1
00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,800
Speaker 1: Warning. Today's episode k Dad spoilers for season two episode

2
00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:05,360
Speaker 1: three of the Last of Us. You have been warned.

3
00:00:06,559 --> 00:00:08,039
Speaker 1: Watch it, watch it, watch it.

4
00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:26,000
Speaker 2: Hello.

5
00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:30,639
Speaker 1: I am Jason Concepcion and I'm Merday Night and welcome

6
00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:32,159
Speaker 1: back to x ray Vision of the podcast where we

7
00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:34,960
Speaker 1: dive deep busier, favorite shows, movies, comics of pop culture

8
00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:37,400
Speaker 1: coming to you from my art podcast. We'll we'll bring

9
00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:40,640
Speaker 1: you three episodes a week every Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and News.

10
00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:43,960
Speaker 2: And in today's episode, we are talking about the Last

11
00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:46,200
Speaker 2: of Us Season two episode three, the past.

12
00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:48,120
Speaker 3: Have you been dreading watching this episode?

13
00:00:48,159 --> 00:00:50,200
Speaker 2: I was dreading it. It was it was tough off

14
00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:54,080
Speaker 2: the last last episode. Every episode, I'm dreading every episode.

15
00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:59,840
Speaker 2: But it's another really interesting, thought provoking, discourse inducing episode.

16
00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:02,920
Speaker 2: And let's talk about it because there's a lot to

17
00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:03,440
Speaker 2: talk about.

18
00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:12,720
Speaker 1: Okay, Episode three we open following the events of episode two.

19
00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,800
Speaker 1: Jackson is still on fire. There's still bodies in the street.

20
00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:19,920
Speaker 1: The town looks like it's taken a real hit. I

21
00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,360
Speaker 1: don't know how many dead, but I would imagine it's

22
00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:24,120
Speaker 1: in the dozens.

23
00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:28,680
Speaker 2: Definitely looks like you're talking about scores of people. I'm saying, would.

24
00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:31,119
Speaker 1: You say live in Jackson two thousand, three thousand.

25
00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe like with all the refugees. And I feel

26
00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:36,039
Speaker 2: like if that's the case, then we're talking about we

27
00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:39,960
Speaker 2: definitely lost like hundreds because it looked like a lot

28
00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:40,560
Speaker 2: of people.

29
00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:44,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, like a large percentage surely of what is I

30
00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:45,639
Speaker 1: would say, like ten.

31
00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:49,240
Speaker 2: Percent Jackson is it looks like it lost.

32
00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:55,320
Speaker 1: Tommy Is goes to see his brother's body and is

33
00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:58,560
Speaker 1: washing it uh to say goodbye as they prepare to

34
00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:03,160
Speaker 1: bury him. The halls of the clinic are packed with

35
00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:06,600
Speaker 1: just all kinds of people who are injured, who need attention,

36
00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:11,800
Speaker 1: who have been shot in friendly fire incidents, whatever. Ellie

37
00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:15,160
Speaker 1: is just coming to after sedation. She's undergone surgery because

38
00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:17,600
Speaker 1: I guess she broke it seems like she had collapsed

39
00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:18,880
Speaker 1: lung and maybe some kind.

40
00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:21,240
Speaker 2: Of broken rib from where Manny kicked her.

41
00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:27,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, And as she wakes up the trauma, the reality

42
00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:29,960
Speaker 1: of what has occurred, the fact that she watched Joel

43
00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:32,000
Speaker 1: get murdered in front of her, hits her and she

44
00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:36,840
Speaker 1: starts screaming. We skip forward some months or weeks.

45
00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, unclear, but her hair is a bit longer, so

46
00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:44,920
Speaker 2: I think that's off the ground. Months a couple of months.

47
00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:48,360
Speaker 1: The leaves are on the trees. Jesse and Tommy are

48
00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:51,240
Speaker 1: like pounding steaks in as they rebuild. Tommy has to

49
00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:54,000
Speaker 1: take the take the sledgehammer because Jesse has to take

50
00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:55,880
Speaker 1: the sledgehammer for Tommy because Tommy's old.

51
00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:58,720
Speaker 2: Now yeah, I know, and Jesse's like, he's like the new,

52
00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:02,000
Speaker 2: the general. And also you can tell that Tommy is

53
00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:06,440
Speaker 2: he's given, he's feeling some probably love towards Jesse. Now

54
00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:09,079
Speaker 2: their you know, Joel is gone. I think you can

55
00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,079
Speaker 2: see that that connection is there. Also Jesse showing off

56
00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:16,040
Speaker 2: those arms, showing off those muscles, they're like, they're like,

57
00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:19,360
Speaker 2: this is the thirty second shot of a man hammering

58
00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:21,720
Speaker 2: a stake into the ground. If that's your kind of thing.

59
00:03:22,480 --> 00:03:25,359
Speaker 1: A doctor is a tests Ellie to make sure her

60
00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:30,000
Speaker 1: breathing's okay, all that stuff, her lung volume is good,

61
00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:34,400
Speaker 1: and then but what about her mind? Your her body

62
00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:36,160
Speaker 1: is healed, but what are her mind? Gail comes in,

63
00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:42,080
Speaker 1: Gail the town's only therapist, uh, which we confirm here

64
00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:44,839
Speaker 1: she really is and she really is, she confirms it.

65
00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,920
Speaker 2: I'm like, Gail, teach someone, you could train them.

66
00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:52,600
Speaker 1: You need to offload some of this Ellie is typically

67
00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,960
Speaker 1: prickly in a cerbic towards Gail, does not want to

68
00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,560
Speaker 1: really go through this process, tries to rush through it.

69
00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:03,000
Speaker 1: Gail is like, okay, talk about New Year's Eve, the

70
00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:04,760
Speaker 1: last when was the last time you and Joel spoke?

71
00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:07,400
Speaker 1: And she talks about the fact that that was the

72
00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:10,320
Speaker 1: last time, in that she saw him on his porch

73
00:04:11,680 --> 00:04:13,560
Speaker 1: New Year's Eve and then did not speak to him.

74
00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,719
Speaker 1: She wishes she spoke to him, and then Gail in

75
00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:21,920
Speaker 1: what I can only describe as a complete rupture of therapist,

76
00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:29,680
Speaker 1: a shocking rupture of therapy ethics that I listen, I

77
00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:33,320
Speaker 1: get it. It's the post apocalypse is a different world,

78
00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:36,080
Speaker 1: but this is not how it should be. Gail then

79
00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:38,240
Speaker 1: is like, hey, so when I was working with Joel,

80
00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:40,920
Speaker 1: Joel mentioned that he wronged you in some way, and

81
00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,080
Speaker 1: he like, maybe in a bad way. Do you know

82
00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:47,440
Speaker 1: what he was talking about? Which, again, I don't think

83
00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:50,080
Speaker 1: you should be talking about your patients with other.

84
00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:53,599
Speaker 2: People, and you are supposed to keep that secret off

85
00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:58,640
Speaker 2: to somebody dies you want. Knowing that does not change Gail.

86
00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,960
Speaker 2: I al, I'm very interested in this interaction too, because

87
00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,240
Speaker 2: one Ellie has clearly been seeing Gail long enough that

88
00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:08,159
Speaker 2: she knows how to play the game. She knows what

89
00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:11,520
Speaker 2: she's supposed to say. Gail knows Ellie is only playing

90
00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:14,719
Speaker 2: the game. So why does Gail bring up this notion

91
00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:18,680
Speaker 2: of how Joel Ronka Is that? Because Gail wants to

92
00:05:18,760 --> 00:05:22,960
Speaker 2: find a reason to feel like her hate of Joel

93
00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:26,599
Speaker 2: is justified. Like I'm interested in that because the reality is,

94
00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:28,800
Speaker 2: it doesn't really matter what Joel did now, because Joel's

95
00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:30,839
Speaker 2: dead and Ellie is not.

96
00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,640
Speaker 1: Like now, maybe there's like a frame that you could

97
00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:42,479
Speaker 1: use right where Gail is thinking, if Joel did something

98
00:05:42,520 --> 00:05:46,640
Speaker 1: that really was traumatizing towards Ellie, she being my patient,

99
00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:48,280
Speaker 1: I should we should talk about it. But I don't

100
00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:50,760
Speaker 1: think you would say that Joel told me this. I

101
00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:54,799
Speaker 1: think you would try and dig around right anyway, Gail.

102
00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:58,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, Gail, drink and smoking all day and then go

103
00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,080
Speaker 2: in and tell people about their problem was like, come on, babe,

104
00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:03,640
Speaker 2: But Katine O'Hara, you're a queen.

105
00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,880
Speaker 1: Now, if I think again, The look on Ellie's face

106
00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:11,080
Speaker 1: tells me that she suspects she knows what Joel is

107
00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:14,320
Speaker 1: talking about. Because I think most certainly because I think

108
00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:18,080
Speaker 1: you and I are on the same page that Ellie

109
00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:18,800
Speaker 1: knows that.

110
00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:24,039
Speaker 2: So we don't know yet, and we may find this

111
00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:27,880
Speaker 2: out via flashback whether Joel ever told Tommy what happened.

112
00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:29,719
Speaker 2: We know he did tell him in the game, So

113
00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:33,720
Speaker 2: I also wonder if they're translating that part of it

114
00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:37,600
Speaker 2: to the fact that Joel did at some point admit

115
00:06:37,839 --> 00:06:42,839
Speaker 2: to Ellie that her suspicions were correct.

