1
00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:02,880
Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media.

2
00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:06,840
Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff.

3
00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:11,520
Speaker 2: The podcast about the people fighting against bad things, which

4
00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:14,520
Speaker 2: is completely unrelated to the current moment. But if you,

5
00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:19,760
Speaker 2: dear listener, are terrified because of the news, it's a

6
00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:26,320
Speaker 2: good month to be terrified, because it's right right see

7
00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:29,400
Speaker 2: almost laughing at my joke is my guest, Sarah Marshall.

8
00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:31,600
Speaker 1: How are you hello? I didn't know if I was

9
00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:35,000
Speaker 1: supposed to pretend to be backstage and the podcast still

10
00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:42,800
Speaker 1: I'm I'm, I'm okay. I'm in Portland, Oregon, and it's

11
00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:46,120
Speaker 1: a war there. I've heard it's yeah, it's it's so

12
00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:50,479
Speaker 1: lovely here. I feel like the city has reacted by

13
00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:57,400
Speaker 1: becoming even cuter than usual. And I'm just so happy

14
00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:01,560
Speaker 1: to be able to speak to you from the literal

15
00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:04,880
Speaker 1: hell in which I evidently live. News to me. From

16
00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:07,800
Speaker 1: where I'm sitting, I can often see hummingbirds.

17
00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:13,880
Speaker 2: Also, and the call is our producer, Sophie Hi, how

18
00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:14,200
Speaker 2: are you?

19
00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:15,039
Speaker 1: I'm good?

20
00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:18,240
Speaker 3: I also can see a hummingbird from my window.

21
00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:26,160
Speaker 1: A hell hummingbird currently hell helling bird, hellingbird, helming.

22
00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:28,000
Speaker 3: Oh, I'm like a little blue jay.

23
00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:34,360
Speaker 2: Oh well, is Arah Marshall and Blue Jay speaking of

24
00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:39,240
Speaker 2: demons and hell, I hear you have a podcast coming out.

25
00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:43,680
Speaker 1: I do, and it's not like my normal podcast You're

26
00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,160
Speaker 1: wrong about, which will be coming out every two weeks

27
00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,560
Speaker 1: until the end of time, because this is a very

28
00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:55,000
Speaker 1: special mini series event from CBC Podcasts and it's my

29
00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:58,880
Speaker 1: show about the Satanic Panic. It's called The Devil you

30
00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:02,720
Speaker 1: know and Magpie. I hope that you listen. And Sophie

31
00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:06,720
Speaker 1: has been this psychically holding my hand through making this

32
00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:11,760
Speaker 1: for years, a very long time. Yeah, our entire lives.

33
00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:17,200
Speaker 2: I've been trying to find a protagonist because I don't

34
00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:19,720
Speaker 2: do a podcast about bad things. I've been trying to

35
00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:22,200
Speaker 2: find a way to talk about the Satanic Panic. Besides,

36
00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:24,840
Speaker 2: the only time I've covered it is Dungeons and Dragons.

37
00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:27,600
Speaker 2: That's a good one, yeah, which was a little bit

38
00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:30,280
Speaker 2: of a cheat because Dungeons and Dragons isn't actually cool

39
00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:32,040
Speaker 2: people did cool stuff. It was more like a bunch

40
00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:35,240
Speaker 2: of kind of shitty people who did something cool. But

41
00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:37,800
Speaker 2: and then I can talk about Satanic panic a little bit.

42
00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:40,880
Speaker 2: You can always talk about Wi Nathan. She's a cool

43
00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:42,960
Speaker 2: people and all this, and she was one of the

44
00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:49,440
Speaker 2: first journalists to point out like Hey, I this seems

45
00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:52,480
Speaker 2: wrong to me, and here's why. And did we listen

46
00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:53,120
Speaker 2: to her? No?

47
00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:57,080
Speaker 1: Not really, certainly not at first, but yeah, there really aren't.

48
00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:59,120
Speaker 1: There are cool people within it. And that's kind of

49
00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:01,440
Speaker 1: what I'm trying to do on this show too, is

50
00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:04,720
Speaker 1: to show really how amazing some of the people who

51
00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:07,639
Speaker 1: got caught up in this moral panic machine were and are.

52
00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:10,919
Speaker 2: Okay, I have so many questions of satanic panic. The

53
00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:14,240
Speaker 2: first question is have you seen Mazes and Monsters, the

54
00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:15,520
Speaker 2: d Panic movie?

55
00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:17,919
Speaker 1: Yeah? I do. I'm fond of that movie.

56
00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,800
Speaker 2: It's so good. It's so good. I mean, it's actually

57
00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:22,520
Speaker 2: terrible and there's nothing redeeming about it.

58
00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:27,400
Speaker 1: It's so good, great young Tom Hanks action. Yeah, yeah,

59
00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:29,480
Speaker 1: and I feel like it's got the Mayor from Jaws

60
00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:32,000
Speaker 1: in it, Like that feels like a dream. But I

61
00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:33,000
Speaker 1: think that happened.

62
00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:36,560
Speaker 2: I I know who Tom Hanks is. I feel really

63
00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:39,600
Speaker 2: good about that. There's no way magp for that. Now

64
00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:44,440
Speaker 2: I've seen Jaws, but I've realized I'm like my defense

65
00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:46,640
Speaker 2: is that I'm also kind of face and name blind.

66
00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,240
Speaker 2: I'm really just incapable of remembering things, which is really

67
00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:51,320
Speaker 2: strange considering what I do for a living.

68
00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,560
Speaker 1: I can't remember someone's name or face if I get

69
00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:58,040
Speaker 1: introduced to them, like I can learn it from Afar.

70
00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:01,640
Speaker 1: It's like this is person name and this is their face.

71
00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:03,560
Speaker 1: I'm never going to figure that out later.

72
00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:05,760
Speaker 3: How long did it take you to know my name?

73
00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:06,080
Speaker 4: Well?

74
00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:08,360
Speaker 1: I always knew your name because I heard about you

75
00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:10,440
Speaker 1: for a while and there was suspense, and then he

76
00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:12,480
Speaker 1: came over to my house and you looked like Tera

77
00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:17,359
Speaker 1: Lipinski and the Sex and the City game together and

78
00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:21,039
Speaker 1: unplayably badly designed trivia game. So that was like, that

79
00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:23,320
Speaker 1: was highly memorable, and that was the first thing I

80
00:04:23,360 --> 00:04:24,560
Speaker 1: said to you when I stand by that.

81
00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:28,280
Speaker 2: Okay, I have another question about the Satanic Panic. Yeah,

82
00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,000
Speaker 2: this one's larger and more philosophical, And if you don't

83
00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:35,240
Speaker 2: have an answer, it's okay. Why isn't more of that

84
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:39,800
Speaker 2: stuff real? My argument here, like the Satanic Panic, we

85
00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:41,359
Speaker 2: can all look at it and be like, this is

86
00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:46,280
Speaker 2: a way to demonize you know, anyone, We feel like, yeah, absolutely,

87
00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:48,120
Speaker 2: And you can look at like you can look at

88
00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:50,120
Speaker 2: the witch trials historically, and you can look at all

89
00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:53,440
Speaker 2: this stuff. But one of the things that I I've

90
00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:57,279
Speaker 2: run across in as I read history is things like

91
00:04:57,279 --> 00:04:59,599
Speaker 2: like I did this episode on Aqua Tefena and like

92
00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:02,800
Speaker 2: people killing husbands for a living? Do you ever hear

93
00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:03,200
Speaker 2: about this?

94
00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:03,960
Speaker 3: No?

95
00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:11,560
Speaker 1: Is that Aquafina's cousin. I'm so sorry. Well is a

96
00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:14,840
Speaker 1: person and also a bottled water, so that joke really

97
00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:16,159
Speaker 1: only works on one level.

98
00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:20,279
Speaker 3: But yeah, okay, Well I was like, magn not know

99
00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:22,000
Speaker 3: who Aquaphene is and.

100
00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:26,520
Speaker 1: Later yeah, and that's that's just fine for her.

101
00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:28,280
Speaker 2: If it happened in the Middle Ages, I have a

102
00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:29,680
Speaker 2: chance of knowing about it.

103
00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:31,080
Speaker 1: Okay.

104
00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:34,120
Speaker 2: So there was this thing where before divorce and this

105
00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:36,000
Speaker 2: is real and it seems like one of those things

106
00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,120
Speaker 2: that's fake. And actually the way that like the Instagram

107
00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:41,080
Speaker 2: levels of it talk about is usually wrong. But there

108
00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:43,279
Speaker 2: were people who's like, oh, my job is you come

109
00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:46,080
Speaker 2: to me. I kill your husband for you? Then you

110
00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:48,840
Speaker 2: because divorce doesn't exist, so really is kind of your

111
00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:50,040
Speaker 2: best bet right.

112
00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:55,680
Speaker 1: And accepting judaism holla, yeah, fair enough. Also sorry, Sophie.

113
00:05:55,800 --> 00:06:00,680
Speaker 2: Middle Ages, the Catholics weren't really Catholic and just you

114
00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,160
Speaker 2: could just divorce people, and like women could initiate divorce.

115
00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,120
Speaker 2: We covered that an episode about the Pirate Queen of.

116
00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:08,280
Speaker 1: What was it Like, Yeah, yeah we're Catholic or whatever,

117
00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:11,520
Speaker 1: but likely, but we're not gonna like do it too bad,

118
00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:12,159
Speaker 1: too much.

119
00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:14,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, we're like I'm just gonna say a note

120
00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:17,640
Speaker 4: to the listeners. I'm gonna try really really hard not

121
00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:22,080
Speaker 4: to laugh the entire episode because magpies are the two

122
00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:23,560
Speaker 4: funniest people I know.

123
00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:27,840
Speaker 1: You need a coss butt like in sports, it's a

124
00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:28,440
Speaker 1: laugh fun.

125
00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:31,719
Speaker 3: I keep having to lean away from the microphone silently

126
00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:34,039
Speaker 3: laugh like I'm in a cartoon, like a.

127
00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:39,000
Speaker 2: Gee, Like you have a good laugh, I don't.

128
00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:41,839
Speaker 1: I don't think the listener will mind it on like

129
00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,520
Speaker 1: a whole hour of Sophie laughing really honestly.

130
00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:49,120
Speaker 2: So in this episode, I learned all this stuff about

131
00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:51,960
Speaker 2: the magical underground that seems fake. It seems like the

132
00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:53,719
Speaker 2: kind of thing you'd be reading about in a like

133
00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:58,359
Speaker 2: oh they did this black Sabbaths, but I think they did,

134
00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:01,840
Speaker 2: like enough action histories like no, this is a thing

135
00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,159
Speaker 2: they did, or like you'd have like a priest and

136
00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:05,680
Speaker 2: he'd be like, oh, I want to make some money,

137
00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:08,400
Speaker 2: so he would like have a black Sabbath where you

138
00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:10,640
Speaker 2: get a naked lady and use her as the altar.

139
00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:13,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a naked lady on the altar, then like

140
00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:16,960
Speaker 1: that always sounds credible to me, I mean without any

141
00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:19,280
Speaker 1: of the you know, because like so much of the

142
00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,560
Speaker 1: eighty Satanic panic which has recurred today is about like

143
00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,760
Speaker 1: accusing anyone you want to marginalize of like sacrificing many,

144
00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:29,679
Speaker 1: many babies. But if we're just talking about like naked

145
00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:31,880
Speaker 1: lady on the altar and nice focal point, a little

146
00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:34,320
Speaker 1: bit of chanting, Like I've been to one of those,

147
00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:38,320
Speaker 1: you like people, that's pretty easy to get someone to.

