WEBVTT - Messaging Matters 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:14.320 Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wikay F Daily with 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:18.400 Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Recording from the Home Bunker. Folks, 0:00:18.640 --> 0:00:22.479 this show is being pre recorded in honoring of the 0:00:22.640 --> 0:00:25.959 Martin Luther King Junior Holiday, and so I wanted to 0:00:26.000 --> 0:00:30.640 bring back to the show my friend Kaivon Shroff, who 0:00:30.840 --> 0:00:35.320 is a Democratic commentator and all around ivy leaguer when 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:38.720 it comes to political science, to give us some insight 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:41.320 into his thoughts on where he thinks that the Democrats 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:44.440 are going to be in twenty twenty three. We go 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:48.199 off on a conversation largely around how this is a 0:00:48.320 --> 0:00:52.640 prime opportunity with Democrats in the minority in the House. 0:00:52.680 --> 0:00:55.880 And again, folks, only by four votes are they in 0:00:55.920 --> 0:01:00.000 the minority in the House. But this is the prime 0:01:00.040 --> 0:01:03.760 opportunity for Democrats to hone their messaging. And we talk 0:01:03.800 --> 0:01:09.319 about the real start contrast between Kevin McCarthy's acceptance speech, 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:11.760 if you can call it that, after fourteen failed vote 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:14.080 attempts that becoming Speaker of the House, which he has 0:01:14.120 --> 0:01:18.840 hollowed out because of his decision to give away everything 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:22.160 including the kitchen sink to the far right, reaching quote 0:01:22.240 --> 0:01:26.040 unquote freedom Caucus and the speech that was given by 0:01:26.319 --> 0:01:31.280 incoming Minority Leader Hakim Jefferies. And so, one of the 0:01:31.319 --> 0:01:34.360 things that you've heard me talk about regularly on woke 0:01:34.600 --> 0:01:38.039 F is the inability of Democrats to have a cohesive 0:01:38.720 --> 0:01:44.520 national messaging strategy that has us distill the very complicated 0:01:44.560 --> 0:01:46.880 policies and ideas that we try and put forth for 0:01:47.000 --> 0:01:51.440 the American people in something that is easily digestible. Now, look, 0:01:51.560 --> 0:01:55.000 we know that hate is readily easily digestible. We also 0:01:55.080 --> 0:01:57.040 know that the truth need not get in the way 0:01:57.080 --> 0:02:00.000 of a good story as it pertains to the far right. 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:06.320 But with Democrats in this space, have an opportunity because 0:02:06.360 --> 0:02:09.160 here's the thing, we know, no policies are going to 0:02:09.160 --> 0:02:14.320 be put forth. You could barely get a speaker chosen 0:02:14.480 --> 0:02:17.400 with the first four days of Republicans supposed to be 0:02:17.800 --> 0:02:21.639 wielding the gavel, let alone any major legislation. I mean, 0:02:21.680 --> 0:02:23.959 one of the first things that Kevin McCarthy talked about 0:02:24.240 --> 0:02:28.720 was defunding the IRS and more investigations into the federal government, 0:02:28.800 --> 0:02:31.080 none of which is going to do anything for the 0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:35.320 average American. So what does a messaging strategy look like 0:02:35.400 --> 0:02:39.160 by Democrats? What does it mean to consistently over the 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:42.400 next two years, remind the American people who is actually 0:02:42.480 --> 0:02:45.680 voting for their best interests when it comes to lowering 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:49.720 prescription drug prices, when it comes to looking at infrastructure, 0:02:49.760 --> 0:02:53.000 when it comes to our public school situation in terms 0:02:53.040 --> 0:02:55.560 of oh, I don't know, changing up full on curriculum 0:02:55.680 --> 0:02:58.400 to make sure that we continue with the white supremacy 0:02:58.440 --> 0:03:02.040 propaganda that we instilling young people instead of teaching them 0:03:02.040 --> 0:03:05.000 the truth. When we look at all of these things, 0:03:05.800 --> 0:03:08.360 we know that it is Democrats that are fighting for 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:12.679 