1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:01,280 Speaker 1: And you're here. 2 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:03,960 Speaker 2: Thanks for choosing the iHeartRadio and Coast to Ghost Day 3 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:09,200 Speaker 2: and Paranormal Podcast Network. Your quest for podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural, 4 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,320 Speaker 2: and the unexplained ends here. They invite you to enjoy 5 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 2: all our shows we have on this network, and right now, 6 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 2: let's start with Chase of the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain. 7 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:25,200 Speaker 3: Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and 8 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:29,240 Speaker 3: opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions 9 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:34,480 Speaker 3: only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast 10 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 3: to Coast, AM employees of Premiere Networks, or their sponsors 11 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 3: and associates. We would like to encourage you to do 12 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 3: your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself. 13 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:48,720 Speaker 1: Hi. 14 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 3: I'm Sandra Champlain. For over twenty five years, I've been 15 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 3: on a journey to prove the existence of life after death. 16 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 3: On each episode, we'll discuss the reasons we now know 17 00:01:01,280 --> 00:01:04,800 Speaker 3: that our loved ones have survived physical death and so 18 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 3: will we. Welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. Have you 19 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:13,920 Speaker 3: ever wondered what your life purpose is? I want to 20 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 3: ask you three questions just for you to ponder. You 21 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 3: don't need to give a response, as it may take 22 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 3: you a little while to come up with the answer. 23 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 3: I will revisit this at the end of the episode 24 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 3: and you'll know why then. The first question is if 25 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,800 Speaker 3: I knew I couldn't fail, what would I do or 26 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 3: who would I be? Second question, if I knew I 27 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:45,960 Speaker 3: had one hundred million dollars in the bank, what would 28 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 3: I do or who would I be? And number three, 29 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 3: if I knew I only had six months left to live, 30 00:01:56,200 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 3: what would I do or who would I be? Good questions. Right, 31 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 3: our guest today has come up with his life purpose 32 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 3: a different way, and I think many of us our 33 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:13,640 Speaker 3: hearts get cracked wide open when we go through the 34 00:02:13,680 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 3: grieving process. As difficult as grief may be, it may 35 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:22,360 Speaker 3: have us asking these important questions of who am I 36 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:26,520 Speaker 3: and what is my life? For our guest today is 37 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 3: a berieved father, a bereaved son, a bereaved brother, and 38 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 3: a bereaved friend. You'll meet Tom Bender, creator and host 39 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 3: of the Heroes in Grief podcast. On each episode you 40 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 3: meet inspiring folks who turn their grief into purpose. You 41 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:49,880 Speaker 3: can find out more at Heroes in Grief dot com. 42 00:02:50,360 --> 00:02:53,840 Speaker 3: Let's meet Tom now hear his story through grief and 43 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 3: his belief in the afterlife. 44 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:59,519 Speaker 1: Now presently in Niagara Falls, New York. I'm a native 45 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,799 Speaker 1: Western New Yorker born in Buffalo, and there's been a 46 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 1: lot of things in my life, a lot of different 47 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 1: things to pull from varied background. I was a pastor 48 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 1: for fifteen years in the Christian Church. I was spiritual 49 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 1: care director at Niagara Hospice for three and a half years. 50 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 1: I worked ambulance for a long time. I was back 51 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: in the, as you were, the food industry for a 52 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 1: while and did all kinds of different things. I also 53 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,919 Speaker 1: had been involved in music almost all my life, and 54 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 1: so my past fifteen years or so has been a 55 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:33,080 Speaker 1: full time musician here in Western New York. And I 56 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 1: played in nursing homes and things like that during the 57 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 1: day times, and then clubs and other things at night, 58 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: and bands and everything else, the whole gamut. But I 59 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: was very privileged to be full time, and so it 60 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 1: was nice. And then in February twenty third of twenty 61 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: twenty three, my son Jeff passed. He was twenty seven 62 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: years old, and he was living with us. He had 63 00:03:57,160 --> 00:04:00,160 Speaker 1: come to us to get out of a lifestyle he 64 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 1: had been in involving drugs and things, and so he 65 00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: came to live with us two and a half years 66 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 1: prior to that, and everything was going relatively well, and 67 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 1: as that sometimes happens, it has gripped him and did 68 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 1: grip him, and so he finally succumbed to that on 69 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: the twenty third, and that was horrific, of course, and 70 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:22,840 Speaker 1: changed my life dramatically. I'm still changing and evolving as 71 00:04:22,880 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 1: a person since that time. It's not that long, of course, 72 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:29,240 Speaker 1: but I found amazing resources right away. I knew I 73 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 1: needed help and tapped into resources that helped me online 74 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 1: and searching out podcast books, just searching for something to 75 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 1: grab onto, and I found immediate help through some of those. 76 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 1: I began to progress in my grief, which I think 77 00:04:45,440 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 1: everybody has to do. Early stages are tough because you're 78 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 1: just trying to live and survive, of course, and so 79 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:57,359 Speaker 1: what it did is it started moving me onward to 80 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 1: wanting to realize what's happening with in me. First of all, 81 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 1: and that was that I was changing. You can't help 82 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 1: but be changed in many ways, but internally it really 83 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: worked in me, and I realized some things that I'm 84 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: still trying to process and better myself in but I 85 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 1: wanted to help people and I wanted to help them 86 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 1: through if I could, the pain that I was going through. 87 00:05:22,279 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 1: I didn't know what that was going to look like. 88 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:26,039 Speaker 1: I didn't know how that was going to happen. I 89 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 1: quickly took a grief educator course through David Kessler that 90 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 1: was on a grief group swanline with his organization, and 91 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: again I didn't know exactly what I was going to 92 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 1: do with that, but I thought, maybe I don't know, 93 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:41,479 Speaker 1: maybe one on ones who knows. So I took that. 94 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:44,159 Speaker 1: I ended that in June of last year, relatively quick 95 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:47,720 Speaker 1: again into everything, and then the idea for the podcast 96 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: came around that time, actually, but it just wasn't time. 97 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 1: I could tell through the summer months and things got busy, 98 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:57,440 Speaker 1: and it was good because we were being occupied and 99 00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 1: that helps pad the grief process as you're going on 100 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 1: and being amongst friends and all those things. Really what 101 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:06,680 Speaker 1: stirred it was that I heard other people's stories and 102 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,159 Speaker 1: they meant a lot to me. It didn't matter the 103 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:12,960 Speaker 1: circumstances of their grief, it was what came out of it, 104 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:15,360 Speaker 1: and it seemed like there was something that came out 105 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:19,000 Speaker 1: of every story that was applicable to my grief. But 106 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 1: that is what really spurred me on when I saw 107 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 1: what people were doing with their grief and so many 108 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 1: people then turned it into purpose, and I thought, first 109 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:31,800 Speaker 1: of all, the stories should be getting out there for people, 110 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: because different people relate to different people's stories, so the 111 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 1: more we can get that out there, the better it 112 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:43,320 Speaker 1: is for everybody. And then to highlight the things that 113 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 1: people are doing through their grief and the remarkable things. 