WEBVTT - How Bill Gates and Steve Jobs Work, Part 1 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:02.960 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. 0:00:03.240 --> 0:00:08.959 It's ready. Are you get in touch with technology? With 0:00:09.080 --> 0:00:18.040 tech stuff from how stuff works dot com. Hey kids, 0:00:18.079 --> 0:00:20.919 welcome to the podcast. My name is Chris polettom an 0:00:21.000 --> 0:00:22.880 editor here and How Stuff Works, and sitting next to 0:00:22.880 --> 0:00:26.960 me as always is senior writer Jonathan Strickland. Hey there everyone, 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:30.840 We were gonna, i don't know, take it down a notch, 0:00:31.400 --> 0:00:33.280 you do, mill out with a couple of guys from 0:00:33.320 --> 0:00:36.000 born in Yeah, a couple of guys who you know, 0:00:36.159 --> 0:00:39.480 they sort of had that typical experience of the growing 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:42.840 up during the whole counterculture movement, tried college for a while, 0:00:42.920 --> 0:00:45.400 decided it wasn't for them. They both are college dropouts, 0:00:45.440 --> 0:00:48.199 and yet they both managed to have a you know, 0:00:49.080 --> 0:00:53.000 somewhat significant impact on the tech world. Well, you know, 0:00:53.520 --> 0:00:58.120 if you use a Microsoft product or an Apple product. Yeah, yeah, 0:00:58.280 --> 0:01:02.200 that's a pretty minor impact. Where talking here about William 0:01:02.240 --> 0:01:08.520 Billy Gates and uh Stephen Paul Jobs PAULA Yeah that's 0:01:08.520 --> 0:01:12.800 his name. Yeah, Okay, okay, um, Yeah, both of these guys, uh, 0:01:12.920 --> 0:01:15.559 you know, they've been uh they've been sort of grouped 0:01:15.600 --> 0:01:17.720 together for a very long time. In fact, there was 0:01:17.760 --> 0:01:21.399 even a movie starting Noah Wiley and Anthony Michael Hall 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:25.520 called Pirates and Silicon Valley made about these two. And 0:01:25.800 --> 0:01:28.120 you know, really when you look at them together, yes, 0:01:28.160 --> 0:01:29.920 they were. They were both born in the same year 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:33.200 they were they both dropped out of college, and they're 0:01:33.240 --> 0:01:36.520 both huge people in the tech industry. And they both 0:01:36.520 --> 0:01:39.920 founded their their own companies in nineteen Yeah, there you go. 0:01:40.040 --> 0:01:42.200 So both when they were twenty years old, they they 0:01:42.240 --> 0:01:46.040 founded a company. Dropped out of college to found a company. 0:01:46.040 --> 0:01:48.480 It's pretty crazy. Yeah, I've just lost them. I've never 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:52.760 found them. No, Yeah, I've been very fortunate in finding 0:01:52.800 --> 0:01:56.320 companies either. So anyway, so we were thinking about starting 0:01:56.360 --> 0:01:59.320 with Mr Jobs. I was, and, um, there are a 0:01:59.320 --> 0:02:02.240 lot of interesting parallels, but I think the more interesting 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:05.440 parts are sort of the places where jobs and gates 0:02:05.480 --> 0:02:08.600 are are are not alike. Yeah, but you know, I'll 0:02:08.600 --> 0:02:11.839 start with jobs. Okay, So came from born in California 0:02:11.960 --> 0:02:15.239 and went to school. You know, it didn't seem to 0:02:15.280 --> 0:02:21.480 be a huge enthusiastic student, I guess you could say, Um, 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:26.920 but he did go to some Hewitt Packard electronics lectures 0:02:26.960 --> 0:02:29.679 that that he really got interested in Um, that's where 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:34.079 he met a certain fellow by the name of Stephen Wozniak. 0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:38.320 The yeah, jobs actually worked at HP for a while. 