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Speaker 1: You are listening to Ruthie's Table four in partnership with Montclair.

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Speaker 2: Here at Ruthie's Table four, we have something exciting to

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Speaker 2: tell you. Our new substack has just launched. You will

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Speaker 2: find all kinds of extra material from the River Cafe,

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Speaker 2: including recipes, our latest news, and bonus content from the podcast.

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Speaker 2: If you enjoy listening to this series as much as

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Speaker 2: I enjoy talking with our guests, visit the River Cafe,

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Speaker 2: dot substack and subscribe. See you there. What I know

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Speaker 2: about Luca Guardonino is, of course the films he's made.

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Speaker 2: But what I know from Luca is how passionate he

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Speaker 2: is about food. Meetium over lunch just last week at

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Speaker 2: the River Cafe, we went straight into not what movies

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Speaker 2: he was making, but what food he was cooking. He

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Speaker 2: is Italian and he cares, friends tell me. In his

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Speaker 2: home in Piermonte, Luca has three kitchens, including one elaborately

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Speaker 2: equipped for pastries and a special room for keeping vinegar

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Speaker 2: and dried herbs from his garden. It's always full of people,

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Speaker 2: everyone gathering around the table and kitchen. He genuinely loves

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Speaker 2: cooking with friends, participating and enjoying the process. Our mutual friend.

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Speaker 2: Lorcan O'Neil says, Luca has a true instinct for friendship.

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Speaker 2: Food not only plays a strong role in his home life,

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Speaker 2: but an important role in his films, conveying sensuous desire

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Speaker 2: and transformation. The prawns and I Am Love the Peach

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Speaker 2: and call me by your name, the churros and Challengers.

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Speaker 2: We're here today in the one kitchen I have in

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Speaker 2: my home to talk about food and memories, food and film,

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Speaker 2: food and family. A beginning to a new friendship, one

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Speaker 2: cook to another.

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Speaker 1: Wonderful. I'm so happy to be here.

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Speaker 2: It's so nice to have you here so fast. We

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Speaker 2: just saw each other two weeks ago. And you're back

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Speaker 2: in London. You're going to come back more often.

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Speaker 1: The first time in Vaccines I saw you.

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Speaker 2: Oh, you're going to come back more. When's the next time?

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Speaker 1: That's what I h I.

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Speaker 3: Hope very soon I might be coming back and stay

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Speaker 3: because I might do a movie in London. I did

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Speaker 3: a movie last year.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what was that?

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Speaker 3: It's After the Hunt? Yes, starring Julia Roberts and Yes

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Speaker 3: are you Debuery and Andrew Garfield, l Seviny, Michael Stohlberg.

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Speaker 1: And there was a great experience and I love to

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Speaker 1: be in London. I was great about it, you know,

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Speaker 1: like first of all, to be in the summer in London.

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Speaker 3: It's good for me because I cannot stand the heat,

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Speaker 3: so I like that the temperature here, okay, and the

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Speaker 3: quality of water.

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Speaker 2: What we don't like about London summer?

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, I can trade place.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. And then what else is the.

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Speaker 1: Quality of work? Amazing amazing crafts. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I used to say that independent films were used to

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Speaker 2: be made in Europe, the small films and the big

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Speaker 2: ones in La, and now it's changing. Everybody wants to

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Speaker 2: make a movie here La.

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Speaker 1: I don't think they do any longer, any movies.

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Speaker 3: But basically it's like impossible because of the very expensive

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Speaker 3: nature of the business.

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Speaker 2: There Brown, who's the prime minister here fifteen years ago,

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Speaker 2: maybe he brought in the idea of lowering the tacks

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Speaker 2: for making citys. You walk into the River Cafe, you know,

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Speaker 2: you see everybody, you know, Noah and Greta here, you

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Speaker 2: were here, Julia Roberts is making another film. Yeah, the

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Speaker 2: Alejandro is here, and jj Abrams is here. It's like

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Speaker 2: walking into a kind of canteen.

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Speaker 3: You know, it's a bit of quality of one nice

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Speaker 3: and good prices.

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Speaker 2: What about in Italy are they making?

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Speaker 3: Probably Italy that the quality of life is very good

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Speaker 3: and we have very good craftsman in Italy, but unfortunately

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Speaker 3: we don't have a very we have a short sighted

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Speaker 3: politics at play there.

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Speaker 2: Because the tradition in Rome. I mean it was amazing.

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Speaker 3: I shot the movie in which is my previous one, Queer,

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Speaker 3: I fulfill these kind of fantasy of making a movie

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Speaker 3: entirely shot on stage in China.

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Speaker 1: Chita voll interior interiorn next theeries.

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Speaker 3: I think we had like ten stages. We built in

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Speaker 3: the back loot, in the front lot. We even there

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Speaker 3: was a sort of big heel of dirt that we

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Speaker 3: took over and we created a jungle over there, and

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Speaker 3: it was fascinating, but almost for the remembrance of things

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Speaker 3: passed and more than the energy of the now.

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Speaker 2: Beau just did Felini and ANTONIOI?

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Speaker 1: Did they make all their Realini for sure?

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Speaker 3: ANTONIOI, I would say maybe not, but Pelini for sure.

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Speaker 2: So we would love to read. You know, we always

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Speaker 2: try and start even the beginning of the conversation, because

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Speaker 2: that's how this podcast started. It was during COVID. The

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Speaker 2: idea originally it was just to read a recipe every day,

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Speaker 2: and then the idea was to say, well, how do

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Speaker 2: you segue from the recipe to this story of your

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Speaker 2: life through food. So we want to talk about cinema,

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Speaker 2: and we want to talk about Italy, and we want

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Speaker 2: to talk about everything, but it's the kind of getting

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Speaker 2: to understand who we are through our experience memories food, which.

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Speaker 1: Is everything I think you think it is.

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Speaker 3: I think so memory of meals, memory of food, memory

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Speaker 3: of the tight, tactile experience of food, the smells, the texture.

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Speaker 3: I think it constitutes. And I'm not talking about fancy

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Speaker 3: food per se. I'm talking about the idea of nourishment

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Speaker 3: or the deprivation of nourishment. It's really like one of

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Speaker 3: the things that makes us universally linked as people.

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Speaker 1: So I do agree with you completely.

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Speaker 2: A memory.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, when my father was dying, I flew when I

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Speaker 3: was in twenty twenty, during lockdown, I flew to Sicily

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Speaker 3: where he was born, in his village, and I walked

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Speaker 3: toward the building where he grew up, where he was

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Speaker 3: born and grew up and where I spent a lot

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Speaker 3: of summers when I was very little, and I could

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Speaker 3: distinctively remember in my mind and still now I can

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Speaker 3: the smell of mold and grapes be dried coming from

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Speaker 3: a storage place in the building. So I went into

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Speaker 3: the building and I could enter and the smell came

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Speaker 3: back to me in its physical presence and was incredible.