116
00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,159
Speaker 3: So I'm interested to find out how that goes.

117
00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:47,560
Speaker 2: But Ellie definitely knows, and in this moment, she is

118
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,400
Speaker 2: really like playing Gail, and Gail knows it because Ellie's like,

119
00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:53,560
Speaker 2: I guess I'll just have to work through this. I'm

120
00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:55,839
Speaker 2: gonna have to let myself off the hook, and she's

121
00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:58,440
Speaker 2: saying all the right therapy things, but we know that

122
00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:04,680
Speaker 2: inside she is just fucking burning with righteous fury about

123
00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:05,320
Speaker 2: what happened.

124
00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:10,680
Speaker 1: Ellie is released. She goes to Joel's house. There's flowers

125
00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:14,840
Speaker 1: the yard. People have been paying their respects the weeks

126
00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,760
Speaker 1: that have passed. She goes through his empty house, his

127
00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:21,640
Speaker 1: empty bedroom. She finds a red box on his bed.

128
00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:24,200
Speaker 1: It's got his watch and his gigantic revolver in it.

129
00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:27,320
Speaker 2: Oh my god, He's like all right, like an Eastwood

130
00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:30,160
Speaker 2: like like like a cowboy, like a fallen cowboy.

131
00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,640
Speaker 1: She hugs his jacket, which, oh man, I was tearing up.

132
00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:39,520
Speaker 1: That was tearing up. That is That's one of those

133
00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,480
Speaker 1: tropes that gets me every time.

134
00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:44,640
Speaker 3: Me too, because I do think it's like.

135
00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:46,560
Speaker 1: I think it's a thing people do.

136
00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:47,680
Speaker 2: You definitely a thing.

137
00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,480
Speaker 4: People do, and also as well, just like a weird

138
00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:55,360
Speaker 4: kind of unacknowledged universal truth of like we are, you know,

139
00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:58,080
Speaker 4: we are connected to scents and the way people smell

140
00:07:58,160 --> 00:07:59,800
Speaker 4: and neck clothes and the way people feel.

141
00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,880
Speaker 2: It's this little, tiny kind of texture of life. And

142
00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:05,760
Speaker 2: I think the reason it is a trope is because

143
00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,000
Speaker 2: I think it is true, you know. And I think

144
00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:11,040
Speaker 2: in that moment also Bella Ramsey just you are absolutely

145
00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:14,480
Speaker 2: killing it. Like I love this episode for you. It's

146
00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:18,080
Speaker 2: so good. I love the way the play that Ellie

147
00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:20,800
Speaker 2: has with Gail and this kind of conversation which will

148
00:08:20,840 --> 00:08:23,120
Speaker 2: come into play later in the episode when Gail says

149
00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:26,320
Speaker 2: something very interesting in my opinion, and I just think,

150
00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:29,880
Speaker 2: then the moment when Ellie walks out of the hospital

151
00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,480
Speaker 2: and it's just this kind of close up dolly shot

152
00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:34,760
Speaker 2: of her face as everything else behind her is kind

153
00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:36,800
Speaker 2: of blurry and you see the real troop of how

154
00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:42,160
Speaker 2: Ellie's feeling. Just a powerhouse powerhouse performance from Bella Ramsey.

155
00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:47,200
Speaker 1: Dina comes over, Ellie drives her eyes and goes to

156
00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:49,360
Speaker 1: meet her in the dining room, trying to act normal,

157
00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:53,719
Speaker 1: which Ellie, there's no reason to pretend like you are

158
00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:55,920
Speaker 1: not shattered by this. I think we all get it,

159
00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,000
Speaker 1: Like you don't need to do that. But Dina brings

160
00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:01,520
Speaker 1: cookies like this kind of piece off ring and says,

161
00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:03,720
Speaker 1: I'm bringing these cookies because I'm about to make you angry.

162
00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:08,320
Speaker 1: And basically she tells her that she's knows who the

163
00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:10,760
Speaker 1: killers are and knows where they're from. Ellie is mad

164
00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:12,560
Speaker 1: because she's like, you cost us time you let them

165
00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:16,959
Speaker 1: get away. It makes a great point that like it's

166
00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:20,920
Speaker 1: a great point. We're weak now, we're not even the

167
00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:25,280
Speaker 1: walls are not rebuilt. People are dead. There's a lot

168
00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:28,160
Speaker 1: to sort out here. And in the days that followed

169
00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:30,800
Speaker 1: Joel's death, we were in no state to go chasing.

170
00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:34,600
Speaker 2: Him after that. And also Ellie would have never recovered

171
00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:36,800
Speaker 2: and would have pulled the tubes out of her arms

172
00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:39,240
Speaker 2: and just like gone with the broken rib and died,

173
00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:42,720
Speaker 2: you know, and Also I love Dina coming to Ellie

174
00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:46,240
Speaker 2: with almost like a strategy point here as well, because

175
00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:48,640
Speaker 2: she says to She's like, and if you know where

176
00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:52,120
Speaker 2: somebody's going, I do, then why follow them? Why not

177
00:09:52,240 --> 00:09:54,360
Speaker 2: just meet them where they are? Yeah? If now they

178
00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:57,319
Speaker 2: were going at the end of the episode, So maybe

179
00:09:57,320 --> 00:09:59,800
Speaker 2: that was not the best idea, but but I loved

180
00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:02,640
Speaker 2: his mindset and I think that wins Ellie over. And

181
00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:04,719
Speaker 2: obviously the cookies are also delicious.

182
00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:07,400
Speaker 1: So she tells Ellie the names, and of course Ellie

183
00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:10,480
Speaker 1: is most interested in the girl with the ponytail, Abbey,

184
00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:15,679
Speaker 1: and they're from the Washington Liberation Front that their little

185
00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,360
Speaker 1: logo is a wolf's head, one of the kind of

186
00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:26,280
Speaker 1: multiple splinter groups that had been opposing FEDRA in recent years,

187
00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:31,240
Speaker 1: and they're based out of Seattle, and Dina thinks wrongly

188
00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:37,640
Speaker 1: that they're probably small enough for.

189
00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:41,959
Speaker 5: Them to handle understandable often understanding what she's still because

190
00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:44,600
Speaker 5: the truth is the group that we met, yeah, they

191
00:10:44,679 --> 00:10:47,199
Speaker 5: kind of had a militia e vibe, but they did

192
00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:48,280
Speaker 5: seem like a road group.

193
00:10:48,320 --> 00:10:51,600
Speaker 2: Abby was not a great leader. It was all very

194
00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:55,360
Speaker 2: emotionally driven and there was a brutality there that spoke

195
00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,360
Speaker 2: to kind of a lone wolf survival effort of the group.

196
00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:00,800
Speaker 3: So I understand what they was thinking.

197
00:11:01,280 --> 00:11:03,920
Speaker 2: But the fact they have a logo, I feel like

198
00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:06,520
Speaker 2: that's like, that's where I'm at. I'm like, babe, if

199
00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:10,920
Speaker 2: you have a logo, that's a graphic designer in the

200
00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:14,440
Speaker 2: team to have a logo, Like, that's where I'm at.

201
00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:18,560
Speaker 1: Like if they if you have patches, they're built up.

202
00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:19,640
Speaker 1: What are you talking about?

203
00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:20,920
Speaker 2: What you got.

204
00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:24,640
Speaker 1: On? They've got a sewing department.

205
00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,360
Speaker 2: It's not they literally like had to get someone who

206
00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:30,000
Speaker 2: knew how to embroider to make the patches, to make

207
00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:33,440
Speaker 2: along the patches. It's not like it's a school logo

208
00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:35,120
Speaker 2: that they have reappropriated.

209
00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:39,240
Speaker 1: This is right scribbled, you know. It's not like the

210
00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:43,200
Speaker 1: surafights and it's like somebody exactly they found like you know,

211
00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:48,440
Speaker 1: like no, this is stitched. It's like I could go

212
00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:51,720
Speaker 1: on atsy right now and buy that dolls.

213
00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:52,360
Speaker 3: Literally.

214
00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:57,160
Speaker 2: Also, something I do love is this and I think

215
00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,640
Speaker 2: this is something that maybe annoys viewers or whatever, but

216
00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:01,480
Speaker 2: I felt this in the game too, And I feel

217
00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:03,480
Speaker 2: like they sum it up in the show is like

218
00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:06,439
Speaker 2: Dina and Ellie are teenagers. They're still teenagers. They're kind

219
00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,679
Speaker 2: of dumb, like that's just normal teenagers do this stuff,

220
00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:12,319
Speaker 2: so I think, and especially someone like Dina who has

221
00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:16,840
Speaker 2: lived in Jackson and really has like a little overcome,

222
00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:22,160
Speaker 2: a little over confident, and especially in as Dina reminds Ellie,

223
00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:24,720
Speaker 2: like Dina loved Joel too, so she is also probably

224
00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:28,720
Speaker 2: you know, Joel was almost like a superhero in this world,

225
00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:31,920
Speaker 2: like not necessarily morally, but like what he could withstand.

226
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:36,120
Speaker 2: And I think that adds to the the overconfidence. So

227
00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:40,719
Speaker 2: you know, then, yeah, I thought it's believable. But hilariously,

228
00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,520
Speaker 2: I was like, no, if they've got as confident the

229
00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:48,320
Speaker 2: Personalyptic design team, don't go stea. Jackson doesn't even have

230
00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:54,440
Speaker 2: like a patch. It doesn't even have like well anyway

231
00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:55,160
Speaker 2: everything else.

