1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,120 Speaker 1: This is mesters in business with very renaults on Bloomberg Radio. 2 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: This week on the podcast, I have an extra special guest. 3 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: His name is Dan Chung and he has been with 4 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:20,200 Speaker 1: Algier Asset Management since where he started out in the 5 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: e commerce and technology sector as an analyst before eventually 6 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:30,360 Speaker 1: becoming president, chief Investment Officer, and then CEO. UH. Dan 7 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:34,159 Speaker 1: Chung has been uh running that firm for quite a 8 00:00:34,159 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 1: while with quite a tremendous track record. The firm has 9 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:42,199 Speaker 1: dollars in assets. In addition to the CEO and c 10 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 1: i O rolls, he also runs a couple of different 11 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: portfolios to a great acclaim. Um Alger is you know, 12 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: best known as founded by Fred Alger. We talk a 13 00:00:54,520 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 1: little bit about various mentors as well as what the 14 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 1: firm's experience was in nine eleven and what they've done 15 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: after that in terms of the room philanthropy. UH, they're 16 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 1: a fairly unique growth firm that focuses on UM tech, healthcare, 17 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:13,399 Speaker 1: variety of other things, specifically growth companies, and we go 18 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:16,800 Speaker 1: over how they're managing through uh what is both a 19 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 1: challenging but target rich period with great opportunities. UH. So, 20 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: with no further ado, my interview with Alger Managements Dan Chung. 21 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:34,559 Speaker 1: This is Masters in Business with very Renaults on Bloomberg Radio. 22 00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:40,120 Speaker 1: My extra special guest this week is Dan Chung. He 23 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 1: is the Chief Investment Officer and Chief Executive Officer at 24 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 1: Alger Management, which runs over thirty five billion dollars in assets. 25 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 1: He's been c i O since two thousand and one. 26 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: He earned his j d from Harvard in eight seven, 27 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 1: got a master's in law from n YU before going 28 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 1: to Clark for the Honorable Justice Anthony Kennedy at the 29 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: Supreme Court of the United States. He is also portfolio 30 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:09,160 Speaker 1: manager for multiple funds and strategies, including the four and 31 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 1: a half billion dollar Alger Spectra Funds. H Dan Chung, 32 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: Welcome to Bloomberg Than. So, I've been looking forward to 33 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: having this conversation with you for a while, and I 34 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 1: have to start by asking you had a storybook legal career. 35 00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: What happened? What made you say, Yeah, the hell with 36 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 1: Harvard in the Supreme Court, I'm gonna switch gears and 37 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: try something totally now. Yeah, it was. It was a 38 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 1: storybook career, and uh, if I had a another opportunity, 39 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 1: I probably would have tested out what the legal world 40 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:43,399 Speaker 1: would have been like, but and where where where many 41 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:47,800 Speaker 1: of my friends still are today? Um, including Justice Selena Kagan? 42 00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:52,240 Speaker 1: Were you a colleague of We co Clark together and 43 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:53,919 Speaker 1: we went to law school together, and we served on 44 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:57,400 Speaker 1: the Larvae together. And she's an amazing person. So it's 45 00:02:57,480 --> 00:02:59,799 Speaker 1: very weird to have a friend who becomes a Supreme 46 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 1: col Right, that's kind of interesting. Do you guys ever 47 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: stay in touch? Do you have a chat? You know? 48 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 1: I was just getting to the point in my career 49 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 1: where I wanted to sort of give back to the 50 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: Harvard Law School. At the time, she was the dean, 51 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:16,120 Speaker 1: so she talked about a story career. She was the dean, 52 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: and so that the last time I I saw her 53 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: on a one on one situation, it was like, you know, 54 00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: talking about let's do something law and business and and 55 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 1: my whole issue was that lawyers um are uh, you know, 56 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:31,880 Speaker 1: the vast majority of them are consulting in some way 57 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:34,639 Speaker 1: for businesses and they don't understand the business at all, 58 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 1: and and it reduces the quality of the work. And 59 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: she was she was very into it, um and um. 60 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: And then I don't know, a couple of months later, 61 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: she's nominated for the Supreme Court. So that's all over. 62 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: So she saved you writing a check. Yeah that's true. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 63 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 1: I save the money. So you end up at Simpson Thatcher, 64 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 1: which was known for international law and and corporate law 65 00:03:57,000 --> 00:03:59,840 Speaker 1: and litigation. Right, what were you doing for them? And 66 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: then how did that end up transferring over to finance? Right? So, Um, 67 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 1: my parents are both academics and knew absolutely nothing about 68 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: Wall Street and only a little bit about business generally. I, 69 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:17,719 Speaker 1: on the other hand, was always interested in it, probably 70 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: not in a very educated way, but probably from like 71 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:22,680 Speaker 1: things like the movies. Um, I did grow up in 72 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,599 Speaker 1: the Silicon Valley and so, but my Silicon Valley was 73 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:30,600 Speaker 1: Hewlett Packard, not undergraduate Stanford, undergraduate Stanford. So there was 74 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:34,479 Speaker 1: an interest I had there in in the business in 75 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 1: Wall Street and and frankly in New York, you know, 76 00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:41,839 Speaker 1: and like the Frank Sinmetris song, you know, if you 77 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: can make it here, you can make it anywhere. And 78 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 1: so I wanted I wanted to In some ways, I 79 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 1: was more driven by the idea, come to New York, 80 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,600 Speaker 1: work at a top notch law firm. That will be 81 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 1: a way to learn about business as well as you 82 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 1: know business law. UM. And essentially along the way, I 83 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 1: realized I loved the clients who were UM making deals 84 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:11,839 Speaker 1: complicated financial investments. Uh, you know, using you know numbers, 85 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: accounting analysis fundamental as well as accounting analysis to figure out, 86 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 1: you know, what's the what's the right paris to pay 87 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 1: for something and you know, UM and UM. But I 88 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 1: was just I was, as a lawyer, just an observer 89 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 1: on the You're not making any decisions really, And so 90 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 1: at some point I realized I thought I would be 91 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:33,279 Speaker 1: more interested in that, and I thought I would be 92 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,080 Speaker 1: good at it. So I so I started to call 93 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: around Wall Street to try to get a job on 94 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 1: Wall Street basically. And what was that process like? Well, UM, 95 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:47,040 Speaker 1: it started off extremely well in that the first person 96 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:51,880 Speaker 1: I told was a client UM. And it was like, 97 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:55,720 Speaker 1: I don't know what their title was. UM, certainly a VP, 98 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: not an m D, I believe, but you're not the 99 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 1: head of the group. UM. But it was the Financial 100 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:06,240 Speaker 1: Derivatives and Complex financial Instruments group UM Merrill Lynch. So 101 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:08,040 Speaker 1: I always think very fondly, Mary Lynch. They're a big 102 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 1: client of ours. Thank you, Meryl UM and the associate. 103 00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: You know, we've been working on something in the associate. 104 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:16,000 Speaker 1: I told the associate, we've become friendly and and he said, 105 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:18,880 Speaker 1: if you're leaving Simpson, I am sure my boss would 106 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: want to talk to you, probably give you a job. 107 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 1: I said, okay, great, So so I go down and 108 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:28,880 Speaker 1: meet his boss and UM, he says, like, I loved 109 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:32,919 Speaker 1: working with you. You know, Uh, my dad was a 110 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: math professor. So he actually said something to the effective, 111 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 1: you're one of the few lawyers who seemed to actually 112 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:39,680 Speaker 1: understand and like the math that we're doing here that's 113 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: around the options and derivatives, and I, you know, and 114 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:47,159 Speaker 1: uh basically gave me a job offer. Um before I 115 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: left his office, and he said it's a standing offer 116 00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 1: Staya Sampson if you want, but anytime you want to leave, 117 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:54,119 Speaker 1: you've got an offer here for our group Merrill Lynch 118 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 1: and UM. So so that that's a confidence booster right 119 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 1: So here. Then I started looking around. So was it 120 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:08,680 Speaker 1: the pre existing math skills that translated to finance or 121 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: was it some of the legal training and experience that 122 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: that helps you once you started having a career in investing. Um, 123 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 1: I would say the math skills, it's more about a 124 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 1: numbers sense, seeing patterns in numbers, liking statistics, understanding probabilities, 125 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: and again I mentioned my father again, but he was 126 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: actually a professor of probability theory, so which I think 127 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:42,200 Speaker 1: is much more important for investors than the bulk of 128 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 1: what you're gonna learn in the CFA exam. Yes, I mean, 129 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:49,960 Speaker 1: investing is basically first recognizing that nobody knows anything about 130 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 1: the future. Anybody who tells you they're predicting the future, 131 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:55,480 Speaker 1: you know, it sounds like they're so confident that they're 132 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 1: going to be right. It's like you know they're selling something. 133 00:07:57,920 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: They're selling you something. So the only way really do 134 00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:03,360 Speaker 1: pro at least from my perspective and algers, is where 135 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 1: the probabilities of a bearer case, the base case, a 136 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,160 Speaker 1: bowl case. You know what's the black Swan event, and 137 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:12,240 Speaker 1: you know what works and what doesn't work? What are 138 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: the values you know? And and and the stock market 139 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 1: obviously is is I mean, it is the greatest real 140 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: world probability machine, right, I mean, the price of of 141 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: any asset in the stock market is essentially the combined 142 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:34,559 Speaker 1: probabilities of everybody bullish, bearish, neutral, ignorant, highly informed insiders outsiders. 143 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:38,439 Speaker 1: What is that worth? And it changes because things happen 144 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 1: and people change their minds a little bit, sometimes too 145 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 1: much and sometimes not enough right, And and that I 146 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 1: think has always been, Um, I've always been I think 147 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:51,200 Speaker 1: very good numbers since I didn't had to prove it Alger. 148 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 1: You know, I thought I had good numbers since I 149 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 1: think I think, uh, I think I proved it an Alger. 150 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:58,320 Speaker 1: But the law, I don't want to underestimate the law 151 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 1: did it did help me a lot, I think, um one, 152 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:07,719 Speaker 1: I like complex situations because I know that a lot 153 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:10,160 Speaker 1: of people don't or they just don't want to take 154 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 1: the time to dig into them. And so as a 155 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 1: fundamental investing shop, getting into the details, getting into the 156 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 1: complex situations is sometimes where you get the most opportunity 157 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 1: because of that. And then on the flip side, running 158 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:28,559 Speaker 1: the business. Lawyers are are very disciplined, organized, detail, deadline oriented, 159 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: all of which is pretty good um for a career, 160 00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 1: but it's it's especially good if you're trying to run 161 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:36,959 Speaker 1: a business. So, so, how did you end up at Algae? 162 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 1: You join in? Was that your first job in finance 163 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 1: out of Simpson Thatcher first job in finance? Um? And 164 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:53,319 Speaker 1: uh I ended up there because uh I so I've 165 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 1: gotten a couple offers um on walls rate. I had 166 00:09:57,559 --> 00:09:59,400 Speaker 1: the Mary Lynch one, I had another. I hadn't gotten 167 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:03,760 Speaker 1: another off for UM, and I thought, you know, I 168 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:09,720 Speaker 1: don't really know any serious Wall Street you know, um, 169 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 1: senior mentor types. So I should I should try to 170 00:10:13,160 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: find one to ask their advice, like where should I go? 171 00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:18,560 Speaker 1: And at the time, the only one that I knew 172 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: was my uh father in law, my my, my just 173 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,960 Speaker 1: my Fred Alger had just become my father in law. June. 174 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 1: I married his daughter, Alexandra, my wife today. Uh. Still, 175 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:35,160 Speaker 1: I can't believe it's been twenty nine years. Um. So 176 00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: I hadn't really met him much, UM, but I knew 177 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 1: he was on Wall Street, and I knew that he 178 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:41,720 Speaker 1: did investing, and so I figured, this is a great 179 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:44,600 Speaker 1: guy to ask, um, I must know the whole landscape. 