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Speaker 2: Is that And your father was drying in a hospital somewhere.

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Speaker 1: Else, Yeah, he was in Milano.

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Speaker 3: I could come back home fun and and see him

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Speaker 3: going to help.

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Speaker 2: It. Never smell, nothing helps, Nothing helps, but the smell

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Speaker 2: that you could feel.

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Speaker 3: Now it's like a legacy and something that I makes

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Speaker 3: me have him close, even the memory of that.

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Speaker 1: You went to Ethiopia, and I was supposed.

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Speaker 3: To be born in Ethiopia, but for I came out earlier,

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Speaker 3: so like seven months in August, I had to be

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Speaker 3: a Leo.

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Speaker 1: There was no way around it. I'm a cancer also closed. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I like cancer women. I don't like men.

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Speaker 2: I have a friend that went to she went to

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Speaker 2: La and she called that's the hotel to find her babysitter.

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Speaker 2: And the baby said, well, I can babysit, but I

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Speaker 2: need to know the sign of the baby first.

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Speaker 1: I agree. Oh, come on, I mean scorpio woman. Impossible,

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Speaker 1: my mom.

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Speaker 2: Okay, we'll get back to the side you went. You're

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Speaker 2: born a Leo in Ethiopia.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and then moved in September.

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Speaker 2: You were born in Palermo.

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Speaker 3: Palermo, and then with you too, Abeba, when I was

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Speaker 3: two months and I spent the first five years of

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Speaker 3: my life there.

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Speaker 2: Can you remember the smells of ethiop Oh yeah, what

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Speaker 2: were they like?

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean I can. I don't know.

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Speaker 3: I don't know how to describe a smell, but I

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Speaker 3: remember very well the smell of the garden. I remember

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Speaker 3: the smell of the pets we had.

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Speaker 1: Which was also big turtle. We had a big turtle

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Speaker 1: as a pet.

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Speaker 3: I can remember the smell of the coffee being roasted outside.

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Speaker 3: I can remember the food and gera and jera is

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Speaker 3: very tangy smell.

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Speaker 2: Very good food Ethiopia.

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Speaker 1: Yes, amazing. The sweets of the onions mixed.

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Speaker 3: With the with the with the powdery smell of the barberret.

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Speaker 3: It's Fantasticbara is a mixture of spices that is typical

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Speaker 3: of the of Ethiopian kitchen. It's very red and it's

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Speaker 3: used for the door watt, which is a chicken stew

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Speaker 3: or for the lamb or beef stew called ziguiney.

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Speaker 2: Wonder why Ethiopia.

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Speaker 3: My father was really restless. He met my mother when

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Speaker 3: he was teaching. He was a professor in Casablanca and

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Speaker 3: my mother is was living there.

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Speaker 1: She was she grew up in Morocco. She's Algerian, but

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Speaker 1: she grew up in Morocco.

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Speaker 3: And then once I was born, he wanted to do

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Speaker 3: another adventure abroad, so he got a post in a disabeba.

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Speaker 2: Are you an only child?

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Speaker 1: No, I am the last of three.

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Speaker 2: Three so all three of you went to Etho.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, every now and then I do and you

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Speaker 1: get the green Yes?

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Speaker 2: Is that what you keep in your special kitchen?

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Speaker 3: I do have a lot of you know that I

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Speaker 3: have like a collection of spices.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you have a very large yeah.

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Speaker 3: And then I have made with the wonderful people at

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Speaker 3: Ninfenburg in Munich. They sourced from their archives those jars

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Speaker 3: made for Apotheke in porcelain. And I asked them how

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Speaker 3: many sizes you have and they had every sizes because

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Speaker 3: these Ninfenburg gits four hundred years so they used to

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Speaker 3: make them for Apoteke. So that for me, like I

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Speaker 3: don't know ten kilos to ten grains, and I made

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Speaker 3: two hundreds of them for my kitchen, from ten kilos

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Speaker 3: to to twenty grames.

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Speaker 2: How long does the ten kilos stay good? I mean

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Speaker 2: do they.

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Speaker 3: Stay I cook a lot, so if you put ten

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Speaker 3: kilos of flour, maybe it's gonna last two weeks or

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Speaker 3: even less.

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Speaker 2: I think the only youse tried a bit of dried

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Speaker 2: time and a bit of dried regular or recana. But

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Speaker 2: I don't think we in narc should we do the freshers.

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Speaker 2: We don't use you know, kind.

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Speaker 1: Of cooking we do, yes, but you do use spices.

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Speaker 2: You're not marriage close human use core.

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Speaker 3: The world of spices is so wide, Yeah, amazing beautiful smells.

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Speaker 2: So the recipe that you chose to read today.

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Speaker 1: Is I chose from all the beauty.

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Speaker 2: That was our thirtieth birth birthday.

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Speaker 1: So beautiful.

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Speaker 3: I chose tierini with asparagus and herbs. There's a wonderful

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Speaker 3: lady on the picture on the left side. Who's this

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Speaker 3: lady that.

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Speaker 2: Is FASTI arm it? Who's the manager of the River Cafe.

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Speaker 3: The River Cafe is an incredible table. You eat so well,

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Speaker 3: they're good.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. We have to eat more. So would you

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Speaker 2: like to read the recipe, which.

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Speaker 1: Is a recipe, and then we're going.

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Speaker 2: To talk about some fresh pastad.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you call them tierini and they are

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Speaker 3: technically called tierine and.

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Speaker 1: It's Pimontes pasta.

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Speaker 3: And I am, as you said before, I live in Pimonte,

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Speaker 3: and you the typical way of using tierne is with

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Speaker 3: truffle when the season is right. It's very thin and

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Speaker 3: very sturdy kind of pasta. So tierne with asparagus and herbs.

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Speaker 3: This is for six six hundred and seventy five grains

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Speaker 3: of thin asparagus pears, which could be also wild asparagus if.

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Speaker 1: You can find them.

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Speaker 2: We try and get that. It's not so easy.

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Speaker 3: My friend Camillo, who is the gardener in my house,

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Speaker 3: his father who harvests collects from the nature's wild herbs,

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Speaker 3: brought me wild asparagus.

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Speaker 2: Last week, so already I have it in the season

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Speaker 2: now because we just got green asparagus today.

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Speaker 3: So everything's really I know, four garlic clothes. I think

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Speaker 3: this is too much, I would say one.

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Speaker 1: Can I Yeah, I love it.

