1 00:00:15,436 --> 00:00:24,036 Speaker 1: Pushkin. When we enter a new year, many of us 2 00:00:24,076 --> 00:00:27,156 Speaker 1: start to feel inspired about making big changes in our lives. 3 00:00:27,796 --> 00:00:29,836 Speaker 1: That new date on the calendar can motivate us to 4 00:00:29,876 --> 00:00:32,956 Speaker 1: improve our careers, our health, our habits, and our happiness. 5 00:00:33,676 --> 00:00:35,476 Speaker 1: But when we start to think about how to go 6 00:00:35,516 --> 00:00:38,916 Speaker 1: about making all these improvements, that's when things start to 7 00:00:38,956 --> 00:00:43,116 Speaker 1: get really, really loud. We start to hear all these 8 00:00:43,156 --> 00:00:46,116 Speaker 1: outside cultural voices shouting at us about what we should 9 00:00:46,156 --> 00:00:48,756 Speaker 1: be doing that number that we're really supposed to have 10 00:00:48,836 --> 00:00:51,996 Speaker 1: on the scale, or the glossy gym we absolutely need 11 00:00:51,996 --> 00:00:54,956 Speaker 1: to join, or the new productivity or dating app that 12 00:00:54,996 --> 00:00:58,196 Speaker 1: all our friends are trying. These outside voices tell us 13 00:00:58,196 --> 00:01:00,916 Speaker 1: there's one way to get fit, or quit biting our nails, 14 00:01:00,996 --> 00:01:03,676 Speaker 1: or get that big promotion at work. It's a new year, 15 00:01:03,756 --> 00:01:06,156 Speaker 1: they scream, and this is how things are going to 16 00:01:06,236 --> 00:01:09,916 Speaker 1: have to change. These new year voices are all very 17 00:01:09,956 --> 00:01:12,996 Speaker 1: well intentioned, but they can sometimes get so loud that 18 00:01:13,036 --> 00:01:18,156 Speaker 1: we can't even hear ourselves things. So, in this new 19 00:01:18,236 --> 00:01:20,516 Speaker 1: Year's season of the Happiness Lab, I want us to 20 00:01:20,556 --> 00:01:23,796 Speaker 1: try something different. Instead of listening to all these loud 21 00:01:23,836 --> 00:01:26,836 Speaker 1: outside voices, We're going to do the harder work of 22 00:01:26,876 --> 00:01:30,036 Speaker 1: looking inward. Over the next few episodes, we'll try to 23 00:01:30,036 --> 00:01:33,396 Speaker 1: pay attention to the wise voice inside us, our inner compass, 24 00:01:33,396 --> 00:01:35,876 Speaker 1: if you will, that often gets drowned out by all 25 00:01:35,916 --> 00:01:39,076 Speaker 1: the outside noise, and we'll see that carefully listening to 26 00:01:39,116 --> 00:01:41,476 Speaker 1: the quiet voice of what our bodies and our minds 27 00:01:41,516 --> 00:01:44,996 Speaker 1: truly need, maybe the real path to happiness in twenty 28 00:01:45,036 --> 00:01:49,276 Speaker 1: twenty three. Our minds are constantly telling us what to 29 00:01:49,316 --> 00:01:51,796 Speaker 1: do to be happy. But what if our minds are wrong? 30 00:01:52,276 --> 00:01:54,676 Speaker 1: What if our minds are lying to us, leading us 31 00:01:54,676 --> 00:01:57,676 Speaker 1: away from what will really make us happy. The good 32 00:01:57,676 --> 00:01:59,996 Speaker 1: news is the understanding the science of the mind can 33 00:02:00,036 --> 00:02:03,156 Speaker 1: point us all back in the right direction. You're listening 34 00:02:03,236 --> 00:02:10,316 Speaker 1: to the Happiness Lab with doctor Laurie Santos. In the 35 00:02:10,316 --> 00:02:12,796 Speaker 1: coming episodes, we're going to take a closer look at 36 00:02:12,796 --> 00:02:15,476 Speaker 1: the perennial urges we have in the new year. To 37 00:02:15,556 --> 00:02:18,236 Speaker 1: work out more, to eat healthier, to throw ourselves into 38 00:02:18,276 --> 00:02:21,156 Speaker 1: our jobs, and to push ourselves to the limit. At 39 00:02:21,156 --> 00:02:24,196 Speaker 1: first glance, all of these seem like reasonable personal goals, 40 00:02:24,636 --> 00:02:26,756 Speaker 1: but we rarely take a moment to stop and think, 41 00:02:27,236 --> 00:02:30,916 Speaker 1: could there be something else underlying all these desires? Why 42 00:02:30,916 --> 00:02:33,036 Speaker 1: are we putting so much emphasis on how much we 43 00:02:33,076 --> 00:02:35,636 Speaker 1: can bench press, how much protein we eat, or what 44 00:02:35,676 --> 00:02:38,636 Speaker 1: our new job title is. And the place where I 45 00:02:38,676 --> 00:02:42,276 Speaker 1: want to start this deeper exploration may seem slightly unorthodox. 46 00:02:42,876 --> 00:02:46,996 Speaker 1: I want to start with a children's book. Archibald's morning 47 00:02:47,116 --> 00:02:50,676 Speaker 1: always started off the way it would end in an egg. 48 00:02:51,636 --> 00:02:53,676 Speaker 1: My husband Mark and I have a ritual where he 49 00:02:53,676 --> 00:02:57,636 Speaker 1: reads me bedtime stories at night. Sometimes we pick classic texts, 50 00:02:58,036 --> 00:03:00,396 Speaker 1: but lots of nights these days we just go for 51 00:03:00,436 --> 00:03:03,236 Speaker 1: a children's book. And that was how I stumbled upon 52 00:03:03,236 --> 00:03:07,076 Speaker 1: the book that inspired this entire episode. It's called Archibald's 53 00:03:07,196 --> 00:03:10,916 Speaker 1: Next Big Thing. Archibald up deeply frustrated that he hadn't 54 00:03:10,956 --> 00:03:13,516 Speaker 1: figured out his next big thing. The book tells the 55 00:03:13,556 --> 00:03:16,916 Speaker 1: story of Archibald, a cartoon chicken who's desperately trying to 56 00:03:16,916 --> 00:03:19,396 Speaker 1: find what he refers to as his next big thing. 57 00:03:19,716 --> 00:03:23,076 Speaker 1: I've got to find my next big thing, often missing 58 00:03:23,076 --> 00:03:25,476 Speaker 1: out on exciting moments that were right there. If he 59 00:03:25,556 --> 00:03:28,396 Speaker 1: just took a moment to notice a dinosaur writing a 60 00:03:28,476 --> 00:03:30,956 Speaker 1: roller coaster is pretty big, So what you're searching for 61 00:03:31,196 --> 00:03:34,876 Speaker 1: must be huge, it is, said Archibald, I know it. 62 00:03:35,596 --> 00:03:38,516 Speaker 1: The book ends with Archibald realizing that big things are 63 00:03:38,556 --> 00:03:41,676 Speaker 1: sometimes right in front of our noses or our beaks 64 00:03:41,716 --> 00:03:45,036 Speaker 1: as it were. Of course, of course, Archibald clucked loudly, 65 00:03:45,276 --> 00:03:48,556 Speaker 1: how could I have missed it? Archibald's Next Big Thing 66 00:03:48,596 --> 00:03:50,916 Speaker 1: is a book for children, but many adults struggle with 67 00:03:50,956 --> 00:03:53,756 Speaker 1: the same problem that this little chicken faced. Many of 68 00:03:53,836 --> 00:03:56,396 Speaker 1: us spend a lot of energy looking forward to that 69 00:03:56,476 --> 00:03:59,436 Speaker 1: next big thing when our new gym membership finally pays off, 70 00:03:59,716 --> 00:04:01,636 Speaker 1: or how happy we'll be when we get that huge 71 00:04:01,756 --> 00:04:05,116 Speaker 1: rays or promotion. We hear all these outside voices telling 72 00:04:05,196 --> 00:04:08,356 Speaker 1: us how great it'll all be in the future, which 73 00:04:08,436 --> 00:04:10,956 Speaker 1: makes it kind of impossible to hear the soft intuition 74 00:04:11,396 --> 00:04:13,316 Speaker 1: that maybe telling us that what we need to be 75 00:04:13,356 --> 00:04:16,516 Speaker 1: happy is right here in the present. The author of 76 00:04:16,596 --> 00:04:19,876 Speaker 1: Archibald's Next Big Thing knows this lesson all too well. 77 00:04:20,276 --> 00:04:22,316 Speaker 1: He wrote the book for his daughter to help her 78 00:04:22,396 --> 00:04:25,396 Speaker 1: learn what he'd gotten wrong so often before, that if 79 00:04:25,396 --> 00:04:28,236 Speaker 1: you only concentrate on the next big thing, you'll miss 80 00:04:28,276 --> 00:04:32,196 Speaker 1: the chance to be happy right now. Hello, hey Tony, 81 00:04:32,316 --> 00:04:34,636 Speaker 1: I'm just realizing now I think I took your course. 