1 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: Hi. 2 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 2: This is Connor Hall, the producer for Wrongful Conviction, and 3 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 2: we're taking a break from our usual release schedule to 4 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:16,079 Speaker 2: discuss Maggie Feeling's new documentary series called Graves County. It's 5 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 2: out now as season three of Bone Valley. In the 6 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 2: Bone Valley Feed, we'll link it in the episode description. 7 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 2: So we got Jason and Maggie to discuss some of 8 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:27,000 Speaker 2: the things that Maggie discovered over the past few years 9 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 2: while investigating a case that you may have heard about 10 00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:32,159 Speaker 2: here a few years ago. This is the murder of 11 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:36,240 Speaker 2: Jessica Current and the wrongful conviction of Quincy Cross, among 12 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:40,000 Speaker 2: several others, and the story takes us to Mayfield, Kentucky 13 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 2: aka Grapes County. 14 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: The new season of Bone Valley, which I'm just gonna 15 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: say it out loud, is as powerful as the first one. 16 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: People said it couldn't be done, but this story is 17 00:00:53,880 --> 00:01:00,560 Speaker 1: every bit as crazy, and the podcast itself is I 18 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:05,319 Speaker 1: think as brilliant of a masterpiece of storytelling as the 19 00:01:05,319 --> 00:01:06,040 Speaker 1: first one was. 20 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 3: Thank you, Jason. 21 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 4: It was obviously an honor to be on the Bone 22 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 4: Valley Feed with Gilbert, who I admire so much. Bone 23 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:15,440 Speaker 4: Valley one was I remember saying to you. I was like, 24 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 4: or I think I said to Gilbert, you know, I 25 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 4: wish I made that. I was so mad he made it. 26 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 4: I was so jealous he made it. I was like, 27 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 4: that's the best podcast I ever heard. I wish I 28 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 4: made that. So I think I might have made something 29 00:01:28,160 --> 00:01:30,960 Speaker 4: equally as good you did. 30 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 1: You did, And somebody was saying to me this morning, 31 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 1: I could just listen to her all day. I mean, you, 32 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: your voice is made for this format. And furthermore, you 33 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 1: know the fact that you wrote it and produced it 34 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 1: is you know, kudos to you, and hopefully there's another 35 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:50,600 Speaker 1: Pulitzer coming your way. I'll never forget. I'll never forget 36 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:52,480 Speaker 1: when you called me. By the way, this is off topic, 37 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: but for Eovil, Maggie of course knows the story because 38 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 1: she's the one who called me. But we were in 39 00:01:57,240 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 1: Nashville where Maggie was going to present me with an award. 40 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: I think it was the which one was it? 41 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 4: It was it was an impact of it. It was 42 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 4: like it was a music award or something. 43 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So Maggie was kind of fly down and 44 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 1: offered to present me with this award, and the day 45 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: of the awards ceremony, which supposed to be that night. 46 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:19,360 Speaker 1: I get a call from Maggie in the afternoon and 47 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:21,520 Speaker 1: she says, I just found out I want to pull Itzir. 48 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:24,079 Speaker 1: I was like, huh, I go how'd you get the news? 49 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:25,760 Speaker 1: She goes, well, I was sitting in the hot top 50 00:02:25,760 --> 00:02:28,359 Speaker 1: of my hotel drinking whiskey when I got the call, 51 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:31,360 Speaker 1: and I was like, Okay, that's perfect, and I'm going 52 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: to remember this moment forever. It also was very It 53 00:02:33,800 --> 00:02:36,320 Speaker 1: was good because it was just it was just absolutely 54 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:38,919 Speaker 1: appropriately humbling because of the idea that I was going 55 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:41,640 Speaker 1: to go get this cleo. So anyway, it's perfect. And 56 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 1: speaking of awards, there's some breaking news about Keith Lamar, 57 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 1: which is a case that lives rent free in my head, 58 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: and I'm sure for anyone who's listened to the Wrongful 59 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,280 Speaker 1: Conviction episode on Keith Lamar's case is probably feel the 60 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 1: same way. Keith Lamar is in process of being nominated 61 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:02,359 Speaker 1: for an Alternative Jazz Award for his Spoken Word. I mean, 62 00:03:02,760 --> 00:03:07,160 Speaker 1: Keith Lamar's on death row and accomplishing more than almost 63 00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 1: anyone I know in the free world with his art, 64 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: with his music, with his spirit. Keith, I hope you 65 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 1: get to hear this because we have nothing but love 66 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:19,400 Speaker 1: and respect for you, and we hope to see you 67 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 1: out here sometime soon where you belong. So so, Maggie, 68 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 1: let's talk about Mayfield, Kentucky. You know, you and I 69 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:28,560 Speaker 1: went down there. 