148
00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:41,000
Speaker 2: Do, right, And they would do this to like make

149
00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:43,320
Speaker 2: potions to sell where you're like, oh, I drip some

150
00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,520
Speaker 2: olive oil down off of a dead saint and then

151
00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:48,360
Speaker 2: onto a like naked lady, and.

152
00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:51,880
Speaker 1: Then that there's like so many bits of dead saints

153
00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:53,040
Speaker 1: going around, you know.

154
00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:57,640
Speaker 2: There's plenty of this, and okay, So then also the

155
00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:01,320
Speaker 2: people whould kill husbands would get accused of sacrificing babies.

156
00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:05,800
Speaker 2: And this could be an abortion thing, right, because they

157
00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:08,200
Speaker 2: would also be the people who would probably like help

158
00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:12,240
Speaker 2: you have an abortion. It also could be an infanticide thing,

159
00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:15,680
Speaker 2: and I wouldn't know, right, And like there's like a

160
00:08:15,800 --> 00:08:18,080
Speaker 2: sensible history where they're like, oh, we dug up this

161
00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:20,640
Speaker 2: lady's yard and we found like thirty dead baby.

162
00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:23,000
Speaker 1: Skeletons, and this is go on.

163
00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:26,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, but my argument is every now and then I

164
00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,320
Speaker 2: run across like shit that seems satanic, panicky, where I'm like, oh,

165
00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:33,360
Speaker 2: that was probably real though, and humans do all kinds

166
00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:39,560
Speaker 2: of shit. Why aren't there more real weird fucked up cults?

167
00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:40,920
Speaker 2: There are real ones? Yeah?

168
00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:44,520
Speaker 1: Right, Oh yeah, I mean there's clearly a lot, based

169
00:08:44,520 --> 00:08:47,280
Speaker 1: on how many documentaries Hulu is putting out about them,

170
00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,319
Speaker 1: you know, which is Men's the Real totally Find Sex

171
00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:54,440
Speaker 1: in the City that was directed at Sophie, that was

172
00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:59,120
Speaker 1: a Sophie targeting. Okay, I have two answers, and one

173
00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:02,839
Speaker 1: is executive right where if you if you look at

174
00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:05,520
Speaker 1: you know, I would imagine so much of the subject

175
00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:07,880
Speaker 1: matter that you've researched in your life and on this show.

176
00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:12,640
Speaker 1: Like when there are major conspiracies in the United States,

177
00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:16,160
Speaker 1: it seems like generally they're being carried out by the

178
00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:20,440
Speaker 1: government by people technically charged totally and that they're you know,

179
00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,040
Speaker 1: writing stuff down that they shouldn't be writing down. They've

180
00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:26,920
Speaker 1: got internal memos and triplicate you know that like if

181
00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:29,240
Speaker 1: they try and cover something up, they do it badly.

182
00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:34,680
Speaker 1: Someone tells everything to a stripper who he keeps talking

183
00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:37,400
Speaker 1: to about all his problems for some reason.

184
00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:38,520
Speaker 2: You know that like the.

185
00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:42,960
Speaker 1: People who carry out really bad stuff. I think, especially

186
00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,680
Speaker 1: in actual conspiracies that we know about, you know, like

187
00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:48,640
Speaker 1: and stuff at like you know, pharma and big tobacco

188
00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:53,600
Speaker 1: and everything too, Like there are records left and it's

189
00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:58,560
Speaker 1: usually not that difficult to find somebody to snitch, right,

190
00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:01,400
Speaker 1: And so I think that it's if you're talking about

191
00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:05,120
Speaker 1: organized Satanism of the kind that the Satanic Panic was

192
00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:09,800
Speaker 1: specifically envisioning, which is like certainly taking some elements of like,

193
00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:12,320
Speaker 1: you know, stuff that Alister Crowley was writing about, and

194
00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:14,720
Speaker 1: some aspects of things that people really do. And of

195
00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:19,880
Speaker 1: course Anton LaVey's Church of Satan was a very big

196
00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:21,800
Speaker 1: news item in the late sixties, and he also had

197
00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,720
Speaker 1: a naked lady on the altar and performed Satanic weddings.

198
00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,959
Speaker 1: But like we just run into I mean, I think

199
00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:29,760
Speaker 1: a lot about the fact that it was like a

200
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:33,640
Speaker 1: major problem continually at the People's temple, and eventually jonestown

201
00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:35,560
Speaker 1: of like how are we going to feed all these people?

202
00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:38,280
Speaker 1: We have a lot of people here they get hungry,

203
00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:40,679
Speaker 1: we need a certain amount of food, and that at

204
00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:42,559
Speaker 1: the end they were running out of food for people,

205
00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:47,520
Speaker 1: and that was a big catalyst in you know, Kim

206
00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:51,880
Speaker 1: Jones deciding that he couldn't whoa keep handling this responsibility

207
00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:53,360
Speaker 1: and therefore everybody had to die.

208
00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Ultimate Family Annihilator.

209
00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,080
Speaker 1: Yes, I really think that. I think that it. It

210
00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:03,720
Speaker 1: seems like pretty much the same thing on a larger scale,

211
00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:06,640
Speaker 1: and I thought about that a lot in this process,

212
00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:08,480
Speaker 1: and so I think it's the issue of just like

213
00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:12,600
Speaker 1: believing in these large scale cults and conspiracies that leave

214
00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,320
Speaker 1: no trace, is giving people, especially white guys, way too

215
00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:21,120
Speaker 1: much credit. And b because the basic promise in these

216
00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:26,120
Speaker 1: stories if you accuse someone of witchcraft or satanism, I

217
00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:28,600
Speaker 1: don't think has ever been lived up to because I

218
00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,960
Speaker 1: think the idea of the draw of Satanism is that

219
00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:34,560
Speaker 1: God is this very distant figure who like sometimes you

220
00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:38,200
Speaker 1: kind of like feel is there like a presence and

221
00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,320
Speaker 1: you're like, thank you, that was great. That's the most

222
00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:43,520
Speaker 1: I'm gonna expect from you, or he'll you know, or

223
00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:48,559
Speaker 1: Jesus will show up on an English muffin or something sometimes.

224
00:11:48,600 --> 00:11:51,080
Speaker 1: But the idea that like you can just like say like,

225
00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:53,920
Speaker 1: come on, Satan, I want to send sell my soul

226
00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:55,800
Speaker 1: to you, and he'll show up and be like, hello,

227
00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:58,320
Speaker 1: I'm here, I'm in the flesh, Satan. I showed up

228
00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,720
Speaker 1: because you asked me to. If he doesn't actually do that,

229
00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:03,960
Speaker 1: and I think that that ruins a lot of the

230
00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:05,280
Speaker 1: premise of these things.

231
00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:08,880
Speaker 2: That makes sense, yeah, because if you're like I want

232
00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:12,120
Speaker 2: this instant satisfaction and then it doesn't happen, I could

233
00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:15,480
Speaker 2: see that. I do run across every now and then

234
00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:18,360
Speaker 2: these ones that seem to be real, or at least

235
00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:21,240
Speaker 2: I don't find anyone arguing that they're not real, even

236
00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:23,400
Speaker 2: though they hit all these same parts. And I did

237
00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:25,280
Speaker 2: not incorporate in this script. So I'm just gonna make

238
00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:27,000
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say these things happening at all the dates

239
00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:31,160
Speaker 2: wrong and like one of the only witch burnings in Ireland,

240
00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:33,680
Speaker 2: because we did an episode on the witch burnings and

241
00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:38,600
Speaker 2: it wasn't what a lot of Marxist feminism claims, and

242
00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:40,760
Speaker 2: specifically the witch burnings were like kind of a pissing

243
00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:43,720
Speaker 2: match between the Protestants and the Catholics to capture popular

244
00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:45,120
Speaker 2: like buy.

245
00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:47,000
Speaker 1: In it always is isn't it.

246
00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, So you like don't have witch burnings in

247
00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:53,760
Speaker 2: fully Catholic countries. But it's not because the Catholics were

248
00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:56,200
Speaker 2: right not down to do it. Catholics did about as

249
00:12:56,200 --> 00:12:58,840
Speaker 2: many witch burnings as Protestants. It was that in a

250
00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:01,439
Speaker 2: fully Catholic country, there's like no reason to like play

251
00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:02,000
Speaker 2: to the masses.

252
00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:04,600
Speaker 1: You're like, we don't feel they need to own any Protestants.

253
00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:07,119
Speaker 1: So I don't know, witches just keep.

254
00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:12,720
Speaker 2: Just keep witching up, keep medicine right and like and so.

255
00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:15,280
Speaker 2: But one of the only witch birdides in Ireland was

256
00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:19,720
Speaker 2: this woman who ran an inn who was was killing

257
00:13:19,960 --> 00:13:23,680
Speaker 2: men in order to like take their property and like

258
00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:26,520
Speaker 2: build a sort of in empire and shit, and like

259
00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,480
Speaker 2: eventually ended up like escaping over to England and no

260
00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:33,720
Speaker 2: one ever heard from her again, and she probably was

261
00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:38,720
Speaker 2: doing it. It is presented as truth that she was

262
00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:42,559
Speaker 2: like keeping body parts pickled in the basement and like

263
00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:47,120
Speaker 2: fucking people dressed up as the Devil in the crossroads

264
00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:50,840
Speaker 2: at night and shape you know, and like weird kinky

265
00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:51,560
Speaker 2: furry shit.

266
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,040
Speaker 1: I can I'm willing to believe a person would do.

267
00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:56,800
Speaker 2: That, especially when it's about power, right, right.

268
00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:59,800
Speaker 1: They have furry costumes that the spirit Halloween story now.

269
00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:01,960
Speaker 1: But basically, you know, it's like that's good, that's the

270
00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:05,720
Speaker 1: it is, and they're very economical. But yeah, that's I

271
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,320
Speaker 1: think I think we agree. I think I understand what

272
00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:12,480
Speaker 1: you're saying that, like people are capable of like remarkably

273
00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:16,480
Speaker 1: strange behavior. And I think it's when I think it's

274
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:20,560
Speaker 1: when we can hear these stories and conspiracy theories imagined

275
00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:24,200
Speaker 1: by like a fundamentally conventional person or a very repressed

276
00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:26,600
Speaker 1: person who's trying to think of what strange people would do,

277
00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,320
Speaker 1: that you're like, that's not really.

278
00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:34,720
Speaker 2: It totally totally. Whereas like there were all kinds of weird, kinky,

279
00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:36,840
Speaker 2: heretical sex cults in the Middle Ages.

280
00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:41,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, they don't pass the time somehow, right.

281
00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:45,920
Speaker 2: They probably weren't sacrificing each other, right, and they did

282
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:48,080
Speaker 2: it was like once, you know, like that guy just

283
00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:48,960
Speaker 2: kept talking.

284
00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:51,680
Speaker 1: Because to quote the Godfather, blood is a big expense.

285
00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:52,040
Speaker 3: You know.

286
00:14:53,120 --> 00:15:01,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've broken Sophie again. Okay. I So this ties

287
00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:04,400
Speaker 2: well into the subject of this week's episode, which we

288
00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:09,360
Speaker 2: are finally going to bring up. So I want to

289
00:15:09,400 --> 00:15:14,160
Speaker 2: talk about the occult, the Illuminati, Freemasonry, all that shit

290
00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:19,280
Speaker 2: because I want to like talk about how it ties

291
00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:21,360
Speaker 2: into modern leftism.

292
00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's I'm here, I'm ready.

293
00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,840
Speaker 2: This is maybe the worst week in all of history

294
00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:29,160
Speaker 2: to do this, because this is the week as we

295
00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:33,280
Speaker 2: record it, where people are like the conspiracy of Antifa

296
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:34,160
Speaker 2: or whatever.