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:41.600 I'm yeah, yeah he did, and they the two of 0:02:41.639 --> 0:02:46.600 those guys went to uh Atari. Right. Yeah. Between his 0:02:46.760 --> 0:02:50.040 HP experience and his Stari experience, he did attend one 0:02:50.160 --> 0:02:55.040 semester of college. Um. Yeah, he went to uh He 0:02:55.080 --> 0:02:58.320 went to Read College, Oregon, which is famous for its 0:02:58.320 --> 0:03:01.600 counterculture or semi famous for counterculture. Yes, and we have 0:03:01.680 --> 0:03:05.880 to mention something. We had a specific request for this podcast. Yes, 0:03:05.880 --> 0:03:09.280 our our colleague Josh Clark wanted us to point out 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:12.359 that one thing that sets jobs apart from Gates is 0:03:12.400 --> 0:03:16.920 that jobs apparently dropped acid. So this is according to 0:03:16.960 --> 0:03:23.600 our colleague Josh Clark. You can direct all iro at him. Um. Yeah, 0:03:24.040 --> 0:03:26.520 from what I understand, he even, um, after he dropped 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:28.400 out of college, went to India for a while to 0:03:28.560 --> 0:03:32.320 explore some spirituality and yes, and so he was really into, 0:03:32.680 --> 0:03:36.560 you know, learning more about the spiritual side of life. Sure, yeah, 0:03:36.640 --> 0:03:40.680 he's he's definitely, he's considers himself a Buddhist. He's, Um, yeah, 0:03:40.720 --> 0:03:43.080 he's very much in touch with that part of his life, 0:03:43.080 --> 0:03:45.400 which is kind of interesting if you learn a little 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:47.560 more about his personality, because it doesn't seem like the 0:03:47.600 --> 0:03:51.600 typical I don't know, Buddhist sort of approach to life. 0:03:52.200 --> 0:03:54.120 Say not, but we we're getting ahead of ourselves. We 0:03:54.120 --> 0:03:56.520 should we should go a little more slowly. I guess. Yeah, 0:03:56.560 --> 0:03:59.920 So so was and Uh and Jobs are over ATITORI 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:03.920 and they're designing video games. And after a while, Uh, 0:04:04.120 --> 0:04:06.840 Jobs gets this crazy idea. He thinks, hey, you know 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:11.040 what we should do is build a computer that could 0:04:11.080 --> 0:04:13.960 be used in the home. Because up to that point, 0:04:14.000 --> 0:04:18.600 computers were pretty much these enormous devices that really existed 0:04:18.640 --> 0:04:22.560 only in the realms of the government and large universities. Yeah, 0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:26.800 and the people who were interested in ideas like like 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:30.200 Jobs and wise were at this point where hobbyists we're 0:04:30.200 --> 0:04:34.680 talking radio shack boxes of switches and diodes and electronics 0:04:34.720 --> 0:04:37.760 that you wired together to make a very rudimentary machine. 0:04:37.880 --> 0:04:40.560 They like the al tear. Yes, so we'll come back 0:04:40.600 --> 0:04:46.440 to yes. So so Jobs ends up convincing Wozniac that hey, 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:48.760 this is a great idea. Let's actually try and do this. 0:04:49.160 --> 0:04:53.440 Because here's here's the other interesting thing about Jobs is that, um, 0:04:53.560 --> 0:04:56.960 he's a brilliant man. There's no denying the fact that 0:04:57.040 --> 0:04:59.840 Jobs is brilliant. I mean, you can't get around it. U. 0:05:00.279 --> 0:05:04.760 But he is not the engineer. When it comes down 0:05:04.800 --> 0:05:07.720 to the whole Apple story, that would that would pretty 0:05:07.800 --> 0:05:10.920 much fall on Wozniak's shoulders, at least in the early years. Yeah, 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:13.080 I mean the two of them were both interested in 0:05:13.400 --> 0:05:16.440 electronics and engineering, but was is really the I mean, 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:19.360 he was the phone freak. He was. He was definitely 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:22.159 into the technology and fiddling with electronics end of it. 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:25.360 Where I think for for Stephen Jobs, it was more 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:29.840 a means to an end. Yeah. Jobs. Jobs recognize the 0:05:29.839 --> 0:05:35.280 potential of creating a brand new product market uh, and 0:05:35.320 --> 0:05:37.839 he could saw that it could be very lucrative, and 0:05:38.000 --> 0:05:42.120 he knew that Wozniak had the ability to to bring 0:05:42.200 --> 0:05:46.760 this into life as it were, so together, the two 0:05:46.800 --> 0:05:50.720 of them worked on building some computers, and they got 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:54.320 a local UM computer store interested in their products, and 0:05:54.320 --> 0:05:58.560 the computer store actually ordered uh several It depends on 0:05:58.920 --> 0:06:01.320 the sources you read. I've read everything from twenty five 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:05.600 