the American people and Republicans that have aligned themselves with 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:16.760 our foreign enemies, looking at you Russia, looking at the House, 0:03:16.840 --> 0:03:19.720 Republicans deciding that they don't want to continue to help 0:03:19.840 --> 0:03:24.080 Ukraine continue their fight for democracy and against Putin because 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:27.799 you know, putinist Trump's BFF. So I think that there 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:31.080 is a major opportunity in the coming two years of 0:03:31.120 --> 0:03:34.080 the circus that we are in for for Democrats to 0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:38.960 really set an agenda, a stark agenda and clear narrative 0:03:39.080 --> 0:03:41.920 that shows the American people who the adults are in 0:03:41.960 --> 0:03:49.720 the room. So, coming up next my conversation with Kaivan Shroff. Folks, 0:03:49.720 --> 0:03:53.760 I am really happy to welcome back to woke f 0:03:53.960 --> 0:03:59.520 Kaivan Streff, who is a Democratic commentator and has is 0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:03.000 a cleated with Harvard Law, MPP from the Kennedy School, 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:06.360 NBA from Yal Sam political science from Brown University. He 0:04:06.560 --> 0:04:11.880 is an all around IVY leaguer and one of the 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:15.920 smartest people that I follow on TikTok, who puts out 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:17.920 some of the most thoughtful videos. So if you're not 0:04:18.080 --> 0:04:22.440 following him on TikTok, you should cavan. Happy New Year 0:04:23.240 --> 0:04:26.480 to you, Happy New Year. Agreed to be here, Happy 0:04:26.520 --> 0:04:32.640 New Year, Same Republican bullshit. So I want to start 0:04:32.680 --> 0:04:38.800 off with, you know, essentially getting your thoughts on how 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:43.120 you believe if you think I'll say this, if you 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:46.760 think that the first couple of weeks of this new 0:04:46.839 --> 0:04:51.640 year are in how Republicans antics on the House floor 0:04:52.200 --> 0:04:55.640 their decision to want to gut the Ethics Committee and 0:04:55.760 --> 0:05:00.240 create what HACKEM. Jeffries, minority leader has referred to the 0:05:00.320 --> 0:05:06.359 Insurrection Protection Committee in its stead. What do you make 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:10.600 of how Republicans are setting the tone for the next 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:14.440 two years. You know, I think they're really failing to 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:18.240 set a clear tone and unfortunately, I mean well fortunately 0:05:18.279 --> 0:05:21.640 for the country. But we've seen, you know, just total 0:05:21.760 --> 0:05:26.160 chaos under McCarthy short tenure so far. Let's see how 0:05:26.160 --> 0:05:28.880 long it lasts. But I think he's gotten so many narratives, 0:05:29.160 --> 0:05:32.200 especially the George Santo's narrative, that have really sort of 0:05:32.200 --> 0:05:34.640 taken away the opportunity to set a clear agenda and 0:05:34.720 --> 0:05:36.839 define what they want to do. At the same time, 0:05:36.880 --> 0:05:38.960 it's a little bit of letting them off the hook 0:05:38.960 --> 0:05:42.800 because I doubt they have a real credible agenda and 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:45.440 so it's very hard to permeate that. And I think 0:05:45.440 --> 0:05:49.400 it's a good time actually for Democrats obviously on messaging, 0:05:49.520 --> 0:05:52.800 because we would rather have won the House. But it's easier, 0:05:52.839 --> 0:05:55.919 I think, when you're in the minority to constantly be 0:05:56.200 --> 0:05:59.920 you know, criticizing and holding those who do have control accountable. 0:06:00.400 --> 0:06:02.680 And there's going to be a lot to say about 0:06:02.680 --> 0:06:05.400 this really corrupt regime that is in power in Congress. 0:06:05.480 --> 0:06:08.480 Right now. Let's talk about George Santos for a minute. 