1
00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:04,000
Speaker 1: Vatican talks with the Society of Saint Pius the Tenth continue,

2
00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:07,000
Speaker 1: but what effect might they have on the celebration of

3
00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:10,920
Speaker 1: the traditional Latin Mass within the wider Roman Church, and

4
00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:14,600
Speaker 1: the Bishop of South Bend claps back at Notre Dame's

5
00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:19,759
Speaker 1: controversial appointment, while Archbishop Fulton Sheen's beatification finally moves forward.

6
00:00:20,079 --> 00:00:31,920
Speaker 1: We'll get into it all on this prayerful Posse. Welcome

7
00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:35,040
Speaker 1: to an important prayerful Posse. Be sure to subscribe to

8
00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:36,960
Speaker 1: the show. It's a wonderful way to support our work

9
00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:39,840
Speaker 1: totally free, or you can visit Raymond Royo dot com

10
00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:42,159
Speaker 1: if you'd like to contribute. And now let's convene the

11
00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:45,760
Speaker 1: prayerful Posse. Canon Lawyer and priests of the Archdiocese of

12
00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:48,560
Speaker 1: New York, Father Gerald Murray, an editor in chief of

13
00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:51,320
Speaker 1: the Catholic Thing dot org. Robert Royal, thank you both

14
00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:55,960
Speaker 1: for being here. The Vatican's chief doctrinal officer, Cardinal Victor

15
00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:59,320
Speaker 1: Manuel Fernandez, meets with the leader of the Society of

16
00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:03,200
Speaker 1: Saint Pius the Tenth this week regarding the breakaway traditionalist

17
00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:07,720
Speaker 1: group's intention to ordain its own bishops in July without

18
00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:10,920
Speaker 1: the Pope's approval. The Superior General decided to go ahead

19
00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:15,959
Speaker 1: with the ordinations without papal sanction after requesting an audience

20
00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:19,319
Speaker 1: with Pope Leo last year which was not granted, and

21
00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:22,720
Speaker 1: receiving a letter recently that he says did not in

22
00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:26,759
Speaker 1: any way respond to the requests of the society. Now

23
00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:31,480
Speaker 1: we have to say the SSPX is not officially declared

24
00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:36,440
Speaker 1: sismatic by the Vatican. Their sacraments are valid, but considered illicit,

25
00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:40,839
Speaker 1: and they do not have legal or canonical standing within

26
00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:41,360
Speaker 1: the Church.

27
00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:44,000
Speaker 2: So the question Father is.

28
00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:47,880
Speaker 1: Given the canonical gray area here in which the Society

29
00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:51,200
Speaker 1: of Saint Pius the Tenth operates. What is the risk

30
00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:55,400
Speaker 1: of conducting these ordinations without papal approval and what do

31
00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,040
Speaker 1: you think these meetings will achieve if anything.

32
00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:02,440
Speaker 3: Well, if they consecrate or ordained bishops without papal approval,

33
00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,200
Speaker 3: then that's an automatic excommunication for the bishop who does

34
00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:09,960
Speaker 3: the ordination and for those who receive it. Now, the

35
00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:12,920
Speaker 3: talks I think are trying to avert that, and the

36
00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:15,320
Speaker 3: Holy See has been trying. It goes back to John Paul,

37
00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:19,400
Speaker 3: the second Benedict. During post Francis, there was a different

38
00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:23,639
Speaker 3: kind of approach more indulgent approach to giving them pastoral

39
00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:28,000
Speaker 3: permissions but not solving the overall issues. Now it seems

40
00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:31,160
Speaker 3: that society is saying, we're not going to wait any longer.

41
00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:34,200
Speaker 3: We have two of our bishops that were ordained by

42
00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:36,720
Speaker 3: archibishal Lefevre have died.

43
00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:38,520
Speaker 4: There are two remaining.

44
00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:41,600
Speaker 3: They always want to have bishops that they can call

45
00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:44,760
Speaker 3: upon to ordain their priests. So I hope the Holy

46
00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:48,480
Speaker 3: See will sit down, and I think they're already they're

47
00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:51,520
Speaker 3: going to, but sit down and actually seriously engage in

48
00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:55,000
Speaker 3: trying to resolve the issues, because quite frankly, the issues

49
00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:59,520
Speaker 3: separating proas the Tenth from the Church fall into a

50
00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:02,040
Speaker 3: whole span of other issues which are even much more

51
00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:06,880
Speaker 3: serious with bishops who, unfortunately, as in Germany, are teaching

52
00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:09,480
Speaker 3: heretical things. So you know, we should be able to

53
00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,079
Speaker 3: make a deal, so to speak. I hate to talk

54
00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:14,760
Speaker 3: about the holes and making deals, but you know, come

55
00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:17,800
Speaker 3: to an understanding in which people who are attached to

56
00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 3: the Old Liturgy and have questions about the way some

57
00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:25,519
Speaker 3: of the Vatican I documents were composed and then implemented,

58
00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:27,600
Speaker 3: that those concerns can be met.

59
00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I know the society is upset about some

60
00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:33,440
Speaker 1: of the more recent you know, indulgences on the part

61
00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:36,520
Speaker 1: of the church, whether that be the sonatal way or

62
00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:38,560
Speaker 1: you know, the blessing of gay unions. All of that

63
00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:41,800
Speaker 1: has created I think more tension. But Bob, are these

64
00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:45,880
Speaker 1: ordinations planned for July similar to what happened with Archbishop

65
00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:49,640
Speaker 1: lefev back in nineteen eighty eight? And how was a

66
00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:54,480
Speaker 1: formal sism avoided then? He claimed at the time that

67
00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:56,600
Speaker 1: they were in a state of grave necessity, which is

68
00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:57,640
Speaker 1: what's being claimed now.

69
00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, they walk a very careful line, and it's worth

70
00:04:01,000 --> 00:04:03,880
Speaker 5: actually reading some of the interviews that have been done

71
00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:06,440
Speaker 5: with their leadership over the years, because they do profess

72
00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:10,520
Speaker 5: loyalty to the Pope and the recognition of the Pope

73
00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,440
Speaker 5: is a supreme authority in the church. But at the

74
00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:16,400
Speaker 5: same time they profess this state of what they think

75
00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:20,200
Speaker 5: of as a state of emergency over what's going on

76
00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:22,599
Speaker 5: in the church right now. And you asked, Father, you

77
00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:24,840
Speaker 5: know what is likely to come out of this? Well,

78
00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:28,040
Speaker 5: First of all, the fact that the Pope did not

79
00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:31,080
Speaker 5: agree to a meet with them, I think indicates that

80
00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,920
Speaker 5: there is there is some substantial resistance inside the Vatican

81
00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:39,240
Speaker 5: to being further indulgent towards them at this point, and

82
00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:42,760
Speaker 5: the meeting with Cardinal Fernandez, who is really, you know,

83
00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:46,279
Speaker 5: the one at the heart of traditional and custeaudes, the

84
00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:51,560
Speaker 5: blessing of unions, et cetera. I don't think that that

85
00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:53,320
Speaker 5: is going to go very far. I think that they

86
00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:55,839
Speaker 5: probably already have determined that he's a figure that is

87
00:04:55,880 --> 00:04:58,880
Speaker 5: at the heart of the problem. And I think that

88
00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:02,000
Speaker 5: the questions go even deeper because one of the things

89
00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:05,240
Speaker 5: that has emerged. One of the leaders was asked like, well,

90
00:05:05,279 --> 00:05:08,120
Speaker 5: you know, what is a major sticking point that you have,

91
00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:12,159
Speaker 5: and he pointed to the Abu Dhabi document, which was

92
00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:16,000
Speaker 5: the statement that Pope Francis signed saying that God wills

93
00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:19,919
Speaker 5: a plurality of religions. And he says, well, look, this

94
00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:23,719
Speaker 5: contradicts the first commandment. You know, I'm the Lord thy God.

95
00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,880
Speaker 5: I shall have no other God before me. So I

96
00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:31,240
Speaker 5: think these these problems are profound. Father rightly says that

97
00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:33,719
Speaker 5: these are you know, they don't like the interpretations of

98
00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:36,120
Speaker 5: what's come out of Vatican. To them, they're walking this

99
00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:40,480
Speaker 5: gray area. But I don't see a lot as possible

100
00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:41,680
Speaker 5: of happening at this point.

101
00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:42,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, Father.

102
00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:45,720
Speaker 1: I mean is Bob referenced Pope Benedict, and I want

103
00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:49,400
Speaker 1: to remind the audience he lifted the excommunication on the

104
00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:53,760
Speaker 1: bishops of the Society of Saint Pius the Tenth back

105
00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:56,680
Speaker 1: in two thousand and nine. And as we pointed out,

106
00:05:56,680 --> 00:06:01,120
Speaker 1: the Vatican didn't impose canonical sanctions when China repeatedly ordained

107
00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:04,760
Speaker 1: bishops without papal approval, even in violation of their secret

108
00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:09,480
Speaker 1: Vatican China accord. Does the Holy See have a consistent

109
00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:10,520
Speaker 1: approach here?

110
00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:12,560
Speaker 2: And what should LEO do?

111
00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:17,360
Speaker 3: Well, there's no consistency when it comes to illegal ordinations

112
00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:20,679
Speaker 3: in China and what happened back in nineteen eighty eight.

113
00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:23,520
Speaker 3: Now I have to say ordaining a bishop without a

114
00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:26,320
Speaker 3: papal mandate does not per se a sismatic act.

115
00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:26,919
Speaker 2: It's not.

