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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds, and Donald Trump says it's very possible

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Speaker 1: he will have to jail President Biden.

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Speaker 2: That's nice. We have such a great show for you today.

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Speaker 1: Wisconsin Senator Tammy Baldwin stops by to talk about the

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Speaker 1: rights never ending aggression towards reproductive rights. Then we'll talk

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Speaker 1: to the daily shows Jordan Klepper about what he sees

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Speaker 1: when he attends those Maga rallies. But first we have

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Speaker 1: the host of the Origin Story podcast and my personal

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Speaker 1: friend Ian dunt Welcome back to Fast Politics.

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Speaker 2: Really one of my favorite guests, Ian, Thank you.

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Speaker 3: Always an in Tadie show who you were referring to

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Speaker 3: that Richardson.

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Speaker 2: I'm very dopic for full disclosure.

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Speaker 1: Before this we were talking, Jesse and I were both like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, something's happening in England.

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Speaker 2: We can get Ian.

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Speaker 3: Yes. Really in a way, that's the most president consequence

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Speaker 3: of the general election here. So I'm glad we'll be

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Speaker 3: satisfied that.

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Speaker 1: Richie Sunak he has announced elections a little early, not

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Speaker 1: like Nanya who was never going to have elections, but

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Speaker 1: he picked July fourth because of how much he loves

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Speaker 1: America discuss at certainly.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I would predict that when he loses in

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Speaker 3: a few weeks time, he will soon enough find himself

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Speaker 3: on the shores of Silicon Valley, desperately hoping that one

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Speaker 3: of the tech bros Will give him a job. That's

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Speaker 3: clearly where he wants to be. In fact, genuinely, and

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Speaker 3: I really didn't mean this, Some bills bandalists thought maybe

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Speaker 3: he called the election for this period so that there

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Speaker 3: was still time to get his kids into school in

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Speaker 3: California when he ineveratively loses it, so it's better impossible

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Speaker 3: in the one hundred percent, maybe as part of his

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Speaker 3: great pr campaign for his next professional venturers to hold

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Speaker 3: it on the fourth of July.

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Speaker 1: It is a bit weird, right, I mean, is there

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Speaker 1: something happening Underly fourth in the UK that we don't

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Speaker 1: know about?

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Speaker 3: No, I mean July fourth, you know, for obvious reasons,

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Speaker 3: doesn't really mean anything over here at bathroom like an

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Speaker 3: old Tom Cruise film, So I don't think I had

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Speaker 3: much of a bell there. The timing of the election

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Speaker 3: is just completely bizarre, and the first week of it

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Speaker 3: we all just sat around being like, why what are

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Speaker 3: you doing?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, can you explain to us why? Because he could

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Speaker 1: have kept this going for another like six months.

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Speaker 3: Right, yeah, exactly. He can call the election whenever he likes.

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Speaker 3: You have to have it within a five year period,

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Speaker 3: like you can't just drag it on forever. It's still

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Speaker 3: like just about kind of a functioning democracy over here.

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Speaker 3: Within that you could just do what you like. Really,

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Speaker 3: we expected him to call it late because he's going

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Speaker 3: to lose, you know, and people are the prime minister.

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Speaker 3: They usually like being prime minister, so they just wait

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Speaker 3: as long as they now not.

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Speaker 2: To put too fine a point on it, yes, go.

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Speaker 3: On, exactly. This is my really deep, acute perceptive political

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Speaker 3: analysis that you're getting right now. It's like they like

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Speaker 3: not losing and so they do not put an election.

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Speaker 3: So from that you can come to one conclusion, which

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Speaker 3: is that imagine like the thought process that you have

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Speaker 3: if you're in Downing Street, if you're the government, thinking

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Speaker 3: when are we going to have the election? You're constantly thinking,

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Speaker 3: we're waiting something to come along to improve our electoral prospects.

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Speaker 3: And at the point that you think, you know what,

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Speaker 3: nothing's ever going to come. Like, you know, the economy,

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Speaker 3: biggs look bad, health figures look bad, finances look bad.

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Speaker 3: Eventually you just think, well, we might as well just

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Speaker 3: hold it now, because this is as good as it's

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Speaker 3: ever going to get. So it wasn't so much a

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Speaker 3: sort of confident announcement of an election. It was more

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Speaker 3: of this sad song of defeat, like an admission of defeat.

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Speaker 3: When he said we're going to have a general election now,

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Speaker 3: it literally sounded like an animal dying on the side

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Speaker 3: of a road.

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Speaker 1: I laugh to keep from crying, and not because I

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Speaker 1: find you're pain funny.

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Speaker 2: But maybe a little. So he basically just gave up.

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Speaker 3: I mean it really does feel like it. You should

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Speaker 3: see the state of him. I mean, I have to

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Speaker 3: say that I'm not going to deny any of this

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Speaker 3: after you know, eight years or so of just acute

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Speaker 3: political pain and disappointment. I've spent almost every day of

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Speaker 3: the last two weeks laughing my ass off at what

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Speaker 3: is going on here, because he is having one of

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Speaker 3: the worst election campaigns I've seen in my life. And

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Speaker 3: it started with the announcement.

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Speaker 2: Can you talk about the rain?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the rain. I just I've never seen political ineptity

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Speaker 3: on this scale, I think, for all of my days.

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Speaker 3: So he comes out. It's been raining for days. You know,

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Speaker 3: it's England, right, this is how it goes. So it's

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Speaker 3: been raining just for days. Everything was sobtly onwear. He

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Speaker 3: comes out of Downing Street. There's no reason to announce

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Speaker 3: the election outside, except of course, for the fact that

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Speaker 3: you know, he wants to have the image of the

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Speaker 3: door behind it, you know, the door down the street,

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Speaker 3: which really is just a prop at this point, just

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Speaker 3: another part of our pathological national sentimentality. He needs to

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Speaker 3: have that door behind him so he can look states.

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Speaker 3: And yet it's raining and you're like, so the whole

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Speaker 3: day and he's thinking like, you can't possibly, you can't

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Speaker 3: do it outside because you know it's raining. For two

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Speaker 3: or three minutes before he comes out, the sun emerges

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Speaker 3: from the clouds like and suddenly I thought, oh no,

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Speaker 3: this is it. We always lose, you know, the liberals.

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Speaker 3: We always lose, as what we're used to happening in

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Speaker 3: this country for the last few years. And now you know,

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Speaker 3: the gods are going to shine on him. So he

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Speaker 3: steps outside and that one second, as soon as he

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Speaker 3: leaves the building, the rain begins and he just gets

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Speaker 3: absolutely drenched out there. He goes and he makes his speech,

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Speaker 3: and his speech is basically some total of all he

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Speaker 3: has to communicate to people is I have got a plan.

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Speaker 3: Trust my plan, Put your faith in my plan. And

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Speaker 3: yet the spectacle of him, this man in an expensive suit,

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Speaker 3: standing outside in the rain without an umbrella, drenched to

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Speaker 3: the bone, telling you to trust him because he's got

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Speaker 3: a plan, was one of the most preposterous sights I've

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Speaker 3: seen in a very long time, and pretty much the

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Speaker 3: perfect curtain opener to what has then gone on to

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Speaker 3: be a disastrously inect campaign.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it just kept raining and raining and raining.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the suit is basically ruined, and he looks like

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Speaker 3: what he is, which is a very desperate, grasping man

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Speaker 3: hoping for one final chance, which he's not really getting.

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Speaker 3: So in the weeks that have followed from that, everything

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Speaker 3: that could possibly go wrong for him has gone wrong

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Speaker 3: for him. And I mean, the worst moment of all

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Speaker 3: I suspect came a couple of days ago when Nigel

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Speaker 3: Farage for the Reform Party announced that he was taking

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Speaker 3: over the leadership and going to run for parliament. Now

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Speaker 3: Nigel Farrage is extremely far to the right. He runs

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Speaker 3: around you. You may have seen him as one of

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Speaker 3: the sort of best friends of Donald Trump. He is

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Speaker 3: entirely in that movel, just an extreme, venal, nasty, anti

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Speaker 3: immigrant tos in in the political blood system. We thought

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Speaker 3: that he wasn't going to bother He actually wrote a

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Speaker 3: letter saying, I can't be bothered to run because I

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Speaker 3: really should be off in the US doing something important,

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Speaker 3: not dabbling around and let old Englin. This is the

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Speaker 3: kind of patriotism that he supposedly espouses. Now he's decided

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Speaker 3: to run, and that really is a complete disaster for

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Speaker 3: the Prime Minster.