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Speaker 2: I am nothing like an Italian teaching me how to cook.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I really appreciate it. I'm not teaching you. I'm

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Speaker 1: saying just the balance.

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Speaker 3: If I put the proportion of the number the games

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Speaker 3: of asparagus, I think one garlic cloves would be enough.

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Speaker 3: Four tablespoons of chopped I love it, chop mix.

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Speaker 2: Wait till I go see your movie. I'm going to

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Speaker 2: give you some advice.

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Speaker 1: I want all the advice.

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Speaker 3: Four tablespoons chopped mix, fresh herbs, basil, mint, parsley, oregano,

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Speaker 3: fantastic one millimetery double cream.

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Speaker 1: And in England you have the incredible double cream.

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Speaker 2: That's one thing we have that fans. We have crimb fresh.

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Speaker 2: You don't have it at all.

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Speaker 1: No, we have like you.

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Speaker 2: Get those little the cream that's in those packets that's

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Speaker 2: last for years.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: But even if even the fresh one is not as

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Speaker 3: thick and good as the one you find here, fair

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Speaker 3: enough two tablespoons of olive oil, fifty grams of unsalted butter,

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Speaker 3: two hundred and fifty grams tierine or tale, one hundred

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Speaker 3: and twenty grams of freshly grated parmesan cheese. Trim or

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Speaker 3: snap off the tough ends from the asparagu spears. Finally,

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Speaker 3: chop the asparagus all together with one of the garlic

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Speaker 3: clothes and the herbs. Bring the cream to the boil

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Speaker 3: in a saucepan with the rest of the whole garlic clothes,

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Speaker 3: and simmer until the clothes are soft. Remove from the

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Speaker 3: heat to discard the galic. So I changed my mind.

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Speaker 3: It's actually good to have four gathered clothes and.

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Speaker 2: Then meeting them this way and then throw them away.

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Speaker 1: I apologize.

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Speaker 3: You know what, Bernard Bertolucci, we used to say only

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Speaker 3: a sole they don't change their mind.

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Speaker 1: I agree, So you see.

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Speaker 2: But I have to say that I haven't looked at

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Speaker 2: that recipe for a long time, so I accepted that

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Speaker 2: I forgot that we took it out. We do that

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Speaker 2: quite often when we use the cream, like when we

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Speaker 2: do for sure the cream.

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Speaker 1: Yes, so we take the aroma. Yeah, I think it's great.

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Speaker 3: Heat the olive oil and butter in a separate large

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Speaker 3: saucepan and fry half of the chopplatea sparagus for five minutes,

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Speaker 3: steering at the rest of the chopping the sparagus, followed

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Speaker 3: by the flavored cream. Bring to the boil, then reduce

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Speaker 3: the heat and simmer until the cream begins to thicken,

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Speaker 3: about six minutes.

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Speaker 1: Season Remove from the heat and keep warm.

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Speaker 3: Cook the path in a generous amount of boiling water,

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Speaker 3: salted and then drain too roughly. Add to the sauce

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Speaker 3: along with about half of the parmesan, and tossed together

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Speaker 3: with the remaining parmesan.

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Speaker 1: Great recipe when you cook.

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Speaker 2: Do you think when you're in Piedmonte and you're making

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Speaker 2: me lunch, what would you make If you were saying, ruthy,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to show you something from.

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Speaker 1: The region, I would make you.

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Speaker 3: Do you like to sweets the SERTs, I would make

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Speaker 3: you a coppa. The Carama diras, which translates into a

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Speaker 3: cup of Syra's cream is a ricotta cheese create produced

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Speaker 3: only in Again and that part of the Pimonte where

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Speaker 3: I live. And it's super thin and almost like double

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Speaker 3: cream kind of texture, but it's ricotta. And I found

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Speaker 3: these in this book. This all ancient aristocratic recipe where

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Speaker 3: you mix the ricotta with raisins, cinnamon, nutmeg, a little

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Speaker 3: bit of double cream, and then you break some savoyard

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Speaker 3: biscuits and rum.

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Speaker 1: It's super good.

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Speaker 2: You getting run the biscuits and rum or do you

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Speaker 2: add the raum no.

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Speaker 3: I and the rum to the cream I think the

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Speaker 3: it's goods to be broken and put with the cream

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Speaker 3: makes this crunchy thing that is good nice.

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Speaker 2: So what do you think about that recipe? Then you

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Speaker 2: prove of the garlic, I thought.

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Speaker 1: Don't improve. I approved the recipe.

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Speaker 3: I love the way in which you you thick the sauce,

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Speaker 3: you make the cream thick. I like the way you

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Speaker 3: chop the asparagus is because that bleeds into the cream

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Speaker 3: and makes the cream being riped with the safe the

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Speaker 3: taste of the which is like sweet and slightly bitter,

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Speaker 3: which I love.

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Speaker 2: And you're really an amazing, incredible palate. So when you're

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Speaker 2: growing up, just tell me going back from Ethiopia and

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Speaker 2: you describe the smells and the food and the recipes

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Speaker 2: which you've stayed with you all your life. But you

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Speaker 2: went back to and what was that like? There was

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Speaker 2: did your mother cooked?

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Speaker 1: My father? Your father did the cooking, Oh, very much

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Speaker 1: a lot. What did he make everything? He was cooking

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Speaker 1: every day and he was cooking a lot, like you,

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Speaker 1: more than what we needed.

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Speaker 2: For three children.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, but it was a large meals or larger recipes.

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Speaker 2: But he was a teacher.

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Speaker 1: He was teaching.

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Speaker 3: It was coming back home at one, and he was

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Speaker 3: cooking all day.

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Speaker 2: What about your mother?

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Speaker 3: My mother was more like shy in the kitchen, probably

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Speaker 3: because my father was very Yeah, she cooked a lot

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Speaker 3: of Moroccan in time to time. She told me how

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Speaker 3: to do crap which is desturded. I love French crab,

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Speaker 3: French crap.

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Speaker 2: What was the technique do you remember?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? I think you have to do it so that

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Speaker 1: once you have.

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Speaker 3: Created the butter butter, he said, butter with the milk, eggs,

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Speaker 3: a little bit of sugar, a little bit of butter,

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Speaker 3: you let it rest for one day near a like

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Speaker 3: how do you call that radiator?

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Speaker 1: So the heat makes that the butter ferment.

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Speaker 2: Did you ever have farinata?

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Speaker 1: Oh? I love much.

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Speaker 2: We do it a lot, because.

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Speaker 3: I had a great farinata the River Cafe when I

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Speaker 3: was there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really I think we often give people pizzas

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Speaker 2: to start, but there's something about a farinata.

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Speaker 1: Which is an incredible.

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Speaker 2: It's just chickpea, flour, olive.