114 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: There's so many resources available for people in grief that 115 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:54,520 Speaker 1: are from other people who have experienced grief, and there's 116 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:57,360 Speaker 1: nobody better, I think, to do that than those who 117 00:06:57,760 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: know what you're going through. So that's where where the 118 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 1: whole idea of heroes and grief came from. I struggled 119 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,240 Speaker 1: with the name heroes initially, and then I looked up 120 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: and saw that there's part of the definition of heroes 121 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: that fit perfectly, and I put that in the intro 122 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 1: to it, and it's those who are doing remarkable things 123 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 1: encourage and it doesn't matter we've made heroes into these 124 00:07:19,880 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 1: superheroes and all these other things. And of course it 125 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:25,400 Speaker 1: applies to military and things like that, but most people 126 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: the common person would not think themselves a hero in 127 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:31,720 Speaker 1: any way, but I found through that definition that it applied, 128 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: and they are heroes and certainly heroes for those who 129 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 1: receive something effective for them in their walk with Greece. 130 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:43,280 Speaker 1: I've been on a spiritual journey that now has changed 131 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: and exploring meditation in those things. I don't do it 132 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 1: as much as I should and as well as I should, 133 00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: but the benefits are incredible. I believe I'm being guided 134 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:57,960 Speaker 1: from the universe and from Spirit and from Jeff and 135 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:00,679 Speaker 1: spirit guides and all those types of things that people 136 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 1: may be familiar with. I believe Jeff is present right 137 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: here with me right now, and he's shown that in 138 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:11,160 Speaker 1: so many ways. I have signs that could fill a 139 00:08:11,640 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: law book of evidence for me personally. So all I 140 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:19,280 Speaker 1: do is share that as well. And it's very freeing 141 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 1: to be in the grief community. I've found people in 142 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 1: the grief community are genuine and wanting help, and those 143 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 1: who are giving the help are genuine. So it's been 144 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: really refreshing to be part of something that is not competitive. 145 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 1: People are genuine and real, and that's where you really 146 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 1: came in for me. And I'll share this story now 147 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:43,359 Speaker 1: how Sandra and I got connected here to do the podcasts. 148 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 1: I did a podcast with Roseanne Norris. She heads up 149 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:52,000 Speaker 1: Helping Parents Heal chapter in Binghamton, New York, and I'm 150 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 1: part of Helping Parents Heal as well. It's an organization 151 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:58,120 Speaker 1: that is all for parents who have lost children. And 152 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:01,480 Speaker 1: so I had her on podcast a couple of weeks ago. 153 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:04,560 Speaker 1: I knew she was acquainted with you, but we didn't 154 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:07,880 Speaker 1: get too deep into that. And so after the podcast, 155 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 1: I sent her an email. And as I have with 156 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:14,400 Speaker 1: several other different people who very initially when I was 157 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:18,360 Speaker 1: in my throes of grief and just clutching for things. 158 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 1: And so that's why I sent the message to Roseanne 159 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:26,679 Speaker 1: for you, is because I found your podcasts and things 160 00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:31,680 Speaker 1: early on. You're very inviting in your conversation and things. 161 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 1: I connected with that, and I just wanted to send 162 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 1: you a message to say that you had a positive 163 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:41,080 Speaker 1: role in my process and moving forward. So that was 164 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:43,959 Speaker 1: my intention, and I sent an email to her and said, 165 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:46,760 Speaker 1: what do you think is the best way to contact 166 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,559 Speaker 1: Sandra so that she would see the message, because I 167 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,760 Speaker 1: didn't know if you actually do your social media and 168 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 1: those types of things, and so that's all I sent her. 169 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 1: And so then she sends me back a message and says, 170 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,200 Speaker 1: I contacted sand and she says she wants to be 171 00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 1: on your podcast and she wants to have you on hers. 172 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 1: That was remarkable to me. So I'm very, very happy 173 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: that you did that. And it's such a privilege to 174 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:11,880 Speaker 1: be here. 175 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,200 Speaker 3: Oh thank you. My mom says, make things happen, don't 176 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:17,560 Speaker 3: wait for them to happen. Make things happen. And I 177 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:20,160 Speaker 3: want to just highlight a few things that you said, 178 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 3: and then I want to ask you about your connection 179 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 3: that ongoing with Jeff as we love to hear stories. 180 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:31,720 Speaker 3: First of all our condolences for his passing. That is 181 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:35,560 Speaker 3: the one thing that unites all of us. Grief is 182 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 3: a thing that hurts worse than anything in the world, 183 00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:41,520 Speaker 3: but can actually crack us open to go on that 184 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:44,680 Speaker 3: spiritual journey that we didn't ask for, that we didn't 185 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:48,920 Speaker 3: think we needed, But in it there's transformation. There really 186 00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 3: is not only looking at your own spiritual beliefs the hereafter, 187 00:10:53,679 --> 00:10:55,679 Speaker 3: but also who you are as a human being, what 188 00:10:55,720 --> 00:11:00,719 Speaker 3: you're here for, and you have taken your grief and 189 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 3: grief and action is what. 190 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: You are doing. 191 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 3: You are making a difference. And I know for myself, 192 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 3: everything that I learned, I couldn't hang on too for myself, 193 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:12,800 Speaker 3: I had to just give it away. So you are, 194 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 3: in fact a hero and grief as well as all 195 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 3: the people that you interview, and they say it a 196 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:22,000 Speaker 3: ton of times. Even if you make a difference for 197 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 3: one person, you never know when you can breathe life 198 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:28,360 Speaker 3: back into a person. And also sometimes we know grief 199 00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 3: is hard prevent them from even taking their own life. So, 200 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 3: my friend, now if we can feel back the onion 201 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 3: a little bit on spiritual beliefs. Now, you mentioned hospice. 202 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 3: There's some great stories of things that happen in hospice. 203 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:46,080 Speaker 3: I don't know if you've known or heard about some 204 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 3: of those deathbed visitors. But also I really want to 205 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 3: hear about your connection with Jeff, because we want to 206 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:54,880 Speaker 3: know that our loved ones are still around and what 207 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:58,840 Speaker 3: are real signs and maybe what is our imagination? And 208 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 3: just if you could talk a little bit about the afterlife. 209 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 1: Side, probably one of my favorite subjects right now. Absolutely, 210 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:10,320 Speaker 1: it's interesting. When I was a pastor, I always felt 211 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 1: that God was bigger. That was the biggest thing that 212 00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:15,520 Speaker 1: stuck with me. You can talk a lot about the 213 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:17,760 Speaker 1: context of the church and things like that, but I 214 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: don't adhere to the dogma of religion anymore. I certainly 215 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: believe in God and Spirit in a different way, so 216 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:27,480 Speaker 1: I don't try to get in battles with anybody in 217 00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: religion or anything like that. I just knew at the 218 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:32,959 Speaker 1: time that God was bigger, and when I went to hospice, 219 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 1: I experienced it. I did see some of the things 220 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 1: you're speaking of. I saw terminal lucidity, where a person 221 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 1: who was not conscious or speaking or in their right 222 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:47,079 Speaker 1: mind for a long time, sometimes up to years. And 223 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:49,959 Speaker 1: usually these occurrences that I'm about to speak of happen 224 00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 1: and the person passes within a couple days. 225 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:55,720 Speaker 3: Of as usual, friends, it's time for a quick break, 226 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 3: and I promised we'll come right back where we left 227 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,840 Speaker 3: off with Tom Bender. You're listening to Shades of the 228 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:07,559 Speaker 3: Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal 229 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:27,400 Speaker 3: podcast Network. Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm 230 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:32,080 Speaker 3: Sandra Champlain and we're with Tom Bender, founder and podcast 231 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 3: host of Heroes in Grief. He's had a varied background, 232 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:41,200 Speaker 3: including being spiritual director at a hospice. Let's continue with 233 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:41,840 Speaker 3: his story. 