Speaker 1: Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where we're once.
Speaker 2: Again reminding you not to eat the yellow snow. It's Tuesday,
Speaker 2: December tenth, and on today's show, our friends Kalain Conahan,
Speaker 2: VP of Global Sales and creative mastermind for Legends, and
Speaker 2: Josh Bart, producer for ESPNS Around the Horn make their
Speaker 2: triumphant return to group Chat. We'll talk college hoops, the
Speaker 2: rules of engagement for coed adult sports, how to pick
Speaker 2: an unrival team, and the new women's sports show coming
Speaker 2: to Disney.
Speaker 1: Plus, it's all coming up right after this.
Speaker 2: Welcome Back Slices tomorrow. We're going to bring you all
Speaker 2: the news you need to know. But there was so
Speaker 2: much to chat with Kalein and Josh about. We're going
Speaker 2: to get right into that conversation.
Speaker 1: Here it is.
Speaker 2: It's time for another group chat where we take the
Speaker 2: tea from the text and bring it on to the airwaves.
Speaker 2: We've got to repeat appearance from my faves Collein and Josh.
Speaker 2: First up, she's a VP of Global Sales and creative
Speaker 2: mastermind for Legends. In the streets and an ultra marathoner
Speaker 2: also in the streets, but maybe in the sheets. We
Speaker 2: don't know we made homemade candles and bass scrubs together
Speaker 2: in OHI like two high class hippie bitches.
Speaker 1: It's Clay Conahan. What's up, Klaid?
Speaker 3: Oh, it's so good to be here. Sarah actually was
Speaker 3: burning one of the candles just like a few hours ago,
Speaker 3: so it still has that crembrulat eminence around here.
Speaker 1: Amazing joining her.
Speaker 2: He's a producer for ESPN's Around the Horn, eighteen years
Speaker 2: at the show and counting. When filling out the Katuba
Speaker 2: wedding contract at his recent nuptials, he accidentally signed as
Speaker 2: the bride. Now that's allyship in action. It's Josh Bard.
Speaker 1: What's up? Josh?
Speaker 4: Read everything twice? People just read things twice before you'd
Speaker 4: sign once.
Speaker 1: You're a beautiful bride. Welcome back.
Speaker 2: You two, so happy to have you. Let's start with
Speaker 2: college basketball. I had a great conversation with Alexa philipp
Speaker 2: Who the other day that really caught our listeners and
Speaker 2: me up on the biggest stories. But I want to
Speaker 2: ask y'all, as two diehards, if there's any teams or
Speaker 2: players you want to give a shout to, any storylines
Speaker 2: you've been dying to talk about or get a hot
Speaker 2: take out about Josh, Let's start with you. You're full of takes.
Speaker 4: Full of takes. I've heard a lot of them. I've
Speaker 4: tried to pick a take that I hadn't heard too
Speaker 4: much of after listening to Let's send you. The team
Speaker 4: that I am most I would say interested in that
Speaker 4: I don't here talked about all the time, the Texas Longhorns.
Speaker 4: I really liked Madison Booker, the way she played last year.
Speaker 4: I'm super excited to see her back. They brought back
Speaker 4: their top four scores from last year. They added a
Speaker 4: chancefer from Miami and who's scoring eleven points in nineteen minutes.
Speaker 4: I looked that up today. Eleven points in nineteen minutes.
Speaker 4: It's crazy, so effective, inefficient. Yeah, I just I've always
Speaker 4: liked this team. I think Vick Schaeffer is one of
Speaker 4: the best coaches in the country that never ever gets
Speaker 4: talked about on the level of you know, the Gino's
Speaker 4: and the Kim Molkys and the John Staleys. Of course,
Speaker 4: he's just so good. I feel like he always makes
Speaker 4: his players a lot better as a team. So, you know,
Speaker 4: they joined the SEC this year. Obviously, that changes a
Speaker 4: lot of things about their schedule. This is just a
Speaker 4: team that I'm really going to be locked in on.
Speaker 1: I love it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, would she drop Texas as a team that could
Speaker 2: maybe get to number one?
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, we like the spicy take.
Speaker 2: Colaine, you got any players, teams, storylines that you've been
Speaker 2: dying to gab about.
Speaker 3: I mean, so, first off, I think one of the
Speaker 3: things as we evaluate college basketball and where where things
Speaker 3: are going to end in the end, because where we
Speaker 3: are right now I think will be will continue to
Speaker 3: be in flux. And I love the conference schedule because
Speaker 3: I just think it chews up and spits out all
Speaker 3: of the fakers, the impostors, and even some of the
Speaker 3: real ones, and it leaves us really confused. And honestly,
Speaker 3: I find that so much fun. And we're obviously getting
Speaker 3: We're right on the precipice of conference play. The thing
Speaker 3: that I'm always looking for, because again, I think it's
Speaker 3: what bears fruit in conference tournaments as well as when
Speaker 3: we get to the march madness. Do you have two
Speaker 3: excellent guards who can carry the ball, create their own shot,
Speaker 3: and facilitate an offense, And I think you need one
Speaker 3: reliable big. So I think there's a lot of contenders,
Speaker 3: and there's a lot of teams in discussion, and Alexa
Speaker 3: mentioned many of them. I think Yukon has that. I
Speaker 3: think if Sarah Strong continues to grow and develop, she's
Speaker 3: to me's the She's the lynchpin in that because page
Speaker 3: is gonna page right if Asy's healthy. Kk Arnold is impressive.
Speaker 3: So I think Yukon really has an opportunity, but I
Speaker 3: think it really hinges on Sarah Strong's continued development. I've
Speaker 3: been super impressed with what I've seen from UCLA. Again,
Speaker 3: that's no surprise. Notre Dame, I think, also has that combination,
Speaker 3: and just we haven't seen us. We have not seen
Speaker 3: a super healthy Matty Westbeld and I suppose this probably
Speaker 3: won't surprise Josh or you, Sarah. But one team that
Speaker 3: we haven't heard anything about is the University of Maryland Terrapins,
Speaker 3: who number seven in the polls. They started I think
Speaker 3: twenty and have just continued eight. And oh and I
Speaker 3: just want to put some respect on Brenda Freese's name.
