WEBVTT - Businessweek Extra - Jerome Griffith

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<v Speaker 1>This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Jason

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<v Speaker 1>Kelly from Bloomberg Radio. Hi, I'm Jason Kelly, and welcome

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<v Speaker 1>to the Bloomberg Business Week Extra. It's our weekly podcast

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<v Speaker 1>bringing you a full conversation one of our favorites from

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<v Speaker 1>the week. Well, this week Alex Steele and I were

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<v Speaker 1>hosting the show together. Carol Master was off and Alex

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<v Speaker 1>and I caught up with Jerome Griffith. He's the CEO

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<v Speaker 1>over at Land's End. He's got a long history in

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<v Speaker 1>the world of retail and fashion and he is pulling

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<v Speaker 1>out every lesson he's learned to deal with this pandemic

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<v Speaker 1>and the new world order. When it comes to the

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<v Speaker 1>consumer check it out. I think what we've seen so

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<v Speaker 1>far is well, I think everybody's been hearing about over

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<v Speaker 1>the last several months, is demand online UH continues to grow. UH.

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<v Speaker 1>It's been a big plus for consumers who are working

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<v Speaker 1>from home to be able to water products in as

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<v Speaker 1>opposed to going out. We see slow traffic and stores.

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<v Speaker 1>We've reopened the few stores that we have over the

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<v Speaker 1>last couple of months. UH, and we think that going

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<v Speaker 1>into the back part of the year, online business should

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<v Speaker 1>still stay strong. Yet we have a business to business

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<v Speaker 1>UH uniform business that we have called Leo Lands and Outsiders,

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<v Speaker 1>which I think is going to continue to be somewhat

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<v Speaker 1>challenged over the quastion next few months. A lot of

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<v Speaker 1>our customers are travel related and most of course you

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<v Speaker 1>know that that's been a tough business. But there has

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<v Speaker 1>been a run up in the stock obviously over the

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<v Speaker 1>last few days, with people expecting us to have a

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<v Speaker 1>decent results for the quarter. I'm glad to get a

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<v Speaker 1>chance to talk to you again because we can delve

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<v Speaker 1>into a lot more over the next two segments. And

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<v Speaker 1>I guess just to take a step back for a second,

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<v Speaker 1>like how has your world changed in the last six

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<v Speaker 1>months and sort of how do you view it over

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<v Speaker 1>the next six to eighteen months, sort of as we

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<v Speaker 1>move towards a vaccine and some kind of normal. I

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<v Speaker 1>think that the where our world has changed has been

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit topsy turvy from you know, we had

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<v Speaker 1>said earlier in March when demand really shrunk, to April

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<v Speaker 1>recovery and then May June and through the rest of

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<v Speaker 1>the summer being relatively strong. So we've had to go

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<v Speaker 1>back and relok at projections for a lot of our

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<v Speaker 1>items and and increase UH quantities that we were ordering

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<v Speaker 1>because we think that the holiday seasons every big and

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<v Speaker 1>what we thought it was. I think one of the

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<v Speaker 1>things which is a concern for us is that all

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<v Speaker 1>of the carriers that are carrying packages today to homes,

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<v Speaker 1>they're really stretched. So if you look at the big

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<v Speaker 1>three of USPS and fed X and UPS, UH, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>every day is like Christmas for them. So we're doing

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of work with our partners to plan for

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<v Speaker 1>what the holiday season is going to look like, which

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<v Speaker 1>is something that does have us, UH, you know, a

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<v Speaker 1>little concerned, and they're going into next year. One of

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<v Speaker 1>the things that we've seen over the course of the

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<v Speaker 1>last couple of years is our product people who have

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<v Speaker 1>continued to refine and improve what the quality and the

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<v Speaker 1>look of the products that we're selling, and we see

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of increase demand. I think he Goes probably

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<v Speaker 1>saw the UH numbers that we're seeing with new customer acquisition,

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<v Speaker 1>which was up about thirty percent last quarter, and then

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<v Speaker 1>the large rebuy rates that we're having from our customers.

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<v Speaker 1>Are active customers tend to be around New customers are

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<v Speaker 1>around thirty which are pretty great numbers for the industry. Uh,

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<v Speaker 1>and we see that continuing. Yeah, it's interesting, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>Jerome to think about buying patterns and and even for

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<v Speaker 1>lack of better terms, sort of wearing patterns. And I've

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<v Speaker 1>joked on this show before that when I wear a

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<v Speaker 1>colored shirt these days, my two year old sort of

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<v Speaker 1>looks at me funny, like, what are you doing? Like

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<v Speaker 1>you're a T shirt guy now. I mean, the last

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<v Speaker 1>time I put on a dress shirt, I have a

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<v Speaker 1>hard time remembering. I mean, are you seeing you know,

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<v Speaker 1>sort of a real change in the way people dress

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<v Speaker 1>that seems to be, at least for a certain category,

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<v Speaker 1>just a market change here. Absolutely, people are looking for comfort.