234 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:44,680 Speaker 1: And when I went to hospice, I experienced it. If 235 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:48,200 Speaker 1: I saw terminal lucidity where a person who was not 236 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:52,520 Speaker 1: conscious or speaking or in their right mind for a 237 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 1: long time, sometimes up to years. And usually these occurrences 238 00:13:56,920 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 1: that I'm about to speak of happen and the person 239 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:02,120 Speaker 1: passes within a couple days of this. Usually there's a 240 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:04,040 Speaker 1: lot of studies going on with this type of thing. 241 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 3: Now. 242 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:08,200 Speaker 1: Actually here locally factor for Christopher Kerr, which is at 243 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,959 Speaker 1: Airy County Hospice or Buffalo Hospice, has done great studies 244 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 1: on this. But terminal lucidity, a person comes into their 245 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 1: regular minds and is talking to their family members. And 246 00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:21,840 Speaker 1: I witnessed this. I saw this happen and they were 247 00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 1: just dumbfounded, the people around this person, because she knew 248 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 1: every name, she knew every place, she knew everything that 249 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: had been happening all around her in the recent history. 250 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,320 Speaker 1: And everybody was shocked. And of course it's difficult for 251 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 1: the family members because they feel this is a rallying point, 252 00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: and really what it is because a kind of a 253 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:44,000 Speaker 1: picture of the end. But yeah, I experienced that, and 254 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 1: it is a remarkable experience, and so we knew this happened, 255 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 1: and we saw this happen. I saw it probably physically 256 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 1: myself a couple times and witnessed it. I heard of 257 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 1: it obviously other times from the workers there. And then 258 00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 1: there's other things where they see somebody who has passed 259 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 1: on before them and they talk about it, and they 260 00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:08,680 Speaker 1: see it and they talk to them, and they see 261 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:11,680 Speaker 1: them in the room, or they'll see them behind somebody 262 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:15,240 Speaker 1: when they're talking to them. These occurrences happened while I 263 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 1: was there too, and I witnessed that happen. So those 264 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:22,240 Speaker 1: are actual things that people see. We're just normal people. 265 00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:25,120 Speaker 1: I know you feel the same Leasander that you share 266 00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 1: these things. We are just normal people who have witnessed 267 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 1: these remarkable things around us, and it has to be shared, 268 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:36,480 Speaker 1: or our society seems to squelch these things for some reason, 269 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 1: or maybe we're just desensitized where it doesn't have the 270 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:44,800 Speaker 1: impact that it should. But they're extraordinary things. With Jeff, 271 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 1: Oh boy, there's so many. One of the very early 272 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:51,440 Speaker 1: things that happened was in the immediate days and day 273 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,840 Speaker 1: of and days after Jeff passed, and he lived with 274 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,600 Speaker 1: us here in the house, and so I'd go into 275 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,840 Speaker 1: the bathroom and and of course I'm in my acute 276 00:16:01,880 --> 00:16:05,240 Speaker 1: grief phase and you are in la la land. You 277 00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: don't even know what's going on. It's hard to find 278 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 1: the door, you know. And so I'd walk into the 279 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 1: bathroom and I would hear Dad, Dad every time it happened, 280 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:19,800 Speaker 1: and I was like, Jeff, I know you're there, and 281 00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: I'm here. I hear you. And I talked to him, 282 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:27,520 Speaker 1: you know, crying at that time, but talking to him. 283 00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 1: And he did it probably for about maybe a month 284 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:36,760 Speaker 1: or so, just every time Dad, and it was his voice, 285 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 1: and so it was amazing. That was the first thing. 286 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:43,720 Speaker 1: About three weeks after he passed. Now, as I said, 287 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: he'd lived with us, and he was a construction worker, 288 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 1: a great worker, and helped around the house and did things. 289 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: We had that bad snowstorm in Buffalo, which was around 290 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:56,760 Speaker 1: Christmas time in twenty twenty two, so he was here 291 00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:59,720 Speaker 1: for that time and we got two or three feet 292 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,280 Speaker 1: of snow oh here, and so he was out shoveling 293 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:04,040 Speaker 1: one day. And Jeff was like a bull in the 294 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:07,200 Speaker 1: china shop. He was a big guy, but a tender heart, 295 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:09,520 Speaker 1: just a teddy bear, but he was like a bull 296 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:11,360 Speaker 1: in the china shop and we just shake our heads 297 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:13,960 Speaker 1: and say, Jeff, what did you do? Yeah, that type 298 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,680 Speaker 1: of thing. Remember he pulled in the driveway one time 299 00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:20,119 Speaker 1: and knocked the extension cord holder off the wall and 300 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: he had to fix that, but he could fix it, 301 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 1: so it was like, OK, what he did this time? He 302 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:27,840 Speaker 1: was shoveling outside and all of a sudden he came 303 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 1: in and he's holding the shovel handle in his hand 304 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: and he goes, I broke the handle, you know. So 305 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:36,560 Speaker 1: actually we went and replaced it that day, or he 306 00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 1: went and got another shovel and he came back in 307 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 1: and he had broken another shovel, so two of them 308 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,760 Speaker 1: while he was doing that. After that time, a few 309 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 1: days after whatever, I fixed the shovel handle on the 310 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 1: first one that he broke, and that was the one 311 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:53,639 Speaker 1: we used all the time, and we had used it 312 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:57,959 Speaker 1: several times multiple times since then. When Jeff passed, it 313 00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:00,960 Speaker 1: was February twenty third, so this was two months after 314 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 1: the snowstorm. And three weeks after that, I go out 315 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:07,120 Speaker 1: to our porch. We didn't really have any snow at 316 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:09,159 Speaker 1: that time, but we kept our shovel on the porch, 317 00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: and it really hadn't been windy that day either, and 318 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:15,240 Speaker 1: we have a carpeted porch. I have a picture of this. Actually. 319 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 1: I opened up the door just to get some air, 320 00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: and the shovel's ling on the carpeted floor and the 321 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:26,560 Speaker 1: handle is broken off. And I just was like, Jeff, 322 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:29,639 Speaker 1: that is Jeff, you know, And how did it break 323 00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: on a carpeted floor, falling from just standing? And it 324 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 1: was remarkable. So a great sign from him something recently 325 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,800 Speaker 1: that happened. And I've really been trying to get in 326 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:44,400 Speaker 1: touch with Jeff and in touch with the spirit world. 327 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:47,600 Speaker 1: So sometimes I drive for a living. I drive for 328 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 1: a charter company here in the Falls, and I was 329 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: driving out to a school one time. It was in 330 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:55,480 Speaker 1: the evening and it was about hour long drive, and 331 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: I put on meditation music. Now this isn't advice for 332 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 1: some people when you're driving, but I just wanted something 333 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 1: to mellow myself, to get myself in a mindful state, 334 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: and so I did that while I was listening. You know, 335 00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:13,840 Speaker 1: if you've ever seen the newer vehicles, sometimes they have 336 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:18,160 Speaker 1: like a holographic display on the windshield and it goes 337 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:21,160 Speaker 1: up there and it's a little rectangle that has holographic 338 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:23,959 Speaker 1: things on there. This is the way it came up 339 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:27,240 Speaker 1: for me. And I was just trying to get in 340 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 1: a mindful state, and mindfulness is just getting in the 341 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:35,120 Speaker 1: present moment, releasing everything else. And so all of a sudden, 342 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:39,439 Speaker 1: I see that, just like a rectangle, and Jeff is 343 00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:43,000 Speaker 1: down in the corner and he's just like like, hey here, 344 00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 1: I am his fun kid, funny, beautiful smile, and he 345 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:50,919 Speaker 1: was just like, hey here I am. I'm here. I 346 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:53,479 Speaker 1: love you, I know it. And I acknowledged him, and 347 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 1: as I do, and I talk to him, and then 