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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, thanks for listening to Breaking Points with Crystal

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Speaker 1: and Sager. We're going to be totally upfront with you.

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Speaker 1: We took a big risk going independent to make this work.

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Speaker 1: We need your support to beat the corporate media CNN, Fox, MSNBC.

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Speaker 1: They are ripping this country apart. They are making millions

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Speaker 1: of dollars doing it to help support our mission of

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Speaker 1: hour early before everyone else. You get to hear our

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Speaker 1: reactions to each other's monologues. You get to participate and

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Speaker 1: weekly ask me any things, and you don't need to

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Speaker 1: hear our annoying voices pitching you like I am right now?

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Speaker 1: com become a Premium member today, which is available in

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Speaker 1: the show notes. Enjoy the show, guys, Good morning, everybody,

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Speaker 1: Happy Thursday. We have an amazing show for everybody today.

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Speaker 1: What do we have, Crystal? Indeed we do so. We

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Speaker 1: have some big updates this morning about Evergrand that's that

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Speaker 1: Chinese property development company that is in danger of collapse,

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Speaker 1: potential contagion across the Chinese economy. Some people are calling

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Speaker 1: it potentially a Lehman Brothers moment for China. Indications this

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Speaker 1: morning that in spite of all expectations, the Chinese government

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Speaker 1: may not actually bail them out. So we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about what's going on there. Some interesting updates on

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Speaker 1: everyone's favorite ex president, of course, I'm talking about George W.

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Speaker 1: Bush joining up with Liz Cheney getting the old band

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Speaker 1: back together Saturay. You love to see it, one thing

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Speaker 1: you do actually love to see. So he got yelled

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Speaker 1: at by a war veteran for his many crimes, so

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Speaker 1: that was very satisfying. We'll show you that interesting moment

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Speaker 1: with Bill Gates getting asked about Jeffrey Epstein. I'm not

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Speaker 1: going to say anything more. We'll show it to you

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Speaker 1: and talk about that. Also, the view Ladies melting down

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Speaker 1: of Vermonica Lewinsky reviving some great old debates from nineteen

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Speaker 1: ninety nine. We also very excited about I guess we

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Speaker 1: have on today. Ben Trekinger, he wrote a book about

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Speaker 1: the Biden family, tracking Joe's career, talking about some of

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Speaker 1: the family corruption. He also broke you guys might have

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Speaker 1: seen this. He broke the story that oh lo and behold,

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Speaker 1: at least some of those emails on Hunter's laptop were

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Speaker 1: actually legitimate A track people who were the recipients of

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Speaker 1: those emails, specifically the ones about Joe Biden possibly getting

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Speaker 1: a little bit of kickback in your see. Yeah, totally.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure you're totally shocked to find out that the

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Speaker 1: Hunter laptop was actually real thing. But we wanted to

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Speaker 1: start with a big old mess here in Washington and

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Speaker 1: the most consequential game of chicken that anyone has ever

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Speaker 1: seen between progressives and corporatists on what exactly is going

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Speaker 1: to happen with this reconciliation bill. And the first thing

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Speaker 1: I want to say is is because the way they

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Speaker 1: decided to do this is so complex, it's so mired

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Speaker 1: and like procedure and the parliamentarian and reconciliation process and

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Speaker 1: all of this nonsense, I understand it's really easy for

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Speaker 1: eyes to glaze over, but I want you to know

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Speaker 1: that the potential implications here are absolutely massive. This is

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Speaker 1: the Biden agenda. Okay, if nothing happens on reconciliation that's

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Speaker 1: it for his presidency. That means that there is no

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Speaker 1: changing the trajectory for working class people, there's no changing

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Speaker 1: the trajectory for a climate change, all of union rights,

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Speaker 1: all of these things that have been proposed to be

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Speaker 1: included in this package. That's it, it's done, it's over.

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Speaker 1: So the entire Biden presidency is basically at stake right now,

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Speaker 1: in this moment, right right now, in this moment. So

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Speaker 1: on one side you have the progressives. Their position has

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Speaker 1: always been, look, these two pieces, the bipartisan infrastructure proposal,

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Speaker 1: which we think kind of sucks and don't really want

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Speaker 1: to vote for. We will only vote for that if

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Speaker 1: tied to the reconciliation bill. The original deal was that

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Speaker 1: the corporatists were on the opposite side. Okay, fine, we'll

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Speaker 1: vote for the reconciliation piece if we get our infrastructure deal.

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Speaker 1: In recent weeks, they've tried to tear those things apart

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Speaker 1: so that they only get their stupid bipartisan infrastructure deal

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Speaker 1: and that the reconciliation bill effectively gets tanked. So the

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Speaker 1: question has been number one, are progressive is going to

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Speaker 1: hold strong? Are they actually going to stick to their

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Speaker 1: position now that there's starting to be some pressure on them,

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Speaker 1: and the media is starting to turn on them. We're

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Speaker 1: going to show you that in a moment. And number two,

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Speaker 1: are the corporatists going to stick to their position? Are

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Speaker 1: they actually going to let both bills fail, both their

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Speaker 1: infrastructure bill and the reconciliation bill and effectively tank the

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Speaker 1: entire Biden presidency. So far neither side is blinking. Let

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Speaker 1: me show you first the chair of the House Congressional

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Speaker 1: Progressive Caucus, Primilagia Paula, talking about their position. How many

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Speaker 1: members are there of the House Democratic Progressive Caucus. They're

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Speaker 1: ninety six members, and over half are absolutely committed to

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Speaker 1: to making sure we deliver both bills at the same time.

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Speaker 1: So forty eight Democrats will vote against the House Infrastructure

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Speaker 1: bill if it does not come with the budget reconciliation package.

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Speaker 1: Is that more than half, more than half of our

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Speaker 1: members will vote for both bills. And this was the

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Speaker 1: deal Jake that came out of the Senate when they passed.

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Speaker 1: When Progressive senators passed the bipartisan bill in the Senate,

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Speaker 1: it was on the specific understanding and commitment that both

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Speaker 1: bills would move together. And so now we want to

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Speaker 1: make sure that both bills are moving together, and we're

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Speaker 1: going to hold to that commitment. And so yes, half

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Speaker 1: our members, more than half our members, will not move

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Speaker 1: the bipartisan bill without the reconciliation bill being passed. And

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Speaker 1: that bipartisan infrastructure bill is supposed to come up for

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Speaker 1: a vote on Monday. So we'll see all coming to

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Speaker 1: a head very very quickly. But what she says there

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Speaker 1: that is crucial is, look, we got nine y plus

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Speaker 1: members of the House Progressive Caucus, and at least half

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Speaker 1: of them, so forty to fifty members are not going

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Speaker 1: to vote for the infrastructure bill. The infrastructure bill will

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Speaker 1: fail if we don't have it tied together with the

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Speaker 1: reconciliation bill. So so far, the Progressives hanging in. They're

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Speaker 1: tough being very clear about their position, at least with

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Speaker 1: regards to that tactic. What they haven't been clear about

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Speaker 1: is what they would accept on a scaled down reconciliation bill,

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Speaker 1: which is where things may end up landing. On the

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Speaker 1: other side, you have Josh Gottheimer and the corporate Democrats.

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Speaker 1: They're the ones who only want the infrastructure bill. They

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Speaker 1: don't want the reconciliation bill whatsoever. They're saying that, Listen,

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Speaker 1: we're not going to vote for this reconciliation bill, especially

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Speaker 1: if we don't get our infrastructure package, which we again

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Speaker 1: are supposed to vote on on Monday. Let's take a

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Speaker 1: listen to what Josh Gotttheimer has to say. Well, first,

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Speaker 1: the vote on infrastructure, of course is out of the

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Speaker 1: Senate sitting waiting for our vote, so we should all

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Speaker 1: get behind that on Monday. And then we're going to,

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Speaker 1: of course keep working so hard as we have been

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Speaker 1: on the reconciliation bill. There's so many things in there

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Speaker 1: that are important, from from climate to reinstating the state

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Speaker 1: local pax sueduction, which matters a lot to Jersey where

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Speaker 1: I'm from, to get taxes down for our families. You know,

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Speaker 1: there's no reason why this can't get done, and I'm

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Speaker 1: really optimistic that it will. But it makes no sense

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Speaker 1: to Actually, these are two separate bills. They stand on

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Speaker 1: their own. It makes no sense to vote against an

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Speaker 1: infrastructure bill that's got two million jobs a year with

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Speaker 1: it to help hardworking men and women a labor and

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Speaker 1: it makes just no sense to me. So we're going

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Speaker 1: to get that done. It's a key part of the

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Speaker 1: President's agenda, and I know that every Democrat will ultimately

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Speaker 1: be there at the end of the day. So effectively,

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Speaker 1: what happened here is corporate Democrats have sort of blown

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Speaker 1: up the truth and the deal that they had. They

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Speaker 1: want the biparson infrastructure deal, which is very business friendly.

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Speaker 1: They don't really want reconciliation, even though he says, oh,

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Speaker 1: sure there's great stuff in it. Clearly their tactics are

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Speaker 1: meant to kill the entire reconciliation package. The last thing

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Speaker 1: that I'll show you and then we can discuss is,

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Speaker 1: of course, whose side is the media going to take. Oh,

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Speaker 1: they're already going. They're starting to take the knives out

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Speaker 1: to go after Progressives and act like they're the ones

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Speaker 1: that are standing the way of any sort of progress here.

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Speaker 1: Let's take a listen to Kate Baldwin, who is sort

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Speaker 1: of representative of this line of thinking from CNN, challenging

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Speaker 1: House Budget Chairman John Yarmouth, who, by the way, is

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Speaker 1: signing with the Progressives in terms of tying these two

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Speaker 1: bills together, which was the original dealistic listen to that

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Speaker 1: it makes no sense to vote against an infrastructure bill

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Speaker 1: that does so much and has so much bipartisan support.

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Speaker 1: Do you agree with that? Yeah, I agree with that.

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't vote against this is this is why I

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Speaker 1: feel crazy because this thing. This is why people are

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Speaker 1: right to feel crazy watching how this is going on

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Speaker 1: in Capitol Hill right now. You agree, but we don't agree.

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Speaker 1: I no, I agree that I would vote for that,

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Speaker 1: and that Josh is right. This is a bill worth

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Speaker 1: passing and we ought to pass it. And what is

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Speaker 1: kind of cut off in that clip is he does

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Speaker 1: in fact side with the progressive and we want the

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Speaker 1: two things together. But you can see the way that

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Speaker 1: the media is taking the side of corporate democrats as

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Speaker 1: they always do soccer. You know, it's really watching this,

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Speaker 1: it is stunning on a couple of levels. Number one,

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Speaker 1: of course, the media is coming in. They have a

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Speaker 1: bias where anything getting done is better than nothing, even

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Speaker 1: if that anything is bad, especially bipartisan attached to it,

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Speaker 1: they just like swoon. It's not even true that it's

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Speaker 1: bypartisan this time, because a lot of House Republicans aren't

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Speaker 1: evening to vote for it. They don't want to it exactly.

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Speaker 1: They don't want to give the Biden administration a win.

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Speaker 1: I think it'll probably be about ten or something defections.

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Speaker 1: But that's not necessarily enough in order to pass the bill.

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Speaker 1: Just to update everybody fully on the news, So let's

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Speaker 1: put this up there on the screen from Jake Sherman.

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Speaker 1: So each of the different factions actually met with the President,

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Speaker 1: or at least at the White House. I think the

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Speaker 1: President did talk with some of them, Gotttheimer, Murphy, that's

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Speaker 1: kind of the moderate crew, quote unquote, the Progressive Caucus, Jaya, Paul, Mark, Pocan,

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Speaker 1: Jim McGovern, Barbara Lee. They met there also at the

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Speaker 1: White House. Many senators were over there too. I do

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Speaker 1: have to say on a macro level, as the Biden

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Speaker 1: agenda is crumbling, where the hell is Joe Biden himself?

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Speaker 1: He has not done anything. I was telling you that

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Speaker 1: he had this bizarre moment in the Oval Office where

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Speaker 1: Boris Johnson, the British Prime Minister, was like, let's take questions,

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Speaker 1: and he was taking questions from the British press while

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Speaker 1: the American press was shouted down by these White House lackeys.

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Speaker 1: And our president in our Oval office is not taking

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Speaker 1: questions about this bill. That's insane, which is his key,

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Speaker 1: his literal legacy. You know, it could turn out here

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Speaker 1: Crystal that Obama at least got you know, some fake

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Speaker 1: Obamacare thing. Again, I think very likely that there's nothing

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Speaker 1: that comes out here at all. Now. David Serota, you know,

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Speaker 1: seems to think that after this whole thing's killed, there'll

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Speaker 1: be some other semi reconciliation bill. I mean, sure that's possible.

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Speaker 1: But everything is coming to head right now. We've got

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Speaker 1: the debt ceiling, We've got a possible government shutdown looming

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Speaker 1: here because of a continuing resolution or to fund the government.

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Speaker 1: We've got the reconciliation bill. It all comes to head

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Speaker 1: on Monday. Pill Losi says, quote, we're on schedule, whatever

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Speaker 1: the hell that means. It's very clear that the votes

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Speaker 1: are not there. There's also clear that there's no way

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Speaker 1: in hell that that actual top line numbers on the

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Speaker 1: reconciliation bill itself are agreed to by Monday. I just

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Speaker 1: don't see that humanly possible. All of it is crumbling.

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Speaker 1: The president himself is nowhere. I mean, look, Obama, to

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Speaker 1: his credit, I guess in the middle of Obamacare negotiations

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Speaker 1: was always there. I actually was reading his book recently

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Speaker 1: or just you know, I'm sorry everyone, I had to

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Speaker 1: in order to convey exactly. The mindset is professional hazard.

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Speaker 1: But look, I said he gave that special address to

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Speaker 1: Congress on Obamacare where Joe Wilson shouted out you lie

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Speaker 1: or whatever. He was actually down on Capitol Hill all

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Speaker 1: the time. He was deeply invested in a lot of

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Speaker 1: the negotiations. Biden to buy all accounts is nowhere to

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Speaker 1: be seen. I mean, sure he'll call Stinema, he'll call

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Speaker 1: a mansion, but he hasn't even been down to Capitol

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Speaker 1: Hill to whip any votes. What is he that was

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Speaker 1: actually during the Obama administration, Who was it that they

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Speaker 1: frequently sent down to Capitol Hill to try to twist

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Speaker 1: arms and work on these negotiations. It was Joe Biden.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this is a central part of the case

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Speaker 1: that he made to the American people. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: be able to get things done there because, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: know these people, I know how an institution works, I

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Speaker 1: know how to do these sort of back room deals.

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Speaker 1: There's an implicit critique of Obama in there, because Obama

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Speaker 1: was sort of famously above getting his hands dirty in

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Speaker 1: these kinds of negotiations. Joe has always been the opposite

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Speaker 1: kind of politician, very hands on very relationship based and yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you just don't really see that happening. You

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Speaker 1: don't see an affirmative case being made to the American

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Speaker 1: people about any of this either, So it is quite puzzling.

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Speaker 1: A little update on what did happen in those White

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Speaker 1: House meetings where he did at least insert himself a

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Speaker 1: little bit yesterday with he had the conservative factions and

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Speaker 1: he also had the progressive faction. So with the this

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Speaker 1: is from Manu Raju tweeted this out for the progressives,

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Speaker 1: Progressive Democrats told Biden that September twenty seventh date that's Monday,

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Speaker 1: for a House vote on the infrastructure bill is quote

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Speaker 1: kind of arbitrary to us. And the President left it

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Speaker 1: at and said let me think it over and talked

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Speaker 1: to Schumer and Speaker Pelosi and get back to you.

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Speaker 1: So that's kind of where they left things with the progressives, like, now,

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Speaker 1: let me think about it. With what Manchin said that

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Speaker 1: Biden told him is and again take all of this

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Speaker 1: with a grain of salt, because everybody coming out of

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Speaker 1: this room is trying to spin things in their favor.

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Speaker 1: But what Manchin said is he basically said, find a

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Speaker 1: number you're comfortable with on the reconciliation bill based on

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Speaker 1: the means that we still have and how we delivered

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Speaker 1: to the American people. Please just work on it. Give

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Speaker 1: me a number, and tell me what you can live

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Speaker 1: with and what you can't. So that would seem to

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Speaker 1: indicate that they are trying to push in the direction

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Speaker 1: of what Siota has been indicating and what we've sort

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Speaker 1: of speculated as well, that ultimately, even if this infrastructure

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Speaker 1: vot gets pulled or fails on Monday, that there's going

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Speaker 1: to continue to be negotiations and they'll come to some number.

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Speaker 1: Is that number going to be acceptable? Is it going

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Speaker 1: to be worthwhile? Is it going to strip? Remember something

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Speaker 1: we've been talking about here for a long time that

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Speaker 1: suddenly the mainstream media just picked up on, is that

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Speaker 1: Joe Manchin heads the committee that writes all the climate

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Speaker 1: change portions. So is that going to be remotely acceptable

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Speaker 1: to progressives who've said no climate, no deal? Do they

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Speaker 1: continue to draw a hard line all of these things?

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Speaker 1: Gigantic question mark and still entirely possible that the whole

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Speaker 1: entire thing collapses. As you said, there are two other

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Speaker 1: major issues coming to a head right now as well,

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Speaker 1: which is the debt ceiling. We're about to reach that

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Speaker 1: sometime mid October and government shutdown at the end of

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Speaker 1: the month if they don't pass a stop gap spending bill.