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<v Speaker 1>They're working from their homes. Not everyone's home was actually

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<v Speaker 1>shet up to be comfortable for them. So you see

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<v Speaker 1>people ordering comfy clothes, something that looks good on top,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's a little bit more casual on the bottom. Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>You see people ordering lots of stuff for the home

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<v Speaker 1>as well. Our home business has been extremely strong because

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<v Speaker 1>kids have been coming home tore loosed with mom and

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<v Speaker 1>dad and people are getting together, so people are retooling

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<v Speaker 1>what their lives are. Our dress shirt business and we

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<v Speaker 1>sell a lot of dress shirts with monograms on them.

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<v Speaker 1>That's been a little depressed for us the last several months,

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<v Speaker 1>as has uh some of our dressed pant business. But

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<v Speaker 1>when you look at the lion's share of our selection,

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<v Speaker 1>it's really casual clothing. And when you get to knit

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<v Speaker 1>tops and loungeware and pull on pants and sleepware, it's

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<v Speaker 1>it's really bit of being dress. I should point out

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<v Speaker 1>as a Jason is home, he's showing off his super

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<v Speaker 1>cool black T shirt. Are you wearing shorts? Is that

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<v Speaker 1>with that? Jeans every day? Jeans and T shirt every day,

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<v Speaker 1>like every single form day, that's the uniform. So in

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<v Speaker 1>this environment, UM, I'm curious as to how you plan

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<v Speaker 1>because there's a bit of confusion as too. If you know,

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<v Speaker 1>Jason's going to wear dress shirts and dress pants again

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<v Speaker 1>in the next two years, you know, and even if

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<v Speaker 1>things open up, if you still will, how do you

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<v Speaker 1>plan for that? Um. We spend a lot of time

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<v Speaker 1>looking at trends and analyzing trends. We also use artificial

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<v Speaker 1>intelligence for a lot of our basics in order to

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<v Speaker 1>make smarter decision because how much you're going to be

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<v Speaker 1>purchasing and you know, inevitably you run out of stuff

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<v Speaker 1>or you have some overstops and the two things. But

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<v Speaker 1>I have to say that the guys have done a

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<v Speaker 1>pretty good job making it through spring and summer, and

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<v Speaker 1>we've relooked at what we think Fallen Winner is going

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<v Speaker 1>to be. But things that will screw up I think

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<v Speaker 1>that you just didn't think of or can't plan for,

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<v Speaker 1>Like you know, if if we have seen this when

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<v Speaker 1>certain states have spikes and COVID demand goes down. So

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<v Speaker 1>over the summer, when you saw the southern states Florida, Texas,

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<v Speaker 1>California have spikes, you saw the demand go down. As

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<v Speaker 1>you see the spikes start to recede, demand goes back

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<v Speaker 1>up and supply chain issues. Anything that you've run into

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<v Speaker 1>in a meaningful way up to this point, and what's

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<v Speaker 1>the status now. We knew several months ago that we

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<v Speaker 1>were going to have some of our full deliveries a

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<v Speaker 1>couple of weeks later, of which we were prepared for

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<v Speaker 1>and I've dealt with. But generally we've divested ourselves of

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<v Speaker 1>being reliable upon anyone country or anyone factory. So what

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<v Speaker 1>we've seen is pretty good deliveries and expect that into

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<v Speaker 1>the back part of the year. UM but again, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I can't stress enough. It's not really the supply chain

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<v Speaker 1>coming in. It's going to be deliveries on the other

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<v Speaker 1>on the other side. Yeah, it's gonna be on the

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<v Speaker 1>other side, right right, all right, Jerome, I gotta bring

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<v Speaker 1>something up. Alex Steel and I we're just talking about

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<v Speaker 1>it in our chat. You were the president of J

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<v Speaker 1>Peterman and I just think that is the coolest thing

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<v Speaker 1>ever as a longtime Seinfeld fan, Like, did you really

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<v Speaker 1>dine out on that at cocktail parties? That must have

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<v Speaker 1>been amazing. It was kind of amazing. I've been living

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<v Speaker 1>in London for several years prior to that, and to

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<v Speaker 1>be honest with you, I did not know the Sidebell connection.

