WEBVTT - The Girlfriends S2/E4: Desperately Seeking Susie 0:00:06.519 --> 0:00:06.880 Novel. 0:00:11.119 --> 0:00:14.240 Hey, listener, in this episode, we'll talk a lot about 0:00:14.320 --> 0:00:19.040 acts of extreme violence, including murder. We'll mention serial killers, 0:00:19.160 --> 0:00:22.239 and we'll speak about drug use and sex work. But 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:26.160 also we'll hear our very own doctor, detective Mindy Shapiro, 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:29.800 get the chance to spar with a real life police detective. 0:00:30.720 --> 0:00:34.040 If you feel impacted by any of the themes while listening, 0:00:34.400 --> 0:00:37.559 I encourage you to check out our charity partner, DNA 0:00:37.640 --> 0:00:41.560 Doe Project. They work with law enforcement to identify Jane 0:00:41.600 --> 0:00:45.360 and John does using genetic genealogy in the hopes of 0:00:45.400 --> 0:00:49.640 reuniting the bodies of unidentified people with their families. You 0:00:49.680 --> 0:00:54.120 can find them at DNADO project dot org. And you 0:00:54.240 --> 0:00:57.160 already know you're probably gonna hear some swear words from me. 0:00:57.520 --> 0:00:59.200 I'm passionate. What can I tell you? 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:04.200 Do you mind if I send the text? Yeah, I 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:05.759 might get something right away. 0:01:06.280 --> 0:01:10.200 What who do you know? 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:14.440 In the last episode you heard producer Anna and Raoul 0:01:14.520 --> 0:01:19.240 Montero are New York citizen sleuth zeroing in on one killer, 0:01:19.319 --> 0:01:27.120 in particular, Joel Rifkin. Shortly before Anna went to visit Raoul, 0:01:27.440 --> 0:01:28.880 she got her hands on a book. 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:30.720 Not just any book. 0:01:31.240 --> 0:01:34.160 It's called from the Mouth of a Monster, which is 0:01:34.200 --> 0:01:38.840 written by someone who attended college with Rifkin. In the book, 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:43.440 Rifkin confesses to seventeen murders between nineteen eighty nine and 0:01:43.560 --> 0:01:47.440 nineteen ninety three. His first victim was a sex worker 0:01:47.520 --> 0:01:50.760 named Susie, who he killed in March of nineteen eighty nine. 0:01:51.520 --> 0:01:54.200 He told the books author about her murder and what 0:01:54.280 --> 0:01:55.680 he did with her remains. 0:01:57.440 --> 0:01:59.800 Driving back into New York City, he had it straight 0:01:59.840 --> 0:02:02.640 for an area near the East River in Lower Manhattan, 0:02:03.240 --> 0:02:05.600 the same area where he had been serviced by street 0:02:05.600 --> 0:02:09.960 walkers countless times before. His head was spinning as he 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:13.560 parked the truck and flung the bags containing Susie's arms 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:16.480 and torso into the frigid's swirling waters. 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:23.680 Holy shit, Rifkin dumps Susie's torso in the East River. 0:02:26.680 --> 0:02:28.359 And you know where The East River. 0:02:28.240 --> 0:02:34.560 Opens up into the Bay which flows directly towards Front Street, 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:43.080 Pier three, Staten Island. I'm Carol Fisher and from the 0:02:43.160 --> 0:02:46.800 teams at Novel and iHeart Podcast, this is the Girlfriend's 0:02:46.919 --> 0:03:28.280 Our Last Sister, Episode four, Desperately seeking Susie Coat. 0:03:28.680 --> 0:03:30.119 Am I taking us the wrong way? 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:31.760 Yes? 0:03:32.760 --> 0:03:35.520 That must be that way that way. 0:03:35.680 --> 0:03:39.000 I'm with Mindy and producer Anna in Alphabet City on 0:03:39.040 --> 0:03:40.960 the Lower East Side of Manhattan. 0:03:41.400 --> 0:03:43.680 Oh, I forgot to have too short legged peak pop. 0:03:43.720 --> 0:03:50.000 Here, Come on, Goliath, we're here because we've been mining 0:03:50.080 --> 0:03:53.480 from the mouth of a monster for more information. In 0:03:53.600 --> 0:03:56.160 the book, Riff can describe picking up a sex worker 0:03:56.240 --> 0:04:00.280 named Susie in Alphabet City back in the eighties. This 0:04:00.400 --> 0:04:03.480 block was one of New York's Red Lake districts. 