180 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:48,319 Speaker 1: And uh, I'll never forget that I didn't know him 181 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:51,000 Speaker 1: really very well. You know, it's sort of like, h 182 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:53,760 Speaker 1: of course we were engaged. So I met him in 183 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 1: some really kind of formal dinner with his his wife 184 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: and you know, I'm my son in law. I have 185 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: to admit I didn't ask him permission to marry his daughter. 186 00:11:04,120 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 1: I was she isn't that kind of woman, and I'm 187 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 1: I'm not. I wasn't that kind of guy. I sort 188 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 1: of regret that maybe I should have done it. Now, Um, 189 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: her kids are doing that now again, you know, but 190 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: I'm more like a seventies kid, because seventies kids didn't 191 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:22,959 Speaker 1: ask permissions for their parents. Um. Anyway, so you speak 192 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:25,240 Speaker 1: to him, so I say, yeah, I say, I'm thinking, 193 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 1: I'm thinking I'm thinking of leaving the law firm. And 194 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:31,000 Speaker 1: I had these offers on Wall Street and like your advice, 195 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:38,000 Speaker 1: and um, he basically begins to tell me how bad 196 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 1: both of the offers I have are and how neither 197 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 1: of the firms that I'm talking about are particularly good. Now, um, 198 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 1: he stops there, but I would say less than a 199 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:56,079 Speaker 1: week later, maybe two weeks later, he calls me and says, 200 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:57,560 Speaker 1: you know what you gotta really do is come down 201 00:11:57,559 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 1: to my office and consider joining Alger. It took him 202 00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:04,839 Speaker 1: two weeks to come around. Well, I think he was 203 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:07,200 Speaker 1: giving me like a little week. Just let it sink in. 204 00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 1: You know, look, he is a he is who he is, 205 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 1: not just a founder, but it was a master businessman 206 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 1: because he's pretty good at let's just say, the m 207 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 1: word of managing people has another word that's a little 208 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 1: bit motivating. Well, some people say manipulating. Um, you know, 209 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 1: uh and I think he understood that I didn't know 210 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 1: much and uh that his you know. So anyway, that 211 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: turns out to be an insightful play on his part. Well, 212 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,600 Speaker 1: because not only do you join Alger, you'd be eventually 213 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:41,760 Speaker 1: become president, then you become c I O, and then 214 00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 1: you become CEO. So clearly he saw potential in you 215 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 1: to take over his his work. I'm gonna be you know, 216 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 1: just really really candid. I mean, his daughters all laugh 217 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:56,080 Speaker 1: about it because they said what they knew was that 218 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:58,840 Speaker 1: he had long longed for a successor that was in 219 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: the family, his daughters at all past you know, I'm 220 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:12,680 Speaker 1: not interested um and and uh uh uh that as 221 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 1: soon as I said this thing, he had no interest 222 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 1: in actually advising me in any accurate, objective sense. It 223 00:13:18,679 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 1: was a campaign to get me on board, using you know, 224 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:27,680 Speaker 1: a very wildly and very intelligent um sixty plus years 225 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 1: of experience against a pretty naive, you know, thirty year old. 226 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 1: Well it seemed to have worked out. It worked worked 227 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:40,240 Speaker 1: out absolutely. Let's talk a little bit about algiers investment philosophy. 228 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:47,160 Speaker 1: I like this description discovering companies undergoing positive dynamic change, 229 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:52,559 Speaker 1: which immediately raises the question how do you identify these companies? 230 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:57,200 Speaker 1: Is this quantifiable? How much of this is less definable 231 00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 1: and squishy and qualitative? Uh? What is positive dynamic change? So? UM, 232 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:07,680 Speaker 1: this is our our investment philosophy. It's what the firm 233 00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 1: was founded on in nineteen four. UM. It's also what 234 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:18,360 Speaker 1: we're recognized for as essentially creating the growth style of investing. UM. 235 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 1: So what does it mean? UM? It's first a recognition 236 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:30,760 Speaker 1: UM that UH changes all around us and in our industries. UM, 237 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:35,800 Speaker 1: in our customers and the competitors and the competitive pressures 238 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:41,320 Speaker 1: UM in an industry are basically always about adapting to change. UM. 239 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 1: So what we recognize in our philosophy is the opportunities 240 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 1: for investors, in particular fundamental investors are where the change 241 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 1: is the greatest. And the reason for that is because 242 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: where the change is the greatest, for example, and what 243 00:14:57,640 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 1: has driven revenue growth or profits or you know, customer demand, 244 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:04,720 Speaker 1: you know where the change is the greatest in those 245 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 1: those those key drivers and others for an industry, it's 246 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 1: where the opportunity for new winners to be created, you know, 247 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:15,200 Speaker 1: for old winners potentially to continue, but if they don't adapt, 248 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 1: but potentially become losers. So the pressure to change wherever 249 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:23,360 Speaker 1: that's the greatest is always of extreme interest to us. 250 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: And what we recognize UM within an industry is there's 251 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 1: two areas where the change or the pressure to change 252 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:33,760 Speaker 1: is though is the greatest, and one is where is 253 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 1: the highest new growth in an industry. If you look 254 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 1: at any industry and ask what's the highest fastest growing 255 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: new product or service, that is a kind of change, right, 256 00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: and that's inherently innovation, changing preferences by consumers or maybe 257 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 1: a changing costs um. But whatever is growing the fastest 258 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 1: UM is a huge challenge because you can either be 259 00:15:57,400 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: a leader and innovator and capture that high growth, or 260 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:02,880 Speaker 1: you can be the company that's selling the product that 261 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:06,880 Speaker 1: is getting cannibalized. Right, it's growing, is growing, was once 262 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 1: growing perhaps, but it's now growing slower and slower and slower. 263 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,080 Speaker 1: So if you think about the high growth UM, a 264 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,880 Speaker 1: great example I like to use is the music industry 265 00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: as a transition from record to tape, from tape to 266 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: UH cassette, cassette to c D, c D to digital. 267 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 1: Each one of those technology transitions, at the beginning of it, 268 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: the new media is always the fastest growing. I mean, yes, 269 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: it's starting from zero, but but also in each one 270 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: of those we can see it's ultimately completely eaten up 271 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 1: the past technology. And so if you're a company selling 272 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 1: records music, or you're selling the electronics that play music 273 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 1: um or a producer of it, you know, you have 274 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: to be aware that the transitions there are important for 275 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: your company to adjust too. And we can think of 276 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:00,280 Speaker 1: a lot of leading companies from say the eighties, which 277 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:02,960 Speaker 1: I you know, I grew up in loving music and 278 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:08,719 Speaker 1: going to college and but Tower Records uh hmv Records, uh, 279 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:13,960 Speaker 1: Sony with the Walkman um uh. You know that today 280 00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:17,800 Speaker 1: either went out of business or are no longer leaders 281 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:22,359 Speaker 1: in you know, streaming digital music UM, which is really 282 00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 1: dominated essentially by Apple uh, Spotify and a few others 283 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:30,680 Speaker 1: as you know. UM. So we know that high growth 284 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:33,399 Speaker 1: is one area where the change is extreme and the 285 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 1: opportunity to identify as fundamentally as investors, who are the leaders, 286 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:40,439 Speaker 1: who are the ones driving that change? Is it going 287 00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: to be durable? And of course you know, the examples 288 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: are countless um retail it's uh, first you had department stores, 289 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 1: then you had the big box retailers, and then you 290 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:53,640 Speaker 1: had Amazon come along and end it all, and now 291 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: it's all e commerce, and well you know, and so 292 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:01,080 Speaker 1: so important to be basically be in the right position there. Um. 293 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:03,919 Speaker 1: But the other part of our philosophy again it's about 294 00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 1: change and where is the pressure to change. Well, interestingly, 295 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:10,040 Speaker 1: it's what we call life cycle change. So that's often 296 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:14,000 Speaker 1: at the other end of the spectrum, it's industries in decline, 297 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:20,640 Speaker 1: companies really struggling to and in decline negative dynamic change. Well, um, 298 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:23,680 Speaker 1: for our hedge fund, absolutely interested in the negative dynamic, 299 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:28,399 Speaker 1: meaning you could both go along with absolutely um on alongside. 300 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 1: We're looking for the positive dynamic change. So the industries 301 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 1: are companies with potentially new management, new innovation, restructuring, or 302 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:40,879 Speaker 1: just new opportunities that can re accelerate and reinvigorate their 303 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:45,160 Speaker 1: companies into a new growth phase. And again often companies 304 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:50,359 Speaker 1: like these sometimes their turnarounds. Sometimes it's just industries shifting. Um, 305 00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:55,280 Speaker 1: they offer great investment opportunities because again, the the key 306 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 1: inside about change is where is where change is happening, 307 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:03,320 Speaker 1: and if it's extreme, it often translates into worry, fear 308 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: in the investors, and it often trans that often translates 309 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:12,679 Speaker 1: into undervaluation. Right, missed up missing an opportunity because instead 310 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 1: of sort of leaning in to the situation, investors flee 311 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:18,680 Speaker 1: to what they think is safety. R So, so let's 312 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:22,520 Speaker 1: talk about that, because what you've been describing is a 313 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:26,199 Speaker 1: fundamental change at a company level, either with a product 314 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:30,919 Speaker 1: or service um that that's penetrating a new market, finding 315 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:35,200 Speaker 1: new consumer acceptance. How do you contextualize what's been going 316 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:39,560 Speaker 1: on in this market since sometime towards the back half 317 00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 1: of where all those fast growing, high flying tech stocks 318 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:47,640 Speaker 1: have been taken out to the wood shed. And it's 319 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 1: not that anything fundamental has changed in these companies or 320 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 1: their prospects. But maybe it's inflation or a new interest 321 00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 1: rate regime or the end of the pandemic. But something 322 00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:04,440 Speaker 1: in macro environment is changing and causing investors to revalue 323 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: these How do you look at that sort of cyclical 324 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:11,719 Speaker 1: change relative to what you've been describing as a fundamental element. 325 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 1: Uh So, this is probably one of the most dynamic periods. 326 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:21,359 Speaker 1: Uh you know, we have really ever seen in thirty years. 327 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:26,119 Speaker 1: And uh, when I say the period, I actually want 328 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 1: to go back into pre COVID. If you think about 329 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:32,119 Speaker 1: what we have seen in our country and across the 330 00:20:32,119 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: world and in the markets pre COVID right, political change, 331 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:42,359 Speaker 1: COVID right, a global pandemic hasn't been seen in basically 332 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,600 Speaker 1: hundred years, right, special influence hundred years, literally hundred years, 333 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:49,080 Speaker 1: and there's no modern market back then. So this is 334 00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 1: completely different COVID forcing um and a global experiment in logistics, healthcare, 335 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:05,200 Speaker 1: e commerce, deliver vere um, remote work um and also 336 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 1: lifestyles you know um um uh that we haven't seen 337 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: and now yes, we're to me, we're still in the 338 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:17,640 Speaker 1: same period. Um. Now we're in the coming out yeah, 339 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:20,720 Speaker 1: where COVID is is ending in one way or the other. 