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<v Speaker 1>And when they recruited me to come to Kentucky, it

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<v Speaker 1>was just the coolest thing. Human was an awesome person,

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<v Speaker 1>an awesome guy. Yeah, loves him a lot, But unfortunately

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<v Speaker 1>the business model was not really set up for success

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<v Speaker 1>and it was a short lived stint for me, right, Yeah, No,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean the whole backstory. I mean, as I was

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<v Speaker 1>researching you, like, I went down a whole rabbit hole

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<v Speaker 1>of like everything that happened with J. Peterman. It was

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<v Speaker 1>really interesting. All right, So with that is a side note.

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<v Speaker 1>You have had a really interesting career working for a Spree,

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<v Speaker 1>working for The Gap, working for Too me Um and

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<v Speaker 1>Tommy Hill figure. I mean, you've seen sort of retail

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<v Speaker 1>and fashion in a number of different iterations, and I

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<v Speaker 1>wonder what you make of this moment. I mean, we

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<v Speaker 1>were talking about sort of the lifestyle changes that were undergoing.

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<v Speaker 1>But when you think about the disruption in retail and

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<v Speaker 1>travel and hospital all those things that that you've had

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<v Speaker 1>as touch points throughout your career, how do you sort

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<v Speaker 1>of sent this is at all right now in this

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<v Speaker 1>kind of amazing time. It's very serendipitous. I started retail

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<v Speaker 1>when I got graduated college in seventy nine. I went

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<v Speaker 1>to work for Lord and Taylor and work their ten years.

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<v Speaker 1>Lord and Taylor famously did not use computers. We handwrote

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<v Speaker 1>every sales check. So that was the eighties for us.

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<v Speaker 1>Now take take it from there to today. AI is

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<v Speaker 1>a big part of our business. So I've seen a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of change over the years. And my advice to

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<v Speaker 1>anybody coming into the industry or working in the industry

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<v Speaker 1>and working their way up is do not get stuck

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<v Speaker 1>on any one thing. You always have to be looking

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<v Speaker 1>for the next thing that's coming out there, or you

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<v Speaker 1>will get left behind. Yeah, I that you're still a retailer.

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<v Speaker 1>Are you ai technology company? Uh? You know, I don't

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<v Speaker 1>know if you call it retail anymore. I tend to

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<v Speaker 1>look at us more as a tech company because of

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<v Speaker 1>the amount of money that we put into tech, the

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<v Speaker 1>type of people that we hire, the emphasis that we

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<v Speaker 1>put on technology and the evolution of technology. Um. Whereas

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<v Speaker 1>you know others might look and stay able to your retailer,

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<v Speaker 1>how am I retailer? We only have one stores of

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<v Speaker 1>all my businesses, I want to click. And so when

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<v Speaker 1>you look at the carnage that we have seen in

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<v Speaker 1>more traditional retail, you know the idea that Gap is

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<v Speaker 1>closing its flagship store in San Francisco, and at the

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<v Speaker 1>same time you see another well known name and retail

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<v Speaker 1>We were talking with one of our internal experts about

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<v Speaker 1>this earlier. You look at the success of a Lulu

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<v Speaker 1>Lemon on the other hand, which obviously has a retail

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<v Speaker 1>footprint and has really ramped up e commerce as well

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<v Speaker 1>and leaned into a lot of the trends that that

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<v Speaker 1>we've been talking about. What's the winning formula at this point,

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<v Speaker 1>there's still much opportunity out there. I think you have

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<v Speaker 1>to look at where the customer is going. The customer

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<v Speaker 1>is in charge of their future. They have so much

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<v Speaker 1>information at their fingertips, they have so much choice. The

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<v Speaker 1>customer really decides what it is that you're going to

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<v Speaker 1>be doing. And when we talk about being a customer

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<v Speaker 1>center company, we think of everything from what's the customer

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<v Speaker 1>going to want? What's the customer to like from this?

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<v Speaker 1>And I know a lot of companies talk about doing that,

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<v Speaker 1>but not a lot of companies actually do it. I

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<v Speaker 1>think there's a ton of opportunity out there right now.

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<v Speaker 1>There's so much disruption in the marketplace that there is

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of opportunity for the people that think right

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<v Speaker 1>and are bold. Does that mean you're gonna buy some stuff?