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Speaker 1: I thought he was going to the States to help

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump.

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Speaker 3: Yes, well that was his plan, and now apparently it

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Speaker 3: turns out that he wants to run to become the

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Speaker 3: Member of Parliament for a part of Essex. He may

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Speaker 3: or may not get that seat, it's not entirely clear,

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Speaker 3: but just by being there, I mean, he's charismatic in

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Speaker 3: the way that you know, you can find some meaning

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Speaker 3: in a really sodden ashtray. And what is exactly what

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Speaker 3: he looks like. He looks like the smell of old

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Speaker 3: cigarettes basically, and behaves pretty much with the same kind

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Speaker 3: of moral substance to it. And yet nevertheless he is

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Speaker 3: liked by about twenty percent of the population. You know,

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Speaker 3: there's a pretty low ceiling on his support. But the

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Speaker 3: people that support him really really like him. They are

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Speaker 3: on the right, hard right, and they will lose those

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Speaker 3: votes from the Conservative Party to the Reform Party. So

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Speaker 3: not only is Richie Suena facing this really quite cataclysmic

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Speaker 3: challenge from the center and the left and even arguably

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Speaker 3: the center right, he's now also facing a separate challenge

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Speaker 3: on the hard right, giving him almost no political sport

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Speaker 3: whatsoever in which to operate.

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Speaker 2: Right now, talk to me about milkshake Gate.

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Speaker 3: Oh yes, right, Well, Nije Raj was out a couple

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Speaker 3: of days ago.

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Speaker 2: I have to hit on all the real highlights. By

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Speaker 2: the way, I love that.

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Speaker 1: When I was growing up, you know, I had all

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Speaker 1: these brotherish friends. They seemed so elegant, they had these

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Speaker 1: great you know, you have this coalition government. You guys

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Speaker 1: seem so smart. Not anymore talk about milkshake gay.

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Speaker 3: No, we just have very good pr That is the

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Speaker 3: sum koto of our image. So Nigel Farage is out,

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Speaker 3: he's walking around a woman very sensibly sees him and

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Speaker 3: thinks that the only rational thing to do is to

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Speaker 3: get hem of Donald's banana milkshake and throw it all

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Speaker 3: over him, which she did. Now this is actually it's

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Speaker 3: almost like a British subculture. It started I think about

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Speaker 3: five or six years ago when arasis far right figure

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Speaker 3: was talking to some Asian guys and they were just like,

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Speaker 3: you know what, I don't feel that we need to

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Speaker 3: engage in the battle of ideas here. I think we

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Speaker 3: should just engage in the kind of battle of milkshakes,

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Speaker 3: and just started throwing their milkshakes at him. And then

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Speaker 3: they started following other figures from the hard right around,

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Speaker 3: people like Nigel far covering him in milkshake. So this

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Speaker 3: old and I think, really, you know, other admirable British

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Speaker 3: tradition has now emerged once again and he was covered

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Speaker 3: in milkshake at that moment. She's now being charged with assault.

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Speaker 3: Seems rather forl on to me. But nevertheless, it's a trope. Now,

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Speaker 3: what are these elections going to look like?

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Speaker 1: Now you basically have this coalition government, so members are

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Speaker 1: running by different parties and then the numbers who get elected. Well,

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Speaker 1: I'm explaining this explain it to us. Yes, I can't

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Speaker 1: know what.

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Speaker 3: I very much enjoyed listening to you. Try.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. Yes, I'm here for fun.

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Speaker 3: There's six hundred and fifty seats and there's no sort

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Speaker 3: of electoral college complications or any of that to this.

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Speaker 3: There's basically just six hundred and fifty seats. Party that's

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Speaker 3: got the majority. In other words, more than three hundred

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Speaker 3: and twenty five. There's some complications there, but basically more

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Speaker 3: than three hundred and twenty five just gets to form

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Speaker 3: the government. You know, you're not voting for the leader

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Speaker 3: in any way. They just happen to be the leader

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Speaker 3: of the party that start the seeds. We've never seen

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Speaker 3: the Tories fall below a certain level, you know, below

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Speaker 3: sort of two hundred or anything like that. The current

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Speaker 3: projections of where they're heading to is sort of like

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Speaker 3: under one hundred seats, just sort of EXI central that

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Speaker 3: there's some projections that came out this week and look,

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Speaker 3: this can't happen. I don't say that on the basis

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Speaker 3: of calculation, but just by I can't believe that it

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Speaker 3: would happen. You know, that puts them on things like

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Speaker 3: sixty fives. That's the kind of numbers that could potentially

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Speaker 3: be the extinction of the Conservative Body. Now, the Conservative

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Speaker 3: Body is the oldest political party in the Western world.

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Speaker 1: And basically has been empower our whole adult lives.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean or off. I mean, it's been in

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Speaker 3: powered much more than Labour's been in power. I mean, obviously,

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Speaker 3: you know, we had the Tony Blair period and the

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Speaker 3: Orden Brown periods, so Labor has these long stints in power.

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Speaker 3: But the Tories have been around as a viable and

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Speaker 3: extremely successful political party since the exclusion crisis in the

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Speaker 3: sixteen hundreds. You know, this is a really, really old organization.

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Speaker 3: And right now people who are typically quite cautious in

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Speaker 3: that political analysis and don't like to appear hysterical or

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Speaker 3: over excited, are talking very genuinely about what if this

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Speaker 3: actually is the party? What if we are just seeing

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Speaker 3: one of those moments I mean that are not that

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Speaker 3: different to you know, Brexit and Trump, but you know,

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Speaker 3: just these moments of like where it can't happen, can it?

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Speaker 3: Until actually it does? That is perfectly possible from where

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Speaker 3: we are right now, and it would happen because a

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Speaker 3: mixture of factors, but at the heart of them, is

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Speaker 3: the catastrophic and complete failure of populacey. You know, unlike

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Speaker 3: in Europe where populist parties run against mainstream parties, Britain

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Speaker 3: has functioned much like the US, where the mainstream center

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Speaker 3: right party has absorbed populism whole set. I mean they

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Speaker 3: have absorbed it entirely. And what have they done. They

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Speaker 3: complain about immigrants, they complain about asylum seekers, they complain

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Speaker 3: about trans people. But all the years that they've been

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Speaker 3: doing that, the economy falls apart, the healthcare system falls apart,

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Speaker 3: the schools, the prisons, the transport. It's just a sense

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Speaker 3: that nothing works, Nothing in the country works. Last week,

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Speaker 3: when our Equalities minister I mean named the best already

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Speaker 3: in manner imaginable, spends an entire day of the election

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Speaker 3: wanting to come out to talk about that policy on

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Speaker 3: excluding trans people from toilets and from great crisis centers.

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Speaker 3: The response is at culture or response that she's looking for.

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Speaker 3: It's more why in the name of God are you

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Speaker 3: talking about this rather than talking about the fact that

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Speaker 3: you cannot make anything in this country actually work. So

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Speaker 3: what you're seeing is not just the death of conservative

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Speaker 3: because it's really the death of a populist form of

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Speaker 3: reactionary politics in the UK.

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Speaker 1: It's so right and it's so interesting, but it's also

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Speaker 1: what's happening with this Republican Party. I mean, we don't

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Speaker 1: know if Trump is going to win. Obviously, there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of machinations and inaccuracies in the polls. But we

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Speaker 1: are in a moment in American life where thirty nine

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Speaker 1: Republican Senators yesterday voted against the Right to Contraception Act

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Speaker 1: so you can get birth control pills and condoms, and

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Speaker 1: Republicans are like, oh, I don't.