0:04:03.880 --> 0:04:09.360 It feels powerful, like walking on pavements that you know somebody. 0:04:09.520 --> 0:04:12.600 Yet, Oh, it's really eerie to meet. 0:04:12.760 --> 0:04:15.640 Yeah, it's weird finding it with Yeah. 0:04:15.440 --> 0:04:17.599 We're walking towards Tompkins Square Park. 0:04:18.080 --> 0:04:20.760 It's a natural meeting point in the area and was 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:24.520 a popular hangout for sex workers. But according to our 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:27.599 resident New york Or Mindy, it has a radical pass 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:28.919 going back much further. 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:31.279 It was kind. 0:04:31.040 --> 0:04:35.760 Of the place where people stood on their soapboxes and 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:41.599 expressed dissenting views in the seventeen and eighteen hundreds, but 0:04:41.880 --> 0:04:47.400 then in the sixties and seventies it sort of became 0:04:47.480 --> 0:04:51.719 a free speech revolutionary place. 0:04:52.000 --> 0:04:54.479 And that would be the sound of a pneumatic drill. 0:04:54.960 --> 0:04:56.640 New York is such a peaceful place. 0:04:57.600 --> 0:05:02.120 In the seventies and eighties, it became sort of like 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:07.599 a needle park, and the vitat devastated during the AIDS epidemic. 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:12.840 The police kept on trying to clean it up, and 0:05:12.880 --> 0:05:13.360 they were. 0:05:13.360 --> 0:05:15.279 Like riots here. 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:20.360 I remember seeing as a kid lies on horseback and 0:05:20.920 --> 0:05:23.760 you know, with their batons. 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:27.279 At the time, there were clashes between the police and 0:05:27.360 --> 0:05:31.760 locals protesting against the gentrification of the park and homeless 0:05:31.760 --> 0:05:36.320 people being pushed out, but ultimately the police won the 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:39.440 Tompkins Square park that we're in todays, where trendy moms 0:05:39.480 --> 0:05:43.880 push around expensive strollers while sipping out lattes. We sit 0:05:44.000 --> 0:05:46.440 down on a bench and Anna pulls out a copy 0:05:46.480 --> 0:05:49.360 of the book From the Mouth of a Monster. 0:05:49.640 --> 0:05:57.599 An excerpt from the book where Joel confessed to earling Susie, 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:00.599 and I was wondering if maybe also want to read 0:06:00.640 --> 0:06:03.600 it because she proud about her Yeah. 0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:06.800 Okay, yeah, because reshig in silence is not good for 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:07.720 a podcast. 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:12.479 We're reading this book because we're longing to learn whatever 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:15.440 we can about this woman who could be our lost sister. 0:06:17.160 --> 0:06:18.760 She said her name was Susie. 0:06:19.040 --> 0:06:22.640 After they negotiated a price for her to accompany him 0:06:22.760 --> 0:06:27.840 to Long Island. The relationship quickly deteriorated and his blood 0:06:27.880 --> 0:06:31.359 began to boil. Before leaving the city, she wanted to 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:33.240 make a few stops for drugs. 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:35.679 First, we stopped at her girlfriend's house. 0:06:35.720 --> 0:06:40.120 Were called, Joel contemptuously, because you always have to take 0:06:40.160 --> 0:06:41.760 care of their narcotic need. 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:43.800 She's in this. 0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:47.640 Girl's bathroom like for hours as she chatted and smoked 0:06:47.640 --> 0:06:48.279 with her friend. 