82 00:04:34,796 --> 00:04:38,156 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it's a course right didn't have its 83 00:04:38,196 --> 00:04:40,596 Speaker 1: called the Science of well Being on Coursera. Now this 84 00:04:40,676 --> 00:04:42,796 Speaker 1: makes so much sense. Where I used talk so eloquently 85 00:04:42,796 --> 00:04:48,476 Speaker 1: about happiness, That's what you taught me. That author whose 86 00:04:48,556 --> 00:04:51,996 Speaker 1: voice you may recognize is Tony Hill, the star of Veep, 87 00:04:52,156 --> 00:04:55,516 Speaker 1: the Mysterious Benedict Society, and the actor who played Buster 88 00:04:55,556 --> 00:04:59,436 Speaker 1: Bluth and Arrested Development. Like many of his characters, Tony 89 00:04:59,476 --> 00:05:02,756 Speaker 1: admits to having been deeply affected by anxiety, and just 90 00:05:02,796 --> 00:05:06,116 Speaker 1: like Archibald the Chicken, Tony spent many years searching for 91 00:05:06,156 --> 00:05:09,236 Speaker 1: his next big thing, including the next big role he 92 00:05:09,236 --> 00:05:12,356 Speaker 1: thought would bring him the happiness he craved. I mentioned 93 00:05:12,356 --> 00:05:14,556 Speaker 1: the story a lot, and I really believe in it 94 00:05:14,596 --> 00:05:16,036 Speaker 1: a lot. And I don't know, I'm a guy that 95 00:05:16,076 --> 00:05:17,876 Speaker 1: needs a lot of reminders, so I don't mind talking 96 00:05:17,876 --> 00:05:19,596 Speaker 1: about it a lot. But when I was living in 97 00:05:19,636 --> 00:05:21,476 Speaker 1: New York, I was an actor in New York for 98 00:05:21,516 --> 00:05:24,276 Speaker 1: like seven years, and I was doing commercials, and I 99 00:05:24,316 --> 00:05:27,156 Speaker 1: was actually doing pretty well in commercials. But there was 100 00:05:27,196 --> 00:05:29,476 Speaker 1: something called pilot season where there was like a three 101 00:05:29,476 --> 00:05:32,436 Speaker 1: month period during the year where they would audition for 102 00:05:32,876 --> 00:05:35,236 Speaker 1: TV pilots, and if you missed that window, you probably 103 00:05:35,236 --> 00:05:37,276 Speaker 1: weren't going to get on a show. And really all 104 00:05:37,316 --> 00:05:38,836 Speaker 1: I wanted in life was to get on a sitcom. 105 00:05:38,996 --> 00:05:41,556 Speaker 1: That was kind of my goal, my end goal. Every 106 00:05:41,636 --> 00:05:43,836 Speaker 1: year would go by and I would miss pilot season, 107 00:05:43,836 --> 00:05:45,556 Speaker 1: I'd be like, what is happening? But I was always 108 00:05:45,596 --> 00:05:46,996 Speaker 1: anytime I would go through something, I was like, you 109 00:05:47,076 --> 00:05:49,076 Speaker 1: know what, that day's coming, that day's coming. I'm gonna 110 00:05:49,116 --> 00:05:51,716 Speaker 1: get that sitcom. It's coming, It's coming. Finally I booked 111 00:05:51,756 --> 00:05:54,836 Speaker 1: Arrest of Development, which was like the best cast, best scripts, 112 00:05:54,996 --> 00:05:57,596 Speaker 1: incredible show. And when I booked it, I found myself 113 00:05:57,636 --> 00:05:59,716 Speaker 1: that I wasn't as satisfied as I thought I was 114 00:05:59,756 --> 00:06:03,396 Speaker 1: going to be, and it really scared me because you 115 00:06:03,436 --> 00:06:06,396 Speaker 1: can't get better at the rest of development. So I 116 00:06:06,476 --> 00:06:08,436 Speaker 1: had no excuse and I was like, wait a second, 117 00:06:08,476 --> 00:06:10,996 Speaker 1: this is what I'm about. And it didn't satisfy me. 118 00:06:11,476 --> 00:06:13,676 Speaker 1: And when it was canceled in two thousand and six, 119 00:06:13,716 --> 00:06:15,516 Speaker 1: so it's kind of a time during that season of 120 00:06:15,596 --> 00:06:18,476 Speaker 1: like what's going on? What's happening? So when it got canceled, 121 00:06:18,596 --> 00:06:22,916 Speaker 1: my daughter was born, and one thing that you have 122 00:06:23,036 --> 00:06:25,636 Speaker 1: to do with a child is you can't be distracted. 123 00:06:25,676 --> 00:06:28,836 Speaker 1: You can't. Because my thing was when I realized through 124 00:06:28,836 --> 00:06:31,396 Speaker 1: the suggressive development experens. I just wasn't present for most 125 00:06:31,396 --> 00:06:33,316 Speaker 1: of my life. And it wasn't just in New York. 126 00:06:33,316 --> 00:06:35,236 Speaker 1: It was like whenever something was going on in my life, 127 00:06:35,236 --> 00:06:37,476 Speaker 1: I would just check out. I would just really just 128 00:06:37,596 --> 00:06:40,196 Speaker 1: kind of disassociates a strong word, but I would just 129 00:06:40,236 --> 00:06:41,876 Speaker 1: check out. I was looking at the future, I would 130 00:06:41,876 --> 00:06:43,196 Speaker 1: just think I would just kind of not be there. 131 00:06:43,516 --> 00:06:46,116 Speaker 1: But my daughter was born, I realized, like, I can't 132 00:06:46,156 --> 00:06:48,356 Speaker 1: check out. I've got to keep the child alive. So 133 00:06:48,396 --> 00:06:51,156 Speaker 1: I've got to be present. And it really woke me 134 00:06:51,236 --> 00:06:53,436 Speaker 1: up to just the many times of my life. For 135 00:06:53,516 --> 00:06:55,716 Speaker 1: most of my life, I wasn't president, And so then 136 00:06:55,796 --> 00:06:58,756 Speaker 1: began this journey of just waking myself up to where 137 00:06:58,756 --> 00:07:01,676 Speaker 1: I was in my career. There's a lot of highs, 138 00:07:01,756 --> 00:07:05,716 Speaker 1: Like there's big highs, and I was kind of putting 139 00:07:05,756 --> 00:07:08,316 Speaker 1: my satisfaction for most of my life in those big highs, 140 00:07:08,356 --> 00:07:10,636 Speaker 1: and I wasn't giving a lot of power to the ordinary, 141 00:07:10,676 --> 00:07:12,396 Speaker 1: a lot of power to the present, a lot of 142 00:07:12,396 --> 00:07:15,356 Speaker 1: power to the every day, and just didn't know how 143 00:07:15,396 --> 00:07:18,836 Speaker 1: to find really joy and contentment in those moments. So 144 00:07:18,876 --> 00:07:21,756 Speaker 1: I did something called CBT, which is cognitive behavioral therapy, 145 00:07:22,196 --> 00:07:25,596 Speaker 1: and really just kind of allowed myself, like he would 146 00:07:25,596 --> 00:07:27,676 Speaker 1: always say, hey, why don't you just activate the five 147 00:07:27,716 --> 00:07:31,116 Speaker 1: senses where you're at? What are you hearing? Smelling, tasting, touching, 148 00:07:31,476 --> 00:07:33,916 Speaker 1: and just like really grounding myself, like he would say, 149 00:07:33,916 --> 00:07:35,436 Speaker 1: you have to wake yourself up one hundred times a 150 00:07:35,476 --> 00:07:37,796 Speaker 1: day to where you are. And that's where this children's 151 00:07:37,836 --> 00:07:40,436 Speaker 1: book came out that I did, called Archibald's Next Big Thing, 152 00:07:40,676 --> 00:07:43,236 Speaker 1: about this little chicken who gets his card in the 153 00:07:43,236 --> 00:07:44,916 Speaker 1: mail that says your big thing is here, and he's 154 00:07:44,956 --> 00:07:46,796 Speaker 1: like where, And he goes on all these adventures. But 155 00:07:46,836 --> 00:07:48,436 Speaker 1: every time he's on an adventure, he's like, I gotta 156 00:07:48,436 --> 00:07:50,716 Speaker 1: get to my next big thing. And this bee comes along. 157 00:07:50,796 --> 00:07:52,276 Speaker 1: It's like, you gotta just be a man. You gotta 158 00:07:52,316 --> 00:07:54,676 Speaker 1: just be And he realizes that the car is right, 159 00:07:54,956 --> 00:07:57,996 Speaker 1: that his big thing was right there. It wasn't somewhere else. 160 00:07:58,396 --> 00:08:00,556 Speaker 1: And I had given that sitcome a lot of weight, 161 00:08:01,156 --> 00:08:03,516 Speaker 1: and nothing can match the weight that I gave it. 162 00:08:03,956 --> 00:08:06,676 Speaker 1: Now keep in mind I sound like I'm a professional 163 00:08:06,716 --> 00:08:09,796 Speaker 1: with this. I'm not. This is something I struggle with. 164 00:08:09,916 --> 00:08:12,036 Speaker 1: This is something it's very easy for me to check out. 165 00:08:12,276 --> 00:08:14,316 Speaker 1: I think I talk about it a lot as a reminder, 166 00:08:14,556 --> 00:08:16,876 Speaker 1: But it's just my default is to check out, and 167 00:08:16,916 --> 00:08:20,836 Speaker 1: I have to daily find the power in the every day, 168 00:08:20,836 --> 00:08:23,676 Speaker 1: in the ordinary, which is a challenge for me. I mean, 169 00:08:23,716 --> 00:08:25,876 Speaker 1: I think it's a challenge for everyone. I mean, I 170 00:08:25,876 --> 00:08:28,516 Speaker 1: think you're in it an industry where like looking ahead 171 00:08:28,596 --> 00:08:30,956 Speaker 1: is really you know, I'm sure every single interview you do, 172 00:08:31,116 --> 00:08:33,356 Speaker 1: somebody's like, you know, what's the next big thing for Tony? Right, 173 00:08:33,516 --> 00:08:35,876 Speaker 1: But it's also just a feature of human nature. I mean, 174 00:08:35,876 --> 00:08:38,156 Speaker 1: you can talked about this idea of waiting for the 175 00:08:38,196 --> 00:08:40,676 Speaker 1: next thing like this. This is a bias that psychologists 176 00:08:40,676 --> 00:08:42,676 Speaker 1: call the arrival fallacy. It's kind of like the happily 177 00:08:42,716 --> 00:08:45,236 Speaker 1: ever after fallacy, like I'll get this next thing and 178 00:08:45,276 --> 00:08:47,516 Speaker 1: I'll be good, but you're always looking to whatever the 179 00:08:47,556 --> 00:08:49,836 Speaker 1: next thing is, like totally, and I never want to 180 00:08:49,836 --> 00:08:52,396 Speaker 1: give the impression that dreaming is wrong, or I never 181 00:08:52,436 --> 00:08:55,036 Speaker 1: want to give the impression that ambition is wrong, or 182 00:08:55,076 --> 00:08:57,236 Speaker 1: like having those moments of a creative like, oh, where's 183 00:08:57,276 --> 00:08:58,956 Speaker 1: this going to go? I think that's great? My thing is, 184 00:08:59,116 --> 00:09:01,876 Speaker 1: That's all I was doing. I always tell people that 185 00:09:02,076 --> 00:09:05,196 Speaker 1: the value you have before success is the same value 186 00:09:05,196 --> 00:09:07,396 Speaker 1: you're going to have after success, and I'm in a 187 00:09:07,436 --> 00:09:10,236 Speaker 1: business that tells you your value will be with what 188 00:09:10,316 --> 00:09:14,116 Speaker 1: you get. And I say that because it's okay to ambition. 