 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 1: And the guy who did that first is called Drake. 146 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:54,040 Speaker 1: And so there's this equation called the Drake equation, which 147 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 1: tries to sort of compartmentalize the questions. It says, you know, 148 00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: the probability for us to be contact by aliens is 149 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 1: the number of stars out there times the fraction of 150 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 1: those stars that have earthlike planets. Right, That gives you 151 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:10,360 Speaker 1: the total number of earthlike planets out there times the 152 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 1: probability for life to be formed on those planets times 153 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: the probability for that life to be intelligent, times the 154 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 1: probability for that life to have technology, times the probability 155 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 1: that we overlap in eras so that we can actually 156 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,280 Speaker 1: talk to them. So it's a lot of different pieces. 157 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 1: So it's like you have to stack these probabilities one 158 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 1: on top of the other. Yeah, exactly. It's kind of like, 159 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 1: what's the probability you're gonna roll a two ones when 160 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 1: you rule to die, And it's like you have to 161 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 1: multiply the probability of rolling one in one die and 162 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:42,079 Speaker 1: then another one in another die, which is one six 163 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: times one six. So it's like there's like a one 164 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 1: in thirty six probability you're gonna throw a deuce a 165 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: two ones in a pair of die exactly. And the 166 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: more pieces you have that have to line up that 167 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: the heart of the chances are even if you do 168 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:56,920 Speaker 1: something more more likely, like flip a coin. Right, what 169 00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 1: are the chances you're gonna flip a coin eight times 170 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 1: and get eight heads in a row? Right? Well, not 171 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:03,839 Speaker 1: very high? You know, one over two to the eight 172 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 1: is a small number. So even if all of those 173 00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 1: numbers are pretty big, it's the probability of all them 174 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 1: together can be kind of small. Oh, I see. It's 175 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 1: like you have to flip a coin and get ahead, 176 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 1: and then flip another coin and get ahead, and so 177 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 1: that there's probability stuck up. And if you have one 178 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:20,360 Speaker 1: coin that's like messed up, that's tails and both sides 179 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:23,320 Speaker 1: and you'll never get all heads. Right, that's right, And 180 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 1: that's the calculation I think people were doing in their 181 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:28,319 Speaker 1: heads when we asked them, is their intelligent life out there? 182 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 1: And they thought, well, the first part of that number, 183 00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 1: the number of stars is huge, and so it doesn't 184 00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: really matter what the other numbers are. I think that's 185 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 1: the argument they were making. But I think that argument 186 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 1: is pretty flawed. Actually, what do you mean it's flawed? Well, 187 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,959 Speaker 1: the first number is big, right, So how many stars 188 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 1: are there in the universe? Well, every galaxy has about 189 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 1: a hundred billion, which is, you know, already a totally 190 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:53,720 Speaker 1: infathomable number. Like it's just it's hard to even imagine, right, 191 00:09:53,920 --> 00:09:56,760 Speaker 1: how many stars that is. Plus you have to multiply 192 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,240 Speaker 1: that by the number of galaxies in the universe. And 193 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:01,400 Speaker 1: in our observed prubble universe, the part we can see, 194 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:05,640 Speaker 1: there's two trillion galaxies. So we're two trillion times a 195 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: hundred billion zillion stars. That's the official that's right technically, 196 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 1: because and so I in fact that I think they've 197 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: figured out that um on any given star, the probability 198 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:23,440 Speaker 1: that there's an earthlike planet, there's like maybe three or 199 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,360 Speaker 1: four of them right per star. Yeah, this is something 200 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:29,000 Speaker 1: we've only learned pretty recently because of the rise of 201 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 1: this exoplanet science where we can look at other stars 202 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: and see the planets around them and