348 00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:59,840 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, my mother shows up. Mother passed 349 00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 1: too years before Jeff, than my father. My dad died 350 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 1: when I was ten. Then my brother, my brother died 351 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,720 Speaker 1: about ten years ago now maybe more. All of a sudden, 352 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 1: all the people in my life that I knew started 353 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:20,280 Speaker 1: showing up, and it formed like this big party of 354 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,199 Speaker 1: people there, and one by one I'd remember them and 355 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:26,600 Speaker 1: they'd show up and they were like hi, Hi, just 356 00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:30,119 Speaker 1: kept saying hi, We're all here, and it was just 357 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 1: such an experience and acknowledgement. Now, this is what happens 358 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,400 Speaker 1: a lot now for me. I need confirmations. We keep 359 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,400 Speaker 1: needing these knocks in the head to say this is real, 360 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,560 Speaker 1: this is real. They're there and they're they're with us. 361 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 1: And so I couldn't think of one person that had 362 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:49,119 Speaker 1: passed in my life that it was close to me 363 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 1: that didn't show up there. And so that is just 364 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:55,879 Speaker 1: something that happened recently that is pretty remarkable. 365 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 3: I just want to ask that you were continuing driving 366 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:00,000 Speaker 3: when this is all happened. 367 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,800 Speaker 1: I did notice that while I was driving. Yes, I'm 368 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 1: thinking of it as it's happening. I was thinking, in 369 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 1: my head, you are totally present what you're doing here. 370 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:12,840 Speaker 1: I was focused on driving the guest right. 371 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 3: And I know from personal experience we need to be present, 372 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:20,480 Speaker 3: we need to be in the zone, and sometimes driving 373 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:25,639 Speaker 3: is it. I've never heard an experience like that, and 374 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:29,640 Speaker 3: I know from my own experiences when they show up 375 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:31,800 Speaker 3: and in my mind it can be an image not 376 00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 3: outside of me, but I can tell what they look like, 377 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:41,399 Speaker 3: what they're wearing. It's different than when my mind says, okay, 378 00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 3: picture my dad, because then I have to slow down 379 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 3: and okay, that's what he looks like, and okay, invent 380 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,840 Speaker 3: what he's wearing. But it's just like, there they are, 381 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 3: And so it sounds to me like a similar thing 382 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:57,480 Speaker 3: that they just present themselves. 383 00:21:57,520 --> 00:21:58,080 Speaker 1: There they are. 384 00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 3: You wouldn't even have time to try to figure out 385 00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 3: and imagine them. 386 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:04,720 Speaker 1: No, And I wouldn't have put him in the striped 387 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,520 Speaker 1: shirt that he had on. People when they see things 388 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:11,119 Speaker 1: or wonder if it's conjuring up in their own mind 389 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,000 Speaker 1: or if it's the reality of some of the spirits 390 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:19,800 Speaker 1: showing themselves that it's definite. It's definite, it's real. It 391 00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 1: wasn't like vague. It was very clear, and you just 392 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:28,359 Speaker 1: know it's real. It's not like some obscure thing that's 393 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:31,320 Speaker 1: just wavering out there or something. It was very definite, 394 00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 1: very clear. And all the rest of them that came up, 395 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,240 Speaker 1: they really didn't say anything. They were just like every 396 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:37,879 Speaker 1: one of them kind of just came up and like 397 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: acknowledged me and waves said we're here, we're here, We're here. 398 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:44,879 Speaker 1: It's it's like pounding into my head. This is real, 399 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:48,159 Speaker 1: this is real that we are here. And so it 400 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:51,560 Speaker 1: was so awesome to experience that. And yeah, yeah, it 401 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:52,440 Speaker 1: was exhilarating. 402 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:55,480 Speaker 3: I just got a new to me car. It's a 403 00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:59,760 Speaker 3: pre owned, and it has that hologram on the windshield 404 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,080 Speaker 3: so I can tell how fast I'm going and not 405 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:05,119 Speaker 3: going and blinks when I'm going over the speed limit. 406 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 3: So I love it. But now next time I get 407 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:08,639 Speaker 3: into my car, I'm going to. 408 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,160 Speaker 1: Think of your story. 409 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 3: Oh you spoke about you still talk to Jeff, which 410 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:20,159 Speaker 3: we should because they're very much alive. But what does 411 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 3: that look like in your day? Is it just including 412 00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:24,560 Speaker 3: him and things? 413 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 1: And how do you? Yeah, you just feel him, yes, yes, 414 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 1: and yes and yes. Sometimes he reveals himself will remind me. 415 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,680 Speaker 1: And boy, you feel guilty sometimes, you know, when you're 416 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:42,120 Speaker 1: not thinking of it all the time. But we need 417 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:43,680 Speaker 1: to go on with our lives. They want us to 418 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:45,400 Speaker 1: go on with our lives. We have things to do. 419 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,119 Speaker 1: As you said, what we're doing is important, and so 420 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:50,360 Speaker 1: you have these things to do, so you can't beat 421 00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 1: yourself up about that. But sometimes I get eleven eleven 422 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 1: on the time all the time. I dur Like I said, 423 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,359 Speaker 1: I drive during the days, and so I'll just glance 424 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:00,800 Speaker 1: at the clock. All of a sudden, it might be 425 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:03,160 Speaker 1: my arrival time, it might be the time that it is. 426 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 1: But one time it happened seven days in a row, 427 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:09,600 Speaker 1: and unprovoked, I was like, okay, well you're getting my 428 00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 1: attention here for something, and you know, I just kind 429 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:16,439 Speaker 1: of used it as my internal working on that. Dad. Remember, 430 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 1: do what you're supposed to be doing, you know. And 431 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:22,360 Speaker 1: I need those reminders. So that's good. But various ways, 432 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:25,159 Speaker 1: I've only had one dream with Jeff, and which is 433 00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 1: strange to me because I would love for those visitations 434 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:32,040 Speaker 1: and dreams. Of course, just recently, again, it was an 435 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:34,600 Speaker 1: acknowledgment that he's here. It was interesting. I don't know, 436 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:36,760 Speaker 1: dreams are so strange, you know, I know his dream 437 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: it wasn't a visit really, Maybe that portion of it 438 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 1: was a visit because I remember it specifically and clearly, 439 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: but you know, dreams going on or whatever. But all 440 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:48,879 Speaker 1: of a sudden, Jeff just protruded out of a section 441 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:52,280 Speaker 1: of the visual field, I guess is the best way 442 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: I can put it. And again, I haven't had a 443 00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:57,600 Speaker 1: dream for Jeff. And it was just like pretty much 444 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: that I'm here, I'm here, dad, you know that pretty 445 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:04,880 Speaker 1: much like that with his handouts, I'm here, Dad. And 446 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: so when I woke up, I was distressed. I felt 447 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 1: that that was meaningful and purposeful and so I just 448 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:17,040 Speaker 1: felt thank you, you know, and I acknowledge him. And 449 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:19,200 Speaker 1: it might be the coins I pick up. I find 450 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:20,879 Speaker 1: the coins all the time, and I've kept all the 451 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,120 Speaker 1: ones that I've found since then. 452 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:26,359 Speaker 3: Friends, it's time for another quick break, and when we 453 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 3: get back, there's more of Heroes and Grief podcast host 454 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:34,680 Speaker 3: Tom Bender. You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on 455 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:46,960 Speaker 3: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast, a paranormal podcast network. 456 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:59,520 Speaker 3: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain 457 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 3: talking to Tom Bender, host of Heroes in Grief. Tom 458 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:09,440 Speaker 3: has been a longtime professional musician. Well, I feel has 459 00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:13,199 Speaker 3: the pause button on that career right now, and a 460 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 3: lot has to do with grief. So let's continue with 461 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 3: him talking about signs and his music and grief. 462 00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:22,920 Speaker 1: It's strange because I've been in music in my life too, 463 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:25,359 Speaker 1: and music has not been a part of it. Really. 