to fifty five machines UM. And with the money they 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:10.800 made from that, that's where they decided to create the company. Apple. Yeah, 0:06:10.839 --> 0:06:14.000 we're we're in the realm of the Apple One, which 0:06:14.080 --> 0:06:16.440 was very much the pictures I've seen of it are 0:06:16.920 --> 0:06:21.200 pretty rudimentary compared to what you would see on your desktop. Um, 0:06:21.240 --> 0:06:23.520 you know, wooden box and it's got you know, the 0:06:23.520 --> 0:06:25.440 electronics inside of it, and you'd hook it up to 0:06:25.440 --> 0:06:29.039 a TV. Um. And of course they chose, being being 0:06:29.200 --> 0:06:32.679 jobs and wise, they chose a very interesting price point. Yes, 0:06:33.440 --> 0:06:39.560 six and sixty six dollars. It was the computer of 0:06:39.600 --> 0:06:43.960 the Beast. Yes, yes, and they actually sold they sold 0:06:44.040 --> 0:06:45.880 quite a few of these machines. Yeah, this was in 0:06:47.240 --> 0:06:50.039 so that's a pretty good chunk of change. You know, 0:06:50.120 --> 0:06:53.400 you think today like a six computer isn't that expensive, 0:06:53.440 --> 0:06:56.040 but in seventy six dollars it's snows. Yeah, it was 0:06:56.080 --> 0:07:00.560 a healthy purchase. Yeah yeah. And so um, a year 0:07:00.600 --> 0:07:03.040 after they introduced the Apple One, they go back, they 0:07:03.080 --> 0:07:06.880 retool it. They and they introduced the Apple Too, which 0:07:06.920 --> 0:07:09.480 was a little bit more advanced as you would expect, 0:07:10.000 --> 0:07:14.920 and uh incorporated some other technologies, including a monitor. And um, 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:17.920 this is where my story about computers kind of comes 0:07:17.920 --> 0:07:22.160 into play, because my first real experience with computers was 0:07:22.200 --> 0:07:24.800 with an Apple to eat. I see ye see, well 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:27.240 lots of uh, I'm willing to bet to lots of 0:07:27.240 --> 0:07:29.960 the people listening to the podcast at this point had 0:07:30.000 --> 0:07:34.960 an apple too of some kind, any in our age range, Yeah, 0:07:36.760 --> 0:07:39.400 or at least they know what they are, and they're 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:42.280 probably seen one thinking about those giant five and a 0:07:42.360 --> 0:07:46.200 quarter inch floppy disk drives, right, Yeah, an Oregon trail 0:07:46.240 --> 0:07:52.400 and lemonade dand trail uh nostalgias so sweet. But this, 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:55.000 but the apple too is really where a lot of 0:07:55.000 --> 0:07:58.240 people first came in contact with computers, and it spurred 0:07:58.240 --> 0:08:01.840 a lot of people to start pro gramming, start fiddling 0:08:01.880 --> 0:08:06.000 around with the idea of having computers on desktops for 0:08:06.080 --> 0:08:08.480 work or you know, for their for their home, for 0:08:08.600 --> 0:08:11.560 educational purposes. And in fact, that's why we had one. 0:08:11.680 --> 0:08:15.200 My father is an author, so he purchased the computer 0:08:15.280 --> 0:08:17.640 as a way so that he could, you know, write 0:08:17.640 --> 0:08:20.120 books and he should store them on discs. And suddenly, 0:08:20.600 --> 0:08:22.200 you know, you don't have to worry about a paper 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:25.679 copy suddenly being ruined by your five year old sons 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:29.440 spilling coffee all over it. Although I should add that 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:34.600 his um son, being me, did once turn off his 0:08:34.679 --> 0:08:39.120 computer before he had saved his chapters and so I 0:08:39.160 --> 0:08:43.240 am personally responsible for deleting I think it's three chapters 0:08:43.280 --> 0:08:46.679 of my father's work. Yeah, it was good times so 0:08:46.800 --> 0:08:49.000 um but yeah, within three years of the Apple two 0:08:49.080 --> 0:08:51.960 coming out, and it earned almost a hundred forty million dollars. 