try to estimate 203 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:36,679 Speaker 1: we've seen enough now that we can start to estimate 204 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:39,839 Speaker 1: what fraction of those stars have an earthlike planet, meaning 205 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:42,760 Speaker 1: a planet that's pretty rocky, reasonable size, and has a 206 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 1: reasonable amount of solar radiation right fried to a crisp 207 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:49,319 Speaker 1: or totally chilly. And yeah, the fraction of stars that 208 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 1: have an earthlike planet is one in five. One in 209 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,760 Speaker 1: five stars as an earthlike planet. Yeah, which is amazing 210 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:59,240 Speaker 1: because that takes that huge number two trillion times a 211 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:01,960 Speaker 1: hundred billion and just divides it by five, which still 212 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:05,960 Speaker 1: leaves an enormous number. There's a huge amount of planets 213 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:08,760 Speaker 1: out there that are just like the Earth, that's right, 214 00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: And we only learned this recently, you know, a few 215 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 1: years ago it could have been that earthlike planets were 216 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 1: super rare. That number could have been one over two gazillion. Right. 217 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:20,599 Speaker 1: So the fact that the first number is big, that 218 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: the number of stars is huge, doesn't guarantee that the 219 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: whole number is big, because if any of those numbers, 220 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:28,800 Speaker 1: the fraction that have earthlike planets, the fraction that have life, 221 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:31,520 Speaker 1: the fractions have intelligent life, if any of those are tiny, 222 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 1: then the whole number is tiny. Right. So, but so 223 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 1: far it's pretty big still, number of stars times number 224 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 1: earthlike planets still an enormous number, but that's as far 225 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 1: as we know. We really just don't know, Like, can 226 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: you answer the question what fraction of earthlike planets have 227 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: life on them? That's a pretty basic question, right, You 228 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: might ask a biologist, like if you ran an Earth 229 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:54,400 Speaker 1: stimulator a hundred times, how many times would you get 230 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 1: life on it? We just don't know the answer to 231 00:11:56,840 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 1: that question. It's one of the core questions and modern biology. 232 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:02,400 Speaker 1: And I'm speaking as a particle physicist who doesn't know 233 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: that much biology except for being married to a biologist. 234 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:07,520 Speaker 1: But we still don't know they answer that very basic question. 235 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:10,760 Speaker 1: So basically she would say, you don't know anything. You 236 00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:13,520 Speaker 1: don't know. She says that to me a lot, and 237 00:12:13,559 --> 00:12:17,319 Speaker 1: she's usually right. Not just about biology, that's right, it's 238 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 1: more of a broader conversation that we have before we 239 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:34,560 Speaker 1: keep going. Let's take a short break. But we sort 240 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 1: of know a little bit about how life form, right, Like, 241 00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:40,640 Speaker 1: you haven't planeted like the Earth, and um that maybe 242 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,680 Speaker 1: has water. It's in the right spot relative to the sun, 243 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:46,080 Speaker 1: it's not too hot, not too cold. It's called the 244 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:49,319 Speaker 1: Goldilocks planet. We sort of know a little bit about 245 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:52,119 Speaker 1: you know, you need this kind of primordial soup, and eventually, 246 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 1: at least on Earth, like some of those molecules kind 247 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:58,720 Speaker 1: of came together and became a life. Yeah, that's true. Um, 248 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 1: we know what's necessar seria, but we don't know if 249 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:02,960 Speaker 1: it's sufficient. Right. So, you know, we know that you 250 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 1: need liquid water, and you need basic amino acids, and 251 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:10,160 Speaker 1: you need some source of energy right to organize things, um, 252 00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:13,079 Speaker 1: lightning or the sun or whatever. But we don't know 253 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 1: if you put that all together, if you get life 254 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: every time, or if it's a totally freak chance. Right. 