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Speaker 3: Know, Oh my god. Although, by the way, it quite

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Speaker 3: meaningful that even as I thought it really was the

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Speaker 3: Right to Conception Act, it didn't necessarily seem like some

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Speaker 3: three Republicans would oppose just on points of reason or practicality. Yeah, sure,

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Speaker 3: why not? Why not that as well?

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's such an interesting moment because you do find,

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Speaker 1: you know, these culture war things, punishing trans people, punishing

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Speaker 1: gay people, punishing women who have abortions, those don't actually

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Speaker 1: help the economy.

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Speaker 3: Yes, exactly. It's as if there's two separate approaches now

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Speaker 3: that you're seeing across Europe. In the US. I think

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Speaker 3: so Kirstarma, the late Party leader, is really quite similar

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Speaker 3: to Joe Biden, I think in his form of sort

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Speaker 3: of centrist response to populism, which is just to try

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Speaker 3: and kill those issues there and to position himself really,

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Speaker 3: you know, in the middle of left and right. You know,

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Speaker 3: very open state intervention in the economy, very open sort

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Speaker 3: of borrowing money in order to spend, but at the

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Speaker 3: same time obviously not socialistic or anything like that, and

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Speaker 3: yet not allowing the culture war on open clothes, that

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Speaker 3: secondary up down binary to define them, to just try

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Speaker 3: and kill those cultural war issues. In Europe you often

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Speaker 3: see a really different approach from people like Emmanuel Macron,

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Speaker 3: where they're a centrist on left right issues on the

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Speaker 3: economic issues, but when it comes to open clothes Racron,

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Speaker 3: just like Tony Blair did before him, defines himself as

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Speaker 3: an advocate for right. It's actually quite embracing many of

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Speaker 3: the culture war distinctions, the sort of anti Trump, the

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Speaker 3: anti Brexit. That's not really what we're seeing in Starmer.

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Speaker 3: Stalmer's project is much more similar to Joe Biden's, and

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Speaker 3: it's really an intend to just take all that culture

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Speaker 3: war stuff and just bury it, just bury it in

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Speaker 3: the earth. Look, what I pledged to you is a

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Speaker 3: machine that works like competent government with people who've followed

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Speaker 3: based moral instructs. You aren't ashamed to see who your

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Speaker 3: political leaders are. They have a call social responsibility, and

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Speaker 3: we'll just do the hard work to make society operate

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Speaker 3: again in the way that it has failed to do

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Speaker 3: when populace have been in charge.

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Speaker 1: It's like they found the stupidest p people to run

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Speaker 1: the government, right, I mean, and those people got together

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Speaker 1: and came up with the stupidest ideas and then they

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Speaker 1: were like, what's the harm? I mean, like Margaret Thatcher.

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Speaker 1: I think so much about Margaret Thatcher. I remember growing

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Speaker 1: up thinking that that was like pretty much the worst

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Speaker 1: you could get. Or Ronald Reagan and those people are

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Speaker 1: like geniuses compared to the Conservative Party of today.

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Speaker 3: I completely agree. I completely agree, And like Thatcher had

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Speaker 3: actually read Hayek, you know, she'd actually read the stuff

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Speaker 3: I mean saying, by the way, for Ronald Reagan, they

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Speaker 3: both read von Mises, like all of that stuff maybe

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Speaker 3: just the most appalling laissez fair neoliberal clap trap of

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Speaker 3: the highest order. And it is. It has failed every

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Speaker 3: time it's been implemented. It's a lunacy that is exactly

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Speaker 3: as insane as communism on the other side, just it

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Speaker 3: happens to love the pre market instead of the state.

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Speaker 3: But at least it has intellectual content to it, at

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Speaker 3: least there's some kind of basis that a rational, intelligent

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Speaker 3: person could grapple with it. The kind of stuff that

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Speaker 3: comes out now from the people that consider themselves their

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Speaker 3: political descendants, and it is stupid in ways that makes

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Speaker 3: you think that your own brain is shrinking inside the

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Speaker 3: inside of your skull rather than come into context. I mean,

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Speaker 3: the other day, Richard Saying's current policy is basically to

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Speaker 3: just throw any half hearted, half conceived idea out there

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Speaker 3: as long as it seems upsetting to liberals and encouraging

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Speaker 3: to some of the most venal and self interested people

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Speaker 3: into South. The other day he popped up in his

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Speaker 3: act of desperation and just said, you know what, We're

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Speaker 3: going to bring back national service.

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Speaker 2: I love national service, but go on, go on. I

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Speaker 2: know no one else likes it, it's just me likes it,

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Speaker 2: but go on.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, there are countries in Europe, you know, in Scandinavia

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Speaker 3: that have national service. Fine, if in a particular context,

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Speaker 3: for a particular reason. You come up with this as

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Speaker 3: an idea. That's a thing to be in the middle

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Speaker 3: of a campaign where you're losing even majority support among

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Speaker 3: the over sixty fives, the one group that could always

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Speaker 3: be trusted. They can just think, you know what, after

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Speaker 3: young people have been kept inside for two to three

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Speaker 3: years over COVID in order to protect the disease, why

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Speaker 3: don't we just plug into your emotional resentment of the

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Speaker 3: young purely on the basis of their youth and really

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Speaker 3: trigger that. And you're can just say, you know what,

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Speaker 3: don't worry, We're going to send the eighteen year odds

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Speaker 3: to walk. And of course, as soon as he announces it,

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Speaker 3: outcome the questions, right, he says, look, you've got to

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Speaker 3: do this. It's going to be for a year. You

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Speaker 3: can of course do voluntary service or whatever, but also

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Speaker 3: otherwise you get I'm going to do it the course

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Speaker 3: of a year when you're eighteen, And then the questions start,

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Speaker 3: what if someone's in university doesn't really have an answer that.

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Speaker 3: What if that person actually has kids themselves doesn't really

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Speaker 3: have an answer to that. What if that person has

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Speaker 3: a job doesn't have an answer to that it didn't

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Speaker 3: even bother do we even I mean even to say

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Speaker 3: we used to say that, you know, they'd write it

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Speaker 3: on the back of a cigarette packet the policy. But

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Speaker 3: the honest truth is a cigarette packet would offer far

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Speaker 3: too much space for the degree of thinking that has

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Speaker 3: gone into these policy.

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Speaker 2: In thank you, you are just the best. I appreciate

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Speaker 2: you so much.

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Speaker 4: Now that's right, the best.

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Speaker 3: Good luck, like even real need it.

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Speaker 1: Spring is here, and I bet you are trying to

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Speaker 1: look fashionable, So why not pick up some fashionable all

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Speaker 1: new Fast Politics merchandise. We just opened a news store

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Speaker 1: and top bags. To grab some head to fastpolitics dot com.

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Speaker 1: Tammy Baldwin is the junior Senator from the state of Wisconsin.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to Fast Politics, Wisconsin Senator Tammy Baldwin.

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Speaker 4: I am delighted to join you.

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Speaker 2: I'm so excited to have you.

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Speaker 1: Yesterday, thirty nine Republican Senators voted against this Right to

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Speaker 1: Contraception Act.

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Speaker 2: Talk to us about what was in the act.

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Speaker 4: First, I'm going to say just what the necessity for

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Speaker 4: the Act is. When the Dobbs decision came down almost

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Speaker 4: two years ago, overturning rel versus Wade because the Court

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Speaker 4: basically said it was wrongigh decided back in nineteen seventy

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Speaker 4: three because there is no constitutional right to privacy. That

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Speaker 4: drew into question, well, what other cases has the Court

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Speaker 4: decided based on a constitutional right to privacy? And one

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Speaker 4: of the key cases, a case called Griswold versus Connecticut,

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Speaker 4: really revolves around access to contraception and basically makes it

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Speaker 4: clear that states cannot ban access to contraception. And so

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Speaker 4: if it weren't enough that the majority opinion implied that

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Speaker 4: this could be next. Just as Clarence Thomas set it

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Speaker 4: outright in his concurring opinion, he listed a bunch of

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Speaker 4: cases that were decided based on a right to privacy

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Speaker 4: and said, Wow, perhaps the US Supreme Court as it's

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Speaker 4: currently composed should reconsider these cases, should bring them up

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Speaker 4: anew And that's where the threat to our access to contraception,

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Speaker 4: birth control, that's where that threat presented itself. You know,

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Speaker 4: we never thought Row would be overturned. It was, and

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Speaker 4: now we have to be very vigilant about these other

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Speaker 4: rights and freedoms that are based on a constitutional right

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Speaker 4: to privacy that this Supreme Court thinks no longer exists.