340 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:24,200 Speaker 1: Economies are still trying to recover from it. Supply chains 341 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:27,639 Speaker 1: were tangled up before. We're barely recovering. And now, of 342 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:35,680 Speaker 1: course we've been hit by Ukrainian Russian war and uh China. Uh, 343 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:38,240 Speaker 1: they're really in their COVID crisis right now because of 344 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:43,679 Speaker 1: the way they managed to delay it through zero COVID policy. Right. Um, 345 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:47,720 Speaker 1: So there are an incredible number of things happening in 346 00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:52,120 Speaker 1: this period. UM, that are are very challenging, and certainly 347 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:56,120 Speaker 1: are in the sense that algia likes UM. But yet 348 00:21:56,119 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 1: it is, of course the challenge dynamic and changing right 349 00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:06,320 Speaker 1: now to the near term UH market action clearly, UM Yes, 350 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: interest rates and inflation caused by supply chain shortages exacerbated 351 00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:15,919 Speaker 1: by Russian Ukrainian War, and then also the concerns about 352 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,440 Speaker 1: what's happening in China, because I remember China's economy going 353 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:21,840 Speaker 1: into a deep percession. It's never really had a deep percession. 354 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 1: In the last twenty it has been a growth driver, 355 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 1: UM and a and a huge growth driver at that, 356 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:29,640 Speaker 1: a huge growth driver on the march on an incremental 357 00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:32,600 Speaker 1: basis across the globe, it's probably been half of the 358 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,879 Speaker 1: growth of global GDP growth. Half of it has probably 359 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 1: been attributable to China's growth over the last twenty years. 360 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:41,800 Speaker 1: I'm not an economist, but I I bet that's a 361 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:45,160 Speaker 1: very good guess, because you know, Europe has been fairly stagnant, 362 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 1: and uh, you're not seeing a lot in Africa. South 363 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:50,879 Speaker 1: America has its own problem, and we've been we've been 364 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:55,600 Speaker 1: a good contributor. But but you know, uh so so 365 00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 1: I think what we're seeing here is um concerns of course, 366 00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 1: that the inflation is not going to be transitory, uh, 367 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,840 Speaker 1: that the Russian Ukrainian War has changed things around the 368 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:14,160 Speaker 1: energy commodities complex um, and that a twenty thirty year 369 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 1: process of globalization is actually unwinding into more localization, more 370 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:24,120 Speaker 1: on shoring, and even of course trade war conflict, which 371 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,280 Speaker 1: of course that didn't start with the Russian War, you know, 372 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: started actually um with the U. S and China, Right, 373 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:36,800 Speaker 1: But now it's going to be potentially even more disruptive 374 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: because how are the sanctions against Russia going to play 375 00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:43,440 Speaker 1: out over the following years, Because it does appear it 376 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: will be years, not nothing. It's going to be resolved 377 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:47,959 Speaker 1: very quickly here, right, I Mean, we could hope that 378 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,520 Speaker 1: it's resolved in months, but so far we're seeing no 379 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:55,480 Speaker 1: indication that that this is anything but a long haul. 380 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: I could still cross our fingers and hope before ends 381 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: the war ends, but that's just a lot of wishful 382 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,200 Speaker 1: thinking on my part, right, Well, I think so. So 383 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:07,680 Speaker 1: your question was how do you invest in what's going 384 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,679 Speaker 1: on with growth stocks? And the key for Algin our 385 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:14,960 Speaker 1: process it is a fundamental research process driven by over 386 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:19,959 Speaker 1: fifty UH animal supportfolio managers looking at every sector and 387 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:25,119 Speaker 1: across the globe. What we first look at is UM 388 00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: industries and trends. UM. You know what will be enhanced 389 00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:33,800 Speaker 1: by the current environment, what will be hurt by it. 390 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:38,719 Speaker 1: UM High energy costs, high commodity costs, high labor costs 391 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,960 Speaker 1: will put a lot of pressure on efficiency. UM driving 392 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,840 Speaker 1: efficiency is usually technology, software and robotics. For manufacturing industries, 393 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:51,480 Speaker 1: UM efficiency might include remote work may get even more 394 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,639 Speaker 1: entrenched because saving on the commute, right if you're if 395 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 1: you're only going to work three days a week instead 396 00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:58,720 Speaker 1: of five, the two days of savings for a lot 397 00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 1: of a lot of consumer or is where they're driving 398 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 1: to work is actually quite significant. And and all the 399 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:07,639 Speaker 1: studies have shown that businesses are getting actually more labor 400 00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,760 Speaker 1: out of people who are working remotely. Right, So, so 401 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:14,119 Speaker 1: we're always looking for is the technologies, the services, the 402 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:18,199 Speaker 1: products that increase efficiency that benefit from the trends that 403 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:19,960 Speaker 1: we think are durable. There are some trends that of 404 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:24,240 Speaker 1: course cyclical, but others are more durable. UM. What's durable 405 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:29,280 Speaker 1: in our view UM E commerce, um AI, machine learning. 406 00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:33,280 Speaker 1: I think we all we always believed in renewables, solar, 407 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:38,639 Speaker 1: wind and energy efficiency generally, very clearly in a high 408 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 1: oil and natural gas price environment, that's going to be 409 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:48,280 Speaker 1: even more in demand than it was. UM. Consumer lifestyles, 410 00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:51,320 Speaker 1: that's harder to predict. UM. I think we're clearly going 411 00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:56,440 Speaker 1: to have uh significant portion of our population as well 412 00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:58,159 Speaker 1: as those across the world, are going to feel a 413 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:02,240 Speaker 1: lot of pain because of higher and energy food prices. However, 414 00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:08,360 Speaker 1: we should also note that the upper sixty of Americans 415 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 1: are actually UM going to be able to weather this 416 00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 1: quite easily. Food and energy costs are not significant in 417 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 1: particular the upper UM, it's not really a significant part 418 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: or a fact. The middle band, there's some effect, but 419 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 1: actually they're doing quite well. You know, we entered this 420 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,959 Speaker 1: period UM partially because of COVID with consumer savings at 421 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:34,680 Speaker 1: record levels. Businesses UM lots of lots of deferred capex, 422 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: and therefore financial situation in corporation is quite strong. Um. 423 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,000 Speaker 1: You know. The only thing that that concerns me about 424 00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 1: the consumer mostly is UM higher interest rates affecting the 425 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,439 Speaker 1: value of their homes, which clearly is going to be 426 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:52,760 Speaker 1: uh you know, a negative wealth effect for for a 427 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 1: lot of consumers. Of course, a lot of us had 428 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,960 Speaker 1: seen a wealth effect that we never really expected nor needed. 429 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 1: And so some of that's probably gonna online, right that 430 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:03,280 Speaker 1: that giant boom in home prices. If if we roll 431 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,880 Speaker 1: ten or the back, it's really not not the worst 432 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:11,240 Speaker 1: thing in the world. That's that's right, quite interesting. So, 433 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,080 Speaker 1: so let's talk about a couple of different sectors that 434 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:19,920 Speaker 1: you mentioned. On on the one hand, we're seeing stores 435 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:22,880 Speaker 1: like home Depot do pretty well. On the other hands, 436 00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:27,520 Speaker 1: UM stores like Walmart and Target have had you know, 437 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:32,439 Speaker 1: the worst UM drop post earnings since seven What do 438 00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:36,439 Speaker 1: you make of this environment where even within a sector 439 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:41,040 Speaker 1: like retail, you have to slice the market very finely, 440 00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:45,040 Speaker 1: very thin to separate the winners from the losers. So 441 00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: I would say, in in the consumer landscape, you know, 442 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: the combination of a couple of things, it's really pretty negative. 443 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 1: And it's reflected in the results of like Walmart and Target. 444 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: And and why we're generally actually not UM we're not 445 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:04,000 Speaker 1: really they very much invested in retail or in consumer goods. 446 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:10,560 Speaker 1: UM one is high labor costs and high inflation, uh, 447 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 1: matched up against not so easy for some of these 448 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,600 Speaker 1: companies to pass that through to the consumer. With higher prices, right, 449 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,280 Speaker 1: especially when many like Walmart and Target customers are feeling 450 00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:26,119 Speaker 1: pressure from higher energy and food UM. And also and 451 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:30,000 Speaker 1: very important to remember, many of those companies of Walmarts 452 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:33,560 Speaker 1: and Targets, they UM were able to stay open during COVID. 453 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:38,280 Speaker 1: They benefited from remote work, stay at home people not 454 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,320 Speaker 1: going to restaurants, eating at home more. Uh, they benefited 455 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 1: from being open when other retailers had to close, like 456 00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:46,440 Speaker 1: department stores, and so they saw a lot of them 457 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:51,440 Speaker 1: saw strong growth in demand for you know, apparel, home goods, furnishings, 458 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, sporting goods, and and Walmart and 459 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,920 Speaker 1: Target in many ways were beneficiaries of COVID relative to 460 00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:02,320 Speaker 1: other other retail UM. So right now, we think in 461 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:06,680 Speaker 1: the consumer sector, uh, and we've had this actually sort 462 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:09,080 Speaker 1: of trend for a belief in a trend for a 463 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:13,440 Speaker 1: long time, which is that over time, the demographics of 464 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 1: the U S consumer particular, it's a trend towards experiences 465 00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:23,440 Speaker 1: over things, and that's definitely pre pandemic. UM. The pandemic 466 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 1: seem to have temporarily reversed it when everybody's stuck at 467 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 1: home getting deliveries exactly exactly right, and so I think 468 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: in the consumer you know, there are still things that 469 00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:38,160 Speaker 1: UM in that experiences category that have not yet recovered 470 00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:44,760 Speaker 1: from COVID's effects. Live entertainment, travel, UM are are great 471 00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:50,400 Speaker 1: experiences restaurant industry to many respects. Hotel industry. Obviously there's 472 00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,760 Speaker 1: a travel related UM, but it's a little bit far 473 00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 1: and few between because if you look at the stock 474 00:29:56,320 --> 00:30:00,400 Speaker 1: market of the dominant part of the consumer error is 475 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 1: really goods, you know, many of which did fairly well 476 00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:08,520 Speaker 1: during COVID. UM. Now, you know, I think we're still 477 00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 1: leaning into companies like UM, Amazon, which obviously was a 478 00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:17,200 Speaker 1: COVID beneficiary. UM. But Amazon is much more than just 479 00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:21,360 Speaker 1: a store. Now AWS Web Services is you know, the 480 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 1: leading cloud services provider. UH. The transition to the cloud 481 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 1: is a major uh RE platforming of business processes from 482 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 1: you know, running running computers and storage and network equipment 483 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:38,600 Speaker 1: on in Europe office to letting a public cloud provider 484 00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:41,320 Speaker 1: do it for you. And Amazon is a winner there 485 00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: and UM. I think it's UM you know, important to 486 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 1: note how significant that business is to Amazon because it's 487 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,000 Speaker 1: much higher margin than the retail business UM, and they 488 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:53,920 Speaker 1: are the dominant leader there and it's still growing very 489 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:58,640 Speaker 1: very fast growing over right now. So so you mentioned 490 00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 1: AI and so off wearing robotics UM in that same space, 491 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: I gotta think Microsoft is a credible competitor. I think 492 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:11,440 Speaker 1: they're what is it Azure is the second biggest cloud 493 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:15,560 Speaker 1: provider after Amazon. UM. What else is catching your eye 494 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:20,280 Speaker 1: in areas like AI, in and robotics right, so, you know, 495 00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:22,520 Speaker 1: I think a lot of the leading growth companies, many 496 00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: of which have come down significantly, um you know in 497 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 1: the last six months, UM in software like Microsoft, Adobe, 498 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 1: but also for example in stomach connectors like a m 499 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 1: D or again going to software service now dated dog. Uh. 500 00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,320 Speaker 1: I think many of these UH companies have come into 501 00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:46,840 Speaker 1: In the case of the bigger, larger cap ones, I 502 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,720 Speaker 1: think they're absolutely attractive in terms of the evaluation now 503 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:54,840 Speaker 1: and um the need for what Microsoft provides cloud services 504 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,640 Speaker 1: of course, enterprise computing, UH you know, their own linked in. 505 00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 1: I mean, this is an incredibly well capitalized company. It's 506 00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:05,240 Speaker 1: hard to believe Microsoft and it's scale, it it's growing 507 00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:08,920 Speaker 1: revenue six um. You know, the pe right now is 508 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:12,480 Speaker 1: below that of companies like UM. You know in the 509 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:14,560 Speaker 1: staples sector, I think is one of the most overvalued. 