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Speaker 1: What's up.

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Speaker 2: It's way up with Angela Yee, Angela Yee, and Jasmine

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Speaker 2: Brand is here with me. Yes, and honestly one of

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Speaker 2: my favorite people to talk to, Daryl Fairweather is here

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Speaker 2: chief economists at Redfinn.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for joining us again.

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Speaker 3: I'm so happy to be here.

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Speaker 2: Yes, you know, we'd like to have these conversations. And

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Speaker 2: what I love whenever you come. You defy what people

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Speaker 2: would think any economists, a chief economist would look like,

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Speaker 2: you know.

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Speaker 1: So I love that I make talking about this fun.

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Speaker 4: And she's a regular up here at this point too.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and this is this is a very

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Speaker 2: intimidating topic for a lot of people, you know, to

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Speaker 2: talk about the economy, to talk about the housing market.

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Speaker 2: And I want to start up with just this question,

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Speaker 2: is this a good time for our first time homeowner

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Speaker 2: to buy?

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Speaker 1: Yes or no? And we want to hear why.

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Speaker 5: I'm going to be honest, there are many things that

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Speaker 5: are challenging about the housing market right now. The first

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Speaker 5: thing is how high mortgage rates are. Mortgage rates are

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Speaker 5: basically how much it costs to borrow money to buy

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Speaker 5: a home, and for a thirty year fixed rate, it's

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Speaker 5: at seven and a half percent right now, or during

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Speaker 5: the pandemic it was it around three percent, So more

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Speaker 5: than doubled.

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Speaker 3: Yes, So how much.

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Speaker 2: Does that add, Like, say your mortgage is one hundred

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars, how much is the difference, Like, say, if

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Speaker 2: it was a three percent rate as opposed to a

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Speaker 2: seven point five percent, it's.

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Speaker 5: Going to be more than double the amount of money

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Speaker 5: that you're going to have to pay over the life

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Speaker 5: of the mortgage to pay that off. It's a huge deal,

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Speaker 5: and it's made housing really expensive, especially for people who

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Speaker 5: borrow to buy.

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Speaker 4: A home, which most people do.

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Speaker 5: Yes, most people do, I mean not many people have

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Speaker 5: the cast to buy a home, especially with how high

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Speaker 5: home prices are, and home prices got quite high during

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Speaker 5: the pandemic and have not come down. They're actually higher

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Speaker 5: than they were last year, so that makes it extremely challenging.

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Speaker 3: I will say that.

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Speaker 5: The good news is that because there isn't much buyer

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Speaker 5: competition in the market right now, it's easier for people

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Speaker 5: who are putting down lower down payments. So during the pandemic,

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Speaker 5: you had to have all cash or at least twenty

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Speaker 5: percent down.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it was so competitive.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, because you bought during the pandemic, right, yes, I did. Okay, right, Okay,

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Speaker 4: got it.

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Speaker 3: But now you don't have as much competition.

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Speaker 5: So if you're only putting five percent down, if you

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Speaker 5: have an FHA loan, which is the kind of loan

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Speaker 5: you get if you have a lower credit score, your

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Speaker 5: first time home buyer, you can get those kinds of

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Speaker 5: offers accepted. So it's a bit easier to break into

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Speaker 5: the housing market. The hard part is having the money

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Speaker 5: and finding a home that you actually want to buy.

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Speaker 1: Is it harder to get a mortgage now?

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Speaker 4: No?

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Speaker 5: I think it's actually I mean, so it's more expensive

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Speaker 5: to get a mortgage, but I don't think it's harder

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Speaker 5: to get a mortgage. Actually, the kinds of people who

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Speaker 5: are getting mortgages right now tend to have lower credit scores.

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Speaker 3: Than they did during the pandemic.

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Speaker 4: Okay, So the answer to the question is yes and no.

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Speaker 3: I would say it's mostly harder, but.

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Speaker 4: Not in terms of now for the first time home buyer.

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Speaker 4: Is now any time?

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Speaker 2: And I want to take that to an article that

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Speaker 2: you wrote for Forbes. Yes, okay, four ways to buy

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Speaker 2: your first home even as affordability worsens, Because we like solutions.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, So to answer your question, I think for most

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Speaker 5: people it's going to be more affordable for them to

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Speaker 5: rent than it is to buy a home. So in

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Speaker 5: that sense, it is hard to be a first time

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Speaker 5: home buyer. I think a lot of people are going

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Speaker 5: to postpone it this year and decide to rench instead.