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Speaker 4: And so one of the things that would help clarify

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Speaker 4: things is if we were to pass the Right to

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Speaker 4: Contraception Act, which we tried to do yesterday. And while

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Speaker 4: there's eighty eight to ninety percent approval among the American

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Speaker 4: people about access to contraception, apparently half the Senate, predominantly

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Speaker 4: the Republicans save two of them, are not in favor

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Speaker 4: of a right to access contraception.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's such an interesting bill because it's birth control

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Speaker 1: pills and condoms and things that are pretty popular in

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Speaker 1: this country. What do you think the thinking here is

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Speaker 1: on the right.

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Speaker 4: Well, we had a hearing in the Senate Help Committee

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Speaker 4: earlier this week on basically access to reproductive rights across

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Speaker 4: the country. It was focused as we approached the two

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Speaker 4: year anniversary of the Dodge decision overturning Roe versus Wade.

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Speaker 4: But we had some testimony from a couple of the

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Speaker 4: Republican witnesses, one in particular, who were clearly opposed to

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Speaker 4: the use of iud's, for example, contraceptive devices Plan B,

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Speaker 4: which is called the Morning After Pill. It was very

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Speaker 4: clear that despite the fact that nearly ninety percent of

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Speaker 4: the American public supports access to contraception. That these Republican

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Speaker 4: witnesses were saying, no, No, We're seeing this in the

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Speaker 4: states play out. We've seen several state legislatures pass bills

435
00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:54,040
Speaker 4: that would guarantee state right to access contraception, and then

436
00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:58,199
Speaker 4: we've seen Republican governors of veto those bills. And in

437
00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,480
Speaker 4: Wisconsin we have such a bill pending, but the Republican

438
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:05,120
Speaker 4: majority in the state legislature won't even bring the bill

439
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:06,240
Speaker 4: up for a vote.

440
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:11,880
Speaker 1: So part of this is this wildly anti science right

441
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:16,919
Speaker 1: wing transition from the quote unquote heartbeat bill, which again

442
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:19,439
Speaker 1: was it anything that looked like a heartbeat meant that

443
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:25,400
Speaker 1: the embryo was a person, to now this embryonic personhood.

444
00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:28,840
Speaker 1: So basically the right is is shopping this notion that

445
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:32,119
Speaker 1: once an egg is fertilized, it is a human.

446
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:37,040
Speaker 4: Well, certainly you see that both among legislators who make

447
00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:41,720
Speaker 4: those claims, but also we saw it in the Alabama

448
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:46,680
Speaker 4: Supreme Court which said that the use of in vitro fertilization,

449
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:50,600
Speaker 4: you know that that was a human and entitled to

450
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:56,199
Speaker 4: all the rights of humans. And so the implications are

451
00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:59,879
Speaker 4: clearly that there's a group of folks who would like

452
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:03,159
Speaker 4: that to be the standard in the United States.

453
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,560
Speaker 1: So they are really painting themselves into a corner here though,

454
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,000
Speaker 1: on the right, because once you go down this road,

455
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 1: you say the morning after pill you can't have that,

456
00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:17,120
Speaker 1: iud eas you can't have that. And then IVF, which

457
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:21,400
Speaker 1: is wildly popular. It's miraculous you have people like Mike

458
00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 1: Pens talking about having done IVF.

459
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 2: You close the door to IVF.

460
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,240
Speaker 4: Right, that would be the logical next step when you

461
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:31,960
Speaker 4: look at the claims that we've just been discussing. But

462
00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:37,359
Speaker 4: we're talking about the ability of women in particular to

463
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 4: control their own bodies and to decide when or whether

464
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 4: to start a family. And we're talking both about access

465
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,440
Speaker 4: to abortion care, but we're also talking about, as you said,

466
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:54,679
Speaker 4: the miracle of IVF for couples who are trying to

467
00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 4: start a family and needing IVF to do so.

468
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 1: So one of the things you have in Wisconsin, you're

469
00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:06,719
Speaker 1: holding hearings with the Wisconsin doctor about working under this

470
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:10,440
Speaker 1: eighteen forty nine criminal abortion ban. Explain to us what

471
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:12,399
Speaker 1: that is and what that means.

472
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:15,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, So, when the Dobbs decision came out nearly two

473
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 4: years ago, overturning roll versus way state law became the

474
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 4: governing law. And so in Wisconsin we have a measure

475
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 4: that was passed one year after statehood in eighteen forty

476
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 4: nine that is widely viewed as a criminal abortion ban.

477
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:39,159
Speaker 4: When the Dobs decision came fourth, all access stopped in

478
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:44,160
Speaker 4: the state of Wisconsin. It was horrendous, and doctor Linton

479
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 4: talked a little bit about some of the experiences she witnessed.

480
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,359
Speaker 4: There were people in the waiting room for appointments that

481
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 4: morning two years ago and people were told, we can't

482
00:24:56,080 --> 00:25:01,160
Speaker 4: provide you with services. And there were also harrowing stories

483
00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:04,879
Speaker 4: that have been shared because the only exception for that

484
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:09,160
Speaker 4: eighteen forty nine law is the life of the mother.

485
00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:14,920
Speaker 4: Women being left to suffer and suffer harm and not

486
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:19,399
Speaker 4: being provided care within the state of Wisconsin until near death.

487
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:23,160
Speaker 4: So the stories of a woman who was bleeding for days,

488
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:27,960
Speaker 4: a woman who's water broke at seventeen weeks and was

489
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 4: sent home and not provided any life saving care until

490
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 4: she had a fever that spiked and was facing the

491
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:43,000
Speaker 4: risk of sepsis. This is not healthcare. It is cruel

492
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 4: and I will say, you know, What has happened in

493
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:51,639
Speaker 4: Wisconsin since then is that in three counties they have

494
00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:57,439
Speaker 4: resumed providing abortion care because of a trial court judge

495
00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 4: determining that the eighteen forty nine statute in Wisconsin was

496
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 4: never intended to apply to consensual abortion care. But only

497
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 4: three counties out of seventy two can you get service,

498
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:16,360
Speaker 4: and that means there are many for who getting the

499
00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:20,680
Speaker 4: cow brands of healthcare that they should get is out

500
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:24,800
Speaker 4: of reach, either financially or because of distances or all

501
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 4: the obstacles that have been placed in people's way.

502
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:34,120
Speaker 1: It is like one of the things that for me,

503
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 1: as someone who's forty five, it just blows my mind

504
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:43,120
Speaker 1: that we're here. But when you read Thomas's concurring opinion,

505
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 1: he actually opens the door to birth control, gay marriage,

506
00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 1: you know, all of the things that were wins in

507
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 1: the last couple decades. Overturning Row taking away that right

508
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:02,879
Speaker 1: really created a sort of sea change in the conservative playbook.

509
00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 1: You know, it does seem like they're going for more

510
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,800
Speaker 1: and more. What can you do as a as a

511
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 1: senitor to try to slow this down, gum up the works,

512
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:14,920
Speaker 1: anything you can do.

513
00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:19,639
Speaker 4: We read the decision carefully in Dobbs, and especially the

514
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:24,520
Speaker 4: concurring opinion by Justice Clarence Thomas where he calls out

515
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,960
Speaker 4: the cases and we get to work. He went after

516
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 4: gay marriage. You're right, he suggested we relitigate the Oberger

517
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 4: Bell case from twenty fifteen, and I think about how

518
00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:39,959
Speaker 4: hard fought that victory was over many, many years. So

519
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,920
Speaker 4: when that case came down, when Dobbs came down, we

520
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:47,800
Speaker 4: introduced the Respect for Marriage Act, which by the way,

521
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 4: covers both interracial marriages and same sex marriages because both

522
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 4: were based on this right to privacy that we were

523
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 4: talking about.