Speaker 3: This coach continuously goes to the transfer portal and finds talent,
Speaker 3: and I think not only does she create an incredible team,
Speaker 3: but like there are players on this squad who are
Speaker 3: like Cheyenne Cellars is a dog. Nobody talks about her.
Speaker 3: And again, I'm a homer went to Maryland. I love
Speaker 3: this team. I have season tickets. But I'm telling you
Speaker 3: that to sleep on this team is you're gonna get
Speaker 3: showed up and spit up yourself. Because we talked about Vick.
Speaker 3: Totally agree, JB. I think Vick Schaeffer is an incredible coach.
Speaker 3: But I think Brenda her exes and o's and her
Speaker 3: ability to get the best from her players and to
Speaker 3: find what she needs is unmatched.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 3: There's a reason that last year, with even a weaker
Speaker 3: team in terms of personnel, that we were still able
Speaker 3: to take We were still able to beat Ohio State
Speaker 3: and still able to take Iowa to the wire. So
Speaker 3: you know, I, I just want to make sure that
Speaker 3: we're not we're not discounting the value of a coach.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and we do get stuck on a lot of
Speaker 2: the same teams, particularly ones that had great success the
Speaker 2: year before, have those big names, and then there's those
Speaker 2: ones that are sitting in that top ten kind of
Speaker 2: sneaky style.
Speaker 1: That we're going to have to address pretty soon before
Speaker 1: we move on.
Speaker 2: Josh, I want to ask you quickly, did you have
Speaker 2: a similar reaction to watching Haley van lift this year
Speaker 2: where what we saw last year was so off that
Speaker 2: you're like, is it her? Is it just the program?
Speaker 2: Is it just the fit? Because she looks reborn at TCU.
Speaker 4: Yeah. I was thinking about that and I felt like
Speaker 4: I should if I was going to bring her up,
Speaker 4: I should come and apologize for the slander I've put
Speaker 4: on her in the three by three in the Olympics.
Speaker 4: I think as soon as we talked about how bad
Speaker 4: it was, how bad it was going, they totally turned
Speaker 4: it around. They kind of looked like a team. Yeah,
Speaker 4: this is another example of like a new fit, a
Speaker 4: new space. You know, it's impossible to it feels like one.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: LSU is one of the the like ultimate conundrums in
Speaker 4: my brain of like the players seem to mostly love
Speaker 4: playing there and that's confusing to me. And yeah, you know,
Speaker 4: like they certainly produced very good results there and that's inarguable,
Speaker 4: and but she it didn't work for her. It just
Speaker 4: did not work for her. It was an embarrassment I
Speaker 4: think for her and the team probably the way that
Speaker 4: season ended for them, together, and I kind of wrote
Speaker 4: her off. I mean I certainly wrote her off talking
Speaker 4: about the Olympics. In my brain, I wrote her off.
Speaker 4: And then when I saw what TCU was doing this
Speaker 4: year and I was like, oh, that's where that's where
Speaker 4: Hayley van Lyth went. It's it's awesome. I mean, like,
Speaker 4: this is what we want. We want players to find
Speaker 4: the best fits. She was the best to watch and
Speaker 4: root for at Louisville. She had that spunk, she had
Speaker 4: that attitude she had. I mean, like Clay said, she
Speaker 4: had that dog in her for sure, and it's nice
Speaker 4: to see her get back to that. I absolutely one
Speaker 4: of the cooler stories so far this year.
Speaker 2: While we're on the topic of TCU, quickly, Colaine, did
Speaker 2: you have any to add to what Alexa said about
Speaker 2: handling stories like Sadona Prince of TCU, Hannah Hidalgo of
Speaker 2: Notre Dame. I won't repeat all the issues, but Hannah
Speaker 2: reposted a Candice Owens Instagram calling gay marriage just in
Speaker 2: Sadona Prince accusations of physical and verbal abuse. Ashton Watkins
Speaker 2: at South Carolina wasn't even with the team for a
Speaker 2: while because of charges first degree as Salt and battery
Speaker 2: and kidnapping that were dismissed after she completed an intervention program.
Speaker 1: I thought Alexa summed up a lot of it.
Speaker 2: Did you have anything to add because I think it's
Speaker 2: interesting to see how we handle women who are problematic
Speaker 2: versus men in the sports space.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I thought Alexa totally had and I know Sarah,
Speaker 3: you and I have talked about this. I thought Alexa
Speaker 3: covered it really well that you don't want if the
Speaker 3: amount of coverage of women's sports is so limited and
Speaker 3: you're having an opportunity, you don't want to dedicate it
Speaker 3: to the negative story because then the good stories don't
Speaker 3: get out there in the mainstream. But I do think
Speaker 3: that we're on the precipice of not having to play
Speaker 3: that game anymore, and I'm I can't wait for us
Speaker 3: to be able to hold people account of right. I
Speaker 3: want my superstars to be superstars, and I want people
Speaker 3: who have growth, you know, in their future, I want
Speaker 3: them to be held accountable. I think that's important to
Speaker 3: me as a fan. You know, I think you hear
Speaker 3: all the time a lot of you heard Caitlin Clark
Speaker 3: talking about how she looked up to Maya Moore and like, look,
Speaker 3: what a role model that is, right, So many of
Speaker 3: these athletes have a platform and an opportunity to impact
Speaker 3: the next generation and even impact older generations their own cohort,
Speaker 3: and I think that responsibility is something that journalists also
Speaker 3: have a responsibility to call attention to. So I think
Speaker 3: we're getting to the point where, you know, your show
Speaker 3: is a great platform, for example, where there's a balance
Speaker 3: of coverage. We're already talking about the sports. So to
Speaker 3: hold people accountable is I think it's it's necessary at
Speaker 3: this point because it's not just a morsel. It's not
Speaker 3: the only thing that we're covering about them. We can
Speaker 3: know that TCU is having a resurgence season and that
Speaker 3: simultaneously Sadona Prince is maybe not an angel, and that's okay, right,
Speaker 3: we reckon with that. How do we reconcile that, How
Speaker 3: do we recognize And I think I'm passionate about this
Speaker 3: as well, that women can be complex, multi dimensional figures
Speaker 3: as well, like we're not.
