WEBVTT - Xtras: The Lighthouse 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:05.600 Today's episode contains spoilers for The Witch and The Lighthouse, 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:25.440 so be prepared for that. Hello, my name is Joel Lenique. 0:00:25.680 --> 0:00:28.240 And I am Carmen Laurent and. 0:00:28.200 --> 0:00:30.760 Welcome to Xtra Vision Extras, an X ray vision series 0:00:30.760 --> 0:00:34.440 where we dive deep into even more of your favorite shows, movies, comics, 0:00:34.440 --> 0:00:38.040 and pop culture. Every superhero team meets side Quest, and 0:00:38.120 --> 0:00:40.680 our rotating panel of producers and guest hosts will be 0:00:40.720 --> 0:00:43.000 suiting up to help Jason and Rosie cover all of 0:00:43.040 --> 0:00:44.600 the amazing nerd content out there. 0:00:45.040 --> 0:00:49.040 Today in the series of Robert Egger's coverage, we are 0:00:49.080 --> 0:00:55.080 covering the movie from twenty nineteen, The Lighthouse, and in 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:57.400 our this is all in our lead up to the 0:00:57.600 --> 0:01:00.840 movie coming out on Christmas Day this year No Speratu, 0:01:01.160 --> 0:01:05.119 so get ready for that and like I said, get 0:01:05.160 --> 0:01:06.119 all your gas out now. 0:01:07.280 --> 0:01:12.679 Tired of these damn farts. But first, yes, previously on okay, 0:01:12.760 --> 0:01:15.119 let's try to have you listened to The Witch. Last 0:01:15.120 --> 0:01:16.960 week we had a very chaotic recap. We're going to 0:01:17.000 --> 0:01:20.240 try to duplicate recapping the Stillness Sour. I was thinking 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:23.880 about Essel's watching and I was like, it's so big 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:28.840 and nebulous. This movie that it's really hard to beyond 0:01:28.880 --> 0:01:31.280 the basic description, which I think would go something like 0:01:31.319 --> 0:01:35.240 this young man gets hired to go to a lighthouse 0:01:35.520 --> 0:01:42.840 where he meets an over zealous aged lighthouse watcher. Uh huh, 0:01:43.319 --> 0:01:47.440 as he's pushed to the edge of his sanity to 0:01:47.440 --> 0:01:51.120 anyone with an overzealous boss can easily identify with a 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:55.440 battle ensues between the two of them, centered specifically on 0:01:55.520 --> 0:02:02.240 their masculinity. Over time, power exchanges hands more and more rapidly, 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:04.800 to the point where sometimes you're talking two minutes of 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:07.360 a character being in a position of power before somebody 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:11.560 else overtakes that. Uh. They are driven mad by isolation, 0:02:12.160 --> 0:02:13.359 bad weather. 0:02:13.320 --> 0:02:16.440 And the sea, maybe even the lighthouse. 0:02:16.720 --> 0:02:19.960 Possibly, Oh, we're going to get into Possibly the lighthouse 0:02:20.040 --> 0:02:23.280 is doing it, and they're both driven to a state 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:26.120 of madness that sort of ends up in a BDSM 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:31.160 pet play relationships. There are a spackling of great Shakespearean 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:35.600 monologues where Egres gets to showcase his knowledge of the 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:39.240 bard An attempt to do some of his own monologue writing, 0:02:40.080 --> 0:02:45.000 and mysterious ending did we do it, didn't we do it? 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:54.400 Yeah, it's very it's very I mean, this is like 0:02:54.680 --> 0:02:57.000 and we're gonna we're gonna talk about it in the 0:02:57.040 --> 0:03:01.040 discussion here, but it's very much like a very cosmic horror, 0:03:01.240 --> 0:03:04.519 and that is what leads to it being kind of, 0:03:04.560 --> 0:03:08.320 I think, so confusing and also fun to watch, or 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:10.239 all of the cosmic elements of this. 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:14.240 So glad you said cosmic horror, because the whole time 0:03:14.320 --> 0:03:18.880 I was thinking about space. Hear me out, Yes, like 0:03:19.000 --> 0:03:23.720 the ocean being this vast unknown, the ocean maybe being 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:27.880 a stand in for women. I had this thought of, like, Okay, 0:03:28.080 --> 0:03:31.600 maybe this film is saying the ocean is like women 0:03:31.680 --> 0:03:34.800 in that they are deep and unknowable, and they are 0:03:34.960 --> 0:03:37.839 a horizon you cannot touch, especially if you're a man 0:03:37.960 --> 0:03:42.200 isolated on an island with another man, which was like, 0:03:42.840 --> 0:03:45.800 that's the the layers of visual artistry we're dealing with. 0:03:46.080 --> 0:03:47.640 Let's go over some of the stats of this film 0:03:47.640 --> 0:03:51.240 before we get too far into a breakdown. So this 0:03:51.280 --> 0:03:54.320 is released May nineteen, twenty nineteen. It can October eighteenth. 0:03:54.400 --> 0:03:56.880 It comes to US theaters. It's got a budget of 0:03:56.920 --> 0:03:59.560 eleven million and does a box office of about eighteen 0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:02.840 point three, which for a sophomore film coming off the 0:04:02.880 --> 0:04:08.400 success of The Witch. Yeah, it's interesting. I think from 0:04:08.560 --> 0:04:12.240 a producer investor perspective, this might have been a little 0:04:12.240 --> 0:04:18.480 bit disappointing. But from an artistic director standpoint, if your 0:04:18.520 --> 0:04:23.520 movie makes money, you did it. We can pay back 0:04:23.560 --> 0:04:26.560 the investors. Everyone got a small percentage. We didn't make 0:04:26.560 --> 0:04:28.080 as much money as we were hoping, but we got 0:04:28.080 --> 0:04:29.520 our percentages off. 0:04:29.800 --> 0:04:33.120 That's a seven million, seven million, you know. 0:04:33.120 --> 0:04:36.440 What, Damn straight seven million is enough to start funding 0:04:36.480 --> 0:04:38.919 the next film. We can put it that way. Jarren 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:42.320 Blashki is the cinematographer. 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:45.279 Sorry, also basically the same team he used for The 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:50.880 Witch Yes music and cinematography, which is great. 0:04:51.000 --> 0:04:54.400 I think I really appreciate a director who's like, this 0:04:54.600 --> 0:04:57.720 is my crew, because if you have spent a lot 0:04:57.720 --> 0:05:00.560 of time on a crew, it's just really good. I'm Carmen. 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:02.600 You spent your first was that your first time working 0:05:02.640 --> 0:05:05.520 with the film crew when you were down in Texas? 0:05:05.800 --> 0:05:07.640 No, we did it here in Atlanta. We did it 0:05:08.000 --> 0:05:13.120 at the Atlanta Capital. That was with Lisa from The 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:14.679 Fake Doctor's Real Friends production. 0:05:15.240 --> 0:05:15.400 Yea. 0:05:15.640 --> 0:05:17.400 And of course I've been on I've been on a 0:05:17.440 --> 0:05:21.000 set when we did our Toyota film, our Toyota commercial, 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:25.479 and I've been on another set with Violet when she 0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:29.600 shot her music video for Fade de Grae, the cover 0:05:29.760 --> 0:05:33.400 of the song Fade Degrae. So I've seen a couple, 0:05:33.680 --> 0:05:35.920 you know, small productions, but that was my first time 0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:38.800 actually working on a production and a lot of fun. 0:05:39.880 --> 0:05:41.920 It is a lot of fun, and I think when 0:05:41.960 --> 0:05:44.560 you're coming back to the same cruise repeatedly, there's a 0:05:44.680 --> 0:05:49.120 level of artistic creativity and pushing one another that you 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:51.760 get to do. Uh. And he's worked with Giant on 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:53.680 all of this films. So he also shoots The Northman 0:05:53.839 --> 0:05:54.680 and The Witch. 0:05:55.160 --> 0:05:58.680 Does he shoot the uh, the Nose Frauty movie? 0:05:59.040 --> 0:06:04.000 Yeah, yep, Wow, that's awesome. Yeah. Well, you know, I'll 0:06:04.000 --> 0:06:06.920 do some deeper research on Jarn's you talk about him 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:08.400 when we talk about the north film, because I actually 0:06:08.400 --> 0:06:10.160 had a lot of questions and we're going to get 0:06:10.160 --> 0:06:12.960 into some color theory on this black and white film 0:06:13.000 --> 0:06:15.359 because I have a lot of thoughts about that. Okay, 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:18.400 So Mark Korn does the music. It's got a respectable 0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:20.640 runtime of one hundred and nine minutes. I thought this 0:06:20.680 --> 0:06:24.560 movie was longer. I remember it feeling very long. It 0:06:24.040 --> 0:06:30.240 does because of the stress Hunters. It's really chaotic. How 0:06:30.279 --> 0:06:31.200 do you feel about the run time? 0:06:31.600 --> 0:06:34.760 The tension builds very slowly throughout the movie, just like 0:06:34.800 --> 0:06:38.159 in The Witch. Similarly, there's a lot of similarities between 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:40.680 this movie and The Witch. I find there and we 0:06:40.720 --> 0:06:43.760 are going to hark. I also wanted to say, Jaron, 0:06:44.040 --> 0:06:48.680 he is the one who pushed Robert Egger's to shoot 0:06:48.720 --> 0:06:52.560 in this almost square aspect ratio. So it's like one 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:56.919 point one nine to one aspect ratio with black and 0:06:56.960 --> 0:07:00.919 white thirty five millimeter film on these like teak lenses. 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:04.400 So I think that's where some of the budget went 0:07:04.680 --> 0:07:08.960 in comparison to The Witch. This was also shot in Canada, 0:07:09.040 --> 0:07:13.400 Nova Scotia. It was shot at Cape Horseshoe is what 0:07:13.440 --> 0:07:16.760 it's called, and they built the lighthouse themselves, which I 0:07:16.800 --> 0:07:18.240 found to be very interesting. 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:23.320 I cannot wait to talk to you about Edgar's dollhouse theory, 0:07:24.040 --> 0:07:26.840 especially when it was so much more prominent in this 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:29.520 movie than in The Witch, and I thought it was 0:07:29.560 --> 0:07:30.239 used a great effect. 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:30.720 Yeah The Witch. 0:07:30.720 --> 0:07:34.600 Okay, so let's talk about first reactions and experiences watching 0:07:34.600 --> 0:07:36.680 this film. Do you remember the first time you saw 0:07:36.720 --> 0:07:37.160 this film? 0:07:38.720 --> 0:07:44.080 Yes? I actually okay, so I just recently watched this 0:07:44.120 --> 0:07:46.360 for the first time. I want to say, back in 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:52.080 late September early October, and it was around the same 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:57.320 time I actually watched the first episode of the Uzumaki anime, 0:07:57.360 --> 0:08:00.000 which first episode was great and then it went on 0:08:00.040 --> 0:08:05.840 on a downward spiral. And I remember thinking after I 0:08:05.880 --> 0:08:09.480 watched the Uzamaki first episode and then watching this, I 0:08:09.520 --> 0:08:12.200 remember thinking, Wow, there's a lot of similarities between this 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:16.320 and Uzumaki. Obviously they're different subject matter, but they are 0:08:16.360 --> 0:08:20.480 both cosmic horrors, and they are both in black and white. 