255 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: We just really, we really have no idea how many 256 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 1: times that happens. And people are studying this, you know, 257 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:25,640 Speaker 1: they do things like put that promodial soup or our 258 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 1: understanding of it, in a test tube and zap it 259 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:30,960 Speaker 1: with electricity, and they see cool stuff happen, like basic 260 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:33,959 Speaker 1: amino acids the building blocks of DNA and stuff they 261 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: do form. But that doesn't make life, right. Life needs 262 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: to be self replicating and has to have metabolism. And 263 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: but you know there's a whole other question there about 264 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:44,319 Speaker 1: what is life anyway. Well, so even if you can 265 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 1: get life out of primorial soup, you still have to 266 00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:53,280 Speaker 1: have that live, survive and evolve and become uh critters 267 00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:57,160 Speaker 1: and beings and intalligent beings. We can build radios and 268 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 1: technology and harness and launch podcast the city, yeah, and 269 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:05,120 Speaker 1: large podcasts and then get transmitted across the cosmos. Like 270 00:14:05,240 --> 00:14:09,480 Speaker 1: that's that's a huge gap to write, like a huge improbability. 271 00:14:09,520 --> 00:14:12,199 Speaker 1: That's right, we just don't know, and so we've already 272 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 1: gone past our knowledge, right that the fraction of planets 273 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:17,680 Speaker 1: that form life could be one in two, it could 274 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 1: be one in a gazillion. Right, Um, you're absolutely right, 275 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: And then you're right that we don't know what fraction 276 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 1: then make intelligent life, Like, yeah, we have the example 277 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:28,920 Speaker 1: here on Earth. We also know that that one example 278 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:31,520 Speaker 1: is highly dependent on a bunch of random events, like 279 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:33,800 Speaker 1: a meteor crashed in the Earth and killed all the 280 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:36,840 Speaker 1: dinosaurs and made room for the mammals to evolve. Would 281 00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:39,680 Speaker 1: the dinosaurs have become intelligent if we hadn't come around? 282 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 1: Is is it guaranteed that something becomes intelligent? Or is 283 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 1: this just a total fluke and in a thousand different 284 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 1: other similar earths without in a meteor, or if the 285 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 1: meteor hit somewhere else, you wouldn't have intelligent life, or 286 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 1: you'd have super intelligent life, or like dumb life or 287 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: life all life would be dead. We just we really 288 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: have no where to answer that question. But even then, 289 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 1: that's just a probability that there is life out there, right, 290 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: Like you just need all those factors to add up 291 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,200 Speaker 1: to more than one in a gazillion, Like if it 292 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 1: was to an a gazillion, there's probably definitely life out there. 293 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:14,680 Speaker 1: But then there's the other question of like, why haven't 294 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:17,280 Speaker 1: we heard from them or contacted them or seen them? Right, Like, 295 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 1: it's kind of two separate questions, like is there life 296 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 1: out there? Right? And then there's a question of why 297 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 1: haven't we like seen it or had contact with it? 298 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 1: I like that thought. Let's assume that life is not 299 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 1: so rare, and even that intelligent life is not so rare, Okay, 300 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:32,240 Speaker 1: So then we live in a universe filled with Earth 301 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: life planets that have some sort of squishy, weird intelligent 302 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:37,920 Speaker 1: life on them, right, And then the question is if 303 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:40,080 Speaker 1: that's true, why haven't we heard from them? Right? Because 304 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: as we said earlier, it's not that complicated to make 305 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:45,880 Speaker 1: self replicating probes that explore the entire galaxy. So why 306 00:15:45,880 --> 00:15:47,880 Speaker 1: haven't we heard from them? Yeah, and there's a lot 307 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 1: of fun ideas. They're like my favorite hypothesis is that 308 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:53,760 Speaker 1: maybe we have heard from them and we just don't know. 309 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 1: I mean, would we understand a message from space? I mean, 310 00:15:57,520 --> 00:15:59,080 Speaker 1: in order to understand it, it it would have to be 311 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 1: in a language we've recognize. It would have to be 312 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:04,200 Speaker 1: in a communication medium we're looking for, Like maybe they're 313 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:07,040 Speaker 1: sending us signals, but it's uh in some kind of 314 00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 1: thing that we don't even look for, like neutrinos or 315 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:12,840 