WEBVTT - 127: Digital Digital Letdown 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.600 It's eleven fifty three PM on a big nugget body 0:00:03.680 --> 0:00:16.280 pillow and you're listening tonight Call. Hello, and welcome to Nightcall, 0:00:16.520 --> 0:00:19.520 the College show for Artistrophe in Reality. My name is 0:00:19.520 --> 0:00:21.560 Emily Aschida, and with me on the other line as 0:00:21.600 --> 0:00:25.079 always are Mollylia Bern and Tess Lynch. And we're going 0:00:25.120 --> 0:00:27.360 to be joined later in the show by Justin Charity 0:00:27.400 --> 0:00:31.200 from the ringer to talk about anime Travis Scott pe 0:00:31.240 --> 0:00:34.760 and on Twitter but uh not actively participating in it, 0:00:34.960 --> 0:00:37.440 and uh yeah, a lot of a lot of other stuff. 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:40.080 It's a it's a wide ranging conversation, so stay tuned 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:42.159 for that. We have a night call that we want 0:00:42.159 --> 0:00:45.600 to take right now from the happiest place on Earth? 0:00:45.720 --> 0:00:50.880 Shall we roll it? Hey, nightcall, long time, first time. UM. 0:00:50.920 --> 0:00:55.240 I'm just calling to tell you the story of how 0:00:55.520 --> 0:01:00.600 I went to Disney World recently. UM. I live in 0:01:00.640 --> 0:01:03.520 Florida and I was visiting some family up in the 0:01:04.000 --> 0:01:09.759 Orlando area and we weren't while I wasn't planning on 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:14.440 going to the parts at all. I've been pretty as 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:17.080 far as airing on the side of caution goes, I've 0:01:17.120 --> 0:01:22.880 been pretty extreme in terms of not leaving my house 0:01:23.000 --> 0:01:27.160 for the most part rationally, so I think I'm not 0:01:27.319 --> 0:01:30.800 like a gooraphobic or anything like that. But so I 0:01:30.920 --> 0:01:35.120 get there to visit family, and they basically are like, 0:01:35.319 --> 0:01:39.520 so there's this Florida resident discount right now, tickets are 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:43.480 really cheap. We won't bring this up to the kids 0:01:43.560 --> 0:01:48.440 as a possibility until we talk to you. Will all go, 0:01:49.000 --> 0:01:52.320 but only if you want to go. And I don't know, 0:01:52.600 --> 0:01:57.040 in like some sort of lapse of judgment or feeling 0:01:57.200 --> 0:02:01.280 like outnumbered, or you know that feeling of like, well, 0:02:01.360 --> 0:02:03.920 all of these people think it's a good idea, I 0:02:03.960 --> 0:02:08.560 guess maybe I'm being you know, extreme or something. So 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:13.440 I went and had a pretty good time. All of 0:02:13.480 --> 0:02:18.919 the lines are six ft apart, there's like hand sanitizers everywhere, 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:25.680 there's like um plexiglass in between wine formations, so you're 0:02:25.720 --> 0:02:28.400 not like breathing on everybody as you're waiting in line, 0:02:28.480 --> 0:02:31.320 and most of the lines have been moved outside, but 0:02:31.400 --> 0:02:33.600 none of that really changes the fact that like a 0:02:33.680 --> 0:02:38.200 lot of rides are inside and you're just fucking touching 0:02:38.240 --> 0:02:42.079 a lot of stuff, And there's like so many different 0:02:42.320 --> 0:02:47.160 vectors of transmission at a park that like even at 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:51.480 percent capacity, which I think to holding it to it's 0:02:51.480 --> 0:02:54.800 still like a lot of people in and out. So 0:02:55.120 --> 0:02:58.119 I like, I went to the parks over the weekend, 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:00.760 and then last night, I like kind of woke up 0:03:00.760 --> 0:03:03.160 in the middle of the night having a hard time sleeping, 0:03:03.280 --> 0:03:05.960 and then just sort of in that like middle of 0:03:06.000 --> 0:03:09.960 the night fashion started thinking about like all of the 0:03:10.040 --> 0:03:13.120 different ways we could have gotten COVID by going to 0:03:13.200 --> 0:03:16.680 the parks. You how, you know, temperature checks only cover 0:03:17.360 --> 0:03:21.680 people who are like symptomatically sick and not those who 0:03:21.680 --> 0:03:26.600 are asymptomatic, and you know how many things we had 0:03:26.680 --> 0:03:30.040 to have touched. Anyway, bottom line is, I woke up 