70 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 4: Like Cities Sleep two and a half years, like almost 71 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 4: three years ago. 72 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: Now, Yeah, eyes wide open, and I don't know if 73 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:36,560 Speaker 1: we were ready for what we found. 74 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 4: You know, it reminded me a lot of these small towns. 75 00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 3: Right. 76 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 4: I did Murder and Alliance a few years ago in 77 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 4: a small town in Ohio. It was a very similar 78 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 4: small police department, not equipped for a murder in any 79 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:52,680 Speaker 4: sort of way. And in these small towns, like rumors 80 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 4: really become fact. And that was one of the first 81 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 4: things that we really kind of honed in on. We 82 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 4: were like, there's so much gossip, so many things going on, 83 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 4: we don't even know it's real. Right, that was like 84 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:07,440 Speaker 4: our first trip, just trying to gather information, hearing all 85 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 4: of these crazy things about sex trafficking and stuff that 86 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 4: none of that made it into the podcast because we 87 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 4: weren't able to really corroborate some of it, but you know, 88 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:21,040 Speaker 4: we heard so many different things. So from the beginning, 89 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 4: we just had a huge task at our hands of 90 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 4: kind of parsing fact from fiction. And that's what happens 91 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 4: in these small towns. Gossip becomes fact over the years. 92 00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:36,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, from my perspective, it was such a powerful experience, 93 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:40,960 Speaker 1: and not in the least part because of the fact 94 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:46,360 Speaker 1: that we were with the families of both the person 95 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:51,200 Speaker 1: who was murdered, Jessica Kurrn, who was so viciously brutally 96 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 1: murdered at the young age of eighteen, and the man 97 00:04:56,520 --> 00:05:02,039 Speaker 1: who is still in prison after twenty plus years. I'm 98 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: just going to say, for having not committed this crime right, 99 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:08,039 Speaker 1: but being charged with it and convicted of it anyway, 100 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 1: And so pretty unusual but not unprecedented to have these 101 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:17,479 Speaker 1: two families united in wanting justice for their kids. 102 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 4: It's so rare that we see the victims family standing 103 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 4: up for the accused. So that just speaks volumes to 104 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 4: the characture of the currents of Jessica's family to be 105 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 4: able to use their own critical thinking skills and see 106 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:40,039 Speaker 4: outside of the prosecution's narrative that something wasn't right. 107 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 1: They're not gullible people, right, And so I think that 108 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 1: consciously or subconsciously, the cops and prosecutors that were involved 109 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:53,200 Speaker 1: in this case expected that this would just go away. 110 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:55,839 Speaker 1: They would make an arrest, the family would be happy, 111 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:58,719 Speaker 1: the headlines would run, everyone would get a pat on 112 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: the back, maybe a rais or motion, and everyone would 113 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: move on. But they don't understand apparently, who Joe Current 114 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 1: is and what his family is. They're pillars of the community, yes, 115 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 1: and they are extremely devoted parents and they are not 116 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 1: going to be trifled with or pushed aside as the 117 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 1: authorities wanted them to be. They're not docile. 118 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:30,279 Speaker 4: You know, you just hit on something is that Joe 119 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:35,360 Speaker 4: was an important member of this community. He had, you know, 120 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 4: grown up here, he worked at the fire department. You know, 121 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 4: he did everything right. He was the correct kind of 122 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:46,760 Speaker 4: person of color in this segregated town. He grew up 123 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:50,600 Speaker 4: during segregation and was able to overcome a lot of that. 124 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:52,839 Speaker 4: He has a successful business. 