Speaker 1: some other medium that's not light exactly. We're listening to 316 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 1: messages from the sky, we're not actually listening that hard, 317 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:18,320 Speaker 1: and we're only listening to a tiny little slice of 318 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 1: the possible messages we can get. And the message could 319 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 1: be in a totally different medium, you're right, Or it 320 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 1: could even be you know, in radio waves, which is 321 00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 1: what we're listening for, but just be undecipherable. I mean, 322 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: what if aliens live thousands of years and so their 323 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 1: messages last hundreds of years and we're hearing it, We're 324 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:37,200 Speaker 1: just hearing the first, you know, few snatches of it, 325 00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 1: and we don't even recognize that. It is like maybe 326 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: we're getting a message thing, uh, guys going, but like 327 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 1: it's so slow if we don't even pay attention to it. Yeah, 328 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: Or it could be the reverse. It could be like 329 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 1: super fast, like super pico second signals that we can't 330 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 1: even detect. Yeah. Absolutely. We have actually in the past 331 00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:09,160 Speaker 1: heard messages or heard things from space that we don't understand. 332 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:12,000 Speaker 1: One of my favorite stories is this message called the 333 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:16,040 Speaker 1: WOW signal. That's the scientific term. It's literally called the 334 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:19,880 Speaker 1: Wow signal because when somebody heard it, they wrote wow 335 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 1: down on a piece of paper when they saw it, 336 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 1: and it was exactly the kind of signal you would 337 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,119 Speaker 1: expect to get from space if they were aliens. It 338 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 1: was the thing. It was the ninety seven and they 339 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 1: had a telescope and they heard this extraordinarily loud, intense 340 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 1: burst of radiation well above the background and nothing they 341 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:40,920 Speaker 1: had seen like that before. And you know, they said, 342 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:43,200 Speaker 1: is it a satellite, is it something reflecting off this, 343 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 1: is it something weird bounce off the moon? Is it 344 00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:49,760 Speaker 1: something else? And they ruled out all those possibilities they 345 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:53,200 Speaker 1: recorded it. Yeah. Absolutely, So we have the data, um, 346 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,000 Speaker 1: but nobody knows if it comes from an intelligent life 347 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 1: or not. Because first of all, it was never repeated, 348 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 1: so we only heard it once and we can't decipher it. 349 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:03,480 Speaker 1: It's very short. We don't know what it means. So 350 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:05,840 Speaker 1: without being able to decipher it, it it could just be like, 351 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 1: you know, some weird emissions structure to it. Yeah, it 352 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:11,640 Speaker 1: has that we can determine, right, I mean, who knows 353 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:14,200 Speaker 1: how these things could be structured encoded in a way 354 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 1: that's totally alien to us. Anything we get will be encoded. 355 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,439 Speaker 1: Like think about the message that we sent into space. 356 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 1: I think about that a lot. Like we send messages 357 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,679 Speaker 1: into space, like on the Voyager Probe and the Pioneer. Right, 358 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:27,639 Speaker 1: there's like the famous Golden Record, that's where we send 359 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:30,760 Speaker 1: that satellite out there into space with like information about it, 360 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 1: like a little note that says call me maybe maybe 361 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 1: I'm crazy, call me um. And I wonder, like, if 362 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 1: you're an alien species, would you have any chance of 363 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,119 Speaker 1: deciphering that? Right? In order for that to work, we 364 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:45,119 Speaker 1: have to have some a lot of stuff in common 365 00:18:45,119 --> 00:18:47,000 Speaker 1: about the way we think. And I think that's the 366 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:50,159 Speaker 1: critical factor, is that really all we're capable of discovering 367 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:53,840 Speaker 1: is life that's very similar to ours in the sense 368 00:18:53,920 --> 00:18:56,399 Speaker 1: that it thinks the way we do. It uses math 369 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: and it communicates the way we do, and also that 370 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:01,440 Speaker 1: they want to communicate. I mean, there could be just 371 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:04,040 Speaker 1: be life out there that just doesn't