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Speaker 1: John Yarmouth, who again is chair of the House Budget Committee,

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Speaker 1: we have this tweet. I think his staff says that

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Speaker 1: there is no time to alter their reconciliation bill or

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Speaker 1: write a standalone bill to lift the debt ceiling. Okay,

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Speaker 1: what does that mean. It means that they've left themselves

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Speaker 1: in a position where they have to get Republican help

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Speaker 1: to lift the debt ceiling before a default in October.

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Speaker 1: They could have lifted the debt ceiling through the reconciliation

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Speaker 1: bill if they put that in the original budget instructions,

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Speaker 1: but they didn't. And now what he's saying is there's

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Speaker 1: no time to do that. We can't. We don't have

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Speaker 1: time before October fifteenth to go back and do new

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Speaker 1: budget instructions and start this process. Have to kick it

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Speaker 1: over the House, redo it. It's a whole thing, it's

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Speaker 1: a whole process. It takes it takes floor time, and

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Speaker 1: there just isn't enough time between now and October fifteenth

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Speaker 1: to do this in the way that Democrats could do

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Speaker 1: it on their own. How is that going to get resolved?

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Speaker 1: Don't know. Their theory of the case right now is

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Speaker 1: that if they put the lifting of the debt ceiling

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Speaker 1: along with the stop gap budget bill that would basically

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Speaker 1: allow the government to not shut down, that Republicans will

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Speaker 1: be pressured and forced into helping them lift the dead sealing.

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Speaker 1: There's no indication that that is the case. I don't

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Speaker 1: think that, and I explain this the last show. Every

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Speaker 1: Democratic president and actually Republican President Trump fell for this too.

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Speaker 1: Every president goes American people aren't gonna blame me. They're

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Speaker 1: gonna blame Congress for screwing around. Trump made that gamble,

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Speaker 1: Obama made that gamble twice. Who did it work out

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Speaker 1: for everybody? It never works out for the people in power. Why,

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Speaker 1: especially in this particular case, people can say, hey, you

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Speaker 1: run the government, what are you doing? You have all

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Speaker 1: three you have both houses of Congress, and you have

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Speaker 1: the president. If the government shuts down on your watch,

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Speaker 1: they ain't gonna blame Republicans, even if it is one

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Speaker 1: hundred percent their fault. It feeds into the chaos. Biden's

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Speaker 1: approval rating is already tanking the economy thing in particular

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Speaker 1: is where he's already has lost the most amount of ground.

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Speaker 1: You have a government shutdown that always costs billions of

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Speaker 1: dollars to the economy. I have zero doubt in my

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Speaker 1: mind that the Biden administration would be the one that

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Speaker 1: suffered the most. Republicans have no incentive, and actually, you know,

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Speaker 1: to your point two, this again shows how much of

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Speaker 1: a failure Biden is in terms of policing the actual

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Speaker 1: coalitions within the Democratic Party. Eleven senators let's put this

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Speaker 1: up there from I think it's another Jake Sherman tweet,

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Speaker 1: which is eleven senators have come out to back the

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Speaker 1: House Progressive. So it's not just like the House who's

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Speaker 1: ravel rousing here. You've got Corey Booker, Jillibrand, Herono, Murkley, Padilla,

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Speaker 1: Sanders Warren, you know, Brian Shatz, Tina Smith even from Minnesota,

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Speaker 1: all Sheldon Whitehouse, all those people in the Senate are

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Speaker 1: actually backing the idea because they don't necessarily like the

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Speaker 1: bipartisan infrastructure bill either. Biden has not done any real

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Speaker 1: job here in trying to square the circle. And you know,

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Speaker 1: going to mansion and saying, give me a number you

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Speaker 1: can live with. I mean, he's one senator, but here

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Speaker 1: we have eleven who haven't entirely other different agenda. I'm

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Speaker 1: just really struck by his complete lack of insertion into

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Speaker 1: the process so far, this kind of hands off thing.

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Speaker 1: He styles himself as LBJ and FDR, and I can

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Speaker 1: tell you that neither of those presidents I think, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've got books about coming behind me. Neither of those

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Speaker 1: presidents did anything of the sort. And we're deeply and

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Speaker 1: intimately involved in these negotiations. This is a big leadership

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Speaker 1: failure in my opinion, the fact that he even got

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Speaker 1: to this point, and now it's so precarious. I don't

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Speaker 1: see any of the option but to fail. I don't

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Speaker 1: see how else it could go. I mean, we're not

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Speaker 1: geniuses here, but we said as soon as the relief

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Speaker 1: bill passed and they didn't put some of these things

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Speaker 1: into it at the time when there was real momentum

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Speaker 1: and there was this real push and there was a

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Speaker 1: lot of pressure on centers to deliver after they promised

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Speaker 1: these checks and all this stuff. When he didn't do that,

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Speaker 1: then at that point we both said this could be

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Speaker 1: it for him. That's what I said we pulletical. I mean,

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Speaker 1: look at the history of presidence, which I know Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden has done. He's wanted to be president for like

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Speaker 1: eighty seven years. Okay, so he's studied the history of

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Speaker 1: how these administrations unfold. He participated for eight years as

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Speaker 1: vice president. Most everything happens in the first time undred days.

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Speaker 1: What doesn't happen in the first hundred days is not

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Speaker 1: likely to get done. So gigantic mistake number one is

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Speaker 1: not trying to make some of these big, permanent, lasting changes,

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Speaker 1: not just the little stop gap relief stuff that's already

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Speaker 1: come and gone, to do that in the first hundred days.

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Speaker 1: The fact that that didn't happen gigantic miss gigantic failure.

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Speaker 1: Then this decision to split these two things apart. And

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Speaker 1: because he you know, this bipartisanship fetish and obsession in

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Speaker 1: Washington that has thoroughly rotted Joe Biden's brain and the

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Speaker 1: brain of like ninety nine percent of the press corps

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Speaker 1: here led to them splitting these two pieces apart. And

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Speaker 1: now it's creating a giant mess because an entirely predictable

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Speaker 1: thing said. At first, the corporate tess were like, yeah, sure,

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Speaker 1: we'll go along with that. And then they sensed a

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Speaker 1: moment to get the upper hand and they've taken it.

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Speaker 1: So they're putting into peril his entire agenda. And yes,

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Speaker 1: that's their fault, but it's also his fault because the

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Speaker 1: entire strategy, the tactical decisions that were made, led to

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Speaker 1: exactly this moment that we're at. Also, they've known that

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Speaker 1: this government shutdown was coming. Also, they've known the debt

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Speaker 1: ceiling was coming. Also they've known the Republicans are assholes

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Speaker 1: and aren't going to help them lift the debt ceiling.

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Speaker 1: Like this is breaking news to you somehow, were you

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Speaker 1: we live in twenty ten, right or anytime? Like what

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Speaker 1: you thought Mitch McConnell was going to help you with

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Speaker 1: your little problem here? Of course he's not. Of course

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Speaker 1: he's not. So they've created a gigantic mess for themselves.

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Speaker 1: And it is entirely unclear how any of this gets resolved.

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Speaker 1: But I can tell you the idea of a three

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Speaker 1: and a half trillion dollar reconciliation bill or anything close

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Speaker 1: to that getting through dead. I remember you saying that.

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Speaker 1: Actually almost immediately after the Cares Act, You're like, what

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Speaker 1: are you doing? You're like, this is the time, and

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Speaker 1: you know, I remember I think I was looking at

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Speaker 1: the schedule whenever they're like, well, nothing's going to pass

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Speaker 1: to October. I was like, that's in four months. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like like we're not going to be able to get

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Speaker 1: to Yeah. I was like, uh, I know how to

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Speaker 1: read a calendar. That just means you all want to

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Speaker 1: go on vacation, which is what happened. Oh and then

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Speaker 1: they were like their justification was, well, negotiations will happen

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Speaker 1: during vacation. How did that work? How'd that work out? Amazing?

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Speaker 1: Another huge story we've been tracking here is what's going

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Speaker 1: on in China. Side Yeah, so actually I'll read some

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Speaker 1: breaking news that actually came out this morning from the

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Speaker 1: Wall Street Journal. So it's China makes preparations for Evergrand's demise.

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Speaker 1: So we brought you previously Evergrand, that highly leverage real

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Speaker 1: estate company, which is in China. They have the largest

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Speaker 1: debt burden of any publicly traded real estate company in

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Speaker 1: the world. It's particularly significant in China because it's kind

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Speaker 1: of the leading edge of this real estate boom, which

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Speaker 1: compromises us about one third of their entire economy. So

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Speaker 1: it's such a huge sector. At the same time, a

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Speaker 1: huge amount of the Chinese public is actually very invested

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Speaker 1: in Evergrand because I think, what is it one point

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Speaker 1: five million something like that. People have deposits with the

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Speaker 1: company and are waiting for delivery on their houses. Now

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Speaker 1: the company itself has not even been able to barely

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Speaker 1: been able to make payroll. They have been paying out

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Speaker 1: huge amounts of dividends to their share holders. Oh coincidentally

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Speaker 1: also their CEO, who have made five billion dollars actually

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Speaker 1: from the companies alone in dividends. One of the richest

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Speaker 1: men in China, one of the richest men in China.

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Speaker 1: All of this being said, and the reason why it's

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Speaker 1: very significant is that Evergrand itself, both its bonds as

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Speaker 1: well as its stock, is actually held by a significant

429
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:23,880
Speaker 1: number of American companies, specifically private equity guys black Rock

430
00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,359
Speaker 1: and more. You know, God bless them. I guess we're

431
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,639
Speaker 1: in real trouble. You just hate to see it right now.

432
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:31,720
Speaker 1: But what they have done essentially is we have globalized

433
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:35,040
Speaker 1: and interconnected our entire economy. So back in two thousand

434
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,720
Speaker 1: and eight, when our economy crashed, obviously rippled over into

435
00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:40,719
Speaker 1: China because they held our stuff. Oh well, thanks to globalization,

436
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:42,920
Speaker 1: now we hold a lot of their debt and their

437
00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:45,919
Speaker 1: bonds which can affect our markets. So the demise of

438
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:50,240
Speaker 1: Evergrand itself could actually trigger an entire fallout within the

439
00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:53,640
Speaker 1: Chinese housing economy as well as here at home. Now,

440
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,120
Speaker 1: the sheshiping in the Chinese government, you might say, why

441
00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:58,320
Speaker 1: don't they just bail them out. Part of the issue

442
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:02,320
Speaker 1: is that the popular upright against Evergrand is both there,

443
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:05,840
Speaker 1: so people are angry. But two is that Evergrand is

444
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 1: in violation of something called the three Red lines. So

445
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,879
Speaker 1: back with I think a couple of years ago, Shishingping recognized,

446
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:13,399
Speaker 1: so like, hey, this thing is out of control, this

447
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 1: is crazy. We have to draw some sort of lines

448
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 1: in terms of our real estate market, and they drew

449
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:20,840
Speaker 1: the three red lines. Won't bore everybody with the details,

450
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:22,720
Speaker 1: but it involves debt, It involves the way that you

451
00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:25,280
Speaker 1: operate your finances, kind of like the stress tests that

452
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 1: we have for our Federal Reserve on our major banking institutions.

453
00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,040
Speaker 1: Evergrand right now is currently in violation of all three

454
00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:35,320
Speaker 1: of the red lines. So if the Chinese Communist Party

455
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,840
Speaker 1: were to bail them out, they're basically sending a message

456
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:41,120
Speaker 1: to the entire real estate market and the Hong Kong

457
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:45,439
Speaker 1: Stock Exchange that actually, our rules don't matter anymore. Well,

458
00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,200
Speaker 1: this morning this raised us to the breaking news in

459
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 1: the journal China and Beijing has made calls to local

460
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:58,760
Speaker 1: officials across the country to prepare for a quote possible storm,

461
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: meaning that the are signaling a major reluctance to bail

462
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,840
Speaker 1: out Evergrand that could trigger. And this is what we

463
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,920
Speaker 1: have here is a slowing Chinese economy. And the reason

464
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:13,560
Speaker 1: why is that Evergrand is actually intertwined with a bunch

465
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:17,640
Speaker 1: of interconnected deals with some of the biggest property developers

466
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,800
Speaker 1: all across of China. And it's so similar to our

467
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 1: own housing bubble, which is that these companies were only

468
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,640
Speaker 1: able to leverage themselves up to such heights as long

469
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,920
Speaker 1: as the prices of houses continued to go up because

470
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: they had appreciating assets which were on their books which

471
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 1: they could again borrow against housing prices are beginning to

472
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 1: go down. We're beginning to see that these fake cities

473
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:42,640
Speaker 1: and all these things that have built are not there

474
00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 1: or are incomplete. The Chinese public itself is beginning to

475
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,600
Speaker 1: be outraged. Shishiping needs to show that he's the boss,

476
00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 1: and that he will allow a company like this to fail.

477
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:54,879
Speaker 1: But the real thing that we all have to be

478
00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:58,360
Speaker 1: worried about is contagion, which is that if the Chinese

479
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:01,199
Speaker 1: Evergrand goes out, we are We saw three different companies

480
00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:04,200
Speaker 1: on the Honkok stock exchange which were real estate companies

481
00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 1: collapse almost by ninety percent before the Chinese halted trading

482
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:12,280
Speaker 1: on that stock exchange, Crystal, and all of it comes

483
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:18,080
Speaker 1: together for the contagion which could reach into our private

484
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 1: equity holdings here in the United States, which of course

485
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,120
Speaker 1: don't just hold Evergrand, they hold all kinds of domestic companies,

486
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,919
Speaker 1: so there have a cash crunch, they might have to

487
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,439
Speaker 1: call in stuff. Then we're going to see, you know,

488
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 1: drops in our holdings. It's just a total and complete mess.

489
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of seeming confidence among a lot

490
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:41,680
Speaker 1: of Wall Street analysts that like, oh, even if Evergran

491
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 1: fails and it's terrible for China, like we're going to

492
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,679
Speaker 1: be fine, and maybe they're right, Like these guys study

493
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,120
Speaker 1: this stuff for a living. Of course they're like routinely

494
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 1: catastrophically wrong all the time and have their own interests

495
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:56,880
Speaker 1: in being like the market's fine. Continue to invest, don't

496
00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 1: worry about it. It's all good to go. So I

497
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,480
Speaker 1: don't really take their word for it, because even if

498
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: their justification is basically like listen, it's mostly domestic Chinese

499
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: firms that are tied up in this thing. Yeah, Black

500
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:11,920
Speaker 1: Rock or whoever, they have some, but they're not. It's

501
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 1: not like a huge exposure. You also have a difference

502
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 1: from Lehman Brothers in that Evergrint has real assets that

503
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:20,639
Speaker 1: they can sell off, so it's not, you know, just

504
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:26,800
Speaker 1: a total like fabricated gambling house of cards. But we

505
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,479
Speaker 1: all know that the stock market is basically fake, and

506
00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 1: we know that it's just a graph of rich people's feelings.

507
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 1: So if China starts to have major economic issues, how

508
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,919
Speaker 1: can you be so confident that this isn't gonna have

509
00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 1: follow on effects? I mean, it just doesn't make sense

510
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,080
Speaker 1: to me. Knowing the very basics of what we know

511
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:48,920
Speaker 1: about how interconnected the world is, how globalization has made

512
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:52,400
Speaker 1: it so that a problem in a gigantic economy like China's,

513
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:54,960
Speaker 1: how can that not be a problem for us as well?

514
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 1: I mean, we see even you know, the way that

515
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:00,720
Speaker 1: our supply chains are all screwed up, partly because of

516
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 1: our own issues here, partly because of global issues with

517
00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 1: regards to COVID. So to me, I just do not

518
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,480
Speaker 1: trust the idea that if China has a gigantic problem,

519
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:12,920
Speaker 1: it's just going to be contained to China and it's

520
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,360
Speaker 1: nothing for us to worry about. And they do have

521
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:19,479
Speaker 1: major issues here because first of all, you have all

522
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 1: that one point five million average Chinese citizens who are like,

523
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: where's my house? Evergrand employees two hundred thousand people roughly thereabouts.

524
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:34,440
Speaker 1: That's not including the contractors who and again a lot

525
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:37,199
Speaker 1: of this there's very little transparency, but who seem to

526
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 1: be you know, meaning payment and not receiving it because

527
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 1: Evergrand and the other real estate development companies in China

528
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 1: seem to have taken a similar approach, but Avergrand's the worst.

529
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,720
Speaker 1: I mean, they fueled their growth with debt and it

530
00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 1: was all effectively kind of like a pyramid scheme, I mean,

531
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,680
Speaker 1: barring from Peter to pay Paul. And then when the

532
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: music stopped and they're stopped being so much demand for

533
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:04,040
Speaker 1: how and prices start to increase at a less rapid rate,

534
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 1: and then these regulations come in putting pressure on them,

535
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 1: making it difficult for them to borrow more to continue

536
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:14,520
Speaker 1: to fuel this cycle when the music stops their host

537
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,040
Speaker 1: So you have, you know, all of so you have

538
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 1: what was it two hundred and eighty cities or something

539
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 1: in China that Evergren has projects in. You've got two

540
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 1: hundred thousand employees, You've got all of these contractors. You

541
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 1: have in China, one hundred and seventy one domestic banks

542
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 1: and one hundred and twenty one other financial firms that

543
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:38,000
Speaker 1: have exposure here. You have all of those you reference.