Speaker 1: We can be villains.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, And Josh, you know, you've been with Around
Speaker 2: the Horn for almost twenty years. It's a place that
Speaker 2: does a good job of covering women's sports. But certainly,
Speaker 2: it's still a much smaller percentage than the men's stories
Speaker 2: that get covered. And I'm sure at times you've had
Speaker 2: to address the idea of like, we can't only cover
Speaker 2: this when somebody does something bad or wins it all.
Speaker 1: So how do you think about this this situation?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I thought Clane, I agree with everything she said there,
Speaker 4: and I was going to actually just add something that
Speaker 4: made me think of is like, it's not just players, right,
Speaker 4: it's teams. It's like what's happening with the Seattle storm
Speaker 4: right now? You know that I think a lot of people,
Speaker 4: because we love the players and the coach of the
Speaker 4: Las Vegas Aces, we look past or we didn't really
Speaker 4: delve as deep into the stuff with Dereka hanby the
Speaker 4: allegations that she had, And it's so it's not just
Speaker 4: like that same kind of call out with the same
Speaker 4: kind of responsibility that we have in holding people's feets
Speaker 4: to the feet to the flames. Same for organizationally. I mean,
Speaker 4: you know, I just think that we, you know, like
Speaker 4: Clain said, the more we're paying attention to women's sports,
Speaker 4: the more power that the players and organizations get. The more,
Speaker 4: you know, the more responsibility they have to answer for
Speaker 4: these things too.
Speaker 1: Yeah for sure.
Speaker 2: Okay, switching gears. I want to talk about co ed
Speaker 2: adult sports. These can be an absolute blast. They can
Speaker 2: also be a hotbed for trash behavior and a breeding
Speaker 2: ground for completely unhinged folks who are stuck in their
Speaker 2: glory days. And you two are the perfect people to
Speaker 2: talk about this because you've been playing co ed hoops
Speaker 2: together forever, and Colaiane you worked in adult co ed sports.
Speaker 2: So I can't think of two better people to help
Speaker 2: me craft this official co ed adult sports etiquette code.
Speaker 1: So I'm going to bring one rule.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna need two from each of you to craft
Speaker 2: this five rule code. But first, before we get started,
Speaker 2: I need a very quick fave anecdote from your co
Speaker 2: ed sports, playing or working whatever it is. I'm gonna
Speaker 2: do mine quickly. I played co ed top ball for
Speaker 2: years and a friend of mine on the team. She
Speaker 2: played collegiately, great player, killer arm absolute howitzer. And there's
Speaker 2: a guy out in the field who just played for fun,
Speaker 2: was not an athlete.
Speaker 1: And deep drive.
Speaker 2: He's out there, run and run and run in to
Speaker 2: track it down, and he hits the cutoff woman next
Speaker 2: to him. In the outfield to try to make the
Speaker 2: play at the plate. She is not in the infield,
Speaker 2: she is not closer to the play than he is.
Speaker 2: He just knows that she's got an arm and he doesn't,
Speaker 2: and without thinking in that moment, he throws it about
Speaker 2: twenty yards to her, maybe ten yards to her, so
Speaker 2: that she can try.
Speaker 1: To go home with it.
Speaker 2: And the knowledge and the awareness that she was the
Speaker 2: person for the job. That's co ed sports at its
Speaker 2: very best. So that's one of my favorites. Also, one time,
Speaker 2: Brad I definitely gave each other a.
Speaker 1: Concussion, both trying to get a pick.
Speaker 2: That wasn't as fun, But that's another perfect example of.
Speaker 1: Co ed adult sports. Just concussing your husband, all right, claim,
Speaker 1: what's your story?
Speaker 3: So this is this goes to my recreational soccer. So
Speaker 3: I played in ninety nine, seventy seven eleven v. Eleven
Speaker 3: and I think the format that I was most proud of,
Speaker 3: and it took us eleven seasons to win a championship,
Speaker 3: eleven consecutive seasons. My team so emotional, and our premise
Speaker 3: was the typical seven on seven co ed is five
Speaker 3: men to women, and we flipped that. So we had
Speaker 3: five women and two men, and the men had to
Speaker 3: be gay, and so our this team we scrapped, got
Speaker 3: it to be gay, and it was Tuesday nights. We
Speaker 3: battled constantly. We're always always in the playoffs. You know,
Speaker 3: we made a semi finals a bunch of times, we
Speaker 3: made the finals and lost. We were you know, the
Speaker 3: Bridesmaids a bunch of times, and then again eleven seasons
Speaker 3: and just the strife, the triumph of getting this team
Speaker 3: over the hump and doing what they said the haters
Speaker 3: wouldn't do, and to me, even the premise was fun.
Speaker 3: For a period of time, we were like, the thing
Speaker 3: is that everyone on this team has to like Dick,
Speaker 3: and then we had less like we can't. We can't.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that doesn't work.
Speaker 2: We need but so emotional, great name, so emotional, great name,
Speaker 2: josh Uh.
Speaker 4: I would just say that I think my favorite moments
Speaker 4: were just ones where like we had like the contributions
Speaker 4: from the women, uh sort of like like your I
Speaker 4: think your stories got to Sarah. The contributions of women
Speaker 4: shocked the men on the other team and they weren't
Speaker 4: ready for it, and they led to victory. It's like,
Speaker 4: you know, it's not so infrequent that happened. But we
Speaker 4: played on the softball team. Our friend Janice saw the
Speaker 4: center fielders coming in and then just hit a ball
Speaker 4: right over their heads, and when she rounded into second
Speaker 4: base for a double, she was just cursing at them.