care about finding 372 00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 1: other life, that's busy living their squishy, little eyeball life. Right, 373 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:09,960 Speaker 1: Like we're the only extroverts in the universe, and most 374 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:13,199 Speaker 1: thoughts aliens out there are like, why would you want 375 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 1: to talk to other people? That's insane, that's right to 376 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: just slam the door and pretend to not home. You know, 377 00:19:18,119 --> 00:19:20,679 Speaker 1: we could be the weird ones in that perspective. Um. 378 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 1: And you know we sent other messages into space when 379 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 1: we got this wow signal. We can tell where in 380 00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 1: the sky it's coming from because from directionality of the 381 00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 1: of the antenna. And so people actually sent a response, 382 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 1: like they beamed a response back into space. What again, 383 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:49,679 Speaker 1: it was it was new phone who did UM. So 384 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: that's one possibilities that like, even if there is intelligent 385 00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,000 Speaker 1: life out there and there are signals to be seen, 386 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 1: there's just two alien for us to even recognize or 387 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:01,560 Speaker 1: process or be able to cypher. That's right, And I 388 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,480 Speaker 1: think that's honestly likely because it's hard for us to 389 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 1: imagine things that are really alien to us. I mean, 390 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:08,359 Speaker 1: like look at all of our science fiction, right, It 391 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,639 Speaker 1: usually the aliens are like some variation on humans with 392 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:16,120 Speaker 1: like fuzzy eyebrows or pointy ears or something, because it's 393 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:18,680 Speaker 1: difficult to extrapolate that far into the unknown. I mean 394 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:21,879 Speaker 1: even here on Earth, people travel to other countries and 395 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 1: they're like shocked at the weird stuff people eat and 396 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:26,399 Speaker 1: the way they talk and how they sleep and what 397 00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:29,879 Speaker 1: they wear, and like even human cultures are bizarre and 398 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 1: alien to us if we're not familiar with them. And 399 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:35,400 Speaker 1: I love traveling for that reason that you discover what's 400 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 1: universal about being human and what's just like totally arbitrary 401 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:40,480 Speaker 1: and made up about your culture. And that's one of 402 00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:43,360 Speaker 1: the amazing things about aliens, Like what stuff that everybody 403 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,879 Speaker 1: does and what's stuff that only you for some reason 404 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 1: or your culture? Yeah, exactly, Like everybody needs caffeine in 405 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,200 Speaker 1: the morning of some kind, right, but only we drink 406 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 1: this water from a weird being on a tree, right. 407 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:58,400 Speaker 1: And so if we discovered aliens, then we would learn 408 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 1: so much about, um, you know, what is common in life, 409 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:03,720 Speaker 1: Like how did they do they use math to think? 410 00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:07,199 Speaker 1: Do they have scientists you know, are they spiritual? Do 411 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:10,760 Speaker 1: they see color? Do they have two genders? Nine genders? 412 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 1: No genders? Like what is basic and similar in life 413 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: and what is totally different? That would be so fascinating. 414 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,919 Speaker 1: That's pretty cool to think about. Yeah, there's another possibility, 415 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 1: like maybe there's life out there, but the universe is 416 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: so big and so vast and so old that the 417 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,159 Speaker 1: chances of us hearing about them are contacting them is 418 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,840 Speaker 1: just too small. I don't like that one because I 419 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 1: feel like, eventually somebody's going to invent the self replicating probe. 420 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 1: Your civilization doesn't even have to survive. You could just 421 00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,400 Speaker 1: send out that probe and eventually it will contact everybody 422 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:44,600 Speaker 1: in the galaxy. I like how you're thinking like a physicist. 423 00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:47,800 Speaker 1: I'm thinking like an engineer, and I'm like, self recomplicating probes. 