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:32.360 in the middle of the night last night and had 0:03:32.400 --> 0:03:37.120 a full blown anxiety attack, which is actually the first 0:03:37.160 --> 0:03:44.080 one I've experienced throughout quarantine. Um probably because up until 0:03:44.160 --> 0:03:48.600 this point I've been extremely cautious, and then I felt 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:52.360 I was feeling like I threw all of that away 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:55.520 by going to the parks this weekend. You know, wanted 0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:59.640 to give you an insider report of Disney World, which 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:03.120 is like a fucking surreal right now, and just like 0:04:03.480 --> 0:04:07.560 wild to be there while everybody's like wearing masks, you know, 0:04:07.840 --> 0:04:12.600 it just it feels super weird, but also to give 0:04:12.720 --> 0:04:15.320 all of your listeners a warning that you know, if 0:04:15.360 --> 0:04:19.839 you're considering doing something, like if you're maybe feeling like, well, 0:04:19.880 --> 0:04:23.680 maybe everything is like safer out there, then I think 0:04:23.720 --> 0:04:26.560 it is or you're kind of double guessing the way 0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:30.080 that you've approached quarantining and being safe up until now, 0:04:30.120 --> 0:04:33.039 and like feeling like you're being left out of stuff 0:04:33.080 --> 0:04:36.400 because like things are reopening and people are going out 0:04:36.440 --> 0:04:40.240 to eat and ship. I was feeling fine while I 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:43.600 was there, and then it all just hit me when 0:04:43.600 --> 0:04:48.240 I got home and realized it was a terrible decision. 0:04:48.600 --> 0:04:54.480 So I would recommend not going overall, and I would 0:04:54.520 --> 0:04:59.960 also especially recommend not going if you're prone to anxiety 0:05:00.080 --> 0:05:03.599 is because this was the worst one that I've had 0:05:04.000 --> 0:05:09.000 in a long time. Thanks night call, have a good one. 0:05:09.400 --> 0:05:11.560 Thank you so much for that call. That that is 0:05:11.600 --> 0:05:16.480 definitely good advice to heed um to be more cautious. 0:05:16.560 --> 0:05:18.360 Then it seems like when you look at the rest 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:21.279 of the world and you see how people are starting 0:05:21.320 --> 0:05:24.080 to be a little bit less careful, I think it 0:05:24.160 --> 0:05:28.200 can make you feel as though you're being overly vigilant 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:31.360 by continuing to quarantine I guess it depends on how 0:05:31.480 --> 0:05:34.160 on where you're located, but um, I was curious if 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:37.839 you guys Molly and Emily have felt like looking at, 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:40.479 you know, how other people are operating at this stage 0:05:40.480 --> 0:05:43.560 of quarantine, that you feel like there's a disconnect there. 0:05:43.800 --> 0:05:48.160 I think that people have gotten really cooped up because 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:51.720 we've been in quarantine for so long, and especially with 0:05:51.920 --> 0:05:56.839 the fires in California and Oregon, it has like doubled 0:05:56.839 --> 0:06:00.640 down on those feelings of claustrophobia and have in fever. 0:06:01.240 --> 0:06:04.000 So I definitely over the past like a few days, 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:06.320 was just like had this urge to get out in 0:06:06.360 --> 0:06:10.479 the world, just desperately because I could not, and I 0:06:10.480 --> 0:06:12.920 think a lot of people because they've been holding back, 0:06:13.640 --> 0:06:16.599 then when they decided to do something, it is this 0:06:16.680 --> 0:06:20.599 sort of like liberating moment followed immediately by intense guilt 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:24.839 and shame. My mom has some friends who it's like 0:06:24.880 --> 0:06:28.240 they're very careful, but especially because they're older, and then 0:06:28.360 --> 0:06:31.400 it's like they'll go to Burger King to get some 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:34.279 food and then just like have an anxiety attack of 0:06:34.360 --> 0:06:37.159 like what if I just fucked myself over by going 0:06:37.200 --> 0:06:39.680 to Burger King. What if I now get COVID from this, 0:06:39.800 --> 0:06:42.119 like it's not worth it. I'm kind of of two minds. 