232
00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:59,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, the girls pitched Tommy on you know, getting a

233
00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:03,439
Speaker 1: Posse together revenge mission. He makes basically the same points

234
00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:06,120
Speaker 1: that Dina made earlier, which is Towns Week were not ready.

235
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:09,640
Speaker 1: Ellie tries to lecture Tommy, which I thought was this

236
00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:12,600
Speaker 1: is a great moment for Tommy, who basically says, listen,

237
00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:18,160
Speaker 1: that's my brother. Don't try to act or present yourself

238
00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:21,120
Speaker 1: as someone who knows my brother better than I do stop.

239
00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:24,240
Speaker 2: Because also they live like it's it's easy to forget

240
00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:26,319
Speaker 2: for Ellie who like a quarter of her life has

241
00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:29,240
Speaker 2: been with Joel or whatever, maybe almost half of it now. Yeah,

242
00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:33,880
Speaker 2: but like Joel and Tommy were together for decades, you know,

243
00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:36,880
Speaker 2: they grew up together, they lived together before, they lived together,

244
00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,839
Speaker 2: through they separated, they came back together. And I love

245
00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:46,360
Speaker 2: it because I think that it's such a beautiful moment

246
00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:52,120
Speaker 2: where you still get this kindness and empathy from Tommy

247
00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:55,160
Speaker 2: where he doesn't like hammer it home in some horrible way.

248
00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:57,800
Speaker 2: He just kind of gives her the reminder of like,

249
00:13:58,200 --> 00:13:59,560
Speaker 2: let's not pretend he's not my brother.

250
00:13:59,640 --> 00:14:02,320
Speaker 1: There's respect there where Ellie's like, okay, you got me

251
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:06,560
Speaker 1: on that. Yeah, and he says, listen, we'll put it

252
00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:10,480
Speaker 1: up for a vote in front of this council. Ellie's like, fuck, yes,

253
00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:12,840
Speaker 1: the council. That's the way we do things here in Jackson.

254
00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:18,520
Speaker 1: So sorry, and Tommy then warns Dina, you hold out

255
00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:20,320
Speaker 1: on Ellie, fine, because she would have ripped the tube

256
00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,480
Speaker 1: to your point, yeah, Rosie, she would have rip the

257
00:14:22,520 --> 00:14:24,680
Speaker 1: tubes out and tried to go. But you tell me

258
00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:27,000
Speaker 1: when you have that information.

259
00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:29,320
Speaker 3: And honestly, she should have told Tommy.

260
00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,840
Speaker 2: But also I think she could have also argued a

261
00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:34,360
Speaker 2: similar thing of and we'll get to this because it's

262
00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:37,720
Speaker 2: been a very big conversation point on the internet. But

263
00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:41,440
Speaker 2: like if Dina could have made the argument that if

264
00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:44,080
Speaker 2: she'd have told Tommy early, he might not still be

265
00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:47,480
Speaker 2: in Jackson now, and I think Jackson needs Tommy. But

266
00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:49,600
Speaker 2: obviously that will come into play as we as we

267
00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:50,480
Speaker 2: converse later.

268
00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:54,640
Speaker 1: So he tells Ellie where Joel and the rest are buried,

269
00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:58,440
Speaker 1: about ten miles outside of the city, and she says,

270
00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:02,160
Speaker 1: I'll pay my respects on the way Seattle. We go

271
00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:06,360
Speaker 1: to the woods somewhere on the trail to Seattle. The

272
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:10,640
Speaker 1: serophytes say, okay, the scars wow. Our first meeting with them.

273
00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:13,520
Speaker 1: They communicate just like in the game, via whistles as

274
00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:17,320
Speaker 1: they walk the trail, the distinctive scars on their cheeks.

275
00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:24,520
Speaker 1: The cult is migrating. They're moving somewhere to separate themselves

276
00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:29,120
Speaker 1: from the dangers that exist in the area. They follow

277
00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:33,040
Speaker 1: the teachings of a dead prophet. They're talking about it.

278
00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:36,680
Speaker 1: This older gentleman is talking about it with this young

279
00:15:36,760 --> 00:15:39,120
Speaker 1: girl and he lets her hold a hammer, which is

280
00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:41,720
Speaker 1: one of their signature weapons, and then there's a warning

281
00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:43,880
Speaker 1: whistle from down the trail and the cult dives into

282
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:45,560
Speaker 1: the trees away.

283
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:49,120
Speaker 2: I thought this was an interesting introduction to the Teraphytes

284
00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:52,280
Speaker 2: because usually, like in the game, they are this really brutal,

285
00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:57,040
Speaker 2: antagonistic force. Obviously, the hammers there's a lot of sacrificial creepiness,

286
00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:58,040
Speaker 2: very cult vibes.

287
00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:00,400
Speaker 3: But I think the introduction of the.

288
00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:04,240
Speaker 2: Child, even with her excitement to have the hammer and

289
00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:07,200
Speaker 2: her excitement for what is clearly violence, this is a

290
00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:11,960
Speaker 2: very humanizing introduction, especially with what goes on next, So

291
00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:14,640
Speaker 2: I'm very interested to see how they expand on that

292
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,320
Speaker 2: as we move towards the rest of the season.

293
00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:21,960
Speaker 1: We go back to Jackson. Jesse is getting Ellie back

294
00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:24,120
Speaker 1: into fighting shape. He wants to make sure that her

295
00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:28,200
Speaker 1: injured side, the right side, is strong enough for her

296
00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:32,560
Speaker 1: to fight somebody or maybe multiple people. Jesse's on the

297
00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:36,880
Speaker 1: council now and Ellie asks another ethics violation.

298
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:39,240
Speaker 2: And luckily Jesse is a real one. He's at the

299
00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:44,880
Speaker 2: segu Jesse. Thanks, Jesse, show us well I should be

300
00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:45,960
Speaker 2: living that's.

301
00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:50,640
Speaker 1: Right, integrity and morality and government. It is so refreshing

302
00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:53,800
Speaker 1: to see this Ellie is like, hey, can I count

303
00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:57,080
Speaker 1: on your vote? And Jesse's like, you know, I can't discuss.

304
00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:01,200
Speaker 3: He's absolutely not like that does make any sense.

305
00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,320
Speaker 1: And then which I again I much respect to Jesse,

306
00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:06,200
Speaker 1: and then gives her a good tip, which is, don't

307
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:07,040
Speaker 1: come off angry.

308
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:09,280
Speaker 3: Don't come off they're gonna vote for angry.

309
00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:11,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, nobody's gonna follow you down the trail of a

310
00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:13,840
Speaker 1: revenge mission that they might not come back from.

311
00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:17,080
Speaker 2: Also, I thought it was really cool to see Ellie training.

312
00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:20,080
Speaker 2: And also I thought there was some very interesting kind

313
00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:23,520
Speaker 2: of the way it was shot and showing how cut

314
00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:26,520
Speaker 2: Bella actually is and kind of a little bit more

315
00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:29,040
Speaker 2: of a throwback to what people might have expected Abby

316
00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:31,320
Speaker 2: to look like. I think there's some very interesting stuff

317
00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:34,080
Speaker 2: going on there. And yeah, I am I'm a Jesse fan.

318
00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:38,520
Speaker 2: I'm saying just stay stay in your weird like love

319
00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:41,639
Speaker 2: triangle with Jesse. It's all gonna be okay. Do not

320
00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:46,080
Speaker 2: go to Seattle. Stay in Jackson. Jesse will look after you, guys,

321
00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,080
Speaker 2: He'll teach you how to fight. It's gonna be okay.

322
00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:50,760
Speaker 2: Don't go. Don't go, guys.

323
00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:53,440
Speaker 1: We go to the council meeting. They're trying to burn

324
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:56,040
Speaker 1: through their schedule to get through the jowel thing that

325
00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:59,399
Speaker 1: they're getting hung up on. Oh, you know, chickens versus turkeys.

326
00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:03,159
Speaker 2: I want to say this is a true representation of

327
00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:08,720
Speaker 2: local representations. I also want to say thank you to

328
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:13,960
Speaker 2: our discord who very politely let me know that the

329
00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:17,320
Speaker 2: Council of Jackson Hole, where we saw them telling off

330
00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:20,080
Speaker 2: Dina and Ellie one time, that was probably already built.

331
00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:22,479
Speaker 2: They didn't spend their time building it. Okay, I get it,

332
00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:23,720
Speaker 2: but I will.

333
00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:24,960
Speaker 3: Say this was unbelievable.

334
00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,119
Speaker 2: When he starts talking about he's like, you know, corn

335
00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:31,920
Speaker 2: is not the most delicious crop, but it is the fastest,

336
00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:34,199
Speaker 2: and like, that's what I really want to come in

337
00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,240
Speaker 2: today to talk to you about. And they're like please,

338
00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:39,000
Speaker 2: everyone else is here for this one specific reason. And

339
00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:40,879
Speaker 2: he's like, I don't care about that.

340
00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:47,639
Speaker 1: That's it's like it's correct, Yeah, real life, real life.

341
00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:51,240
Speaker 1: Another speaker gets up, Rachel. She speaks against the POSSE,

342
00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:54,199
Speaker 1: I think, making good points that the towns sixteen is

343
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,320
Speaker 1: a lot of people to spare right now, that might

344
00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,880
Speaker 1: be they might have lost sixteen people or probably more

345
00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:04,280
Speaker 1: honestly in the in the fight and to send another sixteen.