Speaker 4: And you know, things like things like that, you know,
Speaker 4: play hitting a big three in a game when they're
Speaker 4: laying off her to play down more. You know, it's
Speaker 4: things like that that just make me smile the most.
Speaker 4: You know, Yeah, win or lose, those those are the
Speaker 4: best kinds of wins, I always think.
Speaker 2: But mostly win, but mostly wins, Yeah, mostly wins. You've
Speaker 2: let me perfectly into my rule for the five rule
Speaker 2: co Ed Adult Sports Etiquette Code.
Speaker 1: Rule number one.
Speaker 2: It's flag football based from my experience, but it applies
Speaker 2: to any co.
Speaker 1: Ed sport in which there are quote unquote girl plays.
Speaker 2: These are necessary at times because, for instance, in my
Speaker 2: flag football league multi time champions, obviously every three downs
Speaker 2: a female player had to be throwing or receiving. This
Speaker 2: rule is in place so the bros don't ignore the
Speaker 2: women in the field all game, so no problem with it.
Speaker 2: The rule that I'm creating is don't only use your
Speaker 2: women on girl plays. Not only does it defeat the
Speaker 2: purpose of playing co ed sports to leave the women
Speaker 2: out unless you're forced to include them.
Speaker 1: It's also extremely bad strategy horror.
Speaker 2: So many teams that we played waited until the girl
Speaker 2: and then if they didn't switch out the quarterback to
Speaker 2: a lady, then we knew a woman was going to
Speaker 2: be targeted and we could just double all of them.
Speaker 2: It also allowed our team to cover only the guys
Speaker 2: and ignore the women on the field for the majority
Speaker 2: of plays because they weren't even looking at them. So
Speaker 2: obviously on our team we only had bad bitches, and
Speaker 2: we wanted to use our women all the time anyway,
Speaker 2: and they were better playmakers a lot of the time,
Speaker 2: so we didn't need to wait for the girl plays.
Speaker 1: But also it's just better strategy.
Speaker 2: So the rule is obviously draft badass bitches and then
Speaker 2: let them cook every play, not just girl play.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 3: Rule number two, Colaine, Mine is less of an enforceable
Speaker 3: rule and more a physics, a law of physics, which
Speaker 3: is that the best teams are going to be the ones,
Speaker 3: as you just mentioned, Sarah, that have the baddest bitches
Speaker 3: on them, and so right like realistically, the average athleticism
Speaker 3: of a co ed recreational dude, the average level is
Speaker 3: much closer. The differentiation often happens with the great women
Speaker 3: athletes and the not so great women athletes who are
Speaker 3: out there to have a good time. And by the way,
Speaker 3: high value on all of these players. Love you for
Speaker 3: showing up. Love that there's people who are out there
Speaker 3: having fun and not being hard. O's about it. I've
Speaker 3: never been that type, but like, shout out to you
Speaker 3: for having the experience. Shout out to you. Therapy works.
Speaker 3: But but I think you're This is again, if you
Speaker 3: want a team that's gonna win, you have to recruit
Speaker 3: women who can ball, and that's in every sport because
Speaker 3: you're gonna need them to make plays because the differentiation
Speaker 3: amongst men, like you're gonna have some off days on days.
Speaker 3: And the fact of the matter is that I as
Speaker 3: an athlete, I'm not playing on a team where I'm
Speaker 3: not getting the ball. So you better know how to
Speaker 3: pass your women. It's you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 3: exactly to your point, whether it's a girl play or
Speaker 3: just like during regular play in soccer and basketball, whatever,
Speaker 3: know how to facilitate and include your women because otherwise
Speaker 3: the best women are leaving goodbye and you're gonna lose.
Speaker 1: Yes, And that's so.
Speaker 2: Rule number two is good women win championships the end,
Speaker 2: the end, Josh number three.
Speaker 4: I think that there's a hard uh negotiation sort of
Speaker 4: in co ed players' minds, uh respectful ones at least,
Speaker 4: which are the best kinds about how physical to be, right.
Speaker 4: I mean, that's just like an obvious thing. You don't
Speaker 4: want to be not physical because that's disrespectful and discounting
Speaker 4: the women's contributions to the team and the league. But
Speaker 4: also there needs to be some kind of decord. This
Speaker 4: is not the same as in men's league. And I'm
Speaker 4: not that is I'm not even talking about the quality.
Speaker 4: I'm talking about the physicality. And I think if you're
Speaker 4: if you are driving through people, if anyone takes a
Speaker 4: charge on you in coed basketball, you need to take
Speaker 4: a five minute time out. Like it's not not men
Speaker 4: on women, women on man or anything. If you are
Speaker 4: getting charge calls in coed basketball, you need to take
Speaker 4: a timeout and just have someone on your team explain
Speaker 4: to you why you're in a timeout. It's just it's
Speaker 4: just too much. Again, fouling is fine being physical, trying
Speaker 4: to block shots, trying to steal, you know, aggressive press
Speaker 4: on a ball handler. All these things I am the
Speaker 4: support of. But when we're getting out of control, like
Speaker 4: player especially you know a player control foul in a
Speaker 4: literal sense, we need to take timeouts.
Speaker 1: It is just sure so good.
Speaker 2: Mandatory timeout if you get called for a charge in
Speaker 2: co ed basketball is rule number three. I once literally
Speaker 2: got a concussion in kickball from a guy who ran
Speaker 2: through my base and expected me to move instead of
Speaker 2: trying to.
Speaker 1: Get the pass and get him out.
Speaker 2: And he thought I would get out of the way
Speaker 2: because I would be afraid of him, and I just
Speaker 2: stood there and he ran directly into me and I
Speaker 2: slammed my head against the ground and got a concussion.
Speaker 2: So yeah, just a reminder of the physicality and keeping
Speaker 2: within the realm of fun sports.
Speaker 4: And shout out to claiming my favorite teammate Ashley, who
Speaker 4: took a charge on a like six foot eight behemoth
Speaker 4: of a man a weeks ago. I think she took
Speaker 4: one into all the block, which is also absurd, and
Speaker 4: then she gets another one that's called the charge, and
Speaker 4: just like, what what are we doing? Sir, stop it.