524
00:27:56,400 --> 00:28:00,000
Speaker 1: There's an opportunity here to point out something about justice Toime.

525
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:02,200
Speaker 1: I'm not going to, but I'm just going to say

526
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:05,160
Speaker 1: that he actually didn't mention interracial marriage.

527
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 4: That is correct. He left that out of his list

528
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 4: of cases that the Supreme Court might revisit. So anyways,

529
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 4: we got to work, and I remember my conversations with

530
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 4: Republican senators who I felt like wanted to get to

531
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:25,399
Speaker 4: yes to protect interracial and same sex marriages, and working

532
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 4: over weeks and weeks and months, but we passed the

533
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,320
Speaker 4: Respect for Marriage Act, which your listeners should think of

534
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 4: an insurance policy that your marriage will be protected in

535
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 4: every state and by the federal government should a Supreme

536
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 4: Court look at reversing either the Loving case or the

537
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 4: Oberger Felk case in the future. And we passed that

538
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 4: so that right now that freedom is protected. That's what

539
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,240
Speaker 4: we were trying to do yesterday with the Right to

540
00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,720
Speaker 4: Contraception Act is make sure that we take the next

541
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 4: step and protect another right and freedom that has been

542
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 4: long standing in the United States of America because it

543
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 4: is under threat. I hope. While only two Republicans out

544
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 4: of the forty nine who serve in the US Senate

545
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 4: voted for the Right to Contraception Act, we must pass it.

546
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,400
Speaker 4: We must continue working on this, and we must restore

547
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 4: the rights articulated in Roll versus way, which means passing

548
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 4: my Women's Health Protection Act. So we've got to keep

549
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 4: this fight up.

550
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 2: So you are running for reelection against someone a new Wisconsin, ight,

551
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 2: I feel like he has failed to sort of catch

552
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,880
Speaker 2: on in the state. Can you do two seconds about

553
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 2: your opponent there?

554
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 4: I can so. My opponent, Eric Hovedy. While he was

555
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 4: born and raised in Wisconsin, he spent his adult career

556
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 4: living twenty four years in Washington, BC, running a hedge

557
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:04,120
Speaker 4: Fund and much more recently living in Laguna Beach, California,

558
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 4: running a three billion dollar bank, and he is a

559
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:16,920
Speaker 4: multimillionaire who is self financing. He could not be more

560
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:19,960
Speaker 4: of a contrast in terms of the very issues that

561
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,480
Speaker 4: we're talking about now. He did return home once earlier

562
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 4: to run for US Senate back in twenty twelve, so

563
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 4: we have him on the record saying that he was

564
00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 4: a one hundred percent opposed to abortion rights and talking

565
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 4: about life beginning at conception, and saying that he would

566
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:42,680
Speaker 4: repeal the Affordable Care Act in its entirety, all these

567
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 4: positions that he took. Now that he's running another time,

568
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:53,280
Speaker 4: he is trying to dance around his former positions, maybe

569
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,560
Speaker 4: sounding a little bit more moderate. But you know, as

570
00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:00,560
Speaker 4: I watched Donald Trump and Eric Hovedy try to reframe

571
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:07,120
Speaker 4: their positions after celebrating the Dobbs decision and overturning Rovers's wait,

572
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 4: they're fighting about, well, the federal government should decide no, no,

573
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 4: the state government should decide Well, I say women should

574
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:16,640
Speaker 4: decide period no.

575
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:17,640
Speaker 2: And that's right.

576
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:19,920
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of people feel like that

577
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:25,000
Speaker 1: women and their doctors are not Republican politicians Wisconsin, there

578
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 1: have been like huge strides, but you still are state

579
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:31,000
Speaker 1: that has very much struggled with jerrymandering and a state

580
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:34,520
Speaker 1: legislature that has been you know, you could have things

581
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 1: like what Minnesota has for you breakfast, You have some

582
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 1: things like that, but you could have more of that

583
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 1: if you had a state legislature that was less right wing.

584
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 4: I will say something very heartening, which is the governor

585
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:51,840
Speaker 4: signed into law a couple months ago a new map

586
00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 4: that is a fair map, a not je commanded map.

587
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 4: And so this fall, the folks who are running for

588
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 4: status SEM and state Senate are doing so in much

589
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:08,480
Speaker 4: fairer districts. And we have a record number, it seems,

590
00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 4: of candidates stepping up to run who just two years

591
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:14,160
Speaker 4: ago would have looked at the map and said, oh,

592
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 4: I can't possibly win in this district and are now

593
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 4: got on the ballot and they're now knocking on doors.

594
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 4: And so I do see some real excitement at the

595
00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:27,760
Speaker 4: grassroots level that we can have a much more representative

596
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:32,000
Speaker 4: state legislature than we have had for a decade and

597
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:32,480
Speaker 4: a half.

598
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:36,080
Speaker 1: That is so great. Thank you so much, Senator Baldwin.

599
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 1: I hope you will come back.

600
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 4: I look forward to it. Thank you.

601
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: Jordan Kuepper is a Daily Show correspondent and his special

602
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 1: Moscow Tools is out on Comedy Central. Right now, Welcome

603
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 1: to Fast Politics, Jordan Klepper.

604
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 2: Ami, Jordan, you did this special? Where did you go? Exactly?

605
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 5: Well, this special, I went as far away as Estonia

606
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,680
Speaker 5: and as club as Pennsylvania for the special. So we

607
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 5: were covering Russian misinformation and noticing it primarily at MAGA events,

608
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 5: and so we went to like Green Bay and Pennsylvania

609
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,600
Speaker 5: and people were talking about Vladimir Putin. They were talking about,

610
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:17,000
Speaker 5: frankly parroting Russian misinformation, misinformation that we sort of connected

611
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:19,840
Speaker 5: to this Kremlin report that the Washroom Post reported on,

612
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,000
Speaker 5: and that took us a little bit around the country

613
00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 5: and then ultimately to the border of Russia and Estonia

614
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:26,800
Speaker 5: to talk to the Prime minister. So we you know,

615
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 5: we put in some we put in some miles for

616
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 5: this one.

617
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 1: What I think is interesting is like we in the

618
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 1: sort of news bubble, we read pieces all the time

619
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 1: that are like Kremlin influence campaigns. They're vague and they

620
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 1: say things like, you know, there's a Black Lives Matter

621
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:46,280
Speaker 1: account that's really run by the Kremlin, and there's also

622
00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:48,960
Speaker 1: a White Lives Matter account that's you know what I mean,

623
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,640
Speaker 1: like that they're they're trying to sew division, but this

624
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,920
Speaker 1: is really them trying to speak to a certain group

625
00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 1: of people and it's working very much.

626
00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 5: So I think one of their goals is to, yes,

627
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:03,760
Speaker 5: just flood it with misinformation to accentuate the divisions that

628
00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,600
Speaker 5: are already there. And what we see when we are

629
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:08,960
Speaker 5: out on the road is we see these talking points

630
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,440
Speaker 5: being parroted, and again, some of those are homegrown American

631
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 5: divisions that Russia just fans the flames of and some

632
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 5: of the bs that is planted into the news cycle

633
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:20,800
Speaker 5: that a lot of the folks at these Trump rallies

634
00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:23,720
Speaker 5: are ingesting, and then they're parroting, and then they're using

635
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 5: as an example and a reason to support Vladimir Putin

636
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:29,879
Speaker 5: or to discredit what's happening in Ukraine. And I think

637
00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:32,360
Speaker 5: this is where we were excited about doing this special

638
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,239
Speaker 5: because frankly, we can talk to journalists and talk to

639
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:38,239
Speaker 5: people who can articulate the desires and the wants of

640
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 5: the Kremlin, and then we can actually go out into

641
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,720
Speaker 5: the field and show how that's having a very real

642
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:44,920
Speaker 5: effect on the conversation.

643
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,240
Speaker 1: What I think is interesting is that we have had

644
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:51,520
Speaker 1: this problem probably since I mean maybe even before, but

645
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 1: it's become a sort of pronounced problem since twenty sixteen.