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00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:26,080
Speaker 3: Oil, very good nutritive thing, a lot of protein in it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, is some incredible.

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Speaker 3: I mean, we have so many different ways of farinata

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Speaker 3: in Italy because you have far not in Tuscany, and

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Speaker 3: then you have panelle in Fiftily. Yeah, you have farinata in,

359
00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:43,080
Speaker 3: you have it in Liguria, you have it in and

360
00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:48,040
Speaker 3: you have the panell inmo in Sicily, which is chickpeas

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00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:53,520
Speaker 3: flour mixed with water boiled boiled, yes, and then put

362
00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:59,200
Speaker 3: on a thin layer, cut in slices and fried. That's

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00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:03,240
Speaker 3: panel panel, which is a typical street fair street food. Yes,

364
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:14,320
Speaker 3: but it's another variation of the farinata.

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Speaker 2: Imagine estate bottled olive oil chosen and bottled for the

366
00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:20,240
Speaker 2: River Cafe, arriving at your door every month. Our subscription

367
00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:24,000
Speaker 2: is available for six or twelve months, with each oil

368
00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:28,000
Speaker 2: chosen personally by our head chefs and varying with each delivery.

369
00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:31,360
Speaker 2: It's a perfect way to bring some River Cafe flavor

370
00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:34,440
Speaker 2: into your home or to show someone you really care

371
00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:38,080
Speaker 2: for them with the gift. Visit our website shop the

372
00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:42,920
Speaker 2: Rivercafe dot co dot uk to place your order. Now,

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00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:48,359
Speaker 2: how long did you live at home for?

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Speaker 1: Was it? I think I left home when I was

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Speaker 1: twenty one.

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Speaker 3: I left, I went to Palerm, I went to Rome

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Speaker 3: to study literature.

378
00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,920
Speaker 2: Did you know that you wanted to do film? Yeah?

379
00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:04,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I always I was I was torn between two

380
00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:08,440
Speaker 3: directions for myself. One was to be a director of

381
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:10,560
Speaker 3: indirector and the other one was to be a chef.

382
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Speaker 3: I was cooking. I had my little mini pants when

383
00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:17,000
Speaker 3: I was in Ethiopic growing up, I had my little

384
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Speaker 3: corner in the kitchen where I could do what I wanted.

385
00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:24,520
Speaker 3: And I grew more and more into this, and then

386
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Speaker 3: when I was like fourteen, I realized that if I

387
00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:31,639
Speaker 3: had to go into that direction, I would have probably

388
00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:35,439
Speaker 3: abandoned the intellectual part of my bringing because I was

389
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Speaker 3: also a very avid reader of.

390
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Speaker 1: Books, quite academic.

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00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:43,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, I felt like that between the two, probably I

392
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 3: could have kept being a passionate with food, but I

393
00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:51,040
Speaker 3: would have made my life more intellectual.

394
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Speaker 1: And that's why I choose not had a cinema.

395
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Speaker 2: Did you have if you had little hands for media?

396
00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:01,320
Speaker 3: I had a camera, Yes, you did either Super eight

397
00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:02,240
Speaker 3: my first superade.

398
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Speaker 1: I had it when I was like nine or eight.

399
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:06,240
Speaker 1: Your parents gave it to you, my mother.

400
00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:09,520
Speaker 3: My mother gave me a Super eight, and I started

401
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:12,000
Speaker 3: shooting my little short films with this. You know, like

402
00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:17,919
Speaker 3: you could get these eight millimeters little box where you

403
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:19,680
Speaker 3: put into the camera and then you had to ship

404
00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:21,880
Speaker 3: it to Germany and wait like two months to get

405
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:23,920
Speaker 3: it back. So I had my camera and I had

406
00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:27,760
Speaker 3: my projector, and I started to learn that if you

407
00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:32,080
Speaker 3: wanted to not tell a story but communicate something, you

408
00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:35,080
Speaker 3: didn't have to just film, but you have to create

409
00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:38,840
Speaker 3: a juxtaposition. But I didn't know how to actually cut,

410
00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:41,240
Speaker 3: so I started to cut on camera. So I was

411
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,280
Speaker 3: doing a shot, and then I was thinking what I

412
00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:46,119
Speaker 3: want this to be followed by? And I was shooting

413
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,760
Speaker 3: another thing, and I was doing these mini movies about

414
00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:53,280
Speaker 3: juxtaposition of things you haven't my mom must have in

415
00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:53,840
Speaker 3: some boxes.

416
00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:57,399
Speaker 2: Yes, you should find them, we should find them, but

417
00:20:57,440 --> 00:20:58,080
Speaker 2: you still cook.

418
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Speaker 1: Cook.

419
00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:02,879
Speaker 3: I became friends with great chefs like yourself, and I

420
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,560
Speaker 3: cultivated the cult of food all my life.

421
00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:08,600
Speaker 1: I was for one year and a half.

422
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:11,479
Speaker 3: I was a gastronomic critic for Vanity Fair Italy.

423
00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:15,800
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, every week, reviewed restaurants, yeah, all over the world.

424
00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:21,080
Speaker 3: And it's interesting because at the beginning, of course, it

425
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:24,280
Speaker 3: was like we start, but then I became very consistent

426
00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:27,920
Speaker 3: because I was doing once a week for like more

427
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:33,480
Speaker 3: than seventy weeks. For Vanity Fair Italy was a week weekly, Yes,

428
00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:37,720
Speaker 3: it's weekly. Wow, And there was a great director, Daniella Amaui.

429
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Speaker 1: She was great.

430
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Speaker 3: Then she left and the new director fired me because

431
00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 3: he said to me, you know, we don't like criticism,

432
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:46,840
Speaker 3: maybe because we want to be friends with everybody.

433
00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:50,879
Speaker 1: So I said, okay, bye bye, Adrian girl. Yeah I'm gone.

434
00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:55,719
Speaker 3: And actually the conversation started because I sent a review

435
00:21:55,840 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 3: of a very important restaurant in Bergamo, three star mish Lands.

436
00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:04,720
Speaker 3: So now everybody who knows that knows who's the restaurant

437
00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:07,920
Speaker 3: still there? Oh yeah, yeah, super important. And I sent

438
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,720
Speaker 3: it and they said to me, we can't publish this

439
00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:14,280
Speaker 3: because we're friends, and I said yes, but I say,

440
00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:18,120
Speaker 3: your friends, but journalis journalists, right, No. Then I made

441
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:20,919
Speaker 3: another review of another restaurant, two Starmish Lanes and it

442
00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:23,920
Speaker 3: was another skating review, and they said we can't either.