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:51.800 We're not going to read out the whole passage. It 0:06:51.839 --> 0:06:56.680 goes into graphic detail about Susie's violent death, but there 0:06:56.720 --> 0:06:59.880 is one moment that for us gives a small but 0:07:00.120 --> 0:07:04.080 powerful insight into who this woman was. It happened just 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:07.520 after Rifkin attacked her and thought she was already dead. 0:07:08.880 --> 0:07:13.160 To his horror, Susie suddenly popped up on the couch 0:07:13.480 --> 0:07:16.800 in a last ditch effort to salvage her life. She 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:20.440 tore into her assailant and out of shape man with 0:07:20.600 --> 0:07:24.160 all the strengths she could muster. She even bit my 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:26.200 finger almost to the bone. 0:07:26.320 --> 0:07:36.040 Joel said, how do you feel, count, I'm a little 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:39.800 in shock, actually, I'm just a little bit in All 0:07:39.880 --> 0:07:42.200 of her strength to get the shit kicked out of 0:07:42.200 --> 0:07:47.520 her and then to kind of rise again and try. 0:07:47.280 --> 0:07:49.440 To, you know, set herself free. 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:50.760 She must have. 0:07:50.800 --> 0:07:55.120 Been an amazingly strong woman, not just physically but emotionally. 0:07:56.240 --> 0:07:58.040 Yeah, it's just it's horrible. 0:07:58.280 --> 0:07:59.000 It's just horrific. 0:07:59.120 --> 0:08:07.040 Yeah, nothing living, nothing living, should die like that. 0:08:12.200 --> 0:08:15.360 The three of us contemplate what we've just heard as 0:08:15.440 --> 0:08:17.640 we watch the other people in the park pass by, 0:08:18.520 --> 0:08:21.320 people who are probably doing something much more normal with 0:08:21.360 --> 0:08:25.160 their days, and we wonder where. 0:08:24.840 --> 0:08:30.360 Do we go from here. We know that when the. 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:32.960 Book From the Mouth of a Monster was published in 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:37.880 two thousand and one, Susie's torso is still missing. But 0:08:38.000 --> 0:08:41.359 it's been over twenty years since this book was written. 0:08:41.200 --> 0:08:44.120 And we're wondering was she ever found. 0:08:45.160 --> 0:08:47.840 We put in a freedom of information request to Hope 0:08:47.840 --> 0:08:52.320 Well Police department, who handled the criminal investigation into Susie's murder, 0:08:53.080 --> 0:08:56.600 and luckily, unlike our usual track record, we don't need 0:08:56.600 --> 0:09:00.400 to wait very long for a response. It's more info 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:03.520 than we bargained for, So I call up Mindy and 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:04.200 ask her. 0:09:04.080 --> 0:09:05.120 To talk me through it. 0:09:07.200 --> 0:09:09.520 Oh, you don't even really want to know. 0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:12.319 Oh God, your tone doesn't sound good. 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:16.480 Yeah, well, I've gotten a whole bunch of information. 0:09:17.480 --> 0:09:21.480 I'm trying to be kind. This is kind of difficult information. 0:09:21.800 --> 0:09:24.840 Really yeah, it's bad. Yeah, it's like really bad. 0:09:25.480 --> 0:09:29.240 I read it and had an emotional reaction to it, 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:32.240 so hearing it might be difficult. 0:09:32.640 --> 0:09:37.080 Oh boy, Mindy's not wrong. It was difficult to hear. 