346
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,320
Speaker 1: You don't know if they're coming back at this stage.

347
00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:08,560
Speaker 1: I tend to agree that it's I.

348
00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:10,040
Speaker 2: Agree, I think sixteen.

349
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:11,080
Speaker 3: When they said that, I was.

350
00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:11,640
Speaker 2: Like, whoa.

351
00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,080
Speaker 3: And also as well, I think the other thing that

352
00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:14,680
Speaker 3: she makes.

353
00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:17,560
Speaker 1: Us sources and you know, and the whole thing.

354
00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:19,920
Speaker 2: I think what she makes a really good point about here.

355
00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:22,320
Speaker 2: That again, I think is one of the things this

356
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:25,040
Speaker 2: show does really well. And we talked about it last

357
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:29,520
Speaker 2: episode is like where are empathy and focus is on?

358
00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:33,159
Speaker 2: This show comes from where the framing is. We love Ellie,

359
00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:37,639
Speaker 2: we love Joel, but but but but but, as Rachel

360
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:40,880
Speaker 2: points out, like she lost her sister, so many people

361
00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:43,360
Speaker 2: were lost in this. Why do we have to put

362
00:19:43,359 --> 00:19:44,840
Speaker 2: the town at risk for one man?

363
00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:45,280
Speaker 1: Like?

364
00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:48,719
Speaker 2: And I think that is what Tommy understands and what

365
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,119
Speaker 2: Maria understands, And that's why you have to come to

366
00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:55,200
Speaker 2: the council because everybody lost something, yea, and actually.

367
00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:57,600
Speaker 1: Everybody it makes good everybody makes good point.

368
00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:00,840
Speaker 2: Does this push Jackson forward in a way that is

369
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:01,840
Speaker 2: good for everybody?

370
00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:04,560
Speaker 1: Right? Carlile then gets up and makes a turn the

371
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:09,040
Speaker 1: other cheek pitch, basically saying, hey, if you know, break

372
00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,080
Speaker 1: the cycle of violence? This is what breaking the cycle

373
00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:13,600
Speaker 1: of violence is. Seth gets up and yells at him

374
00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:16,639
Speaker 1: and is basically saying, you know, they don't deserve our mercy,

375
00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:18,720
Speaker 1: and Carlo makes a good point that that's why it's mercy,

376
00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:22,080
Speaker 1: and then Seth basically gives a fuck them, kill them

377
00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:25,119
Speaker 1: all speech, like like they came here, they took one

378
00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:30,040
Speaker 1: of ours, we have to strike back. Ellie then makes

379
00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:32,240
Speaker 1: her speech, and I think it's good and I think

380
00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:33,400
Speaker 1: she makes some good points that.

381
00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:35,840
Speaker 2: Really stuck you because it did a really good job

382
00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:38,560
Speaker 2: like priming her, like write it down, don't get dress.

383
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:40,120
Speaker 2: Just before we get to Ellie, though, I do want

384
00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:42,440
Speaker 2: to say I think this is such a good interaction

385
00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:46,679
Speaker 2: between Carlyle and Seth because Carlyle is arguing for the

386
00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:50,960
Speaker 2: very thing that allows Seth to still be in yes group.

387
00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:54,160
Speaker 2: That's a great point, hey, break the cycle of violence,

388
00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,359
Speaker 2: Like Maria is gonna get you to apologize to this person,

389
00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:00,479
Speaker 2: forgive and be forgiven. That has worked for Jackson on

390
00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:04,760
Speaker 2: a small scale, so why wouldn't they do that with this?

391
00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:07,960
Speaker 2: I will also say, hilariously, Seth makes a good argument

392
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,120
Speaker 2: where he's basically like, oh, if you don't kill them,

393
00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:12,960
Speaker 2: they're going to come back. They're going to be raiders.

394
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:14,760
Speaker 2: They're going to do this again and again. I don't

395
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:16,440
Speaker 2: know if he believes it. I think he is trying

396
00:21:16,440 --> 00:21:18,800
Speaker 2: to stick up for Ane, and I don't know if

397
00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,919
Speaker 2: I believe it. But the funny thing is, ironically, in

398
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:25,440
Speaker 2: this case, Carlile is definitely right because, as we will

399
00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:30,520
Speaker 2: find out, it doesn't matter Set. They could take Jackson

400
00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,760
Speaker 2: Hole if they wanted. That's what we learned like that,

401
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:35,560
Speaker 2: so that doesn't matter. You can't scare them out of it.

402
00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:38,240
Speaker 2: But I found this to be a very interesting kind

403
00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 2: of interior look at how Jackson Hole has survived and

404
00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:43,800
Speaker 2: whether or not this will help it survive.

405
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:47,520
Speaker 1: Ellie then makes her a speech and she, I think

406
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:56,040
Speaker 1: very wisely reframes sets, fuck him, kill them all angle

407
00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:59,880
Speaker 1: in a more familial way, framing it as an act

408
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:02,919
Speaker 1: of justice and familiar love, basically saying like, if one

409
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:05,640
Speaker 1: of you is hurt, I will go to the ends

410
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,439
Speaker 1: of the earth to get justice. And this is where like,

411
00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:12,320
Speaker 1: I'm more looking at the how fucked up the town

412
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:18,760
Speaker 1: is I was, I'm more I definitely lean Rachel and Carlisle.

413
00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:22,040
Speaker 1: That said, I do think that there is something in

414
00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:25,960
Speaker 1: the way Ellie and even Set's point of view that

415
00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:32,600
Speaker 1: says that is a bond in the community that says, hey,

416
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:36,679
Speaker 1: if something wrong, if someone wrongs you, something happens to

417
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:41,040
Speaker 1: you from outside this community, we are going to seek redress. Yeah,

418
00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:44,200
Speaker 1: that is the because you're asking all these people all

419
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,640
Speaker 1: the time to risk their lives, not just for citizenship

420
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:51,159
Speaker 1: in this inside the safe walls and the confines of

421
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,760
Speaker 1: this place, but they have to go outside of them

422
00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:56,119
Speaker 1: and do all these things that are very dangerous and risky.

423
00:22:56,520 --> 00:23:00,760
Speaker 1: And I think part of building those bonds is the

424
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:04,159
Speaker 1: understanding that the other people here have your back and

425
00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:10,600
Speaker 1: if something happens, you know, your kids, the people who

426
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 1: love you, are going to be strengthened by the notion

427
00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:17,240
Speaker 1: that the town will seek justice. So I thought this

428
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:17,919
Speaker 1: was strong.

429
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,320
Speaker 2: I thought Ellie did a really good job here. It's

430
00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:24,239
Speaker 2: a really interesting argument. I think she's right about the

431
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,200
Speaker 2: idea of it being about justice over revenge, and obviously

432
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:30,119
Speaker 2: we know Ellie wants revenge, but I think it's an

433
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:35,600
Speaker 2: interesting framing. Second, I also think, like, well, you know Ellie,

434
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:37,800
Speaker 2: we know her really you Well, that's the thing is

435
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:39,720
Speaker 2: like Ellie is lying her ass off.

436
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:41,080
Speaker 1: She's very good speech.

437
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:45,960
Speaker 2: Sometimes you actually like she is lying for the great

438
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,240
Speaker 2: she does believe it's for the greater good. Like the

439
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 2: way she's arguing it, she meants into the framework of

440
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,480
Speaker 2: Jackson Like she's not making a null and void point.

441
00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 2: You know, I agree with you, and I think something

442
00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:02,680
Speaker 2: else that's interesting is otherwise and I love like I'm

443
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,679
Speaker 2: definitely a Carlyle in real life, you know, I dream

444
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 2: of a like noncstoral state where we can all believe

445
00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:11,480
Speaker 2: in each other. But in the world of the Last

446
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:15,520
Speaker 2: of Us in the zombie apocalypse, is it realistic that

447
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,280
Speaker 2: you think that Jackson Hole can survive simply by always

448
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 2: forgiving those people who do you wrong. I don't know

449
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,880
Speaker 2: if that eventually is really going to keep you safe.

450
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:26,199
Speaker 2: You know, I think that there is a reality that

451
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:28,919
Speaker 2: Ellie is touching on here that, whether she means it

452
00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:34,159
Speaker 2: or not, feels like she's onto something.

453
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 3: And I, yeah, I'm very interested.

454
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 2: Let's talk about what happens next, because I want to

455
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:40,639
Speaker 2: know your thoughts on who who's voted for what?

456
00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 1: So oh, I think it's very easy to figure out.

457
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 1: So I just want to say Ellie lies. She says

458
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:49,439
Speaker 1: that it's not about revenge and everybody's like.

459
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:50,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, She's like.

460
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,600
Speaker 1: And she says she'll abide. Yes, she says she'll abide

461
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,439
Speaker 1: by the vote, which everybody understands is also a lie.

462
00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,920
Speaker 1: The vote goes out and it is eight to three against,

463
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:06,199
Speaker 1: and I think very clearly it's Maria Jesse, Tommy the

464
00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 1: three yes.

465
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:09,800
Speaker 2: I agree because I will say and I am just

466
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 2: such a big fan of the actress who plays Maria.