0:08:52.320 --> 0:08:56.840 That's a lot of money. And uh, and so that's 0:08:56.920 --> 0:09:00.760 when Jobs and Woznia decided to to go public with 0:09:00.840 --> 0:09:06.600 the company, So Apples public and UH and the shares 0:09:06.600 --> 0:09:08.800 where I think at twenty two dollars a share when 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:11.000 it first went public and then shot up to twenty 0:09:11.080 --> 0:09:13.920 nine dollars by the end of the first day. So yeah, 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:16.160 it was a lot of people were really excited about 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:19.480 this company. And uh. It was right around this time 0:09:20.400 --> 0:09:25.880 that IBM started to try and make headway into the 0:09:25.880 --> 0:09:29.880 consumer market. Now IBM had been producing machines for years, 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:33.839 but yes, exactly, so these are these machines though were 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:37.760 mainly these large machines used in mainframe computers, not like 0:09:37.800 --> 0:09:40.719 personal computers. UM, but they decided to try and get 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:44.480 into the personal computer business. And they were taking a 0:09:44.559 --> 0:09:48.160 slightly different route than Apple and um using a completely 0:09:49.200 --> 0:09:54.080 incompatible operating system than Apples at uh. At certain points, 0:09:54.080 --> 0:09:57.280 so uh, there were a lot of strong decisions that 0:09:57.360 --> 0:09:59.240 need to be made. Jobs had to decide whether or 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:02.679 not to stay the course and continue doing what he 0:10:02.760 --> 0:10:04.440 was doing, or to try and find a way to 0:10:04.559 --> 0:10:09.280 merge Apple with IBM, like some sort of operating system 0:10:09.320 --> 0:10:11.839 that could work on both. And there were some serious 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:15.640 attempts at that for many years, it never happened, at 0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:19.280 least not on any large scale. Right. And and for 0:10:19.320 --> 0:10:21.960 those of you playing at home who weren't around during 0:10:22.000 --> 0:10:24.640 this time, we're talking a lot of this stuff is 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:29.000 you know, we didn't have mice really for the most 0:10:29.040 --> 0:10:31.400 part for a lot of these early years. We're talking 0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:35.880 keyboard commands and the disc operating system that the IBM 0:10:35.960 --> 0:10:40.200 PC ran on. UM. You know this, it's very clunky 0:10:40.840 --> 0:10:43.840 for those of you who weren't there to see it. UM. 0:10:44.000 --> 0:10:47.400 So some of the changes that came up UM were 0:10:47.800 --> 0:10:50.160 sort of the result of Apple successes because they got 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:53.560 so large that they started branching off into different products UM, 0:10:53.600 --> 0:10:59.079 including some that started using mice. UM. That's Lisa. Yeah, Well, 0:10:59.360 --> 0:11:03.679 the Apple Lisa, many of which are in landfills now, 0:11:04.520 --> 0:11:10.600 were extremely expensive machines. Yes, exactly, we're all in ones UM. 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:13.880 And they also had controlled they did have mice and uh, 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:16.679 there was another product that came out right about the 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:20.880 same time as the Lisa that Steve Jobs was working on. 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:24.520 The The CEO had put him on the project because 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:27.839 he had become one of the uh, one of the 0:11:27.880 --> 0:11:30.640 directors in the company, but he was no longer directly 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:33.400 in charge of Apple at that point. Are you are 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:37.120 you thinking of the Macintosh computer? That would be the 0:11:37.120 --> 0:11:39.640 one because we totally skipped over the Apple three. I'm sorry, 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:42.120 I forgot about the Apple Yeah, well most people did. Oh, 0:11:42.120 --> 0:11:44.320 that's right, because the Apple three ended up. Here's the 0:11:44.320 --> 0:11:46.920 thing about the Apple three. There was a problem early 0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:50.160 in the production and Apple had to recall around fourteen 0:11:50.200 --> 0:11:53.120 thousand units, and after that it just couldn't get a 0:11:53.160 --> 0:11:56.400 grip on the market because no one trusted it. I wonder, 0:11:56.559 --> 0:11:59.839 can you think of any current products that people have 