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Speaker 1: Welcome to the MLK Tapes, a production of iHeartRadio and

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Speaker 1: Tenderfoot TV. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast

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Speaker 1: are solely those of the podcast author or individuals participating

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Speaker 1: in the podcast, and do not represent those of iHeartMedia,

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Speaker 1: Tenderfoot TV, or their employees. Listener discretion is advised.

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Speaker 2: The National Civil Rights Museum in Memphis traces the history

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Speaker 2: of slavery in America and then follows the nation's long

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Speaker 2: struggle for human rights. Its rooms portray lunch counter sit ins,

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Speaker 2: freedom rides, bus boycotts, and burned churches. To walk through

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Speaker 2: its halls is a moving experience, made all the more

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Speaker 2: exceptional because the museum is built into the shell of

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Speaker 2: the former Lorraine Motel, where Martin Luther King was murdered.

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Speaker 2: Being at the Lorraine also helps to bring into focus

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Speaker 2: some of the unresolved questions surrounding the death of doctor King,

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Speaker 2: more so because in two thousand and two, the museum

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Speaker 2: acquired the neighboring rooming house from where James Earl Ray

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Speaker 2: was said to have fired the fatal bullet. The rooming

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Speaker 2: house has been renovated to accommodate the public and its

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Speaker 2: access from the museum by way of a tunnel. Its

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Speaker 2: interior is dedicated to displays that pertained to the assassination,

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Speaker 2: such as a rifle said to be the murder weapon

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Speaker 2: and a replica of Ray's famous white Mustang. But a

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Speaker 2: few places had been preserved in the condition in which

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Speaker 2: they were found after the murder, such as the bedroom

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Speaker 2: that Ray had rented and the bathroom from which he

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Speaker 2: was said to have fired the shot. When I visited

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Speaker 2: Memphis last year, I was joined by historian Ryan Jones,

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Speaker 2: who accompanied me through both the Lorraine and the rooming

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Speaker 2: house sections of the museum. I was not permitted to

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Speaker 2: record any sound, so the voice of mister Jones that

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Speaker 2: you'll hear in this segment was recorded at a later date.

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Speaker 2: Mister Jones had grown up in Memphis and has been

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Speaker 2: with the museum for ten years. He is an expert

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Speaker 2: on the King assassination, and I asked him what God

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Speaker 2: him interested in the case.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't until I moved back to Memphis in nineteen

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Speaker 3: ninety seven.

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Speaker 4: I think I was watching a talk show.

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Speaker 3: It may have been Montell Williams to be exact, and

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Speaker 3: the King family, some of his children appeared on that

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Speaker 3: talk show and they were talking of getting James Olray,

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Speaker 3: the accused assassin, a trial here in Memphis, which he

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Speaker 3: never got in nineteen sixty eight and sixty nine. And

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Speaker 3: I really didn't get back into it until I began

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Speaker 3: starting to work at the museum.

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Speaker 4: And it was there when I realized that the.

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Speaker 3: Museum holds all of the state's evidence against James Alray

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Speaker 3: and its collections, and I just began to go by

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Speaker 3: box by box, file by file.

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Speaker 4: I left no foul, you know, unturned.

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Speaker 3: So I just began to do my own individual research

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Speaker 3: and began to interview people. And almost ten years later,

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Speaker 3: you know, I feel like I have a pathway of

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Speaker 3: what truly happened here in Memphis at the Lorraine on

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Speaker 3: April fourth, nineteen sixty eight.

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Speaker 2: It should be noted here that on the issue of

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Speaker 2: whether James Earl Ray was the lone assassin or if

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Speaker 2: others were involved, the museum itself takes what it calls

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Speaker 2: a neutral position. The people who work there are entitled

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Speaker 2: to their opinions, But we should remember that Ryan Jones

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Speaker 2: is speaking here on his own and not for the

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Speaker 2: museum itself. Of course, working at the museum in the

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Speaker 2: old Lorraine motel. Jones is in an excellent position to

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Speaker 2: have an informed opinion about certain matters. For example, did

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Speaker 2: King always stay at the Lorraine when he came to Memphis,

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Speaker 2: has some said? Or did he usually stay at other

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Speaker 2: places and was shamed or maneuvered into staying at the

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Speaker 2: Lorraine because a certain reception had been planned.

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Speaker 3: There is this myth that has been floating around for

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Speaker 3: the past fifty two years that doctor King was a

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Speaker 3: normal guest, and even that he stayed at the Lorraine

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Speaker 3: on numerous occasions.

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Speaker 4: This is, however, not true. This is indeed false.

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Speaker 3: The Reverend James Lawson, who lived in Memphis at the time,

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Speaker 3: whom King met with the day before his assassination, stated

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Speaker 3: affirmatively many times that when he came to Memphis, they

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Speaker 3: would stay at his house, they'd go to the Peabody,

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Speaker 3: They'd stayed at the Admiral Bimbo.