0:06:42.160 --> 0:06:46.480 I think that there is definitely stuff that I am 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:48.880 still there's no way I'm going to do it, and 0:06:49.000 --> 0:06:51.840 I kind of looked down upon people who do it. 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:53.880 You know. I'm I'm in a college town right now, 0:06:53.920 --> 0:06:56.960 and like college bar culture is just full steam ahead here. 0:06:57.480 --> 0:07:01.440 And that is you know, obviously college age people aren't 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:04.159 necessarily going to be symptomatic or really you know, have 0:07:04.279 --> 0:07:08.040 an have an extreme case of COVID if they if 0:07:08.040 --> 0:07:10.120 they transmit it or if they get it, but you know, 0:07:10.200 --> 0:07:13.400 it affects the rest of the community eventually in some way, 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:15.920 and that you know, it's hard for me to to 0:07:16.120 --> 0:07:18.040 be like, oh, you know, they just you know, we 0:07:18.080 --> 0:07:20.320 have to we have to continue with life. I will 0:07:20.360 --> 0:07:23.160 say though, that like I do think that kind of 0:07:23.160 --> 0:07:26.239 that that shame and the guilt feeling about doing something 0:07:26.280 --> 0:07:28.960 like going to a McDonald's or a burger king or whatever. 0:07:29.520 --> 0:07:32.480 I don't feel at all anymore. I have to say, 0:07:32.840 --> 0:07:35.160 like going to a burger king or something. It's like 0:07:35.440 --> 0:07:37.600 that's not going to be I don't think how you 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:41.640 contract COVID unless you are immune compromised in which case, 0:07:41.680 --> 0:07:43.760 you know, like like the collar said, all of this 0:07:43.840 --> 0:07:48.360 stuff applies doubly. But there was just this article that 0:07:48.480 --> 0:07:51.400 came out, um was on Elemental, which is like a 0:07:51.440 --> 0:07:54.320 medium blog, like a science and health blog. It was 0:07:54.400 --> 0:07:56.360 chrending all day yesterday, but it was sort of this 0:07:56.440 --> 0:08:01.720 most recent collection of findings about COVID and like, you know, 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:05.520 how much they differ from what was being reported early 0:08:05.600 --> 0:08:09.160 on about how you know, how it would spread, how 0:08:09.160 --> 0:08:12.200 you need to protect yourself and all of that. And 0:08:12.600 --> 0:08:15.560 the big thing from it is that like the surfaces thing, 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:18.000 which is a lot of what the caller was calling about, 0:08:18.080 --> 0:08:21.520 is not really necessarily the biggest risk factor. And the 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:24.480 way that they were conducting the studies early on is 0:08:24.480 --> 0:08:28.120 not really an accurate representation of how like the pathogens 0:08:28.200 --> 0:08:30.520 would be spread, the concentration they would be spread in. 0:08:30.960 --> 0:08:34.319 Just like being able to really concentrate on not like 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:36.640 on the droplets thing on, just like not being in 0:08:36.679 --> 0:08:40.320 close quarters with people who you're not an applied with. 0:08:41.000 --> 0:08:44.080 That's all pretty controllable. I feel like, I don't know, 0:08:44.120 --> 0:08:45.800 maybe it's because I've been out in the world for 0:08:45.840 --> 0:08:48.640 a while now that I don't feel I feel like, 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:50.840 I know exactly like what I can and can't do, 0:08:51.000 --> 0:08:54.720 and so like, yeah, like going to a get pick 0:08:54.800 --> 0:08:57.760 up from somewhere, get fast food or something like that 0:08:57.920 --> 0:09:00.080 is not necessarily the stuff that I'm feeling guilt to 0:09:00.120 --> 0:09:03.400 your anxiety written about. I don't know, Okay, but what 0:09:03.520 --> 0:09:06.920 about going to Disney World, Well, that is your own. 0:09:07.320 --> 0:09:09.760 I have to say though that, UM, I was so 0:09:09.880 --> 0:09:13.920 judgmental at the Honestly, the first like three months of quarantine, 0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:19.320 I had very strong reactions about how I felt other 