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:23.360 And the kind of droning, especially at the beginning of 0:08:23.400 --> 0:08:27.640 the movie, you have that like droning horn sound that 0:08:28.040 --> 0:08:31.440 is played throughout all kind of gave me same like 0:08:31.920 --> 0:08:35.520 atmospheric vibes of the Uza Maki and this is just 0:08:35.559 --> 0:08:38.840 like The Witch is another movie that is very much vibes. 0:08:39.160 --> 0:08:41.040 There's a lot of vibes and a lot of atmosphere 0:08:41.080 --> 0:08:41.640 going on here. 0:08:42.040 --> 0:08:45.760 Both get into some weird cerebral body horror as well. 0:08:46.480 --> 0:08:50.440 I consider The Mermaid vagina body horror. I'm just gonna look, 0:08:50.520 --> 0:08:52.040 you guys, it's so weird. 0:08:51.800 --> 0:08:53.440 The tentacles and all of that. 0:08:53.920 --> 0:08:56.800 Yeah, definitely, you see a lot of reputation there. 0:08:56.880 --> 0:08:57.120 Okay. 0:08:57.160 --> 0:08:59.839 I first saw this at TIFF and there was a 0:08:59.880 --> 0:09:03.320 lot of buzz obviously coming after Can and the question 0:09:03.440 --> 0:09:06.240 was sort of, will general audiences like this like they 0:09:06.400 --> 0:09:09.079 liked The Witch. The answer was for a lot of 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:13.080 critics was no. I think box office suggests that's true. 0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:17.400 It's not as in my mind accessible as The Witch. 0:09:17.520 --> 0:09:21.360 But I remember leaning back in the theater and being like, oh, 0:09:21.440 --> 0:09:24.920 this is brilliant, like just for I like a movie 0:09:24.960 --> 0:09:28.880 that makes me feel And I think, yeah, that's not 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:33.360 an experience everyone vibes with, particularly and perhaps I've been 0:09:33.360 --> 0:09:35.160 talking to a lot of folks who don't like horror, 0:09:35.480 --> 0:09:37.920 almost all men, by the way, who were like, I 0:09:37.960 --> 0:09:40.360 am not interested in horror films. I don't want to 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:44.960 watch Aaron and abou our producers here don't like horror. 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:48.720 They we were like passes to nostraati. They're like, well, literally, 0:09:48.760 --> 0:09:49.880 pass We're not interested. 0:09:51.120 --> 0:09:53.199 My boyfriend not at all interested. 0:09:53.520 --> 0:09:57.160 Really, Okay, so this is fast. Please write in and 0:09:57.160 --> 0:10:00.000 tell us if you're a man who doesn't enjoy horror 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:02.679 or why. I just want to hear more about this. 0:10:02.800 --> 0:10:05.560 A lot of the guys I've talked to have an 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:09.640 issue there, like I don't like the feeling of being terrified. 0:10:09.800 --> 0:10:13.120 It puts me on edge. I can't relax. I don't 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:17.640 understand why you're having fun with this. I think women 0:10:17.679 --> 0:10:19.920 are always afraid and being. 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:21.720 Able exactly what I was gonna say. 0:10:22.160 --> 0:10:24.720 Being able to practice it in a safe environment where 0:10:24.760 --> 0:10:28.559 you can't actually be hurt is a wonderful fun bonding 0:10:28.600 --> 0:10:31.280 experience with your galp hoals And because and we sort 0:10:31.320 --> 0:10:32.920 of talked about this before on some of our other 0:10:33.040 --> 0:10:36.280 horror episodes, but having a final girl that you can 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:38.959 really lean into you and love is such a joy. 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:42.760 And I think that's what makes horror great. And with 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:46.800 that thought in mind, I would talk about like the 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:52.079 gender identity in Egger's films, if we have what He's 0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:54.160 like again. Eggars didn't call it a feminist film, but 0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:56.839 said that he was proud or excited. I can't remember 0:10:56.840 --> 0:10:59.880 his exact adjective. That people felt like The Witch was 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:04.200 feminist film, and to me, I think you could categorize 0:11:04.240 --> 0:11:07.000 it as that there's some possibly if there aren't that 0:11:07.000 --> 0:11:09.720 many women involved directly in the storytelling, is it feminist. 0:11:10.679 --> 0:11:15.040 I think the narrative I would put is leans heavily 0:11:15.080 --> 0:11:17.320 into a lot of feminist shows. Specifically, if you're looking 0:11:17.400 --> 0:11:21.440 at the wich is an evil entity in America. Okay, great, Absolutely, 0:11:21.520 --> 0:11:25.040 this film is absolutely about toxic masculinity. He said that 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:27.520 he sort of stumbled upon that as they were writing, 0:11:27.559 --> 0:11:31.320 so not his agenda in starting the project. He saw 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:34.160 his brother brought him the story, a real story of 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:38.600 two men who were like abandoned or something in a lighthouse, 0:11:38.600 --> 0:11:40.720 and they were like, oh, that's an interesting story. 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:44.760 It's called the Smalls Lighthouse Tragedy. It's a real story 0:11:44.800 --> 0:11:48.120 of an accident that happened at a lighthouse in Wales, 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:51.800 which I found very interesting. And it was partly inspired 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:55.679 by the Edgar Allan Poe short story of the same 0:11:55.840 --> 0:11:57.880 name that he never got to finish before he died. 0:11:58.000 --> 0:12:00.840 So he started it like months before death, and then 0:12:01.440 --> 0:12:03.000 and yeah, and then die. 0:12:03.080 --> 0:12:06.720 I love say, I love that Edgars is so into 0:12:06.960 --> 0:12:09.960 historical village. He's such a nerd uh. And then there's 0:12:10.000 --> 0:12:13.680 something I really appreciate and vibe with, Like, you know, 0:12:13.679 --> 0:12:15.679 I Greyl and Poe didn't get to finished. I want 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:17.520 to do a horror in a lighthouse. I wouldn't need 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:21.959 turned to that as inspiration. That's beautiful. So he was 0:12:22.000 --> 0:12:24.000 like as we're rioting, and if you're dealing with two 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:27.280 guys who are isolated in a job that is considered 0:12:27.360 --> 0:12:31.720 rather masculine but also requires a lot of feminine tasks, Yep. 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:34.640 All placed on Robert Pattins's character. 0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:39.760 Because he's the young and new one and less experienced one, 0:12:39.840 --> 0:12:42.600 and therefore is considered the lesser of the men, and 0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:45.720 so he's forced to do women's work, which he finds 0:12:45.760 --> 0:12:50.720 extremely degrading and keeps bringing it up. And then he 0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:54.360 has a reaction like I think many a woman has 0:12:54.440 --> 0:12:57.000 had in her life for someone's like, oh this isn't 0:12:57.000 --> 0:13:00.080 done well. He was like, bitch, what do you I 0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:04.080 have scrubb Queen's maid could come here and not do 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:07.480 as good a job as I had you. Oh, he 0:13:07.640 --> 0:13:11.960 was angry, he was upset. And because of that you 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:16.000 get like you do start like stripping away women as 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:23.120 Alia dog. Yes, yes, the stripping women away. It totally 0:13:23.320 --> 0:13:27.760 is Carmen, And there's like there's it's just such an 0:13:27.800 --> 0:13:31.920 interesting way to explore like what is masculinity? Right? And 0:13:31.960 --> 0:13:34.520 I think a lot of times when people try to 0:13:34.559 --> 0:13:38.040 explore toxic masculinity, what you're doing is you're looking at 0:13:38.080 --> 0:13:41.040 the end result of it, which is to say, oh, 0:13:41.240 --> 0:13:46.079 violence against women is like the root of toxic but 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:49.400 really it's like the root of toxic masculinity is an 0:13:49.400 --> 0:13:52.719 insecurity in men, right, Like it's it's your own insecurities 0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:56.440 of what it means to be a man. These unfair 0:13:57.360 --> 0:13:59.600 societal pressures and been created to put on other men 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:01.040 of like what does it mean to be a man? 0:14:01.080 --> 0:14:03.280 And throughout the film you get a back and forth 0:14:03.320 --> 0:14:06.520 exchange of that. Okay, so you have younger guy comes 0:14:06.520 --> 0:14:09.440 saying clearly you're inferior. Okay, but I'm physically stronger than 0:14:09.480 --> 0:14:12.800 you are a man, I'm superior. Okay. Well I have more 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:16.439 experience and I'm more intelligent than you, but I'm more 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:19.920 modern and I'm more adept at working in these situations. Okay, 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:22.800 but it's literally my lighthouse line and your boss. I 0:14:22.880 --> 0:14:25.520 have more experience than you. I'm on top. Okay, but 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:27.800 I could Okay, And then you get a twist, so 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:29.720 we've run out of things to top each other with. 0:14:30.680 --> 0:14:33.800 So now it's yeah, and I'm lonely and I hate 0:14:33.800 --> 0:14:35.840 this place, and this place is so hard. Now I'm 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:38.320 codependent on you and I have and Okay, so we're 0:14:38.320 --> 0:14:41.359 sparking up a friendship, but we can only bond. 0:14:41.640 --> 0:14:43.400 Each other while we're drunk and dancing. 0:14:43.720 --> 0:14:46.880 Yeah, we only bond with each other through being super drunk, 0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:50.720 through fighting, and once we reach the depths of that, 0:14:50.800 --> 0:14:54.560 our repression comes out. You know, we're repressed. We're not 0:14:54.600 --> 0:14:56.960 He's not even supposed to masturbate, like, which is crazy. 0:14:57.120 --> 0:14:59.000 It's like, bro, we're alone on an island with no 0:14:59.080 --> 0:15:03.440 TV and apparently enough books, books and teens. Day would 0:15:03.440 --> 0:15:06.280 have been a dream for me. Women would have nailed this. 0:15:06.400 --> 0:15:08.800 I just want to say, if women had been had 0:15:08.880 --> 0:15:10.880 just been women at the Lighthouse, this is a very 0:15:10.920 --> 0:15:16.320 different movie. Last Yeah, totally. It's just quiet and there 0:15:16.320 --> 0:15:19.520 are no men, and it's scenic and beautiful and it's 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:21.920 gonna storm tonight. I have books and good food. We 0:15:21.960 --> 0:15:22.160 can go. 