544
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of these property deals and development

545
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 1: deals are actually joint ventures with other smaller companies, so

546
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 1: they're all exposed and screwed. And this is a third

547
00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 1: of China's economy. I mean a lot of the way

548
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,120
Speaker 1: that they've been able to fuel growth is through this

549
00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:57,080
Speaker 1: housing market that keeps going up and up and up

550
00:28:57,080 --> 00:29:00,880
Speaker 1: and up, gigantic bubble created. And then on the other side,

551
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 1: you have people who haven't been able to buy into that,

552
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 1: you know, their version of the American dream and the

553
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:08,600
Speaker 1: Chinese dream home ownership and all of that, and prices

554
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 1: have just gotten to a point where it's wildly unaffordable

555
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 1: for people. So that was part of why they wanted

556
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 1: to tap the brakes here. They didn't want it to

557
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: continue to escalate forever, creating an ever larger bubble, making

558
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 1: housing wildly out of reach for people. So they're in

559
00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 1: a very tough position. And you know, it is a

560
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 1: very similar dynamic to what we faced here, and the

561
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,959
Speaker 1: choices that politicians made here terrible ones and many times

562
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:39,640
Speaker 1: with regard to our own housing crisis, because they enshrined

563
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 1: the idea here of too big to fail, and they

564
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:45,280
Speaker 1: said to they sent a message to the banks that

565
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 1: you can be as reckless and careless and despicable and

566
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:52,959
Speaker 1: criminal in your behavior as you want, and we're going

567
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: to bail you out and there's no not going to

568
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 1: be any consequences, and your executives are going to get

569
00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:01,160
Speaker 1: as rich as they possibly can. And they're worried about

570
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:05,280
Speaker 1: sending the same message domestically in China to these firms

571
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 1: that they've been trying to kind of reel in that like, man, well,

572
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:10,719
Speaker 1: actually you are too big to fail. Actually we are

573
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 1: going to come to your rescue. And actually everything we

574
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 1: said was kind of bullshit. No, you're exactly right, and

575
00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: so S and P. Five hundred, let's put the CNBC

576
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:20,320
Speaker 1: tear sheet up there. The S and P Global actually

577
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: put out a report saying they don't think China may

578
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 1: bail out Evergrand here unless there's quote far reaching contagion

579
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: and well, one person who I think we should all

580
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:33,200
Speaker 1: take seriously is Jim Chinos. He's actually the guy, the

581
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: short seller who predicted Enron's collapse. Let's put the New

582
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 1: York Post tear sheet up there, which has written up

583
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:42,760
Speaker 1: his comments. He says that the collapse of Evergrand could

584
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: actually be worse than Lehman Brothers. Here's what he says,

585
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: and this echoes a lot of what you just said, Crystal. Quote.

586
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:51,160
Speaker 1: There's a lot of Evergrands out there in China. Evergrand

587
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 1: just happens to be one of the biggest, but all

588
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:58,960
Speaker 1: the developers look like this. The whole Chinese property market

589
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 1: are on stilts. In many ways, you don't have to

590
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 1: worry that it's a Lehman Brothers situation, Leman type situation,

591
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:10,760
Speaker 1: but in many ways it's worse because it's symptomatic of

592
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 1: the whole economic model and debt that's behind the model here.

593
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: So what we're pointing to is that everran, just like Lehman.

594
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: Leman was the worst right it had the most mortgage

595
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 1: backed securities out of all of them. But that didn't

596
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:28,000
Speaker 1: mean that Morgan Stanley and Bank of America and Goldman

597
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:31,040
Speaker 1: and all these other people were like great actors. They

598
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,520
Speaker 1: were just not as screwed. So Evergrand is just the

599
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:36,920
Speaker 1: tip of the iceberg here in terms of the Chinese

600
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 1: property market, and actually the real estate in China comprises

601
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: more of their financial sector in terms of their overall

602
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: economy than the financial sector did here in the United

603
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: States at the time of that crisis. Now, look, at

604
00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: the end of the day, I can't foresee it total

605
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 1: and you know, total collapse just because they're an authoritarian

606
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 1: state and they can literally just reach in and be like, yeah, no,

607
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 1: none of this is happening. It's completely over. But some

608
00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 1: sort of contagion within our markets in particular is not,

609
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:08,920
Speaker 1: you know, too far to be seen. I absolutely think

610
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: that he could be correct here in terms of even

611
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:14,160
Speaker 1: remember that our investors have hundreds of billions of dollars

612
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 1: which are invested out in China. Even a reduction of

613
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 1: gain by five percent would have a massive impact on

614
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 1: the returns of our traders. And as much as I

615
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 1: wouldn't like it to be, those people supply a huge

616
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:28,560
Speaker 1: amount of liquidity and more to the rest of the

617
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:32,800
Speaker 1: financial sector. Yeah, I mean, it's very hard to predict

618
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,920
Speaker 1: how these things end up, because, yes, it's an authoritarian country.

619
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:40,120
Speaker 1: Yes they're gonna like if there is a widespread contagion,

620
00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:41,880
Speaker 1: they're going to jump in and do what they can.

621
00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:45,600
Speaker 1: But it's just it's almost chaos theory. You just don't know.

622
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:51,360
Speaker 1: In a complicated and rigged and you know, like unpredictable

623
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 1: situation like our global economic system is, you just don't

624
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:59,240
Speaker 1: know what's ultimately going to happen. I was thinking this morning,

625
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:00,800
Speaker 1: you know the person you need to get on to

626
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:04,600
Speaker 1: talk about this is Dylan Radigan. It's like so insanely

627
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 1: correct about the housing crisis and tends to be able

628
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:11,160
Speaker 1: to really understand these dynamics and see through sort of

629
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 1: like the bullshit and the spin of everybody propping up

630
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:17,560
Speaker 1: whatever their own self interest is in the crisis. But

631
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 1: certainly something big to keep an eye on and we'll

632
00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 1: see where it goes and continue to look for people

633
00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:26,719
Speaker 1: like Dylan and others who we actually trust who were

634
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: right last time, just like don't listen to people who

635
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 1: were wrong last time around. Just sort of ignoring a

636
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: rack or the financial PRIs. Yeah, that's just time good

637
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 1: rule of thumb. Hey, So remember how we told you

638
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: how awesome premium membership was, Well, here we are again

639
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:41,959
Speaker 1: to remind you that becoming a premium member means you

640
00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 1: don't have to listen to our constant please for you

641
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,360
Speaker 1: to subscribe. So what are you waiting for? Become a

642
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 1: premium member today by going to Breakingpoints dot com, which

643
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 1: you can click on in the show notes. And that's

644
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 1: actually great segue people who were wrong or got us

645
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,400
Speaker 1: into a rock, or light us into a rock and

646
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:03,200
Speaker 1: committed massive war crimes. George W. Bush criminals, Yeah, speaking

647
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,800
Speaker 1: of criminals. So he's having a little bit of a

648
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 1: renaissance right now, Sagar. It is interesting because for a

649
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:12,840
Speaker 1: while he was just kind of quiet, like doing his

650
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,759
Speaker 1: painting at his ranch or whatever. I don't know if

651
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 1: you agree with this, but it seems like he's starting

652
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 1: to feel have the confidence to reinsert himself into our

653
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 1: political conversation. We certainly saw that with that noxious, horrible

654
00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 1: nine to eleven speech that he gave. No other president

655
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 1: or former president spoke, but he did horrible and lacking

656
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,879
Speaker 1: in any you know, repentance, or self reflection or any

657
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 1: of that, and making the case for a new domestic

658
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:44,880
Speaker 1: war on terror to match the horrific, you know, unconscionable

659
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:48,359
Speaker 1: war and terror that he launched during his administration. Well,

660
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 1: now he's getting the band back together. Liz Cheney in

661
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 1: a lot of trouble there in Wyoming in her congressional race,

662
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 1: but no worry, the cavalry is riding in to back

663
00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: her up. Throw this invite up on the screen, having

664
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 1: a fundraiser with special guests present, George W. Bush and

665
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:09,880
Speaker 1: some other familiar names on there. Yeah, in particular, you

666
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:14,440
Speaker 1: might note one Carl Rove is also on the committee

667
00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 1: for the finance committee there, so she's certainly not gonna

668
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:21,160
Speaker 1: have an issue raising money. But I mean, this is

669
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:26,879
Speaker 1: why it's like, was so bizarre and troubling to see

670
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: the way that MSNBC and CNN and mainstream Washington were

671
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:35,759
Speaker 1: like propping up and cheering for Liz Cheney because she

672
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 1: happened to be, you know, correct on the one issue

673
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 1: that seems to matter to them, which is Donald Trump.

674
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:44,120
Speaker 1: But meanwhile, you're gonna align yourself with this dude, who

675
00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, was way way way worse. Just put upside

676
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,920
Speaker 1: their like personality traits. But in terms of the damage

677
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:53,760
Speaker 1: that he wrought on our country and on the world,

678
00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 1: there's no contest between George W. Bush and Donald Trump.

679
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: And she celebrated even as she's like bringing back to

680
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:06,759
Speaker 1: life and aligning with these horrific Bush era Neokhon war criminals.

681
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 1: There's nothing that list there is like a murderer's row,

682
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:15,520
Speaker 1: like Carl Rove, Harriet Myers, Kay Bailey, this is Bush mafia,

683
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: Kay Bailey Hutchins. She was a senator from Texas back

684
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:22,800
Speaker 1: whenever I was growing up. Yeah, my great Senator John Cornyn.

685
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: A lot of these people from the Bush White House.

686
00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:29,120
Speaker 1: And actually I recently reread a history of the Bush

687
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,760
Speaker 1: years just because in order to get myself right before

688
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,600
Speaker 1: nine to eleven, so I could do that monologue that

689
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 1: I did, I think on September fourteenth, And it was

690
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,799
Speaker 1: incredible to me that even within the White House, so

691
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 1: even within the neo con faction on Iraq, who do

692
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 1: you think believed the most in the nation building vision?

693
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:50,800
Speaker 1: It was Liz Cheney. She even believed in it more

694
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 1: than her father, Dick Cheney, Rumsfeld, all of them. She

695
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:58,080
Speaker 1: was a true neo conservative believer, which means she herself

696
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,800
Speaker 1: is just as responsible for justifying that war. She pushed

697
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,799
Speaker 1: President Bush in order to stay the course and all that.

698
00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:07,319
Speaker 1: I mean, if you think about even the crimes of

699
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 1: that as opposed to you know, pushing for all the

700
00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:14,000
Speaker 1: ridiculous stuff that she has in Congress, deregulation, et cetera.

701
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 1: You put it all together and you're just like, this

702
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 1: is the last person on earth anyone should be defending.

703
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: And Bush is coming out for her for one reason,

704
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,399
Speaker 1: which is that she worked on his campaign. She works

705
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 1: as an administration, but she advances the vision that he

706
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,640
Speaker 1: put forth on the world. We know the consequences of that.

707
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:34,439
Speaker 1: And we both saw this video with great relish. An

708
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,759
Speaker 1: Iraq war veteran who actually interrupted Bush at one of

709
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,400
Speaker 1: his more recent speeches, and you can just see the

710
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 1: passion in his face. He said a lot of what

711
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:44,359
Speaker 1: I've always wanted to say, what I think a lot

712
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:45,920
Speaker 1: of people wanted to say, and he has the actual

713
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:48,319
Speaker 1: credibility in order to say it to him. Let's take

714
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,160
Speaker 1: a listen to what he did. When are you going

715
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:54,680
Speaker 1: to apologize for the million Iraqis in her death? Because

716
00:37:54,719 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 1: you are weapons, you learn about connections tonight me to

717
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 1: a rack. Three. My friends are dead. A million of

718
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 1: rack are dead because you lie. My friends are dead

719
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:29,399
Speaker 1: because you lie. Apologizelgiz put it in my veins. Yeah,

720
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,879
Speaker 1: it's just amazing. And also, who are these women man

721
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 1: handling this guy? No one's served in a rack like

722
00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:36,320
Speaker 1: get the hell out of here, you know, I mean security, Okay,

723
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:39,399
Speaker 1: that's one thing, but like the little female organizers or whatever,

724
00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: I'm like, it shows some respect, you know. It looked

725
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:43,640
Speaker 1: like it was just like the lady who happened to

726
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 1: be sitting right. I was like, what are you doing?

727
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 1: I did kind of like her base jumpsuit though, I

728
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 1: will Yeah, it looks they were dressed very nice. I've

729
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:51,480
Speaker 1: been to some of these things and sometimes see these

730
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 1: protesters is pretty annoying, but like these ones veterans. You

731
00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:56,760
Speaker 1: leave these people alone. I've even seen I think Shindy

732
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:59,880
Speaker 1: Cindy she In or whatever, she lost her son, she

733
00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: knew whatever the hell she wants. I agreed. Yeah, by

734
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:04,360
Speaker 1: the way, so this is Mike Prisoner. Who is you

735
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:08,719
Speaker 1: guys may know journalist Abby Martin. This couple man, they

736
00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: go hard, they do not mess around. But I mean,

737
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 1: I can't imagine anything more righteous. I mean, at the

738
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: very least, at the very least, given that this man

739
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:23,919
Speaker 1: has faced zero accountability, is now like a hero celebrated

740
00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:29,680
Speaker 1: by a resistance liberal and absolutely and routinely celebrated by

741
00:39:29,680 --> 00:39:31,399
Speaker 1: the media, is like, Oh, those were the good old

742
00:39:31,440 --> 00:39:34,239
Speaker 1: days under George W. Bush. At least for him to

743
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 1: have to listen to that, at least for him to

744
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 1: have to see the face of one of the men

745
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,040
Speaker 1: that he put through hell because of his lies and

746
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 1: his atrocities, at least it's some modicum of something. So kudos.

747
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 1: I mean, it's an amazing thing to watch, and it's

748
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:56,600
Speaker 1: far less, obviously than what George V. Bush actually deserves.

749
00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:59,440
Speaker 1: It's far less than when he deserves. It gives me,

750
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 1: I guess makes me happy, because what it is is

751
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:04,360
Speaker 1: that I was worried. I was like, are we forgetting?

752
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:07,160
Speaker 1: I'm like, are we forgetting? What these people did? Are

753
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 1: we but toad forgotten? The totality of it is almost

754
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 1: hard to remember and to realize. Iraq, the trillions of dollars,

755
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:17,080
Speaker 1: the Iraqis who are dead, the Americans who are dead,

756
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:20,360
Speaker 1: I mean people who died for nothing, I mean for lies,

757
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,839
Speaker 1: And I don't mean that in a derogatory term. You know,

758
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:26,760
Speaker 1: the their service always has to be remembered. I'm saying,

759
00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: like they were put in harm's way by our leaders

760
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:33,600
Speaker 1: for a straight up lie. And they're legitimate. This is

761
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: what you know, this is like it just really disturbs me.

762
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 1: They're legitimate feelings of patriotism, yes, and desire for service

763
00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:46,400
Speaker 1: and desire to do good in the world. You manipulated that,

764
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:49,480
Speaker 1: and you weaponize that and sent them in many cases

765
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 1: to their death or to be maimed or to you know,

766
00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 1: end up with PTSD or traumatic brain injury that ruined

767
00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:58,400
Speaker 1: their life. The milestones they missed at home, whether it

768
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 1: was the birth of a child or a birthday or

769
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:04,440
Speaker 1: a graduation or whatever. It was like, you did that,

770
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:08,439
Speaker 1: and at least for one moment, he had to look

771
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:12,000
Speaker 1: in the face of someone that he committed these crimes to. Yeah,

772
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 1: so props to him. I guarantee you he will not

773
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:17,879
Speaker 1: remember it. He sleeps just fine at night. He has

774
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:20,359
Speaker 1: like a religious zeal that he did the right thing.

775
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:23,720
Speaker 1: But you know, I think the rest of us should remember. Yeah. Okay,

776
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:27,719
Speaker 1: speaking of people being confronted, I guess evil people being confronted.

777
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:31,720
Speaker 1: Bill Gates recently gave an interview to with PBS News

778
00:41:31,719 --> 00:41:35,839
Speaker 1: Hours Judy Woodruff, and she pressed him pretty hard on

779
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein his past connections there, and Gates gives one

780
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:44,400
Speaker 1: of the most bizarre answers that I've ever heard. For

781
00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 1: those who are watching, pay very close attention to his

782
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:51,560
Speaker 1: body language, the fidgeting, how uncomfortable he is. For those

783
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:53,000
Speaker 1: who are listening, we'll describe it to you. On the

784
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 1: other side, let's take a lesson. Was reported at that

785
00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 1: time that you had a number of meetings with jeff Epstein,

786
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:03,920
Speaker 1: who when you met him ten years ago, he was

787
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 1: convicted of soliciting prostitution from minors. What did you know

788
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:11,200
Speaker 1: about him when you were meeting with him, as you've

789
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 1: said yourself, in the hopes of raising money, Uh, you know,

790
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:20,840
Speaker 1: I had dinners with him. I regret doing that. He

791
00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:25,879
Speaker 1: had relationships with people he said, you know, would give

792
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:29,480
Speaker 1: to global health, which is an interest I have. You know,

793
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 1: not nearly enough philanthropy goes in that direction. You know,

794
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:39,560
Speaker 1: those meetings we were a mistake. They didn't what he

795
00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 1: purported and I cut them off. You know, that goes

796
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:45,719
Speaker 1: back a long time ago. Now there's you know, so

797
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:48,359
Speaker 1: there's nothing new on that. It was reported that you

798
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 1: continue to meet with him over several years, and that,

799
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:57,239
Speaker 1: in other words, a number of meetings. What did you

800
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:03,719
Speaker 1: do when you found out about his background? Well, you know,

801
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,920
Speaker 1: I've said I regretted having those dinners and there's nothing,

802
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:11,200
Speaker 1: absolutely nothing new on that. Is there a lesson for

803
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:18,719
Speaker 1: you for anyone else? Look looking at this, Well, he's dead, so, uh,

804
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,200
Speaker 1: you know, in general, you always have to be careful

805
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:27,720
Speaker 1: and you know the you know, I'm I'm very proud

806
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 1: of what we've done on plant to be very proud

807
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:34,360
Speaker 1: of the work of the foundation. Uh, you know, that's

808
00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:39,960
Speaker 1: that's what I get up every day and focus on. Oh,

809
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 1: he's dead. So there's no lessons. That was no lessons.