443
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:27,600
Speaker 3: So I went to see the director the editor of

444
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,760
Speaker 3: the magazine and they fired me. We parted ways, but

445
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:34,640
Speaker 3: I made like I made like sixty five seventy reviews.

446
00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:36,920
Speaker 1: I should put them in a book you could put

447
00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:37,639
Speaker 1: it was nice.

448
00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 3: But then I started to go to places and people

449
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 3: were like, ah, they were like treating me in a

450
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,600
Speaker 3: different way, and that was bad. And sometimes they were

451
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,040
Speaker 3: asking me, can you come and review us?

452
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,040
Speaker 1: Even if it's a better review, we want the review.

453
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,919
Speaker 2: There is a I wonder you know. I just we

454
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:56,840
Speaker 2: did a podcast recently with Francis Coppola.

455
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:57,840
Speaker 1: The Divine Francis.

456
00:22:58,359 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 2: Yeah. Do you see him?

457
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:02,360
Speaker 3: No, I never met with him. I'm a friend with

458
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:03,960
Speaker 3: his daughter, the wonderful Sofia.

459
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:07,520
Speaker 2: He's living in London now I would love okay, and

460
00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:11,040
Speaker 2: he also you know, you talk about the parallels between

461
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:14,440
Speaker 2: making a movie and making a recipe running a restaurant.

462
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,160
Speaker 2: Directing a film, you know how you of course, it's

463
00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:20,959
Speaker 2: in one way not very similar at all, but in

464
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:25,800
Speaker 2: many ways it is about creating something, something, perhaps temporary.

465
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,639
Speaker 2: The response of the critics, how you do it? Do

466
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 2: you think? I mean, did you find directing films and

467
00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,160
Speaker 2: writing about food or cooking food?

468
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:38,639
Speaker 3: I think directing films and cooking or in general running

469
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:43,159
Speaker 3: an enterprise like a restaurant, are very close because the

470
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:47,320
Speaker 3: director is the entrepreneur who is putting together all the elements,

471
00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:50,840
Speaker 3: including the ingredients, to make the experience be.

472
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 1: So I think they're very.

473
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,159
Speaker 3: Close, and I think there is a lot of savvness

474
00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:59,880
Speaker 3: in the entrepreneur who knows life and habits and behavior.

475
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:03,360
Speaker 3: So a director should be someone.

476
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:03,919
Speaker 1: Who does know that.

477
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:06,400
Speaker 2: And when you made your first film, what was your

478
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:07,480
Speaker 2: first film.

479
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,480
Speaker 3: That you actually what we called The Protagonists that I

480
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 3: shot in London with tild the Swinton, and it's a

481
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,400
Speaker 3: movie that I'm not very happy with that the Cinema

482
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 3: Tech in Bologna restored. I met with the director of

483
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:23,200
Speaker 3: the cinema Tech, Jan Luca Luka, why you restarted that movie?

484
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 2: That's bad?

485
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 1: And it had to be shut up? The movies great.

486
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 3: And then a few months later it was on movie

487
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:31,480
Speaker 3: which is still and I'm very like, why anyway?

488
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 1: And it's gonna be.

489
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,200
Speaker 3: Your vengeance for the four Garly closes. I have no

490
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 3: I'm kidding.

491
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:43,000
Speaker 2: I think that it's interesting to think about the way

492
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:47,400
Speaker 2: you've brought food into film. You know, how your films,

493
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:53,359
Speaker 2: As I said in my introduction, the sensuous quality, the

494
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 2: the way that food can transport you into knowing about

495
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,639
Speaker 2: a relationship, by the way people eat together, by the

496
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:01,920
Speaker 2: way they feed each other.

497
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,840
Speaker 1: With a zero as people to very few and.

498
00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 3: You cannot surpass unsurpassable elements of our being one is

499
00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:18,920
Speaker 3: the biological is important like sleep, it, drink, shite, pee,

500
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 3: those are elements that are constitutional of who we are

501
00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:26,119
Speaker 3: as people. And because we are also capable of telling

502
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:30,679
Speaker 3: a story about ourselves, meaning our condition as people, to

503
00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:35,800
Speaker 3: discard the elements that constitute our everyday life from the narrative,

504
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:41,760
Speaker 3: it's advertisement, it's a sort of artificial construction. So that's

505
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 3: why I'm very keen that in my storytelling there is

506
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 3: always the possibility of experiencing our universal being, which has

507
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:56,120
Speaker 3: to do with sleeping, waking up, being, shiting, and eating

508
00:25:56,280 --> 00:26:01,239
Speaker 3: and sex and having sex. Even though I think that

509
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 3: sex as a cultural.

510
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:08,760
Speaker 1: Artifacts is overrated, so.

511
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 2: Boring, boring to watch, boring in film.

512
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:14,400
Speaker 1: Boring to be discuss it.

513
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:16,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, challenging in film to.

514
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean there is the challenge of filming sex

515
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 3: deals with the undemocratic nature of filmmaking and the inevitable

516
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:31,159
Speaker 3: and absolutely welcome need of democracy in dealing with people

517
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:32,040
Speaker 3: that helps.

518
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 1: You making the movie.

519
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:36,919
Speaker 3: Translation, if you make a movie as a director, you

520
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:40,040
Speaker 3: always have this totalitarian idea that everything has to be

521
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 3: the way you want. But how can you have that

522
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 3: attitude when you ask two people, maybe two people that

523
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,920
Speaker 3: are strangers to each other, to do something intimate, even

524
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:52,640
Speaker 3: if for the fiction of it so it's a compromise,

525
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:57,359
Speaker 3: it's a conversation. It's like, sometimes the compromise brings something

526
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 3: you didn't expect. Sometimes the compromise this troy what you

527
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:05,000
Speaker 3: wanted to do. Sometimes it hurts you or it hurts

528
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 3: the other and it shouldn't.

529
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:08,960
Speaker 2: We were talking with Francis the other day. We're talking

530
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:14,400
Speaker 2: about erotic film. When you see something erotic in the movie, and.

531
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:16,160
Speaker 3: Remind me to tell you what is the most erotic

532
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:17,880
Speaker 3: cinema scene in my life, in my.

533
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:20,360
Speaker 2: Idea, and I said that one of the most erotic

534
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 2: scenes that I remember, and I'm not gonna remember which

535
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 2: one it was with Daniel day Lewis the Edith Wharton

536
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:28,200
Speaker 2: movie of the Age of when he holds her hand

537
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:29,560
Speaker 2: in the carriage. Do you remember I.

538
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:34,800
Speaker 3: Was going, this is incredible, because I was going to

539
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 3: tell you one scene from Manuel de la Vera, and

540
00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,120
Speaker 3: this was going to be my second. In the scene

541
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 3: that you describe, which is incredible, he takes the hand

542
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:47,959
Speaker 3: and unbuttoned the glove on the on the wrist and

543
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:52,959
Speaker 3: he opens the glove almost like in a sort of

544
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,239
Speaker 3: like vagina shape and kisses it and smells it.