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:23.160 We're good. 0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:27.760 We're truly living a blessed life. About your coachy sweater weather, 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:30.200 stop it. I'm fine. The only thing I'm worried about 0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:32.840 is cleanliness, and we can figure it out. So yeah, 0:15:32.880 --> 0:15:36.520 So I'm really curious to hear your thoughts on both 0:15:36.880 --> 0:15:41.600 the way masculinity is portrayed throughout the film and also 0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:45.800 the way these two specific performers sort of go back 0:15:45.840 --> 0:15:48.600 and forth in there, like it's a really interesting pairing 0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:55.600 Robert Pattinson and Willem Dafoe. Willem Dafoe is, you know, 0:15:55.600 --> 0:15:58.760 known for doing these big, over the top characters. She's 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:02.720 got this incredible thing, and Robert has, you know, post 0:16:02.760 --> 0:16:05.160 Twilight has been very interesting and sort of the same 0:16:05.200 --> 0:16:10.000 way that Daniel Bradcliffe has been on choosing weird roles 0:16:10.000 --> 0:16:12.840 that just speak to and challenge, and he's not even 0:16:12.880 --> 0:16:16.320 afraid of going into something like a Batman a blockbuster 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:18.720 as long as he can be weird about it. He's like, 0:16:18.800 --> 0:16:22.360 I'll be there. And so to allow these two really 0:16:22.440 --> 0:16:26.440 incredible performers to be at the peak of weird talking 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:29.200 about masculinity like, I just think it's a stroke of brilliance. 0:16:29.240 --> 0:16:30.040 How did it touch you? 0:16:30.560 --> 0:16:31.040 Yeah? 0:16:31.120 --> 0:16:31.360 Yeah? 0:16:31.360 --> 0:16:34.600 And it's interesting too because they both personally reached out 0:16:34.640 --> 0:16:38.760 to Robert Eggers after they saw The Witch and told 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:40.880 Robert Eggers that they wanted to be involved in his 0:16:40.960 --> 0:16:41.720 next project. 0:16:42.080 --> 0:16:46.560 Robert, what a dream? What a yeah, right, what a 0:16:46.640 --> 0:16:49.120 dream to get these too? Yeah? 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:52.200 What a dream to get these two big names in 0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.160 Hollywood for your next film that are just like down 0:16:55.200 --> 0:16:59.720 for whatever and super excited to work on your next project. 0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:02.960 You know, I want to tie back the conversation of 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:07.639 toxic masculinity. And I don't know if this exactly answers 0:17:07.680 --> 0:17:12.359 the question, but the subject of toxic masculinity being like 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.399 the centerpiece of the movie, I think it ties in 0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:19.480 also into how men, just like we were also talking 0:17:19.480 --> 0:17:22.320 about it at the top, how men don't like horror 0:17:22.359 --> 0:17:27.119 movies is because not only because they don't like to 0:17:27.960 --> 0:17:31.600 feel afraid, but feeling afraid is something that I think 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:34.720 challenges a lot of men's masculinity in a way that 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:38.080 they're not comfortable with. And I'm not calling anyone out, 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:39.160 you know, but. 0:17:39.800 --> 0:17:40.960 No, but I think that's fair. 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:44.840 Yeah, And I you know, another thing I wanted to 0:17:44.840 --> 0:17:46.840 add to that too, is like all of my gay 0:17:47.080 --> 0:17:49.679 male friends love horror. 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:51.560 Oh my god, that's so true. 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:57.480 And it's I think because they are not tied to 0:17:59.040 --> 0:18:02.200 masculinity in the same way is that, you know, sis, 0:18:02.240 --> 0:18:03.840 straight men are tied to masculinity. 0:18:03.840 --> 0:18:10.240 They're not asked to perform the ideology of masculinity exact way, 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:13.040 so our community sort of allows them to you feel 0:18:13.040 --> 0:18:15.280 how you feel, Okay, wow, Okay, go on. 0:18:16.160 --> 0:18:21.120 Yeah. Yeah, So in the movie, I just think that 0:18:21.240 --> 0:18:24.280 they do such a great job, you know, with monologuing 0:18:24.320 --> 0:18:28.040 each other and and kind of you can with each 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:31.760 thing that Willem Dafoe's character says to Robert Pattins's character, 0:18:32.280 --> 0:18:34.960 you can just see in Robert Pattens's face, like how 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:38.159 annoyed he's getting with Willem Dafoe, and that tension is 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:41.320 just slowly and slowly building until they finally, you know, 0:18:41.440 --> 0:18:45.520 have this huge fight which is also during a storm, 0:18:45.760 --> 0:18:48.240 which I think is also a really perfect like symbolism 0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:52.800 of kind of of the anger that men can like 0:18:52.840 --> 0:18:55.719 hold up inside of themselves. It can be very destructive 0:18:56.359 --> 0:18:59.720 and it literally, if I'm not mistaken, it destroys the 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:03.919 how you know, it destroys where they're where they're staying. 0:19:04.280 --> 0:19:07.159 So there's a lot of like symbolism in the movie 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:12.560 I find with that and and toxic masculinity, I agree. 0:19:12.800 --> 0:19:16.679 When we come back, we're going to talk about the 0:19:16.680 --> 0:19:23.439 black and white, the aspect ratio, and what does the 0:19:23.520 --> 0:19:28.680 lighthouse mean? What's happening up there? Is it is it real? 0:19:28.840 --> 0:19:31.119 Is it magic? What what's going on? 0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:32.119 Is it dreams? 0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:46.680 Is it dreams? We'll be right back. Okay, and we're 0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:50.480 back all right. So we've been talking about the ways 0:19:50.560 --> 0:19:54.680 toxic masculinity are explored throughout the film. I want to 0:19:54.720 --> 0:19:56.800 talk a little bit about the visual imagery and work 0:19:56.840 --> 0:20:00.440 our way back to this idea. So yeah, I think 0:20:00.480 --> 0:20:04.440 it was an inspired choice to shoot in this aspect ratio. 0:20:04.640 --> 0:20:09.640 It's almost a perfect square. It did make projecting it difficult. 0:20:09.760 --> 0:20:11.399 You had to have a screen of a certain size 0:20:11.400 --> 0:20:12.520 in order to shoot it. 0:20:12.760 --> 0:20:15.960 And I'm also curious what the IMAX experience would have 0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:17.400 been like with this movie. 0:20:18.040 --> 0:20:20.560 I saw it in an Imax projection. I'm pretty sure 0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:23.800 that was an IMAX projected theater. My screening it, the 0:20:23.800 --> 0:20:26.720 screenings at any film festival, but especially one OF's large 0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:30.600 at TIFF is like one of the five Oscar qualifiers. Immaculate, 0:20:30.760 --> 0:20:35.760 like really really gorgeous, deep deep blacks, like stunning, stunning visually, 0:20:36.240 --> 0:20:38.920 and they, you know, found a way to I think 0:20:38.920 --> 0:20:41.760 they used the classic Kurrasawa I believe. I remember reading 0:20:41.800 --> 0:20:44.440 that effect of putting ink in water to make rain 0:20:44.560 --> 0:20:47.720 pop in a black and white film, right, because the 0:20:47.800 --> 0:20:49.720 rain is gorgeous in it. But it's hard to shoot 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:51.639 rain in black and white because it just kind of 0:20:51.640 --> 0:20:54.280 looks grainy, so you really have to give it a 0:20:54.280 --> 0:20:57.360 different saturation of color. And this really pushes Eggeries as 0:20:57.440 --> 0:21:00.359 a director to shoot in black and white. It's not 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:05.960 for those of you unfamiliar with like filming processes. The 0:21:06.000 --> 0:21:08.399 best way to explain this is to encourage you to 0:21:08.440 --> 0:21:10.919 look up with picture of the set of the Monsters 0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:13.920 from the nineteen sixties. It is pastel as hell. 0:21:14.280 --> 0:21:16.240 It is light the Monsters. 0:21:16.800 --> 0:21:19.159 Yeah, so if you look at the Monsters set photos 0:21:19.520 --> 0:21:22.640 from the sixties and seventies, so the Monsters were shot 0:21:22.640 --> 0:21:26.240 in black and white, but their set is almost pestel. 0:21:26.359 --> 0:21:30.080 You can also do this with looking at old black 0:21:30.119 --> 0:21:34.000 and white makeup tests. In color women wore green lipstick 0:21:34.119 --> 0:21:36.879 to appear red on screen, So you have to be 0:21:37.000 --> 0:21:40.040 so in your bag on your color theory to shoot 0:21:40.080 --> 0:21:42.560 in black and white. Well, it is a challenge a 0:21:42.600 --> 0:21:45.199 lot of directors get excited about, but it's difficult to 0:21:45.280 --> 0:21:48.560 pull off. I thought Eggers did a really great job 0:21:49.040 --> 0:21:52.840 of finding like such a great balance. Everything is very visible, 0:21:53.080 --> 0:21:57.680 the contrasts are like really strong. This is very technically 0:21:57.760 --> 0:22:00.879 difficult work to do, and I thought it was beautiful. 0:22:00.920 --> 0:22:05.600 And the square framing of the film highlights the claustrophobia 0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:07.600 in such a way that it like, I have a 0:22:07.640 --> 0:22:10.240 fear of claustrophobia. I don't like being in small or 0:22:10.320 --> 0:22:14.439 tight spaces. And I think by like, there was a 0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:18.280 there's a shot where Robert is up in the lighthouse 0:22:18.400 --> 0:22:21.399 obviously not touching the light yet because he's not alive, 0:22:23.080 --> 0:22:28.080 and Dafoe is climbing up the ladder, and uh, it's 0:22:28.119 --> 0:22:31.960 two separate shots. So one shot of Dafoe looking down 0:22:32.040 --> 0:22:35.440 on him, Robert is standing above him. At this point 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:38.280 in the film is still pretty early. I would say 0:22:38.320 --> 0:22:40.639 the film is divided almost into two parts. It's or 0:22:40.680 --> 0:22:43.959 maybe three. It's like his early arrival, and then you 0:22:44.000 --> 0:22:47.600 get this time when they're sort of bonded to the 0:22:47.600 --> 0:22:49.760 time he's supposed to leave, and then you get off 0:22:50.000 --> 0:22:53.840 full hour, which is insane. It's so much time between 0:22:53.800 --> 0:22:55.800 the time he's supposed to leave and doesn't get picked 0:22:55.880 --> 0:22:58.840 up to the end. And that's where really the downward 0:22:58.880 --> 0:23:02.960 spiral just goes completely out of control. So in this shot, 0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:06.159 these two solo shots, you're bouncing back and forth, and 0:23:06.320 --> 0:23:10.520 the eye line is diagonal, it's across the frame. When 0:23:10.560 --> 0:23:13.119 you're cutting between the two of them. They feel like 0:23:13.160 --> 0:23:16.920 they're standing like Robert is standing on top of Defot's shoulders, 0:23:17.320 --> 0:23:20.359 almost because there's such a tight frame that when you 0:23:20.440 --> 0:23:24.680 have someone looking across and down, it like shoots their 0:23:24.720 --> 0:23:29.600 height way up visually, and it really makes you like again, 0:23:29.680 --> 0:23:32.800 it just cramps everything together and makes it so tight. 