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:42.720 So I'll cut to the chase. We told you before 0:09:42.760 --> 0:09:46.000 that Susie's torso was never found, but some of her 0:09:46.040 --> 0:09:51.319 other remains were. In March of nineteen eighty nine, Susie's 0:09:51.320 --> 0:09:54.359 head was discovered on a golf course in Hope Will Township, 0:09:54.440 --> 0:09:58.480 New Jersey, fifty five miles down from New York. A 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:01.880 short while later, her were discovered in a wooded area 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:08.720 sixty five miles away. Nobody could understand such a senseless killing, 0:10:09.200 --> 0:10:10.360 and at the time. 0:10:10.440 --> 0:10:12.640 Nobody could figure out who Susie was. 0:10:13.960 --> 0:10:16.920 But in these documents we see the great lens the 0:10:16.960 --> 0:10:20.920 police went to and trying to identify her. They did 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:24.880 nationwide requests asking for information on any missing person that 0:10:24.920 --> 0:10:27.960 would fit the description of the murdered woman. They put 0:10:28.000 --> 0:10:32.600 out flyers, held press conferences, They did canine searches, had 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:36.400 divers dredged lakes, and a helicopter did an aerial search. 0:10:36.440 --> 0:10:38.679 Of the golf course where her head was found. 0:10:39.360 --> 0:10:42.800 The police spoke to the FBI about building a psychological 0:10:42.840 --> 0:10:46.600 profile of the killer. They conducted interviews with parents of 0:10:46.640 --> 0:10:50.000 missing women who believed her remains could be their daughters 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:55.360 or sisters. After this initial flurry of activity, the case 0:10:55.440 --> 0:11:01.280 went cold. But then in two thousand one From the 0:11:01.320 --> 0:11:04.640 Mouth of a Monster came out and in the book, 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:09.280 Riskin admits to killing a woman he knew is Susie. 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:11.960 He then admits to dumping her head on a golf 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:17.000 course and her legs in a wooded area. It was 0:11:17.160 --> 0:11:20.600 clear he was talking about the same case the Hopewell 0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:24.960 cops have been investigating for twelve years, but when they 0:11:25.000 --> 0:11:29.840 put the name Susie or Susan into the missing person's databases, 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:31.360 nothing came up. 0:11:32.280 --> 0:11:37.400 Another dead end until she. 0:11:37.400 --> 0:11:39.520 Looks at it and she says, Yeah, I think you're right. 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:40.520 I think that's your girl. 0:12:01.440 --> 0:12:06.839 Hi, Stephen, it's wonderful to talk to transcontinentally. 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:07.240 Across the US. 0:12:07.360 --> 0:12:08.800 Him Anina, I'm. 0:12:08.640 --> 0:12:10.120 In northern California. 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:10.800 Where are you. 0:12:10.960 --> 0:12:13.920 I'm actually talking to you from Mammouth County, New Jersey. 0:12:14.120 --> 0:12:14.840 I know it well. 0:12:14.920 --> 0:12:19.439 I grew up across the river okay, hi mindy speaking 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:25.360 to Captain Stephen Orbanski, who in twenty thirteen was Detective Orbanski. 0:12:26.040 --> 0:12:28.960 Back then he was working in the missing persons unit, 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:31.520 and he was the guy you called when you wanted 0:12:31.559 --> 0:12:33.280 help getting to the bottom of a case. 0:12:33.880 --> 0:12:37.360 I was called by two detectors from Hopewell Township Police Department. 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:40.240 They called me for some advice and they want to 0:12:40.240 --> 0:12:42.440 get my personal opinion on what we can do more 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:43.000 with the case. 0:12:44.000 --> 0:12:46.800 The Hopewell cops pass on all of their case files 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:50.160 to Urbanski, but the thing that stands out the most 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:53.400 is the book where Riskin describes the first time he 0:12:53.480 --> 0:12:54.680 killed a sex worker. 0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:57.880 He said that he could only remember her name as Susie, 0:12:58.040 --> 0:12:59.800 but he didn't have a last name. He didn't know 0:12:59.800 --> 0:13:02.800 any anything about her. So now we're looking at a 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:04.320 girl named Susan. That's all we have. 