116
00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:30,839
Speaker 3: This can be done, no, because back in communist times

117
00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:35,240
Speaker 3: you had bishops ordained in Czechoslovakia in order to be

118
00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:38,320
Speaker 3: able to continue to supply priests to the people of

119
00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,760
Speaker 3: that persecuted region. Now, in the case of Archbishop Lefevre,

120
00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:45,320
Speaker 3: the Holy See declared that it was a sismatic act,

121
00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,880
Speaker 3: and they did so because Archbishop Lefevre was worn specifically

122
00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:52,640
Speaker 3: he was told do not proceed to those ordinations, so

123
00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:54,640
Speaker 3: the Holy See was aware of what he was doing.

124
00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:59,039
Speaker 3: They didn't agree with his reasoning, and he rejected that command,

125
00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:03,279
Speaker 3: and therefore he was declared to have committed a sismatic act. Now,

126
00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:06,680
Speaker 3: strictly speaking, the only people who were guilty of the

127
00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:10,120
Speaker 3: sin of sism and the canonical penalty incurred were the

128
00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:13,640
Speaker 3: bishops who did the ordination, which were le Fevren Castro

129
00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:16,600
Speaker 3: Mayer from Brazil, and then the four who received it.

130
00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,520
Speaker 3: The other people associated with the pious, the tenth group

131
00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,040
Speaker 3: being laity and priests, were warned not to adhere to

132
00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:26,080
Speaker 3: the sismatic act, but it was never determined by the

133
00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:29,080
Speaker 3: Holy See what that meant. So this time, if the

134
00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:32,560
Speaker 3: Holy See is going to, you know, basically say if

135
00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:35,560
Speaker 3: you don't, if you perceive with these ordinations, it's a

136
00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:38,720
Speaker 3: sism they better give a clear warning to the people

137
00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:43,240
Speaker 3: and the priest what it means for their continued membership

138
00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:44,640
Speaker 3: in the church in good standings.

139
00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:49,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, but considering that Benedict lifted the excommunication on Archbishop

140
00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:53,360
Speaker 1: Lefeed and those bishops, Bob howill Leo's handling of this effect,

141
00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:55,640
Speaker 1: what's going on in the larger church, which, as you

142
00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:59,720
Speaker 1: reference the restrictions on the TLM in some ways that

143
00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:05,000
Speaker 1: dissy on this custodis Pope Francis's document putting the old

144
00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:06,640
Speaker 1: traditional Mass in a box.

145
00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:08,080
Speaker 2: It seems to be.

146
00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:11,000
Speaker 1: Bringing this to a head, and the traditionalists feel isolated

147
00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:13,680
Speaker 1: and they feel their liturgy and their clergy are being targeted.

148
00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:17,720
Speaker 5: Well, as we've talked about multiple times before, Leo is

149
00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:19,800
Speaker 5: going to have to deal with this question in the

150
00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:24,000
Speaker 5: traditional Latin Mass, and the people in s sp X

151
00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:26,560
Speaker 5: are saying, this is not just a concession, you know,

152
00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,000
Speaker 5: it's just not an accommodation, and there has to be

153
00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:33,439
Speaker 5: a recognition that there is something eternally valid and as

154
00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:37,640
Speaker 5: Pope Benedict often said, you know, what was what was

155
00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,240
Speaker 5: sacred at one time cannot become you know, not sacred

156
00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:44,080
Speaker 5: at a further time. But there, I mean, over and

157
00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:47,760
Speaker 5: above sort of the technical theological questions. I think here

158
00:08:47,800 --> 00:08:53,040
Speaker 5: there's going to have to be some very delicate diplomacy

159
00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:55,520
Speaker 5: I think is the right word to use within the church,

160
00:08:55,679 --> 00:09:00,000
Speaker 5: because it's it's easy in a way to allow people

161
00:09:00,559 --> 00:09:03,440
Speaker 5: to have that mass, which is a valid mass still

162
00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:08,320
Speaker 5: even under Traditionanist consertis it is not absolutely banned, but

163
00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:11,480
Speaker 5: it's the stuff around that. It's the kind of recognition

164
00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:16,280
Speaker 5: and the sense that people have that the SSPX is

165
00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:19,040
Speaker 5: just saying, look, everything over the past sixty years has

166
00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:22,600
Speaker 5: been a disaster. A Vatican Two in and of itself

167
00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:25,920
Speaker 5: has created this crisis within the Church over the last

168
00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:28,720
Speaker 5: five or six decades. And I don't know how easily

169
00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:31,360
Speaker 5: you get past that unless there is discussion that goes

170
00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:33,720
Speaker 5: on and there is a kind of a way to

171
00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:36,640
Speaker 5: massage the language. But I don't see that happening very quickly.

172
00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:40,240
Speaker 1: I want to tell you about ave Maria Mutual Funds.

173
00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:45,160
Speaker 1: Ave Maria isn't just about investing, It's about living your values.

174
00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:48,800
Speaker 1: As someone who cares deeply about faith and family, and

175
00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:52,679
Speaker 1: as an ave Maria investor myself, for years, I've always

176
00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:57,480
Speaker 1: believed where we put our money matters. Working with ave

177
00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:00,280
Speaker 1: Maria Mutual Funds has shown me you don't have to

178
00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:05,840
Speaker 1: compromise your principles to achieve financial success. Their team ensures

179
00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:10,240
Speaker 1: every investment reflects Catholic teaching, and that gives me peace

180
00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:14,439
Speaker 1: of mind. For me, it's not just about returns. It's

181
00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:19,160
Speaker 1: about integrity, purpose and making a difference That's why I'm

182
00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:23,160
Speaker 1: proud to stand with ave Maria Mutual Funds. Learn more

183
00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:29,199
Speaker 1: at Avemaria Funds dot com, slash raymond. That's Avemaria Funds

184
00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:33,560
Speaker 1: dot com slash raymond. All mutual funds are subject to

185
00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:38,120
Speaker 1: market risk, including possible loss of principle, Request of perspectives

186
00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:43,520
Speaker 1: which includes investment objectives, risks, fees, charges and expenses, and

187
00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:47,960
Speaker 1: other information that you should read and consider carefully before investing.

188
00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:51,559
Speaker 1: You can get the prospectives by calling eight sixty six

189
00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:55,760
Speaker 1: two eight three six two seven four, or you can

190
00:10:55,880 --> 00:11:00,920
Speaker 1: view it at Avemaria Funds dot com. Avema Mutual Funds

191
00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:06,120
Speaker 1: are distributed by Ultimus Funds distributorsc We're seeing some rather

192
00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:10,080
Speaker 1: pointed commentary from the Priestly Fraternity of Saint Peter. Now,

193
00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:12,719
Speaker 1: this is a group within the Church approved by the

194
00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:18,040
Speaker 1: Vatican to carry on the traditional Latin Mass. Their Superior

195
00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:22,839
Speaker 1: General has distinguished that fraternity from what he calls the

196
00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:27,439
Speaker 1: Society of Saint Pius, the tense hardliners who reject Vatican two. Now, remember,

197
00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:30,560
Speaker 1: the Priestly Fraternity itself is an offshoot of the Society

198
00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:34,240
Speaker 1: of Saint Pius the tenth back when they broke from Rome, Father,

199
00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:39,200
Speaker 1: does Rome risk creating a situation where the fraternity, which

200
00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:41,600
Speaker 1: has been trying to work within the system, feels like

201
00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:46,040
Speaker 1: they're being punished while the SSPX, operating in an irregular situation,

202
00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:48,320
Speaker 1: as they say, continues to gain ground.

203
00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:51,160
Speaker 3: Well, this is part of the discussion that you and

204
00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:55,840
Speaker 3: Bob are laying out very well here tonight. The issue here,

205
00:11:55,920 --> 00:12:00,560
Speaker 3: of course, is what is the major obstacle to unity

206
00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,480
Speaker 3: between Catholics who like the Old Mass and Catholics who

207
00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,280
Speaker 3: like the New Mass. And the only real obstacle I

208
00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:09,320
Speaker 3: have to say at this point is Roman intervention to

209
00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:14,200
Speaker 3: overturn with Pope Benedict allowed. Now the broader questions about

210
00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:20,199
Speaker 3: doctrine and Vatican II its implementation, subsequent actions by Pope Francis,

211
00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:24,640
Speaker 3: those fall within a realm in which theological disputes should

212
00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:27,760
Speaker 3: be very fruitfully held. And that's an area, you know,

213
00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:31,160
Speaker 3: where we can hopefully get a commission to talk about it.

214
00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:35,960
Speaker 3: Because it was done privately under Pope Benedict. There was

215
00:12:36,040 --> 00:12:39,600
Speaker 3: this long discussion. It never led to an agreement, but

216
00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:43,480
Speaker 3: it's quite clear there are legitimate disputes that can be

217
00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:47,040
Speaker 3: had in the Church after a general council to figure

218
00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:48,920
Speaker 3: out what is the true meaning of it, how does

219
00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:52,840
Speaker 3: it cohere with previous councils, and how is this implementation gone.

220
00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:55,240
Speaker 3: Now you quote that, you know, the superior pious the

221
00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:58,880
Speaker 3: tenth At taxed the Abu Dhabi document as well he should.

222
00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:04,160
Speaker 3: That document has been attacked by Catholic bishops, theologians, philosophers,

223
00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,960
Speaker 3: people who are intelligent can't see how you reconcile the

224
00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:11,839
Speaker 3: statement God wills all religions with the statement that Jesus

225
00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:13,840
Speaker 3: says I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life.

226
00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:18,400
Speaker 3: When Jesus said that, that means anybody who contradicts him

227
00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:20,520
Speaker 3: is not the Way, the Truth, and the life. So

228
00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:24,000
Speaker 3: therefore we don't believe in Bodha Mohammad and other religious leaders,

229
00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:27,080
Speaker 3: and we can't say that their religions are just different approaches.

230
00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,480
Speaker 3: This is largely a crisis in the modern era in

231
00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:34,920
Speaker 3: which the claims to unicity of Christianity are viewed as

232
00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:39,400
Speaker 3: offensive to human liberty. That is not anything the Catholic

233
00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:41,800
Speaker 3: Church can agree to. That's really a principle going back

234
00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:42,840
Speaker 3: no French relo.