0:06:08.560 --> 0:06:11.799 So glad you brought him up, because it's like every 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:15.680 single day there is another unearthing of another lie that 0:06:15.720 --> 0:06:20.400 this man has told. And you know, I'm from Long Island, 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:23.240 I'm from Eastern Long Island. So from Suffolk County, and 0:06:23.360 --> 0:06:28.120 he represents parts of Nassau County, and the New York 0:06:28.240 --> 0:06:32.560 Republicans have called for him to step down. They say 0:06:32.600 --> 0:06:35.680 that he is an absolute distraction, that he does not 0:06:35.839 --> 0:06:39.120 have the capability to be able to do the job right. 0:06:40.720 --> 0:06:46.360 You have reporters hounding him this week and his response saying, 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:49.680 the constituents put me here, and I won't leave unless 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:53.000 I have one hundred and forty two random people tell 0:06:53.040 --> 0:06:57.960 me that life totally archery. Yeah right, And I was like, 0:06:57.640 --> 0:07:00.640 I got you know, I got one it as well 0:07:01.000 --> 0:07:03.400 on jan and forty two people telling him to step down. 0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:09.120 I want to talk about basically who George Santos is 0:07:09.640 --> 0:07:14.360 and how Kevin McCarthy as speaker, because he's so desperate 0:07:14.400 --> 0:07:20.640 for votes, refuses to acknowledge that this man is just 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:25.480 corrupt and a grift. Absolutely, and I think, honestly we're 0:07:25.480 --> 0:07:27.960 going to find out soon enough, but probably guilty of 0:07:28.120 --> 0:07:31.360 at least one or more crimes. And I think it's 0:07:31.360 --> 0:07:34.600 a very unique and great challenge for McCarthy to have 0:07:34.640 --> 0:07:38.400 to deal with because it really calls out that yes, 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:40.800 he's an extreme example, and yes they needed the votes, 0:07:40.840 --> 0:07:43.520 but I think there's another reason that McCarthy and others 0:07:43.560 --> 0:07:46.520 in GOOP leadership aren't going after him, it's because where 0:07:46.520 --> 0:07:48.120 do you draw the line. I mean, this is a 0:07:48.160 --> 0:07:52.080 caucus full of liars and sort of close to criminals, 0:07:52.080 --> 0:07:54.920 if not criminals. So you know, I think it's hard 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:57.480 for them to come out and criticize somebody, even such 0:07:57.480 --> 0:08:00.200 an egregious case, because then the next one and the 0:08:00.240 --> 0:08:02.880 next one, and gates and right, like, we're right, you 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:05.680 draw once you've opened the doors to all these sort 0:08:05.720 --> 0:08:09.040 of bad actors to be leaders in making our laws. Now, 0:08:09.040 --> 0:08:12.080 I think it is a total crock to say that 0:08:12.080 --> 0:08:14.080 this guy was elected and he's going to serve and 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:16.760 blah blah blah. This is not who voters elected. Voters 0:08:16.760 --> 0:08:20.680 elected a complete lie, a mythical individual. Nobody voted for 0:08:20.960 --> 0:08:23.800 George Santos or whatever his name is. So I don't 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:27.600 think that that is a reasonable, you know, response. It's ludicrous, 0:08:27.680 --> 0:08:29.520 It doesn't make any sense. I think it kind of 0:08:29.520 --> 0:08:32.600 worked better on some of the more chaotic figures like 0:08:32.640 --> 0:08:35.120 Marjorie Taylor Green, where yeah, like I guess she was 0:08:35.120 --> 0:08:38.640 elected by you know, the constituents in her district, and 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:41.920 that's who she is. She is crazy, but it's it's 0:08:41.920 --> 0:08:45.080 a very different case. Yeah, And I think that that's right. 0:08:45.160 --> 0:08:47.160 I think you make a good distinction, which is that 0:08:47.559 --> 0:08:52.760 you know, and remember, there were calls to take Marjorie 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:56.079 Taylor Green out of the off of the ballot in 0:08:56.160 --> 0:09:00.160 her district. There were calls and they lost, right she 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:02.640 obviously she stayed on the ballot, she was able to run. 