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Speaker 5: But the downside of that is that when you if

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Speaker 5: you delay buying a home when morgage rates drop, the

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Speaker 5: competition is going to come back. It's going to be

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Speaker 5: really fierce. So delaying the decision it might be even

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Speaker 5: harder down the road. So if you do want to

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Speaker 5: buy now, there are things that you can do. You

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Speaker 5: could team up with somebody. It doesn't have to be

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Speaker 5: your married partner. Could be a friend and buy a

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Speaker 5: home together. Make sure that you like figure out how

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Speaker 5: to paperwork.

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Speaker 2: And make sure you legally get that done. I can't

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Speaker 2: just be a that's my friend, that person would never

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Speaker 2: do this to me.

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Speaker 5: Have a contract, like if you're going to live in

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Speaker 5: the home and your co investor is not, then treat

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Speaker 5: it like there your landlord and you're a tenant.

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Speaker 3: Have it all written out.

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Speaker 5: Decide what you're going to do if you're going to sell,

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Speaker 5: but that is a way to afford home ownership a

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Speaker 5: little bit early. Another thing is that if you live

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Speaker 5: in a really expensive area and you can't afford to

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Speaker 5: buy there, you may be able to buy somewhere more affordable.

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Speaker 5: And even if you're not ready to move to that

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Speaker 5: more affordable place, you could use it as an investment

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Speaker 5: property or a rental property and be able to build

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Speaker 5: equity and so you can upgrade to the home that

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Speaker 5: you do want later on.

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Speaker 2: Okay, all right, those are all great tips about buying

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Speaker 2: your first home. Now, since you talked about perhaps if

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Speaker 2: you live in a place that's expensive and investing somewhere else,

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Speaker 2: let's talk about what's happening with these crackdowns on airbnbs.

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Speaker 1: And I know it's an issue in New York City

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Speaker 1: a lot.

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Speaker 2: I think now you have to like register, there's all

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Speaker 2: these new laws in New York City about being able

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Speaker 2: to have an airbnb property. So can we talk about

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Speaker 2: that for a second.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, So what happened is they basically outright band short

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Speaker 5: term rentals airbnbs. And this is a win for the

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Speaker 5: hotel industry, at least existing hotels, because it's going to

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Speaker 5: happen is that without airbnbs, it's going to be more

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Speaker 5: expensive to get a short term rental or hotel stay

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Speaker 5: in New York. You know, I interned in New York

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Speaker 5: when I was a college student, So people like that

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Speaker 5: are going to have a bit of a harder time

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Speaker 5: finding an option. But the good news is that the

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Speaker 5: housing units that aren't being used for Airbnbs, they could

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Speaker 5: potentially be used for long term rentals for long term residents.

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Speaker 5: And I think that's the idea behind it. But in general,

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Speaker 5: I think they went too far. I would have preferred

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Speaker 5: to see them tax those airbnbs, bring in the revenue

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Speaker 5: and make the tax system such that, you know, if

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Speaker 5: you are trying to rent a spare room, you can

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Speaker 5: still do that make some money, but if you're a

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Speaker 5: corporate Airbnb landlord, tax them a lot and just get

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Speaker 5: that revenue.

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Speaker 1: Because it's tough.

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Speaker 2: I see now there's a lot of people renting their

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Speaker 2: homes on like Craigslist. They're on the black market because

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Speaker 2: they can't use Airbnb now.

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Speaker 5: Yes, and when it goes underground, it doesn't get taxed.

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Speaker 5: Somebody doesn't come back to the people of New York.

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Speaker 5: So I'm more in favor of having a lot of

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Speaker 5: taxes as opposed to outright bands.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 2: I was also talking about Airbnb squatters. Now, this story

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Speaker 2: was huge in the news. I think this was in

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Speaker 2: like Brentwood, California, and there was somebody who was staying

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Speaker 2: there basically not paying for the Airbnb for over like

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Speaker 2: a year and a half, and the person can't get

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Speaker 2: them out. Yeah, can you break down? How can something

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Speaker 2: like that happen? They're not even paying and they're not

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Speaker 2: being told they have to leave.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 5: So, there are many laws and places where tenants have rights.