0:23:32.920 --> 0:23:35.880 You feel like you're in this lighthouse and there's literally 0:23:36.440 --> 0:23:40.160 zero reprieve. It never comes. You are always this tight 0:23:40.640 --> 0:23:43.800 and locked in. And I think shooting that way again 0:23:44.119 --> 0:23:47.119 technically difficult when you're used to having all of this space, 0:23:47.160 --> 0:23:49.000 you have a lot of them. You have to use 0:23:49.040 --> 0:23:51.400 a lot of economy of space to pull it off 0:23:51.440 --> 0:23:54.600 and make it look good. And so I think what 0:23:54.760 --> 0:23:58.320 really impresses me. I think sophomore films are such a 0:23:58.440 --> 0:24:01.159 challenge to pull off. And if you think, Okay, I'm 0:24:01.200 --> 0:24:06.080 getting really theoretical here, and there's no proof of anything 0:24:06.080 --> 0:24:07.840 I'm about to say, so I feel free to disregard it. 0:24:08.960 --> 0:24:10.879 I think it's a very interesting subject for Egers to 0:24:10.920 --> 0:24:15.119 go from a film he's excited to have people call feminist. 0:24:15.760 --> 0:24:19.399 Being lauded as an extremely successful early director like this 0:24:19.520 --> 0:24:22.159 is huge. You could do one of two things. You 0:24:22.200 --> 0:24:24.879 could take on a great, big studio project, because I'm 0:24:24.880 --> 0:24:28.040 sure they were offered to him. You could repeat and 0:24:28.200 --> 0:24:32.280 lean into becoming a horror director, or you could turn 0:24:32.320 --> 0:24:34.200 your back on all that and say it was really 0:24:34.280 --> 0:24:38.520 important to me is telling stories I'm excited about period, 0:24:38.560 --> 0:24:40.679 and what excites me is writing my own stories. He 0:24:40.840 --> 0:24:45.679 stayed small when he could have. We've seen directors and 0:24:45.680 --> 0:24:47.879 that was really the era of these. Like if you 0:24:47.920 --> 0:24:51.080 think the guy that did Jurassic Park one hit Steven 0:24:51.080 --> 0:24:52.680 spielg wurds like I love you, He's like, great, I'll 0:24:52.720 --> 0:24:54.760 make I'll direct Jurassic Park. Next. 0:24:56.000 --> 0:24:59.640 I read that Robert Eggers was actually being offered lots 0:24:59.680 --> 0:25:04.280 of studio, big studio projects, but he was not interested 0:25:04.320 --> 0:25:08.240 in any of them, and instead his brother Max brought 0:25:08.240 --> 0:25:10.240 this story to him and that's when he really like 0:25:10.240 --> 0:25:12.840 piqued his interest. So he really is like a director 0:25:12.840 --> 0:25:16.840 who seems to choose things that he's passionate about or 0:25:16.880 --> 0:25:21.400 things that he's really interested in, versus what Hollywood wants 0:25:21.480 --> 0:25:22.639 him to do. You know. 0:25:22.880 --> 0:25:25.120 Yeah, and we saw that in that era, like with 0:25:25.320 --> 0:25:30.320 Gareth Edwards, who directed the new Directsic Park trilogy, was 0:25:30.359 --> 0:25:33.960 also offered Rogue one. Both of those films not as 0:25:33.960 --> 0:25:36.160 well received. But if you were a white man who 0:25:36.160 --> 0:25:40.320 had a successful indie film Rogue one, Yes, but he's 0:25:40.359 --> 0:25:42.880 replaced his director towards the end and they reshoot most 0:25:42.920 --> 0:25:46.320 of it right before it releases. Yeah, one is my 0:25:46.359 --> 0:25:48.639 favorite Star Wars film. But yeah, behind the scenes a 0:25:48.680 --> 0:25:51.560 lot of issues. And to be truthful and honest, it 0:25:51.640 --> 0:25:53.560 is very, very difficult to go for making an indie 0:25:53.600 --> 0:25:57.040 to doing a big studio project because so much more 0:25:57.160 --> 0:25:59.200 is required of you. There's so much more money, there's 0:25:59.240 --> 0:26:02.639 so much more pressure. Oftentimes you're now dealing with stars 0:26:02.680 --> 0:26:05.040 instead of actors who were just excited to work, and 0:26:05.080 --> 0:26:07.320 that comes with the whole other set of conditions. You 0:26:07.359 --> 0:26:09.159 need to know how to speak with and work with 0:26:09.200 --> 0:26:11.800 those people so that you both have their respect and 0:26:11.880 --> 0:26:16.760 their attention slash devotion. Like, it's a very hard it's 0:26:16.880 --> 0:26:19.600 much more political than people think to make a big 0:26:19.600 --> 0:26:24.600 studio film, and so like it makes sense to and 0:26:24.640 --> 0:26:27.040 who I think it takes a really big person, or 0:26:27.080 --> 0:26:28.280 it feels to me like it would take a really 0:26:28.320 --> 0:26:30.800 big person to turn down all of that money, all 0:26:30.880 --> 0:26:34.720 that opportunity, all of that praise to come do something small, 0:26:35.400 --> 0:26:38.800 but to and especially with your sophomore project to land 0:26:38.880 --> 0:26:41.680 that plane is really really difficult. I think he did 0:26:42.000 --> 0:26:43.960 a great job. He gets his brothers in space to 0:26:44.000 --> 0:26:46.280 work on his writing, which I love, and he comes 0:26:46.359 --> 0:26:49.679 up with this idea of like, okay, if we're if 0:26:49.720 --> 0:26:51.520 I'm turning my back on all of that, let me 0:26:51.600 --> 0:26:53.800 really examine what I'm turning like. I really think a 0:26:53.840 --> 0:26:55.679 lot of there's a lot of toxic masculinity. This is 0:26:55.720 --> 0:26:57.879 me too, Era, It's just lining up for me. And 0:26:57.920 --> 0:27:01.480 whether that's a bunch of coincidences or just how the 0:27:01.560 --> 0:27:04.160 universes were happening to unfold. In other words, all these 0:27:04.160 --> 0:27:06.520 things are around, and so of course you're comparing what's 0:27:06.560 --> 0:27:08.320 coming out of this film where you can't say for 0:27:08.359 --> 0:27:10.639 sure that this is what's Ineggar's heart is. He's working 0:27:10.680 --> 0:27:13.760 on it, but it was I think it came an 0:27:13.800 --> 0:27:16.720 interesting time for me as a viewer, I'll say, to 0:27:16.760 --> 0:27:19.240 be exploring all those things. It was really a felt 0:27:19.480 --> 0:27:22.240 uh difficult as a woman to get into this movie. 0:27:22.280 --> 0:27:30.480 At first, the farts are yes, this is a dirty. 0:27:28.680 --> 0:27:31.000 It really is. They really want you to be annoyed 0:27:31.000 --> 0:27:33.560 with Willem Dafoe and just like damn, this old man 0:27:33.680 --> 0:27:38.959 is so crotchety and disgusting, and he's really effective at that, 0:27:39.280 --> 0:27:42.760 you know. But at the same time he also there 0:27:42.760 --> 0:27:46.000 are times when he earns your respect just with his 0:27:46.240 --> 0:27:50.479 wisdom and like the knowledge that he has of being 0:27:50.520 --> 0:27:54.600 a seafarer somebody who lives on an isolated island, Like 0:27:54.600 --> 0:27:57.600 he knows what he's talking about. But he's also very, 0:27:57.680 --> 0:27:58.560 very hard to deal with. 0:27:59.480 --> 0:28:02.639 Yeah, here's another thing that's interesting. When you're doing two 0:28:02.760 --> 0:28:05.480 actors in a show like this, so there's there's no 0:28:05.640 --> 0:28:08.920 supporting castors. There's excuse me. There is a mermaid who's 0:28:08.920 --> 0:28:12.040 played by a woman who is here and she but 0:28:12.119 --> 0:28:15.000 she's not giving a lot of interaction, right, Like the 0:28:15.160 --> 0:28:17.800 thing she's almost all of her shots are like one shots. 0:28:17.880 --> 0:28:21.320 It's just her, you know, she's isolated, almost like these birds, 0:28:21.359 --> 0:28:25.400 until maybe she's pulled into it's like maybe Robert's hands 0:28:25.400 --> 0:28:26.399 are there or something like that. 0:28:26.480 --> 0:28:30.040 Yeah, but in the sex scene, I. 0:28:30.000 --> 0:28:34.040 Mean, I loved that. The Twilight girlies it Robert's doing 0:28:34.080 --> 0:28:38.239 what in this movie? We'll be there and they were like, 0:28:39.120 --> 0:28:42.560 he is a masturbating a shirtless his asses out a 0:28:42.560 --> 0:28:47.400 little bit. Enjoy Listen. He's beautiful even when he's that filthy. 0:28:47.440 --> 0:28:49.880 I have many Okay, so one, you can smell Robert 0:28:49.880 --> 0:28:53.400 Egger's films, and that's something we're seeing a lot. It's 0:28:53.400 --> 0:28:55.680 things that people who've seen No Satu are already commenting 0:28:55.760 --> 0:28:59.320 on the fact that you can almost smell how dirty 0:28:59.360 --> 0:29:03.960 the film is. When Robert goes just throw the absolutely 0:29:04.040 --> 0:29:06.000 not this is a film my life. I've ever seen 0:29:06.000 --> 0:29:08.200 Aggers's film in forty I don't need to smell it. 0:29:08.240 --> 0:29:11.440 Oh gross. When Robert throws the shit over the side 0:29:11.440 --> 0:29:14.440 and it blows back up into his face, I was like, 0:29:15.240 --> 0:29:18.000 I was having such a hard time. But again, if 0:29:18.040 --> 0:29:19.760 we go back to this core idea of this is 0:29:19.760 --> 0:29:22.840 an exploration of masculinity and what it means to be 0:29:22.880 --> 0:29:26.640 an or what two men thinks it means to be 0:29:26.720 --> 0:29:30.960 a man, and they're going and their ideas are constantly 0:29:31.000 --> 0:29:33.280 a conflict in war with each other. Picking up on 0:29:33.320 --> 0:29:36.800 what you said about Defoe's performance, there are times where 0:29:36.800 --> 0:29:38.600 you're really not sure if this is a guy who's like, 0:29:38.600 --> 0:29:41.160 I need to put you through your paces because this 0:29:41.200 --> 0:29:43.880 is a difficult job and I've been here for a while, 0:29:43.920 --> 0:29:45.400 so screw you. I'm not doing all the story. If 0:29:45.400 --> 0:29:47.680 you're young, you can do it like get to work, 0:29:48.080 --> 0:29:52.080 or it is my intention to drive you literally mad 0:29:52.360 --> 0:29:55.800 because it's fun for me. Right, You cannot tell, and 0:29:55.880 --> 0:29:58.480 it feels like it changes from time to time, which 0:29:58.520 --> 0:30:03.840 is something I learned recently on American Psycho. Defoe in 0:30:03.880 --> 0:30:07.479 that film plays three different versions of his character, so 0:30:07.520 --> 0:30:10.640 they would have him do three takes. Right, So the 0:30:10.680 --> 0:30:15.880 first take it is like he believes everything that Christian 0:30:15.880 --> 0:30:19.920 Bale's character is saying, he doesn't believe anything, and the 0:30:19.960 --> 0:30:22.360 third take he doesn't know what to believe, and then 0:30:22.400 --> 0:30:25.600 they would mix up those takes, so you get a 0:30:25.760 --> 0:30:30.760 very confused, unsure off foot character. I have mixed feelings 0:30:30.800 --> 0:30:35.640 about that As somebody who studied directing, I think, yeah, 0:30:35.680 --> 0:30:37.640 a part of me is like, it feels disrespectful to 0:30:37.680 --> 0:30:39.720 the actor not to give them the space to make 0:30:39.760 --> 0:30:43.480 these choices to create a character. And anybody who's edited 0:30:43.520 --> 0:30:47.120 a film knows you can absolutely make beautiful or destroy 0:30:47.240 --> 0:30:50.360 a performance within an edit. I think they did a 0:30:50.400 --> 0:30:52.880 great job with it. In the end. It turned out 0:30:52.920 --> 0:30:55.400 to be a decision that works for the movie. But 0:30:55.600 --> 0:30:59.400 I imagine Edgar sort of gave him the space to 0:30:59.400 --> 0:31:01.520 make these choices and it works just as well here 0:31:01.560 --> 0:31:04.360 with somebody who is maybe all three of these things 0:31:04.400 --> 0:31:07.920 at different times. And that's also very legit for the character. 