510 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:17,000 Speaker 1: I mean staples. You've got a lot of leading staple 511 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:20,680 Speaker 1: companies are twenty six to thirty times PE. Most of 512 00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: them struggle to grow revenues more than five So I 513 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:26,680 Speaker 1: think a lot of the leading tech companies are are 514 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,880 Speaker 1: attractive and continue to play into a lot of the trends. Um. 515 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:34,600 Speaker 1: Digital transformation again, this is you know, businesses. This seems 516 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:37,719 Speaker 1: to happen about once every ten to fifteen years. Um. 517 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:39,320 Speaker 1: You know, it happened in the nineties with the move 518 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:42,160 Speaker 1: to the internet, but then there wasn't a lot of 519 00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 1: tools yet for digital business. Right, what is digital business? 520 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:48,640 Speaker 1: This is instead of paper documents, it's digital documents. Right. 521 00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,360 Speaker 1: By the way, both of us work in firms that 522 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,000 Speaker 1: live and die in the cloud, and yet the two 523 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,280 Speaker 1: of us have papers spread out all over the desk. 524 00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,760 Speaker 1: Are we just are we just the old school old timers? 525 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,520 Speaker 1: Or is there still is this still just a is 526 00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:06,880 Speaker 1: this a generational thing? Are are the people who are 527 00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 1: the millennials who are twenty thirty years younger than us 528 00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:12,640 Speaker 1: stuff like this doesn't happen? Or because I don't see 529 00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,800 Speaker 1: anybody doing this on a tablet all that easily. I 530 00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:17,880 Speaker 1: think you're actually absolutely right, because I tried to do 531 00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:20,400 Speaker 1: it on tablet, and I realized there's no way you 532 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:23,880 Speaker 1: can see me here. I I've got one, two, three, four, 533 00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:26,760 Speaker 1: I got seven pieces of documents that I can easily 534 00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:28,760 Speaker 1: just you know, my hand is a pretty My hand 535 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,760 Speaker 1: is better than the man. My hand so far has 536 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: not crashed on me ever, that's right or frozen, and 537 00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:37,160 Speaker 1: I can reach out and you know, one piece of 538 00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,960 Speaker 1: paper I have. You know, So let me ask you 539 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:43,160 Speaker 1: about another sector. You guys are fairly focused on health 540 00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:46,720 Speaker 1: sciences and and given what took place with m r 541 00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:51,280 Speaker 1: n A and companies like Fires from Maderna, this obviously 542 00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,560 Speaker 1: is going to be a giant sector with the aging 543 00:33:54,600 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 1: of the population, oncology, advancements, lifespan and extension. What are 544 00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:02,920 Speaker 1: you looking at in the healthcare space and in the 545 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:04,600 Speaker 1: health science of space. Yeah, this is a great question. 546 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:06,680 Speaker 1: I'm glad glad you brought it up, because healthcare is 547 00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 1: one of our favorite spaces, and I think it's a 548 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:12,239 Speaker 1: very good example of a sector that has actually opportunities 549 00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:16,200 Speaker 1: both on the high growth innovation end, but also um 550 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:21,320 Speaker 1: great companies um that are great free cash flow a 551 00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:25,200 Speaker 1: stable businesses and probably improving in their prospects. So we 552 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: we like quite a bit across the health care spectrum 553 00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 1: and from pharma and biotech, medtech as well as healthcare 554 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:35,640 Speaker 1: services and even health tax software. UM. You know, healthcare 555 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:41,840 Speaker 1: is UH of course not economically sensitive UM, but is 556 00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:44,600 Speaker 1: driven of course by major trends and demographics. As you mentioned, 557 00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:46,240 Speaker 1: is one of the big ones. But I would say 558 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:50,719 Speaker 1: within healthcare UM two major trends that are occurring right now, 559 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:53,360 Speaker 1: and one that more of a market phenomenal. So the 560 00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 1: market phenomenon is simply that a lot of the leading 561 00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:03,480 Speaker 1: pharma UH and biotech companies household names UM looks severely 562 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: undervalued relative to their profitability. And while their growth is 563 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,759 Speaker 1: more modest, it's certainly competitive with say the staples that 564 00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:13,120 Speaker 1: I mentioned earlier. Right Meanwhile, some of them are coming 565 00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,200 Speaker 1: out of like patent expiations in periods where they were 566 00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,520 Speaker 1: challenged to growth with new products UM. And so we think, 567 00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:21,839 Speaker 1: you know, might in our life cycle change theory sort 568 00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:25,120 Speaker 1: of accelerate their growth going forward. UM. So these are 569 00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:29,520 Speaker 1: leading companies like abv or one of our most interesting 570 00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 1: ones right now is is Bayer UM the big German 571 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 1: boring company UM UM wise Bear interesting, Bear bought Monsanto 572 00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 1: almost at the very peak of the last agricultural fertilizer 573 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:48,680 Speaker 1: cycle and then also inherited the roundup litigation, which is 574 00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:52,480 Speaker 1: costed about a decade. As a result, has became extremely 575 00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:56,000 Speaker 1: undervalued and hated. UM. But they are coming out of 576 00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:58,759 Speaker 1: you know, the round up litigation. They have sort of 577 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:01,839 Speaker 1: ring fenced what the liabilities were they preserved for them. 578 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:05,360 Speaker 1: Their litigation will continue, but the you know, the unknown 579 00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:09,680 Speaker 1: factor there is rapidly diminishing. Meanwhile, first of all, they 580 00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 1: should be created. They're not a bad farma company, including 581 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,200 Speaker 1: some aspects like Beyer and you know, like a Johnson 582 00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 1: and Johnson, but they do also have innovation there. But finally, 583 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:22,400 Speaker 1: also and yes, very much driven by the commodities that 584 00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:26,600 Speaker 1: problem that we're seeing now, the Monsanto business UM, you know, 585 00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:30,120 Speaker 1: looks poised, poised, like a lot of agricultural businesses to 586 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:35,000 Speaker 1: actually um accelerate tremendously in the next few years as 587 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:37,960 Speaker 1: as commodity prices go up. So so there's a lot 588 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: of examples in big PHARMAM. But I want to note 589 00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:44,000 Speaker 1: there's also a lot of opportunity on the high growth 590 00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:47,359 Speaker 1: side of of healthcare. Because in health care, how are 591 00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:49,440 Speaker 1: we how are we meeting the need for healthcare as 592 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,640 Speaker 1: with an aging population. A lot of it is better technology, 593 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:57,120 Speaker 1: better software, uh, and better services, better delivery of services. 594 00:36:57,120 --> 00:36:59,160 Speaker 1: We all know that the health care system is pretty 595 00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:03,640 Speaker 1: pretty inefficient. Um. It's also one of the slower adopters 596 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: in particular things like cloud software, digital um uh you know, 597 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:12,319 Speaker 1: um business processes. Are we ever going to see the 598 00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,279 Speaker 1: health care sector come up with some form of uniform 599 00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:21,040 Speaker 1: standards for healthcare records? You would think there's a massive 600 00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:25,239 Speaker 1: opportunity there. Nobody seems to have come up with a 601 00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:29,919 Speaker 1: way to to to create a standard thing so that 602 00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:35,799 Speaker 1: your doctor, your hospital, your radiologists, your whatever, um, your 603 00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:40,360 Speaker 1: pharmacy can all easily access the same data as directed 604 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:44,040 Speaker 1: when needed. It just seems like the record keeping and 605 00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:47,640 Speaker 1: the all the specifics and I'm dealing with um my 606 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:50,960 Speaker 1: mom is eighty six trying to move her records from Florida, 607 00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:54,960 Speaker 1: New York. It was just a nightmare. And it feels 608 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,120 Speaker 1: like it's you're back in the nineties seventies. What do 609 00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:01,520 Speaker 1: you mean I have to submit a fat request. It's 610 00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:05,359 Speaker 1: two thousand and twenty two. Just email this. They don't 611 00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:09,200 Speaker 1: do email. UM. It's going to get better, And I 612 00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:11,400 Speaker 1: think you and I are too old to benefit and 613 00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 1: your mother and my mother are way too Why because 614 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,840 Speaker 1: some of their records are old and they're in old systems, 615 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:21,120 Speaker 1: buried in US and doctors in a file cabinet of 616 00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 1: a doctor who retired, right, So so they're lost in 617 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:29,239 Speaker 1: kind of lost. Yeah, and so they'll do the test again. Yeah. No, 618 00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:31,840 Speaker 1: I mean a lot of the efficiency and healthcare is 619 00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,560 Speaker 1: is going to be more. There's going to be some there, 620 00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:36,520 Speaker 1: but it's always gonna be a messy process. I think 621 00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:39,480 Speaker 1: it's getting better though, But a lot of things we're 622 00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:43,879 Speaker 1: like robotic surgery, So, um, what companies do you look 623 00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:46,920 Speaker 1: at in that space? Intuitive Surgical as the leader in 624 00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:51,880 Speaker 1: that space? Um, and some of some of the things 625 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:55,680 Speaker 1: I've read in that space are really quite astonishing. What 626 00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:58,880 Speaker 1: what is the advances that have taken what used to 627 00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:02,440 Speaker 1: be somewhat risky so injuries or somewhat complicated surgeries and 628 00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,960 Speaker 1: turn them into fairly routine procedures. Is that a fair statement? 629 00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,239 Speaker 1: I think it's No. I think it's absolutely amazing what 630 00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:13,640 Speaker 1: med tech has done for all kinds of so. I mean, 631 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:18,600 Speaker 1: think about hip knee replacements that are just routinely done now, 632 00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:25,359 Speaker 1: it's so successful UM uh CARDI heart valve replacement UM, 633 00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:28,800 Speaker 1: minimally invasive no no more, you know, no more, not 634 00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:33,120 Speaker 1: not needing open, not cracking you open anymore. Obviously massively 635 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:37,680 Speaker 1: improved results and lowered cost. UM and frankly, you know 636 00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:42,000 Speaker 1: the UH important to note the UH with COVID, the 637 00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:46,160 Speaker 1: development of the vaccines. You know, the rapidity with which 638 00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:48,759 Speaker 1: the m R and A technology was proven out by 639 00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:53,560 Speaker 1: both fiser Um and Maderna and others. UM. And I 640 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:57,440 Speaker 1: think we can look forward to sort of, UM, you know, 641 00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:01,239 Speaker 1: increased use of that technology to solve other other diseases. 642 00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:06,760 Speaker 1: So UM really really fascinated stuff. So what other sectors 643 00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:13,240 Speaker 1: besides software, robotics, UM, healthcare are are really standing out 644 00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:19,600 Speaker 1: as offering a lot of potential for positive dynamic change. UH. 645 00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:24,160 Speaker 1: So let's see, we talked about tech, talked about healthcare. 646 00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:30,160 Speaker 1: I'm trying to sort out I think AI big data. Well, 647 00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:32,640 Speaker 1: so I guess what I what I would say is, look, 648 00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:35,319 Speaker 1: the markets are highly uncertain, we aren't, you know, with 649 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:39,000 Speaker 1: the interest rates and inflation the way they're going. UM. 650 00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:43,000 Speaker 1: I think our portfolios at Algiele we're positioning a little 651 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:48,799 Speaker 1: bit more UMU diversified than perhaps we have been UH 652 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,880 Speaker 1: in the past few years. UM. And the example so 653 00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:56,000 Speaker 1: so you're so there isn't any one sector I think 654 00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:58,160 Speaker 1: I would say that, you know, next most important, but 655 00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:02,920 Speaker 1: I would note that for example, energy and renewables, I 656 00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:06,640 Speaker 1: think given you know, high energy prices now, it's it's 657 00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:11,120 Speaker 1: absolutely UM important as an investor to have a part 658 00:41:11,120 --> 00:41:15,080 Speaker 1: of your portfolio exposed to UH the opportunity in solar 659 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:18,400 Speaker 1: in particular. UM. Who do you like in that space 660 00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:22,280 Speaker 1: or wind or any other world. It's mostly it's mostly 661 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 1: providers of solar UM electronics inverters UM so not necessarily 662 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:34,000 Speaker 1: the panel makers, but not the panel makers, which is 663 00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:38,400 Speaker 1: almost mostly Chinese. And there's actually some issues around you know, 664 00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:45,239 Speaker 1: import export UM. Well, there's ongoing litigation, right, circumventtion. It's 665 00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:49,920 Speaker 1: called circumvention. There's a lawsuit about this, whether importers of 666 00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:56,719 Speaker 1: solar panels circumvented um UH tariffs, tariffs, UM. But you know, 667 00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:00,880 Speaker 1: it's a good it's a good example that controversy is important. 