467
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 2: She's so brilliant. She was so great in True True Blood,

468
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:24,000
Speaker 2: Rettina Wesley. She's so fantastic, And she does this momentary

469
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 2: face acting, this tiny little bit of emotion when Ellie

470
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:32,439
Speaker 2: finishes her speech where she looks at Tommy and she

471
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 2: is like, she doesn't be with pride because that wouldn't

472
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:39,320
Speaker 2: be appropriate as the council member in that moment, but

473
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,919
Speaker 2: there is a slight smile and a nod of the

474
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 2: head where you just know she thinks, like, yeah, this

475
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 2: is the right thing to do, and people are gonna

476
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 2: vote for this. Like she she smiles, she sees Tommy,

477
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:53,639
Speaker 2: and I just I thought she was just so great

478
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,520
Speaker 2: in that moment, because you really feel like there has

479
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 2: been a connection between her Tommy Ellie, and there's a

480
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 2: complexity of understanding about what they should do. But she

481
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:04,119
Speaker 2: feels like they're going to do the right thing, and

482
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:05,880
Speaker 2: obviously we see that they don't.

483
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:07,040
Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break.

484
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:07,640
Speaker 2: When you're out.

485
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:27,080
Speaker 1: And we're back, Tommy seeks out Gail. He finds her

486
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,760
Speaker 1: watching a Jackson Little League baseball game, and they talk

487
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,080
Speaker 1: about the vote. Gil's drink and of course I will

488
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,640
Speaker 1: say that I think that Seth did more harm than good.

489
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:38,639
Speaker 1: I think his I think his outburst kind of scared

490
00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:40,359
Speaker 1: people a little bit, and I think it might have

491
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 1: been closer if we had just let Ellie.

492
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:44,200
Speaker 3: I agree.

493
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 2: I think that Jesse was right. No one's going to

494
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 2: vote for anger. Yeah, you know, and Seth ended up

495
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:49,520
Speaker 2: trying to help.

496
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:52,639
Speaker 1: But I think the other thing is you get the

497
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:56,560
Speaker 1: picture that from not just the homophobia that says is

498
00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:59,760
Speaker 1: kind of the asshole in town, right, So him having

499
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,720
Speaker 1: him on your side might not help. Yeah, So they

500
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 1: talk about the vote, Tommy and Gail. Gail admits that yes,

501
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 1: as the town's only therapist, I'm getting trauma dumped right now,

502
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:13,680
Speaker 1: Gail again train a therapist. Tommy says, hey, I'm concerned

503
00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: Ellie is gonna act, and Gail's like, no shit, She's

504
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,320
Speaker 1: gonna go, what the fuck are you talking about? And

505
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 1: then Tommy's like, you know, I think she learned a

506
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 1: lot of this from Joel. That's this is what Joel

507
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,439
Speaker 1: was like in the you know, I don't want her

508
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 1: to be the guy that Joel was that in the

509
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: years after the Fall, when he was just lashing out

510
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:33,399
Speaker 1: all the time and killing people, we would assume and

511
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:38,159
Speaker 1: doing violent shit. And Gail says, listen, you'd be surprised

512
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 1: at how much Again, this is another thing that struck

513
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 1: me as a therapist. Weird that Gale would do. Gail

514
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 1: would then say, hey, you know, in the in the

515
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:54,719
Speaker 1: struggle between nature and nurture, it's often the innate essence

516
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:58,320
Speaker 1: of a person that comes to the surface and not

517
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 1: not the way they are raised in their experiences. Gail

518
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:03,720
Speaker 1: basically saying, why do I have a job?

519
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 2: Why is my.

520
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:08,440
Speaker 1: Role even important? People are just gonna do what they do.

521
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 1: Very weird take from Gail.

522
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,719
Speaker 2: Very hilarious that Gail says that about Ellie, who is

523
00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,879
Speaker 2: like still basically I'm just only just stop being a minor.

524
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 2: She's nineteen and for like seven years of her life

525
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 2: was raised by fucking Joel. So I think nature Nutcha,

526
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,560
Speaker 2: like how did it come to be? But I also

527
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 2: think I'm loving how much of a bad therapist they're

528
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:33,400
Speaker 2: making Gail, because I also.

529
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:37,359
Speaker 1: She's like openly like, I'm an alcoholic ID all the time,

530
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 1: I talk about my patients with my other patient shits.

531
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 1: I was mad at Joel because he killed my husband

532
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 1: when it seems clearly like he killed him because he

533
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,920
Speaker 1: was tuned like. But I think that Katherine O'Hara brings

534
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: a complexity to it and a humor to it that

535
00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: feels way more real than if she was just like, actually,

536
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: you know, still acting like a therapist who was the

537
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 1: only therapist in his zombie apocalypse.

538
00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:04,040
Speaker 2: But yeah, I thought that was really interesting, and I

539
00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 2: also wondered if that's like again, was her hatred for

540
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 2: Joel and what happened with Eugene kind of like transferring

541
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,480
Speaker 2: a little bit to Ellie because the idea of just

542
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,400
Speaker 2: saying like she's a liar, she'll never change, She's just

543
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:18,440
Speaker 2: that kind of person. I was quite some felt.

544
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:22,680
Speaker 1: I was taken aback. I was really taken aback, I

545
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 1: have to say. But to give Gail a little bit

546
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 1: of grace, I think she's frankly burned out.

547
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 2: Truly, babe, you got you tell, you tell Tommy forty

548
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 2: years of psychotherapy. Just train someone that training kids, That

549
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,040
Speaker 2: training kids out to fix a telephone, that training kids,

550
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 2: just training. You have to listen.

551
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 1: Do you think the doctor who was looking after Ellie,

552
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 1: who is maybe thirty, who was probably fifteen when all

553
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: the shit went down, went to medical school and on

554
00:29:56,320 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 1: this shit, Hey, come on, just trained somebody anyway. Yeah,

555
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 1: Gayla is like, of course Ellie's gonna go, and YadA YadA. Later,

556
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 1: Dina comes to see Ellie. Ellie is in the middle

557
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 1: of packing for her one woman revenge mission to kill

558
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 1: Abbey and her friends, and she tries to lie that Elly, yeah,

559
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 1: I'm going to bed and I'm not really going, And

560
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 1: then Gina's like, give me a fucking break. And by

561
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,120
Speaker 1: the way, look at what you're packing. You're packing all guns,

562
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 1: no food.

563
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 2: It's such a good line where she goes, I'm going

564
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 2: to bed, and Dina goes, that is not why you're going, Like,

565
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:30,840
Speaker 2: we know where you're fucking going.

566
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 1: So she then immediately shows her value to this mission

567
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 1: by saying, here's the route we're gonna take up through

568
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:46,280
Speaker 1: the northwest this trail. Here here is our list of

569
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 1: provisions that we're gonna need, including food for the horse, ammo,

570
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: et cetera. You gotta put on some hiking boots. You

571
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:59,440
Speaker 1: can't be wearing fucking Chuck Taylor's on a cross country revenge, surely,

572
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 1: so to see how wurs Rainias box Let. We're going

573
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:04,960
Speaker 1: to be getting cold and we're going to take I

574
00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 1: know a guy who's going to provision us, and we're

575
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 1: gonna take Shimmer. We meet at this gate at three am.

576
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 1: Seth is the one that meets them in the dark.

577
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: He makes Ellie trade rifles with him because his rifle

578
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: is better, and he turns out he's the guy that's

579
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 1: supplying her. Now. I want to talk about this because

580
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 1: I think it's interesting ASSISI is an addition, it's interesting

581
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: to me to see people say, oh, they're making Seth

582
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 1: a good guy. They're not making him a good guy.

583
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 1: And I think this has been a you know, there

584
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 1: was a piece in Polygon about why not.

585
00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 2: A great job? In that piece, go read that piece

586
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 2: because it's a really interesting take. Why is homophobia the

587
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,480
Speaker 2: only prejudice that still kind of exists?

588
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,200
Speaker 1: I would just say this, we don't know that that's

589
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:49,640
Speaker 1: the case, and I would assume that it's surely not

590
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 1: the case. And about good guy or redeeming Seth, I

591
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: don't believe that they're redeeming Seth at all, although I

592
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 1: do feel that his apology was somewhatson here we can

593
00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 1: disagree about that. I think Jackson is a realist, socialist city.

594
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:14,040
Speaker 1: What I mean by that is, I'm past the point

595
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 1: of my life where I feel like, you know, what

596
00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:16,959
Speaker 1: we should do is get rid of all the racists

597
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:19,760
Speaker 1: and all the homophobes and exile them to racist HOMOPHOBI

598
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: isolin and I don't think we're ever getting rid of them,

599
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:26,960
Speaker 1: But I do think what I do think is doable

600
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:32,800
Speaker 1: is to forcefully, from the top, from leadership, repress their

601
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 1: ideology and make it clear this is not cool. You

602
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 1: don't do this. I don't care what you think in

603
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: your head, but as soon as it comes out, then

604
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: it's our business. You stop this and make it clear

605
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:45,960
Speaker 1: to everybody this is over the line. That's how you

606
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 1: live together, not by getting rid of everybody who doesn't

607
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: agree with you, even though I agree like I would

608
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 1: love to do that hypothetically, but like hypothetically I would

609
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:01,719
Speaker 1: love to be like all you know, like get them

610
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,600
Speaker 1: all out. But then where is the line like and

611
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: how you know you you get into the do we

612
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 1: need this person? Do they have a skill whatever?

613
00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 2: Liket like in a way, it's like police because you don't.