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:04.720 Right. 0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:09.400 The first thing you do in trying to identify someone 0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:12.720 is look at the missing person's databases for a match. 0:13:13.320 --> 0:13:17.199 But when nothing turned up, Urbanski suggested trying something else, 0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:20.720 looking at arrest records of New York sex workers from 0:13:20.720 --> 0:13:22.679 the eighties and nineties. 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:25.120 And we pulled all the girls that were named Susan. 0:13:25.679 --> 0:13:28.160 There was one that I was able to look at. 0:13:28.360 --> 0:13:30.360 It was a girl by the name of Susan Spencer. 0:13:30.880 --> 0:13:33.800 That's kind of something that stuck out to me. We 0:13:34.080 --> 0:13:36.679 also noticed after her last arrest, she kind of went 0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:37.280 off the map. 0:13:39.640 --> 0:13:43.280 Urbanski was able to obtain an arrest photo of Susan Spencer. 0:13:44.000 --> 0:13:46.960 In it, he sees a pale woman with long, light 0:13:47.000 --> 0:13:50.360 brown hair and blue eyes. Her face is covered with 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:53.720 marks the kind you'd associate with the heavy drug user. 0:13:54.240 --> 0:13:57.680 But other than the photo, Urbanski struggled to find any 0:13:57.720 --> 0:13:59.640 other information in the system. 0:14:00.280 --> 0:14:04.959 We couldn't find any reports on Susan being missing. I 0:14:05.040 --> 0:14:07.560 think I went home that night after a long, long 0:14:07.640 --> 0:14:11.120 day of trying to look through pictures and doing interviews, 0:14:11.520 --> 0:14:13.920 you know, eating dinner, and right away open up my 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:17.240 laptop computer and I start looking at different websites. 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:21.080 Detective or Banski starts combing through New York and New 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:24.840 Jersey databases. He's hoping to match the arrest photo he 0:14:24.920 --> 0:14:26.720 has with the missing person's report. 0:14:27.360 --> 0:14:29.200 A picture came up, believe it or not. 0:14:29.280 --> 0:14:31.840 I actually get my wife involved, and she comes over 0:14:31.960 --> 0:14:34.720 yelling at me because I have these pictures throughout on 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:35.160 the top of. 0:14:35.200 --> 0:14:36.840 My table and I'm trying to review. 0:14:36.600 --> 0:14:40.360 It, but she looks at it and she says, yeah, 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:41.000 I think you're right. 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:42.000 I think that's your girl. 0:14:44.000 --> 0:14:46.800 But the missing woman's name isn't Susan Spencer. 0:14:48.640 --> 0:15:14.120 Her name is Heidi Bulch. The missing person's report for 0:15:14.160 --> 0:15:16.920 Heidi Balt was filed in two thousand and one by 0:15:16.960 --> 0:15:20.280 her aunt, Robin. At the time, Robin lived in New York, 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:23.160 so the detectives decided to pay her a visit. 0:15:23.760 --> 0:15:25.840 Pulling up to New York City, it's a lot going on. 0:15:25.880 --> 0:15:28.440 There's a lot of traffic, you know, people walking by, and. 0:15:28.320 --> 0:15:30.600 We pull up to this high rise building. It was 0:15:30.640 --> 0:15:31.920 more of apartment complex. 0:15:32.400 --> 0:15:34.920 I don't know how to explain how I felt that day, 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:37.880 but definitely excited, like is this it? Is this going 0:15:37.960 --> 0:15:39.520 to be the person that we looking for? 0:15:39.680 --> 0:15:43.080 Is this the answer an answer that the Hoopwo Police 0:15:43.080 --> 0:15:47.040 Department had been searching for for twenty four years. 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:49.920 I remember knocking on the door and an elderly lady 0:15:49.960 --> 0:15:52.680 answered the door, and I think just her face alone 0:15:52.840 --> 0:15:56.320 was like that total shock, you know, is this about Heidi. 