235
00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:46,080
Speaker 1: But this is when you look at the society's upsetments

236
00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:48,439
Speaker 1: and you go, wait a minute, they actually have credibility

237
00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:52,360
Speaker 1: on these issues. These issues are problematic not only for

238
00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:55,600
Speaker 1: the people in the society traditionalists in the church, but

239
00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:58,840
Speaker 1: for the wider church. This contradicts tradition going back years,

240
00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:02,160
Speaker 1: and I think that's part of the disgruntlement here and

241
00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:06,840
Speaker 1: upsetment and frankly running to these you know, ad hoc

242
00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,920
Speaker 1: ordinations as a way to survive in their minds and

243
00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:12,600
Speaker 1: as they say, it's a grave necessity to continue the faith.

244
00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:14,160
Speaker 2: Bob will give you the last word on this.

245
00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:18,320
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, when you look at this, when you

246
00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:21,720
Speaker 5: see a document like the Abu Dhabi document, what it

247
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,200
Speaker 5: conveys to the world is that the Catholic Church is

248
00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,920
Speaker 5: more interested in people just getting along in the world.

249
00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,640
Speaker 5: And look, there's nothing wrong with trying to just get

250
00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:32,360
Speaker 5: along with people.

251
00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:37,040
Speaker 6: And yeah, in a world where you know, Muslim extremism

252
00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:41,920
Speaker 6: is a palpable threat to Catholics and other Christians and

253
00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:44,600
Speaker 6: even other Muslims in many countries.

254
00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:44,960
Speaker 2: Around the world.

255
00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:48,440
Speaker 5: But look, that said, one of the crises to come

256
00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:52,120
Speaker 5: out of Vatican two is the way that the evangelizing

257
00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,720
Speaker 5: mission of the Church seems to have been put on

258
00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:59,200
Speaker 5: a back bump burner to this getting along with other people,

259
00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:04,440
Speaker 5: to environmentalism, to immigration and other things. And look, the

260
00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:06,680
Speaker 5: mere fact of the matter is in our own country

261
00:15:06,720 --> 00:15:08,480
Speaker 5: here in the United States, where I think the church

262
00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:11,040
Speaker 5: is still in pretty good shape compared to other places

263
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:14,760
Speaker 5: in the world, we're losing Catholics in large numbers. Yeah,

264
00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:17,040
Speaker 5: you know, NotI out of every ten Catholics, so people

265
00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:19,800
Speaker 5: who grew up Catholic or leaving the church. So there

266
00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:23,920
Speaker 5: is a crisis. This is not something that anybody involved

267
00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,120
Speaker 5: in this debate has created, and the church is trying

268
00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:27,880
Speaker 5: to figure out how to respond to it. One of

269
00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:30,840
Speaker 5: the ways is the traditional Latin Mass, which seems to

270
00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:31,880
Speaker 5: attract a lot of people.

271
00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:33,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I want to move on.

272
00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:35,680
Speaker 1: It's finally been announced this week that the cause of

273
00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:40,880
Speaker 1: canonization for Venerable Archbishop Fulton Jay Sheen is proceeding to

274
00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:44,800
Speaker 1: his beatification, so he will be declared blessed after a

275
00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:49,320
Speaker 1: six year hold on this cause. No data location has

276
00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:53,040
Speaker 1: been set for the beatification, but Bob your thoughts on

277
00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:58,520
Speaker 1: what might have been the reason or reasons for the delay,

278
00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:02,520
Speaker 1: particularly when the body has already been removed from from

279
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:06,040
Speaker 1: New York to Sheen's home diocese of Peory, who is

280
00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:07,120
Speaker 1: the sponsor of the cause.

281
00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:10,960
Speaker 5: You know, you know, there are a lot of people

282
00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,560
Speaker 5: during Shean's life, as successful as he was, who went

283
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,240
Speaker 5: after him and resented him. He was so successful in

284
00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:18,480
Speaker 5: a way that other people.

285
00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:20,080
Speaker 2: Were not jealousy continues.

286
00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:22,640
Speaker 5: There was a debate over you know, where the body

287
00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:24,800
Speaker 5: ought to be, which I think is an embarrassment him

288
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:28,680
Speaker 5: for the church. And there were questions raised about whether

289
00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:31,240
Speaker 5: he had handled certain abuse cases properly when he was

290
00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:34,680
Speaker 5: the Archbishop of Rochester, New York. So look, all this

291
00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:38,000
Speaker 5: somehow got thrown into the hopper. And yet at the

292
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:40,840
Speaker 5: same time, the Vatican had already approved a miracle that

293
00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:43,920
Speaker 5: was attributed to his intervention. Yeah, with you know, someone

294
00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:48,920
Speaker 5: in a medical situation. I think it doesn't bring glory

295
00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:51,600
Speaker 5: on anybody in the church. But thank God that finally,

296
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:55,000
Speaker 5: somewhere somebody has just decided enough is enough. This stuff

297
00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:58,600
Speaker 5: has been resolved and we're able to move forward. And look,

298
00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:01,600
Speaker 5: he's one of the great events Angelus of the twentieth century.

299
00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,120
Speaker 5: And you can still go back and look at those videos,

300
00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,159
Speaker 5: and as corny as some of them are, they're powerful. Yeah, No,

301
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:10,600
Speaker 5: he's he had people who can learn from that type

302
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:11,040
Speaker 5: of event.

303
00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:15,760
Speaker 1: Father, he certainly had a flare in his own nineteenth century,

304
00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:18,800
Speaker 1: you know, actorly approached to things, which I was kind

305
00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:20,760
Speaker 1: of always captivated by it.

306
00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:21,000
Speaker 2: You know.

307
00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,320
Speaker 1: I remember when my children were small and they saw

308
00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:26,920
Speaker 1: them on TV. I said, kids, that's the original Caped

309
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,399
Speaker 1: Crusader right there. You know, I mean he beat everybody

310
00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:34,360
Speaker 1: but Sheen. You know, I know, in full full disclosure,

311
00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,400
Speaker 1: I was part of the first Sheen foundation that moved

312
00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:39,960
Speaker 1: the cause with father Andrew Apostle in New York.

313
00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:42,880
Speaker 2: So I was very involved early on in New York.

314
00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:46,000
Speaker 1: Father, with apologies to my New York priest friend, New

315
00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,240
Speaker 1: York did not want the cause. Cardin Leagan at the

316
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 1: time said we've got Pierre two Saint. I remember him

317
00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:53,200
Speaker 1: saying this like it was yesterday. We've got Pierre two

318
00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:55,960
Speaker 1: Saint and Dorothy Day downstairs in the crypt, and their

319
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:57,400
Speaker 1: cause is going to move a heck of a lot

320
00:17:57,440 --> 00:17:59,600
Speaker 1: faster than Fulton Sheen's, he said.

321
00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:02,359
Speaker 2: So they weren't interested in Sheen.

322
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:05,560
Speaker 1: So the cause took him to Peoria, where he was born,

323
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,280
Speaker 1: and they accepted it, and that's where the body movement.

324
00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:11,440
Speaker 1: Later Egan agreed to move the body, but later Cardinal

325
00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:13,760
Speaker 1: Dolan didn't want to give up the body in New York,

326
00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:16,679
Speaker 1: so it became a legal tussle. They finally moved the

327
00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:18,959
Speaker 1: body out. But what do you make of the timing

328
00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,240
Speaker 1: of this, Father is Poplio signaling something here? And how

329
00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:26,440
Speaker 1: important it is a beatification like this and Sheen himself

330
00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:27,160
Speaker 1: to the church.

331
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,880
Speaker 3: Well, I don't know the details about how this actually hit,

332
00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:34,359
Speaker 3: you know, hit the pavement so to speak, and started

333
00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:34,960
Speaker 3: moving again.

334
00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:36,960
Speaker 4: But certainly I think having an American.

335
00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:40,639
Speaker 3: Pope who appreciates the role of Bishop Sheen, you know

336
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,239
Speaker 3: Sheen can be is appreciating elsewhere in Europe. But you know,

337
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,320
Speaker 3: someone who is specifically a media star in a country,

338
00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:51,080
Speaker 3: as he was in this country for so many years,

339
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,959
Speaker 3: you know, that leaves a deep impression on the Catholic

340
00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:57,480
Speaker 3: Church in this country. And then of course all the

341
00:18:57,520 --> 00:18:59,760
Speaker 3: work was done. And yes, thank you and others, Father

342
00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:03,520
Speaker 3: An Andrew, I knew with great priests to promote Fulton Sheen.

343
00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:05,639
Speaker 3: And you know it really falls and we should go

344
00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:08,240
Speaker 3: back and look at it from a historical perspective, what

345
00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 3: we're doing here on this podcast and what EWTN does

346
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,160
Speaker 3: in all other Catholic media. This was the original ground

347
00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:18,320
Speaker 3: zero guy. I mean, he started in Catholic radio on

348
00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:20,080
Speaker 3: NBC or CBS, one of.

349
00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:21,920
Speaker 4: Those networks in the thirtiesies.

350
00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:24,720
Speaker 3: He was commenting in the twenties, and he was commenting

351
00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:28,280
Speaker 3: on religion and news. You know, he was a powerful

352
00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:32,720
Speaker 3: force against the Nazis and defending the Church against the Communists.

353
00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:35,080
Speaker 4: Yes, no, the Catholic.

