1
00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:13,880
Speaker 1: The Armstrong and getting show very sure. I'm sorry as

2
00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,239
Speaker 1: we await for the records from the National Archives. Are

3
00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:21,439
Speaker 1: you absolutely certain? Are you absolutely positive there is no

4
00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:26,720
Speaker 1: record of any complaint by terror read against you. I

5
00:00:26,720 --> 00:00:29,840
Speaker 1: am absolutely positive that no one that I'm aware of

6
00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:34,040
Speaker 1: ever has been made aware of any complaint, a formal

7
00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:38,400
Speaker 1: complaint made by or a complaint by terror read against

8
00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:42,200
Speaker 1: me at the time this allegedly happened twenty seven years ago,

9
00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:45,760
Speaker 1: or until the I announced for Prett well, I was

10
00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:47,760
Speaker 1: a guess it was in April or May this year.

11
00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:51,479
Speaker 1: So that's from Joe Biden this morning. Now he did it.

12
00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:54,440
Speaker 1: At some point he opened with the unequivocally stated that

13
00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:58,640
Speaker 1: that's never happened. He never u raped or whatever you

14
00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:01,320
Speaker 1: want to call it, this woman terror read. I said

15
00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:03,400
Speaker 1: to Sean, though, we might as well play the embarrassing

16
00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:06,080
Speaker 1: Biden clip, and Sean said, Sean said, You're gonna have

17
00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:10,679
Speaker 1: to be more specific, but um, I picked out the

18
00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,240
Speaker 1: one where he sounded the worst, but mostly it was fine.

19
00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:15,400
Speaker 1: It was Joe Biden saying, no, I never did this. Uh,

20
00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:17,199
Speaker 1: I didn't do anything like this. I've never done anything

21
00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:20,520
Speaker 1: like this. There's no complaint blah, blah blah, and we're

22
00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,560
Speaker 1: thinking it's over. Lany j h N is the David

23
00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:26,400
Speaker 1: and Diane Stiffy Research Fellow to over Institution Director of

24
00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:30,640
Speaker 1: Domestic Policy Studies at Stanford University, and Jones is now

25
00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,160
Speaker 1: long here. How are you, sir? I am fine. How

26
00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:36,400
Speaker 1: are you? Gentlemen? We're We're great, you know, all things considered.

27
00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:39,480
Speaker 1: So do you think the Joe Biden sexual assault thing

28
00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:44,399
Speaker 1: is more or less over? Um? You know? I I

29
00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,520
Speaker 1: don't know, And I say I don't know because the

30
00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:51,760
Speaker 1: Democratic Party and where it is now, uh, it's very

31
00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:54,160
Speaker 1: different than where the Democratic Party was when Joe Biden

32
00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:56,560
Speaker 1: spent most of his time in politics. And what I

33
00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:00,280
Speaker 1: mean by that is the elements of the far left

34
00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:03,080
Speaker 1: that have essentially occupied the party. And we saw this

35
00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:06,480
Speaker 1: during during the presidential primary. I think we're going to

36
00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:09,160
Speaker 1: continue to push Biden. They're going to continue to push

37
00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:13,160
Speaker 1: him on this, and while uther ordinary circumstances, an interview

38
00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:15,400
Speaker 1: like that would have would have kind of lanced the boil.

39
00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:18,400
Speaker 1: I'm just not so sure that folks are going to

40
00:02:18,440 --> 00:02:21,160
Speaker 1: be willing to let go of this at this point.

41
00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:24,239
Speaker 1: And this is just one of those issues. It's really hard.

42
00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:27,519
Speaker 1: I mean, how do you square what he said with

43
00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:30,640
Speaker 1: the way that he treated, for example, Brett Kavanaugh during

44
00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:33,200
Speaker 1: during the Kavanaugh confirmation hearings. I think, I think these

45
00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:35,560
Speaker 1: are questions that are going to continue, and I'm just

46
00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:37,840
Speaker 1: not sure that that interview today did it well. I

47
00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:39,880
Speaker 1: get those a questions from the right because I do

48
00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:42,400
Speaker 1: still have those questions. The way you wanted to change

49
00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:44,919
Speaker 1: college campuses, the way you went after Kavanaugh, I need

50
00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:48,240
Speaker 1: more explanation for how that squares with this. But in

51
00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:50,760
Speaker 1: terms of the left, what would the left push him

52
00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:54,320
Speaker 1: to do? I mean, what else can he do well?