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Speaker 2: On March twenty eight, the night following the Memphis March

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Speaker 2: that became a riot, King stayed at the Rivermont Hotel

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Speaker 2: and held a press conference there the next morning, where

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Speaker 2: he condemned the riot but couldn't say for sure how

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Speaker 2: it had started, though there were those in his camp

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Speaker 2: who believed the window smashing and looting had somehow been

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Speaker 2: arranged in advance. Seven years later, in congressional hearings, it

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Speaker 2: would be revealed that the same morning that King was

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Speaker 2: speaking to the press, document was being produced by the

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Speaker 2: FBI in Washington. It was in the form of a

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Speaker 2: press release that criticized King for staying at the Rivermont

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Speaker 2: and specifically named the Lorraine Motel as the more appropriate

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Speaker 2: place for him to stay. It bore the approving initials

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Speaker 2: of J at Gar Hoover and was to be circulated

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Speaker 2: to what the FBI called friendly news outlets.

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Speaker 3: The very next day, on the twenty ninth, there is

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Speaker 3: a press release calling doctor King a hypocrite, and it

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Speaker 3: pretty much states that you are staying at a predominantly

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Speaker 3: white business and you're asking African Americans to boycott white

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Speaker 3: merchants when you're not even given business to the lavish

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Speaker 3: and plus Lorraine Motel. This was an FBI memorandum that

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Speaker 3: was released on March to twenty ninth, nineteen sixty eight.

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Speaker 3: Whyou the FBI care where doctor King stays at this

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Speaker 3: time unless the Lorraine Motel was a particular area that

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Speaker 3: they needed him to be at, and of course, you know,

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Speaker 3: he was eventually moved from his original room which was

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Speaker 3: down below, and was moved upstairs to three of six.

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Speaker 2: And just how did this room change come about? There

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Speaker 2: are two stories. Both come from the owner of the Lorraine,

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Speaker 2: Walter Bailey.

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Speaker 3: Mister Bailey told this story to an investigative reporter by

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Speaker 3: the name of Wayne Chastain, and the story states that

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Speaker 3: someone who appeared to be very tall and athletic with

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Speaker 3: it like complexion, came to missus Bailey, who did all

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Speaker 3: of the hotel reservations, and stated that doctor King did

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Speaker 3: not want this nice room inside and away from the

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Speaker 3: original trajectory, and that he wonted room three US six

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Speaker 3: on the second floor. The second story is that it

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Speaker 3: was a phone call from Atlanta that was made so

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Speaker 3: that the Bailey's got a phone call from Atlanta a

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Speaker 3: day or two before they arrived, stating that doctor King

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Speaker 3: specifically won at room three oh six.

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Speaker 2: Why two stories, both supposedly from mister Bailey, we don't know,

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Speaker 2: But if the real story involved the phone call from Atlanta,

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Speaker 2: why would Walter Bailey make up another story of a tall,

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Speaker 2: athletic man coming to the Lorraine to make the room change.

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Speaker 5: It makes no sense.

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Speaker 2: But if it were the other way around, and the

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Speaker 2: room was changed by someone posing as an advanced man,

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Speaker 2: a description of that man might, upon further thought, be

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Speaker 2: a dangerous story to tell and give birth to the

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Speaker 2: supposed phone call. Of course, a quick conversation with missus

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Speaker 2: Bailey who changed the room could clear up the situation,

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Speaker 2: but as mister Jones explains, that was never possible.

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Speaker 3: Her name was Laurie Bailey, and she really was the

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Speaker 3: one who ran the Loraino Motel. On the afternoon of

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Speaker 3: April fourth, nineteen sixty eight, doctor King speaks with Missus

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Speaker 3: Bailey standing on the balcony and he says, listen, Missus Bailey,

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Speaker 3: if the food over at Reverend Kyle's's home is not good,

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Speaker 3: I'm going to come back and count on you. And

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Speaker 3: she kind of blushed and said, of course, anything for you,

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Speaker 3: Doctor King, And then they go back into the kitchen

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Speaker 3: area of the diner of the Lorraine. Then the shot

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Speaker 3: rings out and the Baileys hear it from inside. They

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Speaker 3: walk outside and they see doctor King Worley wounded on

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Speaker 3: the second floor outside of room three of six, and

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Speaker 3: immediately Missus Bailey says, why why, why? She took her

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Speaker 3: hand and she kept hitting the side of her temple

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Speaker 3: to the point where he could see her blood vessels

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Speaker 3: moving oddly enough, mister Bailey left the Lora Hotel a

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Speaker 3: few hours he lays his wife when there's police and

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Speaker 3: investigators all over the motel's grounds, and he goes to

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Speaker 3: his other job at the Holiday Inn on Lamar Avenue,

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Speaker 3: and he gets a call from his brother, Beatrice Bailey,

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Speaker 3: and Beatrice says Laurie, he's not an answering, She's not answering,

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Speaker 3: And then they finally get to her, and they found

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Speaker 3: her slumped over and she's gone into a coma to

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Speaker 3: a stroke where she never gains consciousness again and actually

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Speaker 3: dies at nine am on April and ninth, nineteen sixty eight.

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Speaker 3: We know now that a bud vessel ruptured in her brain.

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Speaker 2: Mister Jones and I walk through the tunnel to the

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Speaker 2: basement of the rooming house and then take the elevator

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Speaker 2: up to the second floor. We come upon a glass

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Speaker 2: case displaying the rifle that was found on the street

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Speaker 2: just minutes after the shooting. Mister jo Jones gives a

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Speaker 2: small laugh and informs me that the scope on the

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Speaker 2: rifle is still not properly sighted. The rooming house has

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Speaker 2: been gut renovated, so on the inside it doesn't look

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Speaker 2: like it did in nineteen sixty eight, but the room

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Speaker 2: that Ray rented and the bathroom down the hall had

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Speaker 2: been recreated to be replicas of what was found right

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Speaker 2: after King was killed. Over the years, a lot has

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Speaker 2: been made about Ray choosing room five B because of

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Speaker 2: its window rather than the only other room, which had

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Speaker 2: no view but did have a stove. I asked Jones

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Speaker 2: about five B and what problems it might present to

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Speaker 2: a would be assassin.