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:23.120 people were operating. And now that it's been this long, 0:09:23.440 --> 0:09:26.240 I'm trying to not do that. And I think, like 0:09:26.400 --> 0:09:29.600 the thing with Disney, I don't feel as though you 0:09:29.640 --> 0:09:32.400 should feel guilt or shame about doing that because you 0:09:32.520 --> 0:09:36.680 obviously made a call that you later realized was the 0:09:36.679 --> 0:09:39.679 wrong call, and it's not the same. The only people 0:09:39.720 --> 0:09:42.080 I really judge or think should feel shame are the 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:47.040 people who are like anti maskers, who are going around 0:09:47.360 --> 0:09:51.600 without a mask to basically be dicks and make a point. Yeah, 0:09:51.640 --> 0:09:54.280 I think that it's worth for giving yourself for going 0:09:54.320 --> 0:09:59.400 to Disney. I I guess maybe two months ago, UM 0:09:59.520 --> 0:10:04.080 or maybe three went there was a socially distanced UM 0:10:04.440 --> 0:10:07.120 like six of us were gonna have a glass of 0:10:07.160 --> 0:10:10.560 wine for someone's birthday, and I went up the street. 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:12.840 It was just my neighbors, and I wore a mask 0:10:13.000 --> 0:10:15.440 and then I sat down and we were all far apart. 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:18.480 We were outside, and because we were eating and drinking, 0:10:18.520 --> 0:10:21.160 I took down my mask. Everyone took down their masks, 0:10:21.840 --> 0:10:24.160 and it felt like I was like, I'm not super 0:10:24.200 --> 0:10:26.439 comfortable with this, but I don't want to be wearing 0:10:26.440 --> 0:10:29.920 a mask and make them feel bad. And then on 0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:32.600 the walk home, my heart just started raising and I 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:34.720 was like, I'm not comfortable with the fact that I 0:10:34.760 --> 0:10:36.960 did that. And and not to judge anyone who is 0:10:37.000 --> 0:10:39.080 who's going out to eat or whatever, I do think 0:10:39.120 --> 0:10:42.240 that that can put um weight stuff in a very 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:45.000 uncomfortable position with which we've talked about before. And I 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:47.040 think it might be like I might consider it a 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:49.920 little selfish, but I'm not going to really judge people 0:10:49.960 --> 0:10:52.800 for doing it. But there's this sense of like you, 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:56.720 like the caller said, where you don't want to compromise 0:10:56.800 --> 0:11:00.120 someone else's decision to like bring their kid to Disney, 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:03.120 and it's they're taking these safety protocols or whatever. You 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:05.720 don't want to be the one who brings everyone down, 0:11:05.760 --> 0:11:08.480 and it's only after you do it that you're like, 0:11:08.520 --> 0:11:10.920 oh shit, I made a mistake. And I think as 0:11:10.920 --> 0:11:13.120 long as you realize, like, as long as you check 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:15.400 yourself and you think, like, you know, I won't do 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:18.160 that again, I'm gonna be more careful, then there's no 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:21.160 sense in really beating yourself up too much over it, 0:11:21.280 --> 0:11:25.440 you know, I mean, Captain bring down over here. But um, 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:29.640 I'll judge people for doing stuff that is overly risky 0:11:29.720 --> 0:11:33.000 and frivolous. I think, but if it's a mistake, like 0:11:33.040 --> 0:11:35.200 if they really if they're like, oh, ship, that I 0:11:35.200 --> 0:11:37.200 shouldn't have done it, you know. I mean, I think 0:11:37.240 --> 0:11:39.559 going to disney World because you get pressured into it 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:44.880 and then feeling stressed out afterwards, is you know, completely understandable. 