125 00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:53,080 Speaker 3: Now. 126 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,480 Speaker 4: You know, those were difficult things at the time. And 127 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 4: you know, when Jessica died, he expected that community that 128 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 4: he gave so much to give back to him and 129 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 4: he didn't get that. And you know, one of the 130 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 4: things we did want to put in and because it 131 00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 4: just spoke so much to this community. Was David Cross. 132 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 1: David Cross, of course is Quincy Cross's father. 133 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:16,760 Speaker 4: Both of those dads, they both were pillars in their community. 134 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 4: They both survived segregation. David Cross still has a little 135 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 4: segregated one room schoolhouse in the back of his yard 136 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 4: that he went to school in as a little black boy. 137 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 4: This shack and I said to him, I said, where'd 138 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 4: the white kids go? He said, to the nice school 139 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:34,840 Speaker 4: down the street. So you know, these are men who 140 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 4: have survived and been through so much, and to see 141 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 4: them being a team instead of adversaries, it was so 142 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:49,080 Speaker 4: beautiful and humbling because they fought through the civil rights movement. 143 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 4: I mean, freaking Joe Kern was out there protesting for 144 00:07:51,880 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 4: civil rights. Like Joe Kern's other son just died. Like 145 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 4: they have been through so much. I don't know how 146 00:07:59,840 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 4: you get out of bed and keep fighting. 147 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: You're listening to Wrongful Conviction. You can listen to this 148 00:08:18,520 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 1: and all the Lava for Good podcasts one week early 149 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:24,560 Speaker 1: and ad free by subscribing to Lava for Good Plus 150 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts. 151 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:34,079 Speaker 2: One of the initial suspects in this case was named 152 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:37,200 Speaker 2: Jeremy Adams. He had a child with the victim and 153 00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 2: was indicted alongside Carlos or Lolo Saxton, the victim's boyfriend 154 00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:45,240 Speaker 2: at the time, but when the case was mishandled, their 155 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:49,199 Speaker 2: indictments were dismissed, at which point a friend of Jeremy's mother, 156 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:53,679 Speaker 2: a woman named Susan Golbreanth, began offering rewards on social media, 157 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 2: which brought her alleged witnesses, and the story that emerged 158 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 2: was a complete break from the narrative of the original indictment. 159 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:04,040 Speaker 2: It involved group sex in which Jessica was allegedly involved 160 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:09,280 Speaker 2: before and after her death. Interestingly, this steered everyone away 161 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:12,920 Speaker 2: from Susan's friend's son Jeremy and eventually grabbed the attention 162 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 2: of a BBC reporter, catapulting Susan's ideas into becoming the 163 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:19,680 Speaker 2: state's narrative. 164 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:27,079 Speaker 4: In this case, the story that is created this crazy 165 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 4: orgy sex, disgusting. 166 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:33,959 Speaker 3: Whatever acroyphilia yes thrown even. 167 00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:38,679 Speaker 4: In everywhere, this was not the original story. First of all, 168 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:42,199 Speaker 4: there was no evidence at all, zero that she was 169 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 4: sexually assaulted, so then this story doesn't even come about 170 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,079 Speaker 4: until four or five years later when Susan and the 171 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:52,920 Speaker 4: reporter get involved and it's actually the reporter who picks 172 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:54,960 Speaker 4: up on while her underwear wasn't on her, so there 173 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 4: must have been a sexual assault. Q a few years 174 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 4: later to the KBI than and grotesquely asking these women 175 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:05,680 Speaker 4: how much semen quincy cross sprayed all over the room. 176 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:09,679 Speaker 4: There was no semen in the room. Jason, where is 177 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:13,079 Speaker 4: this coming from? That is the most shocking thing to me. 178 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:17,120 Speaker 4: How we got to this insane, disturbing, disgusting story where 179 00:10:17,160 --> 00:10:22,199 Speaker 4: you hear KBI officers pressing young women about where semen 180 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 4: was sprayed and there's not an ounce of semen in 181 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:28,360 Speaker 4: this case? How does that happen? So one of the 182 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,280 Speaker 4: things we found out when reporting, and it's all public record, 183 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:35,960 Speaker 4: is we had emails between Susan Galbreath, the Citizen investigator 184 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 4: to say it kindly, and a BBC journalist that she 185 00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 4: reached out to saying, you know, there's this crazy story 186 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 4: and you should be here reporting this, and we have 187 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 4: their emails that they wrote back and forth. 