297
00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:40,600
Speaker 1: Right, But Sophie, we had a synchronized Eh, you know,

298
00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:44,760
Speaker 1: it was really dreamy. As Harry Goldenblatt once said to

299
00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:45,800
Speaker 1: Charlotte Yorke.

300
00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:51,120
Speaker 2: It's never a bad week to tell the truth.

301
00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:54,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, and uh, you're the best.

302
00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,680
Speaker 2: Trump is saying, Oh, Antifa has connections to MS thirteen

303
00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:01,920
Speaker 2: and international drug cartels, and we're paid to protest, and

304
00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:05,680
Speaker 2: we're super well funded. And these are lies, right, These are.

305
00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,400
Speaker 1: As if the Nazis weren't all on math.

306
00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:16,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, And there are lies and not misconceptions. Because I

307
00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:20,200
Speaker 2: can't believe that they actually think these things. I just

308
00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:23,440
Speaker 2: know that they want people to believe these things. And

309
00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:25,640
Speaker 2: this is going to kind of tie into what we're

310
00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:31,480
Speaker 2: talking about today about how like one, okay, well I'll

311
00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:35,160
Speaker 2: get to it. Protesters an't getting paid to protest, this

312
00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:41,680
Speaker 2: is fake. But we can trace modern leftist movements back

313
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,760
Speaker 2: to Freemasonry and just for fun, even though they only

314
00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:49,880
Speaker 2: lasted about ten years. The fucking Illuminati, the actual Illuminati

315
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:50,880
Speaker 2: an organization to.

316
00:16:50,920 --> 00:16:53,520
Speaker 1: Hear about the actual Illuminati. There's nothing I want more

317
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:54,080
Speaker 1: right now.

318
00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:57,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, they existed for like about ten years or so

319
00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,040
Speaker 2: in Bavaria what's now Germany. Before, as I was.

320
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:05,040
Speaker 1: Saying, organization is hard. It's hard to keep a group going.

321
00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:06,160
Speaker 1: People get bored.

322
00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:09,520
Speaker 2: You know, well, what's interesting? Okay. One of the main

323
00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:11,760
Speaker 2: premises that I'm going to build up to is that

324
00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:14,560
Speaker 2: we look at conspiracies always wrong. We're like, all the

325
00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:18,800
Speaker 2: conspiracy of the powerful. When you're powerful, you don't conspire,

326
00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:22,200
Speaker 2: You just douche right. Yeah, when we're like, i mean

327
00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:25,679
Speaker 2: like take Epstein, right, you're like, oh, when people are

328
00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:28,600
Speaker 2: like the secret pedophile ring, you're like, no, it's it's open,

329
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:30,040
Speaker 2: we know about it. It happened.

330
00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:34,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's ketchup. We're too powerful to prosecute. And also,

331
00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:38,879
Speaker 1: no one cares about young women, so it's all fine,

332
00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:40,000
Speaker 1: let's cackle together.

333
00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:45,320
Speaker 2: And so secret societies by and large would be against power.

334
00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:50,359
Speaker 2: They would be the revolutionaries form secret societies. So the

335
00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:56,200
Speaker 2: Illuminati fell apart because it was repressed, right, because it

336
00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:59,399
Speaker 2: was a revolutionary organization. It didn't want to control the world.

337
00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:01,600
Speaker 2: It sought the leveling of the world, which is like

338
00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,879
Speaker 2: kind of the Christian framework around like bring up the

339
00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:06,840
Speaker 2: poor and bring down the rich, right, you know.

340
00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:11,600
Speaker 1: And that's so I feel like kind of like Cromwellian

341
00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:14,040
Speaker 1: in a way I wouldn't have expected.

342
00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:15,720
Speaker 2: I know. And I get like really annoyed by this part.

343
00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:17,879
Speaker 2: Great because I hate Cromwell so much that I like,

344
00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:19,760
Speaker 2: I'm gonna do well.

345
00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:22,640
Speaker 1: He was a very unfun person heat among other things,

346
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,280
Speaker 1: genocide of the Irish, and I was gonna I would

347
00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,840
Speaker 1: see what sticks in my mind. And this shows how

348
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:31,199
Speaker 1: incomplete my historical education is, is that I had no

349
00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:34,160
Speaker 1: memory of that. But I'm like, he canceled Christmas.

350
00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:36,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, totally, that's terrible, right.

351
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:39,680
Speaker 1: But yes, the genocide of Irish people is much worse.

352
00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:41,480
Speaker 2: I mean these are tied into each other, right, because

353
00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:43,199
Speaker 2: it was like an anti Catholic thing and like an

354
00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:44,680
Speaker 2: anti like paganism thing.

355
00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:47,640
Speaker 1: Hm hmm. He's like, you guys aren't executing enough witches.

356
00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:49,200
Speaker 1: And I know totally.

357
00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:54,639
Speaker 2: So people think that the Illuminati or the Boogeyman for

358
00:18:55,480 --> 00:19:00,879
Speaker 2: the exact opposite reason, right, make you think, makes you

359
00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:08,560
Speaker 2: wonder was this reversal on purpose anyway? So secret societies

360
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,159
Speaker 2: and shit the subject of today's matter. But do you

361
00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:15,240
Speaker 2: know what isn't secret? There we go, yeah, what is

362
00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:18,920
Speaker 2: right out in the open, directly saying, hey, we're trying

363
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:24,920
Speaker 2: to control how you think it's advertising? Wow, and I

364
00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,600
Speaker 2: participate in it and not even like whatever, Just let's

365
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:38,440
Speaker 2: be honest about it. And that's what's happening now, and

366
00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:43,560
Speaker 2: we're back, all right. So it's a story about secret

367
00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:46,159
Speaker 2: I'm telling a story about secret societies and conspiracies in

368
00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:49,680
Speaker 2: the occult and these things, these ideas have been tied

369
00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:53,280
Speaker 2: together since kind of forever. As far as I can tell,

370
00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:55,879
Speaker 2: I haven't done a lot of the more like anthropological

371
00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:58,600
Speaker 2: level of research for this show, But as far as

372
00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:02,240
Speaker 2: I can tell, like secret societies complete with super secret secrets,

373
00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:05,600
Speaker 2: have existed all over the world and for all time

374
00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:07,840
Speaker 2: you got a society, there's people who are going to

375
00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:09,399
Speaker 2: be like, yeah, but do you want to know the

376
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:12,600
Speaker 2: real stuff? You gotta like, come hang out in this

377
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,080
Speaker 2: tent while we hit you with sticks and then we'll

378
00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,800
Speaker 2: tell you the real stuff. And not know what college is?

379
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:21,440
Speaker 1: Isn't it like you go to college and then you're like, hey,

380
00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:24,960
Speaker 1: let's stay up late in the dorm common area watching Gatica.

381
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:26,280
Speaker 1: That's what I did.

382
00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:30,840
Speaker 2: I mean, honestly, like the way that education works probably

383
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:33,720
Speaker 2: ties into all of this stuff too, certainly, Like I agree,

384
00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:39,159
Speaker 2: secret societies become fraternal societies become fraternities and things. I

385
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,440
Speaker 2: didn't trace that particular lineage, but I don't feel like

386
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:42,320
Speaker 2: I'm out on that.

387
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:44,920
Speaker 1: With covering up the death of someone who got drunk

388
00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:46,080
Speaker 1: and fell down the stairs.

389
00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:49,199
Speaker 2: Wait, is that a specific thing or is it? Well

390
00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:49,480
Speaker 2: in a.

391
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:51,720
Speaker 1: Frat context, yeah, yeah, yeah.

392
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:56,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and everyone kind of wants to be initiated into

393
00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:58,800
Speaker 2: the cool thing that tells them the cool truths of

394
00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:02,879
Speaker 2: the world. And this is even happens like in ways

395
00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:05,120
Speaker 2: that we think are like totally fine, where you're like, oh,

396
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:07,800
Speaker 2: I joined this social movement, now I know the real

397
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:09,119
Speaker 2: thing about what's happening in the.

398
00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:11,720
Speaker 1: World totally, or like I don't know when you just

399
00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:15,640
Speaker 1: like I don't know. Humans just like love to solve

400
00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:17,679
Speaker 1: puzzles and we love to feel like we figured it

401
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:19,720
Speaker 1: all out, and like even if you just you know,

402
00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:22,760
Speaker 1: it's like people start a new diet and they're like,

403
00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:25,719
Speaker 1: let me tell you about beans have you thought about beans?

404
00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 2: Yes? Yeah, no, tell me more about your bean called

405
00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:29,720
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah.

406
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:30,720
Speaker 1: My Lord and Savior beans.

407
00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:33,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, totally. It's like every now and then people

408
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:35,800
Speaker 2: are like, oh, what therapy worked for you? And I'm like, look,

409
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:38,040
Speaker 2: this is going to sound like you know when you

410
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:40,280
Speaker 2: meet someone who's into a martial art and they're convinced

411
00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:44,320
Speaker 2: their martial arts the best. That's how therapy is. I

412
00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:48,440
Speaker 2: think my therapy is the best because it saved my life, right,

413
00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:51,400
Speaker 2: I acknowledge, But not everyone wants to do it.

414
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,399
Speaker 1: Can't make people do capuar. You just can't.

415
00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:59,000
Speaker 2: No, I tried once. I not built for that.

416
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:02,119
Speaker 1: Val I'm certainly not.

417
00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:05,520
Speaker 2: So there's a bunch of secret societies and shit in

418
00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:08,440
Speaker 2: ancient Greece. They're all over the place, and I'm not

419
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,160
Speaker 2: going to get two into the Greek ones, but these

420
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:13,199
Speaker 2: are some of the ones that people orient. Salism is

421
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 2: going to be totally tied up in all of this too,

422
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:17,760
Speaker 2: where people are like, here's the secret knowledge from the

423
00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,920
Speaker 2: far past in a different culture, you know, a long.

424
00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:23,520
Speaker 1: Time ago, in a galaxy far far.

425
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:29,439
Speaker 2: Away, right exactly. I mean I basically do that with

426
00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:30,360
Speaker 2: Tolkien and Middle Earth.

427
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:36,600
Speaker 1: But yeah, so Tolkien vulcans. You know, whatever you can get.

428
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:43,000
Speaker 2: Any so you've got the illusion mysteries. You ever heard

429
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:46,040
Speaker 2: of these? I had not, no what is this? This

430
00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:50,120
Speaker 2: is a secret religious right and this is okay. There

431
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:53,960
Speaker 2: actually was a secret religious right in in Greece, ancient Greece,

432
00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:56,399
Speaker 2: called the Illusian mysteries. And the thing is that no

433
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,800
Speaker 2: one actually knows what was involved. So people will be like,

434
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:02,600
Speaker 2: we know, if you join us and get to the

435
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:05,480
Speaker 2: thirty second or you'll get to know what the illusion

436
00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:09,680
Speaker 2: mysteries are. But there was a pagan or a pre

437
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:16,320
Speaker 2: Christian Greek right or well anyway where people would march

438
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:19,200
Speaker 2: from Athens to another city and then like they would

439
00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 2: do super secret, cool pagany things that later Christians condemned,

440
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,640
Speaker 2: like but we don't actually know what they are, and

441
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:29,200
Speaker 2: they at one point you like bathe in the sea

442
00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,560
Speaker 2: and then you would have fast for three days and

443
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,640
Speaker 2: then you would do the super secret mystery thing, which

444
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:38,440
Speaker 2: probably wasn't like human sacrifice. But actually I mean also,

445
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:40,760
Speaker 2: if you go far enough in the past, basically every culture, right,

446
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:44,240
Speaker 2: a lot a lot of cultures are doing that too. Yeah,

447
00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:46,080
Speaker 2: and people are going to be obsessed with the illusion

448
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,800
Speaker 2: mysteries forever, and then you've got a more proper cult.