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Speaker 3: You are able to see the Lorainotel, and you are

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Speaker 3: able to see the second four balcony of the Lorainmotel

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Speaker 3: as well. Now, however, if your purpose is to assassinate

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Speaker 3: Martin Luther King Jr. And you're using a rifle, you

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Speaker 3: have a significant problem. In order to get a sufficient trajectory,

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Speaker 3: have to walk outside of the bedroom of five B,

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Speaker 3: down the hall and into a community bathroom in order

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Speaker 3: to even get an attempt.

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Speaker 2: The problem with that window was although you could see

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Speaker 2: the rear part of the Lorraine Motel, you could not

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Speaker 2: see room three h six, where doctor King was staying.

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Speaker 2: Without opening the window and leaning out, and no one

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Speaker 2: has ever said the shot was fired from there. I

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Speaker 2: asked mister Jones to describe the bathroom, but I encourage

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Speaker 2: the listener to look on her website to see the

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Speaker 2: photo of the tiny room to better understand the issues

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Speaker 2: at play here.

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Speaker 3: When you look inside of this very small community bathroom

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Speaker 3: that was shared by other people who were staying on

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Speaker 3: the same floor, you see a commode, you see a

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Speaker 3: very small sink, and until the left and the corner

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Speaker 3: right beneath a partially open window, there's a bathtub. Now

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Speaker 3: here's a significant red flag with that. James Olray was

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Speaker 3: six feet in height, and the weapon that he admitted

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Speaker 3: to buying in Birmingham, Alabama, a few days prior to

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Speaker 3: doctor King's death is not a small weapon at all.

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Speaker 3: It's a fairly large weapon with a scope as well.

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Speaker 3: And James Alray, we know, was a right handed marksman.

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Speaker 3: I about six feet, I'm about five to nine, and

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Speaker 3: I've gotten into that bathtub with a rifle that's not

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Speaker 3: the size of the one that rifle is accused of musing.

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Speaker 3: And it was almost impossible for myself, also right handed,

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Speaker 3: to have gotten a sufficient trajectory and My honest estimation

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Speaker 3: is that if there was a shot fired from that

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Speaker 3: community bathroom, which I don't think happened, you will have

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Speaker 3: had to have been a left handed marksman to situate

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Speaker 3: yourself in the bathtub in a very uncomfortable position.

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Speaker 2: The bathroom window is small and leaves very little room

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Speaker 2: for a weapon and a body to gain the needed

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Speaker 2: angle to make the shot not impossible, But it's not

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Speaker 2: like someone would just walk up to this window, take aim,

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Speaker 2: and shoot something directly in front of it. As it

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Speaker 2: exists today, the window is now open, just a matter

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Speaker 2: of benches, as it apparently was on the day of

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Speaker 2: the murder, and it appears to me as though the

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Speaker 2: wooden bottom frame of the window would block or partially

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Speaker 2: block the view through the scope of the rifle, even

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Speaker 2: assuming it was properly sighted. But what got me most

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Speaker 2: when I looked at the bathroom is the tub, a small, narrow,

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Speaker 2: old fashioned bathtub with steep sloping sides. So instead of

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Speaker 2: spreading his legs and creating a secure base for a

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Speaker 2: difficult shot, our presumed shooter, mister Ray has to stand

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Speaker 2: with his feet close together inside this narrow bathtub and

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Speaker 2: get all balanced and squared away at just the time

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Speaker 2: the King came out of his room at the Lorraine.

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Speaker 2: Then Ray fired the only bullet he had loaded into

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Speaker 2: his gun because he was that certain of his skill

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Speaker 2: with the rifle he had only owned for four days.

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Speaker 2: Then there is the question of what needs to happen

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Speaker 2: in the next couple of minutes. As soon as the

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Speaker 2: fatal shot us fired. Ray would need to return to

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Speaker 2: Room five B, place the rifle in the box, and

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Speaker 2: throw his personal belongings into a bag made from a bedspread,

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Speaker 2: if he hadn't already done that before making his way

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Speaker 2: down to his car. But instead of just throwing his

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Speaker 2: stuff into his car, he leaves the bag and the

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Speaker 2: gun on the street. Harold Weisberg's nineteen seventy one book

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Speaker 2: Frame Up was the first to call into question the

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Speaker 2: official story of the king murder, and we all owe

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Speaker 2: him a debt. He died in two thousand and two,

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Speaker 2: but I'd like to play for you here. His take

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Speaker 2: on the stuff found on the street with Ray's rifle ridiculous.

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Speaker 6: He's required of going to his room in the flophouse

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Speaker 6: and picked up the why does collection of junk bobby pins,

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Speaker 6: bobby pins, cans of beer that hadn't been opened. You know,

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Speaker 6: a guy has been a crime like that and he's

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Speaker 6: playing for his life. You're going to pick up a

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Speaker 6: couple of cans of beer or bobby pin. The box

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Speaker 6: didn't hold the rifle. He had to put the rifle

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Speaker 6: in that all sorts of other junk, ridiculous collection of it.