354
00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:39,120
Speaker 3: Attitude of historically speaking that we are loyal Americans who

355
00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:41,159
Speaker 3: are going to promote the good of this country. He

356
00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:45,399
Speaker 3: represented that tremendously. And then after the Council, let's not forget,

357
00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:48,840
Speaker 3: he defended the traditional doctrine of the faith. He did

358
00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,600
Speaker 3: in the face of those tendencies which were trying to

359
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:55,359
Speaker 3: undermine the doctrines that have become part of this discussion

360
00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:58,919
Speaker 3: that we're having today. So he restored confidence and he

361
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:02,160
Speaker 3: had a great influence on non Catholics. That's something else

362
00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:05,639
Speaker 3: that you know, we can rejoice. And he appealed to

363
00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:10,119
Speaker 3: the American sense of fairness, of inquiry, of free thought

364
00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:13,800
Speaker 3: and made the arguments in very philosophical terms that brought

365
00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:14,680
Speaker 3: a lot of people.

366
00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:15,120
Speaker 4: Into the church.

367
00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:19,480
Speaker 3: So his writings tapes, you know, they were indebted to

368
00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:21,639
Speaker 3: the Good Lord for having sent a man like this

369
00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:24,040
Speaker 3: and given him the grace to accomplish what he did.

370
00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:28,480
Speaker 1: Well, look, I'm so touched and I'm a personal devotion

371
00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:32,200
Speaker 1: to him and have for decades now in the nineteen nineties,

372
00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:33,200
Speaker 1: I'll tell this story quickly.

373
00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:35,119
Speaker 2: The listeners and viewers might like this.

374
00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:38,879
Speaker 1: In the nineteen nineties, I was a reporter and interviewing

375
00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:40,960
Speaker 1: a priest on the Upper East Side of New York

376
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:43,200
Speaker 1: and at the end of the interview, Who's asking me

377
00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 1: about my personal wife? I said, well, I'm dating this girl.

378
00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:48,280
Speaker 1: You know, I really like to marry her. She's not Catholic.

379
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:49,879
Speaker 1: And he said, wait, hold on, and he went in

380
00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:51,760
Speaker 1: the other room and he brought me back a vinyl

381
00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:55,840
Speaker 1: box of Fulton Sheen's cassette tapes and it was his

382
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,800
Speaker 1: convert class. It's like thirty or forty tapes on the

383
00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:02,560
Speaker 1: Pope Mary, the Old Testament, New Testament. It was laying

384
00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:04,600
Speaker 1: out the whole face everything, all the sacraments.

385
00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:05,520
Speaker 2: It was tremendous.

386
00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:08,560
Speaker 1: He said, take this to your girlfriend, and on your

387
00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:11,680
Speaker 1: way downtown, stop at Saint Patrick's and make a deal

388
00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:14,000
Speaker 1: with Fulton Sheen. I said, how do you make a

389
00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:16,720
Speaker 1: deal with Fulton Sheen? He said, he said, ask to

390
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:19,680
Speaker 1: go down in the crypt. He's buried there and promise

391
00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,720
Speaker 1: him something in exchange for his help in converting this girl,

392
00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:26,600
Speaker 1: and that was my wife would become my wife, Rebecca.

393
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:30,199
Speaker 1: And the promise I made to Sheen was that I

394
00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:33,520
Speaker 1: would try to get him back on television. And I

395
00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:35,879
Speaker 1: don't really know why I made that promise, but it

396
00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:37,280
Speaker 1: was my first I was in the middle of my

397
00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:40,560
Speaker 1: first TV gig. But two years later I went to

398
00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:44,159
Speaker 1: e WTN. The first thing I did was a documentary

399
00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:47,080
Speaker 1: on Fulton Sheen on the World over, and the guy

400
00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,159
Speaker 1: who owned the rights it was not Catholic. It exploded

401
00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:52,280
Speaker 1: for him and it was such a popular thing. He

402
00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,680
Speaker 1: allowed EWT and to air Life Is Worth Living the

403
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,879
Speaker 1: Old Sheen Show right after my show every week. So

404
00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,280
Speaker 1: that was kind of my little gift to he and

405
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:03,159
Speaker 1: his little gift to me. And yeah, I'm still very

406
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:05,720
Speaker 1: devoted to him as his Rebecca. So it's an amazing

407
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 1: you know, he's a great man. I'm glad he's finally

408
00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:11,919
Speaker 1: reaching the altars of the church and still inspiring people.

409
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 1: But I want to talk about Archbishop Ronald Hicks, your

410
00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:17,480
Speaker 1: new archbishop in New York.

411
00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:17,960
Speaker 2: Father.

412
00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:22,439
Speaker 1: He was installed at Saint Patrick's Cathedral on February sixth,

413
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 1: the Mayor, Zoron Mandani, broke with decades of tradition and

414
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:31,680
Speaker 1: skipped the ceremony. Archbridge of Hicks announced in his homily

415
00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:35,560
Speaker 1: that the archdiocese will focus on mission work and charity,

416
00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:38,000
Speaker 1: which you think might have appealed to the mayor.

417
00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 7: This is a call to be a missionary church, not

418
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 7: a country club. A club exists to serve its members.

419
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,880
Speaker 7: The church exists, on the other hand, to go out

420
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:58,440
Speaker 7: and serve all people on fire with faith, with hope

421
00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:03,280
Speaker 7: and charity in the name of Jesus Christ Father.

422
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,200
Speaker 1: Your thoughts on this very young new archbishop pig shoes

423
00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,639
Speaker 1: to fill and what do you make of the decision

424
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 1: by Mandani to be the first New York mayor in

425
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:15,560
Speaker 1: one hundred years to skip the installation of a new

426
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:16,560
Speaker 1: Catholic archbishop.

427
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:20,280
Speaker 3: Yes, well, I was at that Mass of installation last week,

428
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:23,280
Speaker 3: and yes, we're very grateful to Poe Leo for giving

429
00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:27,240
Speaker 3: us our new archbishop. He is a young, energetic man,

430
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:32,000
Speaker 3: so we look forward to his leadership. As regards the mayor,

431
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:35,639
Speaker 3: I thought that was a terrible mistake and it shows

432
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,760
Speaker 3: that he really is a political amateur. You do not

433
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:43,719
Speaker 3: skip the installation match, which happens about every fifteen years.

434
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:48,119
Speaker 3: By the way, you don't skip it because you're not

435
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 3: a Catholic and you're probably, as we know from your

436
00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 3: public record, disagree with the Catholic Church and a lot

437
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,719
Speaker 3: of issues in the moral and social realm.

438
00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 4: You don't skip it. You go to it.

439
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,959
Speaker 3: He needs some less from taking them from you know,

440
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 3: politicians who are always happy to recognize when a religious

441
00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:10,240
Speaker 3: faith is important to a significant portion of the electorate.

442
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,159
Speaker 4: You respect that religion, you don't disrespect it.

443
00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,159
Speaker 3: But I'll say I think the man has got a

444
00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 3: steep learning curve because he went from state assemblymen. I

445
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 3: think he's served maybe two terms to being mayor of

446
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,119
Speaker 3: New York City, the biggest city in the you know,

447
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,160
Speaker 3: in the country, and that one of the biggest administrative

448
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 3: jobs in the country. He's got to learn you get

449
00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:34,640
Speaker 3: along with everybody by doing things that make them see

450
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 3: that well I met.

451
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,240
Speaker 1: Them, Yeah, particularly as you said, father, I mean what

452
00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:40,960
Speaker 1: we're talking about, what a third of New Yorkers are Catholic.

453
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:44,040
Speaker 1: I mean, that's a huge piece of your electorate. You

454
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:46,480
Speaker 1: can't just ignore them. I guess they had a private meeting.

455
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:51,200
Speaker 1: Bob our Archbishoph Hacks met with Mandani privately.

456
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 2: It's not the same as attending the installation.

457
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think Mom Donnie is actually a very shrewd

458
00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,480
Speaker 5: politician in a way. But father may be right that

459
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:01,600
Speaker 5: he made he made a mistake here because I think

460
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 5: he just thinks that the Catholic Church is not important,

461
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:08,760
Speaker 5: not important to him, and maybe he thinks that it's

462
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 5: going to become not important in New York's city as well.

463
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,639
Speaker 5: From what I understand there, there's a kind of a

464
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:19,119
Speaker 5: clergy advisory body that he's also putting together, and he

465
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:23,760
Speaker 5: hasn't really invited Catholics to participate in that. As I

466
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 5: understand that. He's also not invited Jews who are supportive

467
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,159
Speaker 5: of Israel. You know, he's got that there is a

468
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,280
Speaker 5: kind of a division within the Jewish community in New York.

469
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:35,439
Speaker 5: There are some people who are very Jewish who are

470
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:38,919
Speaker 5: very upset about the behavior of Israel and Gaza and

471
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 5: their others who still support Israel anyway, And so he's

472
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 5: been I think he's shown himself to be a very

473
00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 5: partisan political animal, and one of the ways that it

474
00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 5: expresses itself, and what I think is a mistaken I

475
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:55,200
Speaker 5: think we all agree is mistaken ignoring of the presence

476
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,360
Speaker 5: of the Catholic Church and the power that it still

477
00:25:58,400 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 5: continues to have in New York.

478
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to return to the story of a

479
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: controversial appointment at Notre Dame University. We touched on this

480
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:11,360
Speaker 1: last week. Notre Dame is naming Susan Osterman as head

481
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:12,959
Speaker 1: of their Asian Studies program.

482
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:15,880
Speaker 2: Here's the problem. She's a vocal supporter of abortion.

483
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 1: In recent weeks, students and some faculty have claimed her

484
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,200
Speaker 1: appointment is a violation of Notre Dame's Catholic mission and vision.

485
00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:25,119
Speaker 2: People of Quentin protests.

486
00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 1: Now we have reports of the local Bishop of South Bend,

487
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 1: Kevin Rhodes, issuing a statement. He expressed his quote, dismay

488
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:39,159
Speaker 1: and strong opposition to this appointment that is causing scandal

489
00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 1: to the faithful of our diocese and beyond, Bob your

490
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:44,200
Speaker 1: reaction to the bishop's statement here.