449
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 2: I did not know that I bid off more than

450
00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:54,960
Speaker 2: I could chew when I tried to add a couple

451
00:23:55,040 --> 00:24:01,359
Speaker 2: paragraphs about the pit, about Pythagoras, pythagon the math guy, Yeah,

452
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 2: the triangle guy, mister triangle himself. Yeah, did you know

453
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,119
Speaker 2: he was more of a cult leader than a mathematician. No,

454
00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 2: But I mean, I.

455
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 1: Guess it can't have taken him that long to figure

456
00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:14,040
Speaker 1: out triangles, and it makes sense that he did something

457
00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:17,800
Speaker 1: else with his life. But also well that we're connecting

458
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:18,520
Speaker 1: this to algebra.

459
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:24,399
Speaker 2: Algebra is tied through this whole thing secret society and

460
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:28,680
Speaker 2: magic and the fucking modern left, and didn't.

461
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,800
Speaker 1: Take him that long to figure out.

462
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 2: Trying, which is always, you know, the strongest shape, which

463
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:39,720
Speaker 2: is what you can tell people to try and convince

464
00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 2: him to be in a throutle.

465
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 1: So exactly, that's what you say.

466
00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:47,879
Speaker 2: So the math guy, Pythagorast he probably didn't invent the

467
00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,359
Speaker 2: Pythagoram theorem. Like that was like a thing that like

468
00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:54,119
Speaker 2: god damn it, India knew about it, and like some

469
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:56,120
Speaker 2: other places that were like Easter to where he lived

470
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:59,399
Speaker 2: knew about it. But I again, I did not know

471
00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:02,120
Speaker 2: what a rabbit I was biting off, So I only

472
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:04,400
Speaker 2: know that the cliffs notes of this particular man.

473
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 1: But I don't want to anger the Alquebra community.

474
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,560
Speaker 2: I know modern Pythagoreans will come after me. For a while,

475
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 2: he started like a school and that was actually pretty cool. Okay,

476
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,639
Speaker 2: he goes to Egypt and he learns math there and

477
00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 2: that's cool and good and that seems to be real.

478
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 2: There's other people who are like and then he went

479
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 2: off elsewhere and people are like less certain about that.

480
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 2: People tend to be like No, he went to Egypt,

481
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,639
Speaker 2: that's where he learned his shit. But then he started

482
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:29,719
Speaker 2: this cult after the school worked. But he was like, ah,

483
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:31,440
Speaker 2: that's not enough for me. I'm not in control enough.

484
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:34,159
Speaker 2: He starts a cult. They're wacky vegetarians. If you have

485
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 2: your cool people bingo out people who are vegetarian in

486
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:41,160
Speaker 2: history for no reason, here you go. They were into

487
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:45,800
Speaker 2: egalitarianism ostensibly, and so I should. And they wanted to

488
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,320
Speaker 2: believe that you could understand the universe with numbers, and

489
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:50,560
Speaker 2: they also as expressed through music. So this is a

490
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 2: really rand of something. I guess I agree. That's the

491
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:55,240
Speaker 2: problem with a lot of the shit for me.

492
00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:58,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, a lot of cults. You're like, well, they

493
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 1: have their moments, but yeah, And the only reason I

494
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,920
Speaker 1: think I disliked the Pythagorans is that there was this

495
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:09,040
Speaker 1: like revolt and then the Pythagoras threw down. There's like

496
00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:11,160
Speaker 1: a thousand of them living in this cult and they.

497
00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:12,719
Speaker 2: Go throw down, and I'm like, all right, all right,

498
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 2: you got revolutionary egalitarian vegetarians who are into like music

499
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 2: and the divine numbers. I'm like, I'm this is what

500
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:22,359
Speaker 2: I would be doing, right. And then but then the

501
00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:24,879
Speaker 2: town of Croton where they were, was like, all right,

502
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 2: now we're going to be a democracy, and Pythagoras was.

503
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:33,160
Speaker 1: Like, Hudson, what's that Croton on Hudson making a Hudson

504
00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 1: Valley joke? Very happy with myself.

505
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 2: To fun, I was I thought you were going to

506
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 2: go for a Cruton joke.

507
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:44,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that that occurred to me too.

508
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 2: So Croton a place that I think still exists. I

509
00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:49,439
Speaker 2: don't know, Yes, actually it does because I got some

510
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 2: of this from.

511
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:53,720
Speaker 1: There, like they got like an outlet there. Yeah.

512
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:56,240
Speaker 2: The Pythagoras is like, no way, y'all aren't allowed to

513
00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:00,439
Speaker 2: be democratic. I could not find more about this time.

514
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 2: This is the last part of what I researched before. Okay,

515
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 2: so that people of Crowtown set his house on fire

516
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,200
Speaker 2: and drove his entire cult out and like maybe killed

517
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 2: a bunch of him and maybe killed him, but maybe

518
00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 2: he died later and people don't.

519
00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 1: Know that'll happen. Wow, tough breaks for Pythagoras.

520
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:17,479
Speaker 2: A little early wake up.

521
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:22,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I say leco vibes for sure. Yeah, huh man.

522
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:27,959
Speaker 2: But people have always been suckers for anch and divine wisdom.

523
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 2: It is not hard to convince people that math and

524
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 2: fractals and shit are divine because the kind of are

525
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:39,680
Speaker 2: and if people if shit was written a thousand years ago,

526
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:41,720
Speaker 2: people are going to think it's really cool. And I

527
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 2: don't make the rules. So some of what I thought

528
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,439
Speaker 2: that all of occultism was entirely fake, kind of like

529
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 2: how modern Druidism has no actual connection to Druidic traditions,

530
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,159
Speaker 2: which people will get angry about me now, but I'm

531
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,840
Speaker 2: also gonna probably do an episode about this for Spooky Weeky.

532
00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:01,919
Speaker 2: Either change my mind or people will be even more

533
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,160
Speaker 2: mad at me. But whatever, But some of this shit

534
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 2: actually is old. Take, for example, the Corpus Hermeticum. You

535
00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:15,480
Speaker 2: heard of this one, mm hmmmm, Sophe has I think

536
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,600
Speaker 2: Sophie actually knows more of this shit coming into it

537
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 2: than I did, because secretly, well, I won't tell the

538
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,480
Speaker 2: world about the hikes in the woods that Sophie and

539
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 2: I have taken discussing occultism anyway, what are you talking about, Oh,

540
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 2: just leave all that out. It's fun. So Corpus her

541
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 2: medicum is where hermetic magic comes from, okay, and the

542
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,000
Speaker 2: Gnostics and shit are all into this stuff. I'm not

543
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 2: covering gnosticism whatever. I've seen a lot of different dates

544
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 2: about when the Corpus her Medicam was written, but it

545
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 2: legitimately is from the early Christian period, is legitimately from

546
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 2: the first couple centuries of CE.

547
00:28:57,280 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 1: A lot of this.

548
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:01,080
Speaker 3: Stuff, it's like, that's the best you can do timeline wise.

549
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's actually what's so impressive. I expected, like

550
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:06,760
Speaker 2: a lot of the shit we're going to get into

551
00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 2: later is like fakes made up in the fifteenth century,

552
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 2: sixteenth century, or twentieth century. This one was like, in

553
00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 2: a weird way, it was kind of a fake made

554
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 2: up in the third century because The early Christians thought

555
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:22,200
Speaker 2: it was from like before Moses, and that's part of

556
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 2: why it still exists is they didn't burn it because

557
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 2: they were like, ah, it's like part of our history,

558
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:31,520
Speaker 2: you know. It's thirteen essays about the Nature of God

559
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 2: written in Egypt and ascribed to an author called Hermes

560
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: trice Missegis or thrice Greatest Hermes. I really like that.

561
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 2: What a fucking pen name. Yeah, and Hermes was the

562
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:48,920
Speaker 2: name of a Greek god. So it's basically been like

563
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 2: I'm the God of wisdom or the messenger of the gods. Whatever.

564
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,400
Speaker 2: The early Christians thought these books were way older, and

565
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 2: so they didn't get burned, and they also were like,

566
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:02,200
Speaker 2: all right, Hermes is this important stage probably, but it's

567
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 2: actually was written by an anonymous person who was like,

568
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:09,280
Speaker 2: I'm being God, you know. But Hermes in this teaches

569
00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 2: that there's only one God, and not in a really

570
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 2: Christian way, more in a pantheistic like God is in

571
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 2: everything way. Hermeticism is kind of fractal. It teaches the

572
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 2: humans or microcosms of the universe as above, so below

573
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 2: is like it's big famous slogan that still exists.

574
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,800
Speaker 1: That saw a horror movie called that once. Ah, that's

575
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:34,040
Speaker 1: as fun as much because I know.

576
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 2: My deepest cut. I want to make a horror movie

577
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:43,280
Speaker 2: called a Body without Organs, which is a fucking delusion

578
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 2: Guitari reference of like.

579
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 1: I like that.

580
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. Also a hermetic thing is all is one? And

581
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 2: I like that because I think it means that doctor

582
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:04,200
Speaker 2: Bronner's is onto some occult ship.

583
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean he's a uh, it's just a

584
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 1: fascinating guy in every way. It's always good reading material.

585
00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 2: Everything is internally related by light or energy. God and

586
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 2: its creation are the same thing. We are divine. Everything

587
00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:23,160
Speaker 2: we create is the one.

588
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 1: Don't get it in your eyes.

589
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,160
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, use it as toothpaste.

590
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,320
Speaker 1: I've tried that. It never worked out for me.

591
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 2: I didn't try it. You are a braver person than me,

592
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:36,040
Speaker 2: and I like Bronner's.

593
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 1: I'm a little bit too trusting.

594
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 5: Absolutely gonna say it's not bravery.

595
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 2: I also have an important theory, though I relied on

596
00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:51,640
Speaker 2: Doctor Bronner's as a traveler as an ogle where I

597
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:53,600
Speaker 2: didn't have a house, and I would go to people's

598
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 2: houses because I have this theory that all Doctor Bronner's

599
00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 2: soap is communal and so if you take a shower

600
00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 2: at someone's house, you can't use their like shampoo or

601
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 2: conditioner without asking. You can use their broners without asking.

602
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 3: You can without asking.

603
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 1: Magpie exception is eternal, absolutely none exclamation point exactly. Yeah, And.

604
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:22,959
Speaker 2: People read this shit. Okay. So these books, they were

605
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:26,720
Speaker 2: written in the three hundreds or whatever, they exploded onto

606
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 2: the scene in Europe and kind of created the fucking Renaissance.

607
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:36,120
Speaker 2: Someone had to in the late fifteenth and early sixteenth century.

608
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 2: It arrived on the scene the same time as fucking

609
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 2: algebra and Euclid's Elements of Geometry and the Pythagoram theorem.

610
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 2: Triangles everywhere, just fucking triangles. For days. Math is truth.

611
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 2: It underlies everything. And people went wild. They were like,

612
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:56,400
Speaker 2: oh my god, the ancient world is full of wisdom

613
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:59,760
Speaker 2: and math. And this makes you makes me at least

614
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 2: more sympathetic to the orientalism of the early Renaissance mind right,

615
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,640
Speaker 2: because they're like, oh, actually, if we look at like,

616
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 2: you know, go over south and east from here a lot,

617
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,440
Speaker 2: that's where the smart shit is. They knew all this

618
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 2: shit a long ass time ago. We're just learning it right.

619
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:22,280
Speaker 2: And this math that they learned help them do amazing

620
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 2: shit like build vaulted cathedrals. Yeah, and so much shit,

621
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 2: of course, comes from the fucking Enlightenment, right, and you

622
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,720
Speaker 2: get the scientific Revolution, you get the Western idea of

623
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 2: the republic, you get modern leftism.

624
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 1: And you also had air balloons.