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:07.320 And so these people knowingly are electing a QAnon conspiracist liar, 0:09:07.480 --> 0:09:10.920 right like, somebody who lies about reality, because that's not 0:09:10.920 --> 0:09:14.520 where she's operating. I think that George Santos, to your point, 0:09:14.960 --> 0:09:18.360 is a completely different case because his constituents have no 0:09:18.440 --> 0:09:21.600 idea who they voted for, right like at all. You know. 0:09:21.640 --> 0:09:23.680 One of the questions that I have, you know, as 0:09:23.679 --> 0:09:29.040 somebody who is so studied in our political landscape and 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:33.000 climate and government, is this where do you think that 0:09:33.320 --> 0:09:37.720 where was the breakdown in oppositional research from his opponent 0:09:37.840 --> 0:09:42.160 and just Democrats in general, like every seat mattered, and 0:09:42.200 --> 0:09:44.679 what was what has been said was, oh, well, this 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:48.320 wasn't a high profile you know, k Like, this wasn't 0:09:48.360 --> 0:09:51.040 a high profile election. It wasn't a high profile seat. 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:54.880 And I'm like, but in such a narrow win that 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:57.920 Republicans had every seat did matter. So where was the 0:09:57.960 --> 0:10:01.760 breakdown in research here? Right? No? I mean I think 0:10:02.200 --> 0:10:06.000 there was some democratic opa research here, but and a 0:10:06.040 --> 0:10:08.959 little little bit of local news coverage. Actually, once people 0:10:09.120 --> 0:10:11.480 part of the story, they looked back and saw, oh yeah, 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:13.559 some people did sort of mention this. But I think 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:15.760 it really speaks to and it's an indictment of our 0:10:15.920 --> 0:10:19.840 national media framework once again, where certain like how is 0:10:19.880 --> 0:10:23.000 this this is a critically important story and but four 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:25.960 three or four weeks of time could have totally changed 0:10:26.000 --> 0:10:31.679 the results yea, the power of Congress really, and somehow 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:33.400 it was missed. But you know, we got the New 0:10:33.440 --> 0:10:36.000 York Times today giving Kelly and Conway a platform to 0:10:36.040 --> 0:10:38.480 plug Trump, Like is that really what the New York 0:10:38.480 --> 0:10:41.480 Times should be doing? Yet they missed this story. And 0:10:41.520 --> 0:10:43.960 so I do think, you know, there's this competition at 0:10:43.960 --> 0:10:46.320 the local level and national level in media, and we 0:10:46.480 --> 0:10:48.600 are seeing sort of and continue to see. Really this 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:52.920 is a decades long problem, the decimation of local news yea, 0:10:53.000 --> 0:10:57.200 and very much competition from national players. But then they 0:10:57.280 --> 0:10:59.720 dropped the ball on stories like this, Like I don't 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:02.520 think could possibly argue this was not under the purview 0:11:02.520 --> 0:11:07.600 of the New York Times to cover. Do you think 0:11:07.640 --> 0:11:11.120 that Santos last the year? Do you think, you know, 0:11:11.200 --> 0:11:14.080 just just in your prediction, in your like shaking of 0:11:14.080 --> 0:11:17.000 the crystal ball, do you think that he makes it 0:11:17.040 --> 0:11:20.440 through even one year of his two year term? Or 0:11:20.480 --> 0:11:23.920 do we see indictments? I mean, he's being investigated by 0:11:23.960 --> 0:11:29.280 both the New York the Nassau County DAH and the 0:11:29.320 --> 0:11:33.960 federal government. Totally. I mean, I think it's laughable because 0:11:34.040 --> 0:11:36.480 another response of McCarthy was sort of, oh, if he 0:11:36.520 --> 0:11:38.920 did anything wrong, he'll face ethics. But as you pointed 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:43.840 out when we opened the ethics, he's in Congress, so 0:11:43.880 --> 0:11:47.480 that's that's comical. But um, I think, yes, I don't 0:11:47.480 --> 0:11:49.840 see him lasting the year if there are indictments that 0:11:49.880 --> 0:11:52.120 come down at the same time. And I think we're 0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:54.320 all a little tired of this, but we've seen how 0:11:54.440 --> 0:11:58.040 long this process of investigations can be, so I really 0:11:58.040 --> 0:12:00.199 think it's going to be tied to that. And once 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:03.720 there are criminal charges or more, um, you know, it'll 