0:31:08.640 --> 0:31:10.880 It makes everything Robert gets to do like you are 0:31:11.040 --> 0:31:13.920 so with him in this of like this guy is 0:31:14.040 --> 0:31:16.440 driving me creat When he lets him carry a barrel 0:31:16.480 --> 0:31:18.680 all the way up the spirals in your. 0:31:18.600 --> 0:31:20.920 Case and take it back down, He's. 0:31:20.800 --> 0:31:23.200 Like, catch your breath, Catch your breath, boy, Okay, I 0:31:23.320 --> 0:31:25.840 take that back downstairs. I would kill him right there. 0:31:26.280 --> 0:31:28.680 There'd be no in your sleep for me. I'd be like, well, 0:31:28.760 --> 0:31:31.120 you have to die, because that's like let's but to 0:31:31.160 --> 0:31:33.760 be fair, his next response is, if you don't want 0:31:33.800 --> 0:31:36.480 to set this whole lighthouse on fire, take that back 0:31:36.520 --> 0:31:38.400 down if it's not safe. But why did you let 0:31:38.480 --> 0:31:40.360 me get my ass all the way up here, old man, 0:31:40.520 --> 0:31:45.800 just to teach me a lesson. It's like it's infuriating. 0:31:45.800 --> 0:31:47.480 And it does make you think it that is like 0:31:47.800 --> 0:31:50.200 his goal is to like either teach a lesson, drive 0:31:50.280 --> 0:31:54.760 him insane, or or or just have fun with tormenting 0:31:54.800 --> 0:31:57.280 this poor guy. I wanted to say too, just to 0:31:57.320 --> 0:32:02.040 your point about like if Robert Eggar, if Robert Eggers 0:32:02.040 --> 0:32:05.080 gave Willem Dafoe the space to make that decision. I 0:32:05.080 --> 0:32:07.680 really think he did, because I get the impression just 0:32:07.680 --> 0:32:10.520 from an interview I watched about the lighthouse that I 0:32:10.560 --> 0:32:15.520 think Robert Eggers takes the opinion of his actors to heart. 0:32:16.120 --> 0:32:20.600 Like there is a moment in the interview where he 0:32:20.640 --> 0:32:25.200 talks about the first lighthouse that they scouted for the 0:32:25.320 --> 0:32:28.480 movie was the one that they had decided on, and 0:32:28.560 --> 0:32:32.040 they took the actors the crew there and the actress 0:32:32.040 --> 0:32:36.240 who plays the mermaid, her name is Valeria Karaman, She's Russian, 0:32:36.560 --> 0:32:41.000 and she immediately said, what is this ugly Soviet bullshit? 0:32:41.720 --> 0:32:44.320 You know, like, what is this horrible mids It was 0:32:44.360 --> 0:32:47.920 a mid century designed lighthouse, and that's when Robert Eggers 0:32:47.960 --> 0:32:49.600 was like, yeah, you know what, we can't use this 0:32:49.800 --> 0:32:52.560 because it's it's not right, and she didn't like it, 0:32:52.640 --> 0:32:55.000 So we're going to build our own lighthouse on this cape. 0:32:55.000 --> 0:32:57.680 So I think he does value and that's what I 0:32:57.720 --> 0:33:01.400 think is respectable in a directors, when they actually value 0:33:01.400 --> 0:33:03.640 the opinions of their talent and stuff. 0:33:04.400 --> 0:33:07.640 Yeah, I think there's a balance of trust that needs 0:33:07.640 --> 0:33:12.800 to be established, and not always, but sometimes it bodes 0:33:12.880 --> 0:33:16.800 well when actors frequently return with directors because you understand 0:33:16.800 --> 0:33:21.200 there's a sense of trust and relationship building there that 0:33:21.360 --> 0:33:23.400 brings them back and it makes you feel good. And 0:33:23.440 --> 0:33:25.400 by that I mean I work in this industry and 0:33:25.440 --> 0:33:27.520 I know how toxic and awful it can be. And 0:33:27.560 --> 0:33:30.440 so when there's ever a glimmer of hope that maybe 0:33:30.840 --> 0:33:34.000 this is a director that people, particularly women, seem to 0:33:34.000 --> 0:33:37.200 feel good and safe around and creatively free, like, that's 0:33:37.240 --> 0:33:43.760 always exciting. Yeah, let's talk a little bit about the Light, 0:33:44.040 --> 0:33:46.640 which is something we've sort of speculated on at the 0:33:46.640 --> 0:33:51.680 beginning of this episode. At first, I was like, oh, 0:33:51.800 --> 0:33:53.920 this is a metaphor for when I'm being in my 0:33:54.000 --> 0:33:56.440 most base instinct. Okay, this is a metaphor for a woman. 0:33:56.520 --> 0:33:58.920 It's this thing that they long for that they can't see. 0:33:59.440 --> 0:34:02.960 But then it's like, no, this is our responsibility and 0:34:03.000 --> 0:34:05.720 without women. Okay again, if you're going along the American 0:34:05.760 --> 0:34:08.000 idealized idea of like what a man is this whole 0:34:08.000 --> 0:34:13.600 like Cowboy, rugged, independent, A key factor, a high key factor. 0:34:13.600 --> 0:34:16.000 If you've been watching Cross on Amazon, they talk about 0:34:16.000 --> 0:34:19.239 this a lot, or like, really exploit this idea. If 0:34:19.239 --> 0:34:21.480 you're a man, you're supposed to be a savior or 0:34:21.480 --> 0:34:23.880 a hero or a protector or at the very least 0:34:23.920 --> 0:34:28.480 a provider. At the very least, your responsibility is to 0:34:28.760 --> 0:34:34.200 financially and with like care and taking of the land. 0:34:35.280 --> 0:34:37.960 That is your responsibility. That is the thing that defines 0:34:38.000 --> 0:34:40.080 you as a man. And if there are no women 0:34:40.719 --> 0:34:45.200 to protect, but you have this lighthouse, this responsibility of 0:34:45.239 --> 0:34:49.640 like protecting your fellow man. But it's so offhands right, 0:34:49.640 --> 0:34:51.600 Like you're not actively in it with your fellow man. 0:34:51.640 --> 0:34:55.400 You're literally separated from and from a distance supposed to 0:34:55.440 --> 0:34:57.719 be trying to help them. It's like, so, okay, so 0:34:57.920 --> 0:35:02.040 is the light this idea of their But then they 0:35:02.080 --> 0:35:05.719 literally become like consumed and obsessed over this thing, and 0:35:05.960 --> 0:35:09.600 you think, okay, well maybe that's about like greed. 0:35:10.160 --> 0:35:10.360 You know. 0:35:10.520 --> 0:35:11.719 He's like, I want to take care of les, like 0:35:11.719 --> 0:35:15.000 it's my responsibility. You're not their young buck, I can 0:35:15.200 --> 0:35:17.520 slow your role. He's like, no, okay. Maybe it's a 0:35:17.520 --> 0:35:21.080 metaphor for like when do you lose your manhood? Like 0:35:21.080 --> 0:35:24.480 Willumdafoe's aging, he's older, is he going to age out 0:35:24.480 --> 0:35:26.720 of this job? And what will he do once it happens. 0:35:27.000 --> 0:35:29.080 Robert's trying to make his way, He's trying to get 0:35:29.440 --> 0:35:31.360 enough money to support himself and build this house and 0:35:31.360 --> 0:35:34.000 starts to fan like they're at they're both trying to 0:35:34.120 --> 0:35:38.200 use this pinnacle and they understand inherently one thing that 0:35:38.200 --> 0:35:41.080 they can't do it together, and is that the light. 0:35:41.560 --> 0:35:43.640 I have a lot of maybe the light changes, what 0:35:43.680 --> 0:35:45.399 does it mean for you? How does it come off 0:35:45.440 --> 0:35:47.080 for you? 0:35:45.560 --> 0:35:49.080 You know, I hadn't thought about it like that, but 0:35:49.120 --> 0:35:53.960 I like the idea that the lighthouse is this symbol 0:35:54.000 --> 0:35:56.880 of a woman. And you could even if we're if 0:35:56.880 --> 0:36:00.279 we're going with that analogy, you could even say the 0:36:00.280 --> 0:36:02.279 conflict they have of like, well, when am I going 0:36:02.360 --> 0:36:04.560 to take care of the lighthouse? Is sort of like 0:36:05.719 --> 0:36:09.960 is like when two men are are fighting over a woman, 0:36:10.480 --> 0:36:13.680 you know, and and who gets to be the one 0:36:13.719 --> 0:36:19.080 that cares for and looks after this woman? And you 0:36:19.120 --> 0:36:22.920 can really tell with Robert Pattens through Robert Pattenson's character, 0:36:23.520 --> 0:36:26.000 that is something that he's really consumed with with his 0:36:26.040 --> 0:36:31.080 little soap carving of a mermaid, his dream dreams or 0:36:31.400 --> 0:36:35.720 actual encounters with the mermaid. Who knows what's actually happening there, 0:36:36.680 --> 0:36:38.960 but he is really consumed with this idea of a 0:36:39.040 --> 0:36:42.839 woman when there are no women around, So I think 0:36:42.880 --> 0:36:45.520 it could. I think the analogy of the lighthouse being 0:36:45.560 --> 0:36:48.320 a woman does work for me, But I think it 0:36:48.360 --> 0:36:51.120 could also be fluid in the sense that it at 0:36:51.120 --> 0:36:54.320 different times means different things. But the fact that Willem 0:36:54.360 --> 0:36:57.719 Dafoe like gets naked and like goes up there and 0:36:58.640 --> 0:37:01.880 you know, bathes in the light feels very much like 0:37:01.960 --> 0:37:03.880 you know, a guy like going to a strip club 0:37:04.000 --> 0:37:08.080 and like, you know, enjoying the entertainment of women and 0:37:08.080 --> 0:37:11.640 stuff like that. So I think it's an interesting analogy 0:37:11.680 --> 0:37:12.479 to look at it that way. 0:37:13.560 --> 0:37:18.279 Yeah, I love the Again, the nebulousness of it has 0:37:18.560 --> 0:37:22.680 got the uh two thousand and one Space Odyssey vibes 0:37:23.080 --> 0:37:27.400 of like, who is how supposed to like represent or be? 0:37:28.280 --> 0:37:33.680 You know, is how your own enterdemon is. The outreach 0:37:33.719 --> 0:37:37.319 of man trying to explore beyond this whole earth that 0:37:37.320 --> 0:37:41.560 we've been given is a you know more about I 0:37:41.560 --> 0:37:43.759 don't want to break down this movie. I'm sorry, we're 0:37:43.800 --> 0:37:47.440 on the Lighthouse, but that's the idea of just just 0:37:47.480 --> 0:37:51.719 to compare it as a cosmic horror, This idea of 0:37:51.760 --> 0:37:56.799 the unknown and the desire that you can't reach is 0:37:56.880 --> 0:37:59.600 so fascinating, and we talked a lot in The Witch 0:37:59.640 --> 0:38:03.920 about vibes in tone, and this film starts off in 0:38:04.080 --> 0:38:08.840 a fog of cloudy haze, like it's really trying to 0:38:08.920 --> 0:38:12.080 sell you on the idea of not being able to 0:38:12.120 --> 0:38:15.719 see what's directly in front of you. And I think 0:38:15.760 --> 0:38:17.920 that's really interesting because what these two guys are never 0:38:18.000 --> 0:38:22.080 able to do is find a real partnership, right Like 0:38:22.120 --> 0:38:24.440 you're really what's supposed to be happening here is your 0:38:24.480 --> 0:38:27.400 two dudes who are running a lighthouse. This shouldn't be 0:38:27.440 --> 0:38:30.600 that complicate. There's enough food, there's enough drink, there's enough 0:38:30.680 --> 0:38:34.920 jobs for everyone to be doing. But immediately Defoe is like, 0:38:35.000 --> 0:38:38.840 I need to be on top, And immediately Robert's character 0:38:39.000 --> 0:38:43.440 is coming from a place of I need to establish 0:38:43.480 --> 0:38:46.800 myself here in order to go back and make more money, 0:38:46.840 --> 0:38:50.239 like he's he's formally like a logger. They're both coming 0:38:50.239 --> 0:38:54.439 off with some pretty traumatic experiences and neither can give 0:38:54.480 --> 0:38:58.800 each other the space to sort of be their own person. 0:38:59.160 --> 0:39:03.960 There is this need to be the most dominant figure 0:39:04.200 --> 0:39:05.239 in the space. 0:39:05.400 --> 0:39:08.560 And Robert Pattinson's character is also lying about who he 0:39:08.640 --> 0:39:14.840 really is true, and he takes over the place of 0:39:14.880 --> 0:39:18.600 the real Frahim Winslow and pretends to be Frahim Winslow, 0:39:18.640 --> 0:39:21.840 which I think is what also kind of maybe is 0:39:21.920 --> 0:39:26.440 part of because he is trying to conceal something about himself, 0:39:27.080 --> 0:39:33.160 he's unable to actually connect and be genuine and authentic 0:39:33.239 --> 0:39:37.359 with Willem Dafoe's character. Oh man, does that make sense? 