424 00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:51,760 Speaker 1: That's an impossible engineering feed. Are you kidding me? Is 425 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:54,640 Speaker 1: that what engineers do? They say things are impossible? No, 426 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:56,760 Speaker 1: you can't have this, you can't have this, you can't 427 00:21:56,760 --> 00:21:58,760 Speaker 1: have this. How hard is that? I mean, all you 428 00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 1: gotta do is land and astro w mind some materials, 429 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 1: build a factory, right, Sure, that's super easy. I mean 430 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,119 Speaker 1: we can be doing it for a long time. Why not. 431 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,560 Speaker 1: I'm gonna call Elon Musk and I'm sure you'll have 432 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:12,359 Speaker 1: a we'll start a company to do it tomorrow and 433 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:16,320 Speaker 1: ask him how those are still driving cars are doing. Hey, 434 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:18,360 Speaker 1: when you're done building model threes, can we build self 435 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:21,440 Speaker 1: replicating probes that explore the galaxy? And while we're at it, 436 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:23,879 Speaker 1: let's give them artificial intelligence so they can interact with 437 00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:27,640 Speaker 1: the aliens and answer their questions. That would be pretty awesome. Yeah, yeah, well, 438 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 1: this is a perfect point to take a break. We'll 439 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:44,120 Speaker 1: be right back in a minute. I think the idea 440 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:45,800 Speaker 1: is that it's like we're in an ocean, right, Like 441 00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:48,359 Speaker 1: if you're stranded in the ocean on a raft, Like, 442 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:50,400 Speaker 1: what are the chances you're going to run into other 443 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:52,879 Speaker 1: people stranded in the raft? It's pretty small, right, It 444 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:56,880 Speaker 1: depends how many rafts there are, right. But also there's 445 00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:58,640 Speaker 1: not just like the space of it, that is also 446 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,240 Speaker 1: the age of it, right, Like me be we are 447 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:04,400 Speaker 1: alive right now in a moment that's after the most 448 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: populous time in the universe. Like maybe everybody was alive 449 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 1: a few billion years ago, or maybe everyone's going to 450 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:12,600 Speaker 1: be alive a few billion years from now, but right 451 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,960 Speaker 1: now we're maybe like the first ones at the party 452 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: or something, yeah, or the last ones. Yeah. And that's 453 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:20,680 Speaker 1: the last element that in that Drake equation, right, is 454 00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:23,159 Speaker 1: the probably that we're alive at the same time to communicate. 455 00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,239 Speaker 1: And you're right in terms of how long we've been 456 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:28,680 Speaker 1: around and like listening to this guy and talking to it, 457 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 1: it's a tiny fraction of the life of the universe. 458 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:33,439 Speaker 1: And then you have to wonder, like how long is 459 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,440 Speaker 1: humanity is going to be around and receptive to messages. 460 00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 1: Is there going to be fifty years, which is all 461 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,680 Speaker 1: we've had so far, or fifty thousand years even still, 462 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 1: which would be a tiny fraction. So you're right. It 463 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:46,440 Speaker 1: could be that life flourishes and intelligent life is created 464 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:49,480 Speaker 1: and then you know, destroys itself every time, and so 465 00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 1: that these things don't last very long, which would make 466 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 1: it difficult to talk to each other. Yeah, yeah, but 467 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:59,200 Speaker 1: that's not very optimistic the idea that maybe life is 468 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,480 Speaker 1: super pop blur in the universe, but it all eventually 469 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:05,280 Speaker 1: like kills itself, that's right, blows itself up in a 470 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:08,639 Speaker 1: glorious fireway. Like maybe there's been other civilizations that have 471 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,160 Speaker 1: followed the exact same steps we have. You know, like 472 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:15,639 Speaker 1: um evolved, make cars. Um, you're about to say that 473 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: Donald Trump is inevitable. That is that what you're saying. 474 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: It's a universal truth that every civilization creates Donald Trump. 475 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,640 Speaker 1: Eventually Trump is an alien. That would explain a lot. 476 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:29,239 Speaker 1: But but like it isn't like at some point all 477 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 1: civilizations eventually maybe like learn how to split the atom 478 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 1: and then they all blow each other up inevitably. It's possible, 479 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 1: But again I think that's just extrapolation from our experience. 