491
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:47,200
Speaker 5: You know, he's been very good in the past when

492
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,920
Speaker 5: Notre Dame has been wavering off the right way, and

493
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 5: I was very glad to see that he spoke out

494
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:57,160
Speaker 5: very forcefully about what's going on here. Whether the powers

495
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 5: that be inside the Notre Dame administration will pay the

496
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 5: attack to them. Sometimes they haven't in the past, but

497
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,640
Speaker 5: I think that this protest is starting to gain some traction.

498
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,359
Speaker 5: And as we've said in the past, is it really

499
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:13,719
Speaker 5: necessary to appoint this particular woman with the very radical

500
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 5: views that she has, not just about abortion and women,

501
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:20,159
Speaker 5: but it goes into all kinds of white supremacy and

502
00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 5: almost conspiracy theory types of thing. Is this really what

503
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 5: you want for a person who's going to run the

504
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 5: Asia and Asian Studies program at the University of Notre Dame.

505
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,280
Speaker 5: When aren't there other people who could be doing this

506
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,639
Speaker 5: and obviously the influence that she could have. Some people

507
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 5: have raised the question of you know, who's supporting that

508
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:45,679
Speaker 5: as a China who are who are the donors that

509
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,679
Speaker 5: are are kind of behind that program, And it'd be

510
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 5: worth looking at that because it's a very odd appointment

511
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:54,560
Speaker 5: to a position that given the way that the Chinese

512
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,480
Speaker 5: are rising in power in the world, it could have

513
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:01,280
Speaker 5: a significant significant role to play in the academic world

514
00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:03,440
Speaker 5: of Catholic university.

515
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a really great question, Bob, and Father Bishop

516
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:11,680
Speaker 1: Perode said Osterman's pro abortion advocacy and remarks about pro

517
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:17,280
Speaker 1: lifers quote should disqualify her from an administrative and leadership

518
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:20,719
Speaker 1: role at Catholic University end quote. He urged the administration

519
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:24,239
Speaker 1: to rectify the situation now, just so everybody knows, the

520
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,520
Speaker 1: board met. The Board of Notre Dame met because of

521
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 1: the uprising in the last few weeks. It looks like

522
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:31,600
Speaker 1: they've decided to do nothing.

523
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 3: Father, Well, the wing nothing is doing something. But it's

524
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,680
Speaker 3: saying is that we stick by the administration, and the

525
00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 3: administration makes the decisions.

526
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 4: And that's really a negligent on the board.

527
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 3: If the board is serious about keeping this woman in

528
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 3: this job, then they order to rewrite the handbook. They

529
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 3: ort to get rid of any reference to upholding the

530
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 3: Catholic identity of Notre Dame. They ought to be honest

531
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 3: with the people who are paying the admission fee, meaning

532
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 3: the parents of the students, to say, you think you're

533
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:02,040
Speaker 3: sending a child to a school where we uphold and

534
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 3: promote the Catholic doctrinal vision of life, which includes respect

535
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 3: for every human being, born or unborn. We don't really

536
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 3: believe that, because the way we act is we hire

537
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,600
Speaker 3: people who spend their time arguing the opposite, in fact,

538
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 3: doing all they can to promote the killing of unborn children,

539
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,280
Speaker 3: and then other horrors we you know, we can imagine,

540
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 3: are being promoted, including euthanasia. Yeah, but why is it

541
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,280
Speaker 3: that truth in advertising is never applied by the board

542
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 3: of this university to the products they put out on

543
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,680
Speaker 3: the internet. They used to publish them in catalogs. I

544
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 3: guess they still do. But you know, if an unweary

545
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 3: parent went to that website said, oh it says the

546
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 3: administration upholds the Catholic vision of life, Really, is that

547
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:47,800
Speaker 3: what they're doing there?

548
00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 4: Obviously not?

549
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 2: Yeah.

550
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:51,880
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, and she touches on and will be

551
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:56,480
Speaker 1: concerning herself primarily with human development in Asia. I mean,

552
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:02,560
Speaker 1: this touches on the very militant, hall horrible policies of

553
00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 1: the Chinese regime, certainly North Korea. I mean, you've got

554
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 1: big problems here that you wonder, given her pronouncement, if

555
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:13,560
Speaker 1: she just looks the other way or endorses those tyrannical inhuman,

556
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: anti life policies.

557
00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, if she ever denounced the one child the policy

558
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 3: in China, which even the Chinese ditch because they realized

559
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 3: they had created a demographic nightmare by killing babies who

560
00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 3: were female, because mothers and fathers wanted boys who are

561
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 3: gonna be able to work and support them when they

562
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 3: were older. Now, look, Raymond, no one takes Notre Dame

563
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 3: seriously when they show pictures on their website of kids

564
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 3: saying the Rosary, and then at the same time has

565
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 3: people who would look on those kids saying the Rosaries

566
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 3: being naive fools because they're.

567
00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 4: Pro life kids.

568
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 3: That's not the kind of person you want directing a

569
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:48,520
Speaker 3: university department.

570
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 1: Now they just have to, as we've said so many times,

571
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: b would you advertise be what you claim to be

572
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: and if your Catholic university be that.

573
00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 2: But you can't undermine the.

574
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: Mission of the Church global because you want to appease

575
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:06,080
Speaker 1: some people in academia to make yourself feel better. This

576
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: is the Hesburg vane that Father Bill miss Campbell referenced

577
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 1: last week. This was Hesburg's grand vision to get all

578
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 1: the IVY leagues to embrace Notre Dame because you were

579
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 1: bending to.

580
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:17,959
Speaker 2: The world or throwing scraps to it.

581
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 1: This is just more of that I hope that ends soon,

582
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 1: shifting to something I fear we'll be seeing a lot

583
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: more of in the coming years of story surface this

584
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:30,240
Speaker 1: week about AI deep things. Now, these are ultra realistic

585
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 1: artificial intelligence generated images or likenesses of real people saying

586
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: or doing things they never did. In this case, we're

587
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 1: seeing more and more images impersonating Catholic clergy, giving commentary,

588
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:49,880
Speaker 1: even making requests for donations and financial transfers. It's particularly

589
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,840
Speaker 1: targeting elderly Catholics, as you can imagine.

590
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 2: Here's an example of a deep fake.

591
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 1: This was brought to our attention by a friend of

592
00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 1: mine whose mother heard this, and it was Nashville exorcist

593
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: Father Dan Rehill delivering words of wisdom she found particularly comforting.

594
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 1: But it is not, Father Rehill. Bear that in mind.

595
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 8: Watch, Lord Jesus, thank you for every year you have

596
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 8: given us, for every breath, for every chance to love again.

597
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,000
Speaker 8: Put your peace in our hearts right now, and give

598
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,000
Speaker 8: us wisdom to choose what is good and step away

599
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:21,719
Speaker 8: from what is not.

600
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:25,840
Speaker 1: Bob, the Pope has talked about safeguarding humanity and creating

601
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:29,560
Speaker 1: a framework for managing AI. Your thoughts on this is

602
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 1: the toothpaste out of the can at this point.

603
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 5: Well, if I wanted to be clever about this, I

604
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 5: would say that some people are using AI to promote

605
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 5: things that they already tried to promote coming out of

606
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 5: Vatican too by lying about what was going on there.

607
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 5: In this case, it looks like they're at least they're

608
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 5: only just looking for money, not necessarily trying to work

609
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 5: a doctrine, although that may be on the table too. Now, look,

610
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,640
Speaker 5: this is very worrisome. There used to be a period,

611
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 5: there was a short window when it was possible to

612
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:02,520
Speaker 5: determine when there were these AI generated images. But the

613
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 5: you know, the the technology has gotten more and more sophisticated,

614
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:07,959
Speaker 5: and it's more and more difficult to do this. And

615
00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 5: you know, like many other things in our society, the

616
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 5: technology makes it possible for people to reach out and

617
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 5: to try to doupe people who may.

618
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:18,480
Speaker 2: Not be like me.

619
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 5: All that all that good at using these different technologies,

620
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:25,880
Speaker 5: and I get phone calls and whatnot that sound plausible.

621
00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 5: I've learned to be more cautious about it. I don't

622
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:31,120
Speaker 5: pick them up. Sometimes my phone warms me, warns me

623
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,720
Speaker 5: that they're spam and their grifters out there. But this

624
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 5: is going to be something big, and we're expecting a document,

625
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 5: of course from Pope Leo about AI so presumably especially

626
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 5: since his image has been included in some of these

627
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:47,560
Speaker 5: these so called deep figs. Presumably there'll be some some

628
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 5: words about that, about how to deal with it, but

629
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 5: it's going to have to be dealt with on a

630
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:53,640
Speaker 5: technological level as well.

631
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: How do we protect vulnerable people father from this kind

632
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 1: of manipulation. I mean, clearly, I would recommend the government.

633
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 1: I know there's some states are trying to do this.

634
00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:06,600
Speaker 1: They should clearly identify AI with water marks on the screen.

635
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:08,719
Speaker 1: That should be part of the law so that you

636
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:10,440
Speaker 1: can't get away with this kind of manipulation.

637
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is a legal problem because they're using commercial

638
00:34:15,160 --> 00:34:19,400
Speaker 3: means in order to contact people and attempt to solicit money,

639
00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,760
Speaker 3: you know, in the fraudulent manner, so not to be legal.

640
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,600
Speaker 3: So the problem is, of course the stuff is produced

641
00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 3: in you know, foreign countries and then it's piped in

642
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:32,279
Speaker 3: versus via the internet. There's no physical location here, So

643
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 3: what do you do. You go after the banking, you

644
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:38,319
Speaker 3: go after the means of transmission. You try to, you know,

645
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,839
Speaker 3: as you say, force those companies who are transmitting this

646
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:45,080
Speaker 3: kind of information that water marks and identifiers.