189 00:09:14,116 --> 00:09:17,236 Speaker 1: But am I changing my value with what I think 190 00:09:17,276 --> 00:09:19,276 Speaker 1: I'm going to get? Or am I giving myself the 191 00:09:19,316 --> 00:09:21,916 Speaker 1: same value that I have now? And that's the trick. 192 00:09:22,156 --> 00:09:24,156 Speaker 1: But the cool thing about the rest of development story 193 00:09:24,236 --> 00:09:27,116 Speaker 1: is that you had the realization right You kind of 194 00:09:27,116 --> 00:09:30,116 Speaker 1: did realize you were chasing and chasing and were in 195 00:09:30,116 --> 00:09:33,356 Speaker 1: the present moment. So what caused you to have that realization? 196 00:09:33,556 --> 00:09:35,956 Speaker 1: Was there a moment when you're like, wait, this is 197 00:09:36,036 --> 00:09:38,716 Speaker 1: never going yeah? Was that? Like? Honestly, I think it 198 00:09:38,756 --> 00:09:41,236 Speaker 1: was the gift of getting my dream. I got it. 199 00:09:41,356 --> 00:09:44,076 Speaker 1: And I mean you've heard stories of people getting oscars 200 00:09:44,076 --> 00:09:45,956 Speaker 1: and then the next day they go into a depression. 201 00:09:46,276 --> 00:09:50,316 Speaker 1: Mine was more and my anxiety has amped up because 202 00:09:51,276 --> 00:09:54,596 Speaker 1: all these expectations were not matched and I just freaked out. 203 00:09:54,836 --> 00:09:58,516 Speaker 1: Also another component of that is the guilt when people 204 00:09:58,676 --> 00:10:00,596 Speaker 1: come out to me and say, oh my gosh, are 205 00:10:00,636 --> 00:10:03,596 Speaker 1: you so excited? Are you so excited? And my insides 206 00:10:03,636 --> 00:10:06,196 Speaker 1: did not match their expectation, and so then I walked 207 00:10:06,236 --> 00:10:09,476 Speaker 1: away like what is wrong with me? What is it's wrong? 208 00:10:09,516 --> 00:10:13,156 Speaker 1: With me, and that's when everything began to unfold and 209 00:10:13,276 --> 00:10:15,356 Speaker 1: dissect and I was like, wait, I gotta go back. 210 00:10:15,516 --> 00:10:19,076 Speaker 1: And I got to realize I'm just being presidents of 211 00:10:19,116 --> 00:10:21,836 Speaker 1: a big struggle for me. And the fact is all 212 00:10:21,876 --> 00:10:24,636 Speaker 1: these are very buzzwords right now, being present, all that 213 00:10:24,716 --> 00:10:29,516 Speaker 1: kind of stuff, But for me, that is, it is, 214 00:10:29,636 --> 00:10:31,636 Speaker 1: it is the it's it's a huge component for me 215 00:10:31,756 --> 00:10:34,796 Speaker 1: is that it's being present. Because I say that because 216 00:10:35,036 --> 00:10:36,676 Speaker 1: there's a part of me that fight. It's like, Tony, 217 00:10:36,676 --> 00:10:39,796 Speaker 1: you're sounding cliche, but it's true. I just was not 218 00:10:40,076 --> 00:10:41,796 Speaker 1: very present for most of my life. And we need 219 00:10:41,876 --> 00:10:43,836 Speaker 1: to know what being present means. I think we think 220 00:10:43,916 --> 00:10:46,516 Speaker 1: when we do the buzzwordy versions would just be present, 221 00:10:46,556 --> 00:10:48,876 Speaker 1: but it's like, no, that means sitting with the awful 222 00:10:48,956 --> 00:10:51,476 Speaker 1: voice that's screaming at you. That means noticing that your 223 00:10:51,676 --> 00:10:53,476 Speaker 1: you know, your heart is freaking out and your chest 224 00:10:53,556 --> 00:10:55,636 Speaker 1: wants to bust out, and you feel awful and you're 225 00:10:55,676 --> 00:10:58,036 Speaker 1: saying really mean stuff to yourself. So it's one thing 226 00:10:58,036 --> 00:11:00,156 Speaker 1: to just be present when it's unicorns and rainbows and 227 00:11:00,196 --> 00:11:03,196 Speaker 1: ice cream codes, but it could be present feels awful. 228 00:11:03,276 --> 00:11:05,196 Speaker 1: Like I love that you said that, because I never 229 00:11:05,196 --> 00:11:08,236 Speaker 1: thought about that way that being present, there's there's a 230 00:11:08,236 --> 00:11:11,356 Speaker 1: compassion element to it of I want to check out 231 00:11:11,356 --> 00:11:14,516 Speaker 1: of this space right now. Hey, why am I feeling this? 232 00:11:14,916 --> 00:11:18,036 Speaker 1: I'm sad or I've had a tough day, or I'm 233 00:11:18,036 --> 00:11:20,236 Speaker 1: pissed off at my daughter? Why am I wanting to 234 00:11:20,316 --> 00:11:22,396 Speaker 1: check out? So let me just hey, I hear you. 235 00:11:22,756 --> 00:11:26,316 Speaker 1: And that's hard, you know. And that's something honestly when 236 00:11:26,316 --> 00:11:28,156 Speaker 1: people have said I'm sure you've heard this before, but 237 00:11:28,556 --> 00:11:30,036 Speaker 1: if my daughter comes up to me and says, Dad, 238 00:11:30,076 --> 00:11:32,396 Speaker 1: I'm really sad, I'm having a hard time, I would 239 00:11:32,476 --> 00:11:34,956 Speaker 1: be like, oh my gosh, honey, this is really hard, 240 00:11:35,196 --> 00:11:37,876 Speaker 1: give yourself a break. We don't talk to ourselves that way. 241 00:11:38,236 --> 00:11:40,036 Speaker 1: I don't talk to myself that way. So it's like 242 00:11:40,076 --> 00:11:42,076 Speaker 1: beginning to talk to myself as I would my daughter. 243 00:11:42,116 --> 00:11:44,876 Speaker 1: And I think we, you know, one of our many misconceptions, 244 00:11:44,876 --> 00:11:47,236 Speaker 1: as I think we have this like drill instructor theory 245 00:11:47,236 --> 00:11:49,996 Speaker 1: about motivation where it's like if I just scream at 246 00:11:50,036 --> 00:11:53,196 Speaker 1: myself and just like call myself really terrible names obviously 247 00:11:53,236 --> 00:11:55,556 Speaker 1: that I'll stop making me feel sad or scared, just 248 00:11:55,596 --> 00:11:57,556 Speaker 1: like yeah, myself. Yeah, Because let me tell you, right now, 249 00:11:57,636 --> 00:12:01,716 Speaker 1: that shame closet is packed like it is full. There 250 00:12:01,796 --> 00:12:04,556 Speaker 1: is no more room. The grace compassion has got a 251 00:12:04,636 --> 00:12:07,676 Speaker 1: lot of space. Let's start filling that closet. But it's hard. 252 00:12:07,716 --> 00:12:09,956 Speaker 1: I mean, this is what you're articulate so nicely, right, 253 00:12:09,996 --> 00:12:12,036 Speaker 1: it's like and it's hard in part because I think 254 00:12:12,076 --> 00:12:14,556 Speaker 1: we want to push ourselves. Yeah right, I mean, especially 255 00:12:14,596 --> 00:12:17,996 Speaker 1: in the industry you're in, there's this like push push, push, 256 00:12:18,116 --> 00:12:22,596 Speaker 1: don't admit vulnerability. Yeah, And I mean you had to 257 00:12:22,636 --> 00:12:24,756 Speaker 1: fight against that kind of mantra a lot. Yeah, And 258 00:12:24,796 --> 00:12:26,756 Speaker 1: I mean, and that's what's the gift of life of 259 00:12:26,996 --> 00:12:30,276 Speaker 1: when I remember years ago, I did a Pepto Bismo 260 00:12:30,396 --> 00:12:32,356 Speaker 1: commercial in New York where I was having diary on 261 00:12:32,396 --> 00:12:34,556 Speaker 1: the train and I was this is my first national 262 00:12:34,556 --> 00:12:37,836 Speaker 1: commercial and my tenure reunion was coming out from high school. 