Speaker 3: I mean, I also want to be clear. Ashley is
Speaker 3: six to three, so don't act like it. She's not
Speaker 3: five four of my size. Actually she's she's present that.
Speaker 4: She got a train one through her a couple of times.
Speaker 1: It is big regardless. Yeah, yeah, okay. Rule number four, Colleen.
Speaker 3: Rule number four is, uh this treat this like ah
Speaker 3: a single use or I guess a co ed bathroom space,
Speaker 3: which is to say, don't bring your man rules into
Speaker 3: don't there's We are not treating this like man's own
Speaker 3: like it is not. This is a shared communal space.
Speaker 3: This is co ed sports. Don't bring your super testosterone
Speaker 3: energy in here. And look, Josh, you've maybe crossed this
Speaker 3: line one or two times. I maybe have cross this
Speaker 3: line one or two times. But like know that this
Speaker 3: is a shared space and that at the end of
Speaker 3: the day, we have to keep it neat, we gotta flush,
Speaker 3: we got to make sure that it smells pleasant, and
Speaker 3: we got to shake hands. So wash your hands, stay hygienic,
Speaker 3: and don't be a dick like that's. I feel like
Speaker 3: we got to recognize that this is not an entirely
Speaker 3: like male energy space. And if you came in here
Speaker 3: bringing that you're doing it wrong. You're doing it wrong.
Speaker 3: There are leads, there's such a good one. There are
Speaker 3: plenty of leagues for that. But when you're playing co ed,
Speaker 3: you know, recognize who's there to ball and who's there
Speaker 3: to socialize and act accordingly, you.
Speaker 2: Know both to be willing to be competitive for your hardest. Yes,
Speaker 2: but that energy really matters. So rule number four, don't
Speaker 2: get testerical.
Speaker 1: Trying thank you.
Speaker 2: Try to keep the energy as if it's a gender
Speaker 2: neutral bathroom, a shared space where you can both bring
Speaker 2: all the things that we love about sports, but also
Speaker 2: don't presume that everyone wants to turn it into manland
Speaker 2: because it's a sporting event in fact.
Speaker 1: All right, Number five, Josh.
Speaker 4: Yeah, my last one. I guess it's just sort of
Speaker 4: a question for you guys, is how you feel about
Speaker 4: rules that, like in a basketball league that a women's
Speaker 4: basket might count as an extra point, or a women's
Speaker 4: touchdown in a flag football league might count as extra points.
Speaker 4: I'm sort of just intrigued by that as a rule
Speaker 4: that already exists. So I'm not creating this rule, but
Speaker 4: I'm interested to know what you think is that we're
Speaker 4: on the scale from like sort of encouraging inclusion for
Speaker 4: everyone versus condescending. Where do we fall on this one?
Speaker 2: This is the old women's teas question in golf, Like
Speaker 2: is it insulting that there are women's teas or does
Speaker 2: that make sense based on average length of drive and
Speaker 2: things like that. This is a tough one, Colleen. You're
Speaker 2: the expert. You literally worked in this space. You probably
Speaker 2: know every rule of every sport.
Speaker 3: Here's my if I can answer simply like, no, thank you,
Speaker 3: I don't want it. I don't want it. I don't
Speaker 3: want my threes to count as fours or my twos. No,
Speaker 3: I'm playing basketball like a regular human. Again, to your
Speaker 3: point about the girl plays in flag football, if you
Speaker 3: need a mechanism to include women, that's maybe a moment
Speaker 3: for self reflection, right, Like, are we doing this right
Speaker 3: generally right? And are we making this an inclusive space?
Speaker 3: I don't know. I do think that some rules help
Speaker 3: to serve that and make the game better. But yeah,
Speaker 3: like in general, I find those I do find those
Speaker 3: things patronizing. I find them.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: It's the same way that I feel when someone apologizes
Speaker 3: for regular fouling me. I'm like, please, please, don't like
Speaker 3: I've I find that offensive. So so I'm out on that.
Speaker 3: That said, I'm a more competitive you know, and like
Speaker 3: I grew up playing sports, so I think maybe in
Speaker 3: like social leagues where people are just learning and they
Speaker 3: want you know, I think if you look at a
Speaker 3: lot of leagues, women are more inclined to pass than
Speaker 3: to shoot, and they don't want to be up at
Speaker 3: you know, if there's two outs, they don't want to
Speaker 3: be the last one up. So I think again, like
Speaker 3: if you if you encourage them and say, if you
Speaker 3: walk a woman the next like, she gets two bases, right,
Speaker 3: These different rules that exist to make sure that inclusion
Speaker 3: and full engagement happen. I get them, But for me personally,
Speaker 3: I find them patronizing. Like I don't maybe you can
Speaker 3: opt in to opt out, I want to opt out.
Speaker 2: I So I have not played co ed basketball or
Speaker 2: things like that that are a little more unregulated because
Speaker 2: it's a constant stream of play in softball. In football softball,
Speaker 2: our league didn't have any special rules for women. Everybody
Speaker 2: was exactly the same, and that's how I wanted it.
Speaker 2: And we had women players that were fantastic and guys
Speaker 2: that were fantastic, and just like within the gender, there's
Speaker 2: gonna be people who are great, people who suck, and
Speaker 2: so I'm fine with it being completely neutral in that way.
Speaker 2: In football, I do not mind the girl play aspect.
Speaker 2: I think it forces involvement. It puts pressure on the
Speaker 2: women players to step up and then they get to
Speaker 2: do big things in big moments, which is awesome. But
Speaker 2: then when we score, we don't get more points. It's
Speaker 2: the same points. So the rules are probably different across
Speaker 2: the land. So josh I would say, I don't mind
Speaker 2: when it doesn't change the game. So like the girl
Speaker 2: play doesn't really change the game. The points it just
Speaker 2: is a is a necessity within the context of it.