0:11:45.120 --> 0:11:46.960 I don't think this person was, like, but going to 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:50.479 Disneyland takes a lot more steps and planning and consideration 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:52.480 than having a glass of wine with your friends in 0:11:52.480 --> 0:11:55.800 a distance hanging in somebody's backyard. Like, yeah, that's true. 0:11:55.840 --> 0:11:58.400 But if you if everyone's saying, well, here's what they're doing, 0:11:58.400 --> 0:12:03.000 it's capacity almost everything is outside. When she walked through 0:12:03.240 --> 0:12:06.280 the things that they were doing to keep people safe. 0:12:06.320 --> 0:12:09.199 I could see there being this like sliding doors thing 0:12:09.200 --> 0:12:10.840 where you're like, I know I should say no, but 0:12:11.000 --> 0:12:14.120 I'm just I'm trying to like make a reasonable leap 0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:16.920 that that's enough, that that's okay. And I think that 0:12:16.960 --> 0:12:20.280 those weird You can make a judgment that rationally you 0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:22.480 wouldn't think you would make when you're just like, well, 0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:24.520 they're doing this, and they're doing this, and they're doing 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:28.000 this like I don't know, you know, nobody knows anything 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:30.240 is the problem. And I do think you can judge 0:12:30.280 --> 0:12:33.440 people for I mean, clearly, like people are still having 0:12:33.480 --> 0:12:36.440 gender reveal parties and setting everything on fire. I surely 0:12:36.520 --> 0:12:40.240 judge those people. I judge people who are having big parties. 0:12:40.280 --> 0:12:43.840 I judge people who are doing things deliberately. But I 0:12:43.840 --> 0:12:46.240 I feel like everyone's had a moment where they just 0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:49.959 made the wrong call. You know that's true for sure. 0:12:50.200 --> 0:12:52.439 I mean it's just again, it's just all a matter 0:12:52.559 --> 0:12:56.120 of what qualifies as dangerous or risky to you. And 0:12:56.200 --> 0:12:58.240 I think that that is and that has been the 0:12:58.240 --> 0:13:02.080 theme throughout the last half year. Is different at everybody 0:13:02.120 --> 0:13:06.560 at different moments, and what feels to you is completely 0:13:06.559 --> 0:13:10.400 reasonable and safe and rational to somebody else, maybe because 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:12.520 they haven't read the same articles as you or whatever, 0:13:12.840 --> 0:13:16.120 like will seem like a major risk and super inconsiderate 0:13:16.200 --> 0:13:19.040 and a horrible thing to do. And we're all living 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:22.480 in different, like at different stages of this, like understanding 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:25.319 and reality of like what this pandemic is, and a 0:13:25.400 --> 0:13:27.760 lot of us are I don't know, I feel like 0:13:27.800 --> 0:13:30.880 I'm I'm probably living in a place right now with 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:32.400 it that a lot of people were living in with 0:13:32.440 --> 0:13:34.960 it a couple of months ago. I've kind of relaxed 0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:37.120 to a point that I feel comfortable with with it. 0:13:37.559 --> 0:13:39.920 Whereas like there were a lot of people who were, 0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:43.040 I don't know, hanging out with friends on their porch 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:45.120 or something, and I was like, oh God, you can't 0:13:45.160 --> 0:13:48.480 do that. But now I'm just like, whatever you like, 0:13:48.600 --> 0:13:50.679 I don't I don't feel like judgmental about it at all, 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:52.200 And I would do it if anybody would have me, 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:55.960 you know, I don't know. I don't judge people for 0:13:56.080 --> 0:13:58.480 hanging out on their porches or for hanging out with 0:13:58.559 --> 0:14:02.160 friends in a group, usually in a pod. I do 0:14:02.280 --> 0:14:07.520 think the normalization of eating at restaurants has been completely 0:14:07.679 --> 0:14:11.160 Uh just know, people who are eating a restaurant. That's 0:14:11.160 --> 0:14:13.120 the one thing where I'm like, no way, no way, 0:14:13.160 --> 0:14:15.760 are you kidding me? Like, I was walking the other 0:14:15.840 --> 0:14:19.480 day to get pick up, and I passed um, a 0:14:19.560 --> 0:14:23.120 restaurant that has been operating on Vermont in Los Cila's 0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:27.200 with plexiglass, you know, walls up between tables and stuff. 