263 00:12:37,876 --> 00:12:39,836 Speaker 1: And I remember thinking, I'm going to go back to 264 00:12:39,876 --> 00:12:43,116 Speaker 1: that reunion and I'm gonna be like, guys, I'm just 265 00:12:43,156 --> 00:12:45,436 Speaker 1: this feeling of like I'm on national television and a 266 00:12:45,556 --> 00:12:48,396 Speaker 1: diary or commercial. And I gave that so much power 267 00:12:48,436 --> 00:12:50,916 Speaker 1: because I wanted to go back to these people that 268 00:12:51,196 --> 00:12:53,396 Speaker 1: bullied me or I didn't feel a part of or 269 00:12:53,436 --> 00:12:55,716 Speaker 1: I wanted to feel superior to or I just wanted 270 00:12:55,916 --> 00:12:58,556 Speaker 1: just mainly just to feel like the popular kid. I 271 00:12:58,556 --> 00:13:01,276 Speaker 1: remember leaving that reunion feeling worse than when I came 272 00:13:01,316 --> 00:13:04,116 Speaker 1: at and it was like, God, I gave a lot 273 00:13:04,196 --> 00:13:07,796 Speaker 1: of power to wanting to redo trauma or whatever with 274 00:13:07,956 --> 00:13:10,996 Speaker 1: these quote accomplishments, you know, and it was a diarrhye 275 00:13:10,996 --> 00:13:15,316 Speaker 1: of commercial auditory. One of the first things you talked 276 00:13:15,316 --> 00:13:18,716 Speaker 1: about when you're talking about arrested development and wanting to 277 00:13:18,756 --> 00:13:22,276 Speaker 1: do more, just articulate that urge for more. You finally 278 00:13:22,316 --> 00:13:24,596 Speaker 1: get a sitcom that's it's like one of the coolest 279 00:13:24,676 --> 00:13:27,516 Speaker 1: characters and one of the most well regarded characters in 280 00:13:27,596 --> 00:13:31,236 Speaker 1: like the last two decades of TV history. How did 281 00:13:31,396 --> 00:13:34,476 Speaker 1: that not feel like enough? That's the but that's I 282 00:13:34,516 --> 00:13:36,996 Speaker 1: think the curse we can fall into is and I 283 00:13:37,076 --> 00:13:41,236 Speaker 1: do sometimes I can get a little dark because bringing 284 00:13:41,356 --> 00:13:44,156 Speaker 1: up the fact that it is never enough if you 285 00:13:44,196 --> 00:13:47,396 Speaker 1: don't wake up to what you're around. The sad truth 286 00:13:47,836 --> 00:13:50,156 Speaker 1: it is sugar. You have sugar, and you're gonna want 287 00:13:50,156 --> 00:13:53,516 Speaker 1: more sugar, and it's never going to satisfy. And then 288 00:13:53,516 --> 00:13:55,836 Speaker 1: you're going to get to when you're in your eighties 289 00:13:55,876 --> 00:13:58,676 Speaker 1: and you're going to still be going, I want more, 290 00:13:58,996 --> 00:14:02,916 Speaker 1: what's next? This isn't enough, thinking the whole time the 291 00:14:03,036 --> 00:14:06,036 Speaker 1: next thing is going to be what's enough? Isn't that amazing? 292 00:14:06,156 --> 00:14:10,236 Speaker 1: The very simple truth that I would think I would get. 293 00:14:10,836 --> 00:14:13,356 Speaker 1: But it takes that reminder of like I have been 294 00:14:13,396 --> 00:14:16,236 Speaker 1: doing this and I still believe the next thing can 295 00:14:16,276 --> 00:14:18,756 Speaker 1: be enough. It's very easy to go to that place. Yeah, 296 00:14:18,796 --> 00:14:20,996 Speaker 1: And that's what And that's with career. I mean, you know, 297 00:14:21,156 --> 00:14:23,836 Speaker 1: on the podcast day one of my favorite episodes of 298 00:14:23,876 --> 00:14:25,756 Speaker 1: my own podcast was talking to this guy at clay 299 00:14:25,796 --> 00:14:28,716 Speaker 1: Cockrell who's a wealth psychologist and so he works with 300 00:14:28,756 --> 00:14:32,916 Speaker 1: the like you know, super infinitely wealthy, and they'll they'll 301 00:14:32,956 --> 00:14:34,756 Speaker 1: say things to him like, you know, I thought it 302 00:14:34,796 --> 00:14:36,676 Speaker 1: was the first billion, but it wasn't. It turns out 303 00:14:36,676 --> 00:14:40,076 Speaker 1: it's the second billion. I need to be a multi billion. Yeah. 304 00:14:40,076 --> 00:14:42,876 Speaker 1: And he's like watching this being like, how how can that? 305 00:14:43,196 --> 00:14:45,836 Speaker 1: You just had the data that that wasn't enough, but 306 00:14:45,836 --> 00:14:47,876 Speaker 1: but we don't incode, like, oh the whole premise is wrong. 307 00:14:47,876 --> 00:14:50,076 Speaker 1: Where you in code like I just didn't get there yet, 308 00:14:50,116 --> 00:14:52,516 Speaker 1: you know I need Yeah, he hit sitcoms and that's 309 00:14:52,516 --> 00:14:55,676 Speaker 1: when that happened. Yeah, and the truth is, I say it, 310 00:14:55,716 --> 00:14:57,996 Speaker 1: but it's it's so easy to fall into that pattern. 311 00:14:58,076 --> 00:15:01,316 Speaker 1: And also just all that and again not that money 312 00:15:01,396 --> 00:15:03,396 Speaker 1: is bad or success is bad and all that kind 313 00:15:03,436 --> 00:15:05,996 Speaker 1: of stuff. But I remember, you know, honestly, I was 314 00:15:06,036 --> 00:15:09,316 Speaker 1: watching an interview with Amy Schumer and it was a 315 00:15:09,356 --> 00:15:12,196 Speaker 1: long time ago, and someone was asking about what advice 316 00:15:12,236 --> 00:15:14,236 Speaker 1: would you get that's so exciting. You've got to be 317 00:15:14,236 --> 00:15:15,916 Speaker 1: where I want to be. And I remember Amy saying 318 00:15:15,956 --> 00:15:18,556 Speaker 1: something to this person's like, you have to understand I've 319 00:15:18,596 --> 00:15:21,876 Speaker 1: gotten to the other side and I've seen behind the curtain. 320 00:15:22,276 --> 00:15:26,076 Speaker 1: You're still thinking that thing is behind the curtain and 321 00:15:26,156 --> 00:15:27,996 Speaker 1: it's not, or something to that effect that it was 322 00:15:28,076 --> 00:15:32,196 Speaker 1: so wise. Oh and this was my favorite Jim Carrey's speech. 323 00:15:32,196 --> 00:15:33,876 Speaker 1: Do you know what I'm talking about? Jim Carrey at 324 00:15:33,916 --> 00:15:35,756 Speaker 1: the Golden Globes and I have the chance to meet 325 00:15:35,836 --> 00:15:38,116 Speaker 1: him recently, and I rushed him and I told him, 326 00:15:38,156 --> 00:15:39,636 Speaker 1: I was like, I've told this story so many times 327 00:15:39,676 --> 00:15:41,076 Speaker 1: and I so appreciate you doing this. But he was 328 00:15:41,076 --> 00:15:43,516 Speaker 1: with the Golden Globes years ago and he said something 329 00:15:43,556 --> 00:15:45,876 Speaker 1: to the effect of, as a joke, he said, I've 330 00:15:45,876 --> 00:15:49,036 Speaker 1: got two Golden Globes but a third will be enough. 331 00:15:49,396 --> 00:15:51,436 Speaker 1: And it went to the audience and you can see 332 00:15:51,476 --> 00:15:53,356 Speaker 1: half of them were laughing, and then you saw half 333 00:15:53,396 --> 00:15:56,196 Speaker 1: of them like kind of like it will be like 334 00:15:56,476 --> 00:15:58,876 Speaker 1: because we do tell ourselves that narrative. And he was 335 00:15:58,916 --> 00:16:02,156 Speaker 1: making a joke, but what a profound statement, you know. 336 00:16:02,516 --> 00:16:05,196 Speaker 1: I loved it. Yeah, this idea of never having enough 337 00:16:05,356 --> 00:16:07,756 Speaker 1: is really, I think, such a problem. I mean again, 338 00:16:07,796 --> 00:16:10,236 Speaker 1: I was not consulted when he minds were built, but like, 339 00:16:10,316 --> 00:16:13,036 Speaker 1: you know, three golden globes, like you should cross it 340 00:16:13,076 --> 00:16:16,516 Speaker 1: off your list, go hang out on the couch, right exactly. 341 00:16:16,636 --> 00:16:19,196 Speaker 1: And I think another trick is kind of navigating all 342 00:16:19,236 --> 00:16:22,076 Speaker 1: the other psychological biases we bring to the people. And 343 00:16:22,116 --> 00:16:24,076 Speaker 1: I know this is something you've talked about too, about 344 00:16:24,156 --> 00:16:26,476 Speaker 1: kind of having had a history of anxiety and things 345 00:16:26,516 --> 00:16:29,436 Speaker 1: like that. You're known as an actor who plays anxious characters. 346 00:16:29,476 --> 00:16:31,436 Speaker 1: In fact, one of one of my students once said, 347 00:16:31,676 --> 00:16:33,716 Speaker 1: in the midst of midterms, she was like, I feel 348 00:16:33,756 --> 00:16:37,676 Speaker 1: like I'm a Tony Hale character this week. Students to 349 00:16:37,716 --> 00:16:40,196 Speaker 1: be saying that. Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, so talk a 350 00:16:40,236 --> 00:16:42,276 Speaker 1: little bit about like how this is played out even 351 00:16:42,356 --> 00:16:44,756 Speaker 1: before being an actor in your early life. Yeah, I 352 00:16:44,796 --> 00:16:47,996 Speaker 1: love that question. Hey, talking to you, which you're so 353 00:16:48,316 --> 00:16:52,436 Speaker 1: intelligent and well read about psychology. I'm sure I'm sounding 354 00:16:52,476 --> 00:16:56,236 Speaker 1: like a complete simpleton. But when it comes to anxiety, 355 00:16:56,556 --> 00:16:59,396 Speaker 1: I man, there's so many things to say, because when 356 00:16:59,396 --> 00:17:01,756 Speaker 1: I was a kid, I the word anxiety was not 357 00:17:01,836 --> 00:17:03,996 Speaker 1: as much of a buzzword as it is now, and 358 00:17:04,356 --> 00:17:06,076 Speaker 1: I didn't know how to categorize myself. I had a 359 00:17:06,076 --> 00:17:08,716 Speaker 1: lot of feelings. I was very sensitive, a lot of panic, 360 00:17:08,836 --> 00:17:11,996 Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of fear, and I think 361 00:17:12,036 --> 00:17:15,196 Speaker 1: I was kind of very extroverted and wanted attention. But 362 00:17:15,236 --> 00:17:16,516 Speaker 1: there was a way just to kind of get those 363 00:17:16,516 --> 00:17:18,796 Speaker 1: feelings out, which is good. I'm glad I had those outlets, 364 00:17:18,836 --> 00:17:22,236 Speaker 1: but just a lot of interferes And then I remember, 365 00:17:23,316 --> 00:17:24,956 Speaker 1: I think it was my junior or senior year. I 366 00:17:24,956 --> 00:17:26,716 Speaker 1: did a show a little Abner and I was at 367 00:17:26,756 --> 00:17:29,636 Speaker 1: this character Mary and Sam and in the middle of 368 00:17:29,636 --> 00:17:32,516 Speaker 1: the song, I had what I thought was an asthma attack, 369 00:17:32,556 --> 00:17:35,076 Speaker 1: and it was a panic attack. I didn't know what 370 00:17:35,116 --> 00:17:39,076 Speaker 1: it was then for the rest of my decades ahead, 371 00:17:39,356 --> 00:17:42,116 Speaker 1: that became a marker of what I was terrified to 372 00:17:42,156 --> 00:17:45,676 Speaker 1: have again. And I did have it other times, but 373 00:17:45,756 --> 00:17:48,556 Speaker 1: there was this fear of like, oh my gosh, that's 374 00:17:48,596 --> 00:17:50,556 Speaker 1: going to happen again on stage, that's going to happen 375 00:17:50,556 --> 00:17:52,276 Speaker 1: again in an interview, that's going to happen when I 376 00:17:52,316 --> 00:17:53,996 Speaker 1: have to speak in front of somebody. And it was 377 00:17:54,036 --> 00:17:58,076 Speaker 1: just absolute terror. And then over time kind of getting 378 00:17:58,076 --> 00:18:00,396 Speaker 1: back on stage and doing things I would I remember 379 00:18:00,396 --> 00:18:03,836 Speaker 1: there's this famous preacher named Joyce Myers who would always say, 380 00:18:04,076 --> 00:18:05,436 Speaker 1: many times, we feel like we have to be in 381 00:18:05,436 --> 00:18:07,596 Speaker 1: this place of peace or strength in order to do stuff. 