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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Should Know from how Stuff Works

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Speaker 1: dot Com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark,

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Speaker 1: and there's Charles W. Chuck, Brian over there, and there's

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Speaker 1: Jerry and this is Stuff you Should Know. This is

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Speaker 1: a current contemporary edition. Chuck, Oh, yeah it is. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we're talking about Pando and Pando's kind of made the

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Speaker 1: rounds of the news lately, current contemporary edition of a

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Speaker 1: topic that could be tens of thousands of years old. Yes,

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Speaker 1: that's right. Yeah, that's well. Put Actually, did you know

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Speaker 1: about Pando? Yeah, you saw the news lately. No, I

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Speaker 1: just previously knew about Pando. Oh. Really, that's kind of

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Speaker 1: awesome because I knew about the giant mushroom out in Oregon.

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Speaker 1: Um it, I didn't know about Pando, and now I do,

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Speaker 1: and we'll get to it. But Panda's Panda is not

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Speaker 1: doing so hot right now. Spoiler. Yeah, that is a spoiler,

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Speaker 1: isn't it. It's a sad giant forest. It is a

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Speaker 1: genetically identical forest. So let's let's spell it out for

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Speaker 1: But what Pando is you want to Yeah, it's a

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Speaker 1: it's an aspen forest aspen trees, which, by the way,

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Speaker 1: far and away the best trees, best looking trees at least. Uh,

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Speaker 1: it's certainly one of them, depending on what you're out for.

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Speaker 1: Uh in your as your tree fetish, well, I tend

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Speaker 1: to like the white papery bark with um black eyes.

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Speaker 1: That's usually the kind of tree I like. So aspens

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Speaker 1: it for me. Yeah, So I mean aspens in general,

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Speaker 1: before we get to what Panda is. They are their

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Speaker 1: medium sized. Uh, they're deciduous. They're generally between twenty and

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Speaker 1: eighty feet high, about three to eighteen inches in diameter.

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Speaker 1: And like you said, they have that bark that's that

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Speaker 1: sort of smooth greenish white, yellowish white gray or white.

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Speaker 1: And uh, they have a little green in the bark,

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Speaker 1: but from chlorophyll, which is kind of interesting for a tree. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's um from what I saw unique among North American

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Speaker 1: trees that that um aspen bark actually is living. It's

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Speaker 1: like tissue that actually produces chlorophyll and carries out some

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Speaker 1: of photosynthesis for the tree, and most other trees don't

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Speaker 1: do that. But that explains why the bark is so

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Speaker 1: unique too. Yeah. So the aspen is known for for

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Speaker 1: a lot of things, but one of the things where

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Speaker 1: their leaves produced. They're they're really thin and firm, almost round,

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Speaker 1: about an inch and a half to three inches in diameter,

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Speaker 1: with a little you know, pointy apex. They look kind

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Speaker 1: of like a spade in a suit of cards deck

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Speaker 1: of cards. Yeah, sort of like that. For sure, call

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Speaker 1: a spade a spade unless it's an aspen leaf. But

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Speaker 1: the sound that they make is really unique. If you're

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Speaker 1: in the forest, in a grove of aspen and the

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Speaker 1: wind kicks up, it's a really unique and i say,

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Speaker 1: very very calming experience because the stems are flat instead

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Speaker 1: of round and perpendicular to the flatness of the leaf. Wow,

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Speaker 1: that was a really great description. So the the leaf

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Speaker 1: kind of moves around, and then the stem in ways

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Speaker 1: that leaves typically don't, they kind of trembles in the wind. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's like a fluttery butterfly wing almost. And then because

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Speaker 1: the leaves are sparse enough, you wouldn't just look at

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Speaker 1: and be like, look at how sparse that tree is.

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Speaker 1: But compared to some other trees, say like a maple

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Speaker 1: or an oak or something, the space in between leaves

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Speaker 1: is greater, and so that allows the sunlight to kind

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Speaker 1: of come in through the canopy of the aspen, and

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Speaker 1: when the wind blows and it gets all of those

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Speaker 1: leaves going, that has an effect on the sunlight too. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So that sound though, is uh specifically Pando is a

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Speaker 1: quaking aspen. Uh. It just the sound that it creates

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Speaker 1: is very very unique. It's not even just like a

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Speaker 1: regular calming of the wind through the trees. It's more

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Speaker 1: like a quack quack. That's a pretty good aspen quaking

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Speaker 1: aspen impression. It sounds like a duck. No, that's a

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Speaker 1: lot of people confuse it for ducks, So it's it's

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Speaker 1: actually a pretty good aspen. So that's the aspen in general.

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Speaker 1: But go ahead and drop it, drop it on everyone's

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Speaker 1: head what Panda is, because it's pretty remarkable. Are you're

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Speaker 1: letting me do it? Yeah? All right, So Pando is

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Speaker 1: an aspen forest, an enormous aspen force, a hundred and

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Speaker 1: six acre aspen force. And you'd say, well, I could

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Speaker 1: name the woods in my backyard Todd or Jimmy, who

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Speaker 1: cares somebody gave a name to a forest. But no,

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Speaker 1: there's something very special about Pando. Pando is not just

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Speaker 1: a force. Pando is a forest of trees that are

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Speaker 1: all genetically identical because they all come from one massive

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Speaker 1: roots structure that forms by mass, the largest organism on Earth. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's pando thirteen million pounds uh tons. And uh. While

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Speaker 1: we would love to say every single one of these,

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Speaker 1: maybe up to fifty thou trees is connected literally, some

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Speaker 1: of them might not be. But we did learn through

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Speaker 1: this research that you can be uh cut off if something,

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Speaker 1: you know, happens to cut you off from your from

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Speaker 1: the roots of your neighbor, you can still be considered

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Speaker 1: part of that because you're still genetically identical, right, yes,

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Speaker 1: and so um Quaking aspens are kind of unique at

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Speaker 1: least as far as trees go, but not necessarily as

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Speaker 1: far as plants go, and that they reproduce through something

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Speaker 1: called vegetative reproduction. And it's pretty straightforward stuff. If you've

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Speaker 1: ever seen, like saying, augustine grass or a strawberry or

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Speaker 1: something like that. It just sends out like a stem

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Speaker 1: or something like that, and then the stem, once it

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Speaker 1: gets to certain points, starts to shoot down roots and

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Speaker 1: then it starts to grow like another section of the plant.