0:14:27.200 --> 0:14:29.520 And I saw people, I saw a couple that I 0:14:29.560 --> 0:14:33.240 know eating there, and I was like, man, it just 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.120 doesn't like fun. First and foremost, it doesn't look fun. 0:14:36.200 --> 0:14:39.840 It was like, really, like, aside from the actual risk 0:14:39.920 --> 0:14:43.760 involved the plexiglass thing, the entire esthetics of it, you know, 0:14:44.200 --> 0:14:46.920 the everybody wearing masks around it while you're trying to 0:14:46.920 --> 0:14:49.720 eat food, it's just not fun looking at all. It 0:14:49.800 --> 0:14:52.240 doesn't seem fun. I get stressed out by the fact 0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:55.360 that people have such like entitlement about being served by 0:14:55.360 --> 0:15:00.680 servers because that's what yeah, or to be out of 0:15:00.680 --> 0:15:02.080 the house, I guess. But you can be out of 0:15:02.360 --> 0:15:03.560 you could be out of the house, you could have 0:15:03.600 --> 0:15:06.760 a picnic. It's like the insistence on being served by 0:15:07.120 --> 0:15:09.640 service workers and the fact that that's who's really at 0:15:09.720 --> 0:15:11.920 risk are the service workers who have to deal with 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:16.440 hundreds of people every day. Again, I'm not necessarily putting 0:15:16.480 --> 0:15:19.040 the blame on individuals who are like who would like 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:21.360 to have a nice dinner out. I'm putting the blame 0:15:21.520 --> 0:15:26.360 on all the people who reopened early. Especially now in 0:15:26.520 --> 0:15:29.960 l A we have this al Fresco bullshit program where 0:15:29.960 --> 0:15:32.800 they put tables on the sidewalk that they're now running 0:15:32.800 --> 0:15:34.960 out of money for, where again I'm like, well, why 0:15:34.960 --> 0:15:37.320 didn't they just take that money and give it to 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:41.160 restaurants to shut down and pay their staff. I completely 0:15:41.160 --> 0:15:44.160 agree with that, and I and again, and I think 0:15:44.200 --> 0:15:47.600 it's a great distinction Molly to say that I don't 0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:51.640 understand why people want to eat at restaurants right now, um, 0:15:52.000 --> 0:15:56.160 but shaming them individually when they've been told that the 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:59.400 measures that are in place are relatively safe. Like, it's 0:15:59.440 --> 0:16:02.760 a weirding to want to have dinner out when you 0:16:02.800 --> 0:16:05.960 know that you're making a person who works there like 0:16:06.040 --> 0:16:09.280 face the risk of you, you know, contaminating them. But 0:16:09.720 --> 0:16:12.720 it's also hard to not say, well that that's not 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:16.000 a you know, that's not like a personal flaw on 0:16:16.040 --> 0:16:19.720 their part. Necessarily it's a weird call, but it's a flaw. 0:16:20.040 --> 0:16:22.640 It's a systemic flaw. I think It's also that thing 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:27.480 of the future being here and distributed unevenly where because 0:16:27.920 --> 0:16:32.160 coronavirus has been dealt with in a better way in 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:37.000 other places, and because of social media, it's like people 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:40.360 see that people in other countries are back to normal 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:43.400 more or less in certain ways, and they're like, well, 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:45.800 why can't I do that? You know? I think in 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:48.240 l A, some of the feelings I have about people 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:51.160 eating in restaurants in New York, I have to remind myself, like, well, 0:16:51.160 --> 0:16:55.360 they're down to like a one percent transmission rate versus 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:59.760 Los Angeles, which is not so it is different. Yeah. Yeah. 0:16:59.800 --> 0:17:01.760 This was like an early problem I think with the 0:17:01.800 --> 