0:15:58.280 --> 0:16:01.520 Urbanski and his colleagues try to find out more information 0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:03.120 about Heidi from her aunt. 0:16:03.960 --> 0:16:05.760 She kind of talked her up, saying that she was 0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:08.080 a good kid growing up and she just got involved 0:16:08.080 --> 0:16:10.200 with the wrong people and got involved with drugs, and 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:14.440 she just went down a wrong avenue during her you know, upbringing, 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:17.280 and that it kind of brought it to dark places. 0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:20.800 The next stage in the investigation was to find Heidi's 0:16:20.840 --> 0:16:23.800 parents and get their DNA tested against the head and 0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:27.800 legs found in New Jersey. The detective sent local police 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:31.320 to Heidie's father, who lived in Florida, while her Banski 0:16:31.400 --> 0:16:34.320 and two Hopewoll cops make it drive to Baltimore to 0:16:34.440 --> 0:16:38.240 track down Heidie's mother, and after a two hour journey, 0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:41.520 they pull up the Heidie's mom's house. They knock on 0:16:41.600 --> 0:16:45.080 the door, she lets them in, and then they tell 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:48.320 her we think we found your daughter's remains. 0:16:50.680 --> 0:16:52.320 She was very quiet when we told her. 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:55.000 She looked like was maybe ready to cry or like, 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:57.200 you know, she didn't really have any questions for us. 0:16:57.640 --> 0:16:59.560 She gave us, you know, the background out of a 0:16:59.640 --> 0:17:02.840 daughter be involved with the prostitution and the drugs, and 0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:05.920 she said she has some problems back then herself since 0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:08.439 then got her life together. So I explained to her 0:17:08.480 --> 0:17:11.720 about the DNA, how we're going to compare it to 0:17:12.320 --> 0:17:14.439 the head that was found on the golf course and 0:17:14.480 --> 0:17:17.200 the legs. She was more than willing to give her DNA. 0:17:17.280 --> 0:17:19.240 She was very cooperative at that point. 0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:23.399 They take a swab from the inside of her cheek, 0:17:23.680 --> 0:17:26.680 they pack it away in a sterile container, and then 0:17:26.720 --> 0:17:28.920 they haul asked back to get it tested. 0:17:30.080 --> 0:17:33.639 There was a one hundred percent match. It was definitely Heidi. 0:17:38.320 --> 0:17:43.320 Finally, twenty four years after Heidi's murder, her case was solved. 0:17:44.640 --> 0:17:48.520 But when Heidi's DNA profile was entered into the system 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:52.280 in the spring of twenty thirteen, there was another match 0:17:52.920 --> 0:18:28.320 for a torso, a torso that was buried on Hart Island. Okay, listener, so, 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:31.560 if you're anything like me, you've probably been listening to 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:34.399 this while putting dinner in the oven, driving to work, 0:18:34.640 --> 0:18:37.359 and getting your nails done all at the same time. 0:18:38.080 --> 0:18:41.520 So let's recap what we know so far, because it's 0:18:41.600 --> 0:18:42.800 a lot. 0:18:45.840 --> 0:18:49.040 Joe Rifkin killed his first victim in March of nineteen 0:18:49.119 --> 0:18:52.640 eighty nine and confessed to dumping her torso in New 0:18:52.720 --> 0:18:55.879 York's East River. We now know that her name was 0:18:55.960 --> 0:19:02.480 Heidi Balch. Twenty four years later, in twenty thirteen, detectives 0:19:02.600 --> 0:19:06.640 investigating Heidi's case located her torso on Hart Island. 