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Speaker 1: But it's still kind of like a new plant growing

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Speaker 1: out of the original plant's arm. It's all the same plan.

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Speaker 1: It's one big organism. Um. And that's how Pando has

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Speaker 1: spread through this vegetative reproduction. Yeah. And this can happen underground,

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Speaker 1: like in the case of Pando, it's not like you

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Speaker 1: see this, uh, like horizontal fence of tree branches all

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Speaker 1: along the ground. It's actually roots underground. Sometimes it can

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Speaker 1: go like a hundred feet and say, I think I'd

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Speaker 1: like to grow up now, Yeah, it feels like a

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Speaker 1: good spot. Why don't you grow up? And the little

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Speaker 1: sprout called the ramit says, I will watch, and Pando

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Speaker 1: goes whoa with the light. Yes, and it looks like

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Speaker 1: its own tree. But uh, whether connected or not, it's

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Speaker 1: usually connected. Um, it's it's the same tree. Right. So um,

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Speaker 1: you said something that some of the trees in Pando

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Speaker 1: might not actually be part of Pando. There's a couple

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Speaker 1: of ways that can happen. Like you said. One, they

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Speaker 1: could be cut off physically, but even still it's still

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Speaker 1: considered part of the same group of trees, the same organism.

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Speaker 1: And when you're talking about a like a stand of

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Speaker 1: genetically identical aspen trees, they're called a clone, like a

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Speaker 1: pack of them or stand of them. It's called a clone,

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Speaker 1: so you can have physically cut off, genetically identical trees

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Speaker 1: that are still considered part of the same clone. But

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Speaker 1: being a tree, pando Um can also reproduce sexually. And

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Speaker 1: aspens are also kind of unique or peculiar in that

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Speaker 1: they can reproduce vegetatively, but they also reproduce sexually, but

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Speaker 1: they don't have the equipment for both sides of sexual

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Speaker 1: reproduction on the same tree. So a tree is either

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Speaker 1: male or female, and in the case of pando, Pando's

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Speaker 1: a male. But that's pretty interesting too. I think if

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Speaker 1: that we're talking about like the biggest organism on Earth,

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Speaker 1: the most massive organism on Earth, but to know that

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Speaker 1: it has a name and that it's a male just

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Speaker 1: makes it all that more endearing, you know. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: like you said, even though they do have flowers and sexes,

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Speaker 1: it's they almost always reproduce vegetatively. Yeah, I think it's

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Speaker 1: starting to become clear that they actually produce sexually more

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Speaker 1: than we realize. But for a long time they're like,

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Speaker 1: that's basically it for aspen. Yeah, and it's uh, like

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Speaker 1: there are plenty of aspen grows and clones that are impressive,

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Speaker 1: but this is one where every thing kind of came together,

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Speaker 1: and we'll talk about all those different things, but everything

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Speaker 1: kind of came together in the right way just to

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Speaker 1: create something this massive, Right, Yeah, Panda lucked out. In

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Speaker 1: other words, yeah, they're not normally this impressive and large.

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Speaker 1: No huh um. One of the things about like a

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Speaker 1: clone of aspen trees like Pando is that in one

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Speaker 1: of the reasons why they can get so huge is

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Speaker 1: one that vegetative growth, of vegetative reproduction. But also when

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Speaker 1: you have, like when you're covering a hundred and six

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Speaker 1: acres of land, you've got a like a lot of

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Speaker 1: different resources available to you, and you're interconnected, you're just

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Speaker 1: one organism. And this whole thing makes me think, like, Chuck,

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Speaker 1: what are we really talking about when we're talking about pando.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about the collection of individual trees that we

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Speaker 1: typically see as like as individuals. Are we really talking

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Speaker 1: about like the roots system? Is that the real organism

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Speaker 1: that we're referring to? Are you asking a little bit?

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Speaker 1: I think it's both. It's all the same, right, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I guess it is all the same, but but you

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Speaker 1: tend to think of like an organism is like, you know,

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Speaker 1: a tree is a thing, but a whole bunch of

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Speaker 1: trees that are all connected to a root system that's

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Speaker 1: just different in some weird way that I can't quite

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Speaker 1: put my finger on. Yeah. I like to think that

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Speaker 1: they're all just holding hands underground, right, but it's all

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Speaker 1: just one hand. Yeah. But like you were saying, uh,

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Speaker 1: like the benefits of something like this is that they

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Speaker 1: are they do have different access to different things depending

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Speaker 1: on where they are in that forest. So like there

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Speaker 1: may be you know, three or four big old trees

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Speaker 1: down near the water that are just sucking up water

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Speaker 1: and sharing it with the trees near them. They can

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Speaker 1: just send that right down the old shared root pipeline

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Speaker 1: and say, I know you're thirsty over there, so why

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Speaker 1: don't you enjoy this spring water? Yeah, exactly, it's delicious

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Speaker 1: spring water. Um. They can also shuttle newt treents around

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Speaker 1: pando Can from one area to another, and so as

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Speaker 1: a result, you'll find aspens in some like really surprising places.

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Speaker 1: They're really hearty, and they really they show up everywhere

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Speaker 1: from like kind of wet rainforesty type areas to semi

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Speaker 1: arid um kind of brush land, Like they'll grow everywhere.