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:04.200 of a growing mistrust about, even though it seems like 0:12:04.240 --> 0:12:07.839 all the problems have been fixed. Uh, yeah, I'm thinking 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:09.559 of I'm thinking of we can talk about that when 0:12:09.559 --> 0:12:11.520 we get the gates. I guess, because there's there's a 0:12:11.880 --> 0:12:14.800 it's interesting that right now there's a product that is 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:17.400 experiencing the same problem. Early on, it had problems, They 0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:19.520 fixed the problems, and yet no one wants to use it. 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:25.800 Um suppose it depends on your outlook or so. Back 0:12:25.840 --> 0:12:28.720 to the Macintosh you have now, the Macintosh was really 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:33.440 designed to compete directly with the PC. So now we've 0:12:33.440 --> 0:12:36.600 got we've got our our classic matchup here, the Mac 0:12:36.640 --> 0:12:39.840 and the PC UM. And the Mac had an advantage 0:12:39.840 --> 0:12:42.880 because it used a graphical user interface and yes, which 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:46.640 was very similar to one that Xerox created, wasn't not Yes, 0:12:46.800 --> 0:12:51.400 it was almost identical. But that's funny because future versions 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:56.679 of a program called Windows, people would accuse accuse Microsoft 0:12:56.760 --> 0:13:00.880 of creating Windows to essentially recreate the macin toosh experience, 0:13:01.480 --> 0:13:04.880 and the Macintosh experience was kind of recreating the Xerox experience. Well, 0:13:05.040 --> 0:13:07.960 you know that shrewd guy over at Microsoft I can't 0:13:07.960 --> 0:13:10.880 remember his name. Yeah, we'll get to him managed to 0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:15.560 convince Alpha to let them license the micro the Macintosh 0:13:15.640 --> 0:13:18.880 operating system so that they could build Windows. And and 0:13:19.160 --> 0:13:23.559 the Macintosh was, at the time of its arrival, a 0:13:23.640 --> 0:13:28.679 superior machine to the PC. It was it had a 0:13:28.720 --> 0:13:33.280 better memory, had a better processor, UM, but it was 0:13:33.320 --> 0:13:36.520 also more expensive, which you know what, Hey, some thing's 0:13:36.559 --> 0:13:40.400 never change. And um also around this time was the 0:13:40.440 --> 0:13:45.280 infamous Super Bowl add the nineteen four Super Bowl add. Now, 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:48.080 that was a Macintosh ad that was very Orwellian in nature. 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:52.520 It was this very dreary world where everyone was bald 0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:55.559 and which you know I identify with, and um sitting 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:57.600 at desks and stuff. And then you had the female 0:13:57.640 --> 0:14:01.440 athlete run in and her a hammer essentially through a 0:14:01.520 --> 0:14:04.400 giant screen and it was very dramatic. Well, that was 0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:09.839 the thing was that in three there weren't graphical user interfaces, 0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:13.360 at least not on everyone's desktop. So um, that was 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:16.120 the point of the ad was that wouldn't be like 0:14:17.440 --> 0:14:21.480 the book. Um So this was the big introduction for 0:14:21.520 --> 0:14:25.760 the McIntosh in general. Was the the famous ad, right 0:14:25.880 --> 0:14:29.560 and and surround this time also that um, Steve Jobs 0:14:29.560 --> 0:14:32.800 brings in a guy to help run the Apple Company 0:14:32.880 --> 0:14:35.800 to make it, you know, more successful against the PCs, 0:14:36.080 --> 0:14:40.560 a guy named John Scully who was from Pepsi. And 0:14:40.800 --> 0:14:44.120 this turned out to not be such a great decision. 