188 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:48,480 Speaker 3: To each other. 189 00:10:48,559 --> 00:10:52,360 Speaker 4: And what we've discovered was that this story that was 190 00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:55,880 Speaker 4: put out there by the media, specifically this BBC journalist, 191 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,720 Speaker 4: was half truths. We saw in these emails that actually 192 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 4: a lot of the information that was being put out 193 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 4: was actually not true, and the journalist knew beforehand, had 194 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 4: gotten some email saying, look this information of people you 195 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 4: know saying they did this, they've recanted, and instead of 196 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:16,439 Speaker 4: reporting the facts saying, hey, these people said this, but 197 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 4: they have recanted. So it's a little unclear. This story 198 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 4: was driven that these are the people they did this. 199 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:26,440 Speaker 4: They said they did this. There was even a point 200 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:30,160 Speaker 4: where they reported that Quincy Cross was stalking Susan Goalbreath, 201 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 4: only to find out later it was her own husband 202 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 4: stalking her. Yet no correction was ever made. 203 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,079 Speaker 1: Right, so this stalker I hadn't even heard about that. 204 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,839 Speaker 4: So yeah, so Susan was actually going through either a 205 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 4: divorce or had been divorced at the time, and her 206 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:50,839 Speaker 4: husband was like harassing and stalking her, and she was 207 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:55,199 Speaker 4: telling this reporter it was Quincy Cross, so this reporter 208 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:58,320 Speaker 4: was just taking her word for it, and really that's 209 00:11:58,400 --> 00:11:58,680 Speaker 4: kind of. 210 00:11:58,720 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 3: What we found. 211 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:03,719 Speaker 4: There was a lot of taking of Susan's word. And 212 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 4: then her friend who was quote working with her, this 213 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 4: woman named Lacey Gates, was actually then going to the 214 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,559 Speaker 4: reporter saying, hey, the thing Susan's telling you don't seem 215 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:16,920 Speaker 4: to actually be accurate and bore out by facts, and 216 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 4: that's when we started realizing there was something more than 217 00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 4: just malpractice. There was really an effort to kind of 218 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:28,880 Speaker 4: make Susan look like this, this wonderful helper lady, this 219 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:32,520 Speaker 4: victim of Quincy Cross, and it was a made for 220 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 4: TV story from the beginning. They were hoping for movie 221 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 4: deals with this fantastic story they created. So that's the 222 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:43,439 Speaker 4: kind of trickery that we were dealing with with this 223 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:47,679 Speaker 4: story and this specific journalist and their reporting. 224 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:52,439 Speaker 1: So, Maggie, this is a really full circle kind of 225 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:56,200 Speaker 1: a feeling that I'm having about Bone Valley Graves County 226 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:59,760 Speaker 1: right season three of Bone Valley, because it just occurred 227 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:03,120 Speaker 1: to me that if not for the media attention that 228 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:07,040 Speaker 1: Susan and what became her sort of partner in this 229 00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: frame job, if not for the fact that they've been 230 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:13,199 Speaker 1: able to get the media on board with the nonsensical 231 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:16,800 Speaker 1: theories that they cooked up for a variety of reasons 232 00:13:16,880 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 1: and motives, they could have never gotten this conviction in 233 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:21,679 Speaker 1: the first place. 234 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 4: Right. 235 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 1: So now, what I'm hoping is that the full circle 236 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:28,720 Speaker 1: of it all is that Graves County Podcast will actually 237 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:31,079 Speaker 1: be like the counterweight right and fix it. 238 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:34,640 Speaker 4: It is really meta to have another journalist come in 239 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 4: and try and fix this and make it right. And 240 00:13:38,240 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 4: that just speaks so much to the importance of journalism ethics. 