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Speaker 1: And they have a huge range too. You can find

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Speaker 1: aspen in North America from Alaska down to Mexico and

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Speaker 1: from Vancouver over to Maine. So they have a pretty good,

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Speaker 1: pretty good range. Uh, and they've grow just about everywhere. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but they need a lot of sunshine. The one thing

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Speaker 1: that um, the aspen does not like a shade, and

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Speaker 1: as their kryptonite it kind of is um. Moist soil

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Speaker 1: is the best. Plenty of sunshine and uh, gravelly slopes,

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Speaker 1: sandy sandy ground is great. But they are pretty um,

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Speaker 1: pretty hardy as long as as long as you don't

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Speaker 1: have anything big that's creating a canopy nearby to block

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Speaker 1: out that sunshine. Yeah, because think about you've got some

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Speaker 1: shoots that grew up and they're like, oh, I'm in

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Speaker 1: a semi arid area, now i could use some water

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Speaker 1: over here, and it just sends it from the wetlands.

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Speaker 1: I just think that's amazing. Josh Love, Pando Chuck Love

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Speaker 1: message break. Okay, let's do it then. All right, Well,

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Speaker 1: now we're on the road, driving in your truck. Want

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Speaker 1: to learn a thing or two from Josh Pan Chuck.

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Speaker 1: It's stuff you should know, all right, than alright, Chuck,

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Speaker 1: So we could probably stop here, and I just I'd

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Speaker 1: stand by my statement about loving PANDO. I think PANDO

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Speaker 1: is just an amazing inter seing organism. But I think

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Speaker 1: like all aspen stands are now all clones of aspen

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Speaker 1: let's think they're really cool. But we haven't even begun

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Speaker 1: to scratch the surface and how interesting these things are. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you want to talk about fire, I do, because this

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Speaker 1: is one of the reasons why I love earth science,

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Speaker 1: Like everything fits together, and everything has an explanation, and

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Speaker 1: if you mess with one thing over here, something else

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Speaker 1: way over here goes weird. I just love earth science

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Speaker 1: for that and this is a good example of it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so in our forest fires episode, which I think was

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Speaker 1: a great one, and go back and revisit that if

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Speaker 1: you want to learn more about this kind of thing.

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Speaker 1: But fire, as it happens, forest fires are kind of

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Speaker 1: great for aspens. Yeah, they thrive in fire pretty much

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Speaker 1: not in fire. It's a little little complicated, but it's

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Speaker 1: actually very simple. So um, So there's a few things

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Speaker 1: that happened like with fire. Supposedly, a wildfire when it

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Speaker 1: reaches an aspen stand will will sometimes die out because

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Speaker 1: aspens actually don't burn very well. They have really wet leaves,

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Speaker 1: and their bark says pretty moist too, and so does

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Speaker 1: their branches, So they don't burn well. Um, but they

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Speaker 1: are sensitive to fire, and that they've kind of seems

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Speaker 1: like kind of evolved to respond to fire, but not

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Speaker 1: necessarily in the ways you think like they can burn,

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Speaker 1: especially their canopy, their tops can burn pretty pretty badly.

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Speaker 1: But the way that they react to fire is if

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Speaker 1: fire comes through and wipes out some of their sprouts,

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Speaker 1: those little ramlets, the seedlings basically that grow up from

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Speaker 1: the roots system. If fire wipes some of those out,

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Speaker 1: those things send like a hormonal signal to the rest

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Speaker 1: of the tree saying we've got this area covered. We

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Speaker 1: don't need any competition, just keep the sprouts in check here.

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Speaker 1: When when those things are gone and those hormonal signals

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Speaker 1: are lost to the tree responds by shooting up many,

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Speaker 1: many times the number of sprout that were lost to

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Speaker 1: fire and repopulates an area that's been ravaged by fire

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Speaker 1: very very quickly and comes to dominate it for the

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Speaker 1: next hundred, two hundred, possibly thousand years. Yeah, twenty or

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Speaker 1: thirty years is all it takes. Uh, if an area

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Speaker 1: has been wiped out by wildfire to get that aspen

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Speaker 1: grove is plentiful or even more so than it was before. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And they do this because, uh, well, the conifer is

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Speaker 1: sort of the enemy. We like to think all trees

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Speaker 1: like each other, and they probably do emotionally, but the

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Speaker 1: conifer is what really provides that that upper canopy that

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Speaker 1: that is really bad for the aspen. So during a wildfire,

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Speaker 1: the aspen is fire resistant to a certain degree because,

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Speaker 1: like you said, with the wetness of the leaves and

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Speaker 1: twigs and branches. But those conifers go up like a match,

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Speaker 1: so they're killed off first. A lot of times, like

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Speaker 1: you said that, the aspens are just left and they're great.

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Speaker 1: We we got rid of those jerky conifers over there,

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Speaker 1: and now we're good. But even if it does kill

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Speaker 1: it all out, the aspens grow up a lot faster

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Speaker 1: than the new conifers do, so they basically sort of

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Speaker 1: beat them to the punch post wildfire, right exactly. And

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Speaker 1: not just wildfires. They show up after like mud slides

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Speaker 1: and rock slides and landslides and avalanches and everything you

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Speaker 1: can think of that could wipe out a forest. You're

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Speaker 1: gonna if if it's within the aspens range, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: find aspen there first. And you know, we were talking

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Speaker 1: about how one of the things about it is that quaking,

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Speaker 1: trembling sunlight that allows filter light through well. That obviously

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Speaker 1: allows saplings of um aspen to shoot up and grow.

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Speaker 1: And and as you were saying, when the conifers come in,

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Speaker 1: they block out that sunlight, and so the aspen seedlings

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Speaker 1: don't have any kind of chance at growing up as

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Speaker 1: the conifers start to uh interlope through the borders. I

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Speaker 1: think that right interloped through the borders of the clone,

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Speaker 1: the aspen clone, and then eventually make their way further

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Speaker 1: and further in. And then if everything's going well for

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Speaker 1: the aspen, and as is the case with nature, fire

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Speaker 1: comes along wipes all the conifers out and the cycle

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Speaker 1: starts again. And through this an aspen clone can live

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Speaker 1: for a very very long time as long as there's

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Speaker 1: a cycle of fire that doesn't come too frequently and

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Speaker 1: keep the aspen from growing back or come to infrequently

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Speaker 1: and allow the conifers to really take over and kill

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Speaker 1: off any new growth in the aspen clone. Yeah, if

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Speaker 1: it wasn't for like if America, if North America had

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Speaker 1: never had humans here and it was just allowed to

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Speaker 1: do whatever happens, Uh, there would be a lot more fire.