614
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 3: Right to me.

615
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 1: To me, the way that you build a more a

616
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: real like equal, egalitarian society is you you repress those ideologies.

617
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,320
Speaker 1: Every time it pops up, you smack it down, as

618
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:31,720
Speaker 1: Maria does, make him fucking apologize, make it clear to

619
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:35,040
Speaker 1: him we're not standing for this now. I'm sure that

620
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 1: while that was a kind of slap on the wrist,

621
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:41,480
Speaker 1: although like a council member comes and talks to Seth,

622
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 1: and I think it's notable that Seth is not on

623
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 1: the council and I don't think wouldever be able to

624
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 1: make his way to the council in that group, right. So,

625
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 1: to me, it's not that they're redeeming Seth or quote

626
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 1: making him a good guy. It's that they're showing a

627
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 1: way to live with chi racism, homophobia, different kinds of

628
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 1: biases that are a part of life. How you cope

629
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 1: with that is you make it clear that it's unacceptable

630
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:12,320
Speaker 1: at every time. It pops up because it will. It

631
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:14,799
Speaker 1: simply will pop up, and you smack it down every

632
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: time it comes up. And so I appreciated this take

633
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: on it. I didn't think like Set's a good guy

634
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 1: now and Ellie and Seth they're gonna go walking hand

635
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 1: in hand like through the streets of Jackson and everybody

636
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:28,560
Speaker 1: likes Seth now, or that they accept what he said

637
00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 1: and think it's cool. I think they made it very

638
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 1: clear to him that they think it's uncool what he did,

639
00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:35,359
Speaker 1: and maybe if he keeps doing it, they would exile him.

640
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,040
Speaker 1: But I think that this is I thought that this

641
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 1: was like a realistic way of looking at it. And

642
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 1: I would also say, vis a vis like other biases,

643
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:45,919
Speaker 1: we've only seen Jackson, well.

644
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:46,880
Speaker 3: I was gonna say this is.

645
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 2: I will say this is actually also, I think, ironically

646
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 2: a good argument for why we haven't seen it, but

647
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 2: also a good argument for why some people found the

648
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:58,480
Speaker 2: set thing maybe like stoehorned in or quick or like

649
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:02,200
Speaker 2: too easily resolved. There's only seven episodes in the show. Yeah,

650
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 2: that's right, So it's so I think the shortness of

651
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 2: the show and the lack of maybe being able to

652
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:12,360
Speaker 2: build on some of those things that we are talking

653
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:16,120
Speaker 2: about on both sides has made it like this and

654
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:20,399
Speaker 2: in a kind of discourse, inspiring conversation. I agree, but yeah,

655
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:22,680
Speaker 2: I'm I'm interested to see. I don't I don't love

656
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 2: like Ellie shaking his hand. I'm like, give Dina the

657
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:28,520
Speaker 2: handshake first of all, because like she sorted this out,

658
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:30,880
Speaker 2: my guy. But it's it's it's fine. You know what.

659
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 2: Sometimes TV is on the nose, is a little bit

660
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,399
Speaker 2: on the nose. But we also need Ellie to get

661
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 2: those guns because another change here that we know people

662
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: have been talking about is Tommy not Tommy not being

663
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 2: the one who goes to Seattle on this kind of

664
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 2: tear and they have to go after him to get

665
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:47,600
Speaker 2: him back. So we have to find a way for

666
00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 2: that to happen. That's a pivotal moment this episode. How

667
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:51,279
Speaker 2: do you feel about the.

668
00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,439
Speaker 1: Tommy change, the Tommy thing. I don't care. It makes

669
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:57,719
Speaker 1: complete sense that his character in this show would not

670
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,160
Speaker 1: go he's on the council. It would make it I'm

671
00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: the worst guy, it would make him a worse person

672
00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:03,000
Speaker 1: to me.

673
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 2: Tommy's whole journey in this show is like how he

674
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:10,360
Speaker 2: has grown past the patterns that had sustained him and

675
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:13,640
Speaker 2: jol for so long, and how he is spent time

676
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 2: essentially building this town, building this community so that people

677
00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 2: can be safe, almost as a way of making up

678
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,279
Speaker 2: for the things that they did, you know, early on

679
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:28,640
Speaker 2: after Sarah's death. And I think that I love this

680
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,400
Speaker 2: version of Tommy, and I don't think this version of

681
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 2: Tommy as we know him would leave Maria, or leave

682
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 2: his child, or leave his town. Where we really see

683
00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:39,719
Speaker 2: in this episode he is that leader that they need,

684
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:43,319
Speaker 2: even in a way maybe taking over from Maria, who

685
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 2: in season one definitely felt more like she was in

686
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 2: that role. Now Tommy is much more of this kind

687
00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:52,279
Speaker 2: of paternal father figure, fixing things, making sure people stay

688
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 2: in line. He uses that darkness that is inside him

689
00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 2: and Joel, but here he is channeling it into something

690
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 2: where he can keep you safe. And I think if

691
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 2: he had just run off, it would have been shocking

692
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:06,400
Speaker 2: and it would have been heartbreaking, but I don't know

693
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,680
Speaker 2: that it would have been true to the character as

694
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:11,759
Speaker 2: he is in this show. So I'm fine with this

695
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:14,360
Speaker 2: because Ellie definitely would go after I feel this.

696
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:16,680
Speaker 1: I feel the same way. Listen, He's on the council,

697
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:19,399
Speaker 1: he's going a wife and kids. I think I think

698
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: it would be a I think it would hurt the

699
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:27,080
Speaker 1: town in a way if as part of the council

700
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 1: that had voted we're not sending anybody. He then broke

701
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:33,719
Speaker 1: that social contract and went that.

702
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 3: Could take the whole town down.

703
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 2: Let's be real, because then you say, well, what's the point.

704
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: And abandon his wife and kids. I just I think

705
00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 1: one I think he will follow him there. I think

706
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:46,680
Speaker 1: that that is a change.

707
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:48,520
Speaker 2: I don't think that we're going to end up in

708
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 2: a situation where Tommy doesn't end up in Seattle. That's

709
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:54,840
Speaker 2: also I think this is more believable. Now the child,

710
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 2: the subrogate child that your brother raised after you tube

711
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,839
Speaker 2: couldn't save his daughter, your niece, Now she has gone

712
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:04,480
Speaker 2: and you don't want her, as established through the conversation

713
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 2: with Gail, to follow him on that path.

714
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 3: So now they've gone, you can.

715
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 2: Be part of a conversation with the town where you

716
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 2: don't have to give up sixteen people, but maybe just

717
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:17,000
Speaker 2: a group of three or four can go with Tommy.

718
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 2: There is a way that makes it make sense. And

719
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:22,880
Speaker 2: I do think let's talk a little bit about adaptation, Jason,

720
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:25,359
Speaker 2: because I loved the point you made about how rare

721
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 2: a great video game adaptation is, and I think that

722
00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,040
Speaker 2: is a big point here. There is a lot of

723
00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 2: conversation this season, I feel, more so, maybe even than

724
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 2: the first season, about adaptation and changing from the game

725
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:38,279
Speaker 2: and the beats people really loved in the game not

726
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 2: necessarily playing out the same way. And you just made

727
00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:43,560
Speaker 2: a really great point before we got a mic about

728
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 2: why you think that might be happening.

729
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I find it. I find the conversation interesting,

730
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:52,360
Speaker 1: but also when it turns really negative, I find it

731
00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:56,720
Speaker 1: really wearying. And I think it's I think it's because

732
00:38:57,400 --> 00:39:03,799
Speaker 1: all other types of media, magazines, newspapers, whatever, have comics right,

733
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 1: have been adapted for movies and television for decades and

734
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:11,800
Speaker 1: decades and decades, and we're used to the language of that,

735
00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:14,680
Speaker 1: the shape that takes, the kind of trade offs that

736
00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:18,839
Speaker 1: happen when a comic, book or whatever goes from its

737
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: original form to a television or movie. And I think

738
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:28,320
Speaker 1: this being really a pioneering video game adaptation in so

739
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:34,400
Speaker 1: many ways, like the first prestige video game adaptation, you know,

740
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:34,960
Speaker 1: like of this.

741
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 2: Gly acclaimed video game adaptation on TV. I mean, look,

742
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,319
Speaker 2: at what we have in the past and needs. Look,

743
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 2: you all know I love many of these movies. N

744
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:48,879
Speaker 2: you know, Nineties Street Fire, you know, the Doom video game,

745
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:50,640
Speaker 2: the Doom video game adaptation, Oh.

746
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 3: My god, I yeah, I like the Rocks like a little.

747
00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:54,480
Speaker 2: Bit Doom too.

748
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:57,280
Speaker 3: But I love the original nineties More or Combat.

749
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,840
Speaker 2: But none of those movies were out here making huge

750
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 2: swings and critically acclaimed, award winning performances that was not

751
00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:08,360
Speaker 2: the conversation that was being had around.

752
00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:12,320
Speaker 1: There, or or were coming from an original source material

753
00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 1: game that had as strong a story as the last

754
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 1: of them.

755
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 2: It was also so cinematically yes inspired, which I think

756
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:21,759
Speaker 2: changes it.

757
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:25,960
Speaker 1: I think that the video game audience is just not

758
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 1: used to something coming from their world and being adapted

759
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 1: to the screen. I think it's this is a very new.