Speaker 2: But I don't want to play somewhere where I get
Speaker 2: extra points for accomplishing something, because I do think it
Speaker 2: diminishes and automatically sets it up as the girls that
Speaker 2: are here are worse than the guys that are here.
Speaker 2: And there's a lot of co ed sports where I'm
Speaker 2: better than the guys that are there, or at least
Speaker 2: us be before my spine became dust.
Speaker 1: None of this applies to me anymore. Sadly, what is
Speaker 1: our number five rule? Maybe it is based on the
Speaker 1: level of play.
Speaker 2: And I don't know if in your leagues you have
Speaker 2: like super competitive versus versus competitive. Okay, so maybe like
Speaker 2: in social we can be more trying to help push
Speaker 2: for women to be validated for their successes, and in
Speaker 2: competitive it's each person for themselves.
Speaker 1: It okay, these are great rules. These are excellent rules.
Speaker 1: We're going to print them on parchment paper with calligraphy.
Speaker 1: I feel good about that. We really accomplish something. Let's
Speaker 1: take a break.
Speaker 2: When we come back, we're going to talk Unrivaled and
Speaker 2: Kalaiinn's brilliant idea to pick a team. We're back with
Speaker 2: Kaleain and Josh. I want to talk about the unrival League.
Speaker 2: First of all, I think their rollout has been spectacular
Speaker 2: in every way, the marketing, the name drops, the league,
Speaker 2: the teams, the everything. But Kalaine, you and some friends
Speaker 2: had this brilliant idea of hopping on a zoom to
Speaker 2: strategize where you're going to place your allegiance on a
Speaker 2: single team. You're gonna go ham on merch, You're gonna
Speaker 2: watch every game, You're gonna make it your whole identity.
Speaker 2: Tell us everything, because we're going to steal this idea
Speaker 2: for the show, and I think folks at home might
Speaker 2: want some like tips or ideas on how to do
Speaker 2: their own unrivaled team selection event.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think this is a really unique opportunity. Right,
Speaker 3: it's a new league, but we already know the players,
Speaker 3: and so where are we going?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 3: Like, Like I have the ability to kind of pine
Speaker 3: on something before it's happened. And if there's one thing
Speaker 3: I hate in sports, it's a front runner, Like I
Speaker 3: don't want to wait until I've seen a team be
Speaker 3: successful and then glom on right like that. That is
Speaker 3: not for me, especially because there's no geographic tie here, right,
Speaker 3: They're all playing in one location. So I feel the
Speaker 3: need to proactively select a team. We know the coaches,
Speaker 3: we know the players, and because of that, I felt like,
Speaker 3: how am I going to make the most of this
Speaker 3: new opportunit. I mean, I totally agree with you. I
Speaker 3: think the whole concept is great, the rollout's been amazing,
Speaker 3: the hype is there. I think it's going to be
Speaker 3: a killer viewing experience. And so last night my friends
Speaker 3: Matt Mustrantsuono and Alison Lazarek and I we you know,
Speaker 3: we collaborated and tried to figure out. We were like,
Speaker 3: how are we going to pick their Liberty fan and
Speaker 3: I'm a Mystics fan. How are we going to pick
Speaker 3: a team and unite have a united front? What team
Speaker 3: are we choosing? And so we did our research right,
Speaker 3: We looked at all the players and the team names
Speaker 3: and the colors, and we factored all of this in.
Speaker 3: There was no algorithm. It was just by feel. And
Speaker 3: we had a call last night and we just kind
Speaker 3: of reviewed club by club which direction, you know, where
Speaker 3: were we feeling, like who were we into? What was
Speaker 3: our takeaways for? You know, like how do we feel
Speaker 3: about the Laces? And I, honestly I was like, Laces.
Speaker 3: I think it's the best logo, but I think it's
Speaker 3: the worst name. And Matt was like, you know what,
Speaker 3: it's a aces with an L in front of it,
Speaker 3: Like I don't think so, right, So as.
Speaker 1: Lingerie to me for some reason.
Speaker 3: Even no cool logo exactly. And so went through for
Speaker 3: each of them and kind of, you know, there were
Speaker 3: some teams that we were intrigued by, there are some
Speaker 3: teams that we actually loved, and then there was one
Speaker 3: player that we were like, you can't, I can't do it, yep.
Speaker 3: And so ultimately, yeah, I'm here to announce that I
Speaker 3: am a Vinyl fan. I am here big time Tea
Speaker 3: Spoon coaching energy. You know, I feel like I was
Speaker 3: drawn to that immediately. But then on top of it,
Speaker 3: like I Arique, I want to watch her on a
Speaker 3: team and thriving, right, I think there's a chance she'll
Speaker 3: be able to do that after this next w NBA draft,
Speaker 3: should Page decide to go, but I want to see Arique,
Speaker 3: she's the team captain. I want to see her lead
Speaker 3: and growing thriving. You know, Josh, you mentioned Dereka Hanby earlier,
Speaker 3: like I want a redemption story for her. She's been
Speaker 3: she's been playing her butt off and like she and
Speaker 3: Ryan Howard were both on the three x three this summer,
Speaker 3: there's some chemistry there that's intriguing. Feel great about that,
Speaker 3: Aliah Boston. If you don't like her, you're just wrong.
Speaker 3: And and you know, then we kind of round out
Speaker 3: the team with Jordan Canada and Ray Burrell, and I
Speaker 3: felt like there was this gravity that really Tea Spoon
Speaker 3: and so yeah, like we then my friend Allison, she
Speaker 3: was like, we need an nemesis, you know what I
Speaker 3: mean like we're rival. Yeah, we're getting rival, and we've
Speaker 3: decided that we're out on the mist. In fact, they missed,
Speaker 3: they missed, they missed the opportunity. We hate them, we
Speaker 3: hate them.
Speaker 2: Maybe it's I've always always hated the miss bad weather pattern.
Speaker 3: And on top of that, no.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, this iffy and also just that one just
Speaker 2: reminds me of like a vaginal douche. For some reason,
Speaker 2: I feel like it would be called the mist.