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Speaker 1: You know. Fire suppression is a is a human thing

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Speaker 1: because we like to put out fires for the most part.

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Speaker 1: And if that had never happened, the United States would

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Speaker 1: have I don't want to say it would be largely aspen,

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Speaker 1: but there would be a lot of aspen forest and

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Speaker 1: forest grows, yeah, and the ones that are around still today,

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Speaker 1: it would be in a lot better shape because I mean,

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Speaker 1: just another way to put it is aspen grows need

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Speaker 1: fire to thrive. Yeah, just as simple as that. It's

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Speaker 1: really really interesting. So um, one of the things that

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Speaker 1: I ran across I kept seeing was that a lot

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Speaker 1: of the and I got the impression that was like

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Speaker 1: old time or stuff. And I was right that you

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Speaker 1: can you can tell one aspen grow from another, like

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Speaker 1: a clone from another clone, because they'll grow up against

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Speaker 1: each other and sometimes intermingle. Um. Sometimes in the spring

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Speaker 1: you can see the leaf formation kind of come out

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Speaker 1: in certain ways, but really in the fall you can see,

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Speaker 1: you know, one aspen clone from another one will have

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Speaker 1: like a like a brilliant gold other will be like

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Speaker 1: a scarlet red or something like that. And then in

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Speaker 1: the fall you can kind of see the boundaries between

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Speaker 1: one aspen clone and another aspen clone. And for many

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Speaker 1: of myn of years, that's just how they did it.

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Speaker 1: And then genetics came along and they said, yeah, you're

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Speaker 1: wrong about a lot of this. Yeah. So like the

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Speaker 1: old timey researchers would say, look at those twenty five

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Speaker 1: trees all grouped together. They have the same exact bright

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Speaker 1: yellow color. Uh so that's that's all one clone. And

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Speaker 1: these guys over here red. But like you said, when

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Speaker 1: they actually finally got the technology to check, that was

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Speaker 1: not necessarily the case, and they'd walk away like kind

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Speaker 1: of dust in their hands off and fine, going off

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Speaker 1: to the no after before they're like, it was a

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Speaker 1: fine days work using my peepers to to tell one

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Speaker 1: clone apart from another. Peepers. I know that word. I

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Speaker 1: came across it again. You remember that episode. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think that's one of the worst slang terms of

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Speaker 1: all times. Peepers, one of the worst non offensive slang

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Speaker 1: terms of all time. Yeah, that's a good that's a

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Speaker 1: good call leaf peepers. Yeah, and that the whole thing

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Speaker 1: the genetic zo is. For a while there that was

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Speaker 1: causing a little bit of uh, well, I mean just confusion.

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Speaker 1: I guess it's not. It wasn't like the end of

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Speaker 1: the world or anything, but it was a little confusing

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Speaker 1: because at one point, like you know, thirty years ago,

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Speaker 1: they the scientists were there watching what they thought was

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Speaker 1: that single clone of aspen, and they thought, oh my god,

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00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,879
Speaker 1: we've just learned something. This this this tree or this

336
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:30,359
Speaker 1: you know, this clone has actually changed sex. It's amazing.

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Speaker 1: It's producing pollen this year and last year it produced flowers,

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Speaker 1: and oh my god, what a breakthrough. And then now

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Speaker 1: that we have genetic testing, they're like, oh no, that's

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00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:43,760
Speaker 1: actually two different clones. Yeah, when they started looking at

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Speaker 1: at um some of those trees more closely, like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: they look alike, but actually this is they're not genetically identical.

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Speaker 1: They're not part of the same Aspen clone, but they

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Speaker 1: could still be a direct descendant from that Aspen clone,

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00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:02,240
Speaker 1: because remember and aspens reproduced. They can do it one

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Speaker 1: of two ways, vegetatively, which produces trees that are genetically

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Speaker 1: identical to other trees that have sprouted up from the

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00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:12,280
Speaker 1: same root system, or they can do it sexually um,

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Speaker 1: and the seeds that come out are um are not

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Speaker 1: genetically identical, So you can have offspring and genetic genetically

351
00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 1: identical clones of the same tree all intermingled in the

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00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:31,359
Speaker 1: same little area. It's pretty fascinating, it is. Uh. And

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Speaker 1: as far as age of these things, it kind of

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Speaker 1: depends um on where you are. Like, usually an aspen

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Speaker 1: tree won't live more than a hundred and fifty years,

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Speaker 1: occasionally up to two hundred in in Colorado, where Panda is.

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Speaker 1: I just love saying his name. I know, it's so cute.

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Speaker 1: It's close to Panda, that's why. That's definitely why. But oh,

359
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:55,680
Speaker 1: it's nice of fat on the end, so it looks

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Speaker 1: like it's got some chubby cheeks you just want to pinch.

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Speaker 1: Probably does. As far as as Panda goes in Colorado,

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Speaker 1: they usually don't get to be more than about seventy

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Speaker 1: five years old. And it's not like you can go

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00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:10,280
Speaker 1: to a clone either and pluck out what you think

365
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Speaker 1: is the oldest tree and say this is how old

366
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Speaker 1: the clone is, because it may be oh yeah, it

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Speaker 1: may be the newest tree. That's why I'm like, Okay,

368
00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 1: so is the organism really the root system if a tree,

369
00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:23,399
Speaker 1: if a tree just like dies. I think around the

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Speaker 1: area where Pando grows in Utah, uh, I think on

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Speaker 1: the Colorado Front Range is what it's called. They said

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Speaker 1: Colorado Emit Colorado Front Range, Colorado Front Range, so um,

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Speaker 1: in that area they usually live that well we call trees,

374
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:42,640
Speaker 1: but what are really just stems growing up from Pando's

375
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Speaker 1: root system. Those things live for about seventy five years.