668 00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 1: But I view that as relatively short term. The big 669 00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,960 Speaker 1: picture trend shouldn't be forgotten. If we are going to 670 00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:10,880 Speaker 1: be living in eight dllar oil and natural gas is 671 00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:13,040 Speaker 1: no longer going to be two dollars or less. Right, 672 00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:18,680 Speaker 1: there's gonna be five dollars UM uh the and and 673 00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:21,480 Speaker 1: I believe yes this these prices could recede by the 674 00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,000 Speaker 1: end of the year, particularly get slower economic growth and 675 00:42:24,239 --> 00:42:27,440 Speaker 1: a better resolution of the Ukraine Russian situation. But nevertheless, 676 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:29,799 Speaker 1: I don't think we're going back to two dollar and 677 00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:32,160 Speaker 1: thirty dollar oil. I think we're you know, pre COVID, 678 00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:36,279 Speaker 1: we were in the sixty dollar oil arrange. And I 679 00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:39,440 Speaker 1: think there's a lot of reasons why UM Europe having 680 00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:43,920 Speaker 1: to move away from reliance on Russian gas will maintain 681 00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:49,040 Speaker 1: higher prices for gas and oil UM globally. I think 682 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:51,360 Speaker 1: that's I think, you know, there will be negative effects 683 00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:53,920 Speaker 1: to that, but you know, we're looking for the positive 684 00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,160 Speaker 1: dynamic change it and it to me it is clearly 685 00:42:56,160 --> 00:42:59,880 Speaker 1: from renewables, and so the longer term growth there is 686 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:04,759 Speaker 1: only more likely to be durable solar, wind, hydro, many 687 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:08,160 Speaker 1: things will be UM beneficiaries. Frankly, in the industrial space, 688 00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:11,120 Speaker 1: it's harder to talk about any particular company because there's 689 00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:14,239 Speaker 1: no pure play, but many of the industrials that do 690 00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:19,640 Speaker 1: electrical equipment, pumps or are other kind of mechanical equipment. 691 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:23,160 Speaker 1: You know, I do have significant exposure to the electrical 692 00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:28,280 Speaker 1: grid right, or natural gas transmission or old school oil 693 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:32,920 Speaker 1: and gas refining and drilling, right, all of which is 694 00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:34,600 Speaker 1: going to in my view, pick up an activity. So 695 00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:36,680 Speaker 1: I think the energy sector is one place where you 696 00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:39,240 Speaker 1: want to have some exposure. You want to think about, 697 00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:43,200 Speaker 1: for example, electric vehicles. They are clearly a rising trend. 698 00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,520 Speaker 1: TESLA is obviously the leader. There are now newer players. 699 00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:49,799 Speaker 1: But I'll note within the industrials and materials complex there 700 00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:54,520 Speaker 1: are some very interesting plays within lithium batteries UM and 701 00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:59,520 Speaker 1: companies that supply critical components in substrates for the you know, 702 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,600 Speaker 1: the electric vehicle battery UM of not only the car 703 00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:05,680 Speaker 1: actually I should say, but storage storage for the sub 704 00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:09,719 Speaker 1: units for UH that that's been an ongoing issue is 705 00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:12,360 Speaker 1: how do you store energy from a wind farm or 706 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,680 Speaker 1: a solar farm UH so that it's accessible when there's 707 00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:18,600 Speaker 1: no wind and no sun. And so in the theme 708 00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:20,960 Speaker 1: of this disversification that I want to know, like financials, 709 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:24,319 Speaker 1: we are also you know, currently interested in UM what 710 00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:27,640 Speaker 1: are the opportunities within financials UM. The biggest change for 711 00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:32,200 Speaker 1: financials for US where we have long been very minimally exposed. 712 00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:35,759 Speaker 1: Is we are looking at a steepening yield curve? Right, 713 00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:39,560 Speaker 1: interest rates have risen off the off the zero essentially 714 00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:42,799 Speaker 1: UM and if we get a steepening yield curve, uh, 715 00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:47,759 Speaker 1: that is generally good for bank earnings UM. Potentially for 716 00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:51,480 Speaker 1: the earnings of credit card companies UM. The offset of 717 00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:55,319 Speaker 1: courses will will the higher rates and inflation recession? Will 718 00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:58,680 Speaker 1: that end up in defaults on loans and slower credit 719 00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:01,439 Speaker 1: card growth and spending? Now, I think we're right now 720 00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,640 Speaker 1: trying to be balanced there. But uh, if you think 721 00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:11,680 Speaker 1: about UM, desire for experiences, UM, travel, you think about 722 00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:15,600 Speaker 1: American consumer is actually entering this cycle now in very 723 00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:18,400 Speaker 1: good financial shape, and in particular, you think about the 724 00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:23,000 Speaker 1: upper forty or six spending on travel. What do we 725 00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,480 Speaker 1: pull out? We pull out the American Express card a 726 00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:29,400 Speaker 1: lot of us. So, uh, you know, we like, you know, 727 00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:32,080 Speaker 1: we like. I think could be wrong, you know, he 728 00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:34,440 Speaker 1: procession could hit all that spending. But again I think 729 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:38,600 Speaker 1: in the interest of a diversified portfolio, I think, um, 730 00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:41,279 Speaker 1: you know, there are interesting opportunities within financial So that's 731 00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,239 Speaker 1: one example. Others are there are growthier banks that have 732 00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:46,799 Speaker 1: been hit pretty hard. Recently, many of them are now 733 00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:50,160 Speaker 1: trading as m as if they were sort of um, 734 00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:53,400 Speaker 1: you know, like just any regular bank. The ones that 735 00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,839 Speaker 1: we like are the ones who have been innovative within 736 00:45:55,960 --> 00:46:00,480 Speaker 1: banking uh names uh. Silicon Valley Bank has long been 737 00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:03,120 Speaker 1: a leader in the Silicon Valley. Obviously all that their 738 00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:06,040 Speaker 1: tech customers stocks are down, so people are taking their 739 00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:10,680 Speaker 1: stock down, but actually as bankers doing well, they do 740 00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:13,760 Speaker 1: well when as long as as long as a Silicon 741 00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:17,080 Speaker 1: Valley doesn't go bankrupt as a whole, you know, the 742 00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:19,360 Speaker 1: fact that some company stocks are dump or down doesn't 743 00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:21,799 Speaker 1: actually do anything for them. In fact, if anything, the 744 00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:25,440 Speaker 1: potential for dealmaking increases, which they are often the banker. 745 00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:28,920 Speaker 1: So um, and I should note that they did an 746 00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:33,680 Speaker 1: extremely savvy acquisition of healthcare franchise a few years ago, 747 00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:38,400 Speaker 1: one of the leading investment banking banking healthcare franchises. And again, 748 00:46:38,440 --> 00:46:41,120 Speaker 1: as a noted, healthcare is a very active area. You know, 749 00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:44,719 Speaker 1: we should note that not only is it not economically sensitive, 750 00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:49,600 Speaker 1: but healthcare because of the COVID crisis, has received a 751 00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:54,560 Speaker 1: huge boost in funding, recognition, and interest in investment for 752 00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:58,600 Speaker 1: the future, not just for preventing the next COVID pandemic, 753 00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:02,200 Speaker 1: but also for UM, you know, how can we improve 754 00:47:02,239 --> 00:47:05,719 Speaker 1: the telling medicine? You know, how can we improve outcomes? 755 00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:09,319 Speaker 1: UM in the health care system. It's it's uh, it's 756 00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:11,000 Speaker 1: been a big challenge of the healthcare system. But I 757 00:47:11,000 --> 00:47:13,960 Speaker 1: guess appropriately they're getting rewarded by a lot of interesting 758 00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:17,800 Speaker 1: in investing in that to improve it. Right, So, but there, 759 00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:19,680 Speaker 1: but there Again, going back to financial there's a lot 760 00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:21,560 Speaker 1: of banking. There's a lot of banking opportunity in that. 761 00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:26,719 Speaker 1: Let's let's talk a little bit about those different strategies UM, 762 00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:31,320 Speaker 1: the ALGA thirty five, the dynamic return fund, dynamic opportunities, 763 00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:36,040 Speaker 1: capital appreciation spectro. We talked about health sciences earlier. Tell 764 00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:39,080 Speaker 1: us a little bit about these different strategies. What is 765 00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:43,680 Speaker 1: the goal of all these different approaches to investing so 766 00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:49,000 Speaker 1: as growth specialists, UM, you know, all of these strategies 767 00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:54,279 Speaker 1: reflect basically different market caps and market cap ranges, with 768 00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:57,160 Speaker 1: the exception of the health care fund and dynamic opportunities. 769 00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:01,880 Speaker 1: Dynamic opportunities is a hedge fund, uh so, uh long 770 00:48:01,920 --> 00:48:05,440 Speaker 1: short UM and a health care fund obviously sector fund. 771 00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:09,480 Speaker 1: What about thirty five and the dynamic return or capital 772 00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:13,200 Speaker 1: appreciation five? Uh so UM ALGE thirty five is actually 773 00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:16,359 Speaker 1: very special to us. UM. There's a fund and it's 774 00:48:16,360 --> 00:48:18,400 Speaker 1: also one of our first e t F s Alge 775 00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:21,360 Speaker 1: thirty five e t F, which we launched actually in 776 00:48:21,640 --> 00:48:25,640 Speaker 1: just last year. UM. It's named actually in memory and 777 00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:30,080 Speaker 1: honor of the thirty five colleagues we lost on September eleven, UM, 778 00:48:30,120 --> 00:48:32,520 Speaker 1: and we are donating a part of amagement fees to 779 00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:36,400 Speaker 1: charities UH either in their memory or that we or 780 00:48:36,440 --> 00:48:39,920 Speaker 1: the firm support today in their memory. UM. But the 781 00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:46,000 Speaker 1: thirty five is UM meant to reflect the best ideas 782 00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:49,560 Speaker 1: across all of algiers, so regardless of market cap, regardless 783 00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:53,240 Speaker 1: of whether it's US or international, best ideas focused fund 784 00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:57,080 Speaker 1: UM and UH. So that's the ALGA thirty five idea. 785 00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:03,120 Speaker 1: UM Capital Appreciation is a large cap strategy UM UH 786 00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:06,920 Speaker 1: Spectra is an all cap strategy. Both of those are 787 00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:10,040 Speaker 1: really very much US oriented, although they can invest in 788 00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:14,200 Speaker 1: international or foreign stocks UM and then find dynamic return. 789 00:49:14,600 --> 00:49:19,040 Speaker 1: Dynamic return is UM a hedge fund UM and so 790 00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:23,440 Speaker 1: it's our it's our private version of of a hedge fund. UH. 791 00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:26,600 Speaker 1: We also have a forty a mutual fund called Dynamic 792 00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:32,160 Speaker 1: Opportunities Hedge Fund, but only only um, the dynamic opportunity 793 00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:35,400 Speaker 1: can go long and short. Is that right? No? Actually, 794 00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:39,760 Speaker 1: um so um dynamic return, dynamic opportunity. And actually Spectra 795 00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:42,520 Speaker 1: does a little bit of shorting. Spectra can do ten 796 00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:45,200 Speaker 1: up to ten percent short. Is that really just as 797 00:49:45,200 --> 00:49:48,800 Speaker 1: a hedge or or why uh at ten percent shorting, 798 00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:51,960 Speaker 1: we can't really hedge you know, the larger portfolio. So 799 00:49:52,040 --> 00:49:54,960 Speaker 1: actually the idea of the ten percent short for Spectra 800 00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:59,800 Speaker 1: is generate returns by identifying the as you said earlier, 801 00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:05,600 Speaker 1: negative dynamic change. The companies that are going to be Amazon, 802 00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:10,000 Speaker 1: the companies that are being disrupted by trends in their industry, 803 00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:15,560 Speaker 1: the companies that are being mismanaged. Um so interesting, tell 804 00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:18,320 Speaker 1: us a little bit about the E t F experience. 805 00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:22,080 Speaker 1: Your your history is as a mutual fund and hedge 806 00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:26,600 Speaker 1: fund shop. What's it been like playing in those waters? 807 00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:30,799 Speaker 1: So it's it's new and uh uh you know we 808 00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,520 Speaker 1: I think you know the major theme at Algers as 809 00:50:34,560 --> 00:50:38,320 Speaker 1: growth specialists. We want to be um, you know, offering 810 00:50:38,320 --> 00:50:42,920 Speaker 1: our services investment services in whatever format uh context you know, 811 00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:46,640 Speaker 1: the clients want them and and in particular, you know, 812 00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:52,520 Speaker 1: keeping up with what lowers costs, increases transparency, for for 813 00:50:52,560 --> 00:50:55,200 Speaker 1: the clients and E t fs actively E t F 814 00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:58,520 Speaker 1: s are UM you know, the first opportunity to do 815 00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:00,960 Speaker 1: that for an active manager. You know, we're not interested 816 00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:04,480 Speaker 1: in offering passive index E t F s UM and 817 00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:07,399 Speaker 1: so it's been it's been interesting. UM you know, they're 818 00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:11,000 Speaker 1: they're both just barely a year old and uh still small. 