810
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:49,480
Speaker 1: It's like, maybe I should have done more due diligence

811
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,880
Speaker 1: is the world's We're just man like. Maybe I shouldn't

812
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:53,879
Speaker 1: have tried to use Epstein as a vector to try

813
00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:56,600
Speaker 1: and win the Nobel Peace Prize. Maybe I should have

814
00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:59,759
Speaker 1: been hanging out with him and venting about my wife. Which,

815
00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:02,879
Speaker 1: as a reminder, with the New York Post thing up there,

816
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 1: obviously lying about the nature of his contact with Jeffrey Epstein,

817
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:09,720
Speaker 1: the New York Post article says Jeffrey Epstein gave advice

818
00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:14,120
Speaker 1: to Bill Gates about ending his marriage to Melinda. Now, yeah, huh,

819
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 1: all right, got it. Apparently, you know, this is probably

820
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,920
Speaker 1: leaked by Melinda's divorce team and all of that. But

821
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 1: there have been multiple reports indicating and there have been

822
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:27,160
Speaker 1: multiple witnesses who said, actually they were boys, they were buddies,

823
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:29,279
Speaker 1: Like this is where he went to escape, you know,

824
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:31,560
Speaker 1: it wasn't happy in his marriage. This was where he

825
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 1: went to relax, and that it was a point of

826
00:44:34,040 --> 00:44:39,040
Speaker 1: contention in their marriage because Melinda has worked on, you know,

827
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:41,919
Speaker 1: ending sex trafficking, and this is an issue that she's

828
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:44,520
Speaker 1: actually invested some time, and so she's like, what the

829
00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:47,680
Speaker 1: hell are you doing with this, dude, question that we

830
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:52,080
Speaker 1: all continue to have. Remember, he was a convicted pedophile

831
00:44:52,239 --> 00:44:54,480
Speaker 1: by the time that Gates was hanging out with him.

832
00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:57,440
Speaker 1: This is not there's no excuse, there's no I didn't know, no, Like,

833
00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 1: he was already convicted whenever this and he got his

834
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,239
Speaker 1: little sweetheart deal and Gates hung out with him on

835
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:06,320
Speaker 1: multiple occasions. As I pointed out, I mean the Norwegian

836
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:10,720
Speaker 1: press revealed that Gates actually flew with Epstein to France

837
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:13,880
Speaker 1: and that they visited the head of the Nobel Committee

838
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:16,680
Speaker 1: because Gates is obsessed, as he keeps pointing to with

839
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:20,160
Speaker 1: getting the Nobel Peace Prize for his work with the

840
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 1: Gates Foundation, and that is really what this was all about.

841
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:26,799
Speaker 1: And it's funny too whenever you listen to Gates talking there.

842
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:28,120
Speaker 1: First of all, he's richest man in the world. He

843
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 1: doesn't actually need outside financing. So what's going on, I

844
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:34,799
Speaker 1: guess the second richest man in the world whatever. So

845
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:36,359
Speaker 1: he's the second richest man in the world, he doesn't

846
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 1: need outside financing whatsoever. So now what why are you

847
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 1: meeting with Epstein? And Epstein, according to Gates, was promising

848
00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:46,000
Speaker 1: him all of this, Oh, these like financing structures in

849
00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:48,920
Speaker 1: order to get development work done. I have said this

850
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:51,919
Speaker 1: a million times, like with Leon Black, who was worth

851
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 1: nine billion dollars, who was a Wall Street titan, who

852
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:57,880
Speaker 1: says that he went to Epstein for tax advice. For

853
00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:01,680
Speaker 1: a lot of these guys they can have Look, if

854
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:04,840
Speaker 1: the people were worth nine and eighty billion, can't have

855
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:07,279
Speaker 1: access to the very top of the advisors in the

856
00:46:07,360 --> 00:46:11,200
Speaker 1: legitimate world. The Goldman sacks, what are you doing? Whatever

857
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 1: you're going to after Epstein. This whole tax advice stuff.

858
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:17,399
Speaker 1: It doesn't hold up whatsoever. I mean, Gates can call

859
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:20,719
Speaker 1: any bank and any billionaire in the world in order

860
00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:23,320
Speaker 1: to go sit down with them to talk development financing.

861
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:26,080
Speaker 1: You had to go to this guy. Why this guy? Right?

862
00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:27,880
Speaker 1: And I think we're beginning to learn some of that.

863
00:46:28,560 --> 00:46:31,359
Speaker 1: Adam Johnson actually tweeted to this point. He was like,

864
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 1: Gates keeps giving this line. He hung out with Epstein

865
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:37,799
Speaker 1: multiple times because Epstein had access to donors for public health. Yes,

866
00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 1: and not once does anyone ask the obvious question of

867
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:43,799
Speaker 1: who specifically is this person? Who are these peoples who

868
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:47,319
Speaker 1: Bill Gates cannot on his own get in touch with?

869
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:50,000
Speaker 1: And then he says, Secretary, Sir Bill Gates called again.

870
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 1: He wants to talk about donating with you to cureates

871
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:55,840
Speaker 1: mystery richman, Bill who tell him I'll only deal with

872
00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:59,160
Speaker 1: him through my disgraced child sex trafficker contact. That's a

873
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:02,280
Speaker 1: great point I'm talking about, which is the Gates Foundation

874
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:06,320
Speaker 1: actually has a larger footprint in many countries than the USAID,

875
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:09,840
Speaker 1: our aid organizer. Right to give you an idea of

876
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:12,840
Speaker 1: the scale of which he already is operating at Whenever

877
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:16,200
Speaker 1: he's meeting with. Look, all we're saying is stop be

878
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 1: asking us. The story makes no sense. We're all seeing

879
00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:21,879
Speaker 1: through this. It's insane, like the idea that you need

880
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:26,440
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein for money. You're Bill Gates. You are Bill Gates,

881
00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:29,240
Speaker 1: you are one of the richest men on the entire planet,

882
00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:32,960
Speaker 1: and you need Jeffrey Epstein to have access to donors

883
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:36,960
Speaker 1: or access to money. It's so silly and absurd, Like

884
00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:39,800
Speaker 1: we're not the stupid Bill. I would also be remiss

885
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:42,440
Speaker 1: if I didn't mention that Leon Black we didn't have

886
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:45,520
Speaker 1: a something made for this. He's the former private equity giant,

887
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 1: former CEO of Apollo Global Management, billions of dollars under management.

888
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: Himself a longtime billionaire, was just recently accused by a

889
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:57,800
Speaker 1: second woman of violently raping her at Jeffrey Epstein's Manhattan

890
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:01,400
Speaker 1: townhouse in two thousand and two. Obviously he denies it,

891
00:48:01,680 --> 00:48:04,839
Speaker 1: all the legal caveats and all that, But look, I'm

892
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:07,320
Speaker 1: just saying, you know, we've got the Prince Andrews situation

893
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,560
Speaker 1: here where he's literally being protected by the Palace guard

894
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:16,680
Speaker 1: from being served papers, like they've got the Metropolitan British

895
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 1: Police are protecting him from being able to be served

896
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,960
Speaker 1: with the lawsuit so that he cannot be tried at

897
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:25,840
Speaker 1: a civil court here in the United States. Leon Black

898
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:29,920
Speaker 1: now accused second person. He's forced out of Apollo, specifically

899
00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:32,680
Speaker 1: because he was hiding his ties to Jeffrey Epstein. Now

900
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:35,280
Speaker 1: Bill Gates every time the guy does an interview. Also,

901
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:37,279
Speaker 1: you noticed he's like thumbing for his fake for his

902
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:40,080
Speaker 1: old wedding ring. It's kind of sad. Yeah, he's like

903
00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:44,120
Speaker 1: fidgeting is out there anymore? So he's got that whole situation,

904
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:47,440
Speaker 1: he says, you know, and yet look the real problem

905
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:50,080
Speaker 1: is and props to Woodroff for even pressing him, But

906
00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:52,800
Speaker 1: somebody needs to ask that question, what were you getting

907
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 1: from him that you can't get anywhere else in the world.

908
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:59,200
Speaker 1: You're already one of the world's biggest philanthropists. Not a

909
00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 1: single one of these baires who've been caught up with

910
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: this guy have ever answered. They all answer the same

911
00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:05,600
Speaker 1: version of I wish I never met the guy like

912
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:09,120
Speaker 1: Leslie Wexner whatever, the Victoria's secret guy who signed over

913
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:11,319
Speaker 1: all his fortune to him for some reason. That one

914
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:14,000
Speaker 1: is really right seems to have been the key to

915
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:18,200
Speaker 1: how Epstein was able to live this lavish life in

916
00:49:18,239 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: the beginning and ingratiate himself into these circles to start with.

917
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:26,920
Speaker 1: But yeah, well Epstein's dead, so thinks we should move on.

918
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:29,239
Speaker 1: It's amazing that he says there's no lesson to be learned.

919
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:30,800
Speaker 1: He's like, oh, I got to do my due diligence.

920
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:33,920
Speaker 1: He's like, oh, well he's dead. He's dead, So okay,

921
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:37,480
Speaker 1: all right, interesting Confrent. Next, speaking of things dredged up,

922
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:39,920
Speaker 1: some of you might have seen Fax actually launch a

923
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:43,240
Speaker 1: retro show. This is very retro. Well, it's interesting because

924
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:45,279
Speaker 1: I've been trying to watch this series. It's not on

925
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 1: Hulu or whatever, but FX, which did the O. J.

926
00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 1: Simpson trial and something else which I think was the

927
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:54,680
Speaker 1: Versace thing, they just did a mini series on Lewinsky.

928
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:57,279
Speaker 1: So it's kind of it's revived a little bit of

929
00:49:57,280 --> 00:49:59,760
Speaker 1: the Lewinsky discussion. And I do actually think it's important

930
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 1: for you. With my age and me even a little

931
00:50:01,520 --> 00:50:04,799
Speaker 1: bit younger, we didn't weren't fully cognizant, I think during

932
00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:07,120
Speaker 1: the Lewinsky scandal. But I mean it was, you know,

933
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:09,640
Speaker 1: the national story of the time. It was one hundred

934
00:50:09,640 --> 00:50:12,160
Speaker 1: percent you know, what was happening. And one of the

935
00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:15,319
Speaker 1: elements of it which modern feminists would go crazy over

936
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:18,640
Speaker 1: is the fact that a lot of these old school

937
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:23,320
Speaker 1: feminists in the Democratic Party, they didn't just go to bat.

938
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,600
Speaker 1: They went hard for Bill Clinton to smear Monica Lewinsky,

939
00:50:27,920 --> 00:50:31,680
Speaker 1: turned her life upside down, basically slut shamed her and

940
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 1: not blamed, you know, the president who has you know,

941
00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:38,680
Speaker 1: had multiple allegations against him. We got a little bit

942
00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:42,160
Speaker 1: of a preview of that from the view yesterday when

943
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 1: Joy Behar was who was exactly one of these people

944
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,399
Speaker 1: channeling her like inner nineties protection instincts. Listen to how

945
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:54,160
Speaker 1: she describes what the Lewinsky scandal meant for Monica Lewinsky

946
00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 1: and who the real victim was. Let's take a listen.

947
00:50:57,040 --> 00:51:00,520
Speaker 1: I would submit here that the real victim the United

948
00:51:00,600 --> 00:51:05,040
Speaker 1: States of America because and and Hillary Clinton, because if

949
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: you remember when the debate was going on between Trump

950
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:13,160
Speaker 1: and Hillary, Trump brought in all these so called victims

951
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:20,239
Speaker 1: of Clinton's peccadillos, right, okay, And if they have brought in,

952
00:51:20,719 --> 00:51:22,920
Speaker 1: if they have brought in if Democrats have done the

953
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:25,319
Speaker 1: same and brought in Donald Trump's victims, and those who

954
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:27,960
Speaker 1: wouldn't have done anything. They would have needed, they would

955
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:30,960
Speaker 1: have needed an arena exactly. And there were a lot

956
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:38,400
Speaker 1: of he allegedly abused a lot of women. Bill Clinton here,

957
00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:42,600
Speaker 1: those women into that debate. That hurt Hillary Clinton. And

958
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 1: that is the real victim. The country lost a great person,

959
00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:48,680
Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton could have been the president instead of that

960
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:52,479
Speaker 1: criminal that we had there for four years. And that's

961
00:51:52,520 --> 00:51:55,240
Speaker 1: the real vic and that's the real loser. I pushed

962
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:59,560
Speaker 1: that the real victim was Hillary, Hillary and the United States,

963
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:02,759
Speaker 1: and she not by that is that like, oh, a

964
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,880
Speaker 1: good man was taken out as president, reputation tarnished, and

965
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:08,719
Speaker 1: a good woman who should have been our rifle president

966
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:11,879
Speaker 1: was you know, was tarnished by all of this. I mean,

967
00:52:12,239 --> 00:52:15,480
Speaker 1: I also love the way she says in this just

968
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:21,799
Speaker 1: voice full of contempt alleged victims. It really does harken back.

969
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:23,920
Speaker 1: And even I was, like, you know, I wasn't really

970
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:26,000
Speaker 1: super political when I was young, so this was all

971
00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:27,879
Speaker 1: sort of happening in the background, and I wasn't really

972
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:30,640
Speaker 1: tuning into all of the Washington debates and like Maureen

973
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:34,760
Speaker 1: Dowd columns and whatever when I was seventeen or whatever

974
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 1: it was at the time. So even for me, it's

975
00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:41,520
Speaker 1: helpful to remember the way people like thought about this

976
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:43,560
Speaker 1: and portrayed this at the time. But yeah, all this

977
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:46,080
Speaker 1: language from the beginning about like oh if you drag

978
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:48,759
Speaker 1: a twenty dollars bill through a trailer park and calling

979
00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:52,880
Speaker 1: him bimbo eruptions, and then the way that these supposed

980
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:58,719
Speaker 1: feminists came in not to attack Bill for his exploitation,

981
00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:01,319
Speaker 1: I mean monicale is she was a young intern. She

982
00:53:01,400 --> 00:53:06,279
Speaker 1: was like her higher life has now become defined by

983
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 1: this and ruined by this, and that she goes on

984
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:11,000
Speaker 1: to say, oh, she's doing fine, she's making money, but like,

985
00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:16,000
Speaker 1: money is not everything. You've had your entire life and identity, Yeah,

986
00:53:16,120 --> 00:53:19,239
Speaker 1: stolen from you by this man when you are a

987
00:53:19,320 --> 00:53:23,080
Speaker 1: young intern and he's the most powerful man in the world,

988
00:53:23,560 --> 00:53:26,799
Speaker 1: and you don't think that that's relevant Still today in

989
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:29,719
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, you haven't figured that out, and you're

990
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:33,560
Speaker 1: you know, alleged victims. The other thing, you know, we

991
00:53:33,600 --> 00:53:38,360
Speaker 1: spoke with Unnita Brodrick. That's when we were on around

992
00:53:38,800 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 1: tar Reid and all that was happening there, and you

993
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 1: can see the way that because of how she was treated,

994
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:46,920
Speaker 1: I mean, she has her own agency and all of that,

995
00:53:47,080 --> 00:53:49,480
Speaker 1: but because of the way she was treated so terribly

996
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 1: by the Clintons, by everybody around, by everybody in the

997
00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:53,960
Speaker 1: Democratic Party, like she's so far down the right wing

998
00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:57,160
Speaker 1: rabbit hole, and you can see the way that they're

999
00:53:57,239 --> 00:54:00,920
Speaker 1: just like sneering contempt pushes people away. I mean, you

1000
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,040
Speaker 1: can see it very clearly in that instance. But this

1001
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:06,080
Speaker 1: is just a disgusting way to view the whole situation,

1002
00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:08,719
Speaker 1: and that she still unrepentantly views it the same way

1003
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:10,720
Speaker 1: she did in nineteen ninety nine. It was pretty interesting,

1004
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:12,439
Speaker 1: what everything of one. You know, she's a sweet lady.

1005
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:14,120
Speaker 1: I think we at least got that from the interview.

1006
00:54:14,160 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 1: She's such a nice woman, and you know, she was

1007
00:54:16,239 --> 00:54:19,160
Speaker 1: smeared viciously by these people, and you know, and she

1008
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 1: accused Clinton of right back in the seventies, and the

1009
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:24,719
Speaker 1: machine just destroyed her. And actually I dug this up,

1010
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:26,759
Speaker 1: so I didn't even know about this until the me

1011
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:30,520
Speaker 1: too whole thing started in twenty seventeen, which was one person.

1012
00:54:30,560 --> 00:54:33,319
Speaker 1: Our name was Marjorie Williams. She actually wrote this back

1013
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:35,239
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety eight. Let's put this up there on

1014
00:54:35,280 --> 00:54:37,400
Speaker 1: the screen. One of the only honest actors, and she

1015
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:41,320
Speaker 1: was like, hey, Clinton sorted entanglements with Flowers and Paula

1016
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:44,880
Speaker 1: Jones and Monica Lewinsky have drawn barely a squeak of

1017
00:54:44,960 --> 00:54:49,360
Speaker 1: protest from the powerful writers, lawyers, activist politicians, and academics

1018
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:53,440
Speaker 1: who call themselves feminists. And what she points to repeatedly

1019
00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:55,680
Speaker 1: is that a lot of the people who call themselves

1020
00:54:55,840 --> 00:55:00,440
Speaker 1: feminists back in the nineties, because politically Clinton actually defended

1021
00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:02,279
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff they agreed with. Yeah, they not

1022
00:55:02,320 --> 00:55:05,640
Speaker 1: only gave him a pass, Crystal, they were saying stuff

1023
00:55:05,719 --> 00:55:09,000
Speaker 1: like oh wow, like it's just like a virile southern man.