760
00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 2: I think you're right. And also I think like for

761
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:41,560
Speaker 2: people like who love comic books and this maybe UH

762
00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 2: is speaking to you guys who listen to podcasts, because

763
00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 2: I know we have so many die out comic book heads.

764
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 2: But maybe you don't realize this because you're not. But

765
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:53,320
Speaker 2: like for example, Avengers Infinity War or whatever, it's nothing

766
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:55,600
Speaker 2: like the comics like you, I can't even tell you

767
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:58,800
Speaker 2: how different it is, like the different characters, the different

768
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:00,880
Speaker 2: you know, we were talking our favorite comics.

769
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:02,320
Speaker 3: You'll know, know Adam Warlock.

770
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:05,040
Speaker 2: Like, there's so many changes that we are used to

771
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:09,560
Speaker 2: adaptations that are more about adapting vibes or moments or beats.

772
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,000
Speaker 3: This is a pretty direct adaptation.

773
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:15,960
Speaker 2: But to make it entertaining for TV viewers who have

774
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:18,440
Speaker 2: not who have not played the game or watched the

775
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:22,399
Speaker 2: playthrough of the game, who have not necessarily have any

776
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,400
Speaker 2: experience of these characters outside of what we see here,

777
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 2: it still needs to be true to them. And I

778
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:31,200
Speaker 2: think that this choice, specifically with Tommy is very true

779
00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:33,879
Speaker 2: to who he is and makes a lot of sense.

780
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 2: So I'm interested to see where they go next with it.

781
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:37,560
Speaker 2: But I think you're right, there's no way he doesn't

782
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 2: end up in Seattle at some point.

783
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 1: So they head off. And by the way, with regards

784
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:47,279
Speaker 1: to handshakes, here's my issue. No handshake for Dina. No,

785
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:52,040
Speaker 1: have you ever shaken someone's hand that's going on a

786
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:54,640
Speaker 1: journey and there's a person who's going on the journey

787
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:56,960
Speaker 1: with them, who's standing right next to them, and you

788
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 1: don't shake them too.

789
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 2: She was also called the slow Yeah, he also suck. Also,

790
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 2: she's the one who's organized this set, so I'm like,

791
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 2: what's going on that? But you know, I mean they

792
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:12,480
Speaker 2: want to Yeah, I appreciate it anyway, Yeah, they and

793
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:14,480
Speaker 2: then they stop at the graveyard, which I just I

794
00:42:14,600 --> 00:42:15,839
Speaker 2: love this moment so much.

795
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:19,919
Speaker 1: I guess the crime and Ellie, oh my god, beautifulish.

796
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:24,880
Speaker 1: The shooting was so beautiful. The cinematography here Ellie drops

797
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:28,640
Speaker 1: some coffee beans from that uh you know, call back

798
00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:32,600
Speaker 1: to the season one exchange when Joel Ellie sip some

799
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:33,400
Speaker 1: coffee and she's.

800
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,440
Speaker 2: Like taste like, you know, a bunch shit or whatever

801
00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 2: she says, and he just drinks more of an episode four.

802
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 2: I thought that was so cute.

803
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 1: That was so beautiful, and you know, I wanted to say,

804
00:42:43,080 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 1: like the the cinematography here was so good. There's so Yeah,

805
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:51,600
Speaker 1: there's a lot of shows that I'm watching or have

806
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:57,440
Speaker 1: watched recently that I'm sure Joel will resonate with this

807
00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:01,279
Speaker 1: are so fucking dark, I mean visual dark that even

808
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 1: when the scenes are taking place outside what was the

809
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:09,239
Speaker 1: Jake Jillen hall uh Presumed Innocent presumed it. The adaptation

810
00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 1: of Presumed Innocent looked like it was shot at night.

811
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:18,160
Speaker 1: The highlights are so taken down, and so what I

812
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:21,120
Speaker 1: loved about this, this scene from the Last of Us

813
00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:23,880
Speaker 1: is that they did do that. They squashed the highlights,

814
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:26,360
Speaker 1: but they did it because the sun was in the background.

815
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:32,919
Speaker 1: It's like silhouetting the characters, and it worked. I hate

816
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,759
Speaker 1: the way that looks when the sun is not in

817
00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 1: the frame. This it's just like, you know, bright's full

818
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 1: noon sunlight like coming down very evenly, and then you

819
00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: squash all the highlights. So I'm like, is it night?

820
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,360
Speaker 2: Is it day? You got to be like a Jordan

821
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:48,920
Speaker 2: Peele levelen note to be able to get away.

822
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: And so I just just like really appreciate how beautiful

823
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:51,880
Speaker 1: this looks.

824
00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:55,440
Speaker 2: Anyway, especially because I have to anytime I watch something

825
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 2: with Dolby Vision, I won't name streamers. I literally have

826
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 2: a hat I have to do through my Roku to

827
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:04,480
Speaker 2: ton the Dolby vision off because it looks so dark

828
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:06,919
Speaker 2: on my TV. So yes, I appreciate the beautiful lighting

829
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 2: and incredible cinematic vision that the cinematographer and lighting crew

830
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:13,879
Speaker 2: and gaffer and everyone else get on the chow.

831
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:17,720
Speaker 1: They passed the time just naming musicians according to letters

832
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:20,759
Speaker 1: the kind of old game that m h. Ellie had

833
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:25,320
Speaker 1: been playing for many years. Dina keeps wanting, wanting to

834
00:44:26,280 --> 00:44:29,080
Speaker 1: She's basically using this as a way to like pump

835
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:31,080
Speaker 1: Ellie for more and more and get to know her,

836
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:35,120
Speaker 1: get to know her right, which Ellie is for as

837
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:37,000
Speaker 1: fond as she is of Dina is not used to

838
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:41,359
Speaker 1: letting people in. So Dina asks about the first person

839
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:43,880
Speaker 1: Ellie killed, which Ellie is like, that's really fucked up,

840
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:44,840
Speaker 1: and I don't want to talk about that.

841
00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:48,400
Speaker 2: We know about my first lesbian lover who I had

842
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:49,400
Speaker 2: to kill, but.

843
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 1: I'll tell you about the second one, which was the

844
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:59,439
Speaker 1: the young man in Oklahoma City when Joel and Ellie

845
00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:02,440
Speaker 1: were on the the kid got a hold of Jewel

846
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:08,279
Speaker 1: and Ellie killed him. They then go into the camp

847
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:11,720
Speaker 1: out under an outcrop because Dina must have a broken

848
00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:15,440
Speaker 1: leg or something that she could she can feel the

849
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:19,360
Speaker 1: rain coming, and you know, Ellie's like, how did you

850
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 1: do that? She's like, I'm a witch. And it's clear

851
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:25,880
Speaker 1: that probably both of them want to keep talking, but

852
00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:29,919
Speaker 1: they're just gonna It's very real. It's very real.

853
00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:32,520
Speaker 2: It's like there's always the jokes about like queer women

854
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:35,320
Speaker 2: and lesbians and stuff about how they like. They'll be like,

855
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:37,239
Speaker 2: does this person have a crush from me? All they

856
00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 2: flying and at the same time the other person is

857
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,839
Speaker 2: thinking the same thing. This is very real to that experience.

858
00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:45,040
Speaker 1: So they turn off the lights. But then Dina's like, actually,

859
00:45:45,080 --> 00:45:46,439
Speaker 1: I want to keep talking. I want to talk about

860
00:45:46,440 --> 00:45:48,960
Speaker 1: the kiss and when do you rate it? And so

861
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: this was Dina's first sapphic experience, and Ellie is more experienced,

862
00:45:56,719 --> 00:46:00,200
Speaker 1: somewhat more experienced, So what's the rating? Ellie gives a

863
00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:04,600
Speaker 1: six solid definitely lying, definitely lying, but like a tough number.

864
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 2: I know, she's such a bit sometimes, man, I love her.

865
00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 1: And Dina says that, in fact, did go back to Jesse,

866
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:19,000
Speaker 1: so we are in a situationship or whatever again the case.

867
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,759
Speaker 1: Maybe Ellie seems sad about that, And then Dina's like,

868
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:26,800
Speaker 1: does just Jesse ever strike he was sad? And She's like,

869
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:28,839
Speaker 1: I think he just might be a sad person, which

870
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: I'm like, Dina, Babe, look around.

871
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 3: Everyone's sad, babe. Everyone you're you're living in a bad time.

872
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,640
Speaker 1: At age nineteen or fifteen or whatever, it is absolutely

873
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:41,359
Speaker 1: normal to ask somebody like so, who was the first

874
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:42,240
Speaker 1: person you get.

875
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:45,400
Speaker 2: Killed exactly, this is what this is the life we live, right.

876
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 2: I thought it was really interesting because she said, she said,

877
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:51,719
Speaker 2: you know, do you ever think he's sad? And then

878
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:53,600
Speaker 2: she goes, I think he just might be a sad person,

879
00:46:53,680 --> 00:46:55,440
Speaker 2: and Ellie said, well, why do you think that? And

880
00:46:55,560 --> 00:46:59,000
Speaker 2: I thought Dina was gonna say because otherwise, like he

881
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 2: must have gone through something like we've been through like these,

882
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:04,800
Speaker 2: but she says otherwise it must just be me. And

883
00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:07,239
Speaker 2: I thought that was a very interesting telling kind of

884
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 2: feeling about how Dina sees herself and again maybe how

885
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:15,040
Speaker 2: sheltered she's been in Jackson, because I'm guessing the reason

886
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:17,479
Speaker 2: he's sad is because he's probably like killed fifty people

887
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:18,640
Speaker 2: and lived in this way.