0:19:08.160 --> 0:19:10.000 And why does all this matter to us? 0:19:10.600 --> 0:19:14.679 Well, because we know that our lost sister's torso was 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:21.879 disinterred from Hart Island in twenty thirteen. We've said before 0:19:21.920 --> 0:19:24.800 that the only reason our girl would have been removed 0:19:24.800 --> 0:19:28.480 from her grave on Heart Island is because she was identified, 0:19:29.080 --> 0:19:32.320 or because her body became part of a criminal investigation, 0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:36.879 or both. Could the torso of our lost sister and 0:19:36.960 --> 0:19:39.960 the torso of Heidi Balch be one and the same. 0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:46.600 Mindy pitches our theory to Captain Urbanski. 0:19:48.680 --> 0:19:52.000 In nineteen eighty nine, we knew that a torso had 0:19:52.160 --> 0:19:55.840 washed up on Shoren's Taten Island and that it was 0:19:56.080 --> 0:20:02.240 identified as the torso of Ga Cats and the family 0:20:02.320 --> 0:20:07.159 buried the remains of that torso in a cemetery in 0:20:07.240 --> 0:20:11.520 Queens Yes, the torso nineteen ninety nine or two thousand, 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:12.920 somewhere around there. 0:20:13.680 --> 0:20:18.199 It was exhumed and oops, that's Mindy dropping her headphones. 0:20:18.480 --> 0:20:21.040 Way to play a cool detective Shapiro. 0:20:21.440 --> 0:20:25.600 And the remains were basically buried on Hart Island. So 0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:30.160 we got actually the records from Heart Island and saw 0:20:30.240 --> 0:20:34.440 that the body was exhumed in two thousand and thirteen. 0:20:35.520 --> 0:20:38.080 It all seems to add up to us. 0:20:38.280 --> 0:20:40.840 There's a lot of questions because there's so many bodies there. 0:20:41.119 --> 0:20:44.200 You might have another torso that's in. I know, for fact, 0:20:44.280 --> 0:20:45.280 you'd have a couple. 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:49.040 We can't deny that he's right. At this point. 0:20:49.040 --> 0:20:52.800 Our theory is still just a theory. But a reality 0:20:52.880 --> 0:20:56.240 check is not all Urbanski gives mindy. He also has 0:20:56.520 --> 0:21:01.600 much appreciated advice for his fellow detective. What really matters 0:21:01.680 --> 0:21:03.320 in an investigation like this. 0:21:04.040 --> 0:21:07.119 If my sister, my mother, or somebody my wife went missing, 0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:09.680 I would want somebody putting their heart and. 0:21:09.640 --> 0:21:10.320 Soul into it. 0:21:10.560 --> 0:21:14.200 So do your job basically, and do it with compassion, 0:21:14.359 --> 0:21:17.359 do it with hard work, do it with an open mind, 0:21:17.800 --> 0:21:19.600 and do it as as if it was your own child. 0:21:20.080 --> 0:21:21.080 That's so beautiful. 0:21:21.240 --> 0:21:24.520 You know, the team here and my girlfriend Carol, they 0:21:24.520 --> 0:21:27.960 have dubbed me a dog with a bone because I'm 0:21:28.080 --> 0:21:33.240 just so persist about this. I frankly have not really 0:21:33.240 --> 0:21:39.320 found that term endearing. But speaking to you and your persistence, 0:21:39.840 --> 0:21:42.840 it makes me feel like that's not such a bet term. 0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:53.400 After all, I knew you'd come around eventually, Mindy, despite 0:21:53.480 --> 0:21:58.320 Urbanski's doubts, we really believe that Heidi Balt is our 0:21:58.440 --> 0:22:03.119 lost sister. There are just too many similarities, like the 0:22:03.359 --> 0:22:07.120 estimated date of death in early nineteen eighty nine and 0:22:07.200 --> 0:22:10.760 the year of disinterminent from Hart Island in twenty thirteen. 0:22:11.760 --> 0:22:17.040 But we need absolute, undeniable proof. More than that, we 0:22:17.119 --> 0:22:20.439 need to learn her story, and the best way to 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:23.520 do that is by reaching out to Heidie's family in 0:22:23.560 --> 0:22:27.080 the hopes that they might have something, anything, that could 0:22:27.119 --> 0:22:34.520 prove the connection. After a bit more Internet sleuthen, producer 0:22:34.600 --> 0:22:37.960 Anna manages to track down one of Heidie's cousins, who 0:22:38.040 --> 0:22:39.800 lives in Maine. 