53
00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:56,400
Speaker 1: I I think you know, you saw this with the

54
00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,760
Speaker 1: Washington Post editorial board saying he ought to release his

55
00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:02,160
Speaker 1: pay ferms, make make them completely open. The ones that

56
00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:05,280
Speaker 1: are that are that are held at the University of Delaware. Um,

57
00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:08,560
Speaker 1: I think more questions will arise. There's some dispute, for example,

58
00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:11,600
Speaker 1: over whether, in fact the National Archives is the place

59
00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,840
Speaker 1: where a complaint from his Senate time would be would

60
00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:18,200
Speaker 1: be held. I think that's that's a question. Yeah, he

61
00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:20,720
Speaker 1: said no personnel stuff would be in those archives that

62
00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:24,680
Speaker 1: people are demanding opening, so there's just no point. Yeah.

63
00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:27,359
Speaker 1: But but you know, I think that's not going to

64
00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:30,320
Speaker 1: be satisfactory to some, you know, particularly and hit who

65
00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:32,120
Speaker 1: are the thing on the left comes to play because

66
00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:34,680
Speaker 1: I think on the left, you know, there there are

67
00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:37,520
Speaker 1: some who are agitating and saying, look, you know, is

68
00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:40,440
Speaker 1: there more there? We cannot have a nominee of our

69
00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:44,680
Speaker 1: party who the nominally Democratic party, that is, who who

70
00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,520
Speaker 1: is tainted by this kind of thing, and they want

71
00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,200
Speaker 1: to know more. Now that may just be a way

72
00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,240
Speaker 1: of them trying to get Biden out, which is highly

73
00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,880
Speaker 1: highly probable now. But my point is simply that I

74
00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,080
Speaker 1: just think that that the agitation among some core that

75
00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,440
Speaker 1: the left is going to continue to dog his campaign.

76
00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:05,840
Speaker 1: So yeah, I'm reminded of the quote from Orwell that

77
00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:07,920
Speaker 1: we more or less started the show with this morning,

78
00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:12,360
Speaker 1: in which he's talking about the the reason you acquire

79
00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:16,040
Speaker 1: powers for power. Power is the goal, and if the

80
00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:19,039
Speaker 1: AOC crowd can get rid of the last vestige of

81
00:04:19,080 --> 00:04:22,440
Speaker 1: the old moderate Democrat crowd, they don't care if they

82
00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,240
Speaker 1: lose to Trump in the doing of that, in the

83
00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:28,800
Speaker 1: same way that like your dispatch anti Trump Republicans, they're

84
00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,880
Speaker 1: more than willing to lose to Biden to get rid

85
00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:34,479
Speaker 1: of Trump. So anyway, oh a. Speaking of the election

86
00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,039
Speaker 1: and parties and the rest of it. As a libertarian

87
00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:40,120
Speaker 1: leaning fellow, I was fairly excited to see Justin Amash,

88
00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:44,039
Speaker 1: a non crackpot mostly get into the race. What do

89
00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:45,240
Speaker 1: we know about him? What do you think of the

90
00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:48,080
Speaker 1: dynamics of that if if indeed he doesn't, I think

91
00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:51,040
Speaker 1: he will. Yeah, you know, this is a tough one.