625
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,240
Speaker 2: That's true. We actually covered on air balloons a whole

626
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 2: bunch recently on our on our leftists invented everything thing

627
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 2: about air mail and na dare the socialists who invented

628
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 2: air mail during the Siege of Paris.

629
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: Okay, I gotta listen to that, My god, that's amazing.

630
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 2: It's the same episode where I talk about how an

631
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:01,280
Speaker 2: anarchists invented foosball.

632
00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 1: That's the America anarchist one, right. Everyone has their arms

633
00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 1: cut off and their legs fused into a little flapper,

634
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:15,920
Speaker 1: and then they're all mounted on a steel rod.

635
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 2: It was made for kids who were wounded during the

636
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 2: Spanish Civil War. They could disgust saying.

637
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 1: You shouldn't do. They were wounded because they were losers.

638
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:35,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, fucking losers. Nicholas Copernicus, Nicolaus whatever, I

639
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:38,160
Speaker 2: don't care, was the guy who presented the current model

640
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:42,960
Speaker 2: of the solar system. The heliocentric model, and is sometimes

641
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 2: called the guy who started the scientific revolution, and who

642
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:51,320
Speaker 2: does he cite in his writing, But Thrice's greatest hermes

643
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 2: as does like all the other scientists with names, and

644
00:34:56,200 --> 00:35:00,200
Speaker 2: I pronounced like a discard, Thrice's greatest hermi is this

645
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:04,359
Speaker 2: just like poetry, just feels so good to say, I know,

646
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 2: I know someone I'm sure is going to do a

647
00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 2: music or writing project under that name, and it'll be

648
00:35:11,560 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 2: either really actually, if it's music, it'll be really good,

649
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 2: and if it's writings can be really bad. That's my prediction.

650
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 2: And all of these things, this like art and magic

651
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 2: and science and shit, they weren't seen as all that

652
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:31,280
Speaker 2: different from each other. Recently, we did episodes about evolution

653
00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:33,560
Speaker 2: and mutual aid, and we talked about how the modern

654
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 2: idea of breaking science into discrete fields is kind of

655
00:35:37,080 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 2: new fangled, but even splitting science from art is a

656
00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:44,600
Speaker 2: little bit new fangled. Take for example, this is my

657
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:48,800
Speaker 2: biggest surprise that came out of my research this week. Memory,

658
00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:50,360
Speaker 2: Well besides the fact that I'm going to claim that

659
00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 2: Mozart was an anarchist, but I'll get to that later.

660
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:58,800
Speaker 2: So Memory, you just tease the audience a little oh yeah, yeah, no,

661
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 2: I'm trying to get good of my job and wow,

662
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 2: one of these days, one of these days, and memory

663
00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 2: feels like a really concrete, specific field of study. Right.

664
00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 2: You're like, I don't think about memory very often, which

665
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:13,800
Speaker 2: I should think about it more because I have a

666
00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:14,680
Speaker 2: very bad one.

667
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:18,480
Speaker 3: I have a fantastic memory. It's amazing and horrible.

668
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 2: See I wonder. Okay, there's a tangent. But at some

669
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 2: point I was like, oh, I'm just really bad at

670
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:27,840
Speaker 2: remembering stuff. And my friend was like, do you take notes?

671
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 2: And I was like no, I'm an art school dropout.

672
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:30,800
Speaker 2: I don't know how to take notes. I don't know

673
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 2: how to study. And they're like, you don't remember things

674
00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 2: because you don't take notes, and you hit it. My

675
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:39,200
Speaker 2: brain hit a saturation point.

676
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:41,160
Speaker 3: What kind of a learner are you? Are you someone

677
00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 3: who has to like I.

678
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 2: Have to do it. I have to do a thing

679
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,319
Speaker 2: and fail before I can learn the normal way.

680
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,320
Speaker 3: I'm an auditory learner, which is why this is my job.

681
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:52,000
Speaker 2: Sarah, Yeah, that makes sense.

682
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 1: Kind of learner are you?

683
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:54,960
Speaker 3: I think your visual.

684
00:36:56,320 --> 00:36:56,799
Speaker 2: I don't know.

685
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 1: I think I guess learned most things through like a

686
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 1: lot of repetition, and so I do agree with the

687
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:05,279
Speaker 1: note taking thing that like, if I just record like

688
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 1: a very short even like a bullet point diary of

689
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 1: like what happened that day, then like I'll remember a

690
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: lot more that I didn't write about because I have

691
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,040
Speaker 1: that queuing available to me. But my memory is also

692
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:17,319
Speaker 1: much worse than I used to be.

693
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:22,239
Speaker 2: But my argument here, if there's an esoteric knowledge that

694
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:26,720
Speaker 2: we can learn from the past, here, it's about how

695
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 2: these fucking Renaissance people and the weird occultists thought about

696
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 2: memory because they they like, memory is part of cognition

697
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:41,400
Speaker 2: and it's part of how we learn and understand things.

698
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:43,520
Speaker 2: So the people who are fighting for the scientific revolution,

699
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:46,560
Speaker 2: it wasn't just we need to gather all the information

700
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 2: and test hypotheses. It was about, like, how do we

701
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,400
Speaker 2: become smarter? And so they studied how to remember things

702
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 2: and they had it down to science only actually wow,

703
00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 2: thank you, thank you, But it wasn't a sence. It

704
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:01,960
Speaker 2: was more of an art. But actually they didn't distinguish

705
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 2: between these two things too hard. Are you familiar with

706
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 2: the idea of a memory palace? Yeah, I know of

707
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:12,359
Speaker 2: that from the Hannibal novels. Someone else I was talking

708
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:13,680
Speaker 2: to about this was like, oh, I know it from

709
00:38:13,719 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 2: some book. It was probably the Hannibal novels. Yeah, the

710
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:21,080
Speaker 2: memory palace. I haven't used this, but it's like you

711
00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 2: imagine a palace. You imagine you go in and there's

712
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 2: all these rooms, and you put the memories into specific places,

713
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:29,359
Speaker 2: and you can then go into the palace in your

714
00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 2: mind and go to those places and you can pull

715
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 2: out those memories. Does that seem like an accurate? Is

716
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:36,760
Speaker 2: how handled? Exactly?

717
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 1: It is how Hannibal did it. And of course his

718
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:40,840
Speaker 1: memory palace was very nice and had a lot of

719
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:45,200
Speaker 1: expensive stuff in it. And I've never really tried it,

720
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 1: but it's like there's stuff in my actual house that

721
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 1: I don't know where it is or that I own it.

722
00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 1: So I don't know how well that would work for me,

723
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:55,200
Speaker 1: but I love the concept.

724
00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 2: So this idea is way older than I would have realized.

725
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:03,839
Speaker 2: The idea of at least associating memory and ideas with

726
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,719
Speaker 2: visual and like objects and things goes back at least

727
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 2: to Greek and Roman times as the best way to

728
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,040
Speaker 2: remember complex thoughts like speeches and shit that they would

729
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:17,799
Speaker 2: give and so they would you would see the way

730
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 2: that they would write out their speeches would be like

731
00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:25,319
Speaker 2: an auditorium where all of the seats radiating out from

732
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:29,120
Speaker 2: the speaker place have like whole paragraphs in them.

733
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:29,680
Speaker 1: Wow.

734
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 2: And the Renaissance folks, they're like, all right, we're going

735
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 2: to associate complex ideas with visual images and art. And

736
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 2: they believed that the more transcendent piece of art, the

737
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:47,520
Speaker 2: more divine it was, like whether it was a piece

738
00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:50,719
Speaker 2: of art or architectural detail, the more you could use

739
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 2: it to trick yourself into remembering and thinking complex ideas. Hmm,

740
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,960
Speaker 2: And like, wow, is that this was my main mind blown?

741
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:00,719
Speaker 2: I like this.

742
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: I really like that.

743
00:40:03,160 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 2: I think about this, Like, there are movies that I

744
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 2: love so much that when I think about them, I

745
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:12,759
Speaker 2: immediately just with the title can remember all of these

746
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 2: complex thoughts about the world in philosophy and whatever that

747
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 2: I associate with those movies. Yeah, this is I mean,

748
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 2: this is fucking how memes work, right, right. And you

749
00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:30,000
Speaker 2: can also do this like through you know, it is easier.

750
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:32,560
Speaker 2: For example, I know I already did a Tolkien reference,

751
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:34,319
Speaker 2: but I'm to do another one. It is easier to

752
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:36,319
Speaker 2: just say we must throw the ring of power into

753
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:39,080
Speaker 2: the fires of Mount Doom and let that be shorthand

754
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:41,880
Speaker 2: for understanding that you can't wield authority in the quest

755
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:42,600
Speaker 2: for human liberty.

756
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,920
Speaker 1: Right wow? Yeah?

757
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:48,799
Speaker 2: And man, the other thing I like about this is

758
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:52,879
Speaker 2: to explain so much of late medieval manuscripts, Like if

759
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:55,799
Speaker 2: you spend, like normal person, spend all your time looking

760
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,880
Speaker 2: at all this like random old art and shit, it

761
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:02,839
Speaker 2: all has this like kind of like diagrammy feel right

762
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:05,880
Speaker 2: where it's like there's gonna be like weird wheels with

763
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 2: different fucking spokes that have different little tiny things written

764
00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:11,919
Speaker 2: in them and stuff. And the way that they would

765
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 2: diagram out ideas was really visual and not just like

766
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 2: a diagram, but like there'd be dragons in or woven

767
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,359
Speaker 2: into it and shit. Right, this is consciously designed so

768
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 2: that we can remember things better. God, I love that.

769
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:28,960
Speaker 1: I thought the dragons were just for fun, I know,

770
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:31,120
Speaker 1: I know, and they are fun.

771
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:31,839
Speaker 2: They are fun.

772
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so cool.

773
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 2: And do you know what else uses kinds of tricks

774
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:43,080
Speaker 2: to make us associate certain, say jingles with whole concepts. Hmm,

775
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 2: it's advertisers.

776
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, and it works.

777
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:48,120
Speaker 2: It does work.

778
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:53,880
Speaker 1: Eight hundred five eight day two, three hundred Empire.

779
00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:58,319
Speaker 2: Today and here's the rest of the ads besides the

780
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 2: ad for Empire, and we are back. And the thing

781
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 2: that people do with this is that's how you know,

782
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:16,839
Speaker 2: how like algebra is also like charted on X yaxes

783
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:21,000
Speaker 2: and shit, yeah, it's tied into this shit taxes. No,

784
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:24,040
Speaker 2: they're like, how else can we think about ideas in

785
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:27,080
Speaker 2: all of these different ways of looking at this stuff?

786
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,279
Speaker 1: And now they guess use it in New York magazine. God,

787
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 1: I love that I know.

788
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:36,840
Speaker 2: And people were perfectly fine calling all of this shit

789
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:40,440
Speaker 2: magic even as they're doing the scientific revolution. One of

790
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,240
Speaker 2: my main sources for this episode is a book called

791
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 2: Occult Features of Anarchism by Erico Lagalis, and in it

792
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 2: Erica writes, quote, the disenchantment we often hear about in

793
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:58,200
Speaker 2: relation to the European Enlightenment is but a tail. During

794
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 2: this time, magic was not in fact disqualified, but rather

795
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 2: came to an enjoy an increasingly acceptable, even revered status

796
00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:11,360
Speaker 2: due to connected advances in mathematics and related practical pursuits.

797
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 2: If observers are now inclined to separate out calculus from magic,

798
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:20,279
Speaker 2: it is only because we have defined magic in retrospect

799
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:24,120
Speaker 2: as activity that is useless unfounded and misguided.

800
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:29,200
Speaker 1: H Yeah, I love that.

801
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 2: Yeah. I got so excited about this. This was like

802
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:35,520
Speaker 2: what I needed to pull me out of. This was

803
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,719
Speaker 2: as you know, I.