0:22:40.000 --> 0:22:42.359 Dear Anne, I'm sorry to email you about this so 0:22:42.440 --> 0:22:44.560 out of the blue, but I've been searching for you 0:22:44.640 --> 0:22:47.560 for over a year. My name is Annasinfield. I'm a 0:22:47.600 --> 0:22:49.560 journalist and radio producer from the UK. 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:52.960 It's funny I remember getting one of these emails from 0:22:53.000 --> 0:22:58.120 Anna myself before this crazy journey started. In the email, 0:22:58.400 --> 0:23:02.280 Anna tells Anne all about our investigation, that we think 0:23:02.320 --> 0:23:06.080 there's a link between our last sister and Heidi. That 0:23:06.119 --> 0:23:08.639 we want to bring her cousin's story to life and 0:23:08.720 --> 0:23:12.320 make sure she's not just a plot point in Gailcat's murder. 0:23:12.760 --> 0:23:14.840 I come with absolutely no judgment of the way she 0:23:15.000 --> 0:23:17.800 lived or how life happened to her. I'd just love 0:23:17.840 --> 0:23:22.080 to know more about her as a person. All the best, Annas. 0:23:25.400 --> 0:23:28.560 Anna sends off the email, and we hope and pray 0:23:28.600 --> 0:23:31.440 that Heidi's family are interested in speaking with us. 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:33.840 For now, we wait. 0:23:36.800 --> 0:23:40.560 This whole journey has been one crazy ride. 0:23:40.800 --> 0:23:42.480 We'd been to the medical Examiner. 0:23:43.000 --> 0:23:44.840 We have like case number les. 0:23:45.040 --> 0:23:48.360 Yes, the Emmy case number is eighty nine five six. 0:23:50.359 --> 0:23:54.560 We trilled the archives at New York's biggest public library. 0:23:54.080 --> 0:23:57.480 And I'd like all information that I can find about 0:23:57.520 --> 0:23:58.240 that Torso. 0:23:59.240 --> 0:24:04.639 We spoke to pri investigators, criminal profilers, DNA experts. We 0:24:04.680 --> 0:24:07.760 went to the biggest public burial ground in the USA 0:24:08.080 --> 0:24:09.119 and trailed around. 0:24:08.840 --> 0:24:11.240 The city and beyond looking for leads. 0:24:11.960 --> 0:24:15.440 Hundreds and hundreds of hours have gone into this investigation, 0:24:16.000 --> 0:24:19.119 but our love and friendship have gone into it too, 0:24:19.480 --> 0:24:23.400 not to mention copious amounts of food and wine. 0:24:23.600 --> 0:24:29.480 And now it all comes down to this one last 0:24:29.560 --> 0:24:30.600 shot in the dark. 0:24:32.359 --> 0:24:35.200 Hello, Hi, is this Anne? 0:24:35.560 --> 0:24:35.919 It is? 0:24:37.720 --> 0:25:10.560 That's next time on the girlfriends Our Lost Sister, The 0:25:10.640 --> 0:25:15.400 girlfriends Our Last Sister is produced by Novel for iHeart Podcasts. 0:25:16.160 --> 0:25:20.800 For more from Novel, visit novel dot Audio. The show 0:25:20.880 --> 0:25:24.480 is hosted by me Carol Fisher, and our chief investigator 0:25:24.560 --> 0:25:28.119 is Mindy Shapiro. To find me on social media, search 0:25:28.240 --> 0:25:32.560 Carol A. Fisher, That's Carol with an E. The season 0:25:32.640 --> 0:25:36.080 is written and produced by Anna Sinfield and Lee Meyer. 0:25:36.560 --> 0:25:40.440 Our assistant producer is Madeline Parr. The editor is Joe Wheeler. 0:25:40.760 --> 0:25:44.679 Max O'Brien is our executive producer. Our fact checker is 0:25:44.760 --> 0:25:49.639 Dannia Suleiman. Production management from Shurie Houston and Charlotte woolf 0:25:50.359 --> 0:25:55.440 Sound design, mixing and scoring by Nicholas Alexander, Additional engineering 0:25:55.480 --> 0:26:00.920 by Daniel Kempson. Music supervision by Anna Sinfield and Nicholas Alexander. 0:26:01.560 --> 0:26:05.760 Original music composed and performed by Luisa Gerstin and produced 0:26:05.800 --> 0:26:10.159 by Louisa Gerstine and Nicholas Alexander. The series artwork was 0:26:10.200 --> 0:26:15.520 designed by Christina Linkol. Story development by Anna Sinfield. Willard 0:26:15.560 --> 0:26:20.000 Foxton is creative director of Development. Our executive producers at 0:26:20.000 --> 0:26:24.680 iHeart Podcasts are Katrina Norvel and Nikki Etour special thanks 0:26:24.680 --> 0:26:28.560 to Leona Hamid plus Ali Canter, Carrie Lieberman, and Will 0:26:28.680 --> 0:26:32.520