241 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 4: When you find out something before you report a piece 242 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:51,360 Speaker 4: that really shatters the entire narrative you're going to report, 243 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 4: you need to say that otherwise it's dishonest. 244 00:13:54,640 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 3: And that's what we got in this story, Maggie. 245 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:14,080 Speaker 1: This case is unique for a number of reasons. One 246 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,559 Speaker 1: is that most wrongful conviction cases involve one person being 247 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 1: wrongfully convicted. This ain't that right. This involves a slew 248 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 1: of wrongfully charged and or convicted people. Can you explain 249 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 1: what I mean by. 250 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 4: That Nine people were charged for one murder and there 251 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 4: were countless stories that these people were charged under. You know, 252 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 4: we go into the podcast how the prosecution story had 253 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 4: to change because the original story that they thought of, well, 254 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 4: Quincy was in jail, so he couldn't have been burning 255 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,720 Speaker 4: a body. So then they have to now involve another 256 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:50,960 Speaker 4: person who could have burned and moved this body. So 257 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 4: they find Isaac Benjamin. This kid was charged and convicted 258 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:59,560 Speaker 4: for moving Jessica's body. We don't even freaking know who 259 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:03,320 Speaker 4: this is, how he relates to anybody? We don't mention 260 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 4: him by name in the podcast, But Isaac Benjamin is 261 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:08,960 Speaker 4: another one who was charged and convicted. There were two 262 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 4: other people who were charged. Austin Leach, he was actually 263 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:17,040 Speaker 4: acquitted in this Austin Leach is charged. It's his car, 264 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 4: they're saying did this. He's acquitted. But where is Austin 265 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 4: Leach's car in this trial? Where's Austin Leach's name? Where 266 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:28,720 Speaker 4: aren't we talking about this man that helped move this body? Right? 267 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:32,040 Speaker 4: Why aren't we talking about Isaac Benjamin who allegedly helped 268 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 4: burn and move this body? 269 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: You know? 270 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,760 Speaker 4: And what happened to Jeremy and Lolo the first two 271 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 4: people who were charged under a completely different story. Like, 272 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 4: I am at a loss for words sometimes when I 273 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 4: think of if anyone and this is probably why Joe 274 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 4: kurran knew something was wrong. How are each of these 275 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:54,840 Speaker 4: people being charged under this one's story when at Quincy's 276 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,720 Speaker 4: trial their names don't even come up as accomplices. It 277 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:03,240 Speaker 4: just makes no sense. And the scariest thing to me 278 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 4: is that this prosecutor has been in office since nineteen 279 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 4: eighty two, Jason nineteen eighty two. This woman Barbara mains Wayy. 280 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 4: We have identified at least five people we believe are 281 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 4: wrongfully convicted under Barbara Mainz Whaley. 282 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that five wrongful convictions include the ones from 283 00:16:24,680 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 1: this case. 284 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 4: That is, the ones from this case. That's the ones 285 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 4: I'm talking about. 286 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know which. 287 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 4: Are there any others? I'm sure there are. 288 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: We I mean, these things tend to be in clusters. 289 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:38,080 Speaker 1: We know that, right, because it becomes a pattern. Right 290 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:40,960 Speaker 1: when people do this and they find that it's good 291 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 1: for them in their career or whatever their ambitions are, 292 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: they do it again because there don't seem to be 293 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: any repercussible There aren't any repercussions for them, right. The 294 00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 1: prosecutors have absolute immunity. Police have qualified immunity. And what 295 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: that means in practical terms is they basically, what it 296 00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 1: means in simplest terms is they never get in trouble 297 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 1: for doing this stuff. Almost never. This one stinks from 298 00:17:04,600 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: the top. 299 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:06,600 Speaker 3: That's what it is. You just said. 300 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 4: It's the top down and these people, these humans are 301 00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 4: dealing with this consequence of the corruptibility of power. 