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Speaker 6: The one thing that that bundle served to do was

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Speaker 6: the point a finger it ready.

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Speaker 2: Ryan Jones agrees with Weisberg's doubt about the likelihood that

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Speaker 2: Ray was the one who left the bundle with the

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Speaker 2: rifle on the street.

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Speaker 3: Why he would have ever have done that will always

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Speaker 3: be a mystery. The car wasn't parked right in front

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Speaker 3: of Jim's drills.

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Speaker 7: Parked a little closer to the firehouse, but it's close

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Speaker 7: enough to where he does not have to like run

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Speaker 7: a significant long way.

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Speaker 3: He had more than enough time. It was probably safer

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Speaker 3: for him to just put the rifle and his car

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Speaker 3: and drive off.

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Speaker 2: It was strange to stand on South Maine with Ryan

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Speaker 2: Jones and try to imagine things that had happened.

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Speaker 5: Fifty years ago.

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Speaker 2: There's no question that James Earl Ray rented Room five

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Speaker 2: B from Bessie Brewer the day of the murder, but

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Speaker 2: all the rest of it seems unlikely. I was grateful

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Speaker 2: for the time Ryan Jones spent with me, so I

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Speaker 2: asked him if he had anything else he wanted to say.

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Speaker 3: I think that this would have been a very very

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Speaker 3: interesting trial had Ray gone to trial. We have this

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Speaker 3: weapon and it's never you know, the ballistics and trajectory

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Speaker 3: are not tested. The room changed, Why the weapon was

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Speaker 3: found when it was found? Who supplied Ray? The aliases

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Speaker 3: of Gault Lobyer, Willard Bridgeman, Snay and you know what,

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Speaker 3: this was a hate crime. You know I'm not buying

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Speaker 3: it is said, hey crime, any ku kluks klansmen could

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Speaker 3: have gotten doctor King of Montgomery. They could have got

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Speaker 3: him in Reachville, Georgia. They could have gotten him in Birmingham.

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Speaker 3: They could have got him in Saint Augustine Selma, Chicago,

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Speaker 3: walking the two hundred and twenty one mile distance from

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Speaker 3: Memphis to Jackson at the March against Fear. But no,

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Speaker 3: they don't get him until he is opposing the Vietnam

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Speaker 3: War in April of nineteen sixty seven. For the very

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Speaker 3: last year. They wait and get him when he proposes

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Speaker 3: on December fourth, nineteen sixty seven to the Poor People's Campaign,

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Speaker 3: where he wants to bring black and white people who

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Speaker 3: are stricken by poverty to the nation's capital and to

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Speaker 3: demand that the country, you know, write the check to

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Speaker 3: the people out in their backyard versus an a war.

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Speaker 3: I think that the story that we've been given for

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Speaker 3: the past fifty three years is just fictional. It's laughable

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Speaker 3: in certain areas that this limon was sold to the

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Speaker 3: American public, that this insignificant man is James Olray was

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Speaker 3: able to kill Martin Luther King Junior standing on the

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Speaker 3: balcony of a Memphis hotel room, and to flee and

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Speaker 3: get away untouched, not once. At the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: when we look at it, the people who hated him

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Speaker 3: the most yetbi who was committed to discrediting him, to

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Speaker 3: destroy him, who urged him to commit suicide in January

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Speaker 3: nineteen sixty five, are the same people responsible for investigating

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Speaker 3: his death. If that's done a disservice to justice in

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Speaker 3: this country, I don't know it is. And I feel

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Speaker 3: that the story will never rest, and I will never

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Speaker 3: rest until we get it to the bottom of it,

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Speaker 3: until we give the justice that's due and served to

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Speaker 3: doctor King's family into history.

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Speaker 5: One of my court reporters was down at the Shelby

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Speaker 5: County Courthouse and said there was a British English producer

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Speaker 5: named Jack Saltman there and he was going to be

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Speaker 5: doing this teletrial that never occurred, the trial of James

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Speaker 5: Earl Ray. I thought it was a hoax at first,

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Speaker 5: but I threw on my coat, ran down seven blocks

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Speaker 5: on a cold winter's day, and there was Jack Saltman

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Speaker 5: with contract in hand. He said, I need a real

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Speaker 5: time court reporting for this trial I'm doing. It's going

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Speaker 5: to be a real trial for all intents and purposes,

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Speaker 5: but it will have no judicial weight. Trial of James

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Speaker 5: Earl Ray is what it was called.

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Speaker 2: I'm in Memphis, a block away from the Formula Rainbow

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Speaker 2: Tel talking to Brian de Minski, who is a court

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Speaker 2: reporter and someone who has lived in Memphis.

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Speaker 5: For most of his life.

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Speaker 2: For the last three decades, he's had a front row

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Speaker 2: seat for some of the more important events in the

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Speaker 2: ongoing challenge to the story of how Martin Luther King

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Speaker 2: was murdered. As we just heard, Brian's entrance into the

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Speaker 2: case began when he offered himself as a court reporter

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Speaker 2: to an English producer who was attempting to stage a.

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Speaker 5: Mock trial of James Earl Ray.

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Speaker 2: The trial was to mimic in all possible ways a

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Speaker 2: real trial, with a retired federal judge presiding, attorneys arguing

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Speaker 2: both sides, and an impartial jury to hear the evidence

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Speaker 2: and to come to a verdict. This is in nineteen

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Speaker 2: ninety three. An edited tape of the trial was televised

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Speaker 2: on HBO on the twenty fifth anniversary of the murder

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Speaker 2: of Martin Luther King.