647
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 4: But it is very hard, and you.

648
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:50,239
Speaker 3: Know, there'll be a free market solution because some guy

649
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 3: will make money figuring out how to uncover deep fakes

650
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:56,440
Speaker 3: in the process, so you'll be able to push a

651
00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:59,120
Speaker 3: button and compare. But you know, as Bob says, and

652
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:01,840
Speaker 3: we all know from you know, the little old ladies

653
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 3: getting the solicitation envelopes you know in the mail are

654
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 3: going to turn into the next generation getting the emails

655
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 3: and put clicking a button and suddenly they're supporting what's

656
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:14,840
Speaker 3: not father? You know x y Z, who's doing something

657
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:17,759
Speaker 3: good for the ports, you know, rip off artists to

658
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:18,920
Speaker 3: ABC somewhere.

659
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, so, Father, that wasn't you pushing that new cooking line.

660
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:23,319
Speaker 1: That wasn't you the other day?

661
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 3: No, I only pushed sports betting on the side, you know,

662
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:29,440
Speaker 3: And it's Notre Dame games and stuff like.

663
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:31,280
Speaker 4: No, I'm not I don't push anything.

664
00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:33,719
Speaker 1: I know you don't, but I you know, I say

665
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:37,359
Speaker 1: this to my friends in the media. You're this far

666
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,759
Speaker 1: away from saying anything under the sun. Because of the

667
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 1: ubiquity of this and ease of this technology, anybody can

668
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:46,120
Speaker 1: take your image, anybody can use it.

669
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 2: Your voice is replicated. It's kind of frightening. Uh.

670
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:52,240
Speaker 1: And now we are dead actors returning to the screen

671
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 1: because of it.

672
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, Raymond, there was a deep fake a few

673
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 3: months ago of Pope Leo arguing who is better Lebron

674
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 3: James or Kobe Brynt. And it was very convinced. As

675
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:04,759
Speaker 3: a basketball it was very convincing. But I said, he

676
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:05,759
Speaker 3: never said any of that.

677
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 5: Where did you come out?

678
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 4: Ah, that's a guy forgot, but it might have been

679
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 4: for Lebron.

680
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:13,480
Speaker 5: I hang from that decision.

681
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,439
Speaker 2: Wow, yeah, I think I think Pope Leo. Look, he's

682
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,360
Speaker 2: he's dealing with SSPX.

683
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 1: He's got bigger fish to fry than Lebron and whoever else.

684
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:26,879
Speaker 5: The people have said he's a white Sox fan, which

685
00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 5: means he's a man of sorrow.

686
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: Okay, Another big story this week, and this is heartbreaking

687
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:38,879
Speaker 1: news that Catholic businessman democracy advocate Jimmy Laie has been

688
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 1: sentenced to twenty years in prison by a Hong Kong

689
00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:46,879
Speaker 1: court for alleged sedition. Now, given Jimmy's already failing health,

690
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 1: this is tantamount to a death sentence. I mean, that's

691
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:50,000
Speaker 1: what this means.

692
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:50,680
Speaker 4: Father.

693
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: We've heard Secretary of State Mark or Rubio called for

694
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 1: Jimmy's release. The UK government has done so as well.

695
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:59,400
Speaker 1: He is a British citizen. The question is where is

696
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,200
Speaker 1: Pope's Leo? Where's the Vatican on this?

697
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 3: One of the most disappointing things was the silence of

698
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 3: both Pope Francis and then up till now of Pope

699
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:11,680
Speaker 3: Leo about the case of Jimmy Lai. Jimmy Lai is

700
00:37:11,719 --> 00:37:16,320
Speaker 3: a victim of a tyranny in China which cannot tolerate

701
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 3: a seventy eight seventy eight year old man who disagrees

702
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:22,919
Speaker 3: with their policies. This shows how weak communists is at root.

703
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 3: They can't tolerate people who contradict them. They're not a government,

704
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 3: as they say that, you know, the People's Republic. The

705
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 3: people have nothing to do with that government in any

706
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:34,440
Speaker 3: meaningful way.

707
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:35,839
Speaker 4: So what do we have to do.

708
00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 3: I pray for Jimmy Lai. What a wonderful man. He

709
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:43,959
Speaker 3: is a beautiful family. But both Starmer in Britain and

710
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,560
Speaker 3: our President Trump, they need to make it clear to

711
00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 3: the Chinese government give us Jimmy Laie or we don't

712
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 3: give you what you want in trade and other things.

713
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:57,799
Speaker 3: Because the Chinese government is not humanitarian, They're just going

714
00:37:57,880 --> 00:37:59,719
Speaker 3: to respond if they think it's in their interest to

715
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:01,720
Speaker 3: get Jimmy Lai out of Hong Kong prist.

716
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 2: Right, right.

717
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:06,320
Speaker 1: Well, the family's asking for world leaders and everyone to

718
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:10,200
Speaker 1: condemn this and beg for his release. Bob the Pope

719
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:14,400
Speaker 1: did meet with the live family, with Jimmy's wife and daughter,

720
00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:17,319
Speaker 1: but he's never really spoken about this.

721
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:20,360
Speaker 2: Is it moral for the Church to.

722
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:25,759
Speaker 1: Respect this diplomatic agreement made with China at the expense

723
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,360
Speaker 1: of this brave Catholic layman's life.

724
00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 5: Well, I would say no. Look, I'll use a technical

725
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:34,680
Speaker 5: term about Jimmy Lai. He's a confessor, you know. Confessor

726
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:37,520
Speaker 5: in the tradition of the church is someone who has

727
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:40,640
Speaker 5: suffered for the faith, hasn't been actually martyred.

728
00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 2: The way that you know.

729
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:43,360
Speaker 5: We know a lot of martyrs in different ways have

730
00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:46,879
Speaker 5: been throughout Church history. But it looks like he could also,

731
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 5: in a sense be a mortar because he will die

732
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,720
Speaker 5: in prison unless there was a commutation of the sentence,

733
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:54,040
Speaker 5: or maybe he should just be expelled. I mean, they

734
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 5: should just ask for him to be expelled to England.

735
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,360
Speaker 5: He could have easily left since he was a bigger

736
00:38:59,400 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 5: British citizen. He has a British passport. He could have left,

737
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:05,480
Speaker 5: but he chose to stay in China and fight for

738
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:10,439
Speaker 5: freedom for what is true in that country. And look,

739
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:12,720
Speaker 5: it's one of the further We've talked about this many times,

740
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:16,240
Speaker 5: one of the further evil outcomes of this still secret

741
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:20,279
Speaker 5: agreement with the Chinese government that it appears now that

742
00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 5: he is being sacrificed on the altar of that diplomacy. So,

743
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 5: you know, is this good that the most heroic, the

744
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 5: most loyal Catholics in a place like China, including Cardinal

745
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:37,000
Speaker 5: Zen and others, are being ignored for the sake of

746
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,960
Speaker 5: an agreement that so far, it seems, has given all

747
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:45,280
Speaker 5: the advantage to the Chinese Communist government and very little

748
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 5: advantage to the Roman Catholic Church. At some point, this

749
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 5: is going to explode. I don't think that this can

750
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:51,720
Speaker 5: go on forever.

751
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:53,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I hope not, gentlemen.

752
00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:58,240
Speaker 1: I've been asking our prayerful Posse family for which stories

753
00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:02,320
Speaker 1: they'd like us to explore. Heart Ponder of Palm Desert

754
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 1: told me he wanted us to get into the numbers

755
00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 1: of a twenty twenty five pere research study measuring the

756
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:11,600
Speaker 1: attitudes of US Catholics on a number of issues. And

757
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:14,879
Speaker 1: it's a really interesting study that sort of was dropped.

758
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 2: And then everybody looked away.

759
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:18,360
Speaker 1: The main beam of the headline when the survey was

760
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 1: released last year was sixty percent of US Catholics pulled

761
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:26,640
Speaker 1: favor a more inclusive church, even if it meant changing

762
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 1: some of the teachings, as opposed to thirty seven percent

763
00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:34,920
Speaker 1: who are against that idea. Now, father, what jumps out

764
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 1: you hear the thirty seven percent opposed? I imagine that.

765
00:40:39,800 --> 00:40:41,959
Speaker 1: You know, those are the people who are mass going,

766
00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 1: and you know that's a shrinking number of people, but

767
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:46,319
Speaker 1: they're trying to hold on to the traditions.

768
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:49,640
Speaker 3: Yes they are, and it shows how you know, social

769
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 3: conditioning has won out in the post Vattic and two period.

770
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:56,640
Speaker 3: It used to be where the Catholic Church we were

771
00:40:56,719 --> 00:41:00,279
Speaker 3: loyal Americans, but we upheld Catholic doctrine and we were

772
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:04,520
Speaker 3: not against moral relativism. In fact, the Catholic Church moral relativism.

773
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:07,879
Speaker 3: After the Sexual Revolution, the Catholic Church kind of disappeared.

774
00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:10,720
Speaker 3: It was the main force in trying to keep public

775
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:14,840
Speaker 3: morals in order and to prevent the government from promoting immorality,

776
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:19,200
Speaker 3: you know, contraception and abortion, those things. Sadly, we lost

777
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 3: those fights. So in the educational system of the Catholic Church.

778
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 3: Since the Council, there have been less students and less

779
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:30,880
Speaker 3: emphasis on doctrinal orthodoxy, and I think that's the result.

780
00:41:31,400 --> 00:41:35,279
Speaker 3: And people, you know, basically often view religion as a

781
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:38,480
Speaker 3: sociological fact. You know, I'm a Catholic, your protest and

782
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:41,120
Speaker 3: your Jewish, you're a Muslim. That's just the way it is.