0:12:03.720 --> 0:12:05.640 be a different story and a harder to defend and 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:09.199 maybe a little easier for some Republicans who are uncomfortable 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:12.880 with what's going on to speak out. But you know, 0:12:13.679 --> 0:12:19.120 I'm not too hopeful that course correction here, Yeah, I'm 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:21.480 not too hopeful either. I mean, I won't hold my 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:23.280 breath because I don't want to pass out. But um, 0:12:23.800 --> 0:12:26.160 you know, one of the things that I think is, 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:29.920 you know, was really eye opening. I'll say this, for 0:12:30.120 --> 0:12:34.840 the fourteen failed votes that McCarthy had for speaker took. 0:12:36.080 --> 0:12:39.800 It took four days and fifteen votes for McCarthy to 0:12:40.040 --> 0:12:44.199 have this hollowed out speakership. Can you speak to some 0:12:44.240 --> 0:12:48.080 of the concessions that were made and why he is 0:12:48.240 --> 0:12:54.040 now considered one of the weakest speakers in history. Well, exactly, 0:12:54.040 --> 0:12:55.720 That's what I was going to say, is he's basically 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:59.400 speaker in name only, and the concessions, as I think 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:03.480 everyone's predicted for years seeing this slow moving train wreck 0:13:03.600 --> 0:13:07.040 of the GOP Congress, is that they basically cowt out 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:12.200 to every demand of the most extremist members of their caucus, 0:13:12.360 --> 0:13:15.480 and those people are have every incentive to continue to 0:13:15.520 --> 0:13:19.480 create chaos at every turn. It's paid off for them, unfortunately, 0:13:20.040 --> 0:13:21.360 and I think we're going to see more and more 0:13:21.400 --> 0:13:26.520 of it. And I think what was particularly alarming about 0:13:26.559 --> 0:13:29.440 the fifteen votes. Is I think if you a decade 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:32.240 ago said oh, this like sort of technical things happening 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:34.600 in Congress and they're going to go through multiple rounds 0:13:34.800 --> 0:13:36.439 or a bunch of days, and it's going to go 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:39.680 into the weekend, nobody on Earth would be really caring 0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:44.640 or watching that much. And suddenly you had everyone watching, right. 0:13:44.679 --> 0:13:48.640 And my concern with that is that there is almost 0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:53.040 this reality TV payout where you know, good attention intention 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:57.560 It allowed those people to kind of totally own the 0:13:57.720 --> 0:14:02.000 narratives and the media and write like, who knows fake conversations, 0:14:02.040 --> 0:14:05.319 have real conversations, but kind of play to a public audience. 0:14:05.360 --> 0:14:07.439 And we saw this little from Democrats too with Katie 0:14:07.440 --> 0:14:10.040 Porter and her book, but you know, it's just a 0:14:10.080 --> 0:14:12.640 totally different level. And I do think the incentives are off. 0:14:12.679 --> 0:14:15.240 And what was really interesting is obviously the c SPAN 0:14:15.320 --> 0:14:18.240 cameras kind of had a little bit more control of 0:14:18.240 --> 0:14:20.720 what they wanted to do. And I came across a 0:14:20.760 --> 0:14:22.920 piece and I'm blanking on the author, so forgive me, 0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:26.800 but basically saying, yeah, actually, this is terrible because we 0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:29.680 don't want this sort of false sense of like, oh 0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:31.480 now the cameras can do whatever they want, and there's 0:14:31.480 --> 0:14:34.880 more accountability when it's really just feeding into again that 0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:39.520 national media ecosystem that's really trying to create reality TV moments, 0:14:39.680 --> 0:14:43.360 and that's not really accountability. It's really giving attention seekers 0:14:43.600 --> 0:14:46.760 a channel to seek that attention and have an impact 0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:49.480 