382 00:18:07,636 --> 00:18:09,316 Speaker 1: And she's like, you know what, you just gotta do 383 00:18:09,316 --> 00:18:11,156 Speaker 1: it afraid. You just got to keep walking and do 384 00:18:11,156 --> 00:18:13,916 Speaker 1: it afraid. And I found myself constantly having this mantra 385 00:18:13,916 --> 00:18:16,596 Speaker 1: of like Tony, just do it afraid, And so I 386 00:18:16,636 --> 00:18:19,276 Speaker 1: would just keep walking because I can honestly say that 387 00:18:19,356 --> 00:18:21,036 Speaker 1: I felt like I was a victim to my thoughts, 388 00:18:21,076 --> 00:18:23,476 Speaker 1: to my feelings. I was so drowning in my thoughts 389 00:18:23,476 --> 00:18:25,716 Speaker 1: and my feelings. I'm never going to work again. There's 390 00:18:25,716 --> 00:18:27,356 Speaker 1: that thought that I'm gonna have a panic attack. There's 391 00:18:27,356 --> 00:18:29,876 Speaker 1: that thought that my daughter's gonna get kidnapped or anything. 392 00:18:30,276 --> 00:18:32,636 Speaker 1: There's just these thoughts and feelings that are going by 393 00:18:32,676 --> 00:18:35,116 Speaker 1: like cars on a highway and when I became more 394 00:18:35,156 --> 00:18:37,236 Speaker 1: of an observer of them, it took a seat and 395 00:18:37,276 --> 00:18:40,276 Speaker 1: didn't identify with them so much. Again, this is something 396 00:18:40,356 --> 00:18:42,116 Speaker 1: I do with all the time, but it was an 397 00:18:42,156 --> 00:18:46,156 Speaker 1: angle I never thought about, and I was just incredibly 398 00:18:46,196 --> 00:18:49,516 Speaker 1: grateful to have that new and I'll never this other 399 00:18:49,596 --> 00:18:52,276 Speaker 1: This therapist I worked with who was really just a godsend, 400 00:18:52,276 --> 00:18:55,636 Speaker 1: and actually he just gave me tools that I so appreciated, 401 00:18:55,716 --> 00:18:57,716 Speaker 1: one being I want you to close your eyes for 402 00:18:57,756 --> 00:19:00,556 Speaker 1: ten minutes a day, and if a picture came in 403 00:19:00,596 --> 00:19:02,436 Speaker 1: your mind, say image. And if you find yourself going 404 00:19:02,436 --> 00:19:05,076 Speaker 1: over a conversation, just say words. And the fact is 405 00:19:05,116 --> 00:19:07,716 Speaker 1: we cannot control our thoughts and feelings, we cannot control 406 00:19:07,756 --> 00:19:09,676 Speaker 1: what goes in our heads. But there's some about putting 407 00:19:09,676 --> 00:19:13,076 Speaker 1: a name to these thoughts in these images that you're 408 00:19:13,116 --> 00:19:14,636 Speaker 1: never going to be fully in the driver's seat, but 409 00:19:14,636 --> 00:19:15,876 Speaker 1: it felt like I was a little more in the 410 00:19:15,916 --> 00:19:18,796 Speaker 1: driver's seat. And just simple things like that. That was great. 411 00:19:18,836 --> 00:19:21,596 Speaker 1: And to your question of kind of characters that I've played, 412 00:19:21,996 --> 00:19:25,076 Speaker 1: I do. I do anxiety very well because I know 413 00:19:25,116 --> 00:19:27,316 Speaker 1: what it feels like. But I think it is so 414 00:19:27,356 --> 00:19:29,476 Speaker 1: cool to be in a stage of my life where 415 00:19:29,636 --> 00:19:32,596 Speaker 1: all the stuff that I've walked through, and you know, 416 00:19:32,796 --> 00:19:34,836 Speaker 1: not nearly what other people have walked through, but what 417 00:19:34,916 --> 00:19:37,996 Speaker 1: I personally walk through. I can bring them into comedy. 418 00:19:38,036 --> 00:19:41,236 Speaker 1: I can show a more authentic version of anxiety. I 419 00:19:41,276 --> 00:19:43,836 Speaker 1: can talk about it openly, like it's it is cool 420 00:19:43,916 --> 00:19:47,236 Speaker 1: how something that was so broken in my life, how 421 00:19:47,236 --> 00:19:50,356 Speaker 1: it can be used for restoration and others, And that's 422 00:19:50,396 --> 00:19:54,476 Speaker 1: a that's a cool equation that happens. I think Tony's 423 00:19:54,516 --> 00:19:57,276 Speaker 1: portrayals of anxious characters have made a lot of us laugh, 424 00:19:57,556 --> 00:19:59,956 Speaker 1: but they've also gotten a lot of us to think. 425 00:20:01,116 --> 00:20:03,276 Speaker 1: When we get back from the break, we'll hear more 426 00:20:03,316 --> 00:20:05,796 Speaker 1: about how Tony learn to listen to the anxious voice 427 00:20:05,796 --> 00:20:08,516 Speaker 1: in his head. We'll see how really hearing that voice 428 00:20:08,636 --> 00:20:11,716 Speaker 1: and show at some compassion allowed Tony to make peace 429 00:20:11,716 --> 00:20:14,596 Speaker 1: with his thoughts and fears and feel a little happier. 430 00:20:15,356 --> 00:20:25,676 Speaker 1: The Happiness Lab will return in a moment. Many of 431 00:20:25,756 --> 00:20:28,796 Speaker 1: us experience a little social anxiety now and then, but 432 00:20:28,876 --> 00:20:31,036 Speaker 1: we don't usually have to perform in front of a 433 00:20:31,116 --> 00:20:34,036 Speaker 1: theater full of paying customers, or to step out before 434 00:20:34,036 --> 00:20:37,876 Speaker 1: a live TV audience of millions. After Tony Hall loved 435 00:20:37,876 --> 00:20:40,516 Speaker 1: being a performer, but his mind was often filled with 436 00:20:40,596 --> 00:20:44,236 Speaker 1: terror that he'd freeze or panic when the stakes got high, which, 437 00:20:44,276 --> 00:20:46,996 Speaker 1: as you can imagine, is a scary and lonely place 438 00:20:47,036 --> 00:20:50,876 Speaker 1: to be. So how did he overcome it? People who 439 00:20:50,956 --> 00:20:53,916 Speaker 1: have had panic attacks can understand this. It feels like 440 00:20:53,956 --> 00:20:56,356 Speaker 1: you're never going to get out of it. It feels 441 00:20:56,356 --> 00:20:58,796 Speaker 1: like the tsunami is coming towards you and it's just 442 00:20:58,836 --> 00:21:01,876 Speaker 1: going to eat you alive, and nobody understands what you're 443 00:21:02,036 --> 00:21:04,676 Speaker 1: going through. I'll never forget. I was about to do 444 00:21:04,796 --> 00:21:07,996 Speaker 1: Conan O'Brien and when you're on a talk show, you're 445 00:21:08,036 --> 00:21:09,676 Speaker 1: about to go on and they have a they opened 446 00:21:09,716 --> 00:21:11,476 Speaker 1: the curtain, you walk out, and there was two guys 447 00:21:11,716 --> 00:21:13,356 Speaker 1: about to open the curtain. I was going to walk out, 448 00:21:13,476 --> 00:21:15,836 Speaker 1: and I felt a panic attack coming on. There was 449 00:21:15,876 --> 00:21:19,036 Speaker 1: this moment of I'm either going to run because what 450 00:21:19,076 --> 00:21:21,796 Speaker 1: I wanted to do was just bolt, or what I did, 451 00:21:22,036 --> 00:21:24,516 Speaker 1: by the grace of God, is I started asking these 452 00:21:24,516 --> 00:21:27,436 Speaker 1: two guys questions that we're holding this curtain, and I said, 453 00:21:27,436 --> 00:21:28,956 Speaker 1: so where are you guys from? Oh my gosh, how 454 00:21:28,956 --> 00:21:30,476 Speaker 1: long have you been doing? This? Wouldn't be crazy if 455 00:21:30,476 --> 00:21:32,996 Speaker 1: there was like a documentary back here about people about 456 00:21:33,036 --> 00:21:35,076 Speaker 1: like I just started to ask them questions to get 457 00:21:35,116 --> 00:21:37,356 Speaker 1: my eyes off the anxiety, and then the curtain open 458 00:21:37,396 --> 00:21:40,276 Speaker 1: and I went, but it's there's just this, there's this 459 00:21:40,436 --> 00:21:44,836 Speaker 1: cross roads you hit where it's like it's coming and 460 00:21:45,236 --> 00:21:47,436 Speaker 1: you so want to fight it. You so want to 461 00:21:47,436 --> 