646
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 1: Right since twenty sixteen, we've seen like real concrete evidence

647
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:02,120
Speaker 1: of the Kremlin and you know, getting in there and

648
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 1: influencing voters. But what I think is a little bit

649
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 1: new is that the Kremlin has gotten in there and

650
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 1: influenced lawmakers.

651
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:13,920
Speaker 5: Yes, I think we're seeing that, and this was the

652
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 5: news story of the last couple of months, is that

653
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:18,520
Speaker 5: these Kremlin talking points are being echoed on the House floor.

654
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 5: They're literally coming up works for funding for Ukraine. They

655
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:24,319
Speaker 5: have real world effects, and so yes, there's been a

656
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:26,360
Speaker 5: cat of mouse game between the US and Russia, and

657
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:30,600
Speaker 5: Russia has tried to influence talking points in America for years.

658
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,440
Speaker 5: I think the ground is right for its success, and

659
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:37,600
Speaker 5: we've seen very real, concrete examples of a success. I

660
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 5: think another thing we noticed too is beyond the success

661
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 5: it was having with Ukraine and the conversation around funding Ukraine,

662
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:47,840
Speaker 5: there's a larger, kind of darker question that it brings

663
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:51,279
Speaker 5: up is, yes, Russia feeds the far right and at

664
00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,000
Speaker 5: sometimes also the left whatever they can to fuel the vision,

665
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 5: they feed them the things they want to hear. But

666
00:35:56,760 --> 00:35:59,480
Speaker 5: also there's something there and something new which feels like

667
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:03,960
Speaker 5: a true, earnest desire for autocratic methods. And I don't

668
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:06,680
Speaker 5: think the American public has a totally clear understanding of

669
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,799
Speaker 5: what it's like to live under an autocratic regime. That's

670
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 5: part of the reason we went to Estonium. But I

671
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 5: think there's a darker question. We need to ask ourselves.

672
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 5: How much of this is Russia tampering with American sensibilities

673
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:19,400
Speaker 5: and how much of this is American sensibilities in the

674
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 5: MAGA movement are really leaning and slouching towards Moscow. They

675
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:28,160
Speaker 5: want an autocratic, tough guy, white Christian nationalist leader will

676
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 5: crack down on crimes and be socially conservative. That's something that,

677
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:33,840
Speaker 5: as we're articulating the special is a bit of a

678
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:34,839
Speaker 5: Republican white dream.

679
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 2: Yeah.

680
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 1: No, I mean it's funny because I just read this

681
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 1: book all about the right love affair with autocracy, and

682
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 1: how you know, you had Republicans talking about how much

683
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:48,480
Speaker 1: they love Pino set right, Like this is not a

684
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: new phenomenon, But what is a new phenomenon is this

685
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: fact that there seems to be some amount of people

686
00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 1: and again we can argue about how they've gotten here

687
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 1: that actually do want this.

688
00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,560
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's a message that is sticky to a good

689
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:07,319
Speaker 5: portion of the populace right now. And again you look

690
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 5: at the person there there to see at these MAGA

691
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 5: events is going to not only echo some of these perspectives,

692
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 5: but has been on the stage next to Vladimir Putin

693
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,160
Speaker 5: and essentially given the big thumbs up. So you know,

694
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 5: we were surprised to see in the field. I talked

695
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:23,359
Speaker 5: to a woman who watched Putin fishing videos and got

696
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 5: excited about that. People see this strong man image, which

697
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:32,480
Speaker 5: seems comical, is comical. It's pure propaganda. There's stock in lakes.

698
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:34,439
Speaker 6: With fish, so this guy can dive in all out

699
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,920
Speaker 6: a walleye and look like Kingdom the world and that plays.

700
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:40,400
Speaker 6: There are people in America who watch that like cute

701
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,879
Speaker 6: cat videos, and they see this as like a tough

702
00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:45,879
Speaker 6: guy who's found success. Again, the digital age that we're

703
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:50,640
Speaker 6: in has only created a space where misinformation propaganda, where

704
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 6: situations where you can embed stories and images and then

705
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 6: erase the places that they came from and the people

706
00:37:56,640 --> 00:37:58,839
Speaker 6: will do your bidding, they will send it out there.

707
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:01,120
Speaker 6: There's a little bit of and this Washington Post story

708
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 6: that talked about the new form of propaganda and misinformation

709
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:07,839
Speaker 6: is to essentially to create a news story and then

710
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,840
Speaker 6: erase the place with which it came from and just

711
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:13,800
Speaker 6: bank on true social or x or people to tweet

712
00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 6: it out. And the fact that it has gained traction

713
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 6: and gone elsewhere, you can't put the pieces back together.

714
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:21,720
Speaker 6: And so you see why Russia is having such success

715
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 6: right now. It's a ripe not only political environment in

716
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 6: America for these ideas to take hold, but it's a

717
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,280
Speaker 6: ripe media environment for these ideas to spread.

718
00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:34,200
Speaker 1: One of the things that I talked to you about,

719
00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:36,880
Speaker 1: which I want you to say on this podcast because

720
00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 1: I think it's a really important point that I have

721
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:43,560
Speaker 1: long believed that if you could explain to people this

722
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:47,320
Speaker 1: is how this is like being a stupid media bubble person,

723
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 1: that if you could explain to people why it was wrong,

724
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 1: they would like have a moment and be like, oh,

725
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:57,520
Speaker 1: I get it now, But that doesn't ever happen, right,

726
00:38:57,680 --> 00:38:58,880
Speaker 1: explain this to us.

727
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 5: Yes, I think people often ask me how many minds

728
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:06,040
Speaker 5: do you change? Out there quite frankly, the answer to

729
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 5: that is a zero.

730
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:13,640
Speaker 1: I shouldn't laugh because it's so bleak, but basically they

731
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:14,680
Speaker 1: cannot be reasoned with.

732
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:16,919
Speaker 5: Right, Well, I mean, I think, like what you watch,

733
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:19,840
Speaker 5: the pieces that I do are not a blueprint for

734
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:23,520
Speaker 5: changing people's mind. It's more a diagnosis of the rot

735
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,920
Speaker 5: of the problem. Now, if you're approaching any kind of

736
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 5: idea what I want to change that person's mind, chances

737
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:30,920
Speaker 5: are you're going to be met with resistance. That's not

738
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:34,080
Speaker 5: how people change their minds. And frankly, we are in

739
00:39:34,120 --> 00:39:37,200
Speaker 5: spaces where they're being fed things they want to hear.

740
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:39,880
Speaker 5: I often tell the story of I was talking to

741
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:43,319
Speaker 5: a woman at a Trump rally at Trump's first impeachment

742
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 5: who is insistent on Trump's innocence and talked about He's

743
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:49,799
Speaker 5: so innocent because he's letting everybody speak. He wants the

744
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 5: truth to come out. And I said, well, if there

745
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:54,279
Speaker 5: was proof of him stopping somebody from speaking, that would

746
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:56,239
Speaker 5: be proof of guilt. She said, yes, of course. I

747
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 5: pointed to the fact that he was stopping John Bolton

748
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,400
Speaker 5: from getting his story out, and she realized in that

749
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:04,040
Speaker 5: moment she said something perhaps incorrect. She took a really

750
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,440
Speaker 5: long beat, and she looked at me and she said,

751
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:09,239
Speaker 5: I don't care. And you realize in that moment, like

752
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:11,960
Speaker 5: we're talking about policy and I'm trying to give her

753
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:14,920
Speaker 5: piece of information that will break that bubble, but the

754
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 5: magic trate already occurred. Trump was her identity and that's

755
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:21,440
Speaker 5: who she is. So what we're arguing are details of

756
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 5: her policy. But she's not there because of the policies.

757
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:25,759
Speaker 5: She's not there to be fact check and believe something else.

758
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 5: She's there because MAGA has our identity. She's put on

759
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,440
Speaker 5: the hat. Her neighbors see her with that hat, her

760
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:34,040
Speaker 5: neighbors know that she isn't what she believes in. It's

761
00:40:34,120 --> 00:40:36,200
Speaker 5: at that point it's an act of faith. And if

762
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:39,680
Speaker 5: you think we're trying to change somebody's faith, good luck.