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Speaker 5: If your landlord is not keeping the building up to code,

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Speaker 5: or if they're doing something else kind of shady, the

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Speaker 5: tenant can in some places choose not to pay rent

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Speaker 5: because their landlord is not providing a service. Now, what

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Speaker 5: happened in that situation was this person rented it for

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Speaker 5: six months, so they turned into a long term tenant,

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Speaker 5: not just an Airbnb person. So they were able to

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Speaker 5: take advantage of all those tenant protections that are not

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Speaker 5: really intended for this circumstance. And that's why it's this

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Speaker 5: whole big legal battle. But I think the lesson is

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Speaker 5: is that if you're going to rent out your home,

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Speaker 5: whether it's on Airbnb or to a long term renter,

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Speaker 5: do your research, learn the law. There are risks involved,

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Speaker 5: It's not just easy money. You have to know that

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Speaker 5: you're taking on a risk if you're going to become

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Speaker 5: a landlord.

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Speaker 2: I've heard so many horror stories about people having to

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Speaker 2: a big tenant, and I think sometimes people don't have

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Speaker 2: a lot of sympathy for landlords.

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Speaker 1: And that's another thing.

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Speaker 2: You did this whole article about the economy and how

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Speaker 2: you have to approach it from different points of view, Right,

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Speaker 2: how does it affect a homeowner, but how does it

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Speaker 2: affect a renter also? And I do feel like, because

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Speaker 2: you know, with certain issues, trying to get somebody out

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Speaker 2: they're not paying their rent. A lot of times that

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Speaker 2: person is able to continue to stay guard to the

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Speaker 2: court yeah and say that they need more time and

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Speaker 2: still not even have to pay. Do you think that

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Speaker 2: there needs to be something stricter when it comes to that,

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Speaker 2: because I understand in certain circumstances if the landlord isn't

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Speaker 2: keeping up their end of the bargain, but when they

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Speaker 2: are and then now to struggle for them to even

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Speaker 2: be able to pay their mortgage or they thought they

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Speaker 2: were doing a great investment and it turns out to

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Speaker 2: be a nightmare.

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Speaker 1: What can happen there?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 5: So, landlords they provide a service. They are you know,

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Speaker 5: the good ones. They are doing work to keep the

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Speaker 5: property maintained and make sure that it is habitable for

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Speaker 5: their tenant. So there needs to be some balance between

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Speaker 5: tenants rights and landlord rights. You know, there's some parts

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Speaker 5: of the country Arkansas, for example, where it probably skews

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Speaker 5: more heavily towards landlords, and that's not necessarily good for tenants.

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Speaker 3: But there are some.

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Speaker 5: Places like Seattle that are very heavy on tenants rights,

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Speaker 5: and then landlords can get discouraged by that. And we

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Speaker 5: do need rental properties in the market. If you make

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Speaker 5: things too skewed towards tenants and landlords feel like it's

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Speaker 5: not a good deal for them, they're going to take

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Speaker 5: those units off the market and they're not going to

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Speaker 5: be available for rentals. They may even hold them vacant

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Speaker 5: as opposed to even having a tenant in there, and

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Speaker 5: that's not good for the housing supply problem at all.

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Speaker 2: I don't know what can be done about that, because

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Speaker 2: that is tough, especially if it's like I don't have

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Speaker 2: a lot of money. But I've bought my first you know,

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Speaker 2: investment property, and now I can't get my money, and

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Speaker 2: I can't get this person out and I'm in danger

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Speaker 2: of losing this property because of it.

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Speaker 3: You know, Yeah, it's tough. Now.

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Speaker 2: I want to also discuss with you a housing bubble,

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Speaker 2: because I keep saying, are we having experiencing a housing bubble?

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Speaker 2: And what is going to happen? And will these interest

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Speaker 2: rates come down at any time? Or even like you

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Speaker 2: said that prices of these homes, even though they shot

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Speaker 2: up during COVID and then maybe it's slowing down, they

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Speaker 2: still haven't come back down and stabilized, right, So do

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Speaker 2: you think that we're in a housing bubble? You know?

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Speaker 5: I think that there were bubbles across the country that

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Speaker 5: have already popped. Austin, for example, prices shot up and

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Speaker 5: now they've come back down. Boise is another example. Prices

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Speaker 5: are down from before the pandemic in the Bay Area

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Speaker 5: and in Los Angeles. So I think that there has

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Speaker 5: been this correction in the market in certain parts. Overall,

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Speaker 5: I don't think we're going to see a huge correction.