545
00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:58,520
Speaker 1: I agree with you, that's one of the.

546
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:03,160
Speaker 3: Most erotic scenes ever shot from a director who knows

547
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 3: everything about human nature. The other scene is in the

548
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:11,640
Speaker 3: great movie La vallea Brown The Valley of Sin, which

549
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 3: is a sort of version of Madame Bovarie, shot by

550
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 3: the greatest director or ever, leave Manuel de Olivera Portuguese,

551
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 3: in which she has this actress, Leonor silvera amazing actress,

552
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:31,160
Speaker 3: playing Madame Beavverie, being tormented by this kind of shock

553
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 3: of eroticism that she's feeling for the man, and she

554
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 3: grabs a flower and she fingers the flower and the

555
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 3: director makes this closeup of the flower cup being fingered

556
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 3: by the finger of Leonora silvera incredible moment.

557
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 2: So as I've just been help patizen, but as another

558
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:51,719
Speaker 2: scene that I was thinking another way of torture, and

559
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,960
Speaker 2: one of the most upsetting torture scenes that I've seen

560
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 2: was in Rome Open City, because you never see it,

561
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 2: You never see the torture. It's behind in a room behind,

562
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:05,120
Speaker 2: and you hear you just hear it. It's fromazing and

563
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 2: now if they probably were doing we think of all

564
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:09,200
Speaker 2: the torture scenes we see in film, whether the guy's

565
00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 2: tied up or somebody comes in and throws this and.

566
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 3: I say something that is going to make me lose

567
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,720
Speaker 3: some people that likes my work or myself. I don't

568
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 3: think everybody should make films, only the people who know

569
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 3: how to make them. And you're hitting a very delicate

570
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 3: hot button here, because to represent something like torture, it

571
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 3: takes an ethical and also humanistic wisdom to have to

572
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 3: do it properly. And that's why you mentioned this scene

573
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 3: from one of the greatest movies ever made from one

574
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 3: of the greatest directors I ever leaved, Roberto Rossellini. So

575
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 3: like I agree with you violence spreading on the screen

576
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 3: indiscriminately because it's like a trade and it doesn't come

577
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 3: with an idea of ethics at play from filmmakers sometimes

578
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:01,719
Speaker 3: not now from a long time or in general.

579
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:04,480
Speaker 1: Ramachita Perta, which I.

580
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 3: Watched again, like lasts I haven't seen in London at

581
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 3: the curtain, mayfird they had.

582
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:14,000
Speaker 1: A red you say re re release.

583
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 3: It's interesting because historically the movie has been told of

584
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 3: being one of the great example of Italian neo realism,

585
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 3: but in fact is then one of the great melodramas.

586
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 1: I think more than neo realism. Beautiful movie.

587
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,800
Speaker 2: I thought it was sting, so beautiful. So if we're

588
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 2: going back to the cooking and the food, and your

589
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:38,200
Speaker 2: tell me a scene, because I could say the showsers

590
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 2: and challengers, or we could talk about the peach, or

591
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 2: we could talk about the prawns. For you, which one

592
00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 2: would you talk about if I asked you to talk

593
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 2: to me about the film.

594
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 3: I don't want to be sensationalist. But one scene of

595
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 3: food that I think is very, very successfully made in

596
00:30:56,480 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 3: my movies, it's when Maren and Sally played by Mark

597
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 3: Rylance and Taylor Russell eat the lady in the house

598
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 3: and bones and all.

599
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 1: That is a great meal scene.

600
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 2: I would say, can you describe it to someone who

601
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:16,239
Speaker 2: I can describe you to? He is listening to this

602
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 2: and they won't have seen it.

603
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 3: I think, if I remember properly, you have the character

604
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 3: of Lee of mav Maar, and this girl who is

605
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 3: coping with her own nature. She realizes that she's a

606
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 3: cannibal and cannot stop by being one, and she's in

607
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 3: search of a way not to be like that, and

608
00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 3: also in search of someone to share the burden of

609
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 3: this wave being. And she has met the older man Mark.

610
00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 3: Sally played by Mark Rylands, the amazing Mark Rylance and

611
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 3: who is like her an eater, someone who has an

612
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 3: impulse of eating, a cannibalistic and cannot stop from refrain from.

613
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 3: And he brings her to a house in a village

614
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 3: in the night and base he tells her that in

615
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 3: the other room a lady is almost dying, an older lady,

616
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 3: and revolves by this. She wants to run away, and

617
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 3: she tells her, you that's your nature. She goes into

618
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 3: another room and spend the night awake and not knowing

619
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:20,959
Speaker 3: what to do, and then she falls asleep. And then

620
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 3: when the first light of the day comes, the lady dies,

621
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:30,800
Speaker 3: and she suddenly smells the impulse to go there.

622
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 1: She smells what she has.

623
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,200
Speaker 3: To go for, and she opens the door and she

624
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 3: walks in the landing, and we can see part of

625
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 3: the body of the lady, but you see Sally bending

626
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 3: over the woman, already fisting on her and turning towards

627
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 3: Matine and looking at her and kindly inviting her in.

628
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 3: And the scene. I mean, I thought the movie was

629
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 3: going to be like a great successful love story, and

630
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 3: people were really appalled by the nature of the cannibalies

631
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 3: in the movie. But we were very committed to make

632
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 3: it properly. And I would say that both Taylor Russell

633
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 3: and Mark were sublime in the movie. And of course,

634
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:18,000
Speaker 3: my dear dear Timo Tshelamet was incredible in the movie.

635
00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:22,080
Speaker 3: Either that's my favorite meal scene that I filmed in

636
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 3: my life.

637
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's your favorite.

638
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, because it's terminal. It's like, what can you go

639
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 3: beyond that?

640
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: You can't? That's it. I haven't seen it.

641
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 3: Bones and All was twenty twenty two and it stars

642
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:35,840
Speaker 3: Timtschelamette and Taylor Russell and Mark Rylance.

643
00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 2: The River Cafe when you said Lunch is now running

644
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 2: from Monday to Thursday. Reserve a booking at www. Rivercafe

645
00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 2: dot co dot uk or give us a call. Let's

646
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 2: go back to your kitchen's three kitchens in Piermont, Say so,

647
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 2: tell me about the three kitchens. You have a pastry

648
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:03,760
Speaker 2: kitchen as.

649
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 3: Well to The house I live in is an old

650
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:12,760
Speaker 3: house from nineteenth century, and I renovated it slowly in time.