00:21:48,996 Speaker 1: be like no, no, no no, no no, don't don't, don't 462 00:21:48,996 --> 00:21:51,516 Speaker 1: it's overway. What you don't want to do is give 463 00:21:51,676 --> 00:21:53,996 Speaker 1: yourself over to it. But that's kind of what you 464 00:21:54,076 --> 00:21:58,636 Speaker 1: have to do. Like there's something about surrendering to the 465 00:21:58,716 --> 00:22:01,196 Speaker 1: feelings and be like, you know what there it is, 466 00:22:02,276 --> 00:22:04,996 Speaker 1: this is what this feels like, I know this feeling, 467 00:22:05,156 --> 00:22:06,676 Speaker 1: and I know this feeling is going to pass. I 468 00:22:06,676 --> 00:22:09,476 Speaker 1: remember Bill Hayter was talking about his anxiety one he 469 00:22:09,516 --> 00:22:12,356 Speaker 1: talked about just how he would have He would name 470 00:22:12,396 --> 00:22:14,276 Speaker 1: it as like a funny little friend that would kind 471 00:22:14,276 --> 00:22:16,196 Speaker 1: of crawl all over him. And I was doing a 472 00:22:16,316 --> 00:22:19,876 Speaker 1: play two years ago in San Francisco and it was 473 00:22:19,916 --> 00:22:21,836 Speaker 1: practically a one man play. There was another character that 474 00:22:21,876 --> 00:22:23,396 Speaker 1: came in towards the end, but most of it was 475 00:22:23,436 --> 00:22:26,076 Speaker 1: just me talking for forty five minutes. And every night 476 00:22:26,076 --> 00:22:28,316 Speaker 1: before going on, I would think tonight's tonight that I'm 477 00:22:28,356 --> 00:22:30,076 Speaker 1: going to lose it on stage in front of a 478 00:22:30,156 --> 00:22:33,596 Speaker 1: thousand people, and I would that little voice would come 479 00:22:33,676 --> 00:22:35,836 Speaker 1: up and say, you know what, tonight's to night. And 480 00:22:36,196 --> 00:22:40,076 Speaker 1: I've never had compassion to that voice. I've never looked 481 00:22:40,076 --> 00:22:42,116 Speaker 1: to the voice and say, hey, I really appreciate you 482 00:22:42,156 --> 00:22:44,756 Speaker 1: being here. I know you're trying to protect me, and 483 00:22:44,796 --> 00:22:46,556 Speaker 1: I can't tell you how much that means to me. 484 00:22:46,836 --> 00:22:48,276 Speaker 1: I'm going to go out and do the show, but 485 00:22:48,316 --> 00:22:52,156 Speaker 1: I'll be back. And there was something about having compassion 486 00:22:52,196 --> 00:22:56,196 Speaker 1: to that voice. It dissipates the power. Rather than fighting 487 00:22:56,196 --> 00:22:58,156 Speaker 1: that voice, which I had done from most of my life, 488 00:22:58,156 --> 00:23:00,996 Speaker 1: but really giving it the love and care that it 489 00:23:01,076 --> 00:23:02,916 Speaker 1: needed because it is a part of me, and my 490 00:23:02,956 --> 00:23:04,916 Speaker 1: anxiety is a part of me, and why not begin 491 00:23:04,996 --> 00:23:07,036 Speaker 1: to embrace and have love towards it, because that's what's 492 00:23:07,036 --> 00:23:08,836 Speaker 1: going to release the power of it. Yeah, I mean, 493 00:23:08,876 --> 00:23:12,516 Speaker 1: I really love that suggestion for two reasons. Right. One 494 00:23:12,636 --> 00:23:16,996 Speaker 1: is we know psychologically this idea that what you resist persists. Yeah, right, 495 00:23:16,996 --> 00:23:19,156 Speaker 1: if you try to like squish the beach ball under 496 00:23:19,196 --> 00:23:21,356 Speaker 1: the water, it's gonna come flying back out at you. Right, 497 00:23:21,396 --> 00:23:24,196 Speaker 1: So it just doesn't work, the resistance. But also recognizing 498 00:23:24,236 --> 00:23:27,116 Speaker 1: that that voice is there, it's trying to tell you something, 499 00:23:27,116 --> 00:23:29,556 Speaker 1: and listening to it. I think all too often we 500 00:23:29,596 --> 00:23:32,676 Speaker 1: think of our emotions, whether it's anxiety or anger or whatever, 501 00:23:32,756 --> 00:23:35,716 Speaker 1: as this annoying thing that's rumbling around in our brain 502 00:23:35,756 --> 00:23:37,676 Speaker 1: that we want to shut off. But it's really just 503 00:23:37,716 --> 00:23:40,316 Speaker 1: like a signal. Like it's like an alarm bell that's 504 00:23:40,356 --> 00:23:42,836 Speaker 1: telling us something. It's like when your microwave beeps, when 505 00:23:42,876 --> 00:23:45,556 Speaker 1: the yea the pubcorn's done. It's like it's just telling 506 00:23:45,596 --> 00:23:47,796 Speaker 1: you something. And if we listen to it, say, hey, 507 00:23:47,876 --> 00:23:50,076 Speaker 1: you know, thanks for telling me this. I do have 508 00:23:50,116 --> 00:23:51,396 Speaker 1: to go on stage right now, so I'm not going 509 00:23:51,436 --> 00:23:53,236 Speaker 1: to listen to you right now, but thank you for 510 00:23:53,236 --> 00:23:54,916 Speaker 1: trying to look out for me. It's just such a 511 00:23:54,956 --> 00:23:57,596 Speaker 1: different relationship with that voice. I love that because the 512 00:23:57,636 --> 00:24:00,596 Speaker 1: fact is, if you really think about it, this voice 513 00:24:00,636 --> 00:24:02,636 Speaker 1: has been trying to protect me since I was a kid. 514 00:24:02,956 --> 00:24:07,276 Speaker 1: So the motivation of this voice is really begins. Is 515 00:24:07,316 --> 00:24:10,396 Speaker 1: it from a loving place like wanting to help, and 516 00:24:10,676 --> 00:24:14,196 Speaker 1: it has got distorted and it was crippling, But the 517 00:24:14,276 --> 00:24:17,076 Speaker 1: motivation is they just want to protect me, and I 518 00:24:17,116 --> 00:24:19,596 Speaker 1: want to give it that love. I think also, especially 519 00:24:19,636 --> 00:24:21,716 Speaker 1: you know, for you as a kid, you had this 520 00:24:21,876 --> 00:24:24,236 Speaker 1: secondary thing that I think went along with the anxiety, 521 00:24:24,236 --> 00:24:26,116 Speaker 1: which probably you know, the voice was really trying to 522 00:24:26,116 --> 00:24:28,076 Speaker 1: protect you from. I know you've talked before about your 523 00:24:28,116 --> 00:24:31,756 Speaker 1: history with asthma, and there's such a connection just physiologically 524 00:24:31,756 --> 00:24:34,676 Speaker 1: between what happens and anxiety and with your breath and 525 00:24:34,756 --> 00:24:37,916 Speaker 1: what happens in asthma. And so because if anything, I 526 00:24:37,916 --> 00:24:40,196 Speaker 1: imagine the asthma made you a little bit vigilant in 527 00:24:40,196 --> 00:24:43,356 Speaker 1: a very anxious way. Ye child anyway, Yeah, because there's 528 00:24:43,436 --> 00:24:46,196 Speaker 1: a I would also get really really nervous on elevators 529 00:24:46,236 --> 00:24:47,796 Speaker 1: because I would think, if I have an asthma tack, 530 00:24:47,876 --> 00:24:50,276 Speaker 1: I can't get out if there's a hospital nearby, And 531 00:24:50,556 --> 00:24:53,356 Speaker 1: that just kind of triggered the anxiety, and many times 532 00:24:53,356 --> 00:24:55,916 Speaker 1: it became a psycho where the anxiety then triggered the asthma. 533 00:24:56,036 --> 00:24:58,956 Speaker 1: And a lot of people don't talk about they they 534 00:24:58,996 --> 00:25:00,956 Speaker 1: talk about asthma, they don't they don't talk about the 535 00:25:00,956 --> 00:25:04,156 Speaker 1: anxiety associated with asthma. And our breath is our life 536 00:25:04,156 --> 00:25:06,876 Speaker 1: for us, So it feels like you're breathing through a 537 00:25:06,916 --> 00:25:10,236 Speaker 1: straw like it is a terrifying feeling, and the thought 538 00:25:10,236 --> 00:25:12,636 Speaker 1: of that coming back and not knowing because anything could 539 00:25:12,636 --> 00:25:15,476 Speaker 1: trigger it for me. It could be environmental, it could 540 00:25:15,476 --> 00:25:17,836 Speaker 1: be anxiety, it could be anything, so you never when 541 00:25:17,876 --> 00:25:20,116 Speaker 1: it's going to come, which is very similar to kind 542 00:25:20,116 --> 00:25:23,236 Speaker 1: of panic stuff. So there's a real kind of similarity 543 00:25:23,276 --> 00:25:26,236 Speaker 1: between the two. I'm glad you're talking explicitly because I 544 00:25:26,236 --> 00:25:29,996 Speaker 1: think people just think asthma, Yeah, just the big thing. 