0:17:04.119 coverage of the disease and so much of it being 0:17:04.119 --> 0:17:06.439 focused on New York, probably because a lot of media 0:17:06.520 --> 0:17:08.280 is based in New York and this is an ongoing 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:11.520 thing we almost contend with is that, like the reality 0:17:11.560 --> 0:17:13.239 of COVID in New York was not what it was 0:17:13.280 --> 0:17:15.560 in the rest of the country at that time, and 0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:17.960 then I think that a lot of people like the 0:17:18.240 --> 0:17:20.560 measures that were being taken in certain places were like 0:17:21.119 --> 0:17:23.200 New York measures a lot of times, and now people 0:17:23.240 --> 0:17:25.200 are still in the New York reality of stuff when 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:27.360 like New York is not there anymore. And yeah, it's 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:29.600 like all everybody's kind of cycling through this stuff at 0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:31.919 different times, and it just makes it it's hard to 0:17:31.920 --> 0:17:34.199 know where you stand. And that this was also the 0:17:34.240 --> 0:17:38.399 most dystopian week because the air quality is so bad. 0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:42.840 It's like, you know, unbreathable essentially. And I just went 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:45.159 out for a drive because I was feeling so claustrophobic, 0:17:45.280 --> 0:17:49.280 and all of the outdoor patios were packed. I was 0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:55.560 just like, people are eating outside in you know, poisonous air. 0:17:55.960 --> 0:17:58.640 It was shocking. Well, let's take a break and when 0:17:58.680 --> 0:18:01.880 we come back, we will be briefly discussing the Netflix 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:14.680 documentary The Social Dilemma. Tess and I watched the Netflix 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:18.880 documentary The Social Dilemma, and we are going to fill 0:18:18.960 --> 0:18:21.760 Emily in on it a little bit. This documentary was 0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:24.840 going kind of viral for being about a lot of 0:18:24.880 --> 0:18:31.280 the issues with social media, um especially Facebook. And Tess, 0:18:31.280 --> 0:18:33.840 what do you think of The Social Dilemma? Well, let 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:37.439 me first say that everyone who was who had watched 0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:40.200 this movie that I know it was like, it's so good, 0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:43.320 it's so important, it's going to make you deactivate everything. 0:18:43.440 --> 0:18:47.080 Like I didn't read anything critical of it until after 0:18:47.560 --> 0:18:50.959 I tried to watch it, and then I I found 0:18:51.080 --> 0:18:53.880 that I had to go find other people who didn't 0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:58.520 like it because I hated this movie. I didn't watch 0:18:58.600 --> 0:19:01.760 the last ten minutes because I simply could not. It 0:19:01.800 --> 0:19:03.879 was not what I expected at all. We've talked a 0:19:03.880 --> 0:19:07.320 ton on this podcast about the dangers of social media, 0:19:07.359 --> 0:19:10.800 about the dangers of being addicted to your phone, how 0:19:10.840 --> 0:19:15.760 it's so dystopian, how you know certain social networks, especially 0:19:15.800 --> 0:19:19.320 are prone to reading grounds for conspiracy theories that can 0:19:19.320 --> 0:19:23.200 be very dangerous, interfering with elections, all this kind of stuff. 0:19:23.600 --> 0:19:29.000 And instead of a nuanced and intelligent view of, um, 0:19:29.040 --> 0:19:33.280 the dangers of that kind of thing, I found that 0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:36.840 this was like an after school special for people who 0:19:37.040 --> 0:19:40.080 might have thought like Facebook was good for them. You know, 0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:43.600 it was shocking to me that people like this. I 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:46.040 feel like the audience for this is people who are 0:19:46.520 --> 0:19:50.200 I guess less informed about how social media works then 0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:53.240 we are, because it did