783
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 3: We try to tell people true God's providence. You were

784
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:48,200
Speaker 3: born of Catholic parents and they baptized you. But guess

785
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:50,920
Speaker 3: what the difine providence there, so that your faith will

786
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:54,400
Speaker 3: become a personal experience in which you become a disciple

787
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:56,799
Speaker 3: of disciples. You know that you go out and try

788
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:59,400
Speaker 3: to convince people to follow Jesus because it's not the

789
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 3: question of that is.

790
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:01,560
Speaker 4: An historical thing.

791
00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:05,279
Speaker 3: Quote Christianity is that God intervened in history and we're

792
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:09,240
Speaker 3: part of that. So I have to say this brings

793
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:12,040
Speaker 3: back the bigger discussion, which is more of a problem

794
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:15,239
Speaker 3: for the Church, the fact that people don't believe in

795
00:42:15,280 --> 00:42:17,560
Speaker 3: the doctrine or that they like to go to Latin Mass.

796
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:19,600
Speaker 4: Right, but the ones who go to Latin Mass.

797
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 3: Are getting the hammer put on them, and the ones

798
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 3: who don't like the doctrine are just kind of identified

799
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:26,800
Speaker 3: as well. Maybe we use that to justify not teaching anymore.

800
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:29,720
Speaker 1: I want to move on to The survey also measured

801
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 1: BOB reproductive issues like birth control, ifv ordination of women

802
00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:37,440
Speaker 1: and married priests based on the frequency of mass attendance.

803
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 2: Here are some of the examples.

804
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 1: When asked about allowing Catholics to use birth control, seventy

805
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:46,359
Speaker 1: two percent of weekly mass goers were in favor of it,

806
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,720
Speaker 1: as opposed to twenty seven percent of post Among Catholics

807
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:53,880
Speaker 1: who attend less than a weekly mass, a wopping ninety

808
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 1: percent said they favored the Church allowing birth control, while

809
00:42:58,120 --> 00:42:59,920
Speaker 1: only ten percent of that group.

810
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 2: Of Catholics opposed it.

811
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:04,160
Speaker 1: Overall, eighty four percent of Catholics polled last year were

812
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:06,719
Speaker 1: in favor of birth control. What does that tell you

813
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: about the crisis of the post Vatican two Katechisa spot.

814
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:14,640
Speaker 5: Actually, I'm surprised the numbers are even that good. Really,

815
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:16,359
Speaker 5: I bet, if you want to put it that way,

816
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:18,080
Speaker 5: I mean, at one point, I think we had maybe

817
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 5: seven percent of Catholics. I think there's been some good evangelizing,

818
00:43:21,719 --> 00:43:25,080
Speaker 5: some good teaching done along the line in the last

819
00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:29,800
Speaker 5: couple of decades. You know, it's no surprise that people

820
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 5: are saying this because the message, as we mentioned earlier,

821
00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 5: they came out of Vatican two, was very confused about

822
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 5: a lot of these issues. Bishop Barron has talked about

823
00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 5: how when he was in the seminary and studying, how

824
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:44,360
Speaker 5: for a couple of decades there everything seemed to be

825
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:47,759
Speaker 5: up for grabs and a lot of people I can

826
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:50,880
Speaker 5: remember myself people saying to me when I would, you know,

827
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:54,360
Speaker 5: state the obvious some obvious things that the Church was teaching. Oh, no,

828
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,400
Speaker 5: they've changed all that. Well you know who changed that?

829
00:43:57,800 --> 00:43:59,560
Speaker 5: You didn't even need a I beg then it was

830
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:01,840
Speaker 5: right there. Just it was a kind of a general

831
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:05,480
Speaker 5: social sense that these things had been changed. So, look,

832
00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 5: it's very disturbing to me that even when you look

833
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:12,479
Speaker 5: at the people are so called masculine Catholics, you can't

834
00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:16,320
Speaker 5: find a majority for the Catholic position on most of

835
00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 5: those sensitive issues. And it just shows how powerful peer

836
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:24,480
Speaker 5: pressure is. Most Catholics are not theologians. Many of them

837
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 5: don't care about even the issues that we talk about here.

838
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:28,880
Speaker 5: What they do is they kind of get a general

839
00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:32,239
Speaker 5: sense and if their pastor or if their bishop is

840
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:35,880
Speaker 5: not very firm in teaching things, well, they're going to

841
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:38,640
Speaker 5: just get the sense that we're all going along to

842
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 5: get along. And then you use this very deceptive umbrella

843
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 5: term like inclusivity, which is really a political term for

844
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 5: all those things that the Catholics it's call it. It's

845
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 5: an umbrella term for all those things abandoning all those

846
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 5: things the Catholics regard as distinctive to what Jesus has

847
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:02,320
Speaker 5: taught and what has come down to us from the tradition.

848
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,479
Speaker 5: Inclusivity in and of itself could be a neutral term,

849
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:08,160
Speaker 5: but when it's used here, I think it has an

850
00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 5: ideological connotation.

851
00:45:09,920 --> 00:45:13,520
Speaker 1: Uh huh, Father, what's the solution here? Can the bishops

852
00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 1: actually reverse this what we lost a generation? And is

853
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: this a uniquely American problem where European problem due to

854
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:21,640
Speaker 1: the lack of categorises.

855
00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:24,360
Speaker 3: You know, when the building's on fire, the solution is

856
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 3: called the fire department and put the hoses on the building.

857
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:28,160
Speaker 4: I mean.

858
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:31,880
Speaker 3: In other words, effective remedies are quite clear. Teach clearly

859
00:45:31,920 --> 00:45:36,400
Speaker 3: what the church teaches, support efforts to fight all of

860
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:39,600
Speaker 3: these evils, and then teach clearly tell people, for instance,

861
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:43,400
Speaker 3: the subject of women's ordination is not on the table now.

862
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,080
Speaker 3: Sad to say, the cinidality mode that we went through

863
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:49,440
Speaker 3: right to the Pope Francis. It was always on the table.

864
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:53,000
Speaker 3: What we spend time on TV and here telling people

865
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,840
Speaker 3: what bishops are asking to talk about should not be

866
00:45:55,920 --> 00:45:58,879
Speaker 3: talking You can't ready been decided. Yea, yeah, we don't

867
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:03,719
Speaker 3: talk about reversing the law gravity. So yeah, it's a

868
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 3: combination of teaching and then you have to say with

869
00:46:07,800 --> 00:46:12,799
Speaker 3: young people, supporting people who have large families praising them,

870
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:17,600
Speaker 3: you know, supporting efforts and homes for onwed mothers and

871
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:22,480
Speaker 3: alternatives to abortion on those issues. But doctrinally speaking, we

872
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:25,840
Speaker 3: should have bishops getting up and saying the Catechism of

873
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,640
Speaker 3: the Catholic Church is not a reference book for those

874
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 3: who find it interesting. It is the teaching of Christ

875
00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:34,840
Speaker 3: that all of you need to know. And in my

876
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:37,719
Speaker 3: diocese and throughout our country, we're going to spend a

877
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:40,480
Speaker 3: couple of years going through it together and then do

878
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:43,680
Speaker 3: what Bishop Baron and others are doing on TV. You know,

879
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:47,080
Speaker 3: Father Schmidts, go through the Catechism.

880
00:46:46,520 --> 00:46:49,120
Speaker 4: Explain it. These things can be done.

881
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:52,719
Speaker 3: You know, influencers are out there because they're influential. We

882
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:55,360
Speaker 3: need some influencers to get people to read the categorists

883
00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:59,000
Speaker 3: and the Bible by the way, you know, Father Schmids

884
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:01,680
Speaker 3: deserves a lot of it, and so many others. Get

885
00:47:01,719 --> 00:47:03,759
Speaker 3: people to read the Bible, they're going to discover the

886
00:47:03,800 --> 00:47:06,879
Speaker 3: Catholic teaching is indeed the fruit of what the Holy

887
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:07,840
Speaker 3: Spirit inspires.

888
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:09,560
Speaker 2: Okay, some other numbers I want to get into.

889
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:13,080
Speaker 1: Seventy six percent of Catholics favored, according to this Pew survey,

890
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 1: the Church allowing communion for Catholics even if unmarried and cohabitating.

891
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: Sixty eight percent favored women deacons, sixty three percent favored

892
00:47:24,719 --> 00:47:28,920
Speaker 1: married priests, sixty percent favored blessings for same sex couples,

893
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:31,359
Speaker 1: fifty nine percent are fine with women priests, and now

894
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:35,680
Speaker 1: fifty percent of Catholic surveyed are in favor of Church

895
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:40,400
Speaker 1: sanctioned gay marriage. Father these numbers, Catholics are clearly shifting

896
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:45,520
Speaker 1: away from the traditional teaching. Is it only the fault

897
00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:50,840
Speaker 1: of society societal pressures? Is it a breakdown of family

898
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:53,200
Speaker 1: and catechisis what do those numbers mean to you?

899
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:56,080
Speaker 4: In the devilish for some of those issues.

900
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:58,359
Speaker 3: Quite clear what Poe Francis said and did has had

901
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:02,440
Speaker 3: an influence on people tolerance of gay relationships as somehow

902
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:04,680
Speaker 3: being for the good of the people involved in good

903
00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:08,160
Speaker 3: for society. That the Catholic Church has never said that,

904
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:11,640
Speaker 3: and post Francis conveyed that message with the blessing of couples.

905
00:48:12,520 --> 00:48:14,240
Speaker 4: You know, the idea of women deacons.

906
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:17,279
Speaker 3: We had, we had two commissions under pot Francis, we

907
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 3: had previous studies.

908
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:20,000
Speaker 4: It never seems to end.