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Speaker 5: If interest rates stay really high, we might see prices

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Speaker 5: come down. One percent two percent, But it's not going

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Speaker 5: to be anything like two thousand and eight where prices

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Speaker 5: fell by twenty percent.

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Speaker 4: I was really hoping that would happen again.

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Speaker 1: Can you imagine. Let me tell you something.

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Speaker 2: I kicked myself for not having during the pandemic when

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Speaker 2: everybody was leaving New York City, not buying something in Manhattan, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: because there were so many amazing deal that could have

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Speaker 2: been had.

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Speaker 1: At that time. People were just trying to get rid

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Speaker 1: of their properties.

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Speaker 4: People did not want to stay here, and I.

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Speaker 2: Knew everyone was going to end up coming back. We

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Speaker 2: just didn't know when the pandemic was going to end,

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Speaker 2: but we knew it would. Yeah, and New York was like,

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Speaker 2: I've never seen anything like that, you know, And so

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Speaker 2: sometimes like and I said it to myself too, but

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Speaker 2: I was so dead set on staying in Brooklyn that

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Speaker 2: I ended up buying a house in Brooklyn instead when

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Speaker 2: everybody was moving to Brooklyn. So financially, sometimes emotionally, the

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Speaker 2: decisions that we make don't match up with financially the

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Speaker 2: things that we could be doing.

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Speaker 3: That's so true.

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Speaker 5: And you know, there's like a saying and investment when

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Speaker 5: everyone's getting USA. I mean I think that's true to

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Speaker 5: a certain extent, But I think so much of it

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Speaker 5: depends on how much risk you're willing to take on

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Speaker 5: how long are you willing to wait to see the

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Speaker 5: returns on that investment. Some people took that risk and

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Speaker 5: bought properties when they were down and made the bat

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Speaker 5: that's going to come back, and they did do well.

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Speaker 5: But in other places, like I said in Austin, some

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Speaker 5: people bought as that was going up and it's come

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Speaker 5: back down. So how to you have to be comfortable

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Speaker 5: with the risk of you're going to get involved in investing?

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Speaker 2: What do you see happening in Miami? I was also

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Speaker 2: seeing some research in Miami. Miami was a place that

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Speaker 2: people were flacking to as well. Right, they were doing

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Speaker 2: that because of taxes, but they were also doing that

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Speaker 2: because it was a work from home, work remotely situation.

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Speaker 2: And now they're saying that there's so much a new

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Speaker 2: inventory on the market.

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Speaker 1: You see all these.

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Speaker 2: Buildings luxury and the luxury market you know in general too,

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Speaker 2: what do you see happening there in the near future.

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Speaker 5: Well, in our redfinn data, we see that Florida is

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Speaker 5: extremely popular. It's one of the housing markets that continues

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Speaker 5: to do well even amid these high interest rates. You know,

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Speaker 5: people are retiring. Baby boomers are a big generation, They're

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Speaker 5: moving down to Florida. People who are working remotely are

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Speaker 5: going to Florida, and it just continues to be a

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Speaker 5: really popular place. But I do think that that's not

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Speaker 5: going to be sustainable, especially given how much insurance costs

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Speaker 5: are going up. There was a report by Policy Genius

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Speaker 5: that showed that Florida insurance quotes went up the most

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Speaker 5: out of anywhere in the country with hurricane risk. So

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Speaker 5: I think that, you know, Florida is really attractive right now,

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Speaker 5: but I think long term the affordability is going to

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Speaker 5: be an issue, especially when you factor in insurance costs.

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Speaker 2: I saw one person was paying like six million dollars

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Speaker 2: in insurance over ten years.

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Speaker 1: Was that it is something like that.

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Speaker 4: That's insane.

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Speaker 5: You know, these big mansions right on the coast at

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Speaker 5: sea level, and they're becoming really expensive to ensure.

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Speaker 1: I can't even imagine.

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Speaker 4: Is there ever a scenario? Oh my, this is such

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Speaker 4: a broad question. This is really like a personal question.

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Speaker 4: So like I have a house and I have an

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Speaker 4: investment properly with Angela, but then I rent a place too.

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Speaker 4: And I was having this debate with a friend, like,

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Speaker 4: and they were saying, you should never be renting you

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Speaker 4: can afford. You know, is there ever a scenario where

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Speaker 4: you think it's okay to rent? You know?

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Speaker 5: I think what you're describing where you rent and you

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Speaker 5: have an investment.