0:39:37.960 --> 0:39:43.000 Yeah, No, that's definitely. That's definitely was my takeaway as well. 0:39:43.200 --> 0:39:45.480 When we come back, we're gonna talk about the Dollhouse 0:39:46.080 --> 0:39:48.640 and what that means to Eggers and how it impacts 0:39:48.640 --> 0:40:03.440 this film. So stay tuned. Okay, we're back. Last week 0:40:03.440 --> 0:40:09.600 we talked about the Dollhouse. Edgers when he was designing films, right, 0:40:09.719 --> 0:40:12.560 he has a background in production design, that's sort of 0:40:12.600 --> 0:40:15.080 what he was studying in college. He goes on to 0:40:15.120 --> 0:40:19.040 become a filmmaker and when he's staging his films in 0:40:19.040 --> 0:40:21.600 his head and he's writing the scripts. Eggers gave a 0:40:21.640 --> 0:40:25.200 long talk where he was explaining that his films are 0:40:25.239 --> 0:40:28.280 overwritten because he writes them for himself and he wants 0:40:29.120 --> 0:40:33.680 investors and producers and everyone involved to understand what the 0:40:33.719 --> 0:40:38.880 tonality is because they're so reliant on nailing that. So 0:40:39.680 --> 0:40:43.160 part of that is building literally a dollhouse where he's 0:40:43.719 --> 0:40:46.960 sketching out like what happens in each moment, and then 0:40:47.440 --> 0:40:49.520 he was saying that it's really his goal to walk 0:40:49.560 --> 0:40:52.520 people through that dollhouse in his film. The opening of 0:40:52.560 --> 0:40:55.160 his film come off off the foggy water, and then 0:40:55.239 --> 0:40:59.200 it's a slow walk through the lighthouse and exploration of 0:40:59.239 --> 0:41:03.520 this whole space. It is both. I think it's like 0:41:03.880 --> 0:41:07.360 two and a half to three minutes something in there 0:41:07.520 --> 0:41:12.760 of just scenery and looking around. It builds a creep factor, 0:41:12.840 --> 0:41:16.400 to be sure. But what I think it does more 0:41:16.480 --> 0:41:20.279 than that is imbue you to this space as like 0:41:21.280 --> 0:41:25.200 a setting. That's a really poor way of saying it, 0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:30.440 but I just rewatched Young Frankenstein and the Lutro credits. 0:41:30.680 --> 0:41:34.719 It's a great fucking movie. And the introduction of that 0:41:34.800 --> 0:41:39.440 film is classic, right. It's the old world. It's inspired 0:41:39.480 --> 0:41:41.600 by the films of the thirties. In fact, the entire 0:41:41.680 --> 0:41:44.839 set comes from a production designer in the thirties who 0:41:44.840 --> 0:41:46.480 they went to his house and they were like, hey, 0:41:46.480 --> 0:41:47.759 can you tell us how to make this stuff? He's like, 0:41:47.800 --> 0:41:49.399 I actually have all of it in my garage. If 0:41:49.400 --> 0:41:51.319 you want it, you can just piece together and make 0:41:51.320 --> 0:41:53.200 your own set out of all these old set pieces 0:41:53.239 --> 0:41:57.000 I have. I think it was the original Frankenstein film 0:41:57.000 --> 0:41:58.600 that this guy did, and they just took all that 0:41:58.640 --> 0:42:01.239 stuff and read right, reset it up here, which is 0:42:01.360 --> 0:42:04.400 very cool. But the opening of that film is just 0:42:04.440 --> 0:42:07.719 the castle. It's the castle. It's cracks of lightning and 0:42:07.880 --> 0:42:11.120 credits and what it's like. Okay, so you're in this 0:42:11.160 --> 0:42:13.480 old world caped place. You see there's some lights. It 0:42:13.480 --> 0:42:16.280 gets your brain thinking. And we talked a lot about 0:42:16.280 --> 0:42:20.840 this last week as well, the three aspects of Edgar's films. 0:42:21.320 --> 0:42:25.080 I really think that just pacing the floorboards allows you 0:42:25.120 --> 0:42:27.600 to think, how would I survive in this situation? And 0:42:27.600 --> 0:42:30.480 again not a life or desk situation, but I'm isolated. 0:42:30.560 --> 0:42:33.279 It's kind of beautiful. It's a little creepy though, it's 0:42:33.320 --> 0:42:37.600 all like washed out. It's but it seems scenicd but 0:42:37.600 --> 0:42:39.799 it's also what if I get hurt? Who would come? 0:42:39.840 --> 0:42:43.960 How would you get here? It's so isolated and allowing 0:42:44.000 --> 0:42:45.919 you to sort of sink in and settle into that 0:42:46.160 --> 0:42:50.879 space before you meet your main characters. I mean, it's 0:42:50.920 --> 0:42:55.360 putting your setting first. It's saying the story couldn't happen anywhere, 0:42:55.800 --> 0:42:59.160 but here. I think it elevates and makes special everything 0:42:59.200 --> 0:43:01.680 you're about to see because it's like in a mooge 0:43:01.680 --> 0:43:04.920 booth bosh. I don't speak the language. I'm sure I'm 0:43:04.920 --> 0:43:09.920 not French. Likely a palate cleanser. 0:43:10.960 --> 0:43:14.600 Yeah, yeah, no, it really is. And then that first 0:43:14.680 --> 0:43:18.279 shot that we get of Robert Pattenson and Willem Dafoe 0:43:18.400 --> 0:43:20.719 standing next to each other with all their stuff, it's 0:43:20.760 --> 0:43:24.760 just like they just look they just look so grim 0:43:25.000 --> 0:43:28.000 and like like, why the fuck are we here? You know, 0:43:28.280 --> 0:43:30.799 they just don't look happy. They don't look happy. So 0:43:30.880 --> 0:43:32.240 it really also sets the tone. 0:43:32.920 --> 0:43:37.000 It does. It's yeah, it's it's a hell of a movie. 0:43:37.160 --> 0:43:42.840 I guess we should talk about the ending now. Yes, okay, 0:43:43.480 --> 0:43:50.040 so we spent this whole movie watching these two men 0:43:50.080 --> 0:43:53.360 try to one up each other. There is a power 0:43:53.440 --> 0:43:57.680 struggle and it yeah, really I kept going backwards and 0:43:57.719 --> 0:44:02.719 forwards in the last maybe half hour to track the 0:44:03.040 --> 0:44:06.759 exchange of power, and there's I mean literally, if you 0:44:06.800 --> 0:44:09.040 were to just rewind and fast forward through this part 0:44:09.080 --> 0:44:12.319 like I did, it's every two minutes, every three to 0:44:12.360 --> 0:44:16.640 five minutes, and what is changing is not always clear. 0:44:17.040 --> 0:44:18.560 And we talked a little bit about it earlier. My 0:44:18.560 --> 0:44:21.320 big takeaway from watching this film initially was like, Oh, 0:44:21.600 --> 0:44:25.400 it's strange. How if there's only two people in a room, 0:44:25.719 --> 0:44:28.560 you will become what you need to each other. Maybe 0:44:28.600 --> 0:44:31.640 not in a healthy way, but at some point they're 0:44:31.680 --> 0:44:35.680 parenting each other. At some point, they're brothers, at some point, 0:44:35.719 --> 0:44:38.319 they're coworkers, at some point their families, at some point 0:44:38.360 --> 0:44:43.920 their potential lovers. Like they're going through every possible relationship 0:44:44.040 --> 0:44:47.320 you could have with a person through this time frame. 0:44:47.400 --> 0:44:50.160 And if that's the case, then what your characters are 0:44:50.200 --> 0:44:52.760 left with is really they're fighting themselves and their entertainments, 0:44:52.800 --> 0:44:55.640 which again is the core in space of where masculinity, 0:44:56.040 --> 0:45:00.719 any kind of insecurity lives. And it builds to a 0:45:00.760 --> 0:45:07.399 point where Defoe's character is reduced to a dog and 0:45:07.840 --> 0:45:15.560 Pattenson's character is his owner. It is somewhat bondage puppy 0:45:15.600 --> 0:45:21.600 play maybe, but also just a complete psychotic break and 0:45:21.760 --> 0:45:27.239 instead of you know, you might you would expect an 0:45:27.360 --> 0:45:32.239 unwell person to maybe like beat the dog or to 0:45:32.440 --> 0:45:37.640 shun and like abandon the dog. Maybe again an unwell 0:45:37.640 --> 0:45:39.480 person take the dog out and like shoot it. But 0:45:39.560 --> 0:45:45.480 what he does is he buries it alive. Yeah, what 0:45:45.480 --> 0:45:49.960 what what does this this meaning ending mean to you? 0:45:50.280 --> 0:45:55.000 And also if if this is a film about toxic masculine, 0:45:55.000 --> 0:45:58.680 what do you think Edgar's takeaway is with this this 0:45:58.800 --> 0:46:00.800 part of the conclusion it's a conclusion. 0:46:02.120 --> 0:46:04.960 Yeah, you know, I don't even know if I have 0:46:05.120 --> 0:46:09.520 like a fully formed idea yet of what it means 0:46:09.520 --> 0:46:11.240 to me. But I will say the first time I 0:46:11.280 --> 0:46:14.880 watched it, I was like, what the hell is happening? 0:46:15.640 --> 0:46:18.439 What in the hell? Where did how did we get 0:46:18.560 --> 0:46:23.080 to this? But then you do go there is an 0:46:23.239 --> 0:46:26.720 escalation that gets us to that point, and I think, 0:46:27.880 --> 0:46:32.400 you know, I think maybe burying him alive might be 0:46:32.640 --> 0:46:38.440 a symbolism of like him Robert Pattinson's character, burying his shame, 0:46:38.840 --> 0:46:43.600 burying his you know, inadequacyes, those kinds of things. But 0:46:44.640 --> 0:46:46.560 I don't even know if I have like a fully 0:46:46.600 --> 0:46:50.880 formed idea of what exactly it means yet. You know, 0:46:50.920 --> 0:46:52.319 I think I'm gonna have to watch it a few 0:46:52.320 --> 0:46:55.520 more times to really kind of understand it, especially after 0:46:55.560 --> 0:46:58.160 this conversation, because you've really kind of given me a 0:46:58.200 --> 0:47:03.319 new light on on the movie. But yeah, I think, 0:47:04.040 --> 0:47:06.960 if anything, he feels ashamed about a lot of things, 0:47:08.280 --> 0:47:13.640 replacing the actual Frahim winslow lying doing all of this 0:47:13.760 --> 0:47:16.800 like power dynamic stuff, and then it evolves into a 0:47:16.880 --> 0:47:21.160 very homo erotic direction where he is really more attracted 0:47:21.160 --> 0:47:24.279 to women, or supposed to be attracted to women. There 0:47:24.320 --> 0:47:27.520 could be like a bevarying of shame going on there. 0:47:27.560 --> 0:47:28.839 I think, you know, I. 0:47:28.760 --> 0:47:31.680 Really like that read. I want to bring up. I'm 0:47:31.719 --> 0:47:37.200 trying to see if HBO will let me share this 0:47:37.480 --> 0:47:40.680 audio because I think the final speech. 0:47:41.200 --> 0:47:43.840 Yeah, Edgars is. 0:47:43.120 --> 0:47:48.240 A prolific Shakespeare scholar, studied in school at the collegiate level, 0:47:48.440 --> 0:47:50.960 like really really loves Shakespeare. Talked a lot about his 0:47:51.040 --> 0:47:53.400 love of Shakespeare when he was doing The Witch. And 0:47:53.480 --> 0:47:58.239 I think because this movie is predominantly monologues between men 0:47:58.360 --> 0:48:02.160 swinging erratically between emotions, no states of being can really 0:48:02.160 --> 0:48:05.680 get to embrace that idea. And because you're also dealing 0:48:05.719 --> 0:48:10.080 with death and sort of this operatic level of power, 0:48:10.280 --> 0:48:12.279 it works well. And so I just want to play 0:48:12.280 --> 0:48:15.600 a little bit of the speech that Defoe is as 0:48:15.640 --> 0:48:17.319 he's being buried alive. 0:48:21.080 --> 0:48:30.960 Shut up all all ship breastwork, oh right, aproaching arm 0:48:31.160 --> 0:48:34.920 sway him up from men's minds and men and heart 0:48:35.000 --> 0:48:40.760 Promathian plunder stoking eyes with divine shames and horror. 0:48:43.400 --> 0:48:44.560 I'm casting them. 0:48:44.400 --> 0:48:48.840 Down to David jonas he others. 0:48:50.680 --> 0:48:58.840 Stay mind yet in it see oh, the divine passion, 0:49:02.560 --> 0:49:11.200 the fedders green scent, where no man suffered, what toil is. 0:49:13.440 --> 0:49:16.920 Actually flab. 0:49:21.280 --> 0:49:22.120 Dot changing. 0:49:24.320 --> 0:49:29.720 Yes, the sha who gurdles round the globe. 0:49:32.239 --> 0:49:37.520 That's true, go Mesh. 0:49:38.440 --> 0:49:42.160 Very Shakespearean in the sense that I had to google 0:49:42.200 --> 0:49:46.319 a lot of those phrases to actually understand what the 0:49:46.360 --> 0:49:47.680 hell any of it meant. 