545 00:25:30,116 --> 00:25:31,956 Speaker 1: But it's like, no, it comes with all the psychology, 546 00:25:31,996 --> 00:25:35,956 Speaker 1: but just really quick. Like something I've mentioned I don't 547 00:25:35,996 --> 00:25:39,276 Speaker 1: give like details, but there's been addiction issues in my 548 00:25:39,356 --> 00:25:43,836 Speaker 1: family growing up, and there's a hyper vigilance of being 549 00:25:43,876 --> 00:25:47,516 Speaker 1: around addictive cycles and it puts you in kind of 550 00:25:47,596 --> 00:25:50,436 Speaker 1: high alert a lot, and so there's kind of a 551 00:25:50,436 --> 00:25:54,396 Speaker 1: perfect storm that can happen with that high alertness, the asthma, 552 00:25:54,476 --> 00:25:57,996 Speaker 1: all that can kind of like create a lot of fun. Yeah, 553 00:25:59,436 --> 00:26:02,076 Speaker 1: talk about hyper vigilance, You're like, what the heck is 554 00:26:02,236 --> 00:26:05,156 Speaker 1: going on? Totally totally, And I think that the kind 555 00:26:05,156 --> 00:26:07,076 Speaker 1: of what I wanted to dig into about the anxiety 556 00:26:07,156 --> 00:26:10,836 Speaker 1: is that it's related to this vigilance that takes you 557 00:26:10,836 --> 00:26:13,316 Speaker 1: out of the present moment, right, Like all these voices 558 00:26:13,356 --> 00:26:15,996 Speaker 1: are talking about things in the future, What might happen 559 00:26:16,076 --> 00:26:18,916 Speaker 1: if you know, you're kind of fast forwarding, and so 560 00:26:19,036 --> 00:26:21,796 Speaker 1: has this kind of practice of being in the present 561 00:26:21,836 --> 00:26:24,276 Speaker 1: moment also reduced your anxiety, Like it's good to just 562 00:26:24,316 --> 00:26:26,156 Speaker 1: be in the present moment generally, But has that also 563 00:26:26,236 --> 00:26:28,396 Speaker 1: helped you with some of these emotions? It has, if 564 00:26:28,396 --> 00:26:31,716 Speaker 1: I'm honest, It's just hard, man, It's really, it's really 565 00:26:32,036 --> 00:26:34,916 Speaker 1: it's really hard to be present. You know. I just 566 00:26:34,996 --> 00:26:39,476 Speaker 1: admire a friend of mine, Natalie, her and her husband does. 567 00:26:39,556 --> 00:26:42,276 Speaker 1: They just moved to la and Natalie meditates every day 568 00:26:42,316 --> 00:26:46,356 Speaker 1: and she really practices it. And I just it's something 569 00:26:46,396 --> 00:26:48,876 Speaker 1: that I so wish came naturally and it just and 570 00:26:48,916 --> 00:26:50,876 Speaker 1: I know she's worked at it and started. Look, but 571 00:26:50,876 --> 00:26:53,636 Speaker 1: it's I want to do that more because it's amazing. Like, 572 00:26:53,676 --> 00:26:56,396 Speaker 1: you know, it really works if I if I'm still 573 00:26:56,436 --> 00:26:58,716 Speaker 1: and I sit in that stillness and I allow that space, 574 00:26:58,756 --> 00:27:01,716 Speaker 1: it always works. But man, my body fights to do it, 575 00:27:01,836 --> 00:27:03,636 Speaker 1: Like it is just not a default. It is not 576 00:27:03,716 --> 00:27:05,236 Speaker 1: a default for me. And I know the more I do, 577 00:27:05,276 --> 00:27:07,316 Speaker 1: I get better at it. But jumping into it it's 578 00:27:07,396 --> 00:27:10,556 Speaker 1: really tough for me, really tough. Yeah, I think you're 579 00:27:10,596 --> 00:27:13,436 Speaker 1: not alone. My colleague Dan Harris, who talks about this 580 00:27:13,476 --> 00:27:16,436 Speaker 1: stuff talks about. The meditation is kind of grabbing a 581 00:27:16,636 --> 00:27:18,956 Speaker 1: goldfish in your hands and trying to keep it still 582 00:27:18,996 --> 00:27:20,916 Speaker 1: while you're like holding it out of the water. That's 583 00:27:20,956 --> 00:27:22,596 Speaker 1: what we do with our minds. God, I wish I 584 00:27:22,596 --> 00:27:24,996 Speaker 1: could like be in your cool circles you guys talk 585 00:27:25,036 --> 00:27:26,716 Speaker 1: about this stuff. I bet if you want to talk 586 00:27:26,716 --> 00:27:30,076 Speaker 1: to Dan Harris you can be on his podcast. But 587 00:27:30,316 --> 00:27:31,756 Speaker 1: one of the things we want to do, and one 588 00:27:31,796 --> 00:27:33,956 Speaker 1: of the reasons I love talking to you today is 589 00:27:33,996 --> 00:27:36,636 Speaker 1: that despite the fact that this is so hard for you, 590 00:27:36,636 --> 00:27:39,196 Speaker 1: you've also come up with this toolkit you can use 591 00:27:39,276 --> 00:27:41,876 Speaker 1: whenever the stuff comes up. And they're so evidence based 592 00:27:41,916 --> 00:27:44,196 Speaker 1: and so straight out of CBT, and you know, such 593 00:27:44,196 --> 00:27:45,876 Speaker 1: a great way of talking about how they work for you. 594 00:27:45,916 --> 00:27:47,636 Speaker 1: So I kind of wanted you to walk through some 595 00:27:47,716 --> 00:27:49,876 Speaker 1: of these. You know. One of these techniques that you've 596 00:27:49,876 --> 00:27:53,036 Speaker 1: talked about is the not now technically. Yeah, so explain 597 00:27:53,076 --> 00:27:54,836 Speaker 1: what this is and how you might a situation in 598 00:27:54,916 --> 00:27:57,676 Speaker 1: which you might use it. Yeah. I feel like I 599 00:27:57,796 --> 00:28:00,196 Speaker 1: use this a lot. It is very easy for me 600 00:28:00,276 --> 00:28:02,636 Speaker 1: to live in the what if. My daughter just started driving, 601 00:28:02,756 --> 00:28:05,636 Speaker 1: so the what if kicks in big time. There's a 602 00:28:05,716 --> 00:28:07,476 Speaker 1: job that I might be getting in the spring that 603 00:28:07,836 --> 00:28:10,596 Speaker 1: there's a lot of uncertainty to the location, so there's 604 00:28:10,596 --> 00:28:13,076 Speaker 1: a what if there. Again, this is the first time 605 00:28:13,076 --> 00:28:15,436 Speaker 1: I've thought about this, but I really think these voices 606 00:28:15,436 --> 00:28:18,316 Speaker 1: are coming from a place of protection. You know, Hey, 607 00:28:18,356 --> 00:28:20,556 Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you every scenario you can think about 608 00:28:20,556 --> 00:28:23,596 Speaker 1: so that you can prep for whatever emergency situation happens. 609 00:28:23,796 --> 00:28:26,516 Speaker 1: I think it's motivated really by a place to help 610 00:28:26,756 --> 00:28:29,196 Speaker 1: and I need to have compassion. Like I hear you, 611 00:28:29,316 --> 00:28:32,236 Speaker 1: I hear that what if? Not now? Right now, I'm 612 00:28:32,236 --> 00:28:34,876 Speaker 1: having a great talk. This is where I'm now. She 613 00:28:34,956 --> 00:28:38,676 Speaker 1: has a better zoom background than I do. It's like, 614 00:28:39,476 --> 00:28:43,156 Speaker 1: it's just like that is where I am now, and 615 00:28:43,156 --> 00:28:45,076 Speaker 1: and I and during that moment, let me just touch 616 00:28:45,156 --> 00:28:48,316 Speaker 1: the table, let me smell the smell. Oh. Somebody said, 617 00:28:48,556 --> 00:28:51,356 Speaker 1: oh gosh. They use something like five four three two one, 618 00:28:51,356 --> 00:28:53,236 Speaker 1: where it was like start, have you heard this? It's 619 00:28:53,236 --> 00:28:55,716 Speaker 1: like you seeing what five things? Are you seeing? Four things? 620 00:28:55,716 --> 00:28:57,596 Speaker 1: Are you? And you? I don't remember how it went down, 621 00:28:57,596 --> 00:29:00,156 Speaker 1: but it was such a great tool. Yeah. So this 622 00:29:00,196 --> 00:29:03,756 Speaker 1: is one that's often called the five senses technique, where 623 00:29:03,756 --> 00:29:06,356 Speaker 1: you just force yourself like what are five things you see. 624 00:29:06,396 --> 00:29:08,636 Speaker 1: What are four things you hear? What are three things 625 00:29:09,316 --> 00:29:12,116 Speaker 1: you smell? What are two things you taste? One thing 626 00:29:12,116 --> 00:29:14,196 Speaker 1: you touch? And when you get down to like taste, 627 00:29:14,196 --> 00:29:18,156 Speaker 1: you're kind of like, I guess when, well, maybe that's 628 00:29:18,156 --> 00:29:21,396 Speaker 1: the one, that might be the one yet. But the 629 00:29:21,476 --> 00:29:24,436 Speaker 1: key is that you can't be thinking about the what 630 00:29:24,516 --> 00:29:26,636 Speaker 1: if at that point, because you're just kind of scanning 631 00:29:26,676 --> 00:29:29,676 Speaker 1: for like, well, I guess I smell you know, my hate, 632 00:29:29,956 --> 00:29:31,876 Speaker 1: I don't know, you know it's yeah, yeah. And so 633 00:29:31,916 --> 00:29:35,036 Speaker 1: it's a powerful technique to just ground you in the moment. 634 00:29:35,356 --> 00:29:38,316 Speaker 1: That's the big thing. It's grounding. And I recently got 635 00:29:38,356 --> 00:29:42,876 Speaker 1: into rope bowl making. Wait wait, wait, what is rope 636 00:29:42,916 --> 00:29:45,796 Speaker 1: ball making? It's a rope I make these rope bowls 637 00:29:45,956 --> 00:29:48,076 Speaker 1: and they this friend of mine, Sean, I gave me 638 00:29:48,116 --> 00:29:51,436 Speaker 1: a rope bowl after I wrapped this last season of 639 00:29:51,436 --> 00:29:53,996 Speaker 1: the first season of Mysterious been anxiety. And I've always 640 00:29:53,996 --> 00:29:55,476 Speaker 1: wanted to paint. I've always wanted to do this kind 641 00:29:55,516 --> 00:29:57,956 Speaker 1: of but I'm not a painter. And you make these 642 00:29:58,036 --> 00:30:00,036 Speaker 1: rope balls on the sewing machine like pottery, and then 643 00:30:00,076 --> 00:30:01,916 Speaker 1: you paint the rope and it's just and I give 644 00:30:01,956 --> 00:30:03,676 Speaker 1: them as gifts and I just can't get enough of it. 645 00:30:03,756 --> 00:30:06,596 Speaker 1: But it's this, it's a focused practice for me because 646 00:30:06,876 --> 00:30:10,556 Speaker 1: I'm watching this rope going through the sewing machine, I'm 647 00:30:10,636 --> 00:30:15,036 Speaker 1: painting this rope, I'm listening to something and and it's 648 00:30:15,156 --> 00:30:18,756 Speaker 1: really it's a tool I need because maybe for me 649 00:30:18,836 --> 00:30:21,196 Speaker 1: at this point in my life, I'm getting better at meditation, 650 00:30:21,716 --> 00:30:24,116 Speaker 1: but doing a rope boll is my form of meditation. 