1024
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:12,680
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, or all right, so that's justification.

1025
00:55:12,960 --> 00:55:16,279
Speaker 1: We're taking advantage of a twenty three year old intern

1026
00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:19,799
Speaker 1: wow and turning her life upside down. He never apologized

1027
00:55:19,800 --> 00:55:22,319
Speaker 1: to her well once And you know the fact of

1028
00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:24,960
Speaker 1: the matter is, like nothing's really changed they I mean,

1029
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 1: think about times up, Like, think about this organization supposedly

1030
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:32,239
Speaker 1: dedicated to me too and telling the stories of survivors

1031
00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:34,239
Speaker 1: and helping them fight back in court and all of that.

1032
00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:37,640
Speaker 1: And what you come to learn is like, no, actually,

1033
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:41,120
Speaker 1: you just want to control what happens within the Me

1034
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:43,200
Speaker 1: Too movement so it doesn't come for any of the

1035
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:47,000
Speaker 1: politicians you like, like Joe Biden, when Tara Reid comes

1036
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:48,640
Speaker 1: to you and says, here's what happened to me, and

1037
00:55:48,680 --> 00:55:51,360
Speaker 1: are you gonna help me? And the answer is hell, no,

1038
00:55:51,640 --> 00:55:55,799
Speaker 1: absolutely not. And then with Andrew Cuomo, not only are

1039
00:55:55,800 --> 00:55:57,919
Speaker 1: they like, we're not gonna help you, they're like, how

1040
00:55:57,920 --> 00:56:04,280
Speaker 1: can we assist in smearing Andrew Cuomo's accusers? So nothing's

1041
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:06,920
Speaker 1: really changed. They have total blinders on when it comes

1042
00:56:06,920 --> 00:56:10,320
Speaker 1: to like who counts, whose allegations matter, how they should

1043
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:14,120
Speaker 1: be handled. It's not really any different. And I guess

1044
00:56:14,120 --> 00:56:16,319
Speaker 1: that's what this moment with Joy kind of reveals is

1045
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:18,680
Speaker 1: like they haven't actually changed. They may be a little

1046
00:56:18,719 --> 00:56:22,839
Speaker 1: better in general, like rhetorically about pretending they don't say

1047
00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:25,759
Speaker 1: he's virual, care about all women, They wouldn't say that virile.

1048
00:56:25,800 --> 00:56:28,719
Speaker 1: They wouldn't like allow the bimbo eruption language or the

1049
00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:33,879
Speaker 1: twenty dollars through the trailer park language. But underlying all

1050
00:56:33,920 --> 00:56:38,239
Speaker 1: of that, there's still entire levels of like hypocrisy and

1051
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:42,560
Speaker 1: selective outrage. When a woman comes forward with incredible allegation,

1052
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:44,880
Speaker 1: that's right, Wow, you guys must really like listening to

1053
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:47,000
Speaker 1: our voices. Well, I know this is annoying. Instead of

1054
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:49,640
Speaker 1: making you listen to a Viagra commercial when you're done,

1055
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,200
Speaker 1: check out the other podcast I do with Marshal Cossof

1056
00:56:52,280 --> 00:56:54,520
Speaker 1: called The Realignment. We talk a lot about the deeper

1057
00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:57,960
Speaker 1: issues that are changing realigning in American society. You always

1058
00:56:57,960 --> 00:57:00,680
Speaker 1: need more Crystal and soogur in your daily lives. Take care, guys,

1059
00:57:01,080 --> 00:57:03,920
Speaker 1: All right, Crystal, what are you taking a look at? Well? Guys.

1060
00:57:03,960 --> 00:57:07,440
Speaker 1: I have a very controversial theory of politics. I believe

1061
00:57:07,640 --> 00:57:11,799
Speaker 1: that reality actually matters more than messaging or misinformation or

1062
00:57:11,800 --> 00:57:15,600
Speaker 1: political ads, more than shutdowns even or procedure or poll numbers.

1063
00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:18,720
Speaker 1: The way people feel about their lives and their jobs

1064
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:21,080
Speaker 1: and the future for their kids has a lot more

1065
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:24,400
Speaker 1: to do with how and whether they'll ultimately vote than

1066
00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 1: the source of debates on language and framing and ideology

1067
00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:30,439
Speaker 1: that normally dominate the cable news airwaves. Of course, part

1068
00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:32,880
Speaker 1: of why we've had these crazy swings in our politics

1069
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:35,040
Speaker 1: from one team to the other is because reality has

1070
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:37,800
Speaker 1: not been that great the naive hopes of the Clinton

1071
00:57:37,880 --> 00:57:41,240
Speaker 1: tech bubble era, they've collapsed into a depression of elite crimes,

1072
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:45,960
Speaker 1: financial precarity, and working class oblivion. The most raizen criminals

1073
00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:49,080
Speaker 1: in the country. They got rich. The most honest salt

1074
00:57:49,120 --> 00:57:51,440
Speaker 1: of the earth people in the country, they got screwed.

1075
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:54,200
Speaker 1: And we keep tossing out this party and then tossing

1076
00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:57,400
Speaker 1: out that party because neither one actually gives damn about

1077
00:57:57,440 --> 00:58:00,000
Speaker 1: doing anything to restore some basic sense of fair place

1078
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:04,000
Speaker 1: of possibility, of just an expectation of a basic level

1079
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:07,120
Speaker 1: of dignity. But to give you a few specific examples

1080
00:58:07,160 --> 00:58:09,800
Speaker 1: of my grand theory that reality actually matters, let's think

1081
00:58:09,800 --> 00:58:13,040
Speaker 1: about why Trump lost. It's pretty obvious people felt crappy

1082
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:15,000
Speaker 1: about a pandemic that was keeping them at home, their

1083
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:17,520
Speaker 1: kids out of school, and threatening their loved ones, even

1084
00:58:17,560 --> 00:58:20,160
Speaker 1: if Trump had done nothing different at all. But the

1085
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:22,840
Speaker 1: pandemic happened to be easy, and people were starting the

1086
00:58:22,840 --> 00:58:25,560
Speaker 1: fall with their kids headed back to school. Zero dobt

1087
00:58:25,560 --> 00:58:28,520
Speaker 1: in my mind that he would have been reelected. Another

1088
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:31,040
Speaker 1: example you can think too. Back in twenty twelve, things

1089
00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:34,120
Speaker 1: were not all that amazing the economy, but the unemployment

1090
00:58:34,200 --> 00:58:37,200
Speaker 1: rate was consistently ticking down. The number of people in

1091
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:39,160
Speaker 1: the country who felt the nation was on the right

1092
00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:43,200
Speaker 1: track was consistently ticking up. It was enough for Obama

1093
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:46,120
Speaker 1: to defeat the cartoonish caricature of out of touch wealth

1094
00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:49,919
Speaker 1: that they skillfully defined romneyas. But things were very, very

1095
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:53,360
Speaker 1: different just two years earlier, in the midterms of twenty ten.

1096
00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:57,120
Speaker 1: Remember this President Bush when he went through a similar thing,

1097
00:58:57,200 --> 00:59:00,600
Speaker 1: came out and he said this was a thumping, and

1098
00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:03,000
Speaker 1: you talked about how it was humbling, or you alluded

1099
00:59:03,040 --> 00:59:06,680
Speaker 1: to it perhaps being humbling. And I'm wondering when you

1100
00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:11,800
Speaker 1: call your friends like Congressman Periello or Governor Strickland and

1101
00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:16,640
Speaker 1: you see nineteen state legislatures go to the other side,

1102
00:59:17,920 --> 00:59:22,760
Speaker 1: governorships and swing states, the Democratic Party set back. What

1103
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:27,080
Speaker 1: does it feel like? It feels bad now. I'm not

1104
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:29,920
Speaker 1: recommending for every future president that they take a shellacking

1105
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:34,800
Speaker 1: like they like I did last night. You know, I'm

1106
00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:40,280
Speaker 1: sure they are easier ways to learn these lessons a shellacking.

1107
00:59:41,080 --> 00:59:44,640
Speaker 1: Reality sucked in twenty ten. The left was furious, the

1108
00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:47,640
Speaker 1: right was furious. The economy was terrible, the recovery was slow,

1109
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:51,640
Speaker 1: the mood was seething, and voters either stayed home entirely

1110
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:55,400
Speaker 1: or they showed up to register their fury by kicking

1111
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:58,360
Speaker 1: out the party in power with Gusto. That was the

1112
00:59:58,440 --> 01:00:01,120
Speaker 1: year I ran for Congress as a Demo. Amazing timing

1113
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:03,240
Speaker 1: on my part, But the truth of the matter is

1114
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:06,920
Speaker 1: Democrats that year they deserve to lose. Remember, these people

1115
01:00:06,920 --> 01:00:09,000
Speaker 1: had a majority in the House, they had a super

1116
01:00:09,040 --> 01:00:13,240
Speaker 1: majority in the Senate. They were entrusted with astonishing power,

1117
01:00:13,800 --> 01:00:17,520
Speaker 1: historic power at the most critical moment imaginable, and they

1118
01:00:17,560 --> 01:00:20,760
Speaker 1: blew it. They deserved to lose because they didn't jail

1119
01:00:20,760 --> 01:00:23,040
Speaker 1: any bankers for their crimes, because they didn't end the

1120
01:00:23,080 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 1: wars they said they would, because they were more worried

1121
01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:27,880
Speaker 1: about Chuck Todd, thinking they spent too much money in

1122
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:31,880
Speaker 1: the stimulus than actually getting the policy right. They decided

1123
01:00:31,920 --> 01:00:34,520
Speaker 1: to do a giant giveaway to health insurers rather than

1124
01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:37,360
Speaker 1: actually rip out the corrupt health care mafia system, root

1125
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:39,960
Speaker 1: and branch and creating its place something that was actually

1126
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:43,240
Speaker 1: about health and care. The Republicans, of course, they didn't

1127
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:47,200
Speaker 1: deserve to win, but there is zero doubt Democrats suffered

1128
01:00:47,240 --> 01:00:51,480
Speaker 1: a righteous and fully deserved loss. Well, friends, where are

1129
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:53,960
Speaker 1: we today with the Biden administration. We got some check

1130
01:00:54,000 --> 01:00:56,720
Speaker 1: the box executive orders, we got a short term relief

1131
01:00:56,760 --> 01:00:59,280
Speaker 1: package that has now mostly expired, and we got a

1132
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:02,680
Speaker 1: truly courative switdrawal from Afghanistan that was marred unfairly by

1133
01:01:02,720 --> 01:01:05,520
Speaker 1: media coverage and very fairly by a drone strike that

1134
01:01:05,600 --> 01:01:09,240
Speaker 1: murdered an entire Afghan family and their babies. The rest

1135
01:01:09,240 --> 01:01:12,920
Speaker 1: of the Biden promises on everything from unions, to economics,

1136
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:15,880
Speaker 1: to civil rights and immigration. They have all collapsed in

1137
01:01:15,920 --> 01:01:19,240
Speaker 1: a heap at the feet of Joe Manchin, Josh Gottheimer

1138
01:01:19,360 --> 01:01:24,200
Speaker 1: Kirsen Cinema, and most importantly, Joe Biden himself. Think about it.

1139
01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:27,200
Speaker 1: He promised to raise the wage of fifteen dollars per hour.

1140
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:30,520
Speaker 1: That's gone. He launched his campaign with the firefighters Union,

1141
01:01:30,520 --> 01:01:33,080
Speaker 1: pledging to be the most pro union president in history.

1142
01:01:33,560 --> 01:01:36,000
Speaker 1: But Proact looks set to go down with the Reconciliation

1143
01:01:36,040 --> 01:01:39,200
Speaker 1: Bill or be cut out by the Parliamentarian. Climate change

1144
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:43,320
Speaker 1: is in the hands of Cole Baron, Joe Manchin, voting rights,

1145
01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:48,200
Speaker 1: police reform, redistricting reform, campaign finance reform all dead. Immigration

1146
01:01:48,320 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 1: reform has been killed by the Parliamentarian. The entire populist

1147
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:55,160
Speaker 1: economic agenda appears right now to be going down in flames.

1148
01:01:55,520 --> 01:01:57,960
Speaker 1: A base that was highly animated to end the cruelty

1149
01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:01,120
Speaker 1: of Trump era immigration policies. They've been treated to images

1150
01:02:01,160 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: of horror at the border and the realization that the

1151
01:02:03,440 --> 01:02:06,440
Speaker 1: Biden admin is now engaged in one of the largest

1152
01:02:06,480 --> 01:02:11,000
Speaker 1: mass expulsions of migrants in history. Maybe nothing, though, exemplifies

1153
01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:14,440
Speaker 1: Democratic Party failure better than the doomed fate of prescription

1154
01:02:14,520 --> 01:02:18,160
Speaker 1: drug reform. Everyone in the party has been running on

1155
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:21,800
Speaker 1: lowering drug prices for more than a decade. It is

1156
01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:25,440
Speaker 1: a policy supported by eighty or ninety percent of Americans,

1157
01:02:25,880 --> 01:02:28,880
Speaker 1: and it's probably going to fail. What is a political

1158
01:02:28,920 --> 01:02:31,960
Speaker 1: party worth if they can't even deliver on something so

1159
01:02:32,240 --> 01:02:39,320
Speaker 1: incredibly basic, obvious, and long pledged as lowering prescription drug prices. Now, listen,

1160
01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:41,240
Speaker 1: you might be on one side or the other of

1161
01:02:41,240 --> 01:02:44,080
Speaker 1: some of these issues, but two things are abundantly clear.

1162
01:02:44,480 --> 01:02:48,479
Speaker 1: Number One, Biden voters were lied to. The promises were fake.

1163
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:52,800
Speaker 1: Number Two, reality right now sucks. Let me show you

1164
01:02:52,840 --> 01:02:55,720
Speaker 1: in one graph, how people are feeling about the state

1165
01:02:55,760 --> 01:02:58,439
Speaker 1: of America right now. Just take a look at this chart.

1166
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:00,680
Speaker 1: So the number of Americans who think on the wrong

1167
01:03:00,760 --> 01:03:03,960
Speaker 1: track has spiked dramatically over the past several months. You

1168
01:03:03,960 --> 01:03:06,520
Speaker 1: can see that at the end there, wrong track has

1169
01:03:06,560 --> 01:03:08,800
Speaker 1: been besting right track for a while now. In America,

1170
01:03:09,160 --> 01:03:12,400
Speaker 1: but back just as recently as May, wrong Track was

1171
01:03:12,440 --> 01:03:15,600
Speaker 1: only ahead of right Track by a mere seven points.

1172
01:03:15,960 --> 01:03:20,720
Speaker 1: Today that gap has exploded to thirty points, as delta

1173
01:03:20,760 --> 01:03:25,200
Speaker 1: has surged, supply shortages have widened, and Biden just looks on.

1174
01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:28,160
Speaker 1: He has burned up so much time fixating on this

1175
01:03:28,280 --> 01:03:31,840
Speaker 1: bipartisan infrastructure bill and the absurd belief that voters are

1176
01:03:31,840 --> 01:03:34,200
Speaker 1: going to care more about whether Lindsey Graham signed onto

1177
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:37,720
Speaker 1: an agenda than whether Biden has actually delivered for the

1178
01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:41,800
Speaker 1: American people. Biden's Reconciliation bill is the last big chance

1179
01:03:42,000 --> 01:03:44,920
Speaker 1: to change the state of reality. Not because it has

1180
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:47,920
Speaker 1: to be, but because Biden himself has decided to handcuff

1181
01:03:47,920 --> 01:03:50,800
Speaker 1: his agenda through his own lack of baldness on executive action,

1182
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:54,480
Speaker 1: through a bizarre deference to an unelected bureaucrat, to an

1183
01:03:54,560 --> 01:03:57,600
Speaker 1: unwillingness to end an arcane procedural rule called the filibuster,

1184
01:03:57,720 --> 01:04:01,320
Speaker 1: and a seeming unwillingness to use a single hardball tactic

1185
01:04:01,520 --> 01:04:04,680
Speaker 1: to bring the corporate sellouts to heal, not to mention

1186
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:09,280
Speaker 1: a disastrous political strategy that left the entire agenda hanging

1187
01:04:09,520 --> 01:04:13,240
Speaker 1: until right now. So, just like twenty ten, Republicans don't

1188
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:15,760
Speaker 1: deserve to win, they have zero to offer or say.

1189
01:04:16,160 --> 01:04:20,200
Speaker 1: But do democrats deserve to lose? You betcha? Unless something

1190
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:23,840
Speaker 1: wildly changes, the party in power will get shell act

1191
01:04:23,960 --> 01:04:27,520
Speaker 1: and they will deserve it. And listen, we talked about

1192
01:04:27,520 --> 01:04:31,480
Speaker 1: this starting the show. One more thing, I promise. Just

1193
01:04:31,520 --> 01:04:33,680
Speaker 1: wanted to make sure you knew about my podcast with

1194
01:04:33,760 --> 01:04:36,520
Speaker 1: Kyle Kolinski. It's called Crystal, Kyle and Friends, where we

1195
01:04:36,600 --> 01:04:40,080
Speaker 1: do long form interviews with people like Noam Chomsky, Cornell West,

1196
01:04:40,120 --> 01:04:43,640
Speaker 1: and Glenn Greenwald. You can listen on any podcast platform,

1197
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:46,240
Speaker 1: or you can subscribe over on substack to get the

1198
01:04:46,320 --> 01:04:48,720
Speaker 1: video a day early. We're gonna stop bugging you now

1199
01:04:48,920 --> 01:04:51,520
Speaker 1: enjoy all right, Sager, what are you looking at? Well?