909
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:24,160
Speaker 3: No, it's a doctrinal confusion comes from the you know,

910
00:48:24,239 --> 00:48:27,799
Speaker 3: the unsure messengers who are putting out conflicting It's like,

911
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 3: you know, you know, the message is garbled because the

912
00:48:31,120 --> 00:48:32,720
Speaker 3: radio waves are not clear.

913
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:35,240
Speaker 4: And that's what's happening. The message is garbled.

914
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:39,600
Speaker 3: The people out there aren't getting Catholicism is not like Protestantism.

915
00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:43,280
Speaker 3: Protestantism you create your own version of what the Bible

916
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:46,319
Speaker 3: teaches and you follow it in good conscience. That's the

917
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:50,279
Speaker 3: American way. That is for Protestants. The Catholic Church is

918
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:53,200
Speaker 3: not that. The Catholic Church is the teaching of Christ

919
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:57,640
Speaker 3: through the Apostles and their successors, and it's consistent, it

920
00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:58,839
Speaker 3: is not changeable.

921
00:49:00,120 --> 00:49:04,440
Speaker 1: Reaction to these numbers, do they concern you? And what

922
00:49:04,560 --> 00:49:08,640
Speaker 1: about the influence of politics, how politics has been overlaid

923
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:12,160
Speaker 1: on top of the faith community in many ways to

924
00:49:12,280 --> 00:49:14,919
Speaker 1: divide it and in some ways, I think, to lead

925
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:17,760
Speaker 1: to outcomes like we've been reading here in these numbers.

926
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:21,919
Speaker 5: Well, look, the politics of this are very interesting too,

927
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 5: because other than certain sectors of the evangelicals, and not

928
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 5: even always there, it's not the case that what you

929
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,520
Speaker 5: might call biblical principles are even observed. They're one of

930
00:49:32,560 --> 00:49:35,320
Speaker 5: the reasons why the so called fundamentalist movement in the

931
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 5: United States began back in the early ninete twentieth century

932
00:49:39,560 --> 00:49:42,680
Speaker 5: was because even the Protestants were starting to move away

933
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 5: from Biblical principles. And it's no look, it's no secret

934
00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 5: that if you go into a Protestant church these days,

935
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 5: you're going to hear the trends is a way of

936
00:49:53,480 --> 00:49:57,680
Speaker 5: being Christian, that gays are to be welcomed as gays,

937
00:49:58,360 --> 00:50:02,359
Speaker 5: gay marriages to be to be celebrated. So all these

938
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:07,400
Speaker 5: things that used to be held off because Protestants actually

939
00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:09,520
Speaker 5: did read the Bible and try to remain faithful to it,

940
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:11,960
Speaker 5: those have been abandoned even by the with them what

941
00:50:12,160 --> 00:50:14,839
Speaker 5: used to be called the mainstream. And our friend, father

942
00:50:14,960 --> 00:50:17,160
Speaker 5: Richard John knew House used to say that they went

943
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:20,240
Speaker 5: from the mainstream to the sideline.

944
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 2: It no longer.

945
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,360
Speaker 5: You know, they are only very small pockets even of

946
00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:28,480
Speaker 5: Protestants will hold to biblical principles. So look at shocking

947
00:50:29,200 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 5: and the way that you have to respond to this

948
00:50:31,280 --> 00:50:33,640
Speaker 5: is you have to respond with the truth. We have

949
00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:35,440
Speaker 5: to keep saying. I mean, I think one of the

950
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:41,360
Speaker 5: pernicious things that the whole concept of citidelity has brought

951
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:45,279
Speaker 5: back is this idea that everything is under discussion right right,

952
00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 5: and it's discuss You know, there are words in every

953
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:51,360
Speaker 5: one of the documents, in the sins that kind of

954
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:53,440
Speaker 5: deny that, but it's just kind of a pro former.

955
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:55,520
Speaker 5: There are a few sentences here and there, and you know,

956
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 5: we remain unfaithful to Jesus. It looks like we're going

957
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:01,600
Speaker 5: to continue to talk about what the world continues to

958
00:51:01,640 --> 00:51:04,960
Speaker 5: tell us is wrong about the faith, and that, I mean,

959
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,319
Speaker 5: that is more fundamental than even any one of these

960
00:51:07,480 --> 00:51:09,480
Speaker 5: specific issues, as bad as those are.

961
00:51:09,680 --> 00:51:11,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, I want to end with some good

962
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:15,799
Speaker 1: news before we go. Britta Curl Salemi. She is a

963
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:19,040
Speaker 1: twenty five year old forward for the US women's Olympic

964
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:23,400
Speaker 1: hockey team in Milan. She's posting videos of herself, not

965
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:27,040
Speaker 1: doing workouts or making political statements which everybody else is doing.

966
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:31,200
Speaker 1: She's posting videos of herself at Latin mass. She told

967
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:33,439
Speaker 1: our Sunday Visitor News that the first thing she does

968
00:51:33,520 --> 00:51:35,920
Speaker 1: every morning is go to her Bible, and she calls

969
00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:40,640
Speaker 1: hockey one of her paths to be a saint. Father,

970
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:45,600
Speaker 1: your thoughts on this kind of witness. We live in

971
00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 1: a moment where so many Olympic athletes are using their

972
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:49,440
Speaker 1: platforms for all manner of things.

973
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:51,880
Speaker 2: What do you think of this one?

974
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 4: Now? I love that girl. She's great.

975
00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 3: I was a hockey player, not a collegiate level, played

976
00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:01,600
Speaker 3: inner murals, but and then I played adult hockey as

977
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:04,840
Speaker 3: a man, as a grown man. No, hockey is a

978
00:52:04,840 --> 00:52:07,800
Speaker 3: great sport. And she's, you know, a great competitor, and

979
00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:10,920
Speaker 3: God bless her. Now, I mean the true nature of sport.

980
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 3: And you know, let's go back to NCAA and you know,

981
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:17,279
Speaker 3: Teddy Roosevelt, this was to promote character development, and it

982
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,800
Speaker 3: does promote good socialization, and it promotes an observance of

983
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:23,919
Speaker 3: teamwork and rules. And you know, hockey is a very

984
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:26,400
Speaker 3: disciplined sport. Even though it looks chaotic on the ice,

985
00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:30,360
Speaker 3: it's a very disciplined approach to the game, and she

986
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:32,879
Speaker 3: obviously they're are a great team. By the way, Yeah,

987
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:35,680
Speaker 3: shut out the Canadians five nothing. The other day I

988
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:38,719
Speaker 3: watched the game. I said, these girls are good. We're

989
00:52:38,760 --> 00:52:40,880
Speaker 3: lucky in the US have such good play out. The

990
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:43,319
Speaker 3: Canadians are great. I won't put down any other team,

991
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:44,560
Speaker 3: but say, I'm an American fan.

992
00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:45,279
Speaker 2: There you go.

993
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:48,719
Speaker 1: Father's working that that those sports apps I know.

994
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:51,920
Speaker 2: Bob Britta also says.

995
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:55,759
Speaker 1: She sees hockey as teaching her quote to die to

996
00:52:55,800 --> 00:52:59,880
Speaker 1: yourself and put the team ahead of yourself, very Catholic language.

997
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:01,600
Speaker 2: She's even planning to visit Rome.

998
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:05,800
Speaker 1: And hope to visit with the Pope, boasting in God.

999
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:08,080
Speaker 2: It's an amazing witness. I'll give you the last word.

1000
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:12,319
Speaker 5: She's body checking another player. I hope she's getting glory to.

1001
00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:15,200
Speaker 2: Good asking forgiveness.

1002
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 5: I'm very taken with the way that a lot of athletes,

1003
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 5: and not not only at the Olympics, by the way,

1004
00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:22,440
Speaker 5: we've seen this in you know, sports here in the

1005
00:53:22,520 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 5: United States and even elsewhere, there's this kind of give

1006
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:28,800
Speaker 5: glory to God. You know, it's that old Chariots of

1007
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:32,719
Speaker 5: Fire movie where you know that that Runners talks about

1008
00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:35,480
Speaker 5: how when he ran, he felt he felt God's pleasure

1009
00:53:35,560 --> 00:53:38,600
Speaker 5: and that he was training and he was good at something.

1010
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:40,520
Speaker 5: I think that this is strange, the way that this

1011
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 5: is starting to come back. Just like the way that

1012
00:53:42,600 --> 00:53:45,480
Speaker 5: young people have been attracted to traditional Latin mass there's

1013
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:49,759
Speaker 5: a kind of another open side door, back door of

1014
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:53,680
Speaker 5: excellence and trying to achieve something kind of opens them

1015
00:53:53,719 --> 00:53:56,160
Speaker 5: out to something outside of themselves. And that's the place

1016
00:53:56,600 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 5: really that we start to appreciate the transcendence and something

1017
00:54:00,560 --> 00:54:03,319
Speaker 5: new and if that takes a religious turn, man, that

1018
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:04,200
Speaker 5: could be very powerful.

1019
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:07,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, gentlemen, grateful to you all. As always, glad we

1020
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:09,200
Speaker 1: ended on a happy note. If you want more of

1021
00:54:09,239 --> 00:54:13,280
Speaker 1: the Arroyo Grande Prayerful Posse, subscribe to the Arroyo Grande

1022
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:17,040
Speaker 1: Show on YouTube or the Arroyo Grande Podcast wherever you

1023
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:19,560
Speaker 1: get yours on behalf of Robert Royal, Father Gerald Murray.

1024
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:22,600
Speaker 1: Until the Posse rides again, Stay the course.

1025
00:54:22,600 --> 00:54:25,239
Speaker 2: Follow the light. I'm Raymond Arroyo. We'll see you next time.

1026
00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:29,440
Speaker 1: Arroyo Grande is produced in partnership with DP Studios and

1027
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:33,160
Speaker 1: iHeart Podcasts, and is available on the iHeartRadio app or

1028
00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:46,120
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts,