Speaker 1: From Bloomberg News and I Heart Radio. It's the big take.
Speaker 1: I'm West Kasova. Today China's economy comes roaring back. They
Speaker 1: chant chi Jiping stepped down, an extraordinary show of defiance
Speaker 1: in China. In Shanghai, they chant for freedom, democracy and
Speaker 1: end to COVID lockdowns. There's been mixed signals, but now
Speaker 1: clearly because hong Zo, Shanghai, Beijing, shen Jen, guang Zhoe,
Speaker 1: jong Jo, iPhone City and many more are all starting
Speaker 1: to loosen their COVID restrictions, including relaxing some of those
Speaker 1: PCR test requirements. What a difference a month or so makes.
Speaker 1: At the start of December, China was still in COVID
Speaker 1: zero lockdown, and as you heard there, people were fed
Speaker 1: up with being stuck indoors. Now, in part because of
Speaker 1: those protests, the government has significantly eased COVID restrictions. China's
Speaker 1: people are going out and getting back to work, and
Speaker 1: that means It's economy is starting to rev back up
Speaker 1: to China's reopening will be felt around the world as
Speaker 1: travel picks up and the nation resumes buying products of
Speaker 1: all kinds. But that economic boost potentially also comes with
Speaker 1: a big catch. Bloomberg's chief economist, Tom Orlick in Washington
Speaker 1: and chief Asia economics correspondent in The Current in Hong Kong,
Speaker 1: are here with me now to explain. Tom, you and
Speaker 1: Enda and several of our Bloomberg colleagues have written a
Speaker 1: story that explains how China's reopening will be felt around
Speaker 1: the world. Why was the COVID zero policy such a
Speaker 1: big deal for China is academy and really the global academy.
Speaker 1: So COVID zero is widely presented as a serious policy
Speaker 1: error by Beijing. In fact, it's brought some pretty significant positives. Yes,
Speaker 1: the impact of COVID sweeping across the country was delayed,
Speaker 1: rather than entirely prevented, But that period where China was
Speaker 1: locked down, initially the entire country and then rolling lockdowns
Speaker 1: across cities to try and keep infections as close to
Speaker 1: zero as possible, it had an important benefit for public health.
Speaker 1: It allowed time for vaccines to go into arms. Not
Speaker 1: as many vaccines as the epidemiologists would have liked, but
Speaker 1: certainly a lot of vaccines went into arms. And it
Speaker 1: also allowed time for COVID itself to diminish in lethality.
Speaker 1: And what that hopefully means is that now China's opened
Speaker 1: up from COVID zero, the public health cost, the sicknesses,
Speaker 1: the debts are going to be less much less than
Speaker 1: they would have been if China had allowed COVID to
Speaker 1: sweep across the population right at the beginning of as
Speaker 1: occurred in the United States and lots of European countries.
Speaker 1: There were some public health benefits, there was some really
Speaker 1: serious economic costs. When you lock an economy down is
Speaker 1: inevitable that you're going to suffer. Workers can't go to
Speaker 1: their factories or their offices, households can't go to the shops,
Speaker 1: and what that means is you have a big negative
Speaker 1: impact on growth. So a Chinese economy which went into
Speaker 1: COVID growing around six percent a year last year grew
Speaker 1: just three and end of that slow down in China's
Speaker 1: economy affected not just where Time is describing, which is
Speaker 1: domestic economy, but what China was buying and selling to
Speaker 1: the rest of the world. Yeah, I would add to
Speaker 1: what Tom said there in that China's COVID zero also
Speaker 1: hugely benefited the nation's factories during twenty one, in that
Speaker 1: when the rest of the world was having problems keeping
Speaker 1: its supply lines running and keeping its factories and stores staffed.
Speaker 1: China was able to produce everything that the rest of
Speaker 1: the world wanted and cashed in on this extraordinary boom
Speaker 1: for buying merchandise goods around the rest of the world.
Speaker 1: So if the COVID zero policy is credited with allowing
Speaker 1: China's manufacturing based to continue more or less uninterrupted, so
Speaker 1: that was another economic plus. But you know a Thoma
Speaker 1: was saying the ultimately it was unsustainable to spill over
Speaker 1: from that slowdown in China. Men there were no Chinese
Speaker 1: tourists going overseas, there were no Chinese students going overseas.
Speaker 1: The exchange of no how in two way people flow
Speaker 1: between China, the world's as second larges economy, and other
Speaker 1: major trading partners wasn't happening. There was a whole series
Speaker 1: of hindrances whereby China went from being typically the global
Speaker 1: growth driver of the world economy to slipping down the
Speaker 1: ranks a little bit. And I think last year there's
Speaker 1: a lot of focus on the US picking up the
Speaker 1: growth mat on as China slipped back. So there were
Speaker 1: clear benefits early on, and I would say the merchandise
Speaker 1: trade boom was one of them. But then the benefits,
Speaker 1: the economic benefits became kind of diminishing returns as time
Speaker 1: went on. You mentioned tourism and a couple of other things.
Speaker 1: What are other economic effects of China just not participating
Speaker 1: as vigorously in the world economy as they did before COVID.
Speaker 1: What was the As you mentioned, there's the basic services
Speaker 1: trade effect, the impact of those tourists rich economies, especially
Speaker 1: in Southeast Asia, the lives of Australian elsewhere, not just
Speaker 1: tourists but also students. They were losing out on the
Speaker 1: big China dollar spend that was a feature of pre
Speaker 1: COVID China. But I think also there was a human
Speaker 1: side to it. By the way, in terms of business
Speaker 1: people in chambers of commerce in China itself, we're speaking
Speaker 1: out loud against COVID zero. That was something very unusual.
Speaker 1: Normally companies don't really speak out against a host government
Speaker 1: per se. But they wore their critical overl just because
Speaker 1: they couldn't get stuff in, They couldn't have those exchanges
Speaker 1: with their colleagues, they couldn't do all the rudimentary kind
Speaker 1: of business travel that's needed to keep the flow of
Speaker 1: global commerce and trade ticking over. So as I say,
Speaker 1: there's the obvious spill over and industrial sectors like our
Speaker 1: insectors such as services and so on. But also there
Speaker 1: was a human sign to the impact of COVID zero.
Speaker 1: And it wasn't just COVID zero. China's policymakers, because they
Speaker 1: were so successful in containing the virus in the first
Speaker 1: part of twenty succumbs to an unfortunate bout of hubris.
Speaker 1: They decided we contained COVID, we can do a bunch
Speaker 1: of other stuff as well. So in the second half
Speaker 1: of twenty you had a sweeping shift in policy on
Speaker 1: the property sector, something which is referred to as that
Speaker 1: three redlines policy, cutting off sources of finance for real
Speaker 1: estate developers. That really hammered the investment, which the big
Speaker 1: driver of China's growth. And you had the Common Prosperity Agenda,
Speaker 1: an attempt by Shi Jinping to engineer a more equitable
Speaker 1: Chinese economy by smacking down what he sees as the
Speaker 1: excess power of the tech monopolists Jack mar and Ali Baba,
Speaker 1: pony Maa at ten Cents and other similar entrepreneurs, and
Speaker 1: those forces together they really dealt a really serious blow
Speaker 1: to China's growth, and as Enter said, from the perspective
Speaker 1: of global businesses, they really changed the view on China
Speaker 1: to pretty unbridled optimism to quite a lot of pessimism.
Speaker 1: Chinese economy seems about to open back up in a
Speaker 1: big way. So what does that look like for China's economy. So,
Speaker 1: in fact, whereas you're completely right, the COVID zero policy
Speaker 1: has shifted, but in fact all of the policy which
Speaker 1: I just mentioned have shifted. So at the end of
Speaker 1: last year, we had an extraordinary wave of protests across
Speaker 1: major Chinese cities, frustration at years of lockdowns bubbling up,
Speaker 1: and that seems to have catalyzed a big move in Beijing,
Speaker 1: and they moved away from COVID zero a lot quicker
Speaker 1: than most people were expecting. At the same time, we've
Speaker 1: had a wave of support for the property sector. The
Speaker 1: financing taps for developers have been turned on a little bit,
Speaker 1: Mortgages are now more available for home buyers, so prospects
Speaker 1: for property are a little bit stronger. And the Common
Speaker 1: Prosperity agenda that cracked down on entrepreneurs that isn't quite
Speaker 1: so in evidence either. So there's been a big policy
Speaker 1: shift away from containing the virus and achieving desirable long
Speaker 1: term objectives like containing the property bubble and achieving more
Speaker 1: equity and income distribution towards all out support for growth.