651 00:30:24,236 --> 00:30:26,516 Speaker 1: Right now. I'm not sitting in a room quiet with 652 00:30:26,676 --> 00:30:29,716 Speaker 1: my legs frost, but I'm doing something that's a little 653 00:30:29,716 --> 00:30:33,356 Speaker 1: more focused. So that definitely that's a tool that really 654 00:30:33,356 --> 00:30:35,236 Speaker 1: has helped it. But the way to your question is 655 00:30:35,476 --> 00:30:38,676 Speaker 1: I find myself just saying not now a lot, not now, 656 00:30:38,836 --> 00:30:40,796 Speaker 1: And many times I don't want to be in the now. 657 00:30:40,796 --> 00:30:43,796 Speaker 1: Many times I don't want to be in that space. 658 00:30:43,916 --> 00:30:48,236 Speaker 1: But I not force myself, but I try to ease 659 00:30:48,276 --> 00:30:50,036 Speaker 1: into it a little more and just remember. I think 660 00:30:50,116 --> 00:30:52,556 Speaker 1: one of the things I love about this mantra of 661 00:30:52,596 --> 00:30:55,436 Speaker 1: not now is you force yourself to remember that you 662 00:30:55,436 --> 00:30:58,436 Speaker 1: have a choice, right that you know it's not easy, 663 00:30:58,556 --> 00:31:00,476 Speaker 1: but you can kind of shift back to the now, 664 00:31:00,596 --> 00:31:02,556 Speaker 1: right that there's a sort of choice to our thoughts. 665 00:31:02,556 --> 00:31:05,156 Speaker 1: And I think that is such a powerful realization. Man 666 00:31:05,276 --> 00:31:08,476 Speaker 1: comes from therapy, it comes from CBT, but it's just 667 00:31:08,516 --> 00:31:11,516 Speaker 1: powerful to realize like, Okay, thank you thought, but I'm 668 00:31:11,556 --> 00:31:13,556 Speaker 1: not going to listen to you. We'll come back later, 669 00:31:13,836 --> 00:31:16,516 Speaker 1: Like you have a choice whether it feels like it 670 00:31:16,596 --> 00:31:18,636 Speaker 1: or not. Do you know what's crazy though, is I 671 00:31:18,636 --> 00:31:20,396 Speaker 1: don't know if you can if you relate to this. 672 00:31:20,436 --> 00:31:22,876 Speaker 1: But when I do say not now, if I'm living 673 00:31:22,876 --> 00:31:24,476 Speaker 1: in kind of a fearful what of space and I 674 00:31:24,476 --> 00:31:28,076 Speaker 1: say not now, my body does not want to be 675 00:31:28,236 --> 00:31:31,316 Speaker 1: more in a comfortable space. My body wants to be 676 00:31:31,356 --> 00:31:34,036 Speaker 1: more in the fearful space. And that is something really 677 00:31:34,076 --> 00:31:36,916 Speaker 1: interesting to analyze, like why do I why is my 678 00:31:37,036 --> 00:31:39,396 Speaker 1: default to go to this fearful space for creating this 679 00:31:39,396 --> 00:31:42,276 Speaker 1: emergent situation which is clearly a lot of anxiety and 680 00:31:42,356 --> 00:31:44,356 Speaker 1: I don't want to be in the silence space. I 681 00:31:44,396 --> 00:31:46,916 Speaker 1: am now around my family and you're like, what is 682 00:31:46,956 --> 00:31:49,756 Speaker 1: that about? You know, that's wild to me. This is 683 00:31:49,756 --> 00:31:52,476 Speaker 1: a problem. I mean, you know, I wasn't consulted on 684 00:31:52,476 --> 00:31:55,436 Speaker 1: the design features of our bodies and our brains. But 685 00:31:55,476 --> 00:31:58,476 Speaker 1: one of the things that that has good features but 686 00:31:58,596 --> 00:32:01,236 Speaker 1: in this case is not very good, is it. Our 687 00:32:01,276 --> 00:32:03,716 Speaker 1: thoughts are connected to our bodies. Race. You could be 688 00:32:03,796 --> 00:32:06,556 Speaker 1: not now, not now, not now, but your fight or 689 00:32:06,556 --> 00:32:09,756 Speaker 1: flight systems activated. You know, you have like you know, 690 00:32:09,836 --> 00:32:12,276 Speaker 1: court us, all the stress hormone rushing through your body. 691 00:32:12,756 --> 00:32:14,236 Speaker 1: You know, you might be like not now, but your 692 00:32:14,276 --> 00:32:18,396 Speaker 1: body's like no, like fear, like like the future, like what. 693 00:32:18,956 --> 00:32:22,196 Speaker 1: But the good news is that your thoughts, there's lots 694 00:32:22,196 --> 00:32:26,076 Speaker 1: of evidence that your thoughts actually can hack your body. Right, 695 00:32:26,116 --> 00:32:28,076 Speaker 1: So if you just start saying no, not now, oh, 696 00:32:28,196 --> 00:32:30,356 Speaker 1: let me talk to the guy at the curtain instead, 697 00:32:30,436 --> 00:32:33,356 Speaker 1: I'm just going to pretend like things are fine. Then 698 00:32:33,436 --> 00:32:35,996 Speaker 1: your your body reacts to because your body's like, oh, 699 00:32:36,036 --> 00:32:37,916 Speaker 1: he's talking to the guy at the curtain. I guess 700 00:32:37,996 --> 00:32:40,596 Speaker 1: there's not an emergency, like you know, shut everything down, 701 00:32:40,756 --> 00:32:44,196 Speaker 1: like shut it down. So it's harder because your body 702 00:32:44,276 --> 00:32:46,716 Speaker 1: is connected to your thoughts. But you can also use 703 00:32:46,756 --> 00:32:48,956 Speaker 1: your thoughts to hack your body too, which is pretty cool. 704 00:32:49,036 --> 00:32:50,956 Speaker 1: That is cool, And I think the rope bowls is 705 00:32:51,196 --> 00:32:54,036 Speaker 1: good for that to me too, because it's doing something 706 00:32:54,076 --> 00:32:59,796 Speaker 1: it really does divert the attention from me big time. Yeah, 707 00:33:00,196 --> 00:33:03,476 Speaker 1: chatting with Tony was an absolute blast. I enjoyed every 708 00:33:03,476 --> 00:33:06,916 Speaker 1: single minute. We even ran over our scheduled interview slot 709 00:33:06,956 --> 00:33:08,836 Speaker 1: because we were having so much fun that we lost 710 00:33:08,876 --> 00:33:13,476 Speaker 1: chack of time, which kind of felt nice. This was fantastic, 711 00:33:14,436 --> 00:33:17,716 Speaker 1: Thank you for doing this. Leaning into the present moment 712 00:33:17,756 --> 00:33:21,596 Speaker 1: like that isn't always easy, and it's especially hard in January, 713 00:33:21,676 --> 00:33:23,316 Speaker 1: when we feel like we should be planning out the 714 00:33:23,476 --> 00:33:26,396 Speaker 1: entire year ahead in the hope that that next big 715 00:33:26,436 --> 00:33:29,316 Speaker 1: thing on the far horizon will finally make us happier. 716 00:33:30,676 --> 00:33:33,356 Speaker 1: Tony learned the hard way that big things don't always 717 00:33:33,356 --> 00:33:35,596 Speaker 1: feel as good as we imagine, and that they don't 718 00:33:35,636 --> 00:33:39,396 Speaker 1: fundamentally change who we are as people. So this new year, 719 00:33:39,556 --> 00:33:41,556 Speaker 1: why don't we commit to being a bit more like 720 00:33:41,636 --> 00:33:45,716 Speaker 1: Tony's children's book Creation Archibald, the brave little chicken who 721 00:33:45,716 --> 00:33:48,916 Speaker 1: decided to stop being so obsessed with big ticket changes. 722 00:33:49,356 --> 00:33:52,396 Speaker 1: We can stop worrying about the new jobs, new romances, 723 00:33:52,436 --> 00:33:56,796 Speaker 1: and new bodies and instead just be. Next time on 724 00:33:56,876 --> 00:33:59,036 Speaker 1: the happiness Lab, we'll look at them many loud and 725 00:33:59,076 --> 00:34:01,596 Speaker 1: competing voices telling us to change what we eat in 726 00:34:01,636 --> 00:34:04,556 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three, we'll see that we may want to 727 00:34:04,556 --> 00:34:06,476 Speaker 1: shut them up a bit so we can listen to 728 00:34:06,516 --> 00:34:09,076 Speaker 1: a more compassionate voice that's telling us how to eat 729 00:34:09,316 --> 00:34:20,036 Speaker 1: for ourselves. The Happiness Lab is co written by Ryan 730 00:34:20,116 --> 00:34:23,316 Speaker 1: Dilley and is produced by Ryan Dilley and Courtney Guerino. 731 00:34:23,836 --> 00:34:26,516 Speaker 1: The show was mastered by Evan Viola and our original 732 00:34:26,596 --> 00:34:30,516 Speaker 1: music was composed by Zachary Silver. Special thanks to Shanebeard, 733 00:34:30,676 --> 00:34:35,036 Speaker 1: Greta Kone, Nicole Morano, Morgan Ratner, Maggie Taylor, Jacob Weisberg, 734 00:34:35,156 --> 00:34:38,036 Speaker 1: my agent, Ben Davis, and the rest of the Pushkin team. 735 00:34:38,076 --> 00:34:40,556 Speaker 1: The Happiness Lab is brought to you by Pushkin Industries 736 00:34:40,636 --> 00:34:42,476 Speaker 1: and by me, doctor Laurie Sanchez.