0:49:47.880 --> 0:49:51.200 I know Davy Jones, but yeah, I was like, okay, 0:49:51.280 --> 0:49:54.200 so sent to Davy Jones is thrown undersea. To me, 0:49:54.560 --> 0:49:57.000 the I was just looking. I actually was in the 0:49:57.000 --> 0:49:59.520 process of looking at Philler's Greeds Afterlife, where there is 0:49:59.600 --> 0:50:03.320 prepa mirth okay, a filler never stops playing, and dancers 0:50:03.360 --> 0:50:06.600 you never tire, okay. So talking about being sent to 0:50:06.640 --> 0:50:10.160 the afterlife. But to me rewatching that scene and re 0:50:10.239 --> 0:50:14.560 listening to the speech now and having had this conversation 0:50:14.640 --> 0:50:18.360 with you, I do wonder if this is about And 0:50:18.440 --> 0:50:21.319 again I don't think Eggars is so literal. I think 0:50:21.520 --> 0:50:26.000 his films are open enough to leave it to your interpretation, 0:50:26.160 --> 0:50:28.520 which is to me one of the best forms of art. 0:50:28.560 --> 0:50:32.320 I really like art that is specific enough that it 0:50:32.360 --> 0:50:35.200 becomes universal. This is a really hard element to achieve. 0:50:35.360 --> 0:50:40.560 Oh God. Mir Kari, who's a Japanese fashion designer, talks 0:50:40.600 --> 0:50:45.160 a lot about this in their approach, which is essentially 0:50:45.200 --> 0:50:50.279 like the simpler, smaller, more unique you can be, the 0:50:50.400 --> 0:50:54.440 more universally people will understand, reflect and be able to 0:50:54.480 --> 0:50:56.759 attach to your artwork. That's a very broad way of 0:50:56.800 --> 0:50:59.920 explaining that, but I think Eggers were a lot of it. 0:51:00.040 --> 0:51:02.240 It's inside of that bubble. And because he's a director 0:51:02.239 --> 0:51:05.120 who doesn't talk too much about his work, he doesn't 0:51:05.200 --> 0:51:08.080 wind up cornering it into a very solid idea. And 0:51:08.160 --> 0:51:11.040 so what I get out of this scene is okay, 0:51:11.200 --> 0:51:14.560 if really like at this is patentson having quote one right. 0:51:14.880 --> 0:51:17.920 The masculinity race is one by the younger, more up 0:51:17.920 --> 0:51:20.680 and coming guy, and this is the old guy being 0:51:21.719 --> 0:51:25.800 accepting his end, accepting that he's no longer sort of 0:51:25.840 --> 0:51:31.000 a masculine dominant, accepting that it is his time to go. Yeah, 0:51:31.080 --> 0:51:34.839 but in a strangely in a merry way. And so 0:51:34.880 --> 0:51:36.719 I don't have to toil anymore. I don't have to 0:51:36.760 --> 0:51:39.960 work hard. I don't have to any longer adhere to 0:51:40.000 --> 0:51:42.319 these ideas of masculinity because I'm going to a place 0:51:42.320 --> 0:51:45.400 where that no longer matters and I can experience genuine 0:51:45.560 --> 0:51:49.799 joy I think I experience with him. Yeah, And I 0:51:49.800 --> 0:51:53.880 think that's a really interesting way, because you see in 0:51:53.960 --> 0:51:58.880 Patentson's performance that his character isn't getting any kind of 0:51:58.920 --> 0:52:02.359 joy out of this, even in the light at the end, 0:52:02.360 --> 0:52:04.040 which where we come to the second ending. Right, So 0:52:04.080 --> 0:52:07.360 the first ending is Defoe's character is literally buried alive, 0:52:08.360 --> 0:52:11.160 perhaps accepting that and being excited to leave this plane 0:52:11.160 --> 0:52:13.279 and don't have to deal with this bullshit anymore. Who 0:52:13.320 --> 0:52:18.680 couldn't identify Robert's Like, finally me and this light get 0:52:18.719 --> 0:52:21.399 to be together, and also I'm gonna burn this whole 0:52:21.400 --> 0:52:25.879 place down because I'm crazy, Okay, cool. So he gets 0:52:25.960 --> 0:52:28.319 up to the light and it sort of radiates and 0:52:28.360 --> 0:52:32.040 takes over everything, and this is sort of the final imagery. 0:52:32.680 --> 0:52:35.840 Yeah, the first the only color we see in the film, 0:52:35.880 --> 0:52:37.759 which I think is really fascinating too. 0:52:39.239 --> 0:52:42.000 Whenever the purple I think of purple hearts, right, like 0:52:42.120 --> 0:52:46.160 the idea of the wounded warrior, the fact that maybe 0:52:46.440 --> 0:52:51.719 no man gets out unscathed by the ideals of masculinity. Again, 0:52:51.760 --> 0:52:54.480 I don't think this is a film that's meant to 0:52:54.600 --> 0:52:56.239 say this is what it is to be a man. 0:52:56.280 --> 0:53:00.440 But it's a film interrogating the ideals of masculine and 0:53:00.480 --> 0:53:04.520 the way that they shape and harm the men who 0:53:04.560 --> 0:53:07.279 have to live under them, which is a profound and 0:53:07.760 --> 0:53:10.520 beautiful and weird and absolutely disgusting thing. You had. It 0:53:10.680 --> 0:53:15.600 was so so FROs but it worked on a lot 0:53:15.680 --> 0:53:18.360 of levels. This is a film that I don't know 0:53:18.440 --> 0:53:21.279 if I'll be visiting again soon, but that I have 0:53:21.360 --> 0:53:25.839 a deep appreciation for. Like I appreciate that everyone here 0:53:25.960 --> 0:53:29.279 was willing to be like weird and uncomfortable. I appreciate 0:53:29.320 --> 0:53:33.200 that this is a film that wanted to interrogate masculinity 0:53:33.239 --> 0:53:37.680 in a way that like Fight Club is similarly trying 0:53:37.719 --> 0:53:42.759 to explore this ideal masculinity, but unfortunately became cool and 0:53:42.800 --> 0:53:44.640 guys were like, yes, this is what I would have liked. 0:53:44.800 --> 0:53:47.120 It completely missed, like many people will miss the point. 0:53:47.920 --> 0:53:50.800 I don't think the light House will do that. I think, yeah, 0:53:51.239 --> 0:53:52.120 stay free of that. 0:53:52.360 --> 0:53:55.400 Yeah you may miss the point, but you won't be 0:53:55.520 --> 0:53:57.319 like I want to be like these guys. 0:53:57.400 --> 0:54:01.080 Right, I want to model myself after Yeah, I want to. 0:54:01.080 --> 0:54:05.000 Be as hot and Vicious's Brad pitt You know, none 0:54:05.080 --> 0:54:08.760 of that here, even though Pattinson is bringing the body, 0:54:08.800 --> 0:54:12.200 it's just it's not the same. And so I really 0:54:12.239 --> 0:54:15.239 appreciate that you love the space that I appreciate the 0:54:15.360 --> 0:54:18.480 odd ratio. I appreciate that he went back to working 0:54:18.520 --> 0:54:22.160 with animals despite having a terrible time working with him. Yeah, 0:54:22.160 --> 0:54:25.759 and his first film, he really to mine Eyes has 0:54:25.800 --> 0:54:29.200 pushed himself as a director to get better and try 0:54:29.400 --> 0:54:31.719 new things and get out of his comfort zone. And 0:54:31.760 --> 0:54:35.719 I think that's where great art is made. What is 0:54:36.080 --> 0:54:38.200 the Lighthouse leave you with? And how likely are you 0:54:38.239 --> 0:54:40.040 to watch it again sometime soon? 0:54:40.840 --> 0:54:42.960 Well, this was the second time I watched it in 0:54:43.000 --> 0:54:45.839 one gear. I do think I want to go back 0:54:45.840 --> 0:54:48.680 and watch it again, maybe in the new year, and 0:54:48.800 --> 0:54:52.800 just to kind of again process everything that we talked about, 0:54:53.520 --> 0:54:56.359 because you know, on my first two watches, I was 0:54:56.560 --> 0:55:02.800 a little bit confused as to how what the ending meant, 0:55:03.040 --> 0:55:10.040 you know, but I still respected as like some as 0:55:10.080 --> 0:55:13.040 you said that something that can you can add your 0:55:13.080 --> 0:55:16.000 own interpretation to. I like the fact that he doesn't 0:55:16.040 --> 0:55:17.799 like lay it on thick in the sense like this 0:55:17.880 --> 0:55:21.280 is exactly what it's supposed to mean and that people 0:55:21.320 --> 0:55:26.120 can really add their own, you know, their own thoughts 0:55:26.200 --> 0:55:28.080 and beliefs into it and just kind of see their 0:55:28.080 --> 0:55:31.480 own reflection in it. But yeah, as a woman, it 0:55:31.520 --> 0:55:37.799 doesn't necessarily particularly speak to me because I'm just like, 0:55:38.120 --> 0:55:41.160 you know, can can everybody stop being such guys about 0:55:41.200 --> 0:55:44.719 everything and just you know, actually talk and connect with 0:55:44.800 --> 0:55:50.640 each other and just chill. But you know, it's it's 0:55:50.719 --> 0:55:55.880 It's definitely one that I think probably leaves more men 0:55:56.640 --> 0:55:59.160 with like these thoughts of like, wow, what is my 0:55:59.239 --> 0:56:03.000 masculinity actually mean? And so I would be curious to 0:56:03.080 --> 0:56:06.160 get I would be curious. I tried to get my 0:56:06.200 --> 0:56:07.960 boyfriend to watch this one with me, and he wouldn't 0:56:07.960 --> 0:56:09.520 watch it with me because he was. 0:56:09.480 --> 0:56:13.760 Like, my boyfriend is not that scary. It's more trippy, 0:56:14.120 --> 0:56:15.200 even scary. Come. 0:56:16.320 --> 0:56:18.560 So I really want to get a man's read for 0:56:18.680 --> 0:56:20.799 how they feel about what men. 0:56:21.480 --> 0:56:23.799 Twice we have asked for your opinion, it probably won't 0:56:23.840 --> 0:56:26.680 happen again, so feel free to just really let us 0:56:26.719 --> 0:56:29.560 know how you feel about the horror movies and why, 0:56:29.760 --> 0:56:33.080 and specifically how you feel about this movie before we go. 0:56:33.360 --> 0:56:35.120 I just want to say with the black and white, 0:56:35.160 --> 0:56:36.880 I find it really interesting. I actually, while I was 0:56:36.920 --> 0:56:40.120 watching this, was really thinking about No Serratu, the story 0:56:40.200 --> 0:56:43.319 and what we have already, and I had to go 0:56:43.360 --> 0:56:45.960 and I was like, wait, is it in black and white? Nos? Not, 0:56:46.000 --> 0:56:48.760 It's in color. But if you look at the images 0:56:48.760 --> 0:56:53.719 they've released so far, it is very heavily leaning into grayscale, 0:56:54.080 --> 0:56:56.759 which is a new and fun way. Like again, it's 0:56:56.760 --> 0:57:02.200 like living yeah, not that shitty filtered blue. Like it's 0:57:02.280 --> 0:57:04.320 very exciting to me to be like, oh, you're working 0:57:04.360 --> 0:57:07.319 mostly in black and white, gray scale in it within 0:57:07.360 --> 0:57:09.719 a color film. And then it seems to me to 0:57:09.760 --> 0:57:13.600 be really leaning into fire and light a sort of 0:57:13.600 --> 0:57:16.560 a contrast to that element. And if you watch The Northman, 0:57:16.600 --> 0:57:19.320 which you should because we're gonna cover it next week, Uh, 0:57:19.920 --> 0:57:23.120 they use the blue of the night sky and fire 0:57:23.200 --> 0:57:27.320 as contrasting points of visual color throughout that film in 0:57:27.400 --> 0:57:30.520 a resting way. I cannot wait to talk about The Northman. 0:57:31.000 --> 0:57:31.120 Uh. 0:57:31.680 --> 0:57:34.760 I really love this film, like kind of unapologetically and 0:57:34.960 --> 0:57:38.600 very much into it. This is another film that explores masculinity, 0:57:38.640 --> 0:57:40.720 but in a different kind of way, more in an 0:57:40.760 --> 0:57:45.320 inherited father to son way than a general societal pressure way. 0:57:45.640 --> 0:57:49.120 And also Anya's back in a very fun, different type 0:57:49.120 --> 0:57:51.680 of witchy role, so there can be a lot for 0:57:51.760 --> 0:57:53.160 us to break down in the Northmen. 0:57:53.800 --> 0:57:56.280 And it's the one ager's movie the guys on our 0:57:56.440 --> 0:57:58.080 on our team have watched. 0:57:58.720 --> 0:58:04.680 Oh yeah, Aaron, my peachy, that's gonna be exciting. Yeah. 0:58:04.760 --> 0:58:06.360 Is there anything else you want to say about the 0:58:06.440 --> 0:58:08.680 Lighthouse before we get out of here? No? 0:58:08.800 --> 0:58:11.280 I just love it and it really feels and I 0:58:11.320 --> 0:58:14.680 know that, you know, Lovecraft is a controversial figure, but 0:58:14.880 --> 0:58:18.440 I just I love the use of these there. What 0:58:18.600 --> 0:58:21.000 really captivated me the first time I watched it was 0:58:21.040 --> 0:58:24.320 the use of that ultraviolet kind of purple color, which 0:58:24.320 --> 0:58:26.560 is which is known to be kind of like a 0:58:26.640 --> 0:58:30.600 cosmic horror sort of color. I love the use of 0:58:30.640 --> 0:58:33.200 like the tentacles and all of these things that make 0:58:33.240 --> 0:58:35.880 you think like, is there some sort of like monster, 0:58:36.360 --> 0:58:39.080 Like is there some sort of like unseen monster going 0:58:39.080 --> 0:58:41.840 on here? Because it really adds to all of the 0:58:41.880 --> 0:58:47.240 mystique and the mystery surrounding the movie. So those are 0:58:47.240 --> 0:58:48.960 the things that I think I really enjoyed about. And 0:58:48.960 --> 0:58:52.360 of course the performances from Willem Dafoe and Robert Pattinson. 