Speaker 1: And what that means is that prospects for China this
Speaker 1: year are looking quite a lot stronger. I mentioned that
Speaker 1: China's economy expanded just three this year. If you put
Speaker 1: together the exit from COVID zero, the shift on property,
Speaker 1: the shift on the policy on tech entrepreneurs, our forecast
Speaker 1: is that China this year will grow five point eight percent,
Speaker 1: and in an upside scenario where everything goes right for Beijing,
Speaker 1: they could do even better than that. Tom and and
Speaker 1: Uh please stick around. Our conversation will continue after the break.
Speaker 1: And as we heard Tom say just a minute ago,
Speaker 1: COVID zero ending in China opening up means that it's
Speaker 1: economy could grow much more quickly this year. What are
Speaker 1: the industries that will open up first, and what kind
Speaker 1: of effect is this going to have on the rest
Speaker 1: of the world. So that I m F have said
Speaker 1: it's the single most important thing for the global economy
Speaker 1: this year. It has been seen as a game changer
Speaker 1: for the global session debate for example, ways the most
Speaker 1: obvious areas are number one commodities. Like Tom said, if
Speaker 1: China's economy gets humming again, not just because of the
Speaker 1: COVID zero, but because of the housing sector picking up,
Speaker 1: look for imports of iron ore and copper to pick up.
Speaker 1: Copper prices already rallying back above nine thousand dollar a ton,
Speaker 1: the Chilean Paso rallying on one of the channery upening
Speaker 1: bets because Chile is such a big producer of gaber. Indeed,
Speaker 1: so the whole commodities raw materials input story is there,
Speaker 1: and then of course we're back to the services story,
Speaker 1: which is well understood, but specifically there you're talking about
Speaker 1: demand for airline tickets, demand for hotel rooms around the world,
Speaker 1: demand for tourism resorts. You have the Thai government senior
Speaker 1: officials greeting Chinese tourists with garlands when the first plane
Speaker 1: arrived in Shaman on January nine, and camera crews were
Speaker 1: actually there at the airport to capture the moment. The
Speaker 1: news network France twenty four talked to some Chinese tourists
Speaker 1: who are arriving on the flight. Yeah, I'm very excited
Speaker 1: to come back to Thailand well meeting for three years
Speaker 1: already before well COVID. We come here every year and
Speaker 1: at this time I take my family to come here,
Speaker 1: So there's going to be a significant spillover. I think
Speaker 1: Asia will be on the front line of the tourism impact,
Speaker 1: but so will major developed economies like the UK and Japan.
Speaker 1: The US. I guess might be less clear given the
Speaker 1: political tensions, but I would say commodities will be channel
Speaker 1: number one for the spin over. Services will be channel
Speaker 1: number two. And the other impact probably will be infinancial markets,
Speaker 1: just lifting global sentiment, and we're already seeing money or
Speaker 1: turned to China for the first time in a while.
Speaker 1: I think we're also going to see the Chinese shoppers
Speaker 1: hitting the high street again, right. I don't think there's
Speaker 1: quite the same pent up savings story in China that
Speaker 1: there was in the United States. In the back end
Speaker 1: of one. China didn't go quite so far in terms
Speaker 1: of stimulus. There weren't checks going out and padding people's
Speaker 1: bank accounts um and I think Chinese households are also
Speaker 1: going to be kind of a bit cautious because they
Speaker 1: do see some headwinds still coming in the medium term, right.
Speaker 1: They see that there's still problems in the property sector.
Speaker 1: For example, Still, if you've been stuck at home or
Speaker 1: fearing being stuck at home for the best part of
Speaker 1: three years, and you've got some extra funds in your
Speaker 1: bank account, when the economy reopens again, I think there's
Speaker 1: going to be a sort of a temptation to hit
Speaker 1: the shops. So that's going to be good news for
Speaker 1: the big Chinese brands. It's going to be big news
Speaker 1: for the big multinational brands that sell in China. Apple
Speaker 1: are going to be seeing more foot traffic at the stores.