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Speaker 1: The oldest aspens live for about two hundred years. Pando

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Speaker 1: is way way older than that, even by the most

378
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Speaker 1: conservative estimates. Yeah, I mean they say thirteen thousand years

379
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Speaker 1: old to eighty thousand years old. Yeah, and I think

380
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Speaker 1: thirteen thousand is really hedging bets because they're like, well,

381
00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:10,399
Speaker 1: that's about when the last ice age ended, so Pando

382
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:12,960
Speaker 1: probably couldn't have lived through that. But I was looking

383
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Speaker 1: at ice sheet maps. There was not an ice sheet

384
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Speaker 1: anywhere near where Panda's going. So it's it's entirely possible

385
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:25,120
Speaker 1: with a hardy and resilient as um aspen stands are

386
00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:28,760
Speaker 1: that Pando is as far far older than that. You

387
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:31,720
Speaker 1: mean the ice sheet map on your bedroom wall. He

388
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 1: just got out of bed, went let me look at

389
00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 1: this again. Well, you haven't been over for a while.

390
00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,440
Speaker 1: I haven't pasted to the ceiling, so I don't even

391
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:42,240
Speaker 1: oh man, just lay there in point. I'm like, you're

392
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:47,240
Speaker 1: really getting efficiencies the laurentide kind of day. That's great. Yeah,

393
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,080
Speaker 1: uh yeah. So I mean and this one article sent

394
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:53,880
Speaker 1: over the said in principle, clones may even be essentially immortal.

395
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,480
Speaker 1: That's you know. But yeah, they've they hedged it within principle,

396
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,159
Speaker 1: like and it can die from disease like aspen or

397
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,520
Speaker 1: they're not like indestructible. There's all sorts of things that

398
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: can hurt them. Because of their really soft bark, they're

399
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 1: susceptible to boring insects and diseases that can come from

400
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,080
Speaker 1: that um. A lot of birds that bore live in

401
00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,359
Speaker 1: in aspen um, which I think is not bad for him.

402
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 1: I'm not sure, but there so they can die. There's

403
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,760
Speaker 1: a lot of things that can kill an aspen growth.

404
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,199
Speaker 1: But if if everything was going right, where there's no

405
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 1: reason that it should die, there's no like a human,

406
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:34,320
Speaker 1: we can do everything right and we're still going to

407
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,440
Speaker 1: die someday. There's like a certain there's a certain number

408
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:40,160
Speaker 1: of times our cells are going to divide, and they're

409
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 1: gonna stop, and we're eventually going to run out of

410
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,520
Speaker 1: dividing cells and then we die. Right, that's not necessarily

411
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:48,080
Speaker 1: the case with an Aspen clone. That's why they're saying,

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Speaker 1: like in principle they are technically immortal, or they may

413
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:55,320
Speaker 1: be technically immortal, and they think that possibly Pando is

414
00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:59,239
Speaker 1: more than eighty thousand years old. That's the high end.

415
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,320
Speaker 1: Although there's a and uh at the University of Michigan,

416
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 1: who's who's saying something like a million. I'm not back

417
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:08,800
Speaker 1: in that one. I love that. I'll go as high

418
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:12,760
Speaker 1: as eighty thousand and uh. Dr Barnes, we don't mean

419
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 1: to call you a kook. We're just joking. We were joking.

420
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,120
Speaker 1: All right. Well, let's uh take a break, hire an attorney,

421
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 1: and we're going to talk about why why pandos now

422
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: in trouble, which is very very sad. Right after this, well,

423
00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 1: now we're on the road, driving in your truck. Want

424
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:34,920
Speaker 1: to learn a thing or two from Josh Pam Chuck.

425
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: It's stuff you should know, all right, all right, Chuck,

426
00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,399
Speaker 1: Like you said, I spoiled it for everybody already. But

427
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:04,680
Speaker 1: Pando is dying. Yeah, Um, that's not an overstatement. Yeah,

428
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,879
Speaker 1: it's very sad. Here's what's going on, and here's what

429
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 1: can go on really to any I mean Pando special,

430
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 1: but any any clone like Thisando is very special. It's uh.

431
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 1: There are a few things that can happen. We already

432
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 1: talked a little bit about, like you know, birds and

433
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:25,560
Speaker 1: and blight and stuff like that. There's also disease. Uh,

434
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:31,400
Speaker 1: but human interaction has had a major toll on these forests.

435
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:33,920
Speaker 1: In the eighties and nineties, there were, of course, people

436
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:37,879
Speaker 1: were able to build homes within where Pando is, in

437
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:41,199
Speaker 1: this hundred and six acres. Uh. People also want to

438
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 1: go see these things that like, all right, well let's

439
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 1: let's put a campground there as well. And if you

440
00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:49,720
Speaker 1: want to campground, you want toilets, and you want plumbing,

441
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 1: and you want picnic tables and roads, roads and parking

442
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,120
Speaker 1: lots and stuff like that and water lines and all

443
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 1: of this stuff. Even though they do as good a

444
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: job as they can at pres ovation, um, it all

445
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:05,239
Speaker 1: takes its toll little by little with every new you know,

446
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:09,200
Speaker 1: parking lot laid down on something like Pando. So um,

447
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:13,680
Speaker 1: all of these things being built in the middle of Pando, right,

448
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 1: in the middle of Pando Um. They have had their effect.

449
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:21,440
Speaker 1: But it's probable that Panda is kind of like, let's

450
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: just grow around you. It's fine. I'm not happy about it, human,

451
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 1: but I know you don't know any better. I'm Pando.