in a really bad way. You know, I'm so glad 0:14:49.520 --> 0:14:52.440 that you brought up the cameras because I was going 0:14:52.520 --> 0:14:56.040 to be remiss in not asking you your thoughts on 0:14:56.640 --> 0:15:01.840 that physical altercation that we saw on the house of 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:04.720 the floor at the floor of the house. Never in 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:07.960 my life, right, never in my life have I seen 0:15:08.600 --> 0:15:11.440 in American politics. Now we've seen this play out. We've 0:15:11.480 --> 0:15:13.600 seen a playout in Parliament. We've seen a play out 0:15:13.600 --> 0:15:17.120 in other countries where they literally have gone fisticuffs. We've 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:20.880 never seen this in America. Haive on, what was your 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:26.200 reaction to that, to that clip and to I mean, 0:15:26.360 --> 0:15:33.320 I my mouth felt. I was stunned. It was honestly, 0:15:33.360 --> 0:15:35.240 it did remind me and I might be getting this wrong, 0:15:35.280 --> 0:15:38.320 so forgive me my APUs history teacher, but I think 0:15:38.360 --> 0:15:41.600 there was like one example of some guy, like very 0:15:41.600 --> 0:15:44.360 early on, beating somebody else with a cane like either 0:15:44.480 --> 0:15:46.320 in the house or the Senate. So I have to 0:15:46.320 --> 0:15:49.040 look that up after this, but I'm sure, but it 0:15:49.040 --> 0:15:51.120 really reminded me of that, and I was like, yeah, 0:15:51.160 --> 0:15:54.000 to your point, like we have not seen this in forever, 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:56.680 but this really is who the Republican Party is. I mean, 0:15:56.720 --> 0:16:00.440 this is a pro violence, pro insurrection party. These are 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:02.960 a bunch of frat guys that you know ended up 0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:06.080 in Congress. Let's be honest about that. I mean they 0:16:06.120 --> 0:16:10.240 have no policy positions and they're not very thoughtful now 0:16:10.360 --> 0:16:13.960 care about their constituents. All they care about is you know, 0:16:14.440 --> 0:16:17.520 straight rich white guys and how they can protect that 0:16:17.560 --> 0:16:20.280 group of people and you know, hold onto powers. So 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:24.280 of course you see this sort of ludicrous behavior. I 0:16:24.320 --> 0:16:26.960 mean it was just such you know, and I've said 0:16:26.960 --> 0:16:29.520 this so many times on this show, and obviously, like 0:16:29.840 --> 0:16:34.240 you also went into politics. There was such an esteem 0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:36.800 that I held when I worked on Capitol Hill, like 0:16:36.920 --> 0:16:39.040 I would see these members, it was it was it 0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:41.240 was a kin. I would tell people if you were 0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:44.560 in Hollywood and you're seeing like the directors that you 0:16:44.640 --> 0:16:46.840 love and the writers that you love, like walking the 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:49.640 halls and the actors and the actresses, there was this 0:16:49.800 --> 0:16:52.760 air of like, oh, my goodness, I'm walking the halls 0:16:52.760 --> 0:16:56.800 of history and to watch it devolve into like you're 0:16:56.880 --> 0:17:02.280 into a frat house, into just like this, this horrible, tacky, 0:17:02.840 --> 0:17:08.320 trashy behavior. I just it's it has brought the air 0:17:08.480 --> 0:17:13.320 and the esteem and any bit of regalness that our 0:17:13.359 --> 0:17:16.520 government had is now just in the sewer. And I 0:17:16.520 --> 0:17:20.960 don't think that folks recognize how that damage will affect 0:17:21.040 --> 0:17:25.840 us for decades to come, what that has done to 0:17:25.840 --> 0:17:29.840 to our faith right in these systems and in these people. 