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Speaker 5: It was a little surreal doing my job as a

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Speaker 5: court reporter, but so that my left is a track

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Speaker 5: with a journey on it and a big television camera

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Speaker 5: filming me. It was cool stuff. I enjoyed it.

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Speaker 8: And who were the attorneys involved?

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Speaker 5: Bill Pepper, William Pepper and Pickman Ewing Junior, who was

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Speaker 5: our United States District Attorney for the Western District of

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Speaker 5: Tennessee prior to that he had left that post and

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Speaker 5: they hired him as the prosecutor against versus Bill. James

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Speaker 5: Rolry tested via satellite for two full days and one

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Speaker 5: of the days was a vigorous cross examination by Hickman

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Speaker 5: Ewing Jr. The jury was sequestered every evening. It was

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Speaker 5: done airtight, better than the ones that I actually would

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Speaker 5: handle in my other court reporting life.

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Speaker 2: And for our listeners who were not in class that day,

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Speaker 2: what was the result of the trial.

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Speaker 5: That Ray was not guilty of the assassination of Martin

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Speaker 5: Luther King?

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Speaker 2: Okay, so tell us about Bill Pepper? What was he like?

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Speaker 5: He was very difficult during that entire time. He was frankly,

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Speaker 5: he was an ass to everybody. And as you and

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Speaker 5: I know, he's a charming, wonderful man. But during that

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Speaker 5: trial it was so intense because he was having his

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Speaker 5: shot now. He was extremely intense and he was difficult

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Speaker 5: to everybody. He even made his co consul cry during

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Speaker 5: the trial. April Ferguson made her cry because I don't

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Speaker 5: know what the issue was, so she left the table

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Speaker 5: during one of the days in tears.

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Speaker 8: Did you feel going into the HBO trial that there

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Speaker 8: was something wrong with the King murder or did you

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Speaker 8: basically think that Ray had done ed? What was your

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Speaker 8: mindset before you went in or did it change during

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Speaker 8: the trial.

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Speaker 5: I had an open mind. As the days unfolded, though,

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Speaker 5: I was just astounded at what I didn't know and

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Speaker 5: then what I was learning.

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Speaker 8: What witnesses stick out in your mind from that trial, Well,

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Speaker 8: there's there's Lieutenant Hamby who is sent to a coroner

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Speaker 8: of Francisco's office to pick up the slug and bring

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Speaker 8: it back to Director Holloman's office, the head of Fire

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Speaker 8: in place of Memphis.

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Speaker 5: He saw it was an intact bullet. And now even

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Speaker 5: at the Civil Rights Museum across the street from where

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Speaker 5: we're at, there was this three fragments of a bullet.

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Speaker 5: I recall they were going to put Lloyd Jowers on

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Speaker 5: the stand. I think he actually was on the stand,

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Speaker 5: and there were certain questions that Judge Frankel said, we're

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Speaker 5: not going there. You're not going to ask this. Well,

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Speaker 5: Pepper tried to ask it anyway. He asked, mister Jowers, well,

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Speaker 5: you know what were you doing behind your bar and

396
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,520
Speaker 5: grilla in that day? And Judge Frankel said, you'll see

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Speaker 5: me in chambers right now. And they went into the chambers,

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Speaker 5: hic Youing and Jowers, lawyer Lewis Garrison and Bill and

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Speaker 5: they came back out and they took Jowers off the stand.

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Speaker 8: Frankel had some objection to asking Jowers whether he was

401
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Speaker 8: involved or what he might have been doing.

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Speaker 5: Correct now. During the HbA trial is when I first

403
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:32,640
Speaker 5: saw the photograph of the open window where they alleged

404
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:34,920
Speaker 5: ray what fired the shot from in the rooming house.

405
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:38,240
Speaker 5: Sergeant Papia testified and he said that he came upon

406
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:40,919
Speaker 5: the scene at approximately six point thirty and goes up

407
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Speaker 5: to the rooming house and then requisitions a photographer to

408
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Speaker 5: come up there. So that's the exact position of the window.

409
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 5: And in the Civil Rights Museum there is a photograph

410
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 5: of that on the wall. And when you look at

411
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Speaker 5: that window, it is open. We couldn't go in the

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Speaker 5: bathroom and measure it three four inches max. If you

413
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,520
Speaker 5: take the Remington game Master with scope and you put

414
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:05,760
Speaker 5: it into that window sill, the scope then a butts

415
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,120
Speaker 5: into the wood of the window sill. That's the first

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Speaker 5: time I came across that evidence. After the HBO trial,

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Speaker 5: we left shaking hands and he went on his way.

418
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Speaker 5: I went on my way, thinking I'd never hear from

419
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Speaker 5: him again. About three years later, he calls me up

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00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 5: out of the blue and says, I need to use

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00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:23,000
Speaker 5: your services and your conference room, Brian, and I want

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00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:25,320
Speaker 5: you to be the court reporter. We have another trial

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Speaker 5: coming up, a civil trial involving doctor King's death, and

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Speaker 5: this one will be in Shelby County Circuit Court, and

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Speaker 5: we need to take some depositions. Can you do that?