480 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 1: You know, that's the kind of things humans do, and 481 00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: so we like to think, well, probably everybody does that, 482 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:45,919 Speaker 1: but we really don't know, right, Remember, we really have 483 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:48,560 Speaker 1: no idea. I mean, it could be that other aliens 484 00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,800 Speaker 1: don't have such a defined sense of individuality, right, I Mean, 485 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 1: we have this notion that I'm me and you are you, 486 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 1: and there's this biological difference defined by our skin. But 487 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 1: that's a biological that's a conclusion from a biologic artifact, right, 488 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 1: was this the skin that we have and other beings 489 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: could be like more fluid, where like the nature of 490 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,159 Speaker 1: an individual depends on who's near each other, and so 491 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:11,920 Speaker 1: their concept of resource sharing and therefore war is totally 492 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:15,440 Speaker 1: different and maybe very unlikely that they kill themselves, So 493 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,160 Speaker 1: we we just don't know, but it's it's certainly possible 494 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 1: that life is flourishing and destroying itself very rapidly. Well. 495 00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:25,399 Speaker 1: I also, um, I thought the craziest idea that I 496 00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 1: read out there was this idea that maybe the universe 497 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 1: is teeming with life, but nobody wants to talk to us, 498 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 1: like somehow we're in a bubble where they're like, let's 499 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 1: not let's not even touch these guys. Or or there's 500 00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:40,400 Speaker 1: an idea out there that we're like in a zoo 501 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:44,000 Speaker 1: or something. Oh, I hate that idea. I hate that 502 00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:45,880 Speaker 1: It not because I think it's wrong. I think it's 503 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:49,639 Speaker 1: actually pretty reasonable and clever. But how frustrating, right, I 504 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:52,760 Speaker 1: mean I said earlier that meeting aliens would be dangerous, 505 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:55,000 Speaker 1: and I think that probably would be, But that doesn't 506 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:56,880 Speaker 1: mean I wouldn't want to. I mean, I would love 507 00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,199 Speaker 1: to meet aliens. We could learn so much about the 508 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: universe and six and math and life. So if they're 509 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,680 Speaker 1: out there and could contact us and they're just not 510 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,119 Speaker 1: because we're lame, boy, that would be pretty disappointing. That 511 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 1: would be a crush through the to our self image. 512 00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: So I think it would be comforting to know that 513 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:15,480 Speaker 1: we're not alone in this universe, right like today idea. 514 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:17,640 Speaker 1: It's kind of like having an older sibling or something, 515 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:19,920 Speaker 1: you know, somebody who's been through it, who sort of 516 00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:21,960 Speaker 1: had maybe has some more knowledge than we do. I 517 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,639 Speaker 1: think that would be cool. Um. But you're you're thinking 518 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 1: that maybe it might be dangerous to contact other life forms. Absolutely, 519 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,439 Speaker 1: I think it would be dangerous. Um. The history of 520 00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 1: contact between different cultures is that the more advanced one 521 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:39,320 Speaker 1: always crushes the lesser advanced one. And if we're going 522 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:41,800 Speaker 1: to contact aliens, more likely they're going to come to us, 523 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,040 Speaker 1: then we're going to get to them, which means they 524 00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:47,320 Speaker 1: are the more advanced. And you know what that means, right, 525 00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:50,119 Speaker 1: I mean, think about the way we treat lesser intelligent creatures. Right. 526 00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,800 Speaker 1: We domesticate them, right, Dogs and chimpanzees don't have rights 527 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 1: in our society, um, and we argue that they're less intelligent. 528 00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,800 Speaker 1: We even eat some less intelligent creatures, right, So when 529 00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:02,600 Speaker 1: aliens come, do we apply that same morality to them 530 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 1: and say, well, yeah, you guys are twice as smart 531 00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 1: as us. So go ahead and make us your pets 532 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:09,439 Speaker 1: and eat however many of us you want, right, I 533 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: think that's the most likely outcome. I see, Like, if 534 00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:16,400 Speaker 1: you run into less intelligent species, you're most likely your 535 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:18,960 Speaker 1: thought is, it's not hey, let's bring these guys up 536 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,080 Speaker 1: and show them all we can do, more like hey, 537 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:26,520 Speaker 1: slave labor or something like that. Exactly. Look, resources, Yeah, 538 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:28,959 Speaker 1: we've been traveling on the spaceship for millions of years. 