763
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:41,320
Speaker 5: People have tried that for a ance.

764
00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, we talk so much about how there are these

765
00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:49,840
Speaker 1: evangelicals who love Trump, but the reality is America is

766
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 1: a country where religion is on the decline. But MAGA

767
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 1: is really its own religion.

768
00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:54,959
Speaker 3: For sure.

769
00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 5: It's something you can believe. I mean, you see, it

770
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 5: provides a lot of the things that religion does provide,

771
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,880
Speaker 5: which is a sense of community, sense of ownership, a

772
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:05,880
Speaker 5: sense of purpose. It's quite the feeling to walk into

773
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,799
Speaker 5: an event and see twenty thousand other people dressed like

774
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,919
Speaker 5: you are dressed, and then a very powerful person comes

775
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:15,600
Speaker 5: on stage and tells you that you are a patriot,

776
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:17,879
Speaker 5: you can fight for them, your life has meeting. That's

777
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:21,040
Speaker 5: an evocative message. And I do think looking at some

778
00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:23,240
Speaker 5: of these things as an act of faith, like perhaps

779
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 5: believing that the election was stolen is more akin to

780
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 5: believing that Noah had an arc that had every animal

781
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:33,600
Speaker 5: on the planet in two's on it. Even see some

782
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,839
Speaker 5: of these elected officials now who will argue over whether

783
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:38,520
Speaker 5: or not the election was stolen in a way that

784
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:41,520
Speaker 5: you're like, I know you don't believe it was stolen,

785
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:45,320
Speaker 5: but you have to have this act of faith, this

786
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:47,879
Speaker 5: show of faith. And to me it sounds like when

787
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 5: you argue with that person, it's like, you know, Noah

788
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:53,439
Speaker 5: didn't bring two elephants and two. It's like, oh, we're

789
00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:55,960
Speaker 5: having the wrong conversation. This is not an argument about

790
00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 5: whether that happened. It's an act of faith that I

791
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,320
Speaker 5: believe in the idea of this happening, and feels like

792
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:01,960
Speaker 5: that's where we are right now politically, it's.

793
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,280
Speaker 1: Funny because it's like some of these people and again,

794
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,400
Speaker 1: my dad listens to this podcast, so he's going to

795
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 1: get mad at me, maybe, but a lot of these

796
00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:11,600
Speaker 1: people are not a lot, but some of these people

797
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:15,000
Speaker 1: are the same people who like went to Grateful Dead concerts.

798
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:17,120
Speaker 5: Oh for sure. I talked to a man in the

799
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:19,640
Speaker 5: special who I've seen at many rallies. I think he

800
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:21,920
Speaker 5: was at a seventyeth something rally and he was a

801
00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 5: Barack Obama voter. He was a Grateful Dead supporter, is

802
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:26,840
Speaker 5: a rock and roll guy, and frankly I spent some

803
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:29,040
Speaker 5: time with him and we bonded over our love of

804
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,080
Speaker 5: a classic rock But you see that, what's the connection

805
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,759
Speaker 5: between the Grateful Dead, Barack Obama and Donald Trump. It's like, man,

806
00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:39,640
Speaker 5: those are the most fun show in town. And so yeah,

807
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:43,799
Speaker 5: Barack Obama, that was a big fun show that was

808
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 5: inspiring to him and he got on board. And frankly,

809
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:50,320
Speaker 5: going to a MAGA event is a fun tailgating experience.

810
00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 5: You travel around the country, you see like minded folks,

811
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 5: you put on your fun, crazy outfits, and you rock

812
00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:57,320
Speaker 5: out to the hits. It does provide that for a

813
00:42:57,400 --> 00:42:58,279
Speaker 5: lot of people.

814
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:00,080
Speaker 2: Are we too dumb for democracy?

815
00:43:00,200 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 5: We're certainly testing that.

816
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:03,200
Speaker 2: I mean, do you have that.

817
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 1: Thought as you driving around or in the private Comedy

818
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:11,360
Speaker 1: Central plane sipping along, or your personal helicopter, do you

819
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:14,359
Speaker 1: have the thought, like America, we may be too dumb

820
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 1: for democracy.

821
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,080
Speaker 5: Right now, I'm thinking a lot about the buy in

822
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 5: to democracy. I think citizenry should be work. And that

823
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 5: doesn't mean we need to make it difficult for people

824
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 5: to vote, but it should mean that you should understand

825
00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 5: the consequences of your vote. You should put in time

826
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 5: and think about that. Citizenry involves thinking about choices you

827
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,400
Speaker 5: make and how it affects community. You are not acting alone.

828
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:40,000
Speaker 5: And I think politics has shifted to such an entertainment

829
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:44,080
Speaker 5: spectacle that no longer citizens engaging with politics were consumers.

830
00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 5: And so it's as easy as clicking retweet, as easy

831
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:52,160
Speaker 5: as liking like our support lacks any real depth. There's

832
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:53,839
Speaker 5: very little skin you have to put in the game

833
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 5: to be a part of that democratic conversation. And again,

834
00:43:56,600 --> 00:43:59,160
Speaker 5: I want the buy in to be for everyone. But

835
00:43:59,239 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 5: I think people should understand that democracy has consequences, and

836
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 5: right now we're treating democracy as if it's going shopping

837
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:10,759
Speaker 5: at Walmart or an Amazon binge, where we just clicked

838
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:13,680
Speaker 5: the things we like, we say the things we don't like,

839
00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:15,400
Speaker 5: we spend money, and we move on to what that

840
00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:17,640
Speaker 5: next thing is. And to me, that is part of

841
00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:19,720
Speaker 5: the flaw right now, it's not that we're too stupid

842
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 5: for democracy. It's that I don't think we understand the

843
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:25,719
Speaker 5: consequences of it, and we don't put enough effort into

844
00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 5: thinking that part of democracy is thinking about your community

845
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:30,360
Speaker 5: and not just yourself.

846
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 1: One of the things that it's sort of part of

847
00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 1: this is Tucker Carlson, who is not maybe as powerful

848
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 1: as he once was, but still for that group, has

849
00:44:40,120 --> 00:44:40,840
Speaker 1: a lot of power.

850
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:41,640
Speaker 2: Is that fair?

851
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:42,320
Speaker 3: For sure?

852
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:45,680
Speaker 5: When we were talking about Russia and Moscow, when I

853
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:49,480
Speaker 5: asked people at these events their images what they thought

854
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 5: of Russia, so much of it was colored by that

855
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,640
Speaker 5: very specific special that Tucker Carlson had when he went

856
00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 5: to Moscow, when he sniffed some bread, he looked at

857
00:44:56,880 --> 00:44:59,359
Speaker 5: the subway system, and he sat down with Putin, and

858
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:01,680
Speaker 5: you realize it's like, yeah, people didn't have images of

859
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 5: what Moscow looked like the ways in which Tucker was

860
00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 5: framing it for the folks back here in a field

861
00:45:07,120 --> 00:45:10,759
Speaker 5: in Pennsylvania. It was completely colored by Tucker Carlson, and

862
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:13,320
Speaker 5: so it really very much has has weight out in

863
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:14,080
Speaker 5: the magosphere.

864
00:45:14,160 --> 00:45:16,600
Speaker 1: For example, there was a part of that where he

865
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 1: was very impressed with putting the coin in for the

866
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,719
Speaker 1: shopping cart so you didn't steal the shopping cart, and

867
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:25,279
Speaker 1: that this was a great innovation. But the reality is

868
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 1: this is a country where people steal shopping carts because

869
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 1: they're so poor, right, I mean that you have to

870
00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 1: secure the shopping cart so that multiple people don't steal it.

871
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:39,240
Speaker 1: Did anyone put that together?

872
00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 2: Or now? I mean, is there any like I wonder

873
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:44,240
Speaker 2: why Russia is so shitty?

874
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:45,880
Speaker 5: Part of it has something to do with, you know,

875
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:48,560
Speaker 5: a lack of media literacy and understanding that these are

876
00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:50,759
Speaker 5: storytellers and with every story, you go to point the

877
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:52,600
Speaker 5: camera the things you want to show and not the

878
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:53,560
Speaker 5: things you don't want to show.