0:58:52.400 --> 0:58:57.160 Willem Dafoe really nailed. He really nailed his character and 0:58:57.520 --> 0:58:58.240 really might have. 0:58:58.200 --> 0:59:01.480 Been a missed opportunity for Oscars. Too disgusting for the Oscars. 0:59:01.480 --> 0:59:04.400 But yeah, I'd love to go back and wait. Let's actually, 0:59:04.440 --> 0:59:07.400 let's see who were the If this movie comes out 0:59:07.400 --> 0:59:11.320 in twenty nineteen, then it's eligible for twenty twenty Oscars. 0:59:12.080 --> 0:59:15.600 Let's see twenty twenty eight Oscars. The other question, do 0:59:15.640 --> 0:59:19.600 you think he would have been best supporting or. 0:59:20.840 --> 0:59:25.480 Lead should have been made? I think Robert Pattinson felt 0:59:25.520 --> 0:59:28.960 more I know that he was kind of the main character, 0:59:29.280 --> 0:59:36.360 but Robert Patson felt more like a supporting character to 0:59:36.480 --> 0:59:39.680 Willem Dafoe's performances because his performances were so big and 0:59:39.720 --> 0:59:43.880 they were so like grand you know. It's funny Parasite 0:59:43.920 --> 0:59:47.640 won Best Picture that year and Joker had eleven nominations. 0:59:48.080 --> 0:59:49.960 Yeah, that was a sad year. It's also the year 0:59:49.960 --> 0:59:52.280 of Jojo Rabbit, which initially I liked and then I 0:59:52.320 --> 0:59:55.040 was like, I'm not quite sure how I feel about it. 0:59:55.440 --> 0:59:57.760 Marriage Story nine seventeen. Once upon a time, we were 0:59:57.880 --> 1:00:00.320 dealing with some great films and I'm not even gonna lie. 1:00:00.560 --> 1:00:03.360 I think was that the year? Oh god, what Best 1:00:03.360 --> 1:00:04.240 Supporting Actor? 1:00:04.760 --> 1:00:08.040 He didn't even get Best Director nomination? What the hell? 1:00:08.160 --> 1:00:12.120 Mm mmm, yeah, it was a strange year. No, to 1:00:12.160 --> 1:00:15.240 your point, Carmenate, don't think that there were any nominations 1:00:15.280 --> 1:00:20.280 for this film. Okay, Best Supporting Actor Brad pitt One 1:00:20.320 --> 1:00:22.280 from Once Point a Time in Hollywood is clipped booth. 1:00:22.560 --> 1:00:26.200 Tom Hanks was nominated for a Beautiful Day in the 1:00:26.200 --> 1:00:29.240 Neighborhood is Fred Rogers? Now, how is he Best Supporting Actor? 1:00:29.440 --> 1:00:32.240 Someone make it makes sense. He's a titular character. But 1:00:32.440 --> 1:00:35.840 oh my god. Anthony Hopkins was nominated for two Popes 1:00:35.840 --> 1:00:39.000 Appacino for The Irishman and Joe Peshy also for The Irishman. 1:00:39.040 --> 1:00:41.520 The Irishman. Yeah, I don't think anyone. Again, I'm not 1:00:41.520 --> 1:00:43.680 sure anybody would have voted for this. It's very disgusting. 1:00:43.720 --> 1:00:45.160 It's not an Oscar winner. 1:00:45.880 --> 1:00:49.800 Yeah, the Oscars are not. As we know, the Oscars 1:00:49.840 --> 1:00:53.520 are not a barometer for what's actually good the culture. 1:00:53.680 --> 1:00:58.920 Necessarily, it gave a keen phoenix his Oscar for playing 1:00:58.960 --> 1:01:04.560 the Joker, which, okay, fine, listen, it's a solid performance 1:01:04.560 --> 1:01:05.840 in a shitty film. To me. 1:01:06.800 --> 1:01:10.760 It had one nomination. Oh they did win for Okay, 1:01:10.800 --> 1:01:14.360 it nominated for was nominated at the Oscars for Best Cinematography, 1:01:14.880 --> 1:01:18.040 which feels okay, Yeah, I mean that's good, but it 1:01:18.080 --> 1:01:22.120 still feels like I feel like Robert Eckers maybe deserved 1:01:22.160 --> 1:01:24.000 Best Director nomination at least. 1:01:24.120 --> 1:01:26.480 I mean, he's really getting a lot out of these actors. 1:01:26.560 --> 1:01:30.600 And it's an argument I would have heard, Wait a minute, 1:01:30.600 --> 1:01:33.040 Best Directors, Bonking home one for Parasite. He should have 1:01:33.640 --> 1:01:36.680 Sam Mendez nineteen seventeen. That film is a doozy to 1:01:36.720 --> 1:01:40.280 get through, really like emotionally impactful. I agree with that nomination. 1:01:40.320 --> 1:01:42.440 Tarantino for a Once upon a Time in Hollywood, Okay, 1:01:42.800 --> 1:01:47.880 Todd Philips for Joker Again, I say, okay, gets nominated. 1:01:48.600 --> 1:01:51.160 I could kick Todd or Tarantino out of this category 1:01:51.200 --> 1:01:54.200 to make room for Eggers in this I would absolutely 1:01:54.240 --> 1:01:57.600 hear that argument. I didn't think we're gonna get to 1:01:57.600 --> 1:01:59.760 Awards talk. But you know, there's a lot of this 1:02:00.280 --> 1:02:03.080 is again. I really admire the way it's strived to 1:02:03.160 --> 1:02:06.360 achieve and then accomplished a lot of what its drived 1:02:06.360 --> 1:02:09.280 to do. I think it is as disgusting as it 1:02:09.320 --> 1:02:11.760 is it's genuinely beautiful. I do think you're getting some 1:02:12.160 --> 1:02:16.160 truly great performances. The range these guys have to go through, 1:02:16.560 --> 1:02:19.160 the way they're pushing each other, supporting each other too, 1:02:19.480 --> 1:02:22.600 and no one is ever outperforming. They're only sort of 1:02:22.600 --> 1:02:27.960 bolstering each other's performances. The dialogue. I mean, really, someone 1:02:27.960 --> 1:02:31.800 give this man a script writing nod, because the language 1:02:31.840 --> 1:02:33.360 and the way we didn't talk too much about it 1:02:33.360 --> 1:02:36.320 today and we do have to go. But the language 1:02:36.720 --> 1:02:40.680 and the way he manipulates and authenticates language from the 1:02:40.720 --> 1:02:43.720 era in the same way that he's manuscripts and stuff 1:02:43.760 --> 1:02:46.200 to craft the language for it's the wish and use 1:02:46.240 --> 1:02:48.840 the actual words of children who felt they were possessed 1:02:49.560 --> 1:02:52.080 and gave it to his characters. Here he found a 1:02:52.120 --> 1:02:56.440 woman who broke down the lexicon of different dialects along 1:02:56.480 --> 1:02:59.680 the eastern coast of America, and he used her book 1:02:59.720 --> 1:03:02.160 to really to write his own lines. He feels iffy 1:03:02.160 --> 1:03:04.000 about taking the words of other people and putting it 1:03:04.040 --> 1:03:06.720 on characters. He's like he was trying to be respectful 1:03:06.720 --> 1:03:08.520 then he wasn't sure if it was or wasn't. I'm 1:03:08.560 --> 1:03:10.520 not really sure where I fall along that line, but 1:03:10.560 --> 1:03:12.560 I do love that he has put so much effort 1:03:12.600 --> 1:03:16.920 into bringing these languages to life. The you versus ye 1:03:17.120 --> 1:03:21.919 conversations like battle they have yees you ye. Yeah. It's 1:03:21.920 --> 1:03:24.600 magnetic and it exemplifies so much of like they're from 1:03:24.640 --> 1:03:30.080 different spaces, they had different trades like it really livens 1:03:30.440 --> 1:03:33.160 the characters, and there is something to be said for 1:03:33.200 --> 1:03:36.920 being able to write that dialogue and for people who've 1:03:36.920 --> 1:03:39.240 never heard it before to be able to understand it clearly, 1:03:39.840 --> 1:03:42.160 you know, not just in the addiction of the actors, 1:03:42.200 --> 1:03:45.080 but in these words for the most part makes sense. 1:03:45.080 --> 1:03:47.800 And if they don't, I can at least interpret from 1:03:47.800 --> 1:03:51.000 the performance what's happening. Yes, that happens a lot in Shakespeare. 1:03:51.000 --> 1:03:53.600 It's a difficult thing to pull off. I think he 1:03:53.640 --> 1:03:56.400 does beautifully, So yeah, I don't. Should we end by 1:03:56.440 --> 1:03:57.600 ranking the film? 1:03:58.000 --> 1:04:03.280 I still think The Witch remains my favorite, agree, but 1:04:03.400 --> 1:04:08.320 this would be my my close second for sure. Oh, 1:04:08.360 --> 1:04:11.120 to be completely transparent here, I have yet to watch 1:04:11.160 --> 1:04:12.040 The Northmen, I. 1:04:11.960 --> 1:04:14.640 Compose, Oh my God, imply. 1:04:14.680 --> 1:04:16.680 But I am going to watch it on Thanksgiving, so 1:04:16.800 --> 1:04:18.560 it is going to be my Thanksgiving watch. 1:04:19.000 --> 1:04:21.600 Okay, I can't wait to hear your thoughts. I think 1:04:21.680 --> 1:04:24.280 I'm with you right now. Since we haven't reviewed The Northmen, 1:04:24.400 --> 1:04:25.960 I will keep it based off of these two. The 1:04:25.960 --> 1:04:27.440 Witch wins slightly ahead. 1:04:27.480 --> 1:04:27.720 For me. 1:04:27.960 --> 1:04:34.600 I think the tension in this is oftentimes as as 1:04:34.640 --> 1:04:37.320 good as the Witch. But to me, the little spaces 1:04:37.320 --> 1:04:41.960 in between the Witch are not as laborious, and by 1:04:42.000 --> 1:04:45.600 that I mean ye beats and I can understand more 1:04:45.680 --> 1:04:50.320 innately myself, like the looks between the parents and the 1:04:50.360 --> 1:04:53.760 looks between the kids, like there's something more happening there 1:04:53.800 --> 1:04:56.200 than for me, Like sometimes we're just looking at like 1:04:56.280 --> 1:04:59.640 house equipment for like thirteen seconds, You're like, oh, Robert, 1:04:59.720 --> 1:05:03.000 what what are we doing here? To the next thing? Please, 1:05:03.000 --> 1:05:06.600 for the love of God. But again, Boody Tony fun 1:05:07.280 --> 1:05:10.120 gets under your skin. Performance is so dynamic you can't 1:05:10.160 --> 1:05:13.640 look away from the scream. A solid film and definitely 1:05:13.680 --> 1:05:15.680 we're checking out. If you somehow got through this podcast 1:05:15.720 --> 1:05:18.280 and have never watched a film and you weren't sure 1:05:18.320 --> 1:05:20.840 about it, I highly suggest watching it. It is not 1:05:21.080 --> 1:05:25.480 very scary. It does sort of mess with your brain. Yeah, 1:05:25.520 --> 1:05:27.720 but it's good. Carmen, we did it. Thank you so 1:05:27.800 --> 1:05:30.240 much again for being here. This was a lot of fun. 1:05:30.280 --> 1:05:32.040 I cannot wait for our next one. 1:05:32.600 --> 1:05:33.840 I know, I'm so excited. 1:05:34.480 --> 1:05:37.000 Thank y'all, So thank you guys for listening. You can 1:05:37.080 --> 1:05:39.959 join us back here tomorrow as we have our first 1:05:40.000 --> 1:05:43.720 roundtable with They Had It Coming, an episode where we 1:05:43.800 --> 1:05:47.320 discussed our favorite deserves death from film and television. That 1:05:47.440 --> 1:05:49.880 on Wednesday, A book is us our next guide of 1:05:50.120 --> 1:05:54.960 Dude Prophecy. Thursday, we're looking back at our favorite video 1:05:54.960 --> 1:05:58.280 games of twenty twenty four. I didn't play many, but 1:05:58.320 --> 1:06:01.200 I'm excited to hear what y'all loved. Thinking him back 1:06:01.240 --> 1:06:03.520 on Monday, where Carmen and are going to break down 1:06:03.520 --> 1:06:07.640 Egger's most recent film, The Norseman. That's the episode. Thanks 1:06:07.640 --> 1:06:16.600 for listening, Bye y'all. X ray Vision is hosted by 1:06:16.680 --> 1:06:17.120 Jason N. 1:06:17.200 --> 1:06:21.600 Supsion and Rosie Knight and is a production of iHeart Podcasts. 1:06:22.240 --> 1:06:26.040 Our executive producers are Joelle Smith and Aaron Kaufman. Our 1:06:26.080 --> 1:06:30.920 supervising producer is a Boo Zafar. Our producers are Carmen 1:06:31.040 --> 1:06:35.800 Laurent and Mia Taylor. Our theme song is by Brian Basquez. 1:06:36.280 --> 1:06:40.560 Special thanks to Soul Rubin and Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman 1:06:40.920 --> 1:06:43.000 and Heidi on Disco Moderata