feel very one oh one 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:56.520 in terms of like, hey, you know, they changed the 0:19:56.560 --> 0:20:00.480 photos so that you'll come back more, and they change 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:04.000 the headerers because they want you to be refreshing. It's 0:20:04.119 --> 0:20:08.000 very addictive. Did you know it's crazy too, because so 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:12.160 they're The format of this documentary is different. UM, it's 0:20:12.200 --> 0:20:19.800 a lot of interviews. They interview a number of former UM, Facebook, Google, uh, 0:20:19.920 --> 0:20:23.520 all kinds of you know, venture capitalist people and designers 0:20:23.520 --> 0:20:26.439 and engineers who then many of whom then moved on 0:20:26.520 --> 0:20:29.400 to work at the center of humane technology. That people 0:20:29.440 --> 0:20:32.639 who basically worked at these companies and then felt like 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:36.439 they were complicit in some horrible unraveling of society and 0:20:36.480 --> 0:20:40.000 became kind of like whistleblowers. And those interviews are interesting 0:20:40.440 --> 0:20:43.680 and worth watching for sure. But then there's this whole 0:20:43.720 --> 0:20:47.000 other part of the documentary that we're dying to tell 0:20:47.040 --> 0:20:51.680 you about, Emily, because there it's wild. There there's a family. 0:20:52.560 --> 0:20:55.879 It's like a dramatization of how a family can be 0:20:55.920 --> 0:21:00.399 affected by social media over use, especially that children in 0:21:00.440 --> 0:21:04.560 the family. And um this is also this leads to 0:21:04.680 --> 0:21:08.760 scenes where three different Vincent car tizers with different hair 0:21:08.840 --> 0:21:14.240 dues are in like mission controlled hairlines, yes and different 0:21:14.320 --> 0:21:17.600 and like one's kind of the like more relatable Vincent 0:21:17.680 --> 0:21:20.840 car tizer and wants the like really polished Vincent car 0:21:20.840 --> 0:21:25.640 tizer and they're manipulating. UM. One of the actors from 0:21:25.680 --> 0:21:30.359 the family from these dramatizations as if like they're you know, 0:21:30.480 --> 0:21:32.520 they're like, we gotta get him to get log onto 0:21:32.560 --> 0:21:35.680 Facebook right now. How are we going to do that? Like, oh, well, 0:21:35.680 --> 0:21:38.080 we'll send him a notification that his ex girlfriend is 0:21:38.160 --> 0:21:41.960 dating someone else. And then it becomes this this really 0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:49.000 melodramatic kind of thing of him becoming like a withdrawn um, 0:21:49.040 --> 0:21:52.320 like he starts to look into joining fringe groups from 0:21:52.320 --> 0:21:56.600 this fake political party called like the Extreme Center or something. 0:21:57.359 --> 0:22:01.960 It's the wildest thing. I live in the Extreme Center totally. 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:04.879 It feels like a Black Mirror or something. But the 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:09.080 overall effect is more like refor madness, yes, like a 0:22:09.160 --> 0:22:14.120 refor madness about social media. It's like social media is bad. 0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:17.160 I mean that's always the knock on Black Mirror though, right, 0:22:17.280 --> 0:22:19.560 is that it's just like like, did you know the 0:22:19.600 --> 0:22:21.800 Internet is trying to kill you or something? And I 0:22:22.160 --> 0:22:25.159 think that there can be episodes of Black Mirror that 0:22:25.200 --> 0:22:27.400 are like that, But the best episodes of Black Mirror, 0:22:27.440 --> 0:22:30.520 and also just any conversation about this stuff in general, 0:22:30.960 --> 0:22:34.479 cannot stop at the idea that there is a mega 0:22:34.560 --> 0:22:39.080 corp that is trying to completely overtake your attention span. 0:22:39.440 --> 0:22:42.080 There has to be some sort of examination of how 0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:46.800 I think how individuals operate within this and like how 0:22:46.920 --> 0:22:49.560 it's it's kind of beyond the technology, Like some of 0:22:49.560 --> 0:22:52.560 it is like genuine social phenomenons that are like augmented 0:22:52.600 --> 0:22:55.480 by technology, and like that stuff is more interesting to 0:22:55.520 --> 0:22:58.600 me than you know, I mean obviously like Cambridge Analytica 0:22:58.640 --> 0:23:01.480