Speaker 1: McDonald's are going to be seeing more people popping in
Speaker 1: for a burger, And of course the fact that foreign
Speaker 1: business people can now travel in and out to see
Speaker 1: their staff and see their companies. That's an important part
Speaker 1: of the whole foreign investment framework because last year executives
Speaker 1: were at their wits end and we're looking for talking
Speaker 1: about alternatives to channel. We should say, though, was at
Speaker 1: this point, let's not forget the public health crisis, because
Speaker 1: the lack of transparency around the total caseload and the
Speaker 1: total fatality rate means there's an unknown quantity with the
Speaker 1: COVID outbreaking China by extension, it's not yet known how
Speaker 1: to willfully impact consumer confidence or how long it might
Speaker 1: take consumer confidence to return from that. The whole kind
Speaker 1: of bullish reopening Shina story is out there. It's probably
Speaker 1: the biggest talking point, certainly in this part of the world,
Speaker 1: but there is a caveat in terms of we don't
Speaker 1: yet know how this crisis will play out and what
Speaker 1: the long term lasting impact on consumer confidence might be.
Speaker 1: I'm curious and sitting in Hong Kong, How loan do
Speaker 1: you think this kind of painful period where the infections
Speaker 1: are sweeping the country is going to last? How long
Speaker 1: do you think it's going to be before we're back
Speaker 1: to something which looks like a kind of post pandemic normal.
Speaker 1: End of the first quarter into the second quarter, Well,
Speaker 1: we'll have just have gotten over a lunar new year,
Speaker 1: and of course that will mean in all likelihood the
Speaker 1: infectionary will have spread across regional and rural China, so
Speaker 1: all of China will be feeling the brunt of this outbreak.
Speaker 1: Hong Kong is interesting that we also had COVID zero
Speaker 1: up until maybe at some point last year, when the
Speaker 1: authorities then pivoted and money said Hong Kong was a
Speaker 1: was a guinea pig for broader China. It's taken Hong
Speaker 1: Kong some time to recover confidence from the draconian measures
Speaker 1: that we were under. Still isn't back to where it was.
Speaker 1: Retail spending still isn't back to where it was. Tours
Speaker 1: or not yet turning the way they wore. And it's
Speaker 1: not a mirror image of what's happening Channa, but there
Speaker 1: might be some elements of caution there for the consumer
Speaker 1: rebound time is Anders said. The i m F, the
Speaker 1: International Military Funds says that China's reopening is the biggest
Speaker 1: story of the year, and how all of this money
Speaker 1: is going to be unleashed in China and around the
Speaker 1: world is their way of measuring what the economic impact
Speaker 1: of that will be. So, China's the second biggest economy
Speaker 1: in the world, and if you take account of difference
Speaker 1: in purchasing power across economies, it's actually the biggest. So
Speaker 1: when an economy of that size goes from three percent
Speaker 1: growth to probably something close to six percent growth, that
Speaker 1: has a big global impact. Now, as Ender mentioned, it's
Speaker 1: going to be most visible for China's neighbors in Asia,
Speaker 1: countries that are caught up in the same manufacturing supply chains,
Speaker 1: countries that benefit from the arrival of Chinese tourists Chinese
Speaker 1: business people. But it's going to be an impact which
Speaker 1: ripples around the world. Estimates suggest that the difference between
Speaker 1: a China growing at three and a China growing at
Speaker 1: six pc is around no point five percentage points of
Speaker 1: global growth. A different way of thinking about it is
Speaker 1: the equivalent of adding an economy the size of Nigeria
Speaker 1: to the global economy. Our conversation continues after the break,
Speaker 1: tom as you and and in our colleagues right in
Speaker 1: your story. All of this money unleashed into the world economy,
Speaker 1: which is a good thing, also comes with a big catch.
Speaker 1: The last time we talked in November about the possibility
Speaker 1: of continued inflation around the world, you said, wait till
Speaker 1: next year when China reopens. We could then really see
Speaker 1: what inflation can do. And here we are talking about that.