92
00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:53,200
Speaker 1: I've kind of heard it argued both ways that his

93
00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,560
Speaker 1: presence hurts Biden and his presence hurts Trump. I've kind

94
00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:59,200
Speaker 1: of heard it both ways. I mean, look, I think

95
00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,159
Speaker 1: our political them is better off when we have people

96
00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:06,279
Speaker 1: who fill parts of of lanes or parts of people's

97
00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:10,440
Speaker 1: political interests that wouldn't be filled otherwise. And I do

98
00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:12,600
Speaker 1: think that there are a number of people who are

99
00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:16,080
Speaker 1: concerned on the right about how the Republican Party seems

100
00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:21,680
Speaker 1: increasingly comfortable embracing big government, how it's increasingly comfortable embracing

101
00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:25,680
Speaker 1: lots of spending, how it's increasingly comfortable embracing the role

102
00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:29,120
Speaker 1: of the nanny state in in policing people's lives. And

103
00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:31,720
Speaker 1: I think that Amash presents an alternative to them now

104
00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,880
Speaker 1: for the left. Yeah, so you you just explained the

105
00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,320
Speaker 1: part to me, that makes the most sense. So that

106
00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:41,200
Speaker 1: damages a Republican candidate because he's small government. But I

107
00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:43,680
Speaker 1: I have heard also the arguments that it hurts Biden more.

108
00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:47,320
Speaker 1: Please explain that to me. I don't get it at all. Well,

109
00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:50,640
Speaker 1: I think I think that the notion there is that

110
00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:53,880
Speaker 1: you've got this this uh, this this sort of group

111
00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:58,000
Speaker 1: of voters who are they're just uncomfortable with Biden for

112
00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:01,040
Speaker 1: whatever reason, but they can't vote for Trump because they

113
00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:02,760
Speaker 1: really don't like Trump, so they need to put their

114
00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,159
Speaker 1: votes somewhere else, So they're gonna put it with Justin

115
00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:09,440
Speaker 1: Amash that basically he's a placeholder for whatever it is

116
00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:13,080
Speaker 1: they don't like about about about Joe Biden and they

117
00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:15,599
Speaker 1: don't like about Donald Trump. I don't think that's a

118
00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,960
Speaker 1: very big percentage of people to to sort of betray

119
00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:21,800
Speaker 1: my my my true feeling on this. I don't think

120
00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:23,920
Speaker 1: there's a ton of people who would vote that way.

121
00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:26,560
Speaker 1: But the idea again is just do you have an

122
00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:29,320
Speaker 1: alternative to vote for who's not you know, you just

123
00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:32,640
Speaker 1: you really don't like Joe Biden for whatever reason, and

124
00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:34,800
Speaker 1: you can't bring yourself to vote for Trump, and then

125
00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,960
Speaker 1: you vote for someone like Amash, who has been you know,

126
00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:41,280
Speaker 1: principled on on a number of different things. Uh. And

127
00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:42,800
Speaker 1: so you know that's where you that's where you put

128
00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:45,120
Speaker 1: your vote. Hey, Jack, do you mind if we do

129
00:06:45,160 --> 00:06:47,240
Speaker 1: a minute. I know we've been talking about this a lot,

130
00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,120
Speaker 1: but it's always great to talk to Lani Chan of

131
00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,560
Speaker 1: the Hoover Institution, Stanford University and get your point of view.

132
00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:55,080
Speaker 1: Alan he let's talk a little bit about civil liberties

133
00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:57,919
Speaker 1: in the COVID response. What's your take on what's happening

134
00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:03,880
Speaker 1: these days? Well, people are understandably uncomfortable with the idea,

135
00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:07,480
Speaker 1: for example, of tech companies like you know, Apple and

136
00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:11,320
Speaker 1: Facebook having more control over personal data that could be

137
00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:13,520
Speaker 1: used at some point down the road for for for

138
00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:16,280
Speaker 1: the gain of those companies. It'll be one thing if

139
00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:18,120
Speaker 1: you said, look, we're going to use the data to

140
00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:21,920
Speaker 1: gelocate people to ensure we're not spreading coronavirus. That's one thing.