1200
01:04:51,640 --> 01:04:53,320
Speaker 1: By now, you may have heard of the case of

1201
01:04:53,360 --> 01:04:55,880
Speaker 1: Gabby Patito. She was a young twenty two year old girl,

1202
01:04:55,920 --> 01:04:57,720
Speaker 1: she said, off across the country this summer in a

1203
01:04:57,800 --> 01:05:01,000
Speaker 1: van with her boyfriend Brian Laundry for a trip out west.

1204
01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:04,560
Speaker 1: It was documenting her experience very meticulously on social media

1205
01:05:04,640 --> 01:05:07,160
Speaker 1: and her popular YouTube account. Now the case actually has

1206
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:11,040
Speaker 1: captured national attention after Potito's remains recently were identified in

1207
01:05:11,160 --> 01:05:14,680
Speaker 1: Grand Teton National Park preliminary finding is that her death

1208
01:05:14,800 --> 01:05:17,480
Speaker 1: was sadly caused by a homicide. Now, before I get

1209
01:05:17,520 --> 01:05:19,560
Speaker 1: to the specifics of the case, let's just say her

1210
01:05:19,560 --> 01:05:21,880
Speaker 1: death has caused a lot of takes. One of the

1211
01:05:21,920 --> 01:05:25,439
Speaker 1: most popular is this who cares people go missing every day?

1212
01:05:25,760 --> 01:05:29,000
Speaker 1: MSNBC's joy Anne Reid in particular, was outrage at the

1213
01:05:29,000 --> 01:05:32,040
Speaker 1: attention on Potito's death, saying it's a case of missing

1214
01:05:32,080 --> 01:05:35,120
Speaker 1: white lady syndrome. Let's take a listen. If you've been

1215
01:05:35,160 --> 01:05:37,240
Speaker 1: watching the news for the past few days or on

1216
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:40,920
Speaker 1: Twitter or TikTok, you're probably familiar with the name Gabby Potito,

1217
01:05:41,440 --> 01:05:44,120
Speaker 1: the twenty two year old aspiring social media influencer who

1218
01:05:44,160 --> 01:05:48,040
Speaker 1: was reported missing after her fiance returned from their van

1219
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:52,320
Speaker 1: life excursion without her on Sunday, human remains believed to

1220
01:05:52,360 --> 01:05:55,080
Speaker 1: be Potito's were found in a national park in Wyoming.

1221
01:05:55,480 --> 01:05:58,760
Speaker 1: An autopsy is scheduled for tomorrow to confirm the identity.

1222
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:01,640
Speaker 1: Now goes without saying that no family should ever have

1223
01:06:01,720 --> 01:06:04,520
Speaker 1: to endure that kind of pain, and the Potito family

1224
01:06:04,560 --> 01:06:08,160
Speaker 1: certainly deserve answers and justice, But the way this story

1225
01:06:08,200 --> 01:06:11,440
Speaker 1: has captivated the nation has many wondering why not the

1226
01:06:11,440 --> 01:06:14,560
Speaker 1: same media attention when people of color go missing. Well,

1227
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:18,880
Speaker 1: the answer actually has a name, missing white woman syndrome,

1228
01:06:19,320 --> 01:06:22,360
Speaker 1: the term coined by the late and great Gwen Eiffel

1229
01:06:22,840 --> 01:06:27,040
Speaker 1: to describe the media and public fascination with missing white

1230
01:06:27,120 --> 01:06:31,320
Speaker 1: women like Lacy Peterson or Natalie Holloway while ignoring cases

1231
01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:35,840
Speaker 1: involving missing people of color. Now, look is race a

1232
01:06:35,880 --> 01:06:39,400
Speaker 1: part of national coverage one? And the cases of Natalie

1233
01:06:39,440 --> 01:06:43,840
Speaker 1: Holloway and Lacy Peterson were actually sensationalized two decades ago.

1234
01:06:44,240 --> 01:06:46,800
Speaker 1: But what the entire media is missing here is that

1235
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:50,480
Speaker 1: they were second to this story, not first. The reason

1236
01:06:50,480 --> 01:06:53,960
Speaker 1: that Potito's case gained such salience online is it was

1237
01:06:54,080 --> 01:06:59,640
Speaker 1: born of interest online TikTokers, YouTubers, Instagram people. They considered

1238
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:02,200
Speaker 1: Petita one of their own, and they got involved in

1239
01:07:02,240 --> 01:07:05,320
Speaker 1: the case to piece together the pieces that the cops

1240
01:07:05,360 --> 01:07:08,400
Speaker 1: had very obviously missed. And here's the thing, the facts

1241
01:07:08,400 --> 01:07:12,200
Speaker 1: of this case are actually crazy. After Potito's family lost

1242
01:07:12,240 --> 01:07:14,520
Speaker 1: touch with her in August of twenty twenty one, her

1243
01:07:14,560 --> 01:07:18,200
Speaker 1: boyfriend showed up back in Florida two weeks later with

1244
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:22,520
Speaker 1: the van that they were traveling in and she wasn't there. Obviously,

1245
01:07:22,720 --> 01:07:25,560
Speaker 1: they had a lot of questions, Uh, what's going on, Brian,

1246
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:29,040
Speaker 1: Where's Gabby? Then police showed up to his house to

1247
01:07:29,080 --> 01:07:31,520
Speaker 1: ask him and he wouldn't talk to them. According to

1248
01:07:31,520 --> 01:07:34,120
Speaker 1: the Potito family, he wouldn't talk to them either. On

1249
01:07:34,160 --> 01:07:36,720
Speaker 1: September fifteenth, after Brian was named a person of interest

1250
01:07:36,800 --> 01:07:40,200
Speaker 1: in this case, he also went missing, according to that family,

1251
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:43,160
Speaker 1: and nobody knows where the hell he is today. As

1252
01:07:43,200 --> 01:07:46,800
Speaker 1: people online became aware that Gabby was missing, a ground

1253
01:07:46,800 --> 01:07:50,480
Speaker 1: swell of online salutes actually became involved, and what received

1254
01:07:50,520 --> 01:07:54,280
Speaker 1: particular attention was a resurface body camera footage of a

1255
01:07:54,320 --> 01:07:57,920
Speaker 1: police stop of the couple in Moab, Utah, where Brian

1256
01:07:57,960 --> 01:08:00,920
Speaker 1: and Gabby were actually involved in a fight. On August twelfth,

1257
01:08:00,920 --> 01:08:05,440
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, a bystander in Moab saw Potito and

1258
01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:08,960
Speaker 1: Laundry arguing, in which Potito apparently hit Laundry in the

1259
01:08:09,080 --> 01:08:11,680
Speaker 1: arm as he was keeping her away from her phone.

1260
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:15,040
Speaker 1: Now that bystander heard Potito say, quote, why do you

1261
01:08:15,120 --> 01:08:17,559
Speaker 1: have to be so mean? And he was so concerned

1262
01:08:17,560 --> 01:08:20,240
Speaker 1: he actually called in as a domestic dispute. Now that

1263
01:08:20,360 --> 01:08:24,080
Speaker 1: call told police, quote, we drove by a gentleman was

1264
01:08:24,120 --> 01:08:28,120
Speaker 1: slapping the girl. We stopped they ran and down that sidewalk,

1265
01:08:28,320 --> 01:08:30,960
Speaker 1: he proceeded to hit her. He hopped in the car,

1266
01:08:31,040 --> 01:08:34,280
Speaker 1: and they drove off together. Now, body camera footage reveals

1267
01:08:34,320 --> 01:08:36,519
Speaker 1: that after that couple was stopped in their van, but

1268
01:08:36,640 --> 01:08:39,640
Speaker 1: Tito was in very obvious distress when talking to the officers.

1269
01:08:39,840 --> 01:08:41,639
Speaker 1: So for those who are just listening, here the audio,

1270
01:08:41,680 --> 01:08:43,799
Speaker 1: it's a little bit muffled. Here's a very small tidbit

1271
01:08:43,840 --> 01:08:46,920
Speaker 1: that just gives you an idea of what it was like. Yeah,

1272
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:55,519
Speaker 1: I don't know. I said, I was just cleaning and

1273
01:08:55,720 --> 01:08:59,040
Speaker 1: feeding a second before, and I was apologizing to him

1274
01:08:59,040 --> 01:09:04,920
Speaker 1: and saying, now, look, According to the officers, she was

1275
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:08,200
Speaker 1: like that the entire time. She was distraught emotionally and

1276
01:09:08,320 --> 01:09:11,400
Speaker 1: was apologizing over and over for being mean to her boyfriend,

1277
01:09:11,439 --> 01:09:13,920
Speaker 1: even though a caller said something otherwise. It doesn't take

1278
01:09:13,920 --> 01:09:16,439
Speaker 1: a genius to see some pretty telltale signs of domestic

1279
01:09:16,479 --> 01:09:19,040
Speaker 1: abuse here. But the cops wrote it off and instead

1280
01:09:19,200 --> 01:09:21,519
Speaker 1: they split them apart, asking the boyfriend to spend the

1281
01:09:21,600 --> 01:09:24,320
Speaker 1: night in a hotel while she slept alone in a van.

1282
01:09:24,720 --> 01:09:27,439
Speaker 1: Now from there things get even stranger. She posted on

1283
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:30,360
Speaker 1: Instagram on mutah in August twenty fifth, and then her

1284
01:09:30,360 --> 01:09:33,120
Speaker 1: mother received strange texts saying that she was going to

1285
01:09:33,200 --> 01:09:36,719
Speaker 1: Yellowstone and would have no cell service on August thirtieth,

1286
01:09:36,840 --> 01:09:40,439
Speaker 1: That was five days later. Eleven days after that, she's

1287
01:09:40,439 --> 01:09:43,640
Speaker 1: officially reported missing after not being heard from. And you

1288
01:09:43,760 --> 01:09:46,360
Speaker 1: know that her boyfriend she was traveling with shows up

1289
01:09:46,400 --> 01:09:48,680
Speaker 1: back at his house in Florida with a van and

1290
01:09:48,760 --> 01:09:51,360
Speaker 1: no girlfriend. All of this were known to the police

1291
01:09:51,400 --> 01:09:54,080
Speaker 1: at the time, who then came to the boyfriend's house

1292
01:09:54,320 --> 01:09:56,439
Speaker 1: to seize the van in question. But then when they

1293
01:09:56,479 --> 01:09:59,160
Speaker 1: try to answer ask him questions, he refers them to

1294
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:01,680
Speaker 1: his lawyer, refusing to speak with them. What do the

1295
01:10:01,680 --> 01:10:05,479
Speaker 1: cops do? Nothing? They said her disappearance was odd, but

1296
01:10:05,600 --> 01:10:07,559
Speaker 1: that there was no evidence of a crime in their

1297
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:10,120
Speaker 1: own jurisdiction of Florida, so they just took the van

1298
01:10:10,280 --> 01:10:12,439
Speaker 1: and then they left. They didn't put a car, they

1299
01:10:12,520 --> 01:10:16,080
Speaker 1: didn't pressure the family. Nothing, So lo and behold a

1300
01:10:16,120 --> 01:10:19,120
Speaker 1: few days later, when the FBI decides that the laundry

1301
01:10:19,200 --> 01:10:22,040
Speaker 1: is now a person of interest, he's nowhere to be found.

1302
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:24,360
Speaker 1: They literally let him skip down. Even though the dude

1303
01:10:24,400 --> 01:10:26,720
Speaker 1: showed up at his house with the van they were

1304
01:10:26,760 --> 01:10:30,160
Speaker 1: both in and refused to talk to them. Seriously. Am

1305
01:10:30,200 --> 01:10:33,479
Speaker 1: I crazy. Is this not the easiest case to figure out? Ever,

1306
01:10:33,800 --> 01:10:36,280
Speaker 1: while the police were apparently letting the prime suspect go,

1307
01:10:36,800 --> 01:10:42,920
Speaker 1: people online were actually surfacing details everywhere, geolocating, figuring out

1308
01:10:42,920 --> 01:10:45,640
Speaker 1: her past whereabouts. In fact, it was a pair of

1309
01:10:45,800 --> 01:10:50,280
Speaker 1: YouTubers themselves who happened to drive past Ptito's van on

1310
01:10:50,320 --> 01:10:53,360
Speaker 1: August twenty seventh in Grand Tee to National Park, who

1311
01:10:53,400 --> 01:10:58,000
Speaker 1: then reviewed their footage and alerted authorities to the location

1312
01:10:58,400 --> 01:11:02,120
Speaker 1: where her body was eventually discovered. Various sidings of the

1313
01:11:02,120 --> 01:11:04,839
Speaker 1: couple have been reported also on social media the explosion

1314
01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:08,160
Speaker 1: of interest and a nationwide manhunt now underway for laundry

1315
01:11:08,240 --> 01:11:10,720
Speaker 1: at this time, but the review of the details is

1316
01:11:10,760 --> 01:11:13,720
Speaker 1: merely to underscore that both this is a pretty extraordinary

1317
01:11:13,760 --> 01:11:15,759
Speaker 1: case in which a person who already had a following

1318
01:11:15,760 --> 01:11:19,320
Speaker 1: on social media was involved in an objectively crazy situation

1319
01:11:19,720 --> 01:11:22,400
Speaker 1: and where others sought to do what they could to

1320
01:11:22,400 --> 01:11:24,760
Speaker 1: try and locate her. And the nature of so much

1321
01:11:24,800 --> 01:11:27,960
Speaker 1: of MSNBC and CNN coverage in the last several days

1322
01:11:28,160 --> 01:11:30,759
Speaker 1: has been to essentially try and shame people for caring

1323
01:11:30,880 --> 01:11:33,519
Speaker 1: or tuning in or trying to help, but they ignore

1324
01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:35,920
Speaker 1: that Unlike in the nineties. They aren't the ones who

1325
01:11:36,000 --> 01:11:39,599
Speaker 1: actually created the interests. It was organic. It actually stemmed

1326
01:11:39,640 --> 01:11:42,200
Speaker 1: from the facts themselves. I really don't know how many

1327
01:11:42,280 --> 01:11:44,759
Speaker 1: times we have to discuss on this show. Shaming people

1328
01:11:44,840 --> 01:11:47,800
Speaker 1: is likely to have the opposite reaction when you're trying

1329
01:11:47,840 --> 01:11:50,559
Speaker 1: to elevate something. And number two, I cannot think of

1330
01:11:50,600 --> 01:11:53,559
Speaker 1: a better opportunity than for anyone discussing the case as

1331
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:56,080
Speaker 1: I am right now to draw attention to two big

1332
01:11:56,200 --> 01:11:59,479
Speaker 1: crises that we have in our society. One is domestic abuse,

1333
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:02,400
Speaker 1: which is actually skyrocketed during the pandemic and for which

1334
01:12:02,400 --> 01:12:05,960
Speaker 1: so many women suffer, And two is missing persons. Advocates

1335
01:12:06,000 --> 01:12:08,760
Speaker 1: are one hundred percent correct in noting how many minorities

1336
01:12:08,800 --> 01:12:10,519
Speaker 1: go missing in the country. There are a lot of

1337
01:12:10,520 --> 01:12:13,200
Speaker 1: resources that people should look into if they're interested in

1338
01:12:13,240 --> 01:12:16,280
Speaker 1: helping and being aware to find other people who are missing.

1339
01:12:16,880 --> 01:12:19,519
Speaker 1: But what people who are apparently well intentioned always miss

1340
01:12:19,840 --> 01:12:22,639
Speaker 1: is that talking down to people almost never works. While

1341
01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:25,200
Speaker 1: others have consternation at looking at the interest in the case,

1342
01:12:25,439 --> 01:12:28,559
Speaker 1: I actually see a good thing. The authorities failed Gabby Patito,

1343
01:12:28,760 --> 01:12:30,519
Speaker 1: but a lot of people stepped up to try and

1344
01:12:30,520 --> 01:12:33,759
Speaker 1: bring closure to her family and hopefully justice for her murderer.

1345
01:12:33,960 --> 01:12:35,640
Speaker 1: And I choose to see hope in that, and I

1346
01:12:35,680 --> 01:12:37,320
Speaker 1: see it as a spirit that perhaps that we can

1347
01:12:37,360 --> 01:12:40,080
Speaker 1: build on and help as many people as possible. I'm

1348
01:12:40,120 --> 01:12:42,439
Speaker 1: curious what you think, Cristel, because I think the reflexive

1349
01:12:42,520 --> 01:12:45,840
Speaker 1: nature to be like, oh, it's missing white girl joining us.

1350
01:12:45,840 --> 01:12:49,120
Speaker 1: Now we have Ben Streckinger. He is national political correspondent

1351
01:12:49,160 --> 01:12:51,840
Speaker 1: for Politico. But reason we have him today is he's

1352
01:12:51,880 --> 01:12:54,400
Speaker 1: also author of a brand new book. It is called

1353
01:12:54,439 --> 01:12:58,400
Speaker 1: The Bidens Inside the First Family's fifty year Rise to Power.