Speaker 1: What is the big catch? So it's funny, ways, um,
Speaker 1: if we spin the calendar all the way back to
Speaker 1: two thousand and eight, to the dark days of the
Speaker 1: global financial crisis, China played a really important role in
Speaker 1: getting the global economy going again. China's four trillion yuan stimulus,
Speaker 1: launched at the end of two thousand and eight, unleashed
Speaker 1: a wave of demand, and exactly the moment the rest
Speaker 1: of the world was in a slump and needed that
Speaker 1: kick to get going again. In China helped out the
Speaker 1: rest of the world again, but this time not by
Speaker 1: adding to global demand, but rather by taking away from it,
Speaker 1: by staying locked down, by taking a big hit to
Speaker 1: growth at home, China subtracted from global demand, and with
Speaker 1: the rest of the world grappling with really, really high inflation,
Speaker 1: that was actually an important contribution. If China had been booming,
Speaker 1: in inflation in the United States and in Europe would
Speaker 1: have been even higher than it was, because China buys
Speaker 1: so much, and if it were sucking up so much
Speaker 1: of the world's resources at a time when everyone was
Speaker 1: looking for it, that prices would have been driven even higher.
Speaker 1: Exactly now is meant to be the year where the
Speaker 1: US Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank and all
Speaker 1: the other big central banks start to get inflation under control.
Speaker 1: So inflation is probably going to fall from about ten
Speaker 1: percent in the third quarter of last year to about
Speaker 1: three at the end of this year. China's reopening has
Speaker 1: now introduced a wild card into that process. The Chinese
Speaker 1: buyer is back. That's positive for oil prices, it's positive
Speaker 1: agricultural commodity prices, is positive for exports across all of
Speaker 1: China's trade partners. And the risk is that adds a
Speaker 1: new impulse to inflation just when the FED and others
Speaker 1: hope to be getting it back towards their target. And
Speaker 1: what are some examples of how China opening up and
Speaker 1: starting to buy by by again will have this inflationary
Speaker 1: effect and the global economy well, one area to keep
Speaker 1: an eye on is the price of oil. China is
Speaker 1: the world's biggest importer of oil, and last year it's
Speaker 1: demand was the weakest sin according to the International Energy Agency,
Speaker 1: So there's a feeling that of China comes back in
Speaker 1: the oil market in a material way, that's an obvious
Speaker 1: channel where you can see China's returning. Interestingly, policy makers
Speaker 1: are keeping an eye on that. For example, South Korea's
Speaker 1: Central Bank governor recently made the point that china Is
Speaker 1: reopening will be a good thing because it means they
Speaker 1: will buy more South Korean goods, But he also said
Speaker 1: he's worried about the impact it will have, for example,
Speaker 1: on the price of oil, which will of course ultimately
Speaker 1: mean higher inflation for South Korea, another one of the
Speaker 1: world's economies where interest rates are going up. So I
Speaker 1: think that's one factor to keep an eye on. Now,
Speaker 1: within that there are variables, and of course the energy
Speaker 1: experts can drill into it further. But the role of
Speaker 1: Russia and supplying perhaps cheaper oil to China could take
Speaker 1: the edge of some of that story. But I would
Speaker 1: certainly in terms of when it comes to channels and
Speaker 1: when you want to look at charts and say, how
Speaker 1: do we gauge China's reopening impact on the rest of
Speaker 1: the world, keep an eye on the price of energy.
Speaker 1: A couple of thoughts to add to that. Firstly, if
Speaker 1: you look at a chart of China's oil imports, it
Speaker 1: is on a very very steady rising trend for many
Speaker 1: many years up to the start of and at the
Speaker 1: beginning of twenty when COVID hits and China locks down,
Speaker 1: China's oil imports flatline, and for the last three as
Speaker 1: they have grown at all. So I think that the
Speaker 1: idea with the reopening one point four billion people getting
Speaker 1: back in their cars, getting back on their trains, getting
Speaker 1: back on airplanes for international travel. Now the borders open
Speaker 1: is going to drive more demand for oil. I think
Speaker 1: that idea is pretty well founded in the data. And
Speaker 1: then the second thought, just to build on enders remarks,
Speaker 1: is it's not just the Korean Central Bank governor who's
Speaker 1: got his eyes on this. We had a speech by
Speaker 1: Lal Brainard, the Vice chair of the US Federal Reserve,
Speaker 1: in January, where she flagged China reopening and what that
Speaker 1: means for commodities as a risk that she's looking at.