464 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:29,159 Speaker 1: I'm not involved in music now, so maybe that's it. 465 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:31,440 Speaker 1: People send me a lot of music in it initially, 466 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: and I did not want to listen to anything. But 467 00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:37,120 Speaker 1: that's still a place I kind of don't want to go. 468 00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,040 Speaker 1: I'll tell you another story that happened today though, and 469 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 1: this is interesting. I posted a poem on my podcast 470 00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 1: page and it's a beautiful poem. So I posted the 471 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 1: poem and I had sent this actually to my daughter, 472 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:54,879 Speaker 1: to Jeff's sister, and I put the emojis on there. 473 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,159 Speaker 1: I put a couple emojis. I put a heart with 474 00:26:57,280 --> 00:26:59,480 Speaker 1: stars on it, and then I put one hundred percent 475 00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 1: thing and then I put a thumbs up. And that's 476 00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,400 Speaker 1: what I sent to her yesterday, and today I put 477 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 1: it on the podcast. Well you know, I put those 478 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:09,679 Speaker 1: things on there. I posted it and I looked at 479 00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:14,520 Speaker 1: it and there's a buffalo in there. And I was like, 480 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 1: I didn't click on the buffalo, and I was going 481 00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:18,919 Speaker 1: to change it and take it out, and then I 482 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 1: thought Jeff, Jeff and I were huge are huge Buffalo 483 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,760 Speaker 1: Bills fans, and we watched every single game together. We 484 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:30,400 Speaker 1: have his jersey up in our garage with lights around 485 00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:34,040 Speaker 1: it on a memorial wall for Jeff and everything. I 486 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: acknowledge him. Every game. We do jello shots for the 487 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,919 Speaker 1: Bill's touchdowns. I do one for him every time. You 488 00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:43,240 Speaker 1: know so, but the Buffalo's in there, and I was like, 489 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:47,840 Speaker 1: of course, I mean, just crazy stuff, amazing. 490 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:49,959 Speaker 3: I's like he has a great sense of humor. 491 00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 1: Oh, absolutely, and being a young. 492 00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:57,719 Speaker 3: Man, because you're a young man, there's technology, there's different 493 00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:01,800 Speaker 3: ways I think they'll used to be in touch with us. 494 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 3: You know, my grandmother died at ninety, so she probably 495 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:10,440 Speaker 3: not so much would use the emojis. I think our 496 00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:15,000 Speaker 3: personalities and our interests dictate how people work with us 497 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 3: and through us. So I think as much as you're 498 00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 3: focusing on slowing down, being present, paying attention, talking to him, 499 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 3: he's being creative in different ways to be in touch 500 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,439 Speaker 3: from his side and what works, what doesn't work. Let 501 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,440 Speaker 3: me knock over the shovel. 502 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I literally did laugh then, and it was 503 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 1: a hurtful time and I just shook my head like, oh, Jeff, 504 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 1: you know so typical, Like you said, such a humor 505 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: for sure. Yeah. Yeah. 506 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 3: Let's talk a little bit about grief because I think 507 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:51,960 Speaker 3: one of the reasons that we have such a difficult 508 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:55,360 Speaker 3: time with it, well, one is that's part of our biology. 509 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 3: But other than that, death is kept so distant from us. 510 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 3: Undred years ago, people grew up in a totally different 511 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 3: time and funerals were in their living room. They're parlor, right, 512 00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 3: and it's funny because once they started moving out of 513 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 3: the house that that's when the name living room came 514 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 3: because before that it was parlor and that was associated 515 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:23,680 Speaker 3: with death. And so grief normally hurts awful, But then 516 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 3: when it's caught out of the blue, and then we've 517 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:31,280 Speaker 3: never had training on it as human beings, which is 518 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:36,960 Speaker 3: amazing because people are raised learning how to rear a 519 00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 3: child or get a book on this, that and the 520 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 3: other thing, but it's not taught about before we grieve. 521 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:49,120 Speaker 3: And so people like you and me and others and 522 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:51,160 Speaker 3: let people know that this is a very real thing 523 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:52,880 Speaker 3: and how to best navigate through it. 524 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 1: Can we just talk a little bit about. 525 00:29:54,840 --> 00:30:00,200 Speaker 3: Grief and perhaps your recommendations If somebody's going through a 526 00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:04,400 Speaker 3: time where they're feeling extreme guilt, you know those could 527 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 3: as should have would have moments and replaying things in 528 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:11,280 Speaker 3: our mind and the tremendous pain. Yes, we're going to 529 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 3: point them to Heroes and Grief podcast. But what can 530 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:17,440 Speaker 3: we do? What are some tools that we can do 531 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:18,680 Speaker 3: on the court. 532 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 1: Yes, I'll definitely address that first. First of all, you 533 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 1: shouldn't grieve alone. Nobody should grieve alone. Were I don't 534 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,800 Speaker 1: think we're meant to. I think we're meant to be together. 535 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: And especially in the greeting process, so many things can 536 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,160 Speaker 1: happen when you're associated with other people, and especially other 537 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 1: people who have been grieving. They understand things on a 538 00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:42,280 Speaker 1: level that you can relate to, and so it really 539 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:46,320 Speaker 1: helps that those things about grief or guilt and all 540 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:51,080 Speaker 1: of that, the troublesome scenes. I experienced that myself, the 541 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 1: things that pop into your head, it's a retraining of 542 00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: the mind. You need to acknowledge it at the time, 543 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,560 Speaker 1: and you need to feel it. Anything with grief, you 544 00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:02,280 Speaker 1: need to it and go through it or it's going 545 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,080 Speaker 1: to come back on you at some times. So if 546 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:09,240 Speaker 1: you want to lessen and quicken the process of living 547 00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:12,760 Speaker 1: with more love than pain in your life through the 548 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:16,320 Speaker 1: grief process, then you need to deal with it. You 549 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:18,560 Speaker 1: need to sit down with it and go through it. 550 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 1: So when the pain comes, when you experience it, when 551 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,600 Speaker 1: it goes through. For instance, that image came through my head. 552 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:28,400 Speaker 1: I was at the volleyball game and that popped into 553 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:32,239 Speaker 1: my head and I was like, what you know, and 554 00:31:32,360 --> 00:31:34,479 Speaker 1: it hurt and tears came to my eyes and I 555 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 1: sat with it for a second and then I said 556 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: you know what, I'm going to start replacing this with 557 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,320 Speaker 1: something else so that can move on from my mind. 558 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,120 Speaker 1: So you deal with it, you acknowledge it. And so 559 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,160 Speaker 1: what I started doing, and it's the suggestion again that 560 00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 1: I got from David Kessler and his sessions in Tender Hearts, 561 00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:55,720 Speaker 1: the group that he has online. You talk to somebody, 562 00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:58,600 Speaker 1: and he said, when those things come, to replace them 563 00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:01,120 Speaker 1: with better images and ignore knowledgement of the person and 564 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:03,960 Speaker 1: things like that. So what I do is I say 565 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 1: I love you, Jeff, I love you Jeff, and I 566 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,600 Speaker 1: start thinking other things about Jeff, the better things, the 567 00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: life things, and retraining my mind to get away from 568 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,640 Speaker 1: that vision and those things that are going on. Eventually, 569 00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:21,320 Speaker 1: that process changes as those memories come, and I deal 570 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:23,320 Speaker 1: with it a lot quicker now, you know, I certainly 571 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 1: think of it still, It's still going to come up 572 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: in my mind, but it's also dealt with differently. I 573 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:31,880 Speaker 1: am in a stronger sense with it. It's still hurts 574 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:34,680 Speaker 1: sometimes sometimes I sit in it and I just say 575 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:37,640 Speaker 1: it's horrible, and I go through some of the details 576 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,520 Speaker 1: of it and work through it. But then I still 577 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:42,240 Speaker 1: work to come out of it. And you need to 578 00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:44,360 Speaker 1: do that. You need to look at those other things 579 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:46,840 Speaker 1: and retrain your mind to go in a different direction. 