141
00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:25,920
Speaker 1: But I think people are are nervous because the tech

142
00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:29,280
Speaker 1: companies in particular have been shown to not be trustworthy. Well,

143
00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:31,280
Speaker 1: what about the in the limited time we have and

144
00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:34,200
Speaker 1: I'm sorry to interrupt, but what about the mass closures

145
00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:37,920
Speaker 1: of so many businesses and the rationale going from flattening

146
00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:40,840
Speaker 1: the curve to just eliminating cases if we can. Yeah,

147
00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:43,720
Speaker 1: just last night you had Southern California say no, we

148
00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:47,720
Speaker 1: make our own decisions in our county, not the governor. Yeah.

149
00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:50,440
Speaker 1: I mean to be clear that the goal post keeps

150
00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:53,440
Speaker 1: shifting on this. The reason why we were sheltering in

151
00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:55,760
Speaker 1: place to flatten the curve was precisely because we didn't

152
00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:58,360
Speaker 1: want to overburden our health care system. It's clear our

153
00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:00,760
Speaker 1: healthcare system is not going to be overbur so now

154
00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,960
Speaker 1: that we've achieved that goal, we do need to responsibly

155
00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:06,400
Speaker 1: reopen the economy. We we cannot be out there. I've

156
00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:08,240
Speaker 1: heard people argue, but what we need to do is

157
00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:10,720
Speaker 1: we need to save every life possible. That that is

158
00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:12,800
Speaker 1: not the goal of public policy in this case. It

159
00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:16,200
Speaker 1: should not be the goal because it's unachievable fundamentally, we

160
00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:18,120
Speaker 1: we we have to realize that. By the way, there's

161
00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:21,320
Speaker 1: a ton of other problems with closing the economy and

162
00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:26,280
Speaker 1: keeping it closed. People's livelihood, of people's health that's affected too. Yeah,

163
00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:27,880
Speaker 1: that's the point we've been trying to make. And it

164
00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:32,280
Speaker 1: was funny, strange I read this allegedly great peace in Politico,

165
00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:35,160
Speaker 1: in which the guide did not even acknowledge that a

166
00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:39,000
Speaker 1: crushed economy will cost lives maybe half as many lives

167
00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:42,160
Speaker 1: as the COVID, maybe as many, maybe three times as many.

168
00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:45,240
Speaker 1: So we're not trading lives for money. We're trading lives

169
00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:49,439
Speaker 1: for money and lives. Yeah, and and and that's one thing,

170
00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:52,320
Speaker 1: by the way, these epidemiological models they never account for

171
00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:55,440
Speaker 1: They don't account for the fact that people are sheltering

172
00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:58,160
Speaker 1: in place, which means rates of obesity and rates of

173
00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:01,040
Speaker 1: other diseases are going to rise. That elective procedures have

174
00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:04,280
Speaker 1: been canceled, which means cancer diagnoses have been missed. There's

175
00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:06,400
Speaker 1: all sorts of things. And I'm not saying that that

176
00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:08,840
Speaker 1: the number of those people overwhelmed the number of people

177
00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:10,679
Speaker 1: who would have died from coronavirus. But you've gotta you

178
00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:13,480
Speaker 1: gotta consider all of that, and public policy has to

179
00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:15,800
Speaker 1: be balanced. It can't be out of balance. And I

180
00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:17,839
Speaker 1: fear that right now there's a little bit about a

181
00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:21,000
Speaker 1: balance in some states, California especially. Well, we appreciate you

182
00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:22,640
Speaker 1: taking the time to talk to us today. I hope

183
00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:25,880
Speaker 1: you're you and yours are healthy. We are, thank you.

184
00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:31,040
Speaker 1: Thanks lon um I heard another explanation of why they

185
00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,800
Speaker 1: Some people think that Amash getting into the races libertarian

186
00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,000
Speaker 1: hurts Biden more than Trump. I could get into that

187
00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:39,600
Speaker 1: if you get next hour. If you don't grab it

188
00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:42,520
Speaker 1: at Armstrong and Guinea dot com via podcast. If you're like, yeah,

189
00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:44,480
Speaker 1: I'm kind of mystified by that theory too, so I'd

190
00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,679
Speaker 1: like to hear it. There's another hour of this show.

191
00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,319
Speaker 1: Some people get it very exciting. Armstrong and