Speaker 1: We had the European Central Banks Christine Legarde in Davos,
Speaker 1: raising the same concerns. This is something which is a
Speaker 1: live issue, which is very much on the radar of
Speaker 1: the world's top monetary policymakers. Since this is such a
Speaker 1: pressing concern, have these leaders come up with ways to
Speaker 1: offer that the harmful inflationary effects that you're describing, I'm
Speaker 1: afraid it's the blunt instrument of interest rates. Again, Whereas
Speaker 1: the hope for many in the financial markets, the hope
Speaker 1: for households looking to borrow money to buy a house,
Speaker 1: the hope for businesses that need to borrow to finance
Speaker 1: their operations. Is that the end of the rate hike
Speaker 1: cycle from the FED and other central banks is coming
Speaker 1: into sight, and that's the baseline forecast from most economists.
Speaker 1: Most economists think the FED and the ECB have got
Speaker 1: a couple more rate hikes to come, and then it's
Speaker 1: going to be not quite mission accomplished. But we've done enough.
Speaker 1: Let's let these rate hikes do their work, and inflation
Speaker 1: is going to start coming back towards target. But if
Speaker 1: China reopening gives a big boost global growth pushes commodity
Speaker 1: prices onto a sharply rising trajectory, we could find that
Speaker 1: come the second quarter, the FED and the ECB need
Speaker 1: to do a little bit more and they're not on
Speaker 1: with rate hikes quite as soon as the markets and
Speaker 1: businesses and home buyers hope they are. If I could
Speaker 1: extend that a little bit, we as It could also
Speaker 1: be that the moment when central banks start to bring
Speaker 1: down borrowing costs gets pushed out further. So, as Tom mentioned,
Speaker 1: this year is meant to be the year when central
Speaker 1: banks at least pause pushing up rate hikes because inflation
Speaker 1: is supposed to come under control. But the danger and
Speaker 1: the expectation then was that maybe later in the year
Speaker 1: some of these central banks could start to bring down
Speaker 1: boring costs because they're comfortable inflations under control. Let's give
Speaker 1: the economy from support again. But the China factor means
Speaker 1: that the ability to bring down or to cut rates
Speaker 1: may not be there. It's just another complication in the
Speaker 1: inflation story. And it would be a big call for
Speaker 1: central banks to reach a point where they're comfortable that
Speaker 1: inflation is back where they wanted to be. Given all
Speaker 1: that we've been talking about here, do you think then
Speaker 1: that China's reopening is a net negative or a net
Speaker 1: positive for the global economy. I mean, I think you've
Speaker 1: got to think, first of all, about the human story. Right,
Speaker 1: one point four billion people lockdown, fearing lockdowns that mercifully
Speaker 1: has now come to an end, right, And I think
Speaker 1: that's of the primary lens through which we think about
Speaker 1: China exiting from lockdown. When it comes to the global economy,
Speaker 1: I think one way to think about it is who's
Speaker 1: going to benefit and who's going to lose out from
Speaker 1: the reopening. So if you're sitting in Saudi Arabia, remember
Speaker 1: President she of China just made a trip to Saudi
Speaker 1: Arabia to meet the leaders. There, you're looking at China's
Speaker 1: households getting back in their cars and on the bus
Speaker 1: and on the train, and you're looking at your oil
Speaker 1: revenue and you're pretty happy about it. If you're in
Speaker 1: Brazil or Australia thinking about how much iron ore you're
Speaker 1: going to sell, you're pretty happy about it. If you're
Speaker 1: in Thailander's end of mentioned, you've gone to the airport
Speaker 1: with your Garlands to hang around the first Chinese visit.
Speaker 1: It is arriving right. So there are countries around the
Speaker 1: world that are really significant beneficiaries of China reopening. The
Speaker 1: inflation cost that's going to be something that's bowed by everybody. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would just add that it has added to a
Speaker 1: big shift in tone towards the world economy this year. Wise,
Speaker 1: only a few weeks ago, it was all about Western
Speaker 1: Europe's energy crisis. Jonas Covid zero risk of a global session,
Speaker 1: which is something very unusually in itself. And here we
Speaker 1: are now approaching February and that story has changed dramatically.
Speaker 1: Nobody's calling a dramatic rebound, I think for global growth
Speaker 1: per se, but certainly the talk of a global session
Speaker 1: is much diminished, and so much of that is down
Speaker 1: to John's reopening and the current Tom Orleck, thanks so
Speaker 1: much for joining me today. Great to be here was
Speaker 1: thank you, as you can read more from Tom Orlick
Speaker 1: and and a current at Bloomberg dot com. Thanks for
Speaker 1: listening to us here at The Big Day. It's a
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Speaker 1: Big Take