Speaker 3: The mist. Yeah, I don't need I don't need that
Speaker 3: kind of a pant and so so.
Speaker 1: Already I don't want my team to be moist.
Speaker 3: No, I don't. I don't want my team to be
Speaker 3: one letter away from being moist. I don't most exactly.
Speaker 2: And I also feel like the Vinyl is a great
Speaker 2: choice for you because you are the best person I
Speaker 2: will ever meet.
Speaker 1: I can guarantee it.
Speaker 2: At Hurdle, which is the game where you are given
Speaker 2: notes to try to guess a song, and Josh, you
Speaker 2: and I are all very good at this game, but
Speaker 2: you are freakishly good in a way that feels almost
Speaker 2: like when people have a part of their brain that
Speaker 2: no one else has access to, but you do. There
Speaker 2: were songs that was just someone breathing at the beginning
Speaker 2: for the first note, and you still somehow got it.
Speaker 2: So it feels like a music based team is accurate
Speaker 2: for you, Josh. I won't make you pick your team
Speaker 2: just yet unless you have I.
Speaker 4: Have a team. I'm ready already. I look the ross,
Speaker 4: I look through the rosters. You know. It's fun because
Speaker 4: I think basically, like many of us choose a team
Speaker 4: based off like living in the city of the team,
Speaker 4: or where we grew up, and it's our parents team
Speaker 4: and this is a chance to start over. There is
Speaker 4: no hometown team for any of us. I chose the Laces.
Speaker 4: Although now that you say basically the Ace is taking
Speaker 4: an l on the front, I don't know that part
Speaker 4: of it. I wish I thought of that. Kelsey Plumb
Speaker 4: lost tough, But the way that this team is just
Speaker 4: they're just tough. They're just scrappy. I mean, I think
Speaker 4: they're going to play the hardest out of all the teams.
Speaker 4: You're telling me, Alysa Thomas, Courtney Williams, Kate Martin, Steph Dolston, Dogs,
Speaker 4: you know, and Kato McBride, Stiff Diilson. Obviously we've seen
Speaker 4: her in three by three before she can do it
Speaker 4: like close inside and outside. I'm excited about who they add.
Speaker 4: Certainly I have some ideas, but I don't know who
Speaker 4: is eligible and not eligible, so I won't just start
Speaker 4: throwing things out there. But you know, like if Gabby
Speaker 4: Williams was going to join another league late, that would
Speaker 4: be an expect for them. I'm just saying that shown
Speaker 4: up a little late to the party.
Speaker 3: It's so funny you say that, because that was one
Speaker 3: of the we were like, Okay, these wild cards, they
Speaker 3: they definitely make it tricky. Yeah, and who is there
Speaker 3: anybody who if they were added to the mix, they
Speaker 3: might change your tune? And Gabby Williams was the runaway
Speaker 3: answer because if she joined, which I know she will,
Speaker 3: but if she did, she is nice and watching her
Speaker 3: play and I think I can imagine that her, like
Speaker 3: her size and dynamism, she'd be great for this format.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean, I guess I'm rooting for her
Speaker 3: to join the Laces. Now, Josh, for your sake, there
Speaker 3: you go.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm not going to announce mine because we are
Speaker 2: going to do a show about this, and I famously
Speaker 2: or not famously, but in my mind famously did a
Speaker 2: show for ESPN, not a show. I famously did a
Speaker 2: series of stories for ESPN called College Football Bachelorette, where
Speaker 2: I took twenty five teams and whittled them down using
Speaker 2: various criteria and ultimately picking a college football team. I'm
Speaker 2: going to apply some of the same elements to this.
Speaker 2: You can look forward to that. We'll do this as
Speaker 2: a show where Alex Miish and I will pick teams
Speaker 2: and then will help you find your way to selecting
Speaker 2: an unrivaled team as well. Okay, last thing, Josh, We've
Speaker 2: got you here, so let's get some inside information. News
Speaker 2: just broke that ESPN is introducing two studio shows for
Speaker 2: Disney Plus, a daily sports center just for Disney Plus subscribers,
Speaker 2: and a women's sports show that may air weekly or
Speaker 2: several times a week. They haven't announced that yet. Both
Speaker 2: programs and development both allegedly to be made for a
Speaker 2: more casual sports fan, according to president Jimmy Patterio. Can
Speaker 2: we get your thoughts on this women's sports show for
Speaker 2: actual fans airing weekly or perhaps a few times a
Speaker 2: week with no details yet?
Speaker 4: Yeah, so obviously, like you said, lack of details. I
Speaker 4: also don't have any information just because I work free ESPN,
Speaker 4: I don't know break information, but credit is the NBC.
Speaker 4: Alex Sherman would did break this news, so you know
Speaker 4: that that's out there and you can read all about it.
Speaker 4: I guess my question would be, and again, I think
Speaker 4: there's it seems like from the report it's still pretty
Speaker 4: roughly being developed right now. But I would just recommend
Speaker 4: that it not be a weekly show. I think we've
Speaker 4: learned as the media age has changed, that weeklies don't
Speaker 4: do much anymore. Sports Illustrated, the magazine was once the
Speaker 4: be all end all, and now I don't know anyone
Speaker 4: who has a sports subscription. I don't even know if
Speaker 4: they've printed anymore. Weeklies just aren't the thing, and so
Speaker 4: this show needs to be more frequent than that. And
Speaker 4: there is so much their their new leagues for women.
Speaker 4: Uh there, you know, this is not the women's sports
Speaker 4: landscape that it was that you know, our parents had,
Speaker 4: or even you know, like our old siblings would have had.
Speaker 4: It's changing and it's changing so fast, and I think
Speaker 4: everything that we've seen is when a women's sports product
Speaker 4: is offered, it is absolutely like gobbled down by the audiences,
Speaker 4: whether that is the merch that sells out, whether it's
Speaker 4: the ratings, people realizing that, hey, women's basketball, don't tell
Speaker 4: anyone it's just basketball, you know, like figuring that out
Speaker 4: is what we've done. You know, it's not for it's
Speaker 4: not everyone yet unfortunately, but like the title wave has
Speaker 4: crested and we're about to ride this thing. And I
Speaker 4: would just say that, you know, Sarah, you know this.