580 00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:51,560 Speaker 1: So you talked about being more proactive in the grief conversation, 581 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:56,240 Speaker 1: and this is a huge passion of mine. It's just 582 00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 1: it's come out of nowhere. But I think that this 583 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,080 Speaker 1: needs to be part of wellness training, it needs to 584 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:05,479 Speaker 1: be part of early education. We're all going to go 585 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:09,760 Speaker 1: through grief. There's so many resources in the underground of 586 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 1: us grief workers. And I found this out because I'm 587 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 1: a good networker and on social media. You know, there's 588 00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:18,000 Speaker 1: hundreds of podcasts out there about grief. Everybody's like, Oh, 589 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,040 Speaker 1: you're doing such a remarkable thing. There's plenty out there, 590 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: people just don't know about them. This is where our 591 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 1: society squelches the grief conversation and says, oh, we don't 592 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,120 Speaker 1: want grief. They're okay on a reactive situation. But we 593 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:34,880 Speaker 1: can be way more proactive than grief and the conversation. 594 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:36,960 Speaker 1: And I think it should be done at workplaces. I 595 00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: think it should be done in the student settings to 596 00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:42,720 Speaker 1: help people be more equipped with grief. Whether it's for 597 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:45,760 Speaker 1: the grieving person or the people around them. They can 598 00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 1: be educated better how to be around a grieving person 599 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,160 Speaker 1: and make it a lot easier on you and them. 600 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 1: So many people that'll ask the question, how are you doing, 601 00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:58,480 Speaker 1: and then you start really telling them as an honest 602 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,160 Speaker 1: grieving person, and they don't want to hear that. They're 603 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 1: not ready for that. They need to understand that they 604 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:05,959 Speaker 1: need to receive it and be ready to receive in 605 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:09,799 Speaker 1: love and compassion. Sometimes a grieving person, even though they're 606 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,200 Speaker 1: grieving for a long time, all of a sudden they 607 00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:15,520 Speaker 1: just start crying at work, and somebody may think that 608 00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:18,520 Speaker 1: they cause that to happen or whatever. No, it happens, 609 00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,360 Speaker 1: and it still happens. So there's just a lot of 610 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:23,799 Speaker 1: things that people can be enlightened to. I think I 611 00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,400 Speaker 1: would really love to be part of that process. I 612 00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,560 Speaker 1: started a thing called Grief Talks, where I'm pushing to 613 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:31,799 Speaker 1: try to get into places to be able to do 614 00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:34,359 Speaker 1: that type of thing, and of course also help in 615 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:37,840 Speaker 1: a grieving situation. If something has happened at a place 616 00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:40,759 Speaker 1: or organization, whatever it may be, it doesn't matter to 617 00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:44,160 Speaker 1: me where I go. So that's a big passion. And yeah, 618 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:47,520 Speaker 1: you struck a chord there beyond that, and it seems 619 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:49,400 Speaker 1: to come up again and again really for me. So 620 00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:51,880 Speaker 1: that's how I know that the universe is kind of 621 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:53,960 Speaker 1: leading you in that way. You get these pushes and 622 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:56,440 Speaker 1: they keep coming up again and again. The same circumstances 623 00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:59,359 Speaker 1: are people talking about it. So I feel that I'm 624 00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:01,040 Speaker 1: heading that direct for sure. 625 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,920 Speaker 3: I know my listeners know my story, and I know 626 00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 3: you're going to be interviewing me next week, so I 627 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:10,840 Speaker 3: won't get too much into this right now. But with me, 628 00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:15,080 Speaker 3: grief devastated me. With the death of my father causing 629 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:19,200 Speaker 3: a breakdown of my relationships with siblings, I hit rock bottom. 630 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:22,799 Speaker 3: And before that I knew I was going to someday 631 00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:26,960 Speaker 3: share the afterlife stuff that I was learning, But it 632 00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:30,680 Speaker 3: was really learning about grief and the impact and things 633 00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,600 Speaker 3: we can do to move through the pain that gave 634 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,880 Speaker 3: me the kick in the butt to get these words 635 00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:39,960 Speaker 3: out there. And I really did want to share what 636 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 3: I knew about the afterlife. So the book's titled We 637 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,840 Speaker 3: Don't Die as Skeptics Discovery of Life after Death. But 638 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:48,200 Speaker 3: I thought, like it or not, I'm going to educate 639 00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,280 Speaker 3: people on grief, and so that's chapter ten. So folks 640 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,360 Speaker 3: like it or not, but you do like it because 641 00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:57,239 Speaker 3: you realize that grief isn't just when a loved one dies. 642 00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:01,560 Speaker 3: It can be for so many different things that happen 643 00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,520 Speaker 3: with relationships, and you know, so many different things. So 644 00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:08,440 Speaker 3: I think anytime we can give somebody a helping hand. 645 00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:12,360 Speaker 3: And for those people that are uncomfortable, they don't know 646 00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:14,760 Speaker 3: how to deal with it, well, it's just because grief 647 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:19,680 Speaker 3: hasn't hit you yet, but it will. And I would 648 00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:24,440 Speaker 3: much rather hear from somebody who's experienced grief because they know. 649 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:26,719 Speaker 3: It's like a club that we belong to that we 650 00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:29,360 Speaker 3: didn't really ask to be part of, but it really 651 00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,720 Speaker 3: helps people need people we don't want to be alone, 652 00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:35,359 Speaker 3: and so I applaud you for that. What else can 653 00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 3: we find on your website, Heroes in grief dot com. 654 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:41,480 Speaker 3: There's a way to access your podcast there right. 655 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,080 Speaker 1: All the informations. There are links to go to where 656 00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,160 Speaker 1: you need to go to. I have a couple groups 657 00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:49,960 Speaker 1: that I started on Facebook. I searched resources early on, 658 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 1: probably in the springtime, right after Jeff past I searched 659 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:57,200 Speaker 1: online for a local grief group on Facebook because I 660 00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,239 Speaker 1: tend to do well online, so that's why I do 661 00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:01,799 Speaker 1: that type of stuff. So I looked and there was 662 00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,480 Speaker 1: no group. I was shocked to find that there was 663 00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,480 Speaker 1: no grief group for Western New York people or Buffalo 664 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:09,960 Speaker 1: or any of the area. So I started one, and 665 00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:13,680 Speaker 1: it's called Western New York Network for Grief and the Grieving. 666 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:15,920 Speaker 1: It's for people just to have a safe place to 667 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,720 Speaker 1: come and share grief with others. I have a Grief 668 00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:23,359 Speaker 1: Talks Facebook page. I have Friends of the podcast page 669 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:26,440 Speaker 1: where people could discuss things about the podcast if they wish, 670 00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,040 Speaker 1: and the YouTube page, and now the grief Talks that 671 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,040 Speaker 1: I'm trying to get out there as well. There's a 672 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:34,440 Speaker 1: shop on there and it has the books and resources 673 00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,440 Speaker 1: from the guests that I've had on the podcast, so 674 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:39,880 Speaker 1: those are available there and the links who are always 675 00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:41,960 Speaker 1: in the show notes of the shows that I do too. 676 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:44,920 Speaker 3: My friends. I'm going to stop for our break here, 677 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,759 Speaker 3: and why I'm doing that is because when we get back, 678 00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:51,480 Speaker 3: Tom will continue talking about some interesting things he does 679 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:55,440 Speaker 3: as an uber driver to engage in the conversation. And 680 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:58,440 Speaker 3: then also we'll get back to those three questions I 681 00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:01,600 Speaker 3: asked you in the beginning, so we'll be right back. 682 00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,560 Speaker 3: You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio 683 00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:26,919 Speaker 3: and Coast to Coast am Paranormal Podcast Network. Welcome back 684 00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:30,279 Speaker 3: to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandras Champlain and we 685 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:34,320 Speaker 3: are here with the fabulous Tom Bender, host of Heroes 686 00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:38,759 Speaker 3: in Grief podcast. Tom seems to have found one of 687 00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 3: his life purposes helping people through grief, and you may 688 00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:49,360 Speaker 3: be surprised to learn how he engages people in conversation because, 689 00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:54,719 Speaker 3: as we know, people need people. So let's continue with Tom. 690 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,759 Speaker 1: You are speaking, and it struck me too that so 691 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:01,120 Speaker 1: many people they may reach out to wants and have 692 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:04,080 Speaker 1: a bad experience or not get what they wanted. I 693 00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:06,160 Speaker 1: just want to tell people you've got to keep pressing. 