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Speaker 5: And of course I said yes, And it was a

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Speaker 5: different William Pepper this time around. I like to say

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Speaker 5: that once that aired on HBO and national television, it

429
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 5: shook things loose because people saw that and they said

430
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Speaker 5: I was there that day too, or I know this,

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00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:51,120
Speaker 5: and they started contacting William Pepper or others saying I'd

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Speaker 5: like to come forth and give you my testimony of

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Speaker 5: what happened. So that was a real watershed event for

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Speaker 5: the case.

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00:24:58,080 --> 00:24:59,240
Speaker 8: So who did you depose?

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Speaker 5: We had a series of people like Glinda Grabo, the

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00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:07,800
Speaker 5: captain of the fire station, Carthel Whedon, taxi drivers. We

438
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,240
Speaker 5: deposed the Jowers. Although I didn't do Jowers deposition, one

439
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 5: of my associates did. At that day. A lot of

440
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:18,000
Speaker 5: the people that appear in the ninety nine trial were deposed. First.

441
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 8: Now, you said you deposed Glinda Grabo. Tell me about

442
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:23,920
Speaker 8: Glenda Grabo, Well.

443
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:27,040
Speaker 5: She was extremely nervous. She was going to testify a trial,

444
00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:29,679
Speaker 5: but she became ill. She didn't want to take the

445
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:32,359
Speaker 5: stand in a public forum. But she did give her deposition.

446
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,440
Speaker 5: It speaks for itself. But she tied in the fact

447
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:40,359
Speaker 5: that she knew Raoul the operative that we had learned

448
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:42,600
Speaker 5: that was raised operative leading him around the country.

449
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 8: I'm kind of interested in your perception of her as

450
00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:48,320
Speaker 8: a person. Did she have some reason to come and

451
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 8: make up a story that you're aware of?

452
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:53,520
Speaker 5: I sensed her she was fearing for her life just

453
00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:56,760
Speaker 5: giving her deposition. I mean, she was extremely nervous, and

454
00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 5: Pepper had a kind of draw out from her by

455
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:02,439
Speaker 5: this point that William Pepper is representing the King family,

456
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 5: not James Alray. They've come to him and they said,

457
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 5: you know, we know you're onto something. We believe what

458
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:09,800
Speaker 5: you've got. We'd like to retain you for the civil trial.

459
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:11,080
Speaker 5: What was it like.

460
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:13,360
Speaker 8: I don't know being there with Coreta Scott King.

461
00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:16,480
Speaker 5: I'm not a big spiritual person, but when Missus King,

462
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:18,680
Speaker 5: she was the first witness when she took the stand,

463
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 5: the jury hadn't come out yet, and the core reporters

464
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:23,520
Speaker 5: spot was right in front of the witness stand, so

465
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 5: Missus King was standing there and I introduced myself and

466
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,360
Speaker 5: we chatted for a moment, and she had this angelic

467
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:32,640
Speaker 5: glow about her, just a specially touched person. And again

468
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,879
Speaker 5: I'm not spiritual, but she had just a glower aura

469
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 5: that she was unique.

470
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:42,719
Speaker 2: We are listening to a conversation that I had this

471
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:46,400
Speaker 2: past summer with court reporter Brian Domnski, who's been involved

472
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 2: in the King case in one way or another for

473
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,160
Speaker 2: thirty years. He has told us how he was brought

474
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,080
Speaker 2: in as court reporter for the nineteen ninety three hbo

475
00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:57,919
Speaker 2: Mont trial, which found James Earl Ray not guilty of

476
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 2: murdering Martin Luther King. Now we served the same function

477
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:05,400
Speaker 2: in the nineteen ninety nine civil trial King Family versus Showers,

478
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 2: which found that doctor King had been killed by a conspiracy.

479
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:12,119
Speaker 2: But in the twenty plus years following the civil trial,

480
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 2: Dominski participated in or was witnessed to a half dozen

481
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 2: events that brought new understanding to the murder of doctor King.

482
00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 2: One of those events was something Dominski did on his own,

483
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 2: the publication of the entire transcript of the ninety nine

484
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:28,439
Speaker 2: civil trial.

485
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 5: It took me a good five years because I was

486
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 5: fearful too that if I put this out, particularly under

487
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 5: my name in Memphis I'd have lawyers saying I'm never

488
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:40,400
Speaker 5: using Dominski again. I finally came to the conclusion. I said,

489
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:42,399
Speaker 5: somebody's going to find this transcript in my attic one

490
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 5: day after I'm deceased and go, oh my god, this

491
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 5: is the ninety nine King trial, and then read it

492
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:48,879
Speaker 5: and go, wait a second. They've just proved that it

493
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:49,919
Speaker 5: wasn't James, all right.

494
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:54,120
Speaker 2: The book is titled The Thirteenth Juror, and anyone can

495
00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:57,240
Speaker 2: buy it online. It is seven hundred and fifty pages,

496
00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 2: a complete record of the civil trial, and it was

497
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,359
Speaker 2: a has helped me in the making of this podcast.

498
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 2: Another unique contribution by Domnski was his in depth interview

499
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:11,000
Speaker 2: of Lewis Garrison, the lawyer for the self confessed conspirator

500
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 2: Lloyd Jowers.