302 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 1: You know, the beauty of this podcast. Advocacy is a 303 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 1: term that maybe I coined it, I don't know, but 304 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 1: I'd like to use it. That we do is that 305 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:30,880 Speaker 1: sometimes it actually causes people to straighten up and fly right, 306 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:35,160 Speaker 1: and we're hoping against hope, and it's important. If you've 307 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:39,080 Speaker 1: already listened to Bone Valley Braves County, then you know, 308 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 1: get involved, talk about it, put it on your social media, 309 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 1: send a letter somewhere, send an email. 310 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 4: The governor to Kentucky Governor. I mean, you could send 311 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:51,240 Speaker 4: it to the AG's office, but who knows what that's. 312 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 3: Going to do. 313 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:55,520 Speaker 1: Barbara mains Waley is the Assistant Attorney General and she's 314 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:59,200 Speaker 1: been in that position for decades and decades. I can't 315 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:01,639 Speaker 1: imagine that she's going to go back and reinvestigate her 316 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 1: own case. But the governor, that's probably the way to go. 317 00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:07,360 Speaker 1: That's what i'd recommend people right to the governor. We're 318 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:09,080 Speaker 1: going to put a linked in the episode description for 319 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 1: where you can write and be respectful. It doesn't make 320 00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:14,840 Speaker 1: sense to curse anybody out or do anything like that. 321 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:16,800 Speaker 1: You may want to time you finished listening to the 322 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 1: sixth episode, but the fact is the best thing to 323 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,200 Speaker 1: do is be respectful and just make it known that 324 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:26,440 Speaker 1: you're upset about this. You're outraged. So Maggie, any closing 325 00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:30,600 Speaker 1: thoughts before we wrap up this very special, unique episode 326 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 1: of Wrongful Conviction. 327 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:36,760 Speaker 4: I think our listeners will surely understand. 328 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:39,719 Speaker 3: You know that this is not unique. 329 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,920 Speaker 4: What happened to Quincy Cross and all the others is 330 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:45,480 Speaker 4: not unique. This happens all the time. But I would 331 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 4: love to say, please share it. I mean, it's a 332 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:52,160 Speaker 4: digestible story. It's an interesting story, it's a mystery. There's 333 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:53,160 Speaker 4: twists and turns. 334 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:54,119 Speaker 3: But the person you. 335 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 4: Share it with will learn something about wrongful convictions on 336 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 4: the criminal legal system. So it's not just a wrongful conviction. 337 00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:03,680 Speaker 4: It's something people can learn from. There's so much in 338 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 4: it besides just the wrongful conviction. I mean, there's stories 339 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,480 Speaker 4: of girlhood and being a child, and like I said, 340 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:12,879 Speaker 4: power and corruption and there's so much there. So I 341 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,520 Speaker 4: think you know, if you love the podcast, please please 342 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:18,880 Speaker 4: please share it with somebody who might not know what's 343 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 4: going on in this area of the world. 344 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:29,680 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction. You can listen 345 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,120 Speaker 1: to this and all the Lava for Good podcasts one 346 00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:35,119 Speaker 1: week early and ad free by subscribing to Lava for 347 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: Good plus on Apple Podcasts. I want to thank our 348 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,199 Speaker 1: production team Connor Hall and Kathleen Fink, as well as 349 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 1: my fellow executive producers Jeff Kempler, Kevin Wartis, and Jeff Cliber. 350 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: The music in this production was supplied by three time 351 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:50,359 Speaker 1: OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us 352 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:53,200 Speaker 1: across all social media platforms at Lava for Good and 353 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:56,400 Speaker 1: at Wrongful Conviction. You can also follow me on Instagram 354 00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 1: at It's Jason Flamm. Wrongful Conviction is a production of 355 00:19:59,440 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 1: Lava for Good Podcasts and association with Signal Company Number One. 356 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:05,600 Speaker 2: We have worked hard to ensure that all facts reported 357 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:08,480 Speaker 2: in this show are accurate. The views and opinions expressed 358 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 2: by the individuals featured in this show are their own 359 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:13,720 Speaker 2: and do not necessarily reflect those of Lava for Good.