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Speaker 3: Property that is have house too.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And that's happening more now, especially because homeowners who

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Speaker 5: locked in record loan mortgage rates and who want to

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Speaker 5: move now, they're choosing to rent out their properties instead

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Speaker 5: of selling them right then when they go, they don't

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Speaker 5: want to buy a gain at these high interest rates,

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Speaker 5: so they're renting too. So there's this weird separation like

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Speaker 5: the landlord and the wrencher, and you get both sides

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Speaker 5: of it. I think we're going to see more of

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Speaker 5: that actually.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because if you're like I locked in my interest

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Speaker 2: rate on my house at three point twenty five percent,

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Speaker 2: I'm not selling that because interest rates are almost eight

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Speaker 2: percent now, yeah, and so why would I do that?

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Speaker 2: That would kind of be a terrible time to sell.

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Speaker 2: But I also feel like sometimes people try to shame renting,

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Speaker 2: and for people who are out there renting.

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Speaker 1: That is not a bad thing.

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Speaker 2: If you're not in a position to buy, because you

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Speaker 2: can actually put yourself in a terrible position if you're

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Speaker 2: putting your all on the line to buy a property

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Speaker 2: because everyone's telling you you have to buy?

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Speaker 1: Why rent? Why don't you own something?

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Speaker 2: And some of us just are not right now, And

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Speaker 2: being a homeowner is a lot of responsibility.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it ties you down.

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Speaker 5: If you think you might get a new job opportunity

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Speaker 5: in new city in a couple of years, you probably

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Speaker 5: shouldn't buy. It's only if you feel like you're going

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Speaker 5: to stay in the property for five years or more

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Speaker 5: that it becomes more financially savvy to own than to rent.

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Speaker 5: But if you want to be flexible, if you don't

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Speaker 5: have the down payment, there's no shame in renting. But

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Speaker 5: I would say have a savings plan. Make sure you're

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Speaker 5: still putting aside money for your financial goals. It's not

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Speaker 5: going to be automatic like it is with home ownership,

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Speaker 5: so just be really deliberate about it.

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Speaker 2: And so since we were just talking about selling and

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Speaker 2: we've talked about buying, is this a good time to sell?

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Speaker 5: Well, you know, prices are still quite high, so it's

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Speaker 5: actually a great time to cash out your equity. We're

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Speaker 5: seeing a lot of people who live in really expensive

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Speaker 5: areas like New York or California, who are cashing out

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Speaker 5: and then buying another home and all cash in a

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Speaker 5: much more affordable place, like say you have a million

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Speaker 5: dollar home, most of your market is paid off. You

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Speaker 5: can go buy a home all cash and you don't

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Speaker 5: have to deal with those seven percent interest rates. Now,

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Speaker 5: obviously not everybody is so lucky to own a home

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Speaker 5: with all that equity, but there are people who really

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Speaker 5: made out well with how high home prices have gotten,

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Speaker 5: who can cash out and use that money for whatever

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Speaker 5: they want.

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Speaker 2: Now, another thing I've seen a lot in the news

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Speaker 2: is commercial real estate because a lot of people have

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Speaker 2: not returned to the office, are only doing it on

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Speaker 2: a part time basis. We see a lot of retail

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Speaker 2: locations having to shut down. What do you see happening

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Speaker 2: with that. I even saw an article about how they're

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Speaker 2: trying to transform some of these commercial spaces into residential

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Speaker 2: because it's just a tough time if you have commercial property.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a.

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Speaker 5: Great solution for a place like New York where there

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Speaker 5: isn't vacant land that can be developed to turns.

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Speaker 4: No more land left here.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, basically they can go on exactly exactly. So taking

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Speaker 5: a commercial property and converting it to residential it can

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Speaker 5: be a great thing. I was just talking to some

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Speaker 5: economists that the NYU Furman Center about this, and they

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Speaker 5: were saying, the biggest hurdle is regulation. You have to

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Speaker 5: have a window in every bedroom, you have to have

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Speaker 5: a certain you have to have bathrooms, and a lot

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Speaker 5: of these commercial buildings aren't really set up like that.

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Speaker 5: And these office buildings you might have one big floor

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Speaker 5: that's really wide with only one bathroom the center, so

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Speaker 5: the plumbing's not really set up. So it can be

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Speaker 5: quite expensive to convert a commercial property into residential. It

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Speaker 5: depends on the property and what it looks like. And

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Speaker 5: you need kind of some regulatory reform because oftentimes there

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Speaker 5: are limits on how high residential building can be, which

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Speaker 5: is kind of silly, and we should just you know,

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Speaker 5: clear the way for more housing.