452
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 1: I'll just grow around. So that's fine. That's not what

453
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 1: it is. That was. That's so that's strike one. But

454
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:37,920
Speaker 1: humans are not off the hook because it turns out

455
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 1: that we're doing things in other ways and that whole

456
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,080
Speaker 1: like Earth science, messing with something over here has having

457
00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,239
Speaker 1: these effects over here. That's going on with Pando right

458
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 1: now as well. Yeah, because one of the major threats,

459
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:55,720
Speaker 1: aside from wildfires that we're putting out is uh. Herbivores,

460
00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 1: deer and elk specifically love to eat the those tiny

461
00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: little baby aspen that's sprout up from the ground from well,

462
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:08,120
Speaker 1: I was about to say, from Pando. Uh. They eat

463
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 1: them so fast it never almost has a chance to

464
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:14,960
Speaker 1: become part of Fando, right, like Pando doesn't. They are

465
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,959
Speaker 1: doing studies now. Panda is old. They're old trees. It's

466
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:22,760
Speaker 1: a bunch of senior citizens hanging out holding hands. There's

467
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:25,920
Speaker 1: not a youngster among them, right, And that's not good,

468
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:31,000
Speaker 1: whether it's a human civilization or population or a population

469
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:34,560
Speaker 1: of uh, you know, aspen clones. You want like all

470
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 1: stages of life. You want mature trees, middle aged trees,

471
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 1: young trees, saplings, you want all that. And if you

472
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 1: have nothing but old trees, those old trees, remember they

473
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: only live about seventy five years, so as they start

474
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,640
Speaker 1: to die, that means Pando is dying. As as long

475
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: as an aspen clone is replacing itself, it's fine, it's healthy.

476
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 1: But if it's not, then it's in big, big trouble.

477
00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:01,520
Speaker 1: And apparently Pando is in big, big trouble and has

478
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 1: been for some years now because of overgrazing and over browsing,

479
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,880
Speaker 1: not just with like cattle, like grazing cattle, which apparently

480
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 1: happens on Pando land, but also UM the mule, deer

481
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 1: and elk populations are supposedly booming in Utah in the

482
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 1: area where Pando lives. Yeah, and they're they're you know,

483
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:23,400
Speaker 1: they're able to prove this now, uh. In a couple

484
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: of ways, UM in the US Forestry Service clear cut

485
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:32,680
Speaker 1: fifteen full acres of Pando right in the middle of

486
00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:36,560
Speaker 1: it and fenced off about a third of this left

487
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 1: the other two thirds, uh, just to you know, do

488
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 1: do what it would do. And the fenced part came

489
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 1: back really healthy, which was a very clear indicator that

490
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:51,280
Speaker 1: because uh, there wasn't anything there to eat these little

491
00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: seedlings that pop up that that's the big diff Um.

492
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 1: So that was uh. In two thousand thirteen, they fenced

493
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 1: off and area from Uh. I love the word ungulates.

494
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: It's any kind of hoofed animal, whether natural or just

495
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 1: you know, someone's cattle, because like you said, how many

496
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 1: how many weeks a year do they allow cattle? A

497
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: couple of weeks? Two weeks? But I think like each

498
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 1: rancher gets two weeks there. I don't think it's like, hey,

499
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:21,360
Speaker 1: everybody bring your cattle to Panda land for like a

500
00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:24,920
Speaker 1: two week period, although I could be wrong. Pando pandas

501
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 1: like please please don't not again. Yeah. So in two

502
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:32,479
Speaker 1: thousand thirteen, they they fenced off this area and are

503
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,440
Speaker 1: gonna leave it that way. And this is all part

504
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 1: of a study. UM. A nonprofit group of conservationists got

505
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 1: together with the US Force Service to kind of check

506
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: out what happens. And then this year that's why it's

507
00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 1: what's current, Like you said, at the beginning, these these

508
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: results are coming in and it's pretty obvious what's going on.

509
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,560
Speaker 1: It is. So number one, it's the it's the over browsing,

510
00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 1: especially among elkin mule deer UM. But also number two, uh,

511
00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:06,440
Speaker 1: it's the um the fact that the fences aren't necessarily

512
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: working as well. So like, the fences are doing the

513
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 1: best that they can and the unfenced area is in

514
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,560
Speaker 1: even bigger trouble. But even the fences they're using, the

515
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 1: mule deer are able to hop over and eat these

516
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 1: shoots um. And so you think, okay, well that's the

517
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: mule deer's fault. Let's just kill a bunch of mule deer. Well,

518
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 1: the problem is and this is so we've i should say,

519
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,040
Speaker 1: we've reached like a point of contention here because the

520
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,440
Speaker 1: guys um led by the researchers, led by a guy

521
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 1: at the university or Utah State University, Paul Rodgers. He

522
00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 1: is a an ecologist, and he's clearly he's among a

523
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 1: group who are saying the Utah fish and wildlife are

524
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:54,280
Speaker 1: are they are overpopulating the area with elk and mule

525
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: deer because they make money from hunting licenses and as

526
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 1: like the more l can mule deer there are, the

527
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: more hunting of those things that can go on, the

528
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:08,960
Speaker 1: more the state UM Wildlife Commission can take in hunting licenses, right,

529
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:12,800
Speaker 1: hunting license fees, Yeah, revenue, And so the state is like, no,

530
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:15,680
Speaker 1: that's not it. Actually elk and a mule deer are

531
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 1: lower than ever. Whether that's the case or not, whether

532
00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: they're being managed in correctly or not, it does seem

533
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,920
Speaker 1: pretty clearly that at the very least overbrowsing by mule

534
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 1: deer and elk is a major major factor, if not

535
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 1: the dominant factor in what's killing panda off. Yeah, and

536
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:36,120
Speaker 1: this goes back even further because, like you were saying,

537
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 1: touch one thing here and it affects something over there.

538
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 1: This can even be separated by like a hundred years.