804
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:43,759
Speaker 1: Mean really yeah. And also, you know, just sustained exposure

805
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:48,560
Speaker 1: to people who are so allergic to factual information is tough.

806
00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:52,880
Speaker 1: And I feel like this, I don't know is feeding

807
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:56,000
Speaker 1: my soul in that way. I find it so incredible.

808
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 1: How like we know the answers to so many mystery

809
00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:02,080
Speaker 1: and we know so much about the world, and so

810
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:04,000
Speaker 1: many people are like, no, don't tell me, don't tell

811
00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:05,880
Speaker 1: me anything. I don't want to know, and it's like, no,

812
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:07,920
Speaker 1: it's really cool though, and they're like I don't want

813
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:09,480
Speaker 1: to know anything.

814
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 2: Because they want the mystery or whatever.

815
00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:15,200
Speaker 1: No, well, I don't know because because there's like I

816
00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:19,400
Speaker 1: don't really I mean, you know, there's certainly information that

817
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,399
Speaker 1: I don't feel terribly motivated to put into my brain.

818
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: Like I don't know that much about math, but like

819
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 1: I love that other people know it, you know, totally. Yeah,

820
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:32,400
Speaker 1: And I feel like I don't know, Like I just

821
00:44:32,680 --> 00:44:34,560
Speaker 1: I have this on the brain because I guess recorded

822
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:38,879
Speaker 1: an episode of The Wonderful American Hysteria that maybe out

823
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:42,400
Speaker 1: when when this episode is out about spontaneous human combustion.

824
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 2: Is it real? Because is it not real?

825
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:47,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty much real. I mean the issue is

826
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:51,160
Speaker 1: like how do people conbust to begin with, and like

827
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 1: people have theorized supernatural reasons or kind of you know,

828
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 1: the idea that you because it's really the spontaneous part

829
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:01,960
Speaker 1: that's incorrect because it seems like it happens a lot

830
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:04,760
Speaker 1: to people who are like old, smoking and like falling

831
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 1: asleep smoking in bed while wearing nylon.

832
00:45:07,120 --> 00:45:08,359
Speaker 2: That makes sense stuff like that.

833
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, but there's also the issue of why some people

834
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:14,799
Speaker 1: are just so much more flammable than others apparently. And

835
00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 1: as to the reality of it, it's like, yeah, it's happened,

836
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:20,600
Speaker 1: Like it doesn't happen that much, but like people will

837
00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 1: just like go up in flames really really quickly and

838
00:45:24,520 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 1: then leave nothing behind but their feet, and that is

839
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:33,120
Speaker 1: a thing that happens, and the fact that we know

840
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:39,480
Speaker 1: some about it, there's still I think that gets understudied.

841
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,759
Speaker 1: It is great. It's like the more you know, the

842
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:46,879
Speaker 1: more mysteries that opens the doors to. So even if

843
00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 1: you want mystery, you find more mysteries by learning things

844
00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, and in the same way that math

845
00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:55,839
Speaker 1: and magic aren't diametrically opposed, like you're saying.

846
00:45:56,200 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 2: No, and I I love that shit. And I actually

847
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:00,960
Speaker 2: spontaneoushuman combustion is such a good example of like when

848
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:02,480
Speaker 2: I was a kid, I had those like time Life

849
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 2: books Mysteries of the Unknown books. Yeah, And it's funny

850
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:08,680
Speaker 2: because I look back on those and I'm like, oh,

851
00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:11,359
Speaker 2: that's probably like mostly just grifty shit, right, And it's

852
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:15,600
Speaker 2: like the equivalent of modern podcasts where people be like, like,

853
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 2: let me tell you about the Illuminati, and it's like,

854
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 2: oh my god, someone needs to do Illuminati and.

855
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:25,160
Speaker 1: Is we tried to bother some in an old sanatorium

856
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 1: and I don't think that electromagnetic interference from all of

857
00:46:30,600 --> 00:46:33,440
Speaker 1: our equipment could have possibly made this static.

858
00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:36,160
Speaker 2: Right totally and like and so that's like what those

859
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:38,520
Speaker 2: old time Life books felt to me. But knowing that

860
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:41,839
Speaker 2: somewhere in there kind of like in the Satanic Panic, Okay,

861
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:44,239
Speaker 2: another example that I'll use of the Satanic Panic. What

862
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 2: is real is And I'm not going to get the

863
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 2: dates on this, right, but Malcolm X was in a

864
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:52,279
Speaker 2: cult called the Nation of Islam before eventually he was like, oh,

865
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 2: this is a fucking cult. And then he got way

866
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:56,640
Speaker 2: more cool and radical in the.

867
00:46:56,640 --> 00:46:58,920
Speaker 1: Last couple of years had on my shoulders.

868
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:04,080
Speaker 2: And and the Nation of Islam, probably with some help

869
00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:06,680
Speaker 2: from our friend's co intel pro killed him.

870
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:06,880
Speaker 3: Right.

871
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 2: This is I'm not saying anything particularly conspiracy minded.

872
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:13,400
Speaker 1: With that stuff. Yeah, but you're certainly not the first

873
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:14,000
Speaker 1: to say it.

874
00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:17,080
Speaker 2: When I looked when I was reading the history of

875
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:19,680
Speaker 2: to study Malcolm xin Nation of Islam, when I was

876
00:47:19,719 --> 00:47:21,480
Speaker 2: reading the history of the Nation of Islam, and when

877
00:47:21,520 --> 00:47:23,319
Speaker 2: it started as like kind of like kind of a

878
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:25,799
Speaker 2: community betterment cult, and I think Detroit off the top

879
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:27,840
Speaker 2: of my head. It's been a couple years since this episode.

880
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,720
Speaker 2: The part that stuck out to me was a news

881
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 2: article about how one of the early Nation of Islam

882
00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:37,520
Speaker 2: people sacrifice I can't remember, either sacrificed his landlord on

883
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 2: an altar in the basement or sacrifice someone to get

884
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:44,400
Speaker 2: at the landlord in an altar in the basement. And

885
00:47:44,440 --> 00:47:48,799
Speaker 2: I'm like, that reads like something written as like propaganda

886
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 2: against the Nation of Islam, but I'm like, it's just

887
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:58,879
Speaker 2: presented as truth. I have no contrafactual account whatever. It's

888
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:02,359
Speaker 2: also totally fun, possible yeah, you.

889
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 1: Know, it's very easy to kill like one adult person

890
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:07,880
Speaker 1: and basically get away with it depending on the situation.

891
00:48:08,080 --> 00:48:09,319
Speaker 2: This person did not get away with.

892
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:13,280
Speaker 1: It, but like no, and like it's also the landlord

893
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 1: thing is what makes it funny?

894
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 2: No, no, it's hilarious. I'm not yet And anyway, so

895
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,080
Speaker 2: like the weird shit is real, so the fact that

896
00:48:22,200 --> 00:48:24,239
Speaker 2: there is some spontaneous human combustion, but it's probably not

897
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:26,759
Speaker 2: so spontaneous. It's like whatever anyway, Yeah, yeah, all right,

898
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:31,200
Speaker 2: so they're doing all this shit, they're like, oh my god,

899
00:48:31,560 --> 00:48:34,680
Speaker 2: math numbers, all of our minds are blown. And they're

900
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,120
Speaker 2: doing this, all of this within a religious framework. But

901
00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:40,400
Speaker 2: it changes one of the reasons that causes the Enlightenment,

902
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:43,360
Speaker 2: according to some stuff I've read, is that it changes

903
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,799
Speaker 2: the way that Christians are now thinking about how they

904
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:49,160
Speaker 2: can interact with the world. Because when you look at

905
00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:54,799
Speaker 2: three times Lucky Hermes, three times a Lady Hermes, they're like,

906
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:57,680
Speaker 2: maybe instead of within the Christian framework, we don't have

907
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:00,640
Speaker 2: to just sit around and contemplate the divine, Maybe we

908
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:05,400
Speaker 2: are called upon to act upon the world. And unfortunately

909
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 2: this is probably now I'm literally at my board with

910
00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:13,160
Speaker 2: red yarn, but a bunch of fucking enlightenment Europeans realizing

911
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 2: they can act upon the world causes like all the

912
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:18,480
Speaker 2: bad shit that ever comes after it, like colonialism and

913
00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:21,319
Speaker 2: all of the associated things. I'm not saying three times

914
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:26,319
Speaker 2: lucky HERMEI is the reason for that. But people feel

915
00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:28,200
Speaker 2: empowered to make changes in the world get a lot

916
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:30,520
Speaker 2: of bad shit coming out of it. Eugenics is a

917
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:32,799
Speaker 2: similar impulse where they're like, we've learned a science and

918
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:34,799
Speaker 2: now we're going to try and change the world. You know,

919
00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:37,719
Speaker 2: but her medicism gives and.

920
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:39,560
Speaker 1: Now we're going to use all bring all of our

921
00:49:40,880 --> 00:49:43,960
Speaker 1: biases and prejudices into it. We think that'll be very

922
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:45,840
Speaker 1: scientific of us, totally to fun.

923
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:48,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, but even though it gives leeway to people on

924
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:50,760
Speaker 2: top to make changes in certain ways, it also empowered

925
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:54,279
Speaker 2: the lower classes and it start you start getting these

926
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:58,600
Speaker 2: like revolutionary societies, although they actually mostly started by empowering

927
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:00,880
Speaker 2: the middle classes, like the literate people, but who didn't

928
00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:04,799
Speaker 2: run the world. And this is a change and not

929
00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:10,880
Speaker 2: necessarily a good one. Earlier European revolutionary movements were mostly peasants,

930
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:14,399
Speaker 2: and like often they were peasants kind of like led

931
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:16,440
Speaker 2: by a noble or whatever the fuck. But like by

932
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:19,440
Speaker 2: and large you have these like heretical movements that are

933
00:50:19,480 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 2: actually coming from the lower classes that are seeking egalitarianism

934
00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:25,000
Speaker 2: and or free love and all the shit that everyone

935
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:28,359
Speaker 2: always wants throughout history and has to get squashed down

936
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 2: all the time. If anyone's missing them making a hand

937
00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:33,400
Speaker 2: just or squashing me down. I think it's really important.

938
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:37,839
Speaker 2: Also my eyes, apparently it is important. Yeah, and now

939
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:40,959
Speaker 2: in the Renaissance you get more educated radicals, which means

940
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 2: the power shifts towards bourgeois radicals in away from women

941
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 2: specifically because women weren't the main leaders before, but they

942
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:52,399
Speaker 2: were like way more involved and this whole sciencey magic

943
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:55,160
Speaker 2: stuff is very male coded and controlled at the time. However,

944
00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 2: I read that from one source who I also think

945
00:50:57,719 --> 00:51:00,200
Speaker 2: is like misrepresenting some Marxist feminist stuff, and then I

946
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:02,399
Speaker 2: started reading some other stuff that included a bunch of women,

947
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:04,440
Speaker 2: So I don't know, maybe that source was biased in

948
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:08,680
Speaker 2: a way that didn't work. I don't know. I wish

949
00:51:08,800 --> 00:51:11,440
Speaker 2: I had three years for each subject.

950
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 1: I know it'd be amazing. Yeah, giber, I think a

951
00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:19,479
Speaker 1: lot about Tilda Swinton and only lovers left alive where

952
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:24,800
Speaker 1: she's like married to is that vampire Tom Hittleston. Doesn't

953
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:26,719
Speaker 1: matter some guys, I do like this movie and know

954
00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:27,480
Speaker 1: who Tilda is.

955
00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:30,200
Speaker 2: See see we're doing it.