0:17:31.760 --> 0:17:34.439 And I mean, like, who is going to have the 0:17:34.560 --> 0:17:39.320 institutional knowledge to put things back together? Because to your point, 0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:42.359 I don't think anyone or most people that want to 0:17:42.400 --> 0:17:44.680 do good work and want to contribute to our democracy 0:17:44.760 --> 0:17:47.280 see that it's a viable path to do so. So 0:17:47.520 --> 0:17:49.600 they're not going to go there. Um so where are 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:51.320 they going to go? Probably to the private sector or 0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:53.679 something like that. I meanwhile, you'll have sort of the 0:17:53.720 --> 0:17:57.000 worst group of people doing these things and staffing up 0:17:57.040 --> 0:18:00.280 these offices, and those will be the people around until 0:18:00.320 --> 0:18:03.800 something major changes. Yeah. It just it really, you know, 0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:06.760 aside from the side show and the circus and we 0:18:06.880 --> 0:18:09.280 kind of laugh so that we don't cry, It is 0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:12.240 kind of heartbreaking, right for those of us who really 0:18:12.320 --> 0:18:16.639 believe in public service, who really believe in the ability 0:18:16.640 --> 0:18:20.840 of government to better the lives of everyday Americans, and 0:18:20.880 --> 0:18:24.520 then to watch it turn into a trashy reality TV 0:18:24.720 --> 0:18:29.199 side show is really it is heartbreaking. I don't I 0:18:29.200 --> 0:18:31.399 don't know what else to say about it. As you 0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:36.000 as we watched, um, you know, finally Kevin McCarthy take 0:18:36.040 --> 0:18:40.080 the speakership after fourteen failed votes. We watch him give 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:44.639 his speech, which was just breathless in its inability to 0:18:44.680 --> 0:18:49.320 read the room. Then we, in contrast, watch Hakeem Jeffries. 0:18:50.119 --> 0:18:54.280 I want to get your your response in thoughts to 0:18:54.520 --> 0:18:59.359 Hakeem's jeff Jakeem Jeffreys ABC's of Democracy. I love that. 0:18:59.560 --> 0:19:01.639 I love that. I actually thought it was so clever. 0:19:01.800 --> 0:19:04.199 At first, it was like, is it a little corny? 0:19:04.280 --> 0:19:06.920 And it is a little corny, honest, but it doesn't matter, 0:19:07.119 --> 0:19:09.560 Like it was so wholesome. But it was actually so 0:19:09.960 --> 0:19:13.600 on the mark too, Like it came in a package 0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:16.879 that was very presentable and sort of unassuming, but if 0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:20.160 you look at the words used and the comparisons drawn, 0:19:20.320 --> 0:19:22.639 it was so clever and it was an easy thing. 0:19:22.720 --> 0:19:25.200 By the way, obviously we were talking about TikTok. You know, 0:19:25.400 --> 0:19:27.359 it was an easy thing for people to clip and share, 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:30.919 so that was genius too. So it was a great device, 0:19:31.000 --> 0:19:34.399 I think, and it really introduced him in a tone 0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:39.199 that is going to allow I think McCarthy to make 0:19:39.280 --> 0:19:42.879 the biggest fool of himself because he wasn't going out right. 0:19:43.119 --> 0:19:47.159 He didn't come with, you know, too much harshness or 0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:49.840 like energy to start with. I think we'll probably see 0:19:49.840 --> 0:19:51.800 a little bit more of that as things get more 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:55.680 and more sort of aggressive with this new Congress. But 0:19:56.080 --> 0:19:59.080 you know, it kind of was a totally open, neutral, 0:19:59.440 --> 0:20:02.159 like yes, going to call out facts and be president 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:04.280 in this reality. At the same time, you know, I 0:20:04.359 --> 0:20:07.800 think he said, you know, like let's disagree without being disagreeable. 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:10.639 It's not my personal favorite mantra, but I would think 0:20:10.720 --> 0:20:14.280 it serves in some cases, like perhaps this case on 0:20:14.440 --> 0:20:20.120 his first speech sort of on a supernational stage. How 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:25.120 do you think that How came Jeffreys as minority leader 0:20:25.200 --> 0:20:28.800 and this new leadership team are going to be able 0:20:28.920 --> 0:20:34.120 to take on um these kind of weaponized, violent, volatile 0:20:34.560 --> 0:20:39.320 Republicans in the House. How do you see this, this team, 0:20:39.480 --> 0:20:45.560 this group playing out differently than Pelosi did for you know, 0:20:45.640 --> 0:20:48.920 for for for over a