888
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 1: I snus pressed, I mean it should be Dina. Dina's

889
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:24,040
Speaker 1: pretty rad, you know, like yeah.

890
00:47:24,520 --> 00:47:25,560
Speaker 2: That also as well. Guess what.

891
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:27,839
Speaker 3: My funniest thought wasn't even about the zombie pop.

892
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:30,840
Speaker 2: I was like, maybe it's just depressed, Like I'm depressed,

893
00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:33,400
Speaker 2: not living in a zombie apocalypse, so like maybe he

894
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,400
Speaker 2: just has depression. But yeah, great combo. I felt like

895
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:38,759
Speaker 2: it told a lot. There was so much tension there.

896
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:42,000
Speaker 2: I definitely expected it to go in a different way.

897
00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:43,800
Speaker 2: But I love how they're kind of holding off on

898
00:47:44,160 --> 00:47:46,160
Speaker 2: whatever's to come with these two. I thought it was

899
00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:46,920
Speaker 2: really effective.

900
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:49,400
Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break over.

901
00:48:04,120 --> 00:48:04,879
Speaker 2: It's the next day.

902
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:09,480
Speaker 1: They are on the trail. They're just outside of Seattle.

903
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:13,080
Speaker 1: They come across the bodies of the Seraphytes on that

904
00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:16,239
Speaker 1: trail from the earlier scene, and it's horrible. There's been

905
00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:22,799
Speaker 1: a gunfight, lots of different caliber of bullets around. From

906
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:27,680
Speaker 1: what the Seraphytes said, it was probably the wolves that

907
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:29,839
Speaker 1: did this. Yeah, and by Abby's group.

908
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:33,480
Speaker 2: I like that Ellie works out. She's like, they're different calibers,

909
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,759
Speaker 2: so this probably isn't Fedra because they're basically usually using

910
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:40,800
Speaker 2: the same weapons. I also thought this was really again

911
00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:46,080
Speaker 2: a great hint at how prepared Dina is for this mission,

912
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 2: because she finds the dead body of the good Little

913
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 2: Girl and she pukes.

914
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,799
Speaker 3: Now, obviously that is horrific, terrible thing to see. Even

915
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:55,960
Speaker 3: Ellie is shaken by it.

916
00:48:56,440 --> 00:48:58,840
Speaker 2: But again, I think we start to see Dina realizing

917
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:02,359
Speaker 2: that the outside is where more scary and violent than

918
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 2: you could imagine.

919
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 1: So they follow the highway and they get within sight

920
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:09,840
Speaker 1: of the city Seattle, there and that.

921
00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:12,960
Speaker 2: Like looks really quiet, probably not a problem. They're like,

922
00:49:13,080 --> 00:49:15,799
Speaker 2: think that might maybe they're smaller than we thought, which I.

923
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:21,000
Speaker 1: Low Manny in a lookout post, kind of not doing

924
00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:23,120
Speaker 1: his job. He gets a call on the radio saying, hey,

925
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 1: are we clear to move the patrol up to the

926
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:29,439
Speaker 1: next checkpoint. He looks through his binoculars and he says, yes,

927
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 1: clear to move up. And then we see that patrol,

928
00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:36,040
Speaker 1: and the patrol is like three armored vehicles with fifty

929
00:49:36,120 --> 00:49:39,400
Speaker 1: caliber machine guns mounted on top, followed by like, I

930
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:45,000
Speaker 1: don't know, fifty sixty eighty dismounted heavily armed infantry.

931
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:48,880
Speaker 2: Like like at least I was like, maybe it's one hundred.

932
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:50,239
Speaker 1: And it's a lot.

933
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:54,359
Speaker 2: It's a lot, And this is very interesting. I think

934
00:49:54,440 --> 00:49:57,600
Speaker 2: that the posing of how we're meeting the WLF compared

935
00:49:57,600 --> 00:50:00,279
Speaker 2: to how I'm meeting the Seraphytes is very interesting. I

936
00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:03,200
Speaker 2: also loved like that they kept the Seraphyites looking like

937
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:05,600
Speaker 2: Robin Hood and his merry men, which I always thought

938
00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:09,200
Speaker 2: was like really interesting kind of traditionists, like they kind

939
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:11,640
Speaker 2: of don't want to go back to the future, compared

940
00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:16,919
Speaker 2: to this very heavy armor, armored and militarized WLF. Yes,

941
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:19,839
Speaker 2: I would also say if you watched If you haven't

942
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 2: watched this episode, but you love to listen to our recaps,

943
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 2: this is definitely a less scary episode of the Last

944
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:29,120
Speaker 2: of Us, you could try it out. But I will

945
00:50:29,160 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 2: also say do if you have watched it, yeah, are

946
00:50:32,080 --> 00:50:35,480
Speaker 2: you're gonna watch? Don't watch the coming next because I

947
00:50:35,560 --> 00:50:37,960
Speaker 2: found that there's like a ten minute coming next and

948
00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:41,080
Speaker 2: I found it to be extreme. And I understand maybe

949
00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:44,439
Speaker 2: they're worried about people not keeping up with the show.

950
00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:47,799
Speaker 2: Now we've lost our darling, you know, Pedro Pascal, who

951
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:52,200
Speaker 2: we all love so much. But I accidentally kind of

952
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:54,360
Speaker 2: started playing when I was doing my rewatch and I

953
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 2: was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I was like,

954
00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:58,400
Speaker 2: this is crazy, So keep an eye out for that.

955
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:00,000
Speaker 2: But yeah, Jason, what do you think of this episod?

956
00:51:00,360 --> 00:51:01,239
Speaker 2: How are you feeling about it.

957
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:06,040
Speaker 1: That I think that this is I think this show

958
00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 1: is really good, continues to be really good. I think

959
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:11,920
Speaker 1: that there's so much to think about and talk about,

960
00:51:12,080 --> 00:51:14,320
Speaker 1: Like with this, I think that they've done a great

961
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:20,120
Speaker 1: job of to be frank like, I found it wearying

962
00:51:20,320 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 1: to I found the last of us to the game.

963
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:28,560
Speaker 1: The incessant violence, I find I found it like numbing.

964
00:51:29,120 --> 00:51:33,760
Speaker 1: And I think that the characterizations, you know, the writing,

965
00:51:33,840 --> 00:51:38,200
Speaker 1: the wonderful performances here have breathed flesh and blood and

966
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:43,919
Speaker 1: emotion into these characters that is beyond just bloodlust and revenge. Yeah,

967
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,360
Speaker 1: and I know that that stuff is there, you know,

968
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:50,600
Speaker 1: particularly in the DLC, in the but I agree with

969
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 1: whatever I think that. I think that there's different aspects

970
00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:56,440
Speaker 1: of these characters that have come to the surface, and

971
00:51:56,520 --> 00:51:58,960
Speaker 1: in particular in this episode, there's so much to think about,

972
00:51:59,040 --> 00:52:00,719
Speaker 1: and I'm just really for.

973
00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:03,640
Speaker 2: Me, it definitely wasn't like I was not exaggerating when

974
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:07,239
Speaker 2: I said like it was. I was dreading watching this

975
00:52:07,400 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 2: after the last episode. I was like, I don't want

976
00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 2: to feel that relentless sadness and horror and just depression.

977
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:16,520
Speaker 2: But I felt like the change of scenery, the cinematography,

978
00:52:16,719 --> 00:52:20,120
Speaker 2: the mix of the kind of nature with as a

979
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:24,920
Speaker 2: contrast to Jackson, and the interactions between Dina and Ellie

980
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:28,760
Speaker 2: and kind of the addition of this Tommy and Gaye conversation,

981
00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:30,759
Speaker 2: I felt like they were, Yeah, they were doing a

982
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:34,319
Speaker 2: lot more emotionally to kind of keep you connected, rather

983
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 2: than this kind of blood lust that the original game

984
00:52:38,239 --> 00:52:39,440
Speaker 2: definitely leaned into.

985
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:42,840
Speaker 1: In the next few episodes of X ray Vision, we

986
00:52:42,960 --> 00:52:45,719
Speaker 1: are recapping episodes four, five, and six of and Or

987
00:52:45,719 --> 00:52:49,000
Speaker 1: on Tuesday. We're prepping for Thunderbolts with the MCU in

988
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:51,799
Speaker 1: comics history of the main characters on Thursday, and then

989
00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:55,960
Speaker 1: back to and Or with our roundtable with our super

990
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:58,520
Speaker 1: producers on Friday. And then Monday, we're reacting to the

991
00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:02,320
Speaker 1: Thunderbolts movie. Yeah it's here, folks. That's it for this episode.

992
00:53:02,360 --> 00:53:07,440
Speaker 1: Next were listening bye. X ray Vision is hosted by

993
00:53:07,520 --> 00:53:08,920
Speaker 1: Jason Sepsion.

994
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:11,120
Speaker 2: And Rosie Knight and is a production of iHeart Podcasts.

995
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:15,000
Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kaufman.

996
00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:17,280
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.

997
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:21,640
Speaker 2: Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan and Bay wag.

998
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:24,480
Speaker 1: Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme

999
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:25,840
Speaker 1: songs by Aaron Kaufman.

1000
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:29,320
Speaker 2: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and

1001
00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:31,239
Speaker 2: Heidi our discord moderator