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Speaker 4: I wonder what they're going to do with malls, converting malls.

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Speaker 4: You know a lot of malls are closing down and

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Speaker 4: shutting down.

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Speaker 1: Because I was at the mass said it was deserted.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's going to give I feel like it's

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Speaker 4: going to continue. That trend is going to continue. I

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Speaker 4: wonder what we're going they're going to do with all

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Speaker 4: that property.

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Speaker 5: It works if it's in a place that people actually

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Speaker 5: want to live. Some of these malls that are like

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Speaker 5: kind of.

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Speaker 4: Out in the far a little far, Yeah, I.

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Speaker 5: Don't think those are going to really be ripe for conversion,

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Speaker 5: But maybe there are other purposes they could use for them.

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Speaker 5: I mean, I know, there's like a huge refugee crisis,

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Speaker 5: so I think there might be some kind of thing.

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Speaker 3: That they could do with that.

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Speaker 5: But in order to convert it to like market rate housing,

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Speaker 5: it has to be in a place where the rents

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Speaker 5: are high enough to justify the conversion.

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Speaker 2: And since you bought up this refugee crisis and in

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Speaker 2: New York, I mean, we see all the time we're

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Speaker 2: walking past hotels been converted into housing. What do you

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Speaker 2: think us some long term solutions that can happen Because

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Speaker 2: out here, on the one hand, we have a lot

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Speaker 2: of housing issues with people who are residents already you

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Speaker 2: live here, we have a lot of gentrification happening. But

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Speaker 2: then we're also looking at the humanity of making sure

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Speaker 2: that people who are coming here looking for our better life,

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Speaker 2: maybe fleeing whatever situation they're coming from. They also need

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Speaker 2: a place to stay, and so what can happen because

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Speaker 2: it's really difficult in a crowded city like this too

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Speaker 2: to make sure that everybody is accommodated.

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Speaker 5: You know, I think there's a lot that can be done.

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Speaker 5: Again on the regulatory environment, it used to be in

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Speaker 5: New York that you would have a lot of these

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Speaker 5: single residency occupancy buildings. The derogatory term was flop houses,

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Speaker 5: where basically just rent a room and you have a

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Speaker 5: shared bathroom, shared kitchen. But those buildings went away because

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Speaker 5: they were associated with like low class people. But bringing

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Speaker 5: those back would be a very much more affordable option

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Speaker 5: for people who are coming, who want to work, who

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Speaker 5: just need a place to lay their head at night.

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Speaker 5: I think we need to be more creative about creating

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Speaker 5: housing options that work for people who don't have much means. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 5: the Airbn beefing kind of works against it because there

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Speaker 5: are people who might have, you know, rented out a

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Speaker 5: room to one of these refugees and it.

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Speaker 3: Might not be an option for them anymore.

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Speaker 5: So yeah, again back to perspectives, you got to look

444
00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:12,840
Speaker 5: at it from the perspective of these people, what's best

445
00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:15,280
Speaker 5: for them. Is it better for them to live in

446
00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:17,480
Speaker 5: just one room. I mean, maybe you wouldn't want to

447
00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:19,520
Speaker 5: live there, but they would probably be grateful just to

448
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:20,800
Speaker 5: have a roof over their house.

449
00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:23,280
Speaker 2: I was just saying that the other day. I was

450
00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:25,960
Speaker 2: walking and you know, there's one place that we walk

451
00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:29,200
Speaker 2: past every day and you can it's migrant housing right now.

452
00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:30,640
Speaker 1: And you know, some.

453
00:18:30,600 --> 00:18:32,840
Speaker 2: People might look at it like this is terrible, but

454
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,880
Speaker 2: they might also be like, I'm just happy.

455
00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:35,960
Speaker 1: To be here.

456
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:38,879
Speaker 2: It's like a much better situation, a very community. Like

457
00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:43,640
Speaker 2: the kids are outside playing ball, don't know what's going on. Yeah,

458
00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:45,280
Speaker 2: you don't know when I was a kid. You don't

459
00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:46,560
Speaker 2: know what type of conditions you're in.

460
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:50,760
Speaker 4: When I was. I have no idea.