0:14:44.440 --> 0:14:46.320 I mean, in the end, I guess it was, but 0:14:47.120 --> 0:14:49.960 not in the short term. Um So Jobs brings in Scully, 0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:55.480 and Scully by five thinks Jobs is more of a 0:14:55.640 --> 0:15:01.120 problem than an asset for Apple. Yeah, that that's true. Um, 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:04.200 you see jobs is Uh, he's got a bit of 0:15:04.240 --> 0:15:06.800 a strong personality. Yeah, that's a that's a light way 0:15:06.800 --> 0:15:11.440 of putting it. Yeah, very Yeah. He's known for um, 0:15:11.480 --> 0:15:15.600 throwing things and people around. No, he's he's known for 0:15:15.600 --> 0:15:18.960 throwing tantrums. He's known for he's known for throwing town 0:15:19.120 --> 0:15:21.280 or maybe that's probably the wrong term for it, but 0:15:21.320 --> 0:15:23.840 he is known for getting very very angry and making 0:15:23.880 --> 0:15:26.320 sure people knew about it. Well, it's no secret that 0:15:27.240 --> 0:15:30.120 in his days at Apple, when he takes someone off, 0:15:30.160 --> 0:15:34.400 and he has been known to fire people, uh, with 0:15:34.520 --> 0:15:37.880 a very hair trigger sort of spirit, it's called getting 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:41.560 steved um. And that's that's really no surprise. Here's the 0:15:41.560 --> 0:15:45.000 thing was that Steve got steved so in n he 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:47.760 gets steved well sort if he decided they basically it 0:15:47.840 --> 0:15:50.560 relegated him to second class or maybe even fifth class. 0:15:50.920 --> 0:15:52.840 They pretty much stripped him of all his power. They 0:15:52.880 --> 0:15:55.880 put him in a totally different building, which he dubbed Siberia, 0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:59.520 and they put him on meaningless projects and nothing of 0:15:59.600 --> 0:16:01.960 important has ever seemed to cross his desk. So eventually 0:16:01.960 --> 0:16:03.960 he said, you know what, I get the message loud 0:16:04.000 --> 0:16:07.000 and clear. I've done what I set out to do here, 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:09.800 and I'm not getting to do the things I want 0:16:09.840 --> 0:16:11.320 to do. And if I can't do them here, I'll 0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:13.680 do him somewhere else. So he took a little bit 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:17.560 of a break. He resigned from Apple, and then he 0:16:17.720 --> 0:16:22.600 founded the Next corporation. Yeah. Now, uh, Steve had been 0:16:22.600 --> 0:16:27.080 working on some different educational projects at Apple, and Next 0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:30.160 was designed, or at least conceived in in Steve Jobs 0:16:30.160 --> 0:16:34.480 had to be an educational computer system UM, and it 0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:37.720 was more advanced. It was supposed to run cross platform 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:41.200 on different processors UM, and they actually did. They produced 0:16:41.360 --> 0:16:46.520 hardware UM, an actual box plus an operating system. Right. 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:49.840 The problem though, was again the computer. The physical computers 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:52.840 were consider a lot of people consider him to be 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:56.360 too expensive, so they never really found a foothold UM 0:16:56.360 --> 0:16:58.160 in the market. I mean they sold some, but they 0:16:58.160 --> 0:17:00.480 didn't sell as many as they needed to and have. Ventually, 0:17:00.600 --> 0:17:04.280 Jobs made the decision to get away from hardware and 0:17:04.359 --> 0:17:08.000 concentrate mainly on software and operating systems. Although that machine 0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:12.960 was pretty sexy looking, it was kind of bored cubish. Yeah. Um. Meanwhile, 0:17:13.000 --> 0:17:16.520 at Apple things were going downhill and that's putting it 0:17:16.640 --> 0:17:18.639 very mildly. They had come out with a whole string 0:17:18.720 --> 0:17:23.360 of products that didn't make any sense. Um model numbers, 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:27.720 the quality that the box, the actual computers themselves, they 0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:31.840 were not always they didn't meet they didn't meet the 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:34.919 earlier standards than Jobs hadn't demanded back when he was 0:17:34.960 --> 0:17:39.080 in charge. And then so a decade goes by and uh, 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:44.840 and Apple is on the brink of bankruptcy. They the 0:17:44.920 --> 0:17:49.920 company purchases uh, the next corporation, which you know now 0:17:50.040 --> 0:17:52.399 Steve Jobs is now back