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<v Speaker 1>I didn't say that one way or the other. Then, Uh,

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<v Speaker 1>we need to hint that there's you know, there's some

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<v Speaker 1>opportunity out there, etcetera. Not something that necessarily here right

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<v Speaker 1>now in the retail quote tech retail landscape. UM, walk

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<v Speaker 1>me forward in a few years, like what do you

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<v Speaker 1>think your business looks like? Uh? You know, I think

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<v Speaker 1>we continue to evolve. UM, I might have mentioned earlier,

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<v Speaker 1>just a year ago, you can only buy land things

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<v Speaker 1>on Landing dot com and in a few of our

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<v Speaker 1>Landing stores. Today you can get it on Amazon, you

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<v Speaker 1>can you'll be able to get it on Coals and

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<v Speaker 1>we'll look to do a couple of things. We'll look

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<v Speaker 1>to expand in the third party marketplaces. H Coles is

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<v Speaker 1>a great example, but there's lots more out there, and

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<v Speaker 1>we're doing that domestically and internationally. And we're trying something

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<v Speaker 1>which is a little bit different as well, with the

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<v Speaker 1>investment in our enterprise order management system. We have the

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<v Speaker 1>ability to bring other people's products under our website. So

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<v Speaker 1>last year we tested at a Christmas time with one company.

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<v Speaker 1>This year will have about twenty different companies selling their

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<v Speaker 1>products on our website. And it's all stuff which is

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<v Speaker 1>complimentary toil My. Nothing that's a head a head to

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<v Speaker 1>head competitor. And I think from the research that we've seen,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, our customers looking for ease and simplicity, So

0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.520
<v Speaker 1>they're happy with our website because we convert extremely well

0:11:40.040 --> 0:11:42.520
<v Speaker 1>and they're excited to see other products on the website

0:11:42.600 --> 0:11:45.600
<v Speaker 1>to add to the basket. Jo I'm just the last

0:11:45.640 --> 0:11:47.680
<v Speaker 1>question for you only about a minute left. What role

0:11:47.880 --> 0:11:50.199
<v Speaker 1>are you seeing in terms of social media? I mean,

0:11:50.240 --> 0:11:52.520
<v Speaker 1>I think about I have sort of sold myself out

0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:54.720
<v Speaker 1>as an avid T shirt buyer, Like the amount of

0:11:54.720 --> 0:11:58.040
<v Speaker 1>T shirts I buy through like Instagram and things like

0:11:58.080 --> 0:12:01.720
<v Speaker 1>that is embarrassing to a met But I do wonder.

0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:04.000
<v Speaker 1>And I'm an old guy, you know, I I have

0:12:04.160 --> 0:12:06.760
<v Speaker 1>to think that for a younger generation, there's a whole

0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:10.120
<v Speaker 1>lot of that that's driven on the social side. We

0:12:10.120 --> 0:12:12.920
<v Speaker 1>were late to social media, you know. I I would

0:12:13.040 --> 0:12:15.080
<v Speaker 1>fault us for that. Having said that, though you know,

0:12:15.240 --> 0:12:18.880
<v Speaker 1>a lot of our new customer acquisition comes from earned

0:12:18.960 --> 0:12:23.720
<v Speaker 1>search and paid word search. Um, we we see huge

0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:26.560
<v Speaker 1>increases today in social media where we are, and we

0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:28.200
<v Speaker 1>think that we can lean into it a lot more.

0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:30.679
<v Speaker 1>I think it is more important than what people continue

0:12:30.720 --> 0:12:32.640
<v Speaker 1>to think. I would say a year ago, he would

0:12:32.679 --> 0:12:35.400
<v Speaker 1>say how much bigger is the Internet actually going to get? Well,

0:12:35.480 --> 0:12:37.319
<v Speaker 1>right now with covid, you can see how much figger

0:12:37.320 --> 0:12:38.840
<v Speaker 1>it's going to get. And I think you have the

0:12:38.880 --> 0:12:41.559
<v Speaker 1>same opportunity with social media. You think it's it's very

0:12:41.600 --> 0:12:43.640
<v Speaker 1>prolific as an now that I think there's a lot

0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:45.520
<v Speaker 1>of ways for it to grow and that's lands End

0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:49.920
<v Speaker 1>CEO Jerome Griffiths talking with me and Alex Steel this week.

0:12:50.080 --> 0:12:53.800
<v Speaker 1>It coincided with their earnings report, but he took it

0:12:53.880 --> 0:12:57.280
<v Speaker 1>much wider. Talked a lot about his own history and

0:12:57.320 --> 0:13:00.840
<v Speaker 1>how he's applying those lessons to man. This time it

0:13:00.920 --> 0:13:04.480
<v Speaker 1>continues to be, I'll say it, unprecedented. Well, you've been

0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:07.080
<v Speaker 1>listening to Bloomberg Business Week Extra, be sure to tune

0:13:07.120 --> 0:13:09.840
<v Speaker 1>into Bloomberg Business Week Radio Live Money through Friday at

0:13:09.840 --> 0:13:13.480
<v Speaker 1>two pm Wall Street Time on Bloomberg Radio. I'm Jason Kelly,

0:13:13.600 --> 0:13:14.480
<v Speaker 1>and this is Bloomberg