1354
01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:01,320
Speaker 1: Great tatty Bene, Ben, thanks so much for having me.

1355
01:13:01,479 --> 01:13:02,960
Speaker 1: Of course, I think we have the book jacket we

1356
01:13:02,960 --> 01:13:04,599
Speaker 1: can throw up on the screen so people can see

1357
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:06,680
Speaker 1: it's for sale right now, right so you can go

1358
01:13:06,760 --> 01:13:09,720
Speaker 1: out and go out and grab it. Let's start with

1359
01:13:09,800 --> 01:13:12,639
Speaker 1: the big news that you broke here. I'm sure our

1360
01:13:12,640 --> 01:13:16,280
Speaker 1: audience will recall. Shortly before election day there was a

1361
01:13:16,320 --> 01:13:20,559
Speaker 1: whole blow up in the media around Hunter Biden's alleged

1362
01:13:20,600 --> 01:13:23,960
Speaker 1: at that time laptop. There were there was a lot

1363
01:13:24,000 --> 01:13:27,800
Speaker 1: of allegations, oh maybe this is Russian disinformation. New York

1364
01:13:27,840 --> 01:13:30,960
Speaker 1: Post article comes down about it. It's censored by Twitter.

1365
01:13:31,000 --> 01:13:33,120
Speaker 1: You can't even share it because this came from sketchy

1366
01:13:33,120 --> 01:13:36,519
Speaker 1: sources and it might be Russian disinformation. You were able

1367
01:13:36,560 --> 01:13:40,599
Speaker 1: to nail down with your reporting that at least some

1368
01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:43,760
Speaker 1: of the emails that were exchanged on this laptop were

1369
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:46,719
Speaker 1: in fact legitimate layout for us what you found sure.

1370
01:13:46,800 --> 01:13:49,280
Speaker 1: So most importantly, I spoke to someone who for a

1371
01:13:49,320 --> 01:13:52,479
Speaker 1: time had some independent access to Hunter Biden's emails. They

1372
01:13:52,479 --> 01:13:55,760
Speaker 1: say he did receive an email from a Ukrainian businessman

1373
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:58,360
Speaker 1: thanking him for the chance to meet his father, and

1374
01:13:58,400 --> 01:14:01,080
Speaker 1: that he did receive an email from a business partner

1375
01:14:01,439 --> 01:14:04,640
Speaker 1: laying out the proposed equity structure for a venture with

1376
01:14:04,680 --> 01:14:08,080
Speaker 1: some Chinese business executives that included the line ten held

1377
01:14:08,280 --> 01:14:11,160
Speaker 1: held by h for the big Guy. Those were the

1378
01:14:11,200 --> 01:14:12,880
Speaker 1: lines that were at this sort of at the center

1379
01:14:12,920 --> 01:14:16,479
Speaker 1: of the controversy last October, the emails that were initially

1380
01:14:16,479 --> 01:14:18,920
Speaker 1: published by The New York Post. And I was also

1381
01:14:18,960 --> 01:14:21,800
Speaker 1: able to corroborate some other emails that didn't really make

1382
01:14:21,840 --> 01:14:23,680
Speaker 1: the news that just sort of show that there's other

1383
01:14:23,760 --> 01:14:26,360
Speaker 1: genuine material here. I spoke to a couple of people

1384
01:14:26,360 --> 01:14:29,519
Speaker 1: who corresponded with Hunter Biden in twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen.

1385
01:14:29,600 --> 01:14:32,599
Speaker 1: They said, yep, those messages or messages I did exchange

1386
01:14:32,640 --> 01:14:35,360
Speaker 1: with him, and then I obtained some emails from a

1387
01:14:35,400 --> 01:14:38,280
Speaker 1: Swedish government agency. For a while, Hunter Biden had an

1388
01:14:38,320 --> 01:14:41,400
Speaker 1: office in the complex on K Street that houses the

1389
01:14:41,400 --> 01:14:45,080
Speaker 1: Swedish embassy, so the Swedish government was essentially his landlord.

1390
01:14:45,920 --> 01:14:48,560
Speaker 1: They released me, you know, a half dozen or a

1391
01:14:48,600 --> 01:14:52,479
Speaker 1: dozen email exchanges, and those match emails in the cash.

1392
01:14:52,720 --> 01:14:54,640
Speaker 1: So what I can say is that some of this,

1393
01:14:55,080 --> 01:14:58,200
Speaker 1: some of this material at least is genuine. You know,

1394
01:14:58,280 --> 01:15:00,840
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I did not expect to blow up as

1395
01:15:00,920 --> 01:15:02,800
Speaker 1: much as it did your report on that some of

1396
01:15:02,840 --> 01:15:05,719
Speaker 1: it is genuine. The political press almost to be like, whoa,

1397
01:15:05,720 --> 01:15:07,760
Speaker 1: it's genuine. I mean, it seemed quite obvious to me,

1398
01:15:07,880 --> 01:15:10,040
Speaker 1: given the fact that he didn't deny it, the Biden

1399
01:15:10,400 --> 01:15:13,920
Speaker 1: campaign now administration continues to not deny it. It almost

1400
01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:16,559
Speaker 1: seems unfortunate that that's the top line news. I mean,

1401
01:15:16,640 --> 01:15:19,719
Speaker 1: there's so much more that's packed into the book. So first,

1402
01:15:19,760 --> 01:15:22,680
Speaker 1: just give your reaction in terms of like how exactly

1403
01:15:22,720 --> 01:15:25,360
Speaker 1: the media has responded to what you've put out, But

1404
01:15:25,479 --> 01:15:27,080
Speaker 1: just give us some more of a sense of what's

1405
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:28,720
Speaker 1: in there. I mean, this is an entire thing. You

1406
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:32,240
Speaker 1: really went inside of the Biden family, which is not

1407
01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:34,960
Speaker 1: nearly as well known as if you think about the

1408
01:15:35,080 --> 01:15:37,960
Speaker 1: characters of the Trump Junior and Kushner. I mean, even

1409
01:15:38,040 --> 01:15:41,680
Speaker 1: Clinton and his brother Roger. Everybody knew about that Obama

1410
01:15:41,840 --> 01:15:44,960
Speaker 1: right famously, Malik Obama, or his sister, or his mom

1411
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:47,200
Speaker 1: and his grandma, they all got a lot of scrutiny.

1412
01:15:47,240 --> 01:15:49,000
Speaker 1: We don't know very much about the Biden So your

1413
01:15:49,000 --> 01:15:50,519
Speaker 1: reaction and then just tell us a bit about the

1414
01:15:50,560 --> 01:15:53,320
Speaker 1: Bidens themselves. Yeah, I sort of knew that this would

1415
01:15:53,360 --> 01:15:55,679
Speaker 1: get some attention, but I also knew that for anyone

1416
01:15:55,680 --> 01:15:59,400
Speaker 1: that had really been paying close attention, this wouldn't come

1417
01:15:59,479 --> 01:16:02,720
Speaker 1: as a huge surprise. This was a massive global controversy.

1418
01:16:03,479 --> 01:16:06,799
Speaker 1: Nobody copied on these alleged at the time alleged emails

1419
01:16:07,560 --> 01:16:10,000
Speaker 1: came forward and said these are not authentic. Colenter Biden

1420
01:16:10,040 --> 01:16:14,439
Speaker 1: has never disputed the authenticity of these emails, and one

1421
01:16:14,479 --> 01:16:16,720
Speaker 1: of the recipients of one of these emails, Tony Babulenski,

1422
01:16:16,760 --> 01:16:19,519
Speaker 1: came forward and said, yes, this email is real, and

1423
01:16:19,640 --> 01:16:22,200
Speaker 1: yes ten held byites for the Big Guy did refer

1424
01:16:22,600 --> 01:16:25,320
Speaker 1: to plans to have Hunter hold equity on behalf of

1425
01:16:25,320 --> 01:16:28,840
Speaker 1: his father. Obviously, the Biden campaign has said Joe Biden

1426
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:33,360
Speaker 1: never considered doing anything like that. So it is definitely

1427
01:16:33,360 --> 01:16:36,280
Speaker 1: interesting to see the amount of attention this gets given

1428
01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:41,400
Speaker 1: how unsurprising it should be, I think to people, and

1429
01:16:41,439 --> 01:16:43,040
Speaker 1: in terms of what else is in this book, you know,

1430
01:16:43,360 --> 01:16:45,519
Speaker 1: where do I start? Some of my favorite parts of

1431
01:16:45,520 --> 01:16:49,040
Speaker 1: the book are actually about Delaware, the Delaware Way. There's

1432
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:53,200
Speaker 1: this incredible saga that's not really known about beer distributor

1433
01:16:53,200 --> 01:16:55,680
Speaker 1: in Delaware who had been a big campaign bundler for

1434
01:16:55,680 --> 01:16:59,599
Speaker 1: the bidens ends up going down on some campaign finance charges.

1435
01:16:59,640 --> 01:17:02,120
Speaker 1: But before where he does, where's a wire for the

1436
01:17:02,160 --> 01:17:06,160
Speaker 1: FBI goes after some people in Biden's inner circle. That

1437
01:17:07,080 --> 01:17:10,799
Speaker 1: investigation did not yield real evidence of wrongdoing by Joe Biden,

1438
01:17:10,880 --> 01:17:13,240
Speaker 1: but through the story of this guy, Chris Digany, you

1439
01:17:13,280 --> 01:17:18,200
Speaker 1: sort of go through, you know, the deep parts of

1440
01:17:18,280 --> 01:17:20,280
Speaker 1: Joe Biden's Delaware and I think it's a real glimpse

1441
01:17:20,280 --> 01:17:23,640
Speaker 1: of that. Yeah, so just talk up about the family dynamics.

1442
01:17:23,720 --> 01:17:27,760
Speaker 1: Who are the main players, How is Biden? Who? You know?

1443
01:17:27,800 --> 01:17:30,519
Speaker 1: We all do know the story about his wife and

1444
01:17:30,560 --> 01:17:33,680
Speaker 1: his baby daughter being killed tragically. Hunter and bo are

1445
01:17:33,680 --> 01:17:37,160
Speaker 1: in the car. They're injured. He just was elected senator,

1446
01:17:37,240 --> 01:17:39,400
Speaker 1: is twenty nine years old. He get sworn in next

1447
01:17:39,439 --> 01:17:42,160
Speaker 1: to our hospital bed. Who is there to sort of

1448
01:17:42,200 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 1: like watch the family keep things together and make this

1449
01:17:45,200 --> 01:17:48,040
Speaker 1: all work as he's going to watch Washington to serve

1450
01:17:48,040 --> 01:17:50,439
Speaker 1: as a United States Senator. So it really is a

1451
01:17:50,479 --> 01:17:54,559
Speaker 1: team effort. Starting with the first Senate campaign in nineteen

1452
01:17:54,560 --> 01:17:57,120
Speaker 1: seventy two, it's run by his family members. Vows the

1453
01:17:57,120 --> 01:18:01,439
Speaker 1: campaign manager, his brother Jimmy, one of his younger brothers,

1454
01:18:01,520 --> 01:18:06,679
Speaker 1: heads up fundraising. And so when Neelia and Amy die,

1455
01:18:06,760 --> 01:18:09,680
Speaker 1: his wife and baby daughter again, it's Valin Jimmy who

1456
01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:11,800
Speaker 1: really step up. They move in with the family and

1457
01:18:11,840 --> 01:18:14,599
Speaker 1: they essentially raise Bowen Hunter while Joe Biden is off

1458
01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:17,479
Speaker 1: being a Senator. And that is really the story of

1459
01:18:17,560 --> 01:18:20,960
Speaker 1: the family from beginning to end. They do everything as

1460
01:18:21,000 --> 01:18:24,200
Speaker 1: a family. It really is a team. It's really interesting,

1461
01:18:24,240 --> 01:18:27,400
Speaker 1: you know, pointing to that, and James Biden seems to

1462
01:18:27,520 --> 01:18:29,720
Speaker 1: escape a lot of scrutiny. The only reason I even

1463
01:18:29,720 --> 01:18:32,680
Speaker 1: know anything about him is through your early work at Politico,

1464
01:18:33,160 --> 01:18:35,680
Speaker 1: reading some of the pitch decks and things. He was,

1465
01:18:36,000 --> 01:18:39,439
Speaker 1: let's just say, not shy whatsoever at peddling his he's

1466
01:18:39,479 --> 01:18:42,439
Speaker 1: like my brother the vice president soon to be president.

1467
01:18:42,640 --> 01:18:44,719
Speaker 1: That's why we should probably make a deal on healthcare

1468
01:18:44,840 --> 01:18:48,160
Speaker 1: or whatever. How exactly did that come about? I mean,

1469
01:18:48,280 --> 01:18:52,360
Speaker 1: is this a facet of Biden's long career in the Senate. Obviously,

1470
01:18:52,400 --> 01:18:56,000
Speaker 1: these behaviors become learned in a way. Yeah, that's a

1471
01:18:56,000 --> 01:18:57,920
Speaker 1: big theme of the book, actually, which is that this

1472
01:18:58,000 --> 01:19:00,840
Speaker 1: is a family that does not come from money. They

1473
01:19:00,840 --> 01:19:04,160
Speaker 1: did not come from any sort of well connected background.

1474
01:19:05,200 --> 01:19:07,360
Speaker 1: They don't have you know, they don't have a lot

1475
01:19:07,360 --> 01:19:09,960
Speaker 1: of advantages in this world until all of a sudden,

1476
01:19:10,000 --> 01:19:14,160
Speaker 1: they get their brother, their son, their husband elected United

1477
01:19:14,160 --> 01:19:15,960
Speaker 1: States Senator at the age of twenty nine and the

1478
01:19:15,960 --> 01:19:18,840
Speaker 1: biggest upset of nineteen seventy two, and all of a sudden,

1479
01:19:18,920 --> 01:19:20,559
Speaker 1: you know, that's sort of the golden ticket. They're on

1480
01:19:20,600 --> 01:19:24,280
Speaker 1: the inside of the American system, and they learn over

1481
01:19:24,320 --> 01:19:27,040
Speaker 1: the years, you know, what the advantages of that can be.

1482
01:19:27,960 --> 01:19:31,160
Speaker 1: And Jimmy who starts he learns the ropes of politics

1483
01:19:31,200 --> 01:19:33,320
Speaker 1: as a twenty three year old. He's coming up to Washington,

1484
01:19:33,400 --> 01:19:36,599
Speaker 1: d C. He's talking to union bosses, other interests, trying

1485
01:19:36,600 --> 01:19:38,920
Speaker 1: to get them interested in his kid brother, and so

1486
01:19:39,040 --> 01:19:42,680
Speaker 1: he understands the intersection of money in politics better than

1487
01:19:42,720 --> 01:19:44,519
Speaker 1: probably any other twenty three year old in the United

1488
01:19:44,560 --> 01:19:47,519
Speaker 1: States at that point, and the trajectory of his business

1489
01:19:47,520 --> 01:19:52,840
Speaker 1: career from there basically illustrates the ways in which his

1490
01:19:52,960 --> 01:19:57,920
Speaker 1: connections to Washington, his influence, his highest influential people, can

1491
01:19:57,960 --> 01:20:01,639
Speaker 1: be helpful to a business career and can potentially land

1492
01:20:01,680 --> 01:20:04,160
Speaker 1: his brother in hot water or at least create some

1493
01:20:04,280 --> 01:20:06,800
Speaker 1: unseemly appearances in some of these dealings over the years.

1494
01:20:07,520 --> 01:20:12,320
Speaker 1: My experience with your reporting is that you really, you know,

1495
01:20:12,400 --> 01:20:15,240
Speaker 1: take a pretty fair and critical lens, no matter what

1496
01:20:15,400 --> 01:20:17,880
Speaker 1: the party, whether it's someone who's in favor of the

1497
01:20:17,880 --> 01:20:19,960
Speaker 1: mainstream media or not in favor with the mainstream media,

1498
01:20:19,960 --> 01:20:21,519
Speaker 1: which is part of why, you know, we really wanted

1499
01:20:21,520 --> 01:20:23,960
Speaker 1: to have you on and talk about this book. Is

1500
01:20:24,000 --> 01:20:29,879
Speaker 1: it your sense covering Washington that the Bidens are unique

1501
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:33,280
Speaker 1: in the level of sort of trading access and favors

1502
01:20:33,280 --> 01:20:35,719
Speaker 1: and trading on the family name, or do you think

1503
01:20:35,760 --> 01:20:39,200
Speaker 1: that they're firmly in the mainstream of basically how this

1504
01:20:39,280 --> 01:20:43,599
Speaker 1: town operates. You know, I haven't gone as deep on

1505
01:20:44,080 --> 01:20:46,880
Speaker 1: every other political family in Washington as I have on

1506
01:20:46,920 --> 01:20:51,240
Speaker 1: the Bidens. I would say that they're probably emblematic of,

1507
01:20:52,400 --> 01:20:54,559
Speaker 1: you know, the Washington establishment, people who have been in

1508
01:20:54,600 --> 01:20:57,960
Speaker 1: power for a long time, who understand that there are

1509
01:20:58,000 --> 01:21:02,960
Speaker 1: advantages to proximity of power, proximity to power, people who

1510
01:21:03,240 --> 01:21:06,519
Speaker 1: you know, have not landed themselves in an incredible amount

1511
01:21:06,520 --> 01:21:10,200
Speaker 1: of hot water. But there are often, you know, questions

1512
01:21:10,200 --> 01:21:12,840
Speaker 1: of propriety raised by some of these dealings. Just look

1513
01:21:12,880 --> 01:21:16,760
Speaker 1: at you know, Hunter Biden's work for Barrisma. Yeah, and

1514
01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:18,400
Speaker 1: so I think that, you know, in a in a

1515
01:21:18,439 --> 01:21:21,760
Speaker 1: different election against a different opponent, someone else might have

1516
01:21:21,800 --> 01:21:24,960
Speaker 1: really successfully painted them as symbols of the Washington establishment

1517
01:21:25,439 --> 01:21:29,000
Speaker 1: in a negative way. Trump ultimately didn't succeed in doing that,

1518
01:21:29,360 --> 01:21:32,160
Speaker 1: but it's possible that this is something that that rears

1519
01:21:32,160 --> 01:21:34,080
Speaker 1: its head again if Joe Biden runs again. You know,

1520
01:21:34,320 --> 01:21:37,680
Speaker 1: I'm interested. Hunter always comes across in your work as

1521
01:21:37,800 --> 01:21:40,640
Speaker 1: just this extremely tragic figure, and I mean he is

1522
01:21:40,840 --> 01:21:44,080
Speaker 1: right in terms of the way he's raised. Obviously, you know,

1523
01:21:44,200 --> 01:21:46,840
Speaker 1: Joe favored Bo his brother, who was you know, kind

1524
01:21:46,840 --> 01:21:50,960
Speaker 1: of groomed and meant to be this next big political figure,

1525
01:21:50,960 --> 01:21:53,639
Speaker 1: and he's the one that's left survival guilt all of that.