651
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 3: And I always wanted to be able to have space

652
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:21,040
Speaker 3: to cook properly and to have all the things I

653
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 3: need to cook properly. And I always thought that you

654
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 3: could not cook savory where you cook suite.

655
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:32,240
Speaker 2: Well restaurants, we have a pastry kitchen.

656
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:34,160
Speaker 1: Separated, so that was a rule.

657
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:39,400
Speaker 3: So I created these two rooms separating them. One is

658
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 3: cream color and one is pitch color. It's all tiles.

659
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:47,600
Speaker 3: Which one is the pitch is the is the pastry

660
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 3: the pastry. Then I have another kitchen outside for if

661
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:55,000
Speaker 3: I do. I have not put the actual gears yet,

662
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 3: but this is going to be for caterings maybe. And

663
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:03,600
Speaker 3: I'm now doing a bakery. Are you in the courtyard, yes,

664
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 3: for yourself, because there is this is like a countryside

665
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:10,560
Speaker 3: home with all the buildings made for heart of a

666
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,080
Speaker 3: thing and da da da, And there wasn't an old

667
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:17,400
Speaker 3: brick oven already there. So I'm restoring the brick oven

668
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 3: and making a bakery in order to do bread.

669
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 2: It's very very different, isn't it making bread making pastries

670
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 2: from making pasta.

671
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 1: Or Oh yeah, all of them are very differently.

672
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:33,319
Speaker 2: We have a chefs who are great cooks, and they

673
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,960
Speaker 2: just I mean once because we always had the system

674
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 2: that we didn't have a pastry kitchen from until about

675
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:42,240
Speaker 2: ten years ago. Maybe when the demand we just everything

676
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:44,440
Speaker 2: we made. You came into work in the river cafe,

677
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:45,839
Speaker 2: you come to work and you don't know what you're

678
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 2: going to cook. You might make a risotta one day,

679
00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 2: you might make a sauce another day, or you may

680
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:54,279
Speaker 2: make a chocolate cake. And it was really interesting to

681
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,799
Speaker 2: get the consistency and hearing from some chefs saying I

682
00:35:57,880 --> 00:35:59,480
Speaker 2: just don't like to bake, you know, I don't want

683
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 2: to make a cake. Or then you have the people

684
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,279
Speaker 2: who are in the pastry kitchen saying. Some of them

685
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 2: say they want to come down and learn how to

686
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 2: make a osobuco or you know, girlleds steak, but a

687
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,920
Speaker 2: lot of them feel very proprietor about what they're Do

688
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 2: you feel that, Are you happier when you're making a cake?

689
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 1: To make it? Like? So, I like to be in

690
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 1: the kitchen and nurturing people. I love to do that,

691
00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 1: But what I'm.

692
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:28,239
Speaker 3: Really fond of is to be alone in the pastry

693
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:35,319
Speaker 3: and to do complicated things that takes a lot of time, and.

694
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 1: Be alone the solitary. I love the solitary aspect of it.

695
00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 3: One of the things that I love is when in

696
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:43,719
Speaker 3: the in the when I do stolen around Christmas time

697
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 3: and I do like I don't know ten kilos of

698
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 3: stolins still long, and it takes three days, and maybe

699
00:36:54,160 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 3: you have to be renovating the mix the dough seven

700
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 3: hours in and maybe that's like three o'clock in the morning.

701
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:06,319
Speaker 3: So I go to sleep at ten. I woke up

702
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 3: at two thirty, and then I go and do it.

703
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:09,400
Speaker 3: Then I go another map.

704
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 1: I love that. That's beautiful.

705
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:13,920
Speaker 2: To quote another person, I keep quoting people today. But

706
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:19,560
Speaker 2: Michael Caine said that he loved to cook because it

707
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:21,720
Speaker 2: was the only thing he could do without other people.

708
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 2: It was solitary, he said, gardening and cooking did He said,

709
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,880
Speaker 2: you know everything in a life where making a movie

710
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 2: you have so many people around you.

711
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 1: I don't like when people get into the kitchen.

712
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 2: But yeah, I was going to ask you if I

713
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,200
Speaker 2: come and stay, I don't. I don't have to cook

714
00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:36,760
Speaker 2: with you.

715
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 1: You you you you you. You would be more than

716
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 1: welcome in the kitchen.

717
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:40,840
Speaker 2: No, you don't have to.

718
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,960
Speaker 1: But I don't like when people. You know why I like.

719
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:46,319
Speaker 3: I like people who knows what I'm doing and they

720
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 3: can understand the dyamic.

721
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 2: I feel the same way when somebody. We have an

722
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:54,000
Speaker 2: open kitchen, and so people are curious and it's very nice,

723
00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 2: but you kind of want them to go away a

724
00:37:57,600 --> 00:37:59,880
Speaker 2: little bit, you know. I like having people help me.

725
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:01,319
Speaker 2: I love having Louis too.

726
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:04,880
Speaker 3: I like to host people, but friends they should stay

727
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 3: away from the kitchen.

728
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,240
Speaker 1: I remember I was a kid. I was like fifteen.

729
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:12,799
Speaker 3: My best friend Manfredi, Manfredi Romano, we were growing.

730
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:14,280
Speaker 1: Up together, high school together.

731
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,520
Speaker 3: He said to me, come with me for Christmas holidays

732
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:18,840
Speaker 3: to my grandma house in Milano.

733
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:21,440
Speaker 1: I was in Ficily, so I was very exotic for me.

734
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:25,359
Speaker 3: We went to Leco, this beautiful all mention for like

735
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:30,000
Speaker 3: this large important, like Milanie family. And the second I

736
00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 3: stepped into the kitchen, this woman looks at me and

737
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 3: goes like out out and I felt like, oh so ashamed,

738
00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:38,560
Speaker 3: but I understood her.

739
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:39,359
Speaker 1: She was right.

740
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:41,359
Speaker 2: And when you're working on a film set, when you're

741
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:43,759
Speaker 2: making a movie, do you care about what you feed

742
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:45,959
Speaker 2: the people who are working on the set.

743
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 3: I must say, I wish, I wish I could be

744
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:53,800
Speaker 3: like Wes Anderson, who famously has incredible catering on his sets.

745
00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:58,480
Speaker 3: That what I heard, but I don't. I don't because

746
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:04,360
Speaker 3: it's a Scifian endeavor. Like, first of all, a crew

747
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:06,800
Speaker 3: works so hard that they need to eat a lot.

748
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:09,800
Speaker 3: They need to eat things that makes their energy going.

749
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:12,839
Speaker 3: And I can't think. I mean, I am a control freak.

750
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 3: When I do a movie, I complete control freak. But

751
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 3: if I put my mind also onto that, it becomes

752
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:18,480
Speaker 3: too much, too much.