879
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 3: You're not pointing at the places in Russia.

880
00:45:55,239 --> 00:45:58,399
Speaker 5: Where people don't have running water or toilets that work,

881
00:45:58,520 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 5: the ways in which they're affected by the economy, or

882
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:03,239
Speaker 5: what's happening with the LGBTQ community. Those stories are left

883
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:07,160
Speaker 5: out of a Tucker Carlson special. What's put in is sexy,

884
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:12,200
Speaker 5: bread and fancy and so and again, what that gives

885
00:46:12,239 --> 00:46:15,520
Speaker 5: the person in a field in Philadelphia or in Pennsylvania,

886
00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:18,359
Speaker 5: what it gives them is a weapon to use an

887
00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:21,160
Speaker 5: argument with me. And I get it. I get how

888
00:46:21,200 --> 00:46:23,239
Speaker 5: everybody's got their eyr up and so they see that.

889
00:46:23,239 --> 00:46:25,880
Speaker 5: They're like, this helps my worldview and what Tucker has

890
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 5: given it to me in a package and that Bo

891
00:46:27,719 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 5: says Moscow is good and you know what that means.

892
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:33,240
Speaker 5: It means that Biden is bad. It means that Craine

893
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:36,040
Speaker 5: has a waste of your money, and it means things

894
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:39,040
Speaker 5: could be good with a tough guy Christian white leadership.

895
00:46:39,160 --> 00:46:41,680
Speaker 5: Here here it is. It's a beautiful bow. Unwrap it

896
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,360
Speaker 5: where you will. And people are unwrapping that and trying

897
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:46,839
Speaker 5: to piece apart, like oh what what? What is part

898
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:48,960
Speaker 5: of the story that I don't understand? They're like, oh,

899
00:46:49,000 --> 00:46:51,399
Speaker 5: what's inside here is a weapon? I'm going to use

900
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 5: that against family members or Jordan Klepper out in the field.

901
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:54,640
Speaker 4: Here you go.

902
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 2: I know, you travel with security.

903
00:46:57,040 --> 00:46:59,800
Speaker 1: Are they mostly chill or do you feel like sometimes

904
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:02,280
Speaker 1: going to do something violent?

905
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:05,640
Speaker 5: I will say things keep shifting after the last election.

906
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:09,719
Speaker 5: What was going to MAGA events and people were riled up,

907
00:47:09,719 --> 00:47:13,400
Speaker 5: but not physical. After Trump quote unquote lost the last election,

908
00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:18,080
Speaker 5: the tenor shifted. I noticed to change since this recent conviction.

909
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:20,000
Speaker 2: As well, more violent or less.

910
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 5: There are more threats, definitely not less from the perspective

911
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:25,759
Speaker 5: of threats, and so I can't speak to violence. We've

912
00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:27,640
Speaker 5: had a few incidents in the field where things have

913
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:30,080
Speaker 5: gotten tense and security has had to step in, but

914
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:33,440
Speaker 5: the threats are ratcheted. And again, it's so easy. It

915
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,640
Speaker 5: costs you nothing to be an asshole on the internet,

916
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:40,040
Speaker 5: and it feels good to be angry and anonymous and

917
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:43,239
Speaker 5: yell at somebody, but those things have real consequences. It

918
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:45,759
Speaker 5: riles people up. And I was there on January sixth,

919
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:47,640
Speaker 5: and I see what happens when you rile a bunch

920
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 5: of people up. You put them in a group, and

921
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 5: then you point them at a person and say they're bad.

922
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,720
Speaker 5: Bad things happen. And right now the riling up is happening,

923
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:56,920
Speaker 5: and right now the rhetoric is getting worse and worse,

924
00:47:57,080 --> 00:47:59,400
Speaker 5: and it costs you nothing to be angry and public

925
00:47:59,440 --> 00:47:59,799
Speaker 5: about it.

926
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:02,759
Speaker 1: Me something that makes me not want to go move

927
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,440
Speaker 1: into a pineapple under the city.

928
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 5: Oh, I mean, are you into jazz?

929
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 1: No?

930
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 5: I mean the new Kumasi Washington Album's pretty darn love,

931
00:48:10,680 --> 00:48:11,920
Speaker 5: the Vampire Weekend album.

932
00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:16,359
Speaker 1: All right, gee, I mean, just give me something that

933
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:19,479
Speaker 1: is a little hopeful, Like you met someone who was like, Babe,

934
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,359
Speaker 1: I'm gonna vote for Biden even though I love fascism.

935
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:26,839
Speaker 5: I will tell you this, there's a misunderstanding when people

936
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:29,080
Speaker 5: watch my videos and it's that, oh, man, you talked

937
00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:29,720
Speaker 5: to the crazies.

938
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:34,160
Speaker 2: Oh no, this is not gonna make me kill better.

939
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:37,120
Speaker 5: Go on, these are not the crazies. When I talk

940
00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 5: to Edward, I'll give you that guy. When I talked

941
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:42,239
Speaker 5: to Edward, who is the MAGA fan, the Obama fan,

942
00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:44,320
Speaker 5: the grateful dead fan, who has been to over seventy

943
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:47,000
Speaker 5: plus Trump events. He's there for the show and we

944
00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:49,600
Speaker 5: disagree about certain political things. But when you take the

945
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:52,560
Speaker 5: cameras away and when you sit and talk to that person,

946
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:55,560
Speaker 5: you can connect with them like human beings. And the

947
00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:58,759
Speaker 5: clips that we see online in our media are not

948
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:01,520
Speaker 5: complete representation to the people who are out there. And

949
00:49:01,560 --> 00:49:03,879
Speaker 5: so I do think it is a war perspective as

950
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 5: to how people feel about each other. Now, I think

951
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:10,200
Speaker 5: that's detrimental to our democracy, and it's a cancer right now,

952
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 5: and so that doesn't give me a lot of hope.

953
00:49:12,120 --> 00:49:14,360
Speaker 5: But when I still connect with the people out in

954
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:16,360
Speaker 5: the field, when the cameras are down, and when we

955
00:49:16,400 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 5: can talk without being defensive about the things that we

956
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:23,040
Speaker 5: believe like, we find that common ground. And I don't

957
00:49:23,120 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 5: know how you generate that in a larger society in

958
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:29,000
Speaker 5: the media ecosystem we have right now, but all is

959
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:31,320
Speaker 5: not lost with the people. I think it's the platforms

960
00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 5: and the places we have our conversations that have the

961
00:49:33,160 --> 00:49:34,239
Speaker 5: major problem right now.

962
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:36,360
Speaker 2: Thank you Jordan, Thank you Mollie.

963
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:38,480
Speaker 5: And maybe and try jazz. You'll mess up your brain

964
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 5: for a little bit and that'll help you restart the moment.

965
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 3: Jesse Cannon, My Jong Fast, the thinking man of the Setate,

966
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 3: Tommy Tuberville has some thoughts on Putin.

967
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:57,799
Speaker 1: He's a scholar and a gentleman. Except for being a

968
00:49:57,840 --> 00:50:03,280
Speaker 1: scholar and also a gentleman. Tommy Tubervil, the Senate stupidest man,

969
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 1: says that Vladimir Putin.

970
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,080
Speaker 2: Perhaps you've heard of him, he doesn't want Ukraine, he

971
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:10,160
Speaker 2: doesn't want Europe.

972
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:13,480
Speaker 1: Hell, he's got enough land of his own. He just

973
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 1: wants to make sure whatever. On this podcast, we have

974
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:22,040
Speaker 1: Jordan Koepper, who's talking about how Russian propaganda has infiltrated

975
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:25,799
Speaker 1: the GOP. Look no further than the stupidest man in

976
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:30,359
Speaker 1: the Senate, the one, the only, Tommy Tuberville.

977
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 2: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics.

978
00:50:34,320 --> 00:50:37,239
Speaker 1: Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday to hear the

979
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:40,719
Speaker 1: best minds in politics makes sense of all this chaos.

980
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,520
Speaker 1: If you enjoyed what you've heard, please send it to

981
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 1: a friend and keep the conversation going. And again, thanks

982
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 1: for listening.