under the umbrella of Apple, 0:17:52.560 --> 0:17:56.920 and in fact, Jobs makes a move and essentially rests 0:17:57.040 --> 0:18:01.520 control back so that he's charge of Apple again. And 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:04.760 I'm not so certain that that gil Amelia was very 0:18:04.800 --> 0:18:07.439 sad about that. He seemed to be, uh, sort of 0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:09.960 he seemed to be sort of happy with that, because 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:14.520 I think, um, you know, where Scully was not exactly 0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:18.240 thrilled with jobs outlook on the on the computer company. 0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:21.399 I think that uh, he had convinced Amelia that he 0:18:21.440 --> 0:18:23.760 could do the you know, and do the work necessary. 0:18:23.760 --> 0:18:25.840 And I think well a lot of people at the 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:29.560 time said that Apple didn't buy Next, they bought Steve 0:18:29.640 --> 0:18:34.760 Jobs back, So you know, it's not as surprising. It's 0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:38.280 not as surprising. Um, there was something else, another little 0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:41.119 project that Steve Jobs worked on in the in the 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:44.800 meantime to uh, he bought a little a part of 0:18:44.800 --> 0:18:50.280 the LucasArts Company, the Computer Animation Studio, for ten million dollars, 0:18:50.880 --> 0:18:54.240 which would never amounted anything well under its original name, 0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:58.320 but it changed his name to Pixar. Oh yeah, yeah, 0:18:58.359 --> 0:19:01.800 Pixar of course, being the the movie company that brought 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:05.160 us such wonderful things as a toy story, a Bug's Life, 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:13.880 um in Incredibles, well come on, even even cars. So 0:19:14.359 --> 0:19:16.720 but yeah, so they were in charge of that. So yeah, 0:19:16.760 --> 0:19:22.119 that's Jobs was very savvy. He purchased that company. No no, no, no, no, no, 0:19:22.240 --> 0:19:25.360 not savvy. He bought it for ten million dollars. And uh, 0:19:25.400 --> 0:19:28.439 of course in two thousand six, Disney bought it in 0:19:28.520 --> 0:19:31.840 an all stock purchase for seven point four billion dollars. Right, 0:19:31.920 --> 0:19:36.280 that's savvy. Yeah yeah. But and of course now Jobs 0:19:36.440 --> 0:19:39.159 Jobs is on the board for Disney, so there's that 0:19:39.280 --> 0:19:42.440 as well. He owns part of the Disney So that's uh, yeah, 0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:45.119 that was a good investment. Yeah, that's the reasonable. Now, 0:19:45.119 --> 0:19:46.959 granted I don't have ten million to make those kind 0:19:47.000 --> 0:19:49.960 of investments. Otherwise you would see me totally reeling zealing. 0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:54.840 But anyway, Jobs gets back into Apple, he fires the 0:19:54.880 --> 0:19:58.360 board and and hires a new board of six members. 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:02.880 Um and the and uh completely revamped all the line, 0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:07.199 the product line, simplified everything. Um. And that's kind of 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:09.680 where you know, that's that's leading us up to present day. 0:20:09.880 --> 0:20:13.680 His decisions to really streamline things, make things look really 0:20:13.720 --> 0:20:19.280 really sexy. Uh, control everything from the ground up. That 0:20:19.400 --> 0:20:22.520 was That's kind of what has defined Apple to this day. 0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:27.280 It's very much a closed system. Um. And Job's point 0:20:27.280 --> 0:20:30.240 of view is that that way he can guarantee quality. 