819 00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:14,440 Speaker 1: But we see a lot of interests UM from in 820 00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:19,719 Speaker 1: particular UM uh financial advisors on larger platforms who um 821 00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:22,440 Speaker 1: you know who have clients who are interested in in 822 00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:25,080 Speaker 1: uh you know, the E t F format. And that's 823 00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:29,120 Speaker 1: a concentrated portfolio of h of thirty five names rus 824 00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:33,839 Speaker 1: every style. So we also have a forty two I'm 825 00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:36,040 Speaker 1: not on that. That's round by Amy Jang, who's our 826 00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:39,600 Speaker 1: small cap MidCap specialist. I was gonna say not not 827 00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:45,520 Speaker 1: UM so that particularly alger forty MidCap and small caps 828 00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:50,960 Speaker 1: not all cap correct. So so Cathy Wood recently said 829 00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:54,880 Speaker 1: we're nearing deep value territory for a lot of growth stocks. 830 00:51:55,560 --> 00:51:58,120 Speaker 1: I'm not getting the same sense from you that you 831 00:51:58,160 --> 00:52:03,000 Speaker 1: think we're heading into deep value for growth given how 832 00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:07,760 Speaker 1: diversified and um broad your focus is looking at everything 833 00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:11,879 Speaker 1: from finance to energy to staples to to what have you? 834 00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:14,920 Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on on where we are in 835 00:52:14,960 --> 00:52:19,800 Speaker 1: this cycle? Um? And how inexpensive have growth stocks become? 836 00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:23,200 Speaker 1: So I sort of have three answers. One is I 837 00:52:23,239 --> 00:52:26,600 Speaker 1: think leading growth names like so the larger cap names 838 00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:32,600 Speaker 1: have gotten uh to evaluations where historically and relative to 839 00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:37,719 Speaker 1: the market, they are very attractive. UM. The higher growth 840 00:52:37,840 --> 00:52:41,080 Speaker 1: names some that have been hit the hardest. UM, these 841 00:52:41,120 --> 00:52:43,799 Speaker 1: are a little trickier. UM. You know many of these 842 00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:48,080 Speaker 1: are cloud computing names, UH, cybersecurity names. UM. You know, 843 00:52:48,160 --> 00:52:52,960 Speaker 1: part of the new generation of digital business enterprise software. UM. 844 00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:55,040 Speaker 1: They have very high growth rates. You know. We should 845 00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:58,120 Speaker 1: note that in this entire decline, we've now had two quarters, 846 00:52:58,160 --> 00:53:00,399 Speaker 1: the fourth quarter of twenty one and the first court 847 00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:02,480 Speaker 1: at twenty two. They've been to much all done. And 848 00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:06,160 Speaker 1: these most by large over of the companies. UM, they're 849 00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:10,440 Speaker 1: hitting their numbers. UM. Uh and uh you know growing 850 00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:17,000 Speaker 1: at rates over seventy percent. UM. I mean I'm looking 851 00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:20,879 Speaker 1: at you know a list of holdings that we have. UM. Yes, 852 00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:26,520 Speaker 1: they are still UM expensive on near term multiples. UM. 853 00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:28,920 Speaker 1: Some of them, of course are only just now ramping 854 00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:35,640 Speaker 1: and profitability. So the pe multiples are essentially not not meaningful. Um, 855 00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:38,160 Speaker 1: but that is the wrong way to look at higher 856 00:53:38,200 --> 00:53:43,359 Speaker 1: growth names. Companies that are growing seventy percent, say this year. 857 00:53:44,440 --> 00:53:47,640 Speaker 1: Uh uh, you know, are likely to be probably growing 858 00:53:47,640 --> 00:53:50,880 Speaker 1: in our in our view for the next few years. 859 00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:52,839 Speaker 1: So you have to be able to look out and 860 00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:55,640 Speaker 1: value them on that future. So that's where I was 861 00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:57,640 Speaker 1: going to go. I want to ask you, given this 862 00:53:57,719 --> 00:54:00,840 Speaker 1: pullback and some of the high is growth names have 863 00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:05,120 Speaker 1: gotten cut in half or worse, is this is this 864 00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:09,960 Speaker 1: a target rich environment for a growth stock picker. I 865 00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:13,000 Speaker 1: think I think it's definitely a target rich environment. We're 866 00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:18,600 Speaker 1: increasingly getting excited about the opportunity to build larger positions 867 00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:23,000 Speaker 1: in these high growth names. UM. But in our experience, 868 00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:25,640 Speaker 1: and it's pretty extensive since nineteen sixty four and mind 869 00:54:25,680 --> 00:54:30,600 Speaker 1: personally since nine. UM, you can overshoot to the downside 870 00:54:30,680 --> 00:54:33,240 Speaker 1: for sure, because and we're seeing that now. We're seeing 871 00:54:33,320 --> 00:54:36,520 Speaker 1: days where percent of the stocks are down, you know, 872 00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:39,360 Speaker 1: where nothing is up. Well, we're recording this on a 873 00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:41,279 Speaker 1: day that is going to end up being one of 874 00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:45,560 Speaker 1: those days. Umm. I'm just looking up at the screen 875 00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:48,440 Speaker 1: and I see, uh, lots of red. We're down about 876 00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:51,759 Speaker 1: two and a half three UM. But that raises an 877 00:54:51,800 --> 00:54:55,759 Speaker 1: interesting question. I've heard a number of growth investors say, hey, 878 00:54:55,800 --> 00:54:58,400 Speaker 1: we've had a huge period of out performance in the 879 00:54:58,440 --> 00:55:02,960 Speaker 1: growth space, and therefore we should discount of future returns 880 00:55:03,000 --> 00:55:07,080 Speaker 1: and expect a lower UM rate of growth going forward. 881 00:55:07,560 --> 00:55:09,960 Speaker 1: On the one hand, you're saying, there are a lot 882 00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:13,600 Speaker 1: of really interesting companies that have really seen their prices 883 00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:16,440 Speaker 1: come down, but I'm not hearing that you expect to 884 00:55:16,480 --> 00:55:22,200 Speaker 1: see growth rates to disappear completely. Tell describe how you 885 00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:27,960 Speaker 1: consider forward expected returns from here. So as a fundamental 886 00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:33,640 Speaker 1: UM investment team bottoms up fundamental right, So we have 887 00:55:34,320 --> 00:55:38,600 Speaker 1: UM sector experts, analysts and portfolio management, the extensive experience 888 00:55:38,600 --> 00:55:43,200 Speaker 1: across every sector. UM. You know, our healthcare sector head 889 00:55:44,040 --> 00:55:46,719 Speaker 1: is actually a doctor, a PhD and an m b. 890 00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:49,920 Speaker 1: A is all three degrees. Most agreed person I think 891 00:55:49,960 --> 00:55:52,680 Speaker 1: we I've ever seen UM except for maybe one of 892 00:55:52,680 --> 00:55:55,279 Speaker 1: my pm pms who also has a PhD and a 893 00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:58,680 Speaker 1: bunch of other degrees in patents UM. So what we're 894 00:55:58,680 --> 00:56:03,160 Speaker 1: looking at is the trends, right, the big economic the 895 00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:07,000 Speaker 1: big business trends that the big societal trends that are 896 00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:12,880 Speaker 1: growing regardless of yes, near term economic cycles. So one 897 00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:15,680 Speaker 1: thing that many people, um, you know did experience was 898 00:56:16,040 --> 00:56:18,919 Speaker 1: in O eight oh nine e commerce continue to grow 899 00:56:19,080 --> 00:56:21,680 Speaker 1: right through the recession, and that was a crushing recession, 900 00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:25,200 Speaker 1: right right through it, double digits, even as the department 901 00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:27,879 Speaker 1: stores were falling apart. What we're trying to identify now, 902 00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:31,239 Speaker 1: fundamental bottom up stock pickers is what are the companies 903 00:56:31,320 --> 00:56:34,319 Speaker 1: that are in the right trends They're gonna grow regardless. 904 00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:39,879 Speaker 1: So rising rates, inflation, maybe even recession next year, all 905 00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:44,799 Speaker 1: those are short term concerns. You're looking out beyond exactly, 906 00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:50,239 Speaker 1: and we know from our experience as investors that if 907 00:56:50,280 --> 00:56:53,920 Speaker 1: we're not quite there, we're getting close to. Um, you 908 00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:56,600 Speaker 1: need two things. Yes, I want to see better valuations 909 00:56:56,600 --> 00:56:59,480 Speaker 1: and we're seeing them, but I also want to see timing. 910 00:57:00,080 --> 00:57:02,360 Speaker 1: I want to see some fundamental changes in the market 911 00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:05,920 Speaker 1: that says the sentiment is shifting, because um, you know, 912 00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:10,520 Speaker 1: the nature investing is is yes, it's quantitative and qualitative. Um. 913 00:57:10,640 --> 00:57:16,360 Speaker 1: Right now, you know clearly the negative narrative is overwhelming 914 00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:20,560 Speaker 1: and it's natural a lot of investors are I earlier 915 00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:22,680 Speaker 1: said how many things have changed, and there's so much 916 00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:24,920 Speaker 1: change going on and a lot of it seems negative. 917 00:57:25,400 --> 00:57:27,760 Speaker 1: But um, you know, when I look at at this 918 00:57:27,800 --> 00:57:29,480 Speaker 1: list of high growers that were sort of on our 919 00:57:29,480 --> 00:57:32,360 Speaker 1: shopping list, and most of them we were owning. The 920 00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:34,400 Speaker 1: question is at what time do we think it's better 921 00:57:34,440 --> 00:57:37,600 Speaker 1: to upsize them. I mean, you know, we're talking about 922 00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:41,080 Speaker 1: companies that are for example, leading software company and healthcare 923 00:57:41,120 --> 00:57:47,320 Speaker 1: technology helping manage regulatory risk, clinical trials, data storage safety, 924 00:57:48,080 --> 00:57:52,160 Speaker 1: UM a vertically dominant company within an industry. We're talking 925 00:57:52,200 --> 00:57:55,560 Speaker 1: about cybersecurity. Now we should you know, we should note 926 00:57:55,600 --> 00:58:00,120 Speaker 1: that the company they're going over very high pe but 927 00:58:00,160 --> 00:58:02,760 Speaker 1: we're looking at like six plus earnings growth because it's 928 00:58:02,760 --> 00:58:07,160 Speaker 1: going from a little to more. UM cybersecurity. I've been 929 00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:09,960 Speaker 1: surprised that we haven't seen a major cybersecurity tech as 930 00:58:09,960 --> 00:58:13,120 Speaker 1: part of the Russia Ukraine conflict. But we'll see. We 931 00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:15,320 Speaker 1: know that they're happening. Maybe the good thing is that 932 00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:18,840 Speaker 1: we haven't experienced it because we're getting great defense from 933 00:58:18,880 --> 00:58:22,040 Speaker 1: some of the new generation of cybersecurity companies that are 934 00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:27,680 Speaker 1: you know, defending us literally UM and UM. So, so 935 00:58:27,880 --> 00:58:31,000 Speaker 1: that's the part where I think, you know, being more diversified, 936 00:58:31,480 --> 00:58:33,760 Speaker 1: looking for the opportunity to cross sectors. So so, for example, 937 00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:36,760 Speaker 1: I mentioned financial services earlier. One thing to know is 938 00:58:36,840 --> 00:58:40,040 Speaker 1: financial services and technology are almost acting like hedges to 939 00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:42,440 Speaker 1: each other. When tech is up, financials are down. When 940 00:58:42,440 --> 00:58:45,520 Speaker 1: financials are up, tech is down. And that again has 941 00:58:45,520 --> 00:58:48,360 Speaker 1: a lot to do with with interest rates. UM sure, 942 00:58:48,840 --> 00:58:53,560 Speaker 1: so UM, I think, Uh, you know, we're still looking 943 00:58:53,600 --> 00:58:57,479 Speaker 1: at at uh what are the fundamental opportunities to buy 944 00:58:57,480 --> 00:59:01,840 Speaker 1: the best growth companies that will grow right through this UM. 945 00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:04,680 Speaker 1: But we're also cognizant that in the near term a 946 00:59:04,720 --> 00:59:07,400 Speaker 1: lot of uncertainty. Nobody, no, nobody, nobody really knows what 947 00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:09,800 Speaker 1: will happen right, so to say the very least. So. 948 00:59:09,800 --> 00:59:12,520 Speaker 1: So before I get to my favorite questions, there were 949 00:59:12,560 --> 00:59:15,360 Speaker 1: a couple of things I wanted to touch base with 950 00:59:15,400 --> 00:59:19,960 Speaker 1: you about, uh, involving both Alger and involving some of 951 00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:27,240 Speaker 1: your philanthropic UM activities. UH. Starting with you mentioned the 952 00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:31,120 Speaker 1: Alger thirty five. Um, you guys also fund something we 953 00:59:31,200 --> 00:59:34,640 Speaker 1: remember nine eleven and I've been pretty active in in 954 00:59:34,720 --> 00:59:38,400 Speaker 1: September eleventh philanthropy. Tell us a little bit about what 955 00:59:38,480 --> 00:59:42,880 Speaker 1: you do, um, and the basis of that. So yeah, 956 00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:47,560 Speaker 1: I mean September eleven, again, we lost thirty five people, 957 00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:51,720 Speaker 1: in concluding David Alger, who was who was my boss. 958 00:59:51,960 --> 00:59:54,760 Speaker 1: He was the CEO and CEO of Algrin Elite Performent, 959 00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:58,200 Speaker 1: just like I am today. Um and uh, so I 960 00:59:58,240 --> 01:00:01,600 Speaker 1: took over the firm um and led the rebuilding of 961 01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:04,480 Speaker 1: the firm after nine eleven. And of course the first 962 01:00:04,520 --> 01:00:07,440 Speaker 1: thing we dealt with was really the families who had 963 01:00:07,480 --> 01:00:12,000 Speaker 1: lost someone. Um. And these were I mean, this is 964 01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:16,400 Speaker 1: just an amazing generation of people. And uh, you know, 965 01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:19,400 Speaker 1: in all I think that I think I remember even 966 01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:23,280 Speaker 1: in the darkest times, and it's importful. Is really good 967 01:00:23,320 --> 01:00:26,360 Speaker 1: people far outnumber bad people. You know, we seem some 968 01:00:26,480 --> 01:00:32,360 Speaker 1: horrible shootings over the weekend, right, but um, I could 969 01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:35,640 Speaker 1: not believe some of the families that we saw after 970 01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:38,840 Speaker 1: nine eleven. Um, they lost you know, their only son, 971 01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:43,400 Speaker 1: their daughter, and they are heartbroken, but they are actually 972 01:00:43,440 --> 01:00:46,600 Speaker 1: also wanting to help. And many of them the first 973 01:00:46,600 --> 01:00:50,640 Speaker 1: thing they did was create charities in their kids memories 974 01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:54,440 Speaker 1: or in their husband's memory. Many many husbands were lost, 975 01:00:54,680 --> 01:00:59,640 Speaker 1: and and and moms and everything and and we just 976 01:00:59,720 --> 01:01:01,680 Speaker 1: we is you know, our mission has to be support 977 01:01:01,720 --> 01:01:04,720 Speaker 1: these families and uh and part of that is to 978 01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:07,560 Speaker 1: support them in the memory of their lost ones. So 979 01:01:07,960 --> 01:01:11,880 Speaker 1: the charitable efforts uh since then, I mean obviously just 980 01:01:12,440 --> 01:01:17,960 Speaker 1: uh multiplied by magnitudes. We continue to support essentially every 981 01:01:18,040 --> 01:01:21,520 Speaker 1: charity that is UH an Altro thirty five as well 982 01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:25,080 Speaker 1: as many more. And I think you know, UM a 983 01:01:25,080 --> 01:01:28,040 Speaker 1: few years UM, you know, after an eleven, I sort 984 01:01:28,040 --> 01:01:31,520 Speaker 1: of formalized it with the creation of the employee Committee. 