694 00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:08,200 Speaker 1: There's something out there for you, and the same thing 695 00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:11,080 Speaker 1: with resources. There's something for you there. And I just 696 00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:14,520 Speaker 1: want to encourage people to press on in that and 697 00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:15,759 Speaker 1: you can get help for sure. 698 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:18,360 Speaker 3: Thank you. Can we just do a little plug for 699 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:22,799 Speaker 3: our friends at Helpingparents Heal dot org and let us 700 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:25,080 Speaker 3: know the difference they've made or what's available. 701 00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:28,640 Speaker 1: I am passionate about Helping Parents Heal and I'm in 702 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:33,320 Speaker 1: Helping Fathers Heal group. It's just dads we've lost children. 703 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,520 Speaker 1: It is a Facebook group, but we have a zoom 704 00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:41,680 Speaker 1: session meeting with the men every Wednesday night. It's eight easterns, 705 00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:43,880 Speaker 1: so whatever that works out in the other time zones. 706 00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,839 Speaker 1: You want to be there every single week. And every 707 00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:48,840 Speaker 1: man says that in the group, they're like, oh, I 708 00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:52,120 Speaker 1: can't wait for Wednesdays. It's men sharing as men do 709 00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:56,160 Speaker 1: and that is great. So helping parents heal in general. 710 00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,040 Speaker 1: I got to go to the conference in August. They 711 00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:02,359 Speaker 1: have a conference two years down in Phoenix. We had 712 00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:06,520 Speaker 1: evidential mediums there who brought out the children for certain 713 00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,520 Speaker 1: parents there. And one gentleman, his daughter came through and 714 00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:12,200 Speaker 1: he was behind me in the conference room and it 715 00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:16,239 Speaker 1: was so personal and obviously things that no way these 716 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:20,719 Speaker 1: mediums could know from any other source. And afterwards I 717 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:23,160 Speaker 1: said to that dad, and he's a rawnie guy, his 718 00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:26,760 Speaker 1: military or whatever, and I said, were you like bawling 719 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:29,440 Speaker 1: because I was when they were saying what they were 720 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,400 Speaker 1: saying his daughter was coming through, and he goes, of 721 00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:36,040 Speaker 1: course I was bawling. And so he's actually written this story. Now. 722 00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:39,640 Speaker 1: Mike Johnson is paid remarkable on helping parents heal. But 723 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:41,719 Speaker 1: when I was there, and you want that and you 724 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:44,480 Speaker 1: desire that, and then I heard one of the speakers say, 725 00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:47,239 Speaker 1: if your child's not coming through, don't get discouraged. It 726 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:49,960 Speaker 1: may be that possibly you don't need it as much 727 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:52,879 Speaker 1: as somebody else, or something like that. And I thought 728 00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,960 Speaker 1: about that, and I thought that may be the case. 729 00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:57,319 Speaker 1: I don't know. I feel okay and strong in this, 730 00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:00,600 Speaker 1: and I know Jeff's president. And then I thought about it. 731 00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:02,759 Speaker 1: And as I said to you before, if I thought 732 00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,320 Speaker 1: about all the things that occurred to me through Jeff 733 00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:10,240 Speaker 1: and with Jeff, that I would have a legal binder 734 00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:13,160 Speaker 1: to take into court and show my evidence. It would 735 00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:16,759 Speaker 1: be huge. I don't document it. I should. Everybody says 736 00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:20,200 Speaker 1: about your and I know it's great, but I don't. 737 00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:22,439 Speaker 1: But I would have that I don't have to worry 738 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:23,880 Speaker 1: about it. Thank you. 739 00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:28,760 Speaker 3: Helpingparents. Heal dot Org is the website and there's somewhere 740 00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:33,400 Speaker 3: around twenty thousand members, big organization. If you're not a parent, 741 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,040 Speaker 3: you can still access the YouTube channel and the website. 742 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:40,319 Speaker 3: There's lots of resources on the website itself, but the 743 00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:44,920 Speaker 3: YouTube channel is loaded with just great videos and interviews 744 00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:49,560 Speaker 3: and medium demonstrations and if people don't know, every Sunday 745 00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:52,600 Speaker 3: at two pm Eastern time, we do a free inspirational 746 00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:57,040 Speaker 3: non denominational service on Zoom. Everybody's welcome. In the last 747 00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,640 Speaker 3: forty five minutes of each one is a medium demonstration 748 00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:03,000 Speaker 3: occurred to me, Tom, while we're talking, I'm going to 749 00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:04,440 Speaker 3: throw this out there. Would you like to be a 750 00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:07,000 Speaker 3: guest speaker sometime on our Sunday gathering? 751 00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:10,799 Speaker 1: Wow? What an honor. I would absolutely be honored to 752 00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:12,920 Speaker 1: do that. Thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. 753 00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:15,520 Speaker 3: It just words that I know will make a difference. 754 00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:18,320 Speaker 3: So we'll talk about that after while we're here together. 755 00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:18,920 Speaker 1: You're welcome. 756 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:21,000 Speaker 3: I just you're somebody that makes a difference and I 757 00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:24,120 Speaker 3: can get your words to the most amount of people. 758 00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:27,080 Speaker 3: That's what I'm here to do. I've taken courses in 759 00:42:27,239 --> 00:42:30,400 Speaker 3: medium ship. I'm not an active medium. I don't do 760 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:33,399 Speaker 3: medium readings, but I feel like the universe is using 761 00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:35,520 Speaker 3: me as a medium in a different way to get 762 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:38,880 Speaker 3: good people's stories out to the most amount of people, 763 00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:43,960 Speaker 3: to help get through grief, look at life the bigger picture, 764 00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:48,200 Speaker 3: and to know that we're each important in our own 765 00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:52,560 Speaker 3: unique way. We're all those facets of the diamond, all perfect, 766 00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:56,080 Speaker 3: whole and complete, and to know there's just such a 767 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,080 Speaker 3: bigger purpose. So Tom what else would you like to 768 00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:02,520 Speaker 3: share with our minutes together, If there's anything I should 769 00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:05,200 Speaker 3: have asked you that I didn't any maybe last words 770 00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:06,600 Speaker 3: of inspiration you have. 771 00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:12,200 Speaker 1: I continually go back to who I was, I think 772 00:43:13,239 --> 00:43:16,440 Speaker 1: and where people may be. We progress in this, and 773 00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:19,640 Speaker 1: we have this belief and trust in this now and 774 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:23,000 Speaker 1: confidence in this. And I think of the people who 775 00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:25,600 Speaker 1: aren't there, and I can almost see it as being 776 00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:30,200 Speaker 1: something that's almost not offensive but discouraging to them. So 777 00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:32,799 Speaker 1: I'm sensitive to them, and it just keeps raising up 778 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:34,160 Speaker 1: for me too, And I just want to tell you 779 00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,600 Speaker 1: that once again, we are just normal folks who have 780 00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:40,680 Speaker 1: experienced these great things and are sharing them with you. 781 00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:43,200 Speaker 1: And I tell people sometimes these discussions come up in 782 00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:45,759 Speaker 1: my car. I drive for a company here in the 783 00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:48,000 Speaker 1: Falls that does charters and things like that, but I 784 00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:51,160 Speaker 1: also drive uber and lyft during the day, and I 785 00:43:51,200 --> 00:43:53,440 Speaker 1: decided to put a placard on the back of my 786 00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:55,640 Speaker 1: seats that the people can see while they're riding in 787 00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:58,560 Speaker 1: my car, and I put in there, and I believe 788 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:00,319 Speaker 1: I was led to put this. I put I saw 789 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:05,000 Speaker 1: Jeff past from Fennol, and then I put I'm okay 790 00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,600 Speaker 1: to talk about it. And I think that line has 791 00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:11,680 Speaker 1: made such a difference, and this has really brought out 792 00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:16,720 Speaker 1: conversations with people and sometimes their addicts, sometimes they're grieving people. 