461
00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:53,280
Speaker 2: And another thing I want to talk about is, so

462
00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:56,040
Speaker 2: since we discussed that, you see, they're allowing people to

463
00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:57,040
Speaker 2: build tiny homes.

464
00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:57,680
Speaker 3: Have you seen that?

465
00:18:58,119 --> 00:18:59,960
Speaker 2: Of course you have, So what do you think about

466
00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:02,639
Speaker 2: that as an option? They're paying people like credits to

467
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:06,000
Speaker 2: put a tiny home on their property and rent it

468
00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:06,800
Speaker 2: out to other people.

469
00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:09,399
Speaker 5: Well, there are the tiny homes that are kind of

470
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:12,000
Speaker 5: a homelessess solution. We've seen this in Seattle. You know,

471
00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,119
Speaker 5: it's better than a tent. For example. I think we

472
00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:15,880
Speaker 5: always got to do is compare it to the alternative

473
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:18,000
Speaker 5: where were these people be living If they weren't living there,

474
00:19:18,119 --> 00:19:20,760
Speaker 5: maybe it's not great for like your personal preferences, but

475
00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:22,359
Speaker 5: if the other option is living on a tent or

476
00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:23,919
Speaker 5: in the street, then a tiny home can be a

477
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:26,680
Speaker 5: good option. And then another thing that's kind of similar

478
00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:29,280
Speaker 5: is that in California they've passed all these laws so

479
00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:32,200
Speaker 5: you can build an adu, which is like a little house,

480
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:35,280
Speaker 5: a little cottage in your backyard to rent out. That

481
00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:37,600
Speaker 5: kind of legislation is great because again it's you know,

482
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:41,280
Speaker 5: it's creating more affordable options. It's for people who may

483
00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:43,520
Speaker 5: be renting, who you want to get some extra income,

484
00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:45,359
Speaker 5: or maybe you want to bring in an elderly parent

485
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:47,560
Speaker 5: to take care of. I think we got to we

486
00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:48,960
Speaker 5: gotta make that easier too.

487
00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:52,600
Speaker 2: And three D homes that's something that that is a

488
00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:53,800
Speaker 2: thing now to three home.

489
00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:56,240
Speaker 1: Have you seen these like three D prints.

490
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,199
Speaker 2: That they had the first Like I don't even know

491
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 2: how you do this, but with the three D printer,

492
00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,000
Speaker 2: like the homes that they're able to create, can you

493
00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:04,520
Speaker 2: explain that.

494
00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:06,879
Speaker 5: So there's been a lot of progress in terms of

495
00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:09,000
Speaker 5: the manufacturing of homes, a lot of research into it.

496
00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:11,480
Speaker 5: Building is quite expensive when it comes to things like

497
00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,560
Speaker 5: labor and materials. So yeah, the three D homes, I think,

498
00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,760
Speaker 5: is trying to create a solution to build those homes

499
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:19,560
Speaker 5: much more efficiently and cheaply.

500
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:22,119
Speaker 3: And a lot of places though, the biggest.

501
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:24,560
Speaker 5: Expense for building a home is the land. So you

502
00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:27,800
Speaker 5: could have the structure get cheaper, but if land under

503
00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,160
Speaker 5: it costs like five hundred and six hundred thousand dollars,

504
00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:32,840
Speaker 5: is not ever going to really be affordable even if

505
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:35,159
Speaker 5: you have, you know, one hundred thousand dollars building on

506
00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:35,760
Speaker 5: top of it.

507
00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:39,360
Speaker 2: And as we're talking about the prices of hotels going

508
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:41,639
Speaker 2: up in New York City in particular with them having

509
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,880
Speaker 2: tightened all the regulations on airbnbs, I see they're talking

510
00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,639
Speaker 2: about getting rid of all these junk fees two that

511
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:49,520
Speaker 2: are associated.

512
00:20:49,840 --> 00:20:51,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a good thing.

513
00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:53,280
Speaker 2: What do you think about that, because sometimes you go

514
00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:55,440
Speaker 2: to a hotel and say it's one hundred dollars a night,

515
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,760
Speaker 2: and then by the time you pay, like, how is

516
00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:00,919
Speaker 2: this one hundred and eighty dollars a night when I

517
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:01,800
Speaker 2: didn't budget for that.

518
00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:02,400
Speaker 3: Yes.

519
00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:04,080
Speaker 5: In economics we have a term for that. It's called

520
00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:06,200
Speaker 5: asymmetric information, and it's bad.