501
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:15,959
Speaker 5: So we have Lewis Garrison, who represented Lloyd Jowers from

502
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:19,040
Speaker 5: approximately nineteen seventy two, and he was his lawyer for

503
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,000
Speaker 5: the HBO trial. He was a lawyer for the ninety

504
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 5: nine trial. I know Lewis. He's a Memphis lawyer. I'd

505
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 5: known him over the years. We would chat about the

506
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 5: case because we both intimately involved. So in twenty seventeen,

507
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:33,600
Speaker 5: Lewis calls me he says, Brian, because of your involvement

508
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:36,720
Speaker 5: in the case and being licensed corport as stenographer, I'd

509
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 5: like you to come to my office. I want to

510
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 5: tell you everything I know. Lewis is about eighty nine

511
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 5: at this point eighty seven, and I don't know if

512
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 5: it's a Catharsis or what. But I videoed it as well,

513
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 5: since wasn't an illegal proceeding pending anymore, I just called

514
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 5: it a video affidavit of Lewis Garrison not attaching in

515
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:57,080
Speaker 5: I llegal proceeding. But yet I swore him in under oath,

516
00:28:57,840 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 5: and he being a member of the Memphis barr he

517
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 5: felt that oath was binding. And he testified for about

518
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 5: an hour and a half and he spoke of everything

519
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 5: that mister Jowers had told him over the years as

520
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 5: his lawyer. But he said the Jowers had received one

521
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,520
Speaker 5: hundred thousand dollars from mister Loberto and bought the cab

522
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 5: company shortly some time after the assassination, and how he

523
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,080
Speaker 5: could have never done that owning a greasy spoon bar

524
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 5: and grill, and he didn't have one hundred thousand dollars

525
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:25,360
Speaker 5: to buy that. And Lewis Garrison said he bought the

526
00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 5: cab company with the money he got for acting as

527
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:32,960
Speaker 5: the facilitator. Lewis had said when Lloyd Jowers passing away

528
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:35,800
Speaker 5: on his deathbed, he called Lewis up and the day

529
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 5: before he died he told Lewis that yes, I was

530
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 5: a shooter. Now, that's in juxtaposition to two other stories

531
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 5: that we know.

532
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 2: Dominski was also in the room with Bill Pepper and

533
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,680
Speaker 2: Martin king Thid for the two thousand and three sworn

534
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:52,960
Speaker 2: deposition of Lenny Curtis.

535
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:57,400
Speaker 5: Lenny Curtis was a janitor at the MPD shooting range

536
00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 5: and Jim and on the day of the assassination. Lenny

537
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:03,960
Speaker 5: Curtis testified that Frank Strauser had came in early that

538
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:06,320
Speaker 5: day and was carrying a rifle and went down to

539
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 5: the shooting range and was constantly firing away. Around noon,

540
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 5: Director Hollman, Mayor Loeb and two people he doesn't know

541
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:17,720
Speaker 5: in suits and ties come and meet with Frank Strauser

542
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 5: in a conference room. He's next door sweeping. He's trying

543
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 5: to listen in and he doesn't quite pick up on

544
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 5: what they're talking about, but they leave. Strausser then goes

545
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 5: and practices a little longer and then leaves in a

546
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:31,880
Speaker 5: sports car with the rifle.

547
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:35,960
Speaker 2: As we heard Curtis tell us in episode eleven, he

548
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,040
Speaker 2: felt certain that Strausser was intending to shoot doctor King.

549
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 2: Curtis tried to call a minister he knew to pass

550
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:46,040
Speaker 2: the warning along, but he couldn't get through. Curtis told

551
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:48,880
Speaker 2: his story in the presence of Martin King II, with

552
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 2: a promise that no one could listen to it or

553
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 2: even hear of it until after he had died. But

554
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:58,640
Speaker 2: after Curtis did die, Bill Pepper sought out Frank Strausser

555
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 2: and offered him five hundred if he would have.

556
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 5: Lunch with him.

557
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:05,960
Speaker 2: Strausser agrees, and the two men meet and Brian Demnsky

558
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 2: is sitting at a nearby table.

559
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:11,680
Speaker 5: Ahead of time. Bill asked that I have him wired

560
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 5: for sound, and we did a rudimentary attempt at that

561
00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:17,479
Speaker 5: recorder in his pocket, but Bill welcomed him and they

562
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 5: sat down and they had about a forty five minute

563
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 5: chat about what life was like in nineteen sixty eight

564
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 5: in Memphis and that sort of thing.

565
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 2: In episode eleven, you can hear our recreation of Pepper's

566
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 2: conversation with Frank Strausser that Brian de Minsky overheard and

567
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 2: taped via recorder in Bill Pepper's shirt pocket. Dominski was

568
00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 2: also in the room, this time as a court reporter.

569
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:46,960
Speaker 2: During the stunning seven hours sworn deposition by Ronnie Lee Atkins.

570
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 5: Ronnie Lee was a fascinating interesting man. He was an

571
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,680
Speaker 5: iron horseman, biker and his family. They were the Dixie

572
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 5: Mafia family, not mafia as an Italian mafia. Dixie Mafias

573
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 5: in Southern tough guys that do things, illicit things, and

574
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 5: they still exist. He gave his deposition for seven hours.

575
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,560
Speaker 5: At first I was skeptical. He almost looked like Hulk Hogan.