Speaker 4: You do a daily podcast, but like a weekly a
Speaker 4: weekly show just feels like sort of crumbs or table scraps,
Speaker 4: and that's not what this is about anymore. I think
Speaker 4: it wouldn't be. It's not what I would advise as
Speaker 4: a business decision, and I don't think it's sort of
Speaker 4: what women's sports deserves at this point.
Speaker 2: I agree, And then I also am always that person who,
Speaker 2: unfortunately is so condition to be like, well, but it's
Speaker 2: better than nothing, right, But the problem is when we
Speaker 2: keep doing the better than nothing, if it doesn't work
Speaker 2: out because it was doomed to fail, then we blame
Speaker 2: the product in women's sports, which is not the problem.
Speaker 2: It's the way that we try to present it or
Speaker 2: talk about it. Claan, what do you think.
Speaker 3: I think that if you're going to do a weekly,
Speaker 3: you have to do it the same way that last
Speaker 3: week Tonight goes, which is to say, you know, you
Speaker 3: touch on some things, but you do a deep dive
Speaker 3: on something on substantive and that takes real journalism. Look,
Speaker 3: it doesn't have to be as funny as John Oliver,
Speaker 3: but you have to commit the same level of resources
Speaker 3: as you would frankly to a daily to do that
Speaker 3: deep dive. And so I think if that's the direction
Speaker 3: they choose to go, I could be down for that
Speaker 3: because I think there are plenty of issues in women's
Speaker 3: sports that it would be amazing for ESPN to commit
Speaker 3: to unpacking. But I don't know that that commitment is there,
Speaker 3: And so yeah, I agree with you guys that if
Speaker 3: we're talking about increasing coverage by adding a weekly show,
Speaker 3: it's going to be like watching you know, I feel
Speaker 3: like it's going to be watching Total Request Live right
Speaker 3: Like it's going to be cheap and bubblegum and not
Speaker 3: going to get us what we need. You could just
Speaker 3: listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain, which I think
Speaker 3: the ones already are so like going more to chew
Speaker 3: on and again, that could be in the form of
Speaker 3: a deep dive on issues or just cover us all
Speaker 3: the wall.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I completely agree, and I think your point
Speaker 2: is avoid one. If you do a weekly you can
Speaker 2: do it by touching on a couple of things that
Speaker 2: are going to be evergreen enough not to be dated
Speaker 2: within a couple of days that after it airs. But
Speaker 2: also you can do a deep dive into a league
Speaker 2: a player tell some stories that we do want to see.
Speaker 2: But I mean, I think not to pat ourselves on
Speaker 2: the back, but this show has proved that there's more
Speaker 2: than enough content and the way to get people to
Speaker 2: care is to give them a constant stream of players information,
Speaker 2: all the things that they need to have, the debates
Speaker 2: to talk about, the teams to get into it. And
Speaker 2: that's really hard to do if you have these long
Speaker 2: gaps in between the content and there's just not enough
Speaker 2: time to cover it. So I think your message is
Speaker 2: the right one. Just listen to the Good Game with
Speaker 2: Sarah Spain. You really don't you don't need anything else.
Speaker 2: What are we doing here?
Speaker 1: You guys are the best. We could talk forever.
Speaker 2: We had other segments planned and now you'll just have
Speaker 2: to come back and do them again.
Speaker 1: But thanks so much for the time. We so appreciate it.
Speaker 3: Thanks Sarah.
Speaker 2: Thanks again to Josh and Kalaine for the time we
Speaker 2: got to pay the bills. When we come back, me
Speaker 2: shops in the review chair to dish on an unexpected delight.
Speaker 1: Welcome Bax Slices.
Speaker 2: We love that you're listening, but we want you to
Speaker 2: get in the game every day too, So here's our
Speaker 2: good game play of the day. Now you heard our
Speaker 2: five rule official etiquette code for co ed adult sports,
Speaker 2: tell us what we missed.
Speaker 1: Got a rule you think we should add?
Speaker 2: Send it my way on Twitter, slash x at Sarah Spain,
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Speaker 1: Rate and it's easy check out meshe doing it right now.
Speaker 5: Freeze Dried Fruit rating five out of five. Is this
Speaker 5: really a Fruit Slices review? This is a go to
Speaker 5: I love, love, love, love love fruit, but sometimes I
Speaker 5: cannot stand the messiness that comes with it. Especially when
Speaker 5: I'm on the go, and freeze dried alternatives still taste
Speaker 5: impeccable without running the risk of getting juiced all over
Speaker 5: my hands and face and embarrassing myself in public. If
Speaker 5: you haven't tried your favorite fruit in freeze dried form yet,
Speaker 5: I would highly suggest it. Matter of fact, this morning
Speaker 5: I had some freeze dried mango that well, let's just
Speaker 5: say it got my day.
Speaker 1: Started, right.
Speaker 5: Or if you can freeze dry your own now I've
Speaker 5: never done it, but if you're a fancy like that,
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Speaker 2: See not that hard, subscribe, rate and review. Go do
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Speaker 2: Thanks for listening, slices. We'll see you tomorrow. Good game, Colaine,
Speaker 2: Good game, Josh. Few people who know what works for
Speaker 2: men's sports TV shows but insist on not applying that
Speaker 2: knowledge to their decision making for women's sports TV shows.
Speaker 2: Good Game with Sarah Spain is an iHeart women's sports
Speaker 2: production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You
Speaker 2: can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
Speaker 2: wherever you get your Podcasts production by Wonder Media Network.
Speaker 2: Our producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones. Our executive
Speaker 2: producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder.
Speaker 2: Our editors are Emily Rudder, Britney Martinez, Grace Lynch and
Speaker 2: Lindsay Cradowell. Production assistants from Lucy Jones and I'm Your
Speaker 2: Host Sarah Spain