956
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 1: I know we could do and that like the opening

957
00:51:33,200 --> 00:51:35,720
Speaker 1: of the movie, she's just been in Venice for ten years,

958
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:39,600
Speaker 1: apparently reading for ten years. And ever since I saw that,

959
00:51:39,640 --> 00:51:42,880
Speaker 1: I've just been like, that is correct. That's what we

960
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:45,120
Speaker 1: all deserve if we want it, and I sure do.

961
00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:49,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely. I remember once I was on tour with

962
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 2: a book and I was like, man, I learned so

963
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:53,440
Speaker 2: much about the subject of the book by the end

964
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:55,640
Speaker 2: of the tour. I wish I had gone on tour

965
00:51:55,680 --> 00:51:58,440
Speaker 2: before I'd written the book. And I was like, I

966
00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:00,640
Speaker 2: was saying this to someone and someone was like, that's

967
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:07,200
Speaker 2: called being a professor. But I'm an art school dropout anyway,

968
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:09,960
Speaker 2: what it used to be. Yeah, I guess now I

969
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:12,800
Speaker 2: could if I write some ship at the end of whatever,

970
00:52:12,840 --> 00:52:14,719
Speaker 2: cool people will last until the sun of hours the earth.

971
00:52:14,760 --> 00:52:18,280
Speaker 1: But I think being a professor is now largely about meetings,

972
00:52:18,320 --> 00:52:20,200
Speaker 1: you know, So I think that you're in a better

973
00:52:20,239 --> 00:52:24,239
Speaker 1: approximation of the old way of academia than a lot

974
00:52:24,239 --> 00:52:25,319
Speaker 1: of actual academia.

975
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:29,360
Speaker 3: It's meetings and being like god damn it, did somebody

976
00:52:29,360 --> 00:52:31,200
Speaker 3: write this with chat gept.

977
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:37,080
Speaker 2: And for caarity and organized campaigns harassment?

978
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:39,960
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, those are important too.

979
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:42,520
Speaker 2: Did you all see the video where a Nazi if

980
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 2: someone came in and started si kayliene in a like

981
00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:47,120
Speaker 2: philosophy classes, the whole class chased about that was that

982
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:50,160
Speaker 2: the entire what it was, the entire class when the

983
00:52:50,160 --> 00:52:53,279
Speaker 2: camera turns around is the entire class. I'm like, we're

984
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:56,000
Speaker 2: gonna be all right. I know I'm gonna get through this.

985
00:52:56,880 --> 00:52:58,200
Speaker 1: I know those kids are pretty good.

986
00:52:58,280 --> 00:53:00,680
Speaker 2: Yeah. And so a thing that comes out of all

987
00:53:00,719 --> 00:53:03,760
Speaker 2: of this esoterica and trying to find ways to create

988
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:06,400
Speaker 2: and hold on to power without being the crown or

989
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:10,839
Speaker 2: the church is the rise of secret societies, because if

990
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:13,200
Speaker 2: you want to do something and you're not allowed, you

991
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:19,200
Speaker 2: can't tell people you're doing it famously. Yeah, like the

992
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:23,319
Speaker 2: rosa Crucians, who are kind of silly. All of these

993
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:26,239
Speaker 2: things are kind of silly, but the Rosicrucians like to

994
00:53:26,239 --> 00:53:28,520
Speaker 2: claim to be like fucking ancient. If you go to

995
00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:31,120
Speaker 2: Rosaicrucian dot org, I'm not even a spell it for you.

996
00:53:31,160 --> 00:53:32,719
Speaker 2: I'm not even to look up how to pronounce it.

997
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:35,520
Speaker 2: You find this amazing cope sentence. This is one of

998
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:40,440
Speaker 2: my favorite sentences. Are a couple sentences. Quote Rosaicrucian tradition

999
00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 2: relates that the Great Pyramids of Giza were most sacred

1000
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 2: in the eyes of initiates, contrary to what historians affirm.

1001
00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:51,680
Speaker 2: That's my favorite sentence ever written. Contrary to what is

1002
00:53:51,920 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 2: But I think that they are aware that they're being

1003
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:58,320
Speaker 2: silly anyway, Contrary to what historians affirm. Our tradition relates

1004
00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:01,200
Speaker 2: that the Giza Pyramids were not built to be tombs

1005
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:05,239
Speaker 2: of pharaohs, but were actually places of study and mystical initiation.

1006
00:54:07,080 --> 00:54:12,960
Speaker 1: Oh okay, yeah, I think you should get a hat

1007
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 1: or shirt that says contrary to what historians affirm.

1008
00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 2: I love that.

1009
00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:18,720
Speaker 1: I love that.

1010
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:21,920
Speaker 2: They also are like their symbol is a rose on

1011
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 2: a cross, and they're like, but it's not a Christian cross,

1012
00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 2: it's it predates that it's different, like my Brother in Christ.

1013
00:54:28,080 --> 00:54:29,279
Speaker 2: You started in sixteen ten.

1014
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:31,120
Speaker 1: But I love that.

1015
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:35,839
Speaker 2: They almost certainly started with some anonymous.

1016
00:54:34,440 --> 00:54:37,440
Speaker 1: See that's what I love about cults, Like the scarier

1017
00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 1: people act about them, the more embarrassing they turned out

1018
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:41,040
Speaker 1: to be generally.

1019
00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:47,239
Speaker 5: Brother's so funny coming from you, especially with people who

1020
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:49,960
Speaker 5: just said that they aren't into the Cross for the Yeah, huh,

1021
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:52,640
Speaker 5: you did it so.

1022
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:58,520
Speaker 2: Rosicrucians probably started with some anonymous manifestos written in sixteen

1023
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:02,360
Speaker 2: ten and sixteen fifteen, and it promised to reform. This

1024
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:04,360
Speaker 2: is like the core of most of these things. It

1025
00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:08,080
Speaker 2: promised to reform mankind based on science. Quote built on

1026
00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:13,319
Speaker 2: esoteric truths of the ancient past which have been secret

1027
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:16,799
Speaker 2: until now you see. And I think one of the

1028
00:55:16,840 --> 00:55:19,799
Speaker 2: founders later was like, guys, this is sort of a

1029
00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:22,719
Speaker 2: joke I wrote as a kid, though, but then the

1030
00:55:22,760 --> 00:55:25,000
Speaker 2: ross of Christians are like Noah. He had to say

1031
00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:26,360
Speaker 2: that because of the repression.

1032
00:55:27,800 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 1: Just like spiritualism, if you play a joke as a

1033
00:55:30,320 --> 00:55:32,799
Speaker 1: childe you'll accidentally start a religion and then he can't

1034
00:55:32,840 --> 00:55:33,399
Speaker 1: take it back.

1035
00:55:33,560 --> 00:55:36,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, Spiritualism is like, I'm actually gonna stop this story

1036
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:41,279
Speaker 2: in about eighteen sixty or so, but spiritualism comes out

1037
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:44,839
Speaker 2: of this story too. It all, oh nice, everything is fought.

1038
00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:47,000
Speaker 1: This is like the back rooms, isn't it.

1039
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:51,800
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes, backrooms are spooky as fuck. I actually

1040
00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:53,320
Speaker 2: didn't know about it until I listened to This podcast

1041
00:55:53,600 --> 00:55:55,160
Speaker 2: is little known that you all might have heard of.

1042
00:55:55,160 --> 00:55:57,720
Speaker 2: It's called sixteen Minute, sixteenth Minute.

1043
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:01,040
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that rings a a tiny little bell.

1044
00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:05,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that podcast. It was very good by

1045
00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:08,280
Speaker 2: Jamie Loftus. And there's an episode about the back Rooms

1046
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:09,200
Speaker 2: and if you all Want.

1047
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:11,280
Speaker 1: And the Replaceable Sophia Lichterman.

1048
00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 3: It's true.

1049
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:18,480
Speaker 2: It's a producer that made invented podcasting, actually invented it

1050
00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:21,920
Speaker 2: in the year fourteen thirty.

1051
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:28,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, contrary to what historians affirm.

1052
00:56:24,760 --> 00:56:24,840
Speaker 2: Ye.

1053
00:56:33,360 --> 00:56:36,319
Speaker 1: So if I ordered you some hats today and I

1054
00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:40,400
Speaker 1: really want to tell you what the hats say on them,

1055
00:56:40,560 --> 00:56:42,600
Speaker 1: I'm so excited. Do you want to know what the

1056
00:56:42,600 --> 00:56:48,400
Speaker 1: hats say? Their custom hats? And they say baked potato,

1057
00:56:48,440 --> 00:56:51,840
Speaker 1: no chives, and Caesar salad, no crew turns.

1058
00:56:52,160 --> 00:56:53,719
Speaker 2: Do you wear the hat you need when you go

1059
00:56:53,800 --> 00:56:54,239
Speaker 2: into them?

1060
00:56:55,040 --> 00:56:57,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they're like, may take your order, and you're like,

1061
00:56:59,880 --> 00:57:01,200
Speaker 1: I'm gonna.

1062
00:57:00,960 --> 00:57:04,160
Speaker 4: Be like the guy who goes to Costco with the

1063
00:57:04,239 --> 00:57:05,920
Speaker 4: barcode for the.

1064
00:57:09,239 --> 00:57:10,640
Speaker 1: Guy. Yeah.

1065
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:13,880
Speaker 2: This is like when I was in Athens for way longer,

1066
00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:15,719
Speaker 2: I should have learned way more Greek than I did.

1067
00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:18,160
Speaker 2: All I learned how to do is say span a

1068
00:57:18,200 --> 00:57:22,040
Speaker 2: copa to the hotus duty I want spinach pie without cheese.

1069
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 1: We're gonna make you a hat that says that as well.

1070
00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:32,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you have these rosicrucians. Yeah, one of them

1071
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:35,320
Speaker 2: is a guy named Robert Flood, and he's from England

1072
00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:36,600
Speaker 2: and Flood spelled.

1073
00:57:36,600 --> 00:57:37,960
Speaker 1: Very ancient sounding name.

1074
00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:41,920
Speaker 2: It's it's f l u d d uh. And he's

1075
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:43,440
Speaker 2: from England where they have stupid names.

1076
00:57:44,040 --> 00:57:46,560
Speaker 1: Sounds like a country singer to me, quite honestly.

1077
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 2: Yeah. When I spell it out like flood like flo

1078
00:57:50,400 --> 00:57:52,800
Speaker 2: o d, it's kind of cool. But when it's written

1079
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:55,720
Speaker 2: flood like fl like crud, it's like.

1080
00:57:56,760 --> 00:58:01,560
Speaker 1: You know, evenen, ma'am, my name is Robert Flood spelt

1081
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:05,600
Speaker 1: like cred. Yeah, but with another day. That other day

1082
00:58:05,720 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 1: means and uh and tomy.

1083
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:13,000
Speaker 2: He's a Flood is a hermeticist and a scientist in

1084
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:16,280
Speaker 2: the seventeenth century and arosa crucion. And he's like, you know,

1085
00:58:16,360 --> 00:58:19,160
Speaker 2: what make the world better is if people got together

1086
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:22,600
Speaker 2: with like minded folks and started secret societies. And this

1087
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:25,680
Speaker 2: will have no knock on effects four hundred years from now.

1088
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:28,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, people aren't gonna get weird about this at all,

1089
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:29,120
Speaker 1: I don't think.

1090
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:32,320
Speaker 2: And it is possible that this is what started the Freemasons,

1091
00:58:32,440 --> 00:58:41,000
Speaker 2: who alongside the Illuminati we're going to talk about on Wednesday. Anyway,

1092
00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:43,400
Speaker 2: that's that's well, that's not what I got. That's half

1093
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:46,920
Speaker 2: of what I got. But you have a podcast. Can

1094
00:58:46,920 --> 00:58:49,960
Speaker 2: people listen to it? Now? The answer is no, because

1095
00:58:49,960 --> 00:58:51,760
Speaker 2: this is going to come out in like three or

1096
00:58:51,760 --> 00:58:53,200
Speaker 2: four days, and your podcast.