576
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,440
Speaker 5: He's had this flowing hair, big mustache. I had to

577
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 5: be two eighty but really built strong. But as he

578
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 5: gave his testimony over those seven hours, he had so

579
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 5: many intricate Memphis facts. No, he's from Memphis, so it's understandable,

580
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 5: but he had so much detail that he couldn't have

581
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:28,560
Speaker 5: possibly made this up. Bill. He was telling the story

582
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 5: of his life and his family's life back in the day.

583
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 2: As we were beginning to pack up, I asked Brian

584
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 2: Demnsky if looking back, he felt encouraged by all the

585
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,920
Speaker 2: people that have braved the storm and come forward and

586
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 2: all the evidence they have brought with them, or was

587
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 2: he discouraged by how immune to it all the lie

588
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 2: surrounding King's murder seemed to be he was upbeat.

589
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 5: Pepper would like this, I'm a wax poetic, but doctor

590
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 5: King used to like to quote the truth crushed Earth

591
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 5: will rise again. So as the years passed, it is rising.

592
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 5: It's coming out. But we're not totally there now. The

593
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 5: ninety nine Trials a wonderful template, and there's more, of course,

594
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 5: the weave on Earth, and there's still a little bit

595
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,000
Speaker 5: more that we don't have, but we did a pretty

596
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 5: good job of those two trials.

597
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 2: This is Bill Klaber, creator of the MLK Tapes. Before

598
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 2: we walk away from the podcast, I wanted to play

599
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 2: the interviews you just heard of two people who have

600
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 2: had a front row seat as this story has played

601
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 2: out in Memphis. For most of us, the murder of

602
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 2: Martin Luther King is something that took place over fifty

603
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:41,840
Speaker 2: years ago, but for Ryan Jones and Brian Deminski, it

604
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 2: is a battle between truth and lies that is still

605
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 2: very much alive today. If you are with us this far,

606
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:50,239
Speaker 2: I would like to think that you now know a

607
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:52,680
Speaker 2: great deal more about the murder of Martin Luther King

608
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:56,000
Speaker 2: than you did before, and considering the importance of the

609
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 2: man murdered, I hope that feels odd to you, and

610
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 2: it should, because US Americans think King was killed by

611
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 2: alone assassin driven by racial hatred. They think this because

612
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,840
Speaker 2: for fifty years, the American media has seen fit to

613
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:13,759
Speaker 2: champion the single corrupt story that was provided to them

614
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 2: and to allow for nothing else. So, for example, if

615
00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:20,320
Speaker 2: you have written a book that challenges the official version

616
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,840
Speaker 2: of this crime, as Bill Pepper has done, your book,

617
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,640
Speaker 2: no matter how carefully vetted, will not even be reviewed.

618
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 2: Polite people don't talk about the.

619
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:30,919
Speaker 5: Murder of doctor King.

620
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 2: But podcasts offer a way around those gatekeepers. So we

621
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,280
Speaker 2: have put the evidence as we know it into audio

622
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 2: episodes and shot them out into the ether, where from

623
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:41,760
Speaker 2: now on.

624
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:43,160
Speaker 5: Anyone can access them.

625
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 2: Anyone can hear how Percy Foreman was paid to make

626
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,600
Speaker 2: sure that James Earl Ray pled guilty, and they can

627
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:54,360
Speaker 2: ask themselves how did this happen and why? And of course,

628
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:56,720
Speaker 2: none of this could have happened if Bill Pepper hadn't

629
00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,839
Speaker 2: decided to investigate the murder of his friend Martin King,

630
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,800
Speaker 2: so I want to thank Bill again for those efforts

631
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 2: and for his bravery. I also want to thank Donald

632
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:10,240
Speaker 2: Albright and Jamie Olbright of Tenderfoot TV, and Matt Frederick

633
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:13,400
Speaker 2: and Trevor Young of iHeartMedia for the belief and the

634
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 2: importance of this story and for their confidence in me.

635
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 2: I'm grateful for their exceptional talent and for the spirit

636
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 2: they brought with it. It's not every day that one

637
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 2: gets to shatter a lie as big as this one.

638
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 9: Thanks for listening to The MLK Tapes, a production of

639
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 9: iHeartRadio and Tenderfoot TV. This podcast is not specifically endorsed

640
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,320
Speaker 9: by the King Family or the King of State. The

641
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:45,080
Speaker 9: MLK Tapes is written and hosted by Bill Clayber, Matt Frederick,

642
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:48,399
Speaker 9: and Alex Williams our executive producers on behalf of iHeartRadio,

643
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:52,480
Speaker 9: with producers Trevor Young and Jesse Fonk. Donald Albright and

644
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 9: Payne Lindsay are executive producers on behalf of Tenderfoot TV,

645
00:35:55,920 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 9: with producers Jamie Albright and Meredith Dedman. Original music by

646
00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:03,480
Speaker 9: Makeup and Vanity Set. Cover art by Mister Soul two

647
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 9: one six with photography by Artemis Jenkins. Special thanks to

648
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 9: Owin Rosenbaum and Grace Royer at UTA, the Nord Group,

649
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:16,839
Speaker 9: Beck Median Marketing, Envision Business Management, and Station sixteen. If

650
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:19,960
Speaker 9: you have questions, you can visit our website, the emailktapes

651
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:23,319
Speaker 9: dot com. We posted photos and videos related to the

652
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 9: podcast on our social media accounts. You can check them

653
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:30,000
Speaker 9: out at the emailk Tapes. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio

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00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 9: and Tenderfoot TV, please visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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Speaker 9: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,