539 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 1: Finally we get to eat something warm. Yeah, that's right, 540 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:36,040 Speaker 1: roasted human. That's my concern. And you know, we have 541 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 1: sent messages into space, and I think that's kind of dangerous. 542 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:41,920 Speaker 1: I mean, you're like advertising where you are and who 543 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,320 Speaker 1: you are and the fact that you're pretty clueless. So imagine, 544 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,479 Speaker 1: for example, say the universe is teeming with life and 545 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,960 Speaker 1: nobody's contacted us just because nobody knew we were here. 546 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:54,640 Speaker 1: And then we just on the edge of our technological 547 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 1: capabilities to contact people, we announced ourselves, Hey everybody, look 548 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:01,399 Speaker 1: at us, were totally weak and helpless. Then you know 549 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: what's going to happen here exactly Exactly. Imagine dropping a 550 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 1: baby into the most dangerous neighborhood on Earth. Right, it's 551 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 1: gonna scream and cry and then what's going to happen. Well, 552 00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,479 Speaker 1: it's very unlikely somebody kind harder is going to pick 553 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: it up and take care of it. So again, I 554 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 1: don't know if finding intelligent life in the universe is 555 00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:25,719 Speaker 1: an optimistic or pessimistic viewpoint. So it doesn't seem likely 556 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:29,440 Speaker 1: that we will ever contact or talk to or learn 557 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:31,760 Speaker 1: a lot. So maybe the lesson here is that we 558 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:36,439 Speaker 1: should learn to be by ourselves in a way, you know, like, 559 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,680 Speaker 1: don't expect some siliciation to save us or to destroyers. 560 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,160 Speaker 1: Maybe the lesson is to really just kind of own 561 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: being alone and take responsibility for our existence here on Earth. Yeah, 562 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:50,560 Speaker 1: I think the best case scenario would be if we 563 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,959 Speaker 1: discover intelligent life, you know, we developed technologically, we move 564 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:56,479 Speaker 1: on to other planets, maybe we explore the galaxy, we 565 00:28:56,600 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 1: build those self replicating probes, and then we discover alien 566 00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: life and we learn from them. I think that would 567 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,400 Speaker 1: be the best case scenario for humans to be the colonizers, 568 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: not like cutting out the colonized e s. Well, I 569 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 1: hope by that time, you know, we will have developed 570 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:11,960 Speaker 1: a higher morality and we will you know, not take 571 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: advantage of those squishy little cute aliens we discover around 572 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 1: whatever planet. Um. But yeah, I think it could be 573 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:20,760 Speaker 1: better if we found them before they found us, for sure. 574 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: But I would also love to to see another planet 575 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 1: and to meet aliens and to get to talk to them. 576 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:28,760 Speaker 1: But you know, every time I see a science fiction 577 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:31,480 Speaker 1: movie where there's aliens, I'm always amazed at how it 578 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:33,720 Speaker 1: always takes like six minutes for them to figure out 579 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,680 Speaker 1: how to talk to each other. You know, you just 580 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 1: raise your hand, part your your fingers and that's it. Right, 581 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:44,440 Speaker 1: Live long, and prosper well, whether we are alone or 582 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 1: we're one of many who out there anna enjoy the 583 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 1: experience of being And to our alien listeners, if you're 584 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 1: going to come to Earth, please arrive gently, eat something 585 00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: before you get here, that's right, fill up for the trip, 586 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 1: please please thanks a lot. If you still have a 587 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:13,560 Speaker 1: question after listening to all these explanations, please drop us 588 00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:15,680 Speaker 1: a line. We'd love to hear from you. You can 589 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:19,080 Speaker 1: find us at Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram at Daniel and 590 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,719 Speaker 1: Jorge that's one word, or email us at Feedback at 591 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 1: Daniel and Jorge dot com.