793 00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:19,960 Speaker 1: Sometimes they know somebody else in grief, and so I 794 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,600 Speaker 1: feel I was allowed to do that to foster this 795 00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:26,000 Speaker 1: conversation even in that context. So I just want to 796 00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:29,600 Speaker 1: tell people that there's so much available for you and 797 00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:32,920 Speaker 1: if you can share with people who maybe alone in 798 00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:35,520 Speaker 1: their grief. I did have a woman contact me recently 799 00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:38,400 Speaker 1: lost her daughter and they just sit at the dining 800 00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:40,880 Speaker 1: room table every day and don't do anything. It's been months, 801 00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:44,080 Speaker 1: and I'm like, you got to get together with people. 802 00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:47,640 Speaker 1: The community is needed to get you through these things, 803 00:44:47,800 --> 00:44:50,600 Speaker 1: and so you need to do that. And there's so 804 00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:54,480 Speaker 1: many resources available that you know, and that's part of 805 00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:57,640 Speaker 1: the podcast too. They can fit your style for every 806 00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:01,239 Speaker 1: make or size of person, for or there's something out 807 00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:04,160 Speaker 1: there for you and something you could connect with. Just 808 00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:07,920 Speaker 1: start looking into it, start explore it like you would 809 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,439 Speaker 1: anything else. You'd research anything else, right, So just look 810 00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:14,000 Speaker 1: into it. We don't have to recruit you. It's not 811 00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:18,160 Speaker 1: about recruiting. We just tell our stories and what we're experiencing, 812 00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:21,040 Speaker 1: and we get excited about them because we know that 813 00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:24,239 Speaker 1: other people can experience that too, and that's the greatest thing. 814 00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,200 Speaker 3: Well, thank you for that. You just brought to my 815 00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:31,720 Speaker 3: mind the word inspiration. And when I was writing my book, 816 00:45:32,120 --> 00:45:35,400 Speaker 3: I got some coaching that just start writing even if 817 00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:38,160 Speaker 3: you don't know what to say, and it's like this 818 00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:42,960 Speaker 3: wind of inspiration in spirit comes to help. Last night 819 00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:46,880 Speaker 3: I was recording a podcast and I needed some help editing, 820 00:45:46,920 --> 00:45:50,040 Speaker 3: and I just I was procrastinating. Just start and then 821 00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:52,800 Speaker 3: all of a sudden, whosh, it came in. So, whether 822 00:45:52,840 --> 00:45:56,759 Speaker 3: it's researching the afterlife, grief, whatever that is in your 823 00:45:56,760 --> 00:45:59,440 Speaker 3: life that you're passionate about it, like you said, just 824 00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:02,520 Speaker 3: keep pushing, take that one step in the direction of it. 825 00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:06,880 Speaker 3: And I believe those in the unseen world that spirit 826 00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:09,920 Speaker 3: or the soul within will kick in, but it takes 827 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:12,360 Speaker 3: us taking that very first action. 828 00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:15,600 Speaker 1: Yes, and your journey is your own. You know where 829 00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:17,560 Speaker 1: you are is all right. But I tell some of 830 00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:19,520 Speaker 1: these people who talk to me in the car and 831 00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:21,840 Speaker 1: they're just sometimes they just shake in their heads like 832 00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:25,600 Speaker 1: where did this come from? And what I say is, 833 00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:30,120 Speaker 1: for one thing, I do not believe in coincidences. They 834 00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:32,359 Speaker 1: were there for a reason they were put in my car. 835 00:46:32,440 --> 00:46:35,880 Speaker 1: We were connected for a reason. You're hearing this podcast 836 00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:38,800 Speaker 1: for a reason right now, folks out there who are listening, 837 00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:42,600 Speaker 1: and there's a reason why you've listened to it today. 838 00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:45,920 Speaker 1: And so that's what I tell you to explore, not 839 00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:49,399 Speaker 1: any particular thing that we've said or anything like that, 840 00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:53,359 Speaker 1: but they are resources for you to explore that you 841 00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:56,320 Speaker 1: were put here to listen or to receive what you've 842 00:46:56,400 --> 00:46:59,720 Speaker 1: gained from whatever you hear or listen to from somebody. 843 00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:04,120 Speaker 1: So that's the remarkable thing to me. I tell this 844 00:47:04,160 --> 00:47:06,080 Speaker 1: person in the car, don't think of me or whatever, 845 00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:09,279 Speaker 1: think of the fact that you were in this car, 846 00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:12,080 Speaker 1: and there's reason why you were there, and that's what 847 00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:13,000 Speaker 1: you need to explore. 848 00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:17,880 Speaker 3: Absolutely, yeah, absolutely, And yeah I know it's not about you, 849 00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:20,320 Speaker 3: it's not about me. Where the messengers. If it was 850 00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:22,520 Speaker 3: about us, we'd have a big egos and the world 851 00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:25,960 Speaker 3: couldn't handle it. No, no, no, So just keep staying grounded. 852 00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:28,239 Speaker 3: And also that's a really good tool for people to 853 00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,480 Speaker 3: use what you put on the back of your seats. 854 00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:35,759 Speaker 3: We connect when we can feel each other's humanity. And yes, 855 00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:38,600 Speaker 3: you know, people post pictures of the food they eat 856 00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:41,279 Speaker 3: on social media and all that good stuff, But it 857 00:47:41,320 --> 00:47:43,200 Speaker 3: really is when we get into these heart to heart 858 00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:47,120 Speaker 3: conversations and if we can give ourselves the permission to 859 00:47:47,160 --> 00:47:50,520 Speaker 3: share some of those things, other people feel like, hey, 860 00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:52,960 Speaker 3: if he's talking about this, I can too. And that's 861 00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:55,760 Speaker 3: where you can make the real connections with other human 862 00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:57,840 Speaker 3: beings and people need people. 863 00:47:58,280 --> 00:47:59,960 Speaker 1: So yeah, you know that is something that came to 864 00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:01,960 Speaker 1: mine as you were saying that, is that these people 865 00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:06,080 Speaker 1: want it, they want that conversation, they've wanted it, and 866 00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,120 Speaker 1: that's what I feel when they leave sometimes. 867 00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:13,920 Speaker 3: Well, Tom, I needed doing what you're doing. And Tom, 868 00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,120 Speaker 3: thank you so much for being our guest today. 869 00:48:17,239 --> 00:48:19,160 Speaker 1: Thank you, And like I said, it's such a privilege 870 00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:21,640 Speaker 1: in looking forward to hearing more about you. 871 00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:26,239 Speaker 3: Tom and I have become friends and very soon you 872 00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:30,960 Speaker 3: can find my episode with him on Heroes in Grief 873 00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:37,239 Speaker 3: dot com. Tom has found a life purpose, as have I. 874 00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:42,600 Speaker 3: But is it the life purpose? Is there a purpose 875 00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:46,600 Speaker 3: to each of our lives like one? Nope, I don't 876 00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:49,839 Speaker 3: think so. While we're on this planet, if you look 877 00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:53,760 Speaker 3: at the person you've been being, what you've been doing, 878 00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:57,640 Speaker 3: the people you've been with, you may see a trend 879 00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:01,479 Speaker 3: our life purpose does not have to be one thing. 880 00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:05,480 Speaker 3: It can be how we're being. I'm someone who likes 881 00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:08,320 Speaker 3: to make a difference. I'm someone who loves to share. 882 00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:12,040 Speaker 3: I'm someone who likes to have fun. All of those 883 00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:14,719 Speaker 3: are part of my life purpose. But if we go 884 00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:19,239 Speaker 3: back to those three questions, here they are. If I 885 00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:22,840 Speaker 3: knew I couldn't fail, what would I do or be? 886 00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:26,080 Speaker 3: If I knew I had one hundred million dollars in 887 00:49:26,120 --> 00:49:30,600 Speaker 3: the bank, what would I do or be? And the last, 888 00:49:30,719 --> 00:49:33,839 Speaker 3: if I knew I had only six months to live, 889 00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:38,399 Speaker 3: what would I do or be? There's a time of year, 890 00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:43,480 Speaker 3: my friend, that people make resolutions. Instead of looking at 891 00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:47,640 Speaker 3: what's wrong, look at what's right, Look at who you've 892 00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:52,120 Speaker 3: been being and what you've been doing. Answer those questions 893 00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:58,680 Speaker 3: for yourself. Program your GPS in that direction, and I 894 00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:03,359 Speaker 3: promise you when you take action, the invisible forces will 895 00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:07,920 Speaker 3: kick in and add wind to your sales, bringing you 896 00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:12,480 Speaker 3: towards the life of your dreams. As a reminder, come 897 00:50:12,560 --> 00:50:17,440 Speaker 3: visit me at We Don't Die dot com. I'm Sandra Champlain. 898 00:50:18,120 --> 00:50:21,880 Speaker 3: Thank you so much for listening to Shades of the 899 00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:27,040 Speaker 3: Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am Paranormal 900 00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:28,760 Speaker 3: Podcast Network. 901 00:50:35,040 --> 00:50:37,560 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast 902 00:50:37,600 --> 00:50:40,600 Speaker 2: Day and Paranormal Podcast Network. Make sure and check out 903 00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:43,879 Speaker 2: all our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going 904 00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:50,759 Speaker 2: to iHeartRadio dot com