0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:33.520 So yeah, his system is closed and his machines are 0:20:33.520 --> 0:20:36.120 more expensive, but they also look really nice and they 0:20:36.160 --> 0:20:40.600 work yep. Um and uh, just a note before we 0:20:40.600 --> 0:20:44.440 we go to Bill Gates. UM. You know now people 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:48.119 are concerned. I'm not sure exactly when this will be posted, 0:20:48.200 --> 0:20:53.119 but it was announced in December two eight that Steve 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:55.560 Jobs would not be leading the keynote at the Macworld 0:20:55.640 --> 0:20:59.560 Expo in January, which has caused some consternation because he's 0:20:59.560 --> 0:21:02.800 had some health issues that his death was falsely reported, 0:21:03.160 --> 0:21:05.919 and people are concerned now that he is so intertwined 0:21:05.920 --> 0:21:08.280 with Apple and its future that if he if something 0:21:08.359 --> 0:21:09.960 happens to him, if he steps down, or if he 0:21:10.000 --> 0:21:17.159 were you know, horror. You know, he's been diagnosed with 0:21:17.200 --> 0:21:20.479 pancreatic cancer. He had a surgery to remove the tumor 0:21:20.680 --> 0:21:23.320 um a year after they discovered it, because he resisted 0:21:23.320 --> 0:21:26.960 the surgery. But uh an Apple actually got some flak 0:21:27.080 --> 0:21:30.080 for that because they didn't report that to shareholders. And 0:21:30.119 --> 0:21:32.959 some people say, well, you know, when when your CEO 0:21:33.119 --> 0:21:39.159 has been diagnosed with a potentially fatal um illness, the 0:21:39.240 --> 0:21:42.120 shareholders have a right to know because that could completely 0:21:42.160 --> 0:21:45.880 affect the shares of the company. Uh. The other side 0:21:45.880 --> 0:21:47.960 of that is that it's a private matter. It's a 0:21:48.000 --> 0:21:51.159 health matter, um and that's a sticky situation. But at 0:21:51.160 --> 0:21:55.200 any rate, he seemed to make a pretty good recovery, 0:21:55.240 --> 0:21:58.760 although people always comment on you know, he looks thin, 0:21:59.359 --> 0:22:03.399 he's lost way, so people are are concerned. So there's 0:22:03.440 --> 0:22:06.000 some concern that maybe jobs as health had something to 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:08.200 do with him stepping away. I don't think that that's 0:22:08.280 --> 0:22:10.960 necessarily the case at all. It's just one of those 0:22:11.040 --> 0:22:15.040 unfortunate coincidences that can lead you to a faulty conclusion. 0:22:15.160 --> 0:22:18.520 Now that's not to say the conclusion is faulty. I 0:22:18.520 --> 0:22:21.440 could be totally wrong, but I'm willing to believe them 0:22:21.440 --> 0:22:25.240 on this one. UM. And I was gonna point out 0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:26.800 one other thing before we move on to Bill Gates, 0:22:26.840 --> 0:22:31.040 because it's an interesting counterpoint. Uh So, the Stanford Social 0:22:31.040 --> 0:22:35.080 Innovation Review founder once referred to Steve Jobs as UM 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:40.800 are actually to Apple itself as America's least philanthropic company. 0:22:41.320 --> 0:22:46.960 Um And in an Apple it h cut a lot 0:22:47.000 --> 0:22:51.400 of its philanthropic UM programs. Uh and in a way 0:22:51.440 --> 0:22:57.000 to to try and cut costs and never reinstituted them. 0:22:57.160 --> 0:22:59.640 And I had no idea we could talk about Steve 0:22:59.720 --> 0:23:03.360 Jobs that neither got a lot of Well, since we've 0:23:03.400 --> 0:23:05.800 gone on so long, I'm guessing we should probably divide 0:23:05.800 --> 0:23:08.520 this up and have a part too. Let's let's visit 0:23:08.640 --> 0:23:11.560 Mr Gates in another podcast. Yeah, next week we'll we'll 0:23:11.600 --> 0:23:15.600 tackle Billy Gates before we go. There's one other thing 0:23:15.640 --> 0:23:17.359 I'd like to share that I think is really cool 0:23:17.400 --> 0:23:20.199 about Steve Jobs. So, what's this amazing fact? So I 0:23:20.240 --> 0:23:22.720 got one of these things that I just think is 0:23:22.760 --> 0:23:25.240 really cool. Um. And it's the kind of thing that 0:23:25.560 --> 0:23:29.120 a showman like Steve Jobs would pull out um back 0:23:29.160 --> 0:23:30.880 when they were trying to find a way to turn 0:23:30.960 --> 0:23:35.040 Apple around. Uh, Steve agreed to take a pay cut. 0:23:35.359 --> 0:23:39.640 Oh yeah, he now makes as as the co founder, 0:23:39.720 --> 0:23:42.520 chairman and CEO of Apple, he makes one dollar a 0:23:42.600 --> 0:23:44.959 year in salary and now was so he could keep 0:23:44.960 --> 0:23:48.760 his medical benefits. Of course he has compensated in other ways. 0:23:48.800 --> 0:23:55.200 He gets a little stock which yeah, yeah, But it's 0:23:55.200 --> 0:23:59.359 funny because with all the the automakers talking about ways 0:23:59.440 --> 0:24:02.520 to do, you know, turn the companies around in Congress 0:24:02.520 --> 0:24:04.920