539
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 1: Go back to the early nineteen hundreds, when people in

540
00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 1: this country, uh, in North America as a whole hunted wolves,

541
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 1: hunted mountain lines and mountain lions, hunted grizzly bears. Uh

542
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 1: what is what are they? They are animals that eat

543
00:32:56,840 --> 00:33:00,600
Speaker 1: mule deer and elk. So it's it's called an effect

544
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 1: here a hundred plus years later, where there aren't a

545
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 1: lot of apex predators out there keeping these helping to

546
00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 1: keep these deer population in check. So there's been talk

547
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 1: here and there. I don't I mean, they're not gonna

548
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,360
Speaker 1: do it now that they said unequivocally. They're not like,

549
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:20,360
Speaker 1: should we reintroduce wolves to the ecosystem because that's a

550
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:24,560
Speaker 1: very national natural predator prey cycle that goes on that

551
00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 1: is not happening right now. No. And I mean it's

552
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 1: like hunters coal uh, that is to say, shoot mule

553
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: deer and elkins stuff like that. So the population, it's

554
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: not like it's getting out of hand. And if it

555
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: ever did, they would just have like open season on

556
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: these things, right, And if it ever did, they would

557
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 1: just sell more hunting licenses. I don't think that that's

558
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: the issue. What the what Paul Rodgers and some of

559
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 1: his fellow A collegists are saying is that if the

560
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 1: presence of like wolves and bears and mountain lions is

561
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 1: known in an area, the elkin, the mule deer, they're

562
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:01,840
Speaker 1: not just gonna stay in one place for very long.

563
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,160
Speaker 1: They're going to constantly be on the move. And so

564
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:08,280
Speaker 1: even if they are going through with a big population

565
00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:11,279
Speaker 1: eating a bunch of shoots off of something like Pando.

566
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:13,400
Speaker 1: They're not going to be doing it in the same place,

567
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 1: so the panda will be able to recover over time

568
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 1: because that browsing will be distributed. Whereas now it's like,

569
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:23,240
Speaker 1: I don't feel like going ten miles down the mountain.

570
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:25,600
Speaker 1: I'm gonna stay right here and just keep eating Pando

571
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:29,800
Speaker 1: until Pando dies. Yeah, there's no wolves, right, there's no bears,

572
00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 1: or least not enough to to scare me and my

573
00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 1: my gang here. Yeah. Yeah, they call it an ecology

574
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,839
Speaker 1: of fear. I've never heard of that, haven't either, And yeah,

575
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: it's it's really interesting though that they and and I

576
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 1: guess it takes you know, a hundred plus years too

577
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,240
Speaker 1: to create this kind of uh almost called it a culture.

578
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 1: It kind of is sort of there's a culture among

579
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:56,400
Speaker 1: these herds of hooved animals to where they're just like

580
00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:58,879
Speaker 1: you said, They're like, no, you know, there's nothing around

581
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:01,279
Speaker 1: here to hunt me, So I'm just gonna look at

582
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:04,799
Speaker 1: all this tasty aspen babies. I'm gonna eat them all. Yeah,

583
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,200
Speaker 1: what am I chump? I'm not going anywhere. Yeah, it's

584
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 1: really interesting, it is. And then there's I and like

585
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:13,919
Speaker 1: it's not like I'm a wildlife ecologist or a biologist

586
00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:17,400
Speaker 1: or have any formal training in it whatsoever. But I

587
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:21,000
Speaker 1: tend to think that it's not just over browsing. I

588
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 1: think that they the fact that there are people that

589
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 1: live in Pando means that the Forest Service says, well,

590
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:31,000
Speaker 1: we we have to control wildfire. You don't let wildfire

591
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:34,640
Speaker 1: go any longer. Um, And so then you've got conifer

592
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 1: um forest coming in moving in on Pando too. I

593
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 1: think that that's probably part of the issue as well.

594
00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 1: So the key is, Chuck, is to put up better

595
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:48,879
Speaker 1: fences and let the fires go. Yeah, burn, baby, burn burn,

596
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,560
Speaker 1: Just don't burn the fences down. Yeah. I don't know

597
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:54,640
Speaker 1: what they were doing with those little three foot fences anyway, No,

598
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:58,440
Speaker 1: because a mule deer just hops right over, just so easy. Yeah,

599
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:01,560
Speaker 1: it's all very sad. Mean, panda is such an amazing

600
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:04,520
Speaker 1: I don't know, such an amazing thing in this in

601
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:08,799
Speaker 1: this country. And it's going bye bye. It is it is,

602
00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:12,879
Speaker 1: it's it is said, um yeah, and I mean part

603
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,359
Speaker 1: of it is like, well, yes it's I mean, it's

604
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:19,640
Speaker 1: an aspen stand. But it's possibly the oldest and definitely

605
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:22,279
Speaker 1: the most massive organism on Earth, which seems like it

606
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: should get like a little extra attention just for that,

607
00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 1: you know. But then you ask like, well, is that

608
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:31,600
Speaker 1: just dumbly sentimental? Why not save everything? Why? Why why

609
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: just focus all of your attention on this one thing?

610
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: And then the other part of me says, well, if

611
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 1: you focus attention on this one thing, you come to

612
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 1: realize that all this other stuff is in danger as well,

613
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,200
Speaker 1: and you start to care. So maybe pandas like just

614
00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:47,439
Speaker 1: the poster child for getting people into ecology a little more,

615
00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:51,799
Speaker 1: kind of like the Great Barrier Reef, you know, Superstar

616
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 1: of the Ocean that is uh kind of quickly going away. Yeah,

617
00:36:57,080 --> 00:36:59,720
Speaker 1: it's all sad. I'm depressed now. Yeah, I mean too.

618
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 1: I was kind of hoping to end this on a

619
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:07,280
Speaker 1: high note. Well, you know, despite what happens to Pando,

620
00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 1: it's not like this is the death of the the

621
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:13,600
Speaker 1: aspen in North America. This is Pando. Yeah, there are

622
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,960
Speaker 1: plenty of them in uh. And I encourage you to

623
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 1: go sit among the trees when the breeze is blowing

624
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:23,280
Speaker 1: in the fall and tell us your experience. It's it's amazing.

625
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:27,799
Speaker 1: It's a light and sound show. Nice. Um, I got

626
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,279
Speaker 1: a couple more things. Do you want to talk about

627
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:33,879
Speaker 1: some of the other biggest or oldest stuff on Earth? Sure?