decade. Well, I think it 0:20:49.000 --> 0:20:51.480 ties back to one of your earlier questions today, which is, 0:20:52.040 --> 0:20:55.000 now Democrats have this moment. Right under Pelosi's leadership, they 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:57.520 were actually racing against the clock to get as much 0:20:57.640 --> 0:20:59.600 done as humanly possible, and they did a lot. They 0:20:59.640 --> 0:21:02.880 did alish a massive amount. I think everyone is impressed 0:21:02.880 --> 0:21:05.639 with Biden's sort of first term on that aspect, and 0:21:06.000 --> 0:21:08.320 he obviously owes a lot of credit to Pelosi for that. 0:21:09.440 --> 0:21:12.040 Now they're in the position of really getting to lean 0:21:12.119 --> 0:21:15.760 into narrative and communication and story because it is going 0:21:15.800 --> 0:21:18.680 to be harder for Democrats to push things through Congress. 0:21:19.600 --> 0:21:23.160 But there's that opportunity then to show the country how 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:26.359 diverse and awesome the people that we've elected to the 0:21:26.440 --> 0:21:29.879 party are, and to really call out the bad behaviors 0:21:30.359 --> 0:21:33.000 and maybe in a more sort of strident way, because again, 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:35.560 at the end of the day, it's not realistic that 0:21:36.119 --> 0:21:38.720 too much is going to come through on consensus. So 0:21:38.800 --> 0:21:40.600 we'll see. I mean, maybe that won't be the case, 0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:42.600 but I highly expect it to be sort of a 0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:46.680 standstill with in terms of bi partisanship and so it 0:21:46.840 --> 0:21:49.879 kind of gives you this chance where you're basically getting 0:21:49.960 --> 0:21:54.520 to and it's not a nice phrasing maybe, but to perform, 0:21:54.640 --> 0:21:56.200 right like, they're going to get to perform now for 0:21:56.280 --> 0:21:59.480 the next two years and create the best show possible. 0:21:59.560 --> 0:22:02.640 And do you know, hopefully what frankly, Republicans are pretty 0:22:02.680 --> 0:22:05.120 successful at, which is getting that intention and getting those 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:08.880 narratives out there. Now, Democrats are in a position where 0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:11.200 they can kind of keep you know, poking the bear 0:22:11.280 --> 0:22:14.040 and seeing what they can you know, drive attention around, 0:22:14.080 --> 0:22:16.320 and I think that will be successful, especially you know, 0:22:16.400 --> 0:22:19.480 I think people are concerned if you ask, you know, who, 0:22:19.600 --> 0:22:21.760 if not Biden would run in twenty twenty four, which 0:22:21.760 --> 0:22:24.159 I don't really honestly think is a productive question, but 0:22:24.600 --> 0:22:26.680 they reflect on sort of is there a deep bench 0:22:26.720 --> 0:22:29.720 for Democrats? And I think absolutely, especially from some of 0:22:29.720 --> 0:22:31.600 the governors we're seeing. But we're also going to be 0:22:31.640 --> 0:22:33.440 able to see over the next two years hopefully if 0:22:33.480 --> 0:22:36.680 done well, you know, emphasis on some great members of 0:22:36.720 --> 0:22:38.600 Congress that we have to offer who can be future 0:22:38.720 --> 0:22:40.320 leaders of the party. So I think now is a 0:22:40.440 --> 0:22:43.879 real time to focus on connecting with the American people. 0:22:45.080 --> 0:22:49.240 Last question for you is this you know, I think 0:22:49.280 --> 0:22:52.720 that a lot of Americans. I think the midterm election 0:22:52.880 --> 0:22:58.479 showed that more Americans care about preserving our democracy than 0:22:58.560 --> 0:23:01.280 the mainstream media gave them credit for. They kept saying, 0:23:01.440 --> 0:23:03.359 you know, these are not the issues, it's the kitchen 0:23:03.440 --> 0:23:06.120 table issues. And I kept saying, well, if you don't 0:23:06.160 --> 0:23:08.560 have a democracy, you don't have a kitchen table. So 0:23:08.680 --> 0:23:11.840 I'm confused about the other things that would be taking 0:23:11.920 --> 0:23:17.080 your attention. But you know, as we continue to look ahead, 0:23:17.240 --> 0:23:19.240 this year is kind of the march to the real 0:23:19.359 --> 0:23:22.919 beginning of the presidential cycle. As you have lifted up, 0:23:24.160 --> 0:23:28.560 what do you think about Americans attention and stamina as 0:23:28.680 --> 0:23:33.440