985 01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:33,880 Speaker 1: We call it the Candlelight Committee, you know, so employees 986 01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:37,920 Speaker 1: run that. And I think the the two things I 987 01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:40,040 Speaker 1: request that they do and we still focus on, is 988 01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:44,120 Speaker 1: UM we're trying to make an impact in our community 989 01:01:44,120 --> 01:01:49,120 Speaker 1: where we can so helping more locally rather than say, globally. Secondly, 990 01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:53,160 Speaker 1: we're trying to recognize and support charities where we're not 991 01:01:53,200 --> 01:01:56,000 Speaker 1: just giving money, we're giving of our time or our 992 01:01:56,040 --> 01:02:00,320 Speaker 1: talent or in some ways doing something uh that UM 993 01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:04,200 Speaker 1: maybe helps trigger in frankly, in our own individual you know, 994 01:02:04,240 --> 01:02:08,520 Speaker 1: out myself and the Alter Alter employees, you know, our 995 01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:12,840 Speaker 1: appreciation for how lucky we are, because you know, there's 996 01:02:12,880 --> 01:02:17,440 Speaker 1: nothing like doing something, whether it's planning trees or habitat 997 01:02:17,480 --> 01:02:20,360 Speaker 1: for humanity and helping build a home for someone, or 998 01:02:21,040 --> 01:02:26,480 Speaker 1: UM going to h Harlem Educational Fund and seeing kids 999 01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:29,480 Speaker 1: who didn't have the economic opportunities you know, and education 1000 01:02:29,480 --> 01:02:32,400 Speaker 1: that we had, right. So I always believe that seeing 1001 01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:36,280 Speaker 1: that it is good for a person UM appreciate makes 1002 01:02:36,280 --> 01:02:38,640 Speaker 1: them appreciate the world around them, but also how lucky 1003 01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:42,200 Speaker 1: they we generally are, UM. And so it's it's you know, 1004 01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:44,560 Speaker 1: they always say that the person who give gets the 1005 01:02:44,560 --> 01:02:47,120 Speaker 1: most from giving is often the person who's supposed to 1006 01:02:47,120 --> 01:02:48,720 Speaker 1: be the is you know, is the giver. Yeah, I 1007 01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:52,880 Speaker 1: get more back, you know than that I'm really giving. UM. So, 1008 01:02:52,880 --> 01:02:55,680 Speaker 1: so that's it. And then the final thing is, you know, 1009 01:02:55,800 --> 01:02:59,400 Speaker 1: we we do support some arts and things like that, 1010 01:02:59,440 --> 01:03:04,080 Speaker 1: but it's the arts that are more community based, smaller UM. 1011 01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:06,720 Speaker 1: You know, I love the big institutions, but you know, 1012 01:03:06,760 --> 01:03:10,040 Speaker 1: I don't believe that they we make as much an 1013 01:03:10,040 --> 01:03:12,480 Speaker 1: impact there as we do as if we support more 1014 01:03:12,600 --> 01:03:15,560 Speaker 1: you know, community based, smaller local organization. The other thing 1015 01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:17,920 Speaker 1: I had to ask you about which really stood out 1016 01:03:18,240 --> 01:03:22,040 Speaker 1: when I was doing my research was Algrews is really 1017 01:03:22,120 --> 01:03:28,920 Speaker 1: kind of unique in terms of your portfolio managers are 1018 01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:33,480 Speaker 1: either women or minorities. That that's astounding compared to the 1019 01:03:33,520 --> 01:03:37,840 Speaker 1: rest of finance. Tell us a little bit about how 1020 01:03:37,880 --> 01:03:41,920 Speaker 1: that developed. Is that relatively recent? When when did those 1021 01:03:42,440 --> 01:03:46,959 Speaker 1: numbers tick up to such a you know that that's 1022 01:03:47,000 --> 01:03:49,840 Speaker 1: just nothing like what we've seen in the rest of finance. 1023 01:03:50,160 --> 01:03:54,760 Speaker 1: So it comes from two things, UM, that are very 1024 01:03:54,880 --> 01:03:58,480 Speaker 1: very ingrained in our culture and old and maybe one 1025 01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:02,040 Speaker 1: that's newer. The two old things are UM. The firm 1026 01:04:02,080 --> 01:04:08,880 Speaker 1: has always had UM, a meritacratic um culture UM and 1027 01:04:08,920 --> 01:04:13,200 Speaker 1: a belief that, uh, if you followed our investment process 1028 01:04:13,480 --> 01:04:18,000 Speaker 1: and philosophy UM, that uh, you know, anyone who was 1029 01:04:18,040 --> 01:04:22,280 Speaker 1: hard working, smart and and of course motivated could become 1030 01:04:22,320 --> 01:04:25,200 Speaker 1: a great investor in a particular part of a great 1031 01:04:25,240 --> 01:04:27,920 Speaker 1: investing team. We always believe in the team more than 1032 01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:31,040 Speaker 1: say a single individual. So we've had a robust training 1033 01:04:31,040 --> 01:04:33,480 Speaker 1: program that has gone on for decades and is really 1034 01:04:33,480 --> 01:04:36,760 Speaker 1: widely recognized. And uh many of our leading pms are 1035 01:04:36,920 --> 01:04:39,240 Speaker 1: are actually from that program, as as I was when 1036 01:04:39,240 --> 01:04:43,360 Speaker 1: I when I changed careers. UM. The amocratic part, you know, 1037 01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:47,400 Speaker 1: is about UM recognizing and I think our clients benefit 1038 01:04:47,440 --> 01:04:51,120 Speaker 1: directly from it that as a boutique investment firm UM, 1039 01:04:51,160 --> 01:04:55,200 Speaker 1: you know, specializing in growth, UM, we need to be 1040 01:04:56,200 --> 01:04:59,960 Speaker 1: significantly better than our competition, many of whom are much larger, 1041 01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:02,280 Speaker 1: or they're part of a big bank or at least 1042 01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:04,880 Speaker 1: they're part of an asset manager that has trillions of dollars, right, 1043 01:05:05,040 --> 01:05:07,200 Speaker 1: doesn't many different. We need to be much better in 1044 01:05:07,240 --> 01:05:11,360 Speaker 1: our specialty than the competition. And the way you're gonna 1045 01:05:11,360 --> 01:05:14,080 Speaker 1: get that is if you recognize and promote within your 1046 01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:17,640 Speaker 1: organization the people who simply deliver the best results with 1047 01:05:18,040 --> 01:05:21,800 Speaker 1: you know, without much regard to anything else UM, and 1048 01:05:21,880 --> 01:05:25,360 Speaker 1: that has that has long resulted in what you see today. 1049 01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:27,760 Speaker 1: I think today we are also, of course more aware 1050 01:05:28,360 --> 01:05:32,640 Speaker 1: and making sure that as we recruit, as we mentor 1051 01:05:33,360 --> 01:05:35,560 Speaker 1: UM and as we promote that we're that we're you know, 1052 01:05:35,920 --> 01:05:39,600 Speaker 1: we're recognizing UM people that way. But we've always had 1053 01:05:39,640 --> 01:05:44,480 Speaker 1: a very diverse UM leadership. The firm has always been 1054 01:05:44,560 --> 01:05:47,960 Speaker 1: very mimocratic and UH and we've always had a culture 1055 01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:51,680 Speaker 1: of of of of of people uh sort of coming 1056 01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:54,520 Speaker 1: from different industries and wanting to prove themselves. And often 1057 01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:56,880 Speaker 1: those people who who come from different industries are the 1058 01:05:56,880 --> 01:06:01,480 Speaker 1: ones who sort of UM, you know, re really passionately 1059 01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:03,480 Speaker 1: get into the stock market. We have. You know, one 1060 01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:05,280 Speaker 1: of the biggest changes I'd say in the last thirty 1061 01:06:05,360 --> 01:06:08,280 Speaker 1: years in my career is the industry has become more professional, 1062 01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:12,840 Speaker 1: like in the nineties, there weren't investment management programs at 1063 01:06:12,840 --> 01:06:16,120 Speaker 1: business schools or and certainly the undergrad undergraduate was completely 1064 01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:18,840 Speaker 1: uninterested in what we did. Half the trading desks didn't 1065 01:06:18,840 --> 01:06:21,720 Speaker 1: have college degrees. There you go, and so in some 1066 01:06:21,760 --> 01:06:23,800 Speaker 1: ways it was it was nice because the people who 1067 01:06:23,840 --> 01:06:27,160 Speaker 1: found their way to the industry in a bit like me. 1068 01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:30,280 Speaker 1: You know, we had no formal training. We weren't going 1069 01:06:30,280 --> 01:06:32,120 Speaker 1: there because it was a major or something that we 1070 01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:33,840 Speaker 1: were going there because somehow we had found it and 1071 01:06:33,880 --> 01:06:36,640 Speaker 1: we had fallen in love with it. Today, of course, 1072 01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:39,280 Speaker 1: you know, it's very different. You've got undergraduates that are 1073 01:06:39,280 --> 01:06:42,320 Speaker 1: taking investing courses and that's all well and good, but 1074 01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:45,200 Speaker 1: high school courses are now offered. Yeah, and well, I'm 1075 01:06:45,280 --> 01:06:47,600 Speaker 1: much in favor of education. There's not there's nothing that 1076 01:06:47,680 --> 01:06:51,000 Speaker 1: there's nothing that replaces passion and drive. You know, you 1077 01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:53,280 Speaker 1: don't you don't need to be a rocket scientist to 1078 01:06:53,080 --> 01:06:55,640 Speaker 1: to do well in our industry. Doesn't hurt, doesn't hurt. 1079 01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:58,000 Speaker 1: And we have we have at least one person who 1080 01:06:58,040 --> 01:07:00,800 Speaker 1: might might actually be a rocket scientist. But I have 1081 01:07:00,800 --> 01:07:04,160 Speaker 1: a doctor who's definitely so I know, I only have 1082 01:07:04,240 --> 01:07:07,360 Speaker 1: you for a few more minutes let me jump to 1083 01:07:07,400 --> 01:07:10,640 Speaker 1: our favorite questions that we asked all of our guests, 1084 01:07:10,680 --> 01:07:16,080 Speaker 1: starting with tell us, what kept you entertained during lockdown? 1085 01:07:16,120 --> 01:07:24,320 Speaker 1: What have you been streaming or listening to? Um m hmm, Amazon, Netflix, what, whatever? Okay, 1086 01:07:24,400 --> 01:07:27,400 Speaker 1: I mean it's it's it's uh and you can say 1087 01:07:27,960 --> 01:07:32,520 Speaker 1: you don't have Yeah, I love TV movie, Yeah I will. 1088 01:07:33,080 --> 01:07:37,040 Speaker 1: I will pretty much watch any science fiction junk you 1089 01:07:37,080 --> 01:07:39,280 Speaker 1: put in front of me. Okay, so you're talking to 1090 01:07:39,400 --> 01:07:42,360 Speaker 1: the right guy. I'm watching. Let's let's tick through your 1091 01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:45,080 Speaker 1: favorites and well the way season three of the Boys 1092 01:07:47,120 --> 01:07:48,760 Speaker 1: looking forward to that, that's a good one. But I'll 1093 01:07:48,760 --> 01:07:50,160 Speaker 1: give you a one that I'm like, I'm not sure 1094 01:07:50,160 --> 01:07:52,840 Speaker 1: why I'm still watching it, but it's because there's eight 1095 01:07:52,840 --> 01:07:55,080 Speaker 1: seasons of it. So so I'm like, in my mind, 1096 01:07:55,440 --> 01:07:57,360 Speaker 1: this is actually a bit of a researcher mind, right, 1097 01:07:57,400 --> 01:08:00,240 Speaker 1: If there's eight seasons, some audience must somebody like I 1098 01:08:00,280 --> 01:08:02,960 Speaker 1: want to understand why, even though I so I'm the 1099 01:08:03,080 --> 01:08:08,800 Speaker 1: expanse I love these I finished no spoilers, but what's 1100 01:08:08,800 --> 01:08:14,640 Speaker 1: so fascinating is how many different storylines and set ups 1101 01:08:15,280 --> 01:08:19,160 Speaker 1: are in that Because it began in a specific way 1102 01:08:19,320 --> 01:08:23,920 Speaker 1: and changed to something else before it. But you asked 1103 01:08:23,920 --> 01:08:26,160 Speaker 1: what I was watching, I actually not far into don't 1104 01:08:26,160 --> 01:08:29,559 Speaker 1: really like it. What I really liked, Yeah, I really 1105 01:08:29,600 --> 01:08:36,280 Speaker 1: liked um by the Vikings and the Last Kingdom. That's 1106 01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:39,120 Speaker 1: very interesting. If you're a sci fi junkie, it's a 1107 01:08:39,240 --> 01:08:41,960 Speaker 1: Game of Thrones light right. If you're a sci fi junkie, 1108 01:08:42,000 --> 01:08:44,200 Speaker 1: I'm going to give you a couple of things that 1109 01:08:44,280 --> 01:08:48,040 Speaker 1: you will really like, and one is just two seasons 1110 01:08:48,520 --> 01:08:50,679 Speaker 1: could be the best thing I've seen all of down. 1111 01:08:50,960 --> 01:08:53,360 Speaker 1: I also have to say New Girl. I think I 1112 01:08:53,439 --> 01:08:58,640 Speaker 1: love that. She's hilarious. Have you watched Altered Carbon? Have 1113 01:08:58,720 --> 01:09:02,479 Speaker 1: you seen that? I watched like two seasons. I've kind 1114 01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:06,760 Speaker 1: of it's done. Two seasons. That's all. Well, there may 1115 01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:09,120 Speaker 1: be a third coming, but so far it's only two seasons, 1116 01:09:09,320 --> 01:09:11,800 Speaker 1: or at least the last on my loaded. Um, I 1117 01:09:11,800 --> 01:09:15,000 Speaker 1: think that was Netflix. I don't. I don't remember um. 1118 01:09:15,040 --> 01:09:17,040 Speaker 1: And then I'm gonna go off on a little Tan 1119 01:09:17,080 --> 01:09:22,000 Speaker 1: which was also really good though, go ahead, Italian Mafia series. 1120 01:09:23,960 --> 01:09:26,640 Speaker 1: What's it called? Roma? I haven't seen that? That was 1121 01:09:26,680 --> 01:09:29,559 Speaker 1: a movie? Also Roma? Yeah? That that one that The 1122 01:09:29,600 --> 01:09:32,840 Speaker 1: movie is a great movie, great movie, very very nice 1123 01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:35,639 Speaker 1: portrait of whatever but Roma I think, yeah, it's called 1124 01:09:35,720 --> 01:09:39,080 Speaker 1: roma Is. It's like, um, it's a little bit like Narcos, 1125 01:09:39,920 --> 01:09:43,080 Speaker 1: except that in Italy. And I love Italy, so so 1126 01:09:43,120 --> 01:09:44,960 Speaker 1: you see it's shot in Italy, it's I guess it's 1127 01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:47,400 Speaker 1: Italian and translated. So I love a lot of these 1128 01:09:47,560 --> 01:09:50,760 Speaker 1: UM shows that are there's this, this, this ridiculous one 1129 01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:54,760 Speaker 1: from Denmark. It's about a prime minister or um. There's 1130 01:09:54,800 --> 01:09:57,519 Speaker 1: a lot of foreign you know TV that's now being 1131 01:09:57,600 --> 01:09:59,559 Speaker 1: you know, dubbed or whatever in English that I find 1132 01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:02,080 Speaker 1: kind of quite interesting because it's my agent, which is 1133 01:10:02,160 --> 01:10:06,000 Speaker 1: a great fabulous And the thing that a lot of 1134 01:10:06,000 --> 01:10:09,640 Speaker 1: people don't realize is the people playing French actors are 1135 01:10:09,680 --> 01:10:13,760 Speaker 1: actually famous French actors in France. We just don't know them. 1136 01:10:13,840 --> 01:10:16,600 Speaker 1: They're the one in Spain where they're all about the 1137 01:10:16,720 --> 01:10:22,160 Speaker 1: murder mystery brother dies in Spain somehow sister from England, 1138 01:10:22,479 --> 01:10:24,880 Speaker 1: you know, goes to it to try to find but 1139 01:10:25,360 --> 01:10:27,080 Speaker 1: you know, you know, I realized that there is a 1140 01:10:27,120 --> 01:10:30,120 Speaker 1: theme here. I love travel UM. I think a lot 1141 01:10:30,160 --> 01:10:32,479 Speaker 1: of these shows are during COVID. We're a nice way 1142 01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:37,720 Speaker 1: to sort of see and remember the name of the 1143 01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:42,160 Speaker 1: show where there's a cop in Japan whose brothers in 1144 01:10:42,240 --> 01:10:45,280 Speaker 1: the Yukuza who disappears and he has to come and 1145 01:10:45,400 --> 01:10:48,760 Speaker 1: chase him down, trying to move Chicago and London. I'm 1146 01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:51,920 Speaker 1: joining a blank on the name. Same like that, probably 1147 01:10:52,000 --> 01:10:55,479 Speaker 1: same same concept is what you're talking about in Spain, 1148 01:10:56,120 --> 01:10:59,120 Speaker 1: where it's some of it's subtitled and it was really 1149 01:10:59,200 --> 01:11:02,040 Speaker 1: we haven't watched as kingdom, haven't watched the last I 1150 01:11:02,160 --> 01:11:05,000 Speaker 1: seriously recommend watching that, Okay, I'll put that on. What 1151 01:11:05,479 --> 01:11:10,200 Speaker 1: it's about is England before England, when it's five different 1152 01:11:10,280 --> 01:11:14,680 Speaker 1: kingdoms and Vikings are raiding England, and it's kind of 1153 01:11:14,760 --> 01:11:17,479 Speaker 1: like the English have to unite into a country if 1154 01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:19,320 Speaker 1: they're going to fend off the Vikings who have the 1155 01:11:19,360 --> 01:11:22,360 Speaker 1: awesome warriors, and the Vikings are basically trying to figure 1156 01:11:22,360 --> 01:11:25,000 Speaker 1: out what we like raiding But is this really a 1157 01:11:25,080 --> 01:11:30,160 Speaker 1: sustainable lifestyle? You know? So my my wife and I like, 1158 01:11:30,400 --> 01:11:32,760 Speaker 1: I'll watch a show that she wants to watch, the 1159 01:11:32,800 --> 01:11:35,480 Speaker 1: watch show I want to watch, and that's how compromise 1160 01:11:36,040 --> 01:11:39,639 Speaker 1: the show. Similar to that where maybe it's a few 1161 01:11:39,760 --> 01:11:43,320 Speaker 1: hundred years, it's fifteen hundreds. Is rain R E I 1162 01:11:43,439 --> 01:11:47,160 Speaker 1: G N, which is the United It's France, it's England. 1163 01:11:47,200 --> 01:11:52,880 Speaker 1: It's Scotland. It's just post Viking but before the Enlightenment, 1164 01:11:53,080 --> 01:11:56,599 Speaker 1: and the Vatican is very involved and it's not quite 1165 01:11:56,880 --> 01:12:02,559 Speaker 1: as um era accurate as the Crown was, but it's 1166 01:12:02,560 --> 01:12:05,880 Speaker 1: still you know, entertaining what goes on in the court 1167 01:12:05,920 --> 01:12:11,639 Speaker 1: politics and the various um wars between different uh different crowns, 1168 01:12:11,720 --> 01:12:14,360 Speaker 1: and sounds like it's a few hundred years after the 1169 01:12:14,439 --> 01:12:17,800 Speaker 1: Last Kingdom. I thought, I'll put Last Kingdom on my list, 1170 01:12:18,520 --> 01:12:20,640 Speaker 1: um and there's a bunch of others. I'll send you 1171 01:12:20,720 --> 01:12:22,599 Speaker 1: the name of that other show if I can, if 1172 01:12:22,600 --> 01:12:25,160 Speaker 1: I can dig that up. I don't listen to podcasts, 1173 01:12:26,479 --> 01:12:28,479 Speaker 1: um I. I don't think they're gonna catch on. I 1174 01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:32,080 Speaker 1: can't think. I do listen to in the car my 1175 01:12:32,240 --> 01:12:36,120 Speaker 1: wife when I pick those in to Howard Stern. But still, yeah, 1176 01:12:36,120 --> 01:12:40,000 Speaker 1: he's hilarious. Sometimes that that's was not going to be 1177 01:12:40,160 --> 01:12:42,560 Speaker 1: my first guest. Well, I have to credit her. She 1178 01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:45,760 Speaker 1: she sort of rediscovered it. Okay, to be fair, he's 1179 01:12:45,840 --> 01:12:49,840 Speaker 1: become an amazing interview that's it. So yes, a lot 1180 01:12:49,880 --> 01:12:52,040 Speaker 1: of it is nonsense and you know it's funny, but 1181 01:12:52,200 --> 01:12:55,360 Speaker 1: we have sometimes like no, but the interviews that he's 1182 01:12:55,439 --> 01:12:59,639 Speaker 1: done of rock stars. He's incredibly good at that. Well 1183 01:12:59,680 --> 01:13:01,479 Speaker 1: and all I wanted for forty years he better be. 1184 01:13:01,960 --> 01:13:04,360 Speaker 1: And and there's a there's a there's a there's a 1185 01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:06,800 Speaker 1: show where we we actually replayed the show Cuple times 1186 01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:08,759 Speaker 1: because it's just too funny, where you know, he asks 1187 01:13:09,720 --> 01:13:11,680 Speaker 1: viewers to call him, what are the three greatest rock 1188 01:13:11,720 --> 01:13:15,000 Speaker 1: bands of all time? And you know, a music teacher 1189 01:13:15,080 --> 01:13:18,360 Speaker 1: calls in and on on that music teacher's list is 1190 01:13:18,680 --> 01:13:22,360 Speaker 1: Rush and Um, all right, and he doesn't have like 1191 01:13:22,720 --> 01:13:27,760 Speaker 1: the Beatles, and Howard Stern riffs on this for like 1192 01:13:28,439 --> 01:13:30,680 Speaker 1: two hours. I mean, by the end of it, you're just, 1193 01:13:30,840 --> 01:13:33,760 Speaker 1: you know, you're feeling sorry for this guy. Um. There's 1194 01:13:33,760 --> 01:13:36,599 Speaker 1: an argument over who is number three, but I think 1195 01:13:36,680 --> 01:13:38,760 Speaker 1: we can all agree that numbers one and you and 1196 01:13:38,840 --> 01:13:42,080 Speaker 1: I are comparable beats Stones. And then you know, number 1197 01:13:42,120 --> 01:13:45,160 Speaker 1: three you can rotate, but it's not Rush three. You 1198 01:13:45,200 --> 01:13:47,120 Speaker 1: can't be rushed, right. I don't even know if Rush 1199 01:13:47,160 --> 01:13:50,360 Speaker 1: makes it mean right because he got you led Zeppelin. 