521
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:08,200
Speaker 4: Asymmetric information.

522
00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:10,800
Speaker 5: That means that you know something I don't know. So

523
00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:13,120
Speaker 5: the hotel knows how much that you're going to pay

524
00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:15,080
Speaker 5: at the end, but they try to hide it so

525
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,160
Speaker 5: you don't know, and.

526
00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:19,320
Speaker 2: That resort fees. Yeah, and then like it's ridiculous.

527
00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:19,880
Speaker 3: Yeah.

528
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,600
Speaker 5: So anytime you have this asymmetric information, people end up

529
00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:25,639
Speaker 5: making decisions that they wouldn't have made otherwise. You might

530
00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:27,320
Speaker 5: get a hotel think it's only going to be one

531
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,840
Speaker 5: hundred and fifty dollars, you check out, it's three hundred dollars,

532
00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:32,399
Speaker 5: and maybe that person couldn't afford that to begin with. Yeah,

533
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:34,520
Speaker 5: So it gives more power to the hotels when they

534
00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:37,400
Speaker 5: can hide those fees. So any the legislation to make

535
00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:38,920
Speaker 5: that more transparent, I think it's great.

536
00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:40,760
Speaker 4: I don't really have so much have a problem with

537
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:42,800
Speaker 4: the fees. It's me not knowing beforehand that.

538
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:43,800
Speaker 3: I want to have to pay exactly.

539
00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 4: You don't want to make another decision.

540
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:46,879
Speaker 5: You want to know everything they need. You want to

541
00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:49,480
Speaker 5: be on equal footing, so you can. You can make

542
00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:51,679
Speaker 5: just as good as a decision as the person who's

543
00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 5: renting the property.

544
00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:53,840
Speaker 3: Do you're renting the hotel again.

545
00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:55,359
Speaker 2: Don't surprise me because since I do think it's like

546
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,640
Speaker 2: prepaid and then you get there and then there's extra

547
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:01,119
Speaker 2: fees before you check out. I'm like that, Like, but

548
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:02,840
Speaker 2: you know, I never go to the desk to check out,

549
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:04,439
Speaker 2: and I should. I don't ever do that.

550
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:05,160
Speaker 1: I just leave.

551
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:07,960
Speaker 5: It makes it harder to shop around, too, because if

552
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,840
Speaker 5: one hotel has a fee that's thirty dollars, another hotel

553
00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:13,000
Speaker 5: has a fee that's twenty dollars, and you don't know

554
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,520
Speaker 5: the difference. You might have chosen a different hotel had

555
00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:17,200
Speaker 5: you known the actual price at checkout.

556
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:20,520
Speaker 2: Absolutely well, listen, I just want to thank you. You

557
00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:23,120
Speaker 2: make me want to be an economist if I would

558
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:24,919
Speaker 2: have met you. When I always say that, I'm like,

559
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:27,120
Speaker 2: I love what it is that you do and how

560
00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:29,639
Speaker 2: how much knowledge that you have, which I think is

561
00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:31,560
Speaker 2: really important for us to understand.

562
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:32,480
Speaker 4: It's so useful.

563
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:36,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, because there's so much information out there about what's

564
00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,200
Speaker 2: going on with the economy, what's going on in the

565
00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:42,600
Speaker 2: housing market. Sometimes we don't know where to look or

566
00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:44,640
Speaker 2: who to listen to. But you gave us some really

567
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:46,760
Speaker 2: valuable information today. That's why every time you're in town

568
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 2: you have to stop by, yes, of course, at any time.

569
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 2: All right, well you guys Darra Felworth and make sure

570
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,600
Speaker 2: you check her out also they can subscribe, right, so

571
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,000
Speaker 2: you have a you also write, and she has some

572
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,320
Speaker 2: amazing articles. And like I said, that's what I always

573
00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:02,000
Speaker 2: look at when I'm trying to figure out what's going

574
00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:02,639
Speaker 2: on in the world.

575
00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:05,320
Speaker 5: Yeah, look me up on social media. I write for subsec,

576
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:07,640
Speaker 5: I write for Forbes. I'm always out there.

577
00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:10,919
Speaker 2: Subscribe, subscrib's that girl.

578
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:11,240
Speaker 4: All right?

579
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:13,040
Speaker 1: Thank you Daryl Fairweather, thank you

580
00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:15,960
Speaker 3: Wall