753
00:39:18,719 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 1: So there are people who know how to do it.

754
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:21,480
Speaker 1: And I don't eat much when.

755
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 2: I shoot you down. I was going to ask you

756
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 2: about your own.

757
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 1: I don't eat on set. No, No, I don't.

758
00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:29,240
Speaker 3: At the end of the day, when you shoot something,

759
00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:33,879
Speaker 3: unless it's like a complicated many extras or a lot

760
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:36,319
Speaker 3: of action seen, you don't need much.

761
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 1: Many people.

762
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:41,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interest because film and food and cooking, and

763
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 2: interior architecture, because you are involved in creating not just

764
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:49,320
Speaker 2: the environment for the table, but for rooms and perhaps

765
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:50,240
Speaker 2: even a hotel.

766
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,320
Speaker 1: I did. I did a hotel in Rome called Palazza Talia.

767
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:56,320
Speaker 2: Where is it.

768
00:39:56,320 --> 00:40:00,839
Speaker 3: It's in the formerly known Collegio del Nazzareno, which is

769
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:07,439
Speaker 3: a very famous building from seventeenth century that being has

770
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 3: school for the elite of Roman children for long and

771
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:19,360
Speaker 3: then now became a hotel. It's basically in the middle

772
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,520
Speaker 3: between Piazza Espana and Fontana di trevi.

773
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:25,480
Speaker 1: Yeh of this place.

774
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 3: I did two suites and all the communal spaces everything.

775
00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 1: What does it look like, I don't know, whimsical, whimsical.

776
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:39,319
Speaker 2: Traumatic as a as a and you enjoy it?

777
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:41,319
Speaker 1: I did? I did?

778
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:43,880
Speaker 2: You never thought of doing architecture or design.

779
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:45,840
Speaker 1: I want to be an architect as well, but that

780
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:46,720
Speaker 1: there was a lot.

781
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,600
Speaker 3: Of mathic architecture and mathematics and me, I'm not good

782
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:49,920
Speaker 3: at it.

783
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:50,880
Speaker 2: Would you do another?

784
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:54,200
Speaker 1: I'm actually doing another. What I can't say?

785
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 2: Okay, hotel?

786
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, important, But.

787
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 2: I think there are maybe the lines that we think

788
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:05,600
Speaker 2: are barriers between film and cooking and architecture design. It's

789
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:07,120
Speaker 2: all maybe at all.

790
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:10,040
Speaker 3: For me, it's a question of making, you know. I

791
00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 3: love to make. I like craftsmanship. I like artists in general.

792
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 3: I like creative people. I am happy when I'm surrounded

793
00:41:19,200 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 3: by them.

794
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 1: I like to share.

795
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:26,640
Speaker 3: But at the same time, I like the beautiful, unique

796
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:30,560
Speaker 3: feeling that you feel when you see something becoming, whether

797
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 3: it's an pasta dish with asparagusis or it's this incredible

798
00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:41,399
Speaker 3: fantastic house that I mean, or it's like a scene,

799
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:46,759
Speaker 3: the actual happening of something that becomes a transformation. And

800
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:51,560
Speaker 3: food deals a lot with transformation. It's all about transformation.

801
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:55,160
Speaker 3: So like, I think that is really, really, really at

802
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:57,719
Speaker 3: the end of it. What I love about what I

803
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:00,240
Speaker 3: do that I can witness transformation.

804
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 2: And if food is transformation, and it is memory, and

805
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:08,719
Speaker 2: it is sharing with your friends or creating something, it

806
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:11,919
Speaker 2: also is comfort. Yeah, when you need comfort, is there

807
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 2: something that you would go to? Would it be a

808
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:17,799
Speaker 2: food of your childhood or something tomato pasta that you

809
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:19,960
Speaker 2: make We're going to make for me. What would be

810
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:20,920
Speaker 2: your comfort food?

811
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,280
Speaker 3: I think my comfort food and I know the answer

812
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,920
Speaker 3: very precisely is rice with milk.

813
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 2: Is that sweet?

814
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:28,720
Speaker 1: Sweet?

815
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:31,000
Speaker 2: So it's what we call rice, But tell me about it.

816
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 1: Rice pudding.

817
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would use round rice tiny short right, what

818
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 3: we call vielano or tondo, and I would wash it

819
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,879
Speaker 3: a lot and then I would boil in a lot

820
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 3: of water for like five to seven minutes. I would

821
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,799
Speaker 3: drain it and then I would put let's say one

822
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:56,799
Speaker 3: hundred and fifty grams of these rice washed and pre

823
00:42:56,880 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 3: boiled in a litter of whole milk and two hundred

824
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:05,359
Speaker 3: and fifty grams of double cream and make it go

825
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:08,080
Speaker 3: into the into the stove for like.

826
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:08,919
Speaker 1: An hour and a half.

827
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,120
Speaker 3: You put cinnamon or I would put I would put

828
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:16,000
Speaker 3: sugar and a lot of vanilla and not cinnamon.

829
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:17,400
Speaker 1: And I love cinnamon.

830
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:19,759
Speaker 3: And I would make it cook for like an hour

831
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,600
Speaker 3: and a half until you have a good ratio between

832
00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 3: the growth of the of the grains and the cream

833
00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 3: you need to have.

834
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:27,359
Speaker 1: That's why the best, like.

835
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:31,880
Speaker 2: I love you eat it hot cold? Yeah, so you

836
00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:35,640
Speaker 2: do eat somethings in that room temperature. I generally like

837
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:39,280
Speaker 2: everything room temperature myself. But something is a good cold.

838
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 3: Well like desrt you can have ice cream at the.

839
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:45,879
Speaker 2: Boy said to me in the restaurant, I, so, would

840
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:47,720
Speaker 2: you like some ice cream? He said, no, it's too cold.

841
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 1: But not even in a sunny place, in a warm place.

842
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:56,240
Speaker 2: No. I like pasta has to be hot. But otherwise

843
00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:58,799
Speaker 2: what I like about Italian food is there doesn't seem

844
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:01,759
Speaker 2: to be that America. You get my country in the

845
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 2: United States, you get either very.

846
00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:08,640
Speaker 1: Hot or very cold, very cold. Everybody, So I quite.

847
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 2: Is it no good or good?

848
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:14,200
Speaker 1: Not good? Cold? It is not good. You needn temperature

849
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:14,760
Speaker 1: is perfect.

850
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:16,480
Speaker 2: Okay, Well that's what I go for.

851
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 1: Thank you very much, Thank you so much. With you

852
00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:30,440
Speaker 1: an thank you for listening to Ruthie's Table four in

853
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:31,800
Speaker 1: partnership with Montclair