1200 01:13:51,280 --> 01:14:00,759 Speaker 1: Well you want to start, Who's um, yes, Pink Floyd, 1201 01:14:01,920 --> 01:14:04,840 Speaker 1: Um you start, you start just working your way down. 1202 01:14:05,600 --> 01:14:10,960 Speaker 1: Bruce Springsteen. I'm just thinking about It's funny because when 1203 01:14:11,000 --> 01:14:14,720 Speaker 1: you go digital, you lose the visual visual cues used 1204 01:14:14,720 --> 01:14:18,160 Speaker 1: to get which look, how how many albums I had 1205 01:14:18,479 --> 01:14:21,479 Speaker 1: under um the Rolling Stones that's like eight inches of 1206 01:14:21,880 --> 01:14:25,000 Speaker 1: vinyl versus all right, it's a half an inch of 1207 01:14:25,120 --> 01:14:28,439 Speaker 1: Van Morrison and a half inch of credence. But um 1208 01:14:28,600 --> 01:14:30,960 Speaker 1: and the Doors are like two albums. So how do 1209 01:14:31,080 --> 01:14:34,960 Speaker 1: you anyway, let's um, let's keep working a way through 1210 01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:37,680 Speaker 1: these questions before they kick us out of the studio. UM, 1211 01:14:37,800 --> 01:14:42,000 Speaker 1: tell us about your early mentors who helped shape your career. Uh, 1212 01:14:42,200 --> 01:14:45,960 Speaker 1: you know, that's an interesting one. And um, obviously Fred 1213 01:14:46,000 --> 01:14:48,240 Speaker 1: Alger has to be one of those clothes. Well he 1214 01:14:48,439 --> 01:14:53,400 Speaker 1: was Fred and David Fred Fred retired in so you 1215 01:14:53,479 --> 01:14:57,200 Speaker 1: were overlapped a year after a year after I joined. 1216 01:14:57,240 --> 01:15:00,280 Speaker 1: He had completed his task. He found you when he 1217 01:15:00,360 --> 01:15:04,240 Speaker 1: was able to tell. But David Alder absolutely and you 1218 01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:08,240 Speaker 1: know really um uh Ron Tataro and see like who 1219 01:15:08,680 --> 01:15:11,759 Speaker 1: um Um I worked for Ron. He was an analyst 1220 01:15:11,960 --> 01:15:15,640 Speaker 1: when I worked for him as as his junior. Um 1221 01:15:15,760 --> 01:15:18,679 Speaker 1: he then became a portfolio manager. And see like who 1222 01:15:19,040 --> 01:15:22,160 Speaker 1: um was a leading tech analyst who became a portfolio manager. 1223 01:15:22,479 --> 01:15:24,680 Speaker 1: Both of them, well, actually all three of them died 1224 01:15:24,720 --> 01:15:29,560 Speaker 1: on nine eleven. Um, they were, um, so you know, 1225 01:15:29,720 --> 01:15:31,599 Speaker 1: I'll be frank. I mean, I I was a little 1226 01:15:31,920 --> 01:15:34,200 Speaker 1: um I was. It took for a long time to 1227 01:15:34,240 --> 01:15:35,760 Speaker 1: get me to come to them because I did not 1228 01:15:35,880 --> 01:15:37,479 Speaker 1: like the idea of going to be the son in law, 1229 01:15:38,280 --> 01:15:40,880 Speaker 1: you know. And uh, he did show me some stuff. 1230 01:15:40,920 --> 01:15:43,240 Speaker 1: I met these people. Um and then one of the 1231 01:15:43,240 --> 01:15:45,360 Speaker 1: things he showed me about the meritocracies and we managed 1232 01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:48,880 Speaker 1: like individual analyst performance very rigorously. And he said, like 1233 01:15:49,320 --> 01:15:52,040 Speaker 1: this was posted like on the Bolleton board, the fact 1234 01:15:52,080 --> 01:15:54,120 Speaker 1: that your son in law, it doesn't matter. So I said, like, 1235 01:15:54,200 --> 01:15:55,760 Speaker 1: he said, like you're gonna have a year where you're 1236 01:15:55,880 --> 01:15:57,200 Speaker 1: you're not on the bolton board, and then you're not 1237 01:15:57,200 --> 01:15:59,240 Speaker 1: gonna be on the bulletin board. And if you don't 1238 01:15:59,280 --> 01:16:00,800 Speaker 1: look good on the bull on borge, you'll know. And 1239 01:16:00,840 --> 01:16:02,760 Speaker 1: I said I will leave. He said you won't have to, 1240 01:16:02,840 --> 01:16:04,400 Speaker 1: And I said, I'm gonna leave if I'm not any 1241 01:16:04,439 --> 01:16:07,000 Speaker 1: good at this, you know. So I actually did go 1242 01:16:07,120 --> 01:16:11,360 Speaker 1: in thinking I'll take the training and then I'll probably 1243 01:16:11,400 --> 01:16:13,280 Speaker 1: go need to go somewhere else to get like my 1244 01:16:13,439 --> 01:16:16,800 Speaker 1: sense of um, you know that I'm not just you know, 1245 01:16:17,080 --> 01:16:21,639 Speaker 1: some guy, but um, uh, those guys ron and see 1246 01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:25,360 Speaker 1: lie Uh, they treat treating me like everybody else in 1247 01:16:25,439 --> 01:16:28,080 Speaker 1: both the good and bad ways. So did David. Uh, 1248 01:16:28,200 --> 01:16:30,320 Speaker 1: David probably a little. I mean David once actually told 1249 01:16:30,320 --> 01:16:32,280 Speaker 1: me he was a little harder on me than anybody 1250 01:16:32,320 --> 01:16:36,560 Speaker 1: else because he had to be um, which included like 1251 01:16:36,680 --> 01:16:38,720 Speaker 1: yelling at me in public and stuff like that. I mean, 1252 01:16:38,960 --> 01:16:41,160 Speaker 1: he was he was a very colorful guy, but he 1253 01:16:41,240 --> 01:16:44,560 Speaker 1: did he did have a um. He did like to 1254 01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:46,679 Speaker 1: yell when you made a mistake. Um. But he would 1255 01:16:46,720 --> 01:16:48,439 Speaker 1: also stand up in front of five people and said, 1256 01:16:48,439 --> 01:16:52,439 Speaker 1: that's the best technolist on the street right there. That's fantastic. Yeah. Um. 1257 01:16:52,640 --> 01:16:55,360 Speaker 1: So those those are my business mentors for sure. So 1258 01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:58,760 Speaker 1: so let's talk about everybody's favorite question. Tell us some 1259 01:16:58,920 --> 01:17:02,559 Speaker 1: of your favorite books and what you're reading right now. Oh. Um, 1260 01:17:02,640 --> 01:17:04,320 Speaker 1: I was an English major in college. I should have 1261 01:17:04,360 --> 01:17:06,280 Speaker 1: said I did do a lot of reading during I 1262 01:17:06,320 --> 01:17:10,360 Speaker 1: didn't just watch Netflix and a Game of Thrones. Um, 1263 01:17:11,160 --> 01:17:14,519 Speaker 1: I did a lot of reading. Um. Right now, I 1264 01:17:14,640 --> 01:17:18,080 Speaker 1: am reading The Committed, which is the second book after 1265 01:17:18,200 --> 01:17:21,519 Speaker 1: The Sympathizer by a Vietnamese author whose name I can't 1266 01:17:21,680 --> 01:17:24,800 Speaker 1: quite remember. I finished reading a book given to me 1267 01:17:25,240 --> 01:17:28,960 Speaker 1: by my brilliant daughter, UM, who is going to a 1268 01:17:29,160 --> 01:17:33,840 Speaker 1: PhD in English literature, Um, Um, by an author named 1269 01:17:33,880 --> 01:17:37,599 Speaker 1: Ocean Vong. Yes, there's an Asian American theme going on here, 1270 01:17:37,680 --> 01:17:43,160 Speaker 1: although that's unusual for me. Actually, Um I UM, I 1271 01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:45,840 Speaker 1: am reading a book on environmentalism. Actually I cannot remember 1272 01:17:45,880 --> 01:17:47,400 Speaker 1: the name. It was sent to me by somebody at 1273 01:17:47,400 --> 01:17:51,439 Speaker 1: Stanford University. Um. It's about, you know, um, what we 1274 01:17:51,520 --> 01:17:56,080 Speaker 1: need to do to to be make a more sustainable 1275 01:17:56,120 --> 01:17:58,240 Speaker 1: world and and how difficult it would be, but why 1276 01:17:58,280 --> 01:18:01,920 Speaker 1: we should do it anyway? Uh uh And I wish 1277 01:18:01,920 --> 01:18:04,720 Speaker 1: I could remember the name. But the committed is that 1278 01:18:05,160 --> 01:18:10,240 Speaker 1: viet Than Gillian? Yes, yes, Google to the Rescue. Yeah, 1279 01:18:10,560 --> 01:18:14,439 Speaker 1: and uh, what's the name of the what's the finished 1280 01:18:14,920 --> 01:18:19,120 Speaker 1: reading a book called American Dirt American? Yeah, that's an 1281 01:18:19,200 --> 01:18:22,479 Speaker 1: interesting book. I think I had the name right. It's 1282 01:18:22,520 --> 01:18:28,080 Speaker 1: about um takes place in Mexico, Um, Janine Cummins, Um, 1283 01:18:28,280 --> 01:18:31,320 Speaker 1: it's a it's a it's a story of a woman 1284 01:18:31,400 --> 01:18:37,479 Speaker 1: who has to flee um her country because of drug 1285 01:18:37,840 --> 01:18:40,000 Speaker 1: you know, drug trafficking and just it's like the journey 1286 01:18:40,040 --> 01:18:43,599 Speaker 1: to America from that perspective, and it's it's a pretty 1287 01:18:43,640 --> 01:18:47,280 Speaker 1: amazing novel. I think quite quite interesting. What sort of 1288 01:18:47,320 --> 01:18:50,759 Speaker 1: advice would you give to a recent college grad interested 1289 01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:56,200 Speaker 1: in a career in gross stocks or investing? Um, do 1290 01:18:56,400 --> 01:19:01,720 Speaker 1: not go on robin hood and just trade stocks. Uh Uh. 1291 01:19:02,160 --> 01:19:04,479 Speaker 1: I would say, you want to try to start your career. 1292 01:19:04,800 --> 01:19:10,280 Speaker 1: This is important at a place with a disciplined investment philosophy. Uh. 1293 01:19:10,400 --> 01:19:13,400 Speaker 1: This is not a place an industry where I think, 1294 01:19:13,920 --> 01:19:17,439 Speaker 1: you know, going with the startup or the kind of 1295 01:19:17,680 --> 01:19:20,840 Speaker 1: small shop is necessarily a good place. I I do 1296 01:19:21,000 --> 01:19:24,679 Speaker 1: think a lot of the value that the larger firms 1297 01:19:24,800 --> 01:19:28,000 Speaker 1: bringing and I'll just large enough. Um. You know is 1298 01:19:28,040 --> 01:19:31,120 Speaker 1: that we do have an investment process in philosophy um, 1299 01:19:31,280 --> 01:19:33,080 Speaker 1: and so we will train you in it and it 1300 01:19:33,200 --> 01:19:36,320 Speaker 1: may not fit you ideally, but you'll have a good, 1301 01:19:37,080 --> 01:19:40,280 Speaker 1: clear foundation for whatever you do later. The second thing 1302 01:19:40,320 --> 01:19:42,400 Speaker 1: actually I would tell you is I know that you're 1303 01:19:42,560 --> 01:19:47,080 Speaker 1: you're you know, the the tech the tech world, e 1304 01:19:47,120 --> 01:19:49,360 Speaker 1: commics world suggests you've got a job hop a lot. 1305 01:19:49,560 --> 01:19:52,800 Speaker 1: That's the way in our business. I think it's actually 1306 01:19:53,240 --> 01:19:57,840 Speaker 1: exact opposite, because seeing wherever you go, if it's a 1307 01:19:57,880 --> 01:20:00,479 Speaker 1: good place with a discipline process, you to see it 1308 01:20:00,560 --> 01:20:03,720 Speaker 1: through a full cycle. You know if you go to 1309 01:20:03,840 --> 01:20:05,360 Speaker 1: a firm for two years and then go to another, 1310 01:20:05,520 --> 01:20:06,840 Speaker 1: you know, a growth shop for two years and a 1311 01:20:06,880 --> 01:20:09,439 Speaker 1: value shop for two years, and then a macro shop 1312 01:20:09,520 --> 01:20:11,800 Speaker 1: for two years. I know that some would see people say, oh, 1313 01:20:11,800 --> 01:20:14,120 Speaker 1: you've learned a lot there. I would say, no, you haven't, 1314 01:20:14,160 --> 01:20:16,920 Speaker 1: because what you really need to do is see how 1315 01:20:17,040 --> 01:20:19,720 Speaker 1: growth works through a full cycle, how value works through 1316 01:20:19,760 --> 01:20:22,599 Speaker 1: a full cycle, or how macro does if you if 1317 01:20:22,640 --> 01:20:26,280 Speaker 1: you job hop like that, you can become very articulate 1318 01:20:26,320 --> 01:20:29,519 Speaker 1: on the surface. But our business is that really tough one. 1319 01:20:29,680 --> 01:20:32,320 Speaker 1: I mean it's as tough as competitive professional sports because 1320 01:20:32,360 --> 01:20:34,560 Speaker 1: the number gets put up our our just worse. We 1321 01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:36,840 Speaker 1: get a number every day. Even professional athletes don't play 1322 01:20:36,880 --> 01:20:40,599 Speaker 1: every day, We get a number every day and um, 1323 01:20:40,720 --> 01:20:42,800 Speaker 1: and then they add up to weeks, months, quarters, years, 1324 01:20:43,000 --> 01:20:46,160 Speaker 1: and um and and and Frankly, you can have a 1325 01:20:46,240 --> 01:20:48,640 Speaker 1: fifty plus year record like Alger and then have a 1326 01:20:48,680 --> 01:20:53,200 Speaker 1: horrible six months and you know you're like, wow, uh, 1327 01:20:54,360 --> 01:20:56,000 Speaker 1: did we get out? Did we get out too far 1328 01:20:56,080 --> 01:20:58,200 Speaker 1: over our skis? Um? I don't think we did. But 1329 01:20:58,439 --> 01:21:02,240 Speaker 1: you know, it's a challenging and so you need to 1330 01:21:02,360 --> 01:21:04,680 Speaker 1: know the details and the depth and you need to 1331 01:21:04,760 --> 01:21:08,200 Speaker 1: do that consistently through a period of time that matters 1332 01:21:08,560 --> 01:21:11,760 Speaker 1: for our business. Otherwise you're going to be superficial in 1333 01:21:11,840 --> 01:21:14,400 Speaker 1: shallow and you might find yourself floating around too much 1334 01:21:14,439 --> 01:21:17,240 Speaker 1: longer than you ever thought you would. And our final question, 1335 01:21:17,920 --> 01:21:20,320 Speaker 1: what do you know about the world of investing today 1336 01:21:20,840 --> 01:21:23,080 Speaker 1: that you wish you knew when you were first starting 1337 01:21:23,120 --> 01:21:31,080 Speaker 1: out back in UM? I think that I was so 1338 01:21:31,400 --> 01:21:34,800 Speaker 1: focused on what was put in front of me, which 1339 01:21:34,920 --> 01:21:42,880 Speaker 1: was technology UM, that I didn't really learn much about 1340 01:21:43,439 --> 01:21:47,880 Speaker 1: other sectors or other styles of investing. Now, being that 1341 01:21:47,960 --> 01:21:50,840 Speaker 1: I was an alger UM my boss and everybody around 1342 01:21:50,880 --> 01:21:53,080 Speaker 1: me did not we learn about value investing. And I'm 1343 01:21:53,120 --> 01:21:56,680 Speaker 1: okay with that part, right, but I I think I 1344 01:21:57,760 --> 01:22:01,680 Speaker 1: I wish I had learned war and listen more to 1345 01:22:01,800 --> 01:22:04,879 Speaker 1: what the healthcare guys were saying about health care investing 1346 01:22:05,680 --> 01:22:08,840 Speaker 1: and and frankly that there wasn't that forum at at work. 1347 01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:12,160 Speaker 1: And maybe I'm thinking now maybe it still isn't like that, 1348 01:22:12,240 --> 01:22:15,120 Speaker 1: and maybe I should help create one. I try, but 1349 01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:17,960 Speaker 1: I realize a lot of times, you know, if you're 1350 01:22:18,000 --> 01:22:19,920 Speaker 1: the tech guy, you just tune in for the tech 1351 01:22:20,000 --> 01:22:21,880 Speaker 1: and when the person starts talking health care, you tune 1352 01:22:21,880 --> 01:22:26,479 Speaker 1: out so cross sector experience and knowledge months. And I 1353 01:22:26,680 --> 01:22:31,479 Speaker 1: think that as I think because when you see what 1354 01:22:31,680 --> 01:22:34,120 Speaker 1: works in your sectors. You know, my my key sector 1355 01:22:34,200 --> 01:22:37,120 Speaker 1: was techn e commerce, which I lead for Algier in 1356 01:22:37,160 --> 01:22:41,280 Speaker 1: the nineties. Um, what you see what works there? Um, 1357 01:22:41,600 --> 01:22:44,439 Speaker 1: and then you don't realize, well, does it work in 1358 01:22:44,479 --> 01:22:47,280 Speaker 1: another sector? Um? You know, maybe it will and maybe 1359 01:22:47,280 --> 01:22:50,320 Speaker 1: it doesn't. That's very important learning when you are a 1360 01:22:50,360 --> 01:22:53,599 Speaker 1: portfolio manager or as I am really trying to make 1361 01:22:53,640 --> 01:22:57,000 Speaker 1: sure that my analysts are better analysts, because I think 1362 01:22:57,400 --> 01:23:00,719 Speaker 1: if you learn what doesn't doesn't work in their sectors, 1363 01:23:01,160 --> 01:23:03,760 Speaker 1: you know how they work as well. I think it 1364 01:23:03,840 --> 01:23:06,240 Speaker 1: will come back in some way and help you understand 1365 01:23:06,280 --> 01:23:09,800 Speaker 1: your own sector better. And now that I'm I guess 1366 01:23:09,840 --> 01:23:12,519 Speaker 1: I'm at the level that I'm at. I know this 1367 01:23:12,680 --> 01:23:15,439 Speaker 1: because often when I'm doing training sessions or discussions with 1368 01:23:15,520 --> 01:23:18,640 Speaker 1: the younger end of our analysts, I can see how 1369 01:23:18,680 --> 01:23:21,160 Speaker 1: they've kind of myopically focused on a very set of 1370 01:23:21,240 --> 01:23:24,519 Speaker 1: narrow metrics or very set way than an industry works. 1371 01:23:24,840 --> 01:23:28,040 Speaker 1: They've self bulcanized and they yes and they yes, And 1372 01:23:28,120 --> 01:23:32,360 Speaker 1: that's the professionalization of our industry over the last thirty years, right, Um, 1373 01:23:33,040 --> 01:23:37,000 Speaker 1: and so so they're not only unaware of how things 1374 01:23:37,120 --> 01:23:40,440 Speaker 1: might work in other sectors, they can get completely blindsided 1375 01:23:40,680 --> 01:23:43,320 Speaker 1: when say, a business model or a practice in one 1376 01:23:43,400 --> 01:23:47,400 Speaker 1: sector jumps over into another sector. That's that's the risk 1377 01:23:47,439 --> 01:23:50,200 Speaker 1: of specialization, when you become a half inch wide and 1378 01:23:50,280 --> 01:23:53,679 Speaker 1: a mile deep because it's so specific and so detailed. 1379 01:23:53,960 --> 01:23:55,679 Speaker 1: So if I can ask you a question that sends 1380 01:23:55,720 --> 01:23:57,920 Speaker 1: you back to the office and say, hey, maybe we 1381 01:23:58,000 --> 01:24:00,200 Speaker 1: have to make some changes, well that's a that's a 1382 01:24:00,240 --> 01:24:04,680 Speaker 1: good question. Yeah, really interesting. Dan. Thank you for being 1383 01:24:04,800 --> 01:24:08,160 Speaker 1: so generous with your time. We have been speaking with 1384 01:24:08,280 --> 01:24:11,880 Speaker 1: Dan Chung. He is the CEO and ce IO of 1385 01:24:12,040 --> 01:24:16,720 Speaker 1: Algier Asset Management. If you enjoy this conversation, be sure 1386 01:24:16,760 --> 01:24:20,520 Speaker 1: and check out any of our previous four hundred UH interviews. 1387 01:24:20,600 --> 01:24:24,720 Speaker 1: You can find those at iTunes, Spotify, wherever you get 1388 01:24:24,800 --> 01:24:28,840 Speaker 1: your favorite podcasts. We love your comments, feedback and suggestions 1389 01:24:29,000 --> 01:24:32,720 Speaker 1: right to us at m IB podcast at Bloomberg dot net. 1390 01:24:33,280 --> 01:24:36,080 Speaker 1: Sign up from my daily reading list at rid Halts 1391 01:24:36,120 --> 01:24:39,240 Speaker 1: dot com. Follow me on Twitter at rid Halts. I 1392 01:24:39,280 --> 01:24:41,400 Speaker 1: would be remiss if I did not thank the crack 1393 01:24:41,479 --> 01:24:45,479 Speaker 1: staff who helps put these conversations together each week. Paris 1394 01:24:45,560 --> 01:24:49,839 Speaker 1: Wald is my producer. Sean Russo is my research director. 1395 01:24:49,960 --> 01:24:54,320 Speaker 1: Attica val Bron is my project manager. Jack Holsted is 1396 01:24:54,439 --> 01:24:58,320 Speaker 1: my audio engineer. I'm Barry rid Halts. You've been listening 1397 01:24:58,400 --> 01:25:01,200 Speaker 1: to Masters in Business on Bloomberg Radio.