1097
00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:56,280
Speaker 1: Comes out but so soon, So yeah, you'll be It's

1098
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,640
Speaker 1: it's crowning at this very moment, and we're going to

1099
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:04,200
Speaker 1: start releasing it on October twentieth. Wherever you get your podcasts.

1100
00:59:04,240 --> 00:59:08,320
Speaker 1: I've said that so many times in promotional materials, like

1101
00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:10,280
Speaker 1: there was a day and I'll have to do this

1102
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:12,800
Speaker 1: again where I was just sitting there all by myself

1103
00:59:12,840 --> 00:59:17,280
Speaker 1: saying wherever you get your podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts,

1104
00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:18,880
Speaker 1: but you're Independentember you got.

1105
00:59:18,760 --> 00:59:21,640
Speaker 3: Your podcast and remind folks the name of the show.

1106
00:59:21,720 --> 00:59:25,040
Speaker 1: So yeah, oh yes, thank you, Sophie, and the show

1107
00:59:25,120 --> 00:59:27,160
Speaker 1: is called The Devil. You know, we're going to be

1108
00:59:27,160 --> 00:59:33,040
Speaker 1: putting it out between October twentieth and December sixteenth. There's

1109
00:59:33,080 --> 00:59:35,800
Speaker 1: going to be eight episodes, eight bonus episodes. I got

1110
00:59:35,840 --> 00:59:39,960
Speaker 1: to talk to some of the people who witnessed the

1111
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:44,080
Speaker 1: behind the scenes of Michelle Remembers and in the first

1112
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 1: episode we get to meet a woman who was profiled

1113
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:51,520
Speaker 1: as a Satanist who wanted to sacrifice blue eyed, blonde

1114
00:59:51,560 --> 00:59:55,400
Speaker 1: haired children because she dared to go to small town

1115
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:59,440
Speaker 1: Kentucky to try and teach some kids photography in the eighties.

1116
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:02,960
Speaker 1: And I please come listen to it. It was such

1117
01:00:03,040 --> 01:00:05,520
Speaker 1: a great, great experience to make it and meet all

1118
01:00:05,520 --> 01:00:09,680
Speaker 1: these people, and Magpie, thank you so much for having

1119
01:00:09,720 --> 01:00:13,360
Speaker 1: me on. I'm so excited to learn more about what

1120
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:15,440
Speaker 1: the Rosa Crusions are about to get up to.

1121
01:00:15,720 --> 01:00:17,960
Speaker 2: So the reason that I'm really excited about your podcast

1122
01:00:18,200 --> 01:00:21,520
Speaker 2: is that, like, I love all this kind of stuff,

1123
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:25,680
Speaker 2: but I don't trust almost any of the sources. And

1124
01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:28,440
Speaker 2: the more that I like listen to podcasts for history,

1125
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 2: the more I distrust. Not all there are some history

1126
01:00:32,520 --> 01:00:35,720
Speaker 2: podcasts that are amazing, but I've like the number of

1127
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:38,120
Speaker 2: times I've listened to a podcast that I'm going to

1128
01:00:38,200 --> 01:00:40,800
Speaker 2: cover similar or the same subject, and then I listen

1129
01:00:40,840 --> 01:00:42,720
Speaker 2: to the podcast, I'm like, okay, is what people usually

1130
01:00:42,760 --> 01:00:44,160
Speaker 2: talk about when they talk about this, And then I

1131
01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:46,600
Speaker 2: go do the research and then I'm like, oh, this

1132
01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:50,840
Speaker 2: person read like an article, not even the Wikipedia article.

1133
01:00:50,920 --> 01:00:52,360
Speaker 2: The Wikipedia article is usually my.

1134
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:56,480
Speaker 1: Correact article that they read, and you're like whoopsieh.

1135
01:00:56,480 --> 01:00:59,320
Speaker 2: And then you find all of the scholarly stuff that's

1136
01:00:59,360 --> 01:01:03,360
Speaker 2: like hey, because like the pop version of everything is

1137
01:01:03,480 --> 01:01:04,560
Speaker 2: usually it's like, did you.

1138
01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:07,280
Speaker 1: Know Taft got stuck in a bathtub? And it's like

1139
01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:10,480
Speaker 1: he didn't. Actually, it's very hard to get stuck in

1140
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:13,400
Speaker 1: a bathtub. It's famously a slick surface that doesn't have

1141
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:15,920
Speaker 1: any kind of overhang that could trap a human body.

1142
01:01:16,400 --> 01:01:18,160
Speaker 2: That actually makes a lot of sense. And it never

1143
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 2: occurred to me one way or the other about that

1144
01:01:19,640 --> 01:01:23,640
Speaker 2: because I'm literally but that's such a good example. Like

1145
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:26,960
Speaker 2: people relate the pop history of something and so then

1146
01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:29,160
Speaker 2: other people are like, oh fuck pop history. But I'm like,

1147
01:01:29,640 --> 01:01:32,000
Speaker 2: I essentially do pop history. I'm not a historian. I'm

1148
01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:37,080
Speaker 2: not doing the original research, but I I really like

1149
01:01:37,160 --> 01:01:40,600
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff. I just wanted to be fucking

1150
01:01:40,760 --> 01:01:44,600
Speaker 2: right and or like whatever. No one's perfect, nothing's ever

1151
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 2: perfectly right, but.

1152
01:01:45,680 --> 01:01:48,480
Speaker 1: We all want people to be putting a good faith

1153
01:01:48,520 --> 01:01:51,320
Speaker 1: effort into making things as right as they possibly can,

1154
01:01:52,080 --> 01:01:54,680
Speaker 1: and also just into getting as much information as it's

1155
01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:57,840
Speaker 1: feasible to get in the timeframe that you have, you know,

1156
01:01:57,920 --> 01:01:59,680
Speaker 1: making a show regularly like the one you do.

1157
01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:02,560
Speaker 2: And be aware of broader and more interesting context to

1158
01:02:02,600 --> 01:02:05,400
Speaker 2: bring to it, you know, and like. And so that's

1159
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:07,400
Speaker 2: why I like, I'm really excited about your show is

1160
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:10,080
Speaker 2: that I like trust you as a podcaster. But it's

1161
01:02:10,120 --> 01:02:12,520
Speaker 2: a subject I'm really interested in. But I don't want

1162
01:02:12,520 --> 01:02:14,360
Speaker 2: to go out and if I go get a book

1163
01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:17,160
Speaker 2: on it, I'm gonna it's gonna be fucking sensationalist, even

1164
01:02:17,200 --> 01:02:21,480
Speaker 2: though it's like I like sensational things, I just want

1165
01:02:21,520 --> 01:02:24,600
Speaker 2: them to Yeah, we just don't have to lie, you know, right,

1166
01:02:24,640 --> 01:02:25,000
Speaker 2: It's like.

1167
01:02:25,000 --> 01:02:27,360
Speaker 1: The truth is dramatic enough. You don't have to sweeten

1168
01:02:27,440 --> 01:02:29,680
Speaker 1: it really or liked you know, you just got a

1169
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:32,840
Speaker 1: of really dramatic music on top of it. Yeah, that's

1170
01:02:32,880 --> 01:02:35,600
Speaker 1: the thing anyway, And that's such a big honor. That

1171
01:02:35,640 --> 01:02:37,240
Speaker 1: means so much to me, and I really hope you

1172
01:02:37,320 --> 01:02:37,560
Speaker 1: like it.

1173
01:02:37,600 --> 01:02:39,680
Speaker 2: To check out The Devil, you know, at the same

1174
01:02:39,680 --> 01:02:41,640
Speaker 2: time I will be, which is October twentieth.

1175
01:02:41,680 --> 01:02:44,760
Speaker 1: Is that we said October twentieth, baby, And.

1176
01:02:45,400 --> 01:02:49,240
Speaker 2: You can also check out the backlog of sixteenth minute

1177
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:52,040
Speaker 2: because it is no please do you can listen to

1178
01:02:52,080 --> 01:02:55,480
Speaker 2: the back rooms and get creeped out while driving late

1179
01:02:55,480 --> 01:02:57,080
Speaker 2: at night up through Virginia.

1180
01:02:57,960 --> 01:02:59,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's ideal, all right, you.

1181
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:00,960
Speaker 3: Have any thing else you want to plug?

1182
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:01,600
Speaker 1: Magpie?

1183
01:03:02,160 --> 01:03:05,760
Speaker 2: Oh, I have a substack and I write every week

1184
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:10,560
Speaker 2: about a lot of things, and most of it's free,

1185
01:03:10,800 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 2: and if it's not free, it's behind a paywall because

1186
01:03:12,760 --> 01:03:13,920
Speaker 2: it's like personal. So if you want to have a

1187
01:03:13,920 --> 01:03:16,400
Speaker 2: weird para social read the things that I talk about

1188
01:03:16,400 --> 01:03:17,480
Speaker 2: that or you have to give me money. But if

1189
01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:18,560
Speaker 2: you just want to hear what I have to say

1190
01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:20,919
Speaker 2: about things, you don't have to give me money. And

1191
01:03:21,240 --> 01:03:24,840
Speaker 2: that's the way the world works, and everything's going to

1192
01:03:24,880 --> 01:03:29,000
Speaker 2: be fine, I hope. So I think you want to plug? Yeah?

1193
01:03:29,040 --> 01:03:33,400
Speaker 3: Season two of sad Oligarch is officially oh shit raising episodes.

1194
01:03:33,560 --> 01:03:35,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh fuck Yeah.

1195
01:03:35,480 --> 01:03:39,600
Speaker 3: It's an investigatd podcast SERI hosted by journalist Jake Hanrahan

1196
01:03:40,560 --> 01:03:45,080
Speaker 3: that looks into the odd, strange deaths of Russian elite

1197
01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:49,400
Speaker 3: and just so many people just love to fall downstairs

1198
01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:50,800
Speaker 3: of an out of windows.

1199
01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:54,640
Speaker 2: Jake Hanrahan is such an also perfect example of like

1200
01:03:55,040 --> 01:03:58,000
Speaker 2: I like sensational things, like I really like the series

1201
01:03:58,040 --> 01:03:59,680
Speaker 2: I like the first season of sad Oligarch, and I

1202
01:03:59,720 --> 01:04:03,160
Speaker 2: really liked uh shit, what's the one about underground boxing

1203
01:04:03,200 --> 01:04:07,320
Speaker 2: and drag race days? Await Days? Await Days was amazing.

1204
01:04:08,160 --> 01:04:12,560
Speaker 2: It's pulpy, sensational content about dramatic things. It's just done

1205
01:04:12,560 --> 01:04:14,840
Speaker 2: by someone who's actually doing the fucking work and not

1206
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:17,280
Speaker 2: trying to pull one over on you. All Right, we'll

1207
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:20,440
Speaker 2: see you all on Wednesday when we learn about the Illuminati.

1208
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:22,720
Speaker 2: And I'm hopefully going to successfully do the thing that

1209
01:04:22,760 --> 01:04:25,440
Speaker 2: I am talking about where I talk about the fucking Illuminati,

1210
01:04:25,480 --> 01:04:27,960
Speaker 2: but I'm gonna tell it to you as best as

1211
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:30,400
Speaker 2: I can in an earnest way.

1212
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:33,800
Speaker 3: Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of

1213
01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:36,960
Speaker 3: cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media,

1214
01:04:37,120 --> 01:04:40,360
Speaker 3: visit our website Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out

1215
01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:43,840
Speaker 3: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get

1216
01:04:43,840 --> 01:04:44,720
Speaker 3: your podcasts.