1526
01:21:54,200 --> 01:21:59,679
Speaker 1: What exactly you know, typifies like his behavior throughout Biden's career.

1527
01:21:59,680 --> 01:22:03,479
Speaker 1: He just seems like this wild card and Biden very

1528
01:22:03,520 --> 01:22:06,639
Speaker 1: strangely because he conceives of himself I can tell as

1529
01:22:06,760 --> 01:22:11,040
Speaker 1: stand up guy. How does he look at the barisma,

1530
01:22:11,560 --> 01:22:16,799
Speaker 1: I mean Amtrak, I mean credit card lobbying, the art sales.

1531
01:22:17,000 --> 01:22:20,120
Speaker 1: How does he justify that in his head? His treatment

1532
01:22:20,160 --> 01:22:22,439
Speaker 1: of his son, Is it just like a sympathy thing, like,

1533
01:22:22,439 --> 01:22:25,320
Speaker 1: how does he square that with the square Scranton person

1534
01:22:25,320 --> 01:22:28,320
Speaker 1: that he conceives of himself of. One of the themes

1535
01:22:28,360 --> 01:22:31,559
Speaker 1: that I see really really early on it's going back

1536
01:22:31,600 --> 01:22:35,120
Speaker 1: to the beginning of Joe's childhood, is that his parents

1537
01:22:35,160 --> 01:22:39,640
Speaker 1: impress upon him and his siblings that inside this household

1538
01:22:39,960 --> 01:22:42,679
Speaker 1: you can fight with each other as much as you want.

1539
01:22:42,960 --> 01:22:45,880
Speaker 1: Outside of this household, you are Biden's and you are

1540
01:22:45,920 --> 01:22:48,360
Speaker 1: sticking together, and you will never speak ill of each

1541
01:22:48,400 --> 01:22:50,840
Speaker 1: other outside of this household. And there's a story from

1542
01:22:50,880 --> 01:22:53,240
Speaker 1: Joe's childhood. He's something like a hall monitor on the

1543
01:22:53,280 --> 01:22:56,439
Speaker 1: school bus and valdes something she's not supposed to do,

1544
01:22:56,520 --> 01:22:59,280
Speaker 1: and he has this dilemma and he goes to his sister, Yes,

1545
01:22:59,400 --> 01:23:03,439
Speaker 1: excuse me, sister about val And and Joe Biden goes

1546
01:23:03,479 --> 01:23:05,599
Speaker 1: to his father and says, I have this dilemma. You know,

1547
01:23:05,800 --> 01:23:08,320
Speaker 1: val was I forget what it was, you know, queuing

1548
01:23:08,320 --> 01:23:11,439
Speaker 1: gum on the boss or whatever. I was told that

1549
01:23:11,520 --> 01:23:13,679
Speaker 1: I have to I have to monitor this and report

1550
01:23:13,720 --> 01:23:16,519
Speaker 1: it to the nuns. Uh. And his father says, well, Son,

1551
01:23:16,560 --> 01:23:18,080
Speaker 1: I guess you're gonna have to turn in that badge.

1552
01:23:18,120 --> 01:23:21,559
Speaker 1: And Joe Biden is no longer a home monitor after that. Wow.

1553
01:23:21,760 --> 01:23:24,400
Speaker 1: And I think that that is sort of emblematic of

1554
01:23:24,479 --> 01:23:28,599
Speaker 1: the dilemma where Hunter Biden uh does something that does

1555
01:23:28,640 --> 01:23:32,160
Speaker 1: not look good, like take this position with Barisma, Uh,

1556
01:23:32,479 --> 01:23:35,400
Speaker 1: start selling paintings for up to half a million dollars

1557
01:23:35,479 --> 01:23:40,200
Speaker 1: at Peace Talented right, Yeah, or engages in, you know,

1558
01:23:40,240 --> 01:23:42,880
Speaker 1: in a relationship with Bo's widow and asks his father,

1559
01:23:43,000 --> 01:23:45,480
Speaker 1: will you please go on the record blessing this relationship?

1560
01:23:45,760 --> 01:23:48,599
Speaker 1: And his father does it. And so there's just sort

1561
01:23:48,600 --> 01:23:50,559
Speaker 1: of no world in which Joe Biden is going to

1562
01:23:50,560 --> 01:23:53,840
Speaker 1: publicly say yes, I acknowledge that there are things that

1563
01:23:54,560 --> 01:23:57,720
Speaker 1: are or appear to be ontoured about anything that any

1564
01:23:57,760 --> 01:24:01,000
Speaker 1: of his relatives do. Interesting. I'm going to take a

1565
01:24:01,040 --> 01:24:03,920
Speaker 1: wild guest that you've probably gotten a bunch of Fox

1566
01:24:04,000 --> 01:24:08,000
Speaker 1: News requests for appearances and probably have not gotten a

1567
01:24:08,000 --> 01:24:13,360
Speaker 1: lot of MSNBC or CNN requests for appearances to speak

1568
01:24:13,400 --> 01:24:16,160
Speaker 1: to that piece of this, because again, I you know,

1569
01:24:16,240 --> 01:24:18,960
Speaker 1: my experience with your reporting is your you're truly fair.

1570
01:24:19,160 --> 01:24:22,040
Speaker 1: You know, you follow the facts where they lead. Obviously,

1571
01:24:22,400 --> 01:24:25,280
Speaker 1: this guy's in the White House, like val is still

1572
01:24:25,280 --> 01:24:29,360
Speaker 1: incredibly important as a political advisor within his circle. I

1573
01:24:29,400 --> 01:24:31,920
Speaker 1: know she's one of the people that he really listens to.

1574
01:24:32,360 --> 01:24:35,080
Speaker 1: There's a small cadre of them that you know, always

1575
01:24:35,080 --> 01:24:40,439
Speaker 1: have his ear. Does is it sort of Is it

1576
01:24:40,479 --> 01:24:44,040
Speaker 1: just depressing to you or disappointing to you that there

1577
01:24:44,040 --> 01:24:48,559
Speaker 1: seems to be selective interest in digging into some of

1578
01:24:48,600 --> 01:24:53,800
Speaker 1: the you know, less favorable aspects of Joe Biden's rise. Well,

1579
01:24:53,840 --> 01:24:55,400
Speaker 1: what I what I will say is that it's been

1580
01:24:55,479 --> 01:24:59,320
Speaker 1: very encouraging to me that my editors at Politico have said,

1581
01:24:59,320 --> 01:25:01,840
Speaker 1: you know, report with out fear or fit, whether it's

1582
01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:04,519
Speaker 1: whether it's Donald Trump or Joe Biden or anybody else,

1583
01:25:05,200 --> 01:25:08,639
Speaker 1: that's you know, consistently been the marching orders. And that's

1584
01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:10,439
Speaker 1: what that's what the work shows, that's what the output

1585
01:25:10,439 --> 01:25:13,599
Speaker 1: of political shows. You know, we're still we're still pitching

1586
01:25:13,600 --> 01:25:15,840
Speaker 1: all sorts of networks and outlets that we hope will

1587
01:25:15,880 --> 01:25:18,640
Speaker 1: be interested in this, okay, And I do think it

1588
01:25:18,680 --> 01:25:20,920
Speaker 1: is important to pay attention to these business dealings and

1589
01:25:20,960 --> 01:25:23,920
Speaker 1: the financial dealings of the Bidens. We've just emerged from

1590
01:25:23,920 --> 01:25:26,240
Speaker 1: the Trump era. It was a wash in ethics, scandals,

1591
01:25:26,320 --> 01:25:30,040
Speaker 1: questions about family members of the president and their business

1592
01:25:30,080 --> 01:25:33,599
Speaker 1: dealings and how they intersected with his official powers. It's

1593
01:25:33,600 --> 01:25:35,640
Speaker 1: a separate set of questions. It's you know, it's not

1594
01:25:35,680 --> 01:25:38,960
Speaker 1: apples to apples, but uh, these issues arise again and

1595
01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:41,800
Speaker 1: again over the course of Joe Biden's public life, and

1596
01:25:41,840 --> 01:25:45,240
Speaker 1: it's important that that, you know, any any outlet that's

1597
01:25:45,360 --> 01:25:49,080
Speaker 1: job is to scrutinize the presidency be doing that. And

1598
01:25:49,120 --> 01:25:50,719
Speaker 1: I will say that that I think with this Hunter

1599
01:25:50,800 --> 01:25:54,639
Speaker 1: Biden Hunter Biden painting venture, you have seen pretty widespread

1600
01:25:54,680 --> 01:25:56,439
Speaker 1: coverage of it, and I think it's in negative of

1601
01:25:56,479 --> 01:25:59,639
Speaker 1: the fact that people you know, understand that this is important.

1602
01:25:59,800 --> 01:26:02,080
Speaker 1: It's a little too on the nose the painting, right, Yes,

1603
01:26:03,720 --> 01:26:06,240
Speaker 1: a bit much. Do you have any place particularly want

1604
01:26:06,280 --> 01:26:08,400
Speaker 1: people to go find the book? You and everything? So,

1605
01:26:08,640 --> 01:26:10,160
Speaker 1: do you have a place you would like whatever your

1606
01:26:10,160 --> 01:26:13,040
Speaker 1: favorite bookstore? Is it's on Amazon, It's it's hopefully everywhere

1607
01:26:13,080 --> 01:26:14,840
Speaker 1: you can. You can get the e book version all

1608
01:26:14,880 --> 01:26:17,080
Speaker 1: over the place. Awesome. Yeah, and where can they find

1609
01:26:17,120 --> 01:26:20,160
Speaker 1: you your work? You can go on Twitter at Shrek Reports.

1610
01:26:20,200 --> 01:26:25,040
Speaker 1: Good luck spelling that, Srik Reports. Okay, yeah, well we'll

1611
01:26:25,040 --> 01:26:26,880
Speaker 1: have links down there in the description to all of that.

1612
01:26:26,960 --> 01:26:28,720
Speaker 1: Ben just want to say, like one of the few

1613
01:26:28,720 --> 01:26:31,320
Speaker 1: people who really chases after it, no matter the consequences.

1614
01:26:31,360 --> 01:26:33,920
Speaker 1: So real, props to you. I hope everyday goes and

1615
01:26:33,960 --> 01:26:36,679
Speaker 1: buys the book and you're real what are the journalists

1616
01:26:36,680 --> 01:26:38,400
Speaker 1: in this town really should be so thank you. Yeah,

1617
01:26:38,479 --> 01:26:40,639
Speaker 1: congrats on the book. Thanks so much. I'm so glad

1618
01:26:40,680 --> 01:26:43,280
Speaker 1: you guys had me on absolutely, sir, Thank you guys

1619
01:26:43,280 --> 01:26:45,160
Speaker 1: so much for watching. We really appreciate it. I hope

1620
01:26:45,200 --> 01:26:47,760
Speaker 1: you guys enjoy the interview. And look, we've been trying

1621
01:26:47,760 --> 01:26:50,360
Speaker 1: to draw as much visibility to this as possible. Covering

1622
01:26:50,400 --> 01:26:54,400
Speaker 1: the news here apparently has consequences. Our stuff gets demonetized

1623
01:26:54,600 --> 01:26:57,439
Speaker 1: by YouTube all the time. The latest example was we

1624
01:26:57,479 --> 01:27:02,479
Speaker 1: covered that Roe versus Wade segment again, I mean Supreme

1625
01:27:02,520 --> 01:27:06,120
Speaker 1: Court breaking down the pology, a major news story across

1626
01:27:06,160 --> 01:27:10,120
Speaker 1: the country, and it was demonetized for the entire time

1627
01:27:10,160 --> 01:27:12,840
Speaker 1: that was basically live until like twenty four hours or

1628
01:27:12,920 --> 01:27:15,599
Speaker 1: something later, at which point you're not eligible to like

1629
01:27:15,800 --> 01:27:19,320
Speaker 1: you don't make like back wages, right, So it's like,

1630
01:27:19,360 --> 01:27:21,639
Speaker 1: what's the point, you know, I mean, all we're trying

1631
01:27:21,640 --> 01:27:24,200
Speaker 1: to point to is that the only way. And again,

1632
01:27:24,320 --> 01:27:26,920
Speaker 1: it will not impact our coverage. I guarantee you one

1633
01:27:26,960 --> 01:27:28,920
Speaker 1: of the segments today will likely be done, maybe the

1634
01:27:28,960 --> 01:27:31,680
Speaker 1: Gabby to Potito one. It wouldn't surprise me if the

1635
01:27:31,720 --> 01:27:34,599
Speaker 1: Hunter Biden one does as well. But here's the thing.

1636
01:27:34,680 --> 01:27:36,760
Speaker 1: We rely on you guys to make sure that we

1637
01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:40,200
Speaker 1: do not care whatsoever about YouTube revenue. If it's going

1638
01:27:40,280 --> 01:27:41,960
Speaker 1: to swing down as much as it has this month,

1639
01:27:42,600 --> 01:27:44,880
Speaker 1: so be it, because we don't rely on that to

1640
01:27:44,920 --> 01:27:46,559
Speaker 1: pay our bills, and if we did, we wouldn't be

1641
01:27:46,560 --> 01:27:49,639
Speaker 1: able to. So yeah, premium link down there description Obviously

1642
01:27:49,680 --> 01:27:52,280
Speaker 1: we offer benefits, but really this is just about bringing

1643
01:27:52,280 --> 01:27:54,439
Speaker 1: you the news exactly the way that we think it's

1644
01:27:54,439 --> 01:27:57,439
Speaker 1: important to do. One hundred percent. Thanks for backing us up, guys.

1645
01:27:58,080 --> 01:28:00,800
Speaker 1: It means everything. It allows us to do this and

1646
01:28:00,960 --> 01:28:04,280
Speaker 1: just to really cover what we think matters and is

1647
01:28:04,320 --> 01:28:07,120
Speaker 1: going to be important and relevant. For you. A little

1648
01:28:07,160 --> 01:28:09,840
Speaker 1: programming note. Next week, the schedule is going to be

1649
01:28:10,080 --> 01:28:13,840
Speaker 1: slightly different. Normally we're Monday, Tuesday Thursday. Next week it's

1650
01:28:13,880 --> 01:28:16,280
Speaker 1: going to be Monday Wednesday Thursday. There's a conflict here

1651
01:28:16,320 --> 01:28:19,280
Speaker 1: at the studio, no big deal, but so Monday Wednesday Thursday.

1652
01:28:19,560 --> 01:28:21,160
Speaker 1: Also over the weekend, we're going to be putting out

1653
01:28:21,200 --> 01:28:23,320
Speaker 1: the mini show of the weekend content, so look for

1654
01:28:23,320 --> 01:28:26,599
Speaker 1: that on podcast. Also, those videos will be posting over

1655
01:28:26,680 --> 01:28:30,000
Speaker 1: the weekend. And one other little thing, I'll do a

1656
01:28:30,040 --> 01:28:34,200
Speaker 1: little teas here. Got a little new partnership that we're

1657
01:28:34,200 --> 01:28:36,880
Speaker 1: going to be able to announce next week that we're

1658
01:28:36,920 --> 01:28:39,160
Speaker 1: excited about. I think you guys will be excited about

1659
01:28:39,160 --> 01:28:41,599
Speaker 1: it too, so stay tuned for that as well. Love

1660
01:28:41,600 --> 01:28:44,000
Speaker 1: you guys, Stay safe this weekend, enjoy yourselves, and we'll

1661
01:28:44,000 --> 01:29:00,000
Speaker 1: see you back here next week. See you Monday. Thanks

1662
01:29:00,000 --> 01:29:02,000
Speaker 1: we're listening to the show, guys, we really appreciate it.

1663
01:29:02,000 --> 01:29:04,040
Speaker 1: To help other people find the show, go ahead and

1664
01:29:04,080 --> 01:29:06,920
Speaker 1: leave us a five star rating on Apple Podcasts or

1665
01:29:06,960 --> 01:29:10,160
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. Really helps other people find

1666
01:29:10,280 --> 01:29:13,800
Speaker 1: the show. As always special. Thank you to Supercast for

1667
01:29:13,920 --> 01:29:16,800
Speaker 1: powering our premium membership. If you want to find out more,

1668
01:29:16,920 --> 01:29:19,120
Speaker 1: go to crystalansager dot com.