628
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 1: So I mentioned that giant mushroom in Oregon. Isn't that

629
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:43,839
Speaker 1: how they say Oregon? Oregon? Oregon? Um? It is an

630
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 1: Armillaria Ostoyer specimen and it covers acres. PANDO covers a

631
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:57,440
Speaker 1: hundred and six This covers acres of Mallard National Forests

632
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 1: in Oregon, UM. But they only think that it's just

633
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 1: a couple of thousand years old, and that's just that's

634
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:08,040
Speaker 1: just area that's not mass. Yeah. I think I learned

635
00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:11,240
Speaker 1: about PANDO a few years ago when I was trying

636
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,400
Speaker 1: to find out the oldest tree. There's like a sequoia

637
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,360
Speaker 1: that's pretty old, right or is it the biggest? You know.

638
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,960
Speaker 1: I can't remember where I ended up as far as

639
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:23,880
Speaker 1: that result goes, but I know that's where I found

640
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:28,080
Speaker 1: out about PANDO. And I was like, what And there

641
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 1: are some old trees. There's like some bristle comb pines

642
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:34,879
Speaker 1: in California that are about five thousand years old. That's

643
00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:38,640
Speaker 1: pretty old for a tree. There's a creas salt bush

644
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:42,960
Speaker 1: that's at least eleven thousand, seven hundred years old. And

645
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:47,680
Speaker 1: then have you heard of um glass sponges. There are

646
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:51,120
Speaker 1: glass sponges. They live in the water off of Antarctica.

647
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:54,360
Speaker 1: They lived to about fifteen thousand years old. A sponge.

648
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:58,879
Speaker 1: Who'd have thought, you know, amazing? You got anything else?

649
00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:03,279
Speaker 1: I got nothing now? Okay, well then, uh, we'll just

650
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:06,920
Speaker 1: put out a call for everybody to save Pando. Okay, yes,

651
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:10,799
Speaker 1: send us. Uh if you've actually been to Pando or

652
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 1: in in Pando on Pando on Pando, Yeah, in Pando

653
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,640
Speaker 1: that's gross. Uh, send us. I want to I want

654
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:23,719
Speaker 1: to hear about this experience. Okay, yes, please to Uh.

655
00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 1: And in the meantime, how about a listener mail. Yeah,

656
00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this. UM, we got a couple on

657
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:37,759
Speaker 1: robin Hood. I'll read these these couple in the next

658
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 1: two episodes. Hey guys, Uh, every episode you release, it's

659
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 1: done to such a high standard. It's clear that the

660
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 1: true effort and love of the job is poured into

661
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:49,600
Speaker 1: every session in the studio. You might get a little

662
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 1: too much credit. Joey Uh. The episode on robin Hood

663
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 1: especially piqued my interest, though as I am from Nottingham

664
00:39:56,480 --> 00:40:00,080
Speaker 1: sure myself and I live only about ten miles a

665
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:04,120
Speaker 1: from rain Worth. The area of Sherwood Forest where Robin

666
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 1: Hood and his men are fabled to have resided or

667
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:09,520
Speaker 1: at least spent a lot of their time in this

668
00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 1: area is the major oak of Sherwood Forest, which is

669
00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:16,239
Speaker 1: said to be the location they chose for shelter. It

670
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 1: is between eight hundred to a thousand years old and

671
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 1: is now held up by a series of poles due

672
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:25,399
Speaker 1: to his age and bad health. Interesting. Maybe they should

673
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 1: do that with Bando. I think I saw that tree.

674
00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:30,799
Speaker 1: Actually I saw something on it. Oh yeah, when doing

675
00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 1: panda research would have been like, gosh, this trees everywhere. Uh.

676
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,280
Speaker 1: The episode was so well done. You taught me new information.

677
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:42,520
Speaker 1: Even though I've been to the woods and Visitor Center

678
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:46,440
Speaker 1: a few times, I have taken my children as well,

679
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,800
Speaker 1: and they also love the legend myth of Robin Hood.

680
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 1: My father in law happens to be called Robin and

681
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:57,000
Speaker 1: resides in the Sherwood district, so I sometimes dropped little

682
00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: hints to my young children that he could possibly be

683
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 1: the Robin of Sherwood. I lost all credibility with them.

684
00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:07,320
Speaker 1: They love it, even though I think they're onto the ruse.

685
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 1: Really really looking forward to your legendary Halloween episode. I'm

686
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 1: a huge fan of horror and I am actually in

687
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:21,000
Speaker 1: a horror punk rock band called Headstone Horrors based in Nottingham, UK.

688
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:23,759
Speaker 1: So this is an amazing busy and exciting time of

689
00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:25,359
Speaker 1: the year for us. I bet they book a lot

690
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:28,360
Speaker 1: of gigs in October. Don't you think I would guess

691
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 1: so Headstone Horrors, I would guess January is not a

692
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 1: huge month for him. No, no or Christmas or Christmas season.

693
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 1: Everybody Headstone Horrors Christmas album. Uh, It's an amazing busy

694
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: and exciting time of year for us. I would love

695
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:46,960
Speaker 1: to send you a C D T T shirts if

696
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 1: you like. Just let me know your size as you want,

697
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 1: and I'll pack them up and send them on their way.

698
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:56,440
Speaker 1: That is from Joey Gathercole of shere would, son of

699
00:41:56,560 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 1: Robin perhaps father of incredible this Children. Well thanks a lot, buddy,

700
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 1: that was fantastic. I appreciate the offer for the shirt.

701
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:10,479
Speaker 1: I think we will be taking you up on that. Uh.

702
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:13,239
Speaker 1: And in the meantime, if you out there want to

703
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 1: get in touch with us to let us know you're interesting.

704
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:20,240
Speaker 1: Amazing story of how you fib to your children, We'd

705
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: love to hear that you can go to stuff you

706
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: Should Know dot com and find all of our social links.

707
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 1: I'm also at the Josh clark Way dot com and

708
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 1: you can send me, Chuck and Jerry All an email

709
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:38,799
Speaker 